# do you belive theres a after life



## TyDye (Apr 25, 2018)

I do I belive Heaven


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## DarthDub (Apr 25, 2018)

I believe in spirits and life after death.


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## Mnecraft368 (Apr 25, 2018)

I believe in the afterlife shown in the anime Angel Beats. because its the only anime afterlife I know of


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## VinsCool (Apr 25, 2018)

I wish there is a afterlife, or a reincarnation.
But my rational mind says that once we take our final breath, there will be nothing but the darkness, void, infinitely empty, and we won't even have a conscience to notice.


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## Armadillo (Apr 25, 2018)

Only if it has catgirls, otherwise no.


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## depaul (Apr 25, 2018)

Mnecraft368 said:


> I believe in the afterlife shown in the anime Angel Beats. because its the only anime afterlife I know of


Watch "Gantz" anime !


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## x65943 (Apr 25, 2018)

There's no afterlife, but that's not a bad thing. Life is what you make of it.


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## VinsCool (Apr 25, 2018)

Armadillo said:


> Only if it has catgirls, otherwise no.


God do I wish.


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## JiveTheTurkey (Apr 25, 2018)

Not sure. Depends who you ask, my optimistic person or my realistic person. Either way! I want to get my ashes flushed down the toilet so all you fuckers can have a little part of me in you.


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## VinsCool (Apr 25, 2018)

JiveTheTurkey said:


> Not sure. Depends who you ask, my optimistic person or my realistic person. Either way! I want to get my ashes flushed down the toilet so all you fuckers can have a little part of me in you.


That's perfect 
You almost made me spit my iced tea in the lobby room in front of my coworkers.


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## Deleted User (Apr 25, 2018)

VinsCool said:


> I wish there is a afterlife, or a reincarnation.
> But my rational mind says that once we take our final breath, there will be nothing but the darkness, void, infinitely empty, and we won't even have a conscience to notice.


A cessation of existence, more like? 

I liken death to falling into a deep sleep. You're gone, you cease to exist, but precisely because of this, you don't care anymore, and are at peace, free to let the universe happen around you. 

Honestly, I find this better than having my conscious self continue for eons into the future. I'd probably go nuts.


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## Plstic (Apr 25, 2018)

No.


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## 8BitWonder (Apr 25, 2018)

I don't really reject the idea of afterlife, nor do I say for certain that there is one.
No real set in stone way to know without kicking the bucket. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯


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## Deleted User (Apr 26, 2018)

Yes


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## cots (Apr 26, 2018)

I had a near death experience that makes me believe we're in an infinite loop and repeat our lives over and over again. I went to the hospital for heart problems and after they found the problem and fixed it they sent me to a psychiatric unit because I was having bad side effects to some of the medication they gave me. I guess (I don't remember) I punched a nurse so the next thing I know I wake up in jail. Anyway, so I was having problems separating my thoughts and dreams from reality. I finally got a chance to lay down and the next thing I remember is being injected with something and then I saw myself floating over my body and a voice asked me "Do you want to continue or start over?". I took this as continue on in my current life or start over from the beginning (be born again). Fuck starting over. My life has been shit. I guess I'll have to eventually repeat it though.

EDIT: Before this I was a Christian and it's been hard grained into me that there is a Heaven and Hell, but this sort of makes me question that so I'm not really too sure what happens. Part of me says I'm going to Hell another part says I'll have to start over and do the same things that I already did over, over, over, over and over again for infinite.


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## The Catboy (Apr 26, 2018)

I've actually had my heart stop twice in my life and really don't remember much more than darkness than an extreme pain when my heart was restarted. That being said, I honestly don't know nor care to know if there's an afterlife. I choose to live my life for today and worry about tomorrow when it happens. If there's an afterlife, then accept whatever outcome I get because at least know I lived my life. If there's no afterlife, that's fine too because there's most likely nothing after life anyways. Regardless I don't stress over it when I can't prove anything until it happens.


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## jahrs (Apr 26, 2018)

Doesnt really matter if there is or isnt just enjoy what you have now and work towards a better future while your alive and if theres something afterwards then sweet bonus but if not at least you enjoyed your life to the fullest.


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## VinsCool (Apr 26, 2018)

cots said:


> I was having problems separating my thoughts and dreams from reality.


This speaks to me on so many levels, because there are days I simply am in a limbo state of "is this a dream?" and "has this really happened?".


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## qqq1 (Apr 26, 2018)

Nope. Your life here is it. Have fun and don't be a jerk.


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## Nerdtendo (Apr 26, 2018)

As no shock to anyone, I do.


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## Kayot (Apr 26, 2018)

I hope so, but I expect that there isn't. Then again, it's kind of cool thinking that all of time will pass in the instant that I die and I'll be completely unaware of it.


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## Lacius (Apr 26, 2018)

There's no reason to think an afterlife exists.


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## dpad_5678 (Apr 26, 2018)

I _wish _I could rationally believe there is one, but it goes against basic science in every way possible, so logically I'd say no. The thought of an infinite darkness scares me though.



8BitWonder said:


> I don't really reject the idea of afterlife, nor do I say for certain that there is one.
> No real set in stone way to know without kicking the bucket. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯


OKAY! *kills self* /s


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## MewAndKirby (Apr 26, 2018)

I believe there is, and I believe there is a god, It just doesnt make sense that the universe came from nothing and that there was no one behind it, so I believe that god is real, and for the after life thing, of course I do, when we die we go to an afterlife because it doesnt make sense that we just see nothing for the rest of existence, besides, we dont know what true nothingness is.


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## HaloEliteLegend (Apr 26, 2018)

I personally don't think there's an afterlife, but so what if there is or isn't? Regardless, you should live your best life here. This might be the only life you have.


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## kehkou (Apr 27, 2018)

Only in the sense that our bodies and its materials go on to be consumed, and therefore, integrated into other life forms, over, and over again. We are simply the temporary custodians of the atoms that make up our bodies.


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## Lacius (Apr 27, 2018)

emiicfilms said:


> because it doesnt make sense that we just see nothing for the rest of existence


That's what it was like for billions of years before you were born.


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## MewAndKirby (Apr 27, 2018)

Lacius said:


> That's what it was like for billions of years before you were born.


its impossible to remember while inside the womb


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## DeslotlCL (Apr 27, 2018)

Applying the simple fact that energy cannot be destroyed, i like to think we are energy and when we die, we just get our concious released from our body, free to explore wherever you want to go, be it the earth itself or the whole universe. Because why not? Exploring the whole universe sounds like a fun thing to do while still being concious, but just without a physical body


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## Futurdreamz (Apr 27, 2018)

eh, I don't see anything that validates the existence of one. Seems to be nothing more then the coping strategy for dealing with the death of loved ones and hated ones - and a way to ensure the continued behavior of children who were reared to act good otherwise they will be punished, not be good for the sake of being good.

We're nothing more then a complicated bundle of neurons. With enough time and force we can completely alter a person's personality and behavior, to the extent that they can no longer be recognized as the same person. There's nothing to suggest that some aspect of our "self" exists as an entity that persists after our body dies. If you snap a Britney Spear's CD in half "Oops I did it again" doesn't somehow start playing on a different dimension or something.

Any belief in an afterlife is simply an excuse to not be the best you can be. Start jogging. Lose weight. Pick up a hobby. Never stop learning. You only get one life, might as well make the best of it.


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## DarthDub (Apr 27, 2018)

There are things in this world and beyond that cannot be seen with the naked eye. To think that there is no after-life is foolish in of itself for they cannot see past the veil put over their eyes.


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## ov3rkill (Apr 27, 2018)

I sure hope so. But if there's none, let's just make the most out of what we currently have since we only got one shot to live a fulfilling life. No respawns. No retry. No 1up. Just this single given life we have. Carpe diem!


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## Haamu (Apr 28, 2018)

No, was there a before-life you recall? No. Will it be the same after death? Most likely. 
Even if there is "something" after dying I don't think it can be called after-life because you won't remember it as the same person you were. Too deep hard to explain...


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## Stwert (Apr 29, 2018)

If there is, I seriously hope I don’t need to get a job in it.


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## leon315 (Apr 29, 2018)

i believe that bad guys will be reincarnated after death into pigs and get eat by asians.


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## ut2k4master (Apr 29, 2018)

nope


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## joemoe123g (Apr 29, 2018)

Science has not yet grasped the concept of the soul! Since no one knows or can do any kind of scientific experiments regarding this subject! No one can be 100% sure there is no life after death..

I believe there is a life after death and that one will be eternal...Our bodies are not ours... simply a vessel we borrow until our time comes... So be good and you will be rewarded in the afterlife :-) 

We were not created for nothing.. I believe we were created to be tested which one of us is best in deeds :-)


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## TotalInsanity4 (Apr 29, 2018)

Potentially. I was brought up Christian so I kind of have a wish to believe there is something better after death, but at the same time I can't help but feel that there's just nothing :T


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## ThoD (Apr 29, 2018)

Well, since the soul has weight and exists (not very accurate but somewhat true), we can't be sure of anything that occurs post mortem, for all we know it could just turn into anti-matter causing afterlife to be an ethereal prison of sorts Personally, I like to think that once dead, it's the end of everything, that nothing exists post-mortem, despite what religion likes to claim. If afterlife really existed, we'd have at least valid hints towards it's existence that aren't only present in religion. To sum up, once you die, nothing happens, black emptiness for all eternity at best, black emptiness for all eternity while you are conscious of it at worst


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## Navonod (Apr 29, 2018)

I don't believe life after death. All I want to do is sleep anyway. I feel like I don't get enough. I know I wont technically be sleeping but I'd rather there be nothing.


