# A sealed copy of Super Mario 64 managed to sell for a record-breaking $1.56 million dollars



## Veho (Jul 12, 2021)

_........why? _


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## newo (Jul 12, 2021)

Ninty should copyright claim it for a percent of the re-sale revenue.


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## Mama Looigi (Jul 12, 2021)

Veho said:


> _........why? _


Yea I thought that the average one on EBay and whatnot those tended to go for up to $300 at most


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## chrisrlink (Jul 12, 2021)

my god people are stupid with money these days


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## BitMasterPlus (Jul 12, 2021)

Damn, why can't I ever get that lucky to sell a game for that price? lol


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## Darth Meteos (Jul 12, 2021)

Veho said:


> _........why? _


why is literally the main thrust of the report


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## ShadowOne333 (Jul 12, 2021)

Is El Chapo making the sell for money laundering?


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## ghjfdtg (Jul 12, 2021)

u fucking wot m8. Too many morons with too much money around.


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## Bagel Le Stinky (Jul 12, 2021)

...Seriously?


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## SG854 (Jul 12, 2021)

Smart move that copy would be worth 50 million in 100 years


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## ov3rkill (Jul 12, 2021)

Freshly baked from the oven 25 years ago.  They had me at highest-graded copy, I didn't even know what Wata is all about and that it is a auction and bidding site. I guess some people are just addicted to bidding wars and/or they're just freaking loaded with money and got nothing else to do with it.



SG854 said:


> Smart move that copy would be worth 50 million in 100 years



Definitely better than investing in cryptocurrency.


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## Veho (Jul 12, 2021)

Darth Meteos said:


> why is literally the main thrust of the report


It just says "near-immaculate condition [...] this is the highest-graded copy of Super Mario 64 in the world" but that absolutely does not explain why someone would shell out 1.5 freaking million freaking dollars on it. This market is batshit insane.


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## eyeliner (Jul 12, 2021)

It was sold, but was it paid for?
This is stupid beyond understanding. 

The only game worthwile of that price is Bugsnax.


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## vlvt (Jul 12, 2021)

holy crap that is a lot of money


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## Julie_Pilgrim (Jul 12, 2021)

i am never going to tell anyone "you cant sell it for that much, that's too high" ever again


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## xs4all (Jul 12, 2021)

Hmmm, what if, some salty employee back in the day who packaged this in the assembly line, switched out the game and kept it for him/herself?

We will never know since it's sealed and probably be never opened, just saying.


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## Julie_Pilgrim (Jul 12, 2021)

eyeliner said:


> The only game worthwile of that price is Bugsnax.


@Seliph


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## Jiehfeng (Jul 12, 2021)

A sealed copy of The Legend of Zelda was recently sold for $870k as well iirc.


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## jesus96 (Jul 12, 2021)

Zelda *breaks the record*

SM64 *BLJ's in your path*


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## lokomelo (Jul 12, 2021)

Somebody please warn the buyer that this game is loaded with bugs.


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## Julie_Pilgrim (Jul 12, 2021)

Jiehfeng said:


> View attachment 269791
> 
> A sealed copy of The Legend of Zelda was recently sold for $870k as well iirc.


brb gonna dig through my dad's things to  find something  for way more than its worth


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## pedro702 (Jul 12, 2021)

there are way too many copies of sm64 out there for this to be worth 1.5 million imo, this is just insane.


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## diggeloid (Jul 12, 2021)

Whenever I see one of these stories of a retro game selling for a bunch of money, it's usually some really old game that was released when I wasn't alive, but I actually had this one when I was a kid. I guess that means I'm getting old :[

I wonder if a brand-new sealed copy of Odyssey will be a good investment for my future retirement?


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## Bladexdsl (Jul 12, 2021)

fools and their money


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## Rafciu (Jul 12, 2021)

Enstein quotes still accurate 

Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the universe


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## depaul (Jul 12, 2021)

Auctions should be illegal, or at least regulated by a maximum amount.


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## weatMod (Jul 12, 2021)

BitMasterPlus said:


> Damn, why can't I ever get that lucky to sell a game for that price? lol


this is probably the closest  I will ever come
I have a sealed copy like this one because I bought it  before I got my blue new N3DS XL from play Asia   ,AU model and then needed to buy a EU copy
I wonder what it  will be going for in  20 years
 this seller wants $129 and  he has   SEVEN COPIES! so not exactly that rare

but I rememebr seeing one list for like  $60,000 or some ridiculous price when it was first announced by Smea

https://www.ebay.com/itm/BRAND-NEW-...163757&hash=item35ffaeb572:g:L-sAAMXQcVNQ87UR


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## Mama Looigi (Jul 12, 2021)

depaul said:


> Auctions should be illegal, or at least regulated by a maximum amount.


What would the fun in that be? An auction is an auction because the person who wants it the most will pay the most and rightly so :3


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## GTRagnarok (Jul 12, 2021)

Here are a couple of enlightening comments about this shit:


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## munnimann (Jul 12, 2021)

ShadowOne333 said:


> Is El Chapo making the sell for money laundering?



I honestly think money laundering is the simple answer here, yes.


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## pedro702 (Jul 12, 2021)

depaul said:


> Auctions should be illegal, or at least regulated by a maximum amount.


if there was a maximum amount a guy would just say the maximum first and end the auction lol it would be just unfair tbh.


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## FAST6191 (Jul 12, 2021)

As with others I am used to this being one of a kind versions of items (dev versions, recalls, low volumes in specific regions, rare glitched versions...) but a super popular launch title... yeah I don't get it, even for a nice condition new in box title (I can understand them commanding a bit of premium for those that want a shiny collection but my estimate of said premium is probably a rounding error or less than the credit card charge, sales tax or similar compared to this). I will have to assume it is some kind of investment or laundering play.



depaul said:


> Auctions should be illegal, or at least regulated by a maximum amount.


Some auctions do start from a max and fall from there (see Dutch auction for one style of them) but who would regulate it, why would anybody regulate it (who is really being hurt by this*?) and generally fiddling in the economy at that level is a bad plan -- there are billions of items, billions of needs (my glass of water is worth nothing really to you or I, dying man in a desert... well now. This usually appearing as something is worth what someone else is willing to pay), new things discovered, sources drying up, sources changing radically and all that is just the seconds you spent reading this... fiddling with things often has wildly unintended consequences further down the line (or everybody just starts a black market which is bad for everybody).


