# Analyse a popular game you do not like



## FAST6191 (Apr 30, 2013)

New forum game of sorts.

Around here we often see "I really do not like ?" when ? is a popular game that sells millions, gets a lot of critical acclaim and on paper looks exactly like something you might like (usually the only way to work things up to a true dislike).

Now many people have provided reasons but others are left without them so I thought it might be interesting to see what happens if people do play and cover in a bit of detail why they do not like them.

Popular games that frequently get this
Metal Gear Solid
Pokemon
Kingdom Hearts
Monster Hunter (though popular might be a stretch here)
COD single player.

In honour of this I shall be grabbing one of the PSP monster hunter games and giving it a go but I thought I might as well kick this off in case others had something worth sharing. On monster hunter it should be everything I like given that I really like roguelikes, like complex crafting systems, like thoughtful combat, like active combat, enjoy new and interesting monsters and basically everything Monster Hunter claims to be on paper and many things its fans claim it to be. However even after putting many hours into the game, trying later stage saves (both of which are problems game design had examples of solving in the 16 bit era and before), reading guides, watching videos and generally doing pretty much all I can to have a good time with the game (certainly things that have turned things around before when I was about to dismiss a game) I was really not having a good time.
However this still says little so for mine I will be pulling things apart at various levels, I doubt it is any one thing but it could be a convergence of unfavourable patterns in drop rates, experience gains, hit percentages and so forth with suspect controls that sees me dismiss it.


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## The Catboy (Apr 30, 2013)

Honestly my main complaint for CoD (and 90% of the FPS's nowadays) is that I have hard time seeing what's going on in them. I mess around the video settings in both the game and my TV, but I just can't see what's going on. I actually do have eye problems.
Whenever I do find that right TV with those right settings and I get the chance to play them, they're OK. They're not the worst possible game I ever played, but they aren't my cup of tea.
I do find the single player to be a bit short though, which is rather disappointing that they focus so much on the online multiplayer vs spending at least the same amount of time working on the single player.

As for the others.
MGS: I haven't played enough of them to give a fair judgement on them.
Pokemon: Clearly I am still a huge fan of them and thus have a bias.
Monster Hunter: Same as MGS.
Kingdom Hearts: They have their ups and downs, but overall I actually quite enjoy them. I do however wish they would just finish instead of milking them dry like they have been.


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## FAST6191 (Apr 30, 2013)

Yeah that is a fairly large barrier to entry. Having not encountered it beyond times where the sun shifts from behind the pillar and onto the TV (a problem solved by closing the curtains) I am not sure what I can say there.
That said I would be up for a bit more being unable to see my enemy but the "5 years of boredom, 3 hours of hell" thing probably would not make for a great game and would certainly impact the "I R one man ninja king army" thing many games seem to aim for. Hell I would probably even take a bit more "your enemy might be anywhere up or down" rather than the "if you are looking up or down it is a setpiece/one level gimmick and still likely just the same but tilted a bit" at this point. That said if you have not played Stalker, Metro 2033 (corridors again but done in a manner you might like) or possibly something like Operation Flashpoint (best if you can get a PC with good graphics capabilities here) you might wish to.


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## Chary (Apr 30, 2013)

This is a pretty cool topic.

MGS: I don't see this series as one that gets too much undeserved praise. It's a _solid_ game series.
(Then again, I might be biased because of some reasons.)
Pokemon: I've loved it my whole life, but I can see why people dislike it. Though, there's a reason Pokemon has been around and popular for so long. It's just plain addictive.
Monster Hunter: Never played it. I hardly see people talk about this game series, barring the new game that just came out.
Kingdom Hearts: Was OK, until recently. Now, honestly, I think the series has gotten greedy. Kind of like Sonic the Hedgehog, its a series that might need to be taken out back and killed.

(COD : It sucks. End of sentence.)


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## Ethevion (Apr 30, 2013)

MGS: People possibly don't understand what's going on in the game.
Pokemon: Complainers are adults who don't want to admit that they like Pokemonz in front of their friends or on forums. In reality, they're dying to get their hands on the latest game.
Monster Hunter: Never played it
Kingdom Hearts: They have like 50 games and they really need to end it.
CoD single player: It's CoD, people who hate it, hate it. People who like it, like it.


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## FAST6191 (Apr 30, 2013)

I had not really intended those examples for a bullet point list but carry on as you will.

"MGS: People possibly don't understand what's going on in the game."

Symptom of bad writing and/or translation perhaps? Personally I never cared for the controls, many of the mechanics feel token or setpiece (granted not to many games pull that off) and that went further into making other things almost gimmicks. Indeed the writing thing I could look past in some of the spinoff games (it is not like games have ever had the best writing to be found anywhere or risen much above pulp status when it has been serviceable) so I think I will stick with controls there.

Pokemon. I believe I am on record as saying I adore medabots, robopon and demi kids (though each are not without their flaws) and as each of those is to various degrees a "pokemon clone" it seems odd that I find pokemon boring to an almost unplayable degree. For all I said about monster hunter I do also occasionally go right in for some simple streamlined mechanics (warioware, retro game challenge and G.G Series Collection being nice examples of things that work here).


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## Gahars (Apr 30, 2013)

Are we just limited to these specific franchises or can we tackle others?

I'll just start with these, though. (I realized it's a mix of "Why I don't like this" and "Why don't others like this", but whatever...)

*Metal Gear Solid* - Metal Gear Solid is a complete and total mess. It's all over the place tonally and it relies way too much on exposition (evidently, Kojima doesn't understand the phrase "Show, don't tell"). This is Spinal Tap has a great quote, "There's such a fine line between clever and stupid," and all too often I think the MGS veers into the latter category. I still like many of the games on their own, but I think the franchise as a whole has a fair share of weaknesses and I could understand why some people be turned off by them.
*Pokemon* - I've said it before, and I'll say it again: Pokemon is the microwave burrito of game franchises. There's not much nutritional value there, but you know, you're not always in the mood for a steak. Sometimes you want an easy, convenient treat. They don't really change, but I guess they wouldn't be so comforting if they weren't a constant. I just prefer to get my guilty pleasures elsewhere.
*Kingdom Hearts* - I think KH takes the cake for most needlessly convoluted plotline in... anything, really. I also don't know how a franchise featuring Donald Duck and Goofy as main characters can take itself so damned seriously. The Final Fantasy element feels completely disjointed from the Disney stuff, and the game seems to have no idea how to connect either in any meaningful way. Add in the cringeworthy original characters and you've got "Crack Fic: The Video Game". And good God, the franchise has so many spin-offs it's spinning harder than Linda Carter's Wonder Woman.
*COD single player* - Bandwagons are fun.

I guess I'm the go-to "Defend Call of Duty" guy around here, so... The campaigns are short, sure, but the expectation is that players will be spending a significant amount of time in the (still great) multiplayer, and to be honest, I'd much rather have a short, well-paced campaign than a long, bloated one. 4 has a phenomenal campaign that I think people all too often forget about, and the Black Ops games have some pretty good stories. Even Modern Warfare 2 and 3 provide excellent moments and levels, albeit they are strung together with thin excuse plots. They all have their faults and failings, sure, but all too often people don't even seem to care to bring them up - Call of Duty seems to get a lot of flak simply for being the popular franchise of the day, and that's just kinda, sorta, completely dumb.


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## emigre (Apr 30, 2013)

Gahars said:


> Are we just limited to these specific franchises or can we tackle others?


 
Fast mentioned the aforementioned IPs as examples. However because GBAtemp collectively have little to no reading comprehension, members just thought they had to comment on thise specific IPs.


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## Rizsparky (Apr 30, 2013)

My specific gripe would be the Metal Gear series, I have just not been able to get into them...


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## RodrigoDavy (Apr 30, 2013)

GTA: A serie of games I don't know why people like so much. Missions are boring and require mostly memorization instead of skill. The free 3D map things is cool, but even as a kid I would eventually get tired of destroying everything I can while I try to escape or fight the police, after a while it gets too repetitive. I actually played the PS1 version of the 2D GTA 2 and I found the 3D transition while beautiful graphically lost the few elements that I enjoyed in it. The story started getting too complicated and the game has been showing traces of discrimination for quite some time, be it against females, homossexuals, black people, chinese, latinos and foreigners in general


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## Ethevion (Apr 30, 2013)

emigre said:


> Fast mentioned the aforementioned IPs as examples. However because GBAtemp collectively have little to no reading comprehension, members just thought they had to comment on thise specific IPs.


But they're the best examples


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## Gahars (Apr 30, 2013)

RodrigoDavy said:


> The story started getting too complicated and the game has been showing traces of discrimination for quite some time, be it against females, homossexuals, black people, chinese, latinos and foreigners in general


 
Um... what?

While I disagree with the rest of your points somewhat, this last statement just made me scratch my head. Care to elaborate?


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## lokomelo (Apr 30, 2013)

Kid Icarus: A woman talks on you ear the every single minute until you beat the game. This is a nightmare, at least for who already has or had a wife / girlfriend (0,1% of GBTemp). When you finally get rid of the talking bitch, you got another one (ok like in real life).

Beside that, the game is 100% on rails, you just walk forward and shoot or walk forward and slash. The jokes are pretty boring and childish, the gameplay is ultra repetitive, and the online mode is just a gay version of gunz (it is not bad for being gay, but it is bad for being similar to gunz).

The game is somewhat good, I liked it for some moments, but the more you play, more it gets annoying.


