# Affirmative action / Diversity quotas ... hiring & school admissions vs. sports



## Hanafuda (Oct 19, 2021)

Interesting but obvious question I've seen brought up many times before but there are always new young adults who've never thought about it. What do you guys think?


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## Drak0rex (Oct 19, 2021)

race bait post is race bait


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## Hanafuda (Oct 19, 2021)

Drak0rex said:


> race bait post is race bait



So, you'd rather not talk about it. Gotcha.

Is that because this is an example of (obvious, blatant) institutional racism, but one of which you approve?


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## Drak0rex (Oct 20, 2021)

I demand to see more diversity in the NBA.  FIGHT ME


Hanafuda said:


> So, you'd rather not talk about it. Gotcha.
> 
> Is that because this is an example of (obvious, blatant) institutional racism, but one of which you approve?


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## Xzi (Oct 20, 2021)

This is supposed to be shocking how, exactly?  There's a long history of racial discrimination in academia and higher education, whereas with sports, a person's level of innate and trained athleticism has always been the great equalizer to some extent.  At least after the school system was desegregated, anyway.


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## Drak0rex (Oct 20, 2021)

You just proved my point for me. People shouldn't be granted special favors based on their melanin content.  If you disagree then you're racist


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## Beware (Oct 20, 2021)

Drak0rex said:


> You just proved my point for me. People shouldn't be granted special favors based on their melanin content.  If you disagree then you're racist


Every day this forum gets more belligerently racist and less intelligent. Your comment and the general existence of this thread is the proof in that pudding.


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## Drak0rex (Oct 20, 2021)

Let's say you have a brain tumor. You have a choice between two doctors, one who put in the hard work and dedication to get to where he is, and the other who was boosted up by affirmative action. Which one would you want cracking open your coconut?


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## Xzi (Oct 20, 2021)

Drak0rex said:


> Let's say you have a brain tumor. You have a choice between two doctors, one who put in the hard work and dedication to get to where he is, and the other who was boosted up by affirmative action. Which one would you want cracking open your coconut?


Uhmm...either one because it takes hard work and dedication to make it all the way through medical school regardless of how you got in.  Are you under the false impression that affirmative action grants a student automatic As in every class they take?

Based on your first reply in this thread I assumed you were anti-racist, but I guess that was a foolish assumption on my part.


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## Drak0rex (Oct 20, 2021)

Affirmative action is racist by definition, giving a group of people special treatment over another for the shade of their flesh. Explain why asians are required to score more points than african americans on tests and tell me it's fair. (furious typing intensifies)


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## Xzi (Oct 20, 2021)

Drak0rex said:


> Affirmative action is racist by definition, giving a group of people special treatment over another for the shade of their flesh.


It's literally the opposite of that, it's acknowledgement that some colleges would admit exclusively white people if given the opportunity, even if that meant meant accepting some C-and-D high school students over vastly better-qualified black/Asian/Latino students.  As I said before, there's a long history of exactly that type of discrimination in higher education.


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## Xzi (Oct 20, 2021)

Drak0rex said:


> Explain why asians are required to score more points than african americans on tests and tell me it's fair.


This is only the case for colleges that arbitrarily limit the number of admission slots available for Asians and African-Americans, because they want exactly enough to fulfill the federal requirements and no more.  Once again, it's for the benefit of white students who otherwise might become a minority of admissions next to a more-qualified Asian student body.


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## Drak0rex (Oct 20, 2021)

Let's all just agree that skin color does not make you special. We're all just bags of meat. People should be judged only by how they treat others and the effort they put in for the betterment of humanity.


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## Xzi (Oct 20, 2021)

Drak0rex said:


> Let's all just agree that skin color does not make you special. We're all just bags of meat. People should be judged only by how they treat others


Precisely why affirmative action exists at all...admissions officials spent decades treating students differently based solely on the color of their skin.  Even positive stereotypes can be damaging in their own right, as you pointed out with the higher expectations placed on Asian students.


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## Drak0rex (Oct 20, 2021)

If you're in favor of affirmative action, then you're saying that some people aren't able to make it on their own merit and need special treatment. 

Stop obsessing over superficial things like skin tone and focus more on being a decent human being. No further discussion required.


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## Xzi (Oct 20, 2021)

Drak0rex said:


> If you're in favor of affirmative action, then you're saying that some people aren't able to make it on their own merit and need special treatment.


How are you still not understanding this?  The special treatment was given to below-average white students for decades on decades.  Affirmative action simply attempts to level the playing field and remove that special treatment by instead handing those admissions slots to above-average black/Asian/Latino students.  Whether it actually goes far enough to accomplish that goal is another matter...your own statements in this thread suggest that there probably aren't enough slots for all the above-average Asian students out there.

I'd love it if America was more of a meritocracy, but unfortunately that's never been the case in the past, and it still isn't the case today.


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## Drak0rex (Oct 20, 2021)

Let me simplify it. Color don't matter. Don't be a pud. Move on with your life. (or continue wasting your time in a race bait thread, on what should be a gaming forum instead of a wannabe Reddit, because you have nothing better to do with your time) First one to stop replying wins. GO!


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## Xzi (Oct 20, 2021)

Drak0rex said:


> Color don't matter.


