# PlayStation 4 report suggest price over $400



## Deleted_171835 (Feb 7, 2013)

> The PlayStation 4 will launch this year for over 40,000 yen (about $428), according to a report in major Japanese daily the _Asahi Shimbun_. That's the first clear indication we've gotten on how much the new system might cost.
> 
> Finally, the _Asahi Shimbun_ states in no uncertain terms that February 20th is the date when we'll hear all this information confirmed for real.


http://www.theverge.com/2013/2/6/3961512/ps4-price-and-release-date-in-asahi-shimbun-report

$599 US DOLLARS!


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## Guild McCommunist (Feb 7, 2013)

It'll probably bump down to $399 for everywhere else (which is a reasonable launch price).


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## chyyran (Feb 7, 2013)

Spoiler: I believe this is appropriate








If it's more than $400, then I'm definitely getting a WiiU first. Ugh. Why must my wallet suffer so..? Guess we'll see on the 20th..

It can be anywhere from $399-$499, most likely $449 IMO. Not $599 US Dollars, but still a substantial amount.


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## KingVamp (Feb 7, 2013)

^

They can be doing that again, could they?


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## Guild McCommunist (Feb 7, 2013)

$428 = $599?

Oh right, I forgot about the exchange rates from USD to stupidity.


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## Deleted_171835 (Feb 7, 2013)

Guild McCommunist said:


> $428 = $599?
> 
> Oh right, I forgot about the exchange rates from USD to stupidity.


_*"Over."*_


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## Guild McCommunist (Feb 7, 2013)

soulx said:


> _*"Over."*_


 
It's "over $400" converted from yen but it'll probably go down to $399. That was the launch price of the Xbox 360 last time I checked and it's a reasonable launch price if the hardware is truly next gen.


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## chyyran (Feb 7, 2013)

Oh lord, will this turn out to be another Guild vs soulx thread?



Guild McCommunist said:


> It's "over $400" converted from yen but it'll probably go down to $399. That was the launch price of the Xbox 360 last time I checked and it's a reasonable launch price if the hardware is truly next gen.


TBH, I thought that "$599 US DOLLARS!" line was a joke. It probably will go from $399-$499 though, like I said before.


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## Deleted_171835 (Feb 7, 2013)

Guild McCommunist said:


> It's "over $400" converted from yen but it'll probably go down to $399. That was the launch price of the Xbox 360 last time I checked and it's a reasonable launch price if the hardware is truly next gen.


The launch core 360 was also gimped as fuck.


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## KingVamp (Feb 7, 2013)

Guild McCommunist said:


> $428 = $599?
> 
> Oh right, I forgot about the exchange rates from USD to stupidity.


While $599 was just a joke, that was pretty funny.

I couldn't get it for that price anyway. Maybe in 3 years.
I hope it as has stable backwards capability and that these rumors aren't true.


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## wolfmanz51 (Feb 7, 2013)

WIIIIIIIII UUUUUUU


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## Guild McCommunist (Feb 7, 2013)

soulx said:


> The launch 360 was also gimped as fuck.


 
But it was a reasonable price for the hardware at launch. It's certainly not "$599".


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## EyeZ (Feb 7, 2013)

This is not too surprising considering the cost of the PS3 when that launched.

I'm keen to see what this baby can do tho.


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## Deleted_171835 (Feb 7, 2013)

Guild McCommunist said:


> But it was a reasonable price for the hardware at launch. It's certainly not "$599".


Might seem like a reasonable price but it was filled with hidden costs.

And $599 was a joke. Don't be so pissy.


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## Guild McCommunist (Feb 7, 2013)

soulx said:


> Might seem like a reasonable price but it was filled with hidden costs.
> 
> And $599 was a joke. Don't be so pissy.


 
Heh, and I made a Nintendo joke a few threads back and everyone reported it. Gotta love GBAtemp.

But yeah, $599, old joke, let's move on.


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## emigre (Feb 7, 2013)

I would totally pay $599 for a PS4.


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## GameWinner (Feb 7, 2013)

$400 is not that bad, it's $50 more than a Wii U Deluxe.
It certainly beats paying $599.