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## ilman (Apr 30, 2013)

League of Legends' popularity: God, this game is just blowing up in my school. Everybody is playing it. I really don't get why it's so popular. Because 99% of people in my country are pirates(don't even get me started on that), people tend to lean towards free to play games. I just hate it when 3/4 of my class are discussing the new LoL champions, skins, runes, etc. and I don't understand a thing. I don't mind LoL, but I just don't see why these MMO FtP games like LoL and Travian are played so much. The reason I dislike this game is that it's got a very steep learning curve. If I enter an Online game most people will try to flag me because of my bad playing and say that I've got to play with bots. And playing offline kinda defeats the purpose.  That's the reason I like games like Osu!. They are easy to pick-up and play, yet hard to master, the community is a lot less ragey(is that a word?) and offline mode is as fun, but no one plays Osu except me, 'cuz it's too japanezy. I just don't get LoL. Never have, never will.


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## FAST6191 (Apr 30, 2013)

On GTA
The driving is subpar and motorbikes and flying are worse.
The shooting was bad even for the early PS2 era let alone when it eventually hit.
The hand to hand fighting, even on later games, did not do well. This is a particular issue/point I hold up a lot though and I reckon many games could stand to have a proper fighting engine.
The general movement leaves a lot to be desired as well. Especially now we have things like Assassin's Creed.
I might also agree on the missions thing. However a game that sees me burn down a drugs crop and get stoned doing it, sees me fly along after a train and assault it on a jetpack and plan, come close to doing stealth reasonably well (Mad Dog's rhyme book) and several similar things is not all bad. Also when compared to something like Just Cause 2 or L.A. Noire things look far more positive for GTA but compared to some aspects of the more recent Far Cry titles then yeah. Also GTA as singularly bad for memory tests? I agree memory tests get kind of boring but if you are playing games that eschew them I would not mind a list of them as it seems to be a common mechanic and one I can not escape all that easily.

The story
You start as a low level hood
You work your way up the ranks and get some confidence from a leader in a criminal enterprise.
You get betrayed
You start out on your own and usually make it, often with the help of a character introduced earlier and initially projected as something of a side character.
You seek vengeance for the earlier betrayal. Bitter-sweet ending may follow.

Sections might repeat for each island/city and you also have the completely off the wall stuff that occasionally happens there.

Some of this varies a bit- Lost and Damned you are vice pres and de facto leader of a motorcyle gang (functionally it is still low level hood though) and in GTA 3 the betrayal happens in the opening scenes but you still start as a low level hood. However none of it is new in the slightest to the criminal story world, about the only variation on this is for the undercover cop approach (we have had a few games attempt this as well) or the "unwilling participant"/being dragged back into the life though both San Andreas and to some extents GTA4 (what little I saw of it) do this last one well enough and for a while at least Vice city had that going on too.

However put together I hold it works reasonably well (though things have long been nipping at its heels) and will probably have to say something like "If you are just going through the story then you are doing it wrong".

Gahars already took the last sentence (we share a sentiment there). I will say though that discrimination is never glorified, openly mocked on several occasions, mocked on the in game radio stations, mocked on the fake adverts in the game and more than a few characters go through an arc here (The whole Carl learning to respect Cesar thing in San Andreas being a fine example).

At this point I should note I have not put enough time into any of the Saints Row titles, Sleeping Dogs or Prototype to say I have played them. Other than Lost and the Damned I have not really GTA 4 either.


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## Ethevion (Apr 30, 2013)

I agree with ilman on League of Legends. The games learning curve is very steep, practically a 90 degree angle. If you mess up once in a game your team gets pissed and you get flamed and shit on. I don't understand why people love this game, why not play Star Craft if you think you're skilled in RTS games?


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## ilman (Apr 30, 2013)

Sagat said:


> I agree with ilman on League of Legends. The games learning curve is very steep, practically a 90 degree angle. If you mess up once in a game your team gets pissed and you get flamed and shit on. I don't understand why people love this game, why not play Star Craft if you think you're skilled in RTS games?


Exactly, I love me some normal RTSes like Starcraft and Warcraft(before 'World of' came). Those were the shit, had awesome single-player campaigns, good communities and tolerable people online. Heck, you could play solo against everyone else, so no one would rage at you. I wish Blizzard made Warcraft 4 instead of WoW, which is another extremely popular game I can't get into at all.


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## RodrigoDavy (Apr 30, 2013)

Gahars said:


> Um... what?
> 
> While I disagree with the rest of your points somewhat, this last statement just make me scratch my head. Care to elaborate?


Not the story itself, but in a sense that it's kind of hard to know which part of the game you are if you're not playing it frequently. Also, the 2D gta kind of gave you the instructions and background story while you were playing with your character, the 3D GTA would show a cut-scene for each mission which kind of slowdown the flow of the game.

By the discrimination, it isn't just me... It is well known some cases of it, although considering american culture I think many americans find phrases like "you drive like a crazy bitch" normal. There are more serious case, one of the games give you the option of "beating a whore to death to get your money back". You may argue that it's the player fault since he's the one controlling the character... While that's true, the game does reward you for doing it so it maybe unitentionally support this kind of attitude towards prostitutes, it's important to note while the influence of video games is sometimes greatly exaggerated, games are part of the media and , therefore, can influence people just like television does. One example I took from wikipédia is in a mission where you have to instigate a gang war between Cubans and Haitians, which in the context can be interpreted as supporting extermination of minorities. I know I sound very harsh, but I seriously doubt the game would be accepted if any of these examples involved treating americans or jews like inferior people, meaning people don't find offensive because it has nothing to do with them.


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## Deleted_171835 (Apr 30, 2013)

lokomelo said:


> Kid Icarus: A woman talks on you ear the every single minute until you beat the game. This is a nightmare, at least for who already has or had a wife / girlfriend (0,1% of GBTemp). When you finally get rid of the talking bitch, you got another one (ok like in real life).
> 
> Beside that, the game is 100% on rails, you just walk forward and shoot or walk forward and slash. The jokes are pretty boring and childish, the gameplay is ultra repetitive, and the online mode is just a gay version of gunz (it is not bad for being gay, but it is bad for being similar to gunz).
> 
> The game is somewhat good, I liked it for some moments, but the more you play, more it gets annoying.


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## FAST6191 (Apr 30, 2013)

RodrigoDavy said:


> Not the story itself, but in a sense that it's kind of hard to know which part of the game you are if you're not playing it frequently. Also, the 2D gta kind of gave you the instructions and background story while you were playing with your character, the 3D GTA would show a cut-scene for each mission which kind of slowdown the flow of the game.
> 
> By the discrimination, it isn't just me... It is well known some cases of it, although considering american culture I think many americans find phrases like "you drive like a crazy bitch" normal. There are more serious case, one of the games give you the option of "beating a whore to death to get your money back". You may argue that it's the player fault since he's the one controlling the character... While that's true, the game does reward you for doing it so it maybe unitentionally support this kind of attitude towards prostitutes, it's important to note while the influence of video games is sometimes greatly exaggerated, games are part of the media and , therefore, can influence people just like television does. One example I took from wikipédia is in a mission where you have to instigate a gang war between Cubans and Haitians, which in the context can be interpreted as supporting extermination of minorities. I know I sound very harsh, but I seriously doubt the game would be accepted if any of these examples involved treating americans or jews like inferior people, meaning people don't find offensive because it has nothing to do with them.



GTA4 did quite a bit on random phonecalls, email and side missions or did you mean general game flow was broken up by cutscenes?

Beating prostitutes is much like beating regular members of the public in GTA in that you do not want to do it in front of the police lest you get a wanted level and thus it is not completely positive.

I do recall and narrowly avoided mentioning the "kill all the Haitians" bit as it seemed something of a non issue. However gangs forming along ethnic/religious lines is a fairly well documented thing, especially in every place the GTA games have thus far been set, and for the types of characters you tend to play and people you tend to work for having a gang war start to pull focus from your own dealings is a fairly well documented and fairly effective tactic. Perhaps you are right that things might be treated differently if pet "ooh you can not say that"/hot button topics like Americans* or people of Jewish ancestry if you are also American (it means surprisingly little in the UK) were mentioned and though in many ways that is sad I am not all that sure it is relevant. To that end so I will have to accuse your "could be seen" of reaching a bit, especially as you seem to go after gangs and not ethnic groups for either the sake of it or "reasons". Now it might still be a callous disregard for life or even some variation of vigilantism but not ethnic prejudice or discrimination.

*the amount of American PMC types I have killed in various games might change things here. That said PMC seems to be synonymous with "rogue element" when it needs to be as far as modern games are concerned. Of course the ways Americans tend to treat their military are also a bit different to a lot of other places so I might have to make a whole other topic there.

Games can influence people.... sure but are you not in danger of heading towards the "murder simulators" nonsense that occupied many until quite recently?


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## MegaBassBX (Apr 30, 2013)

Lets see 


Metal Gear Solid : Nice game with an excellent graphics.
Pokemon: I'm a big fan of Pokemon since back in the day when the first game was released , dam it was just fun , Pokemon Platinum was the last best game they ever made , although AR cheats made the spoiled the game , I started losing interest in Pokemon when I realized that I don't need to catch them all , I guess I grow up 
Kingdom Hearts: never liked the series at all , the story is weak , and its just pointless to play the game , oww shitty graphics.
Monster Hunter: They do say much about it , but honestly I never played the game, I don'tt know why though.
COD single player: I hate all first shooter games , for once it's pointless to play if and if you play it must likely you are ether crazy or an idiot end of story  ( I know that the last line will get me in really big trouble but fuck it )


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## Shoat (Apr 30, 2013)

Most of the games I don't like are the ones that are released yearly without any noticeable improvements other than graphics and worse and worse DRM and DLC bullshit. Namely all Sports games, all smartphone and tablet games and the majority of modern shooters.

