# Government class instruction comparing Obama to Hitler draws public ire in Baldwin County (Alabama)



## Xzi (Jan 26, 2018)

http://www.al.com/news/mobile/index.ssf/2018/01/post_131.html

(Title is same as article)







Now, I understand colleges are more liberal-leaning, but I still doubt there are any professors out there requiring their students to read Michael Moore (as a sloppy parallel).  This is a high school forcing this garbage on their students, essentially "thought policing," which I thought the right-wing was against.  What are your thoughts/opinions on this and requiring the study of political material in schools?


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## osaka35 (Jan 26, 2018)

Huh. I live/d here. Doesn't surprise me, but yes, highly inappropriate.

This is a high school, not a university. You'll get this kind of complete nonsense in high schools. Probably a 9th or 10th grade class. If you're going to convince people this stuff is real, you've got to get them before their critical thinking has matured. People are usually far more accepting of things they acquired before they began to think rationally, even if it is absolute hogwash.


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## DRAGONBALLVINTAGE (Jan 26, 2018)

osaka35 said:


> Huh. I live/d here. Doesn't surprise me, but yes, highly inappropriate.
> 
> This is a high-school, not a university. You'll get this kind of complete nonsense in highschools.


you live in Alabama?


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## Xzi (Jan 26, 2018)

osaka35 said:


> Huh. I live/d here. Doesn't surprise me, but yes, highly inappropriate.
> 
> This is a high-school, not a university. You'll get this kind of complete nonsense in highschools.


Yes, which makes it all the worse/more problematic.  Taxpayer money goes to these high schools, and not entirely from in-state.


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## TotalInsanity4 (Jan 26, 2018)

"Liberalism is a Mental Disorder: Savage Solutions" what the actual fuck


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## Viri (Jan 26, 2018)

Did you know that Obama and Hitler both drank water before? I guess Obama is literally Hitler.



Spoiler













Spoiler


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## Xzi (Jan 26, 2018)

TotalInsanity4 said:


> "Liberalism is a Mental Disorder: Savage Solutions" what the actual fuck


The list is 100% political books mostly by 2-3 known hardline right-wing authors.  Funny enough I agree with at least one of these, "End the Fed" by Ron Paul, but it's still an opinion book like all the others.  Opinion isn't what's important to teach high school students.


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## osaka35 (Jan 26, 2018)

DRAGONBALLVINTAGE said:


> you live in Alabama?


yes. In mobile at the moment, working on my Ph.D., though lived in daphne/spanish fort area for a while. I move around a lot. I don't particularly care if anyone knows where I live.


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## VinsCool (Jan 26, 2018)

That's seriously fucked up.
Who thought that was ok?


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## the_randomizer (Jan 26, 2018)

I'm okay with schools teaching politics as long as students aren't ridiculed by whatever political party they side with.


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## MaverickWellington (Jan 26, 2018)

Is there a publicly available source of this document?


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## Xzi (Jan 26, 2018)

the_randomizer said:


> I'm okay with schools teaching politics as long as students aren't ridiculed by whatever political party they side with.


IMO that's a slippery slope, if schools can teach politics they can teach religion or fascism, and there really is nothing to stop students from being outcasts for not conforming.



MaverickWellington said:


> Is there a publicly available source of this document?


I seriously doubt it, the list was pulled from the school last June per the article.


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## CallmeBerto (Jan 26, 2018)

WTF

Me thinks they should just stick to the facts instead of going bat shit crazy to one side.


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## smf (Jan 26, 2018)

Xzi said:


> Funny enough I agree with at least one of these, "End the Fed" by Ron Paul, but it's still an opinion book like all the others.



He's pretty crazy, although he's right that inflation calculations are flawed. But you can fix that.


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## MaverickWellington (Jan 26, 2018)

Xzi said:


> IMO that's a slippery slope, if schools can teach politics they can teach religion or fascism, and there really is nothing to stop students from being outcasts for not conforming.


While we're at it, they could teach students about capitalism, or communism! Imagine coming to an economics class and learning about economic policies like that. Man, our kids HAVE to be shielded from this!

For real though, how is that a slippery slope? They SHOULD be taught about those things. We teach them about wars, war crimes, and so on as they get older, why is it a "slippery slope" to teach them about various government policies and ideas? So long as you don't glorify one side over the other it's perfectly fine.


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## Xzi (Jan 26, 2018)

smf said:


> He's pretty crazy, although he's right that inflation calculations are flawed. But you can fix that.