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## wolfmanz51 (Feb 7, 2013)

400 for a base system, 500 for deluxe with game and new move, then because of next gen dev enviorment 6-9 month wait for new software worth buying, so for me im going to keep playing ps3/wiiU until metal gear is brought to ps4 just like i did with ps3


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## Gahars (Feb 7, 2013)

If it gets bumped down to the $399 price range, that'll be pretty good. The price will be higher than the Wii U, sure, but not by an unreasonable amount, especially if the hardware it's packing is more advanced.

Well, look on the bright side - the "$599 US Dollars" bit may be left behind, but there's still time yet for Sony to tell us about GIANT ENEMY CRABS and RIIIIIIIDGE RACER!


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## Valwin (Feb 7, 2013)

599 UDS
and sony bros will eat it up


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## Guild McCommunist (Feb 7, 2013)

I think Sony will have no issues hitting consumers' weak points for massive damage.


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## RodrigoDavy (Feb 7, 2013)

Video games are getting overly expensive these days. If a deluxe version of PS4 costs $500, might as well buy a computer.


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## AceWarhead (Feb 7, 2013)

RodrigoDavy said:


> Video games are getting overly expensive these days. If a deluxe version of PS4 costs $500, might as well buy a computer.


Video gaming isn't a cheap hobby, it's a luxury.


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## ShadowSoldier (Feb 7, 2013)

And yet... everybody bitched the WiiU is too expensive...


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## RodrigoDavy (Feb 7, 2013)

AceWarhead said:


> Video gaming isn't a cheap hobby, it's a luxury.


 
It depends on your point of view... I bought a gba sp for $20 and I can find some gba games for $5, it doesn't need to be a luxury

Also, many years ago, consoles used to be way cheaper than computers which now is changing. I can use a PC for gaming too, you know... I need to have a PC anyway and the only reason I bought console before was because of their more attractive price, I can find PC games for very reasonable prices too


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## Guild McCommunist (Feb 7, 2013)

RodrigoDavy said:


> It depends on your point of view... I bought a gba sp for $20 and I can find some gba games for $5, it doesn't need to be a luxury
> 
> Also, many years ago, consoles used to be way cheaper than computers which now is changing. I can use a PC for gaming too, you know... I need to have a PC anyway and the only reason I bought console before was because of their more attractive price, I can find PC games for very reasonable prices too


 
A good gaming PC is still $1000+.

And gaming consoles are generally cheaper than years before, adjusting for inflation. Exception is the PS3 when it launched but even that's not as expensive as older consoles.


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## ShadowSoldier (Feb 7, 2013)

RodrigoDavy said:


> It depends on your point of view... I bought a gba sp for $20 and I can find some gba games for $5, it doesn't need to be a luxury
> 
> Also, many years ago, consoles used to be way cheaper than computers which now is changing. I can use a PC for gaming too, you know... I need to have a PC anyway and the only reason I bought console before was because of their more attractive price, I can find PC games for very reasonable prices too


 
You gotta realize, the money value changes. In the 80's early 90's, 300 was A LOT of money, and on gameshows, winning $20,000 made you feel like a millionaire and you could buy anything. Now, $300 is easy to get and $20,000 can barely get you a new car.

So while in retrospect, consoles back then were cheaper, they're still somewhat the equivalent price that we pay now.


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## Sychophantom (Feb 7, 2013)

Not entirely surprising. Sony never seems to learn from previous mistakes in pricing.

It will sell, because people go apeshit for shiny things.


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## AceWarhead (Feb 7, 2013)

RodrigoDavy said:


> It depends on your point of view... I bought a gba sp for $20 and I can find some gba games for $5, it doesn't need to be a luxury
> 
> Also, many years ago, consoles used to be way cheaper than computers which now is changing. I can use a PC for gaming too, you know... I need to have a PC anyway and the only reason I bought console before was because of their more attractive price, I can find PC games for very reasonable prices too


I'm talking about buying things new/current, like a new title that came out. Of course the used market is going to be cheaper, no surprises there. Getting those is a huge luxury. Video gaming isn't gonna lower prices to cater to lower income people. They'd lose massive amounts of money.
Back then, computers were a new thing and weren't readily available like today. You have to take in account the era of which those consoles were in.
That brings me to my next point. Sure, you can get a PC and play PC games, that's nice and dandy, but what of exclusives? I doubt you're gonna find Wind Wanker HD or Tokyo Jungle on a PC ( Not counting emulation ).


