# Boston PD prevents local Pokemon TCG Tournament Massacre



## loco365 (Aug 24, 2015)

Jesus that is legimately terrifying. Thank god nobody was hurt.


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## endoverend (Aug 24, 2015)

Probably shouldn't start posting about your plans to shoot up a highly populated event on facebook


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## RustInPeace (Aug 24, 2015)

I read about this earlier today, so thankful they got the guys. They're complete idiots for sharing their plot on social media. I can't think of a reason why they'd do this, other than the fact it's a big event, so let's go shoot some people. All these mass shootings are called that because of the locations, two guys wanting to be famous I guess. 

I do wonder if this had any effect on a possible announcement for the next main series Pokemon game, since everyone expected an announcement from Junichi Masuda, and nothing but Pokken came of it. Or, just no announcement would be made, period.


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## DJPlace (Aug 24, 2015)

bunch of fuck tards if you ask me.


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## StriderVM (Aug 24, 2015)

I still assume good faith.... I mean a really really bad joke.

This is basically no different saying "I have a bomb" to a bag inspector at an airport. It may not be true, but you're gonna get in big trouble for it.


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## Ritsuki (Aug 24, 2015)

The sad thing is that, again, you can be sure that nothing willl be done to prevent people from buying guns and ammo that easily... How many mass shootings before someone actually do something ? Having a gun should not be a right but a duty. It's not a freaking toy ffs


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## ferofax (Aug 24, 2015)

endoverend said:


> Probably shouldn't start posting about your plans to shoot up a highly populated event on facebook


It's a good thing evolution did not grant them the right genes to *realize that*. Seriously, I don't care what people think - guys like these need to be taken off the gene pool _immediately and with extreme prejudice._


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## VinsCool (Aug 24, 2015)

What the actual fuck...

Seriously, some people need to be away from the society.


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## TecXero (Aug 24, 2015)

Wow, that's disturbing. I wonder what their logic was. I'm glad no one was hurt.


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## endoverend (Aug 24, 2015)

ferofax said:


> It's a good thing evolution did not grant them the right genes to *realize that*. Seriously, I don't care what people think - guys like these need to be taken off the gene pool _immediately and with extreme prejudice._


A death penalty for not actually killing anybody...?


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## ferofax (Aug 24, 2015)

endoverend said:


> A death penalty for not actually killing anybody...?


A death penalty for *almost killing everybody*. You don't go around packing a LOTTA HEAT if you have no intention of using it. And intention to kill is what's dangerous - you could have a spoon in your hands but you'll still use that spoon to try and kill people because of the intentions behind it. With intent, everything becomes dangerous.


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## Monado_III (Aug 24, 2015)

endoverend said:


> A death penalty for not actually killing anybody...?


they probably had every intent too.


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## gman666 (Aug 24, 2015)

This is sick and disturbing.. There are children attending these types of events! What a bunch of low life pieces of shit!


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## Reisyukaku (Aug 24, 2015)

I never got into the competitive pokemon stuff, so i only just heard this event was a thing the other day when i went to subway (with my team rocket shirt on) and the subway girl asked me if i was going too, lol. Then this happens.
Also Hynes convention center is where Anime Boston is held every year, so if i go again next year, there will be cops everwhere (both between this and the recent bombing) .-.


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## Blaze163 (Aug 24, 2015)

How many papercuts from Pokemon cards would it take to slit their throats for the sake of irony?


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## xdarkx (Aug 24, 2015)

People posting their plan to do something stupid on social media is *nothing new*.  I'm just glad nothing bad happened.


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## vayanui8 (Aug 24, 2015)

The fact that they announced this makes me think theres a possibility they just wanted to go viral with a really really bad joke, but I have a feeling they were just some really fucked up idiots.


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## Blaze163 (Aug 24, 2015)

vayanui8 said:


> The fact that they announced this makes me think theres a possibility they just wanted to go viral with a really really bad joke, but I have a feeling they were just some really fucked up idiots.



Much like the Pokemon world, some things are just evoutionary dead ends. These kids are basically the equivalent of Dunsparce; a pointless dumb creature that will never evolve, learn anyting worthwhile or contribute anything of consequence that we'll quickly forget about the moment the novelty wears off.


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## Olmectron (Aug 24, 2015)

Blaze163 said:


> Much like the Pokemon world, some things are just evoutionary dead ends. These kids are basically the equivalent of Dunsparce; a pointless dumb creature that will never evolve, learn anyting worthwhile or contribute anything of consequence that we'll quickly forget about the moment the novelty wears off.



Hey, don't insult poor Dunsparce comparing him to these trashbags. But I agree with everything else you said about this people.


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## The Catboy (Aug 24, 2015)

I am actually really happy to see they were able to prevent this, but it's more disturbing that these guys were able to get these kinds of weapons in the first place.


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## endoverend (Aug 24, 2015)

ferofax said:


> A death penalty for *almost killing everybody*. You don't go around packing a LOTTA HEAT if you have no intention of using it. And intention to kill is what's dangerous - you could have a spoon in your hands but you'll still use that spoon to try and kill people because of the intentions behind it. With intent, everything becomes dangerous.



I understand that while it's entirely possible that they had the intent of firing weaponry at people in a crowded event (and even IF than intent was clearly and without a doubt present the death penalty wouldn't have been justifiable) there are several discrepancies which cause doubt as to whether they even had that intent. It's still entirely possible that it could have been a big (and undoubtedly dumb) joke for which the charges would be something more akin to that of a bomb threat (which, again, I still understand is very serious). Regardless; they may or may not have had the intent to kill people at this event but EITHER WAy a death penalty isn't justifiable because the crime of murder was never committed.


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## thorasgar (Aug 24, 2015)

VinsCool said:


> What the actual fuck...
> 
> Seriously, some people need to be away from the society.


This is what the Matrix is for.


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## HaloEffect17 (Aug 24, 2015)

Blaze163 said:


> Much like the Pokemon world, some things are just evoutionary dead ends. These kids are basically the equivalent of Dunsparce; a pointless dumb creature that will never evolve, learn anyting worthwhile or contribute anything of consequence that we'll quickly forget about the moment the novelty wears off.





Olmectron said:


> Hey, don't insult poor Dunsparce comparing him to these trashbags. But I agree with everything else you said about this people.


Nothing against Dunsparce.  Just a good metaphor.  That is all.  

Anyways, this is really sickening to hear.  Glad they got caught, bottom line.


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## Olmectron (Aug 24, 2015)

HaloEffect17 said:


> Nothing against Dunsparce.  Just a good metaphor.  That is all.


I understand.  Just saying, that people shouldn't even be compared to a living being (even if it's a fictional one). They aren't even worms.


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## master801 (Aug 24, 2015)

They play too much Call of Duty.

That's all I have to say.


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## HaloEffect17 (Aug 24, 2015)

Olmectron said:


> I understand.  Just saying, that people shouldn't even be compared to a living being (even if it's a fictional one). They aren't even worms.


I thought Dunsparce was a snake.  I'll credit him as a worm though, he definitely has worm-like qualities.  LOL.


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## Foxi4 (Aug 24, 2015)

master801 said:


> They play too much Call of Duty.


Yup, let's blame it on video games, the games did it. Or movies. Or TV. Or music. Or maybe there's a bigger problem within the nation that needs to be addressed, but since we have more convenient scapegoats, we'll use them.


Crystal the Glaceon said:


> I am actually really happy to see they were able to prevent this, but it's more disturbing that these guys were able to get these kinds of weapons in the first place.


Guns are not a problem, they're just tools. The problem here is the method of distribution of guns, but that's material for a bigger debate.


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## aaronz77 (Aug 24, 2015)

endoverend said:


> Probably shouldn't start posting about your plans to shoot up a highly populated event on facebook



I'm glad they were crazy enough to post it though. Otherwise we wouldn't find out until it was too late.


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## Olmectron (Aug 24, 2015)

HaloEffect17 said:


> I thought Dunsparce was a snake.  I'll credit him as a worm though, he definitely has worm-like qualities.  LOL.


Oh, no, he's the Land Snake Pokémon, I meant, they aren't even a real world worm for me.


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## HaloEffect17 (Aug 24, 2015)

Olmectron said:


> Oh, no, he's the Land Snake Pokémon, I meant, they aren't even a real world worm for me.


Whew... OK.  Glad we got that sorted out.


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## breaktemp (Aug 24, 2015)

Man...just google'd a few news reports about this...and it hurts to accept that these events really happened.  

I had planned to compete at the World VGC again this year...and while the cops did intervene before they could execute their plan, this story has me thinking of being more cautious traveling to these events.  

