# Trump Raid and the End of the United States (Padraig Martin)



## Creamu (Aug 10, 2022)

'Last night, like many Americans, I was shocked to see that former President of the United States, Donald Trump, had his home raided by the Federal Bureau of Investigations (FBI).  This is a profound turning point in Western history.  For the better part of the past two centuries, the U.S. has enjoyed unprecedented stability because it did not raid the homes of political rivals.  The rest of the democratic world looked upon the United States as a model for successful representative government.  To watch a politically motivated raid on a former president essentially showed the rest of the world that the U.S. is no longer the model it claimed to be.  It so devastatingly rotten to its very core that anyone with eyes can see that unelected officials run the United States – not the people… not its representatives… not its Constitution. 

For those who hate Trump, it is important to note that this raid is more than just Trump.  Trump is a polarizing figure in American politics.  Trump is also a billionaire.  This is not an ordinary, well intentioned political protester who walked the Halls of Congress on January 6th getting hunted down by the FBI a year later at his plumbing job.  This is a powerful person in his own right with nearly seventy-five million supporters.  The fact that they can attempt the gulag treatment on Trump should be a massive wake-up to any powerless, ordinary citizen with an unpopular view.  They are coming for you, next.

For those who may be inclined to call me a Trump apologist, I am not.  I have been critical of “45” for years.  Like most dissidents, I am disappointed in Donald Trump for many reasons.  The list is long.  He should have been more aggressive regarding the removal of far-left activists within the Department of Justice and the Federal Bureau of Investigations – especially after the very obvious targeting of his own 2016 campaign.  He trusted the military far too much, despite mountains of evidence that the senior leadership of the military had been radically transformed by the preceding Obama Administration.  The Israel worship was galling.  I kept hearing about black unemployment, the freedom of A$AP Rocky, and Trump’s friendship with Kanye West, while reading about thousands of dissidents throughout the United States imprisoned for standing up to federal overreach.  Most angering was Trump’s absolute inaction during the extraordinary riots of 2020.  He should have ordered the National Guard to fix bayonets and any officer that pushed back – as General Miley reportedly did – should have been sent to a command in Northern Alaska or a cell in Gitmo.  Trump apologists like to say that, had Trump did that, the media would have portrayed him as a tyrant.  So what?  The media already portrayed him as a dictator.  He should have acted the part and saved civilized society.

[...]

The United States is dead.  It cannot be revived.  This is the regime flexing on you, the worthless American voter.  The choice is simple: stay on the Titanic as its newfound masters order you to swab the decks of oncoming water or jump ship by means of secession.  If you wish to keep the United States intact, so be it.  You should move to a Yankee blue state and enjoy the future that your demographic replacement will ensure.  You might as well get used to those laws now.  Meanwhile, if you are a Southerner flying the American flag, you are part of the problem.  The most important flag flying over your home should be your state flag.  Displaying imagery that expresses your bended knee toward Washington, DC, is an indication of your loyalties.  You have chosen the Union over the Founding Principles. You have chosen elected bureaucrats over your own people.  You have shown that when we need you, you will not be there for us. 

The raid on Trump should be a wake-up call that the Yankee government cannot be reformed.  It is gone.  The Constitution will not protect him.  The Constitution will not protect you.   Secession will.'

-Padraig Martin

https://identitydixie.com/2022/08/09/the-trump-raid-and-the-end-of-the-united-states/


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## Xzi (Aug 10, 2022)

Creamu said:


> To watch a politically motivated raid on a former president


Idiocy.  This was a raid signed off on by the DoJ and an FBI director who was _appointed by Trump_.  The amount of evidence gathered beforehand had to be mountainous, and the executive branch was not made aware of it until well after.



Creamu said:


> The fact that they can attempt the gulag treatment on Trump should be a massive wake-up to any powerless, ordinary citizen with an unpopular view. They are coming for you, next.


Gasp, you mean to tell me that nobody is above the law?  This has fuck all to do with Trump's views, everything to do with the fact that he's the worst kind of criminal scum.

If anything, prosecuting Trump might give US democracy an extra couple years of shelf life.  We obviously can't have every asshole who loses an election attempting to stage a violent coup, it must be made clear to all that there are consequences for such actions.



Creamu said:


> Most angering was Trump’s absolute inaction during the extraordinary riots of 2020. He should have ordered the National Guard to fix bayonets and any officer that pushed back – as General Miley reportedly did – should have been sent to a command in Northern Alaska or a cell in Gitmo.


Just a dude casually calling for the National Guard to murder and gore American citizens for exercising their right to protest that exact type of brutality.  This shithead went off the deep end a long time ago.


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## duwen (Aug 10, 2022)

Creamu said:


> The rest of the democratic world looked upon the United States as a model for successful representative government.



Lol. That may be the perception within the US, but it's certainly not the case in any country I've lived or visited.


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## Xzi (Aug 10, 2022)

duwen said:


> Lol. That may be the perception within the US, but it's certainly not the case in any country I've lived or visited.


Seriously.  Our government has never been anywhere near as representative as European nations with 5+ political parties which have to form coalitions.


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## AmandaRose (Aug 10, 2022)

Creamu said:


> The rest of the democratic world looked upon the United States as a model for successful representative government.


Haha they really don't. The rest of the world laughs at the insanity of American politicians.


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## duwen (Aug 10, 2022)

In fairness, maybe some of the more dubious regimes around the world do see the US as a model to aspire to.


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## Xzi (Aug 10, 2022)

duwen said:


> In fairness, maybe some of the more dubious regimes around the world do see the US as a model to aspire to.


It's more about being infatuated with our economic system than our political system, though.  I'm convinced that much of the reason Republicans hate China is because they beat the US in the race to transform capitalism into full-on oligarchy.


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## Nothereed (Aug 11, 2022)

I figured I probably should go on to state that we don't know anything exactly quite yet. It's just a search warrant atm.

However the fact that Trump is already worried/bashing on people is rather... telling.


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## Osha (Aug 11, 2022)

Creamu said:


> The United States is dead. It cannot be revived


If it could do that a bit faster, that'd be appreciated.


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## AncientBoi (Aug 11, 2022)

I could care less about #megadump tRuMp. I will not have HIM [it] in power ever again. so FUQ him.


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## Zappo23 (Aug 11, 2022)

> The choice is simple: stay on the Titanic as its newfound masters order you to swab the decks of oncoming water or jump ship by means of secession.



Yeah, you can f**k allllllllll the way off with that doomsayer garbage.


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## Osakasan (Aug 11, 2022)

I'm not 'murican, but if the raid on Trump's house proves something is that the US are still alive, and mostly well.

It's time for the 'muricans to take out the trash, starting for that crooked ball of shit who dared to call himself 'President' while conning the whole country and selling it to Russia.

This and the Alex Jones trial are music to my eyes. And this is just starting.

LOCK'EM UP!


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## JonhathonBaxster (Aug 11, 2022)

If Trump did indeed bring classified documents to his residence without permission then he needs to be held accountable. However, I see double standards here coming from the lying dishonest democrats as Hillary Clinton ran a private email server that had classified material on it without permission and when she got caught she used bleachbit to erase the server. She's guilty as fucking hell, yet gets a pass because she's a lefty. Both of these needs to be dealt with.

Of course the raid on Trump's residence was politically motivated. We have Congress investigating the riot on January 6th while ignoring the years of riots from the black lives matter and antifa leftests. I also don't believe a word the leftist media has published due to the fact all they did when Trump was in office was attack him with fake news. Most of what they published were personal attacks and they were mostly all based on lies, misinformation and selective texts taken out of context.

I'm an independent, but I hope that these searches result in Trump running again as he's got my vote. Shit was so much better under Trump regardless of the lies that the left made up to manipulate their members into viewing Trump as some sort of monster. You (the leftists) have been lied to for decades now, isn't time you smarten up?

EDIT: This is the first time I've seen a picture of Trump's mansion. No wonder the leftist liberals hate him ... they want what he has yet are too fucking stupid to achieve anything in life.


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## AncientBoi (Aug 11, 2022)




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## Xzi (Aug 11, 2022)

Nothereed said:


> I figured I probably should go on to state that we don't know anything exactly quite yet. It's just a search warrant atm.
> 
> However the fact that Trump is already worried/bashing on people is rather... telling.


The fact that he claimed the FBI was "planting evidence" tells us there was definitely evidence to be found.  Other Republican lawmakers have since had their data/phones seized as well.


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## Osakasan (Aug 11, 2022)

JonhathonBaxster said:


> If Trump did indeed bring classified documents to his residence without permission then he needs to be held accountable. However, I see double standards here coming from the lying dishonest democrats as Hillary Clinton ran a private email server that had classified material on it without permission and when she got caught she used bleachbit to erase the server. She's guilty as fucking hell, yet gets a pass because she's a lefty. Both of these needs to be dealt with.
> 
> Of course the raid on Trump's residence was politically motivated. We have Congress investigating the riot on January 6th while ignoring the years of riots from the black lives matter and antifa leftests. I also don't believe a word the leftist media has published due to the fact all they did when Trump was in office was attack him with fake news. Most of what they published were personal attacks and they were mostly all based on lies, misinformation and selective texts taken out of context.
> 
> ...


Playing both sides only works when you don't play the whataboutism, and when you don't try to equal a literal coup d'etat to put a tryrant in power with protestors who riot because their rights are being trampled.

You right wingers suck even when trying to be equidistant.


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## JonhathonBaxster (Aug 11, 2022)

Osakasan said:


> I'm not 'murican, but if the raid on Trump's house proves something is that the US are still alive, and mostly well.
> 
> It's time for the 'muricans to take out the trash, starting for that crooked ball of shit who dared to call himself 'President' while conning the whole country and selling it to Russia.
> 
> ...



Sorry to inform you, but the Russian Collusion was made up bullshit from Trump's opposition. He also was elected President and was our President and hopefully is our President again. You're living in a delusion created by your lying masters.


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## Osakasan (Aug 11, 2022)

JonhathonBaxster said:


> Sorry to inform you, but the Russian Collusion was made up bullshit from Trump's opposition. He also was elected President and was our President and hopefully is our President again. You're living in a delusion created by your lying masters.


lmao


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## JonhathonBaxster (Aug 11, 2022)

Osakasan said:


> Playing both sides only works when you don't play the whataboutism, and when you don't try to equal a literal coup d'etat to put a tryrant in power with protestors who riot because their rights are being trampled.
> 
> You right wingers suck even when trying to be equidistant.



There was no literal coup d'etat. There were a few hundred people out of hundreds of thousands who decided to riot. It wasn't planned and Trump wasn't some ringleader. Again, you've been lied to. Seek help.


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## Osakasan (Aug 11, 2022)

JonhathonBaxster said:


> There was no literal coup d'etat. There were a few hundred people out of hundreds of thousands who decided to riot


A coup d'etat only needs a dozen of people to be exactly that, that's how fascism came into power in my country.

I know you MAGA fucks are idiots but at least try to look the part.


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## JonhathonBaxster (Aug 11, 2022)

Osakasan said:


> A coup d'etat only needs a dozen of people to be exactly that, that's how fascism came into power in my country.
> 
> I know you MAGA fucks are idiots but at least try to look the part.



Again, it was not. There were no plans to overthrow the Government. It was just a couple hundred people who decided to riot. You know, destroy shit and cause a ruckus. The worse thing that happened was 1 person died and there was some property damage and theft. The leftist narrative that there was some coordinated coup d'etat run by Trump is just another lie. I'm also done talking about the January 6th shit. That's your whataboutism in every thread from your side. You look to distract with a minor issue like a single riot yet ignore tens of thousands of riots from your own side. So like the rest of the lefties I've put on ignore you're now on my ignore list. I don't need your sort of stupid in my life.


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## Osakasan (Aug 11, 2022)

JonhathonBaxster said:


> Again, it was not. There were no plans to overthrow the Government. It was just a couple hundred people who decided to riot. You know, destroy shit and cause a ruckus. The worse thing that happened was 1 person died and there was some property damage and theft. The leftist narrative that there was some coordinated coup d'etat run by Trump is just another lie. I'm also done talking about the January 6th shit. That's your whataboutism in every thread from your side. You look to distract with a minor issue like a single riot yet ignore tens of thousands of riots from your own side. So like the rest of the lefties I've put on ignore you're now on my ignore list. I don't need your sort of stupid in my life.


Say hello to Fucker Carlton

When you get his mic out of your mouth, i mean.


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## Nothereed (Aug 11, 2022)

JonhathonBaxster said:


> Again, it was not. There were no plans to overthrow the Government. It was just a couple hundred people who decided to riot. You know, destroy shit and cause a ruckus.


Wrong. Oath keepers speaker and one other was charged (and pleaded to) with seditous conspiracy. One of them which testified. Telling the hearing that the oath keepers, despite them not wanting to call themselves this. Is a armed militia. They had plans to look for Nancy Polsei on that day. Body armor and guns.
What do you think would happen?
Other far right/fascist groups were present.

They wanted to overthrow. A simple "peaceful" protest. Or even semi violent in the sense of damage property. Doesn't go as far as killing elected leaders to reinstall their candidate. That's what we saw on jan6th.

Trying to paint it as anything but that isn't going to work. But then again your also the same disgusting piece of crap who think women shouldn't have the right to choose.


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## xmenfan2001 (Aug 11, 2022)

mald seethe cope etc. lol


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## SScorpio (Aug 11, 2022)

Nothereed said:


> Wrong. Oath keepers speaker and one other was charged (and pleaded to) with seditous conspiracy. One of them which testified. Telling the hearing that the oath keepers, despite them not wanting to call themselves this. Is a armed militia. They had plans to look for Nancy Polsei on that day. Body armor and guns.
> What do you think would happen?
> Other far right/fascist groups were present.
> 
> ...


For an armed militia, they did a pretty crappy job. Only one person has been charged with having a gun, and he wasn't a member of that group.

Things also got so wild the vast majority of charges so far have been trespassing charges. This is of course after holding people in inhumane conditions for over two years.


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## JonhathonBaxster (Aug 12, 2022)

SScorpio said:


> For an armed militia, they did a pretty crappy job. Only one person has been charged with having a gun, and he wasn't a member of that group.
> 
> Things also got so wild the vast majority of charges so far have been trespassing charges. This is of course after holding people in inhumane conditions for over two years.



The oath keepers and other people who wanted to overthrow the government were a small minority of the people who were to begin with a small minority of a larger group. The main focus of most of the people who were rioting had nothing to do with overthrowing anything. Thanks for listing your examples of how petty the crimes committed were. However, I could care less. It's 1 riot vs tens of thousands and the only person who died was one of the trespassers. It's a non-issue that's being used to control the left and sadly a lot of the people in our government are taking advantage of their stupidly. The left on this site just use it as a distraction from issues at hand because it's all they have and they think they're being smart by spamming the crap all over the Internet. Sadly, they aren't that bright.


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## stanleyopar2000 (Aug 12, 2022)

BUTTER EMAILS


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## KitChan (Aug 12, 2022)

Conman raided, RIP society.


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## Nothereed (Aug 12, 2022)

So...
holy jesus christ
https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/2022/08/11/garland-trump-mar-a-lago/

the raid was over *nuclear documents *apparently.
you know, the HIGHEST CLASSIFICATION LEVEL????????
shit that should NEVER *EVER* be in any place outside of- of

jesus I can't even make a complete sentance right now. I knew he was stupid, I already knew that he was a facist, but for FUCK SAKES you cannot just hold onto that. Let alone have it in your fucking home


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## omgcat (Aug 12, 2022)

GOP: Unseal the warrant!!
DOJ: k
GOP: wait no

like damn, the warrant was approved by a trump appointed magistrate, and it was trumps group stopping the warrant from being public knowledge.

in terms of documents, I keep seeing people talking about them being declassified, which even if they were you can't remove them from the government as they are federal property.


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## MariArch (Aug 12, 2022)

Nothereed said:


> So...
> holy jesus christ
> https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/2022/08/11/garland-trump-mar-a-lago/
> 
> ...


You realize he was.. president, right? He literally had access to all classified documents while he was president lol. This is obviously just dumb pretext to dig through his shit.


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## Nothereed (Aug 12, 2022)

MariArch said:


> You realize he was.. president, right? He literally had access to all classified documents while he was president lol. This is obviously just dumb pretext to dig through his shit.


Sure. Yeah but not really.
A. That doesn't leave the whitehouse, or if it does, not for a extended periods of time, Or with an extreme amount of security
B. These documents were being asked back for over a year. And Trump refused.
C. These documents are national intelligence essentially. So even if he had clearance to those, it should of been returned _immediately_
not through an fbi raid.


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## Axido (Aug 12, 2022)

MariArch said:


> You realize he was.. president, right? He literally had access to all classified documents while he was president lol. This is obviously just dumb pretext to dig through his shit.


Yet he wasn't allowed to keep them at a time he isn't literally surrounded by personnel that makes sure he doesn't share that info with unauthorized parties.

You may want to rethink your conclusion if you really think this is dumb...


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## MariArch (Aug 12, 2022)

Nothereed said:


> Sure. Yeah but not really.
> A. That doesn't leave the whitehouse, or if it does, not for a extended periods of time, Or with an extreme about of security
> B. These documents were being asked back for over a year. And Trump refused.


Lol.. if they were extremely important, wonder why it took them a year. And wonder why he was cooperating with them up to this point in keeping them.. in a safe... That they had to crack lol.


 Meanwhile the Clinton and Obama administration took thousands of documents after their administration and held on to them for even longer and you don't see the FBI raiding their joints. 

Again, pretext. And also you're the biggest feddy bootlicker I've ever seen.


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## Nothereed (Aug 12, 2022)

MariArch said:


> Meanwhile the Clinton and Obama administration took thousands of documents after their administration and held on to them for even longer and you don't see the FBI raiding their joints.


Source?
Because if your just going to make up claims, why would I bother?


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## Nothereed (Aug 12, 2022)

MariArch said:


> Lol.. if they were extremely important, wonder why it took them a year. And wonder why he was cooperating with them up to this point in keeping them.. in a safe... That they had to crack lol.


Because they didn't want to raid a former president? Trump kept saying that he would give the documents, and he didn't give them back. He was not complying. He said he was complying. But it doesn't mean he was.


MariArch said:


> And also you're the biggest feddy bootlicker I've ever seen.


Really?
So I support BLM (the concept of the movement, now adays it's a husk)  a supposed anarchist group. And I'm a lefty, and those lefties are all burning it down in portland a while back.
But now I'm a feddy?
m-kay, sure.


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## MariArch (Aug 12, 2022)

https://nypost.com/2022/08/09/fbi-trump-raid-exposes-washingtons-secrecy-shams/

Citations, read


Also, we alllll know the FBI doesn't make up shit as a means to an end. Lol

Anyways, tldr, this smells like a complete sham that will probably be thrown in the wastebin along with russiagate and Ukrainegate.  and there's no doubt in my mind that the FBI is an extremely political entity that needs to be destroyed from the ground up.


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## ArugulaZ (Aug 12, 2022)

Being the former president does not give you a free ticket to commit crimes at your whim. The reason past presidents didn't get their homes raided is because they were not as uniquely, egregiously corrupt and as eager to flaunt laws as this one. 

The writer of this article is wrong to carry water for a likely criminal, and he's doubly wrong to pretend that this is a both sides issue, and that the ideal compromise from both sides is to just let Trump do whatever he wants without reprisal. No. Laws were violated, documents were compromised, the government was nearly overthrown. Criminals get treated like criminals, regardless of their political positions.


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## MariArch (Aug 12, 2022)

ArugulaZ said:


> Being the former president does not give you a free ticket to commit crimes at your whim. The reason past presidents didn't get their homes raided is because they were not as uniquely, egregiously corrupt and as eager to flaunt laws as this one.
> 
> The writer of this article is wrong to carry water for a likely criminal, and he's doubly wrong to pretend that this is a both sides issue, and that the ideal compromise from both sides is to just let Trump do whatever he wants without reprisal. No. Laws were violated, documents were compromised, the government was nearly overthrown. Criminals get treated like criminals, regardless of their political positions.


What crime has he been charged with? And don't cite that stupid New York tax shit lmao.
You're pulling stuff out of your ass with accusations of "unique corruption". Lol.

"Likely" criminal? Again, you're just making up headcanon


Also, a warrant isn't a charge lol. We still don't know literally anything about the details of this raid besides what the FBI claims in the warrant. And we don't even know if they found anything that they claim they were looking for lol.

So much conclusion jumping from the tinfoil hats


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## Coto (Aug 12, 2022)

Sounds like Defamation to not let him talk about the Democrats linked South American guerrillas (like FARC, G2, chavism, BLM), believe it or not, linked to Russia and China.

Hint: Iran planes going back and forward between Venezuela, Chile, using the same software and service apparatus involved in Latin American Countries gone Socialist (seen in action in United States elections as well).

There's hard proof in the recently captured Hunter Biden's laptop. Among convo between other leaders, et al.


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## KingVamp (Aug 12, 2022)

Tbf, he should have been arrested a long time ago, let alone this.

Imagine if any random average person took anything from the White House.


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## stanleyopar2000 (Aug 12, 2022)

Warrant is likely going to be "sale of classified us intelligence to other countries"

I'm betting Saudi Arabia or Russia.

This could possibly be considered Treason especially with it involving nuclear origins. I wondered why all of his debts suddenly went away.


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## LainaGabranth (Aug 12, 2022)

"LOCK HER UP!" his cultists chanted when he signed a bill in 2018 that let the FBI do investigations like this.
"DEFUND THE FBI" they start chanting in a complete 180 as the bill is used to investigate someone.

You guys on the right literally don't have morals, it's fucking embarrassing.


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## Nothereed (Aug 12, 2022)

MariArch said:


> Also, we alllll know the FBI doesn't make up shit as a means to an end. Lol


Yeah... Trump should he really mad at the person who hired this FBI director.

Which was... Oh.. Trump hired him. ROFL.
Also further more, Trump could of just... Told what it's in the warrent. If it was true this was just some bs lie. Trump could reveal over what they were searching for. Oh wait. He refuses to do that.

Further more we know he was subpoenaed multiples times over papers he hadn't returned.


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## DCarnage (Aug 12, 2022)

If he did something wrong and it's warranted then lock him up, if he didn't then lock everyone associated with this up.


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## MariArch (Aug 12, 2022)

Nothereed said:


> Yeah... Trump should he really mad at the person who hired this FBI director.
> 
> Which was... Oh.. Trump hired him. ROFL.
> Also further more, Trump could of just... Told what it's in the warrent. If it was true this was just some bs lie. Trump could reveal over what they were searching for. Oh wait. He refuses to do that.
> ...


Except Merrick Garland was the one who approved this warrant, a blatantly political democrat figure lol.

And we don't know what's going on with his lawyers or anything of the sort in the background, so we don't know any details from trumps end. And anyways, they just revealed it like 2 days later.. are you suggesting he was trying to hide something? Lol. Again, conjecture.


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## MariArch (Aug 12, 2022)

DCarnage said:


> If he did something wrong and it's warranted then lock him up, if he didn't then lock everyone associated with this up.


I can agree with this if this arising conspiracy theory about him em.. giving nuclear secrets to a foreign entity? Was true (it isn't).


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## Nothereed (Aug 12, 2022)

MariArch said:


> Except Merrick Garland was the one who approved this warrant, a blatantly political democrat figure lol.


So Trump hired a "blantantly political democrat" as his FBI director
Is that what you  telling me?


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## MariArch (Aug 12, 2022)

Nothereed said:


> So Trump hired a "blantantly political democrat" as his FBI director
> Is that what you  telling me?


..Merrick Garland is the attorney general appointed by Joe Biden? Merrick Garland is the one who approved the warrant. You're thinking of the director of the FBI.. who reports to the DOJ... That's ran by the Attorney General... Who's Merrick Garland. Lol


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## Nothereed (Aug 12, 2022)

MariArch said:


> ..Merrick Garland is the attorney general appointed by Joe Biden? Merrick Garland is the one who approved the warrant. You're thinking of the director of the FBI.. who reports to the DOJ... That's ran by the Attorney General... Who's Merrick Garland. Lol


Ah apologize, I got my wires a little crossed.
Meant the FBI director which was Christopher Wray. Who was appointed by Trump.


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## Osakasan (Aug 12, 2022)

Coto said:


> Sounds like Defamation to not let him talk about the Democrats linked South American guerrillas (like FARC, G2, chavism, BLM), believe it or not, linked to Russia and China.
> 
> Hint: Iran planes going back and forward between Venezuela, Chile, using the same software and service apparatus involved in Latin American Countries gone Socialist (seen in action in United States elections as well).
> 
> There's hard proof in the recently captured Hunter Biden's laptop. Among convo between other leaders, et al.



Ah yes, the mythical Hunter Biden laptop.

How come that and Hillary's e-mails are supposedly hard evidence and they havent been found before the motherfucking nuclear documents of Mar-a-lago?

Also, Irán? My dude, Irán is the country that PAID for the fascist party in my country created by the Opus Dei and trained by Steve Bannon.


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## Dark_Ansem (Aug 12, 2022)

I'm sorry, I wasn't aware being a former president means being above the law. It's amazing how a party that claims to be of "law and order" treats Trump as some sort of God-king above the law. You're embarassing.

EDIT: I would like to clarify that if Trump ends being indicted it will be for a law he passed trying to implicate Hillary Clinton. So, yeah, still PSML


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## SScorpio (Aug 12, 2022)

JonhathonBaxster said:


> The oath keepers and other people who wanted to overthrow the government were a small minority of the people who were to begin with a small minority of a larger group. The main focus of most of the people who were rioting had nothing to do with overthrowing anything. Thanks for listing your examples of how petty the crimes committed were. However, I could care less. It's 1 riot vs tens of thousands and the only person who died was one of the trespassers. It's a non-issue that's being used to control the left and sadly a lot of the people in our government are taking advantage of their stupidly. The left on this site just use it as a distraction from issues at hand because it's all they have and they think they're being smart by spamming the crap all over the Internet. Sadly, they aren't that bright.


Sadly Ashley Babbitt who was the woman who was shot and killed by Michael Byrd who was on Nancy Pelosi's security team was not the only death.

Another woman was killed outside the capital by injuries sustained by being pushed off a ledge by capital police. A man died of a heart attack, though with the number of people there it would be a statistical anomaly for there not to be at least one heart attack. A capital police officer also died after the events back at the station related to a health emergency.


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## SScorpio (Aug 12, 2022)

KingVamp said:


> Tbf, he should have been arrested a long time ago, let alone this.
> 
> Imagine if any random average person took anything from the White House.


If you believe this does it go both ways? Obama took large numbers of documents with him and promised to digitize them and hand over those copies. It's been over six years. Where are the raids? Is the law not applied equally in our country?

What about all the antique furniture that Hillary stole from the White House with not all of it recovered after Bill's terms ended?


----------



## Xzi (Aug 12, 2022)

Holy fuck, so he was trying to sell nuclear secrets to the highest bidder.  In any sane political party that would be the end of all support for him, so naturally Republicans have been doubling down and making tons of death threats on his behalf.  What a hill to die on, trying to shield an elitist scumbag from accountability for his own actions.


----------



## Nothereed (Aug 12, 2022)

snipped


----------



## kevin corms (Aug 12, 2022)

They just don't want us paying attention to Russia/Ukraine/China right now.


----------



## Nothereed (Aug 12, 2022)

kevin corms said:


> They just don't want us paying attention to Russia/Ukraine/China right now.


Who is this mysterious "they"
Democrats?
Republicans?
Because regardless your statement sounds incredibly outlandish. 
It's established that Trump had documents he was supposed to give back that were highest level of classification. And that he was supposed to provide those papers back. 
Further more, we can focus on more than one thing. Crazy that it's possible.


----------



## kevin corms (Aug 12, 2022)

Xzi said:


> Holy fuck, so he was trying to sell nuclear secrets to the highest bidder.  In any sane political party that would be the end of all support for him, so naturally Republicans have been doubling down and making tons of death threats on his behalf.  What a hill to die on, trying to shield an elitist scumbag from accountability for his own actions.


Lets just make things up now!


----------



## kevin corms (Aug 12, 2022)

Nothereed said:


> Who is this mysterious "they"
> Democrats?
> Republicans?
> Because regardless your statement sounds incredibly outlandish.
> ...


The oligarchs, the ones who really have control. Ill give an example even someone simple minded can understand, in what country can the president be kicked off social media? Ill give you another example, George W Bush was at Biden's inauguration as if he wasn't a war criminal and all you foolish children cheered for him.

Still paying attention? Both W Bush and Hillary Clinton (hers was in her house) had illegal email servers with classified information in them, and they both destroyed information which is a crime. No raid, no trial, nothing. I wont argue further until people actually pay attention for once.


----------



## Xzi (Aug 12, 2022)

kevin corms said:


> Lets just make things up now!


Literally the only logical conclusion unless you're gullible enough to believe he took the documents as souvenirs, and he stole a number of White House paintings on his way out for that purpose.


----------



## kevin corms (Aug 12, 2022)

Xzi said:


> Literally the only logical conclusion unless you're gullible enough to believe he took the documents as souvenirs, and he stole a number of White House paintings on his way out for that purpose.


First off, they didn't find any documents. You are reading articles from journalists publishing misinformation given from intelligence and then going full alex jones. How many times can they investigate this man based on lies and still have people believe in it? The problem is that everything Trump did wrong isnt illegal and the worst of it is being continued by Biden and friends.

Morevover, we have a war in Ukraine where nuclear power plants are being shelled.. while you guys are glued to a cartoon.


----------



## Nothereed (Aug 12, 2022)

Xzi said:


> Literally the only logical conclusion unless you believe he took the documents as souvenirs, and he stole a number of White House paintings on his way out for that purpose.


