# Supercard DSTWO SDK ready for developers!



## Costello (Jul 30, 2010)

I have just received an e-mail from Romman, sales manager of the Supercard Team, letting me know that they have finished developing the *Supercard DSTWO SDK**. He also informs me that the SDK will be available on demand for developers who require it (they will also receive a free DSTWO sample!), instead of going completely public. He hopes that by opening the card to 3rd party applications, the 360 MHz CPU could be better exploited to run emulators and homebrew such as the ones found on the PSP (who said PS1 emulation?). Here is the full message below:



			
				Supercard Team said:
			
		

> I am glad to tell you that the DSTWO SDK beta version is ready now. Actually, this is the first time SC team makes a SDK, so there must be a lot of bugs, so SC team do not wish to release the first version of SDK in public. The SC team wants to contact some developers directly, and send them the SDK and a free DSTWO. The developers can use the SDK to develop homebrew on the DSTWO, and can help the SC team to complete and make the SDK better, easier to use. The SC team promise they will release the SDK to the public when it is better and easier to use.
> Actually, the DSTWO has a 360Mhz powerful CPU on board. The PSP CPU highest frequency is 333Mhz. So, in theory, all emulators running on PSP can be ported to the DSTWO with this SDK, which means SNES, GBA, GBC, MAME, PCE etc. all might run on the DS. At last, as you know, PSP can run PS1 games, maybe there could be a small chance to run PS1 games on your DS. Is it a dream or not, it is up to you homebrew developers! We need you, all DS owners need you, genius homebrew programmers. It is time to go beyond DS now.
> --------------------
> Developer requirement:
> ...


Many thanks to the SC team for opening their card to third parties as promised, and giving away SCDSTWO's to developers sounds even more generous. Some might say that they are 'lame' for having to rely on homebrew developers to provide optimal emulators and applications, some might be completely delighted by imagining what the community could come up with. What about you, what do you think? Is the cup half-full or half-empty?





*SDK*: a *S*oftware *D*evelopment *K*it is a set of development tools (libraries, functions, utilities...) that helps developers make the most of the hardware. Without SDK, programmers cannot fully utilize the SCDSTWO's onboard CPU and other features specific to the card. Only a few card manufacturers generally provide a SDK for their card, but this often results in awesome developments from the community. The best example would be AKAIO for the Acekard 2i.


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## Canonbeat234 (Jul 30, 2010)

Hey Costo, not causing any trouble on the forums and what waht.


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## Pong20302000 (Jul 30, 2010)

Well here is to hoping that some good things come from this

they most likely dont trust me tho hahaha


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## signz (Jul 30, 2010)

Will we see SCAIO soon? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




Great news, now many many many "improved" homebrews may come.


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## Traitor (Jul 30, 2010)

meh, I'm interested, but I'm no DS coder. guess I'll have to wait for the final.


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## Overlord Nadrian (Jul 30, 2010)

So, technically, if one were to fake that he/she were a homebrew developer, he/she could just get a free DSTWO, no? Or does the SC team require some sort of proof that you have experience (perhaps show off one of your projects and prove that you are the true author)?

Anyhow, this is still great news and I hope that a great many homebrew developers will make use of this (so that the DS homebrew scene could at long last be more lively again).


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## Frederica Bernkastel (Jul 30, 2010)

SignZ said:
			
		

> Will we see SCAIO soon?
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We said that about the iPlayer SDK, all we got was an emulator that was ripped and is the USP of the SCDS2.
Still, Team SC is better heard of, and there are probably more SCDS2's out there, and I'm sure that the free SCDS2 with SDK is an offer that a lot of devs will be interested in.


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## Chaosruler (Jul 30, 2010)

How many seconds are left til Normmatt claims a free Supercard DSTwo with a SDK privately released?


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## Canonbeat234 (Jul 30, 2010)

Sounds good, at least Nintendo can't say anything about homebrewing lawlz! 

Although I'm curious, how will DSTWO SDK be beneficial? I mean I'm no homebrewer so I someone to explain to me in detail.


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## Overlord Nadrian (Jul 30, 2010)

Chaosruler said:
			
		

> How many seconds are left til Normmatt claims a free Supercard DSTwo with a SDK privately released?


Normmatt isn't God, you know...


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## BoxShot (Jul 30, 2010)

Ellie said:
			
		

> So, technically, if one were to fake that he/she were a homebrew developer, he/she could just get a free DSTWO, no? Or does the SC team require some sort of proof that you have experience (perhaps show off one of your projects and prove that you are the true author)?
> 
> Anyhow, this is still great news and I hope that a great many homebrew developers will make use of this (so that the DS homebrew scene could at long last be more lively again).


Do you seriously think they would give you a SCDS2 without some proof in someway shape or form?