I don't care for the FED, it's not a government institution.  What is essentially a corporation should not be regulating currency.  That said, they've been surprisingly accepting of Bitcoin and other crypto.  The FED is also way too entrenched in our everyday systems by now to be eliminated anyway.



MaverickWellington said:


> While we're at it, they could teach students about capitalism, or communism! Imagine coming to an economics class and learning about economic policies like that. Man, our kids HAVE to be shielded from this!
> 
> For real though, how is that a slippery slope? They SHOULD be taught about those things. We teach them about wars, war crimes, and so on as they get older, why is it a "slippery slope" to teach them about various government policies and ideas? So long as you don't glorify one side over the other it's perfectly fine.


It's teaching opinion, it's not going to prepare students for the real world in any measurable way.  It doesn't make them more employable or knowledgeable about how real government/financial/technical systems work.  It just numbs their brain when they don't have a base of knowledge to layer that opinion on top of.


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## TotalInsanity4 (Jan 26, 2018)

Xzi said:


> IMO that's a slippery slope, if schools can teach politics they can teach religion or fascism, and there really is nothing to stop students from being outcasts for not conforming.
> 
> 
> I seriously doubt it, the list was pulled from the school last June per the article.


You can teach whatever you want in the public education system, as long as it's in a historical/current event context, and the teacher isn't indoctrinating the students


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## RustInPeace (Jan 27, 2018)

Makes me relieved my AP Government teacher was a sweet goober of a man. He had us watch Swing Vote too, which I remembered to be a good movie. Also he taught in the same room as my AP World History class 2 years prior.


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## Xzi (Jan 27, 2018)

TotalInsanity4 said:


> You can teach whatever you want in the public education system, as long as it's in a historical/current event context, and the teacher isn't indoctrinating the students


Yes, there are obviously degrees of subtlety.  Making the entire required reading list teach to only one political view is something else entirely.


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## Gourmet (Jan 27, 2018)

CallmeBerto said:


> WTF
> 
> Me thinks they should just stick to the (((facts))) instead of going bat shit crazy to one side.


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## weatMod (Jan 27, 2018)

a certain ethnic  minority group hates obama for not bombing iran,the same ethnic minority that 98% of the authors of the books on that reading list belong to as well as the teacher , wow what a surprise


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## smf (Jan 27, 2018)

Xzi said:


> I don't care for the FED, it's not a government institution.  What is essentially a corporation should not be regulating currency.



It literally is a government institution. It's largely autonomous, but then you really don't want elected politicians abusing monetary policy for personal short term gain.

The UK equivalent would be the bank of england & it only escaped from politicians meddling in 1998. If you compare how it was before to how it is now, I'll keep how it is now.


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## DRAGONBALLVINTAGE (Jan 27, 2018)

osaka35 said:


> yes. In mobile at the moment, working on my Ph.D., though lived in daphne/spanish fort area for a while. I move around a lot. I don't particularly care if anyone knows where I live.


Now I know I'm not the only tempter living in Alabama


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## Xzi (Jan 27, 2018)

smf said:


> It literally is a government institution. It's largely autonomous, but then you really don't want elected politicians abusing monetary policy for personal short term gain.


Nah instead it's mostly a board of private banking CEOs deciding things on a whim...much better.  /s


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## Whole lotta love (Jan 27, 2018)

weatMod said:


> *The Jews* hate obama for not bombing iran,the same ethnic minority that 98% of the authors of the books on that reading list belong to as well as the teacher , wow what a surprise



Went ahead and fixed that for you.


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## Randy95354 (Jan 27, 2018)

Obama is the same as hittler spread the word i love it!!


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## Hozu (Jan 27, 2018)

I came across what appears to be the full list. If @Xzi wants to put it in the OP, feel free.


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## Xzi (Jan 27, 2018)

Randy95354 said:


> Obama is the same as hittler spread the word i love it!!


Yeah I remember when Hitler retired from being US president after a full two terms.  Wait...

Trump's the only one left to blame your problems on if you're trying to avoid taking responsibility for them now.  "Sat on my balls today.  THANKS TRUMP!"


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## chrisrlink (Jan 27, 2018)

sickening effectivly brainwashing today's youth if i read that list alone I'd drop out btw is the federal government doing anything about it probably not with Donald hitler trump in office


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## DinohScene (Jan 27, 2018)

There's so much misconception about Hitler...

