# Macroaxis: Sony Has 79% Chance of Going Bankrupt in the Next 2 Years



## OriginalHamster (Jan 3, 2014)

According to Macroaxis, a financial engineering tool website that analyzes companies and determines their well-being, Sony Entertainment has a discouraging 79% chance of going bankrupt in the next 2 years.

_“Based on latest financial disclosure Sony Corporation has Probability Of Bankruptcy of 78%. This is 182.34% higher than that of Consumer Goods sector, and 163.57% higher than that of Electronic Equipment industry, The Probability Of Bankruptcy for all stocks is 122.48% lower than the firm.”_






While it wouldn’t be factual to say that SNE will fail in the next 2 years (it’s all a guess), the 78.49% figure is based off of real, actual numbers. Many will consider this number overly inflated, but it all doesn’t sound too far-fetched when you take into consideration some of the things that have been happening over in Sony Land. Last year, Sony’s market value was slashed down to “junk” status, and they’ve sold multiple HQ buildings as well. Not to mention, Sony still hasn’t recovered from all of the money they’ve lost on the PS3, and the Vita is still not profitable and isn’t selling as well as it should.

For comparative purposes, Macroaxis is stating that Nintendo has only a 22% chance of failing in the next 2 years, which is very ironic considering the fact that the majority of gamers and journalists online are always claiming that Nintendo is in imminent danger, when in reality Nintendo is very healthy and Sony is the actually the one closest to failing out of the console manufacturers. Microsoft is sitting off to the side with only 1% chance of failure.


http://gaminrealm.com/2013/12/30/sony-79-chance-bankrupt-2-years/


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## Foxi4 (Jan 3, 2014)

No additional comment required, as I don't think this is really newsworthy. I mean, really, it's an article about an online bot using questionable calculations to decide whether or not an industry giant has a chance to fall within the next few years. Not actual analysts, a bot. Great.


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## OriginalHamster (Jan 3, 2014)

Foxi4 said:


> No additional comment required, as I don't think this is really newsworthy. I mean, really, it's an article about an online bot using questionable calculations to decide whether or not an industry giant has a chance to fall within the next few years. Not actual analysts, a bot. Great.


 
What are those questionable calculations exactly, would you give us some examples to back up your claim?

Well this "bot" is actually a tool, and works on hard data, unlike many analysts that preach out of their ass. Geez the number of times that analyts are been on spot about something in this industry is quite hilarious.


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## Foxi4 (Jan 3, 2014)

OriginalHamster said:


> What are those questionable calculations exactly, would you give us some examples to back up your claim?
> 
> Well this "bot" is actually a tool, and works on hard data, unlike many analysts that preach out of their ass. Geez the number of times that analyts are been on spot about something in this industry is quite hilarious.


This bot is also mentioning that companies are to be considered _"high-risk"_ if their Probability of Bankrupcy ratio reaches 90% or above. This means that Sony's well-under the high-risk marker and isn't as likely to go bankrupt as it seems - they have wiggle room to turn things around.

It also mentions that the function used are linear, which means that _"if nothing drastically changes"_, they are accurate. Thing is, something _drastically changed_ - the PS4 was released. It has not been reflected on any data as of yet since it's not the time for quarterly business reports. Apparently it sells like cure for cancer, but what do I know? 

Additionally, Sony is not a uniform critter - it's composed of numerous smaller entities, from Computer Entertainment to Life Insurance - _"Sony"_ as a whole has many faces, some doing better, some doing worse.

All of the information regarding the calculation is naturally available on the Macroaxis website, all of the factors I'm talking about would be taken into account by a human and would not by a machine which has to be fed reports to stay accurate. 

*EDIT:* Just an additional tidbit, the calculated chance is *78.49%*. In the world of mathemathics, you most often round up _(celling)_ when you get past the half point mark and round down _(flooring)_ when you have not. In other words, the title should be 78%, but that's just me nitpicking.


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## OriginalHamster (Jan 3, 2014)

Sony maybe doing better as a company but its stock is nowhere near as strong as its competition and if Sony gets delisted from the American stock markets because investors start jumping ship it's going to look real bad. The rest of the company is still in horrible shape and not really growing at an expected rate. The PS4 is the only thing keeping Sony alive right now. And let's not forget that PlayStation is just a branch of its many electronics, to think it will keep afloat the whole other branchs is naive at best.


