# Wikileaks reveals shocking documents.



## Vidboy10 (Nov 28, 2010)

Whistle-blowing website Wikileaks has released extracts from secret messages sent by US embassies which give an insight into current global concerns. They include reports of some Arab leaders - including Saudi Arabia's King Abdullah - urging the US to attack Iran and end its nuclear weapons programme. Other concerns include the security of Pakistani nuclear material that could be used to make an atomic weapon.
The widespread use of computer hacking by China's government is also reported. The US government condemned the release of the documents, which number in the hundreds of thousands, saying they put the lives of diplomats and others at risk.

The founder of Wikileaks, Julian Assange, countered by saying the US authorities were afraid of being held to account. The leaked US embassy cables, published at length in newspapers including the New York Times and the UK's Guardian, also reportedly include accounts of:

Iran attempting to adapt North Korean rockets for use as long-range missiles

Corruption within the Afghan government, with concerns heightened when a senior official was found to be carrying more than $50m in cash on a foreign trip

Bargaining to empty the Guantanamo Bay prison camp - including Slovenian diplomats being told to take in a freed prisoner if they wanted to secure a meeting with President Barack Obama

Germany being warned in 2007 not to enforce arrest warrants for US Central Intelligence Agency officers involved in an operation in which an innocent German citizen with the same name as a suspected militant was abducted and held in Afghanistan

US officials being instructed to spy on the UN's leadership by Secretary of State Hillary Clinton

The very close relationship between Russian PM Vladimir Putin and his Italian counterpart Silvio Berlusconi
Alleged links between the Russian government and organised crime

Yemen's president talking to then US Mid-East commander General David Petraeus about attacks on Yemeni al-Qaeda bases and saying: "We'll continue saying the bombs are ours, not yours"

Criticism of UK politicians including Prime Minister David Cameron

Faltering US attempts to prevent Syria from supplying arms to Hezbollah in Lebanon

The leaked embassy cables are both contemporary and historical, and include a 1989 note from a US diplomat in Panama City musing about the options open to Panamanian leader Manuel Noriega and referring to him as "a master of survival" - the author apparently had no idea that US forces would invade a week later and arrest Noriega.
In a statement, the White House said: "Such disclosures put at risk our diplomats, intelligence professionals, and people around the world who come to the United States for assistance in promoting democracy and open government.

"President Obama supports responsible, accountable, and open government at home and around the world, but this reckless and dangerous action runs counter to that goal."

Earlier, Wikileaks said it had come under attack from a computer-hacking operation.

"We are currently under a mass distributed denial of service attack," it reported on its Twitter feed.

No-one has been charged with passing the diplomatic files to the website but suspicion has fallen on US Army private Bradley Manning, an intelligence analyst arrested in Iraq in June and charged over an earlier leak of classified US documents to Mr Assange's organisation. Wikileaks argues that the site's previous releases shed light on the wars in Afghanistan and Iraq.[/p]




*Source*

Wow, Just wow.....


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## Warrior522 (Nov 28, 2010)

Ladies and gentlemen, I give you the catalyst of WWIII.

TO THE BUNKER!!!

(EoF)


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## worlok375 (Nov 28, 2010)

This just got real.


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## _Chaz_ (Nov 28, 2010)

Alright, That's it.

*We're fucked.*


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## trumpet-205 (Nov 28, 2010)

Time to dig some bunker and hide inside.


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## Knyaz Vladimir (Nov 28, 2010)

Gun? Check. Gas mask? Check. Bunker? Check.

Hey, U.S.- *BRING IT ON.*


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## DaMummy (Nov 28, 2010)

the us is attacking canananadia? how much oil could you possibly have?


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## Westside (Nov 28, 2010)

DaMummy said:
			
		

> the us is attacking canananadia? how much oil could you possibly have?


I hope you're joking.


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## 431unknown (Nov 28, 2010)

I like how it's ok for the government to spy on you and what your doing but as soon as some dirt leaks out on their dirty little deeds it's a bad thing. If I did the shit that they are doing I'd fear for my life too.
They sit behind their thrones in DC and have the nerve to tell us what we are doing is wrong, yet we are not the ones conspiring to throw the world in to a climate on civil unrest and possibly another world war. This country needs an enema. Badly.

