# DS #3652: The Dark Spire (USA)



## Rayder (Apr 17, 2009)

^^ndsrelease-4798^^


----------



## Sharpz (Apr 17, 2009)

Woot! It's out.


----------



## purplesludge (Apr 17, 2009)

It looks good. Anyone know whats on the cd in the second video?


----------



## taggart6 (Apr 17, 2009)

purplesludge said:
			
		

> It looks good. Anyone know whats on the cd in the second video?




My guess is the game sound track...which sounds AWESOME!


----------



## purplesludge (Apr 17, 2009)

Just checked gamestop it is the soundtrack.


----------



## SaltyDog (Apr 17, 2009)

Finally  
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





  Been waiting impatiently all week for this! IGN gave this a very fair review to boot.


----------



## Chanser (Apr 17, 2009)

Odd the RAR file got multiple folders containing the rom.


----------



## Covarr (Apr 17, 2009)

Chanser said:
			
		

> Odd the RAR file got multiple folders containing the rom.


This tells me instantly where you obtained it. Of course, I'm not going to say, because I have no desire to get banned.


----------



## Leamonde.Halcyon (Apr 17, 2009)

The gameplay looks good but I think I just fell in love with the music in the first video. Definitely going to try this.


----------



## ryukyus (Apr 17, 2009)

Say what. worst game ever why  would anyone play this piece of crap is beyond me, 30 dollars for this what a rip off,you can go online and pllay those kind of crap for free.


----------



## jerbz (Apr 17, 2009)

must have this game..
cant find it yett


----------



## m2pt5 (Apr 17, 2009)

The NFO says 64Mbit, the info at the top of the page and g-Online say 256Mbit. The ROM file is 32MB, which would be 256Mbit, right?

Also yeah, that one site that has it several folders deep in the archive is weird, I've never seen them do that before.


----------



## iNFiNiTY (Apr 17, 2009)

Kenichi_Arakawa-Sounds_From_The_Dark_Spire_OST-2009-XPA


----------



## War (Apr 17, 2009)

Prepare for disappointment.


----------



## Rayder (Apr 17, 2009)

Chanser said:
			
		

> Odd the RAR file got multiple folders containing the rom.



That type of stuff depends on where you got it (No!, don't tell us!)

Kinda funny, the NFO says it's 32Mbit, but it's actually 256Mbit.   Someone doesn't know the difference between megabits and megabytes apparently. 

Heh, I spent an hour just re-rolling the character stats until I was satisfied with the rolls I got.  I remember way back in the C64 days I would do that too.  Used to drive my friend nuts because he just wanted to get into the game already.


Be careful when leveling up, it's easy to add levels to the wrong character/class.  I accidentally gave my priest a level of mage, so he became a mage/priest.....DOH!  Luckily, I just went back to the save. I figure the multi-class character building should come after I level up their default class a few times first, or I discover a need during the game to multi-class someone.

I haven't really played too far past the tutorial at this point, but this seems like the kind of old-school RPG I might be able to get into.  I don't know why, but pretty much ALL the previous RPG's on the DS have failed to hold my interest.  But as I've said many times around the forums, I burnt myself out on RPG's 20+ years ago on the old C64.  Maybe this one will change that.


I even used the same old names I always gave characters in my RPG's back then;
Basher or Slasher for the warrior.
Pilf for the thief.
Healer for the priest.
Wiz for the mage.

Extremely unoriginal, I know, but I always did that back then because many times the only info you had on the character was his name during battles and the poor graphics of the old C64 didn't make the characters look all that different, so having a descriptive name just made things easier.  Seems like it could be helpful in this game too.....at least for me.


----------



## iNFiNiTY (Apr 17, 2009)

Rayder said:
			
		

> Kinda funny, the NFO says it's 32Mbit, but it's actually 256Mbit.   Someone doesn't know the difference between megabits and megabytes apparently.



Its wrong but it doesn't say 32mbit, guess you cant read!

Its obviously just been not edited from the last nfo. I'm wondering how deep this game is, if its worth giving a try


----------



## Rayder (Apr 17, 2009)

iNFiNiTY said:
			
		

> Rayder said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Excuse me, 64 mbit, yeah......but it's still wrong.

You drink six 16ounce brewskies in less than 2 hours and let me know how YOU feel.


----------



## Xaintrix (Apr 17, 2009)

Well back on topic to the game, I love it!  I'm an hour in and having a blast.  I read an interview about how surprised the localization team was about how much text there actually is.  It actually makes a huge difference, particularly if on classic mode.  I'm still using Modern, but it's nice to have the option.  It's very fun.


----------



## Chanser (Apr 17, 2009)

Rayder said:
			
		

> Chanser said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Believe me this is from XPA themselves, not some site out there. Even have the SFV file to confirm it.


----------



## Covarr (Apr 17, 2009)

Chanser said:
			
		

> Rayder said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Proof that I'm a dumbass:

I misread your first post as "Odd the ZIP got multiple RAR files containing the rom."

And then thought I knew where it came from, based on that.


----------



## Curley5959 (Apr 17, 2009)

Ouch, looks crappy.. Dont know what everyone is on about.. Looks lame to me.. I would rather stick with FFCCROF and EOT... Ive played so many better games than this..

And look at the users reading the topic.. I dont know what the big fuss is.. The gameplay footage makes it look really crap..

Thats just my opinion btw..


----------



## pantomime (Apr 17, 2009)

they are targeting a specific audience. An audience that values challenge over graphics (game looks gorgeous to me btw). If when you hear the term "Dungeon Crawler" and the first game that comes to mind is Diablo. . . . . then this game isnt for you.