My thing is these guys had all of these weapons/ammunition with no license to carry...plus the fact that the officers just let them go...


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## Olmectron (Aug 24, 2015)

HaloEffect17 said:


> Whew... OK.  Glad we got that sorted out.


Yep. I don't like calling people like that, though, but these kinds of nonsense in society are disturbing.

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------



breaktemp said:


> My thing is these guys had all of these weapons/ammunition with no license to carry...plus the fact that the officers just let them go...


They were stopped on Friday, though. However, I think they must've been stopped since Thursday and wait for the investigations to dictate wether freeing them or arresting them.


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## Monado_III (Aug 24, 2015)

endoverend said:


> I understand that while it's entirely possible that they had the intent of firing weaponry at people in a crowded event (and even IF than intent was clearly and without a doubt present the death penalty wouldn't have been justifiable) there are several discrepancies which cause doubt as to whether they even had that intent. It's still entirely possible that it could have been a big (and undoubtedly dumb) joke for which the charges would be something more akin to that of a bomb threat (which, again, I still understand is very serious). Regardless; they may or may not have had the intent to kill people at this event but EITHER WAy *a death penalty isn't justifiable because* *the crime of murder was never committed.*


So, if I build a nuke, and then threaten huge amounts of people with it, cause a global crisis, I wouldn't deserve the death penalty because I never did anything to actually hurt anyone? I'm sorry, but building a nuke and threatening the world and going into a heavily packed event centre with guns have two very important things in common, they're terrorist acts which should (not sure if they do in the USA or not) carry the death penalty.

now I'm not saying that they should necessarily get capital punishment unless we're sure they actually meant to use them, but if there is evidence that they planned an attack they shouldn't be treated any different from the Boston marathon bombers.


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## ferofax (Aug 24, 2015)

endoverend said:


> I understand that while it's entirely possible that they had the intent of firing weaponry at people in a crowded event (and even IF than intent was clearly and without a doubt present the death penalty wouldn't have been justifiable) there are several discrepancies which cause doubt as to whether they even had that intent. It's still entirely possible that it could have been a big (and undoubtedly dumb) joke for which the charges would be something more akin to that of a bomb threat (which, again, I still understand is very serious). Regardless; they may or may not have had the intent to kill people at this event but EITHER WAy a death penalty isn't justifiable because the crime of murder was never committed.


See, this is why the good guys will never win against the bad guys. Good guys are too concerned about justifying this and that - meanwhile the bad guys keep killing and unleashing wanton, unrestrained destruction while the good guys are arguing over what to do with the bad guys if and when they catch them.

LOL, okay I exaggerated that a bit, but you get the point. Essentially, we have a mismatch of opinions. You think we should be lenient because it never really happened anyways. All's well that ends well, right? Well I think _you're gonna have a bad time_ if you wanna wait until somebody shoots up kids before you start doing *decisive action *against these kinds of domestic threats. I say stop the people who wanna shoot up kids, _permanently_. Not right away, they must still be given the chance to prove otherwise (especially in cases like this, where they're caught red-handed with weapons), but it has to be fast, has to be decisive.

Also, if this is some kind of a really bad joke on their part, then I say take their genes out of the gene pool even more. We don't need that kind of idiocy who thinks it's "funny" to "play pretend" shooting up kids by bringing deadly weapons and live ammunition to a place where kids gather. The kind of people who think this is funny are sociopaths. SOCIOPATHS. Sick in the head. Write them off the face of the earth, I say.


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## RustInPeace (Aug 24, 2015)

Olmectron said:


> Hey, don't insult poor Dunsparce comparing him to these trashbags. But I agree with everything else you said about this people.



It's going to get a mega evolution. I can feel it. They gave one to Audino, anything's possible.


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## endoverend (Aug 24, 2015)

Monado_III said:


> now I'm not saying that they should necessarily get capital punishment unless we're sure they actually meant to use them, but it there was evidence that they planned an attack they shouldn't be treated any different from the Boston marathon bombers.



Do you really think that someone who had 2 guns in their car and posted pictures of them on facebook should be judged the same as someone who killed 3 people and injured hundreds of others? That doesn't even make sense.



ferofax said:


> LOL, okay I exaggerated that a bit, but you get the point. Essentially, we have a mismatch of opinions. You think we should be lenient because it never really happened anyways. All's well that ends well, right? Well I think you're gonna have a bad time if you wanna wait until somebody shoots up kids before you start doing *decisive action *against these kinds of domestic threats. I say stop the people who wanna shoot up kids, _permanently_. Not right away, they must still be given the chance to prove otherwise (especially in cases like this, where they're caught red-handed with weapons), but it has to be fast, has to be decisive.
> 
> Also, if this is some kind of a really bad joke on their part, then I say take their genes out of the gene pool even more. We don't need that kind of idiocy who thinks it's "funny" to "play pretend" shooting up kids by bringing deadly weapons and live ammunition to a place where kids gather. The kind of people who think this is funny are sociopaths. SOCIOPATHS. Sick in the head. Write them off the face of the earth, I say.



You have to understand that there are always going to be people who want to or intend to inflict terrorist acts of murder on various people. And I agree that these people need to be stopped. But the death penalty is reserved as punishment for one act and one act only-- the felony murder of at least one other person. It's also true that in certain cases the accomplice in a mass murder could be charged with the death penalty as well. But regardless, no murder was committed, period. I'm not arguing that these psychopaths did nothing wrong, I'm just stating that the death penalty is obviously very serious, and is not intended for "removing genes from the gene pool", but rather for actual punishment for actual murder.

You want fast? You want decisive? Well you've obviously never dealt with the US judicial system. But there are first responders and the police force whose first priority is to put people who endanger the public in jail. And that's exactly what happened. As long as these people are in prison they can't do anything wrong. A death penalty is way more serious than a lifetime prison sentence, which would be way more appropriate in this situation, if at all.


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## Foxi4 (Aug 24, 2015)

endoverend said:


> _(...) a death penalty isn't justifiable because the crime of murder was never committed._


Death penalty aside, at which point is punishment justifiable? Would it be justifiable if they were apprehended on the scene with their guns on their backs? Maybe the moment they grab the grips? Is it after their fingers touch the triggers? Perhaps when they start aiming? At which point _should_ the future assailants be considered dangerous and stopped? Once the bullets leave the muzzles or after they hit their targets? Does someone have to die in order for them to be guilty of anything?

See, this is why the concept of _"prevention"_ exists. If there is a mountain of evidence supporting the fact that Mr.X planned to blow up the local supermarket in a suicide bomb attack, including a belt of explosives, a bunch of suicide letters and a tram ticket, you don't wait for him to actually blow himself up - you put him in jail because there isn't even a shadow of doubt regarding what he intended to do. You don't need a pile of bodies here, in fact, you want to _prevent_ bloodshed from even happening. This isn't _"thought crime"_ territory - if the preparations are apparent, there's enough evidence to step in.


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## ferofax (Aug 24, 2015)

endoverend said:


> - snip -


Don't worry, I read the entire post.

But again, good guys too concerned over justifying things. I guess it's probably just my rebellious streak, but I really have no problem with... certain kinds of people... dealing with threats to society in ways that humans laws cannot provide.

If certain people want to hurt innocents, I certainly won't mind it if someone preemptively takes these certain people _out of the picture. In ways that horrifies them the way we are horrified by their wanting to hurt innocents._

Let's just say that when the rules you enforce is too concerned with punishment instead of with prevention, then there's something wrong with the rules. With punishment, the deed is done - people hurt, lives lost. Not so with prevention. But I guess that's free will at its finest, eh? The right to make the choice - even if the choice you make ends up with lots of innocent lives lost. That's the kind of power we give the bad guys.

Ah, but I digress. Just think of this as an opinion piece.


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## Monado_III (Aug 24, 2015)

endoverend said:


> Do you really think that someone who had *2 guns in their car and posted pictures of them on facebook* should be judged the same as someone who killed 3 people and injured hundreds of others? That doesn't even make sense.


"12-gauge shotgun, an AR-15 rifle, *several hundred rounds of ammunition*". Don't pretend they did nothing more than post a picture on facebook, they took that picture with the guns (IIRC they weren't even legally allowed to own) and then went to the tournament with the guns and a ton of ammo. On the FB post one of the people being charged even implied killing people, so that probably means that they were A)planning something and are were complete morons or B)genuine idiots who don't see how idiotic they are.

And I'm not saying they essentially are the boston marathon bombers, but that planning a terrorist attack or actually going through with it should be treated as the same thing. If it turns out they were actually planning an attack I hope they are tried as terrorists.