*fine art and collectables fall under that... I am not going to say it is all money laundering as I am sure there is one person that likes the item and has serious cash to blow but could be, however when said money launderers are also high society and your biggest campaign donors then politicos care less.


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## ZeroFX (Jul 12, 2021)

Very nice for who bought it! Also, im seeing some poor souls are already acting butthurt here, lets grab some popcorn.


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## JFizDaWiz (Jul 12, 2021)

there's no way that either money laundering or market manipulation are not in play for these recent high price auctions


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## atreyu187 (Jul 12, 2021)




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## wurstpistole (Jul 12, 2021)

weatMod said:


> this is probably the closest  I will ever come
> I have a sealed copy like this one because I bought it  before I got my blue new N3DS XL from play Asia   ,AU model and then needed to buy a EU copy
> I wonder what it  will be going for in  20 years
> this seller wants $129 and  he has   SEVEN COPIES! so not exactly that rare
> ...


The one and only reason that Cubic Ninja was ever worth money was that it was used as an entrypoint in early to mid 3DS hacking, otherwise no one would have given two shits about that game


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## munnimann (Jul 12, 2021)

ZeroFX said:


> Very nice for who bought it! Also, im seeing some poor souls are already acting butthurt here, lets grab some popcorn.



Being able to tell the difference between price and value has nothing to do with being butthurt. Being unable to do it has something to do with idolizing money above common sense.


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## CMDreamer (Jul 12, 2021)

Morons trying to sell their junk "newly-sealed" games at higher prices coming soon...


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## Jayro (Jul 12, 2021)

So was it for charity, or...?


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## Foxi4 (Jul 12, 2021)

Veho said:


> It just says "near-immaculate condition [...] this is the highest-graded copy of Super Mario 64 in the world" but that absolutely does not explain why someone would shell out 1.5 freaking million freaking dollars on it. This market is batshit insane.


The kicker is that this game will *never* be opened and played. Y'know, like it was intended to. It will never, ever fulfill its intended purpose - that cartridge will never reach video game valhalla. One of the many reasons why I hate the "collectors" crowd - I collect myself, but I always actually use the games and consoles I buy, it's what they're for. Preservation ain't worth a damn if you don't get to use the technology you're preserving. I'll get the cheapy copy with the scratched label, please - it's just as good.


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## osaka35 (Jul 12, 2021)

I umm...i have...my original pokemon red manual? and strategy guide? 1st edition base set Venasaur and a few pre-releases?

when do I get my million bucks?

Joking. I was a tiny kid when these came out, so I obviously ripped open the box and never looked back. Treated the cartridges right, but...well, watcha gonna do. It is curious as to how many undiscovered sealed games are floating around on this planet of ours.


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## Foxi4 (Jul 12, 2021)

osaka35 said:


> I umm...i have...my original pokemon red manual? and strategy guide? 1st edition base set Venasaur and a few pre-releases?
> 
> when do I get my million bucks?
> 
> Joking. I was a tiny kid when these came out, so I obviously ripped open the box and never looked back. Treated the cartridges right, but...well, watcha gonna do. It is curious as to how many undiscovered sealed games are floating around on this planet of ours.


All of my cardboard boxes and manuals are folded along the edges and safely stored in a dry box in the basement. No joke, this includes my Game Boy Color box. I was such a happy kid when I got mine that I didnt have the heart to throw out anything, not even the silly ads that came with it.


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## fadx (Jul 12, 2021)

xs4all said:


> Hmmm, what if, some salty employee back in the day who packaged this in the assembly line, switched out the game and kept it for him/herself?
> 
> We will never know since it's sealed and probably be never opened, just saying.


Schrödinger's Super Mario 64


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## BitMasterPlus (Jul 12, 2021)

Foxi4 said:


> All of my cardboard boxes and manuals are folded along the edges and safely stored in a dry box in the basement. No joke, this includes my Game Boy Color box. I was such a happy kid when I got mine that I didnt have the heart to throw out anything, not even the silly ads that came with it.


I wish I was a smart as you when I was a kid. I'm not joking either, since it's good to try and save that stuff as carefully as possible.


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## weatMod (Jul 12, 2021)

wurstpistole said:


> The one and only reason that Cubic Ninja was ever worth money was that it was used as an entrypoint in early to mid 3DS hacking, otherwise no one would have given two shits about that game


true but it was als0 supposed to be a rare title to begin with


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## SG854 (Jul 12, 2021)

Jayro said:


> So was it for charity, or...?


Yes its for charity for Toad

It's to provide medical help for that mushroom shaped tumor growing on the top of his head.


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## JuanBaNaNa (Jul 12, 2021)

Veho said:


> _........why? _


Just like in the Fine Art world... Millionaire bets such as this are often used for money laundering.
The owners rarely sees the money.


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## weatMod (Jul 12, 2021)

fadx said:


> Schrödinger's Super Mario 64


that's why it sold for 1.5mil , they are planning on using it as the main CPU in a quantum "computer"


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## Catastrophic (Jul 12, 2021)

Would you rather:

-Pay 200 dollars for a boxed copy of Super Mario 64 in good condition

OR

-Pay 1.56 million dollars for the same thing except the cardboard box has one fewer scratches on it


idk guys seems like a pretty difficult choice to me...


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## pedro702 (Jul 12, 2021)

Foxi4 said:


> All of my cardboard boxes and manuals are folded along the edges and safely stored in a dry box in the basement. No joke, this includes my Game Boy Color box. I was such a happy kid when I got mine that I didnt have the heart to throw out anything, not even the silly ads that came with it.


i wish i was like you, my kid version ripped and trowed away every box i had of gbc,n64 and gba games, only plastic boxes lived so i only have boxes from ps1/gc/ps2 and up.

i whishi didnt destroyed and trowed away my boxes of old games :S


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## Deleted member 323844 (Jul 12, 2021)

How a 12 million units sold videogame worth 1.56 millions in a mint condition is beyond me.

There must be tons of those.


