# Wtf Is Wrong With This World :(



## jaxxster (Apr 16, 2007)

Man, reading stuff like this makes me sick.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/6560685.stm

My thoughts go out to the poor families of those innocent kids and thier families. I dont know how stuff like this happens but it shouldn't be allowed to happen


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## nintendofreak (Apr 16, 2007)

I know, shocked me too,  even though I live in California....


Seriously... Now i gotta be freakin scared to go to school cause I might get shot...


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## mthrnite (Apr 16, 2007)

Another monkey goes mad... film at eleven.

Hits close to home here, my dad worked at an apartment complex near the school that mainly housed college students.

Sad.


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## Sc4rFac3d (Apr 16, 2007)

Saw it all over the news, I really don't have any words. Condolences to the families and friends of them.


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## Opium (Apr 16, 2007)

That's horrific.

*edit*

But a bomb blast killed over 50 people in Iraq yesterday in an act of senseless violence. It kinda makes you think about these senseless deaths.


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## Tanas (Apr 16, 2007)

This is the 19th school shooting in 10 years.

America is so fucked up...


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## galaxykidgamma (Apr 16, 2007)

alot of my friends go to tech and i've confirmed that alot of them are okay but i'm still waiting to hear from a few,  i'm pretty confused right now, all i can do is hope for the best


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## Deleted User (Apr 16, 2007)

Why don't they have stricter gun laws.  Or just ban guns altogether.  No guns, no shootings.  Simple as that.  Oh, you like to hunt?  Too bad ... pick up another hobby.


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## BMH (Apr 16, 2007)

QUOTE(Nestea80 @ Apr 16 2007 said:


> Why don't they have stricter gun laws.Â Or just ban guns altogether.Â No guns, no shootings.Â Simple as that.Â Oh, you like to hunt?Â Too bad ... pick up another hobby.


Agreed. These shootings keep on happening in America and no one is doing anything about them. It's not video games or a bad youth that kill other people, it's guns!

There are always crazy people who will try to kill others. Just don't give them a chance to cause massive damage. Ban guns you trigger happy Americans.


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## aslacker55 (Apr 16, 2007)

QUOTE(Tanas @ Apr 16 2007 said:


> This is the 19th school shooting in 10 years.
> 
> America is so fucked up...



You can't blame a country for the shooting, it was an act of a deranged person. Your comment was uncalled for and was very insensitive.


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## 111111111 (Apr 16, 2007)

QUOTE(BMH @ Apr 16 2007 said:


> It's not video games or a bad youth that kill other people, it's guns!



And a sick society that places possesions/wealth over people.


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## Shinji (Apr 16, 2007)

QUOTE(galaxykidgamma @ Apr 16 2007 said:


> alot of my friends go to tech and i've confirmed that alot of them are okay but i'm still waiting to hear from a few,Â i'm pretty confused right now, all i can do is hope for the best


A couple of my friends to there as well.  I still havent heard back from any of them.  

P.S. America really is fucked up, thats the truth of it.  I would rather not rant on why this is the case but everyone knows its true.


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## Tanas (Apr 16, 2007)

QUOTE(Nestea80 @ Apr 16 2007 said:


> Why don't they have stricter gun laws.Â Or just ban guns altogether.Â No guns, no shootings.Â Simple as that.Â Oh, you like to hunt?Â Too bad ... pick up another hobby.



I also agree, but a country that values the right to bare arms, more than they do human life, this is just not going to happen.


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## aslacker55 (Apr 16, 2007)

QUOTE(Nestea80 @ Apr 16 2007 said:


> Why don't they have stricter gun laws.Â Or just ban guns altogether.Â No guns, no shootings.Â Simple as that.Â Oh, you like to hunt?Â Too bad ... pick up another hobby.



The right to bare arms is protected by the Constitution of America. Many have tried to ban guns, but there are organizations like the *NRA*(National Rifle Association) that oppose them. And guns don't kill people, people kill people, there will always be crazy people out there. If you have to blame someone, blame the shooter.


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## ozzyzak (Apr 16, 2007)

QUOTE(Nestea80 @ Apr 16 2007 said:


> Why don't they have stricter gun laws.Â Or just ban guns altogether.Â No guns, no shootings.Â Simple as that.Â Oh, you like to hunt?Â Too bad ... pick up another hobby.




I disagree.  Haven't you ever heard the saying 'if you ban guns, only criminals will own guns'.

Think about it, if this guy was willing to do that, don't you think he'd have found a gun whether illegal or not?


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## Deleted User (Apr 16, 2007)

There MUST be something wrong with America.  You don't see this happening in Canada.  It's no coincidence that most of the school massacres happen in the US.  It's just WAY too easy to own a gun in America.  I'm not putting down Americans in general, just their laws ... and their president for that matter. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




Guns don't kill people?  People kill people?  Yeah, with what?  GUNS!


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## galaxykidgamma (Apr 16, 2007)

i'm a little bit offended by these anti-america comments, remember that america is a country made up of people too that don't necessarily agree with the way things are conducted either. assuming that guns can just be taken away is extremely ignorant. Maybe in a place with less violence or that has historically less of a need for them, but if you were to take away guns in America, i guarantee you that things would be much worse, there would be chaos and a pretty bad scene with crime. america isn't fucked up, certain americans are fucked up, just like certain citizens of X country are fucked up

edit: yah, banning guns itself is a such a stupid idea i can't imagine anyone assigning it any merit, those who use guns wrongly aren't going to care whether they're legal or not


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## blade85 (Apr 16, 2007)

stuff like this really shouldnt happen but it does anyway, thansk to all the crazy people out there

I read about this on digg already though

Edit: America isnt the only place that has all this stuff happening, look at the middle east, theres a lot of stuff happening there and i dont see anyone bashing them for suicide bombs...........  Why does everyone have to insult america?


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## _Mazza_ (Apr 16, 2007)

aslacker55 you are right that people kill people, but if these people couldn't get hold of guns then there would be less killings.

US has 8259 killing by firearms, the only other countries in the thousands are Mexico, Columbia, Thailand and South Africa, and these are pretty corrupt countries when compared to the US etc.

By comparison, Austrlia has 59, UK has 62, Spain 97 and Germany 384. I know these countries have less people but only by a factor of about 5 and the simpl;e reason why is because guns are harder to get in these countries.


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## bobrules (Apr 16, 2007)

What's wrong with the US Gun policy. Seems like firearms are easily accessible.


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## aslacker55 (Apr 16, 2007)

QUOTE(Nestea80 @ Apr 16 2007 said:


> There MUST be something wrong with America.Â You don't see this happening in Canada.Â It's no coincidence that most of the school massacres happen in the US.Â It's just WAY too easy to own a gun in America.Â I'm not putting down Americans in general, just their laws ... and their president for that matter.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



People can easy kill other people  with poison, knives, swords, a chair, a bat, a ladder, and many other things. Would you ban them too.


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## lagman (Apr 16, 2007)

People don´t kill people.
Stupid people kill people.

If you know -as a country- that your kids are nuts,you should have some programs to help them.
The terrible thing for me is that this kids became some sort of _stars_, that´s sad.


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## Tanas (Apr 16, 2007)

QUOTE said:
			
		

> The right to bare arms is protected by the Constitution of America. Many have tried to ban guns, but there are organizations like the *NRA*(National Rifle Association) that oppose them. And guns don't kill people, people kill people, there will always be crazy people out there. If you have to blame someone, blame the shooter.



So what you're trying to say is, if this same guy went to the school arm with his wiimote and his DS stylus, he could have still killed all these people if he had really put his mind to it?


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## _Mazza_ (Apr 16, 2007)

QUOTE(aslacker55 @ Apr 16 2007 said:


> QUOTE(Nestea80 @ Apr 16 2007 said:
> 
> 
> > There MUST be something wrong with America.Â You don't see this happening in Canada.Â It's no coincidence that most of the school massacres happen in the US.Â It's just WAY too easy to own a gun in America.Â I'm not putting down Americans in general, just their laws ... and their president for that matter.
> ...



Again you're right in a way, but if someone wants to perform a mass murder in the spur of the moment, firearms are more effective, How many people could one man with a knife kill in a public area maybe about 3 or so and everyone else would have fled, poison would need planning, and chair etc. would be the same as a knife, guns allow anyone to kill anyone as long as they are in line of sight and this is why they should be restricted and not sold to anyone who wants one.


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## galaxykidgamma (Apr 16, 2007)

QUOTE(lagman @ Apr 16 2007 said:


> The terrible thing for me is that this kids became some sort of _stars_, that´s sad.


well he's dead, so he doesn't care


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## aslacker55 (Apr 16, 2007)

QUOTE(_Mazza_ @ Apr 16 2007 said:


> aslacker55 you are right that people kill people, but if these people couldn't get hold of guns then there would be less killings.
> 
> US has 8259 killing by firearms, the only other countries in the thousands are Mexico, Columbia, Thailand and South Africa, and these are pretty corrupt countries when compared to the US etc.
> 
> By comparison, Austrlia has 59, UK has 62, Spain 97 and Germany 384. I know these countries have less people but only by a factor of about 5 and the simpl;e reason why is because guns are harder to get in these countries.



The main problem with America is that of our large and diverse population. You can't compare the numbers, because of the population difference. Also America is composed of many different races that have their own beliefs and traditions, these beliefs will always but heads and more than often bad things happen.

By the way: the killer was an *asian *man.


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## Shinji (Apr 16, 2007)

QUOTE(aslacker55 @ Apr 16 2007 said:


> People can easy kill other peopleÂ with poison, knives, swords, a chair, a bat, a ladder, and many other things. Would you ban them too.


How many deaths are reported in the U.S. related to ALL of those items youve mentioned?  Not much in comparison to gun related deaths.  

The real killer?  Tobacco.... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




Consider this in terms of legality...
Marijuana/pot/weed is ILLEGAL to own.  Now if you made marijuana/pot/weed/whatever you call it LEGAL, MORE people would have it right?  Same with guns.


Oh yeah and about making fun of Iraq and the Middle East, you bet your sweet ass we do.  Just look at most of the political cartoons in the national news papers (in the U.S.)...


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## Akoji (Apr 16, 2007)

Well , maybe they could kill people with anything else but i think that beside a bomb , nothing can kill people as fast as a gun a some packs of ammo's.

Maybe the guy would have killed people with a spoon , but maybe max 3 people , with a sword 10 , but with a gun he killed 31 one if im right. So beside a bomb , nothing could do more damage.

And btw. Nestea... it happens in Canada too , look back at september this year , a guy shoot like a dozen of people and killed 1 girl in Québec at Dawson College.


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## lagman (Apr 16, 2007)

QUOTE(galaxykidgamma @ Apr 16 2007 said:


> QUOTE(lagman @ Apr 16 2007 said:
> 
> 
> > The terrible thing for me is that this kids became some sort of _stars_, that´s sad.
> ...



That doesn´t change a thing, that makes it even sadder.
Maybe I didn´t make my point clear.


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## _Mazza_ (Apr 16, 2007)

QUOTE said:
			
		

> The main problem with America is that of our large and diverse population. You can't compare the numbers, because of the population difference. Also America is composed of many different races that have their own beliefs and traditions, these beliefs will always but heads and more than often bad things happen.
> 
> By the way: the killer was an *asian *man.




There's no excuse for it, the UK is also has a diverse population but nowhere near the amount of killings by firearms

Oh and it doesn't matter that the killer was asian, there was the columbine massacre where the 2 killers were American boys.


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## Shinji (Apr 16, 2007)

QUOTE(lagman @ Apr 16 2007 said:


> QUOTE(galaxykidgamma @ Apr 16 2007 said:
> 
> 
> > QUOTE(lagman @ Apr 16 2007 said:
> ...


Your point was crystal clear cause we're talkin bout him right?


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## aslacker55 (Apr 16, 2007)

QUOTE(_Mazza_ @ Apr 16 2007 said:


> There's no excuse for it, the UK is also has a diverse population but nowhere near the amount of killings by firearms



Do the UK have as large of a population as America?


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## galaxykidgamma (Apr 16, 2007)

QUOTE(aslacker55 @ Apr 16 2007 said:


> QUOTE(_Mazza_ @ Apr 16 2007 said:
> 
> 
> > aslacker55 you are right that people kill people, but if these people couldn't get hold of guns then there would be less killings.
> ...



this is an excellent point

also, what shinji has said about tobacco and illegal drugs is irrelevant. criminals don't go around killing people with illegal drugs, besides, this illustrates the opposite of the point at hand. taking something away is entirely different than making it legal. take one look at prohibition and tell me that banning something will lead to greater control. and for the sake of argument, when something is legal, the government can exercise greater control over it


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## Deleted User (Apr 16, 2007)

QUOTE(ozzyzak @ Apr 16 2007 said:


> QUOTE(Nestea80 @ Apr 16 2007 said:
> 
> 
> > Why don't they have stricter gun laws.  Or just ban guns altogether.  No guns, no shootings.  Simple as that.  Oh, you like to hunt?  Too bad ... pick up another hobby.
> ...



Well, if that was the mentality ... we might as well make everything available.  We need to make owning a gun illegal, just the way it's illegal to drive a car when you're 12 ... just the way it's illegal to have sex with a 10 year old.  We need to have laws and regulations ... strict ones.  Fine, if he needed a gun ... he'll have to get it the hard way ... not at his local walmart.  To have guns so easily available to anyone ... it gives more opportunity.  I'm sure it's more than just gun laws ... it's also cultural influences 'n all ... but begin by taking away the weapons from the hands.  Guns IS culture for Americans.


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## rashef (Apr 16, 2007)

All hail the "Shoot your classmate" day.


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## _Mazza_ (Apr 16, 2007)

QUOTE(aslacker55 @ Apr 16 2007 said:


> QUOTE(_Mazza_ @ Apr 16 2007 said:
> 
> 
> > There's no excuse for it, the UK is also has a diverse population but nowhere near the amount of killings by firearms
> ...



No I didn't say it does, it still has a pretty diverse population, and even if you multiply the number of killing by 5 so the numbers are equal the Uk would still only have about 300 killings compared to the US's 8000


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## galaxykidgamma (Apr 16, 2007)

QUOTE(lagman @ Apr 16 2007 said:


> QUOTE(galaxykidgamma @ Apr 16 2007 said:
> 
> 
> > QUOTE(lagman @ Apr 16 2007 said:
> ...



oh i understood your point perfectly, giving the killer so much attention is really a shame, but really only if it glorifies the situation, i think it's clear that the media is sending a negative message regarding this kid. and if the kid were still alive, maybe some scrutiny over him would be a good thing, helps us understand why something like this happens besides just saying "some kid with some screws loose went crazy"


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## lagman (Apr 16, 2007)

QUOTE(Shinji @ Apr 16 2007 said:


> QUOTE(lagman @ Apr 16 2007 said:
> 
> 
> > QUOTE(galaxykidgamma @ Apr 16 2007 said:
> ...