Other than that there are some games that, when trying them out, didn't give me much enjoyment, but since my feeling towards them was closer to indifference than to disliking, I don't think they're worth listing.


No deep analysing here, for that I'd have to actually play more of those games, which is not something I intend to do. Should be understandable, because unless it's someone's job to do so, why buy a game that you already know is bad just to analyse it? Having more backup arguments for why they're bad is not worth wasting time and money - you wouldn't want to support someone who made something bad financially and you wouldn't want to risk pirating for something that you don't even like.


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## Foxi4 (Apr 30, 2013)

*Sonic The Hedgehog (2006)*​ 
*What was done right:*

...it has Sonic in it?
There are three campaigns to choose from.
Some songs from the soundtrack are very catchy.
Some of the bosses have nice designs.
Guilty pleasure due to the sheer challenge of playing a fundamentally broken game.
*What was done wrong:*

Havoc Engine at its worse - the physics are truly out of this world, especially during vehicle sections. Gravity? No such thing when ypu're in a loop. Snowboard sections go againts all physics - you can gain momentum whilst riding downhill yet randomly stop for no reason when riding downhill.
Glitchy bugfest - characters often get stuck in the terribly-designed maps. In fact, there are points in the game where you can fall out of a cutscene and die. In fact, you can die during scripted events just because you entered them at an angle that was unexpected by the programmers. Clipping through walls is something to be expected in this game and after a while it stops being shocking and starts being sad. Getting stuck on walls whilst climbing is a problem directly connected with the camera which is also glitchy and likes to get stuck on random walls or objects.
Terrible lack of control in crucial moments of gameplay - they're floaty, they're all around the place.
Loading times give you just about enough time to brew a coffee and chat with friends - I hate coffee. They're also designed wrong - the game loads up the entire map just to allow an NPC to say a few words, then dumps everything it loaded so-far and re-loads the map to start a mission - all this could've been done in one loading, but no.
The enemies have the A.I of a retarded snail and don't do anything most of the time - their strenght is in numbers but the engine can't handle it. When a large number of objects is displayed _(especially when they also explode)_ the framerate plummets to ridiculous lows.
_"Mach Speed"_ sections are plainly unfair - the general rule is _"you jump - you die"_ unless you're perfectly alligned with the course. The courses also have paths which try to lure you with power ups but are virtually inaccessible due to the terrible controls and glitchy maps. These sections are also infamous for causing deaths due to idiotic reasons like tripping over a tiny stone that shouldn't pose any problem at all.
The water... oh, the water. No particle effects whatsoever - it's just a texture stretched on a quad and it looks terrible.
The game does a horrible job at explaining what you're supposed to do in some levels - more often than not, if you can't progress it means that you haven't bought a powerup you need _(about which nobody told you about or did so in a fashion that was easy to miss, for example a vague picture on the loading screen) _at the store or you were already given it, it just wasn't explicitly explained.
​
​*Final Score:* 1/10, _It's no use ;O;_​ 


...then again, this game is _"popular"_ only because it's so terrible so... _10/10, well done_, I suppose?


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## FAST6191 (Apr 30, 2013)

Shoat said:


> Other than that there are some games that, when trying them out, didn't give me much enjoyment, but since my feeling towards them was closer to indifference than to disliking, I don't think they're worth listing.
> 
> 
> No deep analysing here, for that I'd have to actually play more of those games, which is not something I intend to do. Should be understandable, because unless it's someone's job to do so, why buy a game that you already know is bad just to analyse it? Having more backup arguments for why they're bad is not worth wasting time and money - you wouldn't want to support someone who made something bad financially and you wouldn't want to risk pirating for something that you don't even like.



Risk? This is why we learn to do this sort of thing properly.
That said have you never picked up a something you know is likely to be bad to have a good laugh (this is probably the backbone of the action films industry), watched some bad TV, purchased a book to read when waiting around for a few hours, purchased a game because a friend said it was good, borrowed a game/book/dvd because a friend said it was good, dropped not a lot of money at all on something just because, got something in a multibuy/bundle deal or got something a few years later you did not like so much at the time but wish to return to (more on that in a moment)? Personally I do like to be able to discuss why things are bad (see many of these sorts of threads that I have made over the years) and for me experiencing bad things does help with that. Similarly there have been a few cases of diamonds in the rough and things I like anyway (I would return to action films for a moment as the stories are invariably basic or outright illogical but I am up for seeing crazy stunts) and I am sure we have all found an open world game and ignored the story in favour of running around, found a level/mission we all enjoyed on a bad game (Mission impossible on the N64 had several of these for me) or otherwise enjoy a single mode (I find most driving games quite boring but there are times I can spend an hour just cruising around, the older MX vs ATV games being especially good for this).

On indifference and disliking, I did try to address that at the start but it was a bit vague. I have certainly found myself indifferent towards certain games over the years but say in the case of monster hunter it had everything I should like and failed for me anyway; my usual policy on ranking failures is not so much "objective" quality but wasted potential.

Back on topic as it were.... if I am to add another suggestion then Super Mario Sunshine. Personally I really like the game (NES mario 1 was awesome, the rest of the NES and the SNES ones I have not played the most of, GB mario and the 6 golden coins game was nice, GBA ones I did little of, DS NSMB (and the rest of them) were OK but nothing I need to remember, Mario 64 was a tech demo as far as I am concerned and Sunshine was a gamble that Nintendo won for me but possibly lost in the bigger picture) but this is not a guilty pleasures thread so I can not do it here. However it is a Mario game and thus automatically assumed to be good but I have still met many that hold something of a dislike for the title. To that end if you dislike Sunshine then why does it not do it for you?


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## Gahars (Apr 30, 2013)

RodrigoDavy said:


> Not the story itself, but in a sense that it's kind of hard to know which part of the game you are if you're not playing it frequently. Also, the 2D gta kind of gave you the instructions and background story while you were playing with your character, the 3D GTA would show a cut-scene for each mission which kind of slowdown the flow of the game.


 
That's the problem with any long narrative, though. The plot can't really be expected to cater to people jumping back into the game late; it's the player's responsibility. As for cutscenes, they're pretty succinct, well paced and placed, and held together with (for the most part) good writing and voice acting; they hardly go to MGS extremes. Besides, the 2D GTA games didn't really have much in the way of plot - the 3D games have vastly more story to tell, so the cutscenes are pretty much a necessity.



> By the discrimination, it isn't just me... It is well known some cases of it, although considering american culture I think many americans find phrases like "you drive like a crazy bitch" normal. *("Bitch" is pretty much a general insult at this point, so...)* There are more serious case, one of the games give you the option of "beating a whore to death to get your money back". You may argue that it's the player fault since he's the one controlling the character... *(And it is. The game offers you choices and gives you the freedom to decide what to do. The responsibility lies on the player.)* While that's true, the game does reward you for doing it *(You get some money, but you also get the notoriety of the police, who hunt you down and either arrest or kill you. That's a pretty big punishment.)* so it maybe unitentionally support this kind of attitude towards prostitutes, it's important to note while the influence of video games is sometimes greatly exaggerated, games are part of the media and , therefore, can influence people just like television does *(If someone plays a videogame or watches tv and can't tell the difference between fiction and reality, they're the ones with the problem. You can't blame the media for crazy people being, well, crazy. Not to mention that violent crime rates have been dropping pretty dramatically, so any attempts to correlate the popularity of games with violence is suspect at best.)*. One example I took from wikipédia is in a mission where you have to instigate a gang war between Cubans and Haitians, which in the context can be interpreted as supporting extermination of minorities *(Seriously? That's a preposterously huge leap to make. Also, see my point below.)*. I know I sound very harsh, but I seriously doubt the game would be accepted if any of these examples involved treating americans or jews like inferior people, meaning people don't find offensive because it has nothing to do with them *(For the most part, everyone you murder in these games are Americans, so...)*.


 

I think you're making a mistake that's, distressingly, all too common: Just because a work of fiction features characters who are racist/sexist/etc. does not make the work itself racist/sexist/etc. The GTA games focus on criminals, so naturally, many of its characters are scummy, horrible people. (American History X isn't racist because it features skinheads, for example.)

It's also worth remembering, though, that the games make no qualms about these characters being scummy or horrible. It doesn't pretend otherwise. Considering how many of these characters end up dead or losing everything for their actions, it's clear that the games condemn them and their lifestyles pretty heavily.


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## ShadowSoldier (Apr 30, 2013)

This makes me think of Evil Craig's videos from Screwattack:

Super Mario Bros 2.


Spoiler








Mega Man


Spoiler








Street Fighter 2


Spoiler








Wii Sports


Spoiler








PS4
http://www.screwattack.com/shows/originals/evil-craig/12-reasons-we-hate-ps4-evil-craig


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## The Real Jdbye (May 1, 2013)

FAST6191 said:


> New forum game of sorts.
> 
> Around here we often see "I really do not like ?" when ? is a popular game that sells millions, gets a lot of critical acclaim and on paper looks exactly like something you might like (usually the only way to work things up to a true dislike).
> 
> ...


I didn't care much for Monster Hunter, but that was down to the mechanics and (if i remember correctly) the quest system.
I didn't play it much though and am going to give it another shot once I finish a few of the games on my backlog.

MGS and CoD are just in a genre I don't care for, but I tend to say "CoD sucks" a lot just because it's the "cool thing to do"
I enjoyed Kingdom Hearts 2 on PS2 but haven't played any of the other ones, and it was a bit repetitive though overall a good game.
I can see why people don't like Pokemon, not much really changes from game to game and to some it can get boring after the first couple of iterations. I love it myself, but I can understand people who don't.

