# What does "Shutting down the governement" means exactly?



## Noctosphere (Dec 11, 2018)

Because right now, at news, they're talking about Trump who had a meeting with democrates leader
And Trump said he wants a wall at the border with mexico
Democrates werent agreeing with him, and, if i got it right, Trump needed some votes from democrates to order to build the wall

However, once again, if i got it right, Trump had a "second option", shutting down the government...
Trump said if he can't have that wall, he would be proud of shutting down the government in order to prevent "criminals and drugs dealer" from crossing the border...

So here's my question, what does "shutting down the government" means exactly?
With the reaction of democrates leader, it seems awful...


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## bitjacker (Dec 11, 2018)

Not so sure it means anything. Congress will draw a paycheck regardless. You can still get a speeding ticket during a government shutdown. Everyone still gets welfare, too.
Im not so sure its legal for the executive to issue an ultimatium because of a childlike tantrum.
Perhaps when the government shuts down everyone in cushy government jobs should loose the positition (along with the kickass medical benifits) and new people should take the jobs?


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## Noctosphere (Dec 11, 2018)

bitjacker said:


> Not so sure it means anything. Congress will draw a paycheck regardless. You can still get a speeding ticket during a government shutdown. Everyone still gets welfare, too.
> Im not so sure its legal for the executive to issue an ultimatium because of a childlike tantrum.


I agree with ya, Trump is a child


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## Xzi (Dec 11, 2018)

Shutdowns have happened previously, but they didn't last long.  Basically it just means that some federal services become unavailable and certain federal workers (including some active duty and military reserves) receive reduced pay during that period.

Trump's a fucking idiot if he thinks he's getting his wall _after_ losing the vast majority of congressional seats.  He had control of all three branches for two years and the only thing Republicans passed was corporate welfare, so it's clear where their priorities really sit.

Edit: Oh, and why are we shutting down our government over funding for a wall that Mexico was supposed to pay for?


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## supermist (Dec 11, 2018)

Let me remind everyone that Trump campaigned on the fact that Mexico would pay for the wall. He has no business demanding federal funding.


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## Noctosphere (Dec 11, 2018)

supermist said:


> Let me remind everyone that Trump campaigned on the fact that Mexico would pay for the wall. He has no business demanding federal funding.


its sooo obvious that mexico will be willing to pay for the wall usa wants

oh btw, my sistra wants a switch, anyone willing to buy her one?


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## tech3475 (Dec 11, 2018)

Noctosphere said:


> its sooo obvious that mexico will be willing to pay for the wall usa wants
> 
> --------------------- MERGED ---------------------------
> 
> oh btw, my sistra wants a switch, anyone willing to buy her one?



Ask Mexico.


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## Pacheko17 (Dec 11, 2018)

bitjacker said:


> Not so sure it means anything. Congress will draw a paycheck regardless. You can still get a speeding ticket during a government shutdown. Everyone still gets welfare, too.
> Im not so sure its legal for the executive to issue an ultimatium because of a childlike tantrum.
> Perhaps when the government shuts down everyone in cushy government jobs should loose the positition (along with the kickass medical benifits) and new people should take the jobs?



Wanting to protect your borders is somehow a childlike tantrum now.


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## supermist (Dec 11, 2018)

A wall is an unnecessary waste of tax payer dollars and won't do a thing anyway.


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## Xzi (Dec 11, 2018)

Pacheko17 said:


> Wanting to protect your borders is somehow a childlike tantrum now.


It's not even about that.  He wants $5 billion dollars of taxpayer money for a wall that will be built on the cheap anyway, and last at most ten years before it's almost entirely in pieces.  Not to mention the amount of Eminent domain use that would be required along our Southern border.

The only reason Trump wants this funding is to funnel more money from the government to his 'friendly' corporations through contracts.  Some of which can then be funneled back to his businesses.  Gotta get a few final cash-ins before the whole Mueller investigation comes crashing down.


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## Noctosphere (Dec 11, 2018)

Xzi said:


> It's not even about that.  He wants $5 billion dollars of taxpayer money for a wall that will be built on the cheap anyway, and last at most ten years before it's almost entirely in pieces.  Not to mention the amount of Eminent domain use that would be required along our Southern border.
> 
> The only reason Trump wants this funding is to funnel more money from the government to his 'friendly' corporations through contracts.  Some of which can then be funneled back to his businesses.  Gotta get a few final cash-ins before the whole Mueller investigation comes crashing down.


not to mention all those undergrounds tunnels where drugs and immigrants pass through
wall wont do shit about that


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## chrisrlink (Dec 11, 2018)

fyi trumps legal problems are heating up he'll transition alright from the white house to the big house after he's impeached he's fair game for prison ironic he wanted Hilary in prison and he might go there himself....shutting down the government would most 100% be the final nail in his political coffin


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## Taleweaver (Dec 12, 2018)

Bitjacker said:
			
		

> Im not so sure its legal for the executive to issue an ultimatium because of a childlike tantrum.