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## Foxi4 (Jan 3, 2014)

OriginalHamster said:


> Sony maybe doing better as a company but its stock is nowhere near as strong as its competition and if Sony gets delisted from the American stock markets because investors start jumping ship it's going to look real bad. The rest of the company is still in horrible shape and not really growing at an expected rate. The PS4 is the only thing keeping Sony alive right now.


As far as I know, Sony's biggest _"earner"_ is the Financial Services sector, but hey! It might as well be the PS4 if you think so.


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## ShadowSoldier (Jan 3, 2014)

Wait, doesn't Sony deal with TV's, laptops, programs, game development, consoles, phones, stereo's, movies, tv, music?

Aren't all of those, if not most, doing pretty good? The only ones that are probably doing bad is Laptops and maybe phones are low.


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## Foxi4 (Jan 3, 2014)

ShadowSoldier said:


> Wait, doesn't Sony deal with TV's, laptops, programs, game development, consoles, phones, stereo's, movies, tv, music?
> 
> Aren't all of those, if not most, doing pretty good? The only ones that are probably doing bad is Laptops and maybe phones are low.


You would think that, but Sony dips their paws in more than just that. According to their financial releases, they earn the most from their banks, life insurance agencies and from manufacturing components for other manufacturers - semi-conductors and the likes. 

In all honesty, Sony could stop making consoles, TV's, cameras and whatnot and they would still comfortably fall on the pillow of their other businesses. They're in no immediate danger of failing - the electronics industry is just one of the many industries they invest in.


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## Sterling (Jan 3, 2014)

Anyone can see the Sony is floundering, correction, their gaming division. Sony as a whole will not be going anywhere close to bankruptcy if their assets have anything to say about it. There's a few things that could happen. Since both Microsoft and Sony's gaming divisions have operated in the red for several years, we could see both brands simply collapse. However, these are very powerful brand names that continue to get more popular. They're going try to save both at any cost if it comes to that.

If I had to make a prediction, we're on the edge of another gaming collapse... console wise at least. Due to the stagnation of the home market, and cheap hardware for on-the-go gaming (aka mobile).

Right now, I'm seeing the rise of crowd funding, and other forms of easy investment systems. This makes the next few years a hotbed of innovation for gaming and technology in general. If Kickstarter was around when the Pandora was in development, we might be seeing a slightly different market. I digress though. If these closed consoles don't ask for more from their third party developers, two of the big three might simply fade away.

Indie gaming is where it's at, and I'm not trying to be a hipster about it. Smaller developers have less and less to lose by the day. This allows for more innovation and less censorship by a parent studio. In the end, it's the player that wins. The satisfaction from seeing a game you've personally put money into coming to life is incredible.

Back to the possible crash, if Sony and Microsoft do fade, Nintendo will be the one to survive. Thanks to their safe business practices, and luck, they've amassed an enormous pocketbook, and asset pool. They have nearly all the most recognizable IPs in the video gaming world. Zelda, Mario, and Pokemon are all very high profile concepts that crank out profits like it's being printed on-site. Since they're a Japanese company, they have the benefit of holding a large part of the market by default.

You see, we're on the edge of a personal gaming golden age. We might even see the rise of crowdfunded platforms that make Bob's (maker of bob's game) Console looks like tomfoolery. Steam Greenlight is only the beginning. Mark my words, the big three have to adapt, or risk losing their foothold at a crucial time.


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## Bobbybangin (Jan 3, 2014)

It makes sense seeing as Sony's debt rating was recently downgraded to junk status. This rating downgrade comes despite the acknowledgment by the ratings group of restructuring plans by Sony, including Sony's One Sony restructuring program. Part of the turnaround strategy includes Sony cutting 10,000 jobs. That's usually a very troubling sign.

http://money.cnn.com/2012/11/22/investing/fitch-sony-panasonic-downgrade/


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## ShadowSoldier (Jan 3, 2014)

Sterling said:


> Anyone can see the Sony is floundering, correction, their gaming division. Sony as a whole will not be going anywhere close to bankruptcy if their assets have anything to say about it. There's a few things that could happen. Since both Microsoft and Sony's gaming divisions have operated in the red for several years, we could see both brands simply collapse. However, these are very powerful brand names that continue to get more popular. They're going try to save both at any cost if it comes to that.
> 
> If I had to make a prediction, we're on the edge of another gaming collapse... console wise at least. Due to the stagnation of the home market, and cheap hardware for on-the-go gaming (aka mobile).
> 
> ...



