# Duceppe's (Former leader of federal politic party) mother found dead outside senior residence



## Noctosphere (Jan 21, 2019)

it relaunch the debate around elder residences...
I dont know how it works where you live, but here in Quebec, elders are horribly treated in elders residences...
For exemple, one bath per week, many have diapers not changed hours after soiling them, or even some falling on the ground not receiving help for dozens of minutes...
And now, I learned this at news
Gilles Duceppe, former leader of Bloc Quebecois, 's mother, 93, was found dead of hypotermia outside her elder's residence after being locked out during the night...
Newspaper

Seriously, elders need better treatment here


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## H1B1Esquire (Jan 21, 2019)

Damn, you made this guy look like shit 


Seriously, elder abuse isn't uncommon, but....really unexpected in Canada. Also kind of surprised anyone would let an elderly person sit outside at night....I mean, she could have broke a window and let them all escape  get crotchety about a broken window.

Super cereal, I hope she becomes a martyr.


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## Noctosphere (Jan 21, 2019)

I just learned more about this case
Apparently, Duceppe's mother, Miss Rowley, is deaf
During the night, there was a fire alarm, and elders had to regroup
Miss Rowley probably exited through an emergency exit
Then, they announced that the fire alarm was a fake one
But Miss Rowley probably never heard about it
And, doors automatically locked after that...
That's probably how she got locked out


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## H1B1Esquire (Jan 21, 2019)

Noctosphere said:


> That's probably how she got locked out



And no one does a headcount? I mean security cameras everywhere is pretty normal for me, but there isn't even one camera remotely close?

Either way, I feel it was 100% preventable--at the bare minimum, does the staff not health records of all the residents?


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## Noctosphere (Jan 21, 2019)

H1B1Esquire said:


> And no one does a headcount? I mean security cameras everywhere is pretty normal for me, but there isn't even one camera remotely close?
> 
> Either way, I feel it was 100% preventable--at the bare minimum, does the staff not health records of all the residents?


exactly, news reporter don't understand either how she got locked out and no one noticed it
They talk about security 24/7, camera, etc..
but, no one noticed anything... weird...


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## H1B1Esquire (Jan 21, 2019)

Noctosphere said:


> no one noticed anything... weird...



You know, if you think 9/11 was an inside jerb, it's probable this was done intentionally. 

Why, you ask? 

Look at what 'Murrica has been through for "_security_" and "to make sure nothing like this ever happens again"--yeah, okay, maybe you won't start a war on cold temperatures giving folks hypothermia, but it definitely might become a point of contention for ulterior motives, when it needs to be addressed as an act of negligence on behalf of the staff.

Get some brownie points--setup a lawsuit in the name of the family and for anyone else who feels their loved ones may become a victim.


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## Taleweaver (Jan 24, 2019)

I had a feeling when I read this thread, and upon inspecting, I wasn't wrong. Here's your problem:

_She [minister Blais] said that the building was inspected recently and had its certification renewed, adding that the facility has six people who work overnight, exceeding the two required by the province.
...
She said that there are 660 residents in the Lux Gouverneur seniors' residence, 69 of which receive some form of home care through the regional health authority._

That means that each member of staff had 110 people to navigate. *A hundred and ten per person*. That's a pretty large amount (and the fact that the province only requires 2 night guards by law means that other senior residence's will have a potentially much higher risk of this sort of thing happening). I mean...say you are tasked to evacuate everyone in your street. Would you be able to do it better?

My girlfriend works in a retirement home. As a result, I'm now downright afraid to grow old. Why? Because these places are chronically understaffed, staff has to do a wide array of different tasks and the elderly are (apparently) growing more demanding (and egocentric) by the month. And while many are friendly and understanding, there are still members who cannot walk by themselves, have to be helped out of bed (and into their clothes), that "wander around" like that (seriously: some just attempt to go out and then forget where they are) or are treating the personnel like they're in some kind of spa.