Yeah, but it doesn´t matter if he was looking for it or not, the yellow media will take care of it, tons of special programs, a show every anniversary, a movie of the week.
Lot of marketing but not real prevention, that´s my point.


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## aslacker55 (Apr 16, 2007)

Most gun crimes in America are gang related, most gangs are race related and they hate other gangs that are of different races. If you ban guns in America, a new type of black market will start and it would cause more problems.


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## Deleted User (Apr 16, 2007)

Maybe there's just a higher percentage of crazy people in America ... probably something in the water.


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## Shinji (Apr 16, 2007)

QUOTE(galaxykidgamma @ Apr 16 2007 said:


> also, what shinji has said about tobacco and illegal drugs is irrelevant. criminals don't go around killing people with illegal drugs, besides, this illustrates the opposite of the point at hand. taking something away is entirely different than making it legal. take one look at prohibition and tell me that banning something will lead to greater control. and for the sake of argument, when something is legal, the government can exercise greater control over it
> 
> The tobacco part was a joke...
> 
> ...


Totally uncalled for


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## aslacker55 (Apr 16, 2007)

QUOTE(Nestea80 @ Apr 16 2007 said:


> Maybe there's just a higher percentage of crazy people in America ... probably something in the water.



It must be the fluoride.


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## Souldragon (Apr 16, 2007)

This is a sad day for the victims of the family, and there always people who use this kinda of events to promote personal hatred against something else like Jack Thompson blaming this on video games. All I have to say is stop with the blaming and do something about it instead of randomly using personal hatred and blame. Have something like must have a clean background. 

Gun don't kill people. People kill people but if give a gun it increase the killing amount..


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## Taras (Apr 16, 2007)

QUOTE(Nestea80 @ Apr 16 2007 said:


> Why don't they have stricter gun laws.Â Or just ban guns altogether.Â No guns, no shootings.Â Simple as that.Â Oh, you like to hunt?Â Too bad ... pick up another hobby.



Asstard. Murder is already illegal. Criminals don't obey the laws. A ban doesn't do s***. Drugs are illegal and anyone can get them. And a Canadian is in no position to tell Americans what to do with American laws.


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## _Mazza_ (Apr 16, 2007)

QUOTE(aslacker55 @ Apr 16 2007 said:


> Most gun crimes in America are gang related, most gangs are race related and they hate other gangs that are of different races. If you ban guns in America, a new type of black market will start and it would cause more problems.



yes there will always be a black market,

but with all these massacres at schools etc. the murderers are ordinary kids that are not members of gangs. If guns were illegal and only sold on the black market, 16 or 17 year old Johnny wouldn't be able to get his 21 year old friend to just go to the shop and get him a shotgun and a pistol would he?

Gun crime will never be erradicated but there is no denying that banning firearms will decrease shootings.


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## lagman (Apr 16, 2007)

QUOTE(galaxykidgamma @ Apr 16 2007 said:


> oh i understood your point perfectly, giving the killer so much attention is really a shame, but really only if it glorifies the situation, i think it's clear that the media is sending a negative message regarding this kid. and if the kid were still alive, maybe some scrutiny over him would be a good thing, helps us understand why something like this happens besides just saying "some kid with some screws loose went crazy"



That´s the thing, how can I do that if the guy´s parents, teachers, classmates, friends,etc... can´t do it?
It´s not because of a broken family, it´s not the TV, it´s not the music, it´s not the videogames, there´s lots and lots of kids that have been through the same things. The kid just felt like doing it and have something to do it with.
I wish I know what was he thinking, but I don´t. All I can do is hope that things like this just stop happening everywhere.


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## 111111111 (Apr 16, 2007)

QUOTE(aslacker55 @ Apr 16 2007 said:


> Do the UK have as large of a population as America?



The population of the usa is 5x that of the uk.  death by gun crime in the usa is 140x that of the uk.


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## Shinji (Apr 16, 2007)

QUOTE said:
			
		

> Gun crime will never be erradicated but there is no denying that banning firearms will decrease shootings.


Mazza does have a point.  There will never be any way to completely rid firearms, but at least do what we can, right?


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## _Mazza_ (Apr 16, 2007)

QUOTE(Taras @ Apr 16 2007 said:


> QUOTE(Nestea80 @ Apr 16 2007 said:
> 
> 
> > Why don't they have stricter gun laws.Â Or just ban guns altogether.Â No guns, no shootings.Â Simple as that.Â Oh, you like to hunt?Â Too bad ... pick up another hobby.
> ...



Of course if you're going to kill a bunch of ppl and then yourself you don't care if murder is illegal. If buying guns was to be made illegal it would be harder to get the weapon adn therefore harder to kill ppl.


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## aslacker55 (Apr 16, 2007)

Why are people here so hateful of America and blaming America.  Stop hating and feel some remorse for the people who just lost their loved ones.

*Blame the the killer and nothing else. The killer, out of his own free will decided to do this sick crime.*


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## Thanatos-Drive (Apr 16, 2007)

You guys in all your other countries must think your land is perfect, huh? No country is perfect. What about the London bombings? You don't see Americans saying, 'Boy those people in the UK must be really messed up to do that.' And before you bash the U.S., wonder why there are so many immigrants. 

*The only people originally in America were the Native Americans. Everybody else in the U.S. is from YOUR country. You're the ones bringing all this over here.*


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## galaxykidgamma (Apr 16, 2007)

QUOTE(Shinji @ Apr 16 2007 said:


> QUOTE said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



the problem is there is no sort of precedent for this kindof thing, so we can either work with the status quo, or take a big risk, and i don't think the latter is a favorable choice


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## Shinji (Apr 16, 2007)

QUOTE(Thanatos-Drive @ Apr 16 2007 said:


> You guys in all your other countries must think your land is perfect, huh? No country is perfect. What about the London bombings? You don't see Americans saying, 'Boy those people in the UK must be really messed up to do that.' And before you bash the U.S., wonder why there are so many immigrants.
> 
> *The only people originally in America were the Native Americans. Everybody else in the U.S. is from YOUR country. You're the ones bringing all this over here.*


What the heck does THAT have to do with this discussion?  Everybody knows the faults of their own country AS A WHOLE.  Nobody has once made it seem that their country is "better" than anothers.  Well at least I havent interpreted it as that...


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## Souldragon (Apr 16, 2007)

QUOTE(Thanatos-Drive @ Apr 16 2007 said:


> *The only people originally in America were the Native Americans. Everybody else in the U.S. is from YOUR country. You're the ones bringing all this over here.*



How the hell did I or any other people bring them over to U.S. Problems occur everywhere, if there people that have greed, hatred, etc etc there always be problems


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## jaxxster (Apr 16, 2007)

QUOTE(Thanatos-Drive @ Apr 16 2007 said:


> You guys in all your other countries must think your land is perfect, huh? No country is perfect. What about the London bombings? You don't see Americans saying, 'Boy those people in the UK must be really messed up to do that.' And before you bash the U.S., wonder why there are so many immigrants.
> 
> *The only people originally in America were the Native Americans. Everybody else in the U.S. is from YOUR country. You're the ones bringing all this over here.*



Theres a difference between a group of terroists and one fucked up little kiddy who obviously managed to get a gun too easily. I cant ever remember a school shooting here apart from the 1 but that was an old fked up peado guy where in america i remember quite a few.

Man its terrible. The numbers keep going up, when i first read it was 30 people now its 33 dead


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## galaxykidgamma (Apr 16, 2007)

QUOTE(Thanatos-Drive @ Apr 16 2007 said:


> *The only people originally in America were the Native Americans. Everybody else in the U.S. is from YOUR country. You're the ones bringing all this over here.*


i don't really think that's fair either, i know that i'm not a german, even though that's the only kind of blood that runs through me. Americans are americans, we've been naturalized over like 300 years now, yet the ethnic heritage claim remains relevant, for those who are still practicing their ethnic traditions more strongly than their american ones,


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## _Mazza_ (Apr 16, 2007)

I'm not bashing America, I'm just making a point that Guns should be made illegal. No, no country is perfect, but how many Gun shootings in colleges and schools are there in the UK or mass murders by seemingly normal members of the public, near to none.

The London bombings was only one event and was an act of terrorism, completely different to the happenings in the USA. The london bombings were by extremists and killed 52 people. The difference is when was the last time something like this happened in the UK?

And to the reamrks about everyone else is from our country, you're ancestors were from our country, since then there has been generations of different people and has become it's own nation and the US doesn't follow UK laws and has the constitution etc. so unless you're saying the US is part of the UK, which I highy doubt then your statement is useless.


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## jaxxster (Apr 16, 2007)

Another sad thing is that America allow this to happen time and time again. Im not insulting America in anyway.


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## Deleted User (Apr 16, 2007)

QUOTE(Taras @ Apr 16 2007 said:


> QUOTE(Nestea80 @ Apr 16 2007 said:
> 
> 
> > Why don't they have stricter gun laws.  Or just ban guns altogether.  No guns, no shootings.  Simple as that.  Oh, you like to hunt?  Too bad ... pick up another hobby.
> ...



Asstard?  Uhhh, what the hell is wrong with you?  Why are you making a personal attack on me?  What did I do to you?

Seriously ... something in your water.


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## Qpido (Apr 16, 2007)

I'm so mad at this shit happening.
It really makes me wanna cry 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




.

Q~


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## Deleted User (Apr 16, 2007)

QUOTE(Thanatos-Drive @ Apr 16 2007 said:


> You guys in all your other countries must think your land is perfect, huh? No country is perfect. What about the London bombings? You don't see Americans saying, 'Boy those people in the UK must be really messed up to do that.' And before you bash the U.S., wonder why there are so many immigrants.
> 
> *The only people originally in America were the Native Americans. Everybody else in the U.S. is from YOUR country. You're the ones bringing all this over here.*



Ok, I've heard a lot of stupid people say stupid things ... but this takes the cake.  I was born in Canada ... which makes me a CANADIAN, even if I have chinese parents.

EDIT:

Just to add, I'm not bashing Americans.  I'm just saying that they should DO something about it ... and why not start with having stricter gun laws?  And for you Americans that are taking this WAY too personally ... DON'T.  I'm not attacking you.  I'm not saying that you're a lunatic who wields guns and shoots up their school.  So, grow up and don't make any personal attacks on me ... like that other guy calling me an asstard.  Gee, people don't know how to argue sensibly these days.  They throw logic out the window and abandon any pretense of trying to make sense or engage in a sensible discussion.


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## Thanatos-Drive (Apr 16, 2007)

My point is, you can't blame the incident because America is 'screwed up.' America is formed out of immigrants from practically every other country out there. So think about the fact that all these crimes are caused because people from another country moved here and started doing their thing. You're blaming the country for these deaths at Virginia Tech, but in my opinion, the fault is on the global scale.


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## Souldragon (Apr 16, 2007)

QUOTE(Thanatos-Drive @ Apr 16 2007 said:


> My point is, you can't blame the incident because America is 'screwed up.' America is formed out of immigrants from practically every other country out there. So think about the fact that all these crimes are caused because people from another country moved here and started doing their thing. You're blaming the country for these deaths at Virginia Tech, but in my opinion, the fault is on the global scale.



Please just stop posting and think before you post. Can you prove that half the crimes that been cause in America is started by none white people? Come on man this is just your personal attack on other races and its also stated as a racist comment. America is mess up due to firearm been public open to all.. Countries problems occur everywhere no matter what the race are..


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## _Mazza_ (Apr 16, 2007)

Sorry but that comment makes no sense. You can't blame diversity in population for the problem when less than 20 million of the poplation in the US is from ethnic minoritys such as Asians and other nations. 

8% of the UKs population are from an ethnic minority so the percentages is close to the USAs.

No-one is saying "America is Screwed Up" America's laws on guns are screwed up, the global scale is definately not the problem.


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## aslacker55 (Apr 16, 2007)

The problem with gun control is that there is no way we can ban guns. I would love to see guns banned, but the right to bare arms is protected by the Constitution of America. I'm a former U.S. Army soldier and I worked with guns all the time. I have no need for guns, so I don't own one, but my cousins love them and own them. For every person like me that are anti-guns, there are 
2 people that are pro-guns. To change the laws, we must first change the minds and hearts of the pro-guns people. That's easier said than done.


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## Deleted User (Apr 16, 2007)

QUOTE(Thanatos-Drive @ Apr 16 2007 said:


> My point is, you can't blame the incident because America is 'screwed up.' America is formed out of immigrants from practically every other country out there. So think about the fact that all these crimes are caused because people from another country moved here and started doing their thing. You're blaming the country for these deaths at Virginia Tech, but in my opinion, the fault is on the global scale.



OMFG ... but these people are living under the American government ... American laws.  You can't say it's a global thing.  I seriously don't understand your train of thought.  How about the people born in America?  So according to you ... can we blame the Afraicans only then?  Since all humans originated from a species that developed in the continent of Africa.  BLAME AFRICA!  W00t!

You make it sound like people come over to America on planes ... get out of the airport and start a riot ... hop back onto the planes and go back home.

People like you give me headaches.  You can't start blaming people in Japan for this.  Firstly, the only blame are on the gunmen.  What I'm trying to get across is the fact that ... you can control these violent acts by controlling the weapons used.  I'm fine with people debating the fact that it doesno't make a difference.  There's two sides to the story.  But you're bringing in a third perspective that's ... absolute nonsense.


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## Thanatos-Drive (Apr 16, 2007)

QUOTE said:
			
		

> Ok, I've heard a lot of stupid people say stupid things ... but this takes the cake. I was born in Canada ... which makes me a CANADIAN, even if I have chinese parents.



In case you were wondering, the topic is about shootings in VirginiaTech. Since then, numerous people on this forum have voiced their disapproval of Americans. I'm presenting a rebuttal, saying that it's not productive to insult the American nationality, because after all, our ancestors are YOUR ancestors, making us an intertwined people. The fault is not just ours.

Your points are:
1. You are a Canadian and have Chinese parents. 
2. You considered my comment stupid. 

The first point you make is irrelevant. The second point you make is subjective to the audience.

Total relative data in the aforementioned post: zero.