----------



## Xaintrix (Apr 17, 2009)

Well said patomime.  Not for the instant gratification type that have no definition of depth of gameplay.


----------



## mrfatso (Apr 17, 2009)

in other words, this game is for old-school guys like us who are sick of these new rpg and wants to go back to good old dungeon crawler 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





i remember my first dungeon crawler game, long story short, got lost and got killed in around 1 hour, ya i suck at dungeon crawler 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 well i get this and get it a swirl, who knows an old school dungeon crawler might be what i need to get my passion for gaming back


----------



## jesuschristmonke (Apr 17, 2009)

Rayder said:
			
		

> Chanser said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Worst game ever?

No, I think your favorite game Imagine:Forum Troll is the worst game ever. This game has retro appeal for those of us who aren't kids and/or Jonas Brothers fans.


----------



## Pizzaroo (Apr 17, 2009)

This game is good, but not as good as my favorite homebrew Lone Wolf DS and it's sequel (actually, most games on the DS I've played are worse than LW).


----------



## Jeff88 (Apr 17, 2009)

Finally, have been waiting it for awhile now.


----------



## Nottulys (Apr 17, 2009)

This games seems wack as hell.


----------



## Rayder (Apr 17, 2009)

It's an "old-school" RPG.  You young whippersnappers just wouldn't understand.  Definitely not a game for everyone.

Believe me, you younger gamers would scoff at all the old-school RPG's of my youth.  Just as I tend to scoff at many of the games you guys like.  It's a generation gap thing.


----------



## DS1 (Apr 17, 2009)

Pizzaroo said:
			
		

> This game is good, but not as good as my favorite homebrew Lone Wolf DS and it's sequel (actually, most games on the DS I've played are worse than LW).



Yeah, when I heard about Lone Wolf on DS I was shocked. I didn't think ANYONE but my brother and I 'played' those.

About this game: Awesome, but I still like Shin Megami Tensei better- Old school dungeon crawler meets JRPG. Anyway this game has wicked music and wicked graphics, who would have imagined a retro revolution like this.


----------



## cupajoe (Apr 17, 2009)

Rayder said:
			
		

> It's an "old-school" RPG.  You young whippersnappers just wouldn't understand.  Definitely not a game for everyone.
> 
> Believe me, you younger gamers would scoff at all the old-school RPG's of my youth.  Just as I tend to scoff at many of the games you guys like.  It's a generation gap thing.


Being a whippersnapper that appreciates games from all corners of gaming history, some of us are lucky enough to mend the generation gap. That's not to say that I've played this game yet, though.


----------



## hova1 (Apr 17, 2009)

well, i like the presentation but the gameplay is a little confusing. maybe it's because i have never played a game like this in my life. I'll try to get in to it, but it'll take some time for me.


----------



## sk3tch (Apr 17, 2009)

Hmm...tempted to start playing this over the weekend.  Going on a trip and my copy doesn't arrive from Amazon.com until Monday.  It's kind of a PITA to xfer saves though...


----------



## Goshogun1 (Apr 17, 2009)

Wow, glad this finally came out. I love the art style, and also admire the fact that it has 2 choices of visuals. This is really for the Wizardry, and Etrian Odyssey crowd, so I don't think everyone will like it. Personally I think it looks awesome.


----------



## Jei (Apr 17, 2009)

pantomime said:
			
		

> If when you hear the term "Dungeon Crawler" and the first game that comes to mind is Diablo. . . . . then this game isnt for you.


When I hear "dungeon crawler" the first thing that comes to my mind is a game of the "fushigi dungeon" kind, like Shiren the Wanderer or Chocobo Dungeon, even so, this game makes me think of Phantasy Star (the classic ones, not the online kind they have nowdays) and Madou Monogatari... which I don't appreciate simply because of that first person view.

I think this game is crap anyways, relies way too much on the shadows...

But the music sounds very good from the videos posted, so I'm gonna look for the Ost later


----------



## eltrut (Apr 17, 2009)

So after watching 30 seconds of the video, is it just like pokemon, except without being good and lacking any moving parts?

EDIT: The soundtrack did seem pretty cool though.


----------



## TraumaHoundNDS (Apr 17, 2009)

I'm sold! Sure, visually it won't appeal to everyone but for me just the fact that it's an RPG that _doesn't_ look like every other RPG out there (I'm looking at you, Squeenix! And the rest of you JRPG lagabouts!) has me more than interested. It's hilarious that you can swap out the graphics for some seriously old-school designs. Reminds me a lot of playing Dungeon Master on the Atari 1040ST, which also reminds me I never did beat that game. Oh Tiggy, where for art thou? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




I'm gonna call my local Gamestop in the morning to see if they have it (and to confirm that it comes with the soundtrack...otherwise I may hold off on buying it right now...)


----------



## da_head (Apr 17, 2009)

o.o
i don't get why you people are impressed with this. i know its all about gameplay/story, and graphics aren't that important, but i mean cmon! the battle scenes are just flashing pictures 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




i am a young whippersnapper afterall lol. but i'll try this out anyways.


----------



## [email protected] (Apr 17, 2009)

Have to say, I'm not loving it. I thought I would, since I played the hell out of both Etrian Odyssey games, but it's just not grabbing me..... maybe I'll try it again later when I'm playing less other things (currently working through Valkyrie Profile, DQV, Moon and GTA:CW...)