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## endoverend (Aug 24, 2015)

I'm going to just post this one piece to respond to all three of you quoting my post.

I absolutely agree with you that prevention is necessary. Prevention is key to public safety. But the death penalty by its nature is not a method of prevention. You know what is prevention? Arrest and imprisonment by a police force. And under US law it isn't hard to determine a reasonable cause to arrest someone-- in fact, that's exactly what happened in this situation. The death penalty is a form of punishment for murder and doesn't happen all of a sudden. 

I'm really trying hard not to seem like "one of the bad guys" in this situation. I just really think that rather thank ending someone's life there are better options like therapy with imprisonment, or lifetime imprisonment even. As a form of prevention wouldn't you agree that throwing someone in jail where they can do no harm and determining their punishment later is sufficient? I'm legitimately interested in your opinions-- I'm just going with what the US law has taught people thus far.


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## Monado_III (Aug 24, 2015)

endoverend said:


> I'm going to just post this one piece to respond to all three of you quoting my post.
> 
> I absolutely agree with you that prevention is necessary. Prevention is key to public safety. But the death penalty by its nature is not a method of prevention. You know what is prevention? Arrest and imprisonment by a police force. And under US law it isn't hard to determine a reasonable cause to arrest someone-- in fact, that's exactly what happened in this situation. The death penalty is a form of punishment for murder and doesn't happen all of a sudden.
> 
> I'm really trying hard not to seem like "one of the bad guys" in this situation. I just really think that rather thank ending someone's life there are better options like therapy with imprisonment, or lifetime imprisonment even. As a form of prevention wouldn't you agree that throwing someone in jail where they can do no harm and determining their punishment later is sufficient? I'm legitimately interested in your opinions-- I'm just going with what the US law has taught people thus far.


No idea how US law works, but I know for a fact in Canada "life" sentences, rarely ever go past 30 years, even news sites have reported on it. And people like that just end up being a waste of taxpayer dollars. Can't really continue discussing this as I know nothing about USA law.


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## HaloEffect17 (Aug 24, 2015)

endoverend said:


> I'm really trying hard not to seem like "one of the bad guys" in this situation.


No one said you were.   Anyways, I do agree with your third paragraph though regarding alternatives for punishment after a prison sentence.  Condemning someone with a death penalty right off the bat does seem harsh and unreasonable and so further discussion for punishment is needed.


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## porkiewpyne (Aug 24, 2015)

Aaaaaaaand this is why we can never have nice things. Thank goodness the police managed to stop these stupid assholes before shit happens. Mad props to them.


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## tony_2018 (Aug 24, 2015)

So fuckin stupid... these kids are just plain dumb.


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## Neru (Aug 24, 2015)

Wow someone send me a ticket to mars please


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## VartioArtel (Aug 24, 2015)

So, far as we know, these guys did it for the reason:

"Pokemon's for nerds" basically. They felt like they were doin' it for the 'greater good' of mankind. Or some retarded jazz like that.

I don't know what sorta history these two have (IE: how much video games they play, how much they stroke their car's exhaust pipe, etc), but cash bets they're the sort of cliche Car rubbing assholes who feel threatened that having fun can actually not be 'nerdish'. They're a result of the current horrid generations of parents (1 generation apart, mind you!) whom have not given their children the proper medical care they needed, or the proper discipline. They're a result of the internet's horrid leniency towards such thoughts and social networks being full of people who SUPPORT such lines of thoughts.

I honestly hope they get the death sentence, and everyone who supported their comments or who didn't report the bloody bastards also gets sent to jail for association*.

Note 1: I am not a hardcore pokemon fan, but this is about as low as humanity can go nowadays: literally hosting slaughters (attempted ones rather) because of one's means of enjoying themselves.

Note 2 / *: yes, you can get sent to jail by viewing someone making such threats and not reporting them. It's called association. You know they have the means, you see them claim intent. And by not reporting to the police, you're aiding them by remaining silent, potentially risking the authorities being in the dark, and hence supporting their actions, even if you don't mean to. (Note: being threatened with your life ofc is an exception, but come on, in this case it's the net, that's barely an excuse).


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## HaloEffect17 (Aug 24, 2015)

VartioArtel said:


> Note 1: I am not a hardcore pokemon fan, but this is about as low as humanity can go nowadays: literally hosting slaughters (attempted ones rather) because of one's means of enjoying themselves.


Yes.  We're constantly reminded on the news about those pushing the boundaries of human capacity and its destructiveness.  This situation is no different and it's dreadfully appalling.


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## VartioArtel (Aug 24, 2015)

Latest news I've gotten: supposedly these 2 were part of the "Masters Division" of the competition. More news at 11:02


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## Deleted User (Aug 24, 2015)

Ritsuki said:


> The sad thing is that, again, you can be sure that nothing willl be done to prevent people from buying guns and ammo that easily... How many mass shootings before someone actually do something ? Having a gun should not be a right but a duty. It's not a freaking toy ffs



Cool, the usual agenda pushing in the face of even the slightest bit of controversy involving guns. when you are born and raised by the guns of the patriots then you have a right to complain. otherwise give it up. our country was born by the gun, telling us to give up the wide availability in our country is like us telling you to give up your swords/bows, and just like a sword or a bow the danger comes from the person holding it, they would probably have done it anyway using a sword, or a bow, or hell they probably would have tried it using a freaking letter opener since they where obviously very intent on killing. 

GUNS ARE PART OF WHO WE ARE AND WE WON'T GIVE IT UP, EVER.


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## petspeed (Aug 24, 2015)

That's insane !


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## wormdood (Aug 24, 2015)

Thelucario21 said:


> Cool, the usual agenda pushing in the face of even the slightest bit of controversy involving guns. when you are born and raised by the guns of the patriots then you have a right to complain. otherwise give it up. our country was born by the gun, telling us to give up the wide availability in our country is like us telling you to give up your swords/bows, and just like a sword or a bow the danger comes from the person holding it, they would probably have done it anyway using a sword, or a bow, or hell they probably would have tried it using a freaking letter opener since they where obviously very intent on killing.
> 
> GUNS ARE PART OF WHO WE ARE AND WE WON'T GIVE IT UP, EVER.


poor analogy a sword and/or bow to a gun that sword is a lot heaver hunk of steel there and if untrained may take multi-swings even more effort,  and compression bows aside (illegal in some states) i have never heard someone say that bow had a hairpin trigger
edit: or i dropped the letter opener and it just went off
i can go on but the point is guns are not something we need to kill you are correct there but at the same time do you really need to be able to just empty a clip instakill a crowd ("boom headsh0t". . ."lol") 
p.s. to who it may concern
guns are for punks who are afraid of getting a good old-fashioned ass whoppin i mean are you at a warzone,  surrounded by wild (dingos) "or insert other animal name here" bent on eating your (baby)"or insert other loved one here" no did not think so


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## StriderVM (Aug 24, 2015)

ferofax said:


> Don't worry, I read the entire post.
> 
> But again, good guys too concerned over justifying things. I guess it's probably just my rebellious streak, but I really have no problem with... certain kinds of people... dealing with threats to society in ways that humans laws cannot provide.
> 
> ...



As a fellow Filipino, I will have to disagree. Abuse can happen on both sides. It's easy to say that "suspicious" people should be dealt with immediately before they can do anthing. But what if that person is actually innocent? Without a proper trial, you can never really know. That's what Marcos has done to the Philippines from the late seventies to the early eighties. Some people can easily prove that it was "safer" on that time, but the relatives of people who has just been executed or "disappeared" without trial will say otherwise.


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## ferofax (Aug 24, 2015)

HaloEffect17 said:


> No one said you were.   Anyways, I do agree with your third paragraph though regarding alternatives for punishment after a prison sentence.  Condemning someone with a death penalty right off the bat does seem harsh and unreasonable and so further discussion for punishment is needed.


If this attack went through... like, seriously, just count the number of potential innocent victims. That much ammunition can easily net them around 20 kills, mostly kids, and quite possibly a lot more than that. Just thinking about it scares the living shit out of me, and I'm a mofuckin asian living in South East Asia! It's either you turn them into a very harsh lesson to strike fear into others that might go down that path, or you will very likely have more crying mothers weeping for little children shot up by sick fuckers like these. Yeah, I'm starting to use swear words a lot because fuck these fuckers need to disappear, stat.