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## TotalInsanity4 (Apr 29, 2018)

ThoD said:


> Well, since the soul has weight and exists (not very accurate but somewhat true), we can't be sure of anything that occurs post mortem, for all we know it could just turn into anti-matter causing afterlife to be an ethereal prison of sorts Personally, I like to think that once dead, it's the end of everything, that nothing exists post-mortem, despite what religion likes to claim. If afterlife really existed, we'd have at least valid hints towards it's existence that aren't only present in religion. To sum up, once you die, nothing happens, black emptiness for all eternity at best, black emptiness for all eternity while you are conscious of it at worst


The page you linked even mentions the flaws of the experiment, that's not a sound theory in the least


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## SAIYAN48 (Apr 29, 2018)

There better be something beyond this...


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## Xanthe (Apr 29, 2018)

emiicfilms said:


> its impossible to remember while inside the womb


Its also impossible to remember things when you're dead...

Hence his point...


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## Jack Daniels (Apr 29, 2018)

Hell no, and it's a good thing too!
Good lord, i sure wish it's not there, seeing everyone that i knew helped make life a living hell again, no way! if there's heaven there would've been heaven all good people should be absolutely be able to agree on the following list of things:

* Favorite type of flowers.
* Favorite colour of flowers.
* Language of writing.
* Language of speech.
* Favorite style of building.
* Favorite style of art.
* Favorite game to play.
* Favorite movie to watch.
* Favorite sport to play.
* Favorite sport to watch.
* Favorite colour in general.
* Favorite style of dressing.
* Favorite book to read.
* Favorite comic books.
* Favorite cartoon to watch.
* What would be the true god.
* How to honour that one god.
* Sing the same songs.
* Like the same songs.
* Accept a god to be so hatefull that he wants all his people to be axcactly the same in mind though he knows he did not give them all the same mind to work with.
* Accept a god to not give a fuck for personal pain.
* accept that god create all creatures, but comes to accept only the few that be beyond perfect, above beying obedient, loving, helping, never taking anything not meant for you, never hurting another creature, beying loyal, you have also withouth any devine help got to go to the perfect religion club, following the perfect path and withouth any devine help being able to see right from wrong.

A god by any means has to be devine, perfect and caring for his people, but in each religion there are just as much people in percentage dying, with just as much pain.

* Why if a god would be devine would he/she not being able to tell or show what's the real religion.
* Why if a god would be devine would he/she not give a fuck about all his creation.
* Why if a god would be devine would he/she not would he let such a great part suffer immense pain.

The only thing relegion brought throughout time is hate towards each other becase of:

* Anothers idea of god.
* Anothers orientation in love.
* Anothers way of expressing his love towards hes or her god.
* Anothers way of showing love to another.
* Anothers way of dealing with pain.
* Anothers way of making art.
* Anothers way of decorating his house.
* Anothers way of celebrating his life.
* Anothers way of cooking dinner.
* Anothers way of behaving around other people.

But hey the Lords book says he or she does it out of love toward us all, so that should mean something? just saying it's love isn't gonna change anything.

The only good thing i can think of for relegion is for kids, it is reasuring them that there's someone for them to turn to when life's difficult, when there's death or pain.


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## THEELEMENTKH (Apr 29, 2018)

I think that there isn't any afterlife, once you die you only "live" via the memories of your family and friends


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## TotalInsanity4 (Apr 29, 2018)

THEELEMENTKH said:


> I think that there isn't any afterlife, once you die you only "live" via the memories of your family and friends


Kinda like Mexican tradition, or just symbolically?


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## _Chaz_ (Apr 29, 2018)

I sure hope not.


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## THEELEMENTKH (Apr 29, 2018)

TotalInsanity4 said:


> Kinda like Mexican tradition, or just symbolically?


Symbolically
Think about that this way:
Once people stop remembering you, you no longer exist


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## osm70 (Apr 29, 2018)

OK, what I'm going to say here will sound fucked up, but bear with me.

This is intended for people who believe in Heaven. And by Heaven, I mean a perfect afterlife, similar to the one promised by Christianity.

When your friends or relatives die, why are you sad? They are at a place that's objectively better than this world. You should be happy for them.


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## Navonod (Apr 29, 2018)

THEELEMENTKH said:


> Symbolically
> Think about that this way:
> Once people stop remembering you, you no longer exist


People are working on a way to save your memories and your likeness in digital form so then your future relatives can go to a library and talk to you.


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## LittleFlame (Apr 29, 2018)

whatever, It's not worth worrying about. live your life the way you want and if there happens to be an afterlife, worry about that after you die.


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## Viri (Apr 29, 2018)

I'm unsure, but I honestly hope so. If I had to choose an after life, I'd easily choose Valhalla.


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## Navonod (Apr 29, 2018)

Viri said:


> I'm unsure, but I honestly hope so. If I had to choose an after life, I'd easily choose Valhalla.


You'd have to die as a warrior.


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## Viri (Apr 29, 2018)

DrGreed said:


> You'd have to die as a warrior.


Yeah, I know, that's the shitty part.  If it's a true after life, I imagine that's where school shooters are going, lol.


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## TotalInsanity4 (Apr 29, 2018)

Viri said:


> I'm unsure, but I honestly hope so. If I had to choose an after life, I'd easily choose Valhalla.


There are other halls that you could go in Nordic mythology, why Valhalla in particular?


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## DarkFlare69 (Apr 29, 2018)

I don't believe in an afterlife. We are just a bunch of atoms that are arranged in a very precise, specific way that gives us the perception of life. Everything that happens is a physical interaction. Whether it be a thought, a feeling, a sense, anything, it's all just chemicals interacting in your brain. Once they are unable to do this anymore, it's over. You will never see anything, you will never know you lived, nothing that ever happened will matter.


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## comput3rus3r (Apr 29, 2018)

Spongebobplace said:


> I do I belive Heaven


Do you believe in grammar?

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------



DarkFlare69 said:


> I don't believe in an afterlife. We are just a bunch of atoms that are arranged in a very precise, specific way that gives us the perception of life. Everything that happens is a physical interaction. Whether it be a thought, a feeling, a sense, anything, it's all just chemicals interacting in your brain. Once they are unable to do this anymore, it's over. You will never see anything, you will never know you lived, nothing that ever happened will matter.


Nothing arranges itself in a precise manner without an intelligence guiding it. There's a God and there's an afterlife and where you end up is entirely up to you.


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## osm70 (Apr 29, 2018)

comput3rus3r said:


> Do you believe in grammar?
> 
> --------------------- MERGED ---------------------------
> 
> ...



Mind telling me what intelligence arranged the God you are talking about?


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## TheDarkGreninja (Apr 29, 2018)

osm70 said:


> OK, what I'm going to say here will sound fucked up, but bear with me.
> 
> This is intended for people who believe in Heaven. And by Heaven, I mean a perfect afterlife, similar to the one promised by Christianity.
> 
> When your friends or relatives die, why are you sad? They are at a place that's objectively better than this world. You should be happy for them.



We're not rational beings. We're sad because, while yes they're in a better place, they're not with *us *anymore what's sad is where they aren't not where they are.





dpad_5678 said:


> but it goes against basic science in every way possible



What...?


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## osm70 (Apr 29, 2018)

TheDarkGreninja said:


> We're not rational beings. We're sad because, while yes they're in a better place, they're not with *us *anymore what's sad is where they aren't not where they are.



Well... (Alright, what I'm going to say now is VERY FUCKED UP. Keep in mind I am not telling you to do that, I'm just pointing out where that threat of logic leads.)

What's stopping you from just... you know... going to that better place too?


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## DarkFlare69 (Apr 29, 2018)

comput3rus3r said:


> Do you believe in grammar?
> 
> --------------------- MERGED ---------------------------
> 
> ...


The universe is infinitely big. Somewhere there is going to be an amazing place where things like that happen. That place is earth. Think about it, there's trillions and trillions of other planets and as far as we know none of them have any life. It was very lucky that life existed on our planet, but it would be bound to happen eventually considering the massive size of the universe.


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## TheDarkGreninja (Apr 29, 2018)

osm70 said:


> Well... (Alright, what I'm going to say now is VERY FUCKED UP. Keep in mind I am not telling you to do that, I'm just pointing out where that threat of logic leads.)
> 
> What's stopping you from just... you know... going to that better place too?



Because usually religion makes killing oneself an act against god.

Also, you really don't need to preface your points with "This is fucked up". I doubt you'll offend anyone


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## osm70 (Apr 29, 2018)

DarkFlare69 said:


> The universe is infinitely big. Somewhere there is going to be an amazing place where things like that happen. That place is earth. Think about it, there's trillions and trillions of other planets and as far as we know none of them have any life. It was very lucky that life existed on our planet, but it would be bound to happen eventually considering the massive size of the universe.


If the universe indeed is infinite, literally anything you can think of (and is scientifically possible) happened, is happening or will happen.

Let's go smaller scale:
Roll a dice infinity times. You will eventually roll a 3. It's impossible not to.



TheDarkGreninja said:


> Because usually religion makes killing oneself an act against god.
> 
> Also, you really don't need to preface your points with "This is fucked up". I doubt you'll offend anyone



I'm not worried about offending people. I'm worried someone will take me way too seriously and go like "yeah, that makes sense, why am I wasting my time here" and kill themselves.


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## TheDarkGreninja (Apr 29, 2018)

osm70 said:


> I'm not worried about offending people. I'm worried someone will take me way too seriously and go like "yeah, that makes sense, why am I wasting my time here" and kill themselves.



Lmao, no one is that stupid, and if someone really did that would just be evolution at work.


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## DarkFlare69 (Apr 29, 2018)

osm70 said:


> If the universe indeed is infinite, literally anything you can think of (and is scientifically possible) happened, is happening or will happen.
> 
> Let's go smaller scale:
> Roll a dice infinity times. You will eventually


That's what I'm saying, too. Our existance may be unique, in comparison to everything else we can see, but it's not the work of "God" or anything.