Edit-spelling


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## The Pi (Nov 28, 2010)

wikileaks=terrorists apparently.


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## T-hug (Nov 28, 2010)

Roll on 2012!


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## mameks (Nov 28, 2010)

Kewl :3
tl;dr: We're all gonna fucking die


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## Gore (Nov 28, 2010)

Fuck WikiLeaks and fuck Julian Assange.


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## I am r4ymond (Nov 28, 2010)

Whoops, there goes mankind.


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## ManFranceGermany (Nov 28, 2010)

Wikileaks is getting like a sickness. Informations are good and its important we know, but not if this means that countries and people live in danger.


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## monkat (Nov 28, 2010)

Iran attempting to adapt North Korean rockets for use as long-range missiles
*Should be leaked.*
Corruption within the Afghan government, with concerns heightened when a senior official was found to be carrying more than $50m in cash on a foreign trip

Bargaining to empty the Guantanamo Bay prison camp - including Slovenian diplomats being told to take in a freed prisoner if they wanted to secure a meeting with President Barack Obama
*Strong-arm tactics, while not looked well upon, are sometimes necessary. Not saying they are here, and securing a meeting with an official is most certainly not something that needs to be bargained for.*
Germany being warned in 2007 not to enforce arrest warrants for US Central Intelligence Agency officers involved in an operation in which an innocent German citizen with the same name as a suspected militant was abducted and held in Afghanistan
*The USA asked Germany to forgive a mistake on their part. Nothing is said about the compensation the man did or did not receive. Mistakes happen. Is it acceptable? No. Is it unavoidable? Sometimes.*
US officials being instructed to spy on the UN's leadership by Secretary of State Hillary Clinton
*I'm not going to be the most popular guy here, but I don't see anything wrong with spying. It's a spatial world - no matter what you do, you will take up space, and light will reflect off of you. The only thing that changes is that someone else sees it.*
The very close relationship between Russian PM Vladimir Putin and his Italian counterpart Silvio Berlusconi
Alleged links between the Russian government and organised crime
*Not really related to the USA, so I don't know about it.*
Yemen's president talking to then US Mid-East commander General David Petraeus about attacks on Yemeni al-Qaeda bases and saying: "We'll continue saying the bombs are ours, not yours"
*It doesn't sound nice, but publicity is a big thing in a democracy. How is it possible to continue any sort of popularity when your actions just say "Bomb bomb bomb!"? Yemen is receiving aid in exchange.*
Criticism of UK politicians including Prime Minister David Cameron
*....K?*
Faltering US attempts to prevent Syria from supplying arms to Hezbollah in Lebanon
*Wait, so you mean the USA isn't doing a perfect job or something?! This must be reported!*
[/p]


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## Depravo (Nov 28, 2010)

http://www.techradar.com/news/internet/aus...ite-list-585894


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## fgghjjkll (Nov 28, 2010)

Jesus Christ... What is the world coming to?
I feel like migrating to a perfect world.


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## DeMoN (Nov 28, 2010)

I'm surprised the CIA hasn't assassinated this guy already.


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## Joe88 (Nov 28, 2010)

Depravo said:
			
		

> http://www.techradar.com/news/internet/aus...ite-list-585894


that was a year in a half ago...

anyway im surprised the creator / owner hasnt been arrested yet
he is already wanted for [email protected] in a few countries and this is just treason for the most part in many nations


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## Deleted User (Nov 28, 2010)

Knyaz Vladimir said:
			
		

> Gun? Check. Gas mask? Check. Bunker? Check.
> 
> Hey, U.S.- *BRING IT ON.*


Army...........Uncheck?


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## fgghjjkll (Nov 28, 2010)

DeMoN said:
			
		

> I'm surprised the CIA hasn't assassinated this guy already.


Isn't Assange being tried for [censored] or something?


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## Depravo (Nov 28, 2010)

Joe88 said:
			
		

> Depravo said:
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Ah, I just saw it in a tweet and assumed it was part of the current Wikileaks scandal. That'll teach me to not look at dates.