Thelucario21 said:


> Cool, the usual agenda pushing in the face of even the slightest bit of controversy involving guns. when you are born and raised by the guns of the patriots then you have a right to complain. otherwise give it up. our country was born by the gun, telling us to give up the wide availability in our country is like us telling you to give up your swords/bows, and just like a sword or a bow the danger comes from the person holding it, they would probably have done it anyway using a sword, or a bow, or hell they probably would have tried it using a freaking letter opener since they where obviously very intent on killing.
> 
> GUNS ARE PART OF WHO WE ARE AND WE WON'T GIVE IT UP, EVER.


Fine, don't give it up. Just be responsible gun owners. And don't be a fucking threat to society. Don't go around toting loaded firearms, especially to unarmed citizens, just because you don't agree on something and feel the need to exert your "authority".
But come to think of it, if you have to have a loaded gun on your person to feel safe in your area, to belong in your area, then there's something VERY VERY WRONG with your area. That area is a WARZONE, regardless of whether or not people are actually shooting each other up or not.



StriderVM said:


> As a fellow Filipino, I will have to disagree. Abuse can happen on both sides. It's easy to say that "suspicious" people should be dealt with immediately before they can do anthing. But what if that person is actually innocent? Without a proper trial, you can never really know. That's what Marcos has done to the Philippines from the late seventies to the early eighties. Some people can easily prove that it was "safer" on that time, but the relatives of people who has just been executed or "disappeared" without trial will say otherwise.


Abductions are far, far too different from cases like these where we have irrefutable evidence of preparation and threats declared through language. That's what happened during the Marcos era. Accusations with no basis, no evidence, just a finger pointed your way and you're off to never never land, never never to appear ever again.

This one's loads different. Caught red-handed, _pare_, they might as well pull their pants down as it stands. But as I said a few posts back, I don't mind giving them a chance to prove us wrong, that they aren't sick fuckers who were about to go on a murder spree. I don't mind that. But things must be quick, and decisive. We don't have to lose our humanity to violence, but when there is threat of violence, we must be able to deal with that threat in such a way that prevents any more threats of that nature from happening in the future. I.E., be so brutal as to scare the living shit out of sick fuckers. Citizens need not fear, unless they do something really stupid. But stupid things can be dealt with in relatively non-violent ways. But there are special cases like these which I think needs to be cauterized.

I'm so glad I'm not in a position to be a monster that scares all the other monsters away, lol. But somebody needs to take that position, and _satin pare_, I wish it's Duterte.


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## DinohScene (Aug 24, 2015)

That's extremely cringy, getting mad over a TCG ._.

Thank fuck those loonies where dumb enough to spam social media with it.


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## leon315 (Aug 24, 2015)

this the reason why i love Canada much more rather than USAssassins


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## Foxi4 (Aug 24, 2015)

leon315 said:


> this the reason why i love Canada much more rather than USAssassins


>Clubs thousands of seals to death every year
>USAssassins

I think you lost that moral battle.


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## VartioArtel (Aug 24, 2015)

DinohScene said:


> That's extremely cringy, getting mad over a TCG ._.
> 
> Thank fuck those loonies where dumb enough to spam social media with it.


Mad? Did you even read what happened?


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## NicEXE (Aug 24, 2015)

Team Fail said:


> Jesus that is legimately terrifying. Thank god nobody was hurt.


Thank the police instead


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## XeR ッ (Aug 24, 2015)

They were both retards , and they will pay for it.


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## Zonark (Aug 24, 2015)

Looks like they really wanted to fn win, glad this was prevented. I'd like to go up to them and say "You know what sounds you'd make if I pushed you in a lake? Da-Douche!" 

pikachu made them do it


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## Ritsuki (Aug 24, 2015)

Thelucario21 said:


> Cool, the usual agenda pushing in the face of even the slightest bit of controversy involving guns. when you are born and raised by the guns of the patriots then you have a right to complain. otherwise give it up. our country was born by the gun, telling us to give up the wide availability in our country is like us telling you to give up your swords/bows, and just like a sword or a bow the danger comes from the person holding it, they would probably have done it anyway using a sword, or a bow, or hell they probably would have tried it using a freaking letter opener since they where obviously very intent on killing.
> 
> GUNS ARE PART OF WHO WE ARE AND WE WON'T GIVE IT UP, EVER.


Do whatever you like, you are totally right this is not my country. But I'm pretty sure that giving access that easily to tools that were made to kill other people with great ease and efficiency isn't the best way to protect a country. You're talking about patriotism, but do you really think that these two guys are a bit of patriots? Do you really think that killing your own people is something patriotic? Heck, they're even way too young to know what is patriotism. You got to earn the right to have, buy or use a gun. This isn't something you can give to anyone because or freedom or misplaced patriotism. And you should not talk lightly about your history, your ancestors fought for your freedom and that's what they are doing with it : killing other Americans... Listen, I'm from a country where military service is mandatory, and men have to keep their weapon at home (it's a SIG-550,feel free to check). So I have my assault rifle at home. But to prevent this kind of situation, ammo is not provided, the AR is registered to your name and ID number, and buying ammo in not permitted without a permit. In my eyes, that's far more secure than giving weapons to everyone... But it's just my opinion, and again you're right, I have absolutely no rights to complain and judge as an outsider. But you know sometimes, you have to be outside to have a better and unbiased look on the situation.


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## Zonark (Aug 24, 2015)

Ritsuki said:


> Do whatever you like, you are totally right this is not my country. But I'm pretty sure that giving access that easily to tools that were made to kill other people with great ease and efficiency isn't the best way to protect a country. You're talking about patriotism, but do you really think that these two guys are a bit of patriots? Do you really think that killing your own people is something patriotic? Heck, they're even way too young to know what is patriotism. You got to earn the right to have, buy or use a gun. This isn't something you can give to anyone because or freedom or misplaced patriotism. And you should not talk lightly about your history, your ancestors fought for your freedom and that's what they are doing with it : killing other Americans... Listen, I'm from a country where military service is mandatory, and men have to keep their weapon at home (it's a SIG-550,feel free to check). So I have my assault rifle at home. But to prevent this kind of situation, ammo is not provided, the AR is registered to your name and ID number, and buying ammo in not permitted without a permit. In my eyes, that's far more secure than giving weapons to everyone... But it's just my opinion, and again you're right, I have absolutely no rights to complain and judge as an outsider. But you know sometimes, you have to be outside to have a better and unbiased look on the situation.


Its not a tool which primary function is used to "kill people" Its used to Defend People and Hunt.


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## Ritsuki (Aug 24, 2015)

Zonark said:


> Its not a tool which primary function is used to "kill people" Its used to Defend People and Hunt.


Well, that is debatable. If we are talking about a hunting rifle, yes. The ammo and specifications of the weapon makes it suitable for hunt. I agree, in this case it would be like I was saying that we shouldn't sell kitchen knives because you can kill people with it  . But the guns they wanted to use are not really for defense, at least not in this context (in a war zone maybe, but clearly not in this place and time). And using a shotgun and an AR-15 to hunt would be tge equivalent of using grenades to fish : a tiny bit extreme 

And to use the knife analogy again, you don't give access to dangerous goods like that to people that hasn't the necessary knowledge and stability to use it. It would be like selling a kitchen knife (yes, I love kitchen knives ) to a 6 years old. Maybe it's not a weapon, but the combination can be dangerous for everybody.


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## Vipera (Aug 24, 2015)

Thelucario21 said:


> Cool, the usual agenda pushing in the face of even the slightest bit of controversy involving guns. when you are born and raised by the guns of the patriots then you have a right to complain. otherwise give it up. our country was born by the gun, telling us to give up the wide availability in our country is like us telling you to give up your swords/bows, and just like a sword or a bow the danger comes from the person holding it, they would probably have done it anyway using a sword, or a bow, or hell they probably would have tried it using a freaking letter opener since they where obviously very intent on killing.
> 
> GUNS ARE PART OF WHO WE ARE AND WE WON'T GIVE IT UP, EVER.


Your country was born as a big "fuck you" to Britain. Guns were part of your ancestors, not you. You got police and trained military to cover your ass in case of invasion. Invasion that will never happen because South America doesn't even dare to piss off the UN. And if it does, I'd rather have some trained professional saving my ass than some lunatic that thinks he's God if he had a gun.


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## Flame (Aug 24, 2015)

> has most nukes on the planet

Guns is my right... _So my country doesn't get invaded._


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## WiiCube_2013 (Aug 24, 2015)

Nintendo fanboys really are a bunch of arseholes. First I read how two guys got into a fight because of fucking amiibos and now this.

Jeez, just play the game and enjoy it!


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## Doran754 (Aug 24, 2015)

Why do people self snitch? I don't get it .. Keep that shit to yourself. This dumb fuck played himself, posts on facebook he's going to kill people then gets arrested .. hopefully he gets the death penalty.