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## duffmmann (Feb 7, 2013)

RodrigoDavy said:


> It depends on your point of view... I bought a gba sp for $20 and I can find some gba games for $5, it doesn't need to be a luxury
> 
> Also, many years ago, consoles used to be way cheaper than computers which now is changing. I can use a PC for gaming too, you know... I need to have a PC anyway and the only reason I bought console before was because of their more attractive price, I can find PC games for very reasonable prices too


 
I think a luxury can be regarded as anything in life that you don't need at all to continue living.  This can be anything from video games to fancy foods.


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## LightyKD (Feb 7, 2013)

And shit like this is why Ouya might be my last console until the next...next generation. Gaming is getting way too expensive and not so family friendly. The ironic part is that the industry wants to be considered mainstream entertainment so badly yet they pull shit like this to turn people off and away.


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## Nah3DS (Feb 7, 2013)




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## RodrigoDavy (Feb 7, 2013)

ShadowSoldier said:


> You gotta realize, the money value changes. In the 80's early 90's, 300 was A LOT of money, and on gameshows, winning $20,000 made you feel like a millionaire and you could buy anything. Now, $300 is easy to get and $20,000 can barely get you a new car.
> 
> So while in retrospect, consoles back then were cheaper, they're still somewhat the equivalent price that we pay now.


 
But it's still counter-intuictive the fact that consoles are getting more expensive as time passes when the prices of computers are clearly dropping. Since, want it or not, consoles are computers.



AceWarhead said:


> Sure, you can get a PC and play PC games, that's nice and dandy, but what of exclusives? I doubt you're gonna find Wind Wanker HD or Tokyo Jungle on a PC ( Not counting emulation ).


 
I think it's a bit worrying that console prices are getting close in price with PCs. Nowadays, even the lower-end PCs have some kind of 3D acceleration and can play at least some older games. It's normal to find for a relatively cheap price, PCs that can run recent games even if it's on lowest settings. PCs are getting more potent and cheaper as time passes and consoles are going the opposite way in this regard.



duffmmann said:


> I think a luxury can be regarded as anything in life that you don't need at all to continue living. This can be anything from video games to fancy foods.


 
If we see things like this we could consider having a TV, a computer, a DVD player and this sort of things a luxury... This doesn't sound right... A luxury is something that is too expensive for most people to afford like helicopters for example. I don't see consoles quite fitting this criterium, they're more like unnecessary but certainly not luxury.


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## duffmmann (Feb 7, 2013)

RodrigoDavy said:


> If we see things like this we could consider having a TV, a computer, a DVD player and this sort of things a luxury... This doesn't sound right... A luxury is something that is too expensive for most people to afford like helicopters for example. I don't see consoles quite fitting this criterium, they're more like unnecessary but certainly not luxury.


 
Those are all absolutely luxuries.  People lived for years and years without them, and could continue to live years and years without them.  Luxury does not automatically equal expensive.  But if we are to acknowledge it that way, then a 200 dollar tv today was absolutely a luxury when it was first introduced to the public.  A PS3 cost 500 and 600 dollars at launch, and now costs less than 300 dollars.  Does that price difference make it less of a luxury or is it still the same product thats just more affordable?  You're strictly looking at this from a dollars and cents point of view, while I'm looking at it from a life value point of view.


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## Nah3DS (Feb 7, 2013)

duffmmann said:


> Those are all absolutely luxuries. People lived for years and years without them.


people lived for years without Brushtooths


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## AceWarhead (Feb 7, 2013)

NahuelDS said:


> people live for years without Brushtooths


And they had pretty shitty teeth and dental problems, eh?


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## Maxternal (Feb 7, 2013)

NahuelDS said:


> people live for years without Brushtooths


That would definitely make it more of a luxury than drinking water ... even if not by much.