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## 431unknown (Nov 28, 2010)

DeMoN said:
			
		

> I'm surprised the CIA hasn't assassinated this guy already.




I'm sure a plans in the works now.


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## Knyaz Vladimir (Nov 28, 2010)

brandonspikes said:
			
		

> Knyaz Vladimir said:
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Page 256... Army... Yeah, that's the one thing we're missing. A decent army, and a normal straightforward majority government. (i.e. The Conservatives need more seats)


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## ThatDudeWithTheFood (Nov 28, 2010)

Waits for 71st censored site by the Us.


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## Infinite Zero (Nov 28, 2010)

ThatDudeWithTheFood said:
			
		

> Waits for 71st censored site by the Us.








Awesome


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## Advi (Nov 28, 2010)

ThatDudeWithTheFood said:
			
		

> Waits for 71st censored site by the Us.


Those were just one torrent site and a bunch of shady spam sites; I really doubt they could handle the bullshit they'd get from censoring this.


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## redact (Nov 28, 2010)

fgghjjkll said:
			
		

> Jesus Christ... What is the world coming to?
> I feel like migrating to a perfect world.


after a lot of searching i have located the oncee-lost 'utopia'

it is located in my left shoe


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## Deleted User (Nov 28, 2010)

Knyaz Vladimir said:
			
		

> brandonspikes said:
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Sorry was just joking around 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.


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## Pliskron (Nov 28, 2010)

I think the liquidation of Julian Assange would send the right message. Our government is obviously too inept to do the job. I hope this clown leaks some Israeli docs. He'd last all of five minutes before the Mossad would kick down his door and stop the leaks forever.


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## Westside (Nov 28, 2010)

431unknown said:
			
		

> I like how it's ok for the government to spy on you and what your doing but as soon as some dirt leaks out on their dirty little deeds it's a bad thing. If I did the shit that they are doing I'd fear for my life too.
> They sit behind their thrones in DC and have the nerve to tell us what we are doing is wrong, yet we are not the ones conspiring to throw the world in to a climate on civil unrest and possibly another world war. This country needs an enema. Badly.
> 
> Edit-spelling


Americans are known around the world for not trusting their government at all.  The people of the states view their government as evil at the first possible evidence without a strong support backing them up.  There is a line, and the state needs to keep certain things secret or else it could induce dangerous situation with other states, most of the time these information are kept secret so that the citizens are protected.  Not too many people are willing to sit down and think of this from the government's perspective.


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## Midna (Nov 28, 2010)

Knyaz Vladimir said:
			
		

> Gun? Check. *Gas mask?* Check. Bunker? Check.








Also, as soon as the conservatives gain a majority, the copyright laws are going to be forced through.


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## Black_Knight_666 (Nov 28, 2010)

Someone should really shut down this website. (wikileak)


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## MEGAMANTROTSKY (Nov 28, 2010)

Black_Knight_666 said:
			
		

> Someone should really shut down this website. (wikileak)



And why is that? Please elaborate, if you would.


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## ManFranceGermany (Nov 28, 2010)

Pliskron said:
			
		

> I think the liquidation of Julian Assange would send the right message. Our government is obviously too inept to do the job. I hope this clown leaks some Israeli docs. He'd last all of five minutes before the Mossad would kick down his door and stop the leaks forever.



Why? It just shows what your Government thinks about our Governments.
I don't agree with everything Wleaks does, but the truth is better than a lie and your Government lied a lot the last years.


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## DeadLocked (Nov 28, 2010)

MEGAMANTROTSKY said:
			
		

> Black_Knight_666 said:
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Not only does the US citizens and allies have this information, but the entire world has access to these documents now.
EDIT: And even if these particular leaks aren't crippling, if they leak something more sensitive this could cause "deep shit" for everyone.


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## monkat (Nov 28, 2010)

ManFranceGermany said:
			
		

> Pliskron said:
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Lies of omission aren't really lies if they're designed to protect.


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## _Chaz_ (Nov 28, 2010)

fgghjjkll said:
			
		

> Jesus Christ... What is the world coming to?
> I feel like migrating to a perfect world.





