# Nintendo patents 'Ornamental Design' for 3DS Circle Pad



## Janthran (May 15, 2012)

Sorry, is this news?


----------



## Deleted_171835 (May 15, 2012)

Nintendo filed a patent on December 6th 2011 for an ornamental design for the 3DS circle pad. The circle-pad shown seems to resemble a Gamecube analog stick.




Source


----------



## pokefloote (May 15, 2012)

Weird, new versions of 3DS might have updated pads?


----------



## Fudge (May 15, 2012)

Janthran said:


> Sorry, is this news?


Sorry, but was this necessary??


----------



## KingVamp (May 15, 2012)

I didn't think so...and as foxi would put it, it probably wouldn't lead to anything.

I just think the 3ds forum would have been better.


----------



## Deleted_171835 (May 15, 2012)

Janthran said:


> Sorry, is this news?


Yes.


----------



## Foxi4 (May 15, 2012)

It sort of is - the patent was filed after the release of the console itself. There may be some ambiguity between the patent and the final device, but the fact that it was filed after the device in question was released points at some sort of a special edition or revision of hardware.


----------



## Janthran (May 15, 2012)

Fudge said:


> Janthran said:
> 
> 
> > Sorry, is this news?
> ...


The idea was that someone explains how it's news.


----------



## Foxi4 (May 15, 2012)

KingVamp said:


> I didn't think so...and as foxi would put it, it probably wouldn't lead to anything.
> 
> I just think the 3ds forum would have been better.


Hehe, indeed, it's not solid proof of a revision in the works, but it's not like we need any to know that one will be released. It's a very Nintendo thing to revise their hardware every now and then and the slider did recieve some criticism, so it's only natural to assume that they'd want to improve it.

*EDIT:* Now that I think about it, it could be an attachment that latches onto the existing pad judging from Fig.7 and 8 - who knows?


----------



## Zerosuit connor (May 15, 2012)

Thank you, I found this interesting  
Maybe its a small rubber sticky kinda thing that you stick to the circle pad for extra grip?


----------



## Deleted_171835 (May 15, 2012)

Zerosuit connor said:


> Maybe its a small rubber sticky kinda thing that you stick to the circle pad for extra grip?


I doubt it. Nintendo wouldn't release an accessory like that. It's probably for the revision.


----------



## Foxi4 (May 15, 2012)

soulx said:


> Zerosuit connor said:
> 
> 
> > Maybe its a small rubber sticky kinda thing that you stick to the circle pad for extra grip?
> ...








In other words, it wouldn't be the first time they release a lump of plastic.


----------



## raulpica (May 15, 2012)

No dual analogs for the revision, then? Well duh.


----------



## Deleted_171835 (May 15, 2012)

raulpica said:


> No dual analogs for the revision, then? Well duh.


This patent is only about the circle-pad. The revision will almost certainly have dual-analogs.


----------



## Foxi4 (May 15, 2012)

soulx said:


> This patent is only about the circle-pad. The revision will almost certainly have dual-analogs.


As much as I would love this to be true, I'm not entirely convinced. The communication between the CirclepadPro and the 3DS is based on IR I/O afterall, I assume that if they were to use a different, on-board I/O port for it, it would require a firmware exception which in turn could cause issues with compatibility...

Then again, 3DS games ARE patchable now, so it's not a hurdle that can't be jumped over... Hmm...


----------



## Clydefrosch (May 15, 2012)

god, would you shut up about the dual sticks already?

theres as much proof that it will have dual sticks as there is proof against it. its 100% 50-50 chance, they can go either way, but there really is not much reason to take one over the other.

also, gamecube analogstick was the best i ever had. my favorite among all the controllers of the last 2 or 3 generations


----------



## GreatZimkogway (May 15, 2012)

soulx said:


> raulpica said:
> 
> 
> > No dual analogs for the revision, then? Well duh.
> ...



You say that like there'll be a revision.  One, they've said there won't be.  Two, adding a second circlepad would *divide the community*.  There'd be NINTENDO 3DS GAMES not playable on a 3DS because they require that second stick.  There will not be one.  Only ever as an attachment.  Get over it.


----------



## Deleted_171835 (May 15, 2012)

alunral said:


> soulx said:
> 
> 
> > raulpica said:
> ...


They haven't said that and it wouldn't divide the community since all 3DS games would be playable without the second circle-pad.



Foxi4 said:


> As much as I would love this to be true, I'm not entirely convinced. The communication between the CirclepadPro and the 3DS is based on IR I/O afterall, I assume that if they were to use a different, on-board I/O port for it, it would require a firmware exception which in turn could cause issues with compatibility...
> 
> Then again, 3DS games ARE patchable now, so it's not a hurdle that can't be jumped over... Hmm...


I'm pretty sure that 3DS games go to the 3DS OS to gain access to the CPP. This could easily be fixed with a firmware update.


----------



## KingVamp (May 15, 2012)

alunral said:


> You say that like there'll be a revision.  One, they've said there won't be.  Two, adding a second circlepad would *divide the community*.  There'd be NINTENDO 3DS GAMES not playable on a 3DS because they require that second stick.  There will not be one.  Only ever as an attachment.  Get over it.


Like the wii motion + and remote plus? No?


----------



## Foxi4 (May 15, 2012)

alunral said:


> You say that like there'll be a revision.  One, they've said there won't be.  Two, adding a second circlepad would *divide the community*.  There'd be NINTENDO 3DS GAMES not playable on a 3DS because they require that second stick.  There will not be one.  Only ever as an attachment.  Get over it.


WiiMotion+
Wii Balance Board
Every Lightgun in existence
Classic Controller/Gamecube Controller Only games, AKA, every single Virtual Console/Gamecube-on-Wii title in existence
Guitar Hero Grip (DS) or Instruments
Rock Band Instruments

Add-ons get exclusive games - deal with it, stop crying, it's gonna happen sooner or later.