I'd hope your wrong. (since that means he didn't do that.)
 But... Given that it was stated that people that did not have qualifications or rights to see some of the documents were seeing them. Kinda hard to argue.


kevin corms said:


> The oligarchs, the ones who really have control. Ill give an example even someone simple minded can understand, in what country can the president be kicked off social media?


Former president. And, yesn't to the oligarch statement.

A lot of your folk drive up the wrong bark.
For example (I'm not saying your in this camp. First time I've seen you. Or at least, in memory)
Remember the whole "vaccines and big pharma" situation?
It was painted as a narrative were people were forcefully getting vaccinated, and that it was to assert control and some other conspiracy shiz?

That was the wrong bark. And even then, it ended up with that camp doubling down with big pharma (buying shit they didn't need, which came from massive pharmaceutical companies. Which some grifters got a cut of.)

What should of been focused off of was that corporations profited off of the covid vaccine patent. Which was going to be free (until patented)
Making the rest of the (poorer) world suffer.

So let's look at twitter now.
It should be concerned that media companies and their algorithms aren't exposed at all. We already know that it heavily favors right wing content, primarily being a stronger source of reactions and a lot of studies.
In other words, I don't take issue with Trump being booted off the platform.
I take issue with twitters entire existence. And we know that twitter profits (like facebook) off of those advertisements and your user data. If they found leftist content profitable, they would do it. Obiviously it isn't since well, leftism straight up is anti corporate/pro union.


----------



## Xzi (Aug 12, 2022)

kevin corms said:


> First off, they didn't find any documents. You are reading articles from journalists publishing misinformation given from intelligence and then going full alex jones.


Rofl, "they didn't find anything except the twelve boxes of highly classified documents they recovered."  It's also hilarious how fast Trump's cultists did a 180 on wanting the details of the warrant to be made public after he screeched about it on social media.  We'll know for sure what exactly the FBI was looking for and what they found soon enough.



Nothereed said:


> I'd hope your wrong. (since that means he didn't do that.)


If I am right it means they have concrete evidence that he has attempted to sell it, so he's ultra-fucked, legally speaking.


----------



## Nothereed (Aug 12, 2022)

Xzi said:


> Trump's cultists did a 180


they do that all time.

Back the blue!
Suddenly:
The FBI is corrupt burn it down!
Them:
Those communist anarchist leftists are burning it all down, they're awful for not following the law
Also them: at fucking CPAC






Really on the nose with this one. It's almost like... idk
They are fascists or something?
Like facists will say what they want to do to people. We already see that much (my signature is proof of that)


----------



## kevin corms (Aug 12, 2022)

Xzi said:


> Rofl, "they didn't find anything except the twelve boxes of highly classified documents they recovered."  It's also hilarious how fast Trump's cultists did a 180 on wanting the details of the warrant to be made public after he screeched about it on social media.  We'll know for sure what exactly the FBI was looking for and what they found soon enough.
> 
> 
> If I am right it means they have concrete evidence that he has attempted to sell it, so he's ultra-fucked, legally speaking.


You got it wrong, they removed boxes of documents and claim some were classified. Considering their track record, ill call complete bs. It would be known if he took them as soon as he did. The whole nuclear secrets thing is ridiculous as well, but its you that will be disappointed later.


----------



## kevin corms (Aug 12, 2022)

Nothereed said:


> they do that all time.
> 
> Back the blue!
> Suddenly:
> ...


Fascists are people who go around intimidating people they dont agree with, they dehumanize others and think if they just agreed with them everything would work out. Plenty on both "sides". Its also funny the "left" all hated the agencies until suddenly they were mean to Trump, now they love them?


----------



## Xzi (Aug 12, 2022)

kevin corms said:


> You got it wrong, they removed boxes of documents and claim some were classified.


As if you could get a search warrant signed by the AG and FBI director for a bunch of beauty magazines, rofl.  Of course they were classified.


----------



## Nothereed (Aug 12, 2022)

kevin corms said:


> Fascists are people who go around intimidating people they dont agree with, they dehumanize others and think if they just agreed with them everything would work out. Plenty on both "sides".


False.
There isn't "plenty on both sides"
Facists are ultra nationalist who believe that their country, or a particular x quality of them, is superior to others, or believe that it should be the way things are run, and will prioritize power over others beyond all else, including self destruction.

Fascism is and always has been a far right wing ideology. Fascism is a specific form of authoritarianism (in which yes you'd be correct there were some left leaning authoritarians)
 This country has a center right, and far right party. as a result of capitalists gaining more and more power, we've entered late stage capitalism, and at the borderline risk of falling into fascism.

If you don't believe me, read my signature. Look at those people. I can unequivocally call them facists. I don't do that because "muh feelings" it's because they match the idealogy extremely closely. They strongly other people, happy that people's civil rights are being banned, under the pretense that it's "states rights" the same argument for slavery of all things, and call themselves patriots.


----------



## kevin corms (Aug 12, 2022)

Nothereed said:


> False.
> There isn't "plenty on both sides"
> Facists are ultra nationalist who believe that their country, or a particular x quality of them, is superior to others, or believe that it should be the way things are run, and will prioritize power over others beyond all else, including self destruction.
> 
> ...


Im going to look at quotes on a forum signature from a lunatic? 

It has nothing to do with nationalism or imaginary lines. Once leaders dehumanize people for any reason, they are fascists. The original fascist party was started by socialists who thought their culture was superior to everyone else... study Mussolini and stop playing whack a mole on twitter bots.


----------



## Xzi (Aug 12, 2022)

kevin corms said:


> It has nothing to do with nationalism or imaginary lines.


You're right, it's much easier to just call "christian nationalists" neo-nazis instead of dancing around with more generalized terminology.


----------



## kevin corms (Aug 12, 2022)

Xzi said:


> You're right, it's much easier to just call "christian nationalists" neo-nazis instead of dancing around with more generalized terminology.


Seems way too vague, racists are racists. Doesnt matter what religion they believe in or how much they love the country. I think thats what you are getting at? The racists that bother me the most are the ones who pretend to be nice, like the feel bad for other races being "inferior"; especially politicians like Biden who use that train of thought to their advantage. I was really looking forward to Bernie Sanders being president...


----------



## Nothereed (Aug 12, 2022)

kevin corms said:


> Im going to look at quotes on a forum signature from a lunatic?
> 
> It has nothing to do with nationalism or imaginary lines. Once leaders dehumanize people for any reason, they are fascists. The original fascist party was started by socialists who thought their culture was superior to everyone else... study Mussolini and stop playing whack a mole on twitter bots.



Bullshit
Maybe you just watch the channel and don't check sources. But I just did.
First off, he bases his video off of previous videos as sources. Not very professional. Further more when you have historically inaccurate videos on the channel such as "The Nazi privatization myth" Or trying to claim Hitler as socialist. NONE OF THAT matches history.

Hitler claimed he was a socialist. This is a tatic used by facists, they use x likable concept to gain power, but not actually support it.
Like remember how Trump was supposed to "drain the swamp" and he never did that?
Further more (going to have to use this again)
https://encyclopedia.ushmm.org/cont...niemoeller-first-they-came-for-the-socialists


> First they came for the socialists, and I did not speak out—because I was not a socialist.
> Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out—because I was not a trade unionist.
> Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—because I was not a Jew.
> Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.
> —Martin Niemöller



let's pay attention to who they came after first.

they came for the socialists. Then the trade unions. Those were the opposing idealogy to hitler. If hitler truly supported socialism, why would he come after his own party?

Further more, removing unions is a pro captalist move.

We live in that kind of hell hole right now. We don't get any access to unions. Or if we do,our bosses will just right us down for a different reason and then fire us.

Further more, We know that facism has to find a new scapegoat non stop. As with hitler it reached the point that if your eyes weren't blue you were aborted, or if you weren't white you were aborted. But facists will always remove their opposition first, before getting to that point, because they want to secure a zone without opposition, or any rhetoric that could oppose them.


----------



## kevin corms (Aug 12, 2022)

Nothereed said:


> Bullshit
> Maybe you just watch the channel and don't check sources. But I just did.
> First off, he bases his video off of previous videos as sources. Not very professional. Further more when you have historically inaccurate videos on the channel such as "The Nazi privatization myth" Or trying to claim Hitler as socialist. NONE OF THAT matches history.
> 
> ...


I said study Mussolini, the guy who defined fascism. Hitler was a coked up mad man. Mussolini didnt even like the man, but if you study you can see why he dealt with him anyway. I dont expect to "win" this discussion, im just pleading with people to expand what they look at.


----------



## Nothereed (Aug 12, 2022)

kevin corms said:


> Im going to look at quotes on a forum signature from a lunatic?


Really?



kevin corms said:


> The original fascist party was started by socialists



First they came for the socialists, and I did not speak out—because I was not a socialist.
Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out—because I was not a trade unionist.
Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—because I was not a Jew.
Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.
       —Martin Niemöller     

No, socialists didn't support Hitler. Hitler claimed he was a socialist. But his actions weren't that. He wouldn't target them first if he was pro socialists.
This also means that no, Hitler was pro corporation since he wasn't pro union.




kevin corms said:


> I said study Mussolini, the guy who defined fascism


I'm pretty damn sure that Hitler takes the cake on that one.  But regardless, that's unessary since both Mussolini and Hitler are cut from the same cloth.
FFS, It's even more blatant. Benito Mussolini's party was
"Republican Fascist party"
Are you trying to make your case more difficult?


----------



## Xzi (Aug 12, 2022)

kevin corms said:


> Seems way too vague, racists are racists. Doesnt matter what religion they believe in or how much they love the country. I think thats what you are getting at?


Nationalism is the belief that your country is inherently superior to all others, and generally leads to a person being unable to identify or acknowledge any flaws in their nation; past, present, or future.  If that sounds familiar, it should, because racists have the same superiority complex in connection to race, almost always their own.  So it follows that racists become nationalists, and nationalists become racists, it's an easy jump to make.  Assuming one doesn't break the cycle of those psychological pitfalls, anyway, and a lot of people are incapable of managing to do that by themselves.


----------



## Dark_Ansem (Aug 12, 2022)

kevin corms said:


> I said study Mussolini, the guy who defined fascism. Hitler was a coked up mad man. Mussolini didnt even like the man, but if you study you can see why he dealt with him anyway. I dont expect to "win" this discussion, im just pleading with people to expand what they look at.


Nonsense. The guy who "defined fascism" is actually professor Umberto Eco and he said, in no uncertain terms, there is a plurality of fascist movements, So your whole idea of "only mussolini represents fascism" is absolute shite.

And if you want to quote George Orwell, do it properly, not with a stupid youtube video.


----------



## Coto (Aug 12, 2022)

Osakasan said:


> Ah yes, the mythical Hunter Biden laptop.
> 
> How come that and Hillary's e-mails are supposedly hard evidence and they havent been found before the motherfucking nuclear documents of Mar-a-lago?
> 
> Also, Irán? My dude, Irán is the country that PAID for the fascist party in my country created by the Opus Dei and trained by Steve Bannon.


Really:

Next time trying to assert a point, try to backup with facts, you make your country look like stupid assholes.


----------



## AncientBoi (Aug 12, 2022)

FUQ YOU tRuMp SUPPORTERS !

THEY DID FIND NATIONAL SECURITY FILES IN HIS HOME! FILES HE WAS NOT ENTITLED TO HAVE ! 

So stop it you bunch of KARENS and DARRENS !


----------



## kevin corms (Aug 12, 2022)

Dark_Ansem said:


> Nonsense. The guy who "defined fascism" is actually professor Umberto Eco and he said, in no uncertain terms, there is a plurality of fascist movements, So your whole idea of "only mussolini represents fascism" is absolute shite.
> 
> And if you want to quote George Orwell, do it properly, not with a stupid youtube video.


The guy who defined fascism is the guy who created the fascist party... I dont appreciate your stupid fallacy argument.


----------



## kevin corms (Aug 12, 2022)

Xzi said:


> Nationalism is the belief that your country is inherently superior to all others, and generally leads to a person being unable to identify or acknowledge any flaws in their nation; past, present, or future.  If that sounds familiar, it should, because racists have the same superiority complex in connection to race, almost always their own.  So it follows that racists become nationalists, and nationalists become racists, it's an easy jump to make.  Assuming one doesn't break the cycle of those psychological pitfalls, anyway, and a lot of people are incapable of managing to do that by themselves.


it doesnt have to be based on nationalism, it can be just about any ideology, Its based on we/I am better than you because, next step we/I dehumanize those that aren't x. It can be based on class, race, culture, religion, or anything else people can make up.


----------



## kevin corms (Aug 12, 2022)

Nothereed said:


> Really?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Its hard to make a case when people are too ignorant to even understand what they are discussing. Study Gaddafi for another example of a fascist.


----------



## kevin corms (Aug 12, 2022)

AncientBoi said:


> FUQ YOU tRuMp SUPPORTERS !
> 
> THEY DID FIND NATIONAL SECURITY FILES IN HIS HOME! FILES HE WAS NOT ENTITLED TO HAVE !
> 
> So stop it you bunch of KARENS and DARRENS !


When it comes out that they were all later declassified, can we pay attention to the actual problems that we should be paying attention to? Nuclear power plants getting shelled near Europe and tensions with China seem more serious than masturbating over Trump getting raided. I feel like Trump is part of the plan, they can just say something bad about him and everyone shuts off their brain. This is the same "weapons of mass destruction" fbi, they are constantly pulling this crap.

Why am I so tired of this? Its been 5 years of constant "we almost got him!", "the walls are closing in!', with nothing to show for it.


----------



## omgcat (Aug 12, 2022)

kevin corms said:


> When it comes out that they were all later declassified, can we pay attention to the actual problems that we should be paying attention to? Nuclear power plants getting shelled near Europe and tensions with China seem more serious than masturbating over Trump getting raided. I feel like Trump is part of the plan, they can just say something bad about him and everyone shuts off their brain.


declassified documents are still federal property. removing them without the proper procedures is still years in jail and thousands of dollars in fines PER DOCUMENT. he had BOXES OF THEM. his ass is fucked.


----------



## kevin corms (Aug 12, 2022)

omgcat said:


> declassified documents are still federal property. removing them without the proper procedures is still years in jail and thousands of dollars in fines PER DOCUMENT. he had BOXES OF THEM. his ass is fucked.


If thats the case, why arent Bush, Obama and Clinton already rotting in jail? We know for a fact they did the same thing. Hillary and George even destroyed several documents. It seems like more misdirection near state election date.

This happens every time, without fail. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2022_United_States_elections

The scary thing is, they would do the same thing to Bernie or anyone else who got in the oligarchs way. Trump running for president is the worst thing that could have happened, hes an asshole and gave them a green light to make whatever laws and intimidate people in any way they want. The fbi is well known for running these operations overseas, and increasingly more and more domestically now.

Anyway, pay attention to the economy, actual whistleblowers being jailed, the wars being started and going on... this is all political bs theater.. again.

Hell American forces have been helping Saudi Arabia commit genocide in Yemen, wake the hell up.


----------



## KingVamp (Aug 12, 2022)

"Whataboutism" isn't an excuse to not hold Trump accountable.


----------



## Flame (Aug 12, 2022)

Classified Nuclear Documents found in his house?

cant a good man not have Nuclear blueprints in his house these days without big government getting all nosy.. sesh


----------



## kevin corms (Aug 12, 2022)

Flame said:


> Classified Nuclear Documents found in his house?
> 
> cant a good man not have Nuclear blueprints in his house these days without big government getting all nosy.. sesh


Not confirmed, some article said there was suspicion.


----------



## Creamu (Aug 12, 2022)

'Attorney General Merrick Garland revealed during a brief Thursday speech that *he personally approved the search warrant at Mar-a-Lago*, and that the DOJ has asked a federal court to unseal the document.

[...]

The FBI was looking for 'classified documents relating to nuclear weapons,' among other things, during its Monday raid at former President Trump's Mar-a-Lago residence, _WaPo_ reports, citing 'people familiar with the investigation.'

So - we're to believe that the FBI took several boxes from Trump in June, told him to put a bigger lock, and then _two months later_ realized 'oh -- he might have *nuclear secrets*' - justifying the raid.

[...]

"Not only will I not oppose the release of documents related to the unAmerican, unwarranted, and unnecessary raid and break-in of my home in Palm Beach, Florida, Mar-a-Lago, _*I am going a step further by ENCOURAGING the immediate release of those documents*_, even though they have been drawn up by radical left Democrats and possible future political opponents, who have a strong and powerful vested interest in attacking me, much as they have done for the last 6 years…" Trump said in a Thursday night post on Truth Social.

"This unprecedented political weaponization of law enforcement is inappropriate and highly unethical. The world is watching as our Country is being brought to a new low, not only on our border, crime, economy, energy, national security, and so much more, but also with respect to our sacred elections!" he said in a subsequent post.'

https://www.zerohedge.com/political...-trump-raid?ref=biztoc.com&curator=biztoc.com


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## kevin corms (Aug 12, 2022)

KingVamp said:


> "Whataboutism" isn't an excuse to not hold Trump accountable.


I don't care what happens to him, my point is they keep just making things up about him and use it to distract from what is happening around you. It works especially well if its something others have done without consequence, divide and conquer.


----------



## kevin corms (Aug 12, 2022)

Creamu said:


> 'Attorney General Merrick Garland revealed during a brief Thursday speech that *he personally approved the search warrant at Mar-a-Lago*, and that the DOJ has asked a federal court to unseal the document.
> 
> [...]
> 
> ...


Ya thats the story, straight from Jeff Bezos and friends. Its a cartoon... The fbi is known to feed reporters complete lies (never with a name attached), they have had to retract countless articles in the last few years. Wait and see, stay focused on more important things. There is a reason Assange isnt a free man, and it has nothing to do with Trump.


----------



## Creamu (Aug 12, 2022)

"My attorneys and representatives were cooperating fully, and very good relationships had been established," Donald Trump said. "The government could have had whatever they wanted, if we had it. They asked us to put an additional lock on a certain area — DONE! Everything was fine, better than that of most previous Presidents, and then, out of nowhere and with no warning, Mar-a-Lago was raided, at 6:30 in the morning, by VERY large numbers of agents, and even 'safecrackers.' They got way ahead of themselves. Crazy!" -Donald Trump

https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/...curity/fbi-records-nuclear-weapons-trump-raid


----------



## lokomelo (Aug 12, 2022)

Creamu said:


> "My attorneys and representatives were cooperating fully, and very good relationships had been established," Donald Trump said. "The government could have had whatever they wanted, if we had it. They asked us to put an additional lock on a certain area — DONE! Everything was fine, better than that of most previous Presidents, and then, out of nowhere and with no warning, Mar-a-Lago was raided, at 6:30 in the morning, by VERY large numbers of agents, and even 'safecrackers.' They got way ahead of themselves. Crazy!" -Donald Trump
> 
> https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/...curity/fbi-records-nuclear-weapons-trump-raid


So the correct procedure is tell the suspect's lawyer before searching for proofs? Nice to know, I bet that's exactly what happens with regular citizens.


----------



## kevin corms (Aug 12, 2022)

Creamu said:


> "My attorneys and representatives were cooperating fully, and very good relationships had been established," Donald Trump said. "The government could have had whatever they wanted, if we had it. They asked us to put an additional lock on a certain area — DONE! Everything was fine, better than that of most previous Presidents, and then, out of nowhere and with no warning, Mar-a-Lago was raided, at 6:30 in the morning, by VERY large numbers of agents, and even 'safecrackers.' They got way ahead of themselves. Crazy!" -Donald Trump
> 
> https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/...curity/fbi-records-nuclear-weapons-trump-raid


If it were real, it wouldnt be a big show. they would hold him, make everyone shut up and have actual charges and evidence. This is a clown show. Trump loves any attention, so im sure hes going with it. Trump is the reality show president, its by design.


----------



## UltraDolphinRevolution (Aug 12, 2022)

I´m very disappointed the FBI didn´t show up with tanks as well. That´s how a real banana republic would have done it.


----------



## kevin corms (Aug 12, 2022)

UltraDolphinRevolution said:


> I´m very disappointed the FBI didn´t show up with tanks as well. That´s how a real banana republic would have done it.


The United States is like a dystopian novel. A country so free everyone has to pledge allegiance to a flag. This is what they don’t want you thinking about https://www.reuters.com/article/us-ukraine-crisis-idCAKBN2PG01B


----------



## UltraDolphinRevolution (Aug 13, 2022)

Xzi said:


> Nationalism is the belief that your country is inherently superior to all others, and generally leads to a person being unable to identify or acknowledge any flaws in their nation; past, present, or future.  If that sounds familiar, it should, because racists have the same superiority complex in connection to race, almost always their own.  So it follows that racists become nationalists, and nationalists become racists, it's an easy jump to make.  Assuming one doesn't break the cycle of those psychological pitfalls, anyway, and a lot of people are incapable of managing to do that by themselves.


So then the racists lost the Chinese Civil War?
Race and nation are indeed related. But the wish to be with one´s own does not necessitate superiority. A black person can prefer black company without feeling superior, right?
I prefer to be with my child/parents/siblings. It does not mean I think my parents are superior.

Please refute this statement.


----------



## kevin corms (Aug 13, 2022)

UltraDolphinRevolution said:


> So then the racists lost the Chinese Civil War?
> Race and nation are indeed related. But the wish to be with one´s own does not necessitate superiority. A black person can prefer black company without feeling superior, right?
> I prefer to be with my child/parents/siblings. It does not mean I think my parents are superior.
> 
> Please refute this statement.


There is actually only one race. The entire idea of multiple races only appeared from people into eugenics, they made it up. It gets even more absurd when you look at the court cases where people originating from different countries went to court to fight to have “whiteness”. The reason they created the idea of race in the United States was to create class based on appearance.


----------



## lokomelo (Aug 13, 2022)

kevin corms said:


> There is actually only one race. The entire idea of multiple races only appeared from people into eugenics, they made it up. It gets even more absurd when you look at the court cases where people originating from different countries went to court to fight to have “whiteness”. The reason they created the idea of race in the United States was to create class based on appearance.


It's only one race but a huge amount of ethnicities. The life game is not even or fair and your ethnicity plays a huge role on that.


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## UltraDolphinRevolution (Aug 13, 2022)

kevin corms said:


> There is actually only one race.


What is so magical about humans that we don´t have different kinds. Call it race or ethnicity or something else.


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## Nothereed (Aug 13, 2022)

https://www.scribd.com/document/586...ago-Search-Warrant-Papers-Redacted#from_embed

So yeah it looks like new York times article is lining up. Within the search warrant there's 4 cases of top secret documents. Those don't leave the white house ever.


Oh so it's likely even worse (i usually don't like videos, but I'll make an exception)


----------



## Dark_Ansem (Aug 13, 2022)

kevin corms said:


> The guy who defined fascism is the guy who created the fascist party... I dont appreciate your stupid fallacy argument.


More falsehoods on your parts. The Italian fascist party is not the only fascist movement which has existed throughout history.


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## AncientBoi (Aug 13, 2022)

kevin corms said:


> When it comes out that they were all later declassified, can we pay attention to the actual problems that we should be paying attention to? Nuclear power plants getting shelled near Europe and tensions with China seem more serious than masturbating over Trump getting raided. I feel like Trump is part of the plan, they can just say something bad about him and everyone shuts off their brain. This is the same "weapons of mass destruction" fbi, they are constantly pulling this crap.
> 
> Why am I so tired of this? Its been 5 years of constant "we almost got him!", "the walls are closing in!', with nothing to show for it.



Another tRUMP supporter. I don't give a  about that fuqin tRuMp's azzhole. . Fuq him and ALL his supporters!! May he rot in hell Got it?!


----------



## sarkwalvein (Aug 13, 2022)

Creamu said:


> The rest of the democratic world looked upon the United States as a model for successful representative government.


LOL, when was that? 50 years ago or even before that?


----------



## TempOutlook (Aug 13, 2022)

Does this Mr. Martin not know what the gulags were or is he just using words to use them? Pretty laughable.


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## LainaGabranth (Aug 13, 2022)

You know it's not a good look if you think the imprisoning of a fascist is the "end of the United States"


----------



## Robika (Aug 13, 2022)

Donny is not going to jail, he white, he rich and he was president. Sad but I think he was the worst representation of the US even worst than the idiot George W. Bush.


----------



## kevin corms (Aug 13, 2022)

UltraDolphinRevolution said:


> What is so magical about humans that we don´t have different kinds. Call it race or ethnicity or something else.


Ask an anthropologist, they are the experts and all agree.



Robika said:


> Donny is not going to jail, he white, he rich and he was president. Sad but I think he was the worst representation of the US even worst than the idiot George W. Bush.


Excuse me, the man is clearly orange.


----------



## AncientBoi (Aug 13, 2022)

kevin corms said:


> Excuse me, the man is clearly orange.



Maybe even *Pink* after the other inmates get to him


----------



## lolcatzuru (Aug 13, 2022)

Xzi said:


> Idiocy.  This was a raid signed off on by the DoJ and an FBI director who was _appointed by Trump_.  The amount of evidence gathered beforehand had to be mountainous, and the executive branch was not made aware of it until well after.
> 
> 
> Gasp, you mean to tell me that nobody is above the law?  This has fuck all to do with Trump's views, everything to do with the fact that he's the worst kind of criminal scum.
> ...




you know i think this may be be the definition of irony.


----------



## osaka35 (Aug 13, 2022)

big oof. 

I guess we'll see exactly what the repercussion are for ...ahh, mishandling "top secret" documents. Those with power are held to different consequences than the rest of us, so now it's a wait-and-see i suppose.


----------



## tabzer (Aug 13, 2022)

Fascism is what governing institutions call other governing institutions to validate their own supremacy.  It's a race to the bottom of human decency and to the top of human authoritarianism.  It's polarizing as a function.


----------



## caki883 (Aug 13, 2022)

who cares. If he done some shady things he needs to pay with money , jail time , life


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## Osakasan (Aug 13, 2022)

LainaGabranth said:


> You know it's not a good look if you think the imprisoning of a fascist is the "end of the United States"


These people don't even realize that saying shit like "going agaisnt [insert abhorrent shit the GOP does and promotes] is going agaisnt América" speaks very badly about them AND América.

Like, 'scuse me sir, if white supremacy, religious fanatism, racism, weapon cult, militarism and misoginy - among others - are american, you have one hell of a shithole country over there.


----------



## sombrerosonic (Aug 13, 2022)

and this is why i avoid this part of gbatemp. screaming 24/7

But i digress i think the democrats are gonna have a shit time making a case with the little evedence ntm this may hit joe's Approval rateing a bit hard


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## MikaDubbz (Aug 13, 2022)

If anything, the US may have just been saved


----------



## sarkwalvein (Aug 13, 2022)

MikaDubbz said:


> If anything, the US may have just been saved


I think it's too late, but to be honest, I think it is at least 20 years too late.
The empire is falling, and it's not exactly good for anybody. IMHO.
But perhaps I am just pessimistic.


----------



## kevin corms (Aug 13, 2022)

https://nypost.com/2017/01/11/schumer-predicted-intelligence-officials-would-get-back-at-trump/

Most other websites have this buried, but chuck knows how this works.


----------



## kevin corms (Aug 13, 2022)

MikaDubbz said:


> If anything, the US may have just been saved





sarkwalvein said:


> I think it's too late, but to be honest, I think it is at least 20 years too late.
> The empire is falling, and it's not exactly good for anybody. IMHO.
> But perhaps I am just pessimistic.


Trump is just a scapegoat at this point. If people believe this raid is saving the country I have a bridge to sell you. Anyway I’ll get back to watching Richard Jewell, and worrying about more important matters.


----------



## Osakasan (Aug 13, 2022)

The US are beyond saving, there's only so much propaganda a country can publish to hide its decadence.

But at the very least some guilty heads will fall.


----------



## UltraDolphinRevolution (Aug 13, 2022)

kevin corms said:


> Ask an anthropologist, they are the experts and all agree.


Do I also need to ask the experts what a woman is? Typical leftist.
If polar bears and brown bears are different races (brown bears make brown bears and polar bears polar bears; and together they make a mix), then Subsaharan Africans and Europeans are different races.
You can swap out the word for another if it makes you uncomfortable, but the biological principle remains.

BTW have people seen the change of terminology on live mainstream television? Somebody from the FBI was interviewed and said that the FBI does not like the term "raid" and instead prefers "search". Within seconds, the title at the bottom of the screen was changed. Soviet nostalgia...


----------



## KennyAtom (Aug 13, 2022)

Look, I've been a long time right leaning guy, but even I can tell Trump broke the law here.

It's the reason I refer to myself as right leaning, and not republican, because people associate you with being a brain dead, stupid son of a bitch traitor when you say you were a republican, and not if you say you are right leaning.


----------



## kevin corms (Aug 13, 2022)

I do want add one thing, if trump goes to jail it will be based on a law he passed.


----------



## kevin corms (Aug 13, 2022)

UltraDolphinRevolution said:


> Do I also need to ask the experts what a woman is? Typical leftist.
> If polar bears and brown bears are different races (brown bears make brown bears and polar bears polar bears; and together they make a mix), then Subsaharan Africans and Europeans are different races.
> You can swap out the word for another if it makes you uncomfortable, but the biological principle remains.
> 
> BTW have people seen the change of terminology on live mainstream television? Somebody from the FBI was interviewed and said that the FBI does not like the term "raid" and instead prefers "search". Within seconds, the title at the bottom of the screen was changed. Soviet nostalgia...


Imaginary lines have nothing to do with facts. Polar bears and black bears aren’t just a different color 

There simply isn’t much difference between people anywhere. Spare me the social science.


