Hideki Kamiya: "PlayStation All-Stars is just a ripoff"

[The Catboy]

This entire thread is centered around whether this game is a SSB clone or not. (and similar branching topics such as, why were other more blatant clones not whined about).
Clearly pointed out by the OP containing quotes from some rando dude bashing Playstation all-stars pointlessly.

If you don't want to argue about the game being similar to this, or that, or it not being similar, or anything like that...you're in the wrong thread bro.

Guild complains a lot but he's perfectly in the green as far as this thread is concerned. All hes done so far is be right.

I always miss the ball on these threads.
I'm going to go over there.

 

[Issac]

Yeah! I mean, I can hardly see the difference between Super Smash Bros. and Jump Ultimate Stars... They look exactly the same and really use similar techniques and features. You know, leveling up characters to stronger types by collecting comic strips, just like in SSB! And also, how it's made for that rivalling console to nintendo.. that DS console..

On a side note: It's fun to see how the first smash bros. game is called "Nintendo All Star! Dairantō Smash Brothers" In Japan. And again, no critique in this. It is a nintedo all-star game, and PSASBR is a sony all-star game (even though it doesn't only use sony exclusive characters, but whatever, the more the merrier)

 

[BORTZ]

'i hope it does well. Im actually really surprised that there havent been any other SSB "rip offs".
And whats so bad about rip offs? We got Crash Team Racing out of a Rip off.

 

[Tom Bombadildo]

The thing I don't get is everyone is trying to judge this game as a rip off and scream and cry because they don't like it, but they've never even played it. Oh sure, they've got those videos. They've got those screenshots. But it's like...trying to judge the flavor of a new ice cream by looking at it and seeing others eat it. Man, that ice cream looks kinda like chocolate so I bet it tastes just like that. Everyone else is trying it and they're like "hey man, this shit ain't chocolate even though it kinda looks like it" and you still scream and cry "NO NO BUT IT IS CUZ THEY LOOK SO MUCH A LIKE!!" Then you try it and it tastes like fucking strawberry. The thing is we can't try the game because it's not even released.

I'm starving.

 

[mad_gamer_jad]

On a slightly unrelated note, I wonder what Sakurai has to say about PS All stars.
If I remember correctly he likes the uncharted series so I'm guessing he'd like seeing Nathan Drake in a smash like game.

 

[stinkoman]

'i hope it does well. Im actually really surprised that there havent been any other SSB "rip offs".
And whats so bad about rip offs? We got Crash Team Racing out of a Rip off.

There was that cartoon network one that ended up sucking ass.

I'm actually kind of excited though. If it's done well it could be really fun.

 

[Issac]

The thing I don't get is everyone is trying to judge this game as a rip off and scream and cry because they don't like it, but they've never even played it. Oh sure, they've got those videos. They've got those screenshots. But it's like...trying to judge the flavor of a new ice cream by looking at it and seeing others eat it. Man, that ice cream looks kinda like chocolate so I bet it tastes just like that. Everyone else is trying it and they're like "hey man, this shit ain't chocolate even though it kinda looks like it" and you still scream and cry "NO NO BUT IT IS CUZ THEY LOOK SO MUCH A LIKE!!" Then you try it and it tastes like fucking strawberry. The thing is we can't try the game because it's not even released.

I'm starving.

I for one think that it looks awesome, but still looks like a ripoff. I haven't said it's bad or that it will be bad. I'd rather use your analogy like this:
(now there may be factual errors, but I hope you get the point i'm trying to make) Ben and Jerrys makes cookie dough ice cream, and it has become really popular. Now other ice cream makers also has that flavour which is "kind of unique" yet popular. No, Ben and Jerrys didn't invent ice cream, (nintendo didn't invent fighting games), but they did invent (or atleast make it popular) the cooke dough flavour (like ninty (hal) did the smash bros-y brawler). And now another company makse the same flavour. It's not a complete copy, but it's more or less the same.

How I see this whole debate on the other hand, using your analogy again, is:
"Fuck yeah this brown strawberry ice cream doesn't look at ALL like chocolate!!!!"
"both are brown and look the same"
"Pff! What?!?!? Dirt is also brown!?!? So why not cry that earth is brown??!? does it taste like chocolate too??!?!? chocolate ice cream is a rip off of earth, because earth is brown!!!"

yeah.

 

[DiscostewSM]

6) There is nothing wrong with disliking what we've seen of the game so far, or feeling skeptical about it, or anything like that. That's not the problem, and never has been. The issue is (and Guild addressed this before) that Kamiya went beyond that. He's already passed judgement on an unreleased game without even playing it and flippantly dismissed it out of hand as a rip-off; that's a shocking lack of professionalism unbecoming of a veteran developer.

Funnily enough, Kamiya even criticized someone else for that very thing. Actually, there are enough inconsistencies with Kamiya's tweets that it almost seems as if he's trolling, but I dunno...
It seems like he also managed to not notice that Cartoon Network already made a SSB clone, and it was probably a lot more of a rip-off than this new game is going to be.

There was also a TMNT SSB "clone" and I thought the Wii-exclusive multiplayer for Force Unleashed 2 was a bit like SSB (correct me if I'm wrong).