----------



## knl (Apr 17, 2009)

I hope I draw my own maps like in EO!!!1


----------



## Maz7006 (Apr 17, 2009)

da_head said:
			
		

> o.o
> i don't get why you people are impressed with this. i know its all about gameplay/story, and graphics aren't that important, but i mean cmon! the battle scenes are just flashing pictures
> 
> 
> ...



This says it all, despite the fact that i was actually waiting for this one, but heck lets give it a try


----------



## twisteddeeds (Apr 17, 2009)

This game is more a tribute to the "hardcore old school rpg" and im loving it...   Anyone who has played similar games, or read game books from the 80s will love this


----------



## kjean (Apr 17, 2009)

Nice game! You don't have to be an old timer for this in my opinion. And classic display mode lolz.
btw, save corruption, that's bugging me. maybe Narin can help me (or us).


----------



## 5H3N10n9 (Apr 17, 2009)

modern d&d = passing boring time


----------



## m_babble (Apr 17, 2009)

Shining in the Darkness!


----------



## JDandy (Apr 17, 2009)

Oh dear lord, status ailments out of battle. At least Etrian had the courtesy to make status ailments go away once you leave finish the fight.
No thanks, I can already see myself trudging toward the save point / healer with only 1 party member left alive. With 10 HP. Poisoned.


----------



## rippingrocker (Apr 17, 2009)

wat do u need???


----------



## Nottulys (Apr 17, 2009)

Rayder said:
			
		

> It's an "old-school" RPG.  You young whippersnappers just wouldn't understand.  Definitely not a game for everyone.
> 
> Believe me, you younger gamers would scoff at all the old-school RPG's of my youth.  Just as I tend to scoff at many of the games you guys like.  It's a generation gap thing.




dont get me wrong, I had a couple of old Nintendo and SNES cartidges, that played just like this, but they were too damn boring....


----------



## Porkdish (Apr 17, 2009)

I quite like the character and enemy graphics, they're stylish.  The gameplay is anything but stylish though.  Before reaching the first corner of the first floor of the first dungeon with my 4 level 1 characters I randomly encountered 4 bandits, each of whom attack twice a round, averaging one and half times the maximum hitpoints of a level 1 character.

I managed to sleep some of them before my mage was killed and somehow I survived with one character barely alive.

...only to discover that fighting one battle and walking 8 steps hadn't quite earned me the $300 price tag to revive 3 level 1 characters...

You can feel chuffed and use the word hardcore all you like, but its not hardcore, its stupid and if you enjoy that kind of 'difficulty' then never invite me to your house because I like to sit on chairs, not nails and I watch TV on a quiet evening rather than self flagellate for hours.


----------



## pantomime (Apr 17, 2009)

some rpgs you actually have to run from battle, as soon as you saw that double attack.


----------



## gbaelink (Apr 17, 2009)

It look cool~~must try~


----------



## acoustic.digital (Apr 17, 2009)

those games SATISFY.


----------



## Phynx (Apr 17, 2009)

Finding this, post-haste, those vids on page 1 were hot!


----------



## Canonbeat234 (Apr 17, 2009)

Yeah but I notice one thing about people; they enjoy RPG's that appeals to their taste. So far I had played JRPG's mainly Final Fantasy; RP's in general like Riveria: the Promised Land. and ARPG's like TWEWY. 

Also I did played Legend of YS; Soma Bringer (Act 2) right now. Most of them are always generic depending on the storyline. The gameplay is what really turns a person on/off. 

As far as what the person said about the first battle with the 4 bandits then get pwned with only 1 character left. You wouldn't like Sonic Chronicles since in the very beginning if you don't strategize correctly you will most likely get pwned and may have to grind for a while until you're strong enough to continue.

I didn't play Mother/Earthbound however the difficulty inside that game is beyond hard from what I heard if you're playing it for the first time! I didn't even beat Chrono Trigger first ending because I didn't know where to go after you given the sword to Frog.


----------



## blu9987 (Apr 17, 2009)

Rayder said:
			
		

> Heh, I spent an hour just re-rolling the character stats until I was satisfied with the rolls I got.  I remember way back in the C64 days I would do that too.  Used to drive my friend nuts because he just wanted to get into the game already.



I used to do that then get SUPER ANGRY when i'd accidentally re-roll the one i wanted


----------



## Porkdish (Apr 17, 2009)

Are you #$%ing kidding me.  Sonic Chronicles? That #$%^ is easy as.  To compare its difficulty to this? Laughable.  Etrian Odyssey, heck even 7th Dragon is a cake walk compared to this. If you found Chrono Trigger hard then turn away now.

To the guy who suggested running.  Nice try.  I did that the next time I met them with a new party, 3 members slaughtered, finally succeeded to run with one hit point left on a warrior after 2 rounds.

This game is masochistic.  A few judicious cheats could make it worth sticking around.  I'm sure even suggesting that will make the self flagellants cringe but whatever.


----------



## crook (Apr 17, 2009)

Why in the worl would someone make such a shitty game?


----------



## twisteddeeds (Apr 17, 2009)

this game takes patience and lots of level grinding lol.. the best review ive read for it that describes it perfectly is destructoids


----------



## Isabelyes (Apr 17, 2009)

OMG I LOVE this!

despite my age ( i'm 13, so I haven't got any good memories of those bleck/white D.C ), a high difficulty (thus grinding) is my biggest turn ON,
and I loved Etrian Odyssey (both) and since this is atleast ten times as difficult, i think i'm gonna have a fun time with this little gem.

finally, after march, whose fantastic games (GTA, Pokemon, FFCC EoT, VP etc.) did nothing but dissapoint me, i've got a REAL game.
no kiddy nintendo shit. (reffering to the latest fantastic, but EASY zelda. don't get me wrong, I love nintendo)

well, anyway, for those who still don't know what this game is about:

you're just walking through a labyrinth, fighting enemies, and dying.
A LOT.