----------



## Tsukiru (Aug 13, 2022)

Only here to comment that reading "the End of the United States" is one of the funniest things I've read, only yo be followed up with "The rest of the democratic world looked upon the United States as a model for successful representative government". I feel like calling for officer's who "pushed back" to be sent to Gitmo is actually more reason why the democratic world doesn't look at the US in that light.


----------



## Tsukiru (Aug 13, 2022)

UltraDolphinRevolution said:


> Do I also need to ask the experts what a woman is? Typical leftist.


IDK if you need to hear this but it is insanely normal to default to an expert on a question like "why don't we have different kinds" (like the fact no one in the field says kinds. Brown bears and polar bears are different species under the 7 classifications, while humans do not have this). It would make complete sense to leave that to someone who knows how the classifications work.

I do not know why your brain tried to link it to "what a woman is" (who are also not a different species) and thought that was cool enough to smugly say "typical leftist". It's not related beyond a sad attempt at a dunk.


----------



## RAHelllord (Aug 13, 2022)

UltraDolphinRevolution said:


> Do I also need to ask the experts what a woman is? Typical leftist.
> If polar bears and brown bears are different races (brown bears make brown bears and polar bears polar bears; and together they make a mix), then Subsaharan Africans and Europeans are different races.
> You can swap out the word for another if it makes you uncomfortable, but the biological principle remains.
> 
> BTW have people seen the change of terminology on live mainstream television? Somebody from the FBI was interviewed and said that the FBI does not like the term "raid" and instead prefers "search". Within seconds, the title at the bottom of the screen was changed. Soviet nostalgia...


Do you understand what a species is? Brown bears and polar bears are genetically much farther away from each other than any human from any other human, regardless of their skin color.
Our genetic diversity as a species is not large enough to deserve a classification into different subspecies. If you wouldn't call black haired and blonde haired individuals as different "races" then neither are people with different skin colors because the genetic differences are on the same level as hair color.


----------



## kevin corms (Aug 13, 2022)

Tsukiru said:


> IDK if you need to hear this but it is insanely normal to default to an expert on a question like "why don't we have different kinds" (like the fact no one in the field says kinds. Brown bears and polar bears are different species under the 7 classifications, while humans do not have this). It would make complete sense to leave that to someone who knows how the classifications work.
> 
> I do not know why your brain tried to link it to "what a woman is" (who are also not a different species) and thought that was cool enough to smugly say "typical leftist". It's not related beyond a sad attempt at a dunk.


I find it funny that tribalists call me a trump supporter and a leftist on the same thread on a forum. Truth is I just don’t have much filter and I would consider myself a pacifist anarchist if I needed a label.


----------



## CMDreamer (Aug 13, 2022)

Creamu said:


> The fact that they can attempt the gulag treatment on Trump should be a massive wake-up to any powerless, ordinary citizen with an unpopular view. They are coming for you, next.


This is pure contradiction. First you point out that Trumpet is "one of a kind, billionare", and now you try to sell the idea that when Trumpet gets raided by the FBi, they're "raiding" the whole U.S. population; when in first stance Trumpet didn't represented the whole U.S. citizens, but the opposite, Trumpet represented (and still do) those minorities that seek and see raids as something that should be done whenever they don't get what they want.

Trumpet represents not a future but a return to Middle Ages, willing to build higher walls while trying to protect a very few that can pay for such protection or are friends, family or colleagues of them.

Don't try to say that the U.S. is rotten now that Trumpet must face the law, when your political system is rotten from the roots, and got worse right after "The Western" years ended. If you can't see it, then you now nothing about your own country's history.


----------



## xIce101x (Aug 13, 2022)

What a title


----------



## Tsukiru (Aug 13, 2022)

kevin corms said:


> I find it funny that tribalists call me a trump supporter and a leftist on the same thread on a forum. Truth is I just don’t have much filter and I would consider myself a pacifist anarchist if I needed a label.


It's what I would expect from the most successful representative government, obviously.


----------



## UltraDolphinRevolution (Aug 13, 2022)

RAHelllord said:


> Do you understand what a species is? Brown bears and polar bears are genetically much farther away from each other than any human from any other human, regardless of their skin color.


They have split longer ago than all human races but they can produce offspring together. It was just an example. If polar bears and brown bears can be considered species, surely humans can be considered races/subspecies:












RAHelllord said:


> Our genetic diversity as a species is not large enough to deserve a classification into different subspecies. If you wouldn't call black haired and blonde haired individuals as different "races" then neither are people with different skin colors because the genetic differences are on the same level as hair color.


I´m not calling human races "races" because of a single trait. Pygmys (see above) have the same skin color as some Subsaharan African races, but they are very distinct. You could theoretically create a blond race through isolation but it hasn´t happened. That´s why I don´t call blonds a seperate race. Sweden is pretty blonde (more than 50%). If you took blonds (who don´t have brown hair genes in them which is extremely rare) and isolated them on an island for 10000 years, perhaps I would call them a different race. But hair color would be only one trait that would differ. Races are about gene clusters.

The principle of isolation is the same as with bears:

"Male brown bears swam across to the islands from the Alaskan mainland and mated with female polar bears, eventually transforming the polar bear population into brown bears.
Polar bears are genetically a very homogeneous species, with no evidence of brown bear genes in the population."
"[...]about the evolutionary history of the two species, which are closely related and known to produce fertile hybrids."
https://www.universityofcalifornia....ationship-between-polar-bears-and-brown-bears


----------



## MikaDubbz (Aug 13, 2022)

sarkwalvein said:


> I think it's too late, but to be honest, I think it is at least 20 years too late.
> The empire is falling, and it's not exactly good for anybody. IMHO.
> But perhaps I am just pessimistic.


I'm just saying that if people think that THIS is the move that ruins America, then they are ridiculously out of touch.


----------



## Nothereed (Aug 14, 2022)

Creamu said:


> I was shocked to see that former President of the United States, Donald Trump, had his home raided by the Federal Bureau of Investigations (FBI).


wasn't shocked.


Creamu said:


> For those who hate Trump, it is important to note that this raid is more than just Trump.


Yes it is just Trump


Creamu said:


> Trump is a polarizing figure in American politics.


And?


Creamu said:


> Trump is also a billionaire. This is not an ordinary, well intentioned political protester who walked the Halls of Congress on January 6th


January6th was a coup attempt. 14 characteristics of fascism, Trump lands on all 14.
They are the following

*Powerful and Continuing Nationalism*_
 Fascist regimes tend to make constant use of patriotic mottos, slogans, symbols, songs, and other paraphernalia. Flags are seen everywhere, as are flag symbols on clothing and in public displays._

"Make American Great Again" Matches patriotic motto_. 



_
Flag condition matched. Then of course you have the bumper stickers and hats.
_*Disdain for the Recognition of Human Rights*
 Because of fear of enemies and the need for security, the people in fascist regimes are persuaded that human rights can be ignored in certain cases because of "need." The people tend to look the other way or even approve of torture, summary executions, assassinations, long incarcerations of prisoners, etc._

Support of removal abortion. Plain and simple. Republican party can dress it up as "states rights" but within their states, they removed that right.


_*Identification of Enemies/Scapegoats as a Unifying Cause*
 The people are rallied into a unifying patriotic frenzy over the need to eliminate a perceived common threat or foe: racial , ethnic or religious minorities; liberals; communists; socialists, terrorists, etc._

"Back the Blue!"
as a response to BLM
"The illegals are out to rape, kill, and take your benefits crossing the boarder illegally. We must build a wall!"
As a dog whistle against Mexicans.
"ANTIFA did X"
As a scapegoat for Jan6th
(insert CRT comment. Or Transphobia)
We also know this rehetroic drives people to kill, or injure, see the 31. White nationalists/facists who wanted to injure people at a Pride parade)



_*Supremacy of the Military*
 Even when there are widespread domestic problems, the military is given a disproportionate amount of government funding, and the domestic agenda is neglected. Soldiers and military service are glamorized._

I don't need to explain this one. What country and what is the thing we spend the most on answers it.



_*Rampant Sexism*
 The governments of fascist nations tend to be almost exclusively male-dominated. Under fascist regimes, traditional gender roles are made more rigid. Opposition to abortion is high, as is homophobia and anti-gay legislation and national policy._

Self explanatory, and already a given. Remember when trans people were banned from the military? and or  still being denied health care services?
_*Controlled Mass Media*
 Sometimes to media is directly controlled by the government, but in other cases, the media is indirectly controlled by government regulation, or sympathetic media spokespeople and executives. Censorship, especially in war time, is very common._

Trump: All the news is fake news except the news I agree with
_*Obsession with National Security*
 Fear is used as a motivational tool by the government over the masses._

See border security in point 3.
_*Religion and Government are Intertwined*
 Governments in fascist nations tend to use the most common religion in the nation as a tool to manipulate public opinion. Religious rhetoric and terminology is common from government leaders, even when the major tenets of the religion are diametrically opposed to the government's policies or actions._


supreme court eroding the seperation of church and state. And Trump doing photo ops with bible.


_*Corporate Power is Protected*
 The industrial and business aristocracy of a fascist nation often are the ones who put the government leaders into power, creating a mutually beneficial business/government relationship and power elite._


Trump and co providing tax breaks and cuts for the rich, while only temporarily providing tax cuts for poor, raising them further.


_*Labor Power is Suppressed*
 Because the organizing power of labor is the only real threat to a fascist government, labor unions are either eliminated entirely, or are severely suppressed ._


Anti union.


_*Disdain for Intellectuals and the Arts*
 Fascist nations tend to promote and tolerate open hostility to higher education, and academia. It is not uncommon for professors and other academics to be censored or even arrested. Free expression in the arts is openly attacked, and governments often refuse to fund the arts._

See lack of funding schools and teachers by Republican party


_*Obsession with Crime and Punishment*
 Under fascist regimes, the police are given almost limitless power to enforce laws. The people are often willing to overlook police abuses and even forego civil liberties in the name of patriotism. There is often a national police force with virtually unlimited power in fascist nations._

*LAW and ORDER!*
Says the party who is now whining about the FBI they setup.


_*Rampant Cronyism and Corruption*
 Fascist regimes almost always are governed by groups of friends and associates who appoint each other to government positions and use governmental power and authority to protect their friends from accountability. It is not uncommon in fascist regimes for national resources and even treasures to be appropriated or even outright stolen by government leaders._

See Trump's ally's asking for pardons on jan6th.


_*Fraudulent Elections*
 Sometimes elections in fascist nations are a complete sham. Other times elections are manipulated by smear campaigns against or even assassination of opposition candidates, use of legislation to control voting numbers or political district boundaries, and manipulation of the media. Fascist nations also typically use their judiciaries to manipulate or control elections._

See jan6th.



Creamu said:


> He should have been more aggressive regarding the removal of far-left activists


False, republican party would of supported looking into extremism in departments. Nearly all of them voted no on that bill. Wonder why (cough, hint, it's because the police force has  a nazi problem)



Creamu said:


> Displaying imagery that expresses your bended knee toward Washington, DC, is an indication of your loyalties. You have chosen the Union over the Founding Principles. You have chosen elected bureaucrats over your own people. You have shown that when we need you, you will not be there for us.


This is a fascist call. Anarchists and left leaning adjacent ideologies will and never bend to any state, we look out for each other. Not a state, not a country.


----------



## Nothereed (Aug 14, 2022)

Creamu said:


> He should have acted the part and saved civilized society.


Part of fascism is seeing a figure is a savoir, idealizing one person to the extreme, despite all the evidence that exists. And even then, it's difficult for those to see that evidence for those who are caught in it. The door has been shut on them for those who have entered the far right rabbit hole. Any evidence that they don't like is either not spoken, or twisted to the point that it's long lost it's original meaning or factuality behind it within continuous boiling rage. Looking for the next immedate thing to get angry at.


----------



## Creamu (Aug 14, 2022)

MikaDubbz said:


> I'm just saying that if people think that THIS is the move that ruins America, then they are ridiculously out of touch.


Yeah in general, the movements you see happening are the result of a greater whole. However, Trump is a big shiny symbol. Him becoming president didnt look good. I mean a reality TV star merchant type as president of the most powerful empire oof. This now with raid doesnt look good as well. It is altogether a bad look I think.


----------



## Creamu (Aug 14, 2022)

'“Number one, it was all declassified. Number two, they didn’t need to ‘seize’ anything,” Mr. Trump said in a statement. “They could have had it anytime they wanted without playing politics and breaking into Mar-a-Lago. It was in secured storage, with an additional lock put on as per their request. They could have had it anytime they wanted—and that includes LONG ago. ALL THEY HAD TO DO WAS ASK.”'

https://m.washingtontimes.com/news/2022/aug/12/donald-trump-under-investigation-violating-espiona/

'The bigger problem is, what are they going to do with the 33 million pages of documents, many of which are classified, that President Obama took to Chicago?'
-Donald Trump


----------



## Osakasan (Aug 14, 2022)

Creamu said:


> '“Number one, it was all declassified. Number two, they didn’t need to ‘seize’ anything,” Mr. Trump said in a statement. “They could have had it anytime they wanted without playing politics and breaking into Mar-a-Lago. It was in secured storage, with an additional lock put on as per their request. They could have had it anytime they wanted—and that includes LONG ago. ALL THEY HAD TO DO WAS ASK.”'
> 
> https://m.washingtontimes.com/news/2022/aug/12/donald-trump-under-investigation-violating-espiona/



That's, literally, "if the president does it it isn't wrong" and it doesn't work like that.

Fuck, i'm spanish and even I know that.

Declassified documents still CAN'T get taken out of the official government archives, and it's a crime to do so.


----------



## Nothereed (Aug 14, 2022)

Creamu said:


> '“Number one, it was all declassified.


No they weren't declassifed. Even if they were however, he is holding property of the united states as a no longer sitting president.  If I worked for the government, kept documents they provided and did not give it back after I was fired or left. I'd be in jail for not complying to give those documents back. And that's basic documents, not TSCI level documents. Which requires a separate agency to approve declassifying because it's that senstive. (TSCI stands for top secret senstive compartmentalized information.)
Which by the way TSCI IS THEE highest level of classification. It requires a dedicated area and staff to *even look* at those documents because it's that important, and NEVER leaves the whitehouse unless it's being securely transported by members who handle that.


----------



## Nothereed (Aug 14, 2022)

Creamu said:


> Number two, they didn’t need to ‘seize’ anything


Yes they did need to seize it, as trump did not comply with providing the documents he was supposed to provide that are the goverments own papers/property.  And also before someone makes a fool of themselves, the national archive association (the one agency responsible for handling these documents) said that Obama did comply with providing the documents back, and did not hold onto anything.


----------



## smf (Aug 14, 2022)

AmandaRose said:


> Haha they really don't. The rest of the world laughs at the insanity of American politicians.


Only the republicans.



JonhathonBaxster said:


> If Trump did indeed bring classified documents to his residence without permission then he needs to be held accountable.


He did. You could have ended your post there.



JonhathonBaxster said:


> He also was elected President and was our President and hopefully is our President again. You're living in a delusion created by your lying masters.


You want a criminal as president and you accuse other people of being delusional?


----------



## RAHelllord (Aug 14, 2022)

UltraDolphinRevolution said:


> They have split longer ago than all human races but they can produce offspring together. It was just an example. If polar bears and brown bears can be considered species, surely humans can be considered races/subspecies:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Species are created over hundreds of thousands of years and thousands of generations. Polar and brown bears split off over 500.000 years ago, the first homo sapiens sapiens occurred about 160.000 to 90.000 years ago. We are a long way from having had enough generations to create a genetic drift large enough to justify a biological classification into different species or subspecies. Both of us are far closer related to both our first homo sapiens sapiens ancestors and any given living human than brown bears are to either polar bears or their common shared ancestor.

And no, the skin color, hair color, curly hair, and facial features are quite literally superficially cosmetic changes and incredibly minor blips in the human genome.

There's also the fact that we have millions of examples of humans of different ethnicities creating healthy children and exactly one example for polar and brown bears. If polar and brown bears would be more regularly able to produce fertile offspring it would mean the species classification for both would need to be reconsidered as it's a requirement for subspecies to have at least partially infertile male offspring and for species to have almost no or entirely no fertile offspring of any sex.


----------



## smf (Aug 14, 2022)

RAHelllord said:


> If you wouldn't call black haired and blonde haired individuals as different "races" then neither are people with different skin colors because the genetic differences are on the same level as hair color.


Skin is the largest organ in the human body, it's color plays an important role which among other things affects oxygen sensors and how much sun exposure is required for vitamin d production.

Hair color is less important and is easily changed.

Although race isn't just skin color anyway.


----------



## Xzi (Aug 14, 2022)

kevin corms said:


> I do want add one thing, if trump goes to jail it will be based on a law he passed.


That might add weight to his sentence, but it's likely they also go after him with the Espionage Act.  He didn't just mishandle classified info after all, the only reason for him to hang on to it would be to sell it.  Trump's lawyers are also in the shit, because they signed off on a statement saying he had returned all documents that he took months ago.


----------



## smf (Aug 14, 2022)

Osakasan said:


> Declassified documents still CAN'T get taken out of the official government archives, and it's a crime to do so.


It's just the "I stole the car, but all the owner had to do was ask me for it back" excuse. And as we know, Trump was asked repeatedly.

It's amazing how times change.



Trump took the fifth over 440 times.


----------



## smf (Aug 14, 2022)

Xzi said:


> He didn't just mishandle classified info after all, the only reason for him to hang on to it would be to sell it.  Trump's lawyers are also in the shit, because they signed off on a statement saying he had returned all documents that he took months ago.


I assumed he held onto it because it showed him in a poor light. If he was going to sell it, then he could have copied and returned it. Not stick it in a safe in his own property.

But then the guy is so deranged, who knows WTF was going on in his tiny mind.


----------



## RAHelllord (Aug 14, 2022)

smf said:


> Skin is the largest organ in the human body, it's color plays an important role which among other things affects oxygen sensors and how much sun exposure is required for vitamin d production.
> 
> Hair color is less important and is easily changed.
> 
> Although race isn't just skin color anyway.


Skin color is easily changed by tanning or lack thereof, and vitamin D can be supplemented as easily as eating fish once a week. Also, oxygen sensors just need to be calibrated to work correctly, and need the same calibration for tanned people. The difference is literally just in the baseline production of melanin, something every human produces in their skin naturally.

And no, dying hair is not the same as having a naturally different hair color, changing your skin color naturally is much easier than changing your hair color via "natural" means.


----------



## UltraDolphinRevolution (Aug 14, 2022)

RAHelllord said:


> Species are created over hundreds of thousands of years and thousands of generations. Polar and brown bears split off over 500.000 years ago, the first homo sapiens sapiens occurred about 160.000 to 90.000 years ago. We are a long way from having had enough generations to create a genetic drift large enough to justify a biological classification into different species or subspecies. Both of us are far closer related to both our first homo sapiens sapiens ancestors and any given living human than brown bears are to either polar bears or their common shared ancestor.
> 
> And no, the skin color, hair color, curly hair, and facial features are quite literally superficially cosmetic changes and incredibly minor blips in the human genome.
> 
> There's also the fact that we have millions of examples of humans of different ethnicities creating healthy children and exactly one example for polar and brown bears. If polar and brown bears would be more regularly able to produce fertile offspring it would mean the species classification for both would need to be reconsidered as it's a requirement for subspecies to have at least partially infertile male offspring and for species to have almost no or entirely no fertile offspring of any sex.


I was not aware that brown bears and polar bears are of a different species (I knew pandas are actually related to cats more so than bears thanks to the Chinese language). The link I shared claims brown bears mated a lot with polar bears in a region.
In any case, I was not talking about different species of humans. Though there are different definitions, races/subspecies are a level below species, i.e. reproduction is possible (or possible without difficulty).
Races do not need to evolve in isolation over hundreds of thousands of years.

Can you support your claim that races need to have partial infertile male offspring? I only heard of this in relation to the distinction between race and species. If you are correct, then e.g. dogs would not consist of various races because most of them produce offspring just fine.


----------



## Creamu (Aug 14, 2022)

Judge Bruce Reinhart was appointed by who? The Florida man who ordered the FBI to raid the Trump residence






'Donald Trump appointed Judge Bruce Reinhart to the position, and he began serving as a judge in 2018. He gave his blessing to the search of the former president’s property.

The Trump-owned Mar-a-Lago in Florida was searched by the FBI on Monday. The warrant they used was signed by Judge Bruce Reinhart. The judge has an extensive legal background in Florida because his career changed from representing Jeffrey Epstein to bringing charges against him.

[...]'

-theancestory

https://theancestory.com/judge-bruce-reinhar/

'[...]

But one local prosecutor described Reinhart — who has been a magistrate judge since 2018 — as “well respected” within the Palm Beach County legal community. Reinhart is married to Circuit Judge Carolyn Bell, a former federal prosecutor who was appointed to the bench by then-Gov. Rick Scott, a Republican who is now a senator.

“He’s a former prosecutor and a defense attorney and he’s also known for being meticulous,” said Palm Beach County State Attorney Dave Aronberg, a Democrat was who elected state attorney but who also once worked for Republican Attorney General Pam Bondi.

[...]

He worked as a federal prosecutor until Jan. 1, 2008, when a day later he became a defense attorney representing employees of Epstein, according to a 2018 story by the Miami Herald. According to the Herald, the employees included pilots for Epstein, his scheduler and a woman who had been described by some of Epstein’s victims as his sex slave. Epstein committed suicide in a Manhattan federal jail in 2019 while awaiting trial for sex trafficking.

[...]'

-Gary Fineout

https://www.politico.com/news/2022/08/09/judge-mar-a-lago-epstein-00050739


----------



## Dark_Ansem (Aug 14, 2022)

I find it genuinely hilarious and misleading that people who claim Trumpo would have simply handed the documents over are blissfully choosing to ignore the guy has been fighting the release of his tax returns for half a decade.


----------



## TraderPatTX (Aug 14, 2022)

JonhathonBaxster said:


> Again, it was not. There were no plans to overthrow the Government. It was just a couple hundred people who decided to riot. You know, destroy shit and cause a ruckus. The worse thing that happened was 1 person died and there was some property damage and theft. The leftist narrative that there was some coordinated coup d'etat run by Trump is just another lie. I'm also done talking about the January 6th shit. That's your whataboutism in every thread from your side. You look to distract with a minor issue like a single riot yet ignore tens of thousands of riots from your own side. So like the rest of the lefties I've put on ignore you're now on my ignore list. I don't need your sort of stupid in my life.


Actually, multiple people died. A woman was shot and another woman was beaten to death. Both killed by Capitol Police. Other people died of things like heart attacks when the police started throwing flash bangs out into the crowd.

Not a single police officer died that day.


----------



## TraderPatTX (Aug 14, 2022)

Creamu said:


> Judge Bruce Reinhart was appointed by who? The Florida man who ordered the FBI to raid the Trump residence
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Magistrate judges are not appointed by the president. They are appointed by a majority vote of the federal district judges of a particular district.


----------



## TraderPatTX (Aug 14, 2022)

The best part of all of this is the left's confusion about the president's declassification powers and the fact that the FBI was just at Mar-a-Lago back in June and looked at all of the documents there. They even suggested he put an additional lock to secure them. The FBI and DOJ got played last week and exposed for the Gestapo that they are.


----------



## Xzi (Aug 14, 2022)

TraderPatTX said:


> The best part of all of this is the left's confusion about the president's declassification powers


No confusion, you can't declassify documents after the fact, and even as president he didn't have the authority to unilaterally declassify these particular top secret documents.



TraderPatTX said:


> the fact that the FBI was just at Mar-a-Lago back in June and looked at all of the documents there.


Back in June Trump's lawyers claimed he had returned all the documents he stole.  Since they found more, that was obviously a lie.  FBI shouldn't have been treating him with kid gloves even back then, though.


----------



## TraderPatTX (Aug 14, 2022)

Xzi said:


> No confusion, you can't declassify documents after the fact, and even as president he didn't have the authority to unilaterally declassify these particular top secret documents.
> 
> 
> Back in June Trump's lawyers claimed he had returned all the documents he stole.  Since they found more, that was obviously a lie.  FBI shouldn't have been treating him with kid gloves even back then, though.


Nobody knows the contents of these documents because they are supposedly top secret, so how do you know he couldn't declassify them?

How could they find more if they looked in the exact same place as they did before?

Your narrative does not make sense.


----------



## Xzi (Aug 14, 2022)

TraderPatTX said:


> Nobody knows the contents of these documents because they are supposedly top secret, so how do you know he couldn't declassify them?


Because POTUS cannot unilaterally declassify any top secret documents, they have to require a lesser clearance than that.  Otherwise he would've been tweeting out national secrets nightly.



TraderPatTX said:


> How could they find more if they looked in the exact same place as they did before?


They didn't look previously.  Just accepted his attorneys' word that they had handed over all the documents.


----------



## RAHelllord (Aug 14, 2022)

UltraDolphinRevolution said:


> I was not aware that brown bears and polar bears are of a different species (I knew pandas are actually related to cats more so than bears thanks to the Chinese language). The link I shared claims brown bears mated a lot with polar bears in a region.
> In any case, I was not talking about different species of humans. Though there are different definitions, races/subspecies are a level below species, i.e. reproduction is possible (or possible without difficulty).
> Races do not need to evolve in isolation over hundreds of thousands of years.
> 
> Can you support your claim that races need to have partial infertile male offspring? I only heard of this in relation to the distinction between race and species. If you are correct, then e.g. dogs would not consist of various races because most of them produce offspring just fine.


I actually didn't read the article you linked because I thought it would talk about the one documented occurrence in a zoo. From what I can gather the hybrids they have studied in Alaska aren't "new", and apparently started happening at the tail end of the last ice age, which would at least be 30.000 years ago? It's a pity they didn't try to quantify when those hybrids started appearing but chances are the authors simply didn't have the tools (or funding) to figure that out. I'm not sure what would happen with further hybrids between polar and brown bears right this moment, as said we have one documented case from captivity, but apparently also one wild polar bear lady getting it on with at least 2 grizzly bears and producing off-spring. But I can't find any concrete evidence on whether her off-spring are fertile or not.

The term "race" or "breed" does not exist in a biological or taxonomical sense, the classification stops at subspecies, and that classification does require that offspring between subspecies (or subspecies and overarching species) are no longer guaranteed to produce fertile offspring [here]. All modern breeds of dogs are the same species, and there is no subspecies yet. All dogs belong to the species Canis Lupus Familiaris and the "breeds" are considered just individuals biologically and genetically speaking, every combination of parents will produce viable offspring. All possible iterations of the genetic code of the parents are compatible with each other and can be passed on without problem to the offspring.
The best fitting term in genetics would be phenotype (the set of observable characteristics or traits of an organism), though if you want to refer to people ethnic group would be better suited.

Even if the changes appear big, on the genome they are entirely superficial. You're no farther away genetically from an extended cousin than you are from a stranger on the other side of the planet. The changes are that insignificant despite outward appearances.


----------



## TraderPatTX (Aug 15, 2022)

Xzi said:


> Because POTUS cannot unilaterally declassify any top secret documents, they have to require a lesser clearance than that.  Otherwise he would've been tweeting out national secrets nightly.
> 
> 
> They didn't look previously.  Just accepted his attorneys' word that they had handed over all the documents.


The president can declassify anything he desires. 

They knew exactly what he had there. They even suggested he put an additional lock on it. 

Wherever you get your info from, you should quit watching/reading them. They are obviously lying to you.


----------



## UltraDolphinRevolution (Aug 15, 2022)

RAHelllord said:


> The term "race" or "breed" does not exist in a biological or taxonomical sense, the classification stops at subspecies, and that classification does require that offspring between subspecies (or subspecies and overarching species) are no longer guaranteed to produce fertile offspring [here].


You gave me a wikipedia link. Where in the wikipedia link does it say "subspecies are no longer guaranteed to produce fertile offspring"?
It says: "A common criterion for recognizing two distinct populations as subspecies rather than full species is the ability of them to interbreed even if some male offspring may be sterile."

I have no problem with calling human races "subspecies". Why do you?
Interracial do have lower fertility rates btw (https://www.brown.edu/academics/pop...have-lower-fertility-rates-average-qian-finds)
(even though I do not view it as a necessary criterion)


RAHelllord said:


> All modern breeds of dogs are the same species, and there is no subspecies yet.


And all humans are of the same species. Then call human races "breeds". I don´t mind.



RAHelllord said:


> though if you want to refer to people ethnic group would be better suited.


So there is a distinction after all. Just give me a name for the phenomena that East Asian women bear East Asian children and Australian Aborigines give borth to Aborigines. And if the latter have sexual intercourse with the former, the result is something in between. Give me a name.
We give names to thinks that


RAHelllord said:


> Even if the changes appear big, on the genome they are entirely superficial. You're no farther away genetically from an extended cousin than you are from a stranger on the other side of the planet. The changes are that insignificant despite outward appearances.


Nonsense. Unless the stranger on the other side of the planet has a shared ancestry. 

Regarding the actual topic: If Trump was hiding nuclear documents, the FBI would not have waited that long.


----------



## RAHelllord (Aug 15, 2022)

UltraDolphinRevolution said:


> You gave me a wikipedia link. Where in the wikipedia link does it say "subspecies are no longer guaranteed to produce fertile offspring"?
> It says: "A common criterion for recognizing two distinct populations as subspecies rather than full species is the ability of them to interbreed even if some male offspring may be sterile."
> 
> I have no problem with calling human races "subspecies". Why do you?
> ...


You're going to want to reread that article you linked, the fertility rate in that context is a polite way of saying of how many babies they produce and not whether their offspring are fertile. Humans have access to birth control and interracial couples are more likely to be stigmatized, thus abstain from having children to not have the child be subjected to said stigma.


> From the article:
> “As interracial unions may generate opposition and receive less social support from families and friends, it is likely that their fertility may be lower than same-race couples. Indeed, our research shows that fertility rates among interracial couples were significantly lower than among racially endogamous couples.”