Umm.. you know Sony is a lot more than just games... right?


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## FireGrey (Jan 3, 2014)

Yeah sony goes bankrupt and nintendo makes the playstation 5


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## Sterling (Jan 3, 2014)

ShadowSoldier said:


> Umm.. you know Sony is a lot more than just games... right?


 




Sterling said:


> *Anyone can see the Sony is floundering, correction, their gaming division.*


 

It's like you only read the first seven words and your mind came to a screeching halt, producing this: "I must correct this dire mistake. He must know how foolish his entire post must be. To get something so wrong when it was mentioned by me mere moments ago is a travesty."

You see, I'm the sharpest and brightest tool in the shed buddy.


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## Gahars (Jan 3, 2014)

OriginalHamster said:


> According to Macroaxis


 
Great, so now the Axis is involved?

The mafia, the nazis... geez, this video game business goes all the way to the top, doesn't it?


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## Clarky (Jan 3, 2014)

ShadowSoldier said:


> Umm.. you know Sony is a lot more than just games... right?


Read his opening statement again


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## ShadowSoldier (Jan 3, 2014)

Sterling said:


> It's like you only read the first seven words and your mind came to a screeching halt, producing this: "I must correct this dire mistake. He must know how foolish his entire post must be. To get something so wrong when it was mentioned by me mere moments ago is a travesty."
> 
> You see, I'm the sharpest and brightest tool in the shed buddy.



Or you know, instead of being a fucking prick on a kid's forum, you could just go "eh, benefit of the doubt, he probably simply just misread or didn't see it". It happens.


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## Sterling (Jan 3, 2014)

ShadowSoldier said:


> Or you know, instead of being a fucking prick on a kid's forum, you could just go "eh, benefit of the doubt, he probably simply just misread or didn't see it". It happens.


 
Yeah, no. I'd give it to someone who doesn't do this on a daily basis though. Cheers.

Anyone else have any insight on what might be happening in the near future? I'm kinda banking on another collapse, but I love my Vita too much to see it die.


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## ShadowSoldier (Jan 3, 2014)

Sterling said:


> Yeah, no. I'd give it to someone who doesn't do this on a daily basis though. Cheers.


Ya because you're totally one to talk right?   

Anyways, for your stupid question. No collapse. Doesn't make sense considering it's booming more than ever.

my guess, Sony isn't going anywhere. Doesn't make any sense considering they're posting profits.


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## DSGamer64 (Jan 3, 2014)

ShadowSoldier said:


> Wait, doesn't Sony deal with TV's, laptops, programs, game development, consoles, phones, stereo's, movies, tv, music?
> 
> Aren't all of those, if not most, doing pretty good? The only ones that are probably doing bad is Laptops and maybe phones are low.


 

It doesn't matter how many resources they have, many of them generate almost no additional revenue for the company as a whole. For the last 15 years Sony has operated with razor thin profit margins and their excessive spending developing consoles has really impacted their bottom line. You know your business isn't making much money when it's cheaper to replace a product with a newer model then it is to fix it. One of my friends had a Sony TV that was still under warranty and it took a big crap and died, they replaced it with a larger model that cost the same price as the previous one.


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## Taleweaver (Jan 3, 2014)

Interesting figure, but nowhere near as dramatic as I thought it was at first glance. As said, it only measures data, not sales estimates. So the PS4 sales are, at best, partially added while the costs of research and manufacturing is most likely added much more. It doesn't require a genius to predict this percentage will soon drop.
And if not...bankruptcy only happens if they can't pay their bills anymore. My guess is that in the worst case scenario, sony will inject some money in the department from other departments with lower risk.