----------



## Gahars (May 16, 2012)

I know exactly what this means... Read on if you want a glimpse into the future...



Spoiler



Nintendo could have something new for the 3DS at the upcoming 3DS. Or not.



Impressed, right? Believe me, though, it ain't easy being a precog.


----------



## Foxi4 (May 16, 2012)

Gahars said:


> I know exactly what this means... Read on if you want a glimpse into the future...
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## Gahars (May 16, 2012)

@*Foxi4*






Also, if they do end up with a stick like the Gamecube's, they might as well bundle it with a purple 3DS to match.


----------



## The Milkman (May 16, 2012)

soulx said:


> alunral said:
> 
> 
> > soulx said:
> ...


If all the 3DS games can be played with out it then what the hell is the point of me. redesiging a already fine handheld that has 2 forms of dual analog, the touch screen and the CPP, just to put in ONE extra stick? Its a company bro. They don't give a fuck about what you want unless its making them money. And Im sure as hell that I'm not going to buy a revision of the same exact console with an extra stick for (knowing Nintendo) 40$ more, when I can just buy the original and a CPP for only 20$ more instead. People need to get over this second pad shit. If it wasn't there to begin with why spend shitloads more of cash (regardless of how much that extra pad costs its still another product to market and distribute) just because some people on the internet don't like using a touch screen instead and think the solution is ugly, I know I wouldn't spend my cash on it and Im pretty sure anyone with any form of logical thinking would agree.

Also, @Foxi4 and @Kingvamp. 

Funny thing, those are all accessories, and DLC. Nintendo didn't just say, "oh a couple of GCN games are on the Wii, let's weld a fucking GCN controller into the next version of it!"
there are NES games on the 3DS. Does that mean they are also going to add a Power Glove to the next revision? And the only reason they stuck the motion plus into the Wiimote, is because they had to figure out some way to make people buy a huge, battery pack looking device that was required for about what? 5 titles? Oh look, the 3DS has less then that using the CPP.


----------



## Deleted_171835 (May 16, 2012)

Zantigo said:


> If all the 3DS games can be played with out it then what the hell is the point of me. redesiging a already fine handheld that has 2 forms of dual analog, the touch screen and the CPP, just to put in ONE extra stick? Its a company bro. They don't give a fuck about what you want unless its making them money. And Im sure as hell that I'm not going to buy a revision of the same exact console with an extra stick for (knowing Nintendo) 40$ more, when I can just buy the original and a CPP for only 20$ more instead. People need to get over this second pad shit. If it wasn't there to begin with why spend shitloads more of cash (regardless of how much that extra pad costs its still another product to market and distribute) just because some people on the internet don't like using a touch screen instead and think the solution is ugly, I know I wouldn't spend my cash on it and Im pretty sure anyone with any form of logical thinking would agree.


Becuase dual-analog is a vastly superior control-scheme to A/B/X/Y?

And they gave enough "_fucks_" to make an add-on for Monster Hunter. Nintendo acknowledged that the lack of a second circle-pad was a mistake and is necessary for some games.

You're assuming a revision will cost the same as a regular 3DS. It will most certainly cost more to offset the cost of the circle-pad and any other changes.

Also stop being so arrogant by saying that your line of thinking is the only "logical" point of view.


----------



## The Milkman (May 16, 2012)

soulx said:


> Zantigo said:
> 
> 
> > If all the 3DS games can be played with out it then what the hell is the point of me. redesiging a already fine handheld that has 2 forms of dual analog, the touch screen and the CPP, just to put in ONE extra stick? Its a company bro. They don't give a fuck about what you want unless its making them money. And Im sure as hell that I'm not going to buy a revision of the same exact console with an extra stick for (knowing Nintendo) 40$ more, when I can just buy the original and a CPP for only 20$ more instead. People need to get over this second pad shit. If it wasn't there to begin with why spend shitloads more of cash (regardless of how much that extra pad costs its still another product to market and distribute) just because some people on the internet don't like using a touch screen instead and think the solution is ugly, I know I wouldn't spend my cash on it and Im pretty sure anyone with any form of logical thinking would agree.
> ...



What? So you agree with me? Your pretty much saying EVERYTHING I just said with less words. They made an accessory primarily, because CAPCOM, pushed it on them. Its the same with the Classic Controller Pro, Nintendo would have NEVER added two fucking plastic handles to that thing if Capcom didn't put Tri on the Wii. Same with the CPP. Its there as an option. THATS ALL. There is absolutely NO point in putting in the extra cost of redesigning the console just to put in a extra pad in, if every game is going to be optional for it. And if not, the CPP is just going to be bundled (in what I imagine would be a more expensive pack) with games that need it. And who the hell said A/B/X/Y was better? I said a TOUCH SCREEN and the ACCESSORY THAT ADDS A SECOND PAD would make more LOGICAL sense then to release a whole new console just for that. Get over it.


----------



## Deleted_171835 (May 16, 2012)

Zantigo said:


> What? So you agree with me? Your pretty much saying EVERYTHING I just said with less words. They made an accessory primarily, because CAPCOM, pushed it on them. Its the same with the Classic Controller Pro, Nintendo would have NEVER added two fucking plastic handles to that thing if Capcom didn't put Tri on the Wii. Same with the CPP. Its there as an option. THATS ALL. There is absolutely NO point in putting in the extra cost of redesigning the console just to put in a extra pad in, if every game is going to be optional for it. And if not, the CPP is just going to be bundled (in what I imagine would be a more expensive pack) with games that need it. And who the hell said A/B/X/Y was better? I said a TOUCH SCREEN and the ACCESSORY THAT ADDS A SECOND PAD would make more LOGICAL sense then to release a whole new console just for that.


No, I don't agree with you.

They added the accessory because they knew that there are games that need a second circle-pad to be played optimally (Monster Hunter being a notable one which is why I mentioned it).

Nowhere did I say they would release a revision solely to include a second circle-pad. Obviously the revision would include other improvements too. They're going to release a revision, anyways. Why wouldn't they add one in? You're grasping at straws here.