Not a single word in the article talks about genetics or biology, it's an entirely social observation study.
You're going to have to go to the footnote on the sentence you correctly found on wikipedia to find out why it's a criteria, but the TL;DR is that a big enough genetic drift between the parents will cause offspring to be infertile, until eventually a large enough drift will prevent the sperm and egg from creating a zygote that can survive at all. This is a great marker for speciation as it's a fairly simple way to tell how far apart the genetic code is without actually having to spend money and time analyzing the genomes manually.


UltraDolphinRevolution said:


> And all humans are of the same species. Then call human races "breeds". I don´t mind.
> 
> So there is a distinction after all. Just give me a name for the phenomena that East Asian women bear East Asian children and Australian Aborigines give borth to Aborigines. And if the latter have sexual intercourse with the former, the result is something in between. Give me a name.
> We give names to thinks that


It's the same reason why every child looks like a hybrid of their parents, with the added baggage that certain traits were more useful in specific areas and thus are more common there. Those are still called phenotypes or ethnic groups, there is no specific scientific term for it.
Also, remember that breeds in animals were specifically selected and bred for traits, the genetic diversity of any ethnic group of people is far larger than of any given breed of animal, up to the point that some dog breeds are basically one or two directly related families only. Part of that is the reason why so many of those breeds have various health issues these days. Forced breeding like that has not happened with humans at large (ignoring incest in european nobility and similar) and thus it's not comparable directly.
The scientific taxonomical classification for all of those is just "individuals", there are only individuals in a species / subspecies as a further grained distinction is meaningless, and that goes for all species and not just humans.


UltraDolphinRevolution said:


> Nonsense. Unless the stranger on the other side of the planet has a shared ancestry.


You *have* shared ancestry with the dude on the other side of the planet! That's the entire point, and the split from their family line to yours is so recent that the changes are on a similar level. The amount of genetic drift that has happened since a few ten thousand years ago are cosmetic alone and entirely single, short changes somewhere on the genome. Those changes are so small that they're still fully compatible with each other and cause no detrimental effects for the offspring. In order for speciation to happen those changes need to accumulate in clusters on the alleles so that entire sections become distinct, as long as it's only small, individual changes in otherwise identical sections the changes aren't enough to create a large enough drift that it would cause problems to the resulting offspring.

For the actual topic of the thread, legaleagle made pretty good overview of the currently known details and how their legality stacks up from the perspective of the law, it's a pretty good watch:


----------



## Creamu (Aug 15, 2022)

'A former director of national intelligence said Aug. 12 that it is “virtually impossible” to prosecute people for mishandling classified documents, and asserted that former President Donald Trump has the “ultimately declassification authority” in terms of such documents.

“The president does have ultimate declassification authority. He can literally declassify—and President Trump had that authority, and could declassify anything you want while he was president,” John Ratcliffe, a Republican congressman before Trump appointed him to be director of national intelligence, said on Fox News.

According to documents unsealed earlier Friday, Trump’s Mar-a-Lago home was raided by FBI agents on Aug. 8 because of potential violations of several laws, including the Espionage Act, which some legal experts say relates to possessing classified defense information.

An inventory showed that agents seized what they listed as classified, secret, and top secret documents.

Ratcliffe said on Fox that before the search warrant materials were made public, he didn’t believe the raid was about classified materials.

“It has to be more than that because the Department of Justice and the FBI have already set a standard that makes it virtually impossible to prosecute a case like that,” he said, pointing to how former Secretary of State Hillary Clinton’s possession of classified documents was handled by the FBI, including then-Director James Comey.

“As people talk about Espionage Act and classified documents and all of that, the standard was set in 2016. Remember the Department of Justice and the FBI took the official position that Hillary Clinton, who was in possession of classified documents … that [being] in possession of that, that wasn’t enough, and that being grossly negligent and being careless, Jim Comey told us, that’s not enough under the Espionage Act. You have to know you’re violating the law,” Ratcliffe said.

“Even if you assume the worst case scenario for President Trump, that there were classified documents in his possession at Mar-a-Lago, that only puts him where Hillary Clinton was. And what the FBI and the Department of Justice would have to show is that he knew the documents were there and he didn’t think they were declassified,” he added.

Trump wrote on Truth Social that all the documents seized from Mar-a-Lago were declassified.

“He had a standing order that documents removed from the Oval Office and taken into the residence were deemed to be declassified,” a Trump spokesperson told Just the News. “The power to classify and declassify documents rests solely with the President of the United States. The idea that some paper-pushing bureaucrat, with classification authority delegated BY THE PRESIDENT, needs to approve of declassification is absurd.”

[...]'

-Zachary Stieber







https://www.theepochtimes.com/forme...tml?utm_source=partner&utm_campaign=ZeroHedge


----------



## Jayro (Aug 15, 2022)

We riot in the cities because we're tired of police murdering unarmed civilians in the streets.

Thye MAGAs stormed the capitol because their presidential candidate lost a fair election.

We are NOT the same. Please stop comparing the 2020 rioters to the Jan 6th insurrection. There's no correlation between the two, at ALL.


----------



## Jayro (Aug 15, 2022)

JonhathonBaxster said:


> There were a few hundred people out of hundreds of thousands who decided to riot. It wasn't planned and Trump wasn't some ringleader.


He literally riled them up at rallies and on Twitter, the fuck you talking about? Head in the sand, as usual.


----------



## Xzi (Aug 15, 2022)

TraderPatTX said:


> The president can declassify anything he desires.
> 
> They knew exactly what he had there. They even suggested he put an additional lock on it.
> 
> Wherever you get your info from, you should quit watching/reading them. They are obviously lying to you.


And you're getting this info from, where?  8Chan?  TruthSocial?  There's a good reason we have the Espionage Act, it's to protect the nation from traitorous scum like Trump.  There's almost nobody with a longer history of grifting, but you're willing to ignore that simply because he hates the same people you do.  Pathetic.


----------



## UltraDolphinRevolution (Aug 15, 2022)

RAHelllord said:


> You're going to want to reread that article you linked, the fertility rate in that context is a polite way of saying of how many babies they produce and not whether their offspring are fertile.


I agree. However, C-sections are more common among mixed-race couples and there are other risks as well (https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2867623/)
I still don´t agree that different races/subspecies need to have more trouble procreating, but there you go.


RAHelllord said:


> You *have* shared ancestry with the dude on the other side of the planet!


Man, if you don´t even know that your mother is closer related to you than your cousin, which in turn is closer related to than your second cousin and so on, I don´t even know what tell you.

I knew you would talk about breeds. Then let´s talk about wolfs. There are two species of wolfs and many subspecies/races. Wolfs and dogs are considered different species even though they split less than 15000 years ago:
_"However, 14,900 years ago the lines of dogs and wolves separated, although they shared common ancestors. From this separation, each species developed differently and the dog was eventually domesticated."_
(https://wolf-stuff.com/blogs/wolf-facts/wolf-subspecies)

If 15.000 years is enough to evolve different species, then tens of thousands of years of human evolution are enough to create subspecies/races (out-of-africa theory).


----------



## UltraDolphinRevolution (Aug 15, 2022)

Jayro said:


> We riot in the cities because we're tired of police murdering unarmed civilians in the streets.


St. George died with or due to COVID. He knew he was infected ("I have COIVD, man!") but did not wear a mask. He not only spread fake dollars but also a real virus (which was more deadly at the time: alpha variant). Chauvin heroicly ensured that St. George would breath towards the pavement, putting fewer people at risk.

I´m not joking. Chauvin should have gone with that explantation instead of saying nothing. What an idiot.

Anyway police is murdering only very few unarmed civilians. Less police means more murders, as we have found out in 2021. Are you tired of crimes in inner cities? Then you need more police and harsher punishment.


----------



## kevin corms (Aug 15, 2022)

Xzi said:


> That might add weight to his sentence, but it's likely they also go after him with the Espionage Act.  He didn't just mishandle classified info after all, the only reason for him to hang on to it would be to sell it.  Trump's lawyers are also in the shit, because they signed off on a statement saying he had returned all documents that he took months ago.


That’s quite a big leap of logic.  There are all kinds of reasons he might have classified information, maybe it makes him look bad, maybe it makes someone he doesn’t like look bad, maybe it’s about aliens, maybe it’s about jfk.


----------



## kevin corms (Aug 15, 2022)

Nothereed said:


> wasn't shocked.
> 
> Yes it is just Trump
> 
> ...


Biden fits your own description better, especially point 6. Fascists always brainwash large masses of followers into thinking they are the opposite. Trump is just an asshole, not a fascist. Fascists always come into power because people are too focused on getting rid of a leader they don’t like and end up with someone worse. Biden even had a ministry of truth setup, but quickly turned it back to a secretive operation. I suggest you stop reading a bunch of propaganda and actually look at what Biden has done all his career.

https://time.com/5936036/secret-2020-election-campaign/

Read this, pelosis biographer couldn’t help themselves.

I’m also sorry to say blm (the group) is a fraud that helps nobody. https://nypost.com/2022/02/06/black...a-lesson-about-causes-deemed-beyond-question/


“Antifa” are the opposite of their name, they are mostly spoiled white kids looking for any excuse to destroy anything. The looting and rioting they did shows this. Heck it’s 100% a fascist move to try and stop people from talking because of political beliefs, nobody but a fascist does this.


----------



## Xzi (Aug 15, 2022)

kevin corms said:


> That’s quite a big leap of logic. There are all kinds of reasons he might have classified information, maybe it makes him look bad, maybe it makes someone he doesn’t like look bad, maybe it’s about aliens, maybe it’s about jfk.


Nah, everything he's ever said and done makes him look bad, he has no shame, especially at this stage in his life.  He owes $34 million to Deutche Bank next year, and he has zero liquidity.  This was a desperate plan to make sure Putin gets paid, because we all know what he does to those who cross him.

Speaking of desperate, he hasn't even called off his rabid dogs from going after the FBI and others involved with executing the warrant.  For that matter, he's only made veiled threats.


----------



## kevin corms (Aug 15, 2022)

Xzi said:


> Nah, everything he's ever said and done makes him look bad, he has no shame, especially at this stage in his life.  He owes $34 million to Deutche Bank next year, and he has zero liquidity.  This was a desperate plan to make sure Putin gets paid, because we all know what he does to those who cross him.


Alright then… that makes perfect sense. The guy he told personally that he would bomb Moscow if Ukraine was touched is the guy trump wants paid.


----------



## Xzi (Aug 15, 2022)

kevin corms said:


> Alright alex jones?


Stay blind to the obvious if you want.  This has been Trump's MO his entire life.  Money's everything to him and he always ends up in the red.  That makes him easy to buy, easy to manipulate.


----------



## Tsukiru (Aug 15, 2022)

kevin corms said:


> Fascists always come into power because people are too focused on getting rid of a leader they don’t like and end up with someone worse.


I mean he did run on "Make America Great Again," to bring back to a nonexistent past that was "lost" directly following the Obama administration. Many talk about how he was "different" (at least in presentation) and how that resonated with White Americans.

Also not sure why you brought BLM (group). If you know enough to distinguish the movement from the group, you should know the group doesn't reflect the movement and people who actually care think about the group. Many of the donation pages and groups I've heard of just weren't theirs at all.


----------



## kevin corms (Aug 15, 2022)

Tsukiru said:


> I mean he did run on "Make America Great Again," to bring back to a nonexistent past that was "lost" directly following the Obama administration. Many talk about how he was "different" (at least in presentation) and how that resonated with White Americans.
> 
> Also not sure why you brought BLM (group). If you know enough to distinguish the movement from the group, you should know the group doesn't reflect the movement and people who actually care think about the group.


He brought back Reagan’s campaign slogan, likely because Reagan won in a landslide each election. Trump never said anything bad about black people that I know of, can’t say the same for Biden. Trump actually did get funding to black colleges, and he denounced white supremacy groups about 14 times until he started getting visibly upset when reporters who had already brought it up brought it up again. Chris literally asked him to denounce white supremacist groups in both the Clinton and Biden debate.

Heck when trump said good people on both sides, he immediately denounced the kkk and other groups but propagandists misled you. Here is the full transcript. https://www.politifact.com/article/2019/apr/26/context-trumps-very-fine-people-both-sides-remarks/

“*Trump*: "Those people -- all of those people – excuse me, I’ve condemned neo-Nazis. I’ve condemned many different groups. But not all of those people were neo-Nazis, believe me. Not all of those people were white supremacists by any stretch. Those people were also there because they wanted to protest the taking down of a statue of Robert E. Lee."


Why is the truth important? Well it could easily happen to someone else, like Bernie sanders or tulsi gabbard.


----------



## Tsukiru (Aug 15, 2022)

kevin corms said:


> He brought back Reagan’s campaign slogan, likely because Reagan won in a landslide each election.


I'm aware, doesn't change the execution though. And Reagan sucks.

The original post got longer but it's more of the same old. Donating to HBCUs isn't gonna erase the birtherism he definitely took part in. Or his talk of Mexicans or- Actually, what does this have to do with what I said? You don't know me so nor do I think I said anything to warrant a lecture about "propagandists." I just said he resonates a lot with White Americans. Which he does.


----------



## kevin corms (Aug 15, 2022)

Tsukiru said:


> I'm aware, doesn't change the execution though. And Reagan sucks.


Reagan ruined everything and appointed fauci. I know very well, must corrupt administration ever.  Regan gutted pretty much every regulation agency, and now fda and cdc is mostly controlled by big pharma and can’t do their own research like they should. Oh but now I’m right wing again for telling the truth…
It’s so frustrating the way people have been hoodwinked by both parties.


----------



## kevin corms (Aug 15, 2022)

Jayro said:


> He literally riled them up at rallies and on Twitter, the fuck you talking about? Head in the sand, as usual.


You mean he did what every politician does? He didn’t tell anyone to take over a building or anything like that, but Biden did tell people to harass judges at their homes.
https://thehill.com/opinion/judicia...late-the-law-by-protesting-at-justices-homes/

It’s weird how people can just make their own reality up.


----------



## Tsukiru (Aug 15, 2022)

kevin corms said:


> Reagan ruined everything and appointed fauci. I know very well, must corrupt administration ever.  Regan gutted pretty much every regulation agency, and now fda and cdc is mostly controlled by big pharma and can’t do their own research like they should. Oh but now I’m right wing again for telling the truth…
> It’s so frustrating the way people have been hoodwinked by both parties.


I'm not going to use party labels but I am going to call you weird for the direction you took this in. I don't know why you tumbled this into Fauci and big pharma to start complaining about just "telling the truth," rushing to complain about the two parties. More power to you... But I said nothing about your party affiliation. Nor is it related to what we've said. And also just sounds of self pity, oh woe is me being called right wing.


----------



## Purple_Shyguy (Aug 15, 2022)

Did they find anything he shouldn't have had? No.

So why don't they just apologize and move on? They obviously overstepped over some random unfound allegation.


----------



## sombrerosonic (Aug 15, 2022)

I hate Pol threads.


----------



## Tsukiru (Aug 15, 2022)

sombrerosonic said:


> I label every alt left and right with angry manchild, Both sides are kinda bad in my opinion, Right screams about lesbians kissing in a movie then riots when they lost a election, while the left screams about you not being woke enough then cancels you on twitter. Both sides are shit in my opinion, and will be untill both calms down, then ill chose.
> 
> We need to calm down, Shut the fuck up, and understand that were all have different opinions than the others.


That is... Still not what I'm talking about. Like the whole post is how much that's not related to what I said.


----------



## sombrerosonic (Aug 15, 2022)

Tsukiru said:


> That is... Still not what I'm talking about. Like the whole post is how much that's not related to what I said.


Ok, i understand, have a fine day


----------



## Tsukiru (Aug 15, 2022)

sombrerosonic said:


> Ok, i understand, have a fine day


You too, I like your Koishi in a Pringles can avatar.


----------



## RAHelllord (Aug 15, 2022)

UltraDolphinRevolution said:


> I agree. However, C-sections are more common among mixed-race couples and there are other risks as well (https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2867623/)
> I still don´t agree that different races/subspecies need to have more trouble procreating, but there you go.


Appears to be social factors most likely, probably poverty for a simple reason:


> Black/black couples had the highest level of risk (OR 2.11, CI 1.77-2.51), followed by black mother/white father couples (OR 2.01, CI 1.16-3.48), and white mother/black father couples (OR 1.84, CI 1.33-2.54).


Black/black has the highest rate of problems, when comparing white/white and black/white couples, meaning interracial procreation actually improves chances for the babies of black parents. And the only adequate answer for that is going to be a multitude of social factors like lower income, worse access to healthcare, etc.


UltraDolphinRevolution said:


> Man, if you don´t even know that your mother is closer related to you than your cousin, which in turn is closer related to than your second cousin and so on, I don´t even know what tell you.


You read the words but missed the point, the significance of the changes to the genome from you to a distant cousin are as significant to the changes a stranger on the other side of the planet has. All changes in the genome to a person of a completely different phenotype is minor changes of a few separate pieces only. Those changes are both in similar regions and of similar extend whether you're looking at a distant cousin or a stranger in Africa. Yes, the stranger has more changes on average than your distant cousin, but again the changes are still incredibly minor.

Want a fun anecdote? Either my great grandma or my great-great grandma had a black dude as lover and had a baby with him, my resulting grandma only has curly hair as visual indicator of that union, and in the generation of me and my siblings the only indicator of that tryst is hair that curls up in high humidity. Our part of the family tree is otherwise indistinguishable from the rest of the population and only a gene test can prove a negligible amount of deviation from your average German. If the changes were significant they wouldn't be almost completely gone and overridden again by less than a handful of generations.


UltraDolphinRevolution said:


> I knew you would talk about breeds. Then let´s talk about wolfs. There are two species of wolfs and many subspecies/races. Wolfs and dogs are considered different species even though they split less than 15000 years ago:
> _"However, 14,900 years ago the lines of dogs and wolves separated, although they shared common ancestors. From this separation, each species developed differently and the dog was eventually domesticated."_
> (https://wolf-stuff.com/blogs/wolf-facts/wolf-subspecies)
> 
> If 15.000 years is enough to evolve different species, then tens of thousands of years of human evolution are enough to create subspecies/races (out-of-africa theory).


Two things:

1: The important factor is generations total, humans can't produce generations as fast as wolves / dogs can. We can create new fruit fly species in the matter of years in laboratories due to their entire life-cycle being over in a week. For humans it takes roughly 20-30 years for an entirely new generation of people to be created, for dogs / wolves about one and a half years.

2: Dogs were bred on purpose to encourage certain traits and weren't allowed to breed freely, forcing an artificial selection pressure on the species that has never been on humans. This drastically increased the speed at which genetic drift happened for almost every generation of dogs. Any proto-dogs that were too aggressive or had other undesireable traits in their behavior got killed before they could have pups. This selection pressure and resulting accelerated genetic drift is part of the reason why breeding dogs with wolves is usually harder than breeding either within their own species.


----------



## KingVamp (Aug 15, 2022)

Now his passports.


----------



## Creamu (Aug 15, 2022)

Let's get back on track:
'Ratcliffe said on Fox that before the search warrant materials were made public, he didn’t believe the raid was about classified materials.


“It has to be more than that because the Department of Justice and the FBI have already set a standard that makes it virtually impossible to prosecute a case like that,” he said, pointing to how former Secretary of State Hillary Clinton’s possession of classified documents was handled by the FBI, including then-Director James Comey.


“As people talk about Espionage Act and classified documents and all of that, the standard was set in 2016. Remember the Department of Justice and the FBI took the official position that Hillary Clinton, who was in possession of classified documents … that [being] in possession of that, that wasn’t enough, and that being grossly negligent and being careless, Jim Comey told us, that’s not enough under the Espionage Act. You have to know you’re violating the law,” Ratcliffe said.


“Even if you assume the worst case scenario for President Trump, that there were classified documents in his possession at Mar-a-Lago, that only puts him where Hillary Clinton was. And what the FBI and the Department of Justice would have to show is that he knew the documents were there and he didn’t think they were declassified,” he added.


Trump wrote on Truth Social that all the documents seized from Mar-a-Lago were declassified.


“He had a standing order that documents removed from the Oval Office and taken into the residence were deemed to be declassified,” a Trump spokesperson told Just the News. “The power to classify and declassify documents rests solely with the President of the United States. The idea that some paper-pushing bureaucrat, with classification authority delegated BY THE PRESIDENT, needs to approve of declassification is absurd.”


Others weren’t sure.


“He can’t just wave a wand and say it’s declassified,” Richard Immerman, an assistant deputy director of national intelligence during the Obama administration, told NBC News. “There has to be a formal process. That’s the only way the system can work.”


“I’ve seen thousands of declassified documents,” he added. “They’re all marked ‘declassified’ with the date they were declassified.”'

https://www.theepochtimes.com/forme...tml?utm_source=partner&utm_campaign=ZeroHedge


----------



## lokomelo (Aug 15, 2022)

KingVamp said:


> Now his passports.


What's happened? It's a genuine question on mine, I did not get if it was seized when the search took place and people notice just now, or if it was seized just now.


----------



## KingVamp (Aug 15, 2022)

lokomelo said:


> What's happened? It's a genuine question on mine, I did not get if it was seized when the search took place and people notice just now, or if it was seized just now.


Idk Seems like the only information about it, is from Trump himself.


----------



## LainaGabranth (Aug 15, 2022)

Is UDR doing racial pseudo science _again_?


----------



## MadonnaProject (Aug 15, 2022)

I see this thread is going as you'd expect a thread regarding trump and american (idiots).

To be honest if this raid is the end of america it can't come soon enough.


----------



## osaka35 (Aug 15, 2022)

lokomelo said:


> What's happened? It's a genuine question on mine, I did not get if it was seized when the search took place and people notice just now, or if it was seized just now.


He tweeted or something about having 3 passports, one of which was expired. But there's personal passports and there's other types of passports, so it's not unusual to have more than one type of passport when you do/did national diplomatic stuff. It's a non-story part of the much more interesting story.


----------



## Creamu (Aug 15, 2022)

'The Department of Justice has opposed the release of the underlying FBI affidavit used to justify last week's raid on Mar-a-Lago because they claim "it would serve as a roadmap to the government’s ongoing investigation, providing specific details about its direction and likely course, in a manner that is highly likely to compromise future investigative steps," according to Politico's Kyle Cheney.

"The fact that this investigation implicates highly classified materials further underscores the need to protect the integrity of the investigation," the DOJ said in a Monday court filing.

Trump and other Republicans stepped up calls on Sunday for the release of the affidavit after a search warrant released last week indicated that Trump had 11 sets of classified documents at his home - which he told journalist John Solomon were declassified before they were taken out of the White House. The DOJ convinced a judge that they had probable cause to conduct the search due to potential violations of the Espionage Act - which have nothing to do with classification issues.

That said, the DOJ says it intends to unseal additional documents related to the raid.

What's more, the DOJ says the release of the FBI affidavit would "chill future cooperation" by witnesses.

[...]'

https://www.zerohedge.com/political/doj-opposes-release-underlying-affidavit-fbi-mar-lago-raid


----------



## Stayhye (Aug 15, 2022)

OP, your mind is lost and you should find it.   Please stop drinking the kool-aid.


----------



## Jayro (Aug 16, 2022)

kevin corms said:


> You mean he did what every politician does? He didn’t tell anyone to take over a building or anything like that, but Biden did tell people to harass judges at their homes.
> https://thehill.com/opinion/judicia...late-the-law-by-protesting-at-justices-homes/
> 
> It’s weird how people can just make their own reality up.


The judges made a shit decision that harms citizens, so that was fine.


----------



## Jayro (Aug 16, 2022)

UltraDolphinRevolution said:


> St. George died with or due to COVID. He knew he was infected ("I have COIVD, man!") but did not wear a mask. He not only spread fake dollars but also a real virus (which was more deadly at the time: alpha variant). Chauvin heroicly ensured that St. George would breath towards the pavement, putting fewer people at risk.
> 
> I´m not joking. Chauvin should have gone with that explantation instead of saying nothing. What an idiot.
> 
> Anyway police is murdering only very few unarmed civilians. Less police means more murders, as we have found out in 2021. Are you tired of crimes in inner cities? Then you need more police and harsher punishment.


Oh fuck right off with that 'heroic Chauvin' bullshit. Like, all the way off. That guy was the REAL thug of the story. I'm tired of thuggish cops killing innocent people and being the same bullies they were in high school. Hopefully Derek gets shanked in prison. Eye for an eye. Even Stevens. Whatever you wanna call it.


----------



## LainaGabranth (Aug 16, 2022)

Jayro said:


> Oh fuck right off with that 'heroic Chauvin' bullshit. Like, all the way off. That guy was the REAL thug of the story. I'm tired of thuggish cops killing innocent people and being the same bullies they were in high school. Hopefully Derek gets shanked in prison. Eye for an eye. Even Stevens. Whatever you wanna call it.


Every time UDR posts I'm getting increasingly convinced he's a racist who just wants to see black people suffer.


----------



## sombrerosonic (Aug 16, 2022)

LainaGabranth said:


> Every time UDR posts I'm getting increasingly convinced he's a racist who just wants to see black people suffer.


Whats UDR?


----------



## LainaGabranth (Aug 16, 2022)

sombrerosonic said:


> Whats UDR?


UltraDolphinRevolution. I've seen him arguing epistemic anti-realist positions like a biological essentialist equation of race with sociological factors, and now this cringe Chauvin nonsense.


----------



## sombrerosonic (Aug 16, 2022)

LainaGabranth said:


> UltraDolphinRevolution. I've seen him arguing epistemic anti-realist positions like a biological essentialist equation of race with sociological factors, and now this cringe Chauvin nonsense.


Hmmm, dont really care for his views at all. seems to radical 1950's rn. i just care to laugh at the post out of these threads. some are really funny.


----------



## LainaGabranth (Aug 16, 2022)

sombrerosonic said:


> Hmmm, dont really care for his views at all. seems to radical 1950's rn. i just care to laugh at the post out of these threads. some are really funny.


Same, I kinda just like flinging shit at people and seeing what happens.


----------



## RAHelllord (Aug 16, 2022)

UltraDolphinRevolution said:


> -snip-


I'm sorry your education is so laughably bad even the basics of genetics go above your head. Not only that but you linked two papers and were unable to understand either, too. Take your own advice little snowflake, the world would improve quickly.


----------



## Donnie-Burger (Aug 16, 2022)

They fell for Trumps trap.  They are some sort of stupid.  Raid Charade.  Purple Reign.


----------



## Jayro (Aug 16, 2022)

LainaGabranth said:


> UltraDolphinRevolution. I've seen him arguing epistemic anti-realist positions like a biological essentialist equation of race with sociological factors, and now this cringe Chauvin nonsense.


Yeah, he's one of the ones Costello should have banned that he mentioned in the stickied thread.


----------



## sombrerosonic (Aug 16, 2022)

Jayro said:


> Yeah, he's one of the ones Costello should have banned that he mentioned in the stickied thread.


Well, it least its best to have more than one opinion on one guy who i should ignore.


----------



## TraderPatTX (Aug 16, 2022)

Xzi said:


> And you're getting this info from, where?  8Chan?  TruthSocial?  There's a good reason we have the Espionage Act, it's to protect the nation from traitorous scum like Trump.  There's almost nobody with a longer history of grifting, but you're willing to ignore that simply because he hates the same people you do.  Pathetic.


The Espionage Act does not apply to presidents. Biden has this same authority right now. Obama, Bush and Clinton all had this same authority.

I would trust 8chan and TruthSocial more than the state-run corporate media you watch/read. There is a reason why trust in the media is at 11%. They are liars pushing narratives. It's too bad you are too blinded by TDS to see it.


----------



## LainaGabranth (Aug 16, 2022)

...You probably don't want to openly admit that you trust 8chan, a site who had one board dedicated to terrorism, another dedicated to stalking, and another dedicated to child pornography.

All in the top 5 most used boards, sooooooooooo.


----------



## KingVamp (Aug 16, 2022)

Funny, the ones that keep claiming to be above MSM, are the ones that bring them up the most. You don't need "state-run corporate media", to see how terrible and dangerous Trump is. People jumping to whatever right wing media that will tell them the most lies, wouldn't change that.

Not to mention, as if one of the biggest pushers of Qanon, 8chan, and Trump Social don't have their own narratives at all.


----------



## Creamu (Aug 16, 2022)

'The FBI Is Now The Federal Bureau Of Intimidation​*Nothing symbolizes the decline of the American republic better than the weaponization of justice that we saw last week when the FBI raided the home of former President Trump.*

And nothing better represents the divide that now exists between Democrats and Republicans than the fact that* some people still have faith in the FBI.*
Aren’t they paying attention? Heck, that's like a citizen of the old Soviet Union saying they had faith in the KGB – yeah, to crush dissent and lock up opponents of the regime in a Siberian gulag.

The evidence is overwhelming. The Federal Bureau of Investigation is now the Federal Bureau of Intimidation. Or more appropriately, the Federal Intimidation Bureau, whose acronym would spell out FIB, as in the Big Lie. Face it, nothing the FBI has said for the last six years since they joined with the Democratic Party to invent the Russia collusion hoax can be taken seriously.

[...]

You can start with the extraordinary 2016 press conference when FBI Director James Comey detailed crimes committed by presidential candidate Hillary Clinton related to her improper use of a private email account to store classified material. Moments after saying she had broken the law, Comey announced with a straight face that “no reasonable prosecutor” would ever bring a case against her. Yeah, because she was a Democrat!

A couple months later, Comey set up President Trump’s National Security adviser, Gen. Michael Flynn, by sending agents to interview him about his supposed contacts with Russians.

