# New Xbox Series X details show the console's specs, graphical capabilities, and the new controller



## JuanBaNaNa (Mar 16, 2020)




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## swabbo (Mar 16, 2020)

*"Memory Bandwidth* 10GB @ 560 GB/s, 6GB @ 336 GB/s"

Typo right?


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## Tom Bombadildo (Mar 16, 2020)

Quick Resume sounds like a really nice feature, basically a kind of save states for a modern console which is neat.


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## fluggy2003 (Mar 16, 2020)

... that 1TB internal aint gonna go far ...


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## Chary (Mar 16, 2020)

swabbo said:


> *"Memory Bandwidth* 10GB @ 560 GB/s, 6GB @ 336 GB/s"
> 
> Typo right?








It's taken straight from the site.


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## OkazakiTheOtaku (Mar 16, 2020)

Looks really good. I'm not an Xbox kinda guy but these cool features and specs will drive competition forward for the other consoles. I'm happy for Xbox fans as this looks really good.


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## Sonic Angel Knight (Mar 16, 2020)

Can it show me a reason to buy it?


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## PityOnU (Mar 16, 2020)

Looks like a really sturdy, well thought out design.

BTW, totally called it when I said this form factor was designed around cooling. Look at all that metal!


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## Chary (Mar 16, 2020)

If only it had exclusives. 

Don't get me wrong, I am absolutely loving the stuff Xbox is bringing to the table here, but if the PS5 comes even close, well...what's the point in getting an Xbox? The backwards compatibility is a huge draw for me, though, I suppose, given that the older games will perform better on the new system. I guess we'll just have to wait and see what Sony has to offer.


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## DANTENDO (Mar 16, 2020)

Sonic Angel Knight said:


> Can it show me a reason to buy it?


Look at all tht pretty black space you could use it to graffiti yr username


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## Silent_Gunner (Mar 16, 2020)

Chary said:


> If only it had exclusives.
> 
> Don't get me wrong, I am absolutely loving the stuff Xbox is bringing to the table here, but if the PS5 comes even close, well...what's the point in getting an Xbox? The backwards compatibility is a huge draw for me, though, I suppose, given that the older games will perform better on the new system. I guess we'll just have to wait and see what Sony has to offer.



You're forgetting whether this system and the Playstation 5 will even come out this year!


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## Sonic Angel Knight (Mar 16, 2020)

DANTENDO said:


> Look at all tht pretty black space you could use it to graffiti yr username


It looks like a heater, or a speaker bar.


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## Foxi4 (Mar 16, 2020)

A genuinely beautifully-designed motherboard - everything is sensible and where it should be. No funky shapes, no-nonsense. I would've preferred a standard NVMe bay on the back instead of weird cartridges, but other than that proprietary bit I like everything else.


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## Vi3trice (Mar 16, 2020)

swabbo said:


> *"Memory Bandwidth* 10GB @ 560 GB/s, 6GB @ 336 GB/s"
> 
> Typo right?



No, there is a lot that's put aside for the system.


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## Mikemk (Mar 16, 2020)

It's better in almost every way than my desktop... that's not supposed to happen


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## Foxi4 (Mar 16, 2020)

Vi3trice said:


> No, there is a lot that's put aside for the system.


Theoretically it's all shared memory, practically 10GB are GPU-optimised, 6GB is system memory, split into 2.5GB and 3.5GB for OS memory and game code respectively. A cost-saving measure, to be sure, but the sheer amount is more than enough to work with.


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## AlexMCS (Mar 16, 2020)

swabbo said:


> *"Memory Bandwidth* 10GB @ 560 GB/s, 6GB @ 336 GB/s"
> 
> Typo right?





Chary said:


> It's taken straight from the site.



the video also clarifies it @ around 6:30.
TOTAL Memory (the 16GB) includes the GPU memory.
ACTUAL Memory is pitifully low IMO: 6GB, 2.5GB reserved for the system, 3.5GB for the games.
The remaining 10GB are for GPU usage.

Edit: however, since it's unified memory, I suppose devs can allocate some of the 10GB for in-game usage as well.


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## Foxi4 (Mar 16, 2020)

AlexMCS said:


> the video also clarifies it @ around 6:30.
> TOTAL Memory (the 16GB) includes the GPU memory.
> ACTUAL Memory is pitifully low IMO: 6GB, 2.5GB reserved for the system, 3.5GB for the games.
> The remaining 10GB are for GPU usage.
> ...


Pretty much. If the developer wants to use the fast memory for game code, they can choose to do so, which is nice. It would be better if *all* of it was fast memory, but hey - a lot of tasks really don't need high frequency memory and in fact benefit from slower, low latency memory. I assume that was the thought process here, cost savings aside.


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## Jayro (Mar 16, 2020)

Zen 4 is almost out and it's not even a Zen 3 chip... I don't have very high hopes for this thing. It's already outdated by mid-range PC standards. I am glad however, that they opted to go with an NVMe SSD over a slower SATA3 SSD. (The XBOne and PS4 should have come with a SATA3 SSD as standard.)


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## Tom Bombadildo (Mar 16, 2020)

Jayro said:


> Zen 4 is almost out and it's not even a Zen 3 chip... I don't have very high hopes for this thing. It's already outdated by mid-range PC standards.


I think you're confused.

Zen 2 is Ryzen 3000, Zen 3 is Ryzen 4000. This is a Zen 2 SoC, AKA Ryzen 3000 based. Ryzen went Zen (1000 series), Zen+ (2000 series), Zen 2 (3000 series) Zen 3 (4000 series). 

Sure, Zen 3 is probably going to be better than Zen 2, it's not going to be a massive difference that would make this "outdated" in any sense.


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## Jayro (Mar 16, 2020)

Tom Bombadildo said:


> I think you're confused.
> 
> Zen 2 is Ryzen 3000, Zen 3 is Ryzen 4000. This is a Zen 2 SoC, AKA Ryzen 3000 based. Ryzen went Zen (1000 series), Zen+ (2000 series), Zen 2 (3000 series) Zen 3 (4000 series).
> 
> Sure, Zen 3 is probably going to be better than Zen 2, it's not going to be a massive difference that would make this "outdated" in any sense.


Ah, I was unaware of AMD's fucky naming scheme. Thanks for clearing that up.


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## Working_Goose (Mar 16, 2020)

hey Sony, you wanna finally show something about the new PS5?


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## shaunj66 (Mar 16, 2020)

Sounds like a beast and I'm glad we're finally getting a technical leap forward in terms of raw computing power. CPU's have been a limiting factor in game design for so long.

The proprietary expandable storage situation is going to be interesting in regards to costs. 1TB isn't going to go far (with a lot of recent games creeping into the 100GB range), so expansion will be essential for most users.

What we shouldn't forget however, is that the XBOX Series X is the "Pro" model and it's price will reflect that. I can't see the cheaper base/standard system having specs anywhere close to this.


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## JavaScribe (Mar 16, 2020)

Jayro said:


> Ah, I was unaware of AMD's ducky naming scheme. Thanks for clearing that up.


Also, the GPU. If I'm not mistaken, it seems to be at least on par with the 2080 Super.


shaunj66 said:


> I can't see the cheaper base/standard system having specs anywhere close to this.


This was posted while I was writing this, and accurately reflects the consequence of having the GPU power of a 2080 Super.