How can you use a touchscreen in a game with the HUD on the bottom screen? Or a game like Metal Gear Solid where you need the other buttons?

The second circle-pad is necessary and is a selling-point to some consumers. Before you mention the CPP, look at these pics. The 3DS is supposed to be a _portable_ console.

AND YOU DON'T HAVE TO USE CAPS TO GET YOUR POINTS ACROSS.


----------



## The Milkman (May 16, 2012)

soulx said:


> Zantigo said:
> 
> 
> > What? So you agree with me? Your pretty much saying EVERYTHING I just said with less words. They made an accessory primarily, because CAPCOM, pushed it on them. Its the same with the Classic Controller Pro, Nintendo would have NEVER added two fucking plastic handles to that thing if Capcom didn't put Tri on the Wii. Same with the CPP. Its there as an option. THATS ALL. There is absolutely NO point in putting in the extra cost of redesigning the console just to put in a extra pad in, if every game is going to be optional for it. And if not, the CPP is just going to be bundled (in what I imagine would be a more expensive pack) with games that need it. And who the hell said A/B/X/Y was better? I said a TOUCH SCREEN and the ACCESSORY THAT ADDS A SECOND PAD would make more LOGICAL sense then to release a whole new console just for that.
> ...


I use caps because its too much of a hassle to put the tags for bolding words on the mobile site.

And as YOU said, there are no games that require a second circle pad. And what the hell is so hard about having a HUD and touch screen aimming at once? Kid Icarus did it, Resident Evil did it? And I'm pretty sure a game like Monster Hunter (seeing how its not even shooting based) could also do it. I think most of the people here can agree that MGS was a lazy port. 

Also, I know a revision would come with other features, but tell me, if you knew that you would have to rearrange most of the consoles inners just for a second stick that most games don't even need, and knowing it would cost you extra, just for the hell of it? There's no straws I'm grasping here. I don't even know why you feel the need to have something that's virtual useless when there are so many easier ways. And don't give me that, "Its supposed to be portable" bullshit. A Tablet is supposed to be portable? So because it cant fit in your pocket does that mean your automatically unable to carry it? A Laptop is portable, but its also big. Does that mean its not portable? 

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Handheld_game_console

Where the hell does it say anything about it being small? 
Also, how does one really turn a USN article about a new CP that looks like a GCN stick, into a discussion about dual pads?


----------



## Deleted_171835 (May 16, 2012)

Zantigo said:


> I use caps because its too much of a hassle to put the tags for bolding words on the mobile site.
> 
> And as YOU said, there are no games that require a second circle pad. And what the hell is so hard about having a HUD and touch screen aimming at once? Kid Icarus did it, Resident Evil did it? And I'm pretty sure a game like Monster Hunter (seeing how its not even shooting based) could also do it. I think most of the people here can agree that MGS was a lazy port.
> 
> ...


Kid Icarus did it because it was part of the control-scheme. The whole game was founded on aiming on the touch-screen and shooting with 'L'.

You can't use the touch-screen in Revelations (clearly you haven't played it). If you could, it would be impractical as it cramps some people's hands and limits you to only one button. Metal Gear Solid being a lazy port has nothing to do with touch-screen aiming. The touch-screen just wouldn't work in that kind of game. It's not an FPS. Face it, the touch-screen doesn't work for all games.

Why would they add a second pad, you ask? Did I not already tell you? It's beneficial for certain games and can help sell the system to those that strive for such a thing. If they are going to change the console, there's no reason not to include a second pad. The cost is irrelevant as the price of the revision would account for that. It would just add an extra selling-point to the console.

And don't even go there bringing up laptops and tablets. The 3DS is a videogame device meant to be played on-the-go. A laptop is portable in that it is a computer that you can bring anywhere but you wouldn't just take out your laptop on the bus and use it like you would a Vita/3DS. Yeah, you're clearly grasping at straws here.


----------



## Rasas (May 16, 2012)

You've got to calm down.
Some or a lot of people are just waiting for a redesign where it has the features the CPP already in it and has something to prevent screen damage on closing the 3ds. I know it will probably cost more then a 3ds and CPP but it should boost sales or target those people waiting for it. I know I waited for the DS Lite after the GBA days. Also on it being portable comparing it to a tablet and laptop just seems foolish some people have bags to carry them or need them during travel plus. The 3ds on the other hand just seems like something some people would want to put in my pocket not in some carrying bag. Some people wouldn't mind a 3ds bag but I do and ask yourself this wouldn't you like the 3ds not to have a bulky attachment preventing you from putting in your pocket easily.

Also video game hardware attachments usually come bundle with the game or can be bought with the attachment at release. Remember red steel 2 and FlingSmash. Sometimes it doesn't but usually in that scenario it already has been a while in the consoles life and they expect you to just own it or it is DLC and bundling it then would be difficult.


----------



## insidexdeath (May 16, 2012)

All I can say here is that nobody knows whether Nintendo will implent a second circle pad into the 3DS revision or not, so let's stop doing all the I'm right and you're wrong crap.


----------



## yuyuyup (May 16, 2012)

People waiting on a revision featuring a 2nd analog, don't hold your breath.  I'll wager there won't be a single version of the 3DS with 2 analogs, EVER


----------



## insidexdeath (May 16, 2012)

yuyuyup said:


> People waiting on a revision featuring a 2nd analog, don't hold your breath.  I'll wager there won't be a single version of the 3DS with 2 analogs, EVER



And how would you exactly know that?


----------



## yuyuyup (May 16, 2012)

insidexdeath said:


> yuyuyup said:
> 
> 
> > People waiting on a revision featuring a 2nd analog, don't hold your breath.  I'll wager there won't be a single version of the 3DS with 2 analogs, EVER
> ...


Just a guess.  I think there won't be a revision at all until they can fit more battery power into the system, and by that time, the system timeline will be too far down to justify such a dramatic and confusing new feature (confusing to the average consumer.)