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## spinal_cord (Jul 30, 2010)

Canonbeat234 said:
			
		

> Sounds good, at least Nintendo can't say anything about homebrewing lawlz!
> 
> Although I'm curious, how will DSTWO SDK be beneficial? I mean I'm no homebrewer so I someone to explain to me in detail.



the DSTwo SDK will allow homebrew coders to use the extra RAM and processor in the DSTwo cart to creat more powerful software than can be run on the DS by itself, such as the GBA emulator available for the DSTwo.


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## Berthenk (Jul 30, 2010)

Canonbeat234 said:
			
		

> Although I'm curious, how will DSTWO SDK be beneficial? I mean I'm no homebrewer so I someone to explain to me in detail.


Read the OP please. It allows homebrew developers to use the CPU intergrated in the DSTWO.
Edit: spinal_cord beat me to et...


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## Chaosruler (Jul 30, 2010)

Ellie said:
			
		

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Are you sure? it can be God communicating with us through the internet 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



Oh wait, yeah, people sending God a EZ 3in1\ewin samples in order to let AKAIO support it doesn't make sense xP


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## tuddy666 (Jul 30, 2010)

Ellie said:
			
		

> So, technically, if one were to fake that he/she were a homebrew developer, he/she could just get a free DSTWO, no? Or does the SC team require some sort of proof that you have experience (perhaps show off one of your projects and prove that you are the true author)?


They'll be approaching developers like Alekmaul, Flubba and Normmatt (and a few other developers they've mentioned in passing with release announcements and similar) and asking them to develop DSTwo compatible homebrew in exchange for a free DSTwo and the SDK. A "regular" developer, however, can just email them and get the SDK Download link, but will need to provide their own DSTwo.


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## Overlord Nadrian (Jul 30, 2010)

BoxShot said:
			
		

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Ah, I see now, thanks for explaining


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## Mbmax (Jul 30, 2010)

Why do this SDK stay private ?
Is there a reason ? Copyrighted stuff inside ?


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## Berthenk (Jul 30, 2010)

Mbmax said:
			
		

> Why do this SDK stay private ?
> Is there a reason ? Copyrighted stuff inside ?
> Is it that hard to just read the full post? Sorry, I'm in rage a mood...
> QUOTE*so there must be a lot of bugs*, so SC team do not wish to release the first version of SDK in public


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## Chaosruler (Jul 30, 2010)

Mbmax said:
			
		

> Why do this SDK stay private ?
> Is there a reason ? Copyrighted stuff inside ?


I think they just don't want to let people develop this SDK until they make sure it cannot harm the DSTwo itself, in other words bricking it


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## tuddy666 (Jul 30, 2010)

Mbmax said:
			
		

> Why do this SDK stay private ?
> Is there a reason ? Copyrighted stuff inside ?


The SDK itself is still a beta, but it's a semi-open beta: you can get it if you email the supercard team and ask for it; but they're obviously waiting until they deem the SDK to be complete for a 100% public release.


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## Mbmax (Jul 30, 2010)

tuddy666 said:
			
		

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Well, i doubt they will give me that kind of stuff.  
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





Time will tell us if it's the reason.


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## cory1492 (Jul 30, 2010)

Makes me kinda wish I was still hacking around in DS land 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




Is it just me, or is it kinda sad that flash carts are really that much more powerful/faster than the DS itself?


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## Mbmax (Jul 30, 2010)

cory1492 said:
			
		

> Is it just me, or is it kinda sad that flash carts are really that much more powerful/faster than the DS itself?


Yeah, until DSi mode get hacked.


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## Berthenk (Jul 30, 2010)

Mbmax said:
			
		

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Even then, the DSTWO and IPlayer are much more powerful than the DSi.


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## Veho (Jul 30, 2010)

I'm excited about all the interesting new homebrew the SC2 is capable of, but a PS1 emulator is a bit much to ask for.


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## indask8 (Jul 30, 2010)

Now it's up to the developers of the DS scene, to do something with it... or not.


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## Mbmax (Jul 30, 2010)

Berthenk said:
			
		

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Agreed, but you needs power to run this extra CPU, don't you ?

Why not try to unleash the Dsi mode power first ?


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## shakirmoledina (Jul 30, 2010)

i guess AKAIO will make the most out of it due to experience... Normatt AND his team (DeSmuME and AKAIO is enuf exp)


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## BlueStar (Jul 30, 2010)

Not really too confident about PS1 emulation - doesn't the PSP have an advantage in that field because it has a similar architecture and was built with playing PSX games in mind?  Seem to remember last time I tried PC based PS1 emulation it was a bit crappy and I'm pretty sure my PC was of a much higher spec.  Saying that, my old Pentium2-300MHz with a Voodoo card used to run some N64 games flawlessly, guess it depends on how well the emulator is coded as much as the raw power of the system doing the emulating.


