# What do you think will Nintendo's next generation handheld's 'Special Feature'?



## raystriker (May 25, 2014)

We've had the Gameboy, Color , Advance, DS , DSi & the 3DS
Each of the above handheld has had a major development over the previous.
I think the 3DS has everything current technology has to offer(Almost?). What do you tempers think will Nintendo's next handheld offer?(Say- 4-5 years from now?)


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## Ace Overclocked (May 25, 2014)

raystriker said:


> We've had the Gameboy, Color , Advance, DS , DSi & the 3DS
> Each of the above handheld has had a major development over the previous.
> I think the 3DS has everything current technology has to offer(Almost?). What do you tempers think will Nintendo's next handheld offer?(Say- 4-5 years from now?)


 
Maybe a better screen, enhanced 3d technology, HD cameras. I dunno it doesn't look like they could add much within reason, i could say HD games but it would make its games incompatible with normal 3ds.


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## Qtis (May 25, 2014)

Better internals and screens. I'd have preferred the 3DS without a 3D screen if the screen could have been upped a bit in terms of resolution.


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## KingVamp (May 25, 2014)

Ace Overclocked said:


> Maybe a better screen, enhanced 3d technology, HD cameras. I dunno it doesn't look like they could add much within reason, i could say HD games but it would make its games incompatible with normal 3ds.


Enhancing past technology isn't really the "Special Feature". Other words, the feature would have to be a different thing altogether. Can't really think of what that would be right now, tho. If they make it strong enough or just leave in 3DS hardware, that shouldn't be a problem.


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## FAST6191 (May 25, 2014)

What was the GBA's major development over the GBC?

If Nintendo does another... probably nothing more than dual analogs,


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## raystriker (May 25, 2014)

Ace Overclocked said:


> Maybe a better screen, enhanced 3d technology, HD cameras. I dunno it doesn't look like they could add much within reason, i could say HD games but it would make its games incompatible with normal 3ds.


 


Qtis said:


> Better internals and screens. I'd have preferred the 3DS without a 3D screen if the screen could have been upped a bit in terms of resolution.


 
So you speculate that the next successor to the 3DS will be like what the DSi was to the DS?


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## Qtis (May 25, 2014)

raystriker said:


> So you speculate that the next successor to the 3DS will be like what the DSi was to the DS?


 
The DSi was a meagre upgrade of the DS. I mean something along the lines of making a handheld with a better screen (compare the PSVita and 3DS screens side by side and you'll notice the difference and problem).


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## Oxybelis (May 25, 2014)

One screen 

As we see with 2DS, 2 screens setup is too costly.


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## TheDarkSeed (May 25, 2014)

Near Field Communication, Bluetooth and that second circle pad I've been waiting for them to release on their next 3ds revision.


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## FAST6191 (May 25, 2014)

NFC and Bluetooth.... for what reasons? Sure it is getting to the point where you can buy the chips in for not a lot and licenses are not that bad either (though Nintendo seems averse to doing more than they absolutely have to) but I am not seeing many benefits from where Nintendo sits.


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## JoostinOnline (May 25, 2014)

Well, they've already done 3D, so the only thing left is to have enemies actually hurt you.  Maybe the console shocks you if you get hit.


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## Arras (May 25, 2014)

JoostinOnline said:


> Well, they've already done 3D, so the only thing left is to have enemies actually hurt you. Maybe the console shocks you if you get hit.


Maybe it's finally time for the smellovision to make its debut?


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## oji (May 25, 2014)

It's could be a built-in video projector to make AR games be more augmented into the real world.


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## KingVamp (May 25, 2014)

FAST6191 said:


> What was the GBA's major development over the GBC?


The form factor and the extra buttons?



FAST6191 said:


> NFC and Bluetooth.... for what reasons? *...* I am not seeing many benefits from where Nintendo sits.


True. I guess other than making a more compelling buy. Not sure if NFC and Bluetooth would make that much of a difference, tho. I see them adding NFC since they are already using it.



Oxybelis said:


> One screen
> 
> As we see with 2DS, 2 screens setup is too costly.


Just no. That's a step backwards.

Except the fact the 2ds is still being used as two screens.

Let's say the 2ds means anything for the next main handheld. We get this.


Spoiler


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## FireGrey (May 25, 2014)

Heavy integration with the next home console, ie. able to used like wii u gamepad and take the same games on the go with you.


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## Ace Overclocked (May 25, 2014)

TheDarkSeed said:


> Near Field Communication, Bluetooth and that second circle pad I've been waiting for them to release on their next 3ds revision.


 
I doubt second circle pad would happen, can anyone tell me about any new games that even use the CPP?


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## KingVamp (May 25, 2014)

Ace Overclocked said:


> I doubt second circle pad would happen, can anyone tell me about any new games that even use the CPP?


Considering the outrage for it in the first place, I think it's more likely than not. CPP isn't the same as having a second one built-in.


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## Harsky (May 25, 2014)

I hope their next handheld is the one that is actually built around online. My ultimate dream would be for them to release a Netflix style subscription for their games where you play X amount monthly and you get access to ALL the VC games and play as much as you want on it. It should also have the ability to stream games online to it but I highly doubt this idea would go down well in areas with poor internet connection (would be enough for older retro games but probably not for their latest releases). 

As for the device itself, I think the 3DS will probably be the last time we'll see the clamshell design and they'll go for a one giant screen with buttons on the side.


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## FAST6191 (May 25, 2014)

KingVamp said:


> [What was the leap between GBC and GBA?]
> The form factor and the extra buttons?



Are we really calling that a leap? I am not inclined to start a "but ? was first" thing but any number of wider handhelds with many buttons happened before then, I am coming up a bit short on shoulder buttons mind you.



KingVamp said:


> [Why/what benefit from NFC and bluetooth?]
> True. I guess other than making a more compelling buy. Not sure if NFC and Bluetooth would make that much of a difference, tho. I see them adding NFC since they are already using it.



I am sure NFC would make skylanders people happy. Otherwise it feels about as redundant as IR.


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## yuyuyup (May 25, 2014)

God I hope Nintendo sticks with 3d.