As for other games I think Final Fantasy gets a lot of this too though not as much as CoD. I haven't really heard of MH/MGS/KH getting this though.


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## RodrigoDavy (May 1, 2013)

FAST6191 said:


> Games can influence people.... sure but are you not in danger of heading towards the "murder simulators" nonsense that occupied many until quite recently?





Gahars said:


> -snip-


Just to clarify, when I say video games have impact on people's opinion, I'm not thinking people will become mass murderer. I do worry though about a more long-term influence, for example, in my country many people make jokes about black people here and while some people consider it innocent, they are actually a way to hide discrimination against black people here, which is not tolerated by law, by the media and by great part of the people here.

My opinion is that some topics should be discussed with some kind of caution and I admit I am harsh with things that touch on these topics. But it's not that I don't like the game because of that, I just find it boring actually


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## 2ndApex (May 1, 2013)

League of Legends.

MOBA's have never been my favorite genre (did play DOTA2 for a while though) but I've never had one I've strongly disliked.

Mechanics are meh but the grind/pay to win mechanics make it the dead joke of the competitive gaming community. The community is absolute shit and the fact that it's the most played and sponsored game right now is insult to the injury. $15+ for character skins and username changes? It's like a fucking iOS game in disguise.


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## Shoat (May 1, 2013)

FAST6191 said:


> Risk? This is why we learn to do this sort of thing properly.
> That said have you never picked up a something you know is likely to be bad to have a good laugh (this is probably the backbone of the action films industry), watched some bad TV, purchased a book to read when waiting around for a few hours, purchased a game because a friend said it was good, borrowed a game/book/dvd because a friend said it was good, dropped not a lot of money at all on something just because, got something in a multibuy/bundle deal or got something a few years later you did not like so much at the time but wish to return to (more on that in a moment)? Personally I do like to be able to discuss why things are bad (see many of these sorts of threads that I have made over the years) and for me experiencing bad things does help with that. Similarly there have been a few cases of diamonds in the rough and things I like anyway (I would return to action films for a moment as the stories are invariably basic or outright illogical but I am up for seeing crazy stunts) and I am sure we have all found an open world game and ignored the story in favour of running around, found a level/mission we all enjoyed on a bad game (Mission impossible on the N64 had several of these for me) or otherwise enjoy a single mode (I find most driving games quite boring but there are times I can spend an hour just cruising around, the older MX vs ATV games being especially good for this).


 
I really can't afford to waste any money whatsoever, the budget I have left for entertainment is laughably tiny, so I only buy things when I'm absolutely certain that it's worth it - so I don't buy bad things just for a short laugh, even if they're 75% off, and I only buy bundles if there's a game in there I would want anyway, regardless of how much of a bargain the other games in it are, and dropping some money on something "just because", even if it's just a tiny amount, is completely out of the question for me. 
I do, however, buy things if they're being suggested to me by friends, but that has (luckily) never resulted in a bad buy so far - quite the contrary, I wouldn't have known half the good games I know now if it wasn't for my best childhood friend suggesting them to me (I was the nintendo kid, he was the playstation kid). 
The same goes for borrowing, the things I borrowed have, so far, have not been total failures.
Back when I watched TV, I watched lots of bad TV. Which is why I don't watch TV anymore now that there's the internet with way better entertainment that is not bound to a schedule (and, most importantly, not covered in shitty german dubs but in it's original english version).

Of course I have encountered bad games, movies, books, TV series and so on, but I never went out of my way to aquire them (be it buying, borrowing or pirating), most of them I played/watched/read at some friend's house (first encounter with CoD, he himself deeply regrets buying it) or because my family decided to watch it in the living room (twilight).

I can understand that someone a little wealther than me would waste small amounts of money now and then to watch a bad action movie or try out a game that he's unsure is good, but I cannot afford that (and that scroogelike behavior will probably remain even once I have more money).


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## astrangeone (May 12, 2013)

I dislike several games for different reasons.

0)  *CoD or any other generic "modern" FPS:*  They are all a bit boring.  It's all about reflexes and you end up with a hairy trigger finger.  See also - shades of brown.  There is nothing in the game world that is vivid or vibrant.  I do like a few dramatic scenes in the series - the nuclear bomb death of your soldier, and surviving just long enough to watch the city go to hell.  I also don't like how the games are so dark that you can't see anything.  (I remember playing Doom 3, and just going...it's shades of black!)  Also, the single player modes are usually tacked on as hell - they feel like demos or trailers for the game.  Multiplayer is just flat out broken - the newbies should be given a shield or a chance to recover from so many bullets in the head.

It's funny, I ended up playing CoD for a research project at my university, and the girl who was playing against me swore to hell and back.  It does increase aggression in people.

1)  *Mortal Kombat (the new one):*
It's tailored for fast combos and other ways for skilled players to finish the game.  The game engine is pretty good now - the fighting feels smooth and uninterrupted, unlike the original MK in the arcade.  However, the addition of the "X-Ray" moves slows down the gameplay to the point of unplayability.  (Plus, watching the characters break each others limbs for the thousandth time is kind of boring.)  The attention to detail in the fatalities is getting a little sick, and kind of weird for my tastes.  The worse is Mileena's end pose - especially after her head rip fatality.  (Add sexual stuff to violence...)  It feels like a game for the fanbase - as most of the events have been rewritten like bad fanfic.  It's like watching a snuff film - you get fascinated by it, and then repelled by it as well.  It's too much!

2)  *MGS: * Haven't played enough of them to understand it's virtues and vices.  I do commend people for playing this, as it is a game for people with a ton of patience - stealth vs killing things.

3)  *Pokemon: * Big fan here, although I completely understand why people think it's overdone.  It is - the Pokemon concept is getting pretty stale.  It is addictive although.  (I will probably pick up PKMN X or Y next year.)

4)  *Monster Hunter: * Funny thing is I'm now a MH3U fan and player.  It's a great game, but has such an obtuse learning curve.  And because people are long-time veterans of the series, there's a lot of snobbery for the newer players/fans of the series.  It's just because of the design of the game - the tutorials don't tell you how to craft weapons, take care of skills, and decorations.  It's very obtuse - but the action is worth it.

5)  *Kingdom Hearts: * I dislike the fighting engine, and that's why I didn't get into it.  Plus it seems like a calculated move by people to enlarge fanbases of both Capcom and Disney.  Weird, but I like the keyblades and other things in them.

6)  *League of Legends:*  It is obtuse.  The learning curve is stupidly high, and people who play online are pretty much gurus.  What does that do?  Why does that do that?  What's my champion good at?  ARggggh!  Never mind.

7)  *WoW:*  I never got into MMORPGs (except for Conquer Online).  I really don't get the appeal of clicking to kill things, collecting things and getting better weapons and armours and doing it all over again.  At least MH has you engaged in the action!


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## Taleweaver (May 12, 2013)

*Assassin's Creed 3 (wiiu edition)*​​*What I liked:*​* an open world with plenty of things to do, side missions and stuff like that​* beautiful graphics and sounds​* some of the (side) missions are pretty fun. Naval missions and taking forts in particular​​*What I'm neutral about:*​* the setting. I don't know anything of American history, so aside from Benjamin Franklin and that Washington guy, I don't know if something or someone is supposed to be accurate or fictional.​​*What I disliked:*​* everything outside the animus is just a mess. There's this evil company, some ghost that talks to you, the world is going to end and more of that stuff that's just irrelevant. Perhaps it's because I haven't played the previous games, but even then...that today's world just breaks the flow. And for what? A couple fetch quests and a bunch of unskippable cutscènes.​* the first couple hours are basically tutorials for things you won't even need later in the game. Everything before Connor leaves his village is just filler.​* there's no upgrading your character, and hardly any better weapon than your starting weapon. While by itself it isn't that hard, it has this strange side effect that all the side missions have rewards that are basically useless. In fact, money itself is pretty useless (the only thing that actually costs anything over your budget are boat additions...and those missions are optional).​* full crashes. I had about a dozen of them, at random times (mostly while loading the game).And yes, I'm on the latest patch and latest firmware. I even have the game on the wiiu drive, so it's nothing with the disk.​* special mention: the whole assassin guild and the merchant menu...what's all that about? You can liberate entire provinces with the former, but it beats me what it does. And the latter...the game constantly floods you with recipes, extra items, extra things your men can do...that SERVE NO PURPOSE. At the end, I just bought all the items, invented/crafted everything possible and (after finally discovering how to create a convoy) sold everything to whomever wanted it. Result: I had EVEN MORE money I had no purpose for. Perhaps the most painful of this was that amidst the dozens - if not hundreds - of useless junk, there was actually a weapon that was better than what I've used for pretty much the entire game. But by the time I found that out, I had no more missions left where I actually needed it.​* the dialog writers (and voice actors) were obviously paid per word. God damnit...the templars and the assassins both think they're right. We get it! But no...every time you kill someone, there's this long ass drama about the dying guy going "hah! I may be dead but I'm STILL right!". At which point your guy goes all "that may be true, but you are still wrong because you did <some action>". After which "Yeah, but we did it for the greater good.". To which...ah, to hell with it. You could write an entire soap opera out of it. And it's not pretty believable if you killed said bloke while still being surrounded by a dozen other guys who want to kill you. I guess they just wait their turn.​* controls. While holding down the 'run' key, you also climb into trees or onto buildings. Result: more often than not, you accidentally climb into everything nearby.​* what's with those guards on the roofs? Why are you suddenly a suspect if you go up there? In fact...it happened quite often that suddenly a whole bunch of guys started chasing me, even though I was "incognito".​* some obligatory missions are...not my cup of tea. Pretty much anything that has the objective "remain undetected", to name one. There was this ship mission near the end that had me just going trial-and-error in the end, because those guards could spot me half the world away.​* the end in itself. As mentioned earlier: I don't know what that stuff outside the animus is supposed to be about, but even the final missions are sloppy. It's like the devs said "okay, guys...we're starting to run out of budget. Make it a mission where you have to actually catch the villain now.". And, technically speaking, that's still the second to last mission. The last mission within the animus consists just of "walk to a bar. Slowly. Then sit through a cutscene.". I wish I was kidding.​​


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## Black-Ice (May 12, 2013)

Sagat said:


> I agree with ilman on League of Legends. The games learning curve is very steep, practically a 90 degree angle. If you mess up once in a game your team gets pissed and you get flamed and shit on. I don't understand why people love this game, why not play Star Craft if you think you're skilled in RTS games?