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## CannonFoddr (Jul 30, 2010)

shakirmoledina said:
			
		

> i guess AKAIO will make the most out of it due to experience... Normatt AND his team (DeSmuME and AKAIO is enuf exp)


Hey & what about Spinal & Soulanger  ??? - I'd like to think they'll put in for a SC SDK Kit - just think what they could do to 'DSCovered' and 'MenuDo'

& while we're at it - it would be nice for Moonlight to 'come out of retirement' (or even release moonshell code) & we'll might get a better 'media player' (one that plays Music and videos) that uses the extra CPU of the DS2


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## indask8 (Jul 30, 2010)

BlueStar said:
			
		

> Not really too confident about PS1 emulation - doesn't the PSP have an advantage in that field because it has a similar architecture and was built with playing PSX games in mind?  Seem to remember last time I tried PC based PS1 emulation it was a bit crappy and I'm pretty sure my PC was of a much higher spec.  Saying that, my old Pentium2-300MHz with a Voodoo card used to run some N64 games flawlessly, guess it depends on how well the emulator is coded as much as the raw power of the system doing the emulating.



The PSX emulator on PSP is fast because of the CPU architecture AND because it's made by Sony so they know the psx architecture at 100%.

For N64 it will be more hard, because I've heard N64 emulation is very floating point intensive...  PSP have a FPU, Every intel X86 CPU have one since 486, 

But DS and almost every ARM CPU (DSTwo's CPU included) doesn't.

Actually the most amazing N64 emulator for PC is IMO Corn, it's amazingly fast and is 100% software based you don't need a 3D card, too bad his author have disappeared from the internet.


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## iFish (Jul 30, 2010)

BoxShot said:
			
		

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I will fake owner of MENUdo 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




Nah, if i wanted a dstwo. i would not be at the apple store


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## Cortador (Jul 30, 2010)

People forget that the Psp is composed of other parts besides the Cpu. . .

I sincerely don't expect a Ps1 emulator like the one on the psp.


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## Paranoid Mouse C (Jul 30, 2010)

Think we'll see a beefed-up version of DSLinux? I'm personally hoping for a drag&drop media player. Perhaps a more capable build of Moonshell, as if it wasn't awesome enough already. Boy, this is very exciting.



			
				QUOTE said:
			
		

> Some might say that they are 'lame' for having to rely on homebrew developers to provide optimal emulators and applications, *some might be completely delighted by imagining what the community could come up with. *What about you, what do you think? Is the cup half-full or half-empty?




Count me among those who are completely delighted.


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## RupeeClock (Jul 30, 2010)

I have absolutely no beef with them having tp "depend" on third parties to get these emulators onto the DS, after all this is how the GP2X systems and the Dingoo A320 operate.


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## Paranoid Mouse C (Jul 30, 2010)

Also, take into consideration the possibility of interpreted languages actually becoming a viable alternative to C or C++ on the DS.
Joyau, a complete ruby implementation for PSP is really awesome. With the advent of the SDK being released, maybe we'll see something similar.
PSPKvm, a complete J2ME implementation for the PSP. I use this daily on the PSP. Why? Opera mini advanced 4. Imagine the possibilities. Check out what Molej, Davr, and Tolus have done on lesser hardware.
We all know about various Lua builds. How awesome it would be to see them benefit from the DSTWO SDK.


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## Dter ic (Jul 30, 2010)

Cortador said:
			
		

> People forget that the Psp is composed of other parts besides the Cpu. . .
> 
> I sincerely don't expect a Ps1 emulator like the one on the psp.


then don't download it when it gets released on filetrip...
go play on your psp if you dobt ps1 will come...

on tpoic: im exited about this maybe will have a all in one firmware (when we can get moonshell to autoboot with xVid and other file formats and play roms aswell 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	







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## The Catboy (Jul 30, 2010)

The cat boy had no idea the Supercard Two was that powerful 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I most say I am now impressed and glad Mike bought one for me 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 With a card that powerful, it does open up some serous opportunities for the DS and DSi, once in the right hands.


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## kiafazool (Jul 30, 2010)

im going to lie about me being a homebrew developer because i really want a dstwo



Spoiler



of course im not gonna do that


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## nl255 (Jul 30, 2010)

boudincaca said:
			
		

> The PSX emulator on PSP is fast because of the CPU architecture AND because it's made by Sony so they know the psx architecture at 100%.
> 
> For N64 it will be more hard, because I've heard N64 emulation is very floating point intensive...  PSP have a FPU, Every intel X86 CPU have one since 486,
> 
> ...



Actually, there is no PSX emulator for the PSP that works at a reasonable speed.  Sony's pops is not an emulator but more like a virtual machine or compatability layer.  That is why Wine/Crossover and Virtualbox are so fast compared to Dosbox.  Not to mention that xbox "emulator" that worked on a 1GHz system because it just translated XDK API calls into NT API calls.