Pacheko17 said:


> Wanting to protect your borders is somehow a childlike tantrum now.


I don't think that is what @bitjacker really meant to say. From what I gather from the video this whole debate stems from, it basically boils down to two disagreeing sides. Trump wants to build the wall to increase security, Pelosi and Schumer disagree. Pelosi mostly for financial reasons, Schumer because he argues that experts deem it inefficient. This in itself isn't out of the ordinary. It'd be even a civil argument.

The childlike tantrum isn't so much about that, but that Trump is deaf to their arguments. And unfortunately, "deaf to their arguments" is putting it mildly. Not only does he not hear what they say, he even interrupts them with his own propaganda while they're arguing their stance. To me (I assume to @bitjacker as well, but I can't speak on his behalf), it's really THAT behavior that is absolutely childish.

Trump: we should build the wall. It enhances our defences.
Pelosi: actually...the finances for the wall won't mean the country is better protected
Trump: but it enhances our defenses. Thus we should build a wall.
Pelosi: we didn't need a wall until now, and there's no reason why today would be different.
Trump: look...all we need is to defend ourselves from the outside world. That's why we need that wall.

And so on. I've read a few books about assertiveness, and this is a scholar example of what was there called "the broken record" method. If you want to get your point across, you shouldn't let others let your from deviating or diverting from that goal. To a degree, there's nothing wrong with that (probably all politicians and most public debaters are familiar with this stuff). The problem is that this is a tool that can be used for good and for bad. Just repeating the same line (or answering/dodging replies just enough to get you back on track to deliver that same message) can blind you from things that might be important. And this is the case: he flat out ignores sound and solid arguments. The cost? Irrelevant. Deemed inefficient by security experts? Irrelevant. Why? Because Trump's goal is to build that wall...NOT to be convinced by something called "the best solution".

In a way, it's hilarious how especially Schumer could see right through this. He understood that Trump's first part of the reply isn't really to be taken seriously, and just a way for him to get back to repeating his initial stance. And damnit, did he played it perfectly. I'm not in an environment to watch it again, but it went something like this:

Schumer: look, mr. President. The point is that a wall would be inefficient.
Trump: so what? The important thing is that we protect our borders!
Schumer: you just called your wall inefficient.

If the stakes weren't so high (hey! Live television!  ) and Trump had any sense of self relativation, he could 've said something like "damn...you've got me there. Okay, I misspoke: the wall IS important...". But Donald Trump doesn't admit defeat. Ever. So this whole "shut down the government" or even the "I'll send in the militia" isn't supposed to be taken seriously. He didn't mean that as a threat, and probably denies ever having said that despite it being all over the internet. It's just that his conversation loop got broken, and he got mad for it.

The moral of this story would be "and that's why you won't give a child whom you deny a piece of candy a loaded gun"...but Donald Trump does have a proverbial gun ("the others won't like me saying that I'd shut down the government so I can get what I want when I AM saying it"). He sees the power given to him as a president as a tool to keep everyone else under his thumb, rather than as a sign of respect which you can use for reaching the best possible agreement.


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## bitjacker (Dec 13, 2018)

We have checks an balances in place so one part of the government can not be the only decider. POTUS is not the be all and end all. He demanded mexico to pay for the wall, so yeah... the money that came out of my fucking paycheck needs to go to feed homeless people. or a school just for autistic kids.


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## Noctosphere (Dec 17, 2018)

They were talking about this at news once again
Apparently, if democrates dont give their vote to Trump's wall project,
Trump is going to shut down the government
If I got it right, it means government employees won't receive their wage until it's unparalysed


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## comput3rus3r (Dec 17, 2018)

Besides the wall we need signs all across that say "private property, no trespassing" We also need to pass the affordable guns act. Then we can all protect our country.


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## Xzi (Dec 19, 2018)

There's not going to be a shutdown after all.  Trump didn't have enough backbone to take the blame, so he caved on the wall funding:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/poli...148a02-0395-11e9-9122-82e98f91ee6f_story.html


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## WiiUBricker (Dec 19, 2018)

lol, now he wants to turn the US military into construction workers to build the wall.


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## the_randomizer (Dec 19, 2018)

Maybe instead of building a dumb ass wall, they could, IDK, have a better system to control immigration regularly?


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## Xzi (Dec 19, 2018)

the_randomizer said:


> Maybe instead of building a dumb ass wall, they could, IDK, have a better system to control immigration regularly?


Great idea.  Only problem is that it doesn't come with a snappy catchphrase.


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## the_randomizer (Dec 19, 2018)

Xzi said:


> Great idea.  Only problem is that it doesn't come with a snappy catchphrase.



A wall, yeah, because people can't go around or fly over those


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## Xzi (Dec 20, 2018)

The shutdown is back on and the stock market is plummeting.  Trump is flip-flopping hard on whether or not to make the wall a priority, probably because he was told he's losing support over it.


