# Handhelds Are Losing Ground.



## KingVamp (Aug 17, 2011)

QUOTE said:
			
		

> "While [the Vita] is a nice achievement from Sony in the first step it's not something we would take into consideration in the short term," said Yerli. “I think people want one mobile device that can do multiple things. Considering this, I think those handhelds are lacking in that area and they are losing ground, actually. I think they have to be more innovative."
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> "In the first place anything new and exciting gets our attention, regardless of what it is. But then the second step is does it fit to what we want to do? Will our people like to work on this? It's all very important. The team must pick it up as well, or a dedicated team we think can pick it up. But ultimately it must make sense in the context of Crytek,” he said.
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> "And then sometimes we say 'OK, that's a nice piece of technology but it doesn't fit' so we leave it. It's a matter of whether it fits basically, with the strategy of Crytek."






Source

I still believe portables are not in any danger.


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## Quietlyawesome94 (Aug 17, 2011)

Glasses free 3D isn't innovative? Thats Bull.


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## Deleted_171835 (Aug 17, 2011)

And this is coming from a company that hasn't developed a single game on a handheld.

Don't agree with him at all. I think it's completely the opposite, handhelds are gaining ground.


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## machomuu (Aug 17, 2011)

I won't say he's completely wrong, people now desire and expect for this type of thing.  They want to be able to use their gaming system as an mp3 player, a video player, and a computer all in one.

I don't think they should be those things, but it is how things are and it's rather sad.


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## Dingoo-fan 32 (Aug 17, 2011)

I agreed with this guy, android devices are popular now \o/


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## Nathan Drake (Aug 17, 2011)

Oh boy, another "smart phones are gonna kill your handhelds," idiot. They're two separate markets, no matter how hard Apple tries to push their way in. Same goes for that Android stuff from Google. I will never consider them handhelds in the sense that handhelds have come to be known.


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## chris888222 (Aug 17, 2011)

Quietlyawesome94 said:
			
		

> Glasses free 3D isn't innovative? Thats Bull.


I won't exactly say it's innovative, but I just like the fact that you can enjoy 3D games without the need of a 3DTV.

Personally I partially agree with this guy. People expect a lot out of game consoles now (including me sadly). Remember when everyone wanted the 3DS to have YouTube compatibility? And also thinking that the PSV can make phone calls before the major details were released?

But losing ground, no no. These two are on two different platforms.


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## Quietlyawesome94 (Aug 17, 2011)

dsisbetterthanxbox said:
			
		

> I agreed with this guy, android devices are popular now \o/



Agreed. But Cellphones, as popular as they may be. Are never going to be as popular gaming platforms as dedicated gaming devices are currently. This disposable game mentality should come and go soon. (I hope O_O)


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## Narayan (Aug 17, 2011)

lols.

i use my psp as mp3 player and pdf reader. but i love it most because it's a handheld gaming device. and it plays awesome games. not some "meh" angry birds.
and i don't want a phone. last phone i had was just an mp3 player. i don't call or text anyone.
i'll leave videos and surfing the web to the pc.


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## ferofax (Aug 17, 2011)

machomuu said:
			
		

> I won't say he's completely wrong, people now desire and expect for this type of thing.  They want to be able to use their gaming system as an mp3 player, a video player, and a computer all in one.
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> I don't think they should be those things, but it is how things are and it's rather sad.


of course they do, handhelds are getting expensive and powerful, it's second nature to assume that all that power can do other stuff than just gaming. which is why there's a homebrew scene, because people are driven to figure out how far they can push a handheld and see what they'll be able to do with it.

i prefer that handhelds stick to specializing in gaming, but smartphones are getting better and better, and there's just no denying that soon they're gonna be catching up with handhelds. i for one will appreciate if they decide to include other stuff that makes things easier. i mean, being able to browse any site without limitations on streaming media or whatnots on an iPad is good, but what if you can do that too on your handheld? sounds better, right? things just naturally lean that way.


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## Quietlyawesome94 (Aug 17, 2011)

Narayan said:
			
		

> lols.
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> i use my psp as mp3 player and pdf reader. but i love it most because it's a handheld gaming device. and it plays awesome games. not some "meh" angry birds.
> and i don't want a phone. last phone i had was just an mp3 player. i don't call or text anyone.