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## Deleted User (Mar 16, 2020)

While the specs in this thing are goddamn beastly compared to the One X, I'll probably hold out until they announce the cheaper Series S (if that's even what it's going to be called.) This just seems like it's going to be far too expensive for what I can afford


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## Trash_Bandatcoot (Mar 16, 2020)

Sonic Angel Knight said:


> Can it show me a reason to buy it?


OG XBOX backwards compatibility.


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## RyRyIV (Mar 16, 2020)

I really hope the next-gen optimization, and free upgrades for re-releases, becomes a standard thing. One of my biggest gripes about the current generation is how much I've spent on game remakes for last gen games. There's a lot to love about the Series X, but that's by far my favorite.


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## OkazakiTheOtaku (Mar 16, 2020)

shaunj66 said:


> The proprietary expandable storage situation is going to be interesting in regards to costs. 1TB isn't going to go far (with a lot of recent games creeping into the 100GB range), so expansion will be essential for most users.


I really can't see this proprietary expansion being the only extra storage option long-term. I really expect them to support USB 3.0 drives, with maybe an extra note about loading times being slower or something.


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## Edgarska (Mar 16, 2020)

So according to the specs its GPU will have almost 90% of the raw power of  an RTX 2080 ti.

Considering the Xbox One X's touted "6 TFlops" amounted to about GTX 1060 performance in real world usage , I wouldn't put much stock on it.


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## eyeliner (Mar 16, 2020)

It kind of reminds me of a UPS. Sturdy bastards they are.
Hope it does well.


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## Purple_Shyguy (Mar 16, 2020)

That gears one X to Xbox gif. Wow its.... More dark!

Also I prefer the One controller to this new one. 

Price??? $500? $600???


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## ChaosEternal (Mar 16, 2020)

Those specs are beastly! I hope they provide some real competition for Sony this time.


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## Yoguur8989 (Mar 16, 2020)

I really hope this means we can start getting information about the games coming out for it now. Right now, we only know about one (That I can think of). This console is going to have to have a solid launch line up if it wants to compete with the PS5 and it would be a real shame for MS to put all of their effort into the hardware to forget about the software. Even games that are crossgen that look significantly better/have exclusive content on the Xbox SX would be nice sell for me (etc The RTX Minecraft tech demo they have). Also I REALLY hope they aren't planning on reusing the Xbox One layout like they did in Austin Evan's video.


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## DinohScene (Mar 16, 2020)

Full compat, eh I'll replace me xboner with it.


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## TR_mahmutpek (Mar 16, 2020)

KERNEL EXPLOIT ETA WEN


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## Foxi4 (Mar 16, 2020)

Edgarska said:


> So according to the specs its GPU will have almost 90% of the raw power of  an RTX 2080 ti.
> 
> Considering the Xbox One X's touted "6 TFlops" amounted to about GTX 1060 performance in real world usage , I wouldn't put much stock on it.


The reason why the Xbox One X couldn't fully utilise its GPU was the fact that it was severely bottlenecked by its mobile-grade Jaguar CPU. This is no longer the case - the Series X runs on desktop-grade Zen 2.


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## Luca91 (Mar 16, 2020)

This is the first time that I comment a news, but OMG this is awesome!
I think that I'll preorder one as soon as it will be possile.



Sonic Angel Knight said:


> Can it show me a reason to buy it?



No kids on xbox live. I'm not able to play on PSN without getting mad at all those toxic kids.
EDIT: also gamepass!



Chary said:


> If only it had exclusives.



This is something that I hear almost everytime we speak of consoles. Am I the only one that doesn't care about exclusives? :/
I mean, what I'm looking for in a console, is to play some fun games on my chouch after a long working day, with a couple of beers


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## Goku1992A (Mar 16, 2020)

If I had to choose between Series X and PS5 I will stick to Xbox. Microsoft been so good to me with Gamepass and Gold. Sony had lacked really hard in those area.

But I'm skipping the next gen for a few years maybe 3 I have too much backlog from prior generations to play.


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## Kioku_Dreams (Mar 16, 2020)

"Custom" NVME: This means they soldered it... I don't know.. I just can't see an NVME M.2 drive being "custom"..


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## DANTENDO (Mar 16, 2020)

Luca91 said:


> This is something that I hear almost everytime we speak of consoles. Am I the only one that doesn't care about exclusives? :/
> I mean, what I'm looking for in a console, is to play some fun games on my chouch after a long working day, with a couple of beers


You are the only one and mayb you should stick to mobile gaming


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## Luca91 (Mar 16, 2020)

DANTENDO said:


> You are the only one and mayb you should stick to mobile gaming


Nah I hate microtransactions, but thanks for the offer 

EDIT: I have to admit that some mobile games are fun tho.


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## Foxi4 (Mar 16, 2020)

DANTENDO said:


> You are the only one and mayb you should stick to mobile gaming


He's not. I too don't go crazy over the "exclusive" label - that doesn't make a game "good", and exclusive games don't magically make poor value hardware "better". Exclusives are often used to push otherwise unimpressive hardware since "if you want to play X, you'll have to buy our machine anyway". I like good games and I want my hardware to be good value, adequate for the generation it represents. This seems to tick the latter box, and Halo Infinite will tick the former.


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## Luca91 (Mar 16, 2020)

Foxi4 said:


> I like good games and I want my hardware to be good value, adequate for the generation it represents.



That's exactly what I think.


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## digipimp75 (Mar 16, 2020)

Looks so beastly.   Can't decide if I wanna go with this or the PS5, or both?  F it.... both.


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## scroeffie1984 (Mar 16, 2020)

not worth the upgrade from xbox one x


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## Kioku_Dreams (Mar 16, 2020)

scroeffie1984 said:


> not worth the upgrade from xbox one x


Not sure if trolling or just that dense... Uhhhh

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------



Trash_Bandatcoot said:


> OG XBOX backwards compatibility.



To what extent? Have they showcased just how compatible it is? Saying "fully compatible with previous gen Xbox systems" seems like it would cover it, right? I don't think so. If it's compatible with the entire library? I may pick one up just for that.


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## Tom Bombadildo (Mar 16, 2020)

Memoir said:


> Not sure if trolling or just that dense... Uhhhh
> 
> --------------------- MERGED ---------------------------
> 
> ...


From what I understand, it's the exact same backwards compatibility that the current Xbox One has, it's not going to include the entire XBOX/360 lineup that you would expect. 

...at least, at launch anyways. I assume, just like the Xbox One, they'll continue adding new games that are backwards compatible to the list as they work out repacking the games/getting proper licenses for them.


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## Foxi4 (Mar 16, 2020)

Tom Bombadildo said:


> From what I understand, it's the exact same backwards compatibility that the current Xbox One has, it's not going to include the entire XBOX/360 lineup that you would expect.
> 
> ...at least, at launch anyways. I assume, just like the Xbox One, they'll continue adding new games that are backwards compatible to the list as they work out repacking the games/getting proper licenses for them.


They got it to a point where the original developer doesn't have to adjust the code in any way, they just need to say yay or nay, which is pretty damn good. I hope it will result in extended BC, I sure like the idea of an Xbox that can go all the way back if needs be.


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## shaunj66 (Mar 16, 2020)

OkazakiTheOtaku said:


> I really can't see this proprietary expansion being the only extra storage option long-term. I really expect them to support USB 3.0 drives, with maybe an extra note about loading times being slower or something.


It's been confirmed that for Xbox Series X games you'll need to use the internal SSD or an expansion card.