----------



## enarky (Apr 17, 2009)

Meh. Don't get me wrong, I love pen & paper RPGs, but when I want to play one I gather a group of friends and do so in the real world. This game is pretty much like a pen & paper rpg, but with _all_ the fun sucked out of it and you have to play alone.


----------



## acoustic.digital (Apr 17, 2009)

Its quite decent. Love the classic mode.
EDIT: 

not a game for everyone. its a dunegon crawler. they tend to be quite hard.


----------



## kesadisan (Apr 17, 2009)

Dang man, i just love these old skool game 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




and my friend furiously said, "You got DS, but you still playing those old skool game"
lol


----------



## sillypatterson (Apr 17, 2009)

Shaking my head.



			
				ryukyus said:
			
		

> Say what. worst game ever why  would anyone play this piece of crap is beyond me, 30 dollars for this what a rip off,you can go online and pllay those kind of crap for free.
> 
> 
> 
> ...











  You people are a disease.  You're why the music industry is full of talentless, shining hacks who all use autotune because 'natural' singing is no longer good enough.  Why "blockbuster" films with a $100 million budget and no genuinity continue to be fiscally worthwhile for the executives who green-light it.  Why the videogame industry pumps out game after game where the majority of the development time and budget goes to graphics and the gameplay is a hollow afterthought.  I'm tired of having entertainment being ruined by shallow demands for "teh graphics" when it comes entirely at the cost of gameplay.

You kids ever read books?  Real ones?  Those don't have graphics at -all-, and manage to evoke more emotions over a longer timespan than movie adaptations ever could.  You're an active participant, and the characters are just as much yours as the author's, as you lend them their voices, mannerisms, and details.  They sometimes even make you think a bit, the horror!

This is the most genuine, atmospheric, engrossing game I've played this generation.  It's true survival horror.  It -engages- the player, but only if the player is willing to be engaged.  The Dark Spire is entirely the game it intends to be, a true labor of love.  

Yes, it's uncompromising in its presentation: those unwilling to exercise their imagination after years of being spoon-fed their bland, by-the-numbers entertainment, desensitised by games with "realistic" graphics where everyone walks away with the same, homogenized experience...they will have a hard time with it.  

It does not hold your hand.  It -will- not hold your hand.  And it's better for it.   Sure, it's a tough game, but some of the complaints I've been reading are pathetic.  Having to grind?  You're doing it so, so wrong.  Sure, in the time I've put in since I picked it up Wednesday, a few characters have died from some bad decisions, but I've never had my whole party wiped.  And I've certainly not done any grinding.  In carefully exploring the dungeon, you take it at its own pace.  If your party isn't prepared to map the whole first floor in one shot (and it just isn't, starting out), you go home, heal, sell off some loot, upgrade your equipment if you can afford it, go to the guild and adjust your spells to match your current needs, see what skills you can learn and if there are any quests you can take on.  Think about your party's strengths and weaknesses and experiment with ways to compensate.  My thief is quite successful in the back row with a longbow, and my priestess is doing great right up front.  And then you save and plow right back in, hopefully having learned from your previous journey.  

When you see that the odds are not in your favor, strategize.  If it's a battle you realize you cannot presently win, you do something about it.  Have your thief (high agility) attempt to escape.  Have the magic users cast buffs on your party, sleep/immobilization on the enemy to increase your odds and decrease your losses.  The game is a learning experience, and it's what you learn that's more important than your characters' levels when it comes to survival and combat.  Just because the majority of modern games present no real risk of failure doesn't mean that choosing to present that risk and make it very real is overdoing it.  If anything, the game tends to lean a bit on the easy side, offering plenty of ways to get the edge on the dungeon.  Heed the warnings signs and err on the side of caution and it'll go a long way.  Make use of your options and just accept that you. will. have. to. think.  While most games reward stubbornly pushing forward, throwing caution to the wind, holding your hand the whole way and kissing it better when you take a little damage, this is a -real- game, and you are the player.

It's nice to be able to enjoy a game that knows what it wants to be and does it so well.  I'm so fucking sick of having games hold my hand, I typically get bored after an hour or two because so many games are so one-sided and pathetically simple.  So keep on hating it, keep watching games continue to -lose- features and gameplay as generations progress, as the development costs for 'hardcore' graphics (fuck that term.) continue to wedge out the meat of gaming.  Can't wait to see how you all react when the little things that -you- enjoy about gaming get destroyed in favor of trying to gather more sales.  I love this little retro revival we seem to be experiencing, at least when they understand what made the great games so great.  I hope this gets a sequel.


----------



## twisteddeeds (Apr 17, 2009)

^^^^^^^ 
NICE RANT


----------



## Isabelyes (Apr 17, 2009)

fantastic rant.

btw, what is AC (the in-game stat)?


----------



## CharAznable (Apr 17, 2009)

sillypatterson said:
			
		

> *SNIP*



You sir are a man among men.


----------



## crook (Apr 17, 2009)

The rant of silkypattachon is pointless. I've played games since C64 and such games like this shit are no games at all.


----------



## Hive Tyrantx (Apr 17, 2009)

this game is a true dungeon crawler, most people won´t like it. but, nobody has to...

anyway, people who could play dungeon hack or similiar for hours with fun shall have a look...