Hopefully this time next year, people will say "Angry waah?"


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## kevan (Aug 17, 2011)

Where are these figures for handhelds losing grounds?  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




I bet you there is stats but this guy needs to learn how to back
up an argument or statement in his case.


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## machomuu (Aug 17, 2011)

ferofax said:
			
		

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I wouldn't say that's the big reason why.  It's because people now expect a device to be able to do everything, to have the power at their fingertips to do whatever, whenever, and this seems to be due to the influence of things like Androids and iPhones, they disregard the fact that it's a gaming system first and that's all that should truly be priority.


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## Quietlyawesome94 (Aug 17, 2011)

machomuu said:
			
		

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Lets not forget what kind of kids are playing Video Games these days. Just the other day I hacked a psp for a 10 year old kid.
I said "Hey, why not get this kid some REAL games, and not these mindless 99 cent games and FPS Shooters". So I got him a few RPG games for some SNES emulators. As soon as he stared playing some of the games he was like "WTF I have to read to know what I am doing?" And he just kept mashing buttons expecting cool explosions and what not. It sickened me. And thats exactly what people want these days. Mindless disposable games that involve no thought process. Thats exactly what these cheap Android and Iphone games are catering too. I hope this is just a phase


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## Narayan (Aug 17, 2011)

Quietlyawesome94 said:
			
		

> Lets not forget what kind of kids are playing Video Games these days. Just the other day I hacked a psp for a 10 year old kid.
> I said "Hey, why not get this kid some REAL games, and not these mindless 99 cent games and FPS Shooters". So I got him a few RPG games for some SNES emulators. As soon as he stared playing some of the games he was like "WTF I have to read to know what I am doing?" And he just kept mashing buttons expecting cool explosions and what not. It sickened me. And thats exactly what people want these days. Mindless disposable games that involve no thought process. Thats exactly what these cheap Android and Iphone games are catering too. I hope this is just a phase


oh god no!!!
don't tell me there are a lot of kids like that???


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## DiscostewSM (Aug 17, 2011)

Wasn't there something some time ago about this same thing, but about consoles?


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## wolffangalchemist (Aug 17, 2011)

Quietlyawesome94 said:
			
		

> thats exactly what people want these days. Mindless disposable games that involve no thought process. Thats exactly what these cheap Android and Iphone games are catering too. I hope this is just a phase


i have my own daily reminder of how simplistic games are getting, in the front of my walmart is a stuffed animal rack, care to guess what these stuffed animals are?
Angry Birds......


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## ferofax (Aug 17, 2011)

machomuu said:
			
		

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...well, yes, i suppose there's that too, which is why people are getting smartphones mixed up with handhelds. there used to be a clear line between that, but Apple made a very good job of muddling that line with its iPhone/iPad games, and now people are confused.

and yes, i also refuse to accept smartphones as gaming systems. sure you can play games on them, but they weren't made specifically for them. and they lack the basic prerequisites--face buttons. on that note, i'm willing to accept the Nokia Ngage and the Sony Ericsson Xperia Play as gaming systems as well. but smartphones? no.


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## Quietlyawesome94 (Aug 17, 2011)

DiscostewSM said:
			
		

> Wasn't there something some time ago about this same thing, but about consoles?



Probably, People have been jizzing in their pants about Smartphones encroaching on dedicated console's territory for a while now.


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## junkerde (Aug 17, 2011)

btw crysis 2 fucken sucked, CRYTEK! Y UR NEW PATCH MAKE GAME BROKE!


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## Terminator02 (Aug 17, 2011)

Quietlyawesome94 said:
			
		

> Lets not forget what kind of kids are playing Video Games these days. Just the other day I hacked a psp for a 10 year old kid.
> I said "Hey, why not get this kid some REAL games, and not these mindless 99 cent games and FPS Shooters". So I got him a few RPG games for some SNES emulators. As soon as he stared playing some of the games he was like "WTF I have to read to know what I am doing?" And he just kept mashing buttons expecting cool explosions and what not. It sickened me. And thats exactly what people want these days. Mindless disposable games that involve no thought process. Thats exactly what these cheap Android and Iphone games are catering too. I hope this is just a phase


This is a 10 year old kid, what do you expect?