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## Guild McCommunist (May 25, 2014)

raystriker said:


> I think the 3DS has everything current technology has to offer(Almost?).


 
Except 2 analog sticks.

And good graphics.


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## emigre (May 25, 2014)

Guild McCommunist said:


> Except 2 analog sticks.
> 
> And good graphics.


 

And a tolerable resolution screen.


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## 1stClassZackFair (May 25, 2014)

Guild McCommunist said:


> Except 2 analog sticks.
> 
> And good graphics.



And a long lasting battery life.


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## Tom Bombadildo (May 25, 2014)

Probably some crap gimmick they throw away after a couple years.


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## Gahars (May 25, 2014)

You know, just games would be nice.



yuyuyup said:


> God I hope Nintendo sticks with 3d.


 

Mais non.


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## Veho (May 25, 2014)

raystriker said:


> What do you tempers think will Nintendo's next handheld offer?(Say- 4-5 years from now?)



This.


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## Clydefrosch (May 25, 2014)

waterproof to use during boring baths or beach holidays


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## FAST6191 (May 25, 2014)

Gahars said:


> You know, just games would be nice.



This is modern/future Nintendo you are talking about.


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## KingVamp (May 25, 2014)

Good graphics and resolution are subjective. 



FAST6191 said:


> Are we really calling that a leap? I am not inclined to start a "but ? was first" thing but any number of wider handhelds with many buttons happened before then, I am coming up a bit short on shoulder buttons mind you.


Not really a leap, but still a noticeable change from the Color, besides that and the form factor, I
guess the GBA doesn't really have that "special feature".




Harsky said:


> My ultimate dream would be for them to release a Netflix style subscription for their games where you play X amount monthly and you get access to ALL the VC games and play as much as you want on it. .
> 
> As for the device itself, I think the 3DS will probably be the last time we'll see the clamshell design and they'll go for a one giant screen with buttons on the side.


 
None of this is going to happen.



1stClassZackFair said:


> And a long lasting battery life.


Which most modern portable devices don't really have, but that said, I do hope the battery and the handheld is bigger from the get go.



Veho said:


> This.


I was thinking Augmented Reality glasses, but thought that was a bit much. Not saying it's out of the realm of Nintendo. They would have to design it to go over eyeglasses. Not to even mention VR.


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## GameWinner (May 25, 2014)

Clydefrosch said:


> waterproof to use during boring baths or beach holidays


I'm not in the bath to play games! I'm in there to handle business!


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## emmanu888 (May 25, 2014)

Better resolution, better graphics, better screen quality and please, release the XL version at launch ! Bigger handhelds are way better than the small one


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## emigre (May 25, 2014)

GameWinner said:


> I'm not in the bath to play games! I'm in there to handle business!


 

Confirmed: GameWinner wanks in the bath.


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## cdoty (May 25, 2014)

FAST6191 said:


> What was the GBA's major development over the GBC?


 
The processor, graphics hardware, sound.

Basically, the GBC was a NES, and the GBA was a SNES.. in relative terms.


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## emmanu888 (May 25, 2014)

cdoty said:


> The processor, graphics hardware, sound.
> 
> Basically, the GBC was a NES, and the GBA was a SNES.. in relative terms.


 

So going by that logic, the NDS was a N64 and the 3DS is a GCN ?


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## Veho (May 25, 2014)

FAST6191 said:


> What was the GBA's major development over the GBC?


Shoulder buttons.


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## FAST6191 (May 25, 2014)

cdoty said:


> The processor, graphics hardware, sound.
> 
> Basically, the GBC was a NES, and the GBA was a SNES.. in relative terms.


So a once good but now/then ageing processor popular in embedded systems, all wrapped around a fairly modest amount of memory and graphics hardware, stuff that has seen technically superior competition during its day, gave way to...  a once good but now/then ageing processor popular in embedded systems, all wrapped around a fairly modest amount of memory and graphics hardware, stuff that has seen technically superior competition during its day*.

*for some this might also have signified the rise of the mobile phone. The amount of times I was linked up the various emulators that were made for various java and phones and asked why no GBA, only to have to point out it was a more advanced ARM running at several hundred MHz with substantially more memory (probably even more than the DS would later have).



emmanu888 said:


> So going by that logic, the NDS was a N64 and the 3DS is a GCN ?


The terms little NES, little SNES and broad comparisons, types of ports and the like mean that line of logic is far from unheard of.



Veho said:


> Shoulder buttons.


I did actually have a look earlier to see if I could find earlier portables with shoulder buttons and came up short, I am content enough with it not exactly being a new concept in game controllers though.


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## TheCasketMan (May 25, 2014)

They should replace cartridges with mini blu-ray disc and put fans where the speakers are to cool me while I play outside and for a neat 4D effect. Add a refillable water tank, scent air, and rumble while they are at it.


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## Foxi4 (May 25, 2014)

raystriker said:


> We've had the Gameboy, Color , Advance, DS , DSi & the 3DS
> Each of the above handheld has had a major development over the previous.
> I think the 3DS has everything current technology has to offer(Almost?). What do you tempers think will Nintendo's next handheld offer?(Say- 4-5 years from now?)


The 3DS is a major development over the DSi? In what regard? I could understand the DS-to-DSi since the DSi introduced DSiWare, embedded cameras and whatnot, but the 3DS's only _"achievement"_ is the glasses-less 3D screen that people use for 15 minutes and then forget about. Other than the specs _(which are a good couple of years behind the times)_, there isn't any jump to speak of unless you want to count the top screen aspect ratio.





FAST6191 said:


> What was the GBA's major development over the GBC?


Landscape screen, shoulder buttons, better form factor? 




KingVamp said:


> Good graphics and resolution are subjective.


They're objective if you have means of comparison to other devices from the same time frame.


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## tbgtbg (May 25, 2014)

FAST6191 said:


> What was the GBA's major development over the GBC?



It was the first Nintendo handheld that could really interact with a Nintendo console, wasn't it? I know there was some pokeymans adapter for the N64, and of course Super Gameboy, but those connected the carts, not the system. With GBA you connected it directly and could interact with the Gamecube as a 2nd screen and stuff. Not used a lot, but probably a better notion for a "leap" than shoulder buttons.