----------



## Rubedo (Apr 17, 2009)

I haven't played the game yet, nor do I really want to - not really my type of game, but all of you morons saying that the game sucks because of "bad graphics" and such are the cancer that is killing hardcore gaming. 

This kind of game isn't for you shallow people, it's for people who enjoy a good challenge and don't feel like being babied and showered with pretty explosions to hold their attention.


----------



## fryguy (Apr 17, 2009)

LOL this looks extremely boring.


----------



## Dratini The Clar (Apr 17, 2009)

Been waiting for this ages!

FINALLY! It's out and I can't wait to put it on my AceKard


----------



## GeekyGuy (Apr 17, 2009)

sillypatterson said:
			
		

> ...You people are a disease.  You're why the music industry is full of talentless, shining hacks who all use autotune because 'natural' singing is no longer good enough....
> 
> You kids ever read books?



First of all, calling other folks "a disease," simply because they don't share your taste (or lack thereof) in games, is horseshit and insulting. 

Secondly, I'm 38, and yes, I read books.

Lastly, games have evolved. The last time I played a game like this, it used ASCII characters for graphics. This was well before Windows. Hell, I was playing games like this on OS9 on my Tandy computer. They were fun as hell...nearly 25 years ago. I'm sure there's still fun to be had here if you're in the mindset to enjoy it. But that doesn't mean folks lack imagination or are "spoon-fed" simply because they demand more from their games these days. That's simply absurd.


----------



## crook (Apr 17, 2009)

Rubedo said:
			
		

> I haven't played the game yet, nor do I really want to - not really my type of game, but all of you morons saying that the game sucks because of "bad graphics" and such are the cancer that is killing hardcore gaming.
> 
> This kind of game isn't for you shallow people, it's for people who enjoy a good challenge and don't feel like being babied and showered with pretty explosions to hold their attention.




What makes you non moron think the people don't like this because of the graphics?


----------



## ZeroTm (Apr 17, 2009)

thats odd . I dont see my location on the map in the tower, and my thief cant attack anymore -.- WTF

BTW the game is fucking great beside of this "glitches"


----------



## SaltyDog (Apr 17, 2009)

It's been a long while since I have taken my DS to bed, played a game until I fell asleep while still playing; I am happy to say this game is worthy of playing to the wee hours of morning until you pass out. DS is now recharging so I can go at it again. The only true downer is that this is likely to be the one and only on the DS while filth like Crystal Chronicles will continue to be pumped out (like I said about the latest one, I'm bored of them). Sure, I didn't cut my teeth on PnP games so this makes it very interesting for me and it is a job well done. Thank you Success!!


----------



## sillypatterson (Apr 17, 2009)

irpacynot said:
			
		

> sillypatterson said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Those aren't glitches at all...just additional layers in the learning process, which is quite intense, but in a more intuitive way than the older games.  

The map is just that:  a map.  In the old days, you used graph paper to block out each cell and took notes and made symbols, the automap does the same, only it does it automatically.  It can be turned off in the options for those who wish to add that additional layer of interactivity, though I chose not to myself.  However, your mage can learn a spell from the very start of the game that enables you to temporarily see both your location and which direction you are facing superimposed over the map.  If you're choosing to go mage-less, I did find an item on the second floor (from a random battle in the gambling hall area, the chest was trapped pretty hard, my thief managed to set it off despite having the Disarmament skill) that would give me the coordinates and direction, which is basically the same 'location' information.

As for your thief not attacking...  I'm going to guess that he's either got a melee weapon but is in the back row (try a bow of some sort), or he went from a two-handed weapon to equipping a shield (which is not compatible with two-handed weapons).  Check his equipment and make sure it's appropriate for his positioning


----------



## ZeroTm (Apr 17, 2009)

Well my thief was always at the secont place and he was able to attack before. I also checked his equipment and he´s wearing his dagger. Guess I should try the bow. Another question: Is there any way to see how strong a weapon is? I dont know if I should keep the claymore for my warrior or buy something else.


----------



## sillypatterson (Apr 17, 2009)

ZeroTm said:
			
		

> Well my thief was always at the secont place and he was able to attack before. I also checked his equipment and he´s wearing his dagger. Guess I should try the bow. Another question: Is there any way to see how strong a weapon is? I dont know if I should keep the claymore for my warrior or buy something else.



Second place is okay for melee, if you're using the 'tactical' formation (assuming you mean he's in the second slot of the four).  Despite loving the claymore as a sword in real life, I felt it was a bit unwieldy for my warrior, though your mileage may vary.  Weapon strength, as far as I can tell, is best correlated by its price and its type comparatively.  Some weapons have different types of attacks available as well; it's something to consider.


----------



## Calafas (Apr 17, 2009)

This is, by far, one of the best DS games i've played in a long time.  There's just so much to it, with so much left to figure out for yourself, the learning curve is quite steep - but its nice to get a challenging DS game for once!
You just cant beat games like this - sure the graphics are simple, but that doesnt really matter, this is such an in depth rpg - does tabletop D&D games have high tec graphics?  NO!

Anyway, to all RPG fans out there, I can't reccomend this highly enough, best RPG game on the DS yet.


----------



## Lactose_Intolera (Apr 17, 2009)

ZeroTm said:
			
		

> thats odd . I dont see my location on the map in the tower, and my thief cant attack anymore -.- WTF
> 
> BTW the game is fucking great beside of this "glitches"




You have to use the mage's spell to see yourself on the map.  Your thief probably got paralyzed.  I believe the spirits on the 2nd floor can do it.


