# Pachter Believes PS Vita Will Rob Nintendo’s Market Share



## Zekrom_cool (Jul 3, 2011)

Outspoken industry analyst Michael Pachter is under the impression that Sony’s forthcoming PlayStation Vita will rob Nintendo of precious market space. Pachter also believes that Sony’s handheld will most “likely contribute to further declines in Nintendo’s share price”. Do you believe that the PlayStation Vita is as big a threat to Nintendo as Pachter is making out to be?[/p]



			
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> “We continue to believe that handheld game sales will suffer in correlation to the growth of smart phone sales, although we think that the handheld games business will remain a healthy niche for the foreseeable future,” he said in an investor note.
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> “With that said, Sony’s announcement of PS Vita pricing (at $249) led many investors to believe that Sony and Nintendo will divide a shrinking handheld market, and likely contributed to further declines in Nintendo’s share price.”
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Source


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## syko5150 (Jul 3, 2011)

I don't think the Vita will be as successful as Sony hopes it will. I will definitely be buying one, but there are a lot of people(including my friends and family) who just don't trust Sony anymore after recent events. I'm sure that the Vita will have more success than the PSP had, but I think people in general have more faith in Nintendo at this point. Especially people who have only recently stepped into the world of gaming thanks to Nintendo's casual we make games for everyone style. I have to say it would be nice to see more competition between Sony and Nintendo this time around rather than it being completely one sided.


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## Zekrom_cool (Jul 3, 2011)

syko5150 said:
			
		

> I don't think the Vita will be as successful as Sony hopes it will. I will definitely be buying one, but there are a lot of people(including my friends and family) who just don't trust Sony anymore after recent events. I'm sure that the Vita will have more success than the PSP had, but I think people in general have more faith in Nintendo at this point. Especially people who have only recently stepped into the world of gaming thanks to Nintendo's casual we make games for everyone style. I have to say it would be nice to see more competition between Sony and Nintendo this time around rather than it being completely one sided.


The competition is there and this is Michael Pachter telling about the stock and not Sony themselves.


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## syko5150 (Jul 3, 2011)

Zekrom_cool said:
			
		

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Even so, Sony lost a lot of face with all of the recent events. They're going to have to prove to stock holders and everyone else alike that they can rebound properly before Sony can even start to steal any of Nintendo's market. I can't speak for other people, but in my opinion it would be very foolish for anyone to invest in Sony until they have proven that nothing similar can happen in the near future.


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## chris888222 (Jul 3, 2011)

Personally, I don't find it such a threat. Maybe a little, but not a total rob. Nintendo themselves aren't stupid as well.


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## frazzledazzle (Jul 3, 2011)

all nintendo needs to do is bring some really good games out for the 3ds, and make sure the wii u isnt too expensive. The PS Vita does look good but, like with the psp, it'll be something i'll buy if theres really good games and there is homebrew at some point, the only reason i bought my psp was for emulators and a few of the good games on it. Also, more competition means higher quality games!


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## Youkai (Jul 3, 2011)

sony already thaught that the psp would completely kill Nintendos handheld and what happened ? sony was crying out loud that noone bought their console.


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## Zekrom_cool (Jul 3, 2011)

Youkai said:
			
		

> sony already thaught that the psp would completely kill Nintendos handheld and what happened ? sony was crying out loud that noone bought their console.


Sony got a taste of underestimating Nintendo.


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## Nathan Drake (Jul 3, 2011)

Zekrom_cool said:
			
		

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No, they got a taste of being a fresh competitor in a previously completely Nintendo owned market. No company has been able to produce handhelds as popular and well selling as Nintendo, so instead of trying, many just gave up. The PSP was neat, but nobody wanted the new handheld. They wanted Nintendo's slick, two screened device. Nintendo doesn't really have a master driving gimmick this go around, as 3D has proved to not be the super seller that it was meant to be (I mean, just look at the name *3D*S). Because of this, Sony's new handheld has a chance to get its foot in the door and to make an impact. The Vita also made a fairly good impact at E3, with the ability to show off many features right then and there in an enjoyable way.

As much as I would love to ride the "Nintendo is the handheld king!" train, the 3DS isn't going to pick up for awhile yet when it comes to sales. It may be more than enough time to get indecisive buyers who only want one system, to go straight for the Vita.

I also find it odd that people think that the average consumer is even going to really remember Sony's fuck up come November or December this year. We can't forget it, only because nobody will shut up about it. When you weren't really affected to begin with, as well as sitting inside of a community that doesn't really focus in on it (ie: most gamers), it doesn't matter much. Tons of people wanted PSN back up just so they could throw more money at it the first day it was back. Pretty sure that nobody is going to care as much as a few would like to think.


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## Zekrom_cool (Jul 3, 2011)

QUOTE said:
			
		

> *Nintendo owned market*




I dont think this part is true. PSP was quite good to match up too.


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## Nathan Drake (Jul 3, 2011)

Zekrom_cool said:
			
		

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The PSP did absolutely terrible when compared the the DS, you know, its only real competitor. I would also say that Nintendo consistently making well selling handhelds for the better part of the last 25 years is pretty much the definition of owning the handheld market, especially when no competitor has ever really been able to come close to the sales Nintendo is able to generate. It would be nothing but ignorance to say that Nintendo hasn't ruled the handheld market for quite awhile now.


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## ZAFDeltaForce (Jul 3, 2011)

I think it's way too early to make any assumptions.

In the past, the PSP was pitched against it's archnemesis, the DS. Though the hardware of the PSP was top notch and provided excellent graphics, it's market share paled in comparison to the DS, which stood dominant in the handheld arena with it's innovative gameplay and affordability.

With the PS Vita, no one knows. It comes with all the gimmicks in the book; hardware, touch screen, dual analog sticks, touch pad at the back and hell, even 3G. Sure, there'll be innovative gameplay. But with cost price in consideration, we can only wait and see how it actually performs in the market.


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## Zekrom_cool (Jul 3, 2011)

Nathan Drake said:
			
		

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That is your opinion. I agree that Nintendo is better I also feel that Sony did quite a good job at least in the part of the world where I live.