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## _Mazza_ (Apr 16, 2007)

QUOTE(Thanatos-Drive @ Apr 16 2007 said:


> My point is, you can't blame the incident because America is 'screwed up.' America is formed out of immigrants from practically every other country out there. So think about the fact that all these crimes are caused because people from another country moved here and started doing their thing. You're blaming the country for these deaths at Virginia Tech, but in my opinion, the fault is on the global scale.



Oh and you may want to look at this site http://www.vpc.org/studies/start3.htm details 10 school shootings and 8 were by white americans and 2 by ethnic minorities thats if you can even call African American a minority any more.

I think your comments are on the verge of becoming racist so please stop posting about other countires and immigrants been the reason for all these killings.


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## Qpido (Apr 16, 2007)

You can't blame this on the difference in nationality, it's mostly drugs and medication that makes people crazy.

EDIT: I'd rather trust a black friend then a white friend.

Q~


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## _Mazza_ (Apr 16, 2007)

QUOTE(Thanatos-Drive @ Apr 16 2007 said:


> QUOTE said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



OMG, don't you get it yet, yes we share ancestors but American follows it's own set of laws. If the US followed UK laws or Spanish Laws or French Laws or Canadian Laws or any other and the numbers were the same you;d have a valid point but as it stands you don't.

plus his point is not irrelavent what he's trying to say is he may have a chinese parents but he his still a Canadian citizen and so lives like a canadian would, when life in China may be different. Just like people from different ethnic groups that are born in American and brought up in America are still Americans.


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## Souldragon (Apr 16, 2007)

Thanatos-Drive listen if you live in a country, you follow their rules and laws like other members stated. If that rules or laws been broken by the citizens within the country then its the country fault not the globe scale fault.. Just stop with the stupid and racist comments about how its other country or people from other country did that..


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## Shinji (Apr 16, 2007)

Ok Thanatos-Drive, you've made me lose interest in this discussion.  Your comments are going way too off topic even though you say they are not.  As everyone else has said, you're comments are borderline racist.

EDIT: edited, ok im done...


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## galaxykidgamma (Apr 16, 2007)

i feel like its dead


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## Deleted User (Apr 16, 2007)

QUOTE(Thanatos-Drive @ Apr 16 2007 said:


> QUOTE said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I guess you fail to notice that people who live in America are Americans.  So if you're going to point any fingers ... don't point them to anyone outside of America for it.  I'm not even BLAMING America ... I'm just voicing an opinion on a solution as to how to avoid these situations in the future.  Ancestors mean nothing.  My parents are from China ... they gave birth to me in Canada ... I go kill some people ... now China is involved somehow?

You are dead to me.


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## Thanatos-Drive (Apr 16, 2007)

You're all misunderstanding me.

I'm trying to say, Americans aren't bad people. You can't look at this one event like it's a totally unique American flaw. Look at the big picture and realize, we're all still humans. We have FLAWS. It's not like America is a horrible melting pot of criminals. I am saying, if you want to blame the nation, look at yourselves first. I brought in the racial-ethnicity factor to make you all realize we have a common link in America that is especially PREVALENT: the fact that we are made of everyone else as well. I'm not being racist, I'm trying to show a common link.

And YES, people in previous pages of this thread have voiced dissaproval. THey have gone so far as to call Americans 'fucked up.' I'm talking about:




			
				QUOTE said:
			
		

> This is the 19th school shooting in 10 years.
> 
> America is so fucked up...
> 
> ...



EDIT: To prevent double post.


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## aslacker55 (Apr 16, 2007)

We are totally getting off topic and *lets just agree to disagree*. People from outside America will never like America or understand our society and the same goes to the people in America, we will never understand how they think. Let us remember that 33 people lost their lives in Virginia today. I don't want fight with anybody here about why this happened. We can only blame one person and that's the killer.


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## Mehdi (Apr 16, 2007)

How easy it is to get guns in America.


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## Souldragon (Apr 16, 2007)

Please if a mod reading this, please close this thread.. Thanatos-Drive how the hell can you blame the nation when this happen within U.S. Come on man this is just you saying bullshit and doing personal attack on other races. Your comments are racist and it also show what kind of person you are.


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## _Mazza_ (Apr 16, 2007)

QUOTE(Thanatos-Drive @ Apr 16 2007 said:


> You're all misunderstanding me.
> 
> I'm trying to say, Americans aren't bad people. You can't look at this one event like it's a totally unique American flaw. Look at the big picture and realize, we're all still humans. We have FLAWS. It's not like America is a horrible melting pot of criminals. I am saying, if you want to blame the nation, look at yourselves first.
> 
> ...



You have a point the first two comments are just aimed at America but the last comment is valid because it is way too easy to own a gun in America.

But again with the "if you want to blame the nation, look at yourselves first."
why? it makes no sense, the nations we live in don't have anywhere near the amount of killingd and it isn't like America's population has been formed in the last 10 years. Again I'm not saying America is fucked up. The laws on guns and firearms are what is wrong with America and the whole view on owning weapons.


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## Deleted User (Apr 16, 2007)

QUOTE(aslacker55 @ Apr 16 2007 said:


> We are totally getting off topic and *lets just agree to disagree*.People from outside America will never like America or understand our society and the same goes to the people in America, we will never understand how they think. Let us remember that 33 people lost their lives in Virginia today. I don't want fight with anybody here about why this happened. We can only blame one person and that's the killer.



Amen to that.  (although I'm an atheist) ... but Amen!  I guess it's only natural to be patriotic isn't it?  Us Canadians aren't so much different from you Americans anyhow.  Except for our accents ... or your accents.  And our superior beer. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




I was just watching the news ... and the death toll in Iraq is like 3000 ... it makes me sad how so many deaths become just a number in a statistic.  And 33 killed in the massacre.  That's a lot of familes and loved ones.


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## _Mazza_ (Apr 16, 2007)

QUOTE(aslacker55 @ Apr 16 2007 said:


> We are totally getting off topic and *lets just agree to disagree*. People from outside America will never like America or understand our society and the same goes to the people in America, we will never understand how they think. Let us remember that 33 people lost their lives in Virginia today. I don't want fight with anybody here about why this happened. We can only blame one person and that's the killer.



I understand American society, the American dream and the Constitution etc. what I don't understand is why with the increasing number of killing and massacres in America is not been properly addressed. Michael Moore exposed the problems and falws with American law in Bowling for Columbine and while he does get on my nerves a bit he makes valid points but it seems like the Big Shots at the White House are more concerned with what is happening in other countries than in their own.


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## Thanatos-Drive (Apr 16, 2007)

Then, _Mazza_, my posts aren't directed at you. I'm mad at the people who aren't thinking and calling America 'fucked up.' Maybe they should change gun control (which is an honorable thing to do, but nearly impossible.) or raise attention to WHY this guy started shooting up the folks at VirginiaTech. Blaming it on America 'just because you're American' is counterproductive.


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## Souldragon (Apr 16, 2007)

Listen no one is blaming on Americans, they are blaming on America which referring to the laws, not the people. The killer should be blame as well..


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## nintendofreak (Apr 16, 2007)

Guns dont kill people, people kill people. 

Well, guns do kill people, but the constitution protects those rights.  Banning cars would be much more effective in decreasing student deaths, seeing as car accidents are the leading cause of student deaths


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## Thanatos-Drive (Apr 17, 2007)

The killer is dead. Any blame he gets won't really affect him too much.

'Listen no one is blaming on Americans, they are blaming on America and its laws, not the people. '

America IS Americans. The people constitute the country. An attack on America is attacking Americans.


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## skullstatue (Apr 17, 2007)

QUOTE(Souldragon @ Apr 16 2007 said:


> QUOTE(Thanatos-Drive @ Apr 16 2007 said:
> 
> 
> > My point is, you can't blame the incident because America is 'screwed up.' America is formed out of immigrants from practically every other country out there. So think about the fact that all these crimes are caused because people from another country moved here and started doing their thing. You're blaming the country for these deaths at Virginia Tech, but in my opinion, the fault is on the global scale.
> ...



Dammit stfu, you don't know shit. Look at some statistics then come back and tell me how it's racist. Shit, if someone tries to tell the truth they are automatically called racist. And one more thing, shut the hell up about firearms, I remember when a black gang threatened to exterminate all of the "honkies" at my old school. Do you know why they didn't try shit? Because half of the White kids brought guns. If it weren't for police protecting the gang bangers then we wouldn't be experiencing this issue right now would we? You can't just outlaw guns and expect them to magically disappear, they will be around for good. So how about we let the law-abiding citizens keep theirs. Really, it's laughable, do you think some crack dealer gives a shit that he's breaking the law by owning an automatic rifle? I remember when America was a good place, but it's over, thank the people that hide with their dick in between their legs and decided to hand over our country to trash.


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## _Mazza_ (Apr 17, 2007)

I think an psychological approach is wnot the way to go though. 

I admit other countries have problems too.

E.g in the UK underage drinking is a problem, I don't know anyone who hadn't been drunk by 16. Yet the laws in the US are stricter for drinking and I'm not sure on the situation there but it is probably better than here. Same is the problem of underage sex and teenage pregnancies in the UK because our government tries to take the we are here to help approach instead of enforcing stricter laws.

Similar to th guns laws in America instead of taking courses and having classes in school saying killing is bad, they should take a more direct approach and stop the sale of guns to the public.


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## Thanatos-Drive (Apr 17, 2007)

The problem with stopping the selling of guns to the public, is that the criminals will then have the guns and the public will have no way to defend.


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## nintendofreak (Apr 17, 2007)

QUOTE(Thanatos-Drive @ Apr 16 2007 said:


> You guys in all your other countries must think your land is perfect, huh? No country is perfect. What about the London bombings? You don't see Americans saying, 'Boy those people in the UK must be really messed up to do that.' And before you bash the U.S., wonder why there are so many immigrants.
> 
> *The only people originally in America were the Native Americans. Everybody else in the U.S. is from YOUR country. You're the ones bringing all this over here.*



Sorry, double post but had to post...


YOU SIR/MADAM, ARE A DISGRACE TO AMERICANS 



NOTE: Thanatos-drive does not represent the views of United States as a whole


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## Souldragon (Apr 17, 2007)

You know what Thanatos-Drive just stfu up dumbass. You are using your own personal experiences and doing a personal attacks on other races. No one says that firearms will just disappear if someone says so. Everyone saying that it the law should do some more shit about guns and changing the law to make it harder to get a guns. 
You of all people are racist and willing not to listen to reasons.


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## aslacker55 (Apr 17, 2007)

QUOTE(_Mazza_ @ Apr 16 2007 said:


> I understand American society, the American dream and the Constitution etc. what I don't understand is why with the increasing number of killing and massacres in America is not been properly addressed. Michael Moore exposed the problems and falws with American law in Bowling for Columbine and while he does get on my nerves a bit he makes valid points but it seems like the Big Shots at the White House are more concerned with what is happening in other countries than in their own.



Michael Moore is one sided(liberal), there are always different sides to a story. If you understand our society and laws, then you would know how hard it is to pass an Amendment. There are people here in America, that would die to protect the right to bare arms. It is easy to say you should this and that, but to actually do something about it is hard. You say that you understand American society, but you have no idea. Our society vary from state to state, each state also have their own set of laws.


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## Qpido (Apr 17, 2007)

QUOTE(Thanatos-Drive @ Apr 17 2007 said:


> The problem with stopping the selling of guns to the public, is that the criminals will then have the guns and the public will have no way to defend.



Well those kids didn't have any way to defend, if that shit happens JUST LIKE THAT, there is no reason to own a gun.
You don't walk around with a glock every hour of the day for fucks sake.
There has got to be a start somewhere, instead of throwing all your fucking money at the war in Iraq or something, invest in more police forces out there.

Q~


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## Thanatos-Drive (Apr 17, 2007)

QUOTE(nintendofreak @ Apr 16 2007 said:


> QUOTE(Thanatos-Drive @ Apr 16 2007 said:
> 
> 
> > You guys in all your other countries must think your land is perfect, huh? No country is perfect. What about the London bombings? You don't see Americans saying, 'Boy those people in the UK must be really messed up to do that.' And before you bash the U.S., wonder why there are so many immigrants.
> ...



No kidding I don't represent America as a whole. If I did, every single one of us would be a male, now wouldn't we? And why don't you try reading my other posts before making that comment? I already said, you're taking my post the wrong way. I'm not being racist, I'm saying we're all COMMON PEOPLE.


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## Thanatos-Drive (Apr 17, 2007)

QUOTE(Souldragon @ Apr 16 2007 said:


> You know what Thanatos-Drive just stfu up dumbass. You are using your own personal experiences and doing a personal attacks on other races. No one says that firearms will just disappear if someone says so. Everyone saying that it the law should do some more shit about guns and changing the law to make it harder to get a guns.
> You of all people are racist and willing not to listen to reasons.



What?

Here's a clue buddy: the last statement you saw directed at you, was NOT BY ME.


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## HelloKitty (Apr 17, 2007)

Its not too far from where I live... Virginia is only a state away... =(
I can't believe people are capable of this.


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## Souldragon (Apr 17, 2007)

QUOTE(Thanatos-Drive @ Apr 17 2007 said:


> QUOTE(Souldragon @ Apr 16 2007 said:
> 
> 
> > You know what Thanatos-Drive just stfu up dumbass. You are using your own personal experiences and doing a personal attacks on other races. No one says that firearms will just disappear if someone says so. Everyone saying that it the law should do some more shit about guns and changing the law to make it harder to get a guns.
> ...



No matter if your post wasn't made by you, all your statement give a message of blaming this event on the colour races and other nations not the true Americans or America itself. Therefore in my book that is a racist comment.


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## _Mazza_ (Apr 17, 2007)

QUOTE(Thanatos-Drive @ Apr 17 2007 said:


> The problem with stopping the selling of guns to the public, is that the criminals will then have the guns and the public will have no way to defend.



No the public will respond with the Police.

Here's the situation in America, a criminal goes to mug someone and has a gun, the victim pulls out a gun to defend, someone gets shot and at the same time forms an enemy.

In the UK, the victim hands over their purse/wallet. Yes this may seem a sissy approach but no-one gets hurt and the victim can report the crime and hopefully the mugger get's prosecuted and is ordered to pay a fine.

Now looking at the number for crime and killing in bother countries which system is more effective.

Obviously the system in the Uk isn't perfect, if I had it my way if someone came into my house and was walking out the door with my TV then I should have the right to whack them with a baseball bat but when it's outside in public i think most people will agree that the US law is flawed.