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## The Pi (Jul 30, 2010)

How many people do you think lied about being a developer?


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## Berthenk (Jul 30, 2010)

The Pi said:
			
		

> How many people do you think lied about being a developer?


Lots, they're just out there for dem free stuffz.


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## signz (Jul 30, 2010)

It's at least worth a try, I think.
Still, I'm looking forward to the maybe soon coming SNES Emulator.


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## Coto (Jul 30, 2010)

I thought of..

If homebrewers manage to get DSi mode on homebew+DSTWO CPU to work together, then it definitely`d be a PSX emu available..

Well, i`ll stop daydreaming then haha.

Never give up coders! never!


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## tuddy666 (Jul 30, 2010)

A Gay Little Cat Boy said:
			
		

> The cat boy had no idea the Supercard Two was that powerful
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I've already said in prior posts that lying for a free DSTwo wouldn't work, because they're approaching notable homebrew developers (normmatt, AlekMaul, Flubba and Moonlight are some of the named devs) with the intention of giving them free DSTwo kits. All a person would get from outright lying to the Supercard team is an SDK that they would be unable to use without knowledge of C or C++ (and, of course, a DSTwo to test their programs with).

So nobody with two or more functioning braincells would bother unless they had a legitimate desire to develop for the DSTwo.

Edit- and considering the intelligence of some people, they'll have gone and applied for a free SDK anyway, despite many people mentioning it's no use to you unless you're a developer who owns a DSTwo.


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## Deleted User (Jul 30, 2010)

I would totally apply for this because its kind of new territory for the DS but unfortunately I can only use Slot-2s on my DS (because my slot 1 is missing a pin).


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## tajio (Jul 30, 2010)

Excellent! I hope the developer for "Colors!" gets the SDK! And the guy that developed moonshell, if moonshell gets an optimized version for SCDS2 it would be awesome.

I'll be waiting for some awesome apps and games for the SCDS2!!!


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## Veho (Jul 30, 2010)

A working web browser would be neat.


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## CannonFoddr (Jul 30, 2010)

tajio said:
			
		

> ...... And the guy that developed moonshell, if moonshell gets an optimized version for SCDS2 it would be awesome.


Actually that 'Guy' is in fact a 'Gal' - Moonlight (the developer of moonshell) is a Woman


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## signz (Jul 30, 2010)

Veho said:
			
		

> A working web browser would be neat.


That would be really great. I was wondering if there'd be some patch to use the CPU and extra RAM from the SCDS2 for the Opera DS Browser. If not, that could be the chance for a proper web browser.


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## EJames2100 (Jul 30, 2010)

With the extra CPU and Ram, a pretty decent Browser could be made to work well 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




Also they could add in a little patch for those of us with 3in1's and the little Ram Expansions, so it'd work even better.


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## phoenixclaws (Jul 30, 2010)

EJames2100 said:
			
		

> With the extra CPU and Ram, a pretty decent Browser could be made to work well
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We will see how much more support that will be.


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## Another World (Jul 30, 2010)

its funny how people think that team sc will do any leg work. i've been talking to developers about the sdk for the past month and a half. i'm also the one who suggested giving a free scds2 to developers who have a high standing in the nds homebrew scene. what are you probably going to see is some dingoo emus ported first as the scds2 uses the same cpu/ram. anyways back to talking to some devs i know now that its released.

cheers for the info costello.

-another world


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## c_house (Jul 30, 2010)

I sense a flood of emulators... Hopfully a N64 one!


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## Innkeeper (Jul 31, 2010)

I highly doubt we'll ever see a full working psx or n64 emulator, but I am happy to see a better nes emu for xl users, snes emu, and a more stable and less hassle gba emu. web browser i dont care about, no browser will better then a full laptop or desktop one.
And we should see a working gamegear for dsi users and for surely a sega cd emu and maybe a saturn one


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## redact (Jul 31, 2010)

why not give the sdk out to people who already own an scds2? :


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## hullo8d (Jul 31, 2010)

Innkeeper said:
			
		

> I highly doubt we'll ever see a full working psx or n64 emulator, but I am happy to see a better nes emu for xl users, snes emu, and a more stable and less hassle gba emu. web browser i dont care about, no browser will better then a full laptop or desktop one.
> And we should see a working gamegear for dsi users and for surely a sega cd emu and maybe a saturn one



Sega CD is to much of a hassle it's just the same 16 or 32 with a better soundtrack, and I highly doubt that there will be a Saturn Emulator since the system is very hard to emulate.


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## 9th_Sage (Jul 31, 2010)

mercluke said:
			
		

> why not give the sdk out to people who already own an scds2? :


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## TyRaNtM (Jul 31, 2010)

I think that the first thing that need to be done with this is a port of Snes9X, a NES and GENESIS emulator.