I actually remember people not hating on the Cartoon Network one when it was coming out because they were like "Hey, it might be SSB on the 3DS!" People didn't even hate on Jump! Super/Ultimate Stars. So we'll pass those up for hate but if Sony does one? They're fucking monsters!

EDIT: Actually, can someone explain to me why they fucking love Jump! Ultimate Stars enough to the point where it got a rather complete fan translation but get so goddamn pissed over this game? And don't try to tell me JUS was all that different from SSB.

If an Uncharted clone in this same nature with having different characters and slightly different mechanics were made on a Nintendo or Microsoft system, wouldn't the fans of that original game be even a little upset? It's one of those scenarios where something unique to a specific territory (in this case, Nintendo territory) is now being plagiarized into territory outside of its origin. The Wii and 3DS "clones" were still within Nintendo territory, which is why I think people weren't upset about those. This is a direct competitor within the game industry making a clone of their rival's game, whether with good intentions or not. I don't think the hate is directed at the game itself, but at Sony because of their "tactics" involving their competitors in the past.

 

[VampireLordAlucard]

Oh come on, everybody wanted a Playstation branded Smash Bros game.

I think everybody's secretly upset by how strange it looks. What do you guys think about the stages representing two games each? Like the God of War / Patapon level? Or how you win the match?

 

[Issac]

I'm highly positive to the two game representing each stage thing! Not too sure what I feel about the "how to win" mechanics. I'd have to try it out first, but reading the details doesn't turn me on. Hopefully there will be different modes, like SSB, where there can be HP based fights as well, etc. When I think of it, a "most damage dealt, no matter which character"-mode would be fun! That's like how it is now, but without the super move gauge...

 

[Black-Ice]

Oh come on, everybody wanted a Playstation branded Smash Bros game.

Clearly not everybody.
Too much butthurt in this thread for that statement to be valid.

 

[broitsak]

Oh come on, everybody wanted a Playstation branded Smash Bros game.

Clearly not everybody.
Too much butthurt in this thread for that statement to be valid.

I wouldnt have minded a super smash bros for playstation..

 

[10_0ARMY]

It all depends on execution. Smash Bros is so successful because it was executed well by Nintendo. Even though this game is clearly a "rip-off", if Sony builds it right, then it'll be successful. Otherwise, it will flop like poorly made games do.

 

[Deleted_171835]

@soulx1) Again, are you sure you're looking at the right games here? I mean, if you want just one example, look at your video; the God of War inspired stages look as far removed from cartoony as you can get with bloodthirsty mythological creatures. Smash Bros. creates a more consistent style for the characters (compare Brawl Mario and Galaxy Mario) while PASBR preserves each character's unique style. This isn't hard to see, right? Because I know some great professionals in the field who would be thrilled to help if it is.

Playstation All Stars has a relatively colourful aesthetic. While the characters have remained rather unchanged, the stages do have this water-colour-esque look to them similar to stages in Smash Bros Brawl. Once again, this isn't really a point to be argued considering one look at the stages will tell you this.

2) Again, the supers in both games work like... supers in anything, so of course they are going to serve the same function. Characters power up and then unleash a powerful attack/take on a new form/etc. which boosts their effectiveness in combat in some way, shape or form. That's any super move in a nutshell, not something Brawl invented. (Now, if the exact methods of obtaining the super moves were the same in both games, this argument might hold a little more weight. They aren't, though, so it doesn't.)

Supers are the most powerful individual move you can get that will almost guarantee an opponent knockout. Just like the Final Smash in Smash Brothers. They simply changed the method of obtaining one but it's essentially the same thing.

3) Well, there's that vision problem again. Like I said, man, medical professionals are the way to go. (On another note,I don't like this sort of argument in general. It's just kind of vague and insubstantial; you could weakly apply it to anything. If you squint really hard, every game will eventually look alike. I don't know It just bugs me, is all.)

Spoiler

[titlelaystation All Stars]

Spoiler: Smash Bros Brawl

Looks pretty similar to me. I don't know, I guess not everyone has perfect vision.

I'm pretty sure 5 sentences counts as continuing further. You know, technically.

.
Elaborating on the point that it's a ripoff. Thought I made that pretty clear.

5) Because maybe it isn't? When it comes to your proof that PASBR has shamelessly stolen from the Smash Bros. series, you seem to be grasping at straws (and not the fun, bendy kind). (In all sincerity, a good chunk of this conflict seems to be based around conflicting views on what constitutes a rip-off, what sort of stigma is attached, etc. For my part, a rip-off is something that shamelessly and desperately takes from others without offering anything new in return. It's a harsh accusation, and one I think should save until, bar certain exceptions, the item in question is completed and released. What did you have in mind?)

From a conceptual standpoint, the game is a ripoff. It's a four-player 3D mascot party brawler. The few changes they have made don't change that fact and it seems you don't realize that.

When I say it is a ripoff, I don't mean that with negative connotations. Being a rip-off doesn't mean that the game is bad, it simply means that they clearly copied Smash Bros.