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## FAST6191 (May 25, 2014)

That seems more like an innovation done _with_ the GBA rather than an innovation _of_ the GBA.



Foxi4 said:


> Landscape screen, shoulder buttons, better form factor?



I already took shoulder buttons, similarly you and I share similar opinions on the pointlessness of "what was first" debates but I will have to *points at gamegear*.


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## Foxi4 (May 25, 2014)

FAST6191 said:


> I already took shoulder buttons, similarly you and I share similar opinions on the pointlessness of "what was first" debates but I will have to *points at gamegear*.


I obviously meant the differences between the Color and the Advance, not anything the Advance introduced to the gaming world in general.


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## FAST6191 (May 25, 2014)

Did the wider aspect ratio really open things up for styles of games that did not work before, at least over what the increased resolution/tile count afforded? It is not like the GB/GBC struggled with platforming, screen scrollers, turn based strategy... after all.


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## Foxi4 (May 25, 2014)

FAST6191 said:


> Did the wider aspect ratio really open things up for styles of games that did not work before, at least over what the increased resolution/tile count afforded? It is not like the GB/GBC struggled with platforming, screen scrollers, turn based strategy... after all.


I think it definitely has - platforming on a widescreen just feels more natural, it gives the player more time to react to what appears on the horizon, I think it was a big game changer for the Game Boy and subsequently the DS line.


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## FAST6191 (May 25, 2014)

You say that but I am far more likely to break out 6 golden coins than I am the advance titles. Granted that could just be being bored of ports/remakes and/or it maybe being better games -- I doubt many would argue GBA mario is that strong.

I definitely say stick with widescreen unless you want to make me a dedicated tetris, tetris themed and vertical shmup system.... actually that is not a bad idea.


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## KingVamp (May 25, 2014)

Foxi4 said:


> The 3DS is a major development over the DSi? In what regard? I could understand the DS-to-DSi since the DSi introduced DSiWare, embedded cameras and whatnot, but the 3DS's* only *_"achievement"_ is the glasses-less 3D screen that people use for 15 minutes and then forget about. *Other* than the specs _(which are a good couple of years behind the times)_, there isn't any jump to speak of unless you want to count the top screen aspect ratio.


Say that to the people who use it most of, if not all, the time. Seems like jumps to me even if you undermine them. Oh, and the SlidePad.




Foxi4 said:


> They're objective if you have means of comparison to other devices from the same time frame.


It's one thing to say these aren't good graphics vs these graphics are better than this one. 

It's like saying the PS4 doesn't have good graphics because it can't outdo a high-end PC.


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## Foxi4 (May 25, 2014)

KingVamp said:


> Say that to the people who use it most of, if not all, the time. Seems like jumps to me even if you undermine them. Oh, and the SlidePad.


A _"jump"_ changes the way you game. 3D doesn't change the way you game, it marginally influences visuals. I am yet to meet a single person who uses the 3D feature of the 3DS all the time, in fact, I'm yet to meet a single person who uses it for more than 15 minutes at a time.


> It's one thing to say these aren't good graphics vs these graphics are better than this one. It's like saying the PS4 doesn't have good graphics because it can't outdo a high-end PC


It's absolutely that easy. The PS4 produces relatively good graphics, they are on-par with a mid-range PC, they fit into the generation neatly. The 3DS on the other hand is nowhere near even low-end smartphones, you can objectively say that its graphics capabilities are poor and behind the times. That doesn't mean that the games look bad - that's aesthetics. We're talking about raw graphics capabilities here and those spring directly from the hardware. I mean, c'mon, the 3DS doesn't even do trilinear filtering - the PICA200 can't handle that. 2005 called, it wants its GPU back.


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## 1stClassZackFair (May 25, 2014)

GameWinner said:


> I'm not in the bath to play games! I'm in there to handle business!


 
By business do you mean choking the chicken? On topic: I predict a 4D console.


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## roastable (May 25, 2014)

raystriker said:


> *I think the 3DS has everything current technology has to offer*(Almost?).


 
When I go to use the 3DS for anything other than playing games, it offers an experience similar to loading files on to a potato.
While I can forgive the extremely lightweight web browser that can get tasks done, provided that you don't expect much from it in the first place, certain features are pretty clunky.

A music player that isn't stuck in the days of old drag'n'drop MP3 players would be nice and also some better useability. I don't quite understand the limit of files per folder and even more so why it takes so long to load said files with there being no difference between using a class 10 and a class 2 SD card.

Also, bluetooth would be nice. I find spotpass more annoying than convenient.


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## cdoty (May 26, 2014)

emmanu888 said:


> So going by that logic, the NDS was a N64 and the 3DS is a GCN ?


 
Uhhm, not quite. The DS was pretty much two SNES consoles 'duct taped' together, with a primitive tacked on (N64ish) 3D mode. The 3DS probably sits somewhere between the N64 and GCN.



FAST6191 said:


> So a once good but now/then ageing processor popular in embedded systems, all wrapped around a fairly modest amount of memory and graphics hardware, stuff that has seen technically superior competition during its day, gave way to... a once good but now/then ageing processor popular in embedded systems, all wrapped around a fairly modest amount of memory and graphics hardware, stuff that has seen technically superior competition during its day*.


 
I don't think anyone can ever accuse Nintendo of being a tech leader. The quote, from 13 Things You Might Not Know About The Game Boy (Gunpei Yokoi), "Lateral thinking of withered technology" pretty much sums up Nintendo's approach to game hardware. Price used to be their secret weapon, which they seem to have forgotten at the start of this generation.


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## WaryLouka (May 26, 2014)

The Nintendo Revolution (smart tablet-ish); 4K Screen, Modular Design ( See Phonebloks ), and eShop included so you can download applications, and games. It could also have 3DS-retrocompatibility.


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## Guild McCommunist (May 26, 2014)

Side note the 3D on the 3DS looks awful anyway. I remember buying my 3DS and turning 3D on for the first time, preparing to be amazed, and it just makes everything look like shit.