“What's our goal? Truth/Admission or to get him to lie, so we can prosecute him or get him fired?" wrote Bill Priestap in a memo before the interview. Priestap was counterintelligence director at the FBI, and it became evident later that the agency’s goal was indeed to get him fired – and more importantly to get Trump impeached, fired, humiliated, you name it.

Comey himself admitted that the FBI targeted Flynn and chose not to approach him through the White House legal counsel, but informally with a direct phone call to arrange an interview. As Comey later told a reporter, it was “something I probably wouldn't have done or maybe gotten away with in a more … organized administration.”
What about the FBI’s abuse of Carter Page and George Papadopoulos? The agency made up evidence in support of subpoenas, FISA warrants, whatever it took to get the desired result. What about the FBI and Department of Justice targeting parents at school boards as “domestic terrorists” because they demanded that their elected representatives actually represent them? What about the unilateral rescission of executive privilege and attorney-client privilege wherever it would have protected President Trump and his advisers?

The purpose of all of this activity, along with the raid at Mar-a-Lago, was to intimidate not just Trump, but also his supporters. Anyone other than Donald Trump would have given up long ago. Who could possibly withstand the power of the state marshaled against you for six long years – through multiple FBI investigations, through two impeachments, through relentless persecution of your children and your friends and family?

Finally, what about the double standard that allows Democrats and their government allies to go unpunished for a multitude of sins? Notwithstanding Attorney General Merrick Garland’s feigned indignation on behalf of the bureau, what about the FBI agents who lied repeatedly during the Trump-Russia investigation, sometimes under oath. Even more stunning has been the FBI’s monumental failure to investigate presidential son Hunter Biden, even though it received his laptop with extensive incriminating evidence of criminal activity in 2019.

Even when the laptop was made public during the 2020 presidential election, the FBI stood silent and thus gave tacit approval to the cynical Democratic Party talking point that the laptop was somehow a GOP dirty trick. It would be interesting to know if the FBI had anything to do with the letter signed by 51 national security experts, falsely claiming that the laptop was “Russian disinformation”! Maybe, like Comey before him, FBI Director Chris Wray thought he could “get away with it.”
That is certainly the only explanation for the raid on the president’s personal residence. It was not appropriate. It was not reasonable. It had no precedent. The FBI claims that the pre-dawn raid by more than 30 armed agents was for the purpose of collecting presidential papers that the National Archive wanted. The Washington Post says that Trump reportedly had documents with nuclear secrets on them, and the legacy media went ballistic with the story. But wait a minute, isn’t that the same Washington Post that won a Pulitzer Prize for collaborating with the FBI to invent the Russia collusion hoax?

Don’t believe a word from either the Washington Post or the FBI. Trump had been cooperating with the National Archive and had already turned over 15 boxes of documents, all of which he could have made a claim to legally possess. If they wanted papers turned over, they could have gone through Trump’s lawyers. No, they wanted the spectacle. They wanted the sizzle. They wanted the headlines.

This wasn’t about the rule of law; it was about the rule of the schoolyard. Bullies get what they want through force and intimidation, and there is no reason for any of us to believe that the raid had any purpose other than to intimidate Donald Trump into backing down from his plans to run for president in 2024.

Essentially what the FBI was saying is “We know where you live, and we aren’t afraid to come for you.” They even rifled through Melania Trump’s closet, as if she might have been hiding top-secret documents in her hat box. When do we find out they also spent an hour sorting through her lingerie?

[...]'

-Frank Miele

https://www.realclearpolitics.com/a...he_federal_bureau_of_intimidation_148044.html


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## Osakasan (Aug 16, 2022)

Creamu said:


> 'The FBI Is Now The Federal Bureau Of Intimidation​*Nothing symbolizes the decline of the American republic better than the weaponization of justice that we saw last week when the FBI raided the home of former President Trump.*
> 
> And nothing better represents the divide that now exists between Democrats and Republicans than the fact that* some people still have faith in the FBI.*
> Aren’t they paying attention? Heck, that's like a citizen of the old Soviet Union saying they had faith in the KGB – yeah, to crush dissent and lock up opponents of the regime in a Siberian gulag.
> ...


Jesus fucking Christ, calling you people deranged would be an understatement.


----------



## Xzi (Aug 16, 2022)

TraderPatTX said:


> The Espionage Act does not apply to presidents.


Good thing he's no longer president then, eh?  Not that the office should ever be used as a shield against criminal charges in the first place.



TraderPatTX said:


> I would trust 8chan and TruthSocial more than the state-run corporate media you watch/read.


I know you would, that's why there's no point in continuing to discuss this with you.  Trump could murder your mom and rape your dad and you'd still be willing to pretend he's the most innocent person to walk the Earth since Jesus.


----------



## UltraDolphinRevolution (Aug 16, 2022)

sombrerosonic said:


> -snip-


I wasn´t taking about you.

To sum up:
Xzi (who I respect despite our opposing views) claimed that racism and nationalism is the same. I then asked whether the racists lost the Chinese Civil War (i.e. those who founded RoC aka Taiwan; they were nationalists). Kevin corms claimed that there is only one human race (which makes no sense: if there are no subspecies, there is not one subspecies). On and on. Trump is not a racist. He is not even a nationalist even though he says so. He thinks America is a nation, which it is not. The US consist of many nations. It would take perhaps thousands of years of mixing to arrive at an American nation. More likely, the US will become what Brazil is today.
People who claim there are no races either want to fool gullible white gender studies females and white soy boys or are victim of said people. NOBODY else believes it.
Sure, races are a social construct, like chairs and tables. But if it is useful for human to give things and concepts names, they do so. I don´t need an expert to know what a woman is or whether there are different human races. In times of crisis or in prison, everyone is suddenly aware what sex and race is. (see Ukraine war, for instance)


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## Osakasan (Aug 16, 2022)

UltraDolphinRevolution said:


> Trump is not a racist


----------



## Xzi (Aug 16, 2022)

UltraDolphinRevolution said:


> Xzi (who I respect despite our opposing views) claimed that racism and nationalism is the same.


That's not what I said.  I said nationalism leads to racism and racism leads to nationalism without breaking oneself of those psychological pitfalls, because it's the same mindset of inherent superiority which leads to both.  They're not the same thing, but they are basically neighbors, and it's a helluva lot easier to walk to your neighbor's house than it is to walk twenty miles to the nearest therapist's office, metaphorically speaking.


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## Donnie-Burger (Aug 16, 2022)

When trump was around we had gas under $2 here in cali and now its almost $7

He even warned us about this if we voted for Biden

But its a conspiracy theory right LOL

How fucked up does america have to get before people open their eyes?  

Fucken zombies everywhere


----------



## Xzi (Aug 16, 2022)

Donnie-Burger said:


> When trump was around we had gas under $2 here in cali and now its almost $7
> 
> He even warned us about this if we voted for Biden
> 
> ...


Not a conspiracy theory, just idiocy on your part.  The president does not work double duty as CEO of Exxon Mobil, oil companies charge however much they feel like charging whenever they feel like charging it.  You should be pissed about that, but misdirecting your anger isn't gonna change it.


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## KingVamp (Aug 16, 2022)

Xzi said:


> Not a conspiracy theory, just idiocy on your part.  The president does not work double duty as CEO of Exxon Mobil, oil companies charge however much they feel like charging whenever they feel like charging it.  You should be pissed about that, but misdirecting your anger isn't gonna change it.


Not to mention, it is the Republicans that are blocking all bills trying to address it.


----------



## Donnie-Burger (Aug 16, 2022)

Xzi said:


> Not a conspiracy theory, just idiocy on your part.  The president does not work double duty as CEO of Exxon Mobil, oil companies charge however much they feel like charging whenever they feel like charging it.  You should be pissed about that, but misdirecting your anger isn't gonna change it.


So its coincidence this didn't happen when trump was president?  Shows how smart you ain't. 
"You want gas at $5 vote for biden" D.J.Trump 45" (During Election debates) So he knew before anyone and he aint part of exon mobile? Ignorant dumbass's some are.

Biden blames Russia.  Your dumbass types believe that shit.  Some are so brainwashed its pointless.  To easy to spot fakes like you.  Move along son as facts are facts.  America was so much better when Trump was in office!  You like sucking Bidens dick?  Dayum! Never suck dick for free.


----------



## Nothereed (Aug 16, 2022)

TraderPatTX said:


> The Espionage Act does not apply to presidents


NO ONE is above the law, mr law and order party.
Not even Former presidents.


----------



## Xzi (Aug 16, 2022)

Donnie-Burger said:


> So its coincidence this didn't happen when trump was president? Shows how smart you ain't.


Coincidence?  No.  Oil companies prefer Republicans in office because they own them wholesale.  Or did you not notice that we got fuck all out of twenty years in Afghanistan/Iraq except a few extra drops of black gold?  A sacrifice you were more than willing to make, I'm sure.



Donnie-Burger said:


> Biden blames Russia.


There are several factors that cause higher gas prices, and Russia removing their refineries from the global market is one of them.  I'm not sure why we're even having this discussion at this point though, you seem to be several talking points behind.  Gas is only $3.50 in my city now, the price has been falling for at least a month straight.


----------



## Tsukiru (Aug 16, 2022)

Donnie-Burger said:


> Your dumbass types believe that shit.  Some are so brainwashed its pointless.


Feel like you should only say this when anyone actually says it's Russia's fault. Which no one did. This is out of thin air. This was written before Xzi's post but even then, they say "one of". Which is something called nuance. 

As for coincidence, from my very limited perspective I think there was less demand for gas when Trump was around. And now with vaccines, and thus more travel, there is more demand (or more reason to use gas) the price rose stupidly. You could probably include how oil companies shape that, but I'm not gonna pretend I'm smart enough to know what's there. 

And also:


UltraDolphinRevolution said:


> Sure, races are a social construct, like chairs and tables.


You probably need an expert on what a social construct is and why people say it at the very least. Chairs and tables are nothing like race. You could be trying to pull "well society only decided what's a chair and what's not" but that's like a child's way of thinking and is nowhere close to how race impacts people. You say it's useful to give concepts names but the concept of race is not useful in the slightest. In fact, I would argue similar rhetoric has been used for very bad things!


----------



## Osakasan (Aug 16, 2022)

Donnie-Burger said:


> When trump was around we had gas under $2 here in cali and now its almost $7
> 
> He even warned us about this if we voted for Biden
> 
> ...


Things are exactly the same everyfuckingwhere. The west is struggling with gas prices and the likes, and you know what? It's the Trumpist right's fault.

Yes, in whatever country the right has been trained or it's following the GOP's way of doing things, bills to help alliviate the price hike of gas and electricity are being repelled. In my country we barely got them approved, and they're still following the GOP's book and opposing to everything.

So please kindly fuck off with that bullshit.


----------



## Tsukiru (Aug 16, 2022)

Creamu said:


> 'The FBI Is Now The Federal Bureau Of Intimidation​*Nothing symbolizes the decline of the American republic better than the weaponization of justice that we saw last week when the FBI raided the home of former President Trump.*
> 
> And nothing better represents the divide that now exists between Democrats and Republicans than the fact that* some people still have faith in the FBI.*
> Aren’t they paying attention? Heck, that's like a citizen of the old Soviet Union saying they had faith in the KGB – yeah, to crush dissent and lock up opponents of the regime in a Siberian gulag.
> ...


----------



## Creamu (Aug 16, 2022)

Tsukiru said:


>




tl;dr:

'[...] some people still have faith in the FBI. Aren’t they paying attention? Heck, that's like a citizen of the old Soviet Union saying they had faith in the KGB – yeah, to crush dissent and lock up opponents of the regime in a Siberian gulag.

The evidence is overwhelming. The Federal Bureau of Investigation is now the Federal Bureau of Intimidation.

[...]

Essentially what the FBI was saying [with the raid] is “We know where you live, and we aren’t afraid to come for you.” [...]'

-Frank Miele

https://www.realclearpolitics.com/a...he_federal_bureau_of_intimidation_148044.html


----------



## Xzi (Aug 16, 2022)

Creamu said:


> tl;dr:
> 
> '[...] some people still have faith in the FBI. Aren’t they paying attention? Heck, that's like a citizen of the old Soviet Union saying they had faith in the KGB – yeah, to crush dissent and lock up opponents of the regime in a Siberian gulag.
> 
> ...


The FBI has always been fucked, but not for the reasons Republicans are claiming it is.  Trump's been a goddamn criminal his entire life and should be treated as such.  If you want to get me on board with abolishing the FBI, all you have to do is bring up the fact that they assassinated MLK Jr.  And not for his part in the civil rights movement, but for his attempts to establish a working families party.


----------



## Creamu (Aug 16, 2022)

Xzi said:


> The FBI has always been fucked, but not for the reasons Republicans are claiming it is.  Trump's been a goddamn criminal his entire life and should be treated as such.  If you want to get me on board with abolishing the FBI, all you have to do is bring up the fact that they assassinated MLK Jr.  And not for his part in the civil rights movement, but for his attempts to establish a working families party.


I like seeing people agreeing or even coming together, even if they have completely different viewpoints.


----------



## Xzi (Aug 16, 2022)

Creamu said:


> I like seeing people agreeing or even coming together, even if they have completely different viewpoints.


We don't really agree though, as Republicans are just now getting angry at the FBI, and only for this one specific thing.  If we could erase their influence in hindsight, Trump likely never would've been elected in the first place, because Comey wouldn't have made a statement about the investigation into Hillary eleven days before the election.  Additionally, Kavanaugh never would've been confirmed to the Supreme Court if they had actually done their job.  It's largely been a right-wing organization since its creation, so it's one of those "careful what you wish for" type of deals.


----------



## osaka35 (Aug 16, 2022)

UltraDolphinRevolution said:


> I know. The relation is about 1-10 or 1-20. People had children much earlier (and still do in Afghanistan).
> Again:
> dogs vs wolfes - 15.000 years, two different species
> humans - 40.000-200.000 years not even enough for subspecies? nonsense
> ...


okay, you've got to knock it off with the anti-science nonsense. You're throwing words like "subspecies" around without seeming to realize these words have very strict definitions. I can go deep into detail, but instead i'll put it very very simply. We can look at genetic code directly. We can literally measure the amount of differences. We are aware of what differences actually matter (humans share around 40-60% of their genes with bananas, more or less).

And here is the result of this knowledge: skin colour does not accurately reflect genetics, only very recent ancestry. Why? Because humans have a lot of sex, they are not restricted by geography, and genetics are spread relatively quickly throughout nearby populations. This means even fairly tight-knit communities still share their genetics with the world and the world with them, more quickly than most people would guess (think genetic bucket-chain).

Dogs/wolves were selectively bred *by* humans, and their genetic code seems more maleable than others (we don't have nearly as much variety in cats, for example). Humans, on the other hand, are not selectively bred and genetic code is spread far and wide easily. There is no question in the scientific community. You should be pissed at whoever has been lying to you about this. I know I would be.


Okay, I'm making this one comment, and that's it. Knock it off with the talk about "races", because that term obviously doesn't mean what you think it's meaning. I'm not going to warn again.


----------



## Xzi (Aug 16, 2022)

osaka35 said:


> Dogs/wolves were selectively bred *by* humans, and their genetic code seems more maleable than others (we don't have nearly as much variety in cats, for example).


That's because cats domesticated themselves.  Or in a sense, they domesticated humans to do their bidding.


----------



## UltraDolphinRevolution (Aug 16, 2022)

Xzi said:


> We don't really agree though, as Republicans are just now getting angry at the FBI, and only for this one specific thing.


Actually, the right-wing (not the same as Republicans, I know) has been mad at he FBI for years. They infiltrate right-wing groups (or found them) in order to frame people. The plans to kidnap Michigan Gov. Whitmer was an FBI plot. The media hyped up the thread of right-wing extremists and that´s what sticks in the public´s mind. The FBI doesn´t do this with e.g. BLM.


----------



## Xzi (Aug 16, 2022)

UltraDolphinRevolution said:


> The media hyped up the thread of right-wing extremists and that´s what sticks in the public´s mind.


Doesn't help when the GOP declares "we are all domestic terrorists" at CPAC.



UltraDolphinRevolution said:


> The FBI doesn´t do this with e.g. BLM.


You're kidding right?  Plain clothes federal agents in windowless vans abducted a ton of BLM and Floyd protestors a couple summers ago.  Plenty of videos out there.


----------



## LainaGabranth (Aug 16, 2022)

Osakasan said:


>



GBATemp is filmed in front of a live audience


----------



## UltraDolphinRevolution (Aug 16, 2022)

osaka35 said:


> And here is the result of this knowledge: skin colour does not accurately reflect genetics, only very recent ancestry.


Strawman. I have not spoken of skin color. Races can have the same skin color while being very distinct, e.g. the Bushmen and Bantu.


osaka35 said:


> Why? Because humans have a lot of sex, they are not restricted by geography [...]


They are. By borders, mountains, rivers, oceans and deserts.



osaka35 said:


> Dogs/wolves were selectively bred *by* humans


Dogs are domesticated, wolves are not. That´s why I talked about wolve races/subspecies.


osaka35 said:


> Okay, I'm making this one comment, and that's it. Knock it off with the talk about "races", because that term obviously doesn't mean what you think it's meaning. I'm not going to warn again.


And that´s my last comment. If you delete it, I will leave this forum. Thanks.


----------



## LainaGabranth (Aug 16, 2022)

Xzi said:


> Doesn't help when the GOP declares "we are all domestic terrorists" at CPAC.
> 
> 
> You're kidding right?  Plain clothes federal agents in windowless vans abducted a ton of BLM and Floyd protestors a couple summers ago.  Plenty of videos out there.


Seconded, I literally went to a fucking BLM protest in my state and we could immediately spot feds as well as agitators.


----------



## LainaGabranth (Aug 16, 2022)

UltraDolphinRevolution said:


> And that´s my last comment. If you delete it, I will leave this forum. Thanks.


Oh no, the racist thinks anyone would value his "protest"


----------



## Creamu (Aug 16, 2022)

LainaGabranth said:


> Oh no, the racist thinks anyone would value his "protest"


I do. Please stay @UltraDolphinRevolution. And let's try to get back on topic. Thanks!


----------



## sombrerosonic (Aug 16, 2022)

Why is everyone on here offended? Well, besides @Creamu


----------



## Creamu (Aug 16, 2022)

sombrerosonic said:


> Why is everyone on here offended? Well, besides @Creamu


Because it is about arguements yes, but it also is very much about emotions, and these are polarizing issues and worth discussing.


----------



## sombrerosonic (Aug 16, 2022)

Creamu said:


> Because it is about arguements yes, but it also is very much about emotions, and these are polarizing issues, yet worth discussing.


I understand this but i think people need to calm down, the other side may be trolling? Its best to be calm about this.


----------



## Creamu (Aug 16, 2022)

sombrerosonic said:


> I understand this but i think people need to calm down, the other side may be trolling? Its best to be calm about this.


You are correct, but it is what it is.


----------



## Xzi (Aug 16, 2022)

sombrerosonic said:


> I understand this but i think people need to calm down, the other side may be trolling? Its best to be calm about this.


Who here isn't calm?  Even the conservatives here are pretty tame by that standard, otherwise they would've already tried to attack an FBI office somewhere.  Nothing to do but wait for more info and/or criminal charges to surface.


----------



## sombrerosonic (Aug 16, 2022)

Xzi said:


> Who here isn't calm?  Even the conservatives here are pretty tame by that standard, otherwise they would've already tried to attack an FBI office somewhere.  Nothing to do but wait for more info and/or criminal charges to surface.


But did they find anything? Thats my question.


----------



## LainaGabranth (Aug 16, 2022)

sombrerosonic said:


> But did they find anything? Thats my question.


https://www.nytimes.com/live/2022/08/12/us/trump-news
Yes. Like, objectively.


----------



## sombrerosonic (Aug 16, 2022)

LainaGabranth said:


> https://www.nytimes.com/live/2022/08/12/us/trump-news
> Yes. Like, objectively.


Ok, Thats what i was looking for, Thanks.

The only question is about the Hillary Clinton email server (Confidential files on there), Will it end up like that or not?


----------



## LainaGabranth (Aug 16, 2022)

I don't really care about Hillary right now, because she doesn't pose the kind of threat to the United States that Trump does.


----------



## sombrerosonic (Aug 16, 2022)

Ill just take that as a yes

Oh well, i hate these threads as much as the other guy, ima head out and troll some guy on the net


----------



## Creamu (Aug 16, 2022)

'[...]

“The RAID was Politics, the Midterm Elections, and 2024. It’s another form of Election CHEATING—That’s all the Radical Left Democrats know what to do. They use the FBI & DOJ to try and dirty up their opponents, but the people of our Country are wise to them like never before. Be careful what you wish for!” Trump wrote in a statement on his Truth Social platform on Aug. 13.

[...]

The FBI raid has significantly boosted voter enthusiasm. According to a survey released by the Convention of States Action and The Trafalgar Group, 83.3 percent of Republicans, 71.7 percent of Independents, and 55.2 percent of Democrats said the raid increased their motivation to vote in November.

Among Independent voters, the survey found that 53.9 percent said they believe “Trump’s political enemies” were behind the raid, with 35.3 percent believing it was the “impartial justice system,” and 10.8 percent saying they were not sure.

The poll was conducted for two days ending on Aug. 10 during which 1,095 respondents were polled.

[...]

“This is a political hit job, designed to stop President Trump from seeking the White House in 2024,” Rep. Clay Higgins (R-La.) wrote on Twitter on Aug. 9. “It will not stand. We are demanding immediate oversight hearings in Congress.”

“The FBI engaged in partisan politics by raiding President Trump to try and damage the America First movement ahead of the 2022 midterms and to try and harm President Trump’s chances of defeating their preferred Democrat candidate in 2024,” Rep. Mary Miller (R-Ill.) wrote on Twitter on Aug. 9.

[...]

The FBI has “a long and unrelenting history of being corrupt,” Trump wrote. “In the modern era, nothing has changed except that it has gotten far worse. … They spied on my campaign, pushed the FAKE Dossier, and illegally used the FISA [Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act] Court.”

“NOW THEY RAID MY HOME, ban my lawyers and, without any witnesses allowed, break the lock that they asked us to install on the storage area that we showed them early on, which held papers that they could have had months ago for the asking,” Trump added.

“The whole World was watching as the FBI rummaged through the house, including the former First Lady’s closets (and clothing!), alone and unchecked,” Trump continued. “They even demanded that the security cameras be turned off (we refused), but there was no way of knowing if what they took was legitimate, or was there a ‘plant?’ This was, after all, the FBI!”'

https://www.theepochtimes.com/trump-calls-fbi-raid-another-form-of-election-cheating_4663503.html?


----------



## LainaGabranth (Aug 16, 2022)

Yeah, the far right is going to be mad about this, because their Dear Leader is getting punished for doing stupid shit. Why is the party of "Law and Order" and "Blue Lives Matter" so tilted when the law works against them?


----------



## Creamu (Aug 16, 2022)

LainaGabranth said:


> Yeah, the far right is going to be mad about this, because their Dear Leader is getting punished for doing stupid shit. Why is the party of "Law and Order" and "Blue Lives Matter" so tilted when the law works against them?


The law; The FBI

choose one.


----------



## Xzi (Aug 16, 2022)

sombrerosonic said:


> Ok, Thats what i was looking for, Thanks.
> 
> The only question is about the Hillary Clinton email server (Confidential files on there), Will it end up like that or not?


No, because there was never any law enforcement movement on that.  Just months and months of partisan investigations that went nowhere and wasted a ton of taxpayer money.  And then Ivanka/Jared did the exact same thing as part of the Trump administration (had their own private e-mail server), and nobody batted an eye.  Other than a few people calling out the hypocrisy, anyway.

I'm no fan of hers, either, she's a neolib who can't run a strong campaign.  Just calling out stupidity wherever I see it.


----------



## LainaGabranth (Aug 16, 2022)

Creamu said:


> The law; The FBI
> 
> choose one.


I'm acab as much as the next girl but you have to acknowledge that when the law is broken, there needs to be repercussions.


----------



## TraderPatTX (Aug 16, 2022)

Xzi said:


> Good thing he's no longer president then, eh?  Not that the office should ever be used as a shield against criminal charges in the first place.
> 
> 
> I know you would, that's why there's no point in continuing to discuss this with you.  Trump could murder your mom and rape your dad and you'd still be willing to pretend he's the most innocent person to walk the Earth since Jesus.


Good thing he declassified everything while he was still president. The reason the Espionage Act cannot be used against any president is because they are the ultimate declass authority.

Considering both my parents have passed, my dad less than two months ago, shows what an absolute heartless clown you are. 

Every response from the leftists in this forum are getting more desperate by the day. Give me your worse. Your insults and bigotry only makes you look smaller and more insignificant.


----------



## TraderPatTX (Aug 16, 2022)

Nothereed said:


> NO ONE is above the law, mr law and order party.
> Not even Former presidents.


Supreme Court already ruled on this in 1987. It's not my opinion, it's already precedent.

Learn.to.research.

Also, he wasn't a former president when he declassed those documents.

I bet you can't explain why they took attorney-client privileged documents and his passports and what they have to do with supposed TS/SCI documents.


----------



## djpannda (Aug 16, 2022)

TS/SCI documents found near storage room near the pool. These are American secerts.
1.These are Documents that are not allowed to leave a special sensitive room.
2.Declassifiation is a process, (pending on the info needs to be verified by other depts (etc Army) Can't wave magic wand
3.Not able to declassify Nuclear or info related to espionage info.
4. IS not able to declassify after the person leaves office
5. Declassified documents are labeled (thru paperwork and an ACTUALLY sticker/stamp stating "declassified")

This is a Crime (Period).


----------



## TraderPatTX (Aug 16, 2022)

LainaGabranth said:


> I'm acab as much as the next girl but you have to acknowledge that when the law is broken, there needs to be repercussions.


You ain't ACAB. You are just pro-federal police and anti-local police. It's the whole fascist/communist centralization of power that makes all leftists panties wet.

The FBI could entrap people to kidnap a governor and you would cheer it on... oh wait, that really did happen and the left cheered it on.


----------



## osaka35 (Aug 16, 2022)

They asked trump for documents back, he didn't give them all back, so they got a court order to look for them. Was it illegal for trump to not return those documents? probably depends on the content of the documents and is above my pay-grade. but the FBI, at the very least, didn't act improperly or without merit. this wasn't some super cereal secret operation, it's been surprisingly transparent.



TraderPatTX said:


> Good thing he declassified everything while he was still president. The reason the Espionage Act cannot be used against any president is because they are the ultimate declass authority.
> 
> Considering both my parents have passed, my dad less than two months ago, shows what an absolute heartless clown you are.
> 
> Every response from the leftists in this forum are getting more desperate by the day. Give me your worse. Your insults and bigotry only makes you look smaller and more insignificant.


even a president can't just declassify nuclear related stuff. Presidential powers DO have limits. and you also have to still be president in order to use them, so it'll be important that only the things he declassified are/were in his possession. Who knows, maybe only declassified documents were in his possession. We'll see.


----------



## LainaGabranth (Aug 16, 2022)

TraderPatTX said:


> You ain't ACAB. You are just pro-federal police and anti-local police. It's the whole fascist/communist centralization of power that makes all leftists panties wet.
> 
> The FBI could entrap people to kidnap a governor and you would cheer it on... oh wait, that really did happen and the left cheered it on.


"Hah you would totally cheer this on! In fact, other people did it, so I know you did it!!"
Most intelligent Trader post


----------



## TraderPatTX (Aug 16, 2022)

LainaGabranth said:


> "Hah you would totally cheer this on! In fact, other people did it, so I know you did it!!"
> Most intelligent Trader post


I see you didn't even try to deny it.


----------



## Xzi (Aug 16, 2022)

TraderPatTX said:


> The reason the Espionage Act cannot be used against any president is because they are the ultimate declass authority.


The president is not king.  There are several security protocols that have to be cleared before declassifying certain documents/information, and if Trump had gone through those protocols, he wouldn't have lied about the documents that he was keeping at Mar-a-lago in the first place.  Logic.



TraderPatTX said:


> Considering both my parents have passed, my dad less than two months ago, shows what an absolute heartless clown you are.


Like I was just supposed to know that through internet telepathy or something.  I'm sorry for your loss, but that doesn't make your obsession with shielding Trump from the consequences of his own actions any less cult-like or pathetic.


----------



## LainaGabranth (Aug 16, 2022)

TraderPatTX said:


> I see you didn't even try to deny it.


I don't entertain nonsense. I laugh at it.


----------



## djpannda (Aug 16, 2022)

Xzi said:


> The president is not king.  There are several security protocols that have to be cleared before declassifying certain documents/information, and if Trump had gone through those protocols, he wouldn't have lied about the documents that he was keeping at Mar-a-lago in the first place.  Logic.


The weirdest part is NOW people are Crying its already been declassified....ok where is the Documentation of the Declassification. 

IF the Documents were already Declassified why was it not presented to the FBI in June when they went Thru the FIRST search ( again being the 2nd time they came looking for Docs, is really telling to the fact that these documents were not legal.

I mean the Whole point of Declassification is allowing the public to view the info.
Why hasn't the Proof of Declassification and the ACTUAL Documents been release.


----------



## Xzi (Aug 16, 2022)

djpannda said:


> The weirdest part is NOW people are Crying its already been declassified....ok where is the Documentation of the Declassification.
> 
> IF the Documents were already Declassified why was it not presented to the FBI in June when they went Thru the FIRST search ( again being the 2nd time they came looking for Docs, is really telling to the fact that these documents were not legal.
> 
> ...