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## pedro702 (Mar 16, 2020)

Trash_Bandatcoot said:


> OG XBOX backwards compatibility.


you mean very limited  ogxbox and xbox360 compatibility right?

because im guessing they will continue the xbone compat list but then again most games arent even on the list, this will only be 100% compatible with xbox one games and very limited original and 360, microsoft always does half assed compatibilities sadly like 360 and ogxbox.


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## Silent_Gunner (Mar 16, 2020)

Foxi4 said:


> A genuinely beautifully-designed motherboard - everything is sensible and where it should be. No funky shapes, no-nonsense. I would've preferred a standard NVMe bay on the back instead of weird cartridges, but other than that proprietary bit I like everything else.



Proprietary cartridges!?


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## pedro702 (Mar 16, 2020)

Silent_Gunner said:


> Proprietary cartridges!?



yeah like the vita proprietary sd cards and psp, sony likes proprietary memory stuff which cost 3 times the normal price per gb.


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## Godofcheese (Mar 16, 2020)

So the NVME is most likely soldered to the board because they use "CUSTOM" when describing it
and the expansion cards must be proprietary.

What is that smell?
Oh, it's what killed the VITA

Hopefully I'm wrong with this, currently watching the Digital Foundry video to see if they ever mention this.


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## Deleted User (Mar 16, 2020)

I'm not worried about exclusives, as long as it has games I want to play, a good user experience and hardware which enables those things.

From my knowledge as a PC builder, they've got the third thing down and from my knowledge as someone whose owned every 6, 7 and 8 gen console, I expect the best user experience from Microsoft. I'm not feeling confident about games after the Xbox One though.

There are some good multiplats which came out after I sold my One that I've been skipping because Valve owes me money and Sony well, read my signature. I would've bought another Xbox One but I built up a backlog of Switch games to play and then I didn't want to waste money on a One when this is around the corner.

Not as many games I want as PS4/5, but I don't have time for all of them anyway, so this will make a good multiplat box for me.

I like the design of the nvme memory cards. Easy to swap out, store and carry. I don't think nvme in this form factor already existed, so unlike the Vita I think this is a necessary innovation. Hope they push it into a new standard and not just proprietary, because I think there's a wider market for something like this.


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## Owenge (Mar 16, 2020)

Welcome to 2018 xbox, you're going to love it


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## Foxi4 (Mar 16, 2020)

Snugglevixen said:


> I'm not worried about exclusives, as long as it has games I want to play, a good user experience and hardware which enables those things.
> 
> From my knowledge as a PC builder, they've got the third thing down and from my knowledge as someone whose owned every 6, 7 and 8 gen console, I expect the best user experience from Microsoft. I'm not feeling confident about games after the Xbox One though.
> 
> ...


Well, you'll be happy to know that NVMe does come in a portable flavour - we reviewed one such NVMe enclosure not so long ago:

https://gbatemp.net/review/helix-dura-portable-nvme-ssd.1315/

But yes, no swappable cartridges, although admittedly the cartridge nature of it reminds me of removable HDD bays from the 90's. I mean, does it *really* have to be hot swappable? I guess it's handy if you're going to a friend's house with your games, but still.


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## sonicvssilver22 (Mar 16, 2020)

I hope more developers make use of the backwards compatibility. My old man recently brought home an Xbox One X out of nowhere for some reason, and although I wasn't really interested in playing any of its exclusives I was interested in using it to play a few OG Xbox games (namely Fatal Frame Special Edition and Fatal Frame II Director's Cut). Until I realized that the backwards compatible library was painfully small and didn't include these games.


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## Ampersound (Mar 16, 2020)

Well it's really just a brick this time. Nice specs but a brick nonetheless.


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## Jayro (Mar 16, 2020)

RyRyIV said:


> I really hope the next-gen optimization, and free upgrades for re-releases, becomes a standard thing. One of my biggest gripes about the current generation is how much I've spent on game remakes for last gen games. There's a lot to love about the Series X, but that's by far my favorite.


I hope they focus more on NEW games, and less on HD remasters, remakes, and ports.


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## Deleted User (Mar 16, 2020)

Well i like that as a gears 5 owner I don’t need to buy it again.  Also i hear that cyberpunk is going to work same way.  At end of day it is going to come down to price for me personally. Also i am curious if dev mode will still be allowed.  I really hope someone will kexploit the xbox one as well.  But apparently that system is frigging solid or nobody cares to exploit it.  Which makes me sad my 360 was very cool once modded and i am still getting life out of my modded oh xbox.


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## boomario (Mar 16, 2020)

seanp2500 said:


> Well i like that as a gears 5 owner I don’t need to buy it again.  Also i hear that cyberpunk is going to work same way.  At end of day it is going to come down to price for me personally. Also i am curious if dev mode will still be allowed.  I really hope someone will kexploit the xbox one as well.  But apparently that system is frigging solid or nobody cares to exploit it.  Which makes me sad my 360 was very cool once modded and i am still getting life out of my modded oh xbox.


Seems like XSX uses the same base OS as XBOne for now so unless they decided to remove for some weird reason until launch they will probably keep it. Just hope they bump up the allowed hardware usage in dev mode, would be really cool to see Dolphin running on 4K at decent speds on Xbox


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## Yoguur8989 (Mar 16, 2020)

seanp2500 said:


> Well i like that as a gears 5 owner I don’t need to buy it again.  Also i hear that cyberpunk is going to work same way.  At end of day it is going to come down to price for me personally. Also i am curious if dev mode will still be allowed.  I really hope someone will kexploit the xbox one as well.  But apparently that system is frigging solid or nobody cares to exploit it.  Which makes me sad my 360 was very cool once modded and i am still getting life out of my modded oh xbox.


Yeah, I can't wait to see what can be done to the Xbox SX and PS5 once it's cracked wide open (if it gets cracked wide open that is)


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## andyhappypants (Mar 16, 2020)

That’s just tickled my pickle! Very nice M$, very nice


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## BlastedGuy9905 (Mar 16, 2020)

TR_mahmutpek said:


> KERNEL EXPLOIT ETA WEN


5 hours


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## Purple_Shyguy (Mar 16, 2020)

BUT.... Will it have a web browser?

For a easy exploit


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## Xzi (Mar 16, 2020)

Sony really doesn't seem to give a damn if MS is generating more hype right now, but I guess if hardware specs were all that mattered, XB1X would've outsold the base PS4 by quite a bit.

I'm just glad we're finally gonna have consoles that can provide a consistent 60 FPS without a big drop in graphics settings.  Only took them nine friggin' generations to get there.


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## MochaMilk (Mar 16, 2020)

*OwO*


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## anhminh (Mar 17, 2020)

How much will this cost? I wouldn't pay 600$ for a console with no exclusive.


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## LightyKD (Mar 17, 2020)

So, we're entering into another XBox generation without gyroscopic controls? Microsoft needs to catch up!


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## Godofcheese (Mar 17, 2020)

LightyKD said:


> So, we're entering into another XBox generation without gyroscopic controls? Microsoft needs to catch up!



Now tell me, how much do you use the gyro on your PS4?


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## Fusion (Mar 17, 2020)

Best to remember the Xbox Series like this:- *X*treme Series and *S*tutter Series.


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## Delerious (Mar 17, 2020)

LightyKD said:


> So, we're entering into another XBox generation without gyroscopic controls? Microsoft needs to catch up!





Godofcheese said:


> Now tell me, how much do you use the gyro on your PS4?



t's true. There are very few situations where gyro is actually necessary. Most of the time I ever use it is when Nintendo has forced me to (Skyword Sword and stupid BOTW shrines), or for assisted aiming which somehow manages to be helpful and horrendous at the same time.