Spoiler











Here you go. Just try not to be too noisy while migrating, people are sleeping.


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## dragon574444 (Nov 28, 2010)

Crazy stuff. Stuff like this and the attack on South Korea are not what we need right now.


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## ManFranceGermany (Nov 28, 2010)

monkat said:
			
		

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what about the protection of people living in other countries, like Iran?
This people have the same right of security like u and me.
Not to forget that your Government said Iraq has Mass destruction Weapons, which was a lie too.


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## OrR (Nov 28, 2010)

DeMoN said:
			
		

> I'm surprised the CIA hasn't assassinated this guy already.


That would be the point at which I'd call people together to go burn some American flags. Coming from the middle of Europe, that would generate some embarassing TV imagery. Also, some more competent people might be provoked into thinking about how to kill Americans in large numbers. The CIA probably want to avoid that.


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## _Chaz_ (Nov 28, 2010)

dragon574444 said:
			
		

> Crazy stuff. Stuff like this and the attack on South Korea are not what we need right now.


I don't believe that this kind of thing is ever needed, or even remotely wanted by most.


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## SubliminalSegue (Nov 28, 2010)

This really, honestly, isn't surprising. And frankly, I'm not worried. What I'm more concerned about is why our US government is too big of a weeping pussy to alarm it's citizens. Yeah, it'll cause riots, but at least they aren't...I dunno, LYING to us. 

Everytime I read shit like this, I shrug it off. No, it doesn't mean WWIII, it doesn't mean that nukes are going to go off...as the infamous George Carlin once said, (and it's not a direct quote, mind you) "it's a war based off who can build bigger phallus shaped rocket. It all comes down to who has the biggest dick." 

It's stupid. If we shut down other nukes, more will show up. If we don't, people will still complain that they're gonna die.

Shut up, sit down, and enjoy life. Stop worrying about every little thing.


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## Pliskron (Nov 29, 2010)

All the leaks consist of obvious assessments and idle gossip. It's the motives of wikileaks that need to be called into question. Julian Assange has already said he wants to do damage to the US. Since past leaks were so forgettable I don't see anything very damaging here. Any policy wonk will tell you the same stuff as in these leaks. Julian Assange wants to be a star plan and simple. These docs have nothing of use to anyone no matter what side you're on.


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## MEGAMANTROTSKY (Nov 29, 2010)

Pliskron said:
			
		

> All the leaks consist of obvious assessments and idle gossip. It's the motives of wikileaks that need to be called into question. Julian Assange has already said he wants to do damage to the US. Since past leaks were so forgettable I don't see anything very damaging here. Any policy wonk will tell you the same stuff as in these leaks. Julian Assange wants to be a star plan and simple. These docs have nothing of use to anyone no matter what side you're on.



I disagree with your assessment of the documents. I find them very useful for exposing the criminality of the American bourgeoisie and the state. Wikileaks is not, of course, without their faults, but calling their motives into question is useless (as far as I can see, it is muckraking). What they have revealed needs to examined and put under the microscope. It is the American government and their enablers that needs to be "called into question."


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## monkat (Nov 29, 2010)

MEGAMANTROTSKY said:
			
		

> It is the American government and their enablers that needs to be "called into question."



I'm not sure what needs to be questioned? Potential motives for each thing are pretty easily predicted.


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## SubliminalSegue (Nov 29, 2010)

monkat said:
			
		

> MEGAMANTROTSKY said:
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.......Reeeeeeeealllyy...... 

As Ricky would say "You got some 'splainin to do."


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## Canonbeat234 (Nov 29, 2010)

Pliskron said:
			
		

> All the leaks consist of obvious assessments and idle gossip. It's the motives of wikileaks that need to be called into question. Julian Assange has already said he wants to do damage to the US. Since past leaks were so forgettable I don't see anything very damaging here. Any policy wonk will tell you the same stuff as in these leaks. Julian Assange wants to be a star plan and simple. These docs have nothing of use to anyone no matter what side you're on.



A 'fucking' men! There's a reason why the truth of 9/11 came out a few years later and not like in 2002. The information was too sensitive and it would have cause a backlash at the government for not protecting the American people. Why do we depend on them so much? Sure the government keeps the balances in check, I can't say the government did any useful besides that Health Reform...or going to the military for that matter.