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## Depravo (Apr 29, 2018)

This is a video game forum. Most of us here don't even have a life _before_ death.


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## Kheartz (Apr 29, 2018)

Depravo said:


> This is a video game forum. Most of us here don't even have a life _before_ death.


Mate, gaming is life.


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## ThoD (Apr 29, 2018)

TotalInsanity4 said:


> The page you linked even mentions the flaws of the experiment, that's not a sound theory in the least


Ok... and how is that relevant? The flaws are regarding the actual weight, not whether souls exist or whether they have weight as those were proven even longer ago



osm70 said:


> OK, what I'm going to say here will sound fucked up, but bear with me.
> 
> This is intended for people who believe in Heaven. And by Heaven, I mean a perfect afterlife, similar to the one promised by Christianity.
> 
> When your friends or relatives die, why are you sad? They are at a place that's objectively better than this world. You should be happy for them.


It's called stupidity. If you actually loved someone and you were close, then being sad and crying only serves a self-satisfactory role of "hey look at me and how I grieve". They wouldn't want you to be sad, so why is it ok to be sad and cry on their name if you actually cared? See? Stupidity at it's finest!


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## SG854 (Apr 29, 2018)

TheDarkGreninja said:


> Lmao, no one is that stupid, and if someone really did that would just be evolution at work.


Let’s say we had access to immortality. And you have a choice to become immortal or not to go to an afterlife. Would you do it? How do you know for certainty there is life after death? Because if there isn’t then you made a big mistake. And you can’t experience life anymore. You cease to exist. 

Death does not give life meaning. Life gives life meaning. Forming bonds, relationships, experiencing music and all of life’s stuff. You can’t do this if your dead and there is no after life. If you had family and friends that chose to be immortal. Would you choose to be immortal too? To be with them here on earth. Or is it against your religion to seek immortality? Because you are playing God. 

What if you had children that don’t believe in the same religion you do and choose immortality on earth. Will this affect your decision?


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## TheDarkGreninja (Apr 29, 2018)

Depravo said:


> This is a video game forum. Most of us here don't even have a life _before_ death.



This.

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------



SG854 said:


> Let’s say we had access to immortality. And you have a choice to become immortal or not to go to an afterlife. Would you do it? How do you know for certainty there is life after death? Because if there isn’t then you made a big mistake. And you can’t experience life anymore. You cease to exist.
> 
> Death does not give life meaning. Life gives life meaning. Forming bonds, relationships, experiencing music and all of life’s stuff. You can’t do this if your dead and there is no after life. If you had family and friends that chose to be immortal. Would you choose to be immortal too? To be with them here on earth. Or is it against your religion to seek immortality? Because you are playing God.
> 
> What if you had children that don’t believe in the same religion you do and choose immortality on earth. Will this affect your decision?



I'll answer these one by one.
"Would you do it?"
Depends, if there's something I've left to do I'll take it.
"How do you know for certainty there is life after death?"
Because of what I know about God, I'd rather not turn this into an argument about God's existence though, especially because of the many different faiths out there, it'll just get messy.
"Because if there isn’t then you made a big mistake. And you can’t experience life anymore. You cease to exist."
No I didn't, because I can still enjoy life and believe in an afterlife you know. They're not binary options.
"Death does not give life meaning. "
I'd say it does, by knowing you have limited time here it drives you to be the person you want to be, live those experiences you want to live. Being immortal would be a boring life in comparison, you'd complete everything you wanted to do and then some, but then what? You wait until the universe's eventual heat death bored out of your mind.
"Or is it against your religion to seek immortality? Because you are playing God."
I don't think it's against my religion (I'm Muslim, by the way) to seek immortality, simply for the fact that I view God as the creator of the universe and everything in it. The only way we can play God is to create a universe, which as far as I am aware is impossible.
"Will this affect your decision?"
Nope. Whether or not I choose to continue on living will be based on what I want, not what others around me want.


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## lolboy (Apr 29, 2018)

In my opinion there has to be otherwise this life would make no sense. Our natural instinct is telling us to keep on going as we are part of something bigger. Otherwise the majority of the world would have ended their lifes because of just work, eat and sleep.


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## orangy57 (Apr 29, 2018)

I don't believe in an afterlife because I don't want one. Life is terrible, it's stressful and puts so much pressure on your mind and body, that I'll eventually want it to be over. The only more terrifying thing than death is the possibility that I could die and then be sentenced to an ETERNITY of consciousness. I'd rather have one shot. One start, one end, and then I'll never have to have it happen again.


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## TheDarkGreninja (Apr 29, 2018)

Orangy57 said:


> I don't believe in an afterlife because I don't want one. Life is terrible, it's stressful and puts so much pressure on your mind and body, that I'll eventually want it to be over. The only more terrifying thing than death is the possibility that I could die and then be sentenced to an ETERNITY of consciousness. I'd rather have one shot. One start, one end, and then I'll never have to have it happen again.



I mean, it's an eternity of very comfortable consciousness. (Well if you go to Heaven or even believe in that sort of afterlife)


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## Xzi (Apr 29, 2018)

I don't know, and I think the unknown is what's most exciting about death.  Heaven and hell are simplistic, Earthly concepts.  Certainly whatever comes next won't be so binary as carrot and stick.


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## Hanafuda (Apr 29, 2018)

I look forward to enjoying my life after death about as much as I enjoyed my life before birth.

In other words, no I don't. Certainly not in any conventional sense that humans have thought of so far. Nice idea though, useful for all kinds of mass behavioral control.


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## TheDarkGreninja (Apr 29, 2018)

Hanafuda said:


> useful for all kinds of mass behavioral control.



Always a fun thing to put in to a line of reasoning.
Just because it can be used to control people's behaviour doesn't mean it was in the past, nor does it mean that it's origins lie there.

Edit:
Trying to use a priori reasoning is never a good thing when there is essentially no evidence of religion originating from the need to control people.


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## CMDreamer (Apr 29, 2018)

We're made of energy, so then, we will transform into something diferent, when our physical beings "expire".


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## osm70 (Apr 30, 2018)

Can you imagine being suicidal, actually killing yourself and then finding out an afterlife does exist?

That must suck.


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## TotalInsanity4 (Apr 30, 2018)

TheDarkGreninja said:


> Lmao, no one is that stupid, and if someone really did that would just be evolution at work.


Nuuuuuuh, you'd be surprised how irrational people who've just experienced loss can be

Also, if you subscribe to some views of Christian Heaven, it's supposedly a place that exists outside of time. So in a way you're already with them, they're just not with you anymore/yet


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## TotalInsanity4 (Apr 30, 2018)

ThoD said:


> Ok... and how is that relevant? The flaws are regarding the actual weight, not whether souls exist or whether they have weight as those were proven even longer ago


Pretty sure that the "he tested 6 corpses and only one showed a measurable change in weight" is referring to the fact that the experiment itself is flawed, not that only one of the "souls" weigh anything

Besides, gas has mass. Piss has mass. Blood has mass. There are a number of factors not controlled for that might cause an undocumented weight change

I'm not here to debate the existence of a soul, but what I am telling you is that you're going to have to keep searching for scientific proof, because that particular experiment is utter crock


----------



## kuwanger (Apr 30, 2018)

The real question is, is there a pre-life (like Haibane Renmei)?  If there is, we don't remember it, but it effects who we are born to be, then the universe is cruel.  The same if there's an after-life.  It's why the idea of reincarnation is cruel.  Anyways, the point is that if you believe in an after-life, then there's no good reason to not believe in an infinite number of after-lives.  Same thing with believing in a God--it's Gods all the way down.

Personally, I choose to believe there is no after-life.  Heaven is hell if you don't know why you're there.


----------



## DarkFlare69 (Apr 30, 2018)

Orangy57 said:


> I don't believe in an afterlife because I don't want one. Life is terrible, it's stressful and puts so much pressure on your mind and body, that I'll eventually want it to be over. The only more terrifying thing than death is the possibility that I could die and then be sentenced to an ETERNITY of consciousness. I'd rather have one shot. One start, one end, and then I'll never have to have it happen again.


I agree with this. Even if it's complete bliss, Id rather it just be over when it's supposed to be over. Being sentenced to eternity of anything is overwhelming, knowing there's never an end


----------



## TheDarkGreninja (Apr 30, 2018)

TotalInsanity4 said:


> Nuuuuuuh, you'd be surprised how irrational people who've just experienced loss can be
> 
> Also, if you subscribe to some views of Christian Heaven, it's supposedly a place that exists outside of time. So in a way you're already with them, they're just not with you anymore/yet



I mean, if they kill themselves, what problem is there? It's their life, it's their's to take as well.




kuwanger said:


> Anyways, the point is that if you believe in an after-life, then there's no good reason to not believe in an infinite number of after-lives. Same thing with believing in a God--it's Gods all the way down.



Well, you can't rationally have an infinite numbers of afterlife's, I'm sure most people would argue that the god that created the afterlife was uncreated, thus preventing an infinite regression.


----------



## antiNT (Apr 30, 2018)

Where is the poll


----------



## kuwanger (Apr 30, 2018)

TheDarkGreninja said:


> Well, you can't rationally have an infinite numbers of afterlife's, I'm sure most people would argue that the god that created the afterlife was uncreated, thus preventing an infinite regression.



The argument could be trivially made that the God of each afterlife is the God of the previous life, so there's no per se infinite regression.  Regardless, there's no rational way to argue this universe exists, no God, God, or an infinite number of Gods.  The Big Bang was as much uncreated as anything yet it had a beginning.