If you truly want to look at an evil man, look at Himmler or Stalin.
I'd go for Stalin if you truly want someone fucked up.


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## TotalInsanity4 (Jan 27, 2018)

DinohScene said:


> There's so much misconception about Hitler...
> 
> If you truly want to look at an evil man, look at Himmler or Stalin.
> I'd go for Stalin if you truly want someone fucked up.


Let's not downplay the suffering he put over 6 million innocent Jews through (not to mention gays and political rivals)


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## DinohScene (Jan 27, 2018)

TotalInsanity4 said:


> Let's not downplay the suffering he put over 6 million innocent Jews through



What about the millions of Ukrainians, starved to death by Stalin?
The brutal massacre in the Katyn forest ordered by Stalin on dozens of Polish officers.
The brutal gulags where everyone and their dog got locked up by Stalin.
The millions of innocent civilians in the USSR that starved to death by him.

Himmler introduced the Einsatzgruppen in the SS which resulted in mass executions.
He found that this was to traumatizing for the officers commencing the shootings so he thought of the death camps.

Please, learn your history.


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## TotalInsanity4 (Jan 27, 2018)

DinohScene said:


> What about the millions of Ukrainians, starved to death by Stalin?
> The brutal massacre in the Katyn forest ordered by Stalin on dozens of Polish officers.
> The brutal gulags where everyone and their dog got locked up by Stalin.
> The millions of innocent civilians in the USSR that starved to death by him.
> ...


You say that like I was trying to imply that Stalin or Himmler weren't awful as well


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## DinohScene (Jan 27, 2018)

TotalInsanity4 said:


> You say that like I was trying to imply that Stalin or Himmler weren't awful as well



Compared to Stalin, Hitler is a pussy.

But the first thing people tie Hitler to is the mass murder of ~6 million Jews.
People always forget that Himmler was more involved with the genocide on the Jews then Hitler was.

But yes, if you worded your post differently, it wouldn't seem that way.

Oh, idk if you already knew but the Volkswagen beetle? it's Hitlers people car.
Autobahn? Hitlers creation.
Anti smoking campaigns? Hitler his work.
Animal rights? mostly Hitler.

By no means am I denying the holocaust nor am I trying to redeem the man.
I'm simply pointing out historical facts that get greatly overlooked.

Edit: Hitler never even visited a death camp.
Himmler however visited numerous camps and criticized the security and build of many on the spot.


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## brickmii82 (Jan 27, 2018)

This level of indoctrination is ..... condederate-esque.


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## CallmeBerto (Jan 27, 2018)

We went from BS levels of right wing propaganda to Hitler and Stalin.


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## Whole lotta love (Jan 27, 2018)

DinohScene said:


> Compared to Stalin, Hitler is a pussy.
> 
> But the first thing people tie Hitler to is the mass murder of ~6 million Jews.
> People always forget that Himmler was more involved with the genocide on the Jews then Hitler was.
> ...



Bruh we can do this shit about the USSR, it doesn't redeem the fucking terrible things done under Stalinism.

-Went from an almost exclusively agrarian nation to having a space program in 40 years
-Nearly eliminated illiteracy
-Equal pay, voting rights, and access to education for women
-Doubling of life expectancy from Tsarist times
-Elimination of homelessness

That's bullshit that Hitler didn't know what was going on in those camps. How could he not know people were being murdered but the Allies did?.

He also said this...



> Once I really am in power, my first and foremost task will be the annihilation of the Jews. As soon as I have the power to do so, I will have gallows built in rows—at the Marienplatz in Munich, for example—as many as traffic allows. Then the Jews will be hanged indiscriminately, and they will remain hanging until they stink; they will hang there as long as the principles of hygiene permit. As soon as they have been untied, the next batch will be strung up, and so on down the line, until the last Jew in Munich has been exterminated. Other cities will follow suit, precisely in this fashion, until all Germany has been completely cleansed of Jews.
> 
> source



and this...



> We are going to destroy the Jews. They are not going to get away with what they did on 9 November 1918. The day of reckoning has come.
> 
> source





> And we say that the war will not end as the Jews imagine it will, namely with the uprooting of the Aryans, but the result of this war will be the complete annihilation of the Jews.
> 
> source





> If at the beginning of the war and during the war twelve or fifteen thousand of these Hebrew corrupters of the people had been held under poison gas, as happened to hundreds of thousands of our very best German workers in the field, the sacrifice of millions at the front would not have been in vain.
> 
> source



wow it's almost as if Adolf Hitler wanted to kill all the jews or something??? but 6 million of them dying in the camps he put them in was definitely just a coincidence and not really his fault! poor guy is awfully misunderstood ¯\_(ツ)_/¯


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## DinohScene (Jan 27, 2018)

Whole lotta love said:


> Bruh we can do this shit about the USSR, it doesn't redeem the fucking terrible things done under Stalinism.
> 
> -Went from an almost exclusively agrarian nation to having a space program in 40 years
> -Nearly eliminated illiteracy
> ...