Meanwhile the OLED on my Vita makes everything look vibrant and clear and doesn't suck on my battery or give me a headache.


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## VMM (May 26, 2014)

There isn't much to innovate in my opinion, but there could be several improvements:
Dual analog sticks, Possibility to record and upload your gameplay,HD screens, bluetooth,
internal storage, better 3D and in both screens, capacitive touch screen, SDXC support,
HD cameras, a decent movie player, GBA, DS and SNES VC titles etc


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## tbgtbg (May 26, 2014)

FAST6191 said:


> Foxi4 said:
> 
> 
> > .Landscape screen, shoulder buttons, better form factor?
> ...



And Gamegear didn't really do anything with screen/form factor that Lynx didn't already do.


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## Foxi4 (May 26, 2014)

tbgtbg said:


> And Gamegear didn't really do anything with screen/form factor that Lynx didn't already do.


Well, there was the whole _"having games"_ and _"working as intended"_ side of things, but other than that...


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## KingVamp (May 27, 2014)

Foxi4 said:


> A _"jump"_ changes the way you game. 3D doesn't change the way you game, it marginally influences visuals. I am yet to meet a single person who uses the 3D feature of the 3DS all the time, in fact, I'm yet to meet a single person who uses it for more than 15 minutes at a time.


We have to agree to disagree on this one.



Foxi4 said:


> The 3DS on the other hand is nowhere near even low-end smartphones,


Low-end as of 2011?



Foxi4 said:


> I mean, c'mon, the 3DS doesn't even do trilinear filtering


And the vita does?



WaryLouka said:


> 4K Screen, Modular Design ( See Phonebloks ),


Not going to happen. Why would you need 4K on such small screens?
Again, not going to happen. Only thing I see that can be module without changing the system are the cameras,Bluetooth and NFC if it has them. Not that they would do that anyway.



Guild McCommunist said:


> Side note the 3D on the 3DS looks awful anyway. I remember buying my 3DS and turning 3D on for the first time, preparing to be amazed, and it just makes everything look like shit.


I'm starting to think you can't see 3DS's 3D correctly. That aside, they can always improve it for the next handheld.



Guild McCommunist said:


> Meanwhile the OLED on my Vita doesn't suck on my battery


That's why Sony didn't change the screen to a LCD.



VMM said:


> There isn't much to innovate in my opinion, but there could be several improvements:
> Dual analog sticks, Possibility to record and upload your gameplay,HD screens, bluetooth,
> internal storage, better 3D and in both screens, capacitive touch screen, SDXC support,
> HD cameras, a decent movie player, GBA, DS and SNES VC titles etc


While all that seems reasonable,  capacitive touch screen isn't going to happen and HD cameras,
I doubt it.


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## Foxi4 (May 27, 2014)

KingVamp said:


> We have to agree to disagree on this one.


Okay.


> Low-end as of 2011?


Absolutely. The specs were poor Day 1.


> And the vita does?


Absolutely. The PowerVR SGX line supports trilinear filtering. Whether PSVita's SDK does is not for me to guess, but it does support OpenGLES 2.0 and trilinear filtering is a part of the function set.

*tl;dr* The 3DS was outdated Day 1.


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## KingVamp (May 27, 2014)

Foxi4 said:


> Absolutely. The specs were poor Day 1.


Then show me a low-end phone of 2011 playing similar games as the 3DS.


Doesn't really mean much if the things aren't being used.


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## Jayro (May 27, 2014)

Nintendo has heard our cry for dual-analogs, so I'm sure we'll get it with the next DS system they make. Hopefully at least a 720pscreen and Bluetooth would be nice.


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## Foxi4 (May 27, 2014)

KingVamp said:


> Then show me a low-end phone of 2011 playing similar games as the 3DS. Doesn't really mean much if the things aren't being used.


Are you kidding? 2011 was the year the iPhone 4S was released - that thing packs a PowerVR SGX543MP2 and a dual-core 1 GHz Cortex-A9. As far as Androids were concerned there was the Galaxy Nexus powered by a dual-core 1.2-1.5GHz ARM Cortex-A9 and a PowerVR SGX540. You want quality games? Okay - Infinity Blade 2, SEGA & Sonic All-Stars Racing, Grand Theft Auto 3, Dead Space, Modern Combat 3, the list goes on. Don't defend the 3DS - the specs were _poor_ Day 1. You're _completely_ forgetting the fact that consoles are initially sold at a loss and phones _are not_, consoles are _supposed_ to have appropriate specs for the time because they're supposed to last, profits come from game licensing.



JayRo said:


> Nintendo has heard our cry for dual-analogs, so I'm sure we'll get it with the next DS system they make. Hopefully at least a 720pscreen and Bluetooth would be nice.


They have? Where's the 3DS revision? Where are the Circlepad Pro games? How come they didn't hear the cries of PSP owners for dual analog and adjusted to that?


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## Veho (May 27, 2014)

Foxi4 said:


> They have? Where's the 3DS revision? Where are the Circlepad Pro games?


"Where's the splitting their userbase in half?" 



Foxi4 said:


> How come they didn't hear the cries of PSP owners for dual analog and adjusted to that?


What do they know? They are Sony fans and therefore their opinion is inherently wrong  ;O;


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## Foxi4 (May 27, 2014)

Veho said:


> "Where's the splitting their userbase in half?"


Because the WiiMotion+ split the userbase in half. Those who _don't_ have a dual analog 3DS _can just grab a Circlepad Pro and still have two sliders_ just like standard WiiMote users could buy a WiiMotion+ add-on to upgrade to WiiMote+. Imaginary problem used as an excuse for inadequacy. There's only one reason why Circlepad Pro's are pulled off the shelves and barely sell and that reason is that there are no gaems hardly any games that support it.