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## MEGAMANTROTSKY (Nov 29, 2010)

monkat said:
			
		

> MEGAMANTROTSKY said:
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I should have been more specific. What needs to be questioned is not simply why there is a war in the Middle East based on false and manipulated testimony, but in whose interests the war is being waged. In response to the USA's declining economic position, the elite of American capitalism is required to expand into other territories, whether those territories want them to or not. Meanwhile, while this elite (the bourgeoisie) is reaping record profits off of the corpse of the their economic opponents and their workers, the media needs to invent justification to forestall an uprising. Several hundred war crimes later, Assange and his organization reveals the truth of these crimes to the general public. Of course, I don't mean to make it sound so simple. There are far more factors involved than what I just listed.

I disagree that these "potential motives pretty easily predicted." The acquisition of super-profits cannot, in the end, explain all of this. Certainly profit is a motive, but above all we should be looking at how far the state and the bourgeoisie will go in order to continue this cycle. Even as we speak, the Obama administration is seeking a way to filter the internet in a way similar to the Chinese state. I assure you that it is not being considered for the interest of the American citizen.


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## smellyunicorn (Nov 29, 2010)

Treason is still a capital crime....right?


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## MEGAMANTROTSKY (Nov 29, 2010)

smellyunicorn said:
			
		

> Treason is still a capital crime....right?


What do you mean?


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## Law (Nov 29, 2010)

smellyunicorn said:
			
		

> Treason is still a capital crime....right?



The guy who runs WikiLeaks isn't American, nor does he live in America.

"In law, treason is the crime that covers some of the more serious acts of betrayal of one's sovereign or nation."

Unless you mean members of the government being convicted of treason, which is probably a whole different barrel of apples.


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## misteromar (Nov 29, 2010)

I salute Julian Assange and everyone brave enough to provide wikileaks with docs. Its all stuff anyone with half a brain knows is going on, buts good to have the proof out there and main stream media attention.

I still want to know what is in the insurance file.


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## RiderLeangle (Nov 29, 2010)

trumpet-205 said:
			
		

> Time to dig some bunker and hide inside.
> QUOTE(Knyaz Vladimir @ Nov 28 2010, 05:13 PM) Gun? Check. Gas mask? Check. Bunker? Check.
> 
> Hey, U.S.- *BRING IT ON.*



Just got to wonder... If there was some kind of war wiping out humanity... Would you even want to live through that?.. You'd be bored out of your damn mind with everything being destroyed...


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## TLSS_N (Nov 29, 2010)

I assume that, within the coming week.. we will have a finger on who actually launched stuxnet. my guess would probably be that, it was coded by the bush admin, and given to israel shortly before B.O. gained power, That way they knew it would  be used if it need to be.


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## wyndcrosser (Nov 29, 2010)

I want to throw my two cents in here.

The information on wikileaks isn't even 100% or even 5% correct, or even valuable intelligence. I was a (erased) for 6yrs, both on the infantry and on higher echelons. Intelligence reports and such documents are those written up by CI specialist (Counter Intel), these reports are from local sources, etc. The sources are not always reliable or even 1% accurate and even we in the field take those individuals with a grain of salt. The fact that these got released as well as SIGACT dairies, is nothing big if you understand the material and what goes into it.



			
				QUOTE said:
			
		

> I assume that, within the coming week.. we will have a finger on who actually launched stuxnet. my guess would probably be that, it was coded by the bush admin, and given to israel shortly before B.O. gained power, That way they knew it would be used if it need to be.



People like you are what cause topics like this to blow up past one page, if you don't understand the world you live in, please don't attempt to document it to the world, and prove to others you are clueless.

It's not funny.

Wynd


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## TLSS_N (Nov 29, 2010)

wyndcrosser said:
			
		

> The Living Shadow said:
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do you remember when bush meat up with obama to talk about national security for a couple of hours? could he have informed him about this in advance perhaps? it's to early to tell, like I said. I was making an educated guess.