Also handhelds are dying to smartphones with games, you can deny it but that won"t change a thing.


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## Goofy Time (Aug 17, 2011)

More of this nonsense from yet another developer who hasn't contributed once to a good handheld game...


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## Quietlyawesome94 (Aug 17, 2011)

Terminator02 said:
			
		

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And 20 year olds who play remake after remake of games like Call of Duty are any better? First Person Shooters these days are mindless. you aim. you shoot. I even went to a friends house and played Black Ops. (I don't normally play FPS's) 
And my friends couldn't believe how much I was owning them at their own game. Why? because you aim. you shoot. thats it.  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




  It's mindless entertainment. And that's what people like these days. I am afraid that's where the gaming industry is heading to sadly enough.


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## wolffangalchemist (Aug 17, 2011)

Quietlyawesome94 said:
			
		

> And 20 year olds who play remake after remake of games like Call of Duty are any better? First Person Shooters these days are mindless. you aim. you shoot. I even went to a friends house and played Black Ops. (I don't normally play FPS's)
> And my friends couldn't believe how much I was owning them at their own game. Why? because you aim. you shoot. thats it.
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if i had a dollar for every time my friends where playing call or duty on Xbox Live, i would be a very rich man.
the games don't even have decent story modes, and don't get me started on regenerating health.


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## haflore (Aug 17, 2011)

Handhelds won't die. As has already been said, the two markets are very different. 
Plus most smartphones lack, y'know, real buttons, which are important for, y'know, real games. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




More likely handhelds will evolve to serve most PC functions, without compromising their abilities as gaming devices.


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## mudassirul (Aug 17, 2011)

Angry birds makes me sick to the bone, oh how I detest that game, I love my android but the only games I have are with snes and megadrive emulators! However I see eveywhere, everyone has phones downloading their shitty minigames! But I guess these minigames are easy to play when your on the bus or tram and are very profitable since so many people own android or iphone. I saw the PSV taking PS3's MGS on the go and I'm guessing if handhelds get powerful enough then there maybe no differentiation between the games for dedicted handheld gaming devices and home consoles except for the graphics and mobile devices may be the platform where intuitive handheld games may take place!
Times change,


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## relminator (Aug 17, 2011)

Just last week, I got hold of Angry Birds as a PSP mini and I thought it sucked (DS/PSP coders can make better homebrews).  So I told my daughter to play it for a while (she was busy with the 3DS) and after like 10 minutes she told me she'd never play it again.

There are however very good games for the android and idevices. My sister's Samsung Galaxy S have some great looking racing games.


I just hope that the time of mega-budget games are not over.  There's just no substitute for those games in the smartphone market.


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## KingVamp (Aug 17, 2011)

Quietlyawesome94 said:
			
		

> Glasses free 3D isn't innovative? Thats Bull.


No, you have to literally throw everything into one portable device to be innovative. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	





Anyway, I know they failed(?) ,but one day we will just have a device that does everything. 

A phone and a dedicated gaming device into one.


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## FireGrey (Aug 17, 2011)

They're two complete different markets.
Phones - Social things you bring around with you.
Handelds - Game playing media devices.
Games on phones are just crap
Phones are being bought more because the phone market is improving.
Handhelds are dropping cause most people already have said handhelds...


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## chartube12 (Aug 17, 2011)

Now that android 4.0 (icecream sandwich) is going to natively support keyboards, xb360 and ps3 controllers, I fully expect there to be at least one tablet with graphics comparable to the 3ds.


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## Bladexdsl (Aug 17, 2011)

FireGrey said:
			
		

> Games on phones are just crap


most are but those are the most that sell you'd be surprised how many time waster games peeps buy so they can play while waiting for a bus/train!


