# Mega Man X Collection: Is the GameCube Version Better Than the PS2 Version?



## xwatchmanx (Nov 28, 2012)

So I've been looking for Mega Man X Collection for quite a while, and finally found and bought the PS2 version on GameStop. I was going to get the GameCube version initially, but the PS2 controller is infinitely superior for those kind of games (featuring a much better dpad and digital triggers), plus the GameCube version is much more expensive ($50 is the cheapest I can find it online).

Anyway, I had never played the PS2 phat I got this summer until I bought this game. Much to my dismay, while GameCube games always looked pretty decent on my 37 inch HD, PS2 games, or at least THIS PS2 game, just looks abysmal. It's blurry as heck, the colors are dark and washed out, and the sound quality on the first two games in particular sounds very poor.

So here's my question: Is the GameCube version any better, or was this just a piss-poor port all around, regardless of the version? I understand that the GameCube is capable of a higher resolution, but I have no idea if the GameCube version of Mega Man X Collection takes advantage of that. Also, what about the sound quality? Is that any better?

Any answers are appreciated. I really don't WANT to cough up $50+ for the GameCube version of Mega Man X Collection (and some more for a GCN/SNES controller adapter), but if doing so will get me noticeably higher quality ports of the Mega Man X games, I'll very willingly do it.


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## Felipe_9595 (Nov 28, 2012)

You could use DIos Mios/ a back up before buying it. WHen i played it on my CRT it looked just like in my play 1, and sound quality was fine.


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## xwatchmanx (Nov 28, 2012)

Felipe_9595 said:


> You could use DIos Mios/ a back up before buying it. WHen i played it on my CRT it looked just like in my play 1, and sound quality was fine.


I'm playing on an HD, not a CRT, though.


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## Felipe_9595 (Nov 28, 2012)

xwatchmanx said:


> I'm playing on an HD, not a CRT, though.


 
HMmm yes, true, it might look different.  As i said, you could test it first, then buy it (the compressed iso is like 600 Mb),  i have done that for some games i did want (Like MGS Twin Snakes)


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## xwatchmanx (Nov 28, 2012)

Felipe_9595 said:


> HMmm yes, true, it might look different. As i said, you could test it first, then buy it (the compressed iso is like 600 Mb), i have done that for some games i did want (Like MGS Twin Snakes)


Eh, maybe. Idk. I kind of gave up pirating a little while ago, and unmodded my Wii and all that, to avoid temptation.


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## Felipe_9595 (Nov 28, 2012)

Wrong topic, srry.


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## Hells Malice (Nov 28, 2012)

The disk or your PS2 is fucked. Both versions are identical AFAIR, and neither looks bad. I can't remember exactly but they're either as good looking as the original, or a bit better. Most likely better...
Either way, bot the picture and the sound should be good quality. Something is up with your setup.


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## Eerpow (Nov 28, 2012)

Even if neither d-pad is that good I still prefer the GC controller D-pad since the directions aren't separated. The GC version is identical to the PS version.


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## xwatchmanx (Nov 28, 2012)

Hells Malice said:


> The disk or your PS2 is fucked. Both versions are identical AFAIR, and neither looks bad. I can't remember exactly but they're either as good looking as the original, or a bit better. Most likely better...
> Either way, bot the picture and the sound should be good quality. Something is up with your setup.


Did you play it on an older CRT, or an HD TV?

Also, any ideas what I could check to see what's wrong? I'm connected with the standard composite cable, nothing fancy. The disc is literally in like-new condition (the guys and gamestop and I all noticed that when they retrieved the disc for me), so I don't think it's the disc. Maybe I'll grab another PS2 game soon and see if it has the same problem.


Eerpow said:


> Even if neither d-pad is that good I still prefer the GC controller D-pad since the directions aren't separated. The GC version is identical to the PS version.


The directions aren't separated on the PS2 controller. Parts of the dpad are beneath a "frame" on the controller, but it's still all one piece and feels like one piece.