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## Maz7006 (Nov 29, 2010)

QUOTE said:
			
		

> Faltering US attempts to prevent Syria from supplying arms to Hezbollah in Lebanon


Wrong 

more like Iran. 

Just sayin.


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## Deleted-188346 (Nov 29, 2010)

Eh, did anybody really think that ANY government is squeaky clean? That there are no dodgy dealings going on? Or ethically questionable activities aren't going on in the background?

This shit is always happening, and nobody has the power to reveal it, stop it, or prevent it.

Now, let's all play some Nintendo.


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## Midna (Nov 29, 2010)

But what dirty secrets does Nintendo have, eh?


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## MEGAMANTROTSKY (Nov 29, 2010)

wyndcrosser said:
			
		

> I want to throw my two cents in here.
> 
> The information on wikileaks isn't even 100% or even 5% correct, or even valuable intelligence. I was a (erased) for 6yrs, both on the infantry and on higher echelons. Intelligence reports and such documents are those written up by CI specialist (Counter Intel), these reports are from local sources, etc. The sources are not always reliable or even 1% accurate and even we in the field take those individuals with a grain of salt. The fact that these got released as well as SIGACT dairies, is nothing big if you understand the material and what goes into it.
> 
> ...



I disagree with your assessment of the evidence. If the information on Wikileaks was not accurate or valuable, why did the US government feel that they had to launch a smear campaign that culminated in fabricated [censored] charges against Assange in Sweden? I argue that the documents are "valuable intelligence" mainly because they reveal the extent of the US state's imperialist foreign policy that include involvement from some of the highest officials in the government. US imperialism, built upon lies, intrigue and subterfuge, has benefited nobody but the US state and their numerous corporate allies.


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## Goli (Nov 29, 2010)

Midna said:
			
		

> But what dirty secrets does Nintendo have, eh?


They killed Gunpei Yokoi.


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## Stevetry (Nov 29, 2010)

wikipedia burns in hell crap site


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## shakirmoledina (Nov 29, 2010)

remember this is all info from US... we cant say everything is 100% correct
most of it doesnt have proof


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## MEGAMANTROTSKY (Nov 29, 2010)

shakirmoledina said:
			
		

> remember this is all info from US... we cant say everything is 100% correct
> most of it doesnt have proof



And how is that?


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## emigre (Nov 29, 2010)

Does anyone else think its a tad funny, in how this confirms a lot of what we were thinking?


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## Ace (Nov 29, 2010)

MEGAMANTROTSKY said:
			
		

> in fabricated *[censored]* charges against Assange in Sweden?


In a thread about an anti-censorship website, why would it be a good idea to censor the R-word?


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## Vulpes Abnocto (Nov 29, 2010)

Our policy on that word might change eventually, when people learn not to use it so flippantly.


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## MEGAMANTROTSKY (Nov 29, 2010)

Vulpes Abnocto said:
			
		

> Our policy on that word might change eventually, when people learn not to use it so flippantly.


Are you implying that I used it flippantly?


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## Law (Nov 29, 2010)

MEGAMANTROTSKY said:
			
		

> Vulpes Abnocto said:
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no he's just saying that people use it all the time when it isn't really appropriate.


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## Vulpes Abnocto (Nov 29, 2010)

Are you implying this censoring of the word was put in place due to you?

Of course I'm not referring to you.


It seems to be a habit among many young gamers to use the word to describe their awesome win,
hence why it became a problem in a community mostly made up of young gamers.


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## MEGAMANTROTSKY (Nov 29, 2010)

Vulpes Abnocto said:
			
		

> Are you implying this censoring of the word was put in place due to you?
> 
> Of course I'm not referring to you.



I apologize. Though it's hardly an excuse, I had some previous experiences on the xkcd forums that colored my judgment when I noticed the censor.


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## Deleted-188346 (Nov 30, 2010)

wyndcrosser said:
			
		

> I want to throw my two cents in here.
> 
> The information on wikileaks isn't even 100% or even 5% correct, or even valuable intelligence. I was a (erased) for 6yrs, both on the infantry and on higher echelons. Intelligence reports and such documents are those written up by CI specialist (Counter Intel), these reports are from local sources, etc. The sources are not always reliable or even 1% accurate and even we in the field take those individuals with a grain of salt. The fact that these got released as well as SIGACT dairies, is nothing big if you understand the material and what goes into it.
> 
> ...