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## Arm73 (Aug 17, 2011)

Sadly, that's the way the market is going with future generations.
Just 10 days ago, I hacked my 12 years old nephew's PSP and put a few games on it like Metal Gear Solid, Assassin Creed , PES 2011 and the two God of War games. He loved it and all, but after that he told me  that he really wanted to get an iPhone for Christmas so he could play the latest games on it ( I think he mentioned Splinter Cell or something ).
I told him why in the world with free PSP and DS great games,  he wanted to get a device that is a phone first, and then with  some gaming capability tackled on ?. He likes serious games, so I told him that very few games are really playable without analogs and face buttons, and that most hardcore games are ported from handheld consoles anyway !  
Get the iPhone if you think you will use it as a phone, but getting it purely for the games ? That doesn't make any sense to me, but sadly, that is what kids think nowadays and that's their idea of being " cool "


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## raulpica (Aug 17, 2011)

Funny, I do remember getting an iPhone over the other smartphones thinking of all the nice games and ports it had.

And the funnier thing is that most of my handheld gaming is ACTUALLY done on my iPhone.

So, deal with it, that's the direction the market's going. With the even more powerful Tegra 3s and such coming our way, smartphones will be soon on par with the home-consoles in terms of graphical fidelity.

This will mean that most people will choose a 300$ tablet with AWESOME graphics over a 300$ homeconsole with similiar graphics.
Hey, I mean... a tablet is portable and can also browse the web, take pictures and upload them to Facebook. ...Can your console do that?


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## hova1 (Aug 17, 2011)

i played more games on my iPhone in the past several months then on my DS. I even stopped playing DQ6. 
I see people playing games on their smartphones who would never ever play a videogame on a console or handheld.
The games are cheap too. The Penny Arcade comic is right. You buy one 3DS game for 40$
and i buy 40 games for 40$, let's see who has more fun.


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## SamAsh07 (Aug 17, 2011)

Stupid claim, handhelds are much more popular now than before.

Again, Smartphones and Hand-helds, different market, different pattern.


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## SamAsh07 (Aug 17, 2011)

raulpica said:
			
		

> a tablet is portable and can also browse the web, take pictures and upload them to Facebook. ...Can your console do that?


My DSi can browse the web, take pictures AND upload them to Facebook 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




Even plays Songs.


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## heartgold (Aug 17, 2011)

As much as I like to deny it, smartphones will be the future of handheld gaming in the future, by the looks of it it'll be sooner than I think. :/

/


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## shakirmoledina (Aug 17, 2011)

its about graphics thats all. ppl just wanna play games with good graphics but thats not a game anymore is it?
IMO, ppl are shifting to iphones and tablets bcz
1. its cooler
2. u can do more than games
3. great graphics
4. cheaper games
5. Diversity and ever increasing library of games
6. everyone is doing it

i think these 6 points are enough to sell non-gaming oriented devices like iphones and ipads.

if u are a gamer (and i dont mean a raulpica type gamer --- jokin bro) then there is no way u will enjoy an action, sports, advanced controls game on anything but a console or handheld with REAL buttons

even playing something as great as the gba emu on the iphone really is annoying. u just cannot do so unless u force yerself... then thats not fun

well again, its a matter of preference but I do not agree at all the handhelds are losing ground.

ppl cannot pay $300 for a great handheld but are ready to pay $600 for an (overpriced) iphone

EDIT: the points just keep increasing


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## Redhorse (Aug 17, 2011)

I think a dedicated gamer (not necc hard core) willl play anything thier favorite game is on. Those used to dedicated handhelds will stay there but those new to gaming and the iphone being available as thier first handheld will choose that. Will the Ipod or Iphone kill the DS? not IMO. But if Nintendo continues to promote these minigames (and Sony too) they are in danger of converting those new to thier console, to a phone type device. I think these shallow games for a dedicated handheld are a bad idea. I don't mean puzzle style, I refer to depth of content.

I'll keep playing the DSi until 5 years after they have run out of releases...(Advance Wars Rocks!)


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## raulpica (Aug 17, 2011)

SamAsh07 said:
			
		

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Sure, but any tablet out there can browse the web a LOT better than the DSi (I've heard that the internal browser is abysmal), take pictures at a much HIGHER resolution (not VGA) and use all the Facebook's functions 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




That's why smartphones/tablets are massively eating their way into the Handhelds market. Better value for money.