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## purplesludge (Jul 31, 2010)

Innkeeper said:
			
		

> I highly doubt we'll ever see a full working psx or n64 emulator, but I am happy to see a better nes emu for xl users, snes emu, and a more stable and less hassle gba emu. web browser i dont care about, no browser will better then a full laptop or desktop one.
> And we should see a working gamegear for dsi users and for surely a sega cd emu and maybe a saturn one


Everything created with the SDK will work on all dss.


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## lolzed (Jul 31, 2010)

all he meant was a nes emulator that doesn't eff up the xl.


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## dewback (Jul 31, 2010)

BlueStar said:
			
		

> Not really too confident about PS1 emulation - doesn't the PSP have an advantage in that field because it has a similar architecture and was built with playing PSX games in mind?  Seem to remember last time I tried PC based PS1 emulation it was a bit crappy and I'm pretty sure my PC was of a much higher spec.  Saying that, my old Pentium2-300MHz with a Voodoo card used to run some N64 games flawlessly, guess it depends on how well the emulator is coded as much as the raw power of the system doing the emulating.




I had an emulator that would run psx games on a Pentium 200mmx with a Voodoo card that emu was using the glide for the card that was setup like the call for 3d on the psx.  It might be able to be done with this card but would be ruff the psp had used a hacked download from $ony that did the first emu on the psp.

would be great if someone using the sdk would make a avi movie player before they release the one that was suppose to be out with the card I will not even think about buying this card until the complete that feature


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## RupeeClock (Jul 31, 2010)

You know personally, it wouldn't surprise me if it turns out someone ends up using the SDK to provide a better SNES emulator than the Supercard Team's official emulator.
Or that Darkchen maybe picking the GBA emulator back up from where the Team left off after improving the iPlayer version.


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## Normmatt (Jul 31, 2010)

N64 emulation is never going to happen.
PS1 emulation might happen but it probably wont ever be full speed.


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## GreatCrippler (Jul 31, 2010)

Normmatt said:
			
		

> N64 emulation is never going to happen.
> PS1 emulation might happen but it probably wont ever be full speed.



Wow, would have hoped that would be obvious... I kinda doubt we'll even see FX Chip SNES games at full speed.


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## ferofax (Jul 31, 2010)

...wow, they're giving the homebrewers full rein, eh? i hope good things come out of this...


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## RupeeClock (Jul 31, 2010)

ferofax said:
			
		

> ...wow, they're giving the homebrewers full rein, eh? i hope good things come out of this...



If it flourishes to a fruitful emulation scene like the Dingoo and GP2X provide, it will be very, VERY good for sales.


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## The Real Jdbye (Jul 31, 2010)

Not everyone knows, but the PSP is actually dual core although the second core (the MediaEngine) only has limited access to the other hardware. Not all emulators take advantage of the second core as it's tricky to use, but it does mean it's unlikely for a PSX emulator to be full speed on the DSTWO although not impossible.


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## RupeeClock (Jul 31, 2010)

sorrycostello said:
			
		

> Not everyone knows, but the PSP is actually dual core although the second core (the MediaEngine) only has limited access to the other hardware. Not all emulators take advantage of the second core as it's tricky to use, but it does mean it's unlikely for a PSX emulator to be full speed on the DSTWO although not impossible.


It's also worth saying that an equal or greater clock speed does not mean the processor is faster, much of it depends on the architecture.


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## amiga (Jul 31, 2010)

It would be great if the sdk would work on the iplayer too, because we know it is practically the same hardware and same company.

Many people like me bought the iplayer when they launched the gba emu expecting more software using the more powerful cpu but more than one year later and there is nothing new for iplayer.


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## lolzed (Jul 31, 2010)

amiga said:
			
		

> It would be great if the sdk would work on the iplayer too, because we know it is practically the same hardware and same company.
> 
> Many people like me bought the iplayer when they launched the gba emu expecting more software using the more powerful cpu but more than one year later and there is nothing new for iplayer.


same hardware?no
same company?maybe


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## Overlord Nadrian (Jul 31, 2010)

lolzed said:
			
		

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Uhh, no. The SuperCard team developed both the iPlayer and the DSTWO, and the hardware is indeed very similar.

Read up on things before trying to post something, please. It's getting really old that people are 'correcting' someone, only to later find out that the other person's statement was in fact correct.


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## RETRO_GAMER (Jul 31, 2010)

i want quake 2 without the need  of a ram expansion


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## lolzed (Jul 31, 2010)

Ellie said:
			
		

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Though I'd really like proof that they really did make it.

also,epic explanations by mercluke himself
http://gbatemp.net/index.php?showtopic=227938


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## Robyx91 (Jul 31, 2010)

It's like a dream, thanks you so much SuperCard Team!