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## Foxi4 (Jul 12, 2021)

BitMasterPlus said:


> I wish I was a smart as you when I was a kid. I'm not joking either, since it's good to try and save that stuff as carefully as possible.





pedro702 said:


> i wish i was like you, my kid version ripped and trowed away every box i had of gbc,n64 and gba games, only plastic boxes lived so i only have boxes from ps1/gc/ps2 and up.
> 
> i whishi didnt destroyed and trowed away my boxes of old games :S


I mean, at the end of the day they're just cardboard. They have some sentimental value, but the real treasure are the memories you have with the device and the games - the sleepless nights playing Pokemon under the covers with a flashlight aimed at the screen, the sick combos you pulled off in Bloody Roar: Primal Fury, wrecking your buddy in Smash Bros. Melee or beating Rainbow Road in Mario Kart: Super Circuit. They're just possessions, it's the memories that you can't put a price tag on...

...certainly not $1.56 million dollary-doos, at least. :V


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## Deleted member 471305 (Jul 12, 2021)

Okay, anybody want my used copy of SOCOM II US Navy Seals? Price starts at 2 million. It's a bit steep and the disc is broken in half but it comes with the original manual, so it's worth it.


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## MarkDarkness (Jul 12, 2021)

We are reaching uprecedented (in modern history) levels of accumulation of capital in the hands of a few... and I say that as a capitalist. These things don't usually end well.


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## DarkCoffe64 (Jul 12, 2021)

Ayo, I too have a perfect mint boxed and sealed copy of Maruo 69 bought day 1 when it released in 1420, it's absolutely not a blank cartridge I downloaded the rom into, can I have my coommillion dollars now?


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## Crazynoob458 (Jul 13, 2021)

uhhh... WHAT?


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## BraveDragonWolf (Jul 13, 2021)

What do you plan to do after you've done spent your rent, car payment, bills, food, gas, lights, child support, college, and house on a damn box that hasn't been open since 96...?


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## DCarnage (Jul 13, 2021)

Lol dumb, I bought mine for $49.99.


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## Ryukiza (Jul 13, 2021)

> Well -- we're a bit speechless on this one.


Yes, I'm also speechless at their stupidity.


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## K3N1 (Jul 13, 2021)

Jiehfeng said:


> View attachment 269791
> 
> A sealed copy of The Legend of Zelda was recently sold for $870k as well iirc.


They would make you buy them lunch also


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## the_randomizer (Jul 13, 2021)

Anyone dumb enough to pay that much deserves to be ripped off


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## Xzi (Jul 13, 2021)

the_randomizer said:


> Anyone dumb enough to pay that much deserves to be ripped off


Anybody who actually pays that much for a single vidja game is probably only doing it because that's a drop in the bucket to them.


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## the_randomizer (Jul 13, 2021)

Xzi said:


> Anybody who actually pays that much for a single vidja game is probably only doing it because that's a drop in the bucket to them.



That amount is just obscene, unfathomable


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## RedBlueGreen (Jul 13, 2021)

That's a stupid amount of money. I don't even think a BGS 10 base set first edition Charizard would be worth half that, and I'm pretty sure there's still only one of those in existence.

I'm gonna say this for everyone thinking that this means their SM64 cart is worth money: it isn't. This one time sale of a very specific sealed graded game cartridge doesn't mean market value of the average SM64 cart is going up. CIB will still be $100, and new sealed graded ones might go up if people sell them for more and there are a ton of sales for them. As of right now, a graded one averages $6.5K. This one specific one got graded a 9.8 because it's the same quality as when it left the factory. Unless you have a something higher than a 9 don't expect it to you anywhere near $1.5M. Don't expect it to be worth more than a few hundred thousand if that.


Xzi said:


> Anybody who actually pays that much for a single vidja game is probably only doing it because that's a drop in the bucket to them.


Unfortunately everybody will do the same thing they're doing with their graded Charizard cards, they'll list something that was worth a couple thousand for tens of thousands, and they'll list good graded SM64 copies for hundreds of thousands. Expect to see graded 7 and 8s listed for $500K+, and be pleasantly surprised if that doesn't happen. I'll be surprised if every random person doesn't stick their loose copy of the game on eBay for a few thousand when they're worth maybe $25.


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## Xzi (Jul 13, 2021)

RedBlueGreen said:


> Unfortunately everybody will do the same thing they're doing with their graded Charizard cards, they'll list something that was worth a couple thousand for tens of thousands, and they'll list good graded SM64 copies for hundreds of thousands. Expect to see graded 7 and 8s listed for $500K+, and be pleasantly surprised if that doesn't happen. I'll be surprised if every random person doesn't stick their loose copy of the game on eBay for a few thousand when they're worth maybe $25.


Generally not worth the hassle, eBay's quick to get the money back when it comes to refunds for an item that doesn't match description.


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## Hanafuda (Jul 13, 2021)

Xzi said:


> Anybody who actually pays that much for a single vidja game is probably only doing it because that's a drop in the bucket to them.



And because they're expecting a fairly good chance that in 10 years, it'll be two drops.

And if this one doesn't work out to a profit, other portfolio diversifications will.


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## raging_chaos (Jul 13, 2021)

Welcome to the WATA scam. They are grading games and then selling it to themselves to set the price bar higher than what it really is. Ties to Herritage Auctions have even been found, lots of posts on this kind of stuff exists on reddit. The previously 9.4 A+ rated SM64 sold for $38,400.


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## jomaper (Jul 13, 2021)

this is a 100% money laundering



MarkDarkness said:


> We are reaching uprecedented (in modern history) levels of accumulation of capital in the hands of a few... and I say that as a capitalist. These things don't usually end well.



How can you say this and at the same time admit that you're a capitalist, lol


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## supergamer368 (Jul 13, 2021)

TBH sounds more like Super Money laundering 64 to me. Nobody would pay THAT much.


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## nine0nine (Jul 13, 2021)

usually I'd dismiss these types of things as investments, but even then, it's hard to see it fetching more than 1.5m any time in the future. I wouldn't be surprised if there's a number of copies in the same condition floating around. 

That said, the buyer probably isn't in a position where spending 1.5m has any effect on his daily life, so fair play to them.


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## duwen (Jul 13, 2021)

WATA needs to FOAD.
Seriously, collectors and auction houses of sealed and graded games are fucktard idiots that are unfortunately skewing prices for the whole market.