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## Pipistrele (Mar 17, 2020)

Chary said:


> View attachment 199701​


Not gonna lie, I wouldn't know which is which if not for that caption in bottom left corner.


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## Deleted User (Mar 17, 2020)

OkazakiTheOtaku said:


> I really can't see this proprietary expansion being the only extra storage option long-term. I really expect them to support USB 3.0 drives, with maybe an extra note about loading times being slower or something.


USB drives are supported, but Series X games need to be copied onto internal or expansion card to play them.


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## Xzi (Mar 17, 2020)

Godofcheese said:


> Now tell me, how much do you use the gyro on your PS4?


In games, virtually not at all.  When using the keyboard or filling in text boxes, it's by far the most efficient and convenient method available on consoles.


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## Deleted User (Mar 17, 2020)

Delerious said:


> t's true. There are very few situations where gyro is actually necessary. Most of the time I ever use it is when Nintendo has forced me to (Skyword Sword and stupid BOTW shrines), or for assisted aiming which somehow manages to be helpful and horrendous at the same time.



dammit i wanna try and come up with a good usage of that control but it is rare i like it in faral frame for wii u but sometimes it was problematic.  Surgeon simulator?  Damn someone help me.  When did gyro not actually suck.  Infamous second son with the spray paint?  Damn i am reaching...wow what an overhyped feature.  Zelda skyward sword?  Is that the pinnacle?  Lmao.


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## Xzi (Mar 17, 2020)

seanp2500 said:


> When did gyro not actually suck.  Infamous second son with the spray paint?  Damn i am reaching...wow what an overhyped feature.  Zelda skyward sword?  Is that the pinnacle?  Lmao.


Nah, the pinnacle of motion controls is in the future of VR controllers.  As it is we've already got sub-millimeter motion tracking combined with tracking for each individual finger.


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## 83TropicStorm (Mar 17, 2020)

In b4 Yuzu port to the Xbox Series X


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## Deleted User (Mar 17, 2020)

Xzi said:


> Nah, the pinnacle of motion controls is in the future of VR controllers.  As it is we've already got sub-millimeter motion tracking combined with tracking for each individual finger.


yea, i hope it becomes invested in by devs and affordable enough that we can get vr mmos like the one in bofuri.


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## Xzi (Mar 17, 2020)

Snugglevixen said:


> yea, i hope it becomes invested in by devs and affordable enough that we can get vr mmos like the one in bofuri.


VR MMOs and even just VR RPGs have so much potential to make gaming much more freeform.  Yore VR is a good example of massively unrealized potential.  OrbusVR is...not great, but the casting system for one of the classes is really awesome.  And Township Tale looks like a promising so far, though it's in the early stages of development.

Personally I just really want to have an intricate blacksmithing system lol.  Maybe a game where you manage an item shop.


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## Deleted User (Mar 17, 2020)

Xzi said:


> VR MMOs and even just VR RPGs have so much potential to make gaming much more freeform.  Yore VR is a good example of massively unrealized potential.  OrbusVR is...not great, but the casting system for one of the classes is really awesome.  And Township Tale looks like a promising so far, though it's in the early stages of development.
> 
> Personally I just really want to have an intricate blacksmithing system lol.  Maybe a game where you manage an item shop.


i think vr chat is a nice tech demo to demonstrate what's possible for socializing in vr.


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## Xzi (Mar 17, 2020)

Snugglevixen said:


> i think vr chat is a nice tech demo to demonstrate what's possible for socializing in vr.


Yeah, there are a couple good options for that.  Until Boneworks came out, my favorite VR games were mostly sports and archery stuff.  There are also a couple really good music/rhythm games, a couple really good roguelikes, and a couple really good action games.

As a tie-in to the thread topic, it's interesting that MS hasn't said anything about VR headset support for the Series X.  These hardware specs are more than capable of driving their Windows Mixed Reality HMDs.  We'd get better games at a faster pace if two out of three console manufacturers supported VR.  Though I guess I can't complain too much with Half-Life Alyx coming up soon.


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## HOv (Mar 17, 2020)

This thing is a beast! My only hope is that the proprietary memory won't be too expensive. We all know how that turned out with the ps vita :/


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## Ericthegreat (Mar 17, 2020)

I dunno I didnt feel like I missed anything much from the Xbox one, probably going to go with the ps5 if anything.


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## Deleted User (Mar 17, 2020)

Ericthegreat said:


> I dunno I didnt feel like I missed anything much from the Xbox one, probably going to go with the ps5 if anything.


You'll miss waifu petting and whats underneath white lights and black bars if you get a PS5 though.


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## tabzer (Mar 17, 2020)

Foxi4 said:


> He's not. I too don't go crazy over the "exclusive" label - that doesn't make a game "good", and exclusive games don't magically make poor value hardware "better".



Many good exclusive games make the hardware absolutely *necessary *to play them.  I get a Nintendo system for my Zelda/Mario/Pokemon, and I get a Sony for Final Fantasy and other exclusives (Horizon, GOW, Spiderman) and I'd miiiight get an XBox for Forza... but I think I might prefer to upgrade my PC and my wheel if I am going to go all fanatical about it.  I think it's assumed that when people talk about "exclusives" that they are talking about games that are worth playing.  Honestly, it seems like exclusives are the reasons why people have all different consoles and not PCs.


----------



## Silent_Gunner (Mar 17, 2020)

Still, this thing is only 1 goddamn terabyte. I know, delete games you don't want to play and re-install later, but honestly,


shaunj66 said:


> It's been confirmed that for Xbox Series X games you'll need to use the internal SSD or an expansion card.



Or a USB-A/USB-C adapter to XB1 expansion card adapter.

If Sony is keeping their playing cards hidden, they'll have a larger SSD and support for every drive on the market. I can't believe that we're bringing back the fucking memory card of all things from the 90's of all things!

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------



Xzi said:


> Sony really doesn't seem to give a damn if MS is generating more hype right now, but I guess if hardware specs were all that mattered, XB1X would've outsold the base PS4 by quite a bit.
> 
> I'm just glad we're finally gonna have consoles that can provide a consistent 60 FPS without a big drop in graphics settings.  Only took them nine friggin' generations to get there.



Expect this only for remasters of previous generation games.


----------



## Foxi4 (Mar 17, 2020)

tabzer said:


> Many good exclusive games make the hardware absolutely *necessary *to play them.  I get a Nintendo system for my Zelda/Mario/Pokemon, and I get a Sony for Final Fantasy and other exclusives (Horizon, GOW, Spiderman) and I'd miiiight get an XBox for Forza... but I think I might prefer to upgrade my PC and my wheel if I am going to go all fanatical about it.  I think it's assumed that when people talk about "exclusives" that they are talking about games that are worth playing.  Honestly, it seems like exclusives are the reasons why people have all different consoles and not PCs.


You seem to be missing the point. Pokemon for instance wouldn't be any worse if played on a PlayStation - in fact, it might've been better. There is nothing about that game that inherently makes the *Switch* better, or vice versa. The game either is, or isn't good. The hardware either is, or isn't good. The fact that there's a synergistic relation between the two is irrelevant, they're mutually exclusive entities. The only exception from that rule concerns games which use oddball hardware features that are not replicable elsewhere, and even that is questionable.


----------



## Bladexdsl (Mar 17, 2020)

all that and it will still have NO exclusives and all the games will just be re-ports of old games updated to use the new hardware playing catch up once again to what the pc can offer right now and more.