But to be honest, I'm much more interested to know how microsoft manages to have 78.49 times lower chance to go bankrupt. Didn't they put research into their console as well? Didn't they have a...not-so-great sales talk back at E3? In fact...didn't one of the candidate CEO's propose to get rid of the xbox brand a few months ago?
So this is mostly VERY bad news for some chairmembers in the sony entertainment board. I suspect some heavy meetings coming up for them...

(nintendo, I can understand. They have so much financial reserves they can probably go some decades without even selling a single unit)


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## Black-Ice (Jan 3, 2014)

SEGA and the dreamcast will rise again


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## Foxi4 (Jan 3, 2014)

Black-Ice said:


> SEGA and the dreamcast will rise again


Considering the fact that hardware-wise SEGA's doing fine as of late... 

...what? They single-handedly revived the arcade business in Japan!


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## Black-Ice (Jan 3, 2014)

Foxi4 said:


> Considering the fact that hardware-wise SEGA's doing fine as of late...
> 
> ...what? They single-handedly revived the arcade business in Japan!


 
We never did discover what the "Sega Spectrum" that got leaked in summer was.
Its a console i bet ya.
SEGA 2K14


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## GameWinner (Jan 3, 2014)

A GameWinner nightmare thread.


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## beta4attack (Jan 3, 2014)

Yeeeeah, riiiight, just like how Nintendo's doomed 
Seriously, why is every single person saying something about a gaming company going bankrupt or doomed?


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## Foxi4 (Jan 3, 2014)

I like how this thing sparked a global circlejerk around here, on Twitter and some lesser-known gaming websites that don't know any better when for all intents and purposes, XBox is far closer to dying. In fact, one of Microsoft's future CEO candidates considers deattaching the XBox division from the main company body and selling it off since it's the least profitable _(or more accurately, the not-at-all-profitable)_ of their branches, which would be likely to happen if he got elected.

The PlayStation brand would become the only _"middle ground"_ between PC gaming and Nintendo, and if Sony went under _(which it won't, that's just silly)_, it would create a massive rift between the two spheres because let's face it, Nintendo is about as good with keeping up with industry trends as a bat is at reading.

To re-iterate, it's unlikely that Sony as a corporation will go bankrupt - if things go sour for them to the point where they have to make difficult decisions, they will withdraw from the non-profitable businesses and stay in the ones that do bring them profits until their situation stabilizes, as any megacorporation would.


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## ShadowSoldier (Jan 3, 2014)

beta4attack said:


> Yeeeeah, riiiight, just like how Nintendo's doomed
> Seriously, why is every single person saying something about a gaming company going bankrupt or doomed?


Because it's easier to deem something doomed than it is to actual do some research and get facts.


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## Foxi4 (Jan 3, 2014)

ShadowSoldier said:


> Because it's easier to deem something doomed than it is to actual do some research and get facts.


Speaking of facts, Sony's on this year's Top 100 Most Valuable Brands list by Forbes. Insert shock.


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## Shuji1987 (Jan 3, 2014)

OriginalHamster said:


> Sony maybe doing better as a company but its stock is nowhere near as strong as its competition and if Sony gets delisted from the American stock markets because investors start jumping ship it's going to look real bad. The rest of the company is still in horrible shape and not really growing at an expected rate. *The PS4 is the only thing keeping Sony alive right now*. And let's not forget that PlayStation is just a branch of its many electronics, to think it will keep afloat the whole other branchs is naive at best.


 

I wouldn't be so sure about that. Sony isn't just manufacturing Playstations you know, they are involved in a huge array of businesses. Besides that, they are also in a "keiretsu" like most other Japanese companies. This means that there is one central bank who funds dozens of companies that can be found in different sectors. So it's like a chain of a huge array of companies. Sectors include but not limited to: Financial, Food, Chemicals, Trading and Commerce, Petroleum, Electronics, Iron and Steel, Gaming, Entertainment and Shipping.

In turn, those companies have interest in each others companies as well as having stocks of each other. Besides that they usually also have shared boardmembers so it goes pretty deep. Another thing is, when companies within the keiretsu sell products another company can use, they usually exclusively purchase from within their keiretsu. Even if this might be more expensive than getting components from china. It's to support growth within their keiretsu and create more money for investments within.