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## _Mazza_ (Apr 17, 2007)

QUOTE(Thanatos-Drive @ Apr 17 2007 said:


> QUOTE(nintendofreak @ Apr 16 2007 said:
> 
> 
> > QUOTE(Thanatos-Drive @ Apr 16 2007 said:
> ...



haha I think he meant "you don't represent everyone in the USAs point of view", and you've taken it as "not everyone is you" shows that you're not very smart now doesn't it. Didn't want to get personal but you've shown you don't know much by this comment


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## Qpido (Apr 17, 2007)

I think we can all agree on this:

We should make a clone army of Chuck Norris.

Q~


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## Thanatos-Drive (Apr 17, 2007)

QUOTE(Souldragon @ Apr 16 2007 said:


> QUOTE(Thanatos-Drive @ Apr 17 2007 said:
> 
> 
> > QUOTE(Souldragon @ Apr 16 2007 said:
> ...



I haven't made any racist comments. I've already explained this.

Sidenote:
'your post wasn't made by you'
Then it wouldn't be my post now would it?


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## _Mazza_ (Apr 17, 2007)

QUOTE(Qpido @ Apr 17 2007 said:


> I think we can all agree on this:
> 
> We should make a clone army of Chuck Norris.
> 
> Q~



the most serious thing in this entire thread, there should be Chuck Norris law enforcement! No-one would break the law!

Although with more than one Chuck Norris there would be competition between the Chuck's and it would inevitably turn the world into one big black hole because it cannot handle the immense force of more than one of the almighty Chuck Norris! lol


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## Souldragon (Apr 17, 2007)

Then why the post from 5 and up is under your username if it wasn't made by you


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## jaxxster (Apr 17, 2007)

Man, All i wanted to do is make people aware of a terrible tradegy and for people to express thier condolences. Instead its alot of back and forth arguing that wont have an end.


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## Qpido (Apr 17, 2007)

Ok, guys.

Just stop it, it's not about trying to outsmart each other by highlighting the most common of mistakes and fuck-ups.
If there was a mod thingy that could silence your voices for an hour, I'd want that to be put into action right now.
I'm positive this won't help anyone and would not make and dead person feel more at ease.

Cut it out.

Q~


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## bobrules (Apr 17, 2007)

Many at least 22 dead. I'll be watching CNN a bit.


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## _Mazza_ (Apr 17, 2007)

I want this thread to be closed, I'm tired of arguing and generally tired so am going to go and get some shut eye. Bye everyone.



			
				QUOTE said:
			
		

> From CNN
> 
> • University officials say 33 dead, including gunman
> • Four hospitals report 29 wounded
> ...



Before I go I just want to send my condolences to all the families who have lost those close to them. R.I.P


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## Souldragon (Apr 17, 2007)

I'm going end my argument and going to says this " the U.S's laws should change in the term of using or owning firearms. This will help and might slow down the crimes involving mass school shooting"


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## Thanatos-Drive (Apr 17, 2007)

QUOTE(_Mazza_ @ Apr 16 2007 said:


> QUOTE(Thanatos-Drive @ Apr 17 2007 said:
> 
> 
> > The problem with stopping the selling of guns to the public, is that the criminals will then have the guns and the public will have no way to defend.
> ...



It's called sarcasm. It was meant to make you chuckle or perhaps even laugh. And yes, you just did get personal, but it's okay, because I'm not too bothered by insults.


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## aslacker55 (Apr 17, 2007)

QUOTE(_Mazza_ @ Apr 16 2007 said:


> QUOTE(Thanatos-Drive @ Apr 17 2007 said:
> 
> 
> > The problem with stopping the selling of guns to the public, is that the criminals will then have the guns and the public will have no way to defend.
> ...



You don't understand, you are only thinking one sided. What works for a country does not automatically means that it will work for another. What's good for one country, does not means it's good for another. UK laws are also flawed, just like ours and every single country in this world.  We are all just doing our best. Like it or hate it, guns are here to stay( sad but true). :'(  :'(


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## _Mazza_ (Apr 17, 2007)

ahhhh yes I forgot about the whole twitchy finger syndrome that must be the cause for all the deaths in America [/sarcasm]

bye bye now


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## Opium (Apr 17, 2007)

I just spent the day in the newsroom going over the massacre. Literally everyone is doing some sort of story about it from various different angles. The overhead TV was on with live news updates and eye witness accounts. Pretty depressing stuff.

And this is in Australia...


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## .TakaM (Apr 17, 2007)

it really is sad..
but sadly, something I can't see ever stopping..
what can, and should stop is assholes like jack thompson attempting to capitalize on these massacres


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## rest0re (Apr 17, 2007)

i think its because pokemon wasnt released somebody got mad


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## Westside (Apr 17, 2007)

QUOTE(rest0re @ Apr 17 2007 said:


> i think its because pokemon wasnt released somebody got mad


What the?  Are you serious?  If not you shouldn't say things like this.  Where are the military police in situation like this?  Those guys move 10x faster and with amazing strategy and tactics and you leave it to the civis to stop monsters like these.


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## phuzzz (Apr 17, 2007)

ACC Pride *beats chest* :'(


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## rest0re (Apr 17, 2007)

hoesntly this fuckign sucks... so fucking fucked 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





(( anyone know if this guy was racist/goth/loonie/gamer/pokemon-fan/jack thompson hater/crackhead/whatever? AND WHY THE HELL WHEN YOU WANT TO KILL YOURSELF YOU NEED TO START FROM OTHERS. god damn, just shoot yourself first.


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## phuzzz (Apr 17, 2007)

Committing suicide escapes accepting responsibility for his actions.  It's possible that he went on some kind of a weird rampage, woke up, and shot himself so he wouldn't have to explain himself.


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## OSW (Apr 17, 2007)

Not something surprising really.
Some people go crazy when life just isn't going their way.

My philosophy teacher mentioned today a past dicussion he had with his colleague about a similar event. The colleague said something along the lines of "why do these things happen?" and my teacher said "i'm surprised they don't happen more often".
It's like people commititng suicide after losing their job and wife. If it's their most important things, it's no wonder they give up hope.

Just thought i'd mention this as it's relevant.


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## Thanatos-Drive (Apr 17, 2007)

For all your information, current news suggests he was looking for his ex-girlfriend, or a man his ex-girlfriend had an affair with.

CNN news has no information as to who the killer is yet.

This is the CNN report at the time of my posting:



			
				QUOTE said:
			
		

> *BLACKSBURG, Virginia* (CNN) -- A gunman who killed at least 30 people in one of two shootings on the campus of Virginia Tech was dressed "almost like a Boy Scout," said a student who survived by pretending to lie dead on a classroom floor.
> 
> "He just stepped within five feet of the door and just started firing," said Erin Sheehan, who was in one of the Norris Hall classrooms where the second shooting incident took place.
> 
> ...



On a sidenote: Glad to see there's no more 'hate America' statements.

EDIT: Bolding appropriate parts of the article.
EDIT: Added comments.


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## Trune (Apr 17, 2007)

Condolences indeed, but I thought this was a hand-held gaming forum.. not a political battleground for adolescents? hmm..


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## Arm73 (Apr 17, 2007)

QUOTE(Westside @ Apr 17 2007 said:


> QUOTE(rest0re @ Apr 17 2007 said:
> 
> 
> > i think its because pokemon wasnt released somebody got mad
> ...



I think that the killer, moved so swiftly around the campus that nobody realized what was really happening until it was too late..
I mean from what I've heard, after the first killing people thought that the criminal had obviously fled the scene, but the guy just went over to the other building and kept on shooting.
I would say _surprise_, was a key element.
How do you prevent such a thing ? Once it's started ,it's unavoidable,  there's bound to be numerous deaths, no matter how fast and how efficiently the forces get there.
If that's the case, there should be some way to prevent any gun to reach any public building at all, like we see metal detectors at airports or even down at the Empire state building here in new your, where in order to get in , you must pass a security check just like at an airport.
And I bet someday it will happen too, just like after 9/11 security check started to pop up here even if you just plan a visit to the statue of liberty.
People are somehow bothered, you have to make the line and pass the security and waste more time, but at the end everybody feel safer and that's a big trade off.
I think more then a low enforcing a ban of fir arms, technology should play an even more important role in this game with automated security just like in Schwarznegger's total Recall, where in a not too distant future people were forced to pass huge x-rays stations in order to even get to the subways.
Even the perfect lows may be broken, but a security check in is hard to beat by anyone.

I've been reading a few comments around this topic(not all of them) and somehow I've seen racial remarks of some sort, and I just wanted to point out that most of us are being racist all the time, everywhere.
I 've been living in New York for more then a decade, but I'm from Italy original, and even there there is a sort of cold war between north and south, region and region and historically many cities don't get along with each other very well.
On a more international scale I hear all the time generalizations and comments like stupid Americans or dirty French or Italians spaghetti eaters or dumb Germans and violent drunk British(hooligans or such).
While some of the appellations might somehow reflect a portion of the population ,  of course you have o agree that not everybody likes spaghetti, not everybody likes football and some people love soap more then others, therefore it's hard to generalize, even more so on a larger scale when we talk about Americans, since the USA are such a big country, with lots of diversity and lots of different society models.
The stupid ones are those who tend to generalize, without realizing that such a huge country is made of a lot of different states, much like Europe in made of many different nations.
The only difference is that here everybody speaks English, and there's only one currency, while in Europe there wasn't even the euro not so long ago.
I am wondering because here, one has to carefully CHOOSE EACH WORD to be politically correct.
Any remark about an other American of a different racial origin or a different religion must be very, very thought trough before spoken.
Legendary radio host Don Imus got fired after over 30 years of radio station work made of bad jokes and racial comments because he said something wrong about the wrong people in the wrong moment. It was the most talked about topic here in the states before the VT.
Personally I feel that this huge mess was a little exaggerated, but it shows that one has to be really careful when it comes to a racial remark, even if it's meant as  a bad taste joke.
Michael Richard ruined his career after using the n-word in a show that wasn't even supposed to be aired, and even people like Howard Stern was forced to leave his network also because of allegations about his jokes about Jewish.
All I'm saying is be careful, don't assume it's ok to diminish other country's  people, it's not right and it's dangerous, and some individuals might not tolerate that even one bit. 
I know, I had my share of embarrassment's when I first moved here, but this goes beyond just plain old bad taste, it can ruin your life sometime.
While we are all a bunch of friendly guys here, it's still not correct to insult other races, expecially like here in the States, chances are some of your ancestors moved here and formed today's society regardlessly of where are you from.


----------



## Mar (Apr 17, 2007)

this is what's wrong with most people in economically developed countries.

Mentally unstable..


i've been to the point of wanting to do some pretty bad stuff, and i can say that this probably, happened from feeling down, not being able to express feelings, and seriously not getting the right attention from people around.

it can drive a person insane, and if done with consistancy can produce a situation like this.


people tend to avoid contact with depressed and desperate persons.
which makes the person more depressed an desperate...

maybe this is weird to say, but could you imagine how the shooter had felt the days before this happened...
if you've ever felt like this you'll understand... agony.

of course the lack of proper parenting helps put someone to this level of aggressiveness...

If i was gonna kill myself anyway... i would take people with me.

that's what it feels like when you're so fucked up...you want people to notice, notice your pain, tears, anger, notice how difficult it is.
and if you can't express that in a normal way...cause you just didn't learn from your parents, it'll find a way out...

as with little kids: any attention...positive or negative is attention, and they'll misbehave to get it if they have to.





i have always tried to be a good person.
i am raised to be nice to others, put others before myself, and help them.

also i've been yelled at, and constantly corrected at anything i did or wanted to do...

that has turned me into a person that MUST do everything right, perfect...and that doesn't work..especially when you're full of fear of doing anything that may be irritating or bad for others.

if i try and try for others...do my best as hard as i can..and still get nothing...i would snap...and i have...to the point of damaging myself physically...hitting my ex girlfriend...and even planning to rape her...

thinking of this makes me scared of what i might do one day, so i'm working on that.

i'm being really open about this... why?

because i want others to let go of their "mental blocks" and start doing things they want...for themselves...

live for yourself and everything will fall into place...

just don't be a dick.


----------



## Opium (Apr 17, 2007)

The Australian said:
			
		

> *Shooter argued with girlfriend before massacre*
> 
> A GUNMAN argued with his girlfriend before killing her and another man, and then went on to massacre another 30 people at a US university before taking his own life in the deadliest shooting rampage in US history.
> 
> ...



source

Very sad, at least we have a bit more of an insight into what actually happened.


----------



## Azimuth (Apr 17, 2007)

@Mar,

this dickhead got dumped, so its justified that he walked into a building chained the doors and then lined up each student in every class and executed them.

Save me the crap, if your depressed then kill yourself that way no one cares anymore, you don't have to prove some childish point by taking people down with you.


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## rest0re (Apr 17, 2007)

yea.. just fucking kill yourself, no need to kill others. "save the planet, kill yourself". honestly..


----------



## Mehdi (Apr 17, 2007)

QUOTE(Mar @ Apr 17 2007 said:


> this is what's wrong with most people in economically developed countries.
> 
> Mentally unstable..
> 
> ...



man damn... Ya know you shouldn't think like that but hell I don't know what u went through. If people ignore me I ignore them right back. I don't think too much about something to get emo about it. And only cowards would hurt others for their own pain.


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## lookout (Apr 17, 2007)

Don't why in US so easy to get hold with guns even kids could have one....


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## MaHe (Apr 17, 2007)

Actually, there IS a problem with USA. 10,000 _gun_ homicides a year. I can't imagine that.
Slovenia is a small country (2 millions of people), but there aren't more than 1 - 2 a year here.
Sure, the population of the States is 150x bigger, but yet, that would still be only about 100 - 200 a year.
(on the completely different matter, we do have 650 suicides a year, making us the most suicidal nation in the world, competing with Japan)

About a year ago, a street criminal killed a woman in Serbia and came here. He later decided to take revenge
on a man who turned him in for a bank robbery, attacked his wife and cut her throat. This was all over the national news
and every single day of his trial in the court was reported in the papers (and still is, because he awaits another trial in Serbia).
That's not likely to happen in the 'New World'.

I agree this tragedy is sad, but Opium made another valid point. On Sunday, 50 people were killed in a bomb blast in the Middle East.
Nobody seemed to care, but does it make it any less sad? After all, it was the United States (with support of the United Nations, unfortunately) that attacked Iraq and disrupted the 'peace'. Sure, Iraq wasn't heaven under Saddam Hussein, but it's worse now.

Despite many people hate Michael Moore, he made a very valid point in Bowling for Columbine - what the hell makes Americans so damn
aggressive? We will never know.