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## Jayro (Jul 13, 2021)

I made this on my phone, and just had to share it here where it feels appropriate.


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## ZeroFX (Jul 13, 2021)

munnimann said:


> Being able to tell the difference between price and value has nothing to do with being butthurt. Being unable to do it has something to do with idolizing money above common sense.


*munching some popcorn* see i told ya.


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## Burorī (Jul 13, 2021)

Guess I'll just print my own box, throw a used copy in there and profit


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## FAST6191 (Jul 13, 2021)

Ryukiza said:


> Yes, I'm also speechless at their stupidity.


I rarely find people dropping that kind of money on this kind of item are stupid, and even if this one is the ones before and following probably are not. There is usually a very good reason and logic underpinning things.

Choice video for what is likely going on

Whole thing is good but skip to about 9:05 if you want.

Might also be some variation on


Others have pondered if the grading house is trying to drum up and corner its own market as well (everybody and their donkey is in collectable cards and comics, and also both of those are dubious where games is probably around for a while) -- if they are the ones with the expertise, the market and trust then the fees alone probably make it worth it. I could see that as well but I am not quite sure it is the case, or at least it is the whole case.

What I can't wait to see is someone restoring a game case, box or similar to how we get the same for comics, art in general 

We have seen some considerable stuff for repairing vintage consoles, and the stuff with batteries for pokemon games always amuses me.



Burorī said:


> Guess I'll just print my own box, throw a used copy in there and profit


You say that but if even if only returns in the region of $100k I could see someone having fun with an industrial printer and vintage cart stock, might have to spend a couple of grand on a decent die to replicate the fold up insides and whatnot. Inks might be fun but could probably get it to fluoresce as I doubt Nintendo employed big boy security measures (not that a sacrificial sample or three could not be happily obtained to recreate far far more easily than I could with pre industrial printer fine wine). As it stands cost for a small run of custom chips of suitable gate size has dropped like a stone and if in this instance, compared to a lot of "rare" games, this you can get away with buying an otherwise good condition main cart of suitable version without going to that length.


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## NeoGranzon (Jul 13, 2021)

Even if it wasn't the first Japanese Mario64 cartridge on sale,it would have all that value.


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## WiiMiiSwitch (Jul 13, 2021)

WiiMiiSwitch: Never opens copy of Mario Odyssey
Becomes a millionaire


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## air2004 (Jul 13, 2021)

Veho said:


> _........why? _


I wish I had money like that to waste


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## spotanjo3 (Jul 13, 2021)

That's ridiculous. It is just a game. Just the same for comic books. Really silly. Oh man.

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------



Jiehfeng said:


> View attachment 269791
> 
> A sealed copy of The Legend of Zelda was recently sold for $870k as well iirc.



Saw this show and this show is fake. And stupid show too!


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## duwen (Jul 13, 2021)

spotanjo3 said:


> That's ridiculous. It is just a game. Just the same for comic books. Really silly. Oh man.



How the prices and 'value' are determined within comic collecting is understandable. The sealed and graded videogame collecting community is trying to force the same logic onto a different media that doesn't really hold up to even vaguely similar criteria... it's as logical as conspiring to initiate a sealed and graded breakfast cereal collecting community... I guarantee that a still sealed box of Coco-pops, in "straight from the factory" quality, from '97 is more rare than anything mass produced for the N64.


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## FAST6191 (Jul 13, 2021)

duwen said:


> How the prices and 'value' are determined within comic collecting is understandable. The sealed and graded videogame collecting community is trying to force the same logic onto a different media that doesn't really hold up to even vaguely similar criteria... it's as logical as conspiring to initiate a sealed and graded breakfast cereal collecting community... I guarantee that a still sealed box of Coco-pops, in "straight from the factory" quality, from '97 is more rare than anything mass produced for the N64.



Cereal might be tricky owing to the very limited shelf life but drinks collecting (as in cans) is very much a thing, never mind wine and spirits which has long been accepted to be in the same realms as any other collecting despite any number of blind taste tests and similar such testing trickery having it be undetectable over a cheap bottle of plonk (the usual thing to note is no undergrad research project is going to have thousands for a bottle of the fancy stuff, will have $50 and a dropper of food dye though).
As far as comics or cards or watches or shoes that otherwise get graded, rarity and other factors play into crazy second hand markets to games I reckon I could happily draw a direct line -- you can go after quality (and even without that faded box, no instructions, loose cart vs not that have been a thing since... I don't necessarily know about the N64 but when I was collecting NES games when the NES was still current), rarity, desirability (not necessarily the same as rarity -- devs going on to make other things, certain bugs, quality of base game, story of that particular cart*). Have no idea of the volume of the market, stability (the comics crash was largely seen to happen after the kids that normally bought them got priced out of the market) or other factors that some of the other things are subject to at this point but it is still a rare item no longer produced, subject to aesthetic desirability across a wide range of demographics (including the nostalgia driven "cash to burn" types), is small enough to be trivially transported (paintings are generally a bastard to ship, this comes with its own nice case already), subject to damage and degradation (and pretty commonly at that, and in this case be long before anybody took collecting seriously enough to keep it in air conditioned vault like many more do today**) and thus very happily could be seen among the same types of things more established.

Now I can't imagine going to a convention, museum or show to see this behind glass like I might a painting, a sculpture, that SNES-PS1 prototype, a wine collection or similar, or indeed some of the other weird and wonderful collectible things people have had over the years but eh.

*jewellery is often this if owned by some royalty, high society types (especially notable mistresses thereof) or whatever and have values far higher than a similar piece made from metals and gems dug up yesterday/without the story. I don't know what will go for games here -- signed by the maker is obvious but we have already seen some fashion design types do one off models ( https://www.flickr.com/photos/travis_l/633693734 -- a rhinestone DS made for Nintendo's shop somewhere), and that whole nonsense with the Wii intended for the queen the other month might not have been a thing in that instance but easily could have been. Don't know if controller/game copy owned by esports/competition/speedrun champion will ever be a thing, more likely to see some unrelated celebrity having owned it be more of a thing before then, that or film prop (nes power gloves might get a bit of something today thanks to rare and silly so good for the shelf of interesting things/conversation starters, should you find the power glove(s) used for The Wizard, aka the reason most know what it is today, and have provenance then different matter entirely).