League is a game best played with friends, or with the ability to take shit.
If you get offended easy, not for you. The players are serious, we all love the game. Its passion brah





2ndApex said:


> Mechanics are meh but the grind/pay to win mechanics make it the dead joke of the competitive gaming community. The community is absolute shit and the fact that it's the most played and sponsored game right now is insult to the injury. $15+ for character skins and username changes? It's like a fucking iOS game in disguise.


You're an example of someone who gets mad easy, didnt take time to learn the game and probably plays CoD


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## Ethevion (May 14, 2013)

Black-Ice said:


> League is a game best played with friends, or with the ability to take shit.
> If you get offended easy, not for you. The players are serious, we all love the game. Its passion brah


 
When I used to play it was either against bots or non ranked matches. If it was ranked, I'd understand the anger, but it wasn't.


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## Joe88 (May 14, 2013)

I love how you assume anyone who doesnt like lol is a typical cod player


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## raulpica (May 14, 2013)

What's happening to you, Black-Ice? You were cool 

Anyway, off-topic/rageness removed.


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## ComeTurismO (May 14, 2013)

I'd talk about CoD. I'm sick and tired of it now. I loved the franchise, but after playing MW2 for a while, I got pretty bored of it. I always got killstreaks, and etc, but when Black Ops came out, I loved Zombies, and I played that for a while, but got tired of it. But whenever MW3 came along, I didn't like it since it was the same thing. But whenever Black Ops 2, no don't have it. I only prefer online playing, no stories, or shit.
I also don't like Skyrim. It's just weird, and I don't get it, don't get the story when I play it.


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## nukeboy95 (May 14, 2013)

<snip>

on topic call of duty it just a reskin every year


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## astrangeone (May 15, 2013)

RodrigoDavy said:


> Just to clarify, when I say video games have impact on people's opinion, I'm not thinking people will become mass murderer. I do worry though about a more long-term influence, for example, in my country many people make jokes about black people here and while some people consider it innocent, they are actually a way to hide discrimination against black people here, which is not tolerated by law, by the media and by great part of the people here.
> 
> My opinion is that some topics should be discussed with some kind of caution and I admit I am harsh with things that touch on these topics. But it's not that I don't like the game because of that, I just find it boring actually


 
Actually, I agree with you.  There are a lot of racist jokes/memes out there, and it's considered funny by some people.  Discrimination comes in all forms, and making those comments about a certain minority comes off as a way to voice those feelings/racism in a different manner.  (It's like GTA making fun of the lbgta community, and poking fun at people like that - mostly people who are lbgta in GTA come off as twisted, sick or perverted.)  I don't mind playing GTA in small doses, but most of the time, it's like...why bother?  (It's mostly escape for me.)


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## Gahars (May 15, 2013)

astrangeone said:


> It's like GTA making fun of the lbgta community, and poking fun at people like that - mostly people who are lbgta in GTA come off as twisted, sick or perverted.


 
But just about everyone in the franchise gets that treatment. The America of GTA is portrayed as a crumbling empire populated (for the most part) by idiots, criminals, or some combination of the two. Besides the main characters, for the most part, its inhabitants are twisted caricatures of people. 

Plus, the games even mock "family values", anti-gay types far more viciously than any other group.

Not to mention, the franchise has its fair share of gay characters that are shown in a fairly positive light. Florian's camp, sure, but it's also clear that playing it up is a part of his coping mechanism for the horrors he's live through, and he's the only person from Niko's squad who was able to distance himself from his past and put the violence behind him. Gay Tony serves as a father figure to Luis, and he's consistently shown to be a competent, intelligent businessman (his drug problem notwithstanding).

It seems like you're looking for persecution and malice that just isn't there. It's like getting mad at South Park - there are no sacred cows. Everyone's a target and everyone gets their lumps.


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## astrangeone (May 15, 2013)

Gahars said:


> But just about everyone in the franchise gets that treatment. The America of GTA is portrayed as a crumbling empire populated (for the most part) by idiots, criminals, or some combination of the two. Besides the main characters, for the most part, its inhabitants are twisted caricatures of people.
> 
> Plus, the games even mock "family values", anti-gay types far more viciously than any other group.
> 
> ...



I'm not mad at GTA, I'm just slightly perplexed by it.  You are right, GTA portrays America like a free for all with everyone being a "durrrrrh, I'm an idiot", criminal elements, or just distasteful apathetic human beings.  It's a great game for stress relief - you kill dumb people by the dozens and it's satisfying because of the way they are portrayed - as hateful, idiotic people.  The main characters are usually portrayed as someone who is just trying to get ahead in life, especially in a corrupt world - they are kind of heroes in that sense.  I'm just perplexed at why the games and the series is so popular - it's a really dark and twisted world, and maybe some players get a thrill by doing illegal things in the game?

  I feel the game "The Ballad of Gay Tony" was a response by Rockstar to try to offset some of the distasteful atmosphere by the rest of the games.  Criminal organizations usually don't like gay or lesbian individuals because they sprung out of old-world values.  Look at the Yakuza or the Mafia, or even the Triad.  Huge organizations that came about because of values of loyalty, obedience and "killer instinct".

I like the series enough to own two copies of it.  The original GTA and GTA Chinatown Wars.  It's just that I spend more time on games that aren't as dark and twisted as this one.  I have to be in a really dark mood or cynical mood to be wanting to play GTA to completion.


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## Gahars (May 15, 2013)

astrangeone said:


> I'm just perplexed at why the games and the series is so popular - it's a really dark and twisted world, and maybe some players get a thrill by doing illegal things in the game?


 
Beyond the well made campaigns, causing havoc and chaos is a great way to release and vent stress. Sometimes it's just fun to hop in a tank and tear down main street, crushing everything in your path. Sometimes it's fun to race around the city at blistering speeds. The series gives you a lot of freedom to do with the world as you please - people appreciate that.

That's why the games present a twisted, crapsack world just close enough to our own to be recognizable. The casual crimes and sprees would be horrific in a realistic environment populated by sympathetic people.



astrangeone said:


> Criminal organizations usually don't like gay or lesbian individuals because they sprung out of old-world values. Look at the Yakuza or the Mafia, or even the Triad. Huge organizations that came about because of values of loyalty, obedience and "killer instinct".


 
...Hence the nickname "Gay Tony" - he's an outlier, an exception, and he's branded for it by others. The game makes no qualms about this fact.


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## Deleted member 473940 (May 15, 2013)

Am I gonna die if I mention this?

Portal 1 and 2: never really got into it. The puzzles and what not.. isnt it annoying? The whole game to me has the same pace.. then again I never played the whole game cuz I got annoyed and bored. Never really into puzzles and anything like that.


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## Gahars (May 15, 2013)

ShawnTRods said:


> The puzzles and what not.. isnt it annoying?


 
It's a puzzle game. That's kind of the entire point.


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## Guild McCommunist (May 15, 2013)

ShawnTRods said:


> Portal 1 and 2: never really got into it. The puzzles and what not.. isnt it annoying? The whole game to me has the same pace.. then again I never played the whole game cuz I got annoyed and bored. Never really into puzzles and anything like that.


 
my sides

That's like saying "The platforming in Mario... Isn't that annoying?"


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## xist (May 16, 2013)

The Legend of Zelda - A Link to the Past

I'm well aware that this is a game that's sacrosanct to many, but as someone who has only experienced it in the last couple of years it's nothing special and doesn't hold up (even within it's own series). That's not to say that at the time of release it wouldn't have been amazing compared to it's competitors and that it offered an experience that was unusual and fun, but playing it for the first time today (after Minish Cap) it felt devoid of all the things that people rave about. It lacks a compelling narrative (don't say that it's because of the age of the game - Ys on the Master System had a great narrative), it features a relatively empty and boring world, and everything feels kind of repetitive after a while because it's dependent upon gameplay that has aged and varies only slightly. Where Minish Cap featured many of the same mechanics it managed to involve the player much more, and reduced the sense of repetition by varying things up more (as did the aforementioned Ys).

I've played precisely 3 Zelda games (Minish Cap, Lttp and Phantom Hourglass) and for me LttP really fails to ignite any passion that others cite. However, i DO understand that it's a game that many grew up with and it occupies a place in many peoples hearts as a formative gaming experience. That means it's hard to remain purely objective and not nostalgic. On it's own merits i don't feel it holds up for someone who doesn't have that nostalgia, especially when compared to other games that offer similar experiences.

I'll go get my armour plated box to hide in now...


