# Windows 11 will be a free upgrade for Windows 10 users and will feature new gaming enhancements



## tpax (Jun 24, 2021)

You are the product.


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## K3N1 (Jun 24, 2021)

We aren't already running it tho.


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## CeeDee (Jun 24, 2021)

Neat! But if it's free, why not just make it a Windows 10 upgrade?


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## Prans (Jun 24, 2021)

CeeDee said:


> Neat! But if it's free, why not just make it a Windows 10 upgrade?


probably because new PCs will come preloaded with it and this will take away the need to update again


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## JuanBaNaNa (Jun 24, 2021)

EW NO!
I can only hope dissapointment thanks to Windows 10.


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## Deleted member 512337 (Jun 24, 2021)

Michaelsoft Binbows


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## ihaveahax (Jun 24, 2021)

The TPM 2.0 requirement is likely going to shut out a lot of PCs that don't have it at all, or don't have it enabled by default. The PC I have from 2014 doesn't support it, therefore it is stuck to Windows 10. It can be bypassed for now but who knows if that will still be possible in the future?

Also there are some other "interesting" changes such as removing the possibility of moving the taskbar from the bottom. https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/windows-11-specifications


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## SaulFabre (Jun 24, 2021)

Not interested in it, I will keep with Windows 10


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## tech3475 (Jun 24, 2021)

CeeDee said:


> Neat! But if it's free, why not just make it a Windows 10 upgrade?



The UI changes alone will probably be a reason, especially from a corporate perspective in terms of support and licensing costs.

Edit:

Plus the newer system requirements compared to w10.


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## Jiehfeng (Jun 24, 2021)

Cool, I grew to like Windows 10 a lot since it released, hopefully I'll dig this one too. I'll probably wait a little bit to avoid any release issues and get a more stable release update later.


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## DKB (Jun 24, 2021)

I do miss Windows 7 with all of my heart. But, I got so used to 10. I might adjust a lot faster though this time.


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## Deleted member 534570 (Jun 24, 2021)

Is it going to lock me out all unlicensed "cracked" products like Windows 10?


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## pustal (Jun 24, 2021)

CeeDee said:


> Neat! But if it's free, why not just make it a Windows 10 upgrade?



Rumor has it that Windows 11 is made out of Windows 10X and not Windows 10. Windows 10X was "made from the ground up" according to Microsoft (I believe many things they just reused from Windows 10 though) and it is not an upgrade from Windows 10.


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## Chris_Dai_Gyakuten_Saiban (Jun 24, 2021)

This sounds like it may be good, but for the time being I will just wait until it is stable and see if it is worth the update. For now Windows 10 does what I need it to do.


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## Seliph (Jun 24, 2021)

Don't need this. I'll be sticking to Windows 98 for gaming, thank you very much!


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## Beerus (Jun 24, 2021)

the built in android player is actually blessed makes doing macros for my games easier


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## MohammedQ8 (Jun 24, 2021)

The announcer has the saddest eyes I have ever see. It looked like he almost cry.


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## ZeroFX (Jun 24, 2021)

cool that the trailer shows everything you can already do, like "multitasking".


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## Chris_Dai_Gyakuten_Saiban (Jun 24, 2021)

ZeroFX said:


> cool that the trailer shows everything you can already do, like "multitasking".


And move the cursor around and call people.


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## Reynardine (Jun 24, 2021)

Windows 10 was a trainwreck. I don't have high hopes for this one either.

I'll hold onto my win 7 and linux dual boot setup for the time being.


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## PikachuPrincess23 (Jun 24, 2021)

When does Windows 11 come out?


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## MohammedQ8 (Jun 24, 2021)

Do you think we will see windows 11 phones? The ui looks like it was made for phones


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## rimoJO (Jun 24, 2021)

I just hope it can run Lego Island.


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## Lacius (Jun 24, 2021)

My understanding is the rebranding is pretty much in name only. Windows 10 users will be forced to update to Windows 11 automatically after enough time as passed, like with any other major Windows 10 update.

The ability of Windows 11 to support running Android apps "natively" is pretty neat though. That was my biggest takeaway.


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## ZeroFX (Jun 24, 2021)

Chris_Dai_Gyakuten_Saiban said:


> And move the cursor around and call people.


Continue where you left and reorder window's position!


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## guisadop (Jun 24, 2021)

I'll probably keep using windows 10 at least until 2025. Especially because updates will cease to be pushed then, and automatic updates are the biggest problem in W10 IMO.


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## Chris_Dai_Gyakuten_Saiban (Jun 24, 2021)

ZeroFX said:


> Continue where you left and reorder window's position!


Now with the complete ability to shut down the pc unlike our 5 other os


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## Tom Bombadildo (Jun 24, 2021)

Been using the leaked version my Razer Blade 14 since it leaked, seems pretty ok (even though the leak is basically just 10 kernel with 11 UI and not too many under the hood changes yet ). 

I do like the new UI design, icons are nice and the new start menu is better than 10's IMO, and the new system sounds are also more enjoyable than 10's. Will be interesting to see what the actual full version will be like, though I don't expect anything massively important changing.


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## ciaomao (Jun 24, 2021)

Wasn't it communicated everywhere that windows 10 will only receive updates and that windows 11 will never appear?


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## shaunj66 (Jun 24, 2021)

My PC isn't compatible according to the Microsoft health check tool.





Not sure why. Something to with TPM or secure boot apparently.


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## porkiewpyne (Jun 24, 2021)

The thing that piqued my interest is the supposed ability to run Android apps. I doubt Android emulators will be going the way of the dodo any time soon though. 

The rest is more of an mmmkay-sure-that's-nice


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## WiiMiiSwitch (Jun 24, 2021)

Now might be a time to switch to Linux....


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## Lacius (Jun 24, 2021)

shaunj66 said:


> My PC isn't compatible according to the Microsoft health check tool.
> 
> View attachment 267980
> 
> Not sure why. Something to with TPM or secure boot apparently.


I got the same error. You're probably right that it's related to TPM. The BitLocker requirements for TPM can already be disabled on Windows 10, so my guess is this will be bypassable one way or another.

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------



WiiMiiSwitch said:


> Now might be a time to switch to Linux....


Why is it time to switch to Linux? What was bad about Windows 11, and what's wrong with staying on Windows 10?


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## WiiMiiSwitch (Jun 24, 2021)

Lacius said:


> I got the same error. You're probably right that it's related to TPM. The BitLocker requirements for TPM can already be disabled on Windows 10, so my guess is this will be bypassable one way or another.
> 
> --------------------- MERGED ---------------------------
> 
> ...


Chrome OS like design. Yuck. Windows 10 will be less stable as it'll be old


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## Lacius (Jun 24, 2021)

ciaomao said:


> Wasn't it communicated everywhere that windows 10 will only receive updates and that windows 11 will never appear?


Yes, sort of, but Windows 10 has always had an end of support date, and everyone assumed there'd be a successor for after that date. I think the implication of what was said was that, starting with Windows 10, new operating system updates would be free and installed automatically. I think what they said/meant was "Windows 10 will be the last OS you buy."

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------



WiiMiiSwitch said:


> Chrome OS like design. Yuck. Windows 10 will be less stable as it'll be old


Windows 10 won't be less stable. It won't even be significantly less secure until after end of life (2025).


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## kevin corms (Jun 24, 2021)

tpax said:


> You are the product.


Customers could have fought this, but its too late now and everyone is moving towards this model.

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------



WiiMiiSwitch said:


> Chrome OS like design. Yuck. Windows 10 will be less stable as it'll be old


I dont even remember what chromeos looked like, it was awful and the hardware that runs it is usually atrocious.


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## 1NOOB (Jun 24, 2021)

i liked windows xp .


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## Zyvyn (Jun 24, 2021)

Eh, its ok. I will see how things are going a few months after launch and make my decision then.


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## lokomelo (Jun 24, 2021)

People that got the free upgrade from windows 7, will they upgrade for free again?


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## MorningBlunt (Jun 24, 2021)

CeeDee said:


> Neat! But if it's free, why not just make it a Windows 10 upgrade?


They make money from licencing and OEMs. They can't make any money by having it as Windows 10.
BUT they can make Samsung, Dell, HP etc. pay for 11 under a new dealio.


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## tech3475 (Jun 24, 2021)

I wonder how much that TPM requirement will be a problem for MS and customers? I just had to manually enable AMD fTPM in UEFI to pass the requirement check.



lokomelo said:


> People that got the free upgrade from windows 7, will they upgrade for free again?



I'd presume so, IIRC XDA had an article on the leaked build where apparently it can accept W7/8 keys.

Although system requirements, especially TPM 2.0, could be an issue.


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## Something whatever (Jun 24, 2021)

Oh SUPER not worth it


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## Julie_Pilgrim (Jun 24, 2021)

Seliph said:


> Don't need this. I'll be sticking to Windows 98 for gaming, thank you very much!


LMAOOOO IMAGINE USING A OS WITH A UI 

sent from linux recovery shell


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## Lacius (Jun 24, 2021)

lokomelo said:


> People that got the free upgrade from windows 7, will they upgrade for free again?


If a computer meets the system requirements and is already on Windows 10, yes, you will get the Windows 11 upgrade for free.


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## NeSchn (Jun 24, 2021)

This is pretty neat but I'll stick with 10 for now. Last thing I need is for Windows 11 to not work with Pro Tools or any of my plugin's so I'll wait. Excited to check it out eventually though!


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## Uiaad (Jun 24, 2021)

lokomelo said:


> People that got the free upgrade from windows 7, will they upgrade for free again?


Yes you will, even if you upgraded to 10 from 7 you will be able to upgrade to 11 


shaunj66 said:


> Not sure why. Something to with TPM or secure boot apparently.


Yeah at the moment Windows 11 does require TPM 2.0 and Secure boot enabled. It's unclear if this is just a temporary thing with the "insider builds" and will vanish nearer the Fall 10 Release/upgrade path - A lot of motherboard support TPM but just lack the module 

I've never got the whole Windows 10 hate train that a lot of people jumped aboard, I can sort of understand the hate toward 8/8.1 Microsoft gambled on touch devices being the next in thing and it just didn't work out when it came to the PC/Laptop market generally but with 10 they took a step back and actually looked at the market and what people wanted. A lot of people will bang on about Telemetry, collecting data and sending data - Cortana etc etc etc but there are simple scripts you can run that will disable all of that. Should it be more transparent? yes. But at the end of the day, people don't seem to question the same data being sent to google or apple from their phones. 

And as far as updates screwing over gaming performance - it's quite simple when you look at the Mac ecosystem they have to develop for a standardised handful (or less and we all know Macs are the thing for gaming right ? ) of system where you have a near impossible to calculate the number of systems in the wild for windows and it's down to the number of people who are on the insider builds there just aren't enough people there using and actively engaging in the system


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## jt_1258 (Jun 24, 2021)

ok...listen...I hate to be that person joining along in just saying oh boo, already bad...but when your trailer has glitches I am already concerned...there is a blinking area in the bottom right ish at the end for no apparent reason


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## ciaomao (Jun 24, 2021)

Lacius said:


> think what they said/meant was "Windows 10 will be the last OS you buy."


If you put it that way, win 7 would have been our "last" OS, right?


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## Lacius (Jun 24, 2021)

ciaomao said:


> If you put it that way, win 7 would have been our "last" OS, right?


Considering the free upgrade offer, yeah, but that was _officially_ only supposed to last a year. Their point was that once you have Windows 10 on a machine, it should be supported for life without having to buy another OS.


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## Jayro (Jun 24, 2021)

ihaveamac said:


> The TPM 2.0 requirement is likely going to shut out a lot of PCs that don't have it at all, or don't have it enabled by default. The PC I have from 2014 doesn't support it, therefore it is stuck to Windows 10. It can be bypassed for now but who knows if that will still be possible in the future?
> 
> Also there are some other "interesting" changes such as removing the possibility of moving the taskbar from the bottom. https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/windows-11-specifications


The site where I got my windows 11 ISO had a "TPM 2.0 fixed" ISO, and that's what I grabbed for MediCat VHD. Zero issues installing it to bare metal. So I'm sure more people will patch out that requirement on their own.


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## nightweb (Jun 24, 2021)

The Bit that got me was Under System requirements it has "Windows 11 Home edition requires internet connectivity and a  Microsoft account to complete device setup on first use."

Nooooope


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## Jayro (Jun 24, 2021)

nightweb said:


> The Bit that got me was Under System requirements it has "Windows 11 Home edition requires internet connectivity and a  Microsoft account to complete device setup on first use."
> 
> Nooooope


Give it time, users will patch that out too. You can also set windows 11 to force the setup of an offline account using NTLite, so not all hope is lost.


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## Lacius (Jun 24, 2021)

nightweb said:


> The Bit that got me was Under System requirements it has "Windows 11 Home edition requires internet connectivity and a  Microsoft account to complete device setup on first use."
> 
> Nooooope





Jayro said:


> Give it time, users will patch that out too. You can also set windows 11 to force the setup of an offline account using NTLite, so not all hope is lost.


Or better yet, use one of the methods out there to upgrade to a Windows 10 Pro account before updating to Windows 11.


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## nightweb (Jun 24, 2021)

Jayro said:


> Give it time, users will patch that out too. You can also set windows 11 to force the setup of an offline account using NTLite, so not all hope is lost.



Probably will but for the non-techy's and OEM buyers who don't know better...


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## MarkDarkness (Jun 24, 2021)

Will they leave me alone and not swarm me to update to one of their crap half-step releases... I have memories from war of being forced into Window 8, that's enough for a lifetime, and this looks the absolutely same thing.


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## CloudStrife1901 (Jun 24, 2021)

It's definitely made my 2016 laptop run alot faster. Windows 10 made it super slow


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## Jayro (Jun 24, 2021)

Lacius said:


> Or better yet, use one of the methods out there to upgrade to a Windows 10 Pro account before updating to Windows 11.


Yeah, you can get a Pro license for just a few bucks on eBay.