----------



## ZAFDeltaForce (May 16, 2012)

How did a patent for a 3DS circle pad design turn into a debate about the possibility of a redesigned 3DS with dual analog sticks?

In any case, the design looks comfortable. My thumb slides around the current circle pad, hopefully the grooves of the new design changes that and adds more grip.


----------



## ShineStar (May 16, 2012)

yuyuyup said:


> insidexdeath said:
> 
> 
> > yuyuyup said:
> ...


Agreed. Also, it doesnt seem like the circle pad is being supported enough to warrant it becoming a staple of the system.
And Gamestop barely ever gets new shipment apparently.


----------



## The Milkman (May 16, 2012)

soulx said:


> Zantigo said:
> 
> 
> > I use caps because its too much of a hassle to put the tags for bolding words on the mobile site.
> ...



I put statements in your quote just so you know.


Listen man, I got nothing against adding in a second stick. I just want to know on what level people think its practical or even possible without he draw backs of the CPP, If you have seen any video of a 3DS being opened, you would see its tightly packed as is. So imagine shoving in a couple move buttons and another stick in there, not to mention another big enough feature that would prompt anyone to buy a revision. Hell, chances are, it would end up being uncomfortably large. If it were practical and worth the drawbacks I would be all for one. Till then these rants about CPP revision are just spam. Now can we please not let another one of our little disagreements get this thread offtopic?


----------



## Janthran (May 16, 2012)

Unless the revision is a 3DSXL, I have been convinced that it's impossible for dual analogs.


----------



## Foxi4 (May 16, 2012)

Zantigo said:


> Funny thing, those are all accessories, and DLC. Nintendo didn't just say, "oh a couple of GCN games are on the Wii, let's weld a fucking GCN controller into the next version of it!"


There are literally 3 WiiWare titles and 31 Wii games that support the Motion+ attachment. BAM! Motion+ embedded into the WiiMote.


> What? So you agree with me? Your pretty much saying EVERYTHING I just said with less words. They made an accessory primarily, because CAPCOM, pushed it on them.


They made an accessory to quickly fix a blatantly overlooked issue. The PSP crowd complained about a "single stick" years before the 3DS, didn't Nintendo hear? If you want to outsell your competition, you need to offer more.





> Its the same with the Classic Controller Pro, Nintendo would have NEVER added two fucking plastic handles to that thing if Capcom didn't put Tri on the Wii.


Nintendo should've put those "two plastic handles" in the original design, it's their whoopsie. 





> Same with the CPP. Its there as an option.


 Do you really think that Nintendo designed a special accessory because of _peer pressure?_ It's a gaming company, not an angsty teenager. 





> THATS ALL. There is absolutely NO point in putting in the extra cost of redesigning the console just to put in a extra pad in, if every game is going to be optional for it.


 Except there may be games which require the second stick, much like the games which require a WiiMotion+. 





> And if not, the CPP is just going to be bundled (in what I imagine would be a more expensive pack) with games that need it.


 Inflation of the price of the game = less games sold. 





> And who the hell said A/B/X/Y was better? I said a TOUCH SCREEN and the ACCESSORY THAT ADDS A SECOND PAD would make more LOGICAL sense then to release a whole new console just for that. Get over it.


In some key setups, using the touchscreen is awkward, did that ever cross your mind? That, and the accessory that adds a second pad is not always accessible - to use the Circlepad Pro you need to remove any anti-shock casing, extended battery or any other attachment from your 3DS. It's big, it's inconvinient and it should be embedded in a redesign because there's no reason why it shouldn't be. Accept that. _Don't question it, just *accept *it._

_Nintendo releases revisions. Nintendo always released revisions:_

The NES became the Top Loader (NES-101).
The N64 later had a Pikachu! exclusive edition, looking vastly different than the original.
The Game Boy became the Gameboy Pocket which was eventually upgraded into the Gameboy Colour (which could be treated as stand-alone due to exclusive games, but let's not get into that).
The Gameboy Advance became the SP, which in turn became the Micro.
The DS was re-designed into the DS Lite, the DS Lite was re-invisioned as the DSi and later the DSiXL (arguably the last two started a new family of products, but not everyone agrees so I won't add them in a separate line).
The Wii was re-released as a horizontal one without the Gamecube compatibility built-in for a lower price.

_All in all... Nintendo likes revisions. _The 3DS will have revisions. Have we established that?


----------



## The Milkman (May 16, 2012)

Foxi4 said:


> Zantigo said:
> 
> 
> > Funny thing, those are all accessories, and DLC. Nintendo didn't just say, "oh a couple of GCN games are on the Wii, let's weld a fucking GCN controller into the next version of it!"
> ...


Eh, I didn't even bother to read that, re-read like the last two pages and use the like button if you really want to argue that bad. I'm not going over this again.


----------



## Foxi4 (May 16, 2012)

I don't have to read the last two pages again - I read them. You think your take is logical but it's not given Nintendo's history. At best, there are equal chances for both scenarios. "Too long, didn't read" is not an argument in a discussion - it's ignorance. I take no offence, but I do remind you that when entering a discussion, one should expect others to have different point of views and what's logical to you may not be logical to others - everything depends on what you include in the equation.


----------



## OJClock (May 16, 2012)

ZAFDeltaForce said:


> How did a patent for a 3DS circle pad design turn into a debate about the possibility of a redesigned 3DS with dual analog sticks?
> 
> In any case, the design looks comfortable. My thumb slides around the current circle pad, hopefully the grooves of the new design changes that and adds more grip.


qft.
really though, patent filings are hardly news most of this stuff never gets made anyways


----------



## shakirmoledina (May 16, 2012)

they're trying to make it look better and sell more.
usually such things are from third parties.


----------



## lostdwarf (May 16, 2012)

Janthran said:


> Fudge said:
> 
> 
> > Janthran said:
> ...



I get it now.  You are genuinly an idiot.