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## Flame (Aug 24, 2015)

If this guys drop the soap in prison...

Cause some one is going to the pokemon move harden on them.

I hope its super effective...


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## Foxi4 (Aug 24, 2015)

Vipera said:


> Your country was born as a big "fuck you" to Britain. Guns were part of your ancestors, not you. You got police and trained military to cover your ass in case of invasion. Invasion that will never happen because South America doesn't even dare to piss off the UN. And if it does, I'd rather have some trained professional saving my ass than some lunatic that thinks he's God if he had a gun.


That doesn't mean that guns should be suddenly outlawed - it's their distribution that should be more restrictive and more selective.

There is nothing intrinsically wrong with a gun - it's a tool. Guns don't kill people - people use guns to kill other people. A gun is not responsible for someone's poor life choices or unsteady mental state. You can kill with many tools, just about anything, in fact. The problems arise when people who do not have the mental fortitude and training to use guns responsibly get access to them.

A gun license should be a relatively difficult thing to obtain and something that requires periodical mental and physical checks in order to keep, not something you either don't have to own or can just request and get on the spot. A speeding car is a massive steel bullet too, it can be as destructive as a gun, if not more, and that's why a driving license is required to operate one - the same applies, or should apply, to any form of a firearm.

The text of the 2nd ammendment is very clear: _"A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed."_ - notice the word _regulated_. The 2nd ammendment doesn't give the indispensible right for nutjobs to bear arms - it's supposed to be _well regulated_, and that implies separating the chaff from the grain.


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## grossaffe (Aug 24, 2015)

Job well done, Officer Jenny.


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## Foxi4 (Aug 24, 2015)

grossaffe said:


> Job well done, Officer Jenny.


Where Officer Jenny f*cks up, Nurse Joy steps in, so all things considered, this would be a win-win either way. _;O;_


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## Vipera (Aug 24, 2015)

Foxi4 said:


> That doesn't mean that guns should be suddenly outlawed - it's their distribution that should be more restrictive and more selective.
> 
> There is nothing intrinsically wrong with a gun - it's a tool. Guns don't kill people - people use guns to kill other people. A gun is not responsible for someone's poor life choices or unsteady mental state. You can kill with many tools, just about anything, in fact. The problems arise when people who do not have the mental fortitude and training to use guns responsibly get access to them.
> 
> ...


I've never said that guns should be outlawed, but IMO they aren't treated as they should in the USA. I agree it should be harder to own a gun, especially because there isn't any of the issues going on today than there were when the Amendments were made.


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## Monado_III (Aug 24, 2015)

Vipera said:


> I've never said that guns should be outlawed, but IMO they aren't treated as they should in the USA. I agree it should be harder to own a gun, *especially because there isn't any of the issues going on today than there were when the Amendments were made.*


and the Amendments were made in 1791 when a gun was usually something like a musket, nothing like today's fully automatic weapons that can fire hundreds of rounds in seconds.


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## AaronUzumaki (Aug 24, 2015)

I was actually at Worlds and it was crazy the amount of security they added (drug dogs and all). It actually made getting in take much longer than normal, so they had to delay and move a lot of matches. It surprised me to find out there was a legitimate threat (I bet my friend that some sour player who didn't get invited called in a fake threat).


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## Hells Malice (Aug 25, 2015)

Thelucario21 said:


> Cool, the usual agenda pushing in the face of even the slightest bit of controversy involving guns. when you are born and raised by the guns of the patriots then you have a right to complain. otherwise give it up. our country was born by the gun, telling us to give up the wide availability in our country is like us telling you to give up your swords/bows, and just like a sword or a bow the danger comes from the person holding it, they would probably have done it anyway using a sword, or a bow, or hell they probably would have tried it using a freaking letter opener since they where obviously very intent on killing.
> 
> GUNS ARE PART OF WHO WE ARE AND WE WON'T GIVE IT UP, EVER.



Can I get a YEEEEEHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAW?


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## InuYasha (Aug 25, 2015)

shamzie said:


> Why do people self snitch? I don't get it .. Keep that shit to yourself. This dumb fuck played himself, posts on facebook he's going to kill people then gets arrested .. hopefully he gets the death penalty.



Some people are fucked up in the head,others just want to be plastered on the news and become famous...


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## DarkCoffe64 (Aug 25, 2015)

What a nice world we live in


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## TeamScriptKiddies (Aug 25, 2015)

chavosaur said:


> ​Pokemon is all fun and games right? Until you piss off the wrong person that is.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


What jackasses! I'm glad they were stupid enough to post their intentions on social media, cause they got themselves busted in doing so and prevented anyone from getting hurt.

As a New Englander myself, I would like to see these scumbags charged with conspiracy to commit domestic terrorism....


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## Bubbysaur (Aug 25, 2015)

I'm really glad they caught this before it happened! These tournaments are frequented by young kids, man, what the hell? Who is so twisted in the head to try and commit mass murder on this scale?


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## storm75x (Aug 25, 2015)

This is just terrifyingly ludicrous.


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## Xabring (Aug 25, 2015)

Damn humanity, you're scary!

I mean, it's just a game, chill the **** out!
We don't need more flames for the blame games already have for making people violent. They where already bad from the head, they just choose a simple card game for their excuse. It could be beer or a girlfrield or anything "accepted by society"... People are violent because they did not control their instincts.

Thanks God it wasn't the case though. And well, many people get caught simply because they can't resist to show off or something like that. Social media HAS uses, who knew...


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## Doran754 (Aug 25, 2015)

For anyone interested they're showing the event now http://www.twitch.tv/pokemon


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## pokemoner2500 (Aug 25, 2015)

I don't know if this is a completely reliable source but this interested me. (Tweet related don't worry)

https://twitter.com/ShurtugalTCG/status/636048055754579970/photo/1


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## Vipera (Aug 25, 2015)

pokemoner2500 said:


> I don't know if this is a completely reliable source but this interested me. (Tweet related don't worry)
> 
> https://twitter.com/ShurtugalTCG/status/636048055754579970/photo/1



I absolutely believe him. However, that's not acceptable. You don't joke with guns, it's one of the first rule of "brain: how-to". They deserve the punishment. I hope Nintendo won't go turtle on us now, as they usually do when something bad happens.


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## Hells Malice (Aug 26, 2015)

pokemoner2500 said:


> I don't know if this is a completely reliable source but this interested me. (Tweet related don't worry)
> 
> https://twitter.com/ShurtugalTCG/status/636048055754579970/photo/1



Rofl if that's true.
Even if it is, they still deserve it. They completely brought it on themselves with the threats and pictures. You can't joke about commiting a terrorist act and then be like "lol jk."
That's not how real life works, and i'm glad those two dipshits are learning exactly what real life is. Bet they wont be that fucking stupid again.
They'll be shitting their bunkbed every time they hear sirens after this.


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## Margen67 (Aug 26, 2015)

I bet they're dirty entitled pirates  #fuckpiracy


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## VartioArtel (Aug 26, 2015)

Vipera said:


> I absolutely believe him. However, that's not acceptable. You don't joke with guns, it's one of the first rule of "brain: how-to". They deserve the punishment. I hope Nintendo won't go turtle on us now, as they usually do when something bad happens.


I honestly don't buy it. I mean it feels more like a third party who supports/promotes trolls. and the story seems TOO convenient.


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## WiiCube_2013 (Aug 26, 2015)

pokemoner2500 said:


> I don't know if this is a completely reliable source but this interested me. (Tweet related don't worry)
> 
> https://twitter.com/ShurtugalTCG/status/636048055754579970/photo/1


So this was going to be a 'prank'? Serves them right. It's like people don't know pranks are supposed to be funny and harmless.


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## Father Crilly (Aug 26, 2015)

WiiCube_2013 said:


> It's like people don't know pranks are supposed to be funny and harmless.



They are? Shit. Better remove that ignition triggered bomb from my friend's car...



> "The BPD detectives did a great job in the stop and prevention of a potential tragedy," BPD bureau of intelligence and analysis commander Paul Fitzgerald said.



What? That's bullshit. Two people made threats to Pokemon people on Facebook. Someone reported those threats. Police went to the event, arrested the two guys when they got there, searched their car and found guns. It's not that hard.
In fact, I find it stupid that they weren't arrested at their houses. They could have arrived there and forced their way through the entrance with guns blazing. That to me is the complete opposite of detective work, never mind a "great job".


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## Drak0rex (Aug 26, 2015)

Blaze163 said:


> How many papercuts from Pokemon cards would it take to slit their throats for the sake of irony?