6) There is nothing wrong with disliking what we've seen of the game so far, or feeling skeptical about it, or anything like that. That's not the problem, and never has been. The issue is (and Guild addressed this before) that Kamiya went beyond that. He's already passed judgement on an unreleased game without even playing it and flippantly dismissed it out of hand as a rip-off; that's a shocking lack of professionalism unbecoming of a veteran developer.

Kamiya dislikes the game because of the fact that it's a ripoff. He values creative integrity and originality so it is no surprise that he isn't fond of the game.

When the game goes against his core values, there is no need to play the game to make judgment. Once again, there is nothing wrong with his comments.

 

[Guild McCommunist]

*snip*

Super Smash Bros. invented supers? It's not like Street Fighter did that concept first. The idea of having a "super attack" in fighting games has been around for a long time. However in here it's a lot different. Unlike Smash Bros., whereas a super attack as seen as an all-powerful attack, here it's more integrated into the gameplay. You need to use supers to score while in SSB you'll be using your standard selection of attacks for the majority of your KOs. Smash Attacks are uncommon at most and most people even exclude them.

Also, having a similar UI constitutes a rip off? Someone call every fighting game in existence, they need to change their user interfaces or they'll be bashed to shit!

Why do we consider this a rip off from SSB but not BlazBlue, Mortal Kombat, Guilty Gear, and any other array of 2D fighters from Street Fighter? I mean they have a similar perspective and similar UI's, by the definitions here that's clearly a rip off.

 

[Smuff]

Lest we forget, both games are a clear rip off of the awesome "Fighters Megamix" on Sega Saturn.

/Fossil gamers ftw

All joking aside, orirginality has gone out the window in this generation of gaming - for shame!

 

[gamefan5]

*eats Popcorn

I mostly agree with everything Gahars said from my POV. I think he made the judgement too early. It may have been based from the concept of SBB but who knows, it may be different enough from the game when we'll get a chance to play it. I, for one, am willing to take a shot at it.

From all we know so far, there is no ring out. The method of KOing is completely different.
You must keep raking combos to build your power meter up and then use one of 3 levels of supers to KO an opponent.

Hmm, sounds interesting. I wouldn't label it as a rip-off just yet.

 

[Guild McCommunist]

From all we know so far, there is no ring out. The method of KOing is completely different.
You must keep raking combos to build your power meter up and then use one of 3 levels of supers to KO an opponent.

It also has combos, something that's a pretty drastic difference from SSB.

Plus so far I haven't seen any items in the game, unlike SSB which has had them since the beginning.

 

[Deleted_171835]

Super Smash Bros. invented supers? It's not like Street Fighter did that concept first. The idea of having a "super attack" in fighting games has been around for a long time. However in here it's a lot different. Unlike Smash Bros., whereas a super attack as seen as an all-powerful attack, here it's more integrated into the gameplay. You need to use supers to score while in SSB you'll be using your standard selection of attacks for the majority of your KOs. Smash Attacks are uncommon at most and most people even exclude them.

Also, having a similar UI constitutes a rip off? Someone call every fighting game in existence, they need to change their user interfaces or they'll be bashed to shit!

Why do we consider this a rip off from SSB but not BlazBlue, Mortal Kombat, Guilty Gear, and any other array of 2D fighters from Street Fighter? I mean they have a similar perspective and similar UI's, by the definitions here that's clearly a rip off.

Considering you fill up your meter for the sole purpose of unlocking an super with it being the only way to kill someone, it clearly is the all-powerful attack. I've played Brawl extensively and Smash Attacks are not "uncommon at most". They come quite often and are used to help easily kill opponents.

Street Fighter-style games are a genre. Smash Bros is not. That's the difference.

 

[Guild McCommunist]

Super Smash Bros. invented supers? It's not like Street Fighter did that concept first. The idea of having a "super attack" in fighting games has been around for a long time. However in here it's a lot different. Unlike Smash Bros., whereas a super attack as seen as an all-powerful attack, here it's more integrated into the gameplay. You need to use supers to score while in SSB you'll be using your standard selection of attacks for the majority of your KOs. Smash Attacks are uncommon at most and most people even exclude them.

Also, having a similar UI constitutes a rip off? Someone call every fighting game in existence, they need to change their user interfaces or they'll be bashed to shit!

Why do we consider this a rip off from SSB but not BlazBlue, Mortal Kombat, Guilty Gear, and any other array of 2D fighters from Street Fighter? I mean they have a similar perspective and similar UI's, by the definitions here that's clearly a rip off.

Considering you fill up your meter for the sole purpose of unlocking an super with it being the only way to kill someone, it clearly is the all-powerful attack. I've played Brawl extensively and Smash Attacks are not "uncommon at most". They come quite often and are used to help easily kill opponents.

Street Fighter-style games are a genre. Smash Bros is not. That's the difference.

I've played Brawl extensively as well and they're not nearly as common as what is being presented here. They come up now and then but it's not even a core mechanic of the game. Most people actually complain that Final Smashes are too overpowered and turn them off.

Also, genre doesn't matter, you're calling it a rip off when plenty of other games that do the same thing as PASBR get a pass.

The game does have significant differences from SSB, face it.