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## Eerpow (Nov 28, 2012)

xwatchmanx said:


> Did you play it on an older CRT, or an HD TV?
> 
> Also, any ideas what I could check to see what's wrong? I'm connected with the standard composite cable, nothing fancy. The disc is literally in like-new condition (the guys and gamestop and I all noticed that when they retrieved the disc for me), so I don't think it's the disc. Maybe I'll grab another PS2 game soon and see if it has the same problem.
> 
> The directions aren't separated on the PS2 controller. Parts of the dpad are beneath a "frame" on the controller, but it's still all one piece and feels like one piece.


I know, it just feels wrong and diagonals are just..., luckily not many PS2 or GC games used the D-pad anyway. Ugh now I'm remembering playing SOTN on the PSX...
Tried a vita d-pad, so much nicer without the separation haha.


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## the_randomizer (Nov 28, 2012)

I should note that most LCD HDTVs don't display this game properly due to the 240p resolution.


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## xwatchmanx (Nov 28, 2012)

the_randomizer said:


> I should note that most LCD HDTVs don't display this game properly due to the 240p resolution.


Thanks for the info. Would this affect sound quality as well? I actually have no idea what the specs of my TV are... it came with the apartment. All I know is that it's a roughly 37 inch Sansui with 1080p capability.


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## NightsOwl (Nov 28, 2012)

Well, actually as far as I know. The only difference is the gamecube version cut the Japanese voices from X6s Cut-scenes. I may be wrong though. But I'm 90% Sure.


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## the_randomizer (Nov 28, 2012)

xwatchmanx said:


> Thanks for the info. Would this affect sound quality as well? I actually have no idea what the specs of my TV are... it came with the apartment. All I know is that it's a roughly 37 inch Sansui with 1080p capability.


 
No, sound is unaffected.


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## taydor_b (Dec 3, 2012)

xwatchmanx said:


> Did you play it on an older CRT, or an HD TV?
> 
> Also, any ideas what I could check to see what's wrong? _*I'm connected with the standard composite cable*_, nothing fancy. The disc is literally in like-new condition (the guys and gamestop and I all noticed that when they retrieved the disc for me), so I don't think it's the disc. Maybe I'll grab another PS2 game soon and see if it has the same problem.
> 
> The directions aren't separated on the PS2 controller. Parts of the dpad are beneath a "frame" on the controller, but it's still all one piece and feels like one piece.


 
I think this may be your problem.  Get yourself a cheap set of component cables from Amazon (like these) and your games will look better than if you were playing them on a CRT.  HD TVs have trouble downscaling to 480p, so just replace your composite cables with components and you should be all set.  I have the cables linked previously, and they work great besides the snug fit in the back of the PS2, so there you shouldn't have to worry about the quality.


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## xwatchmanx (Dec 3, 2012)

taydor_b said:


> I think this may be your problem. Get yourself a cheap set of component cables from Amazon (like these) and your games will look better than if you were playing them on a CRT. HD TVs have trouble downscaling to 480p, so just replace your composite cables with components and you should be all set. I have the cables linked previously, and they work great besides the snug fit in the back of the PS2, so there you shouldn't have to worry about the quality.


Oh, thanks. That's weird, because the first thing I was gonna do was get component cables, but a GameStop employee told me the PS2 wasn't 480p capable, so no component cables. Guess he was wrong.


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## taydor_b (Dec 3, 2012)

xwatchmanx said:


> Oh, thanks. That's weird, because the first thing I was gonna do was get component cables, but a GameStop employee told me the PS2 wasn't 480p capable, so no component cables. Guess he was wrong.


 
Yeah, he is definitely wrong.  I think early PS2 games only ran in 480i, but the majority run in 480p.  Gran Turismo 4 can even run in 1080i, I believe.


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## xwatchmanx (Dec 3, 2012)

Well according to this list, Mega Man X Collection doesn't have 480p support. So I don't think this will fix my issue.