Bingo.  There would be a paper trail if he had been given the go ahead to declassify the documents, and releasing it would have this whole thing over and done with inside a day.  He'd even have grounds to sue the FBI, and we all know how much Trump loves suing anybody and everybody.  In his old age he's never been that much of a forward-thinker, however, and I seriously doubt he would've been given the go ahead to declassify any of the top secret documents he took in the first place.  There's zero chance they pertain to bigfoot or aliens, and a very good chance that they pertain to US military secrets.


----------



## TraderPatTX (Aug 16, 2022)

Xzi said:


> The president is not king.  There are several security protocols that have to be cleared before declassifying certain documents/information, and if Trump had gone through those protocols, he wouldn't have lied about the documents that he was keeping at Mar-a-lago in the first place.  Logic.
> 
> 
> Like I was just supposed to know that through internet telepathy or something.  I'm sorry for your loss, but that doesn't make your obsession with shielding Trump from the consequences of his own actions any less cult-like or pathetic.


The Supreme Court disagrees with you.

General rule. Don't talk about people's parents. Even if they were alive, you would still look like a heartless clown. Try and control yourself and act like an adult instead of the petulant child you come across as.


----------



## LainaGabranth (Aug 16, 2022)

TraderPatTX said:


> The Supreme Court disagrees with you.
> 
> General rule. Don't talk about people's parents. Even if they were alive, you would still look like a heartless clown. Try and control yourself and act like an adult instead of the petulant child you come across as.


This would be a lot funnier if it wasn't just you going "REEEE DON'T MAKE MOM JOKES ABOUT MEEEEEEE"

What are you, 12???


----------



## TraderPatTX (Aug 16, 2022)

djpannda said:


> The weirdest part is NOW people are Crying its already been declassified....ok where is the Documentation of the Declassification.
> 
> IF the Documents were already Declassified why was it not presented to the FBI in June when they went Thru the FIRST search ( again being the 2nd time they came looking for Docs, is really telling to the fact that these documents were not legal.
> 
> ...


There is a huge difference between declassing documents and releasing them to the public.

The pertinent question that nobody asks is if these documents are so important to national security, then why did the FBI wait over 18 months to come get them?


----------



## djpannda (Aug 16, 2022)

TraderPatTX said:


> The Supreme Court disagrees with you.


I have seen you mention this several times?  Please provide this court case..  
because it sounds like if true it competely goes against the Constitution, as Taken Down Rouge Elected offices was Baked in with Impeachment.


----------



## TraderPatTX (Aug 16, 2022)

LainaGabranth said:


> This would be a lot funnier if it wasn't just you going "REEEE DON'T MAKE MOM JOKES ABOUT MEEEEEEE"
> 
> What are you, 12???


I don't have to make dead mom jokes to make a point, unlike every single leftist on this forum. But you continue doing what you do best.


----------



## TraderPatTX (Aug 16, 2022)

djpannda said:


> I have seen you mention this several times?  Please provide this court case..
> because it sounds like if true it competely goes against the Constitution, as Taken Down Rouge Elected offices was Baked in with Impeachment.


Is your internet broken or do you not know how to use it?


----------



## Xzi (Aug 16, 2022)

TraderPatTX said:


> The Supreme Court disagrees with you.


SCOTUS does not set security protocols for declassifying government documents, and especially not military documents.  No point in even referencing it if you aren't going to cite a relevant case.



TraderPatTX said:


> General rule. Don't talk about people's parents.


I was talking about your demented obsession with a corrupt amoral grifter, the bit about your parents was secondary at best to give an example/hypothetical.  Sadly I still don't feel I was too far off the mark, either.  When Trump said, "I could shoot someone on Fifth Avenue and not lose any support," you were surely nodding your head up and down at the TV.


----------



## LainaGabranth (Aug 16, 2022)

TraderPatTX said:


> I don't have to make dead mom jokes to make a point, unlike every single leftist on this forum. But you continue doing what you do best.


Making you mad? Gladly.


----------



## djpannda (Aug 16, 2022)

TraderPatTX said:


> There is a huge difference between declassing documents and releasing them to the public.
> 
> The pertinent question that nobody asks is if these documents are so important to national security, then why did the FBI wait over 18 months to come get them?



In May 2021 ( 3 months after the Previous admin left)  An official from NARA contacts Trump's team after realizing that several important documents weren't handed over before Trump left the White House

the NARA gave  common courtesy to allow the docs to be willingly provided  back..and after they were not able to they contacted DOJ 


Again if this was declassified, why was it not presented to the NARA in 2021, They had more than a whole year?   and better yet IF DECLASSified, it could of been scanned and copied and originals be forwarded back to NARA


----------



## Osakasan (Aug 16, 2022)

UltraDolphinRevolution said:


> Actually, the right-wing (not the same as Republicans, I know) has been mad at he FBI for years. They infiltrate right-wing groups (or found them) in order to frame people. The plans to kidnap Michigan Gov. Whitmer was an FBI plot. The media hyped up the thread of right-wing extremists and that´s what sticks in the public´s mind. The FBI doesn´t do this with e.g. BLM.


Because BLM isn't basically a mafia dedicated to enrich themselves and fuck over the world. If the right doesn't want the FBI to infiltrate them, they should try to be actually decent human beings for once.


----------



## djpannda (Aug 16, 2022)

TraderPatTX said:


> Is your internet broken or do you not know how to use it?


I want to understand your reasoning? but Guess you only want to respond with insults?


----------



## UltraDolphinRevolution (Aug 16, 2022)

Osakasan said:


> Because BLM isn't basically a mafia dedicated to enrich themselves and fuck over the world. If the right doesn't want the FBI to infiltrate them, they should try to be actually decent human beings for once.


BLM threatened people with violence, attacked people and property en masse. Its leaders received money from around the world. They bought mansions with that money to "cultivate hapiness". The mafia would be proud.

Something about declassified documents: Why does it matter where the documents are? Have printers and cameras not yet been invented in this timeline? Just because Trump gives them back, does not mean he doesn´t have a thousand copies somewhere else.


----------



## LainaGabranth (Aug 16, 2022)

UltraDolphinRevolution said:


> BLM threatened people with violence, attacked people and property en masse. Its leaders received money from around the world. They bought mansions with that money to "cultivate hapiness". The mafia would be proud.
> 
> Something about declassified documents: Why does it matter where the documents are? Have printers and cameras not yet been invented in this timeline? Just because Trump gives them back, does not mean he doesn´t have a thousand copies somewhere else.


https://acleddata.com/2020/09/03/de...violence-in-america-new-data-for-summer-2020/
Oh shit! I dropped my superior data, for my superior argument.


----------



## Xzi (Aug 16, 2022)

UltraDolphinRevolution said:


> Just because Trump gives them back, does not mean he doesn´t have a thousand copies somewhere else.


And you think the NSA wouldn't know about that?  For all we know he already attempted to sell the information, but that's the type of thing that would be revealed during a trial.

By all accounts, Trump is pretty much tech illiterate if you don't count Twitter, and he wasn't even very good at using that either.


----------



## LainaGabranth (Aug 16, 2022)

Xzi said:


> And you think the NSA wouldn't know about that?  For all we know he already attempted to sell the information, but that's the type of thing that would be revealed during a trial.


Let's not pretend like pseudo-science believers are all that good at observing reality. Maybe UDR just has some trouble with empiricism.


----------



## Nothereed (Aug 16, 2022)

Wow... So the DOJ is investigating it as a criminal case. I honestly did consider that it was more likely a retrial job.

The DOJ refused to unseal the affidavit  because it would threaten multiple witnesses (with an s)
and ongoing _criminal_ investigations.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/2022/08/15/trump-mar-a-lago-affidavit/

This heavily implies that this is one of the many other things the department of justice is dealing with.


----------



## TraderPatTX (Aug 16, 2022)

Xzi said:


> SCOTUS does not set security protocols for declassifying government documents, and especially not military documents.  No point in even referencing it if you aren't going to cite a relevant case.
> 
> 
> I was talking about your demented obsession with a corrupt amoral grifter, the bit about your parents was secondary at best to give an example/hypothetical.  Sadly I still don't feel I was too far off the mark, either.  When Trump said, "I could shoot someone on Fifth Avenue and not lose any support," you were surely nodding your head up and down at the TV.


So your argument is that SCOTUS decisions have little to no meaning now. That's a bold move Cotton...

How would you know I was nodding my head? Are you some kind of creeper peeper looking thru my windows or are you still just spouting nonsense?


----------



## Nothereed (Aug 16, 2022)

TraderPatTX said:


> So your argument is that SCOTUS decisions have little to no meaning now


What a ludicrous straw man of his argument, my lord.
Xzi:
"SOCTUS doesn't set those (specific) things"
You:" *SO THEY'RE NOT MEANINGFUL!????"*


----------



## TraderPatTX (Aug 16, 2022)

LainaGabranth said:


> Making you mad? Gladly.


The people making dead mom jokes and the people who endorse those jokes are the ones who are mad. I actually kinda feel sorry for you all on here. It literally takes 5 leftists to attack me every single day and none of you can even make a dent in my arguments. But do go ahead and fantasize about me being mad if that makes your fee-fees feel better.


----------



## Xzi (Aug 16, 2022)

TraderPatTX said:


> So your argument is that SCOTUS decisions have little to no meaning now. That's a bold move Cotton...


My argument is that you can't cite a single relevant SCOTUS case, or even tell me what the connection to SCOTUS is here.  Unitary executive theory is not law, it's masturbatory material for fascists.  This is a DoJ and FBI matter, and the REPUBLICAN director of the FBI would not have gone after Trump if the evidence wasn't 100% damning.



TraderPatTX said:


> How would you know I was nodding my head? Are you some kind of creeper peeper looking thru my windows or are you still just spouting nonsense?


So that's a yes.


----------



## TraderPatTX (Aug 16, 2022)

djpannda said:


> In May 2021 ( 3 months after the Previous admin left)  An official from NARA contacts Trump's team after realizing that several important documents weren't handed over before Trump left the White House
> 
> the NARA gave  common courtesy to allow the docs to be willingly provided  back..and after they were not able to they contacted DOJ
> 
> ...


Why haven't the 30 million documents that Obama stole ever been scanned? It's been 6 years. What is he hiding?

People are noticing the two-tiered justice system we have in this country. At least the smart ones are noticing. The partisans like people on this forum choose not to see.


----------



## TraderPatTX (Aug 16, 2022)

djpannda said:


> I want to understand your reasoning? but Guess you only want to respond with insults?


It was a serious question, not an insult. You will appreciate it more if you did your own research instead of relying on other people to just spoon feed it to you. I'm trying to do you a favor.


----------



## TraderPatTX (Aug 16, 2022)

Nothereed said:


> What a ludicrous straw man of his argument, my lord.
> Xzi:
> "SOCTUS doesn't set those (specific) things"
> You:" *SO THEY'RE NOT MEANINGFUL!????"*


It's cute when you defend your partner.


----------



## Nothereed (Aug 16, 2022)

TraderPatTX said:


> Obama stole


rofl
hey buddy
you wanna know a secret?


Nothereed said:


> Yes they did need to seize it, as trump did not comply with providing the documents he was supposed to provide that are the goverments own papers/property. *And also before someone makes a fool of themselves, the national archive association (the one agency responsible for handling these documents) said that Obama did comply with providing the documents back, and did not hold onto anything.*


Your a idiot and a fool. can't fix stupid.


----------



## LainaGabranth (Aug 16, 2022)

TraderPatTX said:


> The people making dead mom jokes and the people who endorse those jokes are the ones who are mad. I actually kinda feel sorry for you all on here. It literally takes 5 leftists to attack me every single day and none of you can even make a dent in my arguments. But do go ahead and fantasize about me being mad if that makes your fee-fees feel better.


"everyone who disagrees with me is mad"

lmao ok


----------



## LainaGabranth (Aug 16, 2022)

TraderPatTX said:


> Why haven't the 30 million documents that Obama stole ever been scanned? It's been 6 years. What is he hiding?
> 
> People are noticing the two-tiered justice system we have in this country. At least the smart ones are noticing. The partisans like people on this forum choose not to see.


"B-B-BUT OBAMNA!!"
cope


----------



## TraderPatTX (Aug 16, 2022)

Xzi said:


> My argument is that you can't cite a single relevant SCOTUS case, or even tell me what the connection to SCOTUS is here.  Unitary executive theory is not law, it's masturbatory material for fascists.  This is a DoJ and FBI matter, and the REPUBLICAN director of the FBI would not have gone after Trump if the evidence wasn't 100% damning.
> 
> 
> So that's a yes.


You forget that the FBI falsified evidence to get FISA warrants in 2016. The FBI also used the now debunked Alfa Bank hoax to open additional investigations.


----------



## TraderPatTX (Aug 16, 2022)

LainaGabranth said:


> "everyone who disagrees with me is mad"
> 
> lmao ok


You are the ones who are attacking me... mmmkay.


----------



## Xzi (Aug 16, 2022)

TraderPatTX said:


> Why haven't the 30 million documents that Obama stole ever been scanned? It's been 6 years. What is he hiding?


If you're going to resort to the losing strategy that is whataboutism, at least pick an event that actually happened.  Any fact checker will tell you this is false, even the GOP ones.



TraderPatTX said:


> People are noticing the two-tiered justice system we have in this country. At least the smart ones are noticing. The partisans like people on this forum choose not to see.


LMAO you're right, we do have a two-tiered justice system.  There's the rich, and then there's everybody else.  It's the reason Trump didn't get locked up decades ago.


----------



## TraderPatTX (Aug 16, 2022)

Nothereed said:


> rofl
> hey buddy
> you wanna know a secret?
> 
> Your a idiot and a fool. can't fix stupid.


Show where attorney-client privilege and passports are the government's property.


----------



## TraderPatTX (Aug 16, 2022)

Xzi said:


> If you're going to resort to the losing strategy that is whataboutism, at least pick an event that actually happened.  Any fact checker will tell you this is false, even the GOP ones.
> 
> 
> LMAO you're right, we do have a two-tiered justice system.  There's the rich, and then there's everybody else.  It's the reason Trump didn't get locked up decades ago.


It's not whataboutism if it is true. It's also true that Hillary had TS/SCI documents on her server. Comey admitted as much, but yet, there were no raids. Are you talking about the fact checkers who said the Alfa Bank hoax was real and the same fact checkers who claimed that Hunter Biden's laptop was Russian disinformation? Those fact checkers? 

Please stop, I'm gonna crack a rib from laughing so hard.

Your definition of a two-tiered justice system does not hold water by what we have been seeing over the last 6 years.


----------



## Xzi (Aug 16, 2022)

TraderPatTX said:


> It's not whataboutism if it is true.


It still is, and your claims still aren't true.  They're just sad and desperate.



TraderPatTX said:


> Your definition of a two-tiered justice system does not hold water by what we have been seeing over the last 6 years.


People are still in jail for a gram of weed in this country.  Trump created a fake university and a fake charity that both had to be shut down by the courts.  No jail time.  He's also a fucking pedophile, but we won't get into that because I can just hear your screeching already.


----------



## djpannda (Aug 16, 2022)

TraderPatTX said:


> It was a serious question, not an insult. You will appreciate it more if you did your own research instead of relying on other people to just spoon feed it to you. I'm trying to do you a favor.


but if you claiming the item as your reasoning, but are not providing details of that reasoning or even a source. People usually have "receipts" when they make Questionable statements. Now I will ask again for for your source of the "Supreme Court case of 1987"


----------



## Nothereed (Aug 16, 2022)

_Introducing the hit game where I simplify arguments until my head hurts!
I'm your game show host Nothered, and today we got joining us @TraderPatTX 

let's see folks if TraderPatTX can make a logical argument and avoid introducing copius amounts of cringe _


TraderPatTX said:


> Obama stole


_Here's a accusation made That Obama stole documents. Let's see what I  had to say folks._

(uses a statement I previously made)

*And also before someone makes a fool of themselves, the national archive association (the one agency responsible for handling these documents) said that Obama did comply with providing the documents back, and did not hold onto anything.*

_oh wow folks, that means Obama didn't steal! Let's see how our contestant Trader has to say. Will he smack that down with a source? perhaps a strong logical argument. It's *it's*_


TraderPatTX said:


> Show where attorney-client privilege and passports are the government's property.


_and uh.... well.. that's cringe. What the hell does attorney client privilege have to deal with disproving that Obama didn't steal?

Well we'll be taking a break as I have to clear up my second hand brain damage from reading such a stupid response_


----------



## TraderPatTX (Aug 16, 2022)

osaka35 said:


> They asked trump for documents back, he didn't give them all back, so they got a court order to look for them. Was it illegal for trump to not return those documents? probably depends on the content of the documents and is above my pay-grade. but the FBI, at the very least, didn't act improperly or without merit. this wasn't some super cereal secret operation, it's been surprisingly transparent.
> 
> 
> even a president can't declassify nuclear related stuff. Presidential powers DO have limits. and you also have to still be president in order to use them, so it'll be important that only the things he declassified are/were in his possession. Who knows, maybe only declassified documents were in his possession. We'll see.


They got a court order from a judge who defended Jeffery Epstein's employees. A judge who hates Trump as proven in past tweets. Totally not partisan and not a witch hunt.

A president is the ultimate declass authority. There is nobody above the president in declassing documents and Congress cannot limit that authority.


----------



## TraderPatTX (Aug 16, 2022)

Xzi said:


> It still is, and your claims still aren't true.  They're just sad and desperate.
> 
> 
> People are still in jail for a gram of weed in this country.  Trump created a fake university and a fake charity that both had to be shut down by the courts.  No jail time.  He's also a fucking pedophile, but we won't get into that because I can just hear your screeching already.


Now you are just throwing shit against the wall to see what sticks. It is an act of desperation on your part. I think I'm going to enjoy watching you sink into madness over the next few months more than anybody else here.

Garland has had people locked up for over a year with zero charges filed against them. Biden's wingman is doing a great job going after Biden's political enemies. Hermann Goring would be so proud.


----------



## djpannda (Aug 16, 2022)

TraderPatTX said:


> Why haven't the 30 million documents that Obama stole ever been scanned? It's been 6 years. What is he hiding?


Whataboutism ? really?
1. Obama never stole. as His Presidential library team FROM NARA  has the docs not him
2. Those docs were give AFTER... Key word. After NARA cleared Them  and provided a NARA TEAM for the Presidential library 
Fox News Host Refutes Trump Claim Obama Kept 33M Classified Documents​






EVEN ... But EVEN if that was True? what does that have to do with Crimes of the Previous admin? Are you claiming if one person gets aways with it, than we can never enforce a law again?


----------



## Xzi (Aug 16, 2022)

TraderPatTX said:


> It is an act of desperation on your part.


Ah the good ol' second grade "I know you are but what am I" card.



TraderPatTX said:


> I think I'm going to enjoy watching you sink into madness over the next few months more than anybody else here.


Lol you don't see me trying and failing to respond to twelve different people at once about this topic.  Loving all the tears and how on edge Trump and all his followers are right now, while I get to kick back in a hammock and just wait.



TraderPatTX said:


> Garland has had people locked up for over a year with zero charges filed against them.


That might be believable if it was coming from anybody but you.


----------



## djpannda (Aug 16, 2022)

TraderPatTX said:


> Garland has had people locked up for over a year with zero charges filed against them. Biden's wingman is doing a great job going after Biden's political enemies. Hermann Goring would be so proud.





Xzi said:


> That might be believable if it was coming from anybody but you.


I'll bite. Please provide list of Persons that are being held over a year with zero charges filed.


----------



## osaka35 (Aug 16, 2022)

TraderPatTX said:


> They got a court order from a judge who defended Jeffery Epstein's employees. A judge who hates Trump as proven in past tweets. Totally not partisan and not a witch hunt.
> 
> A president is the ultimate declass authority. There is nobody above the president in declassing documents and Congress cannot limit that authority.


here's an easy primer: https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment/know-classified-documents-trump-raid-220025590.html



> "Procedures for declassification of materials are complicated. However, the president has ultimate declassification authority and may declassify anything at any time, *subject to certain provisions of the Atomic Energy Act*...Mishandling classified information, especially if it is accidental, is usually handled as an administrative matter. However, more serious violations can incur criminal charges and penalties. Federal law (18 U.S. Code § 1924) states that anyone who 'knowingly removes such documents or materials without authority and with the intent to retain such documents or materials at an unauthorized location shall be fined under this title or imprisoned for not more than five years, or both.'" - _Jeffrey Fields_


emphasis mine.

Basically, *generally* a current president can declassify anything, *but only if proper procedures are followed*. And some topics are far more complex. Nuclear weapons fall under that category, and the procedure to declassify would depend on the KIND of nuclear weapon information being divulged. It does happen (Obama, for instance, declassified how many nuclear weapons the US has) but it's not like the president can pull a Michael Scott and just go to a reporter and say "here's this document that I DECLARE DE-CLASSIFIED". What's important is if the _declassification procedure_ took place and if they were declassified while in office. A president has to declassify *while they are still the sitting president*. They cannot declassify something out of office.

I don't know if anything will come of this, but it's not like any president can just do what they like with any and all top secret information.


----------



## Osakasan (Aug 16, 2022)

UltraDolphinRevolution said:


> BLM threatened people with violence, attacked people and property en masse. Its leaders received money from around the world. They bought mansions with that money to "cultivate hapiness". The mafia would be proud.


You're literally describing the trumpist cult

Word for word.


----------



## VeniaSilente (Aug 16, 2022)

Y'all people who still simp for Trump and the republicans in 202x make me laugh (from a distance) so much. Enjoy covid and polio!


----------



## LainaGabranth (Aug 16, 2022)

TraderPatTX said:


> You are the ones who are attacking me... mmmkay.


Yeah, why are you getting so pressed over banter? Surely the right winger can take a joke without getting offended, _riiiiiiight_?


----------



## Jayro (Aug 16, 2022)

TraderPatTX said:


> The Espionage Act does not apply to presidents. Biden has this same authority right now. Obama, Bush and Clinton all had this same authority.
> 
> I would trust 8chan and TruthSocial more than the state-run corporate media you watch/read. There is a reason why trust in the media is at 11%. They are liars pushing narratives. It's too bad you are too blinded by TDS to see it.


Truth Social is anything but. It's a cesspool of Trump-supporting liars. Trump lost, and you're in a cult. You're just to blind to see it. TDS isn't real.


----------



## TraderPatTX (Aug 16, 2022)

djpannda said:


> Whataboutism ? really?
> 1. Obama never stole. as His Presidential library team FROM NARA  has the docs not him
> 2. Those docs were give AFTER... Key word. After NARA cleared Them  and provided a NARA TEAM for the Presidential library
> Fox News Host Refutes Trump Claim Obama Kept 33M Classified Documents​
> ...


The matrix is officially broken. Leftists are quoting Faux News.

If one person gets away with it and another doesn't, that's called unequal application of the law and is against the Constitution that requires all laws to be applied equally. It's the two-tiered justice system that everybody seems to be against until their TDS hormones kick in, then it's not important anymore.



Xzi said:


> Ah the good ol' second grade "I know you are but what am I" card.
> 
> 
> Lol you don't see me trying and failing to respond to twelve different people at once about this topic.  Loving all the tears and how on edge Trump and all his followers are right now, while I get to kick back in a hammock and just wait.
> ...


I can't speak for anybody else, but I'm comfy af right now. I'm on the edge of my seat hoping that they indict and/or arrest Trump.

Whatever you, do not bother checking. You might actually learn something.



LainaGabranth said:


> Yeah, why are you getting so pressed over banter? Surely the right winger can take a joke without getting offended, _riiiiiiight_?


Joking about somebody's deceased parents is not joking. It's just mean girl crap at this point.



Jayro said:


> Truth Social is anything but. It's a cesspool of Trump-supporting liars. Trump lost, and you're in a cult. You're just to blind to see it. TDS isn't real.


Is that what you tell yourself as you fall asleep every night?


----------



## djpannda (Aug 16, 2022)

TraderPatTX said:


> The matrix is officially broken. Leftists are quoting Faux News.
> 
> If one person gets away with it and another doesn't, that's called unequal application of the law and is against the Constitution that requires all laws to be applied equally. It's the two-tiered justice system that everybody seems to be against until their TDS hormones kick in, then it's not important anymore.


Please provide quote of the Consitituion citing "unequal Application of the law"?
 By your logic, I can murder and assault people because at one point, somewhere a Guilty people never were charged ! lol Your fantasy don't create legal loopholes. You either Believing the Law applied to everyone or there is no law.


----------



## LainaGabranth (Aug 16, 2022)

TraderPatTX said:


> Joking about somebody's deceased parents is not joking. It's just mean girl crap at this point.


----------



## Xzi (Aug 16, 2022)

TraderPatTX said:


> I can't speak for anybody else, but I'm comfy af right now. I'm on the edge of my seat hoping that they indict and/or arrest Trump.


"Comfy af" and "edge of my seat" contradict each other, but okay.  Guess we're both looking forward to a whole lot of Republicans committing suicide by cop, not that their mostly-boomer voter base wasn't already dying off at a shockingly fast rate anyway.


----------



## LainaGabranth (Aug 16, 2022)

Not the right winger getting mad at a dirtbag leftist LMAOOO


----------



## TraderPatTX (Aug 16, 2022)

Xzi said:


> "Comfy af" and "edge of my seat" contradict each other, but okay.  Guess we're both looking forward to a whole lot of Republicans committing suicide by cop, not that their mostly-boomer voter base wasn't already dying off at a shockingly fast rate anyway.


Let me explain. I'm comfy af in knowing that no matter what happens to Trump, it will boomerang back on the Dems/RINO's. I'm on the edge of my seat in anticipation of Biden's Gestapo making their moves against him.

I've been hearing that Republicans are dying off for 30 years. Weird thing is, here in Florida, there are more registered Republicans than Democrats for the first time in state history. Republicans are winning races along the border in Texas. Republicans won state-wide elections in Virginia. And Trump endorsed candidates are beating the Dem supported RINO's all over the country. Hispanics are moving right in droves as we speak. And Gen Z are more conservative than Millennials.

The only group that Dems have not lost support with are the suburban wine moms.



LainaGabranth said:


> ...You probably don't want to openly admit that you trust 8chan, a site who had one board dedicated to terrorism, another dedicated to stalking, and another dedicated to child pornography.
> 
> All in the top 5 most used boards, sooooooooooo.


Twitter and Facebook have similar groups on their platforms and for some reason they can't get rid of them but will ban anybody for posting a frog meme.

I've actually never been on 8chan, but even that dumpster fire has more factual info on the legitimate boards than the state-run corporate media. The same state-run corporate media where men were caught exposing themselves on camera and had door lock buttons installed under their desks.


----------



## Xzi (Aug 16, 2022)

TraderPatTX said:


> I'm comfy af in knowing that no matter what happens to Trump, it will boomerang back on the Dems/RINO's.


So let's say he gets 5-10 years in prison, and is barred from running for office again.  How does that boomerang back, exactly?  Best the Republicans could do then is run DeSantis, and he's a fucking Florida man.  The ads for the opposition practically write themselves.



TraderPatTX said:


> Weird thing is, here in Florida, there are more registered Republicans than Democrats for the first time in state history.


Florida hasn't been remotely close to going blue since 2000, and Georgia flipping shows that Dems don't even need it any more.  It also makes so much sense that that's where you live, I would've guessed Texas because of the "TX" though.



TraderPatTX said:


> And Trump endorsed candidates are beating the Dem supported RINO's all over the country.


You've got that reversed.  Dems want looney Trump-backed candidates to win primaries so they can present themselves as the moderate option for Republicans who haven't gone completely off the deep end.  They've even funded ads in favor of those candidates.  It's not a strategy I love because it helps to push fascism as mainstream, but admittedly it does work most of the time.  And if Trump has a criminal record attached to him come midterms or 2024, it's even more of a slam dunk.



TraderPatTX said:


> And Gen Z are more conservative than Millennials.


Lol I'd love some of what you're smoking.  Polls show 75% of Gen Z are in favor of replacing capitalism with socialism, and only a slightly smaller percentage of Millennials are in favor of the same.


----------



## djpannda (Aug 16, 2022)

djpannda said:


> Please provide quote of the Consitituion citing "unequal Application of the law"?





djpannda said:


> . Now I will ask again for for your source of the "Supreme Court case of 1987"


Weird I have yet to Any of these answers but I’m sure it’s just because you’re gathering all the research…. rather than you you’re talking nonsense  and not being able to back it up

Oh and this doozy of a statement 


djpannda said:


> I'll bite. Please provide list of Persons that are being held over a year with zero charges filed.


----------



## sombrerosonic (Aug 16, 2022)

LainaGabranth said:


> I don't really care about Hillary right now, because she doesn't pose the kind of threat to the United States that Trump does.


Honestly i liked trump and obama, i didn't like biden.

I think trump was a ok president imo as well as obama. Biden dosen't it with me imo.

(Im not trying to piss you off, nor will i try to. I dont care ether way, so dont go ballistic.)


----------



## LainaGabranth (Aug 16, 2022)

sombrerosonic said:


> Honestly i liked trump and obama, i didn't like biden.
> 
> I think trump was a ok president imo as well as obama. Biden dosen't it with me imo.
> 
> (Im not trying to piss you off, nor will i try to. I dont care ether way, so dont go ballistic.)


The myth of the ballistic leftists who break down at the mention of Trump was a fabrication by insecure people on the right lol, no one cares which of the two theatrical pedophiles someone supports.


----------



## Xzi (Aug 16, 2022)

LainaGabranth said:


> The myth of the ballistic leftists who break down at the mention of Trump was a fabrication by insecure people on the right lol, no one cares which of the two theatrical pedophiles someone supports.


Will forever piss me off that Dems stole the nomination from Bernie at the eleventh hour by forcing all other candidates to drop out just before Super Tuesday.  We'll be lucky if Biden cleans up even half of the mess Trump left behind, centrist as he is.