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## ThePowerOutage (Jul 31, 2010)

Extra ram and CPU power... SCDS2Linux anyone? Or even... No that would be too azing... ANDROID! 


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## Rydian (Jul 31, 2010)

Costello said:
			
		

> Some might say that they are 'lame' for having to rely on homebrew developers to provide optimal emulators and applications, some might be completely delighted by imagining what the community could come up with. What about you, what do you think? Is the cup half-full or half-empty?I think the cup is 3/4ths full and the tap is stuck on "on", we're going to need a few more cups for the awesomeness this can make.
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With PJ 64 I can play N64 games fine, in fact I can play Rush 2049 (which is marked "high requirement") fine as long as I keep AA/AF off and keep the game to 640x480.  For normal stuff like Mario Kart 64 and such, I can up the resolution and keep those options on.  I'm using an Athlon XP 2800+ with an integrated GeForce4 MX, too.



(There's a quote limit so I'll continue my reactions to the thread in another post.)


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## Rydian (Jul 31, 2010)

Paranoid Mouse Clicker said:
			
		

> Think we'll see a beefed-up version of DSLinux?Dunno', from what I hear the iPlayer has an MMU so the DSTwo might as well (could be required for their in-game menus), that could mean running a version of linux with an actual GUI.
> ... also maybe windows 95.
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No, the Sega CD is really hard to emulate because it's not it's own device, it's two devices that work in tandem.  The genesis has two processors, and the CD addon has one processor that's the same model as the genesis (but clocked higher) and it's own sound chip as well.  Not only do you basically need to emulate a genesis at the same time as a higher-powered genesis, they both need to keep tight/exact timing and synchronization with each other.


(Again, to be continued.)


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## Rydian (Jul 31, 2010)

GreatCrippler said:
			
		

> I kinda doubt we'll even see FX Chip SNES games at full speed.


I'm not sure on that, AFAIK the SuperFX chip is a glorified math co-processor acting as sort of a GPU.


(Heh, passed the limit by one quote.)


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## Jamstruth (Jul 31, 2010)

Rydian said:
			
		

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PSP can't even render Mode7 at full speed. Not too sure how the DS would handle it even with the DSTwo hardware


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## nl255 (Jul 31, 2010)

sorrycostello said:
			
		

> Not everyone knows, but the PSP is actually dual core although the second core (the MediaEngine) only has limited access to the other hardware. Not all emulators take advantage of the second core as it's tricky to use, but it does mean it's unlikely for a PSX emulator to be full speed on the DSTWO although not impossible.



I don't know how many times it needs to be said, but POPS IS NOT AN EMULATOR.  There is no need to emulate a PS1 on the PSP because the CPU is the same, all you have to do is virtualize the hardware.  Yes, it is tricky without a MMU but VMware and Virtualbox do it on the x86 and the x86 is not normally virtualizable (i.e. the MMU is not very helpful so it has to be done in software).


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## Jamstruth (Jul 31, 2010)

nl255 said:
			
		

> sorrycostello said:
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NO! NO NO NO NO NO NO NO! PSP CPU IS NOT PS1 CPU!!



Spoiler



[titleS1 CPU]
R3051

* MIPS R3000A-compatible 32bit RISC chip running at 33.8688 MHz
* The chip is manufactured by LSI Logic Corp. with technology licensed from SGI.
* Features:
o Operating performance of 30 MIPS
o Bus bandwidth 132 MB/s
o 4 KB Instruction Cache
o 1 KB non-associative SRAM Data Cache
o 2 MB of main RAM





Spoiler



[titleSP CPU]
SP CPU Core:

* Sony CXD2962GG CPU
* Based on MIPS R4000 32-bit Core
* 90 nm Semiconductor CMOS Process
* 1-333 MHz (set at 222 MHz by default) @ 1.2V
* 16 KB Instruction Cache / 16 KB Data Cache
* SiP:

* 8 MB eDRAM @ 2.6 Gbps
* Embedded FPU
* Embedded Vector FPU @ 2.6 GFLOPS
* Embedded Graphics Core:

* 1-166 MHz (set at 111 MHz by default) @ 1.2V
* 256-bit Bus at 5.3 Gbps
* 2 MB eDRAM (VRAM)
* 3D Curved Surface and 3D Polygon
* Compressed Textures
* Hardware Clipping, Morphing, Bone(8)
* Hardware Tessellator
* Bézier surface, Bézier curve and, B-Spline (NURBS)

* 4x4, 16x16, 64x64 Subdivision

* Rendering Engine and Surface Engine
* Pixel Fill Rate: 664 Megapixels/s
* Up to 33 Million Polygon/s (with Transform & Lighting)
* 24-bit Full Color: RGBA

* 128-bit Bus at 2.6 Gbps
* 3D-CG Extended Instruction Set


There's a lot more to the PSP CPU and its a lot faster. Its architecture is not the same so you do need to emulate. If I've misunderstood then feel free to correct me.