My point is, when SCE blows all their funds, they will get more from Sony. And if they're out of funds, their central bank can provide more. Besides that, they have the support of their keiretsu members as well. Honestly Japanese companies don't fall over as easily as western companies do. There is a huge difference in business ethics. For example, Japanese aim for a 1-2% increase over 10 years while keeping their employees, while western companies tend to focus on short term 5% profit and laying off 20% or more of their employees.

I'm also not sure how you say that Sony disapearing from North American stock markets is a bad thing. Sony will keep living on in Japan. Besides that, their biggest markets are Europe and their own country. It will probably save them costs.

In any case, you seem really uninformed. I hope this was useful in any way. =)


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## Sterling (Jan 3, 2014)

Foxi4 said:


> Speaking of facts, Sony's on this year's Top 100 Most Valuable Brands list by Forbes. Insert shock.


 
Not surprising. However, I see a huge amount of terrible companies on that list (Namely Bank of America and AT&T). Valuable does not necessarily mean they'll be successful and practice good business. Since that's based on stock, it can change literally by the hour.


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## Foxi4 (Jan 3, 2014)

Sterling said:


> Not surprising. However, I see a huge amount of terrible companies on that list (Namely Bank of America and AT&T). Valuable does not necessarily mean they'll be successful and practice good business. Since that's based on stock, it can change literally by the hour.


The more value they have, the lesser the chance is that they'll end up with $0 in the bank. Just saying. 

Good or bad business practices have little to do with overall value - we may not _like_ given companies, but our feels don't make them valuable or successful.

Shuji1987 Hit the nail on the head - Sony is a hydra with many heads and cutting off one doesn't mean much. By the time you aim at the next one, the first one will grow back with the funding from other branches. That's not to say that they're too big to fail - no company is, but they're not going bankrupt within the next 2 years, not a chance.


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## Sterling (Jan 3, 2014)

Foxi4 said:


> The more value they have, the lesser the chance is that they'll end up with $0 in the bank. Just saying.
> 
> Good or bad business practices have little to do with overall value - we may not _like_ given companies, but our feels don't make them valuable or successful.


 
The established fact is that Sony has a lot more than just games. That goes for both Microsoft and Sony, who just so happen to be on opposite sides of that list. With as much red zone Sony's gaming division has been operating in, I would not be surprised to simply see them drop out of the business for a while. Japanese companies are very prone to saving face. Look at some of Nintendo's blunders for historical examples of console suicide. I'm not saying they're gonna bankrupt, nor have I said that they aren't turning a profit. The simple facts say that anything is possible with consistent failure, or recession.

I think the home market is stagnated beyond belief in an economy that isn't getting much better, if not worse. We're at a turning point in electronics, and it's definitely not good business to funnel money into something that keeps losing it.


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## Foxi4 (Jan 3, 2014)

Sterling said:


> The established fact is that Sony has a lot more than just games. That goes for both Microsoft and Sony, who just so happen to be on opposite sides of that list. With as much red zone Sony's gaming division has been operating in, I would not be surprised to simply see them drop out of the business for a while. Japanese companies are very prone to saving face. Look at some of Nintendo's blunders for historical examples of console suicide. I'm not saying they're gonna bankrupt, nor have I said that they aren't turning a profit. The simple facts say that anything is possible with consistent failure, or recession.
> 
> I think the home market is stagnated beyond belief in an economy that isn't getting much better, if not worse. We're at a turning point in electronics, and it's definitely not good business to funnel money into something that keeps losing it.


It's probably worth noting that their previous system cost more to put on shelves than it brought back home and on top of that it was incredibly expensive at launch wheras their latest system is the exact opposite.

Sony's gaming devision is doing a 180 in terms of their approach to the console game. The conversation we're having now would be much more sensible in about a year's time when we actually get to see the results of this new approach.


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## Sterling (Jan 3, 2014)

Foxi4 said:


> It's probably worth noting that their previous system cost more to put on shelves than it brought back home and on top of that it was incredibly expensive at launch wheras their latest system is the exact opposite.
> 
> Sony's gaming devision is doing a 180 in terms of their approach to the console game. The conversation we're having now would be much more sensible in about a year's time when we actually get to see the results of this new approach.


 
Which I think is a good start. Definitely better business. I only wish more devs would pay attention to my dear Vita. She's getting kinda lonely.