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## ghjfdtg (Jun 24, 2021)

Something, something "Windows 10 is the last Windows". I guess they had to milk OEMs and consumers again on top of them already milking consumers with ads and private data.


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## Jayro (Jun 24, 2021)

ghjfdtg said:


> Something, something "Windows 10 is the last Windows". I guess they had to milk OEMs and consumers again on top of them already milking consumers with ads and private data.


They already make a killing selling our private data, so they should just give windows away for free.


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## Lacius (Jun 24, 2021)

Jayro said:


> Yeah, you can get a Pro license for just a few bucks on eBay.


Or you can update from Home to an unactivated version of Pro with the generic Pro license, and then use the Windows 7 free upgrade servers to activate your copy of Windows 10 Pro.

It looks like the TPM requirements (and UEFI requirements and Secure Boot requirements) are baked into the installer and not the OS itself. Swapping the install.wim of an older installer with the Windows 11 install.wim seems to be installing just fine on an older system.


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## D34DL1N3R (Jun 24, 2021)

nightweb said:


> The Bit that got me was Under System requirements it has "Windows 11 Home edition requires internet connectivity and a  Microsoft account to complete device setup on first use."
> 
> Nooooope



Was already figured out 5 days ago you can press Alt+F4 to use a local account. Helps to check things out before posting.


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## Jayro (Jun 24, 2021)

Lacius said:


> Or you can update from Home to an unactivated version of Pro with the generic Pro license, and then use the Windows 7 free upgrade servers to activate your copy of Windows 10 Pro.
> 
> It looks like the TPM requirements (and UEFI requirements and Secure Boot requirements) are baked into the installer and not the OS itself. Swapping the install.wim of an older installer with the Windows 11 install.wim seems to be installing just fine on an older system.


Yeah, I read that people were moving the install.wim to a windows 10 ISO, and everything worked just fine.


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## CeeDee (Jun 24, 2021)

MorningBlunt said:


> They make money from licencing and OEMs. They can't make any money by having it as Windows 10.
> BUT they can make Samsung, Dell, HP etc. pay for 11 under a new dealio.


Ah yes, the true reason. 

I just find it funny because I vaguely remember them making a big deal over Windows 10 being 'the last one' and all.


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## Lacius (Jun 24, 2021)

Jayro said:


> Yeah, I read that people were moving the install.wim to a windows 10 ISO, and everything worked just fine.


Issues I foresee:

Will the system requirements become backed into the OS itself in the future?
How will installing Windows 11 on a system that doesn't have a TPM chip, for example, affect the ability to get future updates. Cumulative updates will likely work fine, but largescale updates that happen once or twice a year might run through the aforementioned installer with the TPM requirements. It's hard to say.


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## WG481 (Jun 24, 2021)

I can't wait for Windows 11... malware.
A new operating system means new exploits which means new unofficial hacks, customizations, and ultimately another Internet Pandemic. Remember WannaCry? Just wait until hackers start experimenting with Win11.


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## Dimensional (Jun 24, 2021)

If it's geared towards gaming, does this mean it will be able to run Dos games and old Windows 9X games natively again? What about having RetroArch included?


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## WG481 (Jun 24, 2021)

Dimensional said:


> If it's geared towards gaming, does this mean it will be able to run Dos games and old Windows 9X games natively again? What about having RetroArch included?


Imagine it including Xbox's operating system within it to not only waste more space but to let people but Xbox games in their disc drive only to get an error message.


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## Jayro (Jun 24, 2021)

Dimensional said:


> If it's geared towards gaming, does this mean it will be able to run Dos games and old Windows 9X games natively again? What about having RetroArch included?


Being geared towards better gaming means better performance in modern games. They're not going to bring back 16-bit support, and honestly, they shouldn't even make 32-bit Windows anymore. I ditched 32-bit Windows mid-Windows 7 cycle and I've never looked back. Keeping legacy stuff around isn't helpful for most people. It clutters the OS and just makes a lot of UI inconsistencies. Hell, there's still some Windows XP, Vista, and 7 icons inside Windows 10. It's like the UI team can't get their shit together and do one big overhaul to convert them all at once. (They should hire me to do it, I love making icons)


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## pedro702 (Jun 24, 2021)

well i dont have tpm 2.0 so yeah no windows 11 for me :S


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## PhantomFist (Jun 24, 2021)

Michael MJD on Youtube installed the dev build on an old HP, proving you can bypass the TPM requirement. For now, anyway.


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## Jayro (Jun 24, 2021)

pedro702 said:


> well i dont have tpm 2.0 so yeah no windows 11 for me :S


I wouldn't even know how to check for it honestly.


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## Ishzark (Jun 24, 2021)

sounds like the same trap they used to get me from 7 to 10


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## pedro702 (Jun 24, 2021)

Jayro said:


> I wouldn't even know how to check for it honestly.


followed some instructions online, my pc is preety old, like 10 years and it was custom made, and most custom made motherboards dont have the tpm chip in them so i have no tpm at all on my motherboard.


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## tech3475 (Jun 24, 2021)

Lacius said:


> Issues I foresee:
> 
> Will the system requirements become backed into the OS itself in the future?
> How will installing Windows 11 on a system that doesn't have a TPM chip, for example, affect the ability to get future updates. Cumulative updates will likely work fine, but largescale updates that happen once or twice a year might run through the aforementioned installer with the TPM requirements. It's hard to say.



I can imagine the Windows/MS Store causing problems, especially where it uses EFS.


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## Lacius (Jun 24, 2021)

WG481 said:


> I can't wait for Windows 11... malware.
> A new operating system means new exploits which means new unofficial hacks, customizations, and ultimately another Internet Pandemic. Remember WannaCry? Just wait until hackers start experimenting with Win11.


98% of the computers hit by WannaCry were running Windows 7, and it affected computers on operating systems older than that.


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## Maq47 (Jun 24, 2021)

Welp, I need a new PC now more than ever. I have TPM 1.2 instead of TPM 2.0, so I'm locked out.


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## Lacius (Jun 24, 2021)

Jayro said:


> I wouldn't even know how to check for it honestly.


Run tpm.msc in a run dialog. You may have to enable TPM in your BIOS/UEFI.



pedro702 said:


> well i dont have tpm 2.0 so yeah no windows 11 for me :S





Maq47 said:


> Welp, I need a new PC now more than ever. I have TPM 1.2 instead of TPM 2.0, so I'm locked out.


It might be bypassable. It currently is with the leaked build.

Depending on your computer, you might also be able to swap out the TPM chip with one that's newer.


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## Urbanshadow (Jun 24, 2021)

pustal said:


> Rumor has it that Windows 11 is made out of Windows 10X and not Windows 10. Windows 10X was "made from the ground up" according to Microsoft (I believe many things they just reused from Windows 10 though) and it is not an upgrade from Windows 10.



The printing stack its still the same as we had in windows vista and it is not likely to dissapear as it would break many many many many applications including all adobe suite and the office package.

It´s not like Im calling bs on your claim but Win32 (as architectur) is such a burden in the windows kernel you just canot get rid of it.


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## Lacius (Jun 24, 2021)

I'm reading that enabling fTPM or Intel PTT might meet the TPM 2.0 requirement without having a dedicated chip.


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## ihaveahax (Jun 24, 2021)

Jayro said:


> The site where I got my windows 11 ISO had a "TPM 2.0 fixed" ISO, and that's what I grabbed for MediCat VHD. Zero issues installing it to bare metal. So I'm sure more people will patch out that requirement on their own.


Given that it's still an official requirement, there's no telling that the fully released OS won't enforce it either. Plus bypassing it at all is not going to be that accessible to less technical users. Same with having to enable it if it's not already.


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## tech3475 (Jun 24, 2021)

Lacius said:


> I'm reading that enabling fTPM or Intel PTT might meet the TPM 2.0 requirement without having a dedicated chip.



In my case AMD fTPM worked, however, its' under the CPU settings in UEFI not the TPM settings.

edit:

TPM 2.0 has apparently been a requirement since 2016, so in theory at least any certified computers should work.


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## Jayro (Jun 24, 2021)

ihaveamac said:


> Given that it's still an official requirement, there's no telling that the fully released OS won't enforce it either. Plus bypassing it at all is not going to be that accessible to less technical users. Same with having to enable it if it's not already.


I kind of see it as another one of those "NX" problems like Windows 8 had, where in Windows 10 they got rid of that requirement, and it was a setting in the BCD store. I just hope it's not rooted deeper in the final releases.


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## Asia81 (Jun 24, 2021)

So W11 is now official?


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## chrisrlink (Jun 24, 2021)

Anon_Cypher_ said:


> Is it going to lock me out all unlicensed "cracked" products like Windows 10?


W10 does that odd as long as i have exceptions in my dl path and Program Files folder(s) in windows defender cracks are generally left alone you just need to add folder exceptions and you'll be fine i sure hope W11 doesn't remove folder exceptions like they did with perm defender disable even through group policy


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## Kioku_Dreams (Jun 24, 2021)

nightweb said:


> The Bit that got me was Under System requirements it has "Windows 11 Home edition requires internet connectivity and a  Microsoft account to complete device setup on first use."
> 
> Nooooope





Jayro said:


> Give it time, users will patch that out too. You can also set windows 11 to force the setup of an offline account using NTLite, so not all hope is lost.



Well, unless it changes upon release, it seems you can still setup an offline account. The option was there in LTT's video on the leaked build.


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## WG481 (Jun 24, 2021)

I'm honestly more excited for the cracked product  we can make with a new SDK


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## Xzi (Jun 24, 2021)

Meh, I'll put off upgrading for as long as I possibly can, just like I did from Win7 to Win10.  Hell I might even start dual-booting Linux...Win11 is ugly as sin and I'm sure even more problematic from a data gathering and admin restrictions standpoint.


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## BitMasterPlus (Jun 24, 2021)

Oh boy! I can't wait to NOT upgrade to Shitdows 11 just like how I NOT upgraded to Shitdows 10!


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## Yann47 (Jun 24, 2021)

pas mal


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## MaxToTheMax (Jun 24, 2021)

I never thought I would say this, but I’m a windows 10 hold out.


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## CinnamonMina (Jun 24, 2021)

Tom Bombadildo said:


> Been using the leaked version my Razer Blade 14 since it leaked, seems pretty ok (even though the leak is basically just 10 kernel with 11 UI and not too many under the hood changes yet ).
> 
> I do like the new UI design, icons are nice and the new start menu is better than 10's IMO, and the new system sounds are also more enjoyable than 10's. Will be interesting to see what the actual full version will be like, though I don't expect anything massively important changing.


the leaked build doesn't have all the new things, I'm getting an early official build of it with the new features that aren't in the leaked one.




guisadop said:


> I'll probably keep using windows 10 at least until 2025. Especially because updates will cease to be pushed then, and automatic updates are the biggest problem in W10 IMO.


There's a good reason why, security. 





PikachuPrincess23 said:


> When does Windows 11 come out?


it will start to roll out this year, in the holidays it'll be a wave based roll out, however, Testers will have the build next week


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## guisadop (Jun 24, 2021)

CinnamonMina said:


> There's a good reason why, security.


Not a problem unless you're a company or you keep downloading shady shit.


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## diggeloid (Jun 24, 2021)

Lots of valid complaints from Microsoft's customers, but what are they going to do about it? Microsoft doesn't give a shit. They know you're going to install it anyways.

Fucking monopolies, man. They're all evil.


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## CinnamonMina (Jun 24, 2021)

ghjfdtg said:


> Something, something "Windows 10 is the last Windows". I guess they had to milk OEMs and consumers again on top of them already milking consumers with ads and private data.





Jayro said:


> They already make a killing selling our private data, so they should just give windows away for free.


 its a free upgrade so like..... you wont have to pay another 100$ for the new OS,



Unless you are one of THOSE guys stuck on Win 7, then you are most likely screwed


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## ZeroT21 (Jun 24, 2021)

Think ima just stick to good ol' linux


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## Kioku_Dreams (Jun 24, 2021)

guisadop said:


> Not a problem unless you're a company or you keep downloading shady shit.


This logic was fine 16 years ago... Nowadays that shady shit comes in what appear to be "safe" downloads or browsing.

Let's see if I can TL;DR this thread...

1. Linux Users (lol)

2. Windoze 7 (lul)

3. Microsoft bad

4. Wdym 11?


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## Maq47 (Jun 24, 2021)

Lacius said:


> Run tpm.msc in a run dialog. You may have to enable TPM in your BIOS/UEFI.


I just realized that TPM is disabled in my BIOS (my rig has no UEFI capabilities), but it is only 1.1, with some 1.2 compatibility settings only.


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## DaveLister (Jun 24, 2021)

Windows had a suicide done do it ? Or was that antivirus ?.


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## GhostLatte (Jun 24, 2021)

I’m already using Windows 11 :^)


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## Barloomo (Jun 24, 2021)

wonderin if i can survive the update xd


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## ghjfdtg (Jun 24, 2021)

CinnamonMina said:


> its a free upgrade so like..... you wont have to pay another 100$ for the new OS,


Yes, the upgrade is free but ultimately you will pay for the license when you buy a new PC with Windows 11 installed. That was my critique. On one side they give away free licenses and make a PR stunt out of it but on the other it's still paid for new PC's with it pre-installed. You are not even getting any advantage for the paid one.


----------



## jesus96 (Jun 24, 2021)

It's literally the same stuff,did they really expect people to pay for that?


----------



## SkittleDash (Jun 24, 2021)

Seriously, the requirements are pretty stupid. My PC is only 2 years old and doesn't support TPM 2.0. And it's no gaming one either. So it doesn't have DirectX 12 support either. Would also make laptops with soldered in components much more worthless. Seriously, Microsoft?


----------



## Lazyboss (Jun 24, 2021)

Looks like Mac now, which I really hate.


----------



## Ericthegreat (Jun 24, 2021)

New windows means time for a fresh install.