151. One from each of the original Pokemon. Preferably in PokeRap order. Electrode, Diglett, Nidoran, Mankey...


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## Mr_Pichu (Aug 27, 2015)

Humans are way more dangerous than any Pokemon...


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## Deleted User (Aug 29, 2015)

Ritsuki said:


> Do whatever you like, you are totally right this is not my country. But I'm pretty sure that giving access that easily to tools that were made to kill other people with great ease and efficiency isn't the best way to protect a country. You're talking about patriotism, but do you really think that these two guys are a bit of patriots? Do you really think that killing your own people is something patriotic? Heck, they're even way too young to know what is patriotism. You got to earn the right to have, buy or use a gun. This isn't something you can give to anyone because or freedom or misplaced patriotism. And you should not talk lightly about your history, your ancestors fought for your freedom and that's what they are doing with it : killing other Americans... Listen, I'm from a country where military service is mandatory, and men have to keep their weapon at home (it's a SIG-550,feel free to check). So I have my assault rifle at home. But to prevent this kind of situation, ammo is not provided, the AR is registered to your name and ID number, and buying ammo in not permitted without a permit. In my eyes, that's far more secure than giving weapons to everyone... But it's just my opinion, and again you're right, I have absolutely no rights to complain and judge as an outsider. But you know sometimes, you have to be outside to have a better and unbiased look on the situation.


^I had to break that up in notepad just to try and read it, try breaking up your sentences when you've got more than 5 lines.



Ritsuki said:


> ...But I'm pretty sure that giving access that easily to tools that were made to kill other people with great ease and efficiency isn't the best way to protect a country.


We're a country founded on the idea that everyone should be capable of fighting to defend our country. much like you are "from a country where military service is mandatory" Our whole populace basically a mandatory part of our army, and in every army, country, and society there is a murderer. they will always exist and always will break the law regardless of the methods required.



Ritsuki said:


> Do you really think that killing your own people is something patriotic?


It's real typical of you folks to try and put those words in the mouths of everyone who's patriotic about their guns, NO killing your own kinsmen is NOT patriotic in any way and that is a frankly BROKEN path of logic to follow.



Ritsuki said:


> Heck, they're even way too young to know what is patriotism. You got to earn the right to have, buy or use a gun.





Ritsuki said:


> ... the AR is registered to your name and ID number... In my eyes, that's far more secure than giving weapons to everyone...


now BOTH of those I can agree with. we DO have systems to earn your right to own a gun, There is a DEEP background check including a full historical search, a Psych evaluation, and a full ID Registration of every gun to your ID number, assuming that they obtained the weapon through LEGAL CHANNELS or didn't MAKE THE GUN themselves by hand. but as usual, this statement comes up in a situation where the perpetrators did not go through legal means to obtain their weapons, so no dice. they're criminals, and when someone makes the conscious decision to be a criminal the law kinda goes by the wayside to them.



Ritsuki said:


> And you should not talk lightly about your history, your ancestors fought for your freedom and that's what they are doing with it : killing other Americans...


Again, you take my point and bend it to your purposes. our ancestors fought hard to make sure we have these freedoms, but we can't simply take away these freedoms which come from our very founding document due to a rare sub-0.0001% of our populace who are insane enough to abuse it, that would be insane from our perspective, they wanted us to have guns so bad they wove it into our country's very fabric. To toss it out would be an affront to everything they lived and DIED for.



Ritsuki said:


> But it's just my opinion, and again you're right, I have absolutely no rights to complain and judge as an outsider. But you know sometimes, you have to be outside to have a better and unbiased look on the situation.





Ritsuki said:


> I'm a outsider and you should listen to me because my uneducated opinions shape realtity boo hoo... T.T


FTFY, when you've spent 20+ politics and have done classes on our politics maybe i'll listen, because then and only then could you ever know american politics better than someone who LIVES here.


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## Deleted User (Aug 29, 2015)

Foxi4 said:


> A gun license should be a relatively difficult thing to obtain and something that requires periodical mental and physical checks in order to keep, not something you either don't have to own or can just request and get on the spot. A speeding car is a massive steel bullet too, it can be as destructive as a gun, if not more, and that's why a driving license is required to operate one - the same applies, or should apply, to any form of a firearm.



The fact most people outside america don't seem to get is that guns AREN'T easy to get, it takes on average a week of background checks (Including Criminal, Medical, and Psychological History) and most types and modifications even then require extra licences, classes, and fees that oft out-cost the gun itself.


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## Foxi4 (Aug 30, 2015)

Thelucario21 said:


> The fact most people outside america don't seem to get is that guns AREN'T easy to get, it takes on average a week of background checks (Including Criminal, Medical, and Psychological History) and most types and modifications even then require extra licences, classes, and fees that oft out-cost the gun itself.


It depends on the state, I don't think it's strictly regulated by the federal government since naysayers would cry that it's against the constitution (it isn't, but votes are worth more than sensible reform).


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## Vengenceonu (Aug 30, 2015)

Just had a thought. what if they didn't post on social media and a mass shooting happened where several died, also on camera. Would that combined with this weeks incident open Americas eyes to how lax our gun control is? I'm pretty sure the NRA gun nut conservatives would say something like "games like Pokemon where you 'kill' your opponent, lead to their violent behavior".

@Thelucario21 some places are easier to get than others, the Virginia news guy put a fucking deposit down on June 19 and was mass murdering within a month. Crazy people arent scared of crazy prices if they can get their hands on a gun. They're fucking CRAZY in the first place.

Why is it easier to get a gun than a passport or a green card. All states that sell guns should have laws that state to apply for a gun, the process takes minimum of 1 year, several background checks, a mandatory psychiatric visit twice a year every year, and surprise inspections. If you marked down using the gun for hunting, and they find out you haven't hunted ever they strip you of your shit. Also, there needs to be stricter regulations on bullets.


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## Deleted User (Aug 30, 2015)

Foxi4 said:


> It depends on the state, I don't think it's strictly regulated by the federal government since naysayers would cry that it's against the constitution (it isn't, but votes are worth more than sensible reform).


suprisingly, the rules i mentioned are pretty much universal, it's just some states allow that stuff to be done AFTER the purchase is made and the gun is handed over, only Texas is (basically) de-regulated and Texas oddly has the lowest crime rates of all the states ignoring their problems with illegal immigration.

You say "but votes are worth more" with great sarcasm, and I hear "Submit to a Dictatorship". You say "sensible reform" and i hear "give up your national heritage"


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## Foxi4 (Aug 30, 2015)

Thelucario21 said:


> suprisingly, the rules i mentioned are pretty much universal, it's just some states allow that stuff to be done AFTER the purchase is made and the gun is handed over, only Texas is (basically) de-regulated and Texas oddly has the lowest crime rates of all the states ignoring their problems with illegal immigration.
> 
> You say "but votes are worth more" with great sarcasm, and I hear "Submit to a Dictatorship". You say "sensible reform" and i hear "give up your national heritage"


Sensible regulation is not giving up national herritage, it's preventing nutjobs from obtaining guns. A nutjob won't be bothered by any checks after obtaining a gun, so the idea of post-purchase regulation is completely pointless. You have to acknowledge the fact that the British Empire doesn't exist anymore, the French are in no hurry to invade either and the Native Americans are near-extinct, and not due to guns but due to continental diseases the founders unwittingly brought to America on their blankets. There is no pressing danger of any invasion anymore, you live in a superpower country, you could relax a bit with what you arm yourself with. The only point I'd be willing to give to the pro gun community is that most weapons used in organized crime are from the black market and cannot be regulated, school shooters and other psychos use their ow guns though, or the guns of their family, so there should be regulations in place regarding who can buy weapons, who can buy ammunition, what kind of weapons they buy and how they are supposed to store them, and all those regulations are incredibly lax in the states. That's not to say I'm anti-guns - I'm pro guns, I love'em myself, I just think they shouldn't be treated like toys and licensing should be strict so that only the cream of the crop can get them, and even they should have to attend periodical check-ups in order to keep them. I prefer a slightly demilitarized populace over militarized police which has to be militarized because they have no way of knowing if you have a handgun or a grenade launcher.