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## Harsky (Apr 17, 2007)

Been listening to the news on the radio. They interviewed someone that said the real solution is to relax the gun law. I really don't want to jump into a gun law debate so I'll just leave it at a condolences to the family of the people who died.


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## Shinji (Apr 17, 2007)

QUOTE said:
			
		

> Updated at 10:55 a.m., Tuesday, 04.17.2007
> 
> During today's Convocation at Cassell Coliseum, the Merryman Center auditorium is being reserved for families of the victims who would to attend service in a private location.
> 
> ...



Source

Info on the shooter

I'm still unable to get ahold of my friends who go there.  One was in journalism and the other was in the engineering program...


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## aslacker55 (Apr 17, 2007)

QUOTE(MaHe @ Apr 17 2007 said:


> Despite many people hate Michael Moore, he made a very valid point in Bowling for Columbine - what the hell makes Americans so damn
> aggressive? We will never know.



Michael Moore is a biased and one sided person(liberal), to take his side is not good. Sure it would be ideal to have guns banned, but trying to do so would create such a rift between America that it would not even be worth it. There are millions of people in America that would die to protect their rights to bare arms and trying to take that away from them could cause a civil war. America had a civil war before and we will never let that happen again. 

If you really understand our society, and you probably have seen a little bit of it from our television shows, movies, and videogames. Then you would know that America is a nation of people that don't take shit from anybody. If you push us, we'll push you back. An eye for an eye mentality. Plus we glorify violence in our media; as little kids in America we are exposed to these kind of things all the time. Violence is apart of our society and is apart of our past, but it's not as bad as people make it out to be. America is still the greatest and most powerful nation in the world, you can't deny that.


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## MaHe (Apr 17, 2007)

QUOTE(aslacker55 @ Apr 17 2007 said:


> QUOTE(MaHe @ Apr 17 2007 said:
> 
> 
> > Despite many people hate Michael Moore, he made a very valid point in Bowling for Columbine - what the hell makes Americans so damn
> ...


I don't. And you just proved my point. It's in the culture; now deal with it yourselves. I'm just sick of people saying it's a global problem, 'cause it's not.
There aren't such massive homicides outside of the States.


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## aslacker55 (Apr 17, 2007)

QUOTE(MaHe @ Apr 17 2007 said:


> I don't. And you just proved my point. It's in the culture; now deal with it yourselves. I'm just sick of people saying it's a global problem, 'cause it's not.
> There aren't such massive homicides outside of the States.



What I don't like is people talking all this stuff about knowing the solution, when they have no idea about American laws and our society. There are massive homicides around the world, it's just not as documented and media exposed as America's (can you deny that and don't talk about just your country, remember you said globally).


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## lastdual (Apr 17, 2007)

QUOTE(MaHe @ Apr 17 2007 said:


> I don't. And you just proved my point. It's in the culture; now deal with it yourselves. I'm just sick of people saying it's a global problem, 'cause it's not.
> There aren't such massive homicides outside of the States.


Um...

1998-2000 Murders (per capita) by Country (and 2003 stats)

#1   Colombia: 0.617847 per 1,000 people    
#2   South Africa: 0.496008 per 1,000 people    
#3   Jamaica: 0.324196 per 1,000 people    
#4   Venezuela: 0.316138 per 1,000 people    
#5   Russia: 0.201534 per 1,000 people    
#6   Mexico: 0.130213 per 1,000 people    
#7   Estonia: 0.107277 per 1,000 people    
#8   Latvia: 0.10393 per 1,000 people    
#9   Lithuania: 0.102863 per 1,000 people    
#10   Belarus: 0.0983495 per 1,000 people    
#11   Ukraine: 0.094006 per 1,000 people    
#12   Papua New Guinea: 0.0838593 per 1,000 people    
#13   Kyrgyzstan: 0.0802565 per 1,000 people    
#14   Thailand: 0.0800798 per 1,000 people    
#15   Moldova: 0.0781145 per 1,000 people    
#16   Zimbabwe: 0.0749938 per 1,000 people    
#17   Seychelles: 0.0739025 per 1,000 people    
#18   Zambia: 0.070769 per 1,000 people    
#19   Costa Rica: 0.061006 per 1,000 people    
#20   Poland: 0.0562789 per 1,000 people 

....The US ranks down at #24

Also, there are at least 2 cases recently where similar shootings were prevented by responsible citizens who were carrying guns with concealed weapons licences. Michael Moore is out of touch with reality, and the US is far from the most violent place to live.

vv - fixed


----------



## aslacker55 (Apr 17, 2007)

QUOTE(lastdual @ Apr 17 2007 said:


> Michael Moore is out of tough with reality, and the US is far from the most violent place to live.



He meant out of touch with reality.


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## moribund112 (Apr 17, 2007)

There are massive homicides everywhere in the globe.
Two weeks ago in Lijiang, China a man went wild with a knife and stabbed over 25 people, men, women, and children in a public square.

Was this in the news? No, because here is China. China is a peaceful country, unlike the violent Americans..
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




, and it wouldn't be as sensational as if it were an American event. Anything to jump on them is game it seems...

America gets a bad rap all the time because of our apparent "gun" culture. I can tell you the times I've seen guns in my life on two hands, and the majority of those times were at shooting ranges.

Violence is glorified all over the world, not just in America. Anyone who says otherwise is an absolute liar; I've traveled to many places and people watch the same rubbish on television everywhere. Violence is more a part of any European's past than it is for any American currently alive. To  say that it's an inalienable part of our culture is just ignorant. The Europeans had two world wars fought on their soil, in their towns and homes, and then half of them spent the next fifty years after that behind the iron curtain where violence and militarism was a way of life. What's the difference between the Europeans then, and the Americans?

It's availablity, folks.
Can a Frenchman own a personal firearm? Damn right he can, although he must have a hunting license, and go through numerous areas of red tape to get one.

In America we do have systems to make sure those who shouldn't have guns don't - that's the Brady Bill. However, it's still far too easy to get a gun, legally or otherwise.

Guns don't kill people, people kill people. If you don't believe this, you're simply ignorant. People who want to kill will do so, regardless of whether or not they have a gun. A gun simply makes it much easier to do so.

What it comes down to is education. It comes down to proper parenting. Wouldn't you know if your son or daughter has a gun in their room? 

And to think, this guy wasn't even American...what's that say about South Koreans then? How did a non-citizen acquire two handguns? In my opinion that's something that needs to be investigated.


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## Arm73 (Apr 17, 2007)

So the guy was from S.Korea after all?
What about all this talk about fucked up Americans children then ?
Can't make much of an argument out of it now, can we ?
And Jack Thompson should really quit his career, according to the news shooting in campus happened in the 60's and even in the 1800's way before videogames could affect our judgment...
And by the way, maybe it's easy to get a hold of a gun over here, but then again if this guy wasn't studing in America but in another country, probably qwould have come up with another way to perform his actions, like an home made bomb of some sort or poisons or whatever the hell happens in other rough countries like in Iraq.
If he was determined to kill that day....


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## tetsuya (Apr 17, 2007)

South Korea? Yesterday the news people said the gunman was from china. Did the news gave out information without even checking it?


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## Zaraf (Apr 17, 2007)

So the guy was Korean?  Hmmm...

You know what's kind of interesting about all of this...is seeing the double standard that exists in the US media.  If this had been a "Muslim" or an "Arab" guy, then all of the news reports would have "Terrorist attack his Virginia Tech!"

And instead of just condolences on TV, you'd see Bush saying stuff like "THIS is why our troops are over there in Iraq right now!  It's to protect the America FREEDOM!  We're the land of the FREE!  Home to the BRAVE!"

So Bush, you going to send troops to Korea now?


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## Azimuth (Apr 17, 2007)

QUOTE(Zaraf @ Apr 17 2007 said:


> So the guy was Korean?Â Hmmm...
> 
> You know what's kind of interesting about all of this...is seeing the double standard that exists in the US media.Â If this had been a "Muslim" or an "Arab" guy, then all of the news reports would have "Terrorist attack his Virginia Tech!"
> 
> ...



You know what they say, if a muslim commits a crime its because of religion, if christian/jew/whatever commints a crime its because of personal problems

In other news, people seem to be really capitalizing on this, 

Debbie Schlussel

Dr. Phil

and of course Scientology


----------



## aslacker55 (Apr 17, 2007)

QUOTE(Azimuth @ Apr 17 2007 said:


> You know what they say, if a muslim commits a crime its because of religion, if christian/jew/whatever commints a crime its because of personal problems



Do you have any proof of that?
A crime is a crime, it doesn't matter what religion you are.


----------



## Azimuth (Apr 17, 2007)

QUOTE(aslacker55 @ Apr 17 2007 said:


> QUOTE(Azimuth @ Apr 17 2007 said:
> 
> 
> > You know what they say, if a muslim commits a crime its because of religion, if christian/jew/whatever commints a crime its because of personal problems
> ...



Its a fact that nowadays the US treats arabs/muslims like the enemy and continuously demonizes these people, as an example. whats the first thing you think of when you hear the word muslim. Let me guess terrorist suicide bomber.

But  I don't want to enter into an ethics discussion...


----------



## aslacker55 (Apr 17, 2007)

QUOTE(Azimuth @ Apr 17 2007 said:


> QUOTE(aslacker55 @ Apr 17 2007 said:
> 
> 
> > QUOTE(Azimuth @ Apr 17 2007 said:
> ...



Actually I'm an Asian immigrant that happens to be a Muslim and I also served in the US Army during 911 and the Iraq war. When I hear the word Muslim, I think of my family and friends.


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## Azimuth (Apr 17, 2007)

well you do, but do other people

salam


----------



## aslacker55 (Apr 17, 2007)

QUOTE(Azimuth @ Apr 17 2007 said:


> well you do, but do other people
> 
> salam



Yes they do, I said I was in the Army during that time, my family and I were never treated any differently. What America is against is the radical Muslims that commit terrorist acts and not normal Muslims.


----------



## Azimuth (Apr 17, 2007)

QUOTE(aslacker55 @ Apr 17 2007 said:


> QUOTE(Azimuth @ Apr 17 2007 said:
> 
> 
> > well you do, but do other people
> ...



but nowadays people are bridging the gap between moderate muslims and extremist retards, every other day I hear some hate speech that is supposedly justified by the fact that the US is at war with extremists. I doubt that most people can tell the difference anymore and think that religious extremists signify the majority of muslims. It is a stereotype and just because you have not encountered it does not mean it doesn't exist.


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## Zaraf (Apr 17, 2007)

QUOTE(aslacker55 @ Apr 17 2007 said:


> QUOTE(Azimuth @ Apr 17 2007 said:
> 
> 
> > QUOTE(aslacker55 @ Apr 17 2007 said:
> ...




I'm also a Muslim 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




  Assalamulakum!  But I live in Canada


----------



## aslacker55 (Apr 17, 2007)

QUOTE(Azimuth @ Apr 17 2007 said:


> but nowadays people are bridging the gap between moderate muslims and extremist retards, every other day I hear some hate speech that is supposedly justified by the fact that the US is at war with extremists. I doubt that most people can tell the difference anymore and think that religious extremists signify the majority of muslims. It is a stereotype and just because you have not encountered it does not mean it doesn't exist.
> 
> 
> That's why people have to be educated and the media is at fault for fanning the flames of hate. Not all Muslims come from the Middle East, we are from different races and cultural backgrounds.
> ...



Don't let your anger get to you and say such an ignorant statements.


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## Azimuth (Apr 17, 2007)

I obviously don't mean to offend any Americans or judge them by the actions of a few, if I did that im sorry, because im not better than the people who stereotype.

Its hard to believe there are enlightened individuals in the US, when all I hear is terrorist this muslim that, and you throw away Habeas corpus in the case of an 'insurgent' if that isn't prejudice I don't know what is.


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## mthrnite (Apr 17, 2007)

America will always have both hawks and doves. One will always outnumber the other by a small margin and have control over the country's direction. Just try to remember, that for every person in America that believes a given thing, there is at least 3/4's of another person that denies it. Well, I'm speaking generally, but it's especially true in politics.

Judging a country by it's majority is ignorance... and by ignorance, I don't mean "you stoopit", I just mean you are discounting an awful lot of people to make a point.

Some of America is decidedly screwed up, maybe even the majority... but don't judge the whole country.

By the way, I'm not addressing anyone in particular.. just sayin' y'know.

And aslacker55, I haven't read all of your posts on this matter, but from what I have read, you seem to have a pretty good grip on reality.

..again.. just sayin'.


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## Trace II (Apr 17, 2007)

QUOTE(Nestea80 @ Apr 16 2007 said:


> Why don't they have stricter gun laws.Â Or just ban guns altogether.Â No guns, no shootings.Â Simple as that.Â Oh, you like to hunt?Â Too bad ... pick up another hobby.



Who would want to kill innocent animals either? :'(


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## Mehdi (Apr 17, 2007)

QUOTE(mthrnite @ Apr 17 2007 said:


> America will always have both hawks and doves. One will always outnumber the other by a small margin and have control over the country's direction. Just try to remember, that for every person in America that believes a given thing, there is at least 3/4's of another person that denies it. Well, I'm speaking generally, but it's especially true in politics.
> 
> Judging a country by it's majority is ignorance... and by ignorance, I don't mean "you stoopit", I just mean you are discounting an awful lot of people to make a point.
> 
> ...



Man I agree with you man.. I mean they say America is a democratic country how is it that people who voted for the losing party are unheared and the winning party gets all.. It's not democratic it's bullying, majority deciding what to do in the end. I'm seriuosly happy that I live in holland where every vote counts and parties get seats corresponding to the amount of votes they get.


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## Azimuth (Apr 17, 2007)

As I said, I am sorry for judging all Americans by the actions of a few(or the majority),

But the ignorant are the ones with the loudest voices and are the ones that are heard most often.

And I wasn't on an American smear campaign, if I wanted to hate on America its as simple as switching on the news.


----------



## Xeijin (Apr 17, 2007)

QUOTE(ozzyzak @ Apr 16 2007 said:


> QUOTE(Nestea80 @ Apr 16 2007 said:
> 
> 
> > Why don't they have stricter gun laws.Â Or just ban guns altogether.Â No guns, no shootings.Â Simple as that.Â Oh, you like to hunt?Â Too bad ... pick up another hobby.
> ...