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## Aeter (May 16, 2013)

RodrigoDavy said:


> The story started getting too complicated and the game has been showing traces of discrimination for quite some time, be it against females, homossexuals, black people, chinese, latinos and foreigners in general


Don't forget Elvis impersonators, gotta respect Elvis impersonators.


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## UltraHurricane (May 16, 2013)

can't really say anything about all the others, except maybe Kingdom Hearts

the first game was fantastic even if it was kinda weird, but yeah... the plot somehow started to make less sense with each new installment, like Gahars said it has one of the most convoluted plots in any piece of fiction. Seriously, does Square honestly expect kids (who are suppose to be the target audience btw) to have the patience to understand let alone comprehend the weird as hell pseudo-philosophy about hearts, darkness, nothingness or whatever other crap Nomura pulls out of his ass?

It use to be pretty cool to see Disney and Final Fantasy characters together... not sure *why* there together but it made for a neat premise but even that aspect of the series has fallen by the way side for animu melodrama with their own characters that just happened to be sprinkled with disney/FF cameos. I think the only thing the series has going for it is the gameplay and even then it goes into "press-A-for-seizure-inducing-hack-and-slash-acrobatics" most of the time


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## Aeter (May 16, 2013)

UltraHurricane said:


> can't really say anything about all the others, except maybe Kingdom Hearts


It can be about any popular game that you do not like, why can't people read?!


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## Nah3DS (May 16, 2013)

Tetris - gravity sucks


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## DS1 (May 16, 2013)

xist said:


> The Legend of Zelda - A Link to the Past
> .


 
I think the same can be said for a lot of "amazing/innovative at the time, but just nostalgia trap now" games. I don't even think criticizing LTTP is controversial anymore, but touch Ocarina of Time and you're asking for a shitstorm. There is, however, something to be said about the amazing narrative laid out by the opening sequences of LTTP, but sadly the rest of the game does not follow up as well (maybe a little bit after the Dark/Mirror World or whatever).

Personally, my pick is the Zelda series as a whole. I have played (not to completion / more than 7 hours of each): Link to the Past, Oracle of Seasons, Spirit Tracks, Phantom Hourglass, and Majora's Mask, and (to completion) Link's Awakening and Ocarina of Time.

The Good: Structured gameplay - uncover dungeons, get the treasure-of-the-week, complete puzzles based on treasure, fight boss (often based on treasure), twitchy action gameplay, vast world with lots of little secrets to discover (though mostly health/item bonuses).

The Bad: Repetitive puzzles, many sokoban-type puzzles, managing prickly little enemies while dealing with said boring puzzles, too many "one-time" treasures coupled with a clunky interface (haven't played the newer (?) games, but the older ones let you equip like 3 items at a time tops?). By 'one-time' treasure I mean those big treasures that you acquire through tough puzzles or a mini-boss fight, only to use it once or twice in the game. A better game would incorporate these items into multiple puzzles, but the Zelda titles usually stick to boomerang/hookshot (arrows)/bomb while other treasures are just 'metroid-vania' style power increases (now you can smash bigger rocks!) or go unused after the dungeon you found them in is completed.

My Gripes:

-Besides the aforementioned treasure thing, the repetitive style of play, while comfortably formulaic, leaves me dead bored after the first five dungeons or so (not-quite half the game, but my god, you should have hooked me by that point). My hype level seriously goes from, "Oh man, this is fun, solid, manageable gameplay!) to "This is a complete waist of time, I have more fun seeing a tiny level increase in a JRPG than I do playing through another goddamn sokoban puzzle" in the span of a few dungeons.

-While minor Metroid-vania exploration is required (oh sweet, I can walk on water now!) to get a lot of the health and item upgrades, serious backtracking (despite the game-world itself being non-linear...) is only really done once per game: during the big item trade-off. This is an event that happens once per Zelda game, where you must trade one pointless item at a time to several different NPCs scattered throughout the world, until one finally coughs up the ultimate dungeon key (or whatever the prize happens to be in that particular game).

The Zelda games aren't bad, per se, and I acknowledge the brilliant things each one has done (LTTP and OOT: subtle narrative, OOT: horse-riding/deep 3D world, Awakening: console experience on a frankly ancient handheld), but all the energy people put into holding up the series as some kind of shining beacon as to what makes a solid fantasy/action/adventure game is ridiculous. It's also become synonymous with poseur gamers - I love poseurs, and I love gamers (sort-of..), but my god, keep your ironic hipster Zelda shirts away from me.

It's kind of sad that after over 20 years of advances in gaming and constant retooling of the series, it is completely blown out of the water by the unabashed copycat Okami. Okami's battles had depth, and in turn, they kept those battles far far away from its puzzles which, while not difficult, were visually spectacular. You feel like a kid in a candy store any time you do ANYTHING in Okami, while the fanfare of grabbing a heart piece in Zelda remains the same mediocre affair that it did two decades ago. Okami would surely suffer the same fate had it gotten a proper sequel, but for a Zelda clone, the original sure as hell kept my attention from beginning to end.


----------------------

To the topic creator's original analysis of Monster Hunter: I know many people who enjoy the game, and all of them play multiplayer. If you have to play alone, that is reason enough to ignore the series. When you think of all the possibilities of playing with a team (trapping monsters, tracking them through different quadrants, teaming up, boxing them in, utilizing traps effectively), it's a wonder why there are solo players at all.


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## ggyo (May 16, 2013)

Sagat said:


> MGS: People possibly don't understand what's going on in the game.
> Pokemon: Complainers are adults who don't want to admit that they like Pokemonz in front of their friends or on forums. In reality, they're dying to get their hands on the latest game.
> Monster Hunter: Never played it
> Kingdom Hearts: They have like 50 games and they really need to end it.
> CoD single player: It's CoD, people who hate it, hate it. People who like it, like it.


I co-sign everything here.

MGS: I couldn't really enjoy the stories of the games until post-grade 10 history class. Then I was mad in love with all the plotlines.

Pokemon: I do this all the time. I hate the game in public, adore the game in my bedroom, and shun the game on line (see PokemonXY thread).

Monster Hunter: Okay, I was reluctant to play the games until about 4-5 years ago. All I ever saw were raptors n shit on the cases, and I thought it was some geeky dinosaur game. I was really impatient with the slow start of Tri (my first MH game), and really frustrated with the difficulty of the Great Jaggi, and then I realized the point of battles was about not getting hit instead of slashing your foe up at every second. Now I'm HR 50-some, have full Alat armour... and a game that doesn't have an online server anymore.

Kingdom Hearts: These games are mediocre... I don't understand their appeal and would love it if someone explained it to me. I tried 358/2, BBS, 1, 2, and they're all so inaccessible (besides 1), and they all have terrible plots, terrible characters, terrible voice acting, boring and repetitious hack-n-slash combat, etc. I always felt that the only people who could enjoy them are people who can't stand a challenge and enjoy playing through a game with the button X.

CoD: I'm indifferent to it. The people who hate it, are really mad at it's wide influence and popularity, not the game itself. People who like it... have a reason.


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## Joe88 (May 16, 2013)

pokemon
just recycling the same game over and over again
new trainer starts out on his journey, has a rival he/she faces throughout the game, encounters some bad guys who steal pokemon and single handily takes them down and continues on his way to beat the pokemon league
add insult to injury by releasing 2 versions of the exact same game and only a few different pokemon in each game so people will have to buy both to "catch em all", then a year or 2 later release the same game again this time with minor updates
rinse and repeat

cod
I cant tell any of them apart since mw1
first had good mp and all but when you rehash the same game 5 (an now a 6th) times just for a quick cash in?

monster hunter
granted this is really only popular in japan and has a small following everywhere else
the controls are clunkly and horrible, I fail to see the appeal in it


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## xist (May 16, 2013)

DS1 said:


> Okami would surely suffer the same fate had it gotten a proper sequel, but for a Zelda clone, the original sure as hell kept my attention from beginning to end.


 
Now i enjoyed Okami too, from the characters, the artistry, the setting, story and gameplay mechanics (played on a PS2) but i do have to say that it failed miserably at keeping my attention. And for a game that's generally fun how can that be possible? In Okami's case i think it dragged on for about 10-15 hours too long. It just became ridiculous...and i'm a fan of long RPG's, but for Okami blew it's load and didn't manage to hold my attention because in the last (long) stretch it felt like a slog.


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## beta4attack (May 16, 2013)

ggyo said:


> Kingdom Hearts: These games are mediocre... I don't understand their appeal and would love it if someone explained it to me. I tried 358/2, BBS, 1, 2, and they're all so inaccessible (besides 1), and they all have terrible plots, terrible characters, terrible voice acting, boring and repetitious hack-n-slash combat, etc. I always felt that the only people who could enjoy them are people who can't stand a challenge and enjoy playing through a game with the button X.


Umm no? That's not true at the slightest. I really like KH games to the point it's one of my favorite franchises as, in my opinion, it has an interesting plot and I like some of the characters. KH is either a hit or miss, but that doesn't mean people who play it aren't open for challenge. Not to mention, it's just a bit fast-based compared to other RPGs I played so it's something quite fun for me. I've tackled MH, for example, even when people say it needs patience and time to master it and its controls, and I did. Saying people lack the feeling of challenge because they play certain games is irrelevant.


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## Guild McCommunist (May 16, 2013)

I thought Kingdom Hearts was rather shit and follows the trend of some JRPGs where they confuse "complexity" in plot with "convolution" in plot. See FFX for example.

Also the aesthetic was annoying and it fell into an awkward middleground of trying to keep a "younger" appeal and an "older" appeal. So it ends up being a dark game with random poorly written slapstick. Tonally the game is an absolute mess.