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## taydor_b (Dec 3, 2012)

xwatchmanx said:


> Well according to this list, Mega Man X Collection doesn't have 480p support. So I don't think this will fix my issue.



Hmmm, that's odd. Romance of the Three Kingdoms XI isn't on that list and it looks great on my TV. However, I found another forum talking about the same issue, and they stated that Capcom didn't change the resolution from 240p so if you're paying on an HDTV, then if won't display at all. Others said they had no problem. I would give it a try though. It's only $5 and you can use it for other PS2 you may want to play.


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## xwatchmanx (Dec 3, 2012)

taydor_b said:


> Hmmm, that's odd. Romance of the Three Kingdoms XI isn't on that list and it looks great on my TV. However, I found another forum talking about the same issue, and they stated that Capcom didn't change the resolution from 240p so if you're paying on an HDTV, then if won't display at all. Others said they had no problem. I would give it a try though. It's only $5 and you can use it for other PS2 you may want to play.


Well I've been meaning to grab a CRT for my old systems, anyway. So we'll see how that goes.


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## weiff (Dec 3, 2012)

Bought one of these...

http://www.the-nextlevel.com/features/hardware/hori-digital-controller/

NEVER regretted it.


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## xwatchmanx (Dec 3, 2012)

weiff said:


> Bought one of these...
> 
> http://www.the-nextlevel.com/features/hardware/hori-digital-controller/
> 
> NEVER regretted it.


I've looked into this, and the cheapest I could find is $100. It's much cheaper for me to grab a SNES controller and gamecube adapter for it. Not to mention that I do NOT want to spend an extra $100 if I'm already going to be spending $50 on the GameCube version of MMX Collection.


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## RodrigoDavy (Dec 3, 2012)

Using component cables should improve the image quality even if the games runs on a low resolution (I am not 100% sure). It has something to do with better separation of the colors, less interference, etc... Also maybe it could be that you're used to HD digital quality, especially since the NTSC standard is known for its poor quality (sorry, americans and japaneses =/ )


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## xwatchmanx (Dec 3, 2012)

RodrigoDavy said:


> Using component cables should improve the image quality even if the games runs on a low resolution (I am not 100% sure). It has something to do with better separation of the colors, less interference, etc... Also maybe it could be that you're used to HD digital quality, especially since the NTSC standard is known for its poor quality (sorry, americans and japaneses =/ )


I'm definitely not used to HD, lol. I've only had an HD tv for a few months now, and I play 480i GameCube games on it just fine. The problem I'm having is that the game looks many times worse than on the Wii or PC emulator, so idk what's going on.


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## RodrigoDavy (Dec 3, 2012)

I just remembered something. Old video games that were made with CTR and low resolution in mind use a trick to make the image look better, it envolves using scanlines that would be ignored due to low resolution and making them black or white to adjust the brightness and make the game seem less pixelated. HD tvs just ignore these scanlines so they naturally have slightly less quality for displaying older videogames. But this should not be so much worst since the Wii and PC emulator would have the same problem (unless they use some kind of filter, which I think they do).

Keeping the aspect ratio to resemble the original games (4:3) is also important for image quality, though it would not completely solve your problem.

I hope any of that information can help, but I know it might as well be another problem. xD


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## raulpica (Dec 3, 2012)

xwatchmanx said:


> All I know is that it's a roughly 37 inch Sansui with 1080p capability.


Here's your problem - cheapo TVs tend to look like crap in Standard Definition. Get a component cable, it'll improve the image quality. A good one, preferably.

Anyway, the problem relies in the upscaler. These TVs upscale the image quality (since they're not made for 240/320/480) and they fail at that.



taydor_b said:


> Yeah, he is definitely wrong. I think early PS2 games only ran in 480i, but the majority run in 480p. Gran Turismo 4 can even run in 1080i, I believe.


Wat. The PS2 can't even imagine of doing 1080p.