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## RodrigoDavy (Feb 7, 2013)

AceWarhead said:


> And they had pretty shitty teeth and dental problems, eh?


Actually, not necessarily... If we didn't eat any junk there would be no need for toothbrush, the problem is we eat too much candy

EDIT: Ever noticed how animals don't brush their teeth and still they don't need to use denture?


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## IBNobody (Feb 7, 2013)

RodrigoDavy said:


> Video games are getting overly expensive these days. If a deluxe version of PS4 costs $500, might as well buy a computer.


 
That's exactly what I'm going to be doing. The trick to having a lasting gaming rig is to buy the new computer a year or two after the next batch of consoles launch. That gives the GPU makers enough time to catch up.


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## Psionic Roshambo (Feb 7, 2013)

399 for the base model, some mid range model for 499 and 599 for the deluxe model. 

(The 399 model will require purchase of a Sony bracket to mount the optional hard drive.) 

At least if the PS3 is anything to go by.


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## KingVamp (Feb 7, 2013)

I think my Laptop cost about the same price on sale.



Sychophantom said:


> Not entirely surprising. Sony never seems to learn from previous mistakes in pricing.
> 
> It will sell, because people go apeshit for shiny things.


Surely they would lose some people because of the price alone from the get go from launch,but I didn't think the pricing is too bad. I'm pretty sure most PC gamers would at least double that price for their PC and it isn't $599 us dollars.



LightyKD said:


> And shit like this is why Ouya might be my last console until the next...next generation. Gaming is getting way too expensive and not so family friendly. The ironic part is that the industry wants to be considered mainstream entertainment so badly yet they pull shit like this to turn people off and away.


In the Wii u case,it's $50-100 more than last gen with a $10 increase in the top games and with the ps4 is actually cheaper than last gen. Hopefully the game prices wouldn't go even higher. The expense is pretty much the same, really. Don't get me wrong, I wish they were cheaper too.

What's getting me is these recent rumors that been going around. No used games and always online.

They aren't trying to not off "family friendly" gamers or even cater to them, it's more now about striking a better balance between them. All of the companies are trying to do so, thought I feel Nintendo may be trying harder to find that balance.



duffmmann said:


> I think a luxury can be regarded as anything in life that you don't need at all to continue living. This can be anything from video games to fancy foods.


Video games are use for stress relief and entertainment. I didn't know about you, but I can't live without some form of entertainment (at least not happily and/or comfortably) and video games is one of my choices for entertainment even if I can go for everything and the biggest thing.

Internet (isn't a phone deem so too?) is becoming/is essential thing, why can't my form entertainment be to me?



RodrigoDavy said:


> I think it's a bit worrying that console prices are getting close in price with PCs. Nowadays, even the lower-end PCs have some kind of 3D acceleration and can play at least some older games. It's normal to find for a relatively cheap price, PCs that can run recent games even if it's on lowest settings. PCs are getting more potent and cheaper as time passes and consoles are going the opposite way in this regard.


Not that this add much of anything to this, I just want to say since console are built to play games and doesn't have unnecessary,hindering software then a console at the same price would be able to do more with games than a PC. Especially since they would most likely be sold at a lost.



RodrigoDavy said:


> Actually, not necessarily... If we didn't eat any junk there would be no need for toothbrush, the problem is we eat too much candy
> 
> EDIT: Ever noticed how animals don't brush their teeth and still they don't need to use denture?





Spoiler


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## wolfmanz51 (Feb 7, 2013)

Guild McCommunist said:


> A good gaming PC is still $1000+.
> 
> And gaming consoles are generally cheaper than years before, adjusting for inflation. Exception is the PS3 when it launched but even that's not as expensive as older consoles.


so if you have a decent gaming pc (which is Microsoft's best platform which is why i dont count them/xbox in this post) a wii/wii u a Ps3 a psp a DS light a 3DS what will the PS4 offer to gaming that isnt possible with the stuff i have now, the only thing i see coming from sony is higher polly count, and real 720p native games (ps3 and xbox 360 really are not that HD). Really what consumer should give two shits till there are games announced for it(publishers making AAA titles), right now I know its not fair to make a call either way.