----------



## GreatZimkogway (May 16, 2012)

I'm too lazy to look through more stuff, so this is the last time I'll say something on this.  The WM+ is an *accessory*.  Not a whole new damn *system*.  Yes, some games require ACCESSORIES.  There has never been a game to require a new SYSTEM(in so much being the same system.  Don't try bringing up a new console.  There is a difference, and you frickin' know it.).  That's why the CPP exists.  As an *optional* accessory.  Yes, some games might use it.  I get what you're saying, but it doesn't work.  No one is going to buy a new system, a $150+ new system, just for a few games.  It'd hurt the sales of the games.  Wii Motion Plus was a difference, and most games that needed it...*had the option of coming with it too.  Just like the Circle Pad Pro(with the exception of Kid Icarus, I think.)*


----------



## Foxi4 (May 16, 2012)

alunral said:


> I'm too lazy to look through more stuff, so this is the last time I'll say something on this.  The WM+ is an *accessory*.  Not a whole new damn *system*.  Yes, some games require ACCESSORIES.  There has never been a game to require a new SYSTEM(in so much being the same system.  Don't try bringing up a new console.  There is a difference, and you frickin' know it.).  That's why the CPP exists.  As an *optional* accessory.  Yes, some games might use it.  I get what you're saying, but it doesn't work.  No one is going to buy a new system, a $150+ new system, just for a few games.  It'd hurt the sales of the games.  Wii Motion Plus was a difference, and most games that needed it...*had the option of coming with it too.  Just like the Circle Pad Pro(with the exception of Kid Icarus, I think.)*


Except early adopters wouldn't need the new system - they could just as well use the attachment. The WiiMote Plus is an entirely new WiiMote with the expansion built-in, it's the equivalent of a normal WiiMote with the Motion+ add-on attached to it - the analogy is apt.


----------



## Janthran (May 16, 2012)

lostdwarf said:


> Janthran said:
> 
> 
> > Fudge said:
> ...


First off, you try to be funny and fail.
Second, you suck at spelling.
Third, I don't really care if you call names.
I just like to point out how you're an idiot.


----------



## Fudge (May 16, 2012)

Janthran said:


> lostdwarf said:
> 
> 
> > Janthran said:
> ...


And I just like to point out how you're a douche. This was a very interesting post, news worthy. Considering this is a site themed around Nintendo consoles, I would think everyone would consider this news.


----------



## Rasas (May 16, 2012)

Can you guys stop arguing about this. Lets just agree that they probably cannot fit another analog stick into the 3ds without making it larger since they said they tried to make it as small as possible. They know certain people are asking for it and bringing in more potential buyers is good so they will probably try to do so in the future. Yes WM+ is required on five games but the ones that didn't require it but had support for it didn't benefit from it greatly Conduit 2 and Raving Rabbits being the best example of this. The CPP on the other hand makes games like MGS3 more enjoyable. They admit they should of had two analog sticks but probably didn't have the time or could not fit it in.

If anything it should remind people of Gameboy/Pocket and Gameboy Color.
At first games could be played on both systems but color added colors (example Zelda Pokemon TCG) then there was gameboy color exclusive games. I'm pretty sure if they could add color screen to the gameboy and pocket via a accessory they would.

Of course someone could bring up the DS and DSI. The DSI only had so many exclusive retails games most of them were crap like Hair Salon and Foto Showdown. The DSI had some exclusive DLC and still sold fairly well but not as well as the DS with 200+ million sales compared to 35+ million sales. So anyone going for just the DSI was going for a smaller marketshare.

At any rate I honestly think developers will use the CPP or at least support it till it becomes the norm like with Gameboy/Pocket/Color.


----------



## AlanJohn (May 16, 2012)

I have no idea why but I would love to have a 3DS with that kind of circle pad.


----------



## Deleted_171835 (May 16, 2012)

Zantigo said:


> And a dual stick isn't required for any games. So what makes it something that must be put in a revision? In RE:R you could move and do as much without the second stick as you could when you did, and you couldnt aim with the touch screen, but you could control cammera movement, do you need a second stick for that too? And though KI only required a single button, the touch screen was used for powers, zooming, and other features. Why could MGS just use the touch screen to aim since you had to be in a special mode to shoot also. And another note. If you haven't noticed, when you aim normally with dual sticks, your also cut off to 2 buttons. And what cramps? I have played shooters on my DS for years and I have never gotten cramps, the closest thing I got to a cramp playing a shooter on the DS is my pinkie hurting a little because I because by habit I bend it under the system/controller for extra support.
> 
> Ok, you got a point, but you also have two other methods of doing exactly what you describe using it for. Besides, even if we do get another stick I think your forgetting about the L2 and R2 buttons, either they would end up painfully small and hard to click, or they would add the lumps that the CPP has. Either way you have the same bulky console. Only difference is, I can pull my CPP off the back and put it in another pocket. Yours is welded into the console.
> 
> ...


In Resident Evil: Revelations, you couldn't move and shoot without the second stick (except for gyro but not everyone likes that). As for MGS: Snake Eater 3D, you clearly haven’t played it. You can't aim with the touchscreen because you need access to the other buttons. Not to mention shooting in third-person mode.

When you use dual-sticks, you aren't cut off to 2 buttons. You have access to L/R/R2 (CPP). More buttons than you would have with the touch-screen. And you don't speak for everyone. Just because _you_ don't get cramps doesn't mean that others don't.

Two other methods that I have already proven inferior for certain-games? The L2/R2 buttons can easily be done in a style similar to the Classic Controller. If you're arguing that those buttons would make the system as large as the CPP, you clearly haven't seen the inside of one. There is tons of leg-room as it is.

I _"implied"_ that the 3DS _"became a home console"_. Huh? I just said that the 3DS with the CPP is much too large to bring with you around. For fucks sake, it's almost as big as a Game Gear. And yes, I am saying that you can't use a laptop on a bus comfortably with two hands. Don't try to argue that. You'll just make yourself look silly.