> What do they know? They are Sony fans and therefore their opinion is inherently wrong ;O;


At least our handhelds aren't 5 years behind the times. Enjoy the Nintendo Time Machine. _;O;_


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## KingVamp (May 27, 2014)

Foxi4 said:


> Are you kidding? 2011 was the year the iPhone 4S was released - that thing packs a PowerVR SGX543MP2 and a Dual-core 1 GHz Cortex-A9. As far as Androids were concerned there was the Galaxy Nexus powered by a dual-core ARM Cortex-A9 and a PowerVR SGX540. You want quality games? Okay - Infinity Blade 2, SEGA & Sonic All-Stars Racing, Dead Space, Modern Combat 3, the list goes on. Don't defend the 3DS - the specs were _poor_ Day 1.


 
Galaxy Nexus-$649 
These are low-end?


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## Veho (May 27, 2014)

Foxi4 said:


> Because the WiiMotion+ split the userbase in half.


Are you saying it didn't? How many WiiMotion +-es were sold? And how many games actually demanded it? 



Foxi4 said:


> At least our handhelds aren't 5 years behind the times. Enjoy the Nintendo Time Machine. _;O;_


It's called "retro" and nostalgia is in these days. Get with the times, Foxi   ;O;


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## Foxi4 (May 27, 2014)

Veho said:


> Are you saying it didn't? How many WiiMotion +-es were sold? And how many games actually demanded it?


It's not my fault that Nintendo wins the Gold medal for releasing add-ons that they never support. That said, Skyward Sword was a big title supporting it. There's also Red Steel 2.


> It's called "retro" and nostalgia is in these days. Get with the times, Foxi  ;O;


Retro = Old ergo beautiful and nostalgic. Outdated Day 1 = Inadequate. _;O;_


KingVamp said:


> Galaxy Nexus-$649
> These are low-end?


You missed the part where consoles are initially sold at a loss and phones aren't. You'd like a comparable low-end? Okay - Samsung Wave 2. Single-core 1GHz ARM Cortex-A8, PowerVR SGX540, 512MB RAM, beats the 3DS right off the bat. HTC Trophy 7 - 1GHz Snapdragon S1 with Adreno 200, 576MB RAM. Both handsets released for around the same price as the 3DS, both were sold _at a profit_ for obvious reasons and both narrowly beat the 3DS specs-wise.


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## Veho (May 27, 2014)

Foxi4 said:


> It's not my fault that Nintendo wins the Gold medal for releasing add-ons that they never support.


To be fair, nobody supports add-ons. 



Foxi4 said:


> That said, Skyward Sword was a big title supporting it. There's also Red Steel 2.


And look where that got them. Skyward Sword sold half as many copies as Twilight Princess on the Wii, and Red Steel 2 sold a quarter the number that the first Red Steel did, despite being a vastly better game. Fact is, demanding an add-on fractures the userbase and shrinks your target market.


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## Bean_BR (May 27, 2014)

Holographic gameplay.


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## Ulieq (May 27, 2014)

dual analog, rumble, lighter xl version, analog l/r buttons.


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## Gahars (May 28, 2014)

Veho said:


> And look where that got them. Skyward Sword sold half as many copies as Twilight Princess on the Wii


 

Maybe that's just because Skyward Sword was 



Spoiler



bad.


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## KingVamp (May 28, 2014)

Foxi4 said:


> You missed the part where consoles are initially sold at a loss and phones aren't.


You missed the part where Nintendo normally doesn't sell at a loss and even then those phones cost
a lot more.



Foxi4 said:


> Okay - Samsung Wave 2. Single-core 1GHz ARM Cortex-A8, PowerVR SGX540, 512MB RAM, beats the 3DS right off the bat. HTC Trophy 7 - 1GHz Snapdragon S1 with Adreno 200, 576MB RAM. Both handsets released for around the same price as the 3DS,


 
HTC Trophy 7- $430 (without contract) 



Foxi4 said:


> both *narrowly* beat the 3DS specs-wise.





Foxi4 said:


> The 3DS on the other hand is nowhere near even low-end smartphones,


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## Vipera (May 28, 2014)

There was no special feature in the GBA. I think the new Nintendo handheld will be something like the Ubuntu project with their smartphone.


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## Skelletonike (May 28, 2014)

Foxi4 said:


> A _"jump"_ changes the way you game. 3D doesn't change the way you game, it marginally influences visuals. I am yet to meet a single person who uses the 3D feature of the 3DS all the time, in fact, I'm yet to meet a single person who uses it for more than 15 minutes at a time.


 
I think it does change it. As for a single person, I recall I've told you before on the shoutbox that I do have 3D all the time. Only times I remove it are when the battery is in the red.

While some games don't do the 3D a lot of justice, others do, and very well at that. A recent example would be Bravely Default, a game that looks fantastic with the 3D on, in comparison to the normal 2D per se.



Anyway, I'm hoping the next Nintendo handheld keeps the 3D function, streetpass features (it had a slow start, but now it's everywhere over here), and obviously, double screens. As for new things, while I don't agree on a 3DS revision having two dual analogs, the successor having them right from the start would be a great plus, given that 3D technology keeps getting better and better, a new revision of the 3D screens would be good too, although I wonder if using a new 3D technology would cause compability issues with current 3D that works with two screens.


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## Dork (May 28, 2014)

Gahars said:


> Maybe that's just because Skyward Sword was
> 
> 
> 
> ...


b-but gahars i liked that game


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## Guild McCommunist (May 28, 2014)

Dark S. said:


> b-but gahars i liked that game


 

The only good WM+ was Red Steel 2.

For the record I fucking love Red Steel 2. It's a completely awesome game and it's a shame it never got a PS3 port with Move support and probably won't get a sequel. It has like one of my favorite aesthetics of all time.


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## Dork (May 28, 2014)

Guild McCommunist said:


> The only good WM+ was Red Steel 2.
> 
> For the record I fucking love Red Steel 2. It's a completely awesome game and it's a shame it never got a PS3 port with Move support and probably won't get a sequel. It has like one of my favorite aesthetics of all time.


 
Never played any of Red Steel 1 or 2. What kind of games are they?


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## Guild McCommunist (May 28, 2014)

Dark S. said:


> Never played any of Red Steel 1 or 2. What kind of games are they?