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## Joe88 (Jul 3, 2011)

Zekrom_cool said:
			
		

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how is it not true

there was nothing competing with nintendo in the handheld market at the time


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## syko5150 (Jul 3, 2011)

Zekrom_cool said:
			
		

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It's not really opinion at all. The Nintendo DS outsold even the PS2 in total sales and is nearly 80million units ahead of PSP. If anything PSP could barely make a dent in Nintendo's handheld market.


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## SamAsh07 (Jul 3, 2011)

It won't kill it, when PS Vita releases, there will be a flood of 3DS titles of Kid Icarus, Paper Mario, Super Mario 3D, Mario Kart, MGS, Animal Crossing and Luigis Mansion 2. These titles will rob the PS Vita's initial stages and then the true war of 3DS and PSV will kick off.


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## Zekrom_cool (Jul 3, 2011)

Ok fine. Sony did bad. Lets cut it out.


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## Nathan Drake (Jul 3, 2011)

SamAsh07 said:
			
		

> It won't kill it, when PS Vita releases, there will be a flood of 3DS titles of Kid Icarus, Paper Mario, Super Mario 3D, Mario Kart, MGS, Animal Crossing and Luigis Mansion 2. These titles will rob the PS Vita's initial stages and then the true war of 3DS and PSV will kick off.



The Vita is supposed to launch Holiday 2011, not Holiday 2013.


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## syko5150 (Jul 3, 2011)

SamAsh07 said:
			
		

> It won't kill it, when PS Vita releases, there will be a flood of 3DS titles of Kid Icarus, Paper Mario, Super Mario 3D, Mario Kart, MGS, Animal Crossing and Luigis Mansion 2. These titles will rob the PS Vita's initial stages and then the true war of 3DS and PSV will kick off.


I think Nintendo will definitely start to pick up sales once they have more of their big titles coming out as you mentioned. Last generation Nintendo had the obvious advantage in the handheld market, but I think it will be interesting to see how Sony's big titles such as Uncharted, Killzone, LittleBigPlanet and the likes compete with Mario and Zelda. It might just make things more interesting this time around, but if Nintendo wises up and starts marketing the 3DS better and eventually continues to throw out major titles every few months I don't think Vita will make it.


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## Zekrom_cool (Jul 3, 2011)

Ultimately we all conclude that Patcher's prediction is wrong, right?


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## SamAsh07 (Jul 3, 2011)

Nathan Drake said:
			
		

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And these titles I mentioned are coming by Holiday 2011 not 2013, at most Animal Crossing and Paper Mario might miss out and release in early 2012.


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## Hielkenator (Jul 3, 2011)

Nintendo franchises and good 3rd party support makes 3ds a very big mountain to climb for Sony.


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## Joe88 (Jul 3, 2011)

syko5150 said:
			
		

> The Nintendo DS outsold even the PS2 in total sales


since when?

going by various sites the DS it still about 5 mil units behind in total sales


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## SamAsh07 (Jul 3, 2011)

syko5150 said:
			
		

> The Nintendo DS outsold even the PS2 in total sales


Lolwut  Sir the PS2 is the best selling console in the history of games, DS never outsold it, nope. DS has sold around 60m+ units where as PS2 is near or already at 100m+....no wait it sold even more:-
The PS2 is the best-selling console of all time, having reached over 150 million units sold as of January 31, 2011 (Right from Wikipedia)


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## Nathan Drake (Jul 3, 2011)

Zekrom_cool said:
			
		

> Ultimately we all conclude that Patcher's prediction is wrong, right?
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If I'm not mistaken, Luigi's Mansion 2 has a TBA 2012 release date, and the rest don't appear to really have NA release dates. The only release dates I can find seem to be for the Japanese versions of the games, which doesn't help to sell the 3DS in the rest of the world.


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## syko5150 (Jul 3, 2011)

Zekrom_cool said:
			
		

> Ultimately we all conclude that Patcher's prediction is wrong, right?


I wouldn't say the prediction is wrong yet. I disagree with it of course, but I don't know if Sony has any tricks up it's sleeve to really pull it off as far as games that can compete with the major titles from Nintendo, but Sony could really surprise us you never know in the gaming world. Not investing in a company like Nintendo that sold 235million units between the DS and Wii would seem crazy to me. Nintendo is at the top of their game right now, and all it will take to boost 3DS sales is for more great titles to come out, which they are later this year/early next year.

@samash07: here's a link that proves it 

http://www.vgchartz.com/hardware_totals.php


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## The Catboy (Jul 3, 2011)

I really don't think this system is going to be as big a success as they are trying to make it out to be.


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## Zekrom_cool (Jul 3, 2011)

Nathan Drake said:
			
		

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Once you say that it is hard for sony to beat Nintendo's market share and now you are saying that patcher's prediction is not wrong. Who do you support : 3ds of PSV?


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## Ace Overclocked (Jul 3, 2011)

SamAsh07 said:
			
		

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both
fanboyism is not very good imo just play the games you like

i have gathered 150 euro for the vita so far and i'll buy it when it gets hacked but if square enix takes over again it'll be instant buy


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## Nathan Drake (Jul 3, 2011)

Zekrom_cool said:
			
		

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For the love of fuck, nobody knows anything yet. The Vita hasn't even been released, and I just said the PSP did bad *because it did*. I said Nintendo has dominated the handheld market *because it has*. Or am I supposed to lie to prove a point about my loyalty?

If you try to purposefully turn this into more of a PSV vs 3DS thread than it is already going to be, it's just going to be locked for being another useless debate.


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## SamAsh07 (Jul 3, 2011)

Nathan Drake said:
			
		

> If I'm not mistaken, Luigi's Mansion 2 has a TBA 2012 release date, and the rest don't appear to really have NA release dates. The only release dates I can find seem to be for the Japanese versions of the games, which doesn't help to sell the 3DS in the rest of the world.


Luigis Mansion 2 - Q1 2012 (All regions) Which is when PS Vita will be in the Market
Super Mario 3D - Holiday 2011 (All regions)
Mario Kart - Holiday 2011 (All regions again)
Paper Mario - November 2011 (EU, NA and JP)
MGS - November 2011 (EU, NA and JP again)

Like I said AC might miss out from this.