Nice attempt at putting words in me mouth ;')

If you read closely, I pointed out the terrible things that Stalin did and I never said that Hitler didn't know what was going in.
Idk what you make of "Hitler never visited a camp" but I never said anything about him not knowing what went on.
You must be pretty blind I guess.

Also: do note that literature isn't 100% accurate.
They're heavily revised before being put through the presses.
Things get cut and edited a lot before it's approved for printing.


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## Whole lotta love (Jan 27, 2018)

DinohScene said:


> Nice attempt at putting words in me mouth ;')
> 
> If you read closely, I pointed out the terrible things that Stalin did and I never said that Hitler didn't know what was going in.
> Idk what you make of "Hitler never visited a camp" but I never said anything about him not knowing what went on.
> ...




Your inclusion of "Hitler never even visited a death camp" implies that he didn't really know what was going on or at least isn't really to blame for the holocaust. The subsequent statement about Himmler reinforces that.

But you're right, you didn't explicitly state that. I am very tired and misread what you wrote. My apologies.



> They're heavily revised before being put through the presses.
> Things get cut and editeda lot before it's approved for printing.



what parts of the literature that I cited were edited?


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## Subtle Demise (Jan 27, 2018)

DinohScene said:


> Anti smoking campaigns? Hitler his work.
> Animal rights? mostly Hitler.


So limiting personal liberties and de-valuing human life? Sounds about right.

Anyway, if you were going to compare a president to Hitler, it would be George W. Bush. The way he snatched up a bunch of emergency powers in the wake of disaster is very reminiscent of both Julius Caesar and Hitler. Thankfully, he wasn't bright enough to follow through with it.


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## DinohScene (Jan 27, 2018)

Whole lotta love said:


> Your inclusion of "Hitler never even visited a death camp" implies that he didn't really know what was going on or at least isn't really to blame for the holocaust. The subsequent statement about Himmler reinforces that.
> 
> But you're right, you didn't explicitly state that. I am very tired and misread what you wrote. My apologies.
> 
> ...



Apology accepted.

All literature gets revisited and edited.
All happens before printing of said works.

This is true for decades if not hundreds of years worth of literature.

If you're just going to write a book about history, nobody would bother printing it.
If you however focus on one thing and leave minor details out of it, the work becomes a lot more attractive.
Pretty much the same as how the media works.

People want sensation, not boring facts ;/




Subtle Demise said:


> So limiting personal liberties and de-valuing human life? Sounds about right.
> 
> Anyway, if you were going to compare a president to Hitler, it would be George W. Bush. The way he snatched up a bunch of emergency powers in the wake of disaster is very reminiscent of both Julius Caesar and Hitler. Thankfully, he wasn't bright enough to follow through with it.



That can be said about pretty much everything.

I can't donate blood cus homosexual.
I'm only allowed to donate blood after abstaining from sexual contact for a year.

Isn't that devaluing someones life?
Isn't that limiting a personal liberty?

 ;')


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## Subtle Demise (Jan 27, 2018)

DinohScene said:


> That can be said about pretty much everything.
> 
> I can't donate blood cus homosexual.
> I'm only allowed to donate blood after abstaining from sexual contact for a year.
> ...


Well yeah, that's discrimination.


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## DinohScene (Jan 27, 2018)

Subtle Demise said:


> Well yeah, that's discrimination.



Content of the issue might be different but it comes down to the same thing.

Unfortunately, we don't live in a perfect world where there's only 1 lavatory for both sexes.
completely equal rights (yes that includes a man hitting a woman in her face)
homosexuality being exactly the same as heterosexuality (why this isn't normal yet is beyond me, also fuck marriage)
And lastly no warmongering people or superpowers that need to spend a billion a day on an army.

Mankind is destined to annihilate itself before this can be achieved.
I personally think that the closest thing to "a perfect world" would be bush people in Africa/Amazone.
You know, the tribes that never made contact with the cesspit that's called the western world.