**we are what, 20 years now and 15 at worst since this retro games lark became a notable thing (I was doing it before it was cool, mainly as it was cheap and the games were/are still good, it somewhat rapidly became not cheap and I wandered off) so we see enough people buy collections of what they think will be notable games to match the prices they saw various other things hit. I imagine a few of those will have ended up with a box that was not chucked on the wire frame shelf by a minimum wage teenager, after the palette it came in on was used as a step, whilst also being compressed with shrink wrap and subsequently fumbled by a bunch of children. There is doubtless some investor with the equivalent of https://towardsdatascience.com/what...o-games-compared-to-global-sales-bdf7a395e064 https://towardsdatascience.com/predicting-hit-video-games-with-ml-1341bd9b86b0 but for later years sales prices going on. Indeed most reading this could probably hash out the main rules/variables of such a thing; sales volume, quality, hidden gem status, lawsuits/recall, RPG vs not, sports game rarity in region, bundle games, on Nintendo console or not, kiddy game on xbox and thus hard for set completionists to source, speedrun potential including specific bugs in version, only sold out the back of a given shop... with the only hard variable being whether the 6/10 game will be by a dev that later goes on to rock the world (see prices of king's field before and after dark souls, or generally albums and books by artists and authors that later became super popular) or the game itself is seen as a fundamental stepping stone in innovation.


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## lokomelo (Jul 13, 2021)

Being realistic, that exorbitant value points toward a bigger picture. It is not video game collecting that went crazy in value, but art, cards, comics, everything. Also lots of governments are paying negative interests and they keep getting a lot of their titles sold. I believe that for reasons that I am not qualified to answer, the wealth people are desperate to park their money somewhere, and we are screwed that they choose classic gaming as one of their options.


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## m_babble (Jul 13, 2021)

Weird flex.


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## duwen (Jul 13, 2021)

As someone else pointed out earlier in the thread, it's a completely artificial market (not talking about videogame collecting as a whole, just the sealed & graded subsection).
Pat Contri and Ian Fergusson have had regular slots on their podcast dedicated to the crazy shenanigans... like the sealed and graded Spider-Man for Atari 2600 that sold at auction for over $9k, then subsequent auctions saw similarly graded copies drop to under $3k in a matter of weeks...



Combine the shady practices of the folks at WATA and Heritage Auctions with the elitist mentality of certain people in the scene and you have a shitshow of gigantic proportions that trickles down to regular sellers suddenly thinking that their loose Atari collection will fund their retirement when in actuality it probably wouldn't fund a night out.


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## FAST6191 (Jul 13, 2021)

I am somewhat dubious, or at least not fully accepting of such claims.

I would be the first to tell you auction prices very much depend upon the people in the room as it were on the day, and have any number of examples of things varying wildly as things float in and out of auctions (plenty of things get liquidated in fairly short order as people need to raise some cash, or people die and nobody wants it, fads in fashion, and that is before we get into the game theory of auctions -- others playing along if you played zelda wind waker and putting in high bids, or have seen those storage unit/locker shows where one group will run up the bids of another to make sure they have less funds later in the day then that, except the sorts of games you play when millions are on the line). Claims of artificially pumped markets is harder to justify. It could certainly be the case, and being a somewhat new market the path is far from well worn which only adds to the fun, though how bad I consider that I don't know (a fool and his money and all that).



lokomelo said:


> Being realistic, that exorbitant value points toward a bigger picture. It is not video game collecting that went crazy in value, but art, cards, comics, everything. Also lots of governments are paying negative interests and they keep getting a lot of their titles sold. I believe that for reasons that I am not qualified to answer, the wealth people are desperate to park their money somewhere, and we are screwed that they choose classic gaming as one of their options.


There is a reason everybody is buying land right now, and you don't want to know what was going on for antiques shops back in 2008. Classic games at graded level as both a store of value and hedge against inflation... guess they have far greater tolerances for volatility than I have.


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## supershadow64ds (Jul 13, 2021)

I 100% think this and the zelda copy are just money laundering schemes. I think I read somewhere that much rarer sealed games (like Little Samson) going for only 400k so this extremely common game going for 1.5mil is highly suspect.


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## FAST6191 (Jul 13, 2021)

supershadow64ds said:


> I 100% think this and the zelda copy are just money laundering schemes. I think I read somewhere that much rarer sealed games (like Little Samson) going for only 400k so this extremely common game going for 1.5mil is highly suspect.


I would certainly not bet against it but rarity of base game (rarity of copies at this quality level is a different matter again) is not the only factor -- mario 64 is for many quite a legendary game, the thing that kicked off 3d platform gaming and still something many games are judged against.
Similar idea to the jewellery I mentioned earlier -- plenty of jewellery is worth more than the basic stones and metal because it has a story to go with it. Or if you prefer two identical necklaces get made, one goes to the king of France's mistress, the other to some wife of some basically forgotten duke in a random German state... guess which one goes for more despite being essentially the same. Or go film collecting -- I am sure there is but one copy of someone's home video from the 30s somewhere, going to be far less valuable than some legendary 30s film that there might be some 10 copies remaining for.


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## Julie_Pilgrim (Jul 13, 2021)

RoloDeOvo said:


> Okay, anybody want my used copy of SOCOM II US Navy Seals? Price starts at 2 million. It's a bit steep and the disc is broken in half but it comes with the original manual, so it's worth it.


socom these nuts


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## MetoMeto (Jul 13, 2021)

In my honest opinion, this is idiotic.
I don't see seller nor buyer as a gamer, but a businessman that see games as any other product to make money of.
Imo gamers should be a family and not sell or buy games for astronomical prices but for symbolical so the game is passed on to ones that want it.

People givving money are in most fault imo but least scummy, and people who sell are most scummy and less in fault.
Why? Well, cause its their item, they can sell it whatever they want for to whoever, but they are scummy cause they can sleep at night knowing they ripped off someone for 1M usd for a piece of plastic that has 0 value other than to real gamers and collectors.

And why are gamers in fault for this but not scummy?
Cause they aren't scummy because they just want to play and complete their collection, but they are at fault because they actually GIVE money to scumbags that asks for 1M!

So yeah.....scalpers, these sellers and other similar people is whats wrong with gaming among other things.
Its because of those people preorders aren't available and old games are more and more rare, cause they bought them all to make a profit!