----------



## kjean (Apr 17, 2009)

sillypatterson said:
			
		

> MUSIC BLAH MOVIE BlAH


oh, boy... that's off topic. this is why we need Toni the Great.

btw, this game rocks.


----------



## sfunk (Apr 17, 2009)

isabelyes said:
			
		

> fantastic rant.
> 
> btw, what is AC (the in-game stat)?



It means armor class. The lower the number the harder you are to hit.


----------



## Magus (Apr 17, 2009)

my experience with this
- got excited by comment telling how awesome this game is it
- went trough tutorial
- scratched my head at the fact that the shop offers you no help of "what's better"
- scratched my head when i discovered that the game won't freaking tell you if a weapon is better or worse of what you currently had
- yawned at the somewhat slow combat made even slower by the fact that the game seems to like to throw enemies at you in group of 8
- got enough experience to level up my guys to 3
- scratched my head when one of my guys gained 1 HP (ZOMG THE UPGRADE!) after leveling up
- reached the basement
- got my priest instantkilled by 11 thief enemy
- succesfull runned away
- reached a church
- "can you revive my pal? he got mauled by an horde of ravaging thief" "sure give me a huuuuuuuge pile of gold"
- turned this off disappointed

there is old school and obtuse... etrian might be old school but this game is just obtuse,would it have killed them to put at least actual numbers on item you can equip? why the game doesn't give you these info nor why the HP gain after leveling up is random makes no sense to me besides increasing the game difficulty in an artificial way and make it feel like a chore,especialy when you can save anywhere


----------



## edwardorito (Apr 17, 2009)

COOL! Can't wait to play this! Making it an old-school RPG makes it more interesting. I have got to tell you when I play RPGs I stick with them. Hope it's great!


----------



## Isabelyes (Apr 17, 2009)

many thanks, sfunk!

...i'm so gonna over-use my mage's AC-lowering spell on my allies...

and I love the classic style!
it's just so pure, nothing that distracts you, the enemies are more beautiful IMO,
and everything goes MUCH faster.

wonder if the elevators work like the geomagnetic fields in EO.


----------



## Kreatur84 (Apr 17, 2009)

Did someody know when  DIe Gilde DS  and Quiz Taxi will be released?that are german games,don`t know if they come in engl too.
And what about C.O.R.E. 14th april was release


----------



## Xaintrix (Apr 17, 2009)

Personally I like the lack of visible hard numbers for things like say weapons.  It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure that a longsword is probably going to hurt more than a short dagger.  The game isn't obtuse, you just are trying to rely on crutches that modern gaming conventions have burned into your brain.

A nice dungeon dive shouldn't have to rely on calculus.  Is that sword shinier?  Good, use it.  Go in, find out when you're biting off more than you can chew, run away when ass is getting handed to you..

And oh so worried about the pile of gold it costs to res?  How about trying to save regularly.  Oh wait!  that's right I forgot.  Most games are so damn easy nowadays that missing a save point or thirteen is no problem.  Be grateful that the game lets you save pretty much anywhere.

This game isn't for everyone.  No problem.  Move on.  Go back to FFCC.


----------



## enarky (Apr 17, 2009)

Liking this game dramatically increases your hardcore gamer e-penis. Just saying...


----------



## Magus (Apr 17, 2009)

Xaintrix said:
			
		

> Personally I like the lack of visible hard numbers for things like say weapons.  It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure that a longsword is probably going to hurt more than a short dagger.  The game isn't obtuse, you just are trying to rely on crutches that modern gaming conventions have burned into your brain.
> 
> A nice dungeon dive shouldn't have to rely on calculus.  Is that sword shinier?  Good, use it.  Go in, find out when you're biting off more than you can chew, run away when ass is getting handed to you..
> 
> ...


the shop carries a battle axe and a warhammer for the same price with the same freakin description... how i'm supposed to guess which one is better? what if an enemy drops another weapon and it doesn't look any more shinier than my weapon? is it better or worse? why i have to guess at all? this isn't even about being old-school anymore,even the original dragon quest at least had the decency of telling you the strenght of your equipment

and really doesn't the fact that you can save anywhere just kill all the challenge? there is no risk involved,just a lot of reloading
if the game suddenly decides to send you 16 monster in a single swoop,the game is just a mess but everybody seems to be okay with it because it belongs to a long forgotten genre


----------



## Freudian Lemur (Apr 17, 2009)

Wow, I really am enjoying this game. I'm only 18 but I'd like to think I can still appreciate this as well as modern RPGs (I loved Ring of Fates and am looking forward to playing Tales of Innocence when the patch is done). I particularly enjoy the text in this game, it's sometimes like a cross between a dungeon crawler and a text based adventure.


----------



## N-TG (Apr 18, 2009)

It looks cool...a simple DnD game, well kind of...

But nontheless I will be very excited about it


----------



## Hachibei (Apr 18, 2009)

Well, this is finally out.. now what about the _other_ Atlus game that was supposed to come out on the same day?


----------



## TraumaHoundNDS (Apr 18, 2009)

isabelyes said:
			
		

> btw, what is AC (the in-game stat)?



Haven't fired it up yet but I'd assume it's "Armor Class" (if nearly 30 years of playing D&D helps here...)


----------



## DS1 (Apr 18, 2009)

Hachibei said:
			
		

> Well, this is finally out.. now what about the _other_ Atlus game that was supposed to come out on the same day?



If you mean Dokapon Journey, don't get your hopes up, wait until next week when Fishing Master and A-Train come out.