----------



## joemoe123g (Apr 30, 2018)

" And the heaven, We built it with craftsmanship and We are still expanding."

How could an illiterate man who lived 1400 years have known about the expansion of the universe?


----------



## Bimmel (Apr 30, 2018)

Spongebobplace said:


> I do I belive Heaven


I am deeply touched by your speech and will always hold it in my heart. Truly poetic.


----------



## Helpful Corn (Apr 30, 2018)

Life is a cycle not a circle, repetitious and indefinite yes, but cyclical not circular nor straight.  Be your best, leave the rest, to fate?


----------



## netovsk (Apr 30, 2018)

I believe there is eternal peace after this life.

Dark. Silent. Still.


----------



## Pandaxclone2 (Apr 30, 2018)

I believe that we either have nothing after death or we relive this life again after death to do different things. It would be rather ironic in the sense that we'd never remember a "before", except those moments when you get Déjà vu.

Otherwise, I would like to think there is something more beyond death, be it an afterlife or the consciousness ascending to a higher dimension, but I won't hold my breath.


----------



## TotalInsanity4 (Apr 30, 2018)

TheDarkGreninja said:


> I mean, if they kill themselves, what problem is there? It's their life, it's their's to take as well.


Because I think you'll find that even if someone is prepared to kill themselves, most people prefer living in the end


----------



## RobXcore (Apr 30, 2018)

If there was an afterlife, everyone would be killing themselves because being alive on earth is not necessarily the greatest thing lol


----------



## spotanjo3 (Apr 30, 2018)

Spongebobplace said:


> I do I belive Heaven



Do you believe that good people died and gone to Heaven ? What about bad people ?

Let's focus on this one about Heaven and Earth. I will have good one about bad people for the next. Anyway.. Here it is:

New Earth right here.. It never said anything about going to heaven. We aren't going to Heaven... 


Psalm 37:29:

29 The righteous will possess the earth, And they will live forever on it.


Isaiah 65:17:

17 For look! I am creating new heavens and a new earth;

And the former things will not be called to mind,

Nor will they come up into the heart.


Isaiah 11:6-9:

And the wolf will actually reside for a while with the male lamb,+and with the kid the leopard itself will lie down, and the calf and the maned young lion and the well-fed animal all together; and a mere little boy will be leader over them. 7 And the cow and the bear themselves will feed; together their young ones will lie down. And even the lion will eat straw just like the bull. 8 And the sucking child will certainly play upon the hole of the cobra; and upon the light aperture of a poisonous snake will a weaned child actually put his own hand. 9 They will not do any harm  or cause any ruin in all my holy mountain; because the earth will certainly be filled with the knowledge of God as the waters are covering the very sea.


John 5:28,29:

28 Do not be amazed at this, for the hour is coming in which all those in the memorial tombs will hear his voicea 29 and come out, those who did good things to a resurrection of life, and those who practiced vile things to a resurrection of judgment.


Psalm 67:6:

6 The earth will give its produce; a God, our God, will bless us.


Proverbs 2:22:

22 As for the wicked, they will be cut off from the earth,aAnd the treacherous will be torn away from it.


Isaiah 65:21; 22

21 They will build houses and live in them, And they will plant vineyards and eat their fruitage. 22 They will not build for someone else to inhabit, Nor will they plant for others to eat.For the days of my people will be like the days of a tree, And the work of their hands my chosen ones will enjoy to the full.


Clearly, God talks about New Heaven (Already did in 1914) and New Earth


----------



## TheDarkGreninja (Apr 30, 2018)

kuwanger said:


> The argument could be trivially made that the God of each afterlife is the God of the previous life, so there's no per se infinite regression.  Regardless, there's no rational way to argue this universe exists, no God, God, or an infinite number of Gods.  The Big Bang was as much uncreated as anything yet it had a beginning.



Wouldn't it still be an infinite regression? After all, that would go on backwards forever if that were the case. Unless I misunderstand, of course.

"The Big Bang was as much uncreated as anything yet it had a beginning."

I'm not sure how that makes sense, something uncreated has no beginning or end, it's eternal.
Merriam-Webster Definition:
not existing by creation : eternal, self-existent

Edit: 
The argument should be what the universe was created by, as it doesn't lie solely on God. There are number of theories out there, ranging from another universe creating our own (The Big Bounce) to God himself.



TotalInsanity4 said:


> Because I think you'll find that even if someone is prepared to kill themselves, most people prefer living in the end



They should've thought about that before killing themselves. It shouldn't be up to us to control what others decide to do.


----------



## TotalInsanity4 (Apr 30, 2018)

TheDarkGreninja said:


> They should've thought about that before killing themselves. It shouldn't be up to us to control what others decide to do.


That's a rather insensitive thing to say. Plus, suicidal people tend to not be thinking rationally. That's why suicide hotlines exist


----------



## TheDarkGreninja (Apr 30, 2018)

TotalInsanity4 said:


> That's a rather insensitive thing to say. Plus, suicidal people tend to not be thinking rationally. That's why suicide hotlines exist



I'm not saying that people shouldn't seek help before killing themselves, all I'm saying is that if they do and still feel the same way, there's no stopping them at that point so they might as well. 
Also, let me make it clear, I completely understand that not everyone who is suicidal is the same and that some need help more than others. All I'm saying is that killing yourself because "it makes sense" is about as moronic as it gets.


----------



## kuwanger (Apr 30, 2018)

TheDarkGreninja said:


> Wouldn't it still be an infinite regression? After all, that would go on backwards forever if that were the case. Unless I misunderstand, of course.
> 
> "The Big Bang was as much uncreated as anything yet it had a beginning."
> I'm not sure how that makes sense, something uncreated has no beginning or end, it's eternal.



That's the paradox.  The universe always existed and any differentiation is purely anthropomorphism--we characterize everything to be mortal, with a birth and a death.  Yet, we obviously can't rationalize a way for something to be eternal that also changes because change overall is increased entropy which leads to "death".  I'd say this the reason talk of God and the after-life are part of philosophy, not logic.  Logic is an incomplete mechanism for modeling reality (or unreality).


----------



## Xathya (Apr 30, 2018)

no no lif is after the liv so we gota lives now and be the best we can bes!
as he aron say: be nice, be a flowe, not weds


----------



## TheDarkGreninja (Apr 30, 2018)

kuwanger said:


> That's the paradox.  The universe always existed and any differentiation is purely anthropomorphism--we characterize everything to be mortal, with a birth and a death.  Yet, we obviously can't rationalize a way for something to be eternal that also changes because change overall is increased entropy which leads to "death".  I'd say this the reason talk of God and the after-life are part of philosophy, not logic.  Logic is an incomplete mechanism for modeling reality (or unreality).



Ah, thanks for clearing things up.

"The universe always existed"
I'm not sure the evidence available to us suggests that at all. At the very least, it suggests that time itself had a beginning.

"Yet, we obviously can't rationalize a way for something to be eternal that also changes because change overall is increased entropy which leads to "death"."
We would be able to if that thing were outside our universe, as God would be.

"I'd say this the reason talk of God and the after-life are part of philosophy, not logic."

I'd tend to agree, trying to rationalise something completely out of our scope is irrational. But, I'd also argue that arguing that something like God as the "prime mover" is something within our mental capacity.


----------



## kuwanger (Apr 30, 2018)

TheDarkGreninja said:


> I'm not sure the evidence available to us suggests that at all. At the very least, it suggests that time itself had a beginning.



So at what time did time begin?  See, time is change.



TheDarkGreninja said:


> We would be able to if that thing were outside our universe, as God would be.



So what makes it "outside" our Universe?  If you mean God exists in the multi-verse of universes, then he still lives somewhere and our Universe having a creation date is a bit arbitrary--it came out of the multi-verse and merely didn't differentiate until later.



TheDarkGreninja said:


> I'd tend to agree, trying to rationalise something completely out of our scope is irrational. But, I'd also argue that arguing that something like God as the "prime mover" is something within our mental capacity.



How can God change but not die?  How can he exist without being born?  Every living thing in the universe has a birth after the start of the universe.  So, presumably everything in the multi-verse (or whereever God is) was born after that area existed.  And the multi-verse presumably came from the multi-multi-verse.  We can imagine things that don't exist.  But we can't rationalize them, so just being in our mental capacity isn't enough.  We don't say unicorns exist, for example.


----------



## TheDarkGreninja (Apr 30, 2018)

kuwanger said:


> So at what time did time begin? See, time is change.



Time began around 14 billion years ago. I'm not so sure what was so difficult about that question.



kuwanger said:


> So what makes it "outside" our Universe?



Being completely outside of our universe would me to not have any of the same rules apply, and if anything have no rules apply, thus allowing God to be something we are unable to understand outside of the basic concept that he would be omnipotent, omniscient, omnipresent etc.



kuwanger said:


> merely didn't differentiate until later.



Could you explain what you mean by this?




kuwanger said:


> How can God change but not die?



What do you mean by God changing? If you mean in the sense of entropy as you had mentioned earlier, it wouldn't apply to him as none of the universe's properties would apply to him. If anything you could suggest that God is in a vacuum without anything but himself, something definitely beyond us. 



kuwanger said:


> We don't say unicorns exist, for example.



I'd say that's a false equivalence, seeing as how, if a  Unicorn were to be within our universe many things would apply to it that would rule out it's existence, in comparison to God who would have none of those things apply to it.


----------



## kuwanger (Apr 30, 2018)

TheDarkGreninja said:


> Time began around 14 billion years ago. I'm not so sure what was so difficult about that question.



So before that time didn't exist. So, give at least part of time is change, what didn't change that caused the Big Bang to occur?