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## Xzi (Mar 17, 2020)

Silent_Gunner said:


> Expect this only for remasters of previous generation games.


Nah, 12 TFlops is slightly more than a GTX 1080ti will give you...it puts XBSX/PS5 right around RTX 2080 territory.  If next-gen consoles struggle to hit 60 FPS in a few years, it'll be because developers are really going overboard with ray-tracing and a bunch of other over-the-top graphical effects, and even then it'll only have a noticeable impact on 4K.  Anybody targeting 1440p or 1080p is gonna be plenty satisfied with performance throughout this whole generation.


----------



## tabzer (Mar 17, 2020)

Foxi4 said:


> You seem to be missing the point. Pokemon for instance wouldn't be any worse if played on a PlayStation - in fact, it might've been better. There is nothing about that game that inherently makes the *Switch* better, or vice versa. The game either is, or isn't good. The hardware either is, or isn't good. The fact that there's a synergistic relation between the two is irrelevant, they're mutually exclusive entities. The only exception from that rule concerns games which use oddball hardware features that are not replicable elsewhere, and even that is questionable.



Reality vs. Ideal.  Yes, I acknowledged that point.  Hence, why I said "Honestly, it seems like exclusives are the reasons why people have all different consoles and not PCs."  Hardware is often defined, and given value, by the software developed for it (exclusivity).


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## Foxi4 (Mar 17, 2020)

tabzer said:


> Reality vs. Ideal.  Yes, I acknowledged that point.  Hence, why I said "Honestly, it seems like exclusives are the reasons why people have all different consoles and not PCs."  Hardware is often defined, and given value, by the software developed for it (exclusivity).


Of course - they do bend the knee. I'd say most times it's out of necessity though, not by choice. If they had the option to play all of their games on one platform, they would. This doesn't affect me as a collector, I'll buy both this and the PS5 either way, but I'm not representative of the average buyer - to the average customer this practice is anti-consumer. We shouldn't give "exclusives" any special treatment just because they're artificially tied to a platform, or vice versa. Either they're good on their own merits or they're not. To give an example, I would play Halo: Combat Evolved on a toaster if I had to because it's an amazing game, but if I had to choose a console to play it on, I would choose the best one available, the One X, or I'd play it on PC, because those two provide an objectively better experience when compared to the OG or the 360. I consider the software and the hardware to be mutually exclusive, and any exclusivity of the software is a purely arbitrary annoyance, not an advantage. Naturally hardware developers need talking points to sell their consoles and exclusives do help in this regard, but that doesn't make it right - they're selling you a time share on the merits of one specific holiday.


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## Imparasite (Mar 17, 2020)

how about exclusive games microsoft??? let’s talk about it


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## CrossOut (Mar 17, 2020)

I think it would be more beneficial fo me to just upgrade my mid range pc at this point and just keep using the Gamepass ultimate subscrption. Though that may change as I am hoping that with the whole x cloud thing you will be able to play the majority of the Xbox games on your pc.


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## Deleted User (Mar 17, 2020)

Foxi4 said:


> Of course - they do bend the knee. I'd say most times it's out of necessity though, not by choice. If they had the option to play all of their games on one platform, they would. This doesn't affect me as a collector, I'll buy both this and the PS5 either way, but I'm not representative of the average buyer - to the average customer this practice is anti-consumer. We shouldn't give "exclusives" any special treatment just because they're artificially tied to a platform, or vice versa. Either they're good on their own merits or they're not. To give an example, I would play Halo: Combat Evolved on a toaster if I had to because it's an amazing game, but if I had to choose a console to play it on, I would choose the best one available, the One X, or I'd play it on PC, because those two provide an objectively better experience when compared to the OG or the 360. I consider the software and the hardware to be mutually exclusive, and any exclusivity of the software is a purely arbitrary annoyance, not an advantage. Naturally hardware developers need talking points to sell their consoles and exclusives do help in this regard, but that doesn't make it right - they're selling you a time share on the merits of one specific holiday.


CE's single player is best on OG Xbox. gearbox introduced some visual errors and MCC has added sound, cutscene and high framerate bugs, but fixed the netcode and a small fraction of gearbox's bugs.


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## Foxi4 (Mar 17, 2020)

Snugglevixen said:


> CE's single player is best on OG Xbox. gearbox introduced some visual errors and MCC has added sound, cutscene and high framerate bugs, but fixed the netcode and a small fraction of gearbox's bugs.


Having played both recently on both platforms (yes, I bought an OG Xbox just to play Halo before MCC came out) I can safely say that I prefer the MCC version. I can understand why the glitches are there - the Xbox GPU was a little weird, and so was the 360's, so there are definitely some artifacts to deal with, but playing in high or ultra high resolution with modern lighting and Anniversary models and textures is clearly a better experience unless you just want a trip down memory lane. To me it was night and day, but you know what they say - different strokes for different folks.


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## 64bitmodels (Mar 17, 2020)

cool a comparison gif... so where's the graphical difference?


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## Xzi (Mar 17, 2020)

I'm of two minds about it: ideally, exclusives shouldn't exist.  Gamers would benefit by only needing to invest in hardware once, and developers/publishers would benefit through bulk up-front profits with pre-orders and launch sales.  OTOH, exclusives are what defined every retro console and their individual character, so I can understand not wanting to let that concept go.  The issue there is that, where MS and Sony are concerned, this gen and next gen are basically indistinguishable from gaming PCs in terms of hardware.

Ultimately I am mostly in favor of exclusives ending, but realistically it's not going to happen as long as people keep supporting the practice with their wallets.


----------



## Foxi4 (Mar 17, 2020)

Xzi said:


> I'm of two minds about it: ideally, exclusives shouldn't exist.  Gamers would benefit by only needing to invest in hardware once, and developers/publishers would benefit through bulk up-front profits with pre-orders and launch sales.  OTOH, exclusives are what defined every retro console and their individual character, so I can understand not wanting to let that concept go.  The issue there is that this gen and next gen are basically indistinguishable from gaming PCs in terms of hardware.
> 
> Ultimately I am mostly in favor of exclusives ending, but realistically it's not going to happen as long as people keep supporting the practice with their wallets.


I wouldn't say "indistinguishable", in both cases we're dealing with highly customised hardware that has plenty of "special sauce" to differentiate itself from their desktop counterparts - off the shelf Radeons or Ryzens cannot do what this APU does, at least not at this stage. Consoles have always been derived from other hardware - they don't exist in a technological bubble. What you're saying right now about the current and next gen is applicable to just about every console in existence, they all had desktop or workstation brethren. Spinning custom silicon and designing custom architectures for a single SKU just isn't and effectively never was "a thing" unless we count old oddballs like Pong machines and the like that were effectively full video games hardcoded on a chip - it's the "special sauce" that makes consoles stand out. At the end of the day, what is a Gamecube if not a PowerPC with an ATi graphics card?  All of the components used in game consoles exist elsewhere in different forms, they're just modified to serve a specific purpose.


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## DarkKaine (Mar 17, 2020)

Sony: "Why go first, when your competitors can look up your specifications and come up with something better?"
This is what they said when developing the ps4.

Call it a clever business strategy, I call it shady af lol. If both would play this game we'd be waiting forever.

If they want to bury Sony they just have to do one simple thing: make it able to run windows without any restrictions. You'd have a very accessible gaming pc with best of both worlds. 

Not that I'm buying either of these consoles as I just don't see the need for them anymore, but I always find it interesting to see how this all plays out.