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## Nathan Drake (Jul 3, 2011)

SamAsh07 said:
			
		

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I enjoy that Nintendo is actually making an attempt to get the big name titles everywhere at once vs months in advance in Japan. Those titles are only being kept to that time to boost holiday sales, and probably as a marketing stunt to try to hurt the Vita's launch. I can't think of another time that any company has kept so many big name titles into such a short span of time for so many regions. Of course, is this a sign that Nintendo is scared of the Vita, or just a preemptive strike to make an attempt to keep the Vita from getting to its feet?


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## syko5150 (Jul 3, 2011)

Nathan Drake said:
			
		

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Well if you think about it people have enjoyed hundreds of titles with Mario in it for over 20 years. Many parents, myself included, would rather have our kids playing clean fun games like Mario or other games Nintendo releases compared to games like Uncharted. Now don't get me wrong, I personally love the Uncharted series, but it's just not something that most parents want to buy for their kids. When the holiday season rolls around parents are more likely to buy a Nintendo product compared to a Sony product because they can trust Nintendo to provide their children with good clean fun. I think Nintendo are not only trying to get people to buy the 3DS, but are blocking the Vita from getting launch time recognition it would otherwise get. The only hope for Sony at this point for the holiday season is if they come out with some crazy awesome launch line-up if they want to beat out Nintendo. Just my opinion.


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## Erdnaxela (Jul 3, 2011)

Of course nintendo is scared of the PSVita, now they can only makes good profit instead of huge profit.
I think it's time for sony to get the highest market part now, nintendo already made so much $, and it'll probably force nintendo to release some game like F-Zero or a new Starfox.


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## Nathan Drake (Jul 3, 2011)

A solid launch with all functions actually, you know, there that were promised would place it leagues above the 3DS launch (maybe not in sales, of course). Nintendo is really trying to take advantage of its characters really early. I'm wondering if this won't hurt the 3DS later, and just give the Vita the chance to really kick off a little later.


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## Youkai (Jul 3, 2011)

Well as you are already discussing about the games getting released for 3ds, i think this is the biggest minus for sony, except for some shooter and racing games the psp hardly had any good games, even thaught lately there were some games released that interested many like kingdom hearts  but still Nintendo allways has MORE games and even more good games. (even thaught there are more shovelware as well)

I for one "hate" shooter and really dislike racing games still I got a psp but it was not really worth it for me.

IF and i say IF !! the Vita gets MORE games with many different genres it might really be able to get the 3ds but only if there will be really many good quality games and best with big names.


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## Nathan Drake (Jul 3, 2011)

Youkai said:
			
		

> Well as you are already discussing about the games getting released for 3ds, i think this is the biggest minus for sony, except for some shooter and racing games the psp hardly had any good games, even thaught lately there were some games released that interested many like kingdom hearts  but still Nintendo allways has MORE games and even more good games. (even thaught there are more shovelware as well)
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> IF and i say IF !! the Vita gets MORE games with many different genres it might really be able to get the 3ds but only if there will be really many good quality games and best with big names.



A common misconception about PSP games from somebody who owns a PSP. I'm baffled. The PSP is a fantastic RPG machine. There are incredible action games. More than one awesome platformer. I don't even touch the shooters and racing games, and I've had tons of fun with my PSP. I've also owned a DS since launch. For every handful of good DS games, there is definitely one great PSP game. The PSP library is very underrated when compared to the rather overrated DS library.


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## FireGrey (Jul 3, 2011)

Sure, the Vita will beat the Wii U.
But rob is a harsh way of putting it...


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## chris888222 (Jul 3, 2011)

To me it all comes in the games. A powerful console need not be better.

The vita has already proven to have a great game database. 3DS will also have great games coming. 

No offense but I am very very worried about these two consoles in some areas.

The vita, yes games are good, prices are good, but what I'm worried about is that it will have multiple revisions of the console. The DS/PSP already had a ton of revisions and people are somehow fed up with it. Nintendo did say that they have 'learnt their lesson', but we can't say for sure. Sony didn't mention anything about this. (correct me if I'm wrong, but I haven't heard of any such news)

The 3DS, great games coming... or not? Some highly anticipated games such as Mercenaries 3D did not stand out as expected, and the MGS trailer was disappointing. Will this continue, or is it just a matter of time?


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## Nathan Drake (Jul 3, 2011)

FireGrey said:
			
		

> Sure, the Vita will beat the Wii U.
> But rob is a harsh way of putting it...



When somebody mentions the Vita is a threat against Nintendo, they are basically saying it will be a threat in the handheld market against Nintendo. Last I checked, we had established that the Wii U also had a console with it.


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## KingVamp (Jul 3, 2011)

FireGrey said:
			
		

> Sure, the Vita will beat the Wii U.
> But rob is a harsh way of putting it...


1) just... just no and 
2) He was comparing it to the 3DS

Maybe a little threat,it not like a killer handheld.

I worry that too. The stronger the handheld, the more likely console ports...


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## Ace Overclocked (Jul 3, 2011)

Nathan Drake said:
			
		

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exactly the same thing for me
i bought the psp for kh bbs but then after modding it i found alot of exellent games especially rpgs and SE games
like dissidia, phantasy star portable 2, cc ff7 etc...
if the vita will be like the psp or better it will be a must have for me
i also enjoyed my ds alot and gave me thousands hours of gameplay!(in 2 years the gba gave me 900 hours of gameplay without a flashcart too) and i hope the 3ds will have such exhilarating games


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## chris888222 (Jul 3, 2011)

To me, the PSP is a wonderful handheld (especially with my fav monster hunter). But there are simply just too many who 'hate' sony and claim that PSP ain't got game. Many are actually very excited over the PSV, so am I. I don't care about what OLED multitouch, duo analog or touch rear but it does have the games people want.

I love Nintendo as well, especially the 3DS. I didn't like the Wii though, but at least it was the first step to motion control gaming.


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## Maikel Steneker (Jul 3, 2011)

chris888222 said:
			
		

> To me, the PSP is a wonderful handheld (especially with my fav monster hunter). But there are simply just too many who 'hate' sony and claim that PSP ain't got game. Many are actually very excited over the PSV, so am I. I don't care about what OLED multitouch, duo analog or touch rear but it does have the games people want.
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> I love Nintendo as well, especially the 3DS. I didn't like the Wii though, but at least it was the first step to motion control gaming.