----------



## Covarr (Apr 18, 2009)

Jei said:
			
		

> When I hear "dungeon crawler" the first thing that comes to my mind is a game of the "fushigi dungeon" kind, like Shiren the Wanderer or Chocobo Dungeon
> Precicely. Well, sort of. I don't associate Mystery Dungeon games with the term "dungeon crawler", but I do love those games. I don't so much love dungeon crawlers, as they strike me as too repetitive and slow. Etrian Odyssey bored me witless, and I'm not even going to bother with this one as I expect it'll do the same.
> 
> Then again, I rather liked Might and Magic 3 on the Sega Genesis. Is this more like that, or Etrian Odyssey?
> ...


Your rant is flawed. People say this game is too difficult, and you call them graphics whores for it. On what planet does that make sense?

There is not some mystical scale that all games fall on, stating that any game is either "Good mechanics with insane difficulty, but also ugly" or "Piss-poor game with fantastic graphics". Some games are all-around terrible, such as _Anubis II_, while others are simultaneously good and good-looking, such as _Kingdom Hearts 2_. Additionally, just because a game is hard doesn't mean it's superior, and easy games aren't necessarily worse. One of the best games ever made, _You Have To Burn The Rope_, is quite easy.


----------



## DS1 (Apr 18, 2009)

Covarr said:
			
		

> Jei said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Those 'fushigi dungeon' games are usually called roguelikes. Shiren, Pokemon Dungeon, Izuna, etc. Dark Spire isn't nearly as boring as Etrian Odyssey, but you won't like it. It has great graphics and music, but it is a twisty first-person dungeon-type game, which can get old fast if you don't like wasting hours on a single game. 

Like I said earlier in the thread, I wish Atlus Japan (I know they didn't create Dark Spire, but they did make EO and SMT) would just make a new Shin Megami Tensei and release it for the DS. It wouldn't be so easy that all these whiners would complain about it being too easy, and it wouldn't be so hard that only people who need to die 100 times (or almost 100 times, depending on how arrogant you are) would play it. It'd have an awesome atmosphere, the music would probably be pretty good, the graphics wouldn't upset anyone, and most importantly people would stop making claims of:
A) Atlus only makes lame animu games (sorry, but that's what sells) and 
B) Atlus ruined SMT


----------



## adzix (Apr 18, 2009)

this looks really tempting.
is it similar to Dungeon Master/Chaos Strikes Back for Amiga 500 in terms of difficulty?
anyways, i think the video i saw sold me for it, plus it comes with the soundtrack, which is 
really nice for a ds game.


----------



## adzix (Apr 18, 2009)

a nice read for those interested in the game

http://www.siliconera.com/2009/04/14/atlus...the-dark-spire/


----------



## Ruri (Apr 18, 2009)

Xaintrix said:
			
		

> Personally I like the lack of visible hard numbers for things like say weapons.  It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure that a longsword is probably going to hurt more than a short dagger.  The game isn't obtuse, you just are trying to rely on crutches that modern gaming conventions have burned into your brain.


It also means that you get to experiment with new items that you find in the dungeon to figure out their powers.  For instance, if you find a Kris, did you know they do double damage to undead?  And they're light enough that even a low-level fighter can get two hits with them.  (That's in addition to their listed power of raising your magic resistance, of course.)  Very useful, and it was much more fun to discover that myself than to just see everything an item does listed flat-out.

Also, if you're low on gold, sell your potions and antidotes.  They sell for 125 gold and aren't really necessary.  You can use 10 gold Snake Oil to heal poison (just make sure you bring a lot, since it fails about half the time.)

And if you're having trouble, set your party to hero mode with a fighter in the front, and spend all your money on boosting his AC.  You only have to focus on one person's armor that way, and in the long run a fighter can get better AC than anyone else anyway...  even if you try for a more aggressive party, you'll get ambushed at some point, so it's better to just have a tough armored fighter exposed.  Give everyone else bows or staves.  (Your thief can also attack from the back row with any weapon if you have them 'hide' first, though that means they only attack every other turn because they have to keep re-hiding.)


----------



## kjean (Apr 18, 2009)

Jesus Random Christ:
Sometime it gives you 10 or more pts. of HP when you leveling up your character but most of time 1 or 2 or 3. It makes me orz, and load and do it again... and orz.


----------



## JupiterJazz5th (Apr 18, 2009)

Uhh ok I have decided to try this game since yesterday after reading this thread & seems like Dark Spire is the Contra 4 of Dungeon Crawlers (In my view).

Now I need some help in the game & I hope some of ya can help a fella out.
1st: Why can't some of my characters attack? I have a level 1 warrior dwarf with long sword equipped & I can't even do anything except defense.
2nd: Is priest only for Human race?
3rd: How does AC works?
4th: Does the alignments do anything to the characters or something?
5th: Is there a website for learning all this stuff before I play this dungeon crawler?

Well that's all I wanna know so if any one can shed some light on my case will be greatly appreciated by me.
Thank you.


----------



## shakirmoledina (Apr 18, 2009)

i totally don't like these kinda games but i am gonna try it becuz it is the best of it's kind


----------



## badgerkins (Apr 18, 2009)

JupiterJazz5th said:
			
		

> Uhh ok I have decided to try this game since yesterday after reading this thread & seems like Dark Spire is the Contra 4 of Dungeon Crawlers (In my view).
> 
> Now I need some help in the game & I hope some of ya can help a fella out.
> 1st: Why can't some of my characters attack? I have a level 1 warrior dwarf with long sword equipped & I can't even do anything except defense.
> ...



1. some weapons can't be used if your character is in the back row. an orange icon by the character means its in the font row and a blue icon means its in the back. you can toggle your formations about in the menu screen or guild screen.