So, I guess see you in 2015?


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## Nah3DS (Jan 3, 2014)

2014 year of the Dreamcast


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## Foxi4 (Jan 3, 2014)

Sterling said:


> Which I think is a good start. Definitely better business. I only wish more devs would pay attention to my dear Vita. She's getting kinda lonely.
> 
> So, I guess see you in 2015?


To be fair, the PSVita is seeing a bit of a revival as of late, likely due to the promise of being a good companion device to the PlayStation 4, although this spike in interest is going to be temporary for obvious reasons.

I expect another one like it as soon as Sony launches Gaikai on the platform... but at the end of the day, the PSVita follows the same philosophy as the PS3 - it's high-end, it knows it and it creates a userbase slowly, albeit gradually.


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## p1ngpong (Jan 3, 2014)

I only read the title of this thread and nothing else and I am sitting back feeling good about Nintendo now. All it will take is for Nintendo to release the next *insert sequel to any Nintendo franchise* in the next two years and Sony will be history!


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## GameWinner (Jan 3, 2014)

Foxi4 said:


> To be fair, the PSVita is seeing a bit of a revival as of late, likely due to the promise of being a good companion device to the PlayStation 4, although this spike in interest is going to be temporary for obvious reasons.
> 
> I expect another one like it as soon as Sony launches Gaikai on the platform... but at the end of the day, the PSVita follows the same philosophy as the PS3 - it's high-end, it knows it and it creates a userbase slowly, albeit gradually.


If Sony can get that Vita-PS4 bundle out and actually advertise it I would bet that would increase the userbase a bit.


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## Foxi4 (Jan 3, 2014)

GameWinner said:


> If Sony can get that Vita-PS4 bundle out and actually advertise it I would bet that would increase the userbase a bit.


You mean this?

Unfortunately it's not a huge saving, but still.


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## GameWinner (Jan 3, 2014)

Foxi4 said:


> You mean this?
> 
> Unfortunately it's not a huge saving, but still.


I can only hope.


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## Hells Malice (Jan 4, 2014)

...Soulx is that you guy?



With the seemingly huge success of the PS4, I don't see Sony going anything, gaming wise, anytime soon.


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## Foxi4 (Jan 4, 2014)

Hells Malice said:


> ...Soulx is that you guy?


soulx Understood and changed his ways, he is now on his way to the glorious kingdom of Sonyhalla where all gamers reside.

This... this is a new evil...


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## DSGamer64 (Jan 5, 2014)

Hells Malice said:


> ...Soulx is that you guy?
> 
> 
> 
> With the seemingly huge success of the PS4, I don't see Sony going anything, gaming wise, anytime soon.


 

They are still losing money on it so it doesn't matter if it's doing well or not, Sony is losing money regardless.


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## Pleng (Jan 5, 2014)

Sterling said:


> If Kickstarter was around when the Pandora was in development, we might be seeing a slightly different market.


 
I highly doubt that. The restricted budget was probably the only thing that kept Craigs ego even remotely (albeit _very_ remotely!) under control. Give him a bigger pot of money and watch him rip. See iControlPad 2.


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## Wisenheimer (Jan 5, 2014)

Going bankrupt is not the same as going out of business or the Playstation brand dying.

Reputable analysis suggests the xbox division might lose as much as 2 billion dollars a year and CEO canidates have suggested cutting it.  I think it is the most in danger of being discontinued. 

The Playstation brand has been struggling thanks to the financial failure of the PS3 and PS4.  Sony though has reason to be optomistic about the PS4's ability to make a significant profit and it is likely to continue the Playstation brand or sell it to a company like Apple or Google.

Nintendo is actually in a fairly strong position financially despite several quarters of poor Wii U sales.

I think someone like Apple or Google would buy Sony and continue the PS brand if their stocks continued free falling.   The xbox, on the other hand, might not find a buyer.



ShadowSoldier said:


> Ya because you're totally one to talk right?
> 
> Anyways, for your stupid question. No collapse. Doesn't make sense considering it's booming more than ever.
> 
> my guess, Sony isn't going anywhere. Doesn't make any sense considering they're posting profits.