Funny, for me it's the other way around. I love the new features the PS Vita brings. I love having two analog sticks, I love having an OLED screen with multitouch, I love the touchpad on the back, but so far, I don't like the games. Apart from Little Deviants, LittleBigPlanet, ModNation Racers and Sound Shapes (which, I admit, is a strong lineup), I don't think I'll get anything for this handheld. PSP support hasn't been too strong, so Sony still has a lot to prove.

That said, so far, they haven't made any mistakes with the Vita. The price is spot on and everything about it seems great.


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## Wintrale (Jul 3, 2011)

Well that's it, Sony's screwed now. Whenever Pachter says something, the opposite happens.


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## emigre (Jul 3, 2011)

syko5150 said:
			
		

> Well if you think about it people have enjoyed hundreds of titles with Mario in it for over 20 years. Many parents, myself included, would rather have our kids playing clean fun games like Mario or other games Nintendo releases compared to games like Uncharted. Now don't get me wrong, I personally love the Uncharted series, but it's just not something that most parents want to buy for their kids. When the holiday season rolls around parents are more likely to buy a Nintendo product compared to a Sony product because they can trust Nintendo to provide their children with good clean fun. I think Nintendo are not only trying to get people to buy the 3DS, but are blocking the Vita from getting launch time recognition it would otherwise get. The only hope for Sony at this point for the holiday season is if they come out with some crazy awesome launch line-up if they want to beat out Nintendo. Just my opinion.
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You don't care about competent controls?


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## Range-TE (Jul 3, 2011)

i think the psv will do alright, though i don't think it'll take 3DS's market


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## Ace Overclocked (Jul 3, 2011)

these are all speculations
who gives a shit
let's wait and see, it's not for us nor him to decide the income especially now


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## DeadLocked (Jul 3, 2011)

I think marketing will be a huge factor this time. Sony's PSV advert clearly demonstrates that the PSV is a new handheld with new games, new controls and features while the 3DS adverts I've seen so far on UK television are people sat in a white room laughing at the 3DS with the 3DS back to the camera.
Doubt it will steal Nintendo's market share though, maybe for 3-6 months after PSV has come out, unless the dual analog stick attracts FPS fans with CoD.


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## Erdnaxela (Jul 3, 2011)

Oh and remember when someone said thing like that?
Yeah, the "Wii will fail", and see what happened, marketing play a major factor, just wait and see >.


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## heartgold (Jul 3, 2011)

The fuck! I ain't listening to this dick. The very same guy said PSVita would be dead on arrival and now says this.

Of course this will be a very tight competition this gen, I think smartphones are taking the market share more.


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## chris888222 (Jul 3, 2011)

emigre said:
			
		

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I'm saying I don't buy a console just for controls.


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## OmegaVesko (Jul 3, 2011)

chris888222 said:
			
		

> I'm saying I don't buy a console just for controls.



Well, controls are a huge part of any game. Not to say the PSP's single analogue controls are really that bad (PS buttons work fairly well as another analog stick), but dual analogue controls are a pretty big part of console games.


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## Guild McCommunist (Jul 3, 2011)

I don't know. I've obviously been defending the Vita around every corner and rightly so, but analysts like Patcher enjoy stabbing in the dark and hoping they'll eventually hit something. Because if they somehow say some wild prediction that turns out to be true, whenever he makes another prediction, it'll always be "This guy was the same guy who predicted this, so he's trustworthy!"

I think the Vita will be bringing some serious competition. The PSP did well considering Nintendo's market dominance in handhelds but it wasn't really competition (well, outside of Japan where the thing has been spanking even the 3DS). Still, it launched at significantly more than the DS and it took a while for it to get into a competitive price range. The Vita will be cutting it way to close to comfort for Nintendo and it features what gamers want. No gimmicks, no smoke and mirrors, just simply a successor with natural upgrades instead of using flawed technology to appeal to the latest fad in the world. Nintendo's core fanbase is actually not that large, if you look at the N64 and Gamecube for example. Large enough to keep them afloat but without casual market appeal and competitive pricing, they'll be lagging behind again.

Regardless, I'll be sure to get a Vita and I don't think it'll disappoint.


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## Bladexdsl (Jul 3, 2011)

this fuck-tard is never right he was wrong about wii not being a competitor to the ps3 and the ps3 was gonna dominate and his gonna be wrong about this too. i don't even know why he even bothers and he believes the shit he says and will never admin how he was wrong in the past!!!


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## KingdomBlade (Jul 3, 2011)

Bladexdsl said:
			
		

> this fuck-tard is never right he was wrong about wii not being a competitor to the ps3 and the ps3 was gonna dominate and his gonna be wrong about this too. i don't even know why he even bothers and he believes the shit he says and will never admin how he was wrong in the past!!!


Even though the 3DS isn't selling as excellently as anyone had hoped and the PSV has a fair chance of being more or less even with it? Perhaps even higher.

Thinking realistically, there's a fair chance that the PSV will be quite successful. Even with or even more than the 3DS.


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## Bladexdsl (Jul 3, 2011)

i can't wait to see what idiot lame excuse he pulls out of his ass this time when he is wrong yet again for the third time in a row! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




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## nugundam0079 (Jul 3, 2011)

All i know is this time Nintendo is in for some serious competition-The one major thing that the Ds had over the psp was the price point $150 USD vs the psp's $250-this time its not the same, Both are in competing price ranges. I own a 3DS and to be honest I'm not that impressed anymore, I'll be picking up a vita when it's released-I just hope that by then Nintendo has some killer apps for the 3DS or they're in for a long hard battle this time.


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## chris888222 (Jul 3, 2011)

Sales wise Nintendo isn't stupid - I bet they'll have backup 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



The vita will sell very well - it has my share as well (but it's not a day one for me, I'd wait for a price drop. Eg. The 3DS dipped another $20 today in Singapore! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




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If we are talking about Nintendo's stocks - I doubt it will be affected. The vita will sell well, but it's unlikely that the 3DS will be _greatly_ affected. 