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## Ratatattat (Dec 20, 2018)

My understanding is that the President of Mexico campaigned and was elected based on getting America to build a wall. That was so that in a few years when massive amounts of Americans were fleeing to Mexico to get away from the crime, drugs and the cesspool that America had turned into Mexico wouldn't have to build a wall.


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## KingVamp (Dec 20, 2018)

Xzi said:


> The shutdown is back on and the stock market is plummeting.  Trump is flip-flopping hard on whether or not to make the wall a priority, probably because he was told he's losing support over it.




Even if he got his wall, what's to stop someone from knocking it back down anyway?


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## Xzi (Dec 20, 2018)

KingVamp said:


> Even if he got his wall, what's to stop someone from knocking it back down anyway?


A whole lotta nothing.  Hell, it's likely to get destroyed in places _as it's being built_.  Plus it's likely to be constructed out of 2-3 layers of particle board if it ever actually happens.  The idiots who believe a wall accomplishes anything in 2018 are among his fan base, for Trump himself it's just about using wall funding to line the right pockets.  That's why he was willing to give up on it fairly easily before he realized he might finally lose a little of his base over it.


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## cots (Dec 20, 2018)

So the government might "shut down". The last time they did this (shut down) I didn't notice anything that changed. It's not like every government entity or service just stops working. If it does happen what should I expect to see impacted? Will I lost my internet? Will my power go out? Can I still buy food? Will water still fall out of my faucet?


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## Ratatattat (Dec 21, 2018)

The government has already been shut down for years. They just call it congress. Nothing will happen they don't know how. Situation normal.


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## spotanjo3 (Dec 21, 2018)

I don't care about them. They are simple "THE CORRUPT' of all time. They are all NO GOOD! PERIOD.


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## Ratatattat (Dec 21, 2018)

Actually they are no more corrupt today then they were when the rail roads were being established in the 1800s. And I'm sure many other times. Read up on "Cash and Carry". Its normal government.


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## Glyptofane (Dec 21, 2018)

The wall works for Israel and Spain, but those are tiny borders, only a few miles long. Ours would require constant maintenance and patrolling.


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## D34DL1N3R (Dec 21, 2018)




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## leon315 (Dec 21, 2018)

saw the 1st topic, why a french canadian is so concern about Usa's foreigner politics? Just saying.


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## kuwanger (Dec 21, 2018)

Taleweaver said:


> And so on. I've read a few books about assertiveness, and this is a scholar example of what was there called "the broken record" method.



I like to think of it as the dictator's method.  The inherent justification a dictator has to run a country is because he's right, and that means he has to be a broken record especially when he's wrong.  It's why when people say they like strong leaders, I question whether they really know what that means.

Strong leaders may seem like a broken record because they push a certain belief system without much question, but they principally will listen to others and vary their approach as seems reasonable.  The point when they become know-it-alls who refuse counsel either implicitly or explicitly is the point where you no longer have a strong leader but instead a dictator.  And dictators are usually very childish, in the most evil sorts of ways.


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## FAST6191 (Dec 21, 2018)

leon315 said:


> saw the 1st topic, why a french canadian is so concern about Usa's foreigner politics? Just saying.


A place closer to them than the nation's capital, a world power, a producer of a lot of things they enjoy, the primary trade partner of their country and province, a place where they likely have friends and associates? Why indeed.


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## dimmidice (Dec 21, 2018)

http://time.com/5109899/government-shutdown-explainer/ This pretty much explains it all. Basically it's no big deal to the average person at first. But the longer it drags on the worse it gets. That's why these things usually resolved pretty quickly.


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## AkGBA (Dec 21, 2018)

leon315 said:


> saw the 1st topic, why a french canadian is so concern about Usa's foreigner politics? Just saying.



Don't want to answer for OP, but I'd like to say that as a foreigner, I'm concerned about the USA's foreign politic.
Especially as it has effects on countries all over the world.


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## D34DL1N3R (Dec 21, 2018)

I have to laugh at The Orange One and his followers acting all "Take THAT Dem's! Do what you're told or it will shut down!!!", as if a shut down is some sort of punishment that would effect ONLY Dems. Actually, I can't even laugh anymore. It's not even funny. It's just pure stupidity.

GOP had complete control of Congress for two years and he failed to get it done, but now it's suddenly Dems fault? Not to mention just last week he told Democratic House and Senate minority leaders "I am proud to shut down the government for border security," "... I will be the one to shut it down. I'm not going to blame you for it." But then this morning he Tweets "If enough Dems don’t vote, it will be a Democrat Shutdown!"

I say let him shut it down, then we'll see how well THAT works for him. It would just be another nail in his coffin.


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## chrisrlink (Dec 21, 2018)

until my SSI check gets affected i'm not worried (but if the shutdown continues for a long time (months) it will be and I'm afraid trump is willing to shut us down until he gets his damn ineffective wall


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## D34DL1N3R (Dec 21, 2018)

the_randomizer said:


> A wall, yeah, because people can't go around or fly over those



If someone told that to Trump about the only thing I can picture him saying is, "It will be a tall wall. A VERY tall wall. We will build a wall on TOP of a wall on TOP of a wall. It will be so tall in fact, that it can be seen from space. Space force will be able to watch the very tall wall from space & shoot lasers at anyone attempting to fly over or drive around the wall."