 

Red Steel 1, disregard completely. It was a launch game I'm pretty sure and the controls are shit and the gameplay is shit.

Red Steel 2 is completely unrelated. It's not the first WM+ so it'll sense things pretty well, it's got this cyber western, east-meets-west aesthetic, the art is amazing, the gameplay is fun, it's a mix of first person swordfighting and gun slinging, and it kinda plays out like older FPS games. It's not just a corridor shooter. I'd have to say I'd recommend the game heavily to anyone who enjoys fun.


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## Dork (May 28, 2014)

Guild McCommunist said:


> Red Steel 2 is completely unrelated. It's not the first WM+ so it'll sense things pretty well, it's got this cyber western, east-meets-west aesthetic, the art is amazing, the gameplay is fun, it's a mix of first person swordfighting and gun slinging, and it kinda plays out like older FPS games. It's not just a corridor shooter. I'd have to say I'd recommend the game heavily to anyone who enjoys fun.


That sounds pretty cool, I'll have to pick up a copy. Not that many good WM+ games out there so that should be a breath of fresh air.


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## FireGrey (May 28, 2014)

Maybe they will kick up streetpass to the extent that games feel like MMOs, just offline.
Oh and asymmetric gameplay to the extent that you have 9 screens (1xTV + 4xDS) for a single four player game of mario kart.
I imagine they would pull this stuff off really well on zelda.
They're gimicky thing would probably have to do with their QoL and replacement of Wii accessories to improve motion control.


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## Foxi4 (May 28, 2014)

KingVamp said:


> You missed the part where Nintendo normally doesn't sell at a loss and even then those phones cost
> a lot more.
> HTC Trophy 7- $430 (without contract)


HTC Trophy 7 is a 2010 smartphone, by 2011 it was half-price at most. Let's completely forget about all the additional chips phones have like GPS, GSM and Bluetooth controllers and antennas too. Damned if you're right, damned if you're wrong - the mind of a fanboy does not compute. The hardware was outdated Day 1, worse than low-end mobiles at the time, I proved this much. The difference between a fan and a fanboy is that a fan will buy the product but acknowledge its flaws, a fanboy will grasp at any excuse to cover them up.


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## KingVamp (May 28, 2014)

Foxi4 said:


> HTC Trophy 7 is a 2010 smartphone, by 2011 it was half-price at most. Let's completely forget about all the additional chips phones have like GPS, GSM and Bluetooth controllers and antennas too. Damned if you're right, damned if you're wrong - the mind of a fanboy does not compute. The hardware was outdated Day 1, worse than low-end mobiles at the time, I proved this much. The difference between a fan and a fanboy is that a fan will buy the product but acknowledge its flaws, a fanboy will grasp at any excuse to cover them up.


Half-price at most? Yes, because the 3DS is just a SOC and nothing else.

Doesn't change the fact that the 3DS is close in specs to devices in reality costing twice as much.
There's a difference between criticism and hating while pulling the fanboy card when someone disagrees.


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## FAST6191 (May 28, 2014)

Though I think Foxi4 is right in this (the 3ds is underpowered for what it is and when it was released, let alone now*) I do have to wonder if you could also make the console vs PC argument where one "needs" a PC and thusly the $400 or so it costs to get one is a given and then you can add the $400 more to turn it into a gameplay powerhouse, that or you can negate the contract aspect/look at contract prices ( http://www.fonearena.com/blog/37612...-trophy-price-and-release-date-confirmed.html says $200 at launch on contract).

*not to mention is now, was at the time... matters little when the market as a whole is looked at.


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## Guild McCommunist (May 28, 2014)

KingVamp said:


> Half-price at most? Yes, because the 3DS is just a SOC and nothing else.
> 
> Doesn't change the fact that the 3DS is close in specs to devices in reality costing twice as much.
> There's a difference between criticism and hating while pulling the fanboy card when someone disagrees.


 

There's a slew of reasons cell phones are expensive, the tech is not always one of them. You think an unlocked smart phone is really worth $600 in specs alone? C'mon now.

I think it's also worth noting that the Vita released like a year later at the same price as the 3DS with specs that blow it out of the goddamn water.


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## KingVamp (May 28, 2014)

Guild McCommunist said:


> You think an unlocked smart phone is really worth $600 in specs alone? C'mon now.


No, but the price isn't just for the specs of tech in general.




Guild McCommunist said:


> I think it's also worth noting that the Vita released like a year later at the same price as the 3DS with specs that blow it out of the goddamn water.


It was sold almost, if not, at a lost too.


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## TheDarkSeed (May 28, 2014)

KingVamp said:


> Considering the outrage for it in the first place, I think it's more likely than not. CPP isn't the same as having a second one built-in.


 
It WILL happen. And once I get that 3ds pro in my hands, I'll laugh at all the naysayers.


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## Social_Outlaw (May 28, 2014)

1. LCD instead of OLED
2. Bigger battery
3. Two analog sticks
4. Anti aliasing
5. Bigger screen


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## WiiCube_2013 (May 28, 2014)

Backwards compatibility with GB, GBC, GBA, DS and 3DS. I wish.. lol.


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## Foxchild (May 28, 2014)

They already released it - it comes bundled with the Wii U.  The upgrade is that it can stream Wii U games.


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## KingVamp (May 29, 2014)

Skelletonike said:


> although I wonder if using a new 3D technology would cause compability issues with current 3D that works with two screens.


Sounds like they would have to be converted for the next format.



TheDarkSeed said:


> It WILL happen. And once I get that 3ds pro in my hands, I'll laugh at all the naysayers.


When I read that, I thought you meant for the next handheld. Although, a 3DS Pro could be the DSI for the 3DS.



6SoulTriox said:


> 1. LCD instead of OLED


Strange considering the praise for OLED. Although, Nintendo would probably stay with
LCD.


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## Foxi4 (May 29, 2014)

FAST6191 said:


> Though I think Foxi4 is right in this (the 3ds is underpowered for what it is and when it was released, let alone now*) I do have to wonder if you could also make the console vs PC argument where one "needs" a PC and thusly the $400 or so it costs to get one is a given and then you can add the $400 more to turn it into a gameplay powerhouse, that or you can negate the contract aspect/look at contract prices ( http://www.fonearena.com/blog/37612...-trophy-price-and-release-date-confirmed.html says $200 at launch on contract).
> 
> *not to mention is now, was at the time... matters little when the market as a whole is looked at.