If that's genuinely the case for you, great.  College admissions officials should all strive to achieve the same mindset, and maybe one day we won't need affirmative action any longer.  That's all I've been trying to say.


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## Dakitten (Oct 20, 2021)

Drak0rex said:


> If you're in favor of affirmative action, then you're saying that some people aren't able to make it on their own merit and need special treatment.
> 
> Stop obsessing over superficial things like skin tone and focus more on being a decent human being. No further discussion required.


To those privileged enough to not know what it is to be deprived, equality feels like oppression. 

To be blunt, affirmative action is a countermeasure to racism that happened so wildly in the past that it disadvantaged its victims to the point where their family decendants were also impacted. It is literally the least a society looking to correct itself can do.


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## ElSasori69 (Oct 20, 2021)

How hard is to understand that making anything just because some "special" condition (aside critical health condition of course) are always a bad idea because that idea always implies excluding people that doesn't match that "special" condition.


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## Dakitten (Oct 20, 2021)

ElSasori69 said:


> How hard is to understand that making anything just because some "special" condition (aside critical health condition of course) are always a bad idea because that idea always implies excluding people that doesn't match that "special" condition.


Um... where to even start with this... Racism existed, and resulted in things like slavery, near complete genocide, and wholesale theft of land and resources. Giving those resources and lives back is now impossible, and the aftermath has significantly impaired the victims (not to mention set a cultural norm that is QUITE pervasive even today), so how would you propose otherwise making up for this discrepancy?


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## Hanafuda (Oct 20, 2021)

Drak0rex said:


> I demand to see more diversity in the NBA.  FIGHT ME



I want the opposite ... no imposed artificial "diversity" quotas. Just competitiveness, ability and merit gets the pick. Whether it be sports, admissions, jobs, whatever. If that means the NBA is over 80% black (and it is), so be it. If that means medical schools are predominantly asians, with a minority of white, black, aborigine, whatever ... so be it.


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## Dr_Faustus (Nov 1, 2021)

Dakitten said:


> Um... where to even start with this... Racism existed, and resulted in things like slavery, near complete genocide, and wholesale theft of land and resources. Giving those resources and lives back is now impossible, and the aftermath has significantly impaired the victims (not to mention set a cultural norm that is QUITE pervasive even today), so how would you propose otherwise making up for this discrepancy?


So if I were to understand your argument, because White people made lives of others difficult lifetimes ago, those who are diverse should get an easy pass into life over others who tried hard to getting into where they are today?

I am sorry if this sounds harsh, but regardless of what happened lifetimes ago, my life nor my family in its current form has no obligation to accept that being the case. The past is in the hands of the past and unless you and your family made your entire fortune and status built upon the lives and corpses of those less fortunate then the argument that we should give more just because of the colour of our skin should have no bearing on any principal. Its if anything just as racist suggesting that all of White people should be obligated to give up something in order to obtain peace and diversity. Its a scenario that has no quarter on either end being good.


You want true equality in the world, you strip away the concept of diversity hires/picks in general. You hire/pick people based on their skill and desires. Not out of obligation to fill a checkbox or a number. When your institution worries more about that over choices of those who want to be there and have put the extended effort of being chosen to be there you already have made a bad call. No one should be looked over nor anyone should be given the easy path based on the colour of their skin or their gender. Its about effort, about skill, about desire and dedication. These should be the only qualifications to get where you want in life, anything else is non essential in life and in the workplace/school/team.


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## djpannda (Nov 1, 2021)

Dr_Faustus said:


> because White people made lives of others difficult lifetimes ago,


."because White people made lives of others difficult lifetimes ago and the reprecussions are unfortunately ingrained In todays  system." there I fix it for you


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## The Catboy (Nov 1, 2021)

Well, this just feels like an obvious dogwhistle thread.


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## Dr_Faustus (Nov 1, 2021)

djpannda said:


> ."because White people made lives of others difficult lifetimes ago and the reprecussions are unfortunately ingrained In todays  system." there I fix it for you


I mean if you want to go after the system you might as well just recreate society from the ground up at that point because its becomes so foundational to the way people think, feel and act that its on a subconscious routine level. No matter how you look at it, people are designed to exclude and group others. For better or for worse that is just how things are. With that said that does not mean we cannot push that towards a non-bias towards those with again, the specifics being what I mentioned before and not the colour or gender that you are. If people choose bias for colour or gender rather than anything else it does not matter if its for good or bad reason, the reason is still implied exclusivity designed out of racial or gender based rationale which is a very bad thing to still be doing period.  

If I want to pick a group of people for a task, a job, a team, or an education. I want to pick those who want to and can prove themselves to be able to take up the challenge. I should only worry about that, Race or Sex should not matter in these choices, what matters is their skill, effort and drive. If that group of people I choose has anyone of any different race or sex I would not care, because again its not about that but about what should matter in them. Its about seeing past differences and about embracing what makes everyone whole in the ideology in why they are there, to achieve the same goals as themselves and as a group. 

If that to you sounds somehow wrong, then please enlighten me on the matter.


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## Hanafuda (Nov 2, 2021)

The Catboy said:


> Well, this just feels like an obvious dogwhistle thread.



You just don't want to address the subject. More importantly, you don't want anyone else to.


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