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## 64bitmodels (Mar 17, 2020)

Xzi said:


> I'm of two minds about it: ideally, exclusives shouldn't exist.  Gamers would benefit by only needing to invest in hardware once, and developers/publishers would benefit through bulk up-front profits with pre-orders and launch sales.  OTOH, exclusives are what defined every retro console and their individual character, so I can understand not wanting to let that concept go.  The issue there is that, where MS and Sony are concerned, this gen and next gen are basically indistinguishable from gaming PCs in terms of hardware.
> 
> Ultimately I am mostly in favor of exclusives ending, but realistically it's not going to happen as long as people keep supporting the practice with their wallets.


Killing exclusives would be killing consoles. honestly i'm just fine with that, because i'd rather have 1 unified platform where you can play every game rather than 3 where you can play a few. Call me a gaming socialist, but that's what i believe. Ever since 2012, consoles have been underpowered PCs that only get love because of ther heavily streamlined and dumbed down interface, their gimmicks and their few killer apps. give me one good reason as to why you'd buy a console, that doesn't have anything to do with exclusives or portability. oh yeah, there is none.


----------



## duwen (Mar 17, 2020)

> At its core, Xbox Series X is all about speed, compatibility across generations, and the power to create deeper experiences.


I really hope they're looking at *true* backwards compatibility and not just carrying forwards the xbones back-compat program. The lack of compelling xbone exclusives and it's extremely selective range of backwards compatible titles was a major factor in me jumping back to the PS brand this gen... although I still boot up my X360 fairly regularly to play many of the titles that haven't resurfaced this generation (predominantly all the delisted titles I downloaded; Scott Pilgrim, MvsC Origins, Outrun Online, etc - as well as some of the more niche disk based titles and 'region-free' Japanese import shmups I bought).
Honestly, I'm not in either camp for next gen yet, but whichever system has the better implementation of backwards compatibility is more likely to get me onboard... although Microsoft will find it tough to compete with the quarter of a century's worth of Sony titles I own - maybe they'll make it play Dreamcast and Saturn disks!


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## Xzi (Mar 17, 2020)

64bitmodels said:


> Killing exclusives would be killing consoles.


Not necessarily, a lot of people are going to prefer the simplicity of a console OS no matter what.  Up-front cost of the hardware is always going to be a consideration too, and Switch/Switch Lite would gain a huge boost from having PS4 games available, with the reverse also being true.  Hell, XB1 was the only system without any exclusives this gen, and it still sold about 50 million units.  PC and XBSX definitely stand to gain the most from a hypothetical end to exclusives, but I think Sony would still beat out MS next gen and a surprising amount of people would still choose Nintendo for their primary gaming platform regardless.


----------



## Deleted User (Mar 17, 2020)

If I were Microsoft, I'd release it early. Take advantage of the influx of video game buying and get a headstart on Sony. If people already have Xbox Series Xes, then their friends will want one too and be less likely to wait for a PS5.


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## duwen (Mar 17, 2020)

Snugglevixen said:


> If I were Microsoft, I'd release it early. Take advantage of the influx of video game buying and get a headstart on Sony. If people already have Xbox Series Xes, then their friends will want one too and be less likely to wait for a PS5.


Yeah, coz releasing a system that had no games for it worked so well for them this gen.
oh sorry, I forgot about the uprezzed Minecraft and GoW5 - real system sellers.


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## DANTENDO (Mar 17, 2020)

Releasing a new console November time perfect timing as Christmas lists are being made and of course mor people shop


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## Deleted User (Mar 17, 2020)

DANTENDO said:


> Releasing a new console November time perfect timing as Christmas lists are being made and of course mor people shop


Except peope are unlikely to buy 2 consoles in a year and they're buying consoles now


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## IncredulousP (Mar 17, 2020)

Computer. It's a computer.


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## boomario (Mar 17, 2020)

DarkKaine said:


> If they want to bury Sony they just have to do one simple thing: make it able to run windows without any restrictions. You'd have a very accessible gaming pc with best of both worlds.


That would be the extra that xbox lacks, i mean, the windows 10 core and x86 architecture is already there, and with Series X you have now the power to run PC games at acceptable speed and graphics so it's just a matter of adapting the system to allow that and the console would be much more interesting to everyone.


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## pedro702 (Mar 17, 2020)

64bitmodels said:


> Killing exclusives would be killing consoles. honestly i'm just fine with that, because i'd rather have 1 unified platform where you can play every game rather than 3 where you can play a few. Call me a gaming socialist, but that's what i believe. Ever since 2012, consoles have been underpowered PCs that only get love because of ther heavily streamlined and dumbed down interface, their gimmicks and their few killer apps. give me one good reason as to why you'd buy a console, that doesn't have anything to do with exclusives or portability. oh yeah, there is none.


i buy becuase i want my games in physical format tbh, i dont bother with pc and digital only stuff, same on consoles, only physical games is the way to go for me.


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## tabzer (Mar 17, 2020)

Foxi4 said:


> Of course - they do bend the knee. I'd say most times it's out of necessity though, not by choice. If they had the option to play all of their games on one platform, they would. This doesn't affect me as a collector, I'll buy both this and the PS5 either way, but I'm not representative of the average buyer - to the average customer this practice is anti-consumer. We shouldn't give "exclusives" any special treatment just because they're artificially tied to a platform, or vice versa. Either they're good on their own merits or they're not. To give an example, I would play Halo: Combat Evolved on a toaster if I had to because it's an amazing game, but if I had to choose a console to play it on, I would choose the best one available, the One X, or I'd play it on PC, because those two provide an objectively better experience when compared to the OG or the 360. I consider the software and the hardware to be mutually exclusive, and any exclusivity of the software is a purely arbitrary annoyance, not an advantage. Naturally hardware developers need talking points to sell their consoles and exclusives do help in this regard, but that doesn't make it right - they're selling you a time share on the merits of one specific holiday.



I'm not sure what you are saying.  I'm really trying but even your example loses me.  I mean, I don't disagree with the notion that it sucks to have to buy multiple consoles to play different games, when the machines themselves seem to be almost the same thing.  But how does an operating system, or even firmware support the idea of this mutual exclusivity between soft/hardware?  Are patents or brand identity valid concepts in your view, or are they artificial?


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## Foxi4 (Mar 17, 2020)

tabzer said:


> I'm not sure what you are saying.  I'm really trying but even your example loses me.  I mean, I don't disagree with the notion that it sucks to have to buy multiple consoles to play different games, when the machines themselves seem to be almost the same thing.  But how does an operating system, or even firmware support the idea of this mutual exclusivity between soft/hardware?  Are patents or brand identity valid concepts in your view, or are they artificial?


To me the branding is merely a badge on a piece of hardware that's either fit for purpose or it isn't. In an ideal scenario you'd be able to play any game you want on a platform of your choice, but that's obviously not going to happen - it's wishful thinking. My point was that we should judge hardware for what it is, and if it sells, you can bet developers will flock to it. It's the hardware sales that set the boundaries of the platform's target demo, you're not going to sell games for a platform that 5 people own when the competitor sold 50, based on the vague premise of exclusives that may or may not come. I'm quite happy to see that the Series X is shaping up to be a good piece of tech after some blunders from Microsoft, what I don't like is people slagging it off for "not having exclusives" when the thing's not even out yet. I'm far from a Microsoft fanboy, but I can tell what's well-designed when I see it, and ever since the Xbox One S I have to say that Microsoft is holding the torch in terms of robust and sensible design - Sony and Nintendo don't come even close and feel flimsy in comparison.