My problem with KingVamp is that he keeps on adding additional conditional statements to the original assumption. I said that the 3DS was underpowered Day 1 and had the specs of low-end smartphones, he immediately asks _"2011 ones?"_. I say _"yes, even 2011 low-ends were (arguably) better"_ to which he replies _"but Foxi, those are expensive"_. There's just no pleasing him when in my eyes a console is _not_ a phone, it's not something that you replace in 1-2 year intervals, it's something you invest in once and enjoy throughout the generation. I don't expect my new handhelds to just be _"passable"_ at the day of their release, I expect them to be _"adequate"_ throughout the life cycle. I don't see a problem with suffering some losses in the beginning for the sake of providing a consistently high-quality device for a number of years. Back when the PSVita was released it could rival with the best of the best in mobile entertainment and although a lot of time has passed and stronger devices inevitably hit the market it's still _"way up there"_, it remains relevant. The 3DS on the other hand sank within the year and right now you can only point and laugh at it - the average phone really _does_ beat it and it doesn't even have to be a new one.


6SoulTriox said:


> 1. LCD instead of OLED
> 2. Bigger battery
> 3. Two analog sticks
> 4. Anti aliasing
> 5. Bigger screen


So essentially you want a Nintendo-branded PSVita 2000? Imagine that - _"with Sony the future is now!" _


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## ScarletCrystals (May 29, 2014)

I want COMPs or TS with the devil summoner program.
And a personal messaging app...


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## Foxi4 (May 29, 2014)

ScarletCrystals said:


> And a personal messaging app...


Yeah, we had that - it was called Swapnote. Unfortunately because Nintendo is scared of the Internet, doesn't know that _"banning"_ someone from an Online service is an option and wouldn't know how to moderate online applications even if an instruction booklet for moderating hit them square on the face we no longer have it.


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## ScarletCrystals (May 29, 2014)

Foxi4 said:


> Yeah, we had that - it was called Swapnote. Unfortunately because Nintendo is scared of the Internet, doesn't know that _"banning"_ someone from an Online service is an option and wouldn't know how to moderate online applications even if an instruction booklet for moderating hit them square on the face we no longer have it.


Yes, I was quite fond of swapnote actually. Too bad we'll probably never get another personal message app again. At least AC has basic chat function...


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## Foxi4 (May 29, 2014)

ScarletCrystals said:


> Yes, I was quite fond of swapnote actually. Too bad we'll probably never get another personal message app again. At least AC has basic chat function...


Nintendo has to realize that every now and then they will run into a user who abuses the system and they need to learn how to counteract in such cases instead of, y'know, closing down the entire service because of a handful of incidents. Someone needs to burst their bubble and open their eyes because they seem to be under the impression that the world is made of candy floss and rainbows wheras in reality when you give someone a device with the ability to take photos, _"nudes"_ invariably follow.


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## KingVamp (May 29, 2014)

Foxi4 said:


> My problem with KingVamp is that he keeps on adding additional conditional statements to the original assumption. I said that the 3DS was underpowered Day 1 and had the specs of low-end smartphones, he immediately asks _"2011 ones?"_. I say _"yes, even 2011 low-ends were (arguably) better"_ to which he replies _"but Foxi, those are expensive"_.





Foxi4 said:


> The 3DS on the other hand is nowhere near even low-end smartphones,


Yes, because the 3DS came out in 2011, not 2014.


You gave me high-end phones of that time and then I shown you the true prices. You finally shown me low end phones "narrowly" with the same specs, which again, cost more than the 3DS.




Foxi4 said:


> There's just no pleasing him when in my eyes a console is _not_ a phone, it's not something that you replace in 1-2 year intervals, it's something you invest in once and enjoy throughout the generation.


Which is why it makes no sense to compare something that came out in 2011, especially a console, to 2014 technology other than to show technology progression. 




Foxi4 said:


> I don't expect my new handhelds to just be _"passable"_ at the day of their release, I expect them to be _"adequate"_ throughout the life cycle. I don't see a problem with suffering some losses in the beginning for the sake of providing a consistently high-quality device for a number of years. Back when the PSVita was released it could rival with the best of the best in mobile entertainment and although a lot of time has passed and stronger devices inevitably hit the market it's still _"way up there"_, it remains relevant. The 3DS on the other hand sank within the year and right now you can only point and laugh at it - the average phone really _does_ beat it and it doesn't even have to be a new one.


Surely selling at a lost at that price really paid off for the Vita and Sony. The expensive proprietary memory cards were totally worth it. 




Foxi4 said:


> So essentially you want a Nintendo-branded PSVita? Imagine that - _"with Sony the future is now!" _


Huh?


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## Foxi4 (May 29, 2014)

KingVamp said:


> Yes, because the 3DS came out in 2011, not 2014.


That is not the issue. The issue is that it's based on a 2005 GPU, the PICA200, and an outdated 2005 CPU architecture - ARM11 MPCore. The device was severely outdated the moment it was released, that was my one and only point. This may not be an issue to you and it goes in line with Nintendo's strategy of releasing _"affordable hardware using well-known and understood technology"_ they've established with the original Game Boy, but at a release price of $249 I expected more.





> You gave me high-end phones of that time and then I shown you the true prices. You finally shown me low end phones "narrowly" with the same specs, which again, cost more than the 3DS.