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## Deleted User (Aug 30, 2015)

Foxi4 said:


> Sensible regulation is not giving up national herritage, it's preventing nutjobs from obtaining guns. A nutjob won't be bothered by any checks after obtaining a gun, so the idea of post-purchase regulation is completely pointless. You have to acknowledge the fact that the British Empire doesn't exist anymore, the French are in no hurry to invade either and the Native Americans are near-extinct, and not due to guns but due to continental diseases the founders unwittingly brought to America on their blankets. There is no pressing danger of any invasion anymore, you live in a superpower country, you could relax a bit with what you arm yourself with. The only point I'd be willing to give to the pro gun community is that most weapons used in organized crime are from the black market and cannot be regulated, school shooters and other psychos use their ow guns though, or the guns of their family, so there should be regulations in place regarding who can buy weapons, who can buy ammunition, what kind of weapons they buy and how they are supposed to store them, and all those regulations are incredibly lax in the states. That's not to say I'm anti-guns - I'm pro guns, I love'em myself, I just think they shouldn't be treated like toys and licensing should be strict so that only the cream of the crop can get them, and even they should have to attend periodical check-ups in order to keep them. I prefer a slightly demilitarized populace over militarized police which has to be militarized because they have no way of knowing if you have a handgun or a grenade launcher.



"A nutjob won't be bothered by any checks after obtaining a gun, so the idea of post-purchase regulation is completely pointless."
Maybe i should have been more spesific, FULL DEPTH searches are performed BY THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT after purchase IN THOSE STATES WHO USE THIS METHOD OF REGULATION. The day of the purchase, before money has changed hands there is a basic background check IN ALL STATES, with the purchaser awaiting, run through police databases for criminal records for the usual black flags (APBs for arrest, validating Personal ID, criminal record including number expunged) and if that passes then the gun is handed over, but even then MOST states have a waiting period for the Full Depth check to be executed (typically 2 weeks, California even has a full 90 days)

"[Incoherent protectionist babble, line 2-6]"
It isn't just about being prepared for an invasion or being able to aid our main armed forces, it's also a threat to our own government which reads in the most bold, 99pt font MS Word can produce "If you screw us over, or try to take away our ability to kill you for screwing us over, we will KILL you" the one thing we fear more than anything else is our own government oppressing and killing us. a fear instilled in us by the long old lineage of queens trying to tax us into poverty and killing us for saying no. why do you think the Riots in Ferguson and Oliver are STILL going? BECAUSE WE ARE SCARED SHITLESS OF GOVERNMENT OPPRESSION!

"[Incoherent protectionist babble, line 7-9]"
We've NEVER had a spree shooter use his own legally obtained weapon although i will admit they generally use family member's weapons which is illegal. and we DO have restrictions on what and who can buy a gun, Age restrictions on both weapons and ammunitions, those with a criminal record of any sort may NEVER own a gun and often have regular officer searches to be sure they don't have any, Semi-Automatic weapons only without LOTS of government sanctioned Armorer classes and a huge fee, all Grenades, Incendiary, and Gas weapons are entirely ILLEGAL without being a member of the main army forces and Tracer ammunition is only barely legal as "Training ammunition", no MK.19 grenade launchers with anything but flares (since all other ammunition is illegal and really hard to get black-market, I've tried just for shits and giggles), no M249 LMG/SAW, nothing crazy like your own sensationalist media plays it up as, JUST Semi-automatic rifles and shotguns

"[Typical "Only people like me should own a gun" line]"
-sigh- 2 words, screw off. What passes in your country won't pass here. attempting to add trainings will only postpone those truly intended on using a legal gun for illegal deeds. hell, I've heard of people coming back from full army service with a clean bill of health and use their skills to kill innocent people on their homeland because those skills are what they wanted out of it all. (why do you think our government treats our veterans so poorly?)

@Vengenceonu there will always be that person who breaks, the spesific shooting you mention involves someone who was bullied to no end by 2 or more co-workers, 2 of which he killed, until the day he was fired. Can you imagine ~40 years of devoting your life to a job you have obsessed about since childhood and spending  more than a full year non-stop being harassed by your co-workers to the point of multiple breakdowns and eventually being fired? He was broken by those around him, spending 2 years trying to get legal repercussion for their actions, suing the station twice for discrimination the first time the judge claimed that the issue "had been settled" without citation and threw it out, and when the suit came up again under racism the judge claimed it was "Baseless" even though outside of him it was an all-white broadcasting team, this is someone who wasn't given justice and wrongfully tried to take it into his own hands. more a problem of "Humans treating others terribly" and less "guns need better regulation".

I'm out of here, this argument of cultural ignorance will go nowhere. continuing on for either side is just pissing in the wind, you don't see my side because you didn't grow up here and i don't see your side because it means more control for our government.


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## grossaffe (Aug 30, 2015)

Guns are not a privilege to be granted by the government; they are a right.  They are so important of a right that they are the second after our freedom of speech/press/assembly/religion.  The reason why the right to bear arms is so important isn't because some burglar might break into your home (though it is not a bad reason to own a gun), it is because it is the one right that gives power to all the others.  It gives citizens the ability to stand up to the government.  Our country was born in revolution and founded on the principle that the government exists by the will of the people, not the other way around. 

Gun registration?  No thank-you.  I do not want the government to have a nice easy list of homes to visit when the time comes they've decided that citizens should no longer be armed.  NAZI Germany enacted gun registration before using the registration to disarm the citizenry.  Yes, NAZI Germany is used as an example too often, so how about an American example?  California enacted an Assault Weapons ban with a Grandfather Clause stating that if you already had one, you could keep it if you registered it.  They then turned around and used the registry to later confiscate the formerly grandfathered guns. 

You don't like our militarized police?  I agree, but it has nothing to do with lack of gun control.  There is a piece of legislation that _requires_ police forces to use that military-grade equipment with a certain regularity or else it will be taken away, and you'll not see a part of the government willingly give up funding/resources.

At the end of the day, and I mean no offense by this, but frankly I don't care how Europeans (or anybody else) feel about how our government is run.  I'd equally expect Europeans to be uninterested in how Americans think European countries should run.


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## XDel (Aug 30, 2015)

So is it safe to speak freely and sarcastically in the DOOMWORLD forums now? Has the focus shifted to the Pokemon crowd as the next potential 5th Column recruiting agency of young chidlren?


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## Hells Malice (Aug 30, 2015)

grossaffe said:


> Guns are not a privilege to be granted by the government; they are a right.  They are so important of a right that they are the second after our freedom of speech/press/assembly/religion.  The reason why the right to bear arms is so important isn't because some burglar might break into your home (though it is not a bad reason to own a gun), it is because it is the one right that gives power to all the others.  It gives citizens the ability to stand up to the government.  Our country was born in revolution and founded on the principle that the government exists by the will of the people, not the other way around.
> 
> Gun registration? No thank-you.



Man and so many Americans must wonder why so many people refuse to step foot in America  So many of you are fucking nuts.
It baffles the mind that anyone could be so twisted into believing insane shit like that.
There's a reason the "land of the free" is probably more restricted by fear and laws than any other first world country. Freedoms and rights, hah what a fucking joke.

There's so much one could say, but i'll spare the effort to save myself from having the Pledge of Allegiance screamed at me while machine guns fire in the background.


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## grossaffe (Aug 30, 2015)

Hells Malice said:


> Man and so many Americans must wonder why so many people refuse to step foot in America  So many of you are fucking nuts.
> It baffles the mind that anyone could be so twisted into believing insane shit like that.
> There's a reason the "land of the free" is probably more restricted by fear and laws than any other first world country. Freedoms and rights, hah what a fucking joke.
> 
> There's so much one could say, but i'll spare the effort to save myself from having the Pledge of Allegiance screamed at me while machine guns fire in the background.


Why would someone expressing distrust in the government scream the pledge of allegiance at you?  I refused to say it when I was in high school because it is basically nationalistic propaganda foisted upon children.  I pledge no allegiance to the country simply for being the country in which I live; I instead ally myself to the ideals of liberty as expressed by our founding fathers.  The fact that congress added the words "under god" to the pledge in the 1950s just shows out out of touch our politicians have become with our founding ideals, considering the very first amendment establishes freedom of religion, not adherence to Abrahamic Monotheism.


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## Foxi4 (Aug 30, 2015)

This is why the rest of the world laughs at Americans - slogans like "you can't turk ur gurnz!" and "we need gurnz in case we need to topple a tyrannical government!" - you're not taking down the government, tyrannical or not, the government is, how do I put it bluntly... "better equipped". Nobody wants to take away your guns, it would just be beneficial to everyone if high standards were in place in order to make sure that buyers are eligible to even use a gun in the first place. You can yell about background checks being performed in all states till your face is blue, that doesn't change the fact that the U.S. is one of the only countries in the world where little Johnny can take his dad's guns, go to school and shoot a bunch of other kids because he read an extremist's website. Guns are not the problem, sure - your nation's attitude towards them is, big time. Saying that restricting the distribution of guns in a sensible manner restricts your freedom to bear arms is like saying that the legal requirement of having a driving license restricts your freedom of interstate travel - it's total nonsense. You have the freedom to bear arms and everyone else has the freedom to be safe, require you to be responsible with guns and store them in a safe manner - a locked safe or gun cabinet, which is where they belong when they're not in use.