Imo gamers should be a family and sharing experiences and games among those like them and welcome new ones.


P.S. If you have any other argument against this other than "that's how market works" than please don't expect me to reply, cause i don't reply to scalpers and people who profit on games to be a gazillionare. If you cant sell a game for same but lower price than you bought it, than i see no reason to respond.



Sky is up and ground is down, that's just how it is.

Anyway....these things just piss me off.
But on a bright side, it's nice that these games are preserved!


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## FAST6191 (Jul 13, 2021)

MetoMeto said:


> but they are scummy cause they can sleep at night knowing they ripped off someone for 1M usd for a piece of plastic that has 0 value other than to real gamers and collectors.



Is that not the same for anything?

Diamonds are just carbon.
Gold is a metal with but a handful of industrial users, silver not that much better.
So the above was touched by some descendant of the people with the best army a few hundred years earlier. Big whoop.
Paintings are but paint on canvas or wood or whatever.
Sculptures are but carved marble, cast bronze or whatever.
Wine is but fermented grape juice.
Spirits are but distilled fermented if not grape juice then some other sugary/carbohydrate rich substance.
Comics are but prints on paper.

Most of those you can even replicate with far cheaper means (have shiner stuff than diamonds, gold is a bit harder but not much, my robot can replicate brush strokes these days, no wine really costs more than about $20 to make and most of it can't be told apart in blind taste tests, ditto spirits and even then industrial chemistry can probably take it up a notch, my PDF of a comic is probably far nicer to read...

Similarly gamer is no greater a distinction or barrier to entry than phone user these days.

To that end seems hard to want to be upset because someone decided to spunk a lot of money on something.


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## Vila_ (Jul 13, 2021)

these people clearly don't know how to manage money well... they could literally give it all to some random person and they would probably do a better job at managing it.


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## Panzerfaust (Jul 13, 2021)

I remember the good old days, when I read something like "SUPAH RARE NES STADIUM EVENT SOLD FOR 10k $" or the NWC carts...and somehow I think, that they are worth it...cause you know, they are actually rare items.


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## Plazorn (Jul 13, 2021)

cant wait for a time machine to be invented......


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## SpiffyJUNIOR (Jul 13, 2021)

damn people out here are really getting creative with their money laundering schemes


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## nl255 (Jul 14, 2021)

Catastrophic said:


> Would you rather:
> 
> -Pay 200 dollars for a boxed copy of Super Mario 64 in good condition
> 
> ...



Or pay $175 for the top of the line Everdrive 64 X7 and be able to play pretty much every N64 game ever made.


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## StrayGuitarist (Jul 14, 2021)

I _hate_ game collectors.


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## ldeveraux (Jul 14, 2021)

What a waste of money


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## duwen (Jul 14, 2021)

ldeveraux said:


> What a waste of money


Well, that depends... if the person that bought it (or rather, the consortium of individuals that conspired to bid it up that high) are sitting on some boxes of unopened stock that they picked up for peanuts years ago, they may have increased the _*perceived*_ value of that stock several thousand fold.

The reverse happened with Stadium Events for NES a few years back. A notoriously expensive title that certain gatekeepers in the collecting community traded between themselves to keep the price artificially high got fucked over by a decent collector (believe his name is Tim Atwood if my memory serves) that had been sitting on shipping cartons of brand new stock and decided to sell some.


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## pedro702 (Jul 14, 2021)

if mario64 has this imagine someone selling a 9.8 conker bad fur day lol, mario 64 is the most common game out there for the n64.


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## gamesquest1 (Jul 14, 2021)

heya, what good is a sealed US copy without a sealed PAL copy to go with it, dont worry buyer ill do you a solid and sell you it for a nice flat 1 mil


Spoiler











but to rebuke some of the salty complaints "oh Mario 64 sold millions of copies", yeah true, but probably at least 70% of those were pack in carts bundled with the console, then you have at least 3 different regions to split those sales across, but then it gets a bit more complicated, because typically collectors prefer to collect 1st print copies as opposed to players choice copies, due to Mario 64 being a pack in launch title it hit the players choice milestone pretty quickly, so when you factor in the pack in vs retail boxed copies, the EU/US/JAP split, the players choice silver boxes vs first run box originals then still factory sealed vs open your already down from the 12 million possible copies down to probably a few thousand at most probably more like a few hundred sealed first run copies

that's not to say its not over priced I have seen sealed copies sell for much less, but its dumb to say "urrrgh you can get a $5 cart on eBay", yes everyone knows that, you're saying the obvious, but some people specifically WANT a sealed copy and are willing to pay much more to get their hands on one as they are hard to come across, and the better the condition the more they typically sell for right up until you find the most mint pristine copy which will command the highest price, its again, just basic supply and demand that dictates the prices of things, your tatty old cart is not worth $100,000 because there is millions of tatty old carts all over eBay, more than enough supply to fill the demand, likewise there is a lot less demand for sealed copies, BUT there is a much much lower supply of them to fill the demand so the price is higher

but all that said, yeah it wouldn't surprise me that this specific sale was part of some other deal designed to legitimise the transaction


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## Paulsar99 (Jul 14, 2021)

I'll probably buy a copy of botw, keep it sealed for a few decades, and see what happens. Lol!


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## duwen (Jul 14, 2021)

gamesquest1 said:


> heya, what good is a sealed US copy without a sealed PAL copy to go with it, dont worry buyer ill do you a solid and sell you it for a nice flat 1 mil
> 
> 
> Spoiler



No thanks. I'll take this version of the *original* release of the title for a fraction of the price over the reduced framerate and bordered PAL version any day...


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## gamesquest1 (Jul 14, 2021)

duwen said:


> No thanks. I'll take this version of the *original* release of the title for a fraction of the price over the reduced framerate and bordered PAL version any day...


hey performance of the game doesn't matter when your keeping it sealed, give me my million bucks


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## Sundree (Jul 15, 2021)

There's something off about that entire thing. I'd never buy a copy of Mario 64 for 1 and a half million, even if it's sealed.


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## GbaNober (Jul 15, 2021)

Capitalist dedicate their time on how to expose the human Psychology or stupidity for their advantage
but we need stupid consumers to grow our economy.just be careful where you position yourselves in the food chain.