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## chris888222 (Aug 17, 2011)

raulpica said:
			
		

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The largest thing about Smartphones/tablets is that they are NOT dedicated gaming devices but just casual gaming software..


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## raulpica (Aug 17, 2011)

chris888222 said:
			
		

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People don't care about that. They want functionality.

The only ones who care about games are the hardcore gamers, which are a REAL minority, in terms of market shares.


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## FireGrey (Aug 17, 2011)

raulpica said:
			
		

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Hardcore gamers a minority?
No way!


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## Bladexdsl (Aug 17, 2011)

tablets are getting more and more popular all the time and you can do pretty much anything on them (except the crappy ipad 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




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that's why Nintendo turned their controller into one


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## prowler (Aug 17, 2011)

Bladexdsl said:
			
		

> tablets are getting more and more popular all the time and you can do pretty much anything on them (except the crappy ipad
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But it isn't a tablet.


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## koimayeul (Aug 17, 2011)

maybe by next gen it will only be tablet and smartphones but for now.. handhelds are still good to go


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## CCNaru (Aug 17, 2011)

Japan sold 200k 3DS units after price drop... the problem's not in the console itself but the companies


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## Bladexdsl (Aug 17, 2011)

prowler_ said:
			
		

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could have fooled me


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## FAST6191 (Aug 17, 2011)

In some ways I will have to agree- what some people want (for better or worse those commenting here are far from a representative cross section of the consumer), what others will accept (for a kind of example consider all the tetris clones and then what "proper" tetris fans will accept) and what that does to the profits for various games, types/genres and their commercial viability- games in the regard that most are discussing here are still a commercial medium and there is no real incentive towards arty stuff like films where serious risk or even probable losses/expense will be endured and not all that much in the way of government funded stuff (thinking the likes of the BBC or even the various film/entertainment councils of various parts of the world).

Personally I am looking back in time to the 1980s as I see a lot of echoes of then in the present day.


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## machomuu (Aug 17, 2011)

Bladexdsl said:
			
		

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That's less than surprising.

Seriously though, it's not a tablet.


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## relminator (Aug 17, 2011)

chartube12 said:
			
		

> Now that android 4.0 (icecream sandwich) is going to natively support keyboards, xb360 and ps3 controllers, I fully expect there to be at least one tablet with graphics comparable to the 3ds.



Well, my sister's samsung galaxy's racing game has better gfx than ridgeracer 3ds.


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## doyama (Aug 17, 2011)

Not entirely shocking. The Apple App store has really brought gaming to the true masses at this point on mobile devices. They've also created a huge price descreptancy between phone/tablet market and the handheld market that is going to be hard to overcome for Nintendo/Sony. Infintiy Blade by Epic has shown that visually and gameplay wise phone/tablets can create a compelling experience. Whether the decreased price point is going to enable a lot of game companies to do something as high quality as that within the $9.99 budget is one problem though.


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## ShadowSoldier (Aug 17, 2011)

Crytek big honcho is a troll.


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## GundamXXX (Aug 17, 2011)

The earth is flat

There is no .com bubble

Our economy is doing fine

In 2020 we will be driving hovercars

The world will end last month


Just sayin...


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## KingVamp (Aug 17, 2011)

doyama said:
			
		

> Not entirely shocking. The Apple App store has really brought gaming to the true masses at this point on mobile devices. They've also created a huge price descreptancy between phone/tablet market and the handheld market that is going to be hard to overcome for Nintendo/Sony. Infintiy Blade by Epic has shown that visually and gameplay wise phone/tablets can create a compelling experience. Whether the decreased price point is going to enable a lot of game companies to do something as high quality as that within the $9.99 budget is one problem though.


I look on you tube on that and to me if the game was made for a game dedicated
handheld,the game would have been much better. 

Some (if not most)phone games are just clones,focus parts from real games with some bad controls, lacking contents and with bad animation.


Not saying there aren't good games,but it doesn't nowhere near beat most of handheld games.

I whether play a good psp game (like GOW or Tale games) or ds game (like Kingdom Hearts or Zelda)  than Infintiy Blade.