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## kuwanger (Dec 21, 2018)

D34DL1N3R said:


> If someone told that to Trump about the only thing I can picture him saying is, "It will be a tall wall. A VERY tall wall. ..."



Uh, yea.  Trump already once, when talking about his wall, went on about how one could defeat such a wall like ropes and ladders.  I don't think he feels any need to actually justify how his wall would actually help.  He just feels the need to keep calling for a wall to rally his base.  That his base are still on board is where the stupidity is.


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## KingVamp (Dec 22, 2018)

Apparently it is going to be a long one. Let's see how long it will last.


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## Noctosphere (Dec 22, 2018)

KingVamp said:


> Apparently it is going to be a long one. Let's see how long it will last.


Yea, from what ive heard, he partially shutted down the govrrnement
Right?


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## GhostLatte (Dec 22, 2018)

I honestly can't wait for this clown to get impeached.


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## Noctosphere (Dec 22, 2018)

GhostLatte said:


> I honestly can't wait for this clown to get impeached.


Trump for jail january 2019

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------

Trail for jump


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## bungboi (Dec 22, 2018)

lmao the irony 



Spoiler: Image


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## Xzi (Dec 22, 2018)

This actually makes the third shutdown under Trump while his party controlled all three branches.  Republicans always say government is incompetent and inefficient, then they get elected and prove themselves right.


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## KingVamp (Dec 23, 2018)

At least he made CBD legal during this time.


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## Xzi (Dec 23, 2018)

KingVamp said:


> At least he made CBD legal during this time.


CBD was already legal in all but like four states IIRC.  Good for those states though, it's almost as dumb as keeping tea illegal since CBD is non-psychoactive.


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## cots (Dec 24, 2018)

So the Government is shut down. The supposed made up crisis is upon us! Heaven forbid some unnecessary jobs aren't performed.


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## KingVamp (Dec 25, 2018)

cots said:


> So the Government is shut down. The supposed made up crisis is upon us! Heaven forbid some unnecessary jobs aren't performed.


Well, they are at least necessary for the people that need those jobs.


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## Xzi (Dec 25, 2018)

cots said:


> So the Government is shut down. The supposed made up crisis is upon us! Heaven forbid some unnecessary jobs aren't performed.


Yes, heaven forbid elected officials do the jobs they were elected to do.  And heaven forbid that they even _try_ to appear competent, shutting down the government for a third time whilst their own party has had complete control of government.


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## Joe88 (Dec 25, 2018)

It doesnt matter becuase you still need 60 votes in the senate, majority doesnt mean anything there.


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## TotalInsanity4 (Dec 25, 2018)

Ratatattat said:


> The government has already been shut down for years. They just call it congress. Nothing will happen they don't know how. Situation normal.


That's great and all, but even if Congress doesn't accomplish anything I still prefer it when teachers, social workers, and the national park services get paid


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## Noctosphere (Dec 25, 2018)

Joe88 said:


> It doesnt matter becuase you still need 60 votes in the senate, majority doesnt mean anything there.


That's what I admire Legault for at Quebec's Assembly
He will vote a law so that some decision made by the Assembly will require 2/3 of Assembly's vote
So majority won't give you freedom to do everything your party wants


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## Xzi (Dec 25, 2018)

Joe88 said:


> It doesnt matter becuase you still need 60 votes in the senate, majority doesnt mean anything there.


It still means something if your ideas are so dumb that they lose both Democrat and Republican votes.  Nobody should be willing to fork over taxpayer dollars for a project that Trump promised Mexico would fund.

Not to mention there's no strategy here.  They shut down the government in desperation because they're about to lose absolute control, but then the Democrats get to be the ones to push to re-open it on January 3rd.  It'll make Republicans look even worse if McConnell and/or Trump reject those efforts.  Even if they manage to get some funding for it, the wall is still a losing issue, and Trump's fan base are the only ones who can't see that.


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## Ratatattat (Dec 26, 2018)

Xzi said:


> It still means something if your ideas are so dumb that they lose both Democrat and Republican votes.  Nobody should be willing to fork over taxpayer dollars for a project that Trump promised Mexico would fund.
> 
> Not to mention there's no strategy here.  They shut down the government in desperation because they're about to lose absolute control, but then the Democrats get to be the ones to push to re-open it on January 3rd.  It'll make Republicans look even worse if McConnell and/or Trump reject those efforts.  Even if they manage to get some funding for it, the wall is still a losing issue, and Trump's fan base are the only ones who can't see that.



Trump has a fan base?


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## TotalInsanity4 (Dec 26, 2018)

Ratatattat said:


> Trump has a fan base?