I'm sorry that just does not make sense. All citizens having guns hardly stops criminals from getting them. Also, if guns were banned nation-wide I'm sure that tragedies like this would be far less likely I mean let's face it the most publicised and horrific school shootings have been American. I personally think that the major flaw of the constitution is the right for Americans citizens to carry guns, while I accept that America was built upon these values (have studied all of this in History) I find it hard to sympathise with after some of the tragedies that have ocurred. Not that the UK is much better with the recent slew of London shootings, but I do genuinely think that such incidents could be less frequent if Guns were banned in America.

I think alot of problems are the way in which Guns are glamorized by organisations such as the National Rifle Association.


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## aslacker55 (Apr 17, 2007)

QUOTE(Azimuth @ Apr 17 2007 said:


> And I wasn't on an American smear campaign, if I wanted to hate on America its as simple as switching on the news.



Nothing against you Azimuth, I accepted your apology. 

That's also part of the problem, media outside of America stretches the truth and demonize America. They hate us and they love it when something like the shooting happens to us. It gets more people watching their shows if  something bad happens to the almighty America, nobody cares if America does something good. People shouldn't get persuaded by the media, more than likely they are biased.


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## asv545 (Apr 18, 2007)

I am going to post a progression of quotes from the 1700's on to help people who may not know where Americans are coming from on this topic.

Arms are the only true badges of liberty. The possession of arms is the distinction of a free man from a slave.
— Andrew Fletcher 1698 

"False is the idea of utility that sacrifices a thousand real advantages for one imaginary or trifling inconvenience; that would take fire from men because it burns, and water because one may drown in it; that has no remedy for evils except destruction. The laws that forbid the carrying of arms are laws of such a nature. They disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes."  Cesare Beccaria, as quoted by Thomas Jefferson.

Just to give some people an idea of the philosophy of some of America's founding fathers.  Most believed that in the social contract we negotiate away a minimum of rights necessary to bring about peace.  

"Many politicians are in the habit of laying it down as a self-evident proposition that no people ought to be free till they are fit to use their freedom. The maxim is worthy of the fool in the old story who resolved not to go into the water till he had learned to swim."  Thomas B. Macaulay 

The right to bear(not bare; huge difference) arms is considered a personal freedom by many, and was thought to be a fundamental right by the founders of America.  

"To prohibit a citizen from wearing or carry a war arm... is an unwarranted restriction upon the constitutional right to keep and bear arms. If cowardly and dishonorable men sometimes shoot unarmed men with army pistols or guns, the evil must be prevented by the penitentiary and gallows, and not by a general deprivation of a constitutional privilege."
--Arkansas Supreme Court-1878 

I do believe that where there is a choice only between cowardice and violence, I would advise violence. Thus when my eldest son asked me what he should have done had he been present when I was almost fatally assaulted in 1908 [by an Indian extremist opposed to Gandhi's agreement with Smuts], whether he should have run away and seen me killed or whether he should have used his physical force which he could and wanted to use, and defend me, I told him it was his duty to defend me even by using violence. Hence it was that I took part in the Boer War, the so-called Zulu Rebellion and [World War I]. Hence also do I advocate training in arms for those who believe in the method of violence. I would rather have India resort to arms in order to defend her honor than that she should in a cowardly manner become or remain a helpless witness to her own dishonor.
— Mohandas K. Gandhi, Young India, August 11, 1920 from Fischer, Louis ed.,The Essential Gandhi, 1962 

"A fear of weapons is a sign of retarded sexual and emotional maturity."
- Sigmund Freud, General Introduction to Psychoanalysis 

"That rifle on the wall of the labourer's cottage or working class flat is the symbol of democracy. It our job to see that it stays there."  George Orwell

"2nd Amendment Gun control? It's the best thing you can do for crooks and gangsters. I want you to have nothing. If I'm a bad guy, I'm always gonna have a gun. Safety locks? You will pull the trigger with a lock on, and I'll pull the trigger. We'll see who wins."  Sammy "The Bull" Gravano, whose testimony convicted John Gotti

And to end on a more humorous note, as the great Krusty the Clown once said, "There are three reasons to own a gun. To protect yourself and your family, to hunt dangerous and delicious animals, and to keep the King of England out of your face."


----------



## Azimuth (Apr 18, 2007)

QUOTE(aslacker55 @ Apr 18 2007 said:


> QUOTE(Azimuth @ Apr 17 2007 said:
> 
> 
> > And I wasn't on an American smear campaign, if I wanted to hate on America its as simple as switching on the news.
> ...



I don't think people hate Americans as a people, they hate America's foreign policy and your governments ignorance.


----------



## aslacker55 (Apr 18, 2007)

QUOTE(Azimuth @ Apr 17 2007 said:


> QUOTE(aslacker55 @ Apr 18 2007 said:
> 
> 
> > QUOTE(Azimuth @ Apr 17 2007 said:
> ...



How can you say that when they are screaming death to Americans and America. Burning our flag and showing videos of my fellow brothers in arms being bombed and killed. I was in Iraq during the war, do you know how it feels like when somebody is screaming death to you, your family, and your friends?


----------



## Taras (Apr 18, 2007)

QUOTE(Xeijin @ Apr 17 2007 said:


> I'm sorry that just does not make sense. All citizens having guns hardly stops criminals from getting them. Also, if guns were banned nation-wide I'm sure that tragedies like this would be far less likely I mean let's face it the most publicised and horrific school shootings have been American. I personally think that the major flaw of the constitution is the right for Americans citizens to carry guns, while I accept that America was built upon these values (have studied all of this in History) I find it hard to sympathise with after some of the tragedies that have ocurred.



Don't tell Americans how to structure our laws and we won't tell the British how to molest sheep.

End of thread.


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## jaxxster (Apr 18, 2007)

thats only welsh people who molest sheep but still that was a really immature response *clap clap*


----------



## Azimuth (Apr 18, 2007)

QUOTE(aslacker55 @ Apr 18 2007 said:


> QUOTE(Azimuth @ Apr 17 2007 said:
> 
> 
> > QUOTE(aslacker55 @ Apr 18 2007 said:
> ...



Iraq is a different situation, a hostile occupation will always be met with resistance. I don't mean to digress, but last time I checked Iraq is a war zone, it is expected that there is a lot of hatred and death happening on both sides

The rest of the world doesn't want "death to America" and all that, they just want a better foreign policy that doesn't instigate fear, invade countries and create global tension


----------



## aslacker55 (Apr 18, 2007)

QUOTE(Azimuth @ Apr 17 2007 said:


> Iraq is a different situation, a hostile occupation will always be met with resistance. I don't mean to digress, but last time I checked Iraq is a war zone, it is expected that there is a lot of hatred and death happening on both sides
> 
> The rest of the world doesn't want "death to America" and all that, they just want a better foreign policy that doesn't instigate fear, invade countries and create global tension



Why do they have anti-American rallies that promotes hate to America in Iran, Jordan, Malaysia, and other places around the world. Why don't any other country step up to the plate and police the world and fight terrorism. Nobody else want to do it, because they are afraid of the backlash like America is experiencing.


----------



## skullstatue (Apr 18, 2007)

Because we are in Iraq for oil, plain and simple. Sorry, our country cares more about making money than human lives (thank big business).


----------



## aslacker55 (Apr 18, 2007)

QUOTE(skullstatue @ Apr 17 2007 said:


> Because we are in Iraq for oil, plain and simple. Sorry, our country cares more about making money than human lives (thank big business).



That's an ignorant comment, most of the oil that America buys comes from Saudi Arabia, not Iraq.


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## Taras (Apr 18, 2007)

QUOTE(jaxxster @ Apr 18 2007 said:


> thats only welsh people who molest sheep but still that was a really immature response *clap clap*



I know, but I'm tired of hearing about it. Switzerland has mandated firearms ownership per household as I understand and this doesn't happen there. Hi-capacity firearms have existed for decades, but mass shootings are a recent phenomenon. It's not the guns, it's not video games, it's not rap music, it's not violence on TV and it's not consumption of trans-fats.

So sanctimonious foreigners (not you personally, I don't think) it's fine you don't approve and you don't have to. Just keep those brie-eating, snaggle-toothed, champagne-swilling, soccer-discussing gobs shut about it. Thank you kindly.


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## Taras (Apr 18, 2007)

QUOTE(aslacker55 @ Apr 18 2007 said:


> QUOTE(skullstatue @ Apr 17 2007 said:
> 
> 
> > Because we are in Iraq for oil, plain and simple. Sorry, our country cares more about making money than human lives (thank big business).
> ...



Actually he's right. By simply taking Iraqi oil off the market (which effectively happened), it increased the cost of existing oil supplies all over. Look who is posting record profits.


----------



## Azimuth (Apr 18, 2007)

QUOTE(aslacker55 @ Apr 18 2007 said:


> QUOTE(skullstatue @ Apr 17 2007 said:
> 
> 
> > Because we are in Iraq for oil, plain and simple. Sorry, our country cares more about making money than human lives (thank big business).
> ...



No offence, but whats more ignorant, you assuming that america should police the world and fight "terrorism" or this guy who has some reason for stating this.Iraq does have the 2nd largest oil reserves in the world after all.

Also 9/11 had nothing to do with Iraq, so I don't see any relevance to terrorism, if you are talking about "insurgents" then what were you expecting to "liberate" Iraq and not face any resistance.

And the reason America is shunned is because of this unjust war, the way they treat prisoners and all the lies used to cover up the mistakes made not to mention the hundreds of thousands of civilian deaths that could have been avoided. 

With all the anti-war protest you would think something would have been done already.


----------



## aslacker55 (Apr 18, 2007)

QUOTE(Taras @ Apr 17 2007 said:


> QUOTE(aslacker55 @ Apr 18 2007 said:
> 
> 
> > QUOTE(skullstatue @ Apr 17 2007 said:
> ...



He doesn't speak for the American people, when he says our country is there for oil, that was not the truth. Do you even remember the whole UN inspectors ordeal in Iraq back then. 

Also who's killing the innocent civilians in Iraq, it's not the US, it's the insurgance in Iraq that doing the killing.


----------



## Azimuth (Apr 18, 2007)

well who started this mess, its like the US came in pissed off everyone and now abolishes its responsibility over the whole matter.

so you are justifying a war by saying that Iraq refused to show you there weapons. Hmm why not attack Iran or North Korea then. What happened when you did search for WMDs? And if that was your mission, to save us all from WMDs then why are you still there? And please don't give me the whole 'we are bringing democracy to these people' speech, they don't want you there, I think its quite clear.


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## aslacker55 (Apr 18, 2007)

QUOTE(Azimuth @ Apr 17 2007 said:


> well who started this mess, its like the US came in pissed off everyone and now abolishes its responsibility over the whole matter.



Do you even remember the whole UN inspectors ordeal in Iraq back then. We gave Iraq an Ultimatum, Either let the inspectors do their jobs or prepare for a war. They decided to go to war with us instead.


----------



## Taras (Apr 18, 2007)

QUOTE(aslacker55 @ Apr 18 2007 said:


> QUOTE(Taras @ Apr 17 2007 said:
> 
> 
> > QUOTE(aslacker55 @ Apr 18 2007 said:
> ...



Yes, I remember Hans Blix saying they probably didn't have WMDs. I remember evidence being tenuous at best. I remember the Bush administration setting up new departments to bypass the CIA in order to beat the drums for war. I remember them being called on false Nigerian yellow cake documents (and retaliating against Plame as a result). And I remember the justification for the war subsequently changing three times 1st WMDs that didn't turn up, 2nd Al Queda and Nine eleven ties which didn't exist and finally because "Well, we needed to depose a filthy dictator. And at the end of it all, what do we have? A fortress in the green zone surrounded by carnage everywhere where John McCain can't walk fifty feet without a hundred troops and six gunships to keep him safe.


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## aslacker55 (Apr 18, 2007)

QUOTE(Taras @ Apr 17 2007 said:


> Yes, I remember Hans Blix saying they probably didn't have WMDs. I remember evidence being tenuous at best. I remember the Bush administration setting up new departments to bypass the CIA in order to beat the drums for war. I remember them being called on false Nigerian yellow cake documents (and retaliating against Plame as a result). And I remember the justification for the war subsequently changing three times 1st WMDs that didn't turn up, 2nd Al Queda and Nine eleven ties which didn't exist and finally because "Well, we needed to depose a filthy dictator. And at the end of it all, what do we have? A fortress in the green zone surrounded by carnage everywhere where John McCain can't walk fifty feet without a hundred troops and six gunships to keep him safe.



We went to war far before that.


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## Azimuth (Apr 18, 2007)

QUOTE(aslacker55 @ Apr 18 2007 said:


> QUOTE(Azimuth @ Apr 17 2007 said:
> 
> 
> > well who started this mess, its like the US came in pissed off everyone and now abolishes its responsibility over the whole matter.
> ...



Yup like the back of my hand, Bush kept bitching, UN said that there was probably no WMDs, America made up some intelligence, bombed baghdad. Searched for WMDs, none found, so what now?

And US isn't the personal backup of the UN, if they had refused there were more peaceful courses of action the UN could have applied. It was merely an excuse to attack, whats happening now in Iran or N.Korea is far worse


----------



## Taras (Apr 18, 2007)

QUOTE(aslacker55 @ Apr 18 2007 said:


> We went to war far before that.



You seem to be in favor of mid-East peace and whatnot, so haved you enlisted yet?


----------



## aslacker55 (Apr 18, 2007)

QUOTE(Azimuth @ Apr 17 2007 said:


> QUOTE(aslacker55 @ Apr 18 2007 said:
> 
> 
> > QUOTE(Azimuth @ Apr 17 2007 said:
> ...



If they were not hiding anything, why didn't they want the U.N. inspectors( not American) do their jobs. If they had let them do their job, the war would have never happened.


----------



## aslacker55 (Apr 18, 2007)

QUOTE(Taras @ Apr 17 2007 said:


> QUOTE(aslacker55 @ Apr 18 2007 said:
> 
> 
> > We went to war far before that.
> ...



Retired US Army soldier served during the 9/11 and the Iraq war. Was a Nuclear Biological Chemical Specialist(NBC NCO).


----------



## Azimuth (Apr 18, 2007)

QUOTE(aslacker55 @ Apr 18 2007 said:


> If they were not hiding anything, why didn't they want the U.N. inspectors( not American) do their jobs. If they had let them do their job, the war would have never happened.



Hmm, invade, check for WMDs, then LEAVE!

not so hard is it. There was no need to falsify evidence and make up some crap just to invade a country.

And I don't think using tomahawk missiles is very peaceful is it, what was the estimate of civilians killed in the first attack on baghdad?