----------



## sombrerosonic (Aug 16, 2022)

LainaGabranth said:


> The myth of the ballistic leftists who break down at the mention of Trump was a fabrication by insecure people on the right lol, no one cares which of the two theatrical pedophiles someone supports.


Honestly, Ive only seen shit by trump and joe.

I have freinds who are hard right as well hard left, i choose to stay neural no matter what. mainly cause i dont like pol, i like to laugh at them some times. Oh well.... ill stop annoying you all and you can get back to argument.

See you on the Video game threads.


----------



## TraderPatTX (Aug 16, 2022)

Xzi said:


> So let's say he gets 5-10 years in prison, and is barred from running for office again.  How does that boomerang back, exactly?  Best the Republicans could do then is run DeSantis, and he's a fucking Florida man.  The ads for the opposition practically write themselves.
> 
> 
> Florida hasn't been remotely close to going blue since 2000, and Georgia flipping shows that Dems don't even need it any more.  It also makes so much sense that that's where you live, I would've guessed Texas because of the "TX" though.
> ...


Trump getting convicted of anything is a leftist's wet dream that will never come true. And DeSantis will easily cruise to re-election here.

I did grow up in Texas so you weren't wrong.

I'm well aware that Dems are financially backing Trump's picks. We thank you in advance. You guys have been hyped up on hopium for so long and you keep getting disappointed, but this time is different!! After Russian collusion, two shampeachments, Ukraine phone call, Georgia phone call, Stormy Daniels, tax returns, etc, etc.. and you still hold out hope that this time it's gonna happen fo' realz.

Fascism, you keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.

Socialism will never take hold in the United States and you can quote me on that.


----------



## djpannda (Aug 16, 2022)

TraderPatTX said:


> Socialism will never take hold in the United States and you can quote me on that.


PUblic School, Libraries, Police Dept. Medicare, Social Security... hey look at me I just "quoted" you. 
Now are you going to answer my questions >


----------



## Xzi (Aug 16, 2022)

TraderPatTX said:


> Trump getting convicted of anything is a leftist's wet dream that will never come true.


You seem awfully sure of that for someone so desperate to defend his actions which led to the raid in the first place.



TraderPatTX said:


> And DeSantis will easily cruise to re-election here.


I'm talking about the presidential election.  He doesn't have Trump's baggage, but he also doesn't carry the same clout within the party.



TraderPatTX said:


> I'm well aware that Dems are financially backing Trump's picks. We thank you in advance.


Like I said, it's already proven to be a winning strategy for Dems, multiple times.  I'd much prefer if they just started pushing for more populist/socialist policies like their base wants and let Republicans die of centrist obscurity, but at the end of the day both parties are owned by corporations so you gotta take what little progress you can squeeze out of oligarchy.



TraderPatTX said:


> Socialism will never take hold in the United States and you can quote me on that.


It's already interwoven into almost every facet of our society.  The national highway system?  Socialist.  Public parks and libraries?  Socialist.  The New Deal and the five day work week?  Yep, socialist.  The shit that doesn't work like people being priced out of the market for basic necessities?  Capitalist.  Millennials and Gen Z recognize that a finite planet with finite resources is not compatible with an infinite growth model.  That should be obvious, but boomers are too lead poisoned to put two and two together.


----------



## TraderPatTX (Aug 16, 2022)

djpannda said:


> PUblic School, Libraries, Police Dept. Medicare, Social Security... hey look at me I just "quoted" you.
> Now are you going to answer my questions >


The government taking away all private property will never take hold in America. You don't even know what socialism is, so no, I will not be answering your questions until you learn basic facts.


----------



## LainaGabranth (Aug 16, 2022)

djpannda said:


> PUblic School, Libraries, Police Dept. Medicare, Social Security... hey look at me I just "quoted" you.
> Now are you going to answer my questions >


Don't forget unions! And weekends! Minimum wages!



TraderPatTX said:


> The government taking away all private property will never take hold in America. You don't even know what socialism is, so no, I will not be answering your questions until you learn basic facts.


Socialism and private property can co-exist. Decomodification of housing is a *communist* system, not a *socialist* one, dingus.


----------



## TraderPatTX (Aug 16, 2022)

Xzi said:


> You seem awfully sure of that for someone so desperate to defend his actions which led to the raid in the first place.
> 
> 
> I'm talking about the presidential election.  He doesn't have Trump's baggage, but he also doesn't carry the same clout within the party.
> ...


I'm sure because every other attack on Trump has failed in epic fashion. This will be no different.

Please force the Dems to run on real socialist policies. I would love to see that. AOC can be your spokesperson.

Let me know when government takes away all private property. It's like the left doesn't even know what they are advocating for. Next you are gonna tell me that Denmark and the other Scandinavian countries are socialist.



LainaGabranth said:


> Socialism and private property can co-exist. Decomodification of housing is a *communist* system, not a *socialist* one, dingus.


Once again for the smooth brained... socialism is an economic model used by totalitarian communist and fascist dictatorships. Why is this so hard for you to understand?


----------



## djpannda (Aug 16, 2022)

TraderPatTX said:


> The government taking away all private property will never take hold in America. You don't even know what socialism is, so no, I will not be answering your questions until you learn basic facts.


wait ?.... wait ...wait :::Hold back laughter:::: wtf you talking about..Lolol I don't think you know what Socialism .. as everyone just provided you with example of Socialism in the USA for over 100years.
Sounds like you were just told "Socialism bad" without an actual explanation and now you just Parroting talking points.

Ramblings with key Terms " OBAMA SOCIALISM, CHINA, LAPTOP, Hillary" does not carry weight in a Court of Law.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_programs_in_the_United_States


----------



## LainaGabranth (Aug 16, 2022)

TraderPatTX said:


> Once again for the smooth brained... socialism is an *economic model* used by totalitarian communist and fascist dictatorships. Why is this so hard for you to understand?


wicked self own


----------



## Creamu (Aug 16, 2022)

TraderPatTX said:


> Once again for the smooth brained... socialism is an economic model used by totalitarian communist and fascist dictatorships. Why is this so hard for you to understand?


There is certainly socialism with private property. If your type of socialism is for example run by international actors who want to exploit your people, they will be tempted to abolish private property. This does not mean that this is a inherent attribute of socialism.


----------



## Xzi (Aug 16, 2022)

TraderPatTX said:


> I'm sure because every other attack on Trump has failed in epic fashion. This will be no different.


He doesn't have the office to shield him any more.  That's why he's so worried about it this time.



TraderPatTX said:


> Please force the Dems to run on real socialist policies. I would love to see that. AOC can be your spokesperson.


Don't worry, they won't.  They'll stay centrist and keep letting Republicans out-crazy themselves with candidates like Greene and Boebert.  Easy victories, even if they do very little with their positions once elected.



TraderPatTX said:


> Let me know when government takes away all private property.


That would be full on communism, not socialism.



TraderPatTX said:


> Next you are gonna tell me that Denmark and the other Scandinavian countries are socialist.


There's a big difference between adopting socialism as an economic system and adopting socialist policies within any given framework.  These countries have more socialist policies than the US, but they do not have socialist economies.  Regardless, the former is enough to give them much happier citizens overall.


----------



## LainaGabranth (Aug 16, 2022)

Dude even Creamu knows the difference between decomodification of housing and socialism as a policy, and he think routers can fuck with your brain. Come on now.


----------



## TraderPatTX (Aug 16, 2022)

djpannda said:


> wait ?.... wait ...wait :::Hold back laughter:::: wtf you talking about..Lolol I don't think you know what Socialism .. as everyone just provided you with example of Socialism in the USA for over 100years.
> Sounds like you were just told "Socialism bad" without an actual explanation and now you just Parroting talking points.
> 
> Ramblings with key Terms " OBAMA SOCIALISM, CHINA, LAPTOP, Hillary" does not carry weight in a Court of Law.
> ...


Social programs are not socialism. Ask any Scandinavian country.


----------



## djpannda (Aug 16, 2022)

LainaGabranth said:


> Dude even Creamu knows the difference between decomodification of housing and socialism as a policy, and he think routers can fuck with your brain. Come on now.


Im in Tears... When evenCreamu is like "Whoa slow down there Cowboy" lol


----------



## LainaGabranth (Aug 16, 2022)

TraderPatTX said:


> Socialist programs are not socialism. Ask any Scandinavian country.


HAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAH


----------



## Creamu (Aug 16, 2022)

'The FBI has “a long and unrelenting history of being corrupt,” Trump wrote. “In the modern era, nothing has changed except that it has gotten far worse. … They spied on my campaign, pushed the FAKE Dossier, and illegally used the FISA [Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act] Court.”

“NOW THEY RAID MY HOME, ban my lawyers and, without any witnesses allowed, break the lock that they asked us to install on the storage area that we showed them early on, which held papers that they could have had months ago for the asking,” Trump added.

“The whole World was watching as the FBI rummaged through the house, including the former First Lady’s closets (and clothing!), alone and unchecked,” Trump continued. “They even demanded that the security cameras be turned off (we refused), but there was no way of knowing if what they took was legitimate, or was there a ‘plant?’ This was, after all, the FBI!”'

https://www.theepochtimes.com/trump-calls-fbi-raid-another-form-of-election-cheating_4663503.html


----------



## LainaGabranth (Aug 16, 2022)

If he didn't want the FBI raiding him for stealing secret documents he shouldn't have signed into law the power for the FBI to raid him for stealing secret documents.

Almost like all that posturing about Hillary bit him in the ass!


----------



## djpannda (Aug 16, 2022)

TraderPatTX said:


> Social programs are not socialism. Ask any Scandinavian country.


The US economy is a capitalist democracy with elements of socialism. Some people prefer to call it a mixed economic system.. Why is it always the "patriots" who don't understand basic American history on Government or Economy..?


----------



## LainaGabranth (Aug 16, 2022)

djpannda said:


> The US economy is a capitalist democracy with elements of socialism. Some people prefer to call it a mixed economic system.. Why is it always the "patriots" who don't understand basic American history on Government or Economy..?


I mean patriots objectively have to be historically ignorant or in denial to love a country riddled with racism and exploitation.


----------



## TraderPatTX (Aug 16, 2022)

Xzi said:


> He doesn't have the office to shield him any more.  That's why he's so worried about it this time.
> 
> 
> Don't worry, they won't.  They'll stay centrist and keep letting Republicans out-crazy themselves with candidates like Greene and Boebert.  Easy victories, even if they do very little with their positions once elected.
> ...


Keep the hopium alive, my brotha.


----------



## TraderPatTX (Aug 16, 2022)

djpannda said:


> The US economy is a capitalist democracy with elements of socialism. Some people prefer to call it a mixed economic system.. Why is it always the "patriots" who don't understand basic American history on Government or Economy..?


In other words, it's crony capitalism.


----------



## LainaGabranth (Aug 16, 2022)

TraderPatTX said:


> In other words, it's crony capitalism.


Crony capitalism isn't a thing, because no one who believes in it can point to a system without it. It's just a meaningless buzzword used in place of acknowledging inherent inequalities in the US that are the result of capitalism explicitly.


----------



## TraderPatTX (Aug 16, 2022)

LainaGabranth said:


> HAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAH






Looks like you tried to pull a Kevin Clinesmith there. I see you.


----------



## LainaGabranth (Aug 16, 2022)

I plead the 18th.


----------



## Xzi (Aug 16, 2022)

TraderPatTX said:


> Keep the hopium alive, my brotha.


The ball's already rolling.  Garland wouldn't signed off on the warrant and shattered his non-partisan veneer for documents pertaining to the White House's plumbing.  Nor would Wray cross the guy who appointed him for nothing.


----------



## TraderPatTX (Aug 16, 2022)

LainaGabranth said:


> Crony capitalism isn't a thing, because no one who believes in it can point to a system without it. It's just a meaningless buzzword used in place of acknowledging inherent inequalities in the US that are the result of capitalism explicitly.


Probably because every country has central banks that are ruled by a few, but you ain't ready for that conversation yet.


----------



## LainaGabranth (Aug 16, 2022)

TraderPatTX said:


> Probably because every country has central banks that are ruled by a few, but you ain't ready for that conversation yet.


You still believe in currency as a concept. There is no conversation with me on economics that you will ever be ready for until you free yourself of the money delusion.


----------



## TraderPatTX (Aug 16, 2022)

Xzi said:


> The ball's already rolling.  Garland wouldn't signed off on the warrant and shattered his non-partisan veneer for documents pertaining to the White House's plumbing.  Nor would Wray cross the guy who appointed him for nothing.


Really? The FBI has already been caught falsifying data for FISA warrants. They just happened to present this warrant to the Federal Magistrate who defended Jeffrey Epstein's employees as an attorney. The corruption is staring you in the face and you refuse to look at it.

That's alright, seeing you react on here when it all plays out will be worth it.


----------



## TraderPatTX (Aug 16, 2022)

LainaGabranth said:


> You still believe in currency as a concept. There is no conversation with me on economics that you will ever be ready for until you free yourself of the money delusion.


If you are talking about fiat currency, then we are probably in agreement.


----------



## LainaGabranth (Aug 16, 2022)

TraderPatTX said:


> If you are talking about fiat currency, then we are probably in agreement.


Oh no, I don't believe in currency conceptually. Things like the gold standard were disastrous for economics, fiat for all its flaws is superior, but I still loathe them both.


----------



## Xzi (Aug 16, 2022)

TraderPatTX said:


> Really? The FBI has already been caught falsifying data for FISA warrants.


For this warrant specifically?  Didn't think so.  Not even Trump has made that claim AFAIK.  Just another desperate stroll into your fantasy land.



TraderPatTX said:


> They just happened to present this warrant to the Federal Magistrate who defended Jeffrey Epstein's employees as an attorney.


Okay?  And Trump had Epstein killed in a prison that was being overseen by William Barr.  Has nothing to do with the topic at hand, and it doesn't invalidate the warrant or any forthcoming charges.


----------



## TraderPatTX (Aug 16, 2022)

LainaGabranth said:


> Oh no, I don't believe in currency conceptually. Things like the gold standard were disastrous for economics, fiat for all its flaws is superior, but I still loathe them both.


Gold has been used since the beginning of human civilization. Fiat currency does nothing but decimate savings and make poor people even poorer. Only central bankers prefer fiat currency.


----------



## TraderPatTX (Aug 16, 2022)

Xzi said:


> For this warrant specifically?  Didn't think so.  Not even Trump has made that claim AFAIK.  Just another desperate stroll into your fantasy land.
> 
> 
> Okay?  And Trump had Epstein killed in a prison that was being overseen by William Barr.  Has nothing to do with the topic at hand, and it doesn't invalidate the warrant or any forthcoming charges.


Do you even know who Kevin Clinesmith is or do I have to take you on a stroll down memory lane?

You got any sauce for that claim that Trump had Epstein killed because that's a pretty bold statement, especially since Ghislane Maxwell is still alive. We still don't know who her clients are. One would think if Trump was one them, it would have been "leaked" to the "press" by now.


----------



## LainaGabranth (Aug 16, 2022)

Ah yes, the famous central banker who hates currency as a concept and wants to abolish private property. Those goofy bankers, always hating private property.


----------



## TraderPatTX (Aug 16, 2022)

LainaGabranth said:


> Ah yes, the famous central banker who hates currency as a concept and wants to abolish private property. Those goofy bankers, always hating private property.


They like their own private property, they just don't like other people having private property. It's the ultimate hypocrisy of communists and leftists in general.


----------



## djpannda (Aug 16, 2022)

This is Amazing.. Trump has just admitted to Breaking the law to stop an Investigation


----------



## Xzi (Aug 16, 2022)

TraderPatTX said:


> Do you even know who Kevin Clinesmith is or do I have to take you on a stroll down memory lane?


I wouldn't know him from Adam, nor does it make any fucking difference.  If/when charges are brought against Trump, they'll come from the DoJ.  Whine about the moderate centrist Garland all you want, the evidence will speak for itself during trial.



TraderPatTX said:


> You got any sauce for that claim that Trump had Epstein killed because that's a pretty bold statement, especially since Ghislane Maxwell is still alive.


It's just one of those connect the dots type of deals.  The circumstances surrounding Epstein's murder were extremely suspicious, and the only people with the access to make both the security guards and cameras disappear for the night would've been Trump and Barr.  Maxwell is a lower-level crony, plus she never had to be in a prison overseen by Barr.



TraderPatTX said:


> One would think if Trump was one them, it would have been "leaked" to the "press" by now.


Oh we already know that Trump was in Epstein's black book, along with a lot of other rich and politically connected folk.


----------



## Purple_Shyguy (Aug 16, 2022)

djpannda said:


> This is Amazing.. Trump has just admitted to Breaking the law to stop an Investigation



Totally legit "sources" like the "source" that alleged he had nuclear documents in his house, right?


----------



## KingVamp (Aug 16, 2022)

Social Democracy is probably what most people here mean, when they think of socialism.


----------



## LainaGabranth (Aug 16, 2022)

TraderPatTX said:


> They like their own private property, they just don't like other people having private property. It's the ultimate hypocrisy of communists and leftists in general.


Are these leftists in the room with us now?


----------



## TraderPatTX (Aug 16, 2022)

Xzi said:


> I wouldn't know him from Adam, nor does it make any fucking difference.  If/when charges are brought against Trump, they'll come from the DoJ.  Whine about the moderate centrist Garland all you want, the evidence will speak for itself during trial.
> 
> 
> It's just one of those connect the dots type of deals.  The circumstances surrounding Epstein's murder were extremely suspicious, and the only people with the access to both make the security guards and cameras disappear for the night would've been Trump and Barr.  Maxwell is a lower-level crony, plus she never had to be in a prison overseen by Barr.
> ...


Your lack of knowledge is the reason why you will be blindsided by what happens.

You're throwing shit again with no evidence.

Do you have proof that Trump was an actual client? Was he at Epstein's island? His New Mexico ranch? His New York residence? Are there pictures of Trump and Rachel Chandler? The answers to those questions are No. No. No. And No.

In other words, you have nothing, nada, zilch. All that hopium you've been carrying around for so long much be getting heavy.


----------



## Xzi (Aug 16, 2022)

Purple_Shyguy said:


> Totally legit "sources" like the "source" that alleged he had nuclear documents in his house, right?


Yet to be verified or disproved.  Just another wait and see.


----------



## TraderPatTX (Aug 16, 2022)

KingVamp said:


> Social Democracy is probably what most people here mean, when they think of socialism.


That may be what they mean, but it's never what they get. Go talk to a Cuban or Venezuelan for clarification.


----------



## LainaGabranth (Aug 16, 2022)

God I would love to debate one of these right wing weirdos sometime.


----------



## TraderPatTX (Aug 16, 2022)

Xzi said:


> Yet to be verified or disproved.  Just another wait and see.


You could have stopped at yet to be verified. One does not have to disprove against their government. It's their job to prove their case. It's that innocent until proven guilty concept that the left hates so much.


----------



## TraderPatTX (Aug 16, 2022)

LainaGabranth said:


> God I would love to debate one of these right wing weirdos sometime.


Changing what I said in a message will guarantee you will never debate me. You are proven liar so there's no debate to be had.


----------



## TraderPatTX (Aug 16, 2022)

Purple_Shyguy said:


> Totally legit "sources" like the "source" that alleged he had nuclear documents in his house, right?


I said it before... the FBI found Bush's WMD's in Melania's closet. I bet the fedbois are having a blast playing dress up now.


----------



## Xzi (Aug 16, 2022)

TraderPatTX said:


> Your lack of knowledge is the reason why you will be blindsided by what happens.


Impossible for me to be blindsided so long as I'm just casually waiting for the follow-up to the raid.  You apparently believe Q is gonna swoop down from the heavens and carry Trump to Mars before he can be charged or some shit, lmao.



TraderPatTX said:


> You're throwing shit again with no evidence.


The FBI seized twelve boxes of hard evidence from Mar-A-Lago.  Not sure why you would think I've seen top secret documents.



TraderPatTX said:


> In other words, you have nothing, nada, zilch. All that hopium you've been carrying around for so long much be getting heavy.


Oh I don't expect Trump will ever get charged with that specifically, but you and I both know he's a fucking pedophile, and that's all that matters to me within the context of this conversation.  Maybe Ivanka ratted him out as payback for raping her when she was a minor.


----------



## Creamu (Aug 16, 2022)

KingVamp said:


> Social Democracy is probably what most people here mean, when they think of socialism.


----------



## TraderPatTX (Aug 16, 2022)

Xzi said:


> Impossible for me to be blindsided so long as I'm just casually waiting for the follow-up to the raid.  You apparently believe Q is gonna swoop down from the heavens and carry Trump to Mars before he can be charged or some shit, lmao.
> 
> 
> The FBI seized twelve boxes of hard evidence from Mar-A-Lago.  Not sure why you would think I've seen top secret documents.
> ...


Please point to where I said anything even remotely resembling that.

Evidence of what though, is the question. Because you speak with such authority about the topic.

What kind of BlueAnon crap is this? You sound crazier than Rachel Maddow on meth.


----------



## LainaGabranth (Aug 16, 2022)

TraderPatTX said:


> Changing what I said in a message will guarantee you will never debate me. You are proven liar so there's no debate to be had.


Yeah, but who said anything about debating you in particular? You can't debate your way out of a paper sack LMAO


----------



## TraderPatTX (Aug 16, 2022)

LainaGabranth said:


> Yeah, but who said anything about debating you in particular? You can't debate your way out of a paper sack LMAO






Is this you? I'm pretty sure this is you.


----------



## Creamu (Aug 16, 2022)

I volunteer as host.


----------



## LainaGabranth (Aug 16, 2022)

TraderPatTX said:


> View attachment 322913
> Is this you? I'm pretty sure this is you.


Weird how you had to look aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaall the way back for a post from a month ago. Can you find a more recent debate invitation?


----------



## OpiumSmoke (Aug 16, 2022)

Trump honestly has a EXCUSE for anything, he can convince a horse to drink water by itself smh


----------



## UltraDolphinRevolution (Aug 16, 2022)

Xzi said:


> Will forever piss me off that Dems stole the nomination from Bernie at the eleventh hour by forcing all other candidates to drop out just before Super Tuesday.  We'll be lucky if Biden cleans up even half of the mess Trump left behind, centrist as he is.


Trump is weak. He is still monitoring the situation on his blog... but man, Bernie is such a schwätzer.


----------



## Creamu (Aug 16, 2022)

LainaGabranth said:


> Weird how you had to look aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaall the way back for a post from a month ago. Can you find a more recent debate invitation?


I invite you two to debate with me as host.


----------



## TraderPatTX (Aug 16, 2022)

LainaGabranth said:


> Weird how you had to look aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaall the way back for a post from a month ago. Can you find a more recent debate invitation?


You act like a month was a decade ago. So what is an acceptable time period for you sweetie? A week? A day? 5 minutes ago? It's not my fault you have the memory of a hamster.

You are mad that I shot down your invitation for a date.


----------



## TraderPatTX (Aug 16, 2022)

UltraDolphinRevolution said:


> Trump is weak. He is still monitoring the situation on his blog... but man, Bernie is such a schwätzer.


It's amazing how often the left complains about stolen elections, amirite?


----------



## Nothereed (Aug 16, 2022)

Xzi said:


> That would be full on communism, not socialism.


There is a bit of a distinction. Private property in modern communist talking points, is referring to buisness aka means to producton. Personal property still would exist. I say that now since the two are thrown out  a lot and mixed up often.

Edit: and primarily because the idea that people can exist or would be okay without personal property would be incredibly stupid. We have attachments to certain things. We need personal space.
Also specific i'm ancom. Just so we're more clear (I've stated this a million times by now. But stalinism/tankies can go to hell.)


----------



## LainaGabranth (Aug 16, 2022)

TraderPatTX said:


> You act like a month was a decade ago. So what is an acceptable time period for you sweetie? A week? A day? 5 minutes ago? It's not my fault you have the memory of a hamster.
> 
> You are mad that I shot down your invitation for a date.


why do you think debates are dates LOL


----------



## LainaGabranth (Aug 16, 2022)

Creamu said:


> I invite you two to debate with me as host.


I support this notion.


----------



## TraderPatTX (Aug 16, 2022)

LainaGabranth said:


> why do you think debates are dates LOL


You don't even get the AOC reference. And you also didn't answer my question.


----------



## KingVamp (Aug 16, 2022)

TraderPatTX said:


> That may be what they mean, but it's never what they get. Go talk to a Cuban or Venezuelan for clarification.


Except you already brought up Nordic countries, yourself.


----------



## TraderPatTX (Aug 17, 2022)

KingVamp said:


> Except you already brought up Nordic countries, yourself.


Nordic countries have said they are not socialist countries. Cuba and Venezuela have called themselves socialist countries. You can tell the difference because nobody flees Nordic countries. People risk their lives to flee socialist countries. I know weird, right?


----------



## djpannda (Aug 17, 2022)

TraderPatTX said:


> Nordic countries have said they are not socialist countries. Cuba and Venezuela have called themselves socialist countries. You can tell the difference because nobody flees Nordic countries. People risk their lives to flee socialist countries. I know weird, right?


I thinking the issue is you are refusing to acknowledge that there's a spectrum. IT is not 100% socialism or nothing ....Not even  the USA is 100% Capitalism and has a lot of  Socialist Programs in the wood work. Nordic Countries have ALOT More Socialist Programs and better overall quality of life/ Happiness.. that is why there is a legit Economist word for it "*Nordic model". *
and of course Socialist Programs can go too far and Create Failed states ,( but the same notion can be applied for Capitalism.). but if you look at Failed  states the issue was  Authoritarian behind one party or one PERSON (HINT HINT).
Places that Did not focus on Authoritarianism and actually focused on the population (Nordic model) are Thriving


----------



## LainaGabranth (Aug 17, 2022)

TraderPatTX said:


> Nordic countries have said they are not socialist countries. Cuba and Venezuela have called themselves socialist countries. You can tell the difference because nobody flees Nordic countries. People risk their lives to flee socialist countries. I know weird, right?


Hey quick question, is the Democratic People's Republic of Korea a Democratic Republic?


----------



## Creamu (Aug 17, 2022)

EDIT: Didnt mean to post. Oh well might as well post this then:


----------



## sombrerosonic (Aug 17, 2022)

Creamu said:


> EDIT: Didnt mean to post. Oh well might as well post this then:



PONG?!?


----------



## Creamu (Aug 17, 2022)

sombrerosonic said:


> PONG?!?


The politics section in a nutshell.


----------



## City (Aug 17, 2022)

Osakasan said:


> Playing both sides only works when you don't play the whataboutism, and when you don't try to equal a literal coup d'etat to put a tryrant in power with protestors who riot because their rights are being trampled.


Lmao are you referring to the 2020 riots? Where a global pandemic was going on but americans thought it was appropriate to protest for a drug addict and make him a saint despite pointing a gun at a pregnant woman? Or about all the other countless riots over false information of "unharmed black victims" just to realize that they were, in fact, armed and ready to kill?

Oh but it's ok because the scientists in the US said that the 2020 riots did not help spread COVID. Meanwhile regular people were forced to wear masks, gloves and social distancing. Something I've never cared about, because a pandemic is a pandemic, but that situation and that alone proved that the US is a clown state. And it's even funnier that you people will bash any criticism with "you're just a right winger/russian tool". Meanwhile, on websites like Reddit, people set up subreddits where they celebrate people's deaths due to COVID.


----------



## LainaGabranth (Aug 17, 2022)

City said:


> Lmao are you referring to the 2020 riots? Where a global pandemic was going on but americans thought it was appropriate to protest for a drug addict and make him a saint despite pointing a gun at a pregnant woman? Or about all the other countless riots over false information of "unharmed black victims" just to realize that they were, in fact, armed and ready to kill?
> 
> Oh but it's ok because the scientists in the US said that the 2020 riots did not help spread COVID. Meanwhile regular people were forced to wear masks, gloves and social distancing. Something I've never cared about, because a pandemic is a pandemic, but that situation and that alone proved that the US is a clown state. And it's even funnier that you people will bash any criticism with "you're just a right winger/russian tool". Meanwhile, on websites like Reddit, people set up subreddits where they celebrate people's deaths due to COVID.


How mad does it make you that black people are tired of being killed by cops


----------



## Creamu (Aug 17, 2022)

LainaGabranth said:


> How mad does it make you that black people are tired of being killed by cops


*and feds


----------



## City (Aug 17, 2022)

LainaGabranth said:


> How mad does it make you that black people are tired of being killed by cops


----------



## LainaGabranth (Aug 17, 2022)

City said:


>



We can use your feelings, or we can use empirical data. I think I know what _I'm_ trusting.


----------



## Xzi (Aug 17, 2022)

"Back the blue...unless they enforce the laws that _we're_ breaking, then FUCKING KILL 'EM!" - Every conservative

“Conservatism consists of exactly one proposition, to wit: there must be in-groups whom the law protects but does not bind, alongside out-groups whom the law binds but does not protect.” - Frank Wilhoit


----------



## LainaGabranth (Aug 17, 2022)

Xzi said:


> "Back the blue...unless they enforce the laws that _we're_ breaking, then FUCKING KILL 'EM!" - Every conservative
> 
> “Conservatism Consists of Exactly One Proposition, to Wit: There Must Be In-Groups Whom the Law Protects but Does Not Bind, Alongside Out-Groups Whom the Law Binds but Does Not Protect.” - Frank Wilhoit


For real, watching the party of blue lives matter immediately turn around to being anti-government as soon as it bit their asses was so fucking funny.

I cannot imagine still being a right winger after all the constant Ls.