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## FAST6191 (Jan 27, 2018)

I can see some value in having kids read all sorts of things, I certainly have a growing collection of propaganda books because they are fascinating things to read. Equally if this is supposed to be a higher level class on the subject of politics (that is what AP means?) then some kind of critical thinking one would hopefully have by this point.

Likewise the article linked mentioned some parent saying there were no notions of hate or whatnot put forward by said teacher. I don't know if I want to call helicopter parents but I don't think I can make the leap from what has been shown here to outright condemnation. It might have been better for them to go through some of the trickier stuff in a class and analyse it.

Re: teaching religion despite it being the subject of one of my favourites of said propaganda books (US 1940s/late 30s anti communist rant on the subject) I do forget that it is a thing in the US. General state school had it as an optional subject and taught as dryly as history or anything else (names, dates, ideas popular at the time, logic following from them). To get worked up about that seems kind of odd. Amusingly I saw a bunch of videos earlier on "millenials not doing the religion bit" and the reasoning the various talking heads came to (apparently from current hot off the presses research) was predicted perfectly by this book.


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## Xzi (Jan 27, 2018)

FAST6191 said:


> I can see some value in having kids read all sorts of things, I certainly have a growing collection of propaganda books because they are fascinating things to read. Equally if this is supposed to be a higher level class on the subject of politics (that is what AP means?) then some kind of critical thinking one would hopefully have by this point.
> 
> Likewise the article linked mentioned some parent saying there were no notions of hate or whatnot put forward by said teacher. I don't know if I want to call helicopter parents but I don't think I can make the leap from what has been shown here to outright condemnation. It might have been better for them to go through some of the trickier stuff in a class and analyse it.
> 
> Re: teaching religion despite it being the subject of one of my favourites of said propaganda books (US 1940s/late 30s anti communist rant on the subject) I do forget that it is a thing in the US. General state school had it as an optional subject and taught as dryly as history or anything else (names, dates, ideas popular at the time, logic following from them). To get worked up about that seems kind of odd. Amusingly I saw a bunch of videos earlier on "millenials not doing the religion bit" and the reasoning the various talking heads came to (apparently from current hot off the presses research) was predicted perfectly by this book.


Teaching _about_ something is entirely different from teaching one thing in particular with the intent of indoctrination into one train of thought.  It's fine if the content is varied and presented as controversial, but not when it's implied that it's normal curriculum for schools.


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## Cylent1 (Jan 27, 2018)

People are flipping out over this while they indoctornate Islam to our school children and thats ok?
What happened to the common sense in this world?
Its like a large person counting calories when they need to be counting the chemicals in our food like products we consume
instead of worrying about getting fat!  lemmings.....................


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## TotalInsanity4 (Jan 27, 2018)

DinohScene said:


> completely equal rights (yes that includes a man hitting a woman in her face)


Have you considered that maybe both sexes have the right to NOT be hit in the face?...

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------



Cylent1 said:


> People are flipping out over this while they indoctornate Islam to our school children and thats ok?
> What happened to the common sense in this world?


Feel free to give an example


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## DinohScene (Jan 27, 2018)

TotalInsanity4 said:


> Have you considered that maybe both sexes have the right to NOT be hit in the face?...



That would be limiting personal liberties ;')


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## TotalInsanity4 (Jan 27, 2018)

DinohScene said:


> That would be limiting personal liberties ;')


Hilarious


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## RivenMain (Jan 27, 2018)

You should do it so hitler sounds like an amazing man gaining so many to praise his cause. And that he helped pave the road for medical knowledge much more then now because people study diseases only on rats and there'd only a 7% chance that what happens in a rat could work for you because that's as close as we are to rats. Or the best we would have are ice picking peoples brains hoping it fixes something.


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## Subtle Demise (Jan 27, 2018)

DinohScene said:


> That would be limiting personal liberties ;')


It is not a personal liberty to hurt another person. If you want to harm yourself, however, you should be free to do so, but that's getting away from the topic.


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## DinohScene (Jan 27, 2018)

Subtle Demise said:


> It is not a personal liberty to hurt another person. If you want to harm yourself, however, you should be free to do so, but that's getting away from the topic.



So, if someone slaps you in the face and nicks your wallet, you just stand there stupidly and wait for him to apologize instead of running after said, tackling and nicking your wallet back?
I admire your pacifism and faith in humanity, I really do!

But yeh, you're right about it, it's derailing the thread drastically.