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## duwen (Mar 17, 2020)

Foxi4 said:


> I'm far from a Microsoft fanboy, but I can tell what's well-designed when I see it, and ever since the Xbox One S I have to say that Microsoft is holding the torch in terms of robust and sensible design - Sony and Nintendo don't come even close and feel flimsy in comparison.


I share a lot of the same opinions... except when it comes to build quality dictating actual functionality.
I'm sat at work using my Mac Pro right now, which I'll fully admit is a robustly built bit of kit... but I'd much rather be working on the PC I have at home, built several years ago for literally 1% the cost of this Apple crap, because even at lower specs it performs better.


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## Foxi4 (Mar 17, 2020)

duwen said:


> I share a lot of the same opinions... except when it comes to build quality dictating actual functionality.
> I'm sat at work using my Mac Pro right now, which I'll fully admit is a robustly built bit of kit... but I'd much rather be working on the PC I have at home, built several years ago for literally 1% the cost of this Apple crap, because even at lower specs it performs better.


Oh, for sure - the spec and the OS need to go hand in hand with the build, but look at it this way - would you prefer an i7 Acer laptop that throttles 24/7 or an ASUS or MSI equivalent that, in addition to not feeling like it's made out of paper, consistently turbos? I'll happily pay a premium for a device that's sensibly designed and well-built, provided it meets my expectations in terms of functionality. I love PlayStation, it's my console of choice most of the time, but the PCB was designed by an idiot, particularly the first and second revision of the PS4. The Slims are significantly better, and so is the Pro, but the shells still feel flimsy and only look premium quality from a distance - the Xbox just feels better in terms of the materials used.


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## Plasmaster09 (Mar 17, 2020)

Chary said:


> If only it had exclusives.
> 
> Don't get me wrong, I am absolutely loving the stuff Xbox is bringing to the table here, but if the PS5 comes even close, well...what's the point in getting an Xbox? The backwards compatibility is a huge draw for me, though, I suppose, given that the older games will perform better on the new system. I guess we'll just have to wait and see what Sony has to offer.


honestly I'm downright sick of this whole "console specs arms race" mentality
exclusives and new features are the reason I get a system- not because of how many teraflops or whatever the heck it has, but what new games and new fun ways of playing them there are.
welp better stick with nintendo then lol


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## DANTENDO (Mar 17, 2020)

Plasmaster09 said:


> honestly I'm downright sick of this whole "console specs arms race" mentality
> exclusives and new features are the reason I get a system- not because of how many teraflops or whatever the heck it has, but what new games and new fun ways of playing them there are.
> welp better stick with nintendo then lol


Tel me what new ways zelda and Mario offer lol nintendo ain't even got proper vr - can't you see yr talking nonsense


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## Plasmaster09 (Mar 17, 2020)

DANTENDO said:


> Tel me what new ways zelda and Mario offer lol nintendo ain't even got proper vr - can't you see yr talking nonsense


nah, I'm not.
when I say new ways, I'm referring to the system as a whole.
just because zelda breath of the wild or mario odyssey don't bring some massive new thing to the table in terms of system mechanics doesn't mean they don't bring a massive new thing to the table gameplay wise
they're basically complete revitalizations of their series with open world gameplay
there's a lotta new shit


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## tabzer (Mar 17, 2020)

Foxi4 said:


> To me the branding is merely a badge on a piece of hardware that's either fit for purpose or it isn't. In an ideal scenario you'd be able to play any game you want on a platform of your choice, but that's obviously not going to happen - it's wishful thinking



I honestly think we are making the transition as time continues on.  I don't think it is wishful thinking.  I think it is inevitable. However, I think it is important to recognize the roles that branding and patenting have played in history, and they are necessary steps from the birth of an idea to the transition into the capability-based performance.  That realization is also closely linked to consumer demand.



Foxi4 said:


> My point was that we should judge hardware for what it is, and if it sells, you can bet developers will flock to it. It's the hardware sales that set the boundaries of the platform's target demo, you're not going to sell games for a platform that 5 people own when the competitor sold 50, based on the vague premise of exclusives that may or may not come. I'm quite happy to see that the Series X is shaping up to be a good piece of tech after some blunders from Microsoft, what I don't like is people slagging it off for "not having exclusives" when the thing's not even out yet.



That seems to be the paradigm that we are faced with at this moment.  One thing to consider is that accessibility is a huge factor.  Xbox simply doesn't exist in Japan in any meaningful way.  Whether or not Xbox One had better hardware.



Foxi4 said:


> I'm far from a Microsoft fanboy, but I can tell what's well-designed when I see it, and ever since the Xbox One S I have to say that Microsoft is holding the torch in terms of robust and sensible design - Sony and Nintendo don't come even close and feel flimsy in comparison.



One point.  The Switch outperforms the Xbox in terms of portability by infinity, as that isn't even a demographic that Microsoft is trying to appeal to.  Another point; the hardware XBox and Playstation offers, per generation, are somewhat on par with each other.  Xbox offered a slight boost in performance while Playstation offered a better quality build.  The reputation Sony has for the longevity in support for their products is more stronger than the performance boost that the XBoxes have previously offered.

I'm going to go on a tangent.  It's obvious that Microsoft has patience and a willingness to test, learn from, and maybe even adapt to the audience.  While they were first in revealing the specs of their next gen hardware, we still don't know what Sony has for the table.  It'd be unfair to compare the new Xbox to the older PS4.  I don't understand what you are saying about an idiot designing the first/second generation PS4 as I've personally not had a bad user experience with it at all.  So maybe I am just lacking in experience.

Now, consider this point.  In this past we have had consoles which had (relatively) great potential for processing software.  Jaguar, 3DO and others.  They were major flops because the developers of the time still had a lot to learn about developing with the tools and the architecture for lesser demands.  We learned, as an industry, that it doesn't make sense to release a console that is overly-spec'd when developers are too far from maximizing its potential.  There is an equilibrium between hardware and software development that each generation tries to find, and encourage (test).  Better hardware doesn't automatically mean it's the better platform.

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------



DANTENDO said:


> Tel me what new ways zelda and Mario offer lol nintendo ain't even got proper vr - can't you see yr talking nonsense


Can I play Zelda--Breath of the Wild on the bus... with an Xbox?  Didn't think so!


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## Foxi4 (Mar 17, 2020)

tabzer said:


> I honestly think we are making the transition as time continues on.  I don't think it is wishful thinking.  I think it is inevitable. However, I think it is important to recognize the roles that branding and patenting have played in history, and they are necessary steps from the birth of an idea to the transition into the capability-based performance.  That realization is also closely linked to consumer demand.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


All very good points, particularly their terrible marketing in Japan, which is weird considering the fact that the MSX was huge there. On the subject of portability, I think Microsoft is really banking on the xCloud service here, game streaming certainly has its advantages in the mobile space. With this kind of horsepower I don't imagine Nintendo being able to catch up in terms of raw brawn, so the bottleneck is, and always will be, connection speed and stability. With that said, I sure do fancy a portable Xbox, but I don't think an XSurface is on the horizon, sadly.


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## JavaScribe (Mar 17, 2020)

tabzer said:


> I honestly think we are making the transition as time continues on. I don't think it is wishful thinking. I think it is inevitable.


I've heard this before.[_citation needed_]


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## Deleted User (Mar 17, 2020)

Foxi4 said:


> I sure do fancy a portable Xbox, but I don't think an XSurface is on the horizon, sadly.


 Closest you'd get is an i7 model surface pro playing whatever's on the Windows 10 Xbox platform.