Overall, even if the vita were to outsell, Nintendo won't really be affected IMO.


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## dickfour (Jul 3, 2011)

Is anyone here not going to end up with both? I don't own a 3ds yet but I'll buy one and I'll also end up with a vita.


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## Guild McCommunist (Jul 3, 2011)

dickfour said:
			
		

> Is anyone here not going to end up with both? I don't own a 3ds yet but I'll buy one and I'll also end up with a vita.



Money unfortunately doesn't grow on trees. To get both of them brand new will cost you at least $500, not counting the price of games (handheld games seem to be sitting at $40/each now). The prices aren't outrageous as the consoles are introducing some new and advanced tech, it's just that for me, it's one or the other, I can't compromise.


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## chris888222 (Jul 3, 2011)

dickfour said:
			
		

> Is anyone here not going to end up with both? I don't own a 3ds yet but I'll buy one and I'll also end up with a vita.


Quite a few actually.

I want both for a reason. I like RPGs and first party from Nintendo, but I'm also a crazy shooter fan and the vita is the perfect masterpiece for it. I'm eager to save for both (I already have a 3DS - and saving up $500 is quite an easy task for me given up to 6 months... I won't get the vita at launch as that's when games are most expensive. 3DS launched here at $399, but only a month half later it's now $329.)


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## Fear Zoa (Jul 3, 2011)

Since when do we trust pachter's judgment anyway? 
Whatever happens happens, predict all you want its in the hands of investors and nintendo/sony themselves ....

I'll admit though for once sony is in a strong position to beat out nintendo


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## jalaneme (Jul 3, 2011)

nintendo have always been very dominant in the handheld market, i highly doubt that will change anytime soon, that is the only reason i chose a 3ds and the fact that i will never give sony my money ever again anyway.


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## nugundam0079 (Jul 3, 2011)

dickfour said:
			
		

> Is anyone here not going to end up with both? I don't own a 3ds yet but I'll buy one and I'll also end up with a vita.




Yup I have a 3DS and Plan on getting Vita as well.


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## cwstjdenobs (Jul 3, 2011)

Guild McCommunist said:
			
		

> dickfour said:
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Am I the only person looking at $500 for two consoles and $40 a game and thinking "Wow that's incredibly cheap. Already got a 3DS and I've plenty of time to save up less than half a weeks minimum wage working to get the Vita when it finally comes out. Especially seeing as I'll be after the one that isn't a mobile phone cause what's the point when you cant use that connection for gaming"

Though I'm already worrying that I've wasted money on the 3DS with the lack of games, I'm really worried that this generation will have 2 handhelds that are only any good when cracked for playing emulated games.


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## shakirmoledina (Jul 3, 2011)

it will steal the market in the beginning but like the 3ds, it will die down and probably fast if the games arent tht "fast"


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## Gh0sti (Jul 3, 2011)

why wont he shutup he will be wrong yet again he should quit his job and never speak again he sukcs at his job and i cant wait to be proved wrong yet again


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## KingVamp (Jul 3, 2011)

Guild McCommunist said:
			
		

> I don't know. I've obviously been defending the Vita around every corner and rightly so, but analysts like Patcher enjoy stabbing in the dark and hoping they'll eventually hit something. Because if they somehow say some wild prediction that turns out to be true, whenever he makes another prediction, it'll always be "This guy was the same guy who predicted this, so he's trustworthy!"
> 
> I think the Vita will be bringing some serious competition. The PSP did well considering Nintendo's market dominance in handhelds but it wasn't really competition (well, outside of Japan where the thing has been spanking even the 3DS). Still, it launched at significantly more than the DS and it took a while for it to get into a competitive price range. The Vita will be cutting it way to close to comfort for Nintendo and it features what gamers want. No gimmicks, no smoke and mirrors, just simply a successor with natural upgrades instead of using flawed technology to appeal to the latest fad in the world. Nintendo's core fanbase is actually not that large, if you look at the N64 and Gamecube for example. Large enough to keep them afloat but without casual market appeal and competitive pricing, they'll be lagging behind again.
> 
> Regardless, I'll be sure to get a Vita and I don't think it'll disappoint.


What are you talking about? You even complain about the touchpad in the back. Mr.No gimmicks, no smoke and mirrors.

Sorry for Nintendo trying actually trying something new.  

And where you get the idea that Nintendo doesn't have a large fan base?

Look I didn't mean to sound pushy(?). In all honesty, I enjoy the 3d effect.


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## Nathan Drake (Jul 3, 2011)

KingVamp said:
			
		

> Guild McCommunist said:
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-snip-

Really wanted to say something at the beginning there regarding your post habits when it comes to anybody saying something even remotely negative about Nintendo, but I'll be good.

They are just natural upgrades. Seen any smart phones lately? Yeah, the technology that you may claim to be gimmicks are very common place anymore. 3D is still a new technology that hasn't advanced too far, especially not to a point where I feel it should have been implemented in a system yet as a primary selling point. Nintendo's fan base when it comes to their consoles is very dynamic with not a large chunk being die hard Nintendo. The casual gamers were really able to get into the Wii. This helped to boost the sales quite a bit. Whether Nintendo truly expanded their fan base though, no one can say.


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## Slyakin (Jul 3, 2011)

KingVamp said:
			
		

> What are you talking about? You even complain about the touchpad in the back. Mr.No gimmicks, no smoke and mirrors.
> 
> Sorry for Nintendo trying actually trying something new.
> 
> ...


Sure, that's one gimmick. However, the 3DS has a single gimmick as the WHOLE SELLING POINT of the console itself. The rear touchpad hasn't even been advertised much at all (some of my friends don't even know about it). He's really saying that gimmicks aren't the focus of the PSV.

And, back on topic, I'm gonna get a PSV to go along with my 3DS. At launch, as well, like my 3DS. I love both Sony and Nintendo now, so I don't find a point in arguing in this stuff anymore. Also, in this argument, I think that the Vita will take more of a share in the market then the PSP, but it might not beat the share that Nintendo has made for itself.