----------



## City (Aug 17, 2022)

Xzi said:


> "Back the blue...unless they enforce the laws that _we're_ breaking, then FUCKING KILL 'EM!" - Every conservative
> 
> “Conservatism consists of exactly one proposition, to wit: there must be in-groups whom the law protects but does not bind, alongside out-groups whom the law binds but does not protect.” - Frank Wilhoit


Is this coming from the ACAB people or...?


----------



## Xzi (Aug 17, 2022)

City said:


> Is this coming from the ACAB people or...?


Yeah, I'm openly ACAB.  Or in other words, not a massive hypocrite.


----------



## KingVamp (Aug 17, 2022)

TraderPatTX said:


> Nordic countries have said they are not socialist countries. Cuba and Venezuela have called themselves socialist countries. You can tell the difference because nobody flees Nordic countries. People risk their lives to flee socialist countries. I know weird, right?


Good thing I said social democracy and not socialist then.


----------



## x65943 (Aug 17, 2022)

please keep it civil lads, you can disagree but don't go about calling each other bootlickers or other direct attacks

edit: and please stick to the topic


----------



## RAHelllord (Aug 17, 2022)

LegalEagle released a neat little primer about the alleged crimes Trump may have committed based on the released search warrant parts, and what the allegedly broken laws actually mean: 

Other highlights include going over the legal basis of classification and declassification of documents, how the presidents powers factor into that, and what documents the president can't actually declassify by himself and who must actually sign off on the declassification instead. As well as the process of declassification that may have "accidentally" been skipped by Trump before he wheeled a truck load of documents out of the white house.

The important TL;DR is that Trump can't declassify everything at will, and even if he declares something to be declassified it actually has to be physically declassified by the agency that those documents belong to first. All classified documents stay classified until the document has been properly marked and signed off as declassified by that agency and not a second earlier. If Trump skipped having those documents properly marked as declassified they still are legally considered to be classified, and thus the felonies would start piling in.


----------



## LainaGabranth (Aug 17, 2022)

Trump broke a shitton of laws, and I mean a shitton, in doing so, violated a shitton of procedure, and put the country that he larps about being a patriot for at severe risk. There's a reason why the arguments are "MUH HILLARY, MUH HUNTER BIDEN" and not "UHHH HE DIDN'T BREAK ANY LAWS AT ALL, ACTUALLY"


----------



## Xzi (Aug 17, 2022)

RAHelllord said:


> If Trump skipped having those documents properly marked as declassified they still are legally considered to be classified, and thus the felonies would start piling in.


By all reports he was manically shoveling the documents into boxes to take with him during his final hours in the White House, after finally admitting to himself that he lost the election and wasn't going to be able to con his way into a second term.  No chance he had the time to go through the proper channels to get them declassified, not that he's the type to follow protocol even if he had thought about doing it months prior.

He's facing up to 33 years in prison, according to legal experts. The lard ass has maybe 5 years left to live before the Big Macs finish him off. So there's a lot of wiggle room there.


----------



## x65943 (Aug 17, 2022)

Xzi said:


> By all reports he was manically shoveling the documents into boxes to take with him during his final hours in the White House, after finally admitting to himself that he lost the election and wasn't going to be able to con his way into a second term.  No chance he had the time to go through the proper channels to get them declassified, not that he's the type to follow protocol even if he had thought about doing it months prior.
> 
> He's facing up to 33 years in prison, according to legal experts. The lard ass has maybe 5 years left to live before the Big Macs finish him off. So there's a lot of wiggle room there.


On average, with average medical care in the USA. A man his age will live to 87 (11 more years).

https://www.ssa.gov/cgi-bin/longevity.cgi

But he is also very wealthy, not a smoker or alcohol user. He has a lot of factors that will likely mean living even longer than that. 

I know he seems unhealthy, but from a doctor's perspective he is actually very well for someone his age. I wouldn't expect him to pass away anytime soon. All guys his age are eating unhealthy in my experience.


----------



## Xzi (Aug 17, 2022)

x65943 said:


> On average, with average medical care in the USA. A man his age will live to 87 (11 more years).
> 
> https://www.ssa.gov/cgi-bin/longevity.cgi
> 
> ...


A heart attack can finish off someone much younger and in much better shape in an instant.  By his own admission he doesn't exercise, and he needs a golf cart to move more than ten feet at a time.


----------



## x65943 (Aug 17, 2022)

Xzi said:


> A heart attack can finish off someone much younger and in much better shape in an instant.  By his own admission he doesn't exercise, and he needs a golf cart to move more than ten feet at a time.


yes however, as I shared, average for all comers his age is 11 years without taking into account any of his protective factors. I have a clinic with men his age (veteran's hospital) and I can tell you he has a great shot.

Also, heart attacks don't tend to come out of nowhere. And you can simply have a stent placed in most cases. Additionally - if he was going to have coronary disease it would have likely happened years ago already. By not smoking his chance of heart attack is already quite low.


----------



## Xzi (Aug 17, 2022)

x65943 said:


> yes however, as I shared, average for all comers his age is 11 years without taking into account any of his protective factors. I have a clinic with men his age (veteran's hospital) and I can tell you he has a great shot.


Averages mean very little, because that would be assuming average weight and an average exercise routine, as well as an average diet.  He's both shorter and considerably fatter than the data we have available from that quack doctor of his would lead you to believe.  Dude is morbidly obese.



x65943 said:


> By not smoking his chance of heart attack is already quite low.


Sure, but then you gotta factor in that he blew out his sinuses decades ago by doing way too much cocaine, and that didn't help his cardiovascular health either.  See: his ridiculously loud and lengthy "sniffs" during speeches that are necessary to catch his breath.


----------



## x65943 (Aug 17, 2022)

Xzi said:


> Averages mean very little, because that would be assuming average weight and an average exercise routine, as well as an average diet.  He's both shorter and considerably fatter than the data we have available from that quack doctor of his would lead you to believe.  Dude is morbidly obese.
> 
> 
> Sure, but then you gotta factor in that he blew out his sinuses decades ago by doing way too much cocaine, and that didn't help his cardiovascular health either.  See: his ridiculously loud and lengthy "sniffs" during speeches that are necessary to catch his breath.


average americans over the age of 75 are overweight, with 50th percentile BMI 27.5. Less than half of americans over age 65 exercise regularly. 

The best indicator for longevity is current age. I think you might have a skewed idea of the average american (as they are quite unhealthy). Anyhow I don't want to keep getting off topic but Trump is all things considered at least average for his cohort, but in my personal experience healthier than many people his age.


----------



## Xzi (Aug 17, 2022)

x65943 said:


> average americans over the age of 75 are overweight, with 50th percentile BMI 27.5.


If I'm being generous and calling Trump 6 foot and 300 lbs, his BMI is 40.7.



x65943 said:


> Less than half of americans over age 65 exercise regularly.


Which means they're still weighting the average.



x65943 said:


> Anyhow I don't want to keep getting off topic but Trump is all things considered at least average for his cohort, but in my personal experience healthier than many people his age.


Depends on where you live I suppose, states where people stay inside almost constantly due to the heat see a lot more obesity I'm sure.  Here in Colorado I'd say at least 85% of the elderly population are in much better shape than Trump.


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## City (Aug 17, 2022)

x65943 said:


> average americans over the age of 75 are overweight, with 50th percentile BMI 27.5. Less than half of americans over age 65 exercise regularly.
> 
> The best indicator for longevity is current age. I think you might have a skewed idea of the average american (as they are quite unhealthy). Anyhow I don't want to keep getting off topic but Trump is all things considered at least average for his cohort, but in my personal experience healthier than many people his age.


It's clear that Trump lives rent free in this guy's head. He'd drop hints about him wishing that he'd die soon even if he had the same body type as Schwarzenegger.


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## Xzi (Aug 17, 2022)

City said:


> He'd drop hints about him wishing that he'd die soon even if he had the same body type as Schwarzenegger.


Well yeah, being in better shape wouldn't instantly make him a better person, but it would drop his risk of instantaneous death by a whole lot.  Hell would freeze over long before he decides to start and stick to an exercise routine, though, he has some dumbass beliefs about a "finite human battery."

It's all a moot point anyway, as half the expected sentence would still be about 16 years, and even by x65943's guesstimate he'll kick the bucket 11 years in.


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## x65943 (Aug 17, 2022)

let's try to stick to the topic of the raid


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## Creamu (Aug 17, 2022)

'Liz Cheney wants Americans to 'unite' across party lines to prevent Donald Trump from regaining the White House following her devastating defeat in Wyoming's primary on Tuesday.

[...]

"That’s a decision that I’m going to make in the coming months," she said, adding "It is something that I'm thinking about."

"I have said since Jan. 6 that I will do whatever it takes to ensure Donald Trump is never again anywhere near the Oval Office and I mean it."

In addition to her new PAC, Cheney will have a public forum for her campaign against Trump as vice chair of the committee investigating the former president’s role in the Capitol insurrection until she leaves Congress in January. Cheney was a rising Republican star until she stood up to Trump. After she voted to impeach Trump in the aftermath of the attack on the Capitol by a mob of his supporters, the political costs for Cheney’s defiance mounted. The Wyoming Republican Party voted to censure her and asked her to resign. Then she was removed as the third-ranking  House Republican leader by her colleagues, who accused her of abandoning the party.  That culminated in her loss Tuesday to Hageman by a two-to-one margin with half the votes counted. -Bloomberg

[...]'






https://www.zerohedge.com/political/neocon-gone-liz-cheney-battles-seat-wyoming-primary

'The recent raid by the FBI on former President Donald Trump’s residence has solidified Trump’s hold on the 2024 GOP presidential nomination, according to conservatives and analysts.

The raid of Mar-a-Lago, Trump’s house in Palm Beach, Florida, was aimed at preventing the former president from gaining office again, they told The Epoch Times.

If anything, however, the raid has had the opposite effect, they said, as the belief grows that Trump will announce a new presidential run sooner rather than later.

[...]

Taken together, the results mark a ten-point swing for Trump over his nearest competitor, and seem to solidify what conservative analysts have told The Epoch Times—that the FBI raid on Mar-a-Lago has made Trump more powerful in the GOP as voters become clearer with what’s at stake in 2024.


What Victory Means

For Blackwell, the raid is galvanizing Republicans into action.

“I think people smell what victory for the GOP means,” said Blackwell referring to the 2022 elections as well as 2024.

What it means, he said, is an attempt to take the House, the Senate, and the presidency for a president in Trump who has a bonafide track record as a conservative.

The raid is a reminder of all that is at stake, not just for Donald Trump, but for the country as well.

“I see candidates and donors and voters not just bound by their optimism, but fueled by their concerns as well,” concluded Blackwell.

The Epoch Times has reached out to the White House, DOJ, and FBI for comment.'

-John Ransom

https://www.theepochtimes.com/fbi-r...-expected-2024-run-observers-say_4666287.html

'“Yes, it’s possible [but] I don’t think it’s going to happen,” Alan Dershowitz told Newsmax on Tuesday about whether Trump would be arrested. People who believe that prosecution and an indictment would keep Trump away from the 2024 campaign are “dead wrong,” he remarked.

“He can run for president even if he’s indicted, convicted, and wearing striped shirts, prison garb,” he added to the channel. “The Constitution provides only four bases for disqualification for president, and being convicted of a crime is not one of them. Congress can’t change the criteria that are in the Constitution for the election of the president.”

[...]

The former president on Monday said that FBI agents took three passports from him before a spokesperson confirmed that a Department of Justice official said they were returned. Hours later, he called for the Justice Department to release the affidavit, which would provide insight into why the Department of Justice believes it is justified in trying to obtain the search warrant.

“There is no way to justify the unannounced RAID of Mar-a-Lago, the home of the 45th President of the United States … in the interest of TRANSPARENCY, I call for the immediate release of the completely Unredacted Affidavit pertaining to this horrible and shocking BREAK-IN. Also, the Judge on this case should recuse!” Trump wrote on Truth Social.'

-Jack Phillips

https://www.theepochtimes.com/alan-...p-wont-keep-him-out-of-2024-race_4668498.html


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## Xzi (Aug 17, 2022)

@Creamu how you gonna like a post about sticking to the topic of the raid and then immediately post something not at all related?  Cheney sucks and I'm sure her replacement will suck too, Wyoming doesn't get to have nice things because it's one big truck stop.  Their main export is meth and/or heroin.


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## Osakasan (Aug 17, 2022)

What kind of Psycho keeps what clearly looks like a kill list.

Oh yeah, an alt-righter


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## LainaGabranth (Aug 17, 2022)

Osakasan said:


> What kind of Psycho keeps what clearly looks like a kill list.
> 
> Oh yeah, an alt-righter


Remember, the right is TOTALLY not a cult!


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## Xzi (Aug 17, 2022)

Creamu said:


> '“Yes, it’s possible [but] I don’t think it’s going to happen,” Alan Dershowitz told Newsmax


Bruh, you might as well be asking Tucker Carlson.  WTF you think he's gonna say?

All your sources are hot garbage, btw.  Newsmax, epoch, and zerohedge.  If you could post any actual news instead of opinion pieces for once, that'd be great.


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## Creamu (Aug 17, 2022)

@x65943 This confuses me.


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## x65943 (Aug 17, 2022)

I merged your previous posts, because you posted back to back. If we can't stick to topic or be civil here this thread will be locked. Let's try to have a civil discussion.


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## UltraDolphinRevolution (Aug 17, 2022)

Xzi said:


> He's facing up to 33 years in prison, according to legal experts. The lard ass has maybe 5 years left to live before the Big Macs finish him off. So there's a lot of wiggle room there.


I´ve read the best predictor of near death in old people is the difficulty standing up, i.e. speed strength, not stamina. Technically, Bic Macs extend life, unlike smoking, which contains no protein or vitamines.
Your comment sounds a bit age-ist and if he was black, racist. 

Should his arrest really spark a lot of property damage and loss of life, then we could call it a reverse-Floyd (i.e. people defending and idealizing a criminal)


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## Creamu (Aug 17, 2022)

x65943 said:


> I merged your previous posts, because you posted back to back. If we can't stick to topic or be civil here this thread will be locked. Let's try to have a civil discussion.


Okay, just letting you know that on my end I don't immediatly get what is going on if you do this. I worked under the assumption that I did something I didn't intended to do. Just FYI


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## Xzi (Aug 17, 2022)

UltraDolphinRevolution said:


> Technically, Bic Macs extend life, unlike smoking, which contains no protein or vitamines.


You think cow anus contains vitamins?  I guess maybe very trace amounts.  The bun probably has more than the meat.



UltraDolphinRevolution said:


> Your comment sounds a bit age-ist and if he was black, racist.


Bro lmaooo.  It's neither.  Anybody is capable of taking better care of themselves into their 70s and 80s than Trump has.  "If he was black..." killing me over here.


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## City (Aug 17, 2022)

x65943 said:


> I merged your previous posts, because you posted back to back. If we can't stick to topic or be civil here this thread will be locked. Let's try to have a civil discussion.


You do understand that it's just two users that have been flaming and calling everyone names, right? No need to lock a thread for those two unhinged users.


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## x65943 (Aug 17, 2022)

Thread locked, off-topic posts and constant bickering


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## x65943 (Aug 17, 2022)

City said:


> You do understand that it's just two users that have been flaming and calling everyone names, right? No need to lock a thread for those two unhinged users.


If you don't interact with or engage users who are flaming, and you report them - then you can request reply bans 

If you start bickering then it's on everyone

I will unlock this thread at a later time when everyone calms down and can be civil, and stay on topic


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## sombrerosonic (Aug 19, 2022)

so the thread is back now. nice


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## Dark_Ansem (Aug 19, 2022)

So, tax fraud crimes confirmed. Hmmmm.


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## sombrerosonic (Aug 19, 2022)

Dark_Ansem said:


> So, tax fraud crimes confirmed. Hmmmm.


This thread is more or less about if trump is racist pedo more than tax fraud ngl.....


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## Dark_Ansem (Aug 19, 2022)

sombrerosonic said:


> This thread is more or less about if trump is racist pedo more than tax fraud ngl.....


And yet Al Capone was caught on tax fraud.


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## sombrerosonic (Aug 19, 2022)

Dark_Ansem said:


> And yet Al Capone was caught on tax fraud.


Yes i know but i notice that people on here went to trump is a rasict than the actual conversation. just look.... and you will see what i mean.


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## Dark_Ansem (Aug 19, 2022)

sombrerosonic said:


> Yes i know but i notice that people on here went to trump is a rasict than the actual conversation. just look.... and you will see what i mean.


I know, I'm just trying to be on point - to an extent.


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## LainaGabranth (Aug 20, 2022)

I mean let's all be honest, most if not all rich people are doing some form of tax fraud, or at the least are doing what is in essence tax fraud but isn't explicitly illegal due to numerous loopholes. It's not a stretch to assume that if most billionaires are behaving unethically, then probably one of the most notable and famous ones might be too, thus why it's good to investigate.

Weird how the guy who renewed the Patriot Act however is so quick to hide his personal info on the matter, though...
EDIT: Trump was an initial supporter of it but the attempted renewal was one he said he'd veto, having it dropped. What I wanna know is however is why people who supported renewing it in the House of Representatives are now *also* trying to hide shit.

The point I am making is that the government is bad, but unlike the partisans I am able to say _both_ parties are bad.


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## KingVamp (Aug 23, 2022)

Apparently, he took over 300 classified documents.


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## tabzer (Aug 23, 2022)

KingVamp said:


> Apparently, he took over 300 classified documents.


In layman's terms, how many Beghazis?


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## LainaGabranth (Aug 23, 2022)

KingVamp said:


> Apparently, he took over 300 classified documents.


I for one am glad that Trump was a fascist with no understanding of how to declassify documents or how opsec works. Truly the greatest example of the failures of our two party system.


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## Dr_Faustus (Aug 24, 2022)

tabzer said:


> In layman's terms, how many Beghazis?


If you are going to do nothing but go "but what about Hillary?" talk its not going to get you far, especially with people who believe that the both of them should be locked away and be held for their crimes/disconnected from their party influence. They are both scumbags operating on two sides of the same politically fucked coin. 

Also lets point out the fact that Trump promised to put her away when he was running, but never got to do so during his entire 4 year run. That in itself should be telling on why that was not the case. Perhaps money, power and connections transcends over political sides.. They are both corrupt of their own shit, but honestly neither will be held accountable and will walk free at the end of the day.

Its no longer a game about sides, its people with power getting away with anything because they have the power to, while everyone else frames it as politics and flings red and blue shit at each other ignoring the fact that both sides are just equally fucked in their own horrible ways with no action or representation to stand out and make a change from it. Just imagine if people actually got outside of the political mindset of these people and saw them for what they have done perhaps the world can look much clear to everyone else. But nah, fuck that lets just fling more coloured shit at each other while the rich and powerful retain their freedoms and evade laws.


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## LainaGabranth (Aug 24, 2022)

Dr_Faustus said:


> If you are going to do nothing but go "but what about Hillary?" talk its not going to get you far, especially with people who believe that the both of them should be locked away and be held for their crimes/disconnected from their party influence. They are both scumbags operating on two sides of the same politically fucked coin.
> 
> Also lets point out the fact that Trump promised to put her away when he was running, but never got to do so during his entire 4 year run. That in itself should be telling on why that was not the case. Perhaps money, power and connections transcends over political sides.. They are both corrupt of their own shit, but honestly neither will be held accountable and will walk free at the end of the day.
> 
> Its no longer a game about sides, its people with power getting away with anything because they have the power to, while everyone else frames it as politics and flings red and blue shit at each other ignoring the fact that both sides are just equally fucked in their own horrible ways with no action or representation to stand out and make a change from it. Just imagine if people actually got outside of the political mindset of these people and saw them for what they have done perhaps the world can look much clear to everyone else. But nah, fuck that lets just fling more coloured shit at each other while the rich and powerful retain their freedoms and evade laws.


For real. Both parties have always been bad, and despite any momentary utility we may get (such as one party having a presidential candidate who is not as bad as the other) the fact that we are forced to arbitrarily choose between two objectively bad parties shows we aren't in a democracy. It's all a partisan show when the right accuses anyone of corruption, because there's plenty of skeletons in the closet for their side. There's a reason why people on the left wanted Bernie over people like fuckin Hillary or Biden. The only reason anyone voted for him of all people over Trump is just because he wasn't as bad as the other guy, but still extremely bad, so bad that people ran on platforms like "Bernie or Bust" online.


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## tabzer (Aug 24, 2022)

Dr_Faustus said:


> If you are going to do nothing but go "but what about Hillary?" talk its not going to get you far, especially with people who believe that the both of them should be locked away and be held for their crimes/disconnected from their party influence. They are both scumbags operating on two sides of the same politically fucked coin.
> 
> Also lets point out the fact that Trump promised to put her away when he was running, but never got to do so during his entire 4 year run. That in itself should be telling on why that was not the case. Perhaps money, power and connections transcends over political sides.. They are both corrupt of their own shit, but honestly neither will be held accountable and will walk free at the end of the day.
> 
> Its no longer a game about sides, its people with power getting away with anything because they have the power to, while everyone else frames it as politics and flings red and blue shit at each other ignoring the fact that both sides are just equally fucked in their own horrible ways with no action or representation to stand out and make a change from it. Just imagine if people actually got outside of the political mindset of these people and saw them for what they have done perhaps the world can look much clear to everyone else. But nah, fuck that lets just fling more coloured shit at each other while the rich and powerful retain their freedoms and evade laws.



I'm not saying,"what about Hillary?"

I'm asking for a metric so we can calculate how much jail time Trump is going to get.  If you say 5 Benghazis, then you multiply how much jail time Hillary got by 5.


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## Tsukiru (Aug 24, 2022)

LainaGabranth said:


> For real. Both parties have always been bad, and despite any momentary utility we may get (such as one party having a presidential candidate who is not as bad as the other) the fact that we are forced to arbitrarily choose between two objectively bad parties shows we aren't in a democracy. It's all a partisan show when the right accuses anyone of corruption, because there's plenty of skeletons in the closet for their side. There's a reason why people on the left wanted Bernie over people like fuckin Hillary or Biden. The only reason anyone voted for him of all people over Trump is just because he wasn't as bad as the other guy, but still extremely bad, so bad that people ran on platforms like "Bernie or Bust" online.


Which was still a show with how little they cared beyond getting votes. Pick the "safe" (we don't believe in actually changing or doing anything that matters or helps people, but we'll kinda sorta say we will) and then once you get the seat, do fuck all. Cause what matters is how do we keep making issues so we get more money next time.


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## LainaGabranth (Aug 24, 2022)

Tsukiru said:


> Which was still a show with how little they cared beyond getting votes. Pick the "safe" (we don't believe in actually changing or doing anything that matters or helps people, but we'll kinda sorta say we will) and then once you get the seat, do fuck all. Cause what matters is how do we keep making issues so we get more money next time.


Exactly. It's so mindboggling how people are stupid enough to try to paint the Democrats as this ultra evil, super active party of just pure destruction when anyone with a brain knows they're literally just the most useless, inactive fuckers ever.


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## sombrerosonic (Aug 24, 2022)

LainaGabranth said:


> Exactly. It's so mindboggling how people are stupid enough to try to paint the Democrats as this ultra evil, super active party of just pure destruction when anyone with a brain knows they're literally just the most useless, inactive fuckers ever.


Maybe its to make them feel that they have le big pp...

also haven't the democrats been kinda active? Like the inflation recovery thing?


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## LainaGabranth (Aug 24, 2022)

sombrerosonic said:


> Maybe its to make them feel that they have le big pp...
> 
> also haven't the democrats been kinda active? Like the inflation recovery thing?


Sort of, I am being hyperbolic to a degree when I say they don't do *literally* anything at all, but when it comes to things like fighting for Roe v Wade for example they basically refused to actually do anything about the Supreme Court being ideologically packed, and waited until RvW was going to be abolished just so scum fucks like Nancy Pelosi could crowdfund over it.


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## omgcat (Aug 25, 2022)

sombrerosonic said:


> Maybe its to make them feel that they have le big pp...
> 
> also haven't the democrats been kinda active? Like the inflation recovery thing?


and the student loan forgiveness. more on topic apparently no one wants to be trumps lawyer right now to the point where trump agreed to a new one without actually meeting them in april.

the guy is just classically fucked.

also

Trump appears to concede he illegally retained official documents​


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## UltraDolphinRevolution (Aug 25, 2022)

Forgiveness implies it was a mistake that green-haired Susan studied gender diversity in the 20th century rain forest.


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## LainaGabranth (Aug 25, 2022)

least incoherent UDR post


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## omgcat (Aug 25, 2022)

UltraDolphinRevolution said:


> Forgiveness implies it was a mistake that green-haired Susan studied gender diversity in the 20th century rain forest.


doesn't matter to me, it's less money going to the banks in interest. that money gets spent on other things in the economy that helps everyone.  I paid off all my student loans on my own and I think it's fine. put another way, i'd rather we deflate the 1.9T dollar student loan crisis before it blows the fuck up ruining everything and the whole economy, like the housing crash did in 2008. hell it even helps people in the future by limiting the max interest rate going forwards so we don't end up in this mess again.


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## Tsukiru (Aug 25, 2022)

LainaGabranth said:


> Exactly. It's so mindboggling how people are stupid enough to try to paint the Democrats as this ultra evil, super active party of just pure destruction when anyone with a brain knows they're literally just the most useless, inactive fuckers ever.


Wish they were as cool as people fear they were.


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## tabzer (Aug 25, 2022)

You wish that they were a bunch of human traffickers that sacrifice children to Satan?  You are going to make @LainaGabranth jealous with that edge.


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## tabzer (Aug 25, 2022)

omgcat said:


> doesn't matter to me, it's less money going to the banks in interest. that money gets spent on other things in the economy that helps everyone.  I paid off all my student loans on my own and I think it's fine. put another way, i'd rather we deflate the 1.9T dollar student loan crisis before it blows the fuck up ruining everything and the whole economy, like the housing crash did in 2008. hell it even helps people in the future by limiting the max interest rate going forwards so we don't end up in this mess again.



Infinite money and economy.  Quite a juxtaposition.


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## Xzi (Aug 25, 2022)

tabzer said:


> Infinite money and economy.  Quite a juxtaposition.


Once again tabzer manages to stumble ass first into the correct take.  We do operate on an infinite growth model under capitalism, unsustainable as the concept is.  Yet people like you only seem to emerge to complain about it on the rare occasion when it works to benefit individuals, rather than to the benefit of corporations.


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## tabzer (Aug 25, 2022)

Xzi said:


> Once again tabzer manages to stumble ass first into the correct take.  We do operate on an infinite growth model under capitalism, unsustainable as the concept is.  Yet people like you only seem to emerge to complain about it on the rare occasion when it works to benefit individuals, rather than to the benefit of corporations.



I'm not complaining.  I'm mentioning it because it's on topic, lol.  I've mentioned inflation a few times in cryptocurrency threads.  Many people complain about capitalism here, but rarely do we talk about how money actually works.  As much of a depressing shit you are, I appreciate the acknowledgement.


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## LainaGabranth (Aug 25, 2022)

Tsukiru said:


> Wish they were as cool as people fear they were.


For real. Like, yeah dude, I'd gladly vote for a party that was openly socialist as fuck, who regularly uses evil rules and the like to destroy the nation and create a Marxist utopia, where everyone has pronouns (lmao), but uh, that's never going to happen through the Democrats because they're a nothingburger party, and anyone who gets mad at them for anything other than their inaction is pretty delusional.


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## KingVamp (Aug 31, 2022)

Apparently, they found documents hidden everywhere.

Also, Trump Social has been barred from Google.


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## tabzer (Aug 31, 2022)

Now you don't know what to think.

Just kidding, a real democracy would never allow Trump.


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## Nothereed (Aug 31, 2022)

Oh...


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## Nothereed (Aug 31, 2022)

So this wasn't "this is securely stored"
It was just... Literately on the floor....
I guess I'm the stupid one for even thinking that he at least handled those documents with care.


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## KingVamp (Aug 31, 2022)

Nothereed said:


> So this wasn't "this is securely stored"
> It was just... Literately on the floor....
> I guess I'm the stupid one for even thinking that he at least handled those documents with care.


I'm still having a hard time believing that's real.


----------



## The Catboy (Aug 31, 2022)

Trump’s house wasn’t raided and he shouldn’t have even had those documents in the first place


----------



## Tsukiru (Sep 3, 2022)

Nothereed said:


> Oh...
> View attachment 325299


The TIME magazine at the corner of the photo really makes it.


----------



## MicroNut99 (Sep 24, 2022)

Creamu said:


> 'Last night, like many Americans, I was shocked to see that former President of the United States, Donald Trump, had his home raided by the Federal Bureau of Investigations (FBI).  This is a profound turning point in Western history.  For the better part of the past two centuries, the U.S. has enjoyed unprecedented stability because it did not raid the homes of political rivals.  The rest of the democratic world looked upon the United States as a model for successful representative government.  To watch a politically motivated raid on a former president essentially showed the rest of the world that the U.S. is no longer the model it claimed to be.  It so devastatingly rotten to its very core that anyone with eyes can see that unelected officials run the United States – not the people… not its representatives… not its Constitution.
> 
> For those who hate Trump, it is important to note that this raid is more than just Trump.  Trump is a polarizing figure in American politics.  Trump is also a billionaire.  This is not an ordinary, well intentioned political protester who walked the Halls of Congress on January 6th getting hunted down by the FBI a year later at his plumbing job.  This is a powerful person in his own right with nearly seventy-five million supporters.  The fact that they can attempt the gulag treatment on Trump should be a massive wake-up to any powerless, ordinary citizen with an unpopular view.  They are coming for you, next.
> 
> ...



A rant that really says the same thing over and over again, like a really bad Propaganda film.
Secession from exactly what and to where?
There is nothing in the Constitution that provides instructions for a reboot.
Civil War is Chaos and Death.


----------