I have seen the 3DS internals and you could easily fit another circle-pad in there if you increase the size of the unit a little (which would alleviate complaints about the small size) and move the battery. The system wouldn't be uncomfortably large. A re-design is not supposed to be 100% identical to the original unit so that wouldn't matter.

Considering this is a thread about the circle-pad, none of these posts are spam. This is just typical Zantigo using the "back on topic" retort when you realize your argument is flawed.


----------



## Thesolcity (May 16, 2012)

alunral said:


> There has never been a game to require a new SYSTEM



What about DS games that only played on the DSi?


----------



## tbgtbg (May 16, 2012)

Foxi4 said:


> soulx said:
> 
> 
> > Zerosuit connor said:
> ...









Nintendo only licensed it, Pressman released it.


----------



## Supersonicmonk (May 16, 2012)

So they're making the 3DS feel more like a gamecube controller, does anyone else think it might be a gesture towards smash bros players?


----------



## Foxi4 (May 16, 2012)

tbgtbg said:


> Nintendo only licensed it, Pressman released it.


It's clearly a branded Nintendo product with a Nintendo license and a Nintendo Seal of Quality. You could just as well say "Nintendo consoles ain't Nintendo's - they're Foxconn's". Also, it was a joke.


----------



## gamefan5 (May 16, 2012)

Thesolcity said:


> alunral said:
> 
> 
> > *There has never been a game to require a new SYSTEM*
> ...


If the quote in bold was true, I guess that means I can use my NES to play COD. XD


----------



## Foxi4 (May 16, 2012)

gamefan5 said:


> Thesolcity said:
> 
> 
> > alunral said:
> ...


There are no "DS games that only played on the DSi" - the DS and the DSi are two separate systems and two separate console families despite the fact that many disagree with this statement. They run a different OS on different hardware. The only thing the two share is standard DS compatibility which on the DSi is achieved by downclocking and running the DS games via a compatibility layer, much like GBA games were compatible with the DS. It's not a DS revision, even if it didn't have a whole lot of dedicated games.

That is, unless you take the "DS family" literally as "Dual Screen", in which case you can put the DS, DSi and the 3DS into one basket.


----------



## Thesolcity (May 16, 2012)

Foxi4 said:


> gamefan5 said:
> 
> 
> > Thesolcity said:
> ...



DS and DSi only games are listed under the same category. Ergo, its a DS game only playable on the DSi. Call me nitpicky, but I'm right.


----------



## Foxi4 (May 16, 2012)

Thesolcity said:


> DS and DSi only games are listed under the same category. Ergo, its a DS game only playable on the DSi. Call me nitpicky, but I'm right.


They're listed that way_ because Nintendo under no circumstances would ever admit that they released a console and never released anything particularily good for it_. Facts are that the DS and the DSi are completely different creations which are only visually similar to eachother and both are compatible with DS games.

Arguing that the DSi is a DS revision is like arguing that the DS is a GBA revision or the Wii is a Gamecube revision. Backwards compatibility doesn't equal "revision", even when the hardware is built on a similar blueprint.


----------



## Thesolcity (May 17, 2012)

Foxi4 said:


> Thesolcity said:
> 
> 
> > DS and DSi only games are listed under the same category. Ergo, its a DS game only playable on the DSi. Call me nitpicky, but I'm right.
> ...



I know, I know. The DSi wasn't so much a revision as much as a new system disguised as an accessory boost. But the DSi had no dedicated software besides DSiWare and we know how much that failed on its ass. I was just pointing out that in technicality that guy was wrong, nothing more.


----------



## Foxi4 (May 17, 2012)

Thesolcity said:


> I know, I know. The DSi wasn't so much a revision as much as a new system disguised as an accessory boost. But the DSi had no dedicated software besides DSiWare and we know how much that failed on its ass. I was just pointing out that in technicality that guy was wrong, nothing more.


Well, every single DSiEnhanced game had content dedicated for the system specifically, moreover, there are a _few _DSi-Only titles on cartridges - Monster Finder (Foto Showdown, I believe), System Flaw, Chuck E. Cheese's Arcade Room and Hair Saloon...  so... uhm... Yeah. Great library, right there!


----------



## Foxi4 (May 17, 2012)

There was a lot of potential in the DSi that simply went to waste - the games could've been more extensive, more advanced and complex, not to mention "prettier" but instead developers thought "yay! cameras!" and literally doomed the system. Only a handful of DSi titles made it "worth it" and even so, it just narrowly classifies as a saving grace.


----------



## Rasas (May 17, 2012)

Thesolcity said:


> I know, I know. The DSi wasn't so much a revision as much as a new system disguised as an accessory boost. But the DSi had no dedicated software besides DSiWare and we know how much that failed on its ass. I was just pointing out that in technicality that guy was wrong, nothing more.


I listed a couple of retail DSI only games in a previous post like Hair Salon and Foto Showdown but they sold poorly and weren't to good. It had dedicated software but it was just crap excluding some DSIware.

http://en.wikipedia....tendo_DSi_games


----------



## Midna (May 17, 2012)

Foxi4 said:


> There was a lot of potential in the DSi that simply went to waste - the games could've been more extensive, more advanced and complex, not to mention "prettier" but instead developers thought "yay! cameras!" and literally doomed the system. Only a handful of DSi titles made it "worth it" and even so, it just narrowly classifies as a saving grace.


Incremental hardware upgrades to game systems don't work. If anyone wants to make a DSi exclusive game, they would be limited to a tiny fraction of the Nintendo DS market. No one wants that, no matter how many bells and whistles could have been thrown into the games.


----------



## Foxi4 (May 17, 2012)

Midna said:


> Foxi4 said:
> 
> 
> > There was a lot of potential in the DSi that simply went to waste - the games could've been more extensive, more advanced and complex, not to mention "prettier" but instead developers thought "yay! cameras!" and literally doomed the system. Only a handful of DSi titles made it "worth it" and even so, it just narrowly classifies as a saving grace.
> ...