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## IchigoK2031 (Jul 3, 2011)

Sony has done a lot right, in making the Vita, so that it is competitive in the handheld market, but in the end, it comes down to the consumer. The Vita, has a strong launch line up and competitive pricing to match the 3DS, so it has a good chance, of taking at least SOME chunk of market share away from Nintendo. On Nintendo's end, it relies on whether, the future lineup of games, will foster more widespread adoption in the future. If not, the ball will be in Sony's court... so to speak.


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## KingVamp (Jul 3, 2011)

Slyakin said:
			
		

> Sure, that's one gimmick. However, the 3DS has a single gimmick as the WHOLE SELLING POINT of the console itself. The rear touchpad hasn't even been advertised much at all (some of my friends don't even know about it). He's really saying that gimmicks aren't the focus of the PSV.
> 
> And, back on topic, I'm gonna get a PSV to go along with my 3DS. At launch, as well, like my 3DS. I love both Sony and Nintendo now, so I don't find a point in arguing in this stuff anymore. Also, in this argument, I think that the Vita will take more of a share in the market then the PSP, but it might not beat the share that Nintendo has made for itself.


But even if you look pass the 3D, the 3DS is still a good handheld and people who like 3D just make it better. I just don't think it deserve some off
the dissing. 

3DS ,just like the ds did to touch screen controls, would probably make 3D the norm.


(This is truly what I think without all this fanboy junk.)


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## Slyakin (Jul 3, 2011)

KingVamp said:
			
		

> Slyakin said:
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The problem is, if you look at the 3DS without 3D, it's just a DS with slightly better graphics and an analog. In this sense, the PSV completely wins out, as the "graphics boost" is a hell of a lot more prominent, and it adds so many more things (3G, touch controls, gyro, camera, location services, etc.). Yeah, some dissing isn't fairly based, but most of it can be accepted as a reality.

And, as for 3D becoming normal? Eh... Maybe. The consumers have weird ways of making the strangest things happen.


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## gokujr1000 (Jul 3, 2011)

Meh I'm not necessarily getting a PSV, WiiU or a 3DS until they offer me something I want. Honestly all the "innovative" features given to the PSV and WiiU really don't make me want to buy it. I just look at it and feel like going the opposite way.

I thought the 3D and the Wii Motes were pushing it far enough. And now the PSV is just trying to make a PSP + NDS combo in one...


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## MaxNuker (Jul 3, 2011)

Slyakin said:
			
		

> The problem is, if you look at the 3DS without 3D, it's just a DS with slightly better graphics and an analog. In this sense, the PSV completely wins out, as the "graphics boost" is a hell of a lot more prominent, and it adds so many more things (3G, touch controls, gyro, camera, location services, etc.). Yeah, some dissing isn't fairly based, but most of it can be accepted as a reality.
> 
> And, as for 3D becoming normal? Eh... Maybe. The consumers have weird ways of making the strangest things happen.



Wooooooow, if I do look at the 3DS without 3D its a DS... IF I LOOK AT A PSV, WHAT I SEE? Things I find in the 3DS and normal DS.... AFTER ALL the PSV is just a PSP with better graphics, if we follow your logic...


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## KingVamp (Jul 3, 2011)

Slyakin said:
			
		

> The problem is, if you look at the 3DS without 3D, it's just a DS with slightly better graphics and an analog. In this sense, the PSV completely wins out, as the "graphics boost" is a hell of a lot more prominent, and it adds so many more things (3G, touch controls, gyro, camera, location services, etc.). Yeah, some dissing isn't fairly based, but most of it can be accepted as a reality.
> 
> And, as for 3D becoming normal? Eh... Maybe. The consumers have weird ways of making the strangest things happen.
> 3DS doesn't have (touch controls, gyro, camera,spotpass/streetpass,etc)?
> QUOTE(MaxNuker @ Jul 3 2011, 05:36 PM) Wooooooow, if I do look at the 3DS without 3D its a DS... IF I LOOK AT A PSV, WHAT I SEE? Things I find in the 3DS and normal DS.... AFTER ALL the PSV is just a PSP with better graphics, if we follow your logic...


Who was that towards to? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





I doubt it,but Nintendo still can do a 3G model.


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## MaxNuker (Jul 3, 2011)

Slyakin, forgot to quote his post, editing it now xD


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## ShadowSoldier (Jul 3, 2011)

You guys are idiots you know that right? Selling over 60 million is no easy feat to accomplish. The only thing that helped Nintendo get that far, was the fact that it had 2 screens, Pokemon, and the name "Nintendo" on it.

Sony's PSP was anything but a failure. Sure the games may not be as fun as the DS's, but it still had some games which simply destroyed everything the DS had to offer.


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## ferofax (Jul 4, 2011)

Slyakin said:
			
		

> KingVamp said:
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 (and to anybody else who argues PSV's muscle-bound specs will "destroy" the 3DS)
when are people gonna learn that it's not just about the graphics/processing power? who cares if the PSV wins out with "a hell of a lot more prominent" graphics boost? didn't the DS already prove that point against the PSP? muscle ALONE doesn't do jack-squat if nobody wants to buy it.

Nintendo got that point home across to Sony, and Sony wises up by "out-gimmicking" Nintendo. Don't bother arguing, all those nifty new features are "gimmick" retorts by Sony, whether you like it or not. Sure, they'll be utilized, they have tremendous potential, but gimmicks, just as the DS touchscreen was. 

Rear touchpanel? Really? As if the front touchscreen wasn't enough, they had to add touch controls to the back too? So how you gonna hold it now, with all your fingers poised on buttons/pseudo-touchpanel buttons? What, it's gonna float on its own? And how about people with fidgety hands? You keep messing up because your fingers were fidgeting over the rear touchpanel. and it looks incredibly... fragile. i dunno. both front and back surfaces would be highly vulnerable to damage, since they now have function instead of it just being the front.

Gyro, camera, pfft. 3DS has em first. But who got em first is pointless, as it all comes down to what they do and don't have in comparison to the other. 3G sounds incredibly exciting too... until you see your bill. but that's just money, which some of you apparently has no problem in throwing around (not speaking in general, mind you).

as to the whole 3D becoming a norm... well, i can't say it will, but i most definitely can't say it WON'T. i'm starting to see more and more 3D capable TVs and monitors at the malls, and Japan already has a whole slew of glassless 3D-capable phones (IIRC, they pre-empted the 3DS from becoming the first gadget with glassless 3D). whether all those devices adopting 3D (even if not glassless) can be called trending or not, i'll leave it to the experts. but i'm definitely seeing more 3D. more 3D films, more 3D cinemas to support them, more home 3D screens for 3D Blu-Rays... you seriously cannot ignore that. sure, they're not norm... yet.