----------



## DEFIANT (Jun 24, 2021)

well i guess i have the unpopular opinion...i always said apple osx was a pretty os...but it doesn't do ALL the games and its too proprietary. i really like that windows centered the taskbar icons...something i currently do with either taskbar x or startisback++. the updated icons are a start but i feel more attention to color couldn't hurt. rounded corners aren't bad either. the start menu changes over the years have never really affected me. i always do a dock or dock style center pinned icon approach. so that leaves performance and over all ui work flow...that will be a hands on approach so that's a wait n see.


----------



## the_randomizer (Jun 24, 2021)

Nah I'm good.  The centered taskbar and UI look horrible.


----------



## stanleyopar2000 (Jun 24, 2021)

*me with KMS activation*

haha i'm in danger.


----------



## Lacius (Jun 24, 2021)

DEFIANT said:


> well i guess i have the unpopular opinion...i always said apple osx was a pretty os...but it doesn't do ALL the games and its too proprietary. i really like that windows centered the taskbar icons...something i currently do with either taskbar x or startisback++. the updated icons are a start but i feel more attention to color couldn't hurt. rounded corners aren't bad either. the start menu changes over the years have never really affected me. i always do a dock or dock style center pinned icon approach. so that leaves performance and over all ui work flow...that will be a hands on approach so that's a wait n see.


I don't dislike the UI either. My only issue right now is the TPM requirement.


----------



## wiitendo84 (Jun 24, 2021)

Everything I found about my laptop says that it doesn't have it. Ran the windows checker thing and lo and behold it does in fact have a TPM 2.0


----------



## DEFIANT (Jun 24, 2021)

Lacius said:


> I don't dislike the UI either. My only issue right now is the TPM requirement.


i just enabled mine and checked it. its at 2.0 so i hope that will get me in the club...but i feel there will be a hack or a way to disable it. hell it might all go away in the final version...too soon to tell just yet.


----------



## Lacius (Jun 24, 2021)

DEFIANT said:


> i just enabled mine and checked it. its at 2.0 so i hope that will get me in the club...but i feel there will be a hack or a way to disable it. hell it might all go away in the final version...too soon to tell just yet.


I have a laptop from 2015 with no TPM chip, and I have a desktop I built in 2019 that has no TPM chip ("Why does my desktop need BitLocker?" I said). If I can't bypass the requirement, I won't be happy.

My SO's laptop is also from 2015 with no TPM chip.


----------



## leerpsp (Jun 24, 2021)

My 2 year old gaming pc doesn't support TPM 2.0 also just found out 1st gen ryzen does not work with the new windows 11 my Ryzen 1500 is not going to work, I did not mind upgrading to a new cpu but no way I will upgrade to a new motherboard I was only going to do that when ddr5 come out.  I got a 2070 6 months ago so My gpu is fine.
Microsoft must be wanting to make money on hardware this time around with the new windows 11 it's just seems they worked hard to make people have to ether buy a new pc or hardware.


----------



## Tom Bombadildo (Jun 25, 2021)

For those worried about TPM requirements, MS has clarified this already, 2.0 is _recommended_ but not _required_, TPM 1.2 is their actual required hard limit. 

And firmware-based TPM implementations will work just fine, and TPM 1.2 is basically included in every CPU for the last decade-ish now, it's just a matter of activating it in your BIOS (Intel PTT for Intel CPUs, fTPM for AMD). 

https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/compatibility/windows-11/ <


----------



## Viri (Jun 25, 2021)

ghjfdtg said:


> Yes, the upgrade is free but ultimately you will pay for the license when you buy a new PC with Windows 11 installed.


I don't think the people who use this site, are concerned about the Window's price.


----------



## leerpsp (Jun 25, 2021)

Tom Bombadildo said:


> For those worried about TPM requirements, MS has clarified this already, 2.0 is _recommended_ but not _required_, TPM 1.2 is their actual required hard limit.
> 
> And firmware-based TPM implementations will work just fine, and TPM 1.2 is basically included in every CPU for the last decade-ish now, it's just a matter of activating it in your BIOS (Intel PTT for Intel CPUs, fTPM for AMD).
> 
> https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/compatibility/windows-11/ <


My Motherboard the Asrock ab350 pro 4 does not support it, I can but a Module for the Motherboard but from some reviews its a hit or miss on if it will work and some say it likes to disconnect a lot, I just will not update to windows 11 till I do my next big update but linux with steam play just keeps looking better and if most people can not game with windows 11 and need to do a big hardware update to do it I really could see game devs moving over to linux for gaming, The only thing windows has going for it is gaming.


----------



## Crazynoob458 (Jun 25, 2021)

like many people this should have been a update to windows 10
unlike many people i like the new ui


----------



## leerpsp (Jun 25, 2021)

Crazynoob458 said:


> like many people this should have been a update to windows 10
> unlike many people i like the new ui


I like the new UI but it really looks like a 1 to 1 rip off of mac os.


----------



## Crazynoob458 (Jun 25, 2021)

leerpsp said:


> I like the new UI but it really looks like a 1 to 1 rip off of mac os.


it does have a weird macos vibe on win32 apps but for some reason on uwp apps i dont feel like its macos


----------



## Tom Bombadildo (Jun 25, 2021)

leerpsp said:


> My Motherboard the Asrock ab350 pro 4 does not support it, I can but a Module for the Motherboard but from some reviews its a hit or miss on if it will work and some say it likes to disconnect a lot, I just will not update to windows 11 till I do my next big update but linux with steam play just keeps looking better and if most people can not game with windows 11 and need to do a big hardware update to do it I really could see game devs moving over to linux for gaming, The only thing windows has going for it is gaming.


Look again. Manual says it should.


----------



## AirbusX (Jun 25, 2021)

Jiehfeng said:


> Cool, I grew to like Windows 10 a lot since it released, hopefully I'll dig this one too. I'll probably wait a little bit to avoid any release issues and get a more stable release update later.




Man you made me feel real old. My first windows version was 3.1 for DOS lol. I was 12 back then

I’ve always loved Windows (Except Vista and 8). Windows 7 was great. I like windows 10 too.


----------



## titan_tim (Jun 25, 2021)

Tradition states that every 2nd windows release is total garbage. I hope this one doesn't fall into that category.


----------



## leerpsp (Jun 25, 2021)

Tom Bombadildo said:


> Look again. Manual says it should.


gonna give it a try brb


----------



## AirbusX (Jun 25, 2021)

AirbusX said:


> Man you made me feel real old. My first windows version was 3.1 for DOS lol. I was 12 back then
> 
> I’ve always loved Windows (Except Vista and 8). Windows 7 was great. I like windows 10 too.



sorry I misread what you wrote, I thought it was I grew up with windows 10 lol


----------



## leerpsp (Jun 25, 2021)

Tom Bombadildo said:


> Look again. Manual says it should.


I just did that and now have that turned on but still does not help this problem
MY PC's specs are
AMD Ryzen 1600 six-core processor 3.20
32GB of ddr4
Zotac rtx 2070 OC
500gb SSD
telling you I'm gonna need a new cpu and motherboard for this os.


----------



## Tom Bombadildo (Jun 25, 2021)

leerpsp said:


> I just did that and now have that turned on but still does not help this problem
> MY PC's specs are
> AMD Ryzen 61600 six-core processor 3.20
> 32GB of ddr4
> ...


Honestly, I wouldn't take MS's own potato "checker" seriously. People had the same exact issues back with the Windows 10 free update on release (and plenty later), too. If your PC matches the base requirements in their compatibility page, it'll work just fine. 

Either way, you wouldn't need to upgrade your motherboard anyways, this ain't Intel. You should be able to slap up to a Ryzen 3000 CPU in that mobo just fine, and chances are Asrock probably released a beta BIOS for Ryzen 5000 CPUs, too.


----------



## leerpsp (Jun 25, 2021)

Tom Bombadildo said:


> Honestly, I wouldn't take MS's own potato "checker" seriously. People had the same exact issues back with the Windows 10 free update on release (and plenty later), too. If your PC matches the base requirements in their compatibility page, it'll work just fine.
> 
> Either way, you wouldn't need to upgrade your motherboard anyways, this ain't Intel. You should be able to slap up to a Ryzen 3000 CPU in that mobo just fine, and chances are Asrock probably released a beta BIOS for Ryzen 5000 CPUs, too.


what ryzen cpu do you think I should upgrade to so I can go buy that, Iv been wanting an upgrade and better get that out of the way.


----------



## Soulsilve2010 (Jun 25, 2021)

Well if it's free I don't see why not and I could always roll back to 10 if it's no good.I personally liked 8.1 alot though.


----------



## Tom Bombadildo (Jun 25, 2021)

leerpsp said:


> what ryzen cpu do you think I should upgrade to so I can go buy that, Iv been wanting an upgrade and better get that out of the way.


If you're just going to be gaming, a Ryzen 5 3600 would be perfectly fine (don't bother with a 3600x unless you find one cheaper than a 3600, they're basically identical). If your motherboard does end up supporting Ryzen 5000 (I would contact Asrock to double check that), buy a 5600x. 

If you do more productivity stuff that requires decent processing power, 3700x/5800x are both good options. 

But this is getting off topic now


----------



## leerpsp (Jun 25, 2021)

https://www.asrock.com/mb/AMD/AB350 Pro4/index.asp#CPU
Looks like I can run a Ryzen 9 with a Bios update if I'm looking at the right page.


----------



## GoldenBullet (Jun 25, 2021)

I guess this is really just a facelift update for windows with some cool features added on. Nothing too different from how Mac os handles their updates.

Can we finally figure out the control panel situation? What's the point of the settings app if I'm going to end up in control panel anyways? Pick one or the other Microsoft


----------



## Metal64 (Jun 25, 2021)

Nice, I will stick with windows 7


----------



## Lacius (Jun 25, 2021)

Soulsilve2010 said:


> I personally liked 8.1 alot though.


I've never seen a mythical creature before.


----------



## Metal64 (Jun 25, 2021)

Lacius said:


> I've never seen a mythical creature before.


at the time I was an intern, I saw my supervisor using this thing... almost puke!


----------



## the_randomizer (Jun 25, 2021)

I'll stick to Windows 10, thank you. 11 looks like another unmitigated disaster.


----------



## Lacius (Jun 25, 2021)

the_randomizer said:


> I'll stick to Windows 10, thank you. 11 looks like another unmitigated disaster.


The system requirements at least are an unmitigated disaster.

That being said, I feel like Microsoft has a cycle of major UI change and backlash, good OS, major UI change and backlash, good OS, etc.

Windows XP, good. Windows Vista, bad. Windows 7, good. Windows 8 and 8.1, bad. Windows 10, good. Windows 11... bad?


----------



## CallmeBerto (Jun 25, 2021)

Errrr besides win 8 I never had an issue with the Windows GUI. I'll just wait for an official build before anything as it's not like there is a rush.


----------



## BraveDragonWolf (Jun 25, 2021)

Another ooey and gooey interface? No....
Maybe I'll force myself to upgrade again when my laptop crashes...again.


----------



## tech3475 (Jun 25, 2021)

Soulsilve2010 said:


> Well if it's free I don't see why not and I could always roll back to 10 if it's no good.I personally liked 8.1 alot though.



Windows 8.1 was only good for me with third party software e.g. Classic Shell.

If I was forced to use ‘the UI formally known as Metro’ all the time, I think I would have just pirated W7. Last time I had to use stock W8.1 and it’s start menu, it felt like remembering a bad memory I had forgotten up until then.

W11 feels like another 8.1, by which I mean I MAY like it, but only after altering it e.g. replacement start menu.


----------



## Soldengun (Jun 25, 2021)

Hopefully it's not another Vista!


----------



## Armadillo (Jun 25, 2021)

TPM requirement is anything Intel before Skylake is pretty much fucked then.  PTT (embedded tpm pretty much) wasn't added till z170. 

Earlier chipsets tend to have a tpm header, but getting one that is compatible with old boards and making it work, seems to be a minefield. 

I don't like the change anyway, it's forced obsolescence. A lot of the stuff that is incompatible has more than enough power to still be relevant today. Hopefully Microsoft rethink forcing it.


----------



## chrisrlink (Jun 25, 2021)

my Gateway laptop can run it via the health check app report (Ryzen 5 4600H+nvidia gtx 1650) but i doubt my Xeon E5 can run it sucks for Mac M1 users cant even run windows natively only via VM I wonder if Win 11 will change that?


----------



## Obveron (Jun 25, 2021)

Lacius said:


> Windows 9x, good.  Windows ME, bad. Windows XP, good. Windows Vista, bad. Windows 7, good. Windows 8 and 8.1, bad. Windows 10, good. Windows 11... bad?


Added a couple to the front of your list ^^


----------



## MarioMasta64 (Jun 25, 2021)

nightweb said:


> The Bit that got me was Under System requirements it has "Windows 11 Home edition requires internet connectivity and a  Microsoft account to complete device setup on first use."
> 
> Nooooope


when i was going through setup on the leaked iso there was an option to use an offline account even tho my pc had internet so idk it might be a requirement on release, i do know windows 10 forced you to login if reinstalled with internet connected, tho i think theres cases where it lets you choose offline as well (from many many reinstallation of peoples computers for hobby money)

also note how windows 10 if used on a local account will sometimes popup with "complete setup" menu after upgrades so if they mean it like that then itd be the same and if they dont then oof pain


----------



## pustal (Jun 25, 2021)

Urbanshadow said:


> The printing stack its still the same as we had in windows vista and it is not likely to dissapear as it would break many many many many applications including all adobe suite and the office package.
> 
> It´s not like Im calling bs on your claim but Win32 (as architectur) is such a burden in the windows kernel you just canot get rid of it.



Ofc, but it may not just be a Windows 10 with some tweaks and have workflows changed in some aspects.


----------



## Spider_Man (Jun 25, 2021)

Direct x, god when will they get rid of this shit graphic driver.

Forcing hdr as auto, hmmm not a good idea as it required resources, have fun trying to disable it when win 10 is a pain in the arse to get access to something when it forces a basic version like its ment for mobiles, yet you have to manually seek what you want hidden away from the search feature.

The os does not need to include a dumbed down console os features just proves that xbox isnt a console, its a cheap oc, now our pcs are been forced to run a cheap console os and features.