However you justify this war, it is still shrouded in lies, deceit and general corruption and much could have been done to avoid war, isnt war the last option, I guess it isnt for the Bush administration, Shoot first ask questions later.


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## jtroye32 (Apr 18, 2007)

This isn't some national/global violence debate or gun control debate. This is about some guy that lost it emotionally/mentally and decided to kill a bunch of people. If he didn't have guns he would have made bombs, end of discussion.


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## aslacker55 (Apr 18, 2007)

QUOTE(Azimuth @ Apr 17 2007 said:


> QUOTE(aslacker55 @ Apr 18 2007 said:
> 
> 
> > If they were not hiding anything, why didn't they want the U.N. inspectors( not American) do their jobs. If they had let them do their job, the war would have never happened.
> ...



Your timeline is off, the inspectors did the inspections after the war. We are in the process of rebuilding the country and establishing a government, but they are not allowing us to rebuild it. I was there, I know what happened.


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## imgod22222 (Apr 18, 2007)

If you kill everyone, there wont be anyone to oppose you! Sorta my view on the world. If they want to kill you, kill them in self preservation. If they're cool , then don't do anything.


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## thegame07 (Apr 18, 2007)

I cant even read this thread it really annoys me. I dont care if your from india iraq canada or whatever your still a person.Lets just make a example for instance a young iraq muslim does not want to be a suicide bomber just because hes from iraq. Now come on people stop talking about where he is from thats not a factor. Just because your from a certain nation does not mean you want to kill people. Another point because someone is muslim does not mean their from the middle east. Enough with the foreigner talk also the world s free place people should be allowed to stay where they want.


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## lolsjoel (Apr 18, 2007)

QUOTE(thegame07 @ Apr 18 2007 said:


> I cant even read this thread it really annoys me. I dont care if your from india iraq canada or whatever your still a person.Lets just make a example for instance a young iraq muslim does not want to be a suicide bomber just because hes from iraq. Now come on people stop talking about where he is from thats not a factor. Just because your from a certain nation does not mean you want to kill people. Another point because someone is muslim does not mean their from the middle east. Enough with the foreigner talk also the world s free place people should be allowed to stay where they want.



Here here!  
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





FUCK racism and prejudice.


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## imgod22222 (Apr 18, 2007)

QUOTE(Tanas @ Apr 16 2007 said:


> This is the 19th school shooting in 10 years.
> 
> America is so fucked up...


Think of it this way. thats 2 schools per year out of like, a million schools? Half a million?
Anyways, today i just found out about "colum-bine." Heck do i know how its spelt, but thats how i pronounce it (or at least the ppl who told me)

Not really sure if this belongs in this thread, but since it is in the 'offtopic' part of the forum i really wanted to say this, since it really surprised me. A new person moved into the neighborhood. His name is Akmed. That is THE most stereotypical person i know now, and i know alot of stereotypical jews.


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## Azimuth (Apr 18, 2007)

QUOTE(aslacker55 @ Apr 18 2007 said:


> Your timeline is off, the inspectors did the inspections after the war. We are in the process of rebuilding the country and establishing a government, but they are not allowing us to rebuild it. I was there, I know what happened.



As rightfully you should, you destroyed it and sent the country into chaos. Maybe they want to rebuild their country and setup a government thats independent from what America wants it to be, have you thought of that, maybe give them back some dignity.

Enough hating and hijacking this thread, war is bad, and I wish this whole thing ends well, arguing now will not change the past. Sorry to anyone I may have offended.


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## thegame07 (Apr 18, 2007)

im really pissed the way the world works. My family met a very friendly African family 4 years ago. The women we met then had two kids now these two kids are like my little sister or even my daughters to me. Now the they have been given letters saying they are not allowed to stay in Britain anymore. So now im going to lose my family because of the stupid uk government what gives the british government the right to tell who stays and goes. Once you make friends with these so called "foreigner" maybe some of you arrogant people will relise it doesn't matter what your skin colour is or where your from.


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## cruddybuddy (Apr 18, 2007)

You folks should be thanking the U.S. for offering to be the target of hate in the world. With the Islamic Jihadists focused on Americans, you can go on living happy lives.

"America Lite" should be thanking the U.S.A. especially.


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## aslacker55 (Apr 18, 2007)

QUOTE(Azimuth @ Apr 17 2007 said:


> Enough hating and hijacking this thread, war is bad, and I wish this whole thing ends well, arguing now will not change the past. Sorry to anyone I may have offended.



I agree with you on that. I extend to you my hand, ask you bury the hatchet, and end this quarrel. Are you man enough to accept my offer, like I accepted your apology earlier.


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## BoneMonkey (Apr 18, 2007)

Get over it pussies they are people dieing all over the world in larger numbers 

a kid with a gun goes nuts and goes on a killing spree thats all that happened 

and what is with the american bashing in this thread ???? this kid ISNT EVEN FROM AMERICA ! 

but what pissies me off the most are the people who compare there crappy situations with what happned at virgina tech 



QUOTE(thegame07 @ Apr 17 2007 said:


> im really pissed the way the world works. My family met a very friendly African family 4 years ago. The women we met then had two kids now these two kids are like my little sister or even my daughters to me. Now the they have been given letters saying they are not allowed to stay in Britain anymore. So now im going to lose my family because of the stupid uk government what gives the british government the right to tell who stays and goes. Once you make friends with these so called "foreigner" maybe some of you arrogant people will relise it doesn't matter what your skin colour is or where your from.



ARE YOU FUCKING KIDDING ME ??? how is your story related to this and i GUARENTEE THE COLOR of THERE skin had nothing to do with it your leaving alot out of your story and to tell you the truth who fucken cares... play your race card somewhere else 

infact i bet if we kept immigrants out of america we would be safer 

YES we are a nation of immigrants but guess what WERE FULL !


and of course a big FUCK YOU to all you america haters if it werent for us you would all be speaking german sucking adolf's dick!


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## thegame07 (Apr 18, 2007)

I guess you didn't read all of the posts 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 im not going to argue with you. there no point bye.


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## Azimuth (Apr 18, 2007)

QUOTE(aslacker55 @ Apr 18 2007 said:


> QUOTE(Azimuth @ Apr 17 2007 said:
> 
> 
> > Enough hating and hijacking this thread, war is bad, and I wish this whole thing ends well, arguing now will not change the past. Sorry to anyone I may have offended.
> ...



I accept your offer, it takes a man to apologize, and a bigger man to make peace


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## mthrnite (Apr 18, 2007)

Jesuz cripes! You people wanna maybe get back on topic or what?

I leave for a few hours and come back to this?

Just what does the Iraq war have to do with some nutball snapping and taking out a bunch of students?

Did I miss something?

Oh, hello jtroye32!



QUOTE(jtroye32 @ Apr 17 2007 said:


> This isn't some national/global violence debate or gun control debate. This is about some guy that lost it emotionally/mentally and decided to kill a bunch of people. If he didn't have guns he would have made bombs, end of discussion.



Thank you!


----------



## aslacker55 (Apr 18, 2007)

QUOTE(Azimuth @ Apr 17 2007 said:


> I accept your offer, it takes a man to apologize, and a bigger man to make peaceÂ



Peace my temper brother. Let's have a drink


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## Heran Bago (Apr 18, 2007)

QUOTE(sgadzookie80 @ Apr 17 2007 said:


> ARE YOU FUCKING KIDDING ME ??? how is your related to this and i GUARENTEE THE COLOR of THERE skin had nothing to do with it your leaving alot out of your story and to tell you the truth who fucken cares... play your race card somewhere else
> 
> and of course a big FUCK YOU to all you america haters if it werent for us you would all be speaking german sucking adolf's dick!


You're pretty much right on the first point. This is the first time a Korean guy's gone on a spree. Big racial breakthrough for asians there. Mindless rage knows no race.  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




You don't make Americans sound any better or smarter though. Maybe there's a good reason other countries dislike our craaaazy government and their policy of global domination.


Really you guys. Just because our government sucks atm doesn't mean we're all retarded, just a lot of us.  :'( 
There was a shooting in Canada not too long ago too...


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## Azimuth (Apr 18, 2007)

how the hell did this topic change to the Iraq war and become 13 pages, I guess its partly my fault 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




@sgadzookie80, whats up your ass, just because someone is critical of your government doesn't mean they hate all Americans. Its not like Steven Harper is doing a great job either.


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## thegame07 (Apr 18, 2007)

sgadzookie80 thats a insult to all the people who fought in the war. Dont forget Britain, france, Russia. Dont forget the other countries were they countries just fighting for nothing? Remember america didn't help untill later on in the war. However america was part just like the other countries now dont act like it was just because of america the war was won.


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## BoneMonkey (Apr 18, 2007)

QUOTE(thegame07 @ Apr 17 2007 said:


> sgadzookie80 thats a insult to all the people who fought in the war. Dont forget Britain, france, Russia. Dont forget the other countries where they countries just fighting for nothing? Remember america didn't help untill later on in the war. However america was part just like the other countries now dont act like it was just because of america the war was won.



You dont know history 

Britian was holding but would have lost the war eventually FRANCE ?? are you kidding me ?? they surrendered lol and do you know why ?

to spare there art .....................

all the other countries pretty much fell or would have eventually

and we didnt care the only reason we went over and fought was we were afraid to take the war on our shores


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## aslacker55 (Apr 18, 2007)

Everyone please calm down, let's stop pointing fingers. We did prove one thing in this thread; that as a human race we have a long way to go.


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## thegame07 (Apr 18, 2007)

Nevermind


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## BoneMonkey (Apr 18, 2007)

rofl


----------



## celentt (Apr 18, 2007)




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## jtroye32 (Apr 18, 2007)

QUOTE(mthrnite @ Apr 17 2007 said:


> Jesuz cripes! You people wanna maybe get back on topic or what?
> 
> I leave for a few hours and come back to this?
> 
> ...



np, just trying to get back on topic


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## MaHe (Apr 18, 2007)

Just for the reference: The dude may be Korean, but he was living in the United States since he was a kid. That pretty much makes him an American, huh?

Completely unrelated - I'm disgusted by moves of the American government
and the attitude of certain Americans (I don't hate Americans as people, mind you!). Why the hell do they have to mess with nations across the world? Well, the official statements claim that they want to establish peace in certain countries. But as we all know (god, this sound so cliché), fighting for peace is like screwing for virginity. It's all about maintaining the power.
Let's take a look at some examples:

Vietnam - officially, it was a war against communism (by the way, I'd rather be a Communist that a Republican).  But quite obviously, they never dared to invade Cuba and Cuba never did any harm to the States. Is communism really so harmful for America? Let's just remember how many civilians were killed by the American soldiers (a lot more than by Vietcong -- Tiger Force, anyone?).

Kuwait - USA gave Hussein the weapons and power to make Iraq a powerful country in the Middle-East and give Hussein the power to remain a dictator. But, guess WHO was the one trying to remove Hussein from that position 15 years later? Wow, being a hypocrite is good now?

And I could continue with Yugoslavia, Afghanistan, etc ...
We all know Iraq and Saudi Arabia have the most of the oil fields in the world, that there were no weapons of mass destruction and it's just as bloody now, after Saddam is gone. Bloodier even. Why deny it?

America is the most powerful country in the world, but power corrupts.
And that's what I like about living in a small country nobody ever heard of before. Just my 5 cents. Don't be offended.


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## alucard77 (Apr 18, 2007)

Well, every single country of government is corrupt.  It is easier to point the fingure and accuse bigger countries as they are a bigger target.  When America does something it is considered bad.  When they don't do something it is considered bad.  You really can't win in those cases.

You really must not focus in on the countries, but focus in on the corporations.  They are responsible for most wars, and civil upheaval.  The big countries of the world get corrupt by these corporations.  The US is a prime example.  However, Russia before it was the same.  China already has the stink of corruption.  It's more important to focus on what is causing the country to be corrupt and not the country itself.

As for Republicans, you should not so easily judge.  The fact of the matter is that all party's are equally bad.  I for one am a Repulican, but not a modern day Republican.  The Republican party believes in no government intervention in the lives of it's citizens.  No over taxation and no over spending.

The Bush administration has gone against all of these core fundemental believes.  The problem is that no politician has a back bone to fight back for what they believe.  They are full of corporate money and wan to keep their chairs in the Senate or the Congress.  So don't be so quick to point the fingure at Republicans only.  I would point the fingure at all politicians.

As for the shootings in VT,  the fact is, this can never be controlled.  I know many people will think this is messed up, but if you want this to be controlled every person needs to carry a gun.  So if one person goes pyscho, the rest of the people around this person are not left helpless.  That is as much of an answer as anything.  It's not a good one, but there never is a solution to this type of insanity.


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## alucard77 (Apr 18, 2007)

I was just reading back on all the America bashing.  The only reason this country pisses me off at the moment, is because of idiots who believe that really simple concepts will solve the worlds problems.  I know most of you are still in school and idealistic, but get in the real world and then speak.

First off, getting rid of guns won't solve anything.  Whenever you take something away, there will always be some one who will be able to provide it.  Let me put this in an easy way.  I bet a lot of you smoke weed.  Well weed is illegal right?  Did you still manage to get the weed?  Well guess what, something that is illegal and not sold in stores can still be purchased.

If you are a pyscho, you will still get your hands on a gun.  I wish people would just think.  It's like the whole, fast food makes people fat, so let's sue the fast food industry.  Or Don Imus said something racist on radio, so let's go after everyone who uses the word ho in a song and make sure they don't use those words anymore.  

Come on, this is a free country.  The problem is that people don't take ANY RESPONSIBILITY for their own actions.  If your fat, stop eating and excercise.  You know that McDonald's is fattening.  If you don't then your a moron, and you need to go back and learn to read.  Our civil liberaties are already infringed upon already.

Do you really want 1 pycho to set the rules for a who civilization?  That's the direction America is going in.  Hopefully people wake up before we end up being a communist state, or a dictatorship.


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## Veho (Apr 18, 2007)

My condolences to families and friends of those lost in this tragedy. 

And regarding this discussion.
Knock it off. It's not just America, it's the entire world. 

There's lunatics everywhere. Nobody seems to do anything. This was supposed to be a warning. The last shooting was supposed to be a warning. And the one before that. And the one before. And the incidents in Japan. And in France. And the recent one in England. And all over the world, but there aren't that many TV stations over there to report it on a global scale. 

It's not about America, or about Korea (or about Iraq; how quickly do discussions slip towards it, simply amazing), and it definitely isn't about World War 2, despite the posts on that subject, for some reason. 