Ooooooh yeah, the majority of the people who attend his rallies could easily be considered senior fanboys/girls


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## Xzi (Dec 30, 2018)

So turns out that while Trump has the government shut down over a manufactured immigrant crisis, his golf clubs have been handing out fake green cards to illegals working there:

https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entr...agers-say-reports_us_5c283ceae4b0407e908346c3

I know, Trump being a hypocrite?  Shocker.  /s


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## KingVamp (Dec 30, 2018)

TotalInsanity4 said:


> Ooooooh yeah, the majority of the people who attend his rallies could easily be considered senior fanboys/girls


Most are probably paid off.



Xzi said:


> So turns out that while Trump has the government shut down over a manufactured immigrant crisis, his golf clubs have been handing out fake green cards to illegals working there:
> 
> https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entr...agers-say-reports_us_5c283ceae4b0407e908346c3
> 
> I know, Trump being a hypocrite?  Shocker.  /s


I should have, but I didn't believe it when I read about that.


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## kuwanger (Dec 30, 2018)

Xzi said:


> So turns out that while Trump has the government shut down over a manufactured immigrant crisis, his golf clubs have been handing out fake green cards to illegals working there:



To be fair to Trump, he probably is too uninvolved (legally required at the moment?, and definitely good for deniability in the long term) and incompetent to even realize it's happen.  Also, to be fair to Trump, he never explicitly said building a war would stop all illegal immigration or even be particularly effective.  The whole illegals overstaying their visas (and possibly getting fake green cards) is okay as long as they're not Mexicans, right?  Or I guess whatever the current caravan is made up of since it *may* have some Mexicans included.



Xzi said:


> I know, Trump being a hypocrite?



Well, admittedly that's most politicians, plenty of businessmen, etc.  Trump is just grossly incompetent at the "conceal his real feelings or motives" part.  Trump is like a living caricature of the industrialists from the gilded age, except he's obviously a Trust Fund Baby--like the Kennedys--but with basically zero of the charisma; of course, that's not surprising since his whole election platform was parroting the Republican Party line.  All in all, the situation is a joke and clearly the American people are the punchline.


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## Xzi (Dec 31, 2018)

kuwanger said:


> To be fair to Trump, he probably is too uninvolved (legally required at the moment?, and definitely good for deniability in the long term)


He's still heavily involved in his businesses, which is why he's facing several emoluments lawsuits right now, at least one of which has been cleared to proceed by a federal judge.  I mean, I don't believe that Trump remembers what he had for breakfast on any given evening, but just because he doesn't remember breaking the law doesn't mean he's off the hook.  It was his managers handing out the fake green cards as a large operation, so I have a hard time believing he was never aware of it.


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## Deleted-401606 (Dec 31, 2018)

Pacheko17 said:


> Wanting to protect your borders is somehow a childlike tantrum now.



GBAtemp parrots that Trump is an idiot and 90% of the user base here doesn't really have a clear understanding of American politics to really form an opinion.One of my biggest qualms with GBAtemp is how the hivemind controls absolutely everything.


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## TotalInsanity4 (Dec 31, 2018)

Maluma said:


> GBAtemp parrots that Trump is an idiot and 90% of the user base here doesn't really have a clear understanding of American politics to really form an opinion.One of my biggest qualms with GBAtemp is how the hivemind controls absolutely everything.


Oh, please. Rush Limbaugh threw a colorful rant about Trump being weak for allowing a resolution that would have funded the government through February. Then, suddenly, the Trump flips his position on the account that it doesn't have funding for the border wall? Something that, if I remember correctly, Mexico was supposed to pay for?

I'll readily accept that GBAtemp has a tendency to become an echo chamber for people to amplify the opinions they already have ingrained in them, but do not make the mistake of assuming that the same can't happen for the cause that you support. Please, to the people who routinely target other classes of people, I'd ask that you give me the same courtesy I'm giving you and just... Periodically ask yourself _what exactly_ is the motivation behind your positions


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## Kioku_Dreams (Dec 31, 2018)

Maluma said:


> GBAtemp parrots that Trump is an idiot and 90% of the user base here doesn't really have a clear understanding of American politics to really form an opinion.One of my biggest qualms with GBAtemp is how the hivemind controls absolutely everything.


To be honest, the political hivemind controls nothing here. It does get old when both sides tend to scream "foul" about every little thing, and the stale Trump bashing leaves a bitter taste in some... Still...


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## Deleted-401606 (Dec 31, 2018)

Memoir said:


> To be honest, the political hivemind controls nothing here. It does get old when both sides tend to scream "foul" about every little thing, and the stale Trump bashing leaves a bitter taste in some... Still...



I didn't really mean just politics though.On GBAtemp there is usually one widely accepted opinion on X,and if you go against the grain people either get suspensions or their forum post gets turned into a blog.Group think is honestly a cancer to a community of this nature where the focus should be on video games.


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## TotalInsanity4 (Dec 31, 2018)

Maluma said:


> I didn't really mean just politics though.On GBAtemp there is usually one widely accepted opinion on X,and if you go against the grain people either get suspensions or their forum post gets turned into a blog.Group think is honestly a cancer to a community of this nature where the focus should be on video games.