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## Perseid (Jul 31, 2010)

The CPU class is the same, so you don't need to emulate that. You do need to emulate the GPU, though.

PS1: 	MIPS R3000A-family R3051 @ 33.8688 MHz
PSP: MIPS R4000-based; clocked from 1 to 333 MHz

(from Wikipedia)

If this weren't the case, the PSP wouldn't nearly be fast enough to emulate a PS1.


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## Jamstruth (Jul 31, 2010)

Based but not the same... ahk it doesn't matter. I obviously misunderstood.


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## GreatCrippler (Jul 31, 2010)

Jamstruth said:
			
		

> Rydian said:
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As far as I know, there isn't a handheld yet that emulates it at full speed. (Have not played with a Pandora)


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## Another World (Jul 31, 2010)

dewback said:
			
		

> I had an emulator that would run psx games on a Pentium 200mmx with a Voodoo card that emu was using the glide for the card that was setup like the call for 3d on the psx.  It might be able to be done with this card but would be ruff the psp had used a hacked download from $ony that did the first emu on the psp.



are you talking about the Connectix Virtual Game Station? i used it on my k6III with my voodoo 3dfx card.

-another world


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## Nollog (Jul 31, 2010)

btyre said:
			
		

> Extra ram and CPU power... SCDS2Linux anyone? Or even... No that would be too azing... ANDROID! ???
> Isn't android a crapped-down version of linux?
> 
> QUOTE(Rydian @ Jul 31 2010, 06:20 PM) IIRC there was no iPlayer SDK, so outside development did not exist.  An SDK will allow outside development to exist, so even if the team stops giving updates (assuming the SDK is finalized before that) then homebrew/emulator support can still continue, like it does on the PSP even though none of the official firmware teams are releasing anything.


iplayer had an sdk for people who wanted to make legal homebrew.


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## Rydian (Jul 31, 2010)

Nollog said:
			
		

> Rydian said:
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I don't see it on the site, did they discontinue it?


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## 9th_Sage (Jul 31, 2010)

We may not see DSLinux, or at least not from the same people (I think they've mostly done what they want with it and are tired of working on it, judging on their forums).


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## Veho (Jul 31, 2010)

If it's the same CPU as the Dingoo, maybe we'll see Dingux on the DS?


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## Christopher8827 (Aug 1, 2010)

I will buy this card as soon as the Opera Mini web browser is ported onto it.



			
				QUOTE said:
			
		

> Opera Mini is a web browser designed primarily for mobile phones, smartphones and personal digital assistants. It uses the Java ME platform and consequently requires that the mobile device be capable of running Java ME applications. Opera Mini is offered free of charge...
> 
> Opera Mini requests web pages through the Opera Software company's servers, which process and compress them before relaying the pages back to the mobile phone. This compression process makes transfer time about two to three times faster, and the pre-processing smooths compatibility with web pages not designed for mobile phones.



So - web pages are rendered on a server and sent to the client. This enables faster web browsing on a device that is too slow to do it itself. eg. Nintendo DS.


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## 9th_Sage (Aug 1, 2010)

Christopher8827 said:
			
		

> I will buy this card as soon as the Opera Mini web browser is ported onto it.


That WOULD be a pretty awesome thing to see running on it.


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## BowserMan (Aug 2, 2010)

im creating a team of devs to port psp homebrew  
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





  and that would require the sdk  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



i was wondering if  i could get a copy


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## Sarvesh50 (Aug 3, 2010)

Bunjaloo is opensource.
I contacted Richard Quirk about all this but still no respond 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



But still bunjaloo is opensource


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## Veho (Aug 3, 2010)

YouTube. 



What do you think?


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## Berthenk (Aug 3, 2010)

9th_Sage said:
			
		

> Christopher8827 said:
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Only, there's one problem: DS Wi-Fi speed. It. Is. Slow. As. Hell.


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## Veho (Aug 3, 2010)

Berthenk said:
			
		

> Only, there's one problem: DS Wi-Fi speed. It. Is. Slow. As. Hell.


So it really is the WiFi's fault? I thought loading was slow because of the CPU speed.


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## KazoWAR (Aug 4, 2010)

Veho said:
			
		

> Berthenk said:
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Yep, its the Wi-Fi chip in the DS, its capped at like 10-15 Kb/s kinda dumb on Nintendo's part if you ask me.

Also, I think I might get a copy of the SCDS2 SDK. I can't wait to test it out and see how far the SCDS2 can be pushed.


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## Christopher8827 (Aug 4, 2010)

Its not capped on the DSi, in DSi mode. But it's still very slow. Opera Mini would just compress the page so it loads quicker. The rendering is done on its server.