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## xwatchmanx (Dec 3, 2012)

raulpica said:


> Here's your problem - cheapo TVs tend to look like crap in Standard Definition. Get a component cable, it'll do WONDERS. A good one, preferably.
> 
> 
> Wat. The PS2 can't even imagine of doing 1080p.


I'll definitely check the component cable out... after all, the component cable on my Wii made SNES games look so much better.

The list I just linked actually said that Grand Turismo is 1080p-capable on the PS2. No idea if you can do that on a PS2, or if you need a PS3 phat, though.


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## raulpica (Dec 3, 2012)

xwatchmanx said:


> I'll definitely check the component cable out... after all, the component cable on my Wii made SNES games look so much better.
> 
> The list I just linked actually said that Grand Turismo is 1080p-capable on the PS2. No idea if you can do that on a PS2, or if you need a PS3 phat, though.


I edited my post a bit 

Just bullcrap. The PS2's processing power isn't enough to do 1080p on a normal 3D game, imagine what would happen with a graphically complex game like GT4. The PS2's GPU would catch fire.

I'm not even sure it'd be even able to sync up to 1080p...

And even if that was on a PS3, the point is moot. I can upscale an Atari 2600 up to 1080p using upscalers - but that doesn't mean that the game is interally rendered at 1080p.


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## xwatchmanx (Dec 3, 2012)

raulpica said:


> I edited my post a bit
> 
> Just bullcrap. The PS2's processing power isn't enough to do 1080p on a normal 3D game, imagine what would happen with a graphically complex game like GT4. The PS2's GPU would catch fire.
> 
> ...


I saw the edited post. I have no idea how Gran Turismo 4 is rendered at 1080i (upscaled, internal, etc), but everything I'm reading said it indeed is 1080i capable.

"Gran Turismo 4 is one of only four titles for thePlayStation 2 that is capable of 1080i output." -Wikipedia


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## raulpica (Dec 3, 2012)

xwatchmanx said:


> I saw the edited post. I have no idea how Gran Turismo 4 is rendered at 1080i (upscaled, internal, etc), but everything I'm reading said it indeed is 1080i capable.
> 
> "Gran Turismo 4 is one of only four titles for thePlayStation 2 that is capable of 1080i output." -Wikipedia


1080i = 540x2 - that explains it 

It's not really 1080


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## xwatchmanx (Dec 3, 2012)

raulpica said:


> 1080i = 540x2 - that explains it
> 
> It's not really 1080


Why not? I don't see anything saying that...


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## raulpica (Dec 3, 2012)

xwatchmanx said:


> Why not? I don't see anything saying that...


Interlacing means exactly that - you get an image by rendering stuff in two images which flicker ultra-fast, giving you a complete image in your eyes.

It works like this: there's a first frame which contains 540 rows, and another frame which contains another 540 shifted by one pixel down.

The PS2 is only rendering 540 lines per frame, but interlacing them, you get the impression that it's full 1080.

But the PS2 is only managing 540 lines at time (which isn't a lot more than 480 which the PS2 could render in 480p, so 480 rows every frame).

That's the explanation.


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## xwatchmanx (Dec 3, 2012)

raulpica said:


> Interlacing means exactly that - you get an image by rendering stuff in two images which flicker ultra-fast, giving you a complete image in your eyes.
> 
> It works like this: there's a first frame which contains 540 rows, and another frame which contains another 540 shifted by one pixel down.
> 
> ...


I see... but if it's that simple, why didn't more legacy systems support 1080i? It's still better visually than 480i or 480p, right?


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## raulpica (Dec 3, 2012)

xwatchmanx said:


> I see... but if it's that simple, why didn't more legacy systems support 1080i? It's still better visually than 480i or 480p, right?


Computer systems like the Amiga did support it, y'know  (and it was made in 1985)



> Have you ever used an Amiga application that causes the screen to flicker? This is a trick used by the Amiga to display a higher resolution than is usually possible by doubling the scanlines. Starring at an interlace screen can have a terrible effect on the eyes, producing headaches or migranes.