Generally speaking I'd say both responses you mentioned are level-headed. Typically suspensions, from what I've seen, are dished out when someone is consistently picking fights and being obnoxious (or legitimately openly and unapologetically hateful towards other members), and I've only ever seen threads moved to blogs when they contained personal opinion that's either unsubstantiated or doesn't really fit any particular forum forum section very well. I can say with a fair degree of certainty that compared to most other online communities I've interacted with, the staff here are not only fair, but even generous in terms of what they'll allow people to get away with. Generally speaking, if someone is given a warning, let alone suspended, it's because they deserved it, plain and simple


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## Xzi (Dec 31, 2018)

Memoir said:


> To be honest, the political hivemind controls nothing here. It does get old when both sides tend to scream "foul" about every little thing, and the stale Trump bashing leaves a bitter taste in some... Still...


At some point, reporting on the facts/current events and "Trump bashing" become one and the same.  I'm just as ready as anyone for the lunacy to end and a return to boring presidents, but to be boring you have to be a stable, reliable adult first.


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## FAST6191 (Dec 31, 2018)

Maluma said:


> GBAtemp parrots that Trump is an idiot and 90% of the user base here doesn't really have a clear understanding of American politics to really form an opinion.One of my biggest qualms with GBAtemp is how the hivemind controls absolutely everything.


If the shoe fits... and I would go further and say fine to judge things relative to your local standards as well, especially if the shortcomings of that are realised.
Similarly if that 90% is content to do other things and leave those that wish to discuss them to discuss such things.

As far as hive minds go if you steer clear of pokemon and smash brothers it is all good, and even then questioning how they might not be the finest game franchises ever crafted by man is not without support.

Going a bit further I see plenty of people of all political stripes complaining about us allowing other people to drivel on in the forums, and plenty of people debating finer points and having complex and nuanced opinions on things that their normal "party lines" would appear to differ massively on. There are those with some utterly bizarre notions of how the world, laws, ethics and so forth work but they tend to meet the cold, hard mistress that is reality soon enough and I would much rather that than an echo chamber. I don't know if I would quite make a claim of completely balanced as US style right wing politics are very much on the defensive at all points (I don't know if that is what you mean by/perceive as the hive mind), though at the same time the nonsense the US left presently seems to be going in for gets called out all the time as well. As you might imagine there is a very overt push towards letting devices run free, regardless of what any copyright holder/system maker might care to say on the matter, which stands above all that but as the homebrews and ROM hacks don't exactly threaten* world security at this point in time... yeah.


*choice links
https://craphound.com/stories/2006/01/12/printcrime/


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## kuwanger (Dec 31, 2018)

Xzi said:


> He's still heavily involved in his businesses, which is why he's facing several emoluments lawsuits right now, at least one of which has been cleared to proceed by a federal judge.  I mean, I don't believe that Trump remembers what he had for breakfast on any given evening, but just because he doesn't remember breaking the law doesn't mean he's off the hook.  It was his managers handing out the fake green cards as a large operation, so I have a hard time believing he was never aware of it.



Well, I'm trying to give Trump the benefit of the doubt.  To that end, it still looks incredibly bad.  Like you say, he should be heavily involved in his own business and ignorance or forgetting aren't legitimate excuses for avoiding punishment.  Yet, plenty of companies have done criminal things, and it's become the norm to punish with settlements without admitting guilt over fines or jail.  My understanding is this was chosen as a strategy some time ago for economic reasons; I guess the threat of actual prosecution (instead of ignoring things) and the punishment being jail would have been very disruptive on the US economy.  So, yea, the government basically chose to be complicit in both acknowledging widespread corruption and crime in business as well as mitigating the punishment.  And here we are.



Maluma said:


> I didn't really mean just politics though.On GBAtemp there is usually one widely accepted opinion on X,and if you go against the grain people either get suspensions or their forum post gets turned into a blog.Group think is honestly a cancer to a community of this nature where the focus should be on video games.



There's lots of things I don't agree with people on.  I've yet to receive a suspension or even be warned.  I definitely agree that group think can be very bad for a community.  Honestly, I think very few people are independent thinkers--me included--on most subjects because it would take decades to come up with something self-formed on most subjects.  To that end, I think the most important thing is to try to keep an open mind about things and as TotalInsanity4 said to always try to be aware of your own motivations on things.  The best way to do that is to be willing to listen to a lot of people you disagree with, so long as it's clear they too are trying to be open minded and listen and think.  I'd say mostly people on gbatemp do that.


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## Saiyan Lusitano (Jan 3, 2019)

Maluma said:


> GBAtemp parrots that Trump is an idiot and 90% of the user base here doesn't really have a clear understanding of American politics to really form an opinion.One of my biggest qualms with GBAtemp is how the hivemind controls absolutely everything.