A good idea would be that if you have bought an xbox game, you get the pc version and sync game data to and from.

Like if you buy a xbx1 game, you get the sx version free, why isnt pc version included?


----------



## D34DL1N3R (Jun 25, 2021)

Needing an online account was shown to be able to be bypassed 5 days ago, and now it's been shown that Win11 also does not require TMP 2.0. Only 1.2. The health check app is just giving incorrect information.

https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/compatibility/windows-11/#hardware-requirements


----------



## fvig2001 (Jun 25, 2021)

I hate that my laptop is 7th gen and then there was a revision 3 months later that was 8th gen with a minor speedboost. It's not like I'll be playing Win 11 exclusive games on it anyway.


----------



## Asia81 (Jun 25, 2021)

I activated the intel TPM things in my bios but the health app still say My PC is not compatible with W11, any ideas ?


----------



## StrayGuitarist (Jun 25, 2021)

I really can't trust Microsoft after all the anti-privacy bullshit they forced onto us with Windows 10. I've stuck with 8.1 with ClassicShell forever, and I probably will until my hardware stops supporting it, in which case I'll find some Linux distro I don't hate.


----------



## Kioku_Dreams (Jun 25, 2021)

Asia81 said:


> I activated the intel TPM things in my bios but the health app still say My PC is not compatible with W11, any ideas ?



Probably a bug.


----------



## RedBlueGreen (Jun 25, 2021)

The only thing that interests me is the native Android app support. I hope they get rid of all the crap introduced in Windows 10 updates like the weather and news things. The only thing stopping me from switching to a Linux distro like Pop OS is that even with Proton gaming on Linux is a pain. Windows 10 updates breaking crap and bloating the OS are a slightly smaller pain.

Oh I do like the new taskbar though. Doesn't look as bad as Windows 10's does now. I miss basic Windows 7 taskbar when it was just the start button, your pinned programs, and time, volume, and battery if applicable. Windows 10 is start button, search bar, task view button, pinned programs, weather, battery, volume, language, time, and notification center.


Asia81 said:


> I activated the intel TPM things in my bios but the health app still say My PC is not compatible with W11, any ideas ?


Same here. I think it's just a bug or the tool reports inaccurate information. If the past is any indication stuff not officially supported might run Win11 just fine.


----------



## Zyvyn (Jun 25, 2021)

So I just checked. My computer which was just built a little over a year ago. Does not support Windows 11.


----------



## BitMasterPlus (Jun 25, 2021)

Technically Windows 11 is Windows 10, and Windows 10 was Windows 9, even though they skipped the number 9 like a bunch of dumbfucks. I mean, it wasn't that much of a leap that they needed to go straight to 10. How can I trust a company to give me a competent OS if they can't even count right? lol


----------



## Pipistrele (Jun 25, 2021)

Native Android app support is legit dope though, kinda excited for it.


----------



## nl255 (Jun 25, 2021)

BitMasterPlus said:


> Technically Windows 11 is Windows 10, and Windows 10 was Windows 9, even though they skipped the number 9 like a bunch of dumbfucks. I mean, it wasn't that much of a leap that they needed to go straight to 10. How can I trust a company to give me a competent OS if they can't even count right? lol



They had to skip Windows 9 otherwise a ton of software wouldn't work because it would think it was being run under Windows 95/98 because it would check for the substring "Windows 9".


----------



## Jiehfeng (Jun 25, 2021)

AirbusX said:


> sorry I misread what you wrote, I thought it was I grew up with windows 10 lol



Yeah haha, iirc I either grew up with DOS or Windows 95, all I remember was that I played some DOS games and that 95/98 look familiar, never really knew what Windows was until XP came.


----------



## Urbanshadow (Jun 25, 2021)

pustal said:


> Ofc, but it may not just be a Windows 10 with some tweaks and have workflows changed in some aspects.



I am telling you it will because windows 10 is really Windows 7 with some tweaks, and Windows 7 is a mix between Windows Vista and Win XP SP3 with some tweaks.

And it has to be like this not because Microsoft wants it this way or because they do things half-assed (which we can discuss but it is not the topic) it has to be like this because most third party will break badly and those third parties are big enough to exert a so vast amount of pressure to successfully block progress into the operating system only to avoid setting their budgets to rebuild the humongous architecture chaos their core applications have become.

There is no easy way out of this unless Microsoft fixes the inherent problems their Insider Program has, and let's everyone be ready for a big new version of Windows on launch day.

EDIT: As an example, services mostly still work the same way they did on Windows NT a whooping 28 years later.


----------



## MiiJack (Jun 25, 2021)

I'll wait for Windows 11 debloater before jumping into this.


----------



## Deleted member 532471 (Jun 25, 2021)

I shudder at the thought of what devilish things they have done to make the user even more into a product
Win10 already had ads a la carte with unrequested toast notifications, start menu ads and the like

Everyone will resist the upgrade until ms starts enforcing win11  only apps and everyone is forced to upgrade.
I recently had to install win10 because newer games won't work on win7 anymore.


----------



## jeffyTheHomebrewer (Jun 25, 2021)

Please tell me this isn't an automatic thing. I REFUSE to use windows 11 on my 2 machines already running 10. 11 is ugly as hell.


----------



## AlexMCS (Jun 25, 2021)

Gotta wait for Open Shell updates to get a functional Start Menu again, and stick the task bar where it belongs, icon alignment and all, but I'll live... 

I'd stick to XP/Vista/7 if I could though.


----------



## RichardTheKing (Jun 25, 2021)

The heck? I specifically remember Microsoft saying "Windows 10 will be the last version ever", with improvements being incremental and still being labelled as part of 10.
Why'd they change their minds?


----------



## Burorī (Jun 25, 2021)

I mostly want better compatibility with older games


----------



## Sathya (Jun 25, 2021)

im disappointed when microsoft store have tiktok apps


----------



## Bladexdsl (Jun 25, 2021)

nope not believing it have you seen the interface for w11? they are trying to turn our computers into shitty macs!

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------



jeffyTheHomebrewer said:


> Please tell me this isn't an automatic thing. I REFUSE to use windows 11 on my 2 machines already running 10. 11 is ugly as hell.


get windows 10 manager and block auto updates


----------



## tpax (Jun 25, 2021)

It'll be funny to see what they did to telemetry in Windows 11. 10 was already a pain, you had to go through a lot of trouble to completely get rid of the telemetry and to debloat a fresh install from unnecessary crap.
11, at least the home edition, seems to make it really hard to have an instance running with an offline account, since it enforces you to have an MS account during the installation. The old trick with pulling your ethernet cable isn't working anymore.


----------



## tech3475 (Jun 25, 2021)

RichardTheKing said:


> The heck? I specifically remember Microsoft saying "Windows 10 will be the last version ever", with improvements being incremental and still being labelled as part of 10.
> Why'd they change their minds?



Maybe:
1) They wanted new system requirements, especially TPM 2.0 and ditch 32bit
2) The radical UI change

Had this been done under W10, it could create a much worse situation since many older machines were able to run it but don’t support TPM 2.0 and I’d imagine more complaints, particularly commercial users.


----------



## RichardTheKing (Jun 25, 2021)

tech3475 said:


> Maybe:
> 1) They wanted new system requirements, especially TPM 2.0 and ditch 32bit
> 2) The radical UI change
> 
> Had this been done under W10, it could create a much worse situation since many older machines were able to run it but don’t support TPM 2.0 and I’d imagine more complaints, particularly commercial users.


You know that Windows 12 is now practically guaranteed, since they've just broken their "last version" promise...and Microsoft previously liked to keep a bunch of antiquated features in their OSes to allow for as much backwards-compatibility as possible (examples: A and B drives, which are _floppy disk drives_; how you can't name folders "CON" and stuff because they were used in DOS as overrides, to target printers and stuff), so them actually removing 32-bit support would be surprising.

About time for them to remove old crap and (hopefully) fix bugs relating to such old features, but still not something I ever expected them to do.


----------



## Skelletonike (Jun 25, 2021)

Pretty interesting, I may just upgrade my laptop as soon as it's released.


----------



## tech3475 (Jun 25, 2021)

RichardTheKing said:


> You know that Windows 12 is now practically guaranteed, since they've just broken their "last version" promise...and Microsoft previously liked to keep a bunch of antiquated features in their OSes to allow for as much backwards-compatibility as possible (examples: A and B drives, which are _floppy disk drives_; how you can't name folders "CON" and stuff because they were used in DOS as overrides, to target printers and stuff), so them actually removing 32-bit support would be surprising.
> 
> About time for them to remove old crap and (hopefully) fix bugs relating to such old features, but still not something I ever expected them to do.



I didn't mean 32bit app support, just 32bit versions of Windows. Windows 10 32bit stopped being shipped to OEMs a few years ago so now with Windows 11 they only have 64bit versions of the OS to maintain.

I doubt we'll see 32bit app support dropped any time soon.


----------



## LightBeam (Jun 25, 2021)

And they still don't have tabs for the explorer
It has been asked for ages
Anyway I'm more interested in gaming anyway, if most games were available on Linux without hassle I wouldn't consider Windows for a sec, and the features don't feel very appealing. I'll still probably upgrade but I'll wait for softwares to be compatible


----------



## RedBlueGreen (Jun 25, 2021)

zupi said:


> I shudder at the thought of what devilish things they have done to make the user even more into a product
> Win10 already had ads a la carte with unrequested toast notifications, start menu ads and the like
> 
> Everyone will resist the upgrade until ms starts enforcing win11  only apps and everyone is forced to upgrade.
> I recently had to install win10 because newer games won't work on win7 anymore.


A lot of those games work on Ubuntu through Steam Play and Lutris with DXVK and Proton. It's actually my older games that rely on old ass Windows XP codecs that keep me on Windows. That and proprietary software (including anti-cheats) that won't run well through Wine or Lutris. Namely I use Waves Z-Noise and WNS which don't install on Linux even with compatibility layers. Unfortunately tons of good post production software is Windows and/or Mac only. Especially the noise clean up stuff which is a necessity in an urban area, especially apartments.


LightBeam said:


> And they still don't have tabs for the explorer
> It has been asked for age
> Anyway I'm more interested in gaming anyway, if most games were available on Linux without hassle I wouldn't consider Windows for a sec, and the features don't feel very appealing. I'll still probably upgrade but I'll wait for softwares to be compatible


This too. I don't have the patience to have to set different versions of Proton for different games and then have some games require a beta build like Persona 4 Golden just to rub properly when it ran fine before (the cutscene patch basically killed compatibility without the beta version installed). Then have an update potentially kill the compatibility again. Also I use a virtual desktop to stream PCVR to my Oculus Quest 2, and the software I use only supports Windows 10, and the Oculus software might only support Windows and Mac as well.


----------



## BlastedGuy9905 (Jun 25, 2021)

SaulFabre said:


> Not interested in it, I will keep with Windows 10


Isn't that what everyone said every single time there was a new Windows version, only to update a year or two later..


----------



## smf (Jun 25, 2021)

CeeDee said:


> Neat! But if it's free, why not just make it a Windows 10 upgrade?



A combination of corporate clients who are cautious about any kind of change that will require retraining/compatibility for line of business apps (but still want to receive security updates) & also a chance to cut off some older machines to save themselves some money in terms of development and testing.



ihaveamac said:


> The TPM 2.0 requirement is likely going to shut out a lot of PCs that don't have it at all, or don't have it enabled by default. The PC I have from 2014 doesn't support it, therefore it is stuck to Windows 10. It can be bypassed for now but who knows if that will still be possible in the future?



Frankly if you can't follow instructions on how to enable it, then you shouldn't be attempting to install an operating system upgrade in the first place.

Expect to see a lot of articles on how to enable or fit a TPM (and TPM availability, taking into account the silicon shortage) now that they've announced



ihaveamac said:


> Also there are some other "interesting" changes such as removing the possibility of moving the taskbar from the bottom. https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/windows-11-specifications



It reduces the amount of meeting, development and testing they have by 3/4. How many people move it? And is there any good reason for them to move it? "I like it when it annoys people who try to use my computer" is not something I think Microsoft should be paying for.



pustal said:


> Rumor has it that Windows 11 is made out of Windows 10X and not Windows 10. Windows 10X was "made from the ground up" according to Microsoft (I believe many things they just reused from Windows 10 though) and it is not an upgrade from Windows 10.



Windows 10X was based on Windows Core, as is Windows 10.

Windows 11 has the UI from Windows 10X but it's not Windows 10X.

The distinction between Windows 10 and Windows 11 is mostly marketing.



Reynardine said:


> Windows 10 was a trainwreck. I don't have high hopes for this one either.
> 
> I'll hold onto my win 7 and linux dual boot setup for the time being.



Windows 10 has been great for me, much better than Windows 7. But then I find Linux a train wreck that only survived due to hatred of Microsoft and I stopped hating them 20 years ago when I gave up using my Amiga as my main machine at home.



Lacius said:


> My understanding is the rebranding is pretty much in name only. Windows 10 users will be forced to update to Windows 11 automatically after enough time as passed, like with any other major Windows 10 update.



Supposedly nobody will be forced to update to Windows 11. You've got 4 years of updates and then it will be up to you, either you carry on without updates and risk being hacked or you figure a way to meet the requirements.



Lacius said:


> The ability of Windows 11 to support running Android apps "natively" is pretty neat though. That was my biggest takeaway.



It's going to be interesting on how that pans out, it doesn't seem to work like bluestacks etc as I think they said apps would need to opt in.



guisadop said:


> I'll probably keep using windows 10 at least until 2025. Especially because updates will cease to be pushed then, and automatic updates are the biggest problem in W10 IMO.



I don't know what it's like on Windows 10 Home, but Windows 10 Pro is pretty good with updates. At least now they fixed it so you could throttle the update download. In the beginning, when I only had 2mb/s, I'd be streaming something on TV and it would stop & I'd have to suspend my laptop.



Tom Bombadildo said:


> Been using the leaked version my Razer Blade 14 since it leaked, seems pretty ok (even though the leak is basically just 10 kernel with 11 UI and not too many under the hood changes yet ).