This _will_ happen again, in _your_ neighbourhood. Mental illness isn't exclusive to America. The world is sick. It has _always_ been sick. But now we aren't limited to wooden clubs. Now we have guns. One man can kill dozens. How do we stop it?


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## mikeosoft (Apr 18, 2007)

wow i'm disgraced to be a GBAtemp member after reading through these pages. i can't believe the hate you all put out.  If you all hate my country, that's fine, but for hells sake, keep it to yourself, or open another goddamn thread.  I lost a buddy in this, hell i don't even know where to start.  The goddamn media turns this into a bigger than life incident which in turn causes mass hatred in Americans.  i just don't understand this.  

You all, americans, europeans, whoever, get a life and stop watching televised news, instead read some grassroots internet news or read the new york times.  And for hells sake, all you non-americans who use this thread to bash american laws, you don't live in America, you don't reside in Virginia, and you sure as fuck don't go to Virginia Tech.  You never tried to purchase a gun in America, you didn't know this kid or anyone who died, so why the hell do you all of a sudden have some great statement or point with any bit of validity whatsoever. Why? Is it because you saw the video on cnn.com, or worse did you get your facts rom friends or family?

Why don't you use your brain for a second and think about those 30 Americans who died and if they read this 14 pages what they would feel?  I'll tell you for sure, in those 14 pages that you don't offer any condolences besides a few Americans.  My buddy James is gone and what do I, as an American, College Student, friend, and fellow school mate feel about this, ill tell you first off, I sure as hell don't blame America.



			
				QUOTE said:
			
		

> Several students and professors described Cho as a sullen loner. Authorities said he left a rambling note raging against women and rich kids. News reports said that Cho, a 23-year-old senior majoring in English, may have been taking medication for depression and that he was becoming increasingly erratic.
> 
> Professors and classmates were alarmed by his class writings -- pages filled with twisted, violence-drenched writing.
> 
> ...



Quote from the Boston Metro


Now I'm more than angry that this thread has been construed and used as a means to voice politically stubborn and racist ideologies about America, but i'm even more mad that you all have forgotten what this thread was about: 29 innocent deaths

RIP James  "Jimbo" Sully


----------



## MaHe (Apr 18, 2007)

mikeosoft: I agree completely, but as Opium stated - 50 people, innocent people died the previous day in Iraq. :/
Also, I'm sorry for your loss. I know you're more concerned about your friend that people you don't know. Should read your post better.


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## BoneMonkey (Apr 18, 2007)

CLOSE THIS THREAD 

its just becoming a american bashing thread now from the ignorant


----------



## THeLL (Apr 18, 2007)

QUOTE(MaHe @ Apr 18 2007 said:


> mikeosoft: I agree completely, but as Opium stated - 50 people, innocent people died the previous day in Iraq. :/
> Also, I'm sorry for your loss. I know you're more concerned about your friend that people you don't know. Should read your post better.
> 
> 
> ...



Why can't we have express our opinion? Don't like critism on your country?


----------



## aslacker55 (Apr 18, 2007)

QUOTE(THeLL @ Apr 18 2007 said:


> QUOTE(MaHe @ Apr 18 2007 said:
> 
> 
> > mikeosoft: I agree completely, but as Opium stated - 50 people, innocent people died the previous day in Iraq. :/
> ...



The problem is that this thread was used in order to fan the flames of hate for America. You're government is no better than mine, as my government no better than yours. I am one of the reason why this thread has become like this and I'm sorry, but not once did I say anything bad about another country. Like Azimuth and I, we had  different points of views and we came to the conclusion that it's better to make peace with each other. None of us here are politicians, we have no control of our governments. Everybody is patriotic about their country, no one is to blame.

To mikeosoft, I'm sorry for your loss and condolences to all that lost their love ones and friends. Lets put it to rest everybody, Let's agree to disagree. We're all no better, each one of us have fallen for the trap of hate. I extend my hand out to all my temper brothers and ask everyone to put aside your differences. Maybe we can do one thing here that the world can't do, let's make peace here. Thank you


----------



## Xeijin (Apr 18, 2007)

QUOTE(Taras @ Apr 18 2007 said:


> QUOTE(jaxxster @ Apr 18 2007 said:
> 
> 
> > thats only welsh people who molest sheep but still that was a really immature response *clap clap*
> ...



Your opinions are your own, as are mine, but are the immature comments really necessary. It really degrades what is a valid argument. There are a million stereotypes I could apply to American citizens, some alot more offensive and generalised than the ones you just mentioned but I find that when you do, people begin to detect just a hint of sour grapes.


----------



## BoneMonkey (Apr 18, 2007)

QUOTE(THeLL @ Apr 18 2007 said:


> QUOTE(MaHe @ Apr 18 2007 said:
> 
> 
> > mikeosoft: I agree completely, but as Opium stated - 50 people, innocent people died the previous day in Iraq. :/
> ...



NO what i hate is a double standard if i were to start a thread and say I HATE MUSLIMS MUSLIMS SUCK it would be closed and i would be banned ! 

yet its ok to bash americans ?


----------



## aslacker55 (Apr 18, 2007)

Please read my message and let's stop this hating.


			
				QUOTE said:
			
		

> The problem is that this thread was used in order to fan the flames of hate for America. You're government is no better than mine, as my government no better than yours. I am one of the reason why this thread has become like this and I'm sorry, but not once did I say anything bad about another country. Like Azimuth and I, we hadÂ different points of views and we came to the conclusion that it's better to make peace with each other. None of us here are politicians, we have no control of our governments. Everybody is patriotic about their country, no one is to blame.
> 
> To mikeosoft, I'm sorry for your loss and condolences to all that lost their love ones and friends. Lets put it to rest everybody, Let's agree to disagree. We're all no better, each one of us have fallen for the trap of hate. I extend my hand out to all my temper brothers and ask everyone to put aside your differences. Maybe we can do one thing here that the world can't do, let's make peace here. Thank you


----------



## alucard77 (Apr 18, 2007)

First I must say, this thread is about what Mikeosoft the fact that people died.  It is insensitive for anyone to say who died in Iraq or anywhere else in the world, when Mikeosoft personal friend died.  Not a news report about some people none of us here met.  Imagine the person you grew up next to died.  Try to put that in perspective.

Secondly, I think it's ironic that we fight and argue against each other based our goverments believes.  Do you have the same moral structures as your neighbors.  Do you always agree with everything that your friends agree with?  No, I doubt it.  I think everyone disagrees with everyone's own personal government.  So don't go bashing any countries government, when most likely your is flawed to.  You are not your government.  You don't need to increase the hate and anger.

As for anti-americanism.  I just want to share a little story with you guys about a soldier I know.  He was positioned in Bosnia, during the time the Serbs began to do mass slaughterings of the Muslims in that area.  His responsibility as a US soldier was to keep the peace, and stop the genicide of the Muslim race.  While he was there, 9/11 happened.  And the world turned on it's head.  Fast forward some time, and you have my friend station in Bosnia for nothing.  At this point, the Serbs and the Muslims were both attacking the American soldiers.  The same person you saved less then a year ago is trying to kill you today.  Think about that for a second before deciding America and all American's are evil SOBs.  Don't be so quick to pass judgement.


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## Lazycus (Apr 18, 2007)

Thanks for everyone's posts to this thread.  You have answered the topic question perfectly!  The ignorance and arrogance from posters from all over the world is here.  Every country on the earth has their fair share of idiots who love to point fingers and attack others based on whatever beliefs they have.  Some commit individual acts to eliminate/harm others.  Some rise to positions of power and eliminate/harm others in the millions.  To see what is truly wrong with this world you need look no further than this GBAtemp thread.  Cheers 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 to all those that posted and have shown that idiocy is truly a global phenomenon.


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## alucard77 (Apr 18, 2007)

QUOTE(Lazycus @ Apr 18 2007 said:


> Thanks for everyone's posts to this thread.Â You have answered the topic question perfectly!Â The ignorance and arrogance from posters from all over the world is here.Â Every country on the earth has their fair share of idiots who love to point fingers and attack others based on whatever beliefs they have.Â Some commit individual acts to eliminate/harm others.Â Some rise to positions of power and eliminate/harm others in the millions.Â To see what is truly wrong with this world you need look no further than this GBAtemp thread.Â Cheers
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Here here... total agreement.  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




If we all did more  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




  then  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




  this world would be a better place.


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## amptor (Apr 18, 2007)

For those of you who don't know, America is a business.  And if something goes wrong, they do whatever is in their power to fix it.  Even if it means screwing over someone's life.  Some day I might move to Canada, people here make me sick.  But for the time being, I just reap some of the benefits and wait to figure out where I want to be and stay away from these idiots in government power.

The people who are doing the most good are the ones who are taught to believe in freedom and upholding peace.  Those are the ones you see fighting in Iraq and other overseas nations, but a lot of them are very brainwashed and blindfolded from the truth.  At least it gets the job done, trying to maintain peace..but they do teach them to hate Arabs and more than likely some other nationalities.  I don't agree with that part but it gets things moving in the right direction anyway.

Personally I don't agree with going into Iraq and I didn't agree with that to begin with.  America is not suppose to be about revenge, but look where this led us.  I think we will have another dipshit republican president again (also bush has proven that there is virtually no such thing as check and balances).  The reason why I say this is because nobody's going to allow a woman or a black to be president (even though we could benefit from having a woman or a black, depends on how they behave in office I mean nobody wants an extremist for president).  Well anyway watch how the next election goes and watch a republican jack up your gas prices more and get more americans as well as iraqi killed.


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## rest0re (Apr 19, 2007)

but blacks vote for democrats


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## THeLL (Apr 19, 2007)

QUOTE(amptor @ Apr 18 2007 said:


> For those of you who don't know, America is a business.Â And if something goes wrong, they do whatever is in their power to fix it.Â Even if it means screwing over someone's life.Â Some day I might move to Canada, people here make me sick.Â But for the time being, I just reap some of the benefits and wait to figure out where I want to be and stay away from these idiots in government power.
> 
> The people who are doing the most good are the ones who are taught to believe in freedom and upholding peace.Â Those are the ones you see fighting in Iraq and other overseas nations, but a lot of them are very brainwashed and blindfolded from the truth.Â At least it gets the job done, trying to maintain peace..but they do teach them to hate Arabs and more than likely some other nationalities.Â I don't agree with that part but it gets things moving in the right direction anyway.
> 
> Personally I don't agree with going into Iraq and I didn't agree with that to begin with.Â America is not suppose to be about revenge, but look where this led us.Â I think we will have another dipshit republican president again (also bush has proven that there is virtually no such thing as check and balances).Â The reason why I say this is because nobody's going to allow a woman or a black to be president (even though we could benefit from having a woman or a black, depends on how they behave in office I mean nobody wants an extremist for president).Â Well anyway watch how the next election goes and watch a republican jack up your gas prices more and get more americans as well as iraqi killed.




I totally agree with this. I was flabbergasted that Bush actually got re-elected in the first place. (who voted for him and WHY, WHYYY??? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 )  All this patriotism talk and his additute of ‘the US is the best and greatest country in the world’ may be good to win votes in the US but the rest of the world, including here, really got a began to hate Bush (and because of that the US). 
Why is he doing like this? The US isn’t the great country anymore, just face it.


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## Opium (Apr 19, 2007)

QUOTE(alucard77 @ Apr 19 2007 said:


> First I must say, this thread is about what Mikeosoft the fact that people died.Â *It is insensitive for anyone to say who died in Iraq or anywhere else in the world, when Mikeosoft personal friend died. Not a news report about some people none of us here met.*Â Imagine the person you grew up next to died.Â Try to put that in perspective.



It's bloody sad either way but really, I don't know Mikeosoft's friend do I? How it is different for me personally from someone else who died that I also don't know?

No disrespect meant, this is a horrific incident and all the lives lost were a senseless waste. But these are 32 deaths in an overseas country shooting. On the same page 45 people died in bomb blasts in another overseas country too. Both are tragic, senseless wastes.

*EDIT* Jesus, I just saw on the news over 150 people were killed today in a blast in a Baghdad market. But it was late in the news bulletin as per usual. For some reason people care less about it......the shootings in the US were still number one.


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## alucard77 (Apr 19, 2007)

QUOTE(Opium @ Apr 19 2007 said:


> QUOTE(alucard77 @ Apr 19 2007 said:
> 
> 
> > First I must say, this thread is about what Mikeosoft the fact that people died.  *It is insensitive for anyone to say who died in Iraq or anywhere else in the world, when Mikeosoft personal friend died. Not a news report about some people none of us here met.*  Imagine the person you grew up next to died.  Try to put that in perspective.
> ...



That's easy.  It is because people are sick of the war.  Any act of violence in Iraq is shown as losing the war.  So this bit of information is usually put towards the end of the news reports.  When a shooting like the one in the US occures, it is occuring in "peaceful" country.  So if it can happen in the US, it can happen anywhere type of thing.  Iraq is looked at under the circumstances it is under.  There are hundreds of thousands of people killed or allowed to die in Africa every year.  This shodows all the deaths in the rest of the world combined, and do you see any of it on the news?  The only reason you see Iraq stuff on the news is because of the war.  If there was no war, and the bombings continued to occure, noone would give a crap.

Wait and see what happens in Iraq when we pull out.  There will be a genocide occuring and nothing on the news.


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## suppachipmunk (Apr 19, 2007)

My sympathy goes out to those friends and families of the victims.

This was a horrible incident.  The dude was obviously insane.  He was declared mentally unstable in 2005.  Yet since he was sent to a VOLUNTARY (BS) hospital, it was not recorded, and therefore he could buy his guns.  As an American citizen, I would like to see some stricter gun laws, for my own safety as well.  Being in college is hard enough without the threat of a gunman shooting me down.

Did they ever reveal why he did this, other than the fact that he had some ordeal with rich kids???


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## Veho (Apr 20, 2007)

This was a tragedy. But an even greater tragedy is that this isn't an isolated incident. This will happen again. And not only in America. America doesn't have the exclusive rights to lunatics. It can happen anywhere. 

And what is worse: media have shown us that this is the best way to be heard, to bring your message to the general public, to achieve immortality. News networks aired his photos, read his letter. Everyone knows his face. In a year or so, no one but the families and friends will remember the victims, but the whole world will remember the murderer. And this will give incentive to other lunatics.

In my opinion, news networks shouldn't have aired his letter. They should have handed it over to the police, profilers, psychologists, people who know how to learn something from it, to prevent it happening again. If nothing else, then out of respect for the victims. _He does not deserve to be heard._ 

This way they told every other lunatic in the world: "If you want the whole world to listen to you, kill somebody."


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