I gave you examples of contemporary technology from that time that blow it out of the water and then I gave you some _"low end"_ phones that do so as well. My _"narrowly"_ does not necessarily mean your _"narrowly"_ once we'd get to the bare numbers - the 3DS has 128MB RAM and smallest amount in the proposed _"low ends"_ was 512MB, that's *four times the system memory*. The 3DS has a dual core 268MHz ARM11 MPCore CPU, the worst out of the two _"low ends"_ had a 1GHz ARM Cortex-A8 CPU which despite being single core would still beat the 3DS's CPU due to sheer clock speed and due to benefits springing from a more advanced architecture, *it would beat it at least two-fold*. The 3DS's PICA200 pushes 15.3M _(at 200MHz, it's actually running @ 268MHz according to 3Dbrew so let's *assume* it gets a 25% boost to 20M polygons per second as a result)_ polygons per second while the little Adreno 200 from the low-end pushes 28.2M _(standard non-enhanced version)_ polygons per second, that's *almost twice as much* on stock clock speeds _(or 1/3 more than the 3DS if we account for the non-stock clock speed of the 3DS's GPU versus stock Ardeno 200)_ in sheer triangle performance and I'm not even touching upon dedicated features like shading or filtering. I said that they're narrowly beating it because _these phones were still meh, they were low end_ but they _still_ leave the 3DS in the dust. They're _"twice as expensive"_ because they're at least _"twice as good"_, at least as far as sheer performance is concerned.


> Which is why it makes no sense to compare something that came out in 2011, especially a console, to 2014 technology other than to show technology progression.


Because releasing a console gives you a green card for releasing non-future-proof devices. Actually, the 3DS was non-present-proof and non-past-proof considering the fact that devices from a year back can literally beat it.





> Surely selling at a lost at that price really paid off for the Vita and Sony. The expensive proprietary memory cards were totally worth it.


The price point was definitely acceptable, the problem was the initial lack of games and the 3DS's omnipresence. Nevertheless the system sells relatively well in Japan now and I can only hope that sales will increase in the west as well because it's a terrific platform.





> Huh?


That wasn't to you.


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## Social_Outlaw (May 29, 2014)

Foxi4 said:


> My problem with KingVamp is that he keeps on adding additional conditional statements to the original assumption. I said that the 3DS was underpowered Day 1 and had the specs of low-end smartphones, he immediately asks _"2011 ones?"_. I say _"yes, even 2011 low-ends were (arguably) better"_ to which he replies _"but Foxi, those are expensive"_. There's just no pleasing him when in my eyes a console is _not_ a phone, it's not something that you replace in 1-2 year intervals, it's something you invest in once and enjoy throughout the generation. I don't expect my new handhelds to just be _"passable"_ at the day of their release, I expect them to be _"adequate"_ throughout the life cycle. I don't see a problem with suffering some losses in the beginning for the sake of providing a consistently high-quality device for a number of years. Back when the PSVita was released it could rival with the best of the best in mobile entertainment and although a lot of time has passed and stronger devices inevitably hit the market it's still _"way up there"_, it remains relevant. The 3DS on the other hand sank within the year and right now you can only point and laugh at it - the average phone really _does_ beat it and it doesn't even have to be a new one.
> So essentially you want a Nintendo-branded PSVita 2000? Imagine that - _"with Sony the future is now!" _


 
Not really, since I didn't mention graphics, which is Sony main switch to be considered Sony lol. Nintendo don't care about graphics really. I just want to see some improvements .


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## KingVamp (May 29, 2014)

Foxi4 said:


> That is not the issue. The issue is that it's based on a 2005 GPU, the PICA200, and an outdated 2005 CPU architecture - ARM11 MPCore. The device was severely outdated the moment it was released, that was my one and only point. This may not be an issue to you and it goes in line with Nintendo's strategy of releasing _"affordable hardware using well-known and understood technology"_ they've established with the original Game Boy, but at a release price of $249 I expected more.


Getting tech from around the year the console is going to release is going be expansive.
Well, this turning into should they sell at a lost from the get go and Idk that answer. It seems to work for them so far until recently.

To throw you bone, I guess they could have did a little more recent tech. (2007-2008)



Foxi4 said:


> I gave you examples of contemporary technology from that time that blow it out of the water and then I gave you some _"low end"_ phones that do so as well. I said that they're narrowly beating it because _these phones were still meh, they were low end_ but they _still_ leave the 3DS in the dust. They're _"twice as expensive"_ because they're at least _"twice as good"_, at least as far as sheer performance is concerned.


So, twice as much means "no where near". That aside, I also gave you prices of those contemporary tech to put it more into context. So either they would have to sell it at a lost or it was going to cost more.

This kind of sounds like a repeat.



Foxi4 said:


> Because releasing a console gives you a green card for releasing non-future-proof devices. Actually, the 3DS was non-present-proof and non-past-proof considering the fact that devices from a year back can literally beat it.


Considering the amount of quality games until now and seemly beyond, I find it to be future proofed. Which cost more, as stated before.



Foxi4 said:


> The price point was definitely acceptable, the problem was the initial lack of games and the 3DS's omnipresence. Nevertheless the system sells relatively well in Japan now and I can only hope that sales will increase in the west as well because it's a terrific platform.


So, the memory cards had nothing to do with it?

Nintendo could have been in a similar situation with more recent or Vita tech. Do you think this is OK or would you rather have the Vita adopted and more successful as the 3DS?

Even worse if they drop the price as far they did if the 3DS had stronger tech.



Foxi4 said:


> That wasn't to you.


IK, but nothing he said was Vita specific.


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## notrustinsasuke (Jun 6, 2014)

Didn't they say the new Nintendo handheld was going to have attachable buttons


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## Foxi4 (Jun 6, 2014)

KingVamp said:


> IK, but nothing he said was Vita specific.


Honestly? He pretty much described what the PSV-2000 already offers. C'mon, grow a sense of humour!


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## KingVamp (Jun 6, 2014)

notrustinsasuke said:


> Didn't they say the new Nintendo handheld was going to have attachable buttons


From who and from where?



Foxi4 said:


> C'mon, grow a sense of humour!


Fine. lol


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## KingVamp (Jun 23, 2014)

This looks pretty cool.


Spoiler


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## Psionic Roshambo (Jun 23, 2014)

KingVamp said:


> This looks pretty cool.
> 
> 
> Spoiler


 


Maybe one of those new flexible screens with the clam shell design so when folded the screen is in a C shape... That would be kinda cool. 

Not sure how it would hold up to being folded and unfolded all the time though.


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