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## Whole lotta love (Jan 27, 2018)

DinohScene said:


> Apology accepted.
> 
> All literature gets revisited and edited.
> All happens before printing of said works.
> ...



You seem to be conflating pop non-fiction with academic research. Academic historians strive to represent their research as objectively as possible. Your concern is the exact reason this research gets edited in the peer review process, so it is unbiased. It is of course impossible to be truly unbiased, but the peer review process helps immensely in the integrity of research that gets published.

Historians very much want boring facts. I don't know why you bring this up if you can't cite specific instances where this has compromised the sources I have cited. The only purpose I can imagine is to muddy the waters and attempt to discredit the field of history so to indirectly and fallaciously discredit my points.


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## Hanafuda (Jan 27, 2018)

I'm not sure what bothers me more - this one, individual teacher's inappropriate summer reading list and his school board's inability to get him to behave, or the bigoted generalizations against any form of conservative political ideology that I see in this thread by a _few_ posters (not all). Try to maintain some perspective with this - it is one story, one incident, one teacher. It's not a nationwide infiltration of the public school curriculum. Trust me, if anything it is more left-leaning in its editing than ever, so rest easy. Remember when all those schoolkids sang the song to Obama during the 2008 campaign? That freaked out a bunch of conservatives, like it was an indoctrination or something, but I saw that the same as this. One or a few kooks in an isolated situation, creating an extreme example.





Also, FWIW, here are some selections from NPR's summer reading list last year. Before you say the NPR's not public school ...  NPR is government funded, and it's nationwide, not just one dude with a fetish for talk radio.

https://www.npr.org/sections/ed/2017/07/06/534443123/summer-reading-for-your-woke-kid

*A Is for Activist*

*Stepping Stones: A Refugee Family's Journey*

*Rad Women Worldwide *
This book takes your child through a list of revolutionary women who changed history through activism and *radical thought*. Young readers meet influential leaders from the painter Frida Kahlo to *anarchist* political activist Emma Goldman.

*Fred Korematsu Speaks Up*
This book tells the story of internment camps for Japanese-Americans during World War II.

*The Hate U Give*


I'm not saying any of these books are inappropriate to recommend to kids ... but they all have an agenda. One might say that agenda is attuned to the current political frictions in our country. One might also reasonably say the perspective of that agenda is decidedly in support of resisting the President and any conservative policy. As Xzi said earlier in the thread, "Making the entire required reading list teach to only one political view is something else entirely."


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## ThisIsDaAccount (Jan 27, 2018)

Cylent1 said:


> People are flipping out over this while they indoctornate Islam to our school children and thats ok?
> What happened to the common sense in this world?
> Its like a large person counting calories when they need to be counting the chemicals in our food like products we consume
> instead of worrying about getting fat!  lemmings.....................


There's so much wrong with what you just said, it's literally illegal to indoctrinate students to Islam in public schools, we have a Constitution that separates church and state. You literally have no idea what you're talking about. If you find an example of a teacher doing that, you can call the school board and get them fired.

Also, aren't you the guy that said that everyone who doesn't support Trump is a communist?

Please stop commenting in political threads, you don't exaclty enrich the conversation. Please take my advice and read some newspaper articles written from the point of view of the party you hate, you really need to learn more about viewpoints that aren't your own.


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## dAVID_ (Jan 27, 2018)

Obama, Hitler.

George Orwell was right.


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## Hanafuda (Jan 27, 2018)

dAVID_ said:


> Obama, Hitler.
> 
> George Orwell was right.




No, just one Alabama idiot is wrong. When the actual textbooks say that, then maybe you're onto something.


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## dAVID_ (Jan 27, 2018)

Hanafuda said:


> No, just one Alabama idiot is wrong. When the actual textbooks say that, then maybe you're onto something.


Oh. ok. overreacted.


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## Hanafuda (Jan 27, 2018)

dAVID_ said:


> Oh. ok. overreacted.



Natural impulse. Most of what gets reported in the news is for its clickbait value. And they're very bipartisan about it ... outraged liberals, outraged conservatives, both equal more clicks.


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## chrisrlink (Jan 27, 2018)

it all boils down to this teacher needs to be pinkslipped for even suggested these garbage books but Alabama is normally Red politically so they won't bat an eye i guess


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## Hanafuda (Jan 27, 2018)

chrisrlink said:


> it all boils down to this teacher needs to be pinkslipped for even suggested these garbage books but Alabama is normally Red politically so they won't bat an eye i guess




I think they already crossed the 'disciplinary measures' line with the guy last year if I read all that correctly. So yeah, he needs to be dismissed. Maybe he can get a job at that 'university' Rush Limbaugh hawks for.