Look at this.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7BjiiSwR5Lc[/youtube]


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## Terminator02 (Aug 18, 2011)

actually a pretty good video, thanks kingvamp

i definitely agree that the DS will remain the best selling handheld because the whole casual market they focused on are now going towards iOS devices


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## Windaga (Aug 18, 2011)

I have my PSP (and eventually a Vita) and DS/3DS for my handheld games. I have a HTC Phone, and while it's nice that I can play a few emulated games on it, there's no buttons, and there's no dedicated titles that really draw me. For the current market, for me personally, there's still a need to carry both a phone and a handheld gaming device. Angry Birds and Nova just don't cut it for me - the lack of buttons really hurt, and even with a controller or those nub buttons, it's not the same.


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## DSGamer64 (Aug 18, 2011)

Nathan Drake said:
			
		

> Oh boy, another "smart phones are gonna kill your handhelds," idiot. They're two separate markets, no matter how hard Apple tries to push their way in. Same goes for that Android stuff from Google. I will never consider them handhelds in the sense that handhelds have come to be known.



When Nvidia has pushed more advanced Tegra chips out the door in the next few years, the PS Vita and 3DS will be eating the dust unfortunately.


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## Nathan Drake (Aug 18, 2011)

DSGamer64 said:
			
		

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A cellphone will never be a handheld. They will never have the third party support they need in the right places. As has been mentioned multiple times, $.99 games are nowhere near the same as what you get on a handheld.


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## KingVamp (Aug 18, 2011)

Nathan Drake said:
			
		

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Why can't Tegra or equivalent chips be in handhelds anyway?

You (DSGamer64) at like handhelds can't or not allow to get these chips.

I did not see how phone games can fill you gaming needs over the handhelds...

@Terminator02 np


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## Terminator02 (Aug 18, 2011)

Nathan Drake said:
			
		

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they most certainly do have 3rd party support and it only gets stronger and larger with time, popcap, EA, activision, all of the big publishers realize where we are headed, and most all of them are already in the smartphone business aswell as the traditional handheld markets

and it's not like the app store has nothing but $0.99 apps, developers/publishers can put whatever price they want, as well as make as deep a game as they are willing to


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## Oveneise (Aug 18, 2011)

What a crock of shit. The DS pretty much popularized touch-based gaming and now Nintendo introduces us to Glassless-3D. I'm in no worry. Handhelds are doing good now imo.


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## Haloman800 (Aug 18, 2011)

raulpica said:
			
		

> Funny, I do remember getting an iPhone over the other smartphones thinking of all the nice games and ports it had.
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Yes. It's called a DSi.


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## TheDarkSeed (Aug 18, 2011)

Haloman800 said:
			
		

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*Owned*


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## Hielkenator (Aug 18, 2011)

I'm 33 and just recently bought a DS Lite with and acekard, ez-flash3in1, and 5 8GB sd cards.
New for about 200 euro's, incl original softshell + see through hard shell.

BEST investment since my Wii 5 years ago, most ds games ( mainly rpg's ) are a very fullfilling gaming experience.

With the addition of the GBA Card slot and my ez flash, I'm also enjoying the WHOLE GBA library.
Add lameboy ( gameboy classic/ color emulator) to the equesion, and it almost 20 years of epic gaming right in your handpalms. YOU CAN"T BEAT THAT.

( I just love pixelart style games. )


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## DSGamer64 (Aug 18, 2011)

KingVamp said:
			
		

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My point flew over both of your heads. Even now the Tegra 2 chip is a strong piece of technology and the 3DS and PS Vita are going to have a hard time competing with more advanced chips in about 2 or 3 years. Nvidia is pushing Tegra hard, apparently Tegra 3 is in late stages of development and is going to be released soon. The Tegra 2 is a dual core, Tegra 3 is a quad core. If you have seen any of the high end games and applications for Android, you would know that Tegra 2 is already pushing some decent looking games on tablet computers and phones. These aren't cheap little micro games either, obviously some time has been put into making them. It's going to come down to the developers in the next few years as to which direction portable gaming heads. I hate touch screen controls, but the constant visual improvements in Android based portables is improving rapidly.


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## wrettcaughn (Aug 18, 2011)

Something that's being missed in the discussion...