TheDarkGreninja said:


> Being completely outside of our universe would me to not have any of the same rules apply, and if anything have no rules apply, thus allowing God to be something we are unable to understand outside of the basic concept that he would be omnipotent, omniscient, omnipresent etc.



Being outside the universe, we wouldn't be able to understand he does exist either.



TheDarkGreninja said:


> Could you explain what you mean by this?



Before the Big Bang "happened" everything was in the Big Bang.  It was the Universe.  If you believe in Determinism, then everything that followed was a byproduct of that initial state with no deviation.  So, the evolution of time in the Universe is merely the differentiation/increased entropy of matter/energy.  Taken down to the resolution of Planck time and you have conceptually a [in]finite number of 3D frames that make up the Universe.



TheDarkGreninja said:


> What do you mean by God changing? If you mean in the sense of entropy as you had mentioned earlier, it wouldn't apply to him as none of the universe's properties would apply to him. If anything you could suggest that God is in a vacuum without anything but himself, something definitely beyond us.



I mean change as in change.  For God to act, he has to change.  If God acted simultaneously in the creation and all his interactions in the universe in all the individual frames of the universe, there's no real differentiation between his actions and nothingness except the potentially measurable differentiation from the expected norms.  At that level, though, his actions are merely an illusion (which is in the same scope as time and consciousness being illusions based upon perception).



TheDarkGreninja said:


> I'd say that's a false equivalence, seeing as how, if a Unicorn were to be within our universe many things would apply to it that would rule out it's existence, in comparison to God who would have none of those things apply to it.



Whatever miraculous property that allows God to interact with our universe would apply equally to unicorns because unicorns could be a creation of God (or vice versa).  We don't believe in unicorns because we haven't been indoctrinated to believe in unicorns and so we attempt to apply rules of evidence in our Universe to discount them.


----------



## DaFixer (Apr 30, 2018)

Yep Beer,women,beer and more women 

But no I don't belive in a life after my life.
When my life ends, I hope it for good.


----------



## TheDarkGreninja (Apr 30, 2018)

kuwanger said:


> So before that time didn't exist. So, give at least part of time is change, what didn't change that caused the Big Bang to occur?



Something, what that something is up for debate.



kuwanger said:


> Being outside the universe, we wouldn't be able to understand he does exist either.



Definitely, and that's where religion and each religion's various "proofs" come into play as well. But I'd rather stick to just the possibility of God existing being not completely out of this world (and at least making sense.)



kuwanger said:


> I mean change as in change. For God to act, he has to change. If God acted simultaneously in the creation and all his interactions in the universe in all the individual frames of the universe, there's no real differentiation between his actions and nothingness except the potentially measurable differentiation from the expected norms. At that level, though, his actions are merely an illusion (which is in the same scope as time and consciousness being illusions based upon perception).



Ah, that makes a lot more sense, thanks.
I'd say God is much like a programmer, in that once the code has been executed he essentially just observes it continue and perform certain instructions at certain times, thus he never interacts then and there but rather planned for those interactions to occur.



kuwanger said:


> Whatever miraculous property that allows God to interact with our universe would apply equally to unicorns because unicorns could be a creation of God (or vice versa). We don't believe in unicorns because we haven't been indoctrinated to believe in unicorns and so we attempt to apply rules of evidence in our Universe to discount them.



As said above, God never truly interacts with the universe directly, what would be interactions were just planned events that would occur at certain points in time.


----------



## Fates-Blade-900 (Apr 30, 2018)

Yeah, there's a Heaven that is more organized then the Dancing Moons of Saturn,
which means it is the most beautiful thing ever, also this universe is WAY to perfectly
tweaked for there to not to be a creator, everything and everyone is in JUST the right
place, at JUST the right time, like everywhere, that is amazing, and of course we have
the Eclipses that we can see, so perfectly made for us humans, amazing, even THOSE
don't scratch the surface of what Heaven is like.


----------



## Peloisan (Apr 30, 2018)

The soul incarnate the body to experience and learn, and for some to help others, when the body dies, the soul goes to area to rest before choosing what to do next.
do some reseach, some many fear producing crap bomb barding us every day, so many made up half truths, fake news, it's no wonder people don't believe.


----------



## ken28 (Apr 30, 2018)

8BitWonder said:


> I don't really reject the idea of afterlife, nor do I say for certain that there is one.
> No real set in stone way to know without kicking the bucket. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯


or like someone once said, "if there is a afterlife it must be really nice there, after all no one came back from it yet. besides jesus but he is god sons so who knows "


----------



## osm70 (Apr 30, 2018)

TheDarkGreninja said:


> Something, what that something is up for debate.
> 
> 
> 
> ...




God never interacts with the universe.

So, are you saying praying is pointless?


----------



## osaka35 (Apr 30, 2018)

I do not. No evidence, and faith is a requirement. That's a deal-breaker for me.


----------



## ken28 (Apr 30, 2018)

Statiscally it's better to believe in God. 

Case 1 he exist.
If you believed your are fine if not you have a problem.

Case 2 he doesn't.
In either case nothing will happen. 

Hence better belive in case case 1 is true xD


----------



## osm70 (Apr 30, 2018)

ken28 said:


> Statiscally it's better to believe in God.
> 
> Case 1 he exist.
> If you believed your are fine if not you have a problem.
> ...



A few problems with that:

1. You can't choose what you believe. Go ahead and try believing that Australia doesn't exist. Yeah, you can't.

2. What if you believe in the Christian god, but it turns out the god of Islam is the real one? (Or Budha, or the Jewish god, or whatever.) You can't possibly believe in all of them. Do you consider yourself lucky enough to believe the right one?

3. Believing in a god usually requires some devotion. Most religions say that your belief doesn't matter if you don't pray. So, if Case 2 is true, you just wasted a lot of time.


----------



## TheDarkGreninja (Apr 30, 2018)

osm70 said:


> God never interacts with the universe.
> 
> So, are you saying praying is pointless?



No. God would no beforehand who would pray and therefore would help those people benefit ny that "programming" as initially described.

After all, whether or not God exists, Free will is a complete illusion so God doesn't need to worry about someone deciding to pray.


----------



## osm70 (Apr 30, 2018)

TheDarkGreninja said:


> No. God would no beforehand who would pray and therefore would help those people benefit ny that "programming" as initially described.
> 
> After all, whether or not God exists, Free will is a complete illusion so God doesn't need to worry about someone deciding to pray.



Since we are talking about programming...

He could also do this:


```
while (true) { //start of a loop that loops infinity times
Thread.sleep(n); //wait n nanoseconds (probably a lot)
if (person.prayed==true) { //if person prayed
person.help(); //help person
} //end of if
person.prayed=false; //force the person to pray again to get more help in the next loop
} //end of loop
```


----------



## TheDarkGreninja (Apr 30, 2018)

osm70 said:


> Since we are talking about programming...
> 
> He could also do this:
> 
> ...



He could, but then the illusion of free will is completely lost. At that point, living completely loses meaning in the religious sense. It has to feel like a choice, rather than something forced.


----------



## D34DL1N3R (Apr 30, 2018)

Fates-Blade-900 said:


> Yeah, there's a Heaven that is more organized then the Dancing Moons of Saturn,
> which means it is the most beautiful thing ever, also this universe is WAY to perfectly
> tweaked for there to not to be a creator, everything and everyone is in JUST the right
> place, at JUST the right time, like everywhere, that is amazing, and of course we have
> ...



So you're saying that everyone has a plan according to God? That everything is part of "His" plan, and that everything has a predetermined role?


----------



## osm70 (Apr 30, 2018)

TheDarkGreninja said:


> He could, but then the illusion of free will is completely lost. At that point, living completely loses meaning in the religious sense. It has to feel like a choice, rather than something forced.



Not unless you don't know that's how it works.

Also, what is a free will, anyway? Even if we ignore all of the neuroscience and all that, it still doesn't work.

There are only two possible reasons you do anything.

1. You are forced to

2. You want to

1 clearly isn't free will, so let's get right to 2. You will never willingly do anything you don't want to. (Yeah, yeah, you can do something you don't want to do, but you are doing it because of a different "want".) The thing is, you can't control what you want. (Go ahead and try wanting to punch the next person you see in the face. No, I'm not telling you to do it, I am telling you to WANT to do it. You can't, right?)

In conclusion, the only reason you do anything is because of something you can't control.


----------



## bitjacker (Apr 30, 2018)

When you die, You still hear for a few minutes until your brain dies completely. Often to the nasty sound of medical equipment buzzing.
Have fun.
Then it all goes black. You don't feel it. You don't know it. The life you lived left a carbon footprint. You put plastic into the landfill ya fuckin jerk.
Oh and no one plays the harp for you.


----------



## osaka35 (Apr 30, 2018)

ken28 said:


> Statiscally it's better to believe in God.
> 
> Case 1 he exist.
> If you believed your are fine if not you have a problem.
> ...


The presumption between these two cases is the resulting personal state of mind and actions are the same, only the belief varies. This thinking is flawed; those who rely on faith to make determinations of reality will behave and understand reality differently. Since our goal is to try and suss out how reality actually is, we shouldn't be using personal consequences to determine the likelihood of something being real or not. "Pascal's Wager", which is what you're presenting here, and has other problems as well. This is just my personal problem with it  Or, put another way, "It is far better to grasp the universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring." - Carl Sagan 

but if we're talking about personal consequences determining if we should believe or not, I prefer:

Case 1 he exist:
Accept him or suffer?he created hell to make you suffer for not worshiping him. Not worthy of respect or appreciation. Be a good person or you'll be punished.

Case 2 he doesn't exist:
this life is the only one you have and you are responsible to only yourself and those lives you impact. make your life count and don't be a dick to anyone, because it's the personally responsible choice.


