# DSi Flashcarts will be practically useless



## DeltaBurnt (Oct 31, 2009)

Ok so the first DSi only game was just released (System Flaw, a shovelware game). And alot of people are thinking of taking it and editing it to make it a DSi flashcart. But that won't do anything.

Here's me talking on #dsidev with a few other people (the irc network is efnet).

Basically DSi Only games are signed with the common key like DSi Ware. So if you try to run DSi homebrew through a DSi flashcart the DSi will reject it because it's not signed.

Thus meaning the only thing DSi flashcarts could do (until we get the common key, which probably won't be released because Team Twiizers would probably want to prevent DSi flashcarts from succeeding) is play DSi enhanced and dsi only games and so far that's just shovelware.



			
				QUOTE said:
			
		

> [20:34]  yet DELTAburn you couldn't really pirate anything with a DSi flashcart yet cause there aren't many DSi games
> [20:35]  *anything YET
> [20:35]  Yah
> [20:35]  But people would write things like wad managers and wad creaters pretty fast
> ...


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## ChuckBartowski (Oct 31, 2009)

so roms work, but no homebrew. Dammit.


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## BoxShot (Oct 31, 2009)

Hackers will prevail! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Thanks for saddening my day.


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## DeltaBurnt (Oct 31, 2009)

BoxShot said:
			
		

> Hackers will prevail!
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Pessimism ftw.


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## BoxShot (Oct 31, 2009)

Eh I'm a pessimist half of the time anyways out of gbatemp er more like online.

Well we still have dsi flashcarts (non dsi mode) that run ds games. DSi only games don't really look like they are going to be any good so far. Only thing I'd like right now is some of the dsiware.


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## Hop2089 (Oct 31, 2009)

They know once the common key is released all hell will break loose and the noobs will flood places like GBATemp.  If the key is cracked then Nintendo will really put the iron fist on flashcarts.


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## BoxShot (Oct 31, 2009)

Yet that won't be happening anytime soon will it?


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## DeltaBurnt (Oct 31, 2009)

Hop2089 said:
			
		

> They know once the common key is released all hell will break loose and the noobs will flood places like GBATemp.  If the key is cracked then Nintendo will really put the iron fist on flashcarts.



Exactly why it probably won't be released to the public for awhile.


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## iFish (Oct 31, 2009)

i dont think team twiizers can help making a dsi homebrew cahnnel


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## DeltaBurnt (Oct 31, 2009)

ifish said:
			
		

> i dont think team twiizers can help making a dsi homebrew cahnnel



What do you mean by that?


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## iFish (Oct 31, 2009)

team twiizers are itching to dig into the dsi and make us happy


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## DeltaBurnt (Oct 31, 2009)

ifish said:
			
		

> team twiizers are itching to dig into the dsi and make us happy



So what you're saying is that you're happy TT is working on the DSi hacking alot?


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## luke_c (Oct 31, 2009)

Saw this coming...


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## Maikel Steneker (Oct 31, 2009)

Wait, they do have the common key already? And how would it be possible for DSi flashcards to play DSi only games? I thought they ran in DS mode...


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## yuyuyup (Oct 31, 2009)

hurry up and hack it 4 my enjoyment


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## Vague Rant (Oct 31, 2009)

Nobody in this topic knows anything about anything.


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## DeltaBurnt (Oct 31, 2009)

Vague Rant said:
			
		

> Nobody in this topic knows anything about anything.



I'm not a hacker but I'm not some noob who trys to hex edit the .bin files of dsiware.

Apparently DSi only games (the roms) are signed in a similar if not the same way as dsiware. Meaning with a dsi flashcart it will be impossible to play DSi mode homebrew unless it's signed like DSi ware or like a channel.

Also the common key was not found I was just saying TT would probably be the ones to find it and they probably wouldn't just hand it out so people can software that allows you to pirate more.


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## stab244 (Oct 31, 2009)

The only thing that would be DSi only that would be of interest will probably be first-party titles...


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## iFish (Oct 31, 2009)

i would love for team twiizers to make the homebrew channel dsi but ofr now if a dsi game come out that i want ill pick it up and not be a cheap jew lol


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## stab244 (Oct 31, 2009)

Considering that Team Twiizers doesn't encourage piracy, I'm not surprised that they didn't leak the Common Key.


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## cracker (Oct 31, 2009)

There's a lot of speculation about what protection the DSi has for DSi mode so it may not be nearly as bad as some are thinking. I wouldn't doubt if there were a save game exploit for DSi only games that would allow arbitrary code to be executed in DSi mode.. Thus leading to Wii type-hacks and hopefully softmods/CFW. There's probably a lot more progress being accomplished in private than we know.