What percentage of "casual" gamers (younger kids/clueless parents/average "non-game-obsessed" people) are going to pay another couple hundred dollars on a handheld when they have a cellphone that can give them access the types of games they play?

Being a "gaming" community here at GBAtemp, it's difficult to understand that while there are many "gamers" worldwide, it's still a niche community.  Even further, handheld gaming is a niche community of a niche community.  I agree, it's nice having all of these deep, well developed games in my pocket, but I'm in the minority among the people I actually know (in person) who play video games of any sort.

That fact that this is a gaming community, everyone here is likely of the mind that "Handhelds are popular and you can do everything you want with them"...  But looking at the market as a whole, it's closer to comparing McDonald's Dollar menu to their "higher end" burgers.  Sure, some people would rather have a Double Quarter Pounder w/Cheese, but for most people, a McDouble is enough...


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## nando (Aug 18, 2011)

most people are viewing this through the 50 hour per game gamer glasses. a lot of kids and gamers never liked those types of games but "dedicated gaming" devices were the way to go if you wanted to play any games. but now that is not the case, now you can have a more useful device that covers many basic gaming needs without having to have a "dedicated gaming" device. therefore yes, handhelds are losing ground. just face it


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## Nathanaël (Aug 18, 2011)

nando said:
			
		

> most people are viewing this through the 50 hour per game gamer glasses. a lot of kids and gamers never liked those types of games but "dedicated gaming" devices were the way to go if you wanted to play any games.



Agree. 50 hours for a game is quite long. And boring. 10-20 hours maximum is OK.


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## machomuu (Aug 18, 2011)

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50 hours isn't that long, really.


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## wrettcaughn (Aug 18, 2011)

machomuu said:
			
		

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exactly nando's point...


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## machomuu (Aug 18, 2011)

Old8oy said:
			
		

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I understand that, but that's not exactly the point of my post, Nando's saying that the majority or casual gamer market buys games that are usually short and time-wasting, while we are used to long[er] games as gamers,  However Nathaneal is saying that 50 hours is too long for a game, and 10-20 hours is good, which wasn't exactly Nando's point.  We're talking short and sweet games that sell for little and for the most part are unseen on consoles.


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## wrettcaughn (Aug 18, 2011)

machomuu said:
			
		

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I see.  so you're just demonstrating the different tiers then?  Nathanael is a more "casual" gamer while you are more "hardcore"?  To the casual gamer, 50+ hours of story is a pretty substantial investment of time.


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## machomuu (Aug 18, 2011)

Old8oy said:
			
		

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Well, yes and no.  For the casual gamer we're talking about short and sweet games that sell for little and for the most part are unseen on consoles, and when they are on consoles they usually cost more than they would on a mobile phone.  For instance, someone like me would be able to play through something like Final Fantasy or Metal Gear Solid, long games that require time and attention and have long cut scenes and are very story oriented, while a casual gamer from this generation might only be able to play a game like Call of Duty, Cut the Rope, or Angry Birds, one where it doesn't require much time and attention, and the story is thin and simple so as not to divert or delay the gameplay and in the long run can be ignored or skipped.


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## Dingoo-fan 32 (Aug 18, 2011)

Nathanaël said:
			
		

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Yeah, i get bored with 30 minutes of Final Fantasy 3, i prefer more short games


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## prowler (Aug 18, 2011)

A 50 hour game can be made casual, just look at FFXIII.
I still love it though.


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## Nathanaël (Aug 18, 2011)

I think 'casual gamer' is a difficult word.

But some people like puzzle games, for example. Logic games or action puzzle games. These games are usually 10-15 hours long, some even 30 hours. 

The big point of this games is the replay value.

Not everybody likes epic RPGs all the time or platform game. Especially on a small handheld screen... In a bus or train... There are different sorts of games.


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## machomuu (Aug 18, 2011)

Nathanaël said:
			
		

> I think 'casual gamer' is a difficult word.
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When did I say anything about RPGs?