Although the leak is an older build, that is basically what Windows 11 is.



ciaomao said:


> Wasn't it communicated everywhere that windows 10 will only receive updates and that windows 11 will never appear?



When Windows 10 launched (six years ago) they planned on feature updates every 6 months rather than repeating the same mistake they had made previously where they would disappear and come back 5 years later with a new version of Windows.

They've slightly changed their mind as they had the work from Windows 10X that would otherwise be wasted as the hardware it was for is no longer coming. I don't think you can blame them for this.



Lacius said:


> I got the same error. You're probably right that it's related to TPM. The BitLocker requirements for TPM can already be disabled on Windows 10, so my guess is this will be bypassable one way or another.



TPM isn't a requirement for bitlocker, the default security level cannot be used without a TPM but you can lower it.

I don't doubt that a lot of people will be looking for ways to install Windows 11 without a TPM & they may well find one. I suspect more people will just get a TPM.



MorningBlunt said:


> They make money from licencing and OEMs. They can't make any money by having it as Windows 10.
> BUT they can make Samsung, Dell, HP etc. pay for 11 under a new dealio.



Dell etc pay per copy of Windows 10, they'll pay the same per copy of Windows 11.



tech3475 said:


> I wonder how much that TPM requirement will be a problem for MS and customers? I just had to manually enable AMD fTPM in UEFI to pass the requirement check.



I would expect a lot of "can you help me upgrade my computer to windows 11 calls".
There will probably be a TPM shortage too



tech3475 said:


> I'd presume so, IIRC XDA had an article on the leaked build where apparently it can accept W7/8 keys.



The leaked build is not a good indication of what they will accept in terms of hardware and licensing as they can make that decision right at the last minutes.



Uiaad said:


> Yeah at the moment Windows 11 does require TPM 2.0 and Secure boot enabled. It's unclear if this is just a temporary thing with the "insider builds" and will vanish nearer the Fall 10 Release/upgrade path - A lot of motherboard support TPM but just lack the module



Actually it seems to be the other way round, the insider builds will not enforce the minimum requirements. At general availability you'll be forced to re-install windows 10 if your machine doesn't meet the minimum requirements. You can't even stay on windows 11 insider builds.



Lacius said:


> Or you can update from Home to an unactivated version of Pro with the generic Pro license, and then use the Windows 7 free upgrade servers to activate your copy of Windows 10 Pro.



How?



Lacius said:


> It looks like the TPM requirements (and UEFI requirements and Secure Boot requirements) are baked into the installer and not the OS itself. Swapping the install.wim of an older installer with the Windows 11 install.wim seems to be installing just fine on an older system.



That doesn't surprise me, but don't expect that to work forever. If they are serious about enforcing TPM then they are perfectly capable of doing so. As they are also enforcing Secure Boot then patching out the check will be impossible, you'd have to break Secure Boot...



D34DL1N3R said:


> Was already figured out 5 days ago you can press Alt+F4 to use a local account. Helps to check things out before posting.



As the minimum system requirements aren't going to be enforced until general availability (maybe November this year???) then it would be premature to say that you can work round them as you don't have that version. But then it helps to check things out before posting.



pedro702 said:


> well i dont have tpm 2.0 so yeah no windows 11 for me :S



If you have a desktop then adding a TPM might be easy (and pretty cheap), laptops without TPM or a new enough chipset to support firmware TPM might be out of luck. I do wonder if a USB/PCIE TPM is possible.



PhantomFist said:


> Michael MJD on Youtube installed the dev build on an old HP, proving you can bypass the TPM requirement. For now, anyway.



It proves that they don't enforce the announced general availability minimum system requirements, like they say don't.

https://blogs.windows.com/windows-i...ing-for-insider-preview-builds-of-windows-11/



Maq47 said:


> I just realized that TPM is disabled in my BIOS (my rig has no UEFI capabilities), but it is only 1.1, with some 1.2 compatibility settings only.



If you have a desktop with a TPM it's probably removable & you can fit a 2.0 module.

How old is your computer? UEFI came out in 2006. Secure Boot was added in UEFI 2.3.1, which was around 2012.



ghjfdtg said:


> On one side they give away free licenses and make a PR stunt out of it but on the other it's still paid for new PC's with it pre-installed. You are not even getting any advantage for the paid one.



You buy it once and get free upgrades, what is the problem with that?



wiitendo84 said:


> Everything I found about my laptop says that it doesn't have it. Ran the windows checker thing and lo and behold it does in fact have a TPM 2.0



It's probably got what is referred to as a firmware TPM.

https://www.onlogic.com/company/io-hub/intel-platform-trust-technology-ptt-tpm-for-the-masses/



Lacius said:


> I have a laptop from 2015 with no TPM chip, and I have a desktop I built in 2019 that has no TPM chip ("Why does my desktop need BitLocker?" I said). If I can't bypass the requirement, I won't be happy.
> 
> My SO's laptop is also from 2015 with no TPM chip.



I'm not sure why you wouldn't want to use bitlocker, but you should be able to get a TPM for the Desktop.
Laptops are harder, even if there is a TPM header then dismantling it could be a PITA. I've



leerpsp said:


> I just did that and now have that turned on but still does not help this problem
> MY PC's specs are
> AMD Ryzen 1600 six-core processor 3.20
> 32GB of ddr4
> ...



Have you enabled secure boot? I suspect that will be a bit of a sticking point for people who dual boot, you can do it but a lot of people seem to rage at secure boot and instantly turn it off.



the_randomizer said:


> I'll stick to Windows 10, thank you. 11 looks like another unmitigated disaster.



11 looks great, it basically is windows 10.



Lacius said:


> Windows XP, good. Windows Vista, bad. Windows 7, good. Windows 8 and 8.1, bad. Windows 10, good. Windows 11... bad?



It's actually people not liking change.

I remember a huge backlash against Microsoft for adding the Start Menu to Windows 95, because they liked Program Manager in Windows 3.1.

Then when they removed it from Windows 7 there was a huge backlash.

I have run WIndows 95/98/NT4/2k/XP/Vista/7/8.1/10 and once I'd spent a week with each then I wouldn't go back.



Armadillo said:


> Earlier chipsets tend to have a tpm header, but getting one that is compatible with old boards and making it work, seems to be a minefield.



I'd expect that to change now that there is a compelling reason to have one.



D34DL1N3R said:


> Needing an online account was shown to be able to be bypassed 5 days ago, and now it's been shown that Win11 also does not require TMP 2.0. Only 1.2. The health check app is just giving incorrect information.
> 
> https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/compatibility/windows-11/#hardware-requirements



Or maybe that link is giving incorrect information.

https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/windows-11

*Minimum system requirements*
TPM Trusted Platform Module (TPM) version 2.0

It's not being enforced in any of the beta builds yet, so we can't tell.



Asia81 said:


> I activated the intel TPM things in my bios but the health app still say My PC is not compatible with W11, any ideas ?



Does it show up in device manager? It might need a driver.
Did you enable secure boot?
Do you meet all the other requirements?



RichardTheKing said:


> You know that Windows 12 is now practically guaranteed, since they've just broken their "last version" promise...



There was never a promise to break.



RichardTheKing said:


> and Microsoft previously liked to keep a bunch of antiquated features in their OSes to allow for as much backwards-compatibility as possible (examples: A and B drives, which are _floppy disk drives_;



A: & B: aren't floppy disk drives, I could set my 2nd hard drive to be A: or B: if I wanted. Drive letters aren't going away.



RichardTheKing said:


> how you can't name folders "CON" and stuff because they were used in DOS as overrides, to target printers and stuff), so them actually removing 32-bit support would be surprising.



CON is part of Windows and even if they did drop 32 bit app support, then CON it would remain.


----------



## Flame (Jun 25, 2021)

@smf thanks for your Microsoft tech support. /s


----------



## D34DL1N3R (Jun 25, 2021)

There is SOOOOOOOOO much misinformation & SOOOOOOOOO many completely untrue statements in this topic that it kinda literally makes me sick to my stomach. Half of the people commenting are clueless and should just stop using a PC altogether. Quoting all of the pure bullshit over the last 9 pages would be too much work and much too long of a post. Sorry that Windows has to be so complicated and tough for a lot of you.


----------



## neotank19 (Jun 25, 2021)

on windows 7, still miss window xp.


----------



## D34DL1N3R (Jun 25, 2021)

neotank19 said:


> on windows 7, still miss window xp.



What do you plan on doing when Windows 7 ESU ends next year? Go back to XP? lol. Win 10 is superior to Windows 7 in almost every way.


----------



## Maq47 (Jun 25, 2021)

smf said:


> If you have a desktop with a TPM it's probably removable & you can fit a 2.0 module.
> 
> How old is your computer? UEFI came out in 2006. Secure Boot was added in UEFI 2.3.1, which was around 2012.


I checked again, and my mobo has no TPM header, although there are settings for TPM in BIOS (which, not surprisingly, are grayed out). I have a P6T SE motherboard. The next nearest mobo that has a TPM header is the P6T WS PRO, but according to my mobo's manual, there is no TPM header on mine. My PC is a custom rig from 2010, with a 650W CoolerMaster GX Bronze PSU and a P6T SE mobo in a black/blue Apevia X-Sniper G-Type ATX Mid Tower case. The best GPU my computer can _reasonably_ handle is a GTX 960 or R9 285. I really want an upgrade, but due to someone (no idea who) COMPLETELY borking up my info at the IRS, I have gotten ZERO stimulus checks, and I have never had to do a tax return (I'm on SSI - this alone should allow me to get the checks), so I cannot use the new form for it.
...
But, back on topic, yeah, I'm not getting W11 anytime soon, although I really want that Android compatibility (my PC is custom, so I cannot get RemixOS working, and although I use MEmu, the ads and bloat, not to mention the newer block on custom Launchers, make it unbearable). The one game I play on Android should work out of the box with W11, since it has very few system requirements (it runs perfectly on the very first Samsung Galaxy phone, for example).


----------



## CrossOut (Jun 25, 2021)

Until i can get a new computer ill be on windows 10 since i dont have the TPM 2.0 chipset on this really old computer. i wonder what problems will be with this new upgrade, hopefully no blue screen error on check disc. Though a good thing is that windows 10 has a great compatibility for many games now so lets hope that windows 11 or rather windows 10 DLC will keep it up.


----------



## Quarions (Jun 25, 2021)

neotank19 said:


> on windows 7, still miss window xp.


imagine staying on Windows 7 in 2k21, you must be a hardcore looser.


----------



## smf (Jun 25, 2021)

Maq47 said:


> so I cannot get RemixOS working, and although I use MEmu, the ads and bloat, not to mention the newer block on custom Launchers, make it unbearable).



I run lineageos on my phone and some software complains about it being rooted, even though it technically isn't, so I went through all of them. memu stayed on my machine for about 30 seconds, bluestacks is the only one that would run the apps and the bloat/adds on it isn't that bad.

It worked fine until I enabled wsl2 and then complained saying I needed to use a different version that was compatible with hyperv & that one wasn't compatible with the apps & eventually I went through the pain of downgrading to wsl1.

I'm not convinced Android on W11 is going to be painless either though...



CrossOut said:


> Until i can get a new computer ill be on windows 10 since i dont have the TPM 2.0 chipset on this really old computer.



I wouldn't be surprised if there was a solution to this problem, I don't think the TPM header is particular secure & so it could potentially be put on pcie/usb. It might need a UEFI update though.


----------



## Lacius (Jun 25, 2021)

Lacius said:


> Or you can update from Home to an unactivated version of Pro with the generic Pro license, and then use the Windows 7 free upgrade servers to activate your copy of Windows 10 Pro.





smf said:


> How?


Change the product key to the generic Windows 10 Pro key, let it upgrade from Windows 10 Home to Windows 10 Pro, and then use one of the many third-party tools out there to activate the system via the free Windows 7 upgrade servers.


----------



## Squidge (Jun 25, 2021)

Ughh those icons are way too stylized. These vibes are rancid.


----------



## chrisrlink (Jun 25, 2021)

neotank19 said:


> on windows 7, still miss window xp.


so you're on a hackers playground? good 2 know....JK


----------



## Megadriver94 (Jun 25, 2021)

Lacius said:


> My understanding is the rebranding is pretty much in name only. Windows 10 users will be forced to update to Windows 11 automatically after enough time as passed, like with any other major Windows 10 update.
> 
> The ability of Windows 11 to support running Android apps "natively" is pretty neat though. That was my biggest takeaway.


Not if you got Windows update blocker in an active state, which I do.


----------



## leerpsp (Jun 25, 2021)

well after reading some new things on this I can tell you that I will have to upgrade my cpu no matter what and get that chip for my motherboard but I may just give in and get a new cpu motherboard combo deal or something along the lines of that sine I did want to upgrade but I will try and go cheap on the motherboard since I think we may see ddr5 next year or the year after so that way I can just swap to a ddr5 motherboard after.


----------



## Naster (Jun 25, 2021)

Didn’t used Windows for gaming since 2009 when Call of Pripyat was released.


----------



## Mythical (Jun 25, 2021)

Prans said:


> probably because new PCs will come preloaded with it and this will take away the need to update again


couldn't you just preload them with the latest either way?


----------



## Delerious (Jun 25, 2021)

*Telemetry intensifies*


----------



## D34DL1N3R (Jun 25, 2021)

Delerious said:


> *Telemetry intensifies*



*Tin foil sales increase upon release of Windows 11*


----------



## Bladexdsl (Jun 25, 2021)

this is their plan to turn our pcs into shitty ipads


----------



## subcon959 (Jun 25, 2021)

I enabled TPM 2.0 in my bios and I don't feel any different


----------



## MarioMasta64 (Jun 26, 2021)

AlexMCS said:


> Gotta wait for Open Shell updates to get a functional Start Menu again, and stick the task bar where it belongs, icon alignment and all, but I'll live...
> 
> I'd stick to XP/Vista/7 if I could though.


openshell already works with windows 11


----------



## Deleted User (Jun 26, 2021)

Knowing MS they will force you to update eventually, but until then I will not be updating.