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## sarkwalvein (Aug 30, 2015)

I feel more in peace and live better in a place where I just don't need to carry a gun to feel safe, and where I also know that it is very difficult that someone in a bad day could go nuts take a gun out of his closet and go on a killing spree.
PS: Just in case, I live in Germany.

EDIT: Also, have you noticed that the Police here works to help you, and it is not an entity that might inspire any kind of fear to the average citizen?... That is really different that in the whole South-Center-North American continent, including the almighty USA. (Well, perhaps in Canada it is different, I just don't know)


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## grossaffe (Aug 30, 2015)

And this is precisely why I waited so long to post on the topic.  Clearly this is not a place where people are willing to have a mature discussion on the topic.


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## sarkwalvein (Aug 30, 2015)

grossaffe said:


> And this is precisely why I waited so long to post on the topic.  Clearly this is not a place where people are willing to have a mature discussion on the topic.


Why do you think so?
And what is the topic now?
I have seen this go from the Boston PD preventing a massacre, to actual theories that it was all a bad joke from these two kids, to a discussion on right to carry and own firearms by common citizens... to... well, where are we now?
What is the topic you wanted to have a mature discussion on?
On the one hand, trust me regarding this, people from outside of America are kind of freaked out (or at least somewhat scared) with this concept of common citizens carrying firearms. That can be good, or bad, or whatever, but it is true.
Also I think I went OT with this, but regarding the role and significance police has in the mind of the common citizen, I speak from my own experience, based mostly in what I see in Argentina, not in the USA, but it matches what I listen from people in the USA.
As I have no personal experience regarding the situation in the USA other than news and talks with third parties, this should be taken with a grain of salt.

I don't know if any of those comments of mine offended you, or if you were offended by something else. But at least I don't think my comments are in the proportion to say I derailed the conversation into something where it "is not a place where people are willing to have a mature discussion on the topic".


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## grossaffe (Aug 30, 2015)

sarkwalvein said:


> Why do you think so?
> And what is the topic now?
> I have seen this go from the Boston PD preventing a massacre, to actual theories that it was all a bad joke from these two kids, to a discussion on right to carry and own firearms by common citizens... to... well, where are we now?
> What is the topic you wanted to have a mature discussion on?


It's not so much that I desired to have a mature discussion on a particular topic as much as my preference that discussions on serious topics in general be mature.  This thread was going to inevitably become about gun control as that is how this always goes down, but this just does not seem to be a forum capable of having a mature discussion on that topic.



> On the one hand, trust me regarding this, people from outside of America are kind of freaked out (or at least somewhat scared) with this concept of common citizens carrying firearms. That can be good, or bad, or whatever, but it is true.


I've noticed.  The same is also true of many in America who have never handled a gun.  Sometimes all it takes to get someone to stop crusading against guns is to put one in their hands and teach them how to use it properly.  It loses its mystique and the reputation built up for it in the media.  I can't count the number of times I've seen the cliche on TV and Film where a character proclaims something to the effect of "don't worry, it's empty" and then the gun goes off.



> Also I think I went OT with this, but regarding the role and significance police has in the mind of the common citizen, I speak from my own experience, based mostly in what I see in Argentina, not in the USA, but it matches what I listen from people in the USA.
> As I have no personal experience regarding the situation in the USA other than news and talks with third parties, this should be taken with a grain of salt.


I don't think you went OT with that, really, as the police were brought up by Foxi (if not earlier) and then addressed by myself.
On the subject of police, most of the police we have are good people.  My own personal experiences with police have been positive.  The school resource officer at my middle school took me out of lunch one day to show me the M16 he had in the back of his squad car from his SWAT training.  My car once broke down on a busy road and a cop came along to help me get my car off the road (which I couldn't do myself while the car was still moving because the other assholes on the road kept illegally passing me on the shoulder which prevented me from getting over and out of the way).  Then there was the time my car died (for good  ) on another major road (I did manage to get to the shoulder that time) at around 1:30 in the morning, and a cop swung by and gave me a lift to a convenience store so I could pick up some antifreeze in the off chance that coolant could get my car running again (since the engine had overheated and the coolant reservoir was empty).  There was the time just last winter when the cops were called on my because I was playing pond hockey (one of those nosey neighbors out  there who thinks they know what's best for us).  After a bit of discussion, they were willing walk away and not check the sign near the pond to see if it says to stay off the ice (which it does), and just asked us to try to be quieter on the ice to keep anyone else from calling them about us.

Anyways, my point is that most cops here are good cops that put service to the community first.  It's a big deal to us when the police abuse their power, and it's a part of our culture to put it out there when they do in the hopes that we can get better.  I guess a side effect of that is that the world sees our dirty laundry and paints a picture of us based on that, but so be it.



> I don't know if any of those comments of mine offended you, or if you were offended by something else. But at least I don't think my comments are in the proportion to say I derailed the conversation into something where it "is not a place where people are willing to have a mature discussion on the topic".


I wasn't really referring to you (although I think the "Almighty America" comment was a bit unnecessary), but rather the individuals out there resorting to Ad Hominem remarks with offensive and ignorant caricatures of Americans.


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## sarkwalvein (Aug 30, 2015)

grossaffe said:


> I wasn't really referring to you (although I think the "Almighty America" comment was a bit unnecessary), but rather the individuals out there resorting to Ad Hominem remarks with offensive and ignorant caricatures of Americans.


Sorry, that actually sounded bad. I was trying to convey I didn't think it was only a third world problem, but sure my wording could have been better.


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## grossaffe (Aug 30, 2015)

sarkwalvein said:


> Sorry, that actually sounded bad. I was trying to convey I didn't think it was only a third world problem, but sure my wording could have been better.


Apology accepted.  Also, I'm not quite sure what you were saying there.  Were you saying that the cops in Argentina are more benevolent than the ones in the rest of the American Continents?  If so, I would advise taking into consideration that you are likely to hear only negative things from the news, so comparing police where you are to places that you haven't been and haven't experienced directly may lead to a skewed view.


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## sarkwalvein (Aug 30, 2015)

grossaffe said:


> Apology accepted.  Also, I'm not quite sure what you were saying there.  Were you saying that the cops in Argentina are more benevolent than the ones in the rest of the American Continents?  If so, I would advise taking into consideration that you are likely to hear only negative things from the news, so comparing police where you are to places that you haven't been and haven't experienced directly may lead to a skewed view.


Nope, cops in Argentina are not exactly benevolent, they may sometimes abuse power but -normally- not with lethal consequences (not that it is good anyway).
Even so they are not so helpful.
You can expect them to trick you, ask for bribes, and in general, when you think of somebody helpful you don't think of the police.
Of course there are good policemen and bad policemen, like in every place, but IMHO there is so much corruption that good policemen can't do much.
I was actually saying that I find the way people see the police, and how the police works, is very different in Argentina (and probably also in the rest of Latin America and even the USA), compared to Germany where I now live.

EDIT: I find the police in Germany to be quite helpful even to foreigners like me that barely speak German.


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## grossaffe (Aug 31, 2015)

sarkwalvein said:


> Nope, cops in Argentina are not exactly benevolent, they may sometimes abuse power but -normally- not with lethal consequences (not that it is good anyway).
> Even so they are not so helpful.
> You can expect them to trick you, ask for bribes, and in general, when you think of somebody helpful you don't think of the police.
> Of course there are good policemen and bad policeman, like in every place, but IMHO there is so much corruption that good policemen can't do much.
> I was actually saying that I find the way people see the police, and how the police works, is very different in Argentina (and probably also in the rest of Latin America and even the USA), compared to Germany where I now live.


Oh, I think I missed the Germany part.  I saw you have the Argentina flag under your name, so I associated "here" with Argentina.

I find it difficult, sometimes, comparing something from a European country to the United States because we're so much bigger and more diverse, and each of our states can have such different ways of doing things.  We've got very urban areas like DC and Philly where there'll be more crime and cops may be more aggressive and corruptible, and then there are suburban and rural areas where one can expect much a much more relaxed police service where the cops probably spend a lot more time just helping people rather than dealing with violent crime.

I'm with you that corruption and abuse of power is not exclusive to third world countries.  We've got our own demons in that aspect, but we're working on it.  I think we may be looking at a time of change in America right now when it comes to policing.  The Ferguson riots seem to have set off a chain reaction and has really raised awareness that will give us the chance to look at what we are currently doing and will hopefully lead to improving ourselves.


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