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## wrettcaughn (Aug 18, 2011)

machomuu said:
			
		

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and that is precisely the point.  in a niche community like this, you're more likely to find people with the "free time" to play these games.

and if you've taken a look at the app store any time recently, you'll see games like FFIII and FF:Tactics up there.  turn based games are a horrible example of handheld games as they are the easiest to make the transition, control wise, to a touch screen.  it's only a matter of time before there are full re-releases of all the rest of the FF games along with full releases of Metal Gear, Dead Space, CoD, etc...  (though there already are 3D releases for games from those franchises...)


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## machomuu (Aug 18, 2011)

Old8oy said:
			
		

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I don't think that's just it, if you've met the people who play these mobile games most of the time it's the fact that they like the games rather than a matter of time.  It's more a interest than time, it just happens to be convenient and helps, getting someone who is a mobile/casual gamer to play something like MGS is hard and they'll easily think it's boring.  Plus, I wouldn't say they're horrible examples of handheld games, handheld =/= mobile, and the JRPG market is slowly transitioning to the handheld market and doing a fine job at that.


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## wrettcaughn (Aug 18, 2011)

machomuu said:
			
		

> I don't think that's just it, *if you've met the people who play these mobile games *most of the time it's the fact that they like the games rather than a matter of time.  It's more a interest than time, it just happens to be convenient and helps, getting someone who is a mobile/casual gamer to play something like MGS is hard and they'll easily think it's boring.



you say that like it a sickness...and like mobile games aren't really games  
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





I think I've met some of "those" people.  My wife probably has 50+ hours into Angry Birds.  I think that makes her just as hardcore a gamer as anyone on this site.  Have you played that game past the first 20 levels?  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




I enjoy Angry Birds as much as I enjoy any other game.  If I have "time" to sit and play a game for a couple hours, I'll turn on my Xbox.  If I'm just relaxing I might just bring out my iPod...or read a book.  I've had a DS/DSi.  I've had a PSP.  There's a reason I no longer do.  Maybe it's the fact that I'm out of my teens and have responsibilities and that's the market cellphones are going after with their "casual gaming".  Or maybe today's handheld games just aren't as fun and you want to think they are


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## Maedhros (Aug 19, 2011)

DSGamer64 said:
			
		

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Phones are made to talk, they need to be on most of the time. Gaming on phones will never be a priority of people who need phones on most of their time. Gaming in these devices are just for time killing. And the experience they get is limited, because of:
- Cost ($0.99 limit what resources the developers will use for these games, this model is a two-edge knife)
- Input (most of the games are the ones suited for touch controls only. The ones who gets a virtual pad all fucking sucks, for gamers at least).

Even if the next Tegra chips come out next year, it'll still not be on par with handheld devices games, because of the reasons I gave (and because of the middlewares optmized for Vita/3DS platforms, they'll gave resources for the games be even more beautifull in the second generation of releases for both of them). 

Smartphones will always be popular for the other things they do, though.


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## ShakeBunny (Aug 20, 2011)

I think this is true. Now that most phones are capable to game-worthy graphics /and/ so many other features, handheld developers are going to need to push the envelope in any way the can to keep people interested.

When the DS Lite came out, I was all over it, but I let the 3DS pass by with a simple, "Meh," because I now own a phone that satisfies all of my on-the-go gaming needs. Moreover, my phone is also an MP3 player, camera, mobile internet browser, and phone.

With only better graphics and 3D being added to the lineup, I can understand why Nintendo's handheld sales are hurting.


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## Mantis41 (Aug 20, 2011)

A phone still needs proper controls to make it game worthy. I think it's a fad at the mom that will pass.


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## BORTZ (Aug 20, 2011)

I dont know guys. After some research, it looks like even though this guy has no authority in the mobile/handheld market, phones are starting to cut into the handheld profit. 

Listen i dont like what im hearing, but its starting to scare me. I dont think that its gonna be a fad. 

I can buy a shitty game for a dollar (or even get it for free with the lite version), where as buying an Imagine game for $40 is much larger of a bad decision. I can get 40 terrible games and feel much better than buying one shovelware title.


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## machomuu (Aug 20, 2011)

Old8oy said:
			
		

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Why do you say "you", don't you mean "I"?  I still have my DSiXL, and I'm very happy with it.  Besides, you make it sound like handhelds are for kids.

Also, are you saying the hours you put into a game, despite what type of game it is, determines the type of gamer you are?


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