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## DeltaBurnt (Nov 1, 2009)

cracker said:
			
		

> There's a lot of speculation about what protection the DSi has for DSi mode so it may not be nearly as bad as some are thinking. I wouldn't doubt if there were a save game exploit for DSi only games that would allow arbitrary code to be executed in DSi mode.. Thus leading to Wii type-hacks and hopefully softmods/CFW. There's probably a lot more progress being accomplished in private than we know.



Yes I realize that, but DSi mode flashcarts are different from softmods. This topic is saying that DSi mode flashcarts won't be able to run homebrew that uses the DSi's cameras because it will need to be signed to be able to be played.


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## jackdanielchan (Nov 1, 2009)

The only other person who might have the DSi common-key is Yasu... And well, we haven't seen much of him have we?


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## lolzed (Nov 1, 2009)

jackdanielchan said:
			
		

> The only other person who might have the DSi common-key is Yasu... And well, we haven't seen much of him have we?


thats not true,prove that he has it,i haven't exactly heard that he really has the common key,if your pointing about his video(i think it was him),it could have been faked


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## DeltaBurnt (Nov 1, 2009)

lolzed said:
			
		

> jackdanielchan said:
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Don't freak out he didn't say he did have it he just said he might have it.

Right now I'm pretty sure no one has the common key.


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## iPikachu (Nov 1, 2009)

yuyuyup said:
			
		

> hurry up and hack it 4 my enjoyment


troll? or incredibly stupid?


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## BoxShot (Nov 1, 2009)

I think he is being both.


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## popoffka (Nov 1, 2009)

I think, that this signing will be hacked pretty soon.

Wasn't there the same thing with Wii? As I remember, there also were some crap with signing.

And also, I think that maybe, it's possible to do something like PassMe, so it will authenticate with DSi-only game's key and then boot something else(flashcart, for example)?


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## Zantheo (Nov 1, 2009)

At least DSI flashcarts can play normal DS roms. That's what most people are buying them for anyway.


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## cracker (Nov 1, 2009)

DeltaBurnt said:
			
		

> cracker said:
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But what I'm saying is that after the initial check for DSi mode to be 'unlocked' with a commercial game then it may be possible that homebrew booted through a TP style save exploit may be able to have full access to the DSi hardware. Hopefully this would be the case and there wouldn't be more than just a check upon booting the commercial game...


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## DeltaBurnt (Nov 1, 2009)

popoffka said:
			
		

> I think, that this signing will be hacked pretty soon.
> 
> Wasn't there the same thing with Wii? As I remember, there also were some crap with signing.
> 
> ...



Yes well I suppose they could do this, but that's basically a passmi but even more annoying. It'd just be easier to take that exploit and install the homebrew channel.

EDIT: Huge mistake in the first post, the games are not signed by the common key they are signed by a different key that only Nintendo has access to.


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## stab244 (Nov 1, 2009)

I guess we'll just have to wait for an exploit to the next-gen DS...


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## cracker (Nov 1, 2009)

DeltaBurnt said:
			
		

> Yes well I suppose they could do this, but that's basically a passmi but even more annoying. It'd just be easier to take that exploit and install the homebrew channel.



That's what I was saying in my previous post... It will probably come down to a TP -> HBC like exploit (hopefully).


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## shakirmoledina (Nov 2, 2009)

i dont think this is very threatening... anything can be hacked unless it is using different language or something (i dont know) by which a person cannot meddle around with anything or else there is always a way esp since it's nintendo, they are not as good as others (like sony) but they did good nonetheless
i dont know how they will do it but they surely CAN


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## DeltaBurnt (Nov 3, 2009)

shakirmoledina said:
			
		

> i dont think this is very threatening... anything can be hacked unless it is using different language or something (i dont know) by which a person cannot meddle around with anything or else there is always a way esp since it's nintendo, they are not as good as others (like sony) but they did good nonetheless
> i dont know how they will do it but they surely CAN



Yah but it's a private key only Nintendo has access too, it's not so much intimidating as it is "ah let's just go back to the original plan, a homebrew channel".


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## worlok375 (Nov 3, 2009)

popoffka said:
			
		

> I think, that this signing will be hacked pretty soon.
> 
> Wasn't there the same thing with Wii? As I remember, there also were some crap with signing.
> 
> And also, I think that maybe, it's possible to do something like PassMe, so it will authenticate with DSi-only game's key and then boot something else(flashcart, for example)?