I personally think that it's a myth - this statement may have been true back when the DSi was first introduced, but today? Not really. It is my sincere belief that many DS users upgraded to the DSi for the sake of DSiWare - rarely do I see a DS Lite of a Classic being used, most people actually have a DSi.


----------



## Midna (May 17, 2012)

Foxi4 said:


> Midna said:
> 
> 
> > Foxi4 said:
> ...


I don't know anybody who bought a DSi for DSiWare. It was just another version like the DSlite.

But anyway, you're saying you believe the DSi adoption rates turned out to be high enough that developers would be able to justify cutting huge amounts of potential customers out of the picture for their games? I... don't think that's true at all.


----------



## Foxi4 (May 17, 2012)

Midna said:


> I don't know anybody who bought a DSi for DSiWare. It was just another version like the DSlite.
> 
> But anyway, you're saying you believe the DSi adoption rates turned out to be high enough that developers would be able to justify cutting huge amounts of potential customers out of the picture for their games? I... don't think that's true at all.


Adoption rate aside, many classic and lite DS'es simply went out of comission - not everyone takes care of their consoles. I honestly believe that the great majority of the currently used "DS-Compatible" systems are in fact DSi's, but I don't really have any data to support that, I'm just speaking from my own observation. A good idea for a poll, really.

In any case, the DSi is better-protected anyways. Releasing a game purely for the DSi, which I remind you is still barely hacked, would cut down on the piracy and provided that the game would be worth it, and it probably would since you get a whole lot more resources than on the DS, it could be a real bullseye.


----------



## Vampire Lied (May 17, 2012)

I just gotta say I like the idea of more texture on the circle pad.
If there's a revision, would I buy it just for a 2nd circle pad at a higher price?
No. If the revision has a 2nd circle pad, larger screens and more battery life, hell yeah ill pay more and get the same system again.
Ppl do it all the time. I've heard of ppl that have a perfectly working ps3 or 360 buying a slim model just because they like the looks of it.
I know when the midnight purple 3ds releases in a few days, ppl are gonna buy it that already have a 3ds just cause they like the color.
I'm just saying, if they make a revision, ppl will buy it.
Weather you think it's dumb or not, it'll sell.
There's a few key things it'll have to have for me to buy it, but if they deliver, I'm in.
BTW thanks OP for posting this. Makes me hopeful that a revision is already in the works.


----------



## The Milkman (May 17, 2012)

soulx said:


> Zantigo said:
> 
> 
> > And a dual stick isn't required for any games. So what makes it something that must be put in a revision? In RE:R you could move and do as much without the second stick as you could when you did, and you couldnt aim with the touch screen, but you could control cammera movement, do you need a second stick for that too? And though KI only required a single button, the touch screen was used for powers, zooming, and other features. Why could MGS just use the touch screen to aim since you had to be in a special mode to shoot also. And another note. If you haven't noticed, when you aim normally with dual sticks, your also cut off to 2 buttons. And what cramps? I have played shooters on my DS for years and I have never gotten cramps, the closest thing I got to a cramp playing a shooter on the DS is my pinkie hurting a little because I because by habit I bend it under the system/controller for extra support.
> ...


Soul, how is my argument flawed if what were arguing about is entirely opinionated? I suppose that's the old SoulX way of saying anyone who doesn't argee and dares to tell him is wrong.

I think its not a practical thing. You think somehow that because you cant adjust to certain controls its wrong. Its not a fact that everyone hates using the touch screen. And while you are right its not good for everything, anything else you have the CPP for. I still cant understand how you seem to think 5 games using it means its going to be in a revision, and like I said. I'm not against it, I don't think its happening that's all. So unless you can somehow proove that most 3DS games are going to use this and it will be something more then just a peferable control, I refuse to think that its practical to stick this in a new 3DS and if its not going to sell then its not going to happen. Now like Vamp said, if its got a shitload of cool features like bigger screens and better battery, then chances of that go up, but putting it in just for the fuck of putting it in is just stupid, and I'm sure you would agree.


----------



## Janthran (May 17, 2012)

DSiware still was DSi only.


----------



## Rasas (May 17, 2012)

Janthran said:


> DSiware still was DSi only.


Also most DSIware works on the 3ds and I'm sure previous posts mention dsiware was not for the DS/Lite.


----------



## Janthran (May 17, 2012)

Rasas said:


> Janthran said:
> 
> 
> > DSiware still was DSi only.
> ...


I don't see your point. DS games are still called DS games, and they work on the 3DS.
The fact is there was a decent library of DSiWare games and it counts as a second DS.

I like to think that because then the name 3DS is much more clever.


----------



## gameandmatch (May 17, 2012)

Dear OP, 
I think you have been forgotten. 
Sincerely, 
A reader.


----------



## lostdwarf (May 17, 2012)

Janthran said:


> Rasas said:
> 
> 
> > Janthran said:
> ...



Dsiware was not the reason people bought a dsi.  It is just an added bonus.
It was the cameras and the sleeker OS with game reset.(tap power to return to home)and music player(if you knew how to convert files to aac)

DSi is just a fancy looking DSlite with a few added features.  IT IS STILL A DS.  not a new console.
Nintendo dont even differentiate the sales figures for DS, DSLite, DSi and DSiXL.
Games that are DSi only, have the use of cameras.  The graphics, and controls are identicle in every way.


----------



## Janthran (May 17, 2012)

lostdwarf said:


> Janthran said:
> 
> 
> > Rasas said:
> ...


And what exactly do you think defines a new system?
The DSi was capable of better graphics. IIRC PS2 and PS3 had the same controls.
Excepting Move, which was released long after the PS3


----------



## GreatZimkogway (May 17, 2012)

Hey guys...take a look at this, for those thinking an accessory(WM+) is an equivalent to a new console iteration(3DS with two circle pads): http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_games_that_support_Wii_MotionPlus

Just about 30 retail games use the WM+.  Almost all of them are *optional*.  Thus, terrible analogy, and proof against that.  There's also the fact that it wasn't a new console.  Again.