I also just found the gameplay to be rather simplistic and boring.

The "mash up" between the two universes ends up being entirely useless. Like there's no explanation on why Final Fantasy characters are there, they just are there and have little relevance to the whole scheme of the game. It's literally just fanservice because games with Final Fantasy stapled onto it sell. It's not like an actual crossover game like Marvel vs. Capcom where the whole draw is seeing two franchises in full force together, it's kinda like a Disney game but randomly you see Squall (also seriously, out of every Final Fantasy characters, you chose fucking Squall?) walking across the background.


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## xist (May 16, 2013)

I think i'm playing Kingdom Hearts wrong. Whilst there are all these melodramatic and overarching themes of a nefarious organisation and a group of evil? (Not sure that's right but i'll go with it) individuals i've always just seen Kingdom Hearts as a tale of friendship and love triumphing over adversity. All the crazy somewhat poorly thought out stuff is just there in the background behind the journeys of young people going on a voyage of discovery.

Maybe i've been over sentimental (or under analysing) but i see Kingdom Hearts games primarily as a bond of friendship rather than a complex tale of intrigue.


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## DS1 (May 16, 2013)

xist said:


> Now i enjoyed Okami too, from the characters, the artistry, the setting, story and gameplay mechanics (played on a PS2) but i do have to say that it failed miserably at keeping my attention. And for a game that's generally fun how can that be possible? In Okami's case i think it dragged on for about 10-15 hours too long. It just became ridiculous...and i'm a fan of long RPG's, but for Okami blew it's load and didn't manage to hold my attention because in the last (long) stretch it felt like a slog.


 
I feel that, I certainly thought it was going to end before it did, but I stuck it out anyway. Seems not every Zelda-like can break the tedium curse.

RE Kingdom Hearts: While I thought the original was great (if long-winded in the end with nonsense battles against invisible enemies that took forever despite being easy), the story itself has spun way out of control. It used to be so straight forward, but, in true Japanese shounen manga (think DBZ) style, they just had to tack on a bunch of dumb enemies, orginizations,  sequels, prequels and open plotholes to draw out into a series what should have been a single-entry title.


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## ggyo (May 17, 2013)

beta4attack said:


> Umm no? That's not true at the slightest. I really like KH games to the point it's one of my favorite franchises as, in my opinion, it has an interesting plot and I like some of the characters. KH is either a hit or miss, but that doesn't mean people who play it aren't open for challenge. Not to mention, it's just a bit fast-based compared to other RPGs I played so it's something quite fun for me. I've tackled MH, for example, even when people say it needs patience and time to master it and its controls, and I did. Saying people lack the feeling of challenge because they play certain games is irrelevant.


 Instead of saying it's not true, TELL ME WHY PLEASE. KH is the style of game I really enjoy, but the experience is so shallow right from the start that I never continue with the game, because I don't expect anything deeper.

Is the story NOT complicated?
Can you NOT complete just about every battle with simple hack-n-slashing?
Is there even a world to explore, or is it constant "stages" of limited thought-invested puzzles and tons of repetitive battles?
Does the music captivate you?
Are the characters NOT over dramatic? Do they even rarely display non-basic emotions outside of anger, happiness or sadness?
Does the voice acting NOT suck?

I really can't see a reason to like the game.

Every RPG is based around the story (and characters), the gameplay (and battling), and the world (and exploration), and every video game is based around visual and audible appeal.
As an RPG, the story is notoriously bad post-KH1, the gameplay is repetitious pseudo-platform hack-n-slash battling, and the world is quite literally as interesting as a Disney world( which is fine for children, if that was the target audience) and there isn't a big world with towns and people to explore (to my understanding. I have never gotten deep into a KH game). It's all stages.
As a video game, the graphics are typical of a JRPG, not gorgeous, and nothing special (but of course it hasn't met current generation consoles yet), and the music is alright. I'm a fan of the J-Pop themes, but everything else is just generic JRPG music.

There. I broke it down to a SCIENCE (and no, science doesn't exclusively mean biology, chemistry, physics, etc. I'm talking about deeper understanding). I don't want to dictate my LIMITED EXPERIENCE with the games as facts, so please tell me if I'm wrong.

Out of precaution; this is not a personal attack on your ego. Don't project your emotions at me because you disagree.


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## Yepi69 (May 17, 2013)




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## nachoscool (May 17, 2013)

Okay this looks like fun.

Metal Gear Solid: I'm a huge Metal Gear fan having played all of them but 4 because I don't have a PS3. People should play Metal Gear not for the story but for the experiences you will go through playing it.

Pokemon: Having played all the Pokes I can safely say that its addictive as shit. In my opinion the only reason why people hate on the games is because they find them too childish to play in public and are afraid they will get ridiculed.

Kingdom Hearts: Never played them. It's fanfic tier shit that I have no interest in playing. I do see the appeal however.

Monster Hunter: I have 3 on the Wii and spent like 100 playing it. It was mostly grinding and I loved every minute of it.

Cowaduty: It's shit.


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## astrangeone (May 17, 2013)

nachoscool said:


> Okay this looks like fun.
> 
> Metal Gear Solid: I'm a huge Metal Gear fan having played all of them but 4 because I don't have a PS3. People should play Metal Gear not for the story but for the experiences you will go through playing it.
> 
> ...



I so agree with the analysis of KH.  I will never, in a million years find it find.  Plus, the game side of things really pisses me off.  (The fighting with cards things.)


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## beta4attack (May 17, 2013)

ggyo said:


> Instead of saying it's not true, TELL ME WHY PLEASE. KH is the style of game I really enjoy, but the experience is so shallow right from the start that I never continue with the game, because I don't expect anything deeper.
> 
> Is the story NOT complicated?
> Can you NOT complete just about every battle with simple hack-n-slashing?
> ...


The story is complicated, yes, but that's the beauty of it for us fans of the series, we continue to analyse the story bit by bit with each other, try to uncover its secrets and we go crazy predicting what will happen next, it's all about having fun. The world is not huge I admit that, but it's constantly getting bigger by the games. Yes, several music pieces do that and they're very memorable, at least to me, some are happy-go-round, sad violin and others epic themes. The voice for some characters, sure, but most of the characters have good voice-acting, a lot other JRPGs have worse, really.

The story, in my opinion, is not "notoriously bad" as you say after KH I, sure they extended the story, but they added other characters that are supremely memorable and each with a distinct personality. Organization XIII? Master Xehanort? All those are awesome characters that added to the first story and given back-story to several unexplained things in KH I. And as for the gameplay, the hack and slash is a lot, I admit, but you can't go around hacking and slashing your way to the end of the game, some requires actual timing, memorizing the move patterns of the enemy and using defensive methods, it's not all just mindless slashing, just try Xemnas' boss fight in KH3D, for example. And how fast-paced it is makes the game actually fun, at least for me. And Nomura (the creator of KH) specifically that this game is NOT for children as a lot of people were saying that.
But in the end, neither am I nor you are wrong, it's just a matter of opinion, really.


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## RodrigoDavy (May 17, 2013)

nachoscool said:


> Pokemon: Having played all the Pokes I can safely say that its addictive as shit. In my opinion the only reason why people hate on the games is because they find them too childish to play in public and are afraid they will get ridiculed.


Why people might hate pokémon:

- Slow gameplay
- You spend 90% of the game pressing A
- The story of the game has been more or less the same for years
- The game hasn't changed much, the difference between games is not big
- Too much titles and remakes released
- Pokémon fans tend to be annoying, generally hyped for the next releases and heavily overstating the game's qualities without accepting that it also has flaws
- Last but not least, it's the pokémon fans fault that the series is stagnated, since you'll buy whatever shit that has the pokémon name instead of demanding quality and, thus, leading to developers not wanting to innovate but instead always do more of the same with the next pokémon games

There! I said it!


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## chavosaur (May 17, 2013)

Earthbound. 
I have played every single game, just ATTEMPTING to get into it, but I just can't. 
I understand the concept and its uniqueness of being based in the US and all that, but it just plays like any other RPG. There really isn't a LOT that sets it apart from your average RPG. 
I can understand how it must have been unique for its time, but trying to get into it nowadays just isn't easy.


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## RodrigoDavy (May 18, 2013)

chavosaur said:


> Earthbound.
> I have played every single game, just ATTEMPTING to get into it, but I just can't.
> I understand the concept and its uniqueness of being based in the US and all that, but it just plays like any other RPG. There really isn't a LOT that sets it apart from your average RPG.
> I can understand how it must have been unique for its time, but trying to get into it nowadays just isn't easy.


Earthbound certainly has style but it's hard to get into. Hell, I've tried beating Mother 1 in the NES version and later in the GBA version but the battle system is very annoying. I also tried beating Mother 2 (Earthbound) but it would get to the point where the game became so difficult, maybe it was the anti-piracy protection working.
Unfortunately, classic RPGs tend to have the issue that they priorizes the time a player spend in the game rather than the player's skills.


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## xwatchmanx (May 18, 2013)

RodrigoDavy said:


> I also tried beating Mother 2 (Earthbound) but it would get to the point where the game became so difficult, maybe it was the anti-piracy protection working.


I remember reading somewhere that Earthbound/Mother2 does have a form of anti-piracy measures that make the game get ridiculously harder at certain points. But modern SNES emulators are so much more accurate than back in the day, that that shouldn't be happening to you, if I'm not mistaken...


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## Camplord (May 18, 2013)

astrangeone said:


> I so agree with the analysis of KH. I will never, in a million years find it find. Plus, the game side of things really pisses me off. (The fighting with cards things.)