Well if something was authenticated with the game key and it ran what then? Would the flashcart require extra firmware combined with this code to be able to run the homebrew?

By the way popoffka KURUMU FOR THE WIN!!!!


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## popoffka (Nov 4, 2009)

worlok375 said:
			
		

> popoffka said:
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I thought about something that will work like iPhone ProxySIM(or how it's called) works - when console needs authenticate information(that secret key) it directs the request to original game card, when anything else is requested - it's directed to a flashcart. About the need for extra firmware for flashcarts - i don't really know, maybe any cart will work, maybe you'll have to install some special DSi-only firmware, in fact, I'm not a coder and I don't really know much about all those things, I'm just suggesting my ideas.

And about Kurumu - yeah, she's soooo cute


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## stab244 (Nov 4, 2009)

The only thing that I would care about is loading from SD card slot... But no flashcart manufacturer will want the Common Key leaked since then they would lose their business.


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## sjones900 (Nov 5, 2009)

What about the M3i Zero, couldn't it be flashed as a DSi game? Not 100% on this but I'm sure there are more in depth checks the dsi does for the dsi games than just DS games. But that could work couldn't it?


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## Guild McCommunist (Nov 5, 2009)

Why is this topic User Submitted News? This isn't anything but essentially theorycrafting, from what I'm guessing. News is if you learn the latest Zelda title is called Oracle of Sausages or something, not "well, I'm thinking that this might happen..."

And who fucking cares if there's not DSi-game flashcarts. I don't think there's a single game worth half my spit that uses DSi features. Most game developers will either settle with a regular game with DSi features or a standard DS game. It's common logic. If you've got 3 people buying food from you and 2 of them have pots with small holes in them, you're not going to sell only soup. Yeah, that was a horrible metaphor but I'm too lazy and incompetent to think of another one.

It's a fact that I doubt anyone will care about. The only reason people are making such a big fuss over this is because they want to show off their hacking cocks and because when you put a title like "DSI FLASHCARTS WILL BE PRACTICALLY USELESS", people want to shoot it down.

Also, change the fucking title. It sounds like "Nintendo will update all DSi's without your consent so they will never ever ever use any type of flashcart ever".

Jesus Christ...


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## sjones900 (Nov 5, 2009)

Guild McCommunist said:
			
		

> Why is this topic User Submitted News? This isn't anything but essentially theorycrafting, from what I'm guessing. News is if you learn the latest Zelda title is called Oracle of Sausages or something, not "well, I'm thinking that this might happen..."
> 
> And who fucking cares if there's not DSi-game flashcarts. I don't think there's a single game worth half my spit that uses DSi features. Most game developers will either settle with a regular game with DSi features or a standard DS game. It's common logic. If you've got 3 people buying food from you and 2 of them have pots with small holes in them, you're not going to sell only soup. Yeah, that was a horrible metaphor but I'm too lazy and incompetent to think of another one.
> 
> ...



Wow dude you're over reacting a bit don't you think? If that's what he wanted for his title so what.. and if it turns into a little bit of speculation, so.. whats your point, that always happens around here. Everyone is trying to figure how this is all gonna work usually that happens when you ask questions. So taking a stand right here, right now will not change a thing.. There will always be people who ask stupid question, speculate silly things, and occasionally post misleading forum topics. Oh well, it's just how it works it's annoying I know but it can't really be helped..


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## Vague Rant (Nov 5, 2009)

sjones900 said:
			
		

> Wow dude you're over reacting a bit don't you think? If that's what he wanted for his title so what.. and if it turns into a little bit of speculation, so.. whats your point, that always happens around here. Everyone is trying to figure how this is all gonna work usually that happens when you ask questions.


But as I already stated, nobody in this topic knows anything about anything. I'm not being inflammatory, it's just that all of the "theories" in this topic are complete fucking nonsense. Remember that old DSi Homebrew Channel topic which went fuck nowhere, and yet they had all their art ready? The whole thing was moronic, nobody there knew the first thing about hacking the DSi, and the same is true in this topic. I know nobody's going to stop being morons just because I told them to, but it's highly unlikely that any of you are going to come up with the groundbreaking DSi hack without actually knowing anything about DSi hacking. I know you think you do, but you don't. None of you even understand Wii hacking. This topic is horrible. I'm out.


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## stab244 (Nov 6, 2009)

Here's a suggestion for a new title: "DSi mode flashcarts will be pointless". Okay... Maybe that isn't so great.


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## cracker (Nov 6, 2009)

Maybe 'Dsi mode flashcarts will unleash a crapload of shovelware on pirates'.


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