			
				QUOTE said:
			
		

> So it really is the WiFi's fault? I thought loading was slow because of the CPU speed


It is the CPU speed mostly. Yep, its at 10kb but its better than nothing.


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## Veho (Aug 4, 2010)

KazoWAR said:
			
		

> Yep, its the Wi-Fi chip in the DS, its capped at like 10-15 Kb/sQUOTE(Christopher8827 @ Aug 4 2010, 07:23 AM) Yep, its at 10kb



That's five times worse than dialup...


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## Traitor (Aug 4, 2010)

Veho said:
			
		

> KazoWAR said:
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Dialup is actually 56 kilobits per second (roughly), which equals out to about 6.5 kilobytes per second.


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## Veho (Aug 4, 2010)

Traitor said:
			
		

> Dialup is actually 56 kilobits per second (roughly), which equals out to about 6.5 kilobytes per second.


Wait, so is the DS WiFi capped at 10 _kilobits_ or _kilobytes_? I thought it was 10 kilobits (and that's five times slower than dialup).


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## TrolleyDave (Aug 4, 2010)

Veho said:
			
		

> Traitor said:
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It's capped at roughly 10 kilobytes.


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## Veho (Aug 4, 2010)

TrolleyDave said:
			
		

> It's capped at roughly 10 kilobytes.


That's still only 80 kilobits per second.  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	






Spoiler


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## Mbmax (Aug 4, 2010)

I have 110kB/s with  Fileninja DS.


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## Berthenk (Aug 4, 2010)

Mbmax said:
			
		

> I have 110kB/s with  Fileninja DS.


Pics or it didn't happen. That's just impossible.


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## indask8 (Aug 4, 2010)

Does anyone have received his SDK link?

That's not for me (I haven't requested it since I have no use for it), but I want to know if some famous developer have received their SDK?


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## Mbmax (Aug 4, 2010)

Berthenk said:
			
		

> Mbmax said:
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Hehe.
Well, right now i can't snapshot anything because i'm on holidays, but don't worry i will give you some proof. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




Now, if you don't want to wait, just test fileninja.

Edit : Ok. Was lucky to have my Ralink USB wifi key with me. I turned it into wifi AP and here you go.
Tested with a 50MB dummy file + fileninja + FileZilla Server + DSi + EZ5i firmw v101 + Kernel 3.0ob1 :



 



Enough ?


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## Escape (Aug 4, 2010)

So, will it be possible to make a homebrew that will allow you to link GBA games with DS games (in games such as Pokemon - to migrate, and Megaman) with the SDK?


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## dhjohn (Aug 4, 2010)

Escape said:
			
		

> So, will it be possible to make a homebrew that will allow you to link GBA games with DS games (in games such as Pokemon - to migrate, and Megaman) with the SDK?



It depends on how complete the SDK is. If it lets people write homebrew that loads commercial nds games, then in theory, yes someone could write that. Though I think Supercard is adding that (in some form. I think it will be using a slot-2 device though (just opinion, I have no proof what form it will take)) in the next version of eos.


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## YayMii (Aug 4, 2010)

Escape said:
			
		

> So, will it be possible to make a homebrew that will allow you to link GBA games with DS games (in games such as Pokemon - to migrate, and Megaman) with the SDK?


The SC team's already making that possible (linking GBA emulator saves with DS games)

EDIT: I was misleaded.


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## 9th_Sage (Aug 5, 2010)

Berthenk said:
			
		

> Only, there's one problem: DS Wi-Fi speed. It. Is. Slow. As. Hell.


Yes, it is slow (though it still seems faster than people are making it out to be), but for browsing regular old webpages this is hardly a problem.  It's when you start to get into streaming video and such it can be a problem.


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## Berthenk (Aug 6, 2010)

Mbmax said:
			
		

> Hehe.
> Well, right now i can't snapshot anything because i'm on holidays, but don't worry i will give you some proof.
> 
> 
> ...


Crap. I'll have to test that. Just for the awesomeness.


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## _Chaz_ (Aug 10, 2010)

This is awesome.

SCDS2 homebrew. I can't wait for mine to arrive!


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## R4Liam (Aug 12, 2010)

it would be great to have a genesis emulator that fixes the problems that other emulators for the ds had like having to pan the screen all of the time and having increased genesis rom compatability would also be great.


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## Sc4rFac3d (Aug 29, 2010)

So, while I don't know much about coding does this mean they can use the code to run on the card's CPU without some bottleneck or anything like that? What about multicore development? This is pretty huge if so, they could make even bigger CPUs that can be attached to the DS no?


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## jadawin (Aug 29, 2010)

Awesome news! I am positive that it will do just fine. It is very promising even if it fails to play PS1 games. Developers should subscribe and finally come out with a first class and trusted product.
As for me, I may purchase it as long as the price is fair.

Go for it SC team!


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