2. any race. you can have a dwarf priest.

3. the lower your ac, the more likely you'll dodge attacks. don't know if it affects how much damage you receive from hits.

4. some spells are exclusive to either lawful or chaotic. don't know what else.

5. i checked out gamefaqs.


----------



## Isabelyes (Apr 18, 2009)

@JupiterJazz5th:

1: I think some weapons only work on the front/back line.
check it's description for some hints.

2riest is AFAIK a class for lawful adventurers only. 
(I spent hours trying to make my Elf a Priest...)

don't know about the rest of your questions... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			







but I don't think EO was more boring than this game. I find both (EO 1/2 and The D.S.) non-boring. (err...)


----------



## pantomime (Apr 18, 2009)

I have a chaotic human priest


----------



## Isabelyes (Apr 18, 2009)

oh...
hmm that's strange.
my elf couldn't become a priest, even though she had 16(!) INT...


----------



## daquiri (Apr 18, 2009)

priests have to be either lawful or chaotic, neutral doesnt work

in order to make an elf priest you have to create the elf with a different class and go pray at one of the temples, after some time you should change your alignment


----------



## Isabelyes (Apr 18, 2009)

alright, thanks.

though this won't help me (i'm already pretty far), i'm sure others will like it!


----------



## Karmatic (Apr 18, 2009)

This game rocks! Finally a reason to use my DS again! It's been collecting dust since I got tired of Shiren 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	






			
				Rayder said:
			
		

> It's an "old-school" RPG.  You young whippersnappers just wouldn't understand.  Definitely not a game for everyone.
> 
> Believe me, you younger gamers would scoff at all the old-school RPG's of my youth.  Just as I tend to scoff at many of the games you guys like.  It's a generation gap thing.



The young whippersnappers like easy games with anime art marketed to the under 10 crowd


----------



## DS1 (Apr 18, 2009)

Karmatic said:
			
		

> This game rocks! Finally a reason to use my DS again! It's been collecting dust since I got tired of Shiren
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Those young whippersnappers will eat me alive at Pokemon. Remembering 100s of different characters, all of their stats, abilities, strengths, weaknesses, endlessly leveling them up. You're all just sour, stop complaining and play the game if you like it so much.


----------



## NaYa (Apr 19, 2009)

Whoa, this game is so old school, yet the designs are pretty modern. The art style actually reminds me of TWEWY.
Mmmmmm...


----------



## Karmatic (Apr 19, 2009)

DS1 said:
			
		

> Those young whippersnappers will eat me alive at Pokemon. Remembering 100s of different characters, all of their stats, abilities, strengths, weaknesses, endlessly leveling them up. You're all just sour, stop complaining and play the game if you like it so much.



You can download a .sav file that makes you competitive at Pokemon I thought?


----------



## gramin (Apr 19, 2009)

Does anyone else encounter some slowdown whenever you turn around a corner that has a long hall or something. It didn't take me long to get deeper into F1 before this problem started appearing, only when I was turning on corners though.

Maybe it's just how they animated though.


----------



## Ruri (Apr 19, 2009)

Huh.  The stuffed parrot that they sell in the gambling den is an accessory that grants -1 AC.  That's useful to know if you can't afford Choker Necklaces for your whole front line.


----------



## DS1 (Apr 19, 2009)

Karmatic said:
			
		

> DS1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Yeah, I don't know what young kids play Pokemon on their flashcard, except in Hong Kong of course.


----------



## Ruri (Apr 20, 2009)

Also, you need a charisma of at least 10 to be a Paladin.  And it seems to be impossible to raise your charisma after chargen by any means.  Dammit.

...nevermind the rest of how you become a Paladin, you'll know when the time comes.  But if you have anyone you want to multiclass Cleric / Fighter, make sure they start with at least 10 Charisma, or they will be _screwed_.


----------



## aragon (Apr 20, 2009)

I'm really enjoying this game so far.

Has anybody a clue where I can find the robber's hideout?


----------



## adzix (Apr 20, 2009)

my copy hasn't arrived yet :/
and i dont wanna play it on my flashcard.
for some reason that even i dont know, i am so psyched about this game, i can't wait to get my hands on it


----------



## daquiri (Apr 20, 2009)

aragon said:
			
		

> I'm really enjoying this game so far.
> 
> Has anybody a clue where I can find the robber's hideout?


it is behind a secret door in the wall in the dark area of level 1 that can only be accessed from level 2


----------



## aragon (Apr 21, 2009)

daquiri said:
			
		

> aragon said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Great! I really love that this game is unlike many other games not always pointing out the most obvious things.
Really hated Midna in TP always telling me what I had already figured out...


----------



## Nethalite (Apr 24, 2009)

This game is pretty fun considering its D&D type. I was just finish playing the "Eye of the Beholder" series on PC a couple months back. I was totally amazed that this game would have same if not similar ideas on the NDS, I also like "Mazes of Fate" as well. The only thing I really didn't understand in "Dark Spire" is that some rooms are empty and the secret hidden door you found turns out to be a empty room if you toss the random encounter out. :\


----------



## Isabelyes (Apr 28, 2009)

I'm sorry for reviving this thread,
but can anone tell me how many floors this game has?


----------



## TraumaHoundNDS (Apr 29, 2009)

isabelyes said:
			
		

> I'm sorry for reviving this thread,
> but can anone tell me how many floors this game has?



While I can't confirm the floor-count I picked this up yesterday at Fry's and based on the soundtrack listing at least 7 floors (plus a "mid-boss" and "The Unknown".)


----------