So a fire alarm in the middle of the night isn't a joke. It's more like a pandemic. Just getting "your" 110 elderly out of the bed and decently dressed is something I have no idea how I'd do in a short time, let alone guide them all to the designated areas.
...and then back. This "isn't there a head count?" is a very valid question, but I fear that it doesn't take reality into account. Can I count to 110? Sure. That's...ten people in the wheel chairs. 12,14, 16...hey, Ms Smith: wait up, please. We're getting back to the dorm soon. 18, 20, 22...would you please stand still over there? I'm trying to count here! 24, 26, 27...did I count you already? Please...stay still for a moment. No, ms. Drew: there is no need to panic. Oh, wait...mr Jones has fallen. Let me help you up. What? No, I don't know when we'll get back to the dorm. I just have to count everyone. So...29, 31, 33...hey! What are you doing here, Jim? You should be in Carol's group. She's over there. Yeah...go on. It's okay. Just down the hallway. Now, where was I with counting? 33, right? Oh...wait...we are allowed to go back to our rooms. <*everyone starts leaving*> I...guess I'll count you all when everyone's back in their room, then. 

See where I'm going with this? It's pretty easy to find someone dead in the snow and point out the importance of a head count. But in the heat of the moment you'll see another task that has to be done immediately or the family will have your head over it ("what do you mean, you couldn't help my poor father up? Was counting REALLY that important???").


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## H1B1Esquire (Jan 24, 2019)

Taleweaver said:


> Would you be able to do it better?



Well, for starters, it was a drill, so someone planned it, which means they should have thought about how the drill should be executed and what could go wrong and how to prevent those things from happening.

I'm pretty sure of 660 elderly folk, at least 10 would have a problem with hearing that would require more attention and that isn't even mentioning how many caregivers it could take to assist disabled residents, which easily outnumbers the already strained staff.

After the realization of being understaffed, I'd get some cameras and a very attentive, highly organized employee who takes responsibility seriously.


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## DeadlyFoez (Jan 24, 2019)

That is everywhere, not just Canada. I used to work as an LNA and I quit my job after seeing how horribly elders got treated. The sad thing is, the people that are supposed to be taking care of residents at nursing homes are given too many residents per shift to properly care for everyone and the nursing homes don't want to hire more staff. From the few different places I worked at, I saw the same thing at all of them. Far too understaffed.


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## Taleweaver (Jan 24, 2019)

H1B1Esquire said:


> Well, for starters, it was a drill, so someone planned it, which means they should have thought about how the drill should be executed and what could go wrong and how to prevent those things from happening.
> 
> I'm pretty sure of 660 elderly folk, at least 10 would have a problem with hearing that would require more attention and that isn't even mentioning how many caregivers it could take to assist disabled residents, which easily outnumbers the already strained staff.
> 
> After the realization of being understaffed, I'd get some cameras and a very attentive, highly organized employee who takes responsibility seriously.


Are we reading the same article?  From this, I assume it wasn't a drill:


			
				article said:
			
		

> A spokesperson for the Montreal fire department said about 100 people were forced to leave the residence when carbon monoxide was detected.



(also...I REALLY don't want to live in a retirement home where they think it's okay to hold fire drills at night at -19 degrees celcius (or -32 if the wind's calculated).


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## H1B1Esquire (Jan 27, 2019)

Taleweaver said:


> Are we reading the same article?





Noctosphere said:


> Then, they announced that the fire alarm was a fake one



@Taleweaver
I'm trusting that Nocto got the correct info.


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## Noctosphere (Jan 27, 2019)

H1B1Esquire said:


> @Taleweaver
> I'm trusting that Nocto got the correct info.


yea well, that's what I've heard at news


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## Taleweaver (Jan 28, 2019)

H1B1Esquire said:


> @Taleweaver
> I'm trusting that Nocto got the correct info.


A fake fire alarm still isn't the same as a drill. There are plenty of reasons why the fire alarm could've gone off without preparation.

I just googled this. A quote:

_Montreal police said a fire alarm was set off in a building in the seniors' home complex at 4:15 a.m., but a notice followed indicating residents in Rowley Hotte’s building did not need to evacuate._

I'd say that this says that there was no beforehand planning whatsoever.


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## H1B1Esquire (Jan 28, 2019)

Taleweaver said:


> fake


...News.

Honestly, I didn't do my own investigation, but I do know what these words mean: "fake", "practice", "accidentally" 

so if I see "fake alarm", I'll probably associate that to "___ drill", rather than, "accidental fire alarm". 

Still sucks that it happened.


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