When I'm in the field (on gbatemp, lol), I take individuals who claim to be fantastic ex-military intelligence officers with a grain of salt.

Also, your argument is flawed, just because documents MAY come from unreputable sources in SOME circumstances, doesn't actually mean that this document did. And even if it did, does that mean that every word is a lie? If it wasn't true in any way, then why would the government react the way it did? Couldn't the government disprove it in a second if it was all lies?

I mean, I'm also a skeptical person, and this document may very well be fake, but think up a better argument next time.
In the end, the government gets up to naughty things. All governments do. Way more naughty things than we'll ever know about.


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## tsol (Nov 30, 2010)

Reading this.. all I could think was, "Well.. yeah.."

Nothing remotely surprising, just not something you like to see confirmed. Just like the last batch of files that included the deaths of thousands of Iraqi and Afghan civilians. We all new, it was just that our media will report the death of 1 us soldier before it reports the deaths of a thousand Iraqi civilians.

If these leaks are anything like the last ones, everyone will purposefully forget that they ever came out in the first place and continue being willfully ignorant so long as we get to live in comfort and not think of all the crimes that are being committed to so that we may do so.

edit: I also wanted to point out that this is really low security stuff. Any kid can get a secret clearance when joining the army. All private Bradley did was copy the files over to a CD and went home to leak them. He literally just told his coworkers he was listening to Lady Gaga so they would let him put the CD in the machine (A huge security breach by the way, Private Bradley shouldn't be put away, his IASO should be). Anyway, If this is the secret stuff, Imagine what the Top and higher reports must be like.


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## Crass (Nov 30, 2010)

WikiLeaks is what happens when the entire US government is forced to go through a full-body scanner.


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## Fudge (Nov 30, 2010)

Shit! We're doomed!


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## Searinox (Nov 30, 2010)

I love them. I absolutely love them like I do few things in life. If I had money I'd donate to them. If they forshamed me someday and I'd still support them. I believe them to be one of the most powerful democratic forces in history! I fully support everything they've done and I do not believe to date ONE person was jeopardized, injured, or killed from the documents they've released. They're as damn close as they can get to being my heroes!

Let me be clear that this isn't about the US alone. The indiscriminate whistleblowing of corrupt, embarassing, and scandalous actions perpetrated by whatever organizations around the world is as noble an ideal and as laudable to stand up to first ammendments in constitutions around the world as possible. It should be universally lauded. They deserve all the recognition and support in the world!


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## Son of Science (Dec 1, 2010)

Fox News is funding North Korea


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## trumpet-205 (Dec 1, 2010)

I like Wikileak, because for years governments have been withholding information to people. Our founding father (US) wanted a transparent government, a government that does not withhold information.

Either you don't have such information, don't do misdeed, or release these documents (if existed).


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## Vulpes Abnocto (Dec 1, 2010)

trumpet-205 said:
			
		

> Our founding father (US) wanted a transparent government, a government that does not withhold information.



You mean like Benjamin Franklin, our first spy? 
I doubt he was particularly forthcoming with all of his information.


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## monkat (Dec 1, 2010)

trumpet-205 said:
			
		

> Our founding father (US) wanted a transparent government, a government that does not withhold information.



Idealistic rubbish. Even if it was true that the founding fathers wanted a 100% transparent government, allowing their own secrets to become available, it's just not reasonable with a country this size (in terms of actual size, population, and global power).

The more information that the government reveals, the more those who want to hurt us know - intelligence is the most important thing in warfare.

I may not be the biggest fan of the way our country does things, but I do owe them a huge debt (literally and figuratively), and I want the country to survive.


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## TrolleyDave (Dec 5, 2010)

Searinox said:
			
		

> I love them. I absolutely love them like I do few things in life. If I had money I'd donate to them. If they forshamed me someday and I'd still support them. I believe them to be one of the most powerful democratic forces in history! I fully support everything they've done and I do not believe to date ONE person was jeopardized, injured, or killed from the documents they've released. They're as damn close as they can get to being my heroes!