----------



## TheDarkGreninja (Apr 30, 2018)

osm70 said:


> Not unless you don't know that's how it works.
> 
> Also, what is a free will, anyway? Even if we ignore all of the neuroscience and all that, it still doesn't work.
> 
> ...




Not disagreeing.


----------



## osaka35 (Apr 30, 2018)

osm70 said:


> Not unless you don't know that's how it works.
> 
> Also, what is a free will, anyway? Even if we ignore all of the neuroscience and all that, it still doesn't work.
> 
> ...


In the same way you can't think without your brain. "The future is predetermine by those who shape it", if you will. Whether you have free will or not, you have the perception of free will. And so I'd say the reason you do anything is because it makes sense to you. You are true to yourself and your understanding of the world around you. Change your perception, change your understanding, and change the flow of your decisions.


----------



## Fates-Blade-900 (Apr 30, 2018)

D34DL1N3R said:


> So you're saying that everyone has a plan according to God? That everything is part of "His" plan, and that everything has a predetermined role?



Well yes and no, there are two paths for all humanity: 1. The path of God which is always the best, and 2. Our path which we make for ourselves which will end in destruction, either path we take is a part of His plan, but which path we take is not predetermined, it is our choice completely, He doesn't control our fate, we do.


----------



## osm70 (Apr 30, 2018)

Fates-Blade-900 said:


> Well yes and no, there are two paths for all humanity: 1. The path of God which is always the best, and 2. Our path which we make for ourselves which will end in destruction, either path we take is a part of His plan, but which path we take is not predetermined, it is our choice completely, He doesn't control our fate, we do.



So, in summary... we either do what he wants or we destroy ourselves.


----------



## Fates-Blade-900 (Apr 30, 2018)

osm70 said:


> So, in summary... we either do what he wants or we destroy ourselves.


Yes and no, we either do the right thing (e.g. tell the truth instead of lies) which is His path or we destroy ourselves, you understand sir, but we *should want to do the right thing*, but as Humans we *don't* want to do the right thing, that is why Jesus came to change our hearts TO want to do the right thing, if we accept his gift on the cross, so we can make it to heaven. I can go more in depth if you want. (e.g. If everyone in the world told only lies, where would we be?)


----------



## JellyPerson (Apr 30, 2018)

cots said:


> I had a near death experience that makes me believe we're in an infinite loop and repeat our lives over and over again. I went to the hospital for heart problems and after they found the problem and fixed it they sent me to a psychiatric unit because I was having bad side effects to some of the medication they gave me. I guess (I don't remember) I punched a nurse so the next thing I know I wake up in jail. Anyway, so I was having problems separating my thoughts and dreams from reality. I finally got a chance to lay down and the next thing I remember is being injected with something and then I saw myself floating over my body and a voice asked me "Do you want to continue or start over?". I took this as continue on in my current life or start over from the beginning (be born again). Fuck starting over. My life has been shit. I guess I'll have to eventually repeat it though.
> 
> EDIT: Before this I was a Christian and it's been hard grained into me that there is a Heaven and Hell, but this sort of makes me question that so I'm not really too sure what happens. Part of me says I'm going to Hell another part says I'll have to start over and do the same things that I already did over, over, over, over and over again for infinite.


is this a shitpost


----------



## Viri (Apr 30, 2018)

TotalInsanity4 said:


> There are other halls that you could go in Nordic mythology, why Valhalla in particular?


A hall with warriors, with endless food and ale and mead, sounds like fun! Plus, gotta prepare for Ragnarok!


----------



## JellyPerson (Apr 30, 2018)

leon315 said:


> i believe that bad guys will be reincarnated after death into pigs and get eat by asians.


freaking racist


----------



## leon315 (May 1, 2018)

JellyPerson said:


> freaking racist


excuse me, which part is racist??


----------



## Pandaxclone2 (May 1, 2018)

osaka35 said:


> I do not. No evidence, and faith is a requirement. That's a deal-breaker for me.



(I probably shouldn't be asking) Is there any particular reason why faith is a problem? Faith is simply believing in something that has no scientific or knowledge-based reasons beyond your feelings and instincts. You could have faith in any number of things like family, blood, luck, etc. It's not necessarily tied to the concept of an afterlife in particular. Furthermore, an afterlife (or something beyond death from your perspective) doesn't have to be tied to a religion's perspective of their afterlife (if that is one of the issues.)

I guess what I'm saying is, it doesn't hurt anything to believe in an afterlife of sorts. If it exists, then good. If it doesn't, well, you won't know about it since your existence would be over anyway.


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## osaka35 (May 1, 2018)

Pandaxclone2 said:


> (I probably shouldn't be asking) Is there any particular reason why faith is a problem? Faith is simply believing in something that has no scientific or knowledge-based reasons beyond your feelings and instincts. You could have faith in any number of things like family, blood, luck, etc. It's not necessarily tied to the concept of an afterlife in particular. Furthermore, an afterlife (or something beyond death from your perspective) doesn't have to be tied to a religion's perspective of their afterlife (if that is one of the issues.)
> 
> I guess what I'm saying is, it doesn't hurt anything to believe in an afterlife of sorts. If it exists, then good. If it doesn't, well, you won't know about it since your existence would be over anyway.



Faith that a certain perception of reality is the one and only reality, with all evidence to the contrary, is a bit much for me.

Faith in a friend serves a purpose. Faith everything will work out serves a similar purpose. You can make a leap of faith and rely on others to push your future forward. Rather than "faith", the terms "trust" or "confidence" might be more accurate in those situations. Faith in these situations are about taking risk. And I don't know if that something risky will pay off, but I have the confidence in the people and in the situation. or in the hope for a future unrealized. This is a different kind of faith than what we're talking about in regards to an afterlife.

Really, what we're talking about here isn't just faith in the lack of evidence or logic...it's faith contrary to evidence and reason. Reality is going to be the way it's going to be, and it's up to us to figure it out. Just leaving it to our feelings, rather than earnestly searching for answers, is why I have a hard time with the cop-out of faith when it comes to determining the nature of reality. In regards to an afterlife in particular: in the end, for me, it's the choice between living your life to prove worthiness for a reward after death, and the choice to live your life to completion here on earth. If you've only got one shot at life, you live it differently than if you think you're just warming up for the big-leagues. intrinsic vs extrinsic motivation, not to put too fine a point on it.


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## osaka35 (May 1, 2018)

Fates-Blade-900 said:


> Yes and no, we either do the right thing (e.g. tell the truth instead of lies) which is His path or we destroy ourselves, you understand sir, but we should want to do the right thing, but as Humans we don't want to do the right thing, that is why Jesus came to change our hearts TO want to do the right thing so we can make it to heaven. I can go more in depth if you want. (e.g. If everyone in the world told only lies, where would we be?)


So this god does not create the moral code, he merely abides by it, wishing for us to do the same? The closer we come to perfection, the less punishment we get for not being pure in our ability to abide by this moral code? Does this god create the punishment, or is this also an inherent part of this moral code which exist outside of his control and abilities to control?


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## Fates-Blade-900 (May 1, 2018)

osaka35 said:


> So this god does not create the moral code, he merely abides by it, wishing for us to do the same? The closer we come to perfection, the less punishment we get for not being pure in our ability to abide by this moral code? Does this god create the punishment, or is this also an inherent part of this moral code which exist outside of his control and abilities to control?


God is the moral code, and we can be led by the Holy Spirit which would guide us AWAY from sin so we can be perfect in the eyes of The Creator, which is given to those who accept Jesus Christ as there personal Lord and Savior (there for stating that you will live under God's moral code to the best of your ability), and even though you are given the Holy Spirit, you will still make mistakes occasionally and sin, and if that happens, you would ask God for forgiveness, and turn away from that sin. "The closer we come to perfection, the less punishment we get for not being pure in our ability to abide by this moral code? " Well the answer is yes and no again as all wrong has it's punishment by humankind, (e.g. murder can have the capital punishment sentence, stealing has a punishment etc.) but God has punishment of some sin through humankind as well, but then he directly punishes Human's for sin as well, but in answer to your question, no, us as Humans as selfish as we are we can't get close to perfection "the closer we come to perfection....", that's why we accept The Creator which is God, his gift of grace on the cross so that our sins can be forgiven and we turn away from ALL our sins, which we do through the Holy Spirit which leads and guides us to do so. "Does this god create the punishment, or is this also an inherent part of this moral code which exist outside of his control and abilities to control?" Yes, God creates the punishment, and yes it's a inherent part of God's moral code that is the only moral code which is Right or Wrong, and no, God doesn't need to control a moral code, because he IS THE moral code,  because if there was no punishment for sin there would be no reason not to, but God gives us the choice to sin, or to not, but that punishment is Hell, you see because when we die, we don't really die the Bible says, "For the wages of sin is death...Romans 6:23" when it says that...it is talking about the gruesome, terrible, eating up of our souls by Hellfire which the Bible says was made only for The Devil and his angels, but through us not wanting to turn away from our sins God will give us sins punishment, death of our souls, not existing anymore, but forever this time and with the worst pain ever, before the ultimate death of our souls, to put us out of our misery so to speak, and God sadly having to do so, as truly, "For the *wages* of sin is death..." or the *punishment *of sin is death, and it truly is. If you want I recommend going to Bible gateway and using the EXB (Expanded) Bible to study the book of Romans. (known as the epistle of Paul to the Romans) It will help everybody's understanding I promise.