----------



## Firexploit (Jun 26, 2021)

I think the ui looks kinda generic. With things like: offwhite, round, minimalist icons, etc... I wish they did a unique design


----------



## Ampersound (Jun 26, 2021)

Chris_Dai_Gyakuten_Saiban said:


> This sounds like it may be good, but for the time being I will just wait until it is stable and see if it is worth the update. For now Windows 10 does what I need it to do.


If you wait until Windows is stable, you won't be upgrading at all.


----------



## Kingy (Jun 26, 2021)

I like this. Having been running the leaked build, the design has grown on me and I really do enjoy using Win11- they are finally solving the problem of inconsistency in design throughout the OS! The performance difference also really shows, everything feels much snappier while using Win11. I'm excited to upgrade, and I've already signed for the Beta Channel.

However, the hardware requirements are strange indeed. I'm sure it'll be patchable just like on build 21996. But, I also hope this encourages OEMs to use more modern components in their systems, if that's one good thing you can hope from it...


----------



## protomouse (Jun 26, 2021)

I'm concerned about my data, so I'll continue to browse the web with this outdated and insecure version of Windows.



Spoiler



/s


----------



## D34DL1N3R (Jun 26, 2021)

smf said:


> Or maybe that link is giving incorrect information.



Turned out to be the case, although previously no one new 100% because their own documentation was stating two different things. MS has since updated the link I posted. https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/compatibility/windows-11/#hardware-requirements


----------



## Pluupy (Jun 26, 2021)

nightweb said:


> The Bit that got me was Under System requirements it has "Windows 11 Home edition requires internet connectivity and a  Microsoft account to complete device setup on first use."
> 
> Nooooope


It's not required. They just heavily, heavily, heavily recommend it. In this video, at 04:25, the guy installs Windows 11 and the installer will ask you multiple times to make or login to a Microsoft account, all the while giving you the option to just skip. Windows 10 already does this in a way, but Windows 11 is far more aggressive by removing features from the operating system to punish users.


----------



## Tom Bombadildo (Jun 26, 2021)

Pluupy said:


> It's not required. They just heavily, heavily, heavily recommend it. In this video, at 04:25, the guy installs Windows 11 and the installer will ask you multiple times to make or login to a Microsoft account, all the while giving you the option to just skip. Windows 10 already does this in a way, but Windows 11 is far more aggressive by removing features from the operating system to punish users.



If you watch the video, he uses the pro version of 11 (for workstations), not *Home*. Home requires an account unless you use the usual "no internet" bypass that works with Windows 10.


----------



## Kraken_X (Jun 26, 2021)

I'm pretty sure that this TPM requirement is all about strengthening Windows Store and Xbox DRM, effectively turning all PC's into consoles in 2025.  


From the TPM wikipedia page: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trusted_Platform_Module#Other_uses_and_concerns


*Other uses and concerns*
Any application can use a TPM chip for:


Digital rights management (DRM)
Windows Defender
Windows Domain logon [16]
Protection and enforcement of software licenses
Prevention of cheating in online games[17]


----------



## Hakaisha (Jun 26, 2021)

Nice try, Microsoft! I'll be sticking with TempleOS.


----------



## tech3475 (Jun 26, 2021)

Kraken_X said:


> I'm pretty sure that this TPM requirement is all about strengthening Windows Store and Xbox DRM, effectively turning all PC's into consoles in 2025.
> 
> 
> From the TPM wikipedia page: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trusted_Platform_Module#Other_uses_and_concerns
> ...



AFAIK depending on the game they already use EFS on purchases through the store.


----------



## nikeymikey (Jun 26, 2021)

My PC is only 4 years old and is not compatible due to the processor, guess my I7-7700K isn't enough nowadays. I'm not upgrading just for an OS ffs.


----------



## CMDreamer (Jun 26, 2021)

Here comes the new Windows, a combination of what Windows Vista & Windows 8 had to offer to the computer users back then.

You need a completely new computer (diferent hardware) if you're willing to run this Windows version.

A single environment to control them all has never succeeded, anywhere. Will this be an exception? Time will tell.


----------



## subcon959 (Jun 26, 2021)

nikeymikey said:


> My PC is only 4 years old and is not compatible due to the processor, guess my I7-7700K isn't enough nowadays. I'm not upgrading just for an OS ffs.


The minimum requirement is a 1ghz dual core cpu so I think you'll be fine.


----------



## NinStar (Jun 26, 2021)

subcon959 said:


> The minimum requirement is a 1ghz dual core cpu so I think you'll be fine.



That is not the problem here, 7th gen core and older are not supported officially, even with TPM 2.0 enabled.

I don't understand what is the reason for this is, maybe some very specific instruction sets?


----------



## Tom Bombadildo (Jun 26, 2021)

MarioSilva said:


> That is not the problem here, 7th gen core and older are not supported officially, even with TPM 2.0 enabled.
> 
> I don't understand what is the reason for this is, maybe some very specific instruction sets?


Officially supported =/= does not work at all. I installed the leak on a laptop with a 7700hq in it, works just fine.


----------



## NinStar (Jun 26, 2021)

Tom Bombadildo said:


> Officially supported =/= does not work at all. I installed the leak on a laptop with a 7700hq in it, works just fine.



I know, but it's just strange they haven't made clear why these restrictions exists.


----------



## Worldblender (Jun 26, 2021)

From https://www.reddit.com/r/Windows11/...ompatibility_a_brief_explanation_9999_of_all/, https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/wi...supported/windows-11-supported-amd-processors, and https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/wi...pported/windows-11-supported-intel-processors, only CPUs explicitly listed within the latter two pages are supported, which means at least 8th gen Intel / AMD Ryzen 2000 CPUs have to be used. All older CPUs cannot be used when the final version of Windows 11 is released; this doesn't seem to apply to Insider builds for now.

Although I use Ubuntu GNU/Linux as my daily OS, I'm giving out this information to let people better know the minimum CPU  requirements of Windows 11; not just any x86-64 CPU can be used, but only the most recent ones from the past three years.


----------



## Tom Bombadildo (Jun 26, 2021)

MarioSilva said:


> I know, but it's just strange they haven't made clear why these restrictions exists.


They're not "restrictions", they're recommendations. Big difference between "This will not work at all on" and "This is the minimum we recommend you use". You can only validate your product on so many pieces of hardware, it's impossible for any company to go and buy every single CPU or motherboard or GPU and go and test the thing. 

I think MS just screwed up by giving an "officially supported" list of hardware for an OS, since it's clearly giving people all these wrong ideas that Windows 11 "needs new hardware" and other such dumb ideas that simply aren't true. 

It's like PC game "requirements", some game may say the minimum "requirements" need a GTX 1060 or whatever in order to run, but that doesn't mean you can't use a GTX 1050.


----------



## TheGodMauro (Jun 26, 2021)

I'll wait to see if the actual release brings performance improvements to the table. Direct storage is the only feature that looks good, otherwise it just felt like a presentation full of stuff that I would either remove, ignore or modify in a personal installation.


----------



## NinStar (Jun 26, 2021)

Tom Bombadildo said:


> They're not "restrictions", they're recommendations. Big difference between "This will not work at all on" and "This is the minimum we recommend you use". You can only validate your product on so many pieces of hardware, it's impossible for any company to go and buy every single CPU or motherboard or GPU and go and test the thing.
> 
> I think MS just screwed up by giving an "officially supported" list of hardware for an OS, since it's clearly giving people all these wrong ideas that Windows 11 "needs new hardware" and other such dumb ideas that simply aren't true.
> 
> It's like PC game "requirements", some game may say the minimum "requirements" need a GTX 1060 or whatever in order to run, but that doesn't mean you can't use a GTX 1050.



I get what you mean, I know the difference between these two things, but that wasn't my point, I didn't say it wouldn't run, I just stated that it is not officially supported and they didn't give a clear reason for this. 

And yes, Microsoft is clearly referring to it as requirements, not recommendations.


----------



## vincentx77 (Jun 26, 2021)

I have to say I'm completely floored by the CPU requirements for what looks like another yearly upgrade patch. Ok, it probably has a few more features, but still. No intel CPUs before 8th gen? No Ryzen CPUs before 2nd gen? I could understand not wanting to support Core2 Duos at this point, but I fail to see how even Sandy Bridge is too slow to run this OS, much less Ryzen 1. I bet they're going to try to lock it down with a bunch of encryption crap that hurts the consumer more than it helps them. It's frustrating. I've mostly liked Windows 10 overall. Why do I have the feeling they're going to fuck it up?


----------



## Lavaimp (Jun 27, 2021)

ihaveamac said:


> The TPM 2.0 requirement is likely going to shut out a lot of PCs that don't have it at all, or don't have it enabled by default. The PC I have from 2014 doesn't support it, therefore it is stuck to Windows 10. It can be bypassed for now but who knows if that will still be possible in the future?
> 
> Also there are some other "interesting" changes such as removing the possibility of moving the taskbar from the bottom. https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/windows-11-specifications



The fact you can't move the taskbar to the top of the screen is already a huge turnoff for me, since i grew to like it at the top over the bottom


----------



## BitMasterPlus (Jun 27, 2021)

SphereDoomer said:


> The fact you can't move the taskbar to the top of the screen is already a huge turnoff for me, since i grew to like it at the top over the bottom


Being a top is always better than being a bottom.


----------



## LogicIsHansom (Jun 27, 2021)

ihaveamac said:


> The TPM 2.0 requirement is likely going to shut out a lot of PCs that don't have it at all, or don't have it enabled by default. The PC I have from 2014 doesn't support it, therefore it is stuck to Windows 10. It can be bypassed for now but who knows if that will still be possible in the future?
> 
> Also there are some other "interesting" changes such as removing the possibility of moving the taskbar from the bottom. https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/windows-11-specifications


That singlehandedly killed the update to me.


----------



## TomSwitch (Jun 27, 2021)

Yes, Microsoft is the new Apple. I hope to like this new Apple better than the old Apple.

Microsoft has been really missing out on the HDR and media action for so long. Windows was the worst HDR experience today. Even a cheap TV stick could do better ages ago.


----------



## tech3475 (Jun 27, 2021)

I'm curious about what the adoption rate of W11 will be like? Out of the 9 or so W10 machines I have between myself and my parents, only 3 I know will officially work.


----------



## J-Machine (Jun 27, 2021)

luckily most mobos should be able to just have a tpm chip slotted in. the chip is generally like 20 bucks. BUT it's clear 11 is M$ officially killing backwards compatibility thanks to removing the ancient coding that's been in the OS since hecking 3.1.


----------



## tech3475 (Jun 27, 2021)

J-Machine said:


> luckily most mobos should be able to just have a tpm chip slotted in. the chip is generally like 20 bucks. BUT it's clear 11 is M$ officially killing backwards compatibility thanks to removing the ancient coding that's been in the OS since hecking 3.1.



You're forgetting the CPU requirements, such as 8th gen Intel or above.


----------



## J-Machine (Jun 27, 2021)

tech3475 said:


> You're forgetting the CPU requirements, such as 8th gen Intel or above.


I'm not forgetting that. win 10 has 4 more years. i figure a 9+ year old desktop would be ready to upgrade regardless and thus we shouldn't see any real disruption for users.


----------



## chrisrlink (Jun 27, 2021)

tech3475 said:


> You're forgetting the CPU requirements, such as 8th gen Intel or above.


guess 10 is the end of the line then for my z420 then


----------



## Lacius (Jun 27, 2021)

It looks like the TPM 2.0 requirement will probably continue to be bypassable after it reaches general availability (relevant part in bold).



> 3.6.1 Trusted Platform Module (TPM)
> 
> All device models, lines or series must implement and be in compliance with the International Standard ISO/IEC 11889:2015 or the Trusted Computing Group TPM 2.0 Library and a component which implements the TPM 2.0 must be present and enabled by default.
> 
> ...



(PDF: Extensive Windows 11 System Requirements)


----------



## tech3475 (Jun 27, 2021)

J-Machine said:


> I'm not forgetting that. win 10 has 4 more years. i figure a 9+ year old desktop would be ready to upgrade regardless and thus we shouldn't see any real disruption for users.



You said you just need to add the TPM chip.

edit:

If you meant 'if you have a compatible CPU, you can add the chip', then I would first check UEFI as it may have software TPM (fTPM or PTT).


----------



## Alexander1970 (Jun 27, 2021)

ihaveamac said:


> The TPM 2.0 requirement is likely going to shut out a lot of PCs that don't have it at all, or don't have it enabled by default. The PC I have from 2014 doesn't support it, therefore it is stuck to Windows 10. It can be bypassed for now but who knows if that will still be possible in the future?



Yes,that is really great.

And thanks to that fucking bloody annoying Bullshit I need now a new PC.....

My PC is still able to run actual Games,Appllications and that Stuff and because of this Bullshit I have to get a new(er) PC....fuck Microsoft this Time.


----------



## J-Machine (Jun 27, 2021)

tech3475 said:


> You said you just need to add the TPM chip.
> 
> edit:
> 
> If you meant 'if you have a compatible CPU, you can add the chip', then I would first check UEFI as it may have software TPM (fTPM or PTT).


I was just replying to your reply. as for the comparability I stand by it. if you don't have the 2.0 chip specifically (custom builds could have this happen so best to check the bios) then you can just buy the chip itself since it gets socketed to the mobo.


----------



## tech3475 (Jun 27, 2021)

J-Machine said:


> I was just replying to your reply. as for the comparability I stand by it. if you don't have the 2.0 chip specifically (custom builds could have this happen so best to check the bios) then you can just buy the chip itself since it gets socketed to the mobo.



I'm not saying you can't buy the socketed chip, what I'm saying is that IN ADDITION to the TPM requirement MS also changed the CPU requirements, so just adding TPM may not be enough to meet the official requirements.

So even if I bought the TPM for my old 3770K, it still wont be officially supported.

I wouldn't be surprised if the 'officially supported' CPUs have a compatible TPM built in, either fTPM or PTT.