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## chris888222 (Jul 4, 2011)

I don't care how powerful the console is. Games are the ones which matter. Give me a fancy shooter, RPG and some more nice arcade and I'm sold. I am willing to save up for both no matter how long it takes.


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## Slyakin (Jul 4, 2011)

ferofax said:
			
		

> *ferofax's bigass post*


I was referring to the systems from a technical standpoint, not who wins the situation. It's true that the PSV is technically more innovative (quality over quantity? Different topic, different time), but I never tried to cross into an actual situation.


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## Nathan Drake (Jul 4, 2011)

@ferofax

Ugh. lolwut?

Sony is adding shit because even smart phones come with tons of stuff that they're adding. With smart phones starting to invade the handheld gaming market, it's either throw a bunch of shit in there, or don't try to market your product. What Nintendo does has little bearing on the design of the Vita. The Vita isn't just "Oh look at the better hardware" either. Game selection, system functions, and the like are determining factors in a system purchase. Staring at the brand name as much as you are just leads to fanboyism, then you just sound like a douche (not directed at anybody in particular, but something to keep in mind).

3D will become what we consider the norm. Why? It's a fad. It's a technology fad. Yes, those exist. Eventually, the novelty will wear off, and nobody will think anything of it, while I'm still sitting here enjoying my non-HD tube television.

It seems you are also assuming the rear touch pad will have constant use. Wrong. It will be used if a developer finds a use for it, and then that's only if they want to implement it. Unless a game is made to utilize the rear touch pad in a way that is vital towards game play, there is likely to be a way to shut off its function for that game.

You're also assuming that the PSP did absolutely terrible. Yes, in the west, the PSP didn't do as good as the DS as Sony's premier handheld in a previously completely Nintendo owned handheld market. I can't understand how people don't understand that Nintendo had no real competition for a very long time, and thus, people went with what they were used to. Sony has shown they are competent, and that will hold in this generation. You can't say the new Sony handheld will fail just because it isn't a Nintendo handheld (which is what I'm getting from that entire post).


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## Deleted member 473940 (Jul 4, 2011)

Who gives a shit about what Pachter believes?
Make it a reality then we will believe.


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## ferofax (Jul 5, 2011)

i never said anything about Sony failing, or the PSV in general. sure, my post sounded more like "bashing", but i'm pretty sure that most of them are sensible points, at the very least. but since i didn't see anybody contesting Sony's gimmicks, i think it's safe to assume that at this point, Sony has officially joined the bandwagon of "gimmicry". (*attn:Slyakin*, you said the PSV is technically more innovative, so read on) I'd call it _innovation_ if it was something new, but no. 3G? nope, smart phones do it better. well, they use it anyways. touchpanels/screens? so 2004. given, back placement is unorthodox, but not enough to call it "innovative". even if it was multitouch/capacitive(?), it's still old news as Apple got em first. gyro? pfft. Wii Remote has it first. Cameras? don't get me started on that one. (but i'm curious, PSV camera will probably look much, much better than the 3DS. it'll be ironic if it sucked with all that "muscle"). I'll tell you it's innovative if the developers come up with something really new with old technology (example, developers incorporating face-tracking on cameras to make an augmented reality game. that was innovative use of old tech). on second thought, nah. if developers even do find some surprisingly new use for PSV features, +1 for devs, as they're the ones who innovated, not Playstation.

As for the rear touchpanel issue, i'm not an idiot to assume that it's constantly gonna be on. but on the games that DO use them, then my question stands. how do you actually hold it if you're gonna need fingers poised on it? i bet it won't be as comfortable as some thinks. it could even lead to units slipping off your hand if you're not careful, unless the PSVita has some sort of molded grip i haven't seen that helps you hold it even with fingers poised on the back.

And from what i can recall, Playstation consoles/hardware have always been "oh look at the better hardware". Everybody's harping on that this unit is X times more powerful than this/that, faster/better, etc. So does Microsoft's Xbox. It's their main selling point, isn't it? Don't tell me it isn't. I've seen/read/heard too much practically everywhere. When it comes to Playstation/Microsoft machines, _it's always been about the hardware,_ whether or not the companies themselves are promoting them based on that.

but really, what's to argue? we'll all know soon enough. i really couldn't care less about Pachter's comments.

...oh, and sorry if tl;dr.


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## Guild McCommunist (Jul 5, 2011)

ferofax said:
			
		

> i never said anything about Sony failing, or the PSV in general. sure, my post sounded more like "bashing", but i'm pretty sure that most of them are sensible points, at the very least. but since i didn't see anybody contesting Sony's gimmicks, i think it's safe to assume that at this point, Sony has officially joined the bandwagon of "gimmicry". (*attn:Slyakin*, you said the PSV is technically more innovative, so read on) I'd call it _innovation_ if it was something new, but no. 3G? nope, smart phones do it better. well, they use it anyways. touchpanels/screens? so 2004. given, back placement is unorthodox, but not enough to call it "innovative". even if it was multitouch/capacitive(?), it's still old news as Apple got em first. gyro? pfft. Wii Remote has it first. Cameras? don't get me started on that one. (but i'm curious, PSV camera will probably look much, much better than the 3DS. it'll be ironic if it sucked with all that "muscle"). I'll tell you it's innovative if the developers come up with something really new with old technology (example, developers incorporating face-tracking on cameras to make an augmented reality game. that was innovative use of old tech). on second thought, nah. if developers even do find some surprisingly new use for PSV features, +1 for devs, as they're the ones who innovated, not Playstation.
> 
> As for the rear touchpanel issue, i'm not an idiot to assume that it's constantly gonna be on. but on the games that DO use them, then my question stands. how do you actually hold it if you're gonna need fingers poised on it? i bet it won't be as comfortable as some thinks. it could even lead to units slipping off your hand if you're not careful, unless the PSVita has some sort of molded grip i haven't seen that helps you hold it even with fingers poised on the back.
> 
> ...