Sony is not posting profits.  They had half a decade of major net losses.  Their last annual report showed a small net profit that was generated primarily by cannibalizing assets rathe r rhan through sales.  

Sony is far from dead, but they are on the path to financial failure  and they cannot sustain another 5 years of losses.


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## grossaffe (Jan 5, 2014)

Pleng said:


> I highly doubt that. The restricted budget was probably the only thing that kept Craigs ego even remotely (albeit _very_ remotely!) under control. Give him a bigger pot of money and watch him rip. See iControlPad 2.


man, the icontrolpad was such an expensive disappointment.  Good thing others got into the market with products like the ipega 9017.


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## Bladexdsl (Jan 5, 2014)

a web script says it's going to happen so it MUST BE TRUE!


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## Guild McCommunist (Jan 5, 2014)

Wisenheimer said:


> Going bankrupt is not the same as going out of business or the Playstation brand dying.
> 
> Reputable analysis suggests the xbox division might lose as much as 2 billion dollars a year and CEO canidates have suggested cutting it. I think it is the most in danger of being discontinued.
> 
> ...


 

To the contrary I heard that the video game division of Sony has been doing quite well. Well, Vita aside. Sony was really taking a beating on televisions. The PS3 overall turned itself around, once Slims started turning a profit. People shit on the PSP but it still sold well over 50 million units in its lifetime and had a rather strong finish in Japan.

I mean we've already discussed the Vita to death and it could easily go either way, currently I think they're doing a pretty clumsy job and if they really put a big effort into it the system could do very well. It has potential, when it gets good games it sells well, but it's not getting any of those. I just checked the upcoming releases for it and god it's pretty dismal. It didn't have downloadable games though so it can still get some solid indie games but it won't carry the system at all.

The PS4, it had a very strong start but it can go either way. Sony has always managed their home consoles well and it'll most likely be successful. Even with the PS3, they managed to turn a large mistake into a very strong console overall, from price to content to features.

Everyone thinks Nintendo is in a strong position because they've got some money from the DS and Wii but if they're just burning through it with no returns in sight that is not considered doing well. That's called bleeding out.


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## Wisenheimer (Jan 6, 2014)

Sony only recently broke even on the PS3.  It is only now generating small profits.  Nintendo managed to post a small net profit despite the cost of Wii U development. 




Guild McCommunist said:


> To the contrary I heard that the video game division of Sony has been doing quite well. Well, Vita aside. Sony was really taking a beating on televisions. The PS3 overall turned itself around, once Slims started turning a profit. People shit on the PSP but it still sold well over 50 million units in its lifetime and had a rather strong finish in Japan.
> 
> I mean we've already discussed the Vita to death and it could easily go either way, currently I think they're doing a pretty clumsy job and if they really put a big effort into it the system could do very well. It has potential, when it gets good games it sells well, but it's not getting any of those. I just checked the upcoming releases for it and god it's pretty dismal. It didn't have downloadable games though so it can still get some solid indie games but it won't carry the system at all.
> 
> ...


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## Foxi4 (Jan 6, 2014)

Wisenheimer said:


> Sony only recently broke even on the PS3. It is only now generating small profits. Nintendo managed to post a small net profit despite the cost of Wii U development.


Perhaps that's because during launch, Sony was losing $200 on each PS3 sold - that's how much ahead of its time it was as far as consumer electronics were concerned... wheras the Wii U... well...


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## GHANMI (Jan 6, 2014)

beta4attack said:


> Yeeeeah, riiiight, just like how Nintendo's doomed
> Seriously, why is every single person saying something about a gaming company going bankrupt or doomed?


 
If that's any help, the "source" also gives Nintendo 24% chances of going bankrupt next two years, and 1% for the Xbox.


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## Guild McCommunist (Jan 6, 2014)

Wisenheimer said:


> Sony only recently broke even on the PS3. It is only now generating small profits. Nintendo managed to post a small net profit despite the cost of Wii U development.


 

Pretty sure "only recently" was a couple years ago.


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## OriginalHamster (Jan 6, 2014)

Foxi4 said:


> Perhaps that's because during launch, Sony was losing $200 on each PS3 sold - that's how much ahead of its time it was as far as consumer electronics were concerned... wheras the Wii U... well...