 
It could even reach 640x480 in an age where PCs were still stuck at 320x200  Fast pacing games on the Amiga were usually displayed in 240p, and used 640x480 for stuff like Title Screen and the likes.

The Gamecube and the XBOX1 were also capable of interlacing anyway


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## xwatchmanx (Dec 3, 2012)

interesting... anyway, what were we talking about? Ah, Mega Man X, right.


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## taydor_b (Dec 3, 2012)

Yeah, 1080i doesn't look even look as good as 720p.  I don't think it's even considered HD.

Anyway, I looked into your problem a little more, and it seems the game wasn't meant to be played on an HDTV.  With that said, you can either buy a CRT and play it on that, or play it on PCSX2.  If you play it on an emulator, you could always just connect your computer to the TV via HDMI and get as close as you can to the console style of gaming.


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## xwatchmanx (Dec 4, 2012)

taydor_b said:


> Yeah, 1080i doesn't look even look as good as 720p. I don't think it's even considered HD.
> 
> Anyway, I looked into your problem a little more, and it seems the game wasn't meant to be played on an HDTV. With that said, you can either buy a CRT and play it on that, or play it on PCSX2. If you play it on an emulator, you could always just connect your computer to the TV via HDMI and get as close as you can to the console style of gaming.


Eh, I kind of gave up emulation a while ago since I'm sick of frame-skips and incompatibility. I'm going to buy a CRT when I get a chance.


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## the_randomizer (Dec 4, 2012)

raulpica said:


> I edited my post a bit
> 
> Just bullcrap. The PS2's processing power isn't enough to do 1080p on a normal 3D game, imagine what would happen with a graphically complex game like GT4. The PS2's GPU would catch fire.
> 
> ...


 
So how do Dolphin/PCSX2 make such low-res games so crisp? Is it being upscaled internally?


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## xwatchmanx (Dec 4, 2012)

the_randomizer said:


> So how do Dolphin/PCSX2 make such low-res games so crisp? Is it being upscaled internally?


It's the same way that SNES9X GX on the Wii upscales SNES games to 480p. Emulation allows you to upscale games like that, since you're using the extra hardware power of the device you're emulating on. The reason that, for example, the Wii U doesn't upscale Wii games to 1080p is because Wii mode uses true hardware compatibility for Wii games, not emulation.


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## raulpica (Dec 4, 2012)

the_randomizer said:


> So how do Dolphin/PCSX2 make such low-res games so crisp? Is it being upscaled internally?


They fool the system in thinking that it has to render for a much bigger area (1080p).

It's obviously doable since there's no silicon limit for chips in emulation (well duh!) so they can do stuff well over their specifications (a-la N64 high texture packs).



xwatchmanx said:


> It's the same way that SNES9X GX on the Wii upscales SNES games to 480p. Emulation allows you to upscale games like that, since you're using the extra hardware power of the device you're emulating on. The reason that, for example, the Wii U doesn't upscale Wii games to 1080p is because Wii mode uses true hardware compatibility for Wii games, not emulation.


That's another matter entirely - SNES9X uses filters to achieve that. Games are still rendered at their original resolution (_Progressive:_ 256 × 224, 512 × 224, 256 × 239, 512 × 239
_Interlaced:_ 512 × 448, 512 × 478 right... the SNES used interlacing too in some games) then completely "stretched" over 480p. Filters come in handy there since they avoid you looking at HUGE pixels.

I still dunno enough about the WiiU to let me express on that argument, tho  I can hypothesize that they're upscaled externally (the rendered image, that is) and not internally.


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## Elrinth (Dec 4, 2012)

Dunno about the X collection but the Anniversary collection the ps2 version is superior. Since they had more disk space they could include more content. There's some remastered background music. However since it's only released in the US it won't ever work unless using modded ps3. so I'm fine with using my gamecube + loader swap-disk


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