Yet I cant help but think this situation this gen could be dire for Sony whom is all ready in a dire situation financially with everything outside of the game profits. The PlayStation move is underutilized due to the fact that it was not included at launch, the vita is flopping around like a fish out of water gasping for air because it didn't innovate enough to distinguish it self from ps3, psp, or 3ds.

The ps3 had advanced capability's and it had bluray. the ps2 had emotion and DVD, but now people want something fresh. GBA to ds offered dual screens and touch controls, DS to 3DS offered 3D gaming, console like online and graphics. GC to wii offered new control methods and online capabilitys, Wii to Wii U brings a number of advancements, new architecture, new disc format that reads 2.5 times faster than Bluray, dual screen gaming, game-pad only gaming, asymmetrical gaming, and social gaming via Miiverse (though ps4 and xbox 3 will likely have there own versions of this).

So what does PS4 offer... nothing, yet.


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## KingVamp (Feb 7, 2013)

wolfmanz51 said:


> so if you have a decent gaming pc (ido) a wii/wii u a Ps3 a psp a DS light a 3DS what will the PS4 offer to gaming that isnt possible with the stuff i have now, the only thing i see coming from sony is higher polly count, and real *1080p* native games (ps3 and xbox 360 really are not that HD). Really what consumer should give two shits till there are games announced for it(publishers making AAA titles), right now I know its not fair to make a call either way.





wolfmanz51 said:


> The ps3 had advanced capability's and it had bluray. the ps2 had emotion and DVD, but now people want something fresh. GBA to ds offered dual screens and touch controls, DS to 3DS offered 3D gaming, console like online and graphics. GC to wii offered new control methods and online capabilitys, Wii to Wii U brings a number of advancements, new architecture, new disc format that reads 2.5 times faster than Bluray,* sdd*,dual screen gaming, game-pad only gaming, asymmetrical gaming, and social gaming via Miiverse (though ps4 and xbox 3 will likely have there own versions of this).
> 
> So what does PS4 offer... nothing, yet.


So, the ps4 wouldn't at least offer a number of advancements and a new architecture?
Do you honestly think they wouldn't bring something more than just "polly count"? Of course it doesn't offer anything yet, we didn't really know anything about it.


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## Valwin (Feb 7, 2013)

is ps3 all over again is like sony never learnsssssss


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## Bladexdsl (Feb 7, 2013)

looks like they didn't learn their lesson from the ps3 launch prepare to sell it at a loss yet again $ony


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## wolfmanz51 (Feb 7, 2013)

KingVamp said:


> So, the ps4 wouldn't at least offer a number of advancements and a new architecture?
> You don't thing they wouldn't bring something more than just "polly count"? Of course it doesn't offer
> anything yet, we really didn't know anything about it.


all though just as you said really we know nothing of ps4.
 but based on whats floating around:
a touch pad on a Dualshock hmm im not a fan of the vita rear touch panel thing, and again this is available on vita, 3ds, wii u.
 The new architecture uses a revised version of the LibGCM API used on PlayStation 3 and PS Vita which is good because devs will be able to port easily.
 What i meant by the new architecture thing with wii to wii u is Nintendo basically released a suped up gamecube with wii, and wii u is not a suped up GC. I didnt mean ps4 would not have new architecture just that, that's all its offering right now.
So far PS4 will have faster ram, a more accessible CPU and a far superior GPU so yeah it offers better graphic capability and bigger open world games. 
So to me as a game designer ps4 would be my last choice to make a game for because the only thing it would challenge me to do is spend a lot of money on producing highly detailed graphics to compete with other high end games on the platform, a risky investment that could spell the death of my studio if it flops. 
You could also see games being touched by too many hands to have that finely crafted feel i love so much, AC3 suffered due to 600+ people working on the game.
Also its common knowledge that the best selling platform is never and has never been the most powerful one.