 
Ironically the game with the "card system" namely KH: Chain of memories for the GBA was my introduction to the series. Been a fan of the games ever since, the story is amazing, gameplay, etc.
Every game posted on this thread is awesome in its own sense.

Oh except Call of Duty. Bad in every sense.


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## xwatchmanx (May 18, 2013)

Camplord said:


> Oh except Call of Duty. Bad in every sense.


Why does everyone get this BS hypocritical idea that it's bad to judge any game as terrible, except for Call of Duty?

I mean, I don't care for Call of Duty either, and I especially don't care for the yearly releases (I have qualms about Assassin's Creed for the same reason). But having played very little, I'm not going to write it off as a terrible series just because hating CoD is the "in" thing for people on the internet to do.

Not attacking you in particular, I'm just saying.


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## ggyo (May 18, 2013)

RodrigoDavy said:


> JRPGs tend to have the issue that they prioritize the time a player spends in the game rather than the player's skills.


Edited*
I had a friend who had a big brother with a racist friend (bear with me), and he despised me. I was 12, and I was over at my friends house, playing guitar while his older brother and friend, who were 20, were playing FFX (they we're THE epitome of stereotypical video gamers. Pizza-faced slobs living in their mother's basement). His brother's friend said "Man, you suck at guitar." (he played guitar himself, but was less than average). So I played the solo to All Along the Watchtower - Jimi Hendrix perfectly, which I just learned an hour prior, and he went on hating, saying I sped up by "half a beat" and a plethora of other remarks. Then the brother cast some sort of summon, and the guy was like "Now THAT'S skill."

And I've hated turn-based JRPGs ever since.

And that's my story... if anyone cares.


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## Taleweaver (May 18, 2013)

ggyo said:


> ... So I played the solo to All Along the Watchtower - Jimi Hendrix perfectly, which I just learned an hour prior, and he went on hating, saying I sped up by "half a beat" and a plethora of other remarks. Then the brother cast some sort of summon, and the guy was like "Now THAT'S skill."


Ouch. I feel for you, man. 

This sort of thing is exactly the sort of mental image I get when a gamer brags about his "mad skillz". I mean...it's okay to be proud and fierce of yourself when you destroyed the evil fortress that was about to wipe out and then enslave the entire galaxy...but it's not like any of that really took place.


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## KingdomBlade (May 19, 2013)

Camplord said:


> Ironically the game with the "card system" namely KH: Chain of memories for the GBA was my introduction to the series. Been a fan of the games ever since, the story is amazing, gameplay, etc.
> Every game posted on this thread is awesome in its own sense.
> 
> Oh except Call of Duty. Bad in every sense.


 
Every sense? Graphically, it is absolutely not bad. The graphics are pretty damn good, and there's no disagreeing with that. If you do, you probably need to get your eyes checked. I mean, you could claim that the art style is muddy, but regardless, the way it's designed and the way that the models are developed is pretty damn impressive. Black Ops 2's story wasn't half bad either (not amazing, but I've seen worse.) Voice acting is decent. Multiplayer is really fun in certain games. So why in the world would you suppose that it's "bad in every sense?" I mean, it's not GOTY material, sure, but I don't think that anyone unbiased would regard any game as popular as that as "bad in every sense." Everyone's free to dislike it, but there's merit in virtually every popular game. There must be a reason why people like it, no?

Here are mine:
1. Monster Hunter Series - I could never get into how non-existent the lore or the story was or how slow and mind numbing combat was and I how long it took to grind. I mean, I thought graphics were good and the customization options were pretty decent, but it was virtually impossible for me to really like this series. It's found it really difficult to immerse myself into a world as detached from emotion as that one. I like my games to have something further from gameplay to take it into another place, which Monster Hunter did not have at all.
2. Golden Sun: Dark Dawn - Story-wise, I find it way less engaging than the previous two. The conversations seemed to drag on for hours, to the point that it was almost boring, and I do not like my Golden Sun games to be boring. Character development was weak. Combat and exploration were lackluster.
3. Animal Crossing (DS and Gamecube for now) - I just found it all phenomenally pointless and boring. Basically nothing happens. It's interesting sometimes, but I greatly prefer the tight bustle and the work and the character development of the Harvest Moon series. I recall playing this game because I couldn't sleep and I figured I would fall asleep while playing it. I was right.
4. Duck Hunt - Please just stop talking about this game as if it was some sort of retro god classic. To me, it really, really, really isn't. At all.
5. Call of Duty Series - Yeah, I still don't like it. Graphics are nice, multiplayer is great, but the game feels rehashed from the previous. It gets boring after a few of them.
6. Wii Play - Horrendous gameplay mechanics and irritating exploitation of pretty much the parts of the Wii that I like the least.
7. Super Mario RPG Series - I know that the mechanics and the story are meant to be more oriented to a younger market, but goddammit, after too many serious RPG's, I just could not wrap my head around the mechanics and the story. It's nice and upbeat, but personally, I dislike the series.

As for the remainder of the ones listed, which I actually like:
1. Metal Gear Solid - Phenomenal cinematics and amazing atmosphere.
2. Pokemon - While I wish they'd deviate for once, I find that the Pokemon games improve in mechanics with each installment. Besides, Pokemon is still one of my favorite games ever. I can't hate it. I don't hate the new Pokemon nearly as much as everyone else does.
3. Kingdom Hearts - Same reasoning as Pokemon, in the sense that I love it too much to hate it. That doesn't make sense, but yeah. I played it when I was around 6-8 and it was one of my favorite games for the PS2 at the time, and also the first console RPG I'd ever finished. It was incredible. I loved the fast-paced battle mechanics, the characters, and most especially, how strangely fascinating the way they implemented the Disney universe in. As a Disney kid, I won't deny that my view on the franchise is biased. But what I will say is that I still consider it's story one of the most involving I've ever played, so as long as you either love Disney or you just happen to get sucked in. It's convoluted, but as a fan, I like that it encourages speculation.

And a few that were also mentioned, which I will defend:
1. League of Legends - It hooks you in, and it's hella fun to play with friends. I got introduced to it by friends, and as someone who never particularly got into DoTa (though I wouldn't say I disliked it) it's a fantastic introduction to the genre thanks to the lower learning curve and the much more polished gameplay mechanics than DoTa.
2. GTA - I really like the series. I like the grittiness, I like the violence, I like the driving, and I like the way they manage to almost perfectly encapsulate wherever it is each game takes place. The environments are perfect. The story is sort of a grounds in which to show it off.


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## KingdomBlade (May 19, 2013)

- Double Posted -


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## Camplord (May 20, 2013)

KingdomBlade said:


> Every sense? Graphically, it is absolutely not bad. The graphics are pretty damn good, and there's no disagreeing with that. If you do, you probably need to get your eyes checked. I mean, you could claim that the art style is muddy, but regardless, the way it's designed and the way that the models are developed is pretty damn impressive. Black Ops 2's story wasn't half bad either (not amazing, but I've seen worse.) Voice acting is decent. Multiplayer is really fun in certain games. So why in the world would you suppose that it's "bad in every sense?" I mean, it's not GOTY material, sure, but I don't think that anyone unbiased would regard any game as popular as that as "bad in every sense." Everyone's free to dislike it, but there's merit in virtually every popular game. There must be a reason why people like it, no?
> 
> Here are mine:
> 1. Monster Hunter Series - I could never get into how non-existent the lore or the story was or how slow and mind numbing combat was and I how long it took to grind. I mean, I thought graphics were good and the customization options were pretty decent, but it was virtually impossible for me to really like this series. It's found it really difficult to immerse myself into a world as detached from emotion as that one. I like my games to have something further from gameplay to take it into another place, which Monster Hunter did not have at all.
> ...


 
I get your point on Call of Duty, i really do, but the repetitiveness on the game is what makes it so...unoriginal? Anyways like you said everyone has its own opinion so i wont argue.
I have to agree with you on Mario RPG series and League of Legends, they are freakin awesome .


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## narutofan777 (May 21, 2013)

bioshock infinite, i cant play for 10 minute b4 i get headaches.


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## Gahars (May 21, 2013)

narutofan777 said:


> bioshock infinite, i cant play for 10 minute b4 i get headaches.


 
Come now, it can't be that hard to understand.


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## Nah3DS (May 21, 2013)

*Metroid Prime*
It's like that popular kid in school that everyone likes, but you secretly hate.

My main gripe is how the game tells the "story" (if there is one). Your goal is unclear... even in Metroid II (a gameboy game) you know exactly what you have to do, and why you are doing it (destroy all the Metroids). In Prime... all I know is that I have to investigate Tallon IV... dunno why .
The narrative relies on scanning stuff, making you unveiling the "story" little by little, but most of the things you scan are uninteresting and irrelevant. The game puts 0 effort in making you care about what it has to say... scanning turns really tedious after a while. Actually... I prefer to sit back and watch a flashy and bad FMV (Other M), than stopping my exploration every 10 seconds to scan something. I know it's optional... but I kinda like to know why I'm doing what I'm doing.

Gameplay wise... it's a common problem that I have with most first person games, I feel like I'm floating. Usually that's not a issue with FPS, but in a game that has quite a few platforming sections, it feels really odd to me. I never felt comfortable controlling Samus, and in a game this long... that's a huge problem.

I have other complaints with this one... but this is getting long.

Overall... I find myself stopping after 30-40 minutes of playing because of boringness. I try again the next day, and the same happens. I'm forcing myself to play this game, hoping it gets fun, but it never does.

Hey Prime, I'm trying to like you... but I guess you don't like me.


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