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## cots (May 1, 2018)

Fates-Blade-900 said:


> God is the moral code, and we can be led by the Holy Spirit which would guide us AWAY from sin so we can be perfect in the eyes of The Creator, which is given to those who accept Jesus Christ as there personal Lord and Savior (there for stating that you will live under God's moral code to the best of your ability), and even though you are given the Holy Spirit, you will still make mistakes occasionally and sin, and if that happens, you would ask God for forgiveness, and turn away from that sin. "The closer we come to perfection, the less punishment we get for not being pure in our ability to abide by this moral code? " Well the answer is yes and no again as all wrong has it's punishment by humankind, (e.g. murder can have the capital punishment sentence, stealing has a punishment etc.) but God has punishment of some sin through humankind as well, but then he directly punishes Human's for sin as well, but in answer to your question, no, us as Humans as selfish as we are we can't get close to perfection "the closer we come to perfection....", that's why we accept The Creator which is God, his gift of grace on the cross so that our sins can be forgiven and we turn away from ALL our sins, which we do through the Holy Spirit which leads and guides us to do so. "Does this god create the punishment, or is this also an inherent part of this moral code which exist outside of his control and abilities to control?" Yes, God creates the punishment, and yes it's a inherent part of God's moral code that is the only moral code which is Right or Wrong, and no, God doesn't need to control a moral code, because he IS THE moral code,  because if there was no punishment for sin there would be no reason not to, but God gives us the choice to sin, or to not, but that punishment is Hell, you see because when we die, we don't really die the Bible says, "For the wages of sin is death...Romans 6:23" when it says that...it is talking about the gruesome, terrible, eating up of our souls by Hellfire which the Bible says was made only for The Devil and his angels, but through us not wanting to turn away from our sins God will give us sins punishment, death of our souls, not existing anymore, but forever this time and with the worst pain ever, before the ultimate death of our souls, to put us out of our misery so to speak, and God sadly having to do so, as truly, "For the *wages* of sin is death..." or the *punishment *of sin is death, and it truly is. If you want I recommend going to Bible gateway and using the EXB (Expanded) Bible to study the book of Romans. (known as the epistle of Paul to the Romans) It will help everybody's understanding I promise.



One of the problems is that people hear the word "God" and automatically shun it. I doubt you'll get anyone to actually read and learn why people believe in him. I was taught as long as you open your soul to God and take in the Holy Spirit that you will go to Heaven no matter the sins you commit, but it is wise to also ask for forgiveness for your sins and strive to do better, but that isn't required to get into Heaven.


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## Fates-Blade-900 (May 1, 2018)

cots said:


> One of the problems is that people hear the word "God" and automatically shun it. I doubt you'll get anyone to actually read and learn why people believe in him. I was taught as long as you open your soul to God and take in the Holy Spirit that you will go to Heaven no matter the sins you commit, but it is wise to also ask for forgiveness for your sins and strive to do better, but that isn't required to get into Heaven.


Sadly you were taught wrong sir, our job as humans is to ask for forgiveness of our sins if we commit any, then with the help of the Holy Spirit to 100% turn AWAY from sin (meaning don't seek after it at ALL) NOBODY can enter Heaven without doing so.


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## osaka35 (May 1, 2018)

Fates-Blade-900 said:


> God is the moral code, and we can be led by the Holy Spirit which would guide us AWAY from sin so we can be perfect in the eyes of The Creator, which is given to those who accept Jesus Christ as there personal Lord and Savior (there for stating that you will live under God's moral code to the best of your ability), and even though you are given the Holy Spirit, you will still make mistakes occasionally and sin, and if that happens, you would ask God for forgiveness, and turn away from that sin. "The closer we come to perfection, the less punishment we get for not being pure in our ability to abide by this moral code? " Well the answer is yes and no again as all wrong has it's punishment by humankind, (e.g. murder can have the capital punishment sentence, stealing has a punishment etc.) but God has punishment of some sin through humankind as well, but then he directly punishes Human's for sin as well, but in answer to your question, no, us as Humans as selfish as we are we can't get close to perfection "the closer we come to perfection....", that's why we accept The Creator which is God, his gift of grace on the cross so that our sins can be forgiven and we turn away from ALL our sins, which we do through the Holy Spirit which leads and guides us to do so. "Does this god create the punishment, or is this also an inherent part of this moral code which exist outside of his control and abilities to control?" Yes, God creates the punishment, and yes it's a inherent part of God's moral code that is the only moral code which is Right or Wrong, and no, God doesn't need to control a moral code, because he IS THE moral code,  because if there was no punishment for sin there would be no reason not to, but God gives us the choice to sin, or to not, but that punishment is Hell, you see because when we die, we don't really die the Bible says, "For the wages of sin is death...Romans 6:23" when it says that...it is talking about the gruesome, terrible, eating up of our souls by Hellfire which the Bible says was made only for The Devil and his angels, but through us not wanting to turn away from our sins God will give us sins punishment, death of our souls, not existing anymore, but forever this time and with the worst pain ever, before the ultimate death of our souls, to put us out of our misery so to speak, and God sadly having to do so, as truly, "For the *wages* of sin is death..." or the *punishment *of sin is death, and it truly is. If you want I recommend going to Bible gateway and using the EXB (Expanded) Bible to study the book of Romans. (known as the epistle of Paul to the Romans) It will help everybody's understanding I promise.


So we are attempting to become gods ourselves, and just falling short? And when we die, we are free of our mortal bodies and are thus capable of becoming demi-gods ourselves? that's a fun narrative, might make for a good short story.

And really? no reason to not sin except for the fear of punishment? That doesn't jive well with how humans actually operate. Our moral code as humans is far far better than that weird notion. Most people do good with knowledge they won't be rewarded, and most people avoid doing wrong even if they know they could get away with it. We don't always do it, but most people tend to do this. And Atheist are not worse people than christians. They might even be better off because they realize relationships with other people are the only thing there is in life, really. They see the world as something we all have to work through together, rather than as a test to avoid punishment if we fail.

god doesn't have to punish people. he chose to. he always has chosen to, according to you. this god believes not being like him is worthy of being tormented for all of eternity? why not a nice rehabilitation program? why not trail and error, with some constructive feedback? Why not kindness instead of this...hateful retribution? I can't get behind such an atrocious deity. I've read the bible, cover to cover, several times with several different versions, and he just seems like the most immoral of creations. Really, just a giant dick. Even the few positives scattered throughout, like "the golden rule", have been superseded by newer and better morality ("the platinum rule").

Romans is really just full of "god is good. god is great. worship him because otherwise you're shit". It's mostly flowery language with reassurances that this deity is definitely the best one. I've read interpretations of this book, and they seem to be really...inventive with the text. it's really weird how this religious stuff works.

Back on topic, the christian after life seems pretty boring, though. I mean, wouldn't you feel worried or sad about people in hell? wouldn't you want to rescue people? I can't imagine ever being happy or want a life like that. I'd feel a moral imperative to try and fix it.


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## DinohScene (May 1, 2018)

No.
When you die, you die.
Simple as that.


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## cots (May 1, 2018)

Fates-Blade-900 said:


> Sadly you were taught wrong sir, our job as humans is to ask for forgiveness of our sins if we commit any, then with the help of the Holy Spirit to 100% turn AWAY from sin (meaning don't seek after it at ALL) NOBODY can enter Heaven without doing so.



There are a lot of different religions that state different requirements to enter the Gates of Heaven. From what I've read about the subject matter from various types of groups, Churches and organizations I have come to believe all you need to do is believe in God, that he sent his Son Jesus to die for your sins and if you take in the Holy Ghost into your spirit you will not die and go to hell regardless if you still sin, because we're all sinners and it's impossible to be "sin-free".

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------



JellyPerson said:


> is this a shitpost



Nope, I'm dead serious.


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## The Real Jdbye (May 1, 2018)

I believe there's *something* after death. People close to me have experienced a lot of weird unexplainable things. But I don't believe in Heaven.


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## Fates-Blade-900 (May 1, 2018)

osaka35 said:


> So we are attempting to become gods ourselves, and just falling short? And when we die, we are free of our mortal bodies and are thus capable of becoming demi-gods ourselves? that's a fun narrative, might make for a good short story.
> 
> And really? no reason to not sin except for the fear of punishment? That doesn't jive well with how humans actually operate. Our moral code as humans is far far better than that weird notion. Most people do good with knowledge they won't be rewarded, and most people avoid doing wrong even if they know they could get away with it. We don't always do it, but most people tend to do this. And Atheist are not worse people than christians. They might even be better off because they realize relationships with other people are the only thing there is in life, really. They see the world as something we all have to work through together, rather than as a test to avoid punishment if we fail.
> 
> ...


We get our moral code from God friend, don't you understand? Without God there is no standard for what right and wrong is, If not for god there is no reason to be moral as Dostoevsky pointed out "If god does not exist then *everything* is permitted" which therefore means *nothing* has a point at all, everything is worthless even living life is worthless, which is the most important thing in our eyes...but because of God.


DinohScene said:


> No.
> When you die, you die.
> Simple as that.


Not according to the word of the true and living God friend.


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## DinohScene (May 1, 2018)

Fates-Blade-900 said:


> Not according to the word of the true and living God friend.



Ofcourse there isn't ;')
Whatever floats your goat mate.

But face it.
When you die, you die.

You'll likely be put into the ground and sooner or later, worms will start feasting on your rotting corpse the moment the wooden casket breaks.
Or you get burned up and turned into plant fertilizer.
Eventually, the sun will swallow the earth and every human that has ever lived and died here will be gone forever.

No god or other make believe can change that.


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## osaka35 (May 1, 2018)

Fates-Blade-900 said:


> We get our moral code from God friend, don't you understand? If not for god there is no reason to be moral as Dostoevsky pointed out "If god does not exist then *everything* is permitted" which therefore means *nothing* has a point at all, everything is worthless even living life is worthless, which is the most important thing in our eyes...but because of God.



the universe has no inherent meaning, this is true. We, as humans, are the ones that give meaning to our lives. Things are important because they're important to us. This is why we all have different things that are important to us, and we all have different goals and interest.