Really it seem ridiculous to cut off so many CPUs, TPM is bad enough but as you say, at least might be possible to add it depending on the motherboard.


----------



## nl255 (Jun 27, 2021)

J-Machine said:


> I'm not forgetting that. win 10 has 4 more years. i figure a 9+ year old desktop would be ready to upgrade regardless and thus we shouldn't see any real disruption for users.



Four more years of support by Microsoft.  I fully expect that by the end of 2022 there will be quite a few games, including GTA Online, that will require Windows 11 and DirectStorage to even run.  While it will likely be possible to create a DirectStorage to Nvidia RTX IO wrapper (assuming MS allows Nvidia to ship drivers for Windows 10 that include RTX IO support) for single player games online games like GTA are going to be a problem.



chrisrlink said:


> guess 10 is the end of the line then for my z420 then





alexander1970 said:


> Yes,that is really great.
> 
> And thanks to that fucking bloody annoying Bullshit I need now a new PC.....
> 
> My PC is still able to run actual Games,Appllications and that Stuff and because of this Bullshit I have to get a new(er) PC....fuck Microsoft this Time.



Of course it won't be the end of the line or require you to get a new system.  At worst you will have to use a BluePill style loader (a very lightweight bare metal hypervisor that intercepts certain instructions and hardware access attempts and returns fake values) but I am sure there will be USB stick/SD images (for use with a SD to SATA adapter) that will walk you through all the steps of taking full ownership of secure boot (dumping the current vendor public keys, generating your own secure boot keypairs, installing those keys, resigning the vendor keys and installing them, signing the custom bootloader, and finally adding the MS bootloader to the blocklist so that Windows can only be booted via the shim/BluePill loader).

I am honestly surprised that on a site like this that is dedicated to homebrew and custom firmware that a claim by MS about "requiring" anything is taken seriously and treated as anything more than a potential speed bump.  Compared to how 3DS CFW used to be in the menuxhax/emunand days bypassing the Windows 11 "requirements" is going to be trivial and the more MS insists that they are "hard requirements" the more likely there will be at least half a dozen ways to ignore said requirements before it even goes gold much less hits RTM.


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## leerpsp (Jun 27, 2021)

On there web page I see They are saying windows 11 is coming out holiday this year also the new Halo game will be coming out holiday this year so If I could make a guess I would say we will see a full release of windows 11 this November, If I stick back $200 a month witch i really hate to do and after paying off my pokemon preorder I will have a little under $1,000 If I stick with my still new rtx 2070 and if I keep the same ram (its 32gb overkill) I should be able to upgrade to a really good motherboard and cpu and also upgrade to a  better PSU, I hate to upgrade my parts so soon seeing how ddr5 will be coming soon (i hope).  I was going to buy the New Beats Studio Buds but really don't want to to risk skipping out on the motherboard, They did upgrade the pc health check and it does say that my CPU is only not supported but what if i just upgrade it and then its my motherboard, I really don't want to risk it so that is why I want to get the parts all together.


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## ZeroT21 (Jun 27, 2021)

Bet the new Halo title might require windows 11 lolz


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## nl255 (Jun 27, 2021)

leerpsp said:


> On there web page I see They are saying windows 11 is coming out holiday this year also the new Halo game will be coming out holiday this year so If I could make a guess I would say we will see a full release of windows 11 this November, If I stick back $200 a month witch i really hate to do and after paying off my pokemon preorder I will have a little under $1,000 If I stick with my still new rtx 2070 and if I keep the same ram (its 32gb overkill) I should be able to upgrade to a really good motherboard and cpu and also upgrade to a  better PSU, I hate to upgrade my parts so soon seeing how ddr5 will be coming soon (i hope).  I was going to buy the New Beats Studio Buds but really don't want to to risk skipping out on the motherboard, They did upgrade the pc health check and it does say that my CPU is only not supported but what if i just upgrade it and then its my motherboard, I really don't want to risk it so that is why I want to get the parts all together.



I would save up but not actually get any new hardware as it is almost certain that your existing hardware will work just fine once a bootloader is released that bypasses all the checks.  Even if it isn't possible to bypass them (yeah, right) it is unlikely very many if any games will actually require Windows 11 until the middle of 2022.

The point is while saving up as much money as you reasonably can is a good idea, don't panic. This is still a very early announcement to the point that MS employees are making contradictory statements about the matter.  It is entirely possible that they will backtrack entirely on the CPU requirements or that it will be easily bypassed with nothing more than a sysprep unattended answers file no different than what is currently used to move \Users to a drive other than C.  Remember when the Xbox One was going to have always online DRM and a bunch of other bullshit and it ended up not only not having any such requirement but the XBone also ended up having more or less official homebrew support?

Finally, even if it doesn't I can see three ways right now that such a requirement can be bypassed.  First, all hardware checks are disabled if running in a virtual machine so you can simply set up a small Linux/KVM system and run Windows 11 in a virtual machine using single GPU passthrough.  The second would be for someone to make a FakeVM bootloader/bootkit that tricks Windows into thinking it is running in a VM similar to how the old OEM SLIC emulators worked back in the XP days.  The third is a full blown BluePill style bootkit that is a very lightweight bare metal hypervisor that intercepts the instructions and hardware access requests used for said checks and returns fake values (fortunately most VM software including Hyper-V supports nested virtualization so you will still be able to use Vmware/Virtualbox/Hyper-V/etc even with such a loader).


----------



## leerpsp (Jun 27, 2021)

nl255 said:


> I would save up but not actually get any new hardware as it is almost certain that your existing hardware will work just fine once a bootloader is released that bypasses all the checks.  Even if it isn't possible to bypass them (yeah, right) it is unlikely very many if any games will actually require Windows 11 until the middle of 2022.
> 
> The point is while saving up as much money as you reasonably can is a good idea, don't panic. This is still a very early announcement to the point that MS employees are making contradictory statements about the matter.  It is entirely possible that they will backtrack entirely on the CPU requirements or that it will be easily bypassed with nothing more than a sysprep unattended answers file no different than what is currently used to move \Users to a drive other than C.  Remember when the Xbox One was going to have always online DRM and a bunch of other bullshit and it ended up not only not having any such requirement but the XBone also ended up having more or less official homebrew support?
> 
> Finally, even if it doesn't I can see three ways right now that such a requirement can be bypassed.  First, all hardware checks are disabled if running in a virtual machine so you can simply set up a small Linux/KVM system and run Windows 11 in a virtual machine using single GPU passthrough.  The second would be for someone to make a FakeVM bootloader/bootkit that tricks Windows into thinking it is running in a VM similar to how the old OEM SLIC emulators worked back in the XP days.  The third is a full blown BluePill style bootkit that is a very lightweight bare metal hypervisor that intercepts the instructions and hardware access requests used for said checks and returns fake values (fortunately most VM software including Hyper-V supports nested virtualization so you will still be able to use Vmware/Virtualbox/Hyper-V/etc even with such a loader).


Ok I'll save up but not buy anything till everyone knows, If I can bypass it or they backtrack I'll just buy a new gamesystem with what I saved up.


----------



## vincentx77 (Jun 27, 2021)

tech3475 said:


> You're forgetting the CPU requirements, such as 8th gen Intel or above.



It's starting to look like they're talking out of both sides of their mouths on that. It's being 'suggested' that any machine that supports TPM 2.0 will be able to run Windows 11, which makes sense. It didn't come standard on motherboards until 2016. Those little add-in modules have shot up in price in the few days. What was a ~$20-25 add in TPM2.0 chip is now over $150 on ebay. I get that it's supposed to be for added security, but this is the kind of added fuckery we don't need in the pc space.


----------



## tech3475 (Jun 27, 2021)

vincentx77 said:


> It's starting to look like they're talking out of both sides of their mouths on that. It's being 'suggested' that any machine that supports TPM 2.0 will be able to run Windows 11, which makes sense. It didn't come standard on motherboards until 2016. Those little add-in modules have shot up in price in the few days. What was a ~$20-25 add in TPM2.0 chip is now over $150 on ebay. I get that it's supposed to be for added security, but this is the kind of added fuckery we don't need in the pc space.



I wont be surprised if either requirements are just an artificial barrier on install, which can be bypassed, but the issue is whether they cause problems long term.

For example, an update refusing to install (even if it’s again artificial) or not being able to run certain games as they’re storing keys on the TPM. 

Reminds me of hackintoshes and how much of a pain they can be.

I find the CPU official requirement in many ways to be worse than the TPM one, since at least the former may be available as an addon, depending on the motherboard (e.g. my old Asus mobo lacks a header but my MSI does have one).


----------



## nl255 (Jun 28, 2021)

tech3475 said:


> I wont be surprised if either requirements are just an artificial barrier on install, which can be bypassed, but the issue is whether they cause problems long term.
> 
> For example, an update refusing to install (even if it’s again artificial) or not being able to run certain games as they’re storing keys on the TPM.
> 
> ...



As I understand it, Hackintoshes are mostly a pain because of limited hardware driver availability which isn't a problem on Windows.  So said bypass methods (most likely by either tricking into thinking it is running in a VM or even using a very lightweight bare metal hypervisor to intercept and fake the CPU version check, also note that software only TPMs designed for use with things like qemu do exist) will probably be more like using Luma or Atmosphere CFW than a Hackintosh.

Of course, that is assuming they actually go through with it and it can't be permanently bypassed with nothing more than a sysprep unattended answers file like what you would use to permanently move the Users folder to another partition/drive.


----------



## KimKong (Jun 28, 2021)

Gosh Darn Dangit on a popstickle with a wherry in the middle!!!

THIS IS NOT WHAT I WANT!


----------



## GanjiMEX (Jun 28, 2021)

where windows 9 at tho?


----------



## KoopTheKoopa (Jun 28, 2021)

Even though this is a cool Windows leak, I still prefer Windows 10 still...



GanjiMEX said:


> where windows 9 at tho?


Let’s say Windows 8.1 is Windows 9


----------



## tech3475 (Jun 28, 2021)

nl255 said:


> As I understand it, Hackintoshes are mostly a pain because of limited hardware driver availability which isn't a problem on Windows.  So said bypass methods (most likely by either tricking into thinking it is running in a VM or even using a very lightweight bare metal hypervisor to intercept and fake the CPU version check, also note that software only TPMs designed for use with things like qemu do exist) will probably be more like using Luma or Atmosphere CFW than a Hackintosh.
> 
> Of course, that is assuming they actually go through with it and it can't be permanently bypassed with nothing more than a sysprep unattended answers file like what you would use to permanently move the Users folder to another partition/drive.



I referenced Hackintoshes because depending on the host, the initial setup can be a pain e.g. configuring DSDT (or whatever it is now), choosing what patches you need and in the past at least, you had to be careful with updates in case it breaks something.

In the early days, I even remember patches for SSE4 (or something along those lines) to make it work on older processors.

Drivers are an issue, but that’s just part of it.

Edit:

Whilst tech people could probably bypass it, I can’t imagine allot of ‘normal’ people going through hoops or we’ll probably see ‘commercial’ solutions sold in places like Currys, Best Buy, etc.

‘Extend the life of your PC for £39.99!’

Even though the same thing will probably be available for free online.



GanjiMEX said:


> where windows 9 at tho?



The rumoured reason I heard why they skipped it is because software would check the version string of Windows, so there’s a chance they’d detect the OS as Windows 95/98.


----------



## D34DL1N3R (Jun 28, 2021)

KoopTheKoopa said:


> Even though this is a cool Windows leak, I still prefer Windows 10 still...



Did you install the RTM of Win11 to be able to make that comparison?


----------



## KoopTheKoopa (Jun 28, 2021)

D34DL1N3R said:


> Did you install the RTM of Win11 to be able to make that comparison?


Nop. And I might not install it


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## D34DL1N3R (Jun 28, 2021)

KoopTheKoopa said:


> Nop. And I might not install it



I'm curious as to how you STILL prefer Windows 10 if you haven't even tried Windows 11 that just happens to not be out yet, except in an early preview state.


----------



## lokomelo (Jun 28, 2021)

tech3475 said:


> The rumoured reason I heard why they skipped it is because software would check the version string of Windows, so there’s a chance they’d detect the OS as Windows 95/98.




So Windows 11 may be detected as Windows 10? (not that they are too different under the hood)


----------



## SaberLilly (Jun 28, 2021)

I hope that the TPM stuff is more of a suggestion than a flat out requirement, because if windows 11 is as good as microsoft is hyping it up, plus what i've experienced using the build that was leaked online, its perfect for low end netbooks and older computers. I legitimately mean that, it would be perfect to spruce up an old laptop with without having to install and teach someone how to use Linux.
(No i do not hate linux either, that comment was directed towards the older crowd who has been using windows for years)


----------



## KoopTheKoopa (Jun 28, 2021)

lokomelo said:


> So Windows 11 may be detected as Windows 10? (not that they are too different under the hood)


Yep. Windows 11 is a highly modified Windows 10 clone.

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------



D34DL1N3R said:


> I'm curious as to how you STILL prefer Windows 10 if you haven't even tried Windows 11 that just happens to not be out yet, except in an early preview state.


I watched a video of the leak so I spoilt my self


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## NinStar (Jun 28, 2021)

To be honest, I'm more concerned about the design. I didn't expect they to announce a new Windows until they had completed the transition to fluent design in Windows 10.

The new design language doesn't seem like the one they were originally doing for fluent design. and that's a problem, because once again they will leave their previous design incomplete and put a new one on top and consequently create even more inconsistencies in the UI/UX.


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## D34DL1N3R (Jun 28, 2021)

KoopTheKoopa said:


> Yep. Windows 11 is a highly modified Windows 10 clone.
> 
> --------------------- MERGED ---------------------------
> 
> ...



But but... That's like hearing 5 seconds of a song and saying you don't like it. Or watching 5 minutes of a sequel and claiming that it's not as good at the first one.


----------



## smf (Jun 28, 2021)

MarioSilva said:


> I know, but it's just strange they haven't made clear why these restrictions exists.