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## ldeveraux (Jul 15, 2021)

duwen said:


> Well, that depends... if the person that bought it (or rather, the consortium of individuals that conspired to bid it up that high) are sitting on some boxes of unopened stock that they picked up for peanuts years ago, they may have increased the _*perceived*_ value of that stock several thousand fold.
> 
> The reverse happened with Stadium Events for NES a few years back. A notoriously expensive title that certain gatekeepers in the collecting community traded between themselves to keep the price artificially high got fucked over by a decent collector (believe his name is Tim Atwood if my memory serves) that had been sitting on shipping cartons of brand new stock and decided to sell some.


No, that's stupid. It's a waste of money.


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## SaberLilly (Jul 15, 2021)

Well, a fool and his money are soon parted.

I mean i can understand shelling out a few hundred, like maybe 1-300, but spending 1.56 million is just a waste of money, and there is no way on earth the buyer is going to be able to recoup that.
Granted i once spent 50 bucks on a copy of JAP Pokemon Yellow complete in box.


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## duwen (Jul 15, 2021)

ldeveraux said:


> No, that's stupid. It's a waste of money.


Taking something that's worth a few hundred and manipulating the market to make similar items you can sell worth over 1.5mil is stupid?
Welcome to capitalism ...and enjoy poverty.


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## FAST6191 (Jul 15, 2021)

SaberLilly said:


> and there is no way on earth the buyer is going to be able to recoup that.


While not a volatility I care to indulge in (the arse has fallen out of far too many art markets in the past), and I would not bet on the buyer being able to realise the same money next week (two years from now is a different matter, ten years even more so), I would similarly not take your bet there -- no new versions of this are being made (and even under the best will in the world there is unlikely to be too many other surviving copies of this grade), fakes is harder than many other things, it is far from the first thing to establish this market in super rare high quality (or just super rare) games or disposable art in general, people generally like games such that I don't see them falling out of fashion as a general concept (and N64 stuff is probably fairly safe) any time soon.


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## SaberLilly (Jul 15, 2021)

FAST6191 said:


> While not a volatility I care to indulge in (the arse has fallen out of far too many art markets in the past), and I would not bet on the buyer being able to realise the same money next week (two years from now is a different matter, ten years even more so), I would similarly not take your bet there -- no new versions of this are being made (and even under the best will in the world there is unlikely to be too many other surviving copies of this grade), fakes is harder than many other things, it is far from the first thing to establish this market in super rare high quality (or just super rare) games or disposable art in general, people generally like games such that I don't see them falling out of fashion as a general concept (and N64 stuff is probably fairly safe) any time soon.



Ok, fair point. I just wasn't thinking long term.


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## ldeveraux (Jul 17, 2021)

duwen said:


> Taking something that's worth a few hundred and manipulating the market to make similar items you can sell worth over 1.5mil is stupid?
> Welcome to capitalism ...and enjoy poverty.


I'm just saying it's not worth that much money. It's just not. Insane that some dimwit would even consider that purchase.


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## FAST6191 (Jul 17, 2021)

ldeveraux said:


> I'm just saying it's not worth that much money. It's just not. Insane that some dimwit would even consider that purchase.


The glib response is several people seem to think it, and things like it, are worth that kind of money; rare and exemplar games having been seen in the various hundreds of thousands of dollars for some years now ( https://kmaupdates.com/world-record-for-most-expensive-video-game-auction-is-now-870000/ ). It is also not entirely out of line with some other rare books, comics, art or similar trinkets.

Prices also seem to be going one way in general, and with that this becomes something of an investment as well. For my money the volatility for the return is way too low compared to any other number of assets (sinking that kind of money into some nice crypto, index funds, gold... all likely to do far more for far less risk) but hey.

Now even if I were not a flash cart and emulation enthusiast I would still say the whole point of cartridges was generally that all the carts play the same*, which is probably also where you are finding yourself along with many others in this thread.

*I say that but on this N64 subject my Mario Kart 64 is one of those with the thing that makes the skyscraper balloon battle happen at crazy speed.


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## duwen (Jul 18, 2021)

Although I generally find Pat Contri to be obnoxious, with an attitude that comes across as kind of 'gatekeepery' while simultaneously being anti-gatekeeper, this excerpt from their recent podcast sheds a lot of insight into what's going on with the current WATA/Heritage Auctions/sealed+graded collectors... definitely worth a watch to see a perspective on how fucked this subsection of game collecting is becoming...


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## ldeveraux (Jul 19, 2021)

FAST6191 said:


> The glib response is several people seem to think it, and things like it, are worth that kind of money; rare and exemplar games having been seen in the various hundreds of thousands of dollars for some years now ( https://kmaupdates.com/world-record-for-most-expensive-video-game-auction-is-now-870000/ ). It is also not entirely out of line with some other rare books, comics, art or similar trinkets.
> 
> Prices also seem to be going one way in general, and with that this becomes something of an investment as well. For my money the volatility for the return is way too low compared to any other number of assets (sinking that kind of money into some nice crypto, index funds, gold... all likely to do far more for far less risk) but hey.
> 
> ...


No way. A video game is not worth a million and a half dollars. Think outside the box on this one, not as fan, or a gamer.


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## FAST6191 (Jul 19, 2021)

ldeveraux said:


> No way. A video game is not worth a million and a half dollars. Think outside the box on this one, not as fan, or a gamer.