Talking about politics can be almost as bad and exhausting as reading what Incels write in their websites/threads. Between the two, I'd rather read articles about politics than what involuntary celibates post.

They can be really depressing and harmful. I tried to be friendly with them and they insulted me. lol They're the ones in charge of their lives, anyway, so if they want to change they have to work towards it.


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## KingVamp (Jan 3, 2019)

Well, the new Democrats are in.


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## Deleted-401606 (Jan 4, 2019)

Saiyan Lusitano said:


> Talking about politics can be almost as bad and exhausting as reading what Incels write in their websites/threads. Between the two, I'd rather read articles about politics than what involuntary celibates post.
> 
> They can be really depressing and harmful. I tried to be friendly with them and they insulted me. lol They're the ones in charge of their lives, anyway, so if they want to change they have to work towards it.



What exactly did I post about incels?


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## Captain_N (Jan 4, 2019)

The politicians are the only ones that should not be paid during a so called government shut down.


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## Xzi (Jan 8, 2019)

So Trump is starting to get pretty desperate over this...the expectation is that he might declare a national emergency tonight on primetime TV.  He thinks he can use a non-existent emergency to fund his wall through the DoD.  Hopefully a federal judge is quick to intervene if that happens.

If this sounds familiar, it's because it was literally a plot line from House of Cards.  Underwood declares an emergency in order to illegally funnel money to his jobs program.


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## KingVamp (Jan 9, 2019)

Xzi said:


> So Trump is starting to get pretty desperate over this...the expectation is that he might declare a national emergency tonight on primetime TV.  He thinks he can use a non-existent emergency to fund his wall through the DoD.  Hopefully a federal judge is quick to intervene if that happens.


That would hurt the legitimacy of a national emergency. I hope this doesn't happen.


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## Xzi (Jan 9, 2019)

KingVamp said:


> That would hurt the legitimacy of a national emergency. I hope this doesn't happen.


It didn't, he already gave the address.  He still tried to hype up immigration as a "crisis," but largely it was ten minutes of the same material he's been using since his campaign.  I don't see it changing anybody's mind in favor of a wall, especially since the Democrats gave a much more articulate response.


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## KingVamp (Jan 9, 2019)

Looks like this guy is trying to set a new record for this government shutdown.


Xzi said:


> If this sounds familiar, it's because it was literally a plot line from House of Cards.  Underwood declares an emergency in order to illegally funnel money to his jobs program.


Actually, this reminds me of the recent


Spoiler



Young Justice episodes


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## KingVamp (Jan 26, 2019)

Apparently, it is going to open... for a few weeks.


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## dAVID_ (Feb 4, 2019)

Mexico already said no, so I wonder if Trump will shut down the government again.


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## Attacker3 (Feb 4, 2019)

Government spending during the shutdown was only down 7%, so it really doesn't matter all that much.


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## Xzi (Feb 4, 2019)

Attacker3 said:


> Government spending during the shutdown was only down 7%, so it really doesn't matter all that much.


It matters to the people who didn't get paid, and also the contractors that still won't get back pay because Republicans refuse to endorse the necessary legislation.  As usual, Trump leaves the room before the bill comes due.


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## CMDreamer (Feb 4, 2019)

Trumpet has a medieval way of thinking. Walls don't last long protecting castles when the real problem is on the inside (as in this case on US government).

And speaking of castles, he thinks he's the king, when on reality he's just the buffoon and the burglar, he's just trying to protect his own businesses.


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## Attacker3 (Feb 4, 2019)

Xzi said:


> It matters to the people who didn't get paid, and also the contractors that still won't get back pay because Republicans refuse to endorse the necessary legislation. As usual, Trump leaves the room before the bill comes due.


https://www.cnn.com/2019/01/16/politics/trump-signs-backpay-bill-government-shutdown/index.html


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## Xzi (Feb 4, 2019)

Attacker3 said:


> https://www.cnn.com/2019/01/16/politics/trump-signs-backpay-bill-government-shutdown/index.html


That article is in reference to federal workers, not federal contractors.  Only one Republican has signed on to give back pay to contractors so far, along with 90 Democrats:

https://thinkprogress.org/90-democr...ng-back-pay-to-contract-workers-4ed1b943b79c/


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## Attacker3 (Feb 4, 2019)

Xzi said:


> That article is in reference to federal workers, not federal contractors.  Only one Republican has signed on to give back pay to contractors so far, along with 90 Democrats:
> 
> https://thinkprogress.org/90-democr...ng-back-pay-to-contract-workers-4ed1b943b79c/



I don't know enough about the contracting situation in the US to comment on that, but here in Canada contractors don't have to same protections as actual employees. In return, they get more freedom and such, but again, I don't know what the situation in the US is.


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## Xzi (Feb 4, 2019)

Attacker3 said:


> I don't know enough about the contracting situation in the US to comment on that, but here in Canada contractors don't have to same protections as actual employees. In return, they get more freedom and such, but again, I don't know what the situation in the US is.