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## Foxi4 (Mar 17, 2020)

Snugglevixen said:


> Closest you'd get is an i7 model surface pro playing whatever's on the Windows 10 Xbox platform.


Not necessarily. A portable Xbox wouldn't need all the fancy raytracing, 4K support or much of the memory of a full-blown SKU, and I'm confident that current gen mobile/embedded APU's would be more than up to the task. Just look at the Udoo Bolt, and that's running on the last gen architecture. An RDNA2/Zen 2 face-lift would both lower TDP's and improve performance.


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## 64bitmodels (Mar 17, 2020)

Plasmaster09 said:


> honestly I'm downright sick of this whole "console specs arms race" mentality
> exclusives and new features are the reason I get a system- not because of how many teraflops or whatever the heck it has, but what new games and new fun ways of playing them there are.
> welp better stick with nintendo then lol


Wouldn't you want PC then also? I mean you ask for "new fun ways to playing games" and mods are literally that lmao.
Also, in Xbox's defense, what makes you guys so sure the new xbox series x is not going to have exclusives right off the bat? Just because one console lacks exclusives doesn't mean that the next one won't have exclusives either. If microsoft knew anything about the console market, it's that only exclusives sell a console-nothing more nothing less. if they didn't know that they woulnd't be competing in the console market now would they? plus, when a console fails or doesn't do as well as expected, that's a good incentive to heavily improve the next one. I mean, just look at Sony! PS3 was their worst console, so guess what? they got their shit together with the PS4. what makes you think xbox won't do the same? just sayin


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## Yoguur8989 (Mar 17, 2020)

64bitmodels said:


> Wouldn't you want PC then also? I mean you ask for "new fun ways to playing games" and mods are literally that lmao.
> Also, in Xbox's defense, what makes you guys so sure the new xbox series x is not going to have exclusives right off the bat? Just because one console lacks exclusives doesn't mean that the next one won't have exclusives either. If microsoft knew anything about the console market, it's that only exclusives sell a console-nothing more nothing less. if they didn't know that they woulnd't be competing in the console market now would they? plus, when a console fails or doesn't do as well as expected, that's a good incentive to heavily improve the next one. I mean, just look at Sony! PS3 was their worst console, so guess what? they got their shit together with the PS4. what makes you think xbox won't do the same? just sayin


it all depends on what you mean by exclusive. MS puts all of their games on PC so some people don't consider that exclusive (even though with that logic, there are no exclusives because everything is playable on PC to some extent). MS also said all Xbox Series X games are gonna be crossgen the first year. Other than that I completely agree with you. I think if MS comes out with heavy hitting exclusive after heavy hitting exclusive (exclusive to Xbox ecosystem of course), the PS5 is gonna have some tough competition. MS has the studios under their belt and if they keep releases steady like Nintendo has been able to do with the NX, they will be golden.


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## yadspi (Mar 17, 2020)

Sonic Angel Knight said:


> Can it show me a reason to buy it?


Seems like trolling but....everything shown here plus your whole (almost) library since Xbox 1 there free running better with no developer input, gamepass is an insane deal, your Xbox one controllers will work....


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## tabzer (Mar 18, 2020)

Foxi4 said:


> All very good points, particularly their terrible marketing in Japan, which is weird considering the fact that the MSX was huge there. On the subject of portability, I think Microsoft is really banking on the xCloud service here, game streaming certainly has its advantages in the mobile space. With this kind of horsepower I don't imagine Nintendo being able to catch up in terms of raw brawn, so the bottleneck is, and always will be, connection speed and stability. With that said, I sure do fancy a portable Xbox, but I don't think an XSurface is on the horizon, sadly.



I never made the connection between portability and streaming.  Personally I don't care for it, but the portability factor is real with streaming.  Obviously, not totally, but it would take a bite out of the demographic nonetheless.


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## pedro702 (Mar 18, 2020)

64bitmodels said:


> Wouldn't you want PC then also? I mean you ask for "new fun ways to playing games" and mods are literally that lmao.
> Also, in Xbox's defense, what makes you guys so sure the new xbox series x is not going to have exclusives right off the bat? Just because one console lacks exclusives doesn't mean that the next one won't have exclusives either. If microsoft knew anything about the console market, it's that only exclusives sell a console-nothing more nothing less. if they didn't know that they woulnd't be competing in the console market now would they? plus, when a console fails or doesn't do as well as expected, that's a good incentive to heavily improve the next one. I mean, just look at Sony! PS3 was their worst console, so guess what? they got their shit together with the PS4. what makes you think xbox won't do the same? just sayin


considering microsoft wants to push cloud gaming and gamepass, im preety sure all their games will come out on pc as well so people dont really need to buy an xbox console.


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## Foxi4 (Mar 18, 2020)

pedro702 said:


> considering microsoft wants to push cloud gaming and gamepass, im preety sure all their games will come out on pc as well so people dont really need to buy an xbox console.


Their sales model is fairly obvious - if you don't want to bother with all the setup and tinkery involved in PC gaming, you go for Xbox and at the tail end of the generation you soft-upgrade to the next SKU up by trading your old one. In fact, you can just sign up to Xbox All Access and not even think about it - they'll notify you when it's time to upgrade. What they're offering here is convenience, and from what I can tell All Access has been tremendously successful, at least in my area. Lots of people prefer to spread the cost, even if they end up paying twice as much, and it comes with Gamepass already in the box, so you're good for a starter library.


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## naxil (Mar 19, 2020)

The spec is enough for make super games (ps4 and one too). Resume features is the best options we can have.


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## Cortador (Mar 19, 2020)

duwen said:


> I really hope they're looking at *true* backwards compatibility and not just carrying forwards the xbones back-compat program. The lack of compelling xbone exclusives and it's extremely selective range of backwards compatible titles was a major factor in me jumping back to the PS brand this gen... although I still boot up my X360 fairly regularly to play many of the titles that haven't resurfaced this generation (predominantly all the delisted titles I downloaded; Scott Pilgrim, MvsC Origins, Outrun Online, etc - as well as some of the more niche disk based titles and 'region-free' Japanese import shmups I bought).
> Honestly, I'm not in either camp for next gen yet, but whichever system has the better implementation of backwards compatibility is more likely to get me onboard... although Microsoft will find it tough to compete with the quarter of a century's worth of Sony titles I own - maybe they'll make it play Dreamcast and Saturn disks!



If it were just standard backwards comparability I would agree but for a good portion of the backwards catalog, Microsoft goes the extra mile and provides some enhancements at no extra costs. Some examples are:

- Sonic Generations in native 4k, 
- Ninja Gaiden 1 & and 2 at higher resolutions than 1080p and higher frame rate.
- Star Wars Force Unleashed in native 4k.

These are just a few of the X enhanced backwards games. There are many more.


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## duwen (Mar 20, 2020)

Cortador said:


> If it were just standard backwards comparability I would agree but for a good portion of the backwards catalog, Microsoft goes the extra mile and provides some enhancements at no extra costs.


...which unfortunately automatically means that a big chunk of the 360 and original Xbox library will NEVER be available to play on future hardware.
I'd much prefer true backwards compatibility over their extremely selective range of low effort remasters.


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## PROTOBOY (Mar 21, 2020)

Wil have the same memory limitation to use uwp apps that current xbox ones have??

If so will the same limitation or will be possible to use higher memory such on uwp emulators???


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## Deleted User (Mar 25, 2020)

Looks like a Xbox One Series X devkit is shown in this video.
Starts at 6:00


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