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## RodrigoDavy (Feb 7, 2013)

wolfmanz51 said:


> so if you have a decent gaming pc (which is Microsoft's best platform which is why i dont count them/xbox in this post)


 
PC is NOT a Microsoft platform. MS only makes a OS compatible with PC... The *P*ersonal *C*omputer is an open platform originally developed by IBM. Also, MS doesn't license games made for Windows, so MS doesn't profit from games made for Windows directly...

Sorry to pull your ear, but you're not the first I've seen saying this and it's just plainly wrong.


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## Psionic Roshambo (Feb 7, 2013)

RodrigoDavy said:


> PC is NOT a Microsoft platform. MS only makes a OS compatible with PC... The *P*ersonal *C*omputer is an open platform originally developed by IBM. Also, MS doesn't license games made for Windows, so MS doesn't profit from games made for Windows directly...
> 
> Sorry to pull your ear, but you're not the first I've seen saying this and it's just plainly wrong.


 
I know this is just being the devils advocate here but I would call owning ~90% of a market as being that market. Google isn't the only search engine on the planet but if I tell you to go Google something you will know exactly what I am talking about even if you hate using Google as your search engine. 

Microsoft might as well be the PC market, so effectively it's known as this that even Apple says in it's commercials "I'm a PC, and I'm a Mac!"


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## BlueStar (Feb 7, 2013)

Guild McCommunist said:


> It'll probably bump down to $399 for everywhere else (which is a reasonable launch price).


 
What do you mean by 'everywhere else'? Based on previous console releases that would mean a price of around £350-£399 - or around $599.


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## shakirmoledina (Feb 7, 2013)

$400 is not bad but then again like the vita initial sales will be slow unless they drop the price. that's how sony goes.
when they see other consoles losing their magic, they drop the price and hell breaks loose on the sales.


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## porkiewpyne (Feb 7, 2013)

Oh man. It's turning into the "Is entertainment a necessity?" discussion which we had in the last "Is piracy okay?" thread


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## RodrigoDavy (Feb 7, 2013)

Psionic Roshambo said:


> I know this is just being the devils advocate here but I would call owning ~90% of a market as being that market. Google isn't the only search engine on the planet but if I tell you to go Google something you will know exactly what I am talking about even if you hate using Google as your search engine.


 
You didn't get my point. Software and hardware are two completely different things. When you talk about the PC platform, you're talking about the hardware. So, saying MS
dominates the PC market doesn't make any sense. Now saying companies like Dell or Hp or Samsung that actually sell PCs dominate the PC market would be more precise.

What MS dominates is the PC OS market, that is correct.

As a counter-example, it is known that Sega's Dreamcast used a embedded version of Windows. If the Dreamcast was the best-selling console of it's generation, then who would have dominated the gaming market that generation, Microsoft or Sega?



> Microsoft might as well be the PC market, so effectively it's known as this that even Apple says in it's commercials "I'm a PC, and I'm a Mac!"


 
Might as well remember you that Apple is a hardware manufacturer, so in that said TV commercial they didn't care to distinguish that "Windows sucks", they wanted to say "PC (the hardware) sucks". Also, since 2006 Macs are essentialy IBM PC compatible and you can even run Windows in it.


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## MelodieOctavia (Feb 7, 2013)

Valwin said:


> *is ps3 all over again* is like sony never learnsssssss


 
No, it's the PS4. Are you even paying attention?


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## DiscostewSM (Feb 7, 2013)

I'm reading the article, and I think with it saying over 40,000 yen would mean at least 40,000 yen, so yeah, the possibility of it being $400 is thre, but also the possibility of it being a little more or a lot more than that much.


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## wolfmanz51 (Feb 7, 2013)

RodrigoDavy said:


> You didn't get my point. Software and hardware are two completely different things. When you talk about the PC platform, you're talking about the hardware. So, saying MS
> dominates the PC market doesn't make any sense. Now saying companies like Dell or Hp or Samsung that actually sell PCs dominate the PC market would be more precise.
> 
> What MS dominates is the PC OS market, that is correct.
> ...