It's strange that we don't know if the list is complete and if it's enforced, I'm not sure if everyone at microsoft is on the same page either.


----------



## raxadian (Jun 28, 2021)

And you literally need a new computer to tun it.


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## tech3475 (Jun 28, 2021)

lokomelo said:


> So Windows 11 may be detected as Windows 10? (not that they are too different under the hood)



Depends, if the software just looks for 1x then possibly.

https://www.independent.co.uk/life-...-why-microsoft-skipped-windows-9-9769537.html


----------



## nikeymikey (Jun 28, 2021)

ZeroT21 said:


> Bet the new Halo title might require windows 11 lolz



Good job i have a Series X then


----------



## Kingy (Jun 28, 2021)

Windows 11 has just released to the Insider Dev channel! Installing now


----------



## the_randomizer (Jun 28, 2021)

Yeah, gonna pass. Windows 10 with disabling forced updates is good enough for me.


----------



## DarthMotzkus (Jun 28, 2021)

Well, they said windows insiders on beta channel will get builds of Windows 11 starting 28/06/2021 (today). Did anyone here received the update?


----------



## Kingy (Jun 28, 2021)

DarthMotzkus said:


> Well, they said windows insiders on beta channel will get builds of Windows 11 starting 28/06/2021 (today). Did anyone here received the update?


It has not released for the beta channel- only the dev channel. I got the insider preview at 18:00 GMT+1, and it's working great so far.


----------



## nero99 (Jun 28, 2021)

shaunj66 said:


> My PC isn't compatible according to the Microsoft health check tool.
> 
> View attachment 267980
> 
> Not sure why. Something to with TPM or secure boot apparently.



if you have a recent cpu, tpm can be enabled in the bios


----------



## The Catboy (Jun 28, 2021)

>“Free upgrade”
>*doesn’t work on your PC*
>”Free”


----------



## Kingy (Jun 28, 2021)

You should be able to install the new Insider build of Windows 11 on "unsupported" hardware using UUP dump to make an ISO and then placing the install.wim into a Windows 10 installation disc, but at the moment UUP dump seems to be creating the ISOs without the experience pack seen in the new Insider preview, meaning missing features such as the new redesigned settings menu, and the new store. It's best to wait for now if you plan to upgrade through this method, it doesn't seem to be grabbing all the files it needs right now.


----------



## Lacius (Jun 28, 2021)

The Windows 11 Insider Preview dropped today, if anyone is interested in test driving Windows 11 legally. This is also a much newer build than the leaked one.


----------



## leerpsp (Jun 28, 2021)

I'm downloading the insider preview it will let me install it and I plan on sticking with it so I will prob upgrade the cpu if anything hope that will be all if i have to i'll spend $20 on that tpm chip for my motherboard. I really hate to since my parts are not that old and because of that it really bugs the hell out of me.


----------



## nero99 (Jun 28, 2021)

I'm using the leaked win11 iso. so far its pretty nice compared to win10. Seems to run smoother, looks nicer. can't wait for the final build this year


----------



## leerpsp (Jun 28, 2021)

Iv got the preview installed and like what I see with the eyes, Now I need to learn were everything is/moved too.


----------



## AsPika2219 (Jun 28, 2021)

Stay with Windows 10 forever until final release plus more fixed was comes... maybe a next year.


----------



## leerpsp (Jun 28, 2021)

AsPika2219 said:


> Stay with Windows 10 forever until final release plus more fixed was comes... maybe a next year.


all ready updated to this insider build I plan on sticking with it till the full thing comes, if i have not upgraded my hardware by then i may role back but would hate to get use to this and then role back and loose things I may like.

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------

It does remind me of mac os way to much like they intended to almost try a 1 to 1 copy.


----------



## PityOnU (Jun 28, 2021)

Supporting the Android runtime libraries is pretty awesome - I will be interested to see how much of a muck about installing apps from the Google Play store will be. Would be pretty neat to run my shitty gacha games on my PC.


----------



## Kingy (Jun 29, 2021)

Kingy said:


> You should be able to install the new Insider build of Windows 11 on "unsupported" hardware using UUP dump to make an ISO and then placing the install.wim into a Windows 10 installation disc, but at the moment UUP dump seems to be creating the ISOs without the experience pack seen in the new Insider preview, meaning missing features such as the new redesigned settings menu, and the new store. It's best to wait for now if you plan to upgrade through this method, it doesn't seem to be grabbing all the files it needs right now.


Aaaand, it's now been worked around!

If you would like to install the new Insider build on unsupported hardware, you can download the iso from UUPdump (selecting the amd64 version as well as your own locale and chosen edition), but in order to be able to access the latest features with the experience pack, *you need to open ConvertConfig.ini and check that AddUpdates = 1. If it is not 1, you must change it to 1.* After this, you just need to run the batch script and it should generate an ISO for you.

After this, you just need to mount the new ISO you've generated, and copy the install.wim inside the /sources/ folder into the same folder on Windows 10 install disc, just like the workaround in the leaked build. From here, you can either just run the setup.exe to upgrade, or boot from it to do a clean install, and you should have a working Windows 11 Build 22000.51 install on an unsupported PC. I've seen that this also works on Legacy, non-UEFI PCs.


----------



## leerpsp (Jun 29, 2021)

Kingy said:


> Aaaand, it's now been worked around!
> 
> If you would like to install the new Insider build on unsupported hardware, you can download the iso from UUPdump (selecting the amd64 version as well as your own locale and chosen edition), but in order to be able to access the latest features with the experience pack, *you need to open ConvertConfig.ini and check that AddUpdates = 1. If it is not 1, you must change it to 1.* After this, you just need to run the batch script and it should generate an ISO for you.
> 
> After this, you just need to mount the new ISO you've generated, and copy the install.wim inside the /sources/ folder into the same folder on Windows 10 install disc, just like the workaround in the leaked build. From here, you can either just run the setup.exe to upgrade, or boot from it to do a clean install, and you should have a working Windows 11 Build 22000.51 install on an unsupported PC. I've seen that this also works on Legacy, non-UEFI PCs.


why do all that when as of right now you can install it normal on unsupported hardware without all of that, you don't need to do all of that at all I just did a upgrade to the build with a ryzen 1600 6 core that is unsupported without a problem.
They are not enforcing the new hardware requirements right now


----------



## Kingy (Jun 29, 2021)

leerpsp said:


> why do all that when as of right now you can install it normal on unsupported hardware without all of that, you don't need to do all of that at all I just did a upgrade to the build with a ryzen 1600 6 core that is unsupported without a problem.


CPU generation isn't as significant as TPM2 or UEFI support. For these specific cases, you will need to do this.


----------



## leerpsp (Jun 29, 2021)

Kingy said:


> CPU generation isn't as significant as TPM2 or UEFI support. For these specific cases, you will need to do this.


I don't have the TPM2 support on my motherboard the Asrock AB350 PRO4


----------



## Kingy (Jun 29, 2021)

leerpsp said:


> I don't have the TPM2 support on my motherboard the Asrock AB350 PRO4


You do


----------



## leerpsp (Jun 29, 2021)

Kingy said:


> You do


I have a place on my motherboard to install one but don't have one and shows I can not activate it in the bio's so as of right now I do not.

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------




I can install a tpms1 but not tpm2 so there is that.


----------



## Kingy (Jun 29, 2021)

leerpsp said:


> I have a place on my motherboard to install one but don't have one and shows I can not activate it in the bio's so as of right now I do not.


I'll take your word for it- I actually have Secure Boot disabled on my PC, yet I was still able to install 22000. The instructions I posted are for those who are locked to the Release Preview branch of the Insider program. If you joined the Insider program after the 24th June, you will be limited by the hardware requirements, but before then, you'll be able to use Win11 until RTM


----------



## leerpsp (Jun 29, 2021)

Kingy said:


> I'll take your word for it- I actually have Secure Boot disabled on my PC, yet I was still able to install 22000. The instructions I posted are for those who are locked to the Release Preview branch of the Insider program. If you joined the Insider program after the 24th June, you will be limited by the hardware requirements, but before then, you'll be able to use Win11 until RTM


Trust me I will be using the work around when the os is out because I really don't want to upgrade hardware yet.


----------



## NinStar (Jun 29, 2021)

leerpsp said:


> I don't have the TPM2 support on my motherboard the Asrock AB350 PRO4



1600 already has fTPM, you don't need a chip for that.


----------



## leerpsp (Jun 29, 2021)

MarioSilva said:


> 1600 already has fTPM, you don't need a chip for that.


Yes it does but cpu not supported on the OS, but after doing a lot and I mean a lot of reading they may role back the CPU requirements


----------



## KeeperCP1 (Jun 29, 2021)

This looks great! But i can't use it on my L440 ThinkPad when it will release


----------



## DarthMotzkus (Jun 29, 2021)

Kingy said:


> It has not released for the beta channel- only the dev channel. I got the insider preview at 18:00 GMT+1, and it's working great so far.


Do you recommend install it? My hardware is 100% compatible and has TPM (It's an Asus Vivobook). I pretend to keep using as personal computer to work and gaming. Should i move to dev channel, upgrade and go back to beta?


----------



## CinnamonMina (Jun 29, 2021)

ghjfdtg said:


> Yes, the upgrade is free but ultimately you will pay for the license when you buy a new PC with Windows 11 installed. That was my critique. On one side they give away free licenses and make a PR stunt out of it but on the other it's still paid for new PC's with it pre-installed. You are not even getting any advantage for the paid one.




Product keys are now tied to your Microsoft account so even if you build a new Desktop you wont need to shell out money


----------



## fvig2001 (Jun 30, 2021)

I wonder how long will people be able to use win 11 installed through that workaround if their devices aren't supported but has TPM 2.0. I do hope Microsoft drops that 9" screen requirement as there are 6 and 5.5 inch 720p devices out there.


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## Ottoclav (Jun 30, 2021)

Probably could've saved some money and dignity by just rotating the Windows icon to face forward right at the beginning instead of using that pixelated transformation approach.

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------



Chris_Dai_Gyakuten_Saiban said:


> This sounds like it may be good, but for the time being I will just wait until it is stable and see if it is worth the update. For now Windows 10 does what I need it to do.


When SP2 comes out you mean? ;P


----------



## Chris_Dai_Gyakuten_Saiban (Jun 30, 2021)

Ottoclav said:


> Probably could've saved some money and dignity by just rotating the Windows icon to face forward right at the beginning instead of using that pixelated transformation approach.
> 
> --------------------- MERGED ---------------------------
> 
> ...


Yeah


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## AsPika2219 (Jul 1, 2021)

*BIG NEWS!* My PC which using Windows 10.... IS NOW SUPPORT *TPM VERSION 2.0*!!!! CAN INSTALL WINDOWS 11! 

UPDATE!

Download special tool called WHYNOTWIN11 on this website!

https://github.com/rcmaehl/WhyNotWin11

It will detect your PC are supported Windows 11 or not! Just likes this for my PC!


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## 3DSBricker (Jul 1, 2021)

I'm an Insider in the highest ring on my almost 9 year old computer. No TPM chip and a Intel Core I7 2700K CPU, I was able to install Windows 11 and it just works great. The TPM is just for security, the CPU doesn't make sense. My other pc with a 6700K isn't supported and Microsoft is "investigating" if the 7th Gen will be supported. If my 9 year old pc can run it without problems (without the TPM and CPU check ofcourse, so less security according to their reason of the TPM) why can't a modern 6th Gen or 7th Gen run it? Luckily I was able to move the start menu to the left instead of the center. It's mainly Windows 10 with a new skin and a few features.


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## RedBlueGreen (Jul 1, 2021)

3DSBricker said:


> I'm an Insider in the highest ring on my almost 9 year old computer. No TPM chip and a Intel Core I7 2700K CPU, I was able to install Windows 11 and it just works great. The TPM is just for security, the CPU doesn't make sense. My other pc with a 6700K isn't supported and Microsoft is "investigating" if the 7th Gen will be supported. If my 9 year old pc can run it without problems (without the TPM and CPU check ofcourse, so less security according to their reason of the TPM) why can't a modern 6th Gen or 7th Gen run it? Luckily I was able to move the start menu to the left instead of the center. It's mainly Windows 10 with a new skin and a few features.


It's a little ridiculous they're not supporting 7th gen Intel Core CPUs and the 2017 Ryzens, the former were still being used in PCs in 2018. They make all the excuses they want about security, but they're excluding plenty CPUs that have TPM 2.0. Maybe this'll be my excuse to finally switch to an Ubuntu variant and just dual boot Windows for VR and other stuff I can't run on Linux.

If they want security then they need to pay attention to the things that make Linux based OS's so secure.


AsPika2219 said:


> *BIG NEWS!* My PC which using Windows 10.... IS NOW SUPPORT *TPM VERSION 2.0*!!!! CAN INSTALL WINDOWS 11!
> 
> UPDATE!
> 
> ...


We've just learned only 8th Gen Intel Core CPUs and up and AMD Zen 2 and up will be supported. Even the Skylake CPUs support TPM 2.0 but aren't being supported by Windows 11, and those weren't even discontinued until 2019. Realistically amy of the TPM 2.0 CPUs and likely older ones will be able to install Windows 11, even if it requires a workaround, but how well it'll perform or how stable it'll be is another story.


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## KeeperCP1 (Jul 12, 2021)

There is a page on LeCrabeInfo on how to fix Windows 11 for support on PCs without TPM 2.0 or Secure Boot instead of replacing the Install.wim of Windows 10 with the one from Windows 11. You can check the page here but it's in French.


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## christense (Aug 31, 2021)

OMG, soon appears windows 11. How so fast? I'm still behind at Windows 7, haha. It would be time for me to change to another. But I can't, I like Windows 7 too much. And more, I found how to install windows 7 pro OA with a Product Key. This is nice. Because I saw this, I don't know how to awaken my desire to download a more advanced one. I don't even know if I need another window. I don't use the computer often, and I wouldn't want to pay a hefty amount to install a new window. I will analyze this when windows 11 appears. I am ready to find out as much as possible about it.


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