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## FAST6191 (Jan 27, 2018)

chrisrlink said:


> it all boils down to this teacher needs to be pinkslipped for even suggested these garbage books but Alabama is normally Red politically so they won't bat an eye i guess


If I am teaching history then having to beat into my students that they need to consider the reliability of the source is paramount. Might there not be an equivalent here? Or do we teach higher level students of politics that everything is a happy hugfest all the time?


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## TotalInsanity4 (Jan 27, 2018)

FAST6191 said:


> If I am teaching history then having to beat into my students that they need to consider the reliability of the source is paramount. Might there not be an equivalent here? Or do we teach higher level students of politics that everything is a happy hugfest all the time?


I'm not sure you read the list of books/are familiar with the authors if you're suggesting that any kind of responsibility for objectivity remains with the students in this case


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## FAST6191 (Jan 27, 2018)

TotalInsanity4 said:


> I'm not sure you read the list of books/are familiar with the authors if you're suggesting that any kind of responsibility for objectivity remains with the students in this case



I have only read a few on that list, and most of those you could probably guess. At this point I have not looked up the remainder on the list but I am not sure it is all that relevant for even if they were some seriously extreme shit my position is not terribly likely to change.

Maybe if it was a plain old English reading list or something like that you may wish to raise an eyebrow at least but high level politics seems fairly fitting.


"comparing Obama to Hitler"
A patently absurd notion from where I sit, however it appears to be something out there so why not learn about it?


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## the_randomizer (Jan 27, 2018)

I am genuinely curious, is having beliefs different that differ from left-leaning beliefs something worth  of being ridiculed and/or publicly shamed for or intrinsically wrong? (In other words, is having right-leaning political beliefs, which differ from left-leaning beliefs, something worthy of being ostracized or shamed from others for?)  I really want to know, as I'm getting that impression from political discussions as a whole. The other side of media would like for one to believe it's immoral and makes you evil if you do.


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## FAST6191 (Jan 27, 2018)

What an odd statement. Leaving aside that definitions of left and right, and indeed common talking points thereof*, vary dramatically between places my general policy is can you try to back up your positions. Following the crowd "just because" would be a bad thing from where I sit.

*no UK politician cares much about abortion, none are likely to ever say scrap public healthcare (indeed what are arguably the most right wing had a rather silly phrase on the debate on the exit from Europe about funding said public healthcare with the balance), big government and small government is not really a thing. This however may be an example of things being mired in dogma which is a problem for every flavour.

Media. They long ago figured out fear sells and as they have to sell things to survive then so it goes. Fear of the unknown is good. Sex also sells so throw a bit of that in. The world is complex but if you can make it a binary thing, no matter how silly that is, and both in politics* and in news you then face a trend to have to be more and more that.

*the US right wing currently has something of a problem with their incumbents either suffering the spoiler effect from someone even more right wing or outright being replaced by said same.


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## Cylent1 (Jan 27, 2018)

ThisIsDaAccount said:


> There's so much wrong with what you just said, it's literally illegal to indoctrinate students to Islam in public schools, we have a Constitution that separates church and state. You literally have no idea what you're talking about. If you find an example of a teacher doing that, you can call the school board and get them fired.
> 
> Also, aren't you the guy that said that everyone who doesn't support Trump is a communist?
> 
> Please stop commenting in political threads, you don't exaclty enrich the conversation. Please take my advice and read some newspaper articles written from the point of view of the party you hate, you really need to learn more about viewpoints that aren't your own.


http://www.politifact.com/florida/s...-department-education-introduce-islamic-indo/
And why yes I am the one that said that!


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## TotalInsanity4 (Jan 27, 2018)

Cylent1 said:


> http://www.politifact.com/florida/s...-department-education-introduce-islamic-indo/
> And why yes I am the one that said that!


The irony of you linking that particular website as SUPPORT of your claim just fucking obliterated my grip on reality

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------



the_randomizer said:


> I am genuinely curious, is having beliefs different that differ from left-leaning beliefs something worth  of being ridiculed and/or publicly shamed for or intrinsically wrong? (In other words, is having right-leaning political beliefs, which differ from left-leaning beliefs, something worthy of being ostracized or shamed from others for?)  I really want to know, as I'm getting that impression from political discussions as a whole. The other side of media would like for one to believe it's immoral and makes you evil if you do.