What sort of outside the box thinking is needed here? I was looking at it much like one might look at fancy wine, comic books, trading cards, film prints, books, various types of art and drawing a line directly to it. Functionally I don't see a difference with this one -- generally rare items of cultural or aesthetic significance that will likely remain so, in this case with a serious quality bias.
Is some auction company and item grading outfit trying to corner a market and probably inflating things? Most likely, seems quite lucrative if so (buyer fees, seller fees, grading fees all being high or percentages) and even more so if they become "the" place to go for it all; there is no physical concept called grading, no tax one, probably no insurance one unless you get a contract noting it, no legal one... just a number some private company/individual makes up to describe various characteristics of items they find relevant, you can make your own right now if you wanted (indeed I would not be surprised if many of us have a rather informal one for games on our list, I certainly have my pain points for 360 games I have been trying to get for my little collection of them and turned one down the other day whilst buying some 6 of the things from the same seller), and that they hope others will follow or respect which typically has a serious establishment/first mover bias. The video a couple of posts up now notes this is all quite fast, whether this means bubble, fraud or previously unrealised value (there is no particular reason things have to follow the same course as trading cards and go back and forth for years) I do not know.
I did also link some videos previously on how the art market and fancy goods markets work which is another aspect of this
https://gbatemp.net/threads/a-seale...56-million-dollars.591219/page-4#post-9524195


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## ldeveraux (Jul 19, 2021)

FAST6191 said:


> What sort of outside the box thinking is needed here? I was looking at it much like one might look at fancy wine, comic books, trading cards, film prints, books, various types of art and drawing a line directly to it. Functionally I don't see a difference with this one -- generally rare items of cultural or aesthetic significance that will likely remain so, in this case with a serious quality bias.
> Is some auction company and item grading outfit trying to corner a market and probably inflating things? Most likely, seems quite lucrative if so (buyer fees, seller fees, grading fees all being high or percentages) and even more so if they become "the" place to go for it all; there is no physical concept called grading, no tax one, probably no insurance one unless you get a contract noting it, no legal one... just a number some private company/individual makes up to describe various characteristics of items they find relevant, you can make your own right now if you wanted (indeed I would not be surprised if many of us have a rather informal one for games on our list, I certainly have my pain points for 360 games I have been trying to get for my little collection of them and turned one down the other day whilst buying some 6 of the things from the same seller), and that they hope others will follow or respect which typically has a serious establishment/first mover bias. The video a couple of posts up now notes this is all quite fast, whether this means bubble, fraud or previously unrealised value (there is no particular reason things have to follow the same course as trading cards and go back and forth for years) I do not know.
> I did also link some videos previously on how the art market and fancy goods markets work which is another aspect of this
> https://gbatemp.net/threads/a-seale...56-million-dollars.591219/page-4#post-9524195


I honestly can't be bothered to read all that. If you're at all trying to justify a 1.5M price tag for a sealed N64 game, screw that.


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## Veho (Jul 19, 2021)

Without going over what others have already said, Ars Technica did a writeup on this, did sime research, asked around, and tl;dr: 
1: Collector's items are strange and fickle things and the market is volatile; 
2: Prices are usually driven up by completionist collectors bidding for the one game missing from their collection; 
3: This sometimes leads to obscure games selling for very large prices because they are the only surviving copy (and the rest are in a landfill somewhere); 
And 4: None of this explains the 1.5 million dollars, and there whole thing is just plain weird.


https://arstechnica.com/features/20...you-are-about-that-1-56m-super-mario-64-sale/


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## FAST6191 (Jul 19, 2021)

ldeveraux said:


> I honestly can't be bothered to read all that. If you're at all trying to justify a 1.5M price tag for a sealed N64 game, screw that.


Looking at your replies to this thread this is getting quite repetitive. I will go one more though, though I would have thought the few paragraphs earlier would have sufficed.

Rare things, which extends to exemplary copies of readily consumed or damaged items, can be worth a lot of money, both as objects in their own right and as means of investment. With this sort of news it seems computer games have firmly joined the ranks of such goods.
I don't get the appeal myself, and the risk-reward is way too bad even if I were someone with a few million spare to be investing, but it is a thing seen in many other fields -- wine, watches, jewellery, books, recordings, comics, playing cards, films, paintings, collectables and the list goes on and on*.
There is no reason computer games can't join those ranks either as they have all the same traits -- market in which they are enjoyed (basically everybody plays games, it is a soon to be trillions of dollars market despite only being millions a few decades ago), not making any more of them, small number of surviving copies of quality (especially not some kind of imagined super quality that we seem to be dealing with here) with demand far exceeding the supply... all together that means you see people parting with serious cash for things. It is fast for it to happen and not without a few questions but there is no reason for it not to happen if everything else is acceptable.

*I recently watched a video wherein a generally considered to be almost useless hand plane being apparently worth north of $1000 USD for one such example some might not expect


Though I could go the other way. You have said it is not worth that. Why do you think that?


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## ldeveraux (Jul 19, 2021)

FAST6191 said:


> Looking at your replies to this thread this is getting quite repetitive. I will go one more though, though I would have thought the few paragraphs earlier would have sufficed.
> 
> Rare things, which extends to exemplary copies of readily consumed or damaged items, can be worth a lot of money, both as objects in their own right and as means of investment. With this sort of news it seems computer games have firmly joined the ranks of such goods.
> I don't get the appeal myself, and the risk-reward is way too bad even if I were someone with a few million spare to be investing, but it is a thing seen in many other fields -- wine, watches, jewellery, books, recordings, comics, playing cards, films, paintings, collectables and the list goes on and on*.
> ...


Nope!


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## FAST6191 (Dec 1, 2021)

There was a follow up video to the earlier one detailing some of the potentially questionable actions by the auction house and grading company that some enjoyed



Original


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## Jayro (Dec 1, 2021)

Heh, wait until they get a load of my slightly used copy that I'll sell for $1.57 million...


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## FAST6191 (Dec 1, 2021)

Jayro said:


> Heh, wait until they get a load of my slightly used copy that I'll sell for $1.57 million...


At current rates of inflation in the US that might be undervalued in a couple of months.


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## lokomelo (Dec 1, 2021)

FAST6191 said:


> There was a follow up video to the earlier one detailing some of the potentially questionable actions by the auction house and grading company that some enjoyed
> 
> 
> 
> Original



look, the amount that I spend with old video games is a value that not even my wife knows (and I just buy cheap Japanese media), so why the hell an individual would made public a 2 million purchase? If is not for advertising, there is no reason for that.


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## FAST6191 (Dec 1, 2021)

lokomelo said:


> look, the amount that I spend with old video games is a value that not even my wife knows (and I just buy cheap Japanese media), so why the hell an individual would made public a 2 million purchase? If is not for advertising, there is no reason for that.


It was an auction company holding a public auction (with potential shadiness as described in the videos). Similarly a lot of rich investor types do it to flex*, to ensure they get a better price next time (if it is anything like art, comics, wine and whatnot, and from what I have seen in game collecting circles it is -- see history of Stadium events there) and possibly for insurance.

*for cars but holds much the same whatever you are doing

4:35 particularly.


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