Yes but If I'm a serious game developer releasing a AAA title on a PC I'm going to use Direct X11 by Microsoft, and the programs/midddleware that supports it which requires Windows which is owned by Microsoft, then I can port to MAC using wrappers as ugly as that is.
It is that way I fucking hate Windows OS but if you're a gamer on PC and you want to play 90% of the games that's what you do. So no Microsoft does not Make PCS but every PC ships with windows heck even my macbook has windows, just to play games/use programs to make games. your quibbling over something silly. Microsoft doesn't "make" all of the xbox ether if you wanna put it that way; they use chips made by other companies and merely designed the xbox and only really make software for it. so in a sense the xbox is a pc with a crappy limited version of windows on it that shows Advertisements every time you boot like add ware built in, oh and did I mention that you have to pay microsoft to play online; wtf my pc (and every other platform) has free to play games online with voice chat.


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## Qtis (Feb 7, 2013)

RodrigoDavy said:


> You didn't get my point. Software and hardware are two completely different things. When you talk about the PC platform, you're talking about the hardware. So, saying MS
> dominates the PC market doesn't make any sense. Now saying companies like Dell or Hp or Samsung that actually sell PCs dominate the PC market would be more precise.
> 
> What MS dominates is the PC OS market, that is correct.
> ...


 
Actually you could just as well say Microsoft dominates the PC market. While the PC stands for Personal Computer, you can't honestly say that MS isn't the leader in PC OS software (and possibly in hardware too in a way), because you can't use a computer without an interface. Sure you have OSX and Linux, but those are a very small minority. Only real reason I could understand a corporation using OSX is for graphics/video/publishing. Pretty much all engineering CAD and ERP software for example are pretty much Windows exclusive (thanks to Apple f'ing up their computer sales in the beginning of 2000s and AutoCAD for OSX being trashed). Gaming is very close to the previous example. Most games are Windows exclusive or have a far superior version version for Windows. A good recent example is Starcraft II: on OSX it was a shitstorm and lagged very much, but on Windows 7 no real problem and graphics were set to high. I'm talking about the same computer here (MBP 15", 2.66 GHz i7, GeForce GT 330M). Sure you could blame Blizzard for it, but it's just as well a problem with the OS. In my opinion, for gaming: Windows > OSX > Linux. This is all from personal experience. Actually only reason why I have a Windows partition on my Mac..

As for the latter question, I'd say both. You can also say Google dominates the mobile phone OS market, but Samsung is the global leader in selling the hardware. It's not necessary to go that deep into the discussion, but both interpretations are just as valid on the matter.



RodrigoDavy said:


> Might as well remember you that Apple is a hardware manufacturer, so in that said TV commercial they didn't care to distinguish that "Windows sucks", they wanted to say "PC (the hardware) sucks". Also, since 2006 Macs are essentialy IBM PC compatible and you can even run Windows in it.


Actually it doesn't have anything to do with IBM PC compatibility per se, it's all about Macs running on Intel processors instead of PowerPC. After the change from PowerPC to Intel was done, Windows was compatible. If Macs were still in the PowerPC wagon, I doubt Windows would run on it.

As for the PS4 price, I don't see any problem with it. People already mentioned gaming being a luxury. Well, hate to break it to you folks, everything new is a luxury. You don't have to buy the latest and greatest to play games. That's why there are older models too. In the car industry Audi makes something an extra for a cost. The next year it's already part of the basic model and VW has it as an extra customizable feature for a cost. After a year or so, it's also a standard for the basic line of VW.

Compared to the price, I think the WiiU is overpriced compared to what it has to offer vs the competition at the moment, it doesn't mean it won't come down after early adopters have had their share and Nintendo is confident with lowered manufacturing costs to lower the price. It's also pretty much the same for the PS4 and Nextbox. Once a console has something really great to offer for you, go ahead and buy it. If you don't break it and keep buying software for it, you'll get your moneys worth out of it. Regardless of the price.

(Note to all: I don't mean that the WiiU is bad, on the contrary. It has fantastic games, but the amount of games offered is still relatively small and most ports have been out for the other consoles for a while before the WiiU launch. I'll probably get me a WiiU at some point, but I'll just wait to see if there are any serious hardware problems like the RRoD for 360s, YLOD for PS3s or the Wii heating issues with the internet connect).