Protections are a separate issue entirely, we're talking about back pay for work that was already done.  Republicans love eroding trust in government, though, and stiffing workers definitely furthers that cause.


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## Taleweaver (Feb 5, 2019)

Xzi said:


> Protections are a separate issue entirely, we're talking about back pay for work that was already done.  Republicans love eroding trust in government, though, and stiffing workers definitely furthers that cause.


Some suggested reading on that front: 'the fifth risk' by Michael Lewis. Lewis is one of my favorite non-fiction authors, and has some very good books on the financial crisis. The fifth risk goes into detail...on government workers. Not exactly the most sexy topic, but I meant it when I said he was an awesome writer (see also "the big short"...the movie is somewhat different but retains the rock 'n roll style).
The Trump administration isn't so much "eroding trust in government" but downright attacking it pretty much the day he came into office. His carefully drafted transition team that would take over the many different government agencies went straight into the trash can and was replaced by guys who had no idea what the department they were supposed to lead even did in the first place (and did not care either). The department that actively searched and secured nuclear resources around the world (and has, as such, prevented 150 nuclear bombs from being made) ? Seriously crippled. The department that made sure that hurricanes were discovered in time (and the population alerted)? Now lead by a guy who wants to dismantle it. The department that watched Iran kept their part of the nuclear deal (and as such were in no position to ever create a nuclear bomb)? Downright ignored.

I'm not even halfway into the book and I'm wondering why the hell THIS isn't picked up by mainstream media. Yes, Trump's antics are more sensational. But sooner or later he'll leave office, you'll find the departments in such a sorry state that it'll probably take more time to even recover to the point where it previously was than Trump's time in the office.

And how does this tie in to the shutdown of the government? Easy: it's just the extension of the policy that is already in progress for the last couple of years. Many republicans bang on about how the government is useless, but once they're confronted with what the government actually DOES, they'll wind down a bit ("oh, so the department of energy isn't just about creating energy but also providing cutting edge innovations in terms of resource and development? Hmmm...interesting"). If Lewis isn't exaggerating, the clerics simply weren't given a chance to explain the importance of their jobs to this government.


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## Attacker3 (Feb 5, 2019)

Xzi said:


> Republicans love eroding trust in government


The US was founded on low trust in governments. There should be barely any trust in the first place


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## Xzi (Feb 5, 2019)

Attacker3 said:


> The US was founded on low trust in governments. There should be barely any trust in the first place


The US was not founded on low trust in our own government, that makes zero sense.  The problem with Republicans isn't so much that they don't trust government, it's that they purposefully sabotage its functions when elected.  Of course trust is going to be low after several decades of Republicans starting needless wars and crashing the economy repetitively.  This is why the party needs a complete overhaul, or needs to be replaced with a new party.  Nobody is benefiting from obstructionism and contrarianism being the only things they're consistent about.


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## Deleted User (Feb 5, 2019)

Boarder patrol might have an easier time with a better barrier than the current fencing. And a way to stop people digging under could be to dig a deep trench around the wall and fill it with cement.


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## Xzi (Feb 5, 2019)

Snugglevixen said:


> Boarder patrol might have an easier time with a better barrier than the current fencing. And a way to stop people digging under could be to dig a deep trench around the wall and fill it with cement.


So just add another $25 billion to the budget?  Simple!  Next thing you know we're going to be building a wall around the wall.  Because obviously the wall can't protect itself.


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## Deleted User (Feb 6, 2019)

Xzi said:


> So just add another $25 billion to the budget?  Simple!  Next thing you know we're going to be building a wall around the wall.  Because obviously the wall can't protect itself.


Does the border specifically have to be non lethal? Cos water might be cheaper than cement and it'd drown them upon digging into it.


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## Xzi (Feb 6, 2019)

Snugglevixen said:


> Does the border specifically have to be non lethal? Cos water might be cheaper than cement and it'd drown them upon digging into it.


Under is not the only option.  You can literally go right through the wall with a saw, because they haven't found a prototype that can't be sawed through yet.  Or they can go over with a ladder.  Or they can go around on a boat, or over on a plane.

If I've said it before, I've said it a million times: focusing on the illegal immigrants is never going to solve a damn thing.  As long as people like Donald Trump keep offering employment to undocumented workers, they'll keep coming even if you force them through an American Ninja Warrior obstacle course on the border.  Providing $25 billion for what is basically a statue that 90% of America will never see is completely asinine, especially considering that in the meantime, our core infrastructure is crumbling.  FFS, if we're gonna waste the money on a vanity project anyway, we might as well fund gold toilets for all Americans instead.


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## KingVamp (Feb 7, 2019)

Xzi said:


> we might as well fund gold toilets for all Americans instead.


I know you are mostly being symbolic, but I wouldn't want that, no matter how much money I had.


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## Xzi (Feb 7, 2019)

KingVamp said:


> I know you are mostly being symbolic, but I wouldn't want that, no matter how much money I had.


And yet it's _just _dumb enough to get Trump's base behind it, like the wall.


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