Completely and utterly agree with everything you've said here.  The people running Wikileaks deserve awards for preserving free speech.  Free speech is the right to tell the truth unhindered by prosecution or persecution.  All these people these days who argue that free speech is the right to say what ever they want don't actually understand or appreciate the history of free speech.  Wikileaks is a shining example of what free speech is.  Always remember, you can't be a supporter of free speech until someone tells a truth that you don't like and you still argue their right to say it.


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## monkat (Dec 5, 2010)

TrolleyDave said:
			
		

> Searinox said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Absolutely, you're correct.

While I don't think much of anything released was of any importance, bad as though it may have been, there is a difference between having the right to do something, and whether or not you should be doing something.

Imagine the information was more like, "The U.N.'s forces weapons can be turned off with this noise!" (ridiculous, but regardless...). Potentially millions would die because of your right to do something. With every right comes a responsibility, not only to use it, but to use it wisely.


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## Sterling (Dec 5, 2010)

monkat said:
			
		

> TrolleyDave said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Absolute worse case scenario. However, even less sensitive leaks can have potentially similar consequences.


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## TrolleyDave (Dec 5, 2010)

monkat said:
			
		

> Absolutely, you're correct.
> 
> While I don't think much of anything released was of any importance, bad as though it may have been, there is a difference between having the right to do something, and whether or not you should be doing something.
> 
> Imagine the information was more like, "The U.N.'s forces weapons can be turned off with this noise!" (ridiculous, but regardless...). Potentially millions would die because of your right to do something. With every right comes a responsibility, not only to use it, but to use it wisely.



Totally agree that there's a difference between a right and what's right.  I've been saying for a long time now that people are more concerned with protecting someones right to do something than whether it's right or not.  However, in the case of Wikileaks discretion has been used when releasing stuff.  If you go back through past interviews you'll see that they've been given information where the release of it could put real people in real jeopardy and have declined it's publication.  They are using their right responsibly so deserve to be supported.  The American government are showing their fascist colours over the site by declaring him a terrorist, it's a real "toe the party line" ideology.


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## Sterling (Dec 5, 2010)

TrolleyDave said:
			
		

> monkat said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I heard a little bit ago that if they are shutdown, they have way more sensitive documents that have been encrypted and distributed with their normally downloaded files. All they have to do is release the password. I honestly have no qualm with the release of with held information, but as Monkat has said, there is a difference between the right information being released, and information that has deadly consequences for everyone. WikiLeaks has to draw the line, but where will the line be drawn.


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## TrolleyDave (Dec 5, 2010)

Sterl500 said:
			
		

> I heard a little bit ago that if they are shutdown, they have way more sensitive documents that have been encrypted and distributed with their normally downloaded files. All they have to do is release the password. I honestly have no qualm with the release of with held information, but as Monkat has said, there is a difference between the right information being released, and information that has deadly consequences for everyone. WikiLeaks has to draw the line, but where will the line be drawn.



I've not heard anything about the encrypted documents.  Sounds kind of fishy to me to be honest.  People would have noticed these documents already I'd imagine, even if they couldn't decrypt them.  As for where the line is drawn, they've already said they draw the line at releasing info that could put peoples lives in jeopardy.  None of the documents revealed so far do that.  All the information is relevant to showing cover-ups, dodgy dealings, corruption and the like.  It's relevant truths, and relevant truths should always be told.  

Take for example the recent release of information concerning the marine that killed the hostage.  The US govt said that there was nothing they could do to stop the death as the kidnapper had a suicide vest on.  The information was completely false.  Everyone knows that hostage situations are tricky at the easiest of times, if they'd have told the truth they probably still would have gotten the same amount of support.  There have been several incidents in the past in regards to PLO hijackings where hostages were killed during a standoff.  People understood that those hostages would have died anyway.  Instead the US govt made an attempt to turn the marine into a hero through false propaganda that demonised the hostage taker.  No demonising was really necessary, everyone already knows how evil hostage takers are.  They should simply have told the truth.

Think of Wikileaks as more of a war on false propaganda than anything else.


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