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## Deleted-185407 (Feb 7, 2013)

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## Issac (Feb 7, 2013)

Guild McCommunist said:


> $428 = $599?
> 
> Oh right, I forgot about the exchange rates from USD to stupidity.


 
Actually, that's more like USD to Swedish Kronor back to USD, almost...
$399 -> Video Game Price Conversion -> 3999 SEK -> Normal Price Conversion -> $629

sooo, for Swedes: $399 = $629....
(Hell, the launch 3DS at $250 was $399 here in Sweden when I bought it)


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## Deleted member 318366 (Feb 7, 2013)

Seeing how I payed a lot for my 3ds, wii and wii u I don't think I'll have any problem getting the ps4...just as long as it never goes past the $800 margin lol


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## chartube12 (Feb 7, 2013)

Guild McCommunist said:


> It'll probably bump down to $399 for everywhere else (which is a reasonable launch price).


 
No it isn't. Anything that cost a 3rd or 4th of average monthly pay check is too high. Looks like I'll be jumping ship this generation for a long time. At least my father inlaw get's pc parts from his company for free. Looks like I have legitimate reasons to go PC gaming. Unreasonable pricing and console DRMs are not for me.


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## LockeCole_101629 (Feb 7, 2013)

I think I forgot how long I saved to get Sega MegaDrive & SNES.
Now I understand why NeoGeo, 3DO, Jaguar, and CD-i is failing.


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## FAST6191 (Feb 7, 2013)

RodrigoDavy said:


> Actually, not necessarily... If we didn't eat any junk there would be no need for toothbrush, the problem is we eat too much candy
> 
> EDIT: Ever noticed how animals don't brush their teeth and still they don't need to use denture?



Archeology probably begs to differ- the move to farming from hunter gather made survival somewhat easier and allowed things like society to work (hunter gather tends to be about break even in terms of time spent getting enough energy to do it all over again) but it did see a marked decline in dental quality.

Equally animals- many will still chew on something (there is a reason you are often told to have a bowl of dry food for animals) and more importantly bad/broken teeth (and the sorting thereof) is one of the bigger reasons why captive animals live longer than wild ones.

Re gaming PC.... certainly you could see the benefits of dropping 1000 or more but games do seem to have been held back a bit in terms of specs so 500 or so can do a lot of damage. Done right you might even be able to get half nice system with a cheaper graphics card and upgrade instead.

As for the matter at hand it could work or it could not, trouble is I am not sure what Sony could offer to mitigate it all unless MS does go full penny pinching mode as the rumour the other day suggested could happen.


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## chartube12 (Feb 7, 2013)

LockeCole_101629 said:


> I think I forgot how long I saved to get Sega MegaDrive & SNES.
> Now I understand why NeoGeo, 3DO, Jaguar, and CD-i is failing.


 
Don't know where you guys have been shopping, but I have never paid over 250+tax for a console.


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## Bladexdsl (Feb 7, 2013)

the atari 2600 was not $659 who made this list stoned collage students?!


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## Qtis (Feb 7, 2013)

Bladexdsl said:


> the atari 2600 was not $659 who made this list stoned collage students?!


I guess you didn't read the "prices adjusted for inflation"? :3


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## Bladexdsl (Feb 7, 2013)

a 2600 is NOT worth that today


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## Issac (Feb 7, 2013)

chartube12 said:


> Don't know where you guys have been shopping, but I have never paid over 250+tax for a console.


I remember the Dreamcast being 4999 SEK here, that's $788 in todays exchange rate ( $1 = 6.34 SEK ). Back in 1999 it would've been $588 ( $1 = 8.50 SEK)


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## Veho (Feb 7, 2013)

Bladexdsl said:


> a 2600 is NOT worth that today


That's not what "adjusted for inflation" means.


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## emigre (Feb 7, 2013)

Bladexdsl said:


> a 2600 is NOT worth that today


 
Do you not understand inflation? The Atari cost around $200 in 1977. Adjust for inflation and voila.


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## Guild McCommunist (Feb 7, 2013)

chartube12 said:


> No it isn't. Anything that cost a 3rd or 4