If anything, the DSi is a better comparison.  Added new things the DS/DSL didn't have.  And look how bad that bombed.  I'm not saying the games would still suck, but no one bought it.  The vast majority found it to be a pointless upgrade.  And that's exactly what a 3DS with two circle pads would be.  A pointless upgrade that would force users to buy a new console or some accessory.  You say not all games would use it?  Compare it again to the WM+?  *Can you justify buying a brand new version of a console for a handful of games?*


----------



## Rasas (May 17, 2012)

alunral said:


> Hey guys...take a look at this, for those thinking an accessory(WM+) is an equivalent to a new console iteration(3DS with two circle pads): http://en.wikipedia...._Wii_MotionPlus
> Just about 30 retail games use the WM+.  Almost all of them are *optional*.  Thus, terrible analogy, and proof against that.  There's also the fact that it wasn't a new console.  Again. *It was crap though Nintendo barely got any dev support and the games that had the option of using it Conduit 2 and Raving Rabbits being a example did not benefit from them much or at all. Just try them yourself and see. I don't think anyone is saying it is a new console it was a accessory but it can be compared to a 3ds revision with two analog sticks since all it does is put the accessory into it like the WiiMote+.*
> If anything, the DSi is a better comparison.  Added new things the DS/DSL didn't have.  And look how bad that bombed.  I'm not saying the games would still suck, but no one bought it.  The vast majority found it to be a pointless upgrade.  And that's exactly what a 3DS with two circle pads would be.  A pointless upgrade that would force users to buy a new console or some accessory.  You say not all games would use it?  Compare it again to the WM+?  *Can you justify buying a brand new version of a console for a handful of games? Yes, considering I'm waiting for a revison but it isn't really a new console just a 3ds with a accessory built in. It is like putting WM+ in a controller.*


The DSI did not bomb but it did sell less then the DS by like 150+ million. People bought the DSI/XL it is just that developers wanted to go for both market shares so they didn't take advantage of the higher ram and processor for obvious reasons. As I said before you can a make it a ds/lite versus dsi/xl scenario but you can also think about the gameboy/pocket versus color. The Color was something new granted but it sold fairly well but this isn't a good comparison. At first games could be played on both then they had exclusives for color. The color like the DSI had better tech specs but isn't a good example same with the DSI.

Oh and if you want to compare controllers why not go for Sega genesis' 6 button controller it added something for fighting games like Street Fighter and Mortal Kombat. Of course you can compare it to the add ons that came like the 32x and CD but can we just agree that if they made a revision and could add in a second analog stick they probably would.


----------



## Deleted_171835 (May 19, 2012)

Zantigo said:


> Soul, how is my argument flawed if what were arguing about is entirely opinionated? I suppose that's the old SoulX way of saying anyone who doesn't argee and dares to tell him is wrong.
> 
> I think its not a practical thing. You think somehow that because you cant adjust to certain controls its wrong. Its not a fact that everyone hates using the touch screen. And while you are right its not good for everything, anything else you have the CPP for. I still cant understand how you seem to think 5 games using it means its going to be in a revision, and like I said. I'm not against it, I don't think its happening that's all. So unless you can somehow proove that most 3DS games are going to use this and it will be something more then just a peferable control, I refuse to think that its practical to stick this in a new 3DS and if its not going to sell then its not going to happen. Now like Vamp said, if its got a shitload of cool features like bigger screens and better battery, then chances of that go up, but putting it in just for the fuck of putting it in is just stupid, and I'm sure you would agree.


You can have an opinion, nothing wrong with that. It's your justification for that opinion that's flawed.

You don't seem to be getting the point. I'm arguing that a second stick should be included as it's necessary for an optimal control method in games. I already explained that a touch-screen is not a good substitute for it in all games.

And since you're arguing that only a few games use it, look at the following:
Resident Evil Revelations
Metal Gear Solid: Snake Eater 3D
Kid Icarus Uprising
Kingdom Hearts 3D: Dream Drop Distance
Monster Hunter Tri G
Ace Combat 3D: Rumble Cross (JP version only)
Dynasty Warriors VS
Monster Hunter 4
They all use it. And the upcoming games, Luigi's Mansion, E.X.Troopers and Heroes of Ruin will all probably use it.


Like I said already, it's more than practical to add it in. They're going to make a revision, anyways. Why not add in a second analog stick (especially when they already acknowledged that the lack of a second stick is a problem) along with whatever else?


----------



## The Milkman (May 19, 2012)

soulx said:


> Zantigo said:
> 
> 
> > Soul, how is my argument flawed if what were arguing about is entirely opinionated? I suppose that's the old SoulX way of saying anyone who doesn't argee and dares to tell him is wrong.
> ...


So now were assuming what games will use it?


----------



## Deleted_171835 (May 19, 2012)

Zantigo said:


> So now were assuming what games will use it?


That's your response? Seriously?

I already gave you 8 games that use it as well as 3 more that will probably use it (and would benefit from it).


----------



## gamefan5 (May 19, 2012)

soulx said:


> Zantigo said:
> 
> 
> > So now were assuming what games will use it?
> ...


He's trying to counter your argument by making you think you've changed the subject. -_-'


----------



## The Milkman (May 20, 2012)

gamefan5 said:


> soulx said:
> 
> 
> > Zantigo said:
> ...


Caught me :3

I really cant take an argument that's pretty much boiled down to conflicting opinions seriously anymore. Sorry.


----------



## machomuu (May 20, 2012)

Zantigo said:


> gamefan5 said:
> 
> 
> > soulx said:
> ...


It's based more on subjectivity (or PoV, in this case) than opinion.  Though I will say, this post made my day.


----------



## The Milkman (May 20, 2012)

machomuu said:


> Zantigo said:
> 
> 
> > gamefan5 said:
> ...


Glad to hear, even if that was in a negative sense.


----------