There is absolutely nothing wrong with teaching from a right or left perspective, nor is there anything wrong with holding views opposing the opposite party, so long as they aren't going to harm someone. The issue here is that this teacher is assigning reading that effectively says "economic conservativism is the only valid political stance and if you're a progressive you're an actual moron"


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## ThisIsDaAccount (Jan 27, 2018)

Cylent1 said:


> http://www.politifact.com/florida/s...-department-education-introduce-islamic-indo/
> And why yes I am the one that said that!


Dude, you should really read that link you posted, because it says that your claim is "False". 

Its kinda funny that you actually provided a link that says you're wrong.


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## the_randomizer (Jan 27, 2018)

TotalInsanity4 said:


> The irony of you linking that particular website as SUPPORT of your claim just fucking obliterated my grip on reality
> 
> --------------------- MERGED ---------------------------
> 
> ...



Okay, that's all I wanted to know, fair enough.


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## ThisIsDaAccount (Jan 27, 2018)

the_randomizer said:


> I am genuinely curious, is having beliefs different that differ from left-leaning beliefs something worth  of being ridiculed and/or publicly shamed for or intrinsically wrong? (In other words, is having right-leaning political beliefs, which differ from left-leaning beliefs, something worthy of being ostracized or shamed from others for?)  I really want to know, as I'm getting that impression from political discussions as a whole. The other side of media would like for one to believe it's immoral and makes you evil if you do.


In my opinion, all beliefs should be celebrated as long as they respect others. Right-leaning beliefs aren't worse, they're just another way of approaching an issue


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## the_randomizer (Jan 27, 2018)

ThisIsDaAccount said:


> In my opinion, all beliefs should be celebrated as long as they respect others. Right-leaning beliefs aren't worse, they're just another way of approaching an issue



I'm extremely wary of expressing said views due to the potentiality of being attacked for expressing, so I've been forced to b very cautious.  The mainstream media wishes to paint the opposing side as the enemy.


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## TotalInsanity4 (Jan 27, 2018)

ThisIsDaAccount said:


> In my opinion, all beliefs should be celebrated as long as they respect others. Right-leaning beliefs aren't worse, they're just another way of approaching an issue


Not true, beliefs that involve harm towards a group of people should be discouraged by any means necessary. Otherwise I agree with you


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## ThisIsDaAccount (Jan 27, 2018)

the_randomizer said:


> I'm extremely wary of expressing said views due to the potentiality of being attacked for expressing, so I've been forced to b very cautious.  The mainstream media wishes to paint the opposing side as the enemy.


I honestly do kinda feel the same way, a lot of the people where I used to live were conservative and watched Fox News/Breitbart/stuff like that, things that aren't very kind to left-leaning people. 

I started to be a bit more vocal because of a classmate I had. He had very right-leaning views but was very open to debating them, and he was nice to me when I explained mine. A lot of people gave him a hard time for his, even other right-leaning people, but, to his credit, he stuck to his guns and he was quite open about hearing others' views. 

I disagree with his views a lot, but I've tried to hsve the same approach, which is basically "respect those who disagree, but ignore those who disrespect".


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## Xzi (Jan 27, 2018)

the_randomizer said:


> I'm extremely wary of expressing said views due to the potentiality of being attacked for expressing, so I've been forced to b very cautious.  The mainstream media wishes to paint the opposing side as the enemy.


Fox News is also mainstream, so there is no "opposing side,"  mainstream media covers liberals and conservatives.  I've had this discussion on this site before, but none of the rest combined (MSNBC, CNN, CBS, etc) can equal up to one Fox News in terms of the power they hold.  Fox skips the middle-man and just talks to Trump directly in a lot of their shows now.


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## DarthDub (Jan 27, 2018)

"Liberalism is a Mental Disorder!" Where can I get this book? I want to read it.


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## VinsCool (Jan 27, 2018)

DarthDub said:


> "Liberalism is a Mental Disorder!" Where can I get this book? I want to read it.


Probably near the fiction section


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## ThisIsDaAccount (Jan 27, 2018)

DarthDub said:


> "Liberalism is a Mental Disorder!" Where can I get this book? I want to read it.


If I'm not mistaken, it's in the section titled "Delusional partisan stupidity", if that's the sort of stuff you read you've probsbly been there quite a few times


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