I find it funny people always want something new instead of something that works. The 3D on the 3DS is imperfect technology. From what I've heard it's more of a pain to use than actually fun. The sweet spot is a gigantic annoyance and, in my friend's words, "defeats the purpose of a [3]DS." Outside of the 3D, everything that's been on the 3DS has pretty much become a norm or highly popular amongst modern electronics.

You do realize devs are supposed to be innovative, right? Any retard can make a game with new technology and call it innovative. Only a real master of his craft can make a game on old technology and have it considered innovative. Considering the PS2 offered an identical control scheme to the PSX but featured many groundbreaking and innovative games, I'll say this whole "WE NEED INNOVATIVE TECHNOLOGY" thing is absolute bullshit. I don't want my games to be innovative, I want them to be fun. Whatever happened to people caring about gameplay, story, hell even graphics (as much as people love railing on HD graphics because they think they're such gamer snobs, I actually like my games to look good)? Nowadays all I hear is "NEEDS MOAR INNOVATION" and the similar cries of Wii fanboys because they realized Nintendo gimped their system on power and they needed something to gloat about.

And to me, power is a selling point. I want an upgrade, not a downgrade with some stupid controls. PC gaming has done this for, oh, how many years? Ever since the modern computer set-up (keyboard, mouse, and internet) has been around, PC gaming has essentially just gotten more powerful. Yet so many people consider the PC the best of the gaming platforms, and rightly so.

I'm just sick of this "it needs to be innovative" bullshit when people weren't screaming about this a decade go or more. They only start screaming about it now because they got a Wii (I like my Wii but I realize it's faults), they realized it's almost completely gimped in every department (functionality, online features, graphics, storage space, etc) and wanted to gloat about being such "true gamers".


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## DSGamer64 (Jul 5, 2011)

Pachter is once again being a stupid troll. Here are some flaws in his argument:

Console release: Late releases without any kind of innovation pretty much kill your chances at doing better in the console sales market. Nintendo already has a solid user base with the 3DS, and the DS was the most popular portable gaming system since the Gameboy sales wise.

User reception: The PSP was by all accounts the most successful competitor to Nintendo, but they still were behind in the market share by at least 60%. Expecting users to receive another hand held with a high launch price tag (no doubt by the time it comes out Nintendo might be price cutting the 3DS to increase sales) with a short battery life, are things that will hamper user reception.

Games: We saw it with the DS launch, we saw it with the PSP and even the 3DS. Sales started off slowly because of the lack in game selection and quality titles from multiple developers. Unlike Nintendo, Sony doesn't thrive on 1st party development nearly as much because their franchises don't have near the market recognition. Nintendo can release a game using any of their mascots and it would sell like hot cakes. The 3DS will have a strong game base as well as a variety of services available to players long before the PS Vita comes out, Nintendo already has the eShop running and the video store as well as Netflix are coming out shortly.

We aren't talking about two devices that are explicitly different anymore, it's all about the visual presentation now for Nintendo and less about innovating the hardware, despite the fact that the 3DS has the gyroscope sensors and 3D cameras and screen now. Sony is going the same route with the graphics but ultimately the power of their device and just how much it consumes a battery could be a potential downfall.


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## BlueStar (Jul 5, 2011)

You know what's a gimmick?  The ability to play a version of CoD, Killzone or Uncharted on the bus in tiny vision.  Stuff like Little Deviants, Mr Inkjet and maybe Gravity Daze is what Sony needs to push as a system seller, something that's suited to the handheld platform and provides a game experience you can't get anywhere else.  The danger is that people will go "Well, I'll just play the latest (insert graphically amazing space marine/terrorist blastfest with a rich online aspect) on my PS3 or 360 when I'm at home and I'll buy a 3DS to play Professor Layton, Kid Icarus, Phoenix Wright and Pokemon on my way to work", and see it as getting the best of both worlds.

If they rely too much on their "home console in your pocket" gimmick  and don't provide and agressively market those type of exclusives then history will repeat itself.


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## Guild McCommunist (Jul 5, 2011)

BlueStar said:
			
		

> You know what's a gimmick?  The ability to play a version of CoD, Killzone or Uncharted on the bus in tiny vision.



Most of the people who are buying the Vita are probably not buying it for that. If they love CoD they'll play it at home. Same with Killzone. There's nothing wrong with Uncharted from everyone I here, people just love hating on it for no real reason other than it's a Sony exclusive.

Most people will probably buy it because it's a PSP successor that's in a competitive price range that already has a decent looking line-up and if it follows the PSP's library, it'll be fantastic. Plus I'll take HD graphics over 3D any day.


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## BlueStar (Jul 5, 2011)

Guild McCommunist said:
			
		

> Plus I'll take HD graphics over 3D any day.



Will they be able to market it as "HD", bearing in mind the rather arbitrary, big-screen-based numbers the HD bar has been set at?


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## Guild McCommunist (Jul 5, 2011)

BlueStar said:
			
		

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In terms of handhelds, the Vita does have a pretty nice sized screen. They'll at least market it as "next gen", maybe not "HD" though.


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## Goli (Jul 5, 2011)

BlueStar said:
			
		

> Guild McCommunist said:
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There are hundreds of iPad apps that render at a slightly higher resolution than they would on another iDevice and they do label them as HD, even though they aren't "HD", so I don't see why they wouldn't.


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## ferofax (Jul 6, 2011)

um... i think anything HD is supposed to break a certain resolution threshold (not sure how high, but high enough to warrant a big ass HD monitor?) with pixel-perfect clarity. is the PSV screen resolution beyond that? if it is, then by all means, HD it is. but if it doesn't cross that threshold, i don't see how it should be called HD, as that would mean current HD definition would become super HD or something. :/

EDIT: I looked up HD on wiki, and it's all greek to me, lol. this may all be hogwash, but that's the general idea i got. my opinion stands though: if the PSV's resolution/framerate/bitrate/whatnot passes as an HD device, then HD it is.


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## chris888222 (Jul 6, 2011)

I just want the vita for FPS cuz I have no time to play at home!!! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




Always crammed with work.


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