Our moral code is a biologically given one. It comes from the interplay of individual wants and group wants. That interaction is what creates the need for moral rules and imperatives. We see this in the animal kingdom, particularly in primates. Our sense of fairness and our sense of kindness and the like, can be documented as having a natural origin. No god needed.

It is interesting how the threat of torture by a god is meant to make you do what it wants you to do (that's called abuse and extortion), instead of just saying "only those who follow me have an afterlife. Otherwise you cease to exist". That'd be a lot scarier to me, I'd think. And you'd be able to get around the moral bankruptcy of letting people suffer for all eternity. They should rewrite the bible again and do that instead.


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## cots (May 1, 2018)

The Real Jdbye said:


> I believe there's *something* after death. People close to me have experienced a lot of weird unexplainable things. But I don't believe in Heaven.



Yeah, read my near death experience post above.


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## Selim873 (May 1, 2018)

I always believed the afterlife is like sleeping indefinitely.

You ever went to sleep and woke up without remembering any dreams?  That quick blip between dozing off and waking up where it's just nothing.  No worries, no feeling, just peace.  I've looked up near death experiences before because I was curious and a lot were the same.


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## onibaku (May 1, 2018)

I like to think of life in terms of the first law of thermodynamics. Energy cannot be destroyed or created, only transferred or changed into another form. I look at us all as entities of energy so for that reason I guess I believe in an afterlife.


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## D34DL1N3R (May 1, 2018)

Fates-Blade-900 said:


> Sadly you were taught wrong sir, our job as humans is to ask for forgiveness of our sins if we commit any, then with the help of the Holy Spirit to 100% turn AWAY from sin (meaning don't seek after it at ALL) NOBODY can enter Heaven without doing so.



So your religion and beliefs are right, and everyone else's are wrong? Please tell me why you are the one that is right. Do you realize that if you had been raised in a different country, or by different parents, etc that your religious beliefs would likely be very different? Do you honestly believe that a loving, kind, forgiving, all holy "father" would send his children to a place of everlasting torture & torment because they didn't abide by his rules? Would you do that to your own child? How about other sick "God Complex" shit in the Bible? For example... "Hey... Abraham!! Kill your son and sacrifice him to me to prove your loyalty to your father!!!" Then at the last second "Oh... nah. I was just fucking with ya to see if you'd do it." Like really? IS that something you'd also ask your own child to to, to show their obedience to you?

Blood sacrifices? Sounds pretty pagan to me. You honestly believe that a blood sacrifice (Jesus) was needed to save all of our souls? What about before Jesus? Sins were not forgiven & people were not let into Heaven? Why all of a sudden did we need Jesus for that? I mean... he's God after all right? He can do anything, but he chose to completely flood the earth... and obviously his plan there completely failed. Then sent his son to die a horribly cruel death? Again, what kind of "father" does these sick, vile, and disgusting things? How about Adam and Eve? Uh oh... you two didn't follow my every order so now I'm not only going to punish you both... but also all of your descendants who had zero to do with your actions, until the end of time.

What an outstanding father. He even said he regrets his creation of us.


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## deSSy2724 (May 1, 2018)

I simply dont believe in anything or anyone, why would I?
, 
The question should be: "why do I believe in afterlife" or whatever.  Simply because the burden of proof lies with someone who is making a claim, and btw the inability to disprove  a random  claim does not make it valid.


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## Fates-Blade-900 (May 1, 2018)

D34DL1N3R said:


> So your religion and beliefs are right, and everyone else's are wrong? Please tell me why you are the one that is right. Do you realize that if you had been raised in a different country, or by different parents, etc that your religious beliefs would likely be very different? Do you honestly believe that a loving, kind, forgiving, all holy "father" would send his children to a place of everlasting torture & torment because they didn't abide by his rules? Would you do that to your own child? How about other sick "God Complex" shit in the Bible? For example... "Hey... Abraham!! Kill your son and sacrifice him to me to prove your loyalty to your father!!!" Then at the last second "Oh... nah. I was just fucking with ya to see if you'd do it." Like really? IS that something you'd also ask your own child to to, to show their obedience to you?
> 
> Blood sacrifices? Sounds pretty pagan to me. You honestly believe that a blood sacrifice (Jesus) was needed to save all of our souls? What about before Jesus? Sins were not forgiven & people were not let into Heaven? Why all of a sudden did we need Jesus for that? I mean... he's God after all right? He can do anything, but he chose to completely flood the earth... and obviously his plan there completely failed. Then sent his son to die a horribly cruel death? Again, what kind of "father" does these sick, vile, and disgusting things? How about Adam and Eve? Uh oh... you two didn't follow my every order so now I'm not only going to punish you both... but also all of your descendants who had zero to do with your actions, until the end of time.
> 
> What an outstanding father. He even said he regrets his creation of us.


Your are spiritually blind sir, sad but true you willfully blind yourself to not see the truth, if you ever want to see the truth just ask God to open your eyes to see Him, and his wonder and splendor, the door is always open, *always*.

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------



DinohScene said:


> Ofcourse there isn't ;')
> Whatever floats your goat mate.
> 
> But face it.
> ...





osaka35 said:


> the universe has no inherent meaning, this is true. We, as humans, are the ones that give meaning to our lives. Things are important because they're important to us. This is why we all have different things that are important to us, and we all have different goals and interest.
> 
> Our moral code is a biologically given one. It comes from the interplay of individual wants and group wants. That interaction is what creates the need for moral rules and imperatives. We see this in the animal kingdom, particularly in primates. Our sense of fairness and our sense of kindness and the like, can be documented as having a natural origin. No god needed.
> 
> It is interesting how the threat of torture by a god is meant to make you do what it wants you to do (that's called abuse and extortion), instead of just saying "only those who follow me have an afterlife. Otherwise you cease to exist". That'd be a lot scarier to me, I'd think. And you'd be able to get around the moral bankruptcy of letting people suffer for all eternity. They should rewrite the bible again and do that instead.


Your are also spiritually blind sirs, sad but true you willfully blind yourself to not see the truth, if you ever want to see the truth just ask God to open your eyes to see Him, and his wonder and splendor, the door is always open, *always*.

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------

I don't need to tell you guys everything, go read for yourself. Don't just take my word for it. I'm not saying anything else on this sir, but I do care about all of you...because of God.


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## Hector Ludovino (May 1, 2018)

Have You read five ways to get God (Idk how to write in english in spanish it's cinco vías para llegar a Dios, the author is saint Thomas, or have You read Kurt Godel ?


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## D34DL1N3R (May 1, 2018)

Fates-Blade-900 said:


> Your are spiritually blind sir, sad but true you willfully blind yourself to not see the truth, if you ever want to see the truth just ask God to open your eyes to see Him, and his wonder and splendor, the door is always open, *always*.
> 
> --------------------- MERGED ---------------------------
> 
> ...



So you get stuck with questions & statements you cannot answer or justify then just ditch with some blanket "You are spiritually blind" nonsense? For the record I've asked God to open my eyes plenty of times, to come into my life, blah blah blah. I have stood up in front of literally thousands of people and given my life to Christ. Thing is... nothing happened. On more than one occasion I had done this, and nothing happened. I went to church, read my bible, attended youth groups regularly, bible study, etc. Guess what? Notta. All I saw was lies, corruption, deceit, cover-ups, judgement, hurt, and a slew of other great things I now choose to have zero part of.

You can't go around preaching your gospel, then ditch when the heat is on. I think you're the one blinded by spiritual matters, not others. Your own Bible is so full of contradictions it makes me sick. You're just to blind to accept it. Now please do give me your insight into my previous post or stop preaching. Doesn't your God tell you hot or cold? There is no in-between? You're sinking and not even trying to stay afloat. How about your Christian holidays? Can we discuss all of those as well, and how they came to be?


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## DinohScene (May 1, 2018)

Fates-Blade-900 said:


> Your are also spiritually blind sirs, sad but true you willfully blind yourself to not see the truth, if you ever want to see the truth just ask God to open your eyes to see Him, and his wonder and splendor, the door is always open, *always*.



No thank you.


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## Pandaxclone2 (May 1, 2018)

osaka35 said:


> in the end, for me, it's the choice between living your life to prove worthiness for a reward after death, and the choice to live your life to completion here on earth. If you've only got one shot at life, you live it differently than if you think you're just warming up for the big-leagues. intrinsic vs extrinsic motivation, not to put too fine a point on it.



You have a point for the most part, but I imagine that depends a conditional; that is, you need to do stuff in life to get into an afterlife. This is one of the major issues I have with religious afterlife, because they dictate what you should do in life instead of just letting you do it yourself. I was suggesting more of a realm that is simply present, that anyone who dies can go to, no strings attached. As far as that should be concerned, there's really no need whatsoever to structure your life around that because regardless you should either get into that realm as soon as you die, or if it doesn't exist then we all become nothingness.


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## spotanjo3 (May 1, 2018)

It is going to be an endless page after page.


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## osaka35 (May 2, 2018)

Pandaxclone2 said:


> You have a point for the most part, but I imagine that depends a conditional; that is, you need to do stuff in life to get into an afterlife. This is one of the major issues I have with religious afterlife, because they dictate what you should do in life instead of just letting you do it yourself. I was suggesting more of a realm that is simply present, that anyone who dies can go to, no strings attached. As far as that should be concerned, there's really no need whatsoever to structure your life around that because regardless you should either get into that realm as soon as you die, or if it doesn't exist then we all become nothingness.


I can appreciate that. For me, I take the stance of that which is presented with no evidence can be dismissed with no evidence. Makes me think of "Russell's teapot". I'm always open to the idea, but i'll think it not true until i can be convinced otherwise.


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