 
It was because they were stuck with cell technology which was extremely poor efective cost-performance, 360 had relative power with a more standart eficient cost wise technology. It explains why most multiplatform games ran better on 360, even when PS3 was more powerful in paper.


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## Foxi4 (Jan 6, 2014)

OriginalHamster said:


> It was because they were stuck with cell technology which was extremely poor efective cost-performance, 360 had relative power with a more standart eficient cost wise technology. It explains why most multiplatform games ran better on 360, even when PS3 was more powerful in paper.


 
Most multiplatforms _early on_ when a lot of microcode was required to take advantage of the SPU's - later down the line, the PS3 shined just as bright if not brighter.


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## OriginalHamster (Jan 6, 2014)

They still were with a more standart technology because cell wasn't worth the cost and it had no future (see PS4).


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## Foxi4 (Jan 6, 2014)

OriginalHamster said:


> They still were with a more standart technology because cell wasn't worth the cost and it had no future (see PS4).


Perhaps because CELL is a processor built for science, not so much for gaming.  I'm with you on this, I think that if Sony picked a more... _"standard"_ design the PS3 would probably have a better start. Then again, if not for CELL development, there would be no XBox 360 - its CPU cores are heavily based on PPE.


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## Wisenheimer (Jan 6, 2014)

OriginalHamster said:


> It was because they were stuck with cell technology which was extremely poor efective cost-performance, 360 had relative power with a more standart eficient cost wise technology. It explains why most multiplatform games ran better on 360, even when PS3 was more powerful in paper.



I doubt the cell cpu performance was worse per dollar than the more conventional types of PPC architecture the Xbox 360 or Wii used.  Ports often ran better on the 360 because port developers are lazy.

In In actual real world computations, the PS3 was roughly twice the speed of the 360.

However, like the PS2, performance was often hobbled by the unusual architecture


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## Guild McCommunist (Jan 6, 2014)

General rule of thumb is multiplats are better on the PS3, exclusives are optimized better on the PS3.

Like the PS3 port of Bayonetta is complete ass but play a game like God of War Ascension and you'll be hard pressed to find a Xbox 360 game that looks better.


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## Social_Outlaw (Jan 6, 2014)

I doubt that sony will go bankrupt sony has gotten wiser ever since the release of the ps3 price and cell technology, you got to fuck up to do better in general you got to lose something precious like your MONEY lol, and work hard as hell to get back to the top, and guess what? Sony is paying us back with the lovely smexy ps4 great spec major improvement, price? Its good since everything on the ps4 is high due to spec, so the spec match its price....give  sony another year or 2 , and they'll be at the top to make up for the ps3 sales, in addition  lately since the ps4 came out it has been a crazy sales they will rule like they did back in 03 with the 6th gen ps2 everyone remember them days   .


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## grossaffe (Jan 6, 2014)

Guild McCommunist said:


> General rule of thumb is multiplats are better on the PS3, exclusives are optimized better on the PS3.
> 
> Like the PS3 port of Bayonetta is complete ass but play a game like God of War Ascension and you'll be hard pressed to find a Xbox 360 game that looks better.


I assume this was a typo and you meant multiplats are better on the 360?


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## DrOctapu (Jan 6, 2014)

They also rate Nintendo at 73%. Bull fucking shit, plain and simple. I'm glad they've made a robot with Pachter level accuracy, though, because god knows nobody needs to give that guy any more money.


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## trumpet-205 (Jan 6, 2014)

OriginalHamster said:


> It was because they were stuck with cell technology which was extremely poor efective cost-performance, 360 had relative power with a more standart eficient cost wise technology. It explains why most multiplatform games ran better on 360, even when PS3 was more powerful in paper.


CELL has plenty performance. CELL is designed for super computer, but for some reason Sony and IBM thought it would be good for mainstream gaming.

Back when OtherOS exists PS3 is a viable alternative to Bladeserver, CELL based super computer that costs 20x more than PS3 per unit.

The biggest issue with PS3 is lack of RAM. 256 MB of RAM is small.


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## Guild McCommunist (Jan 6, 2014)

grossaffe said:


> I assume this was a typo and you meant multiplats are better on the 360?


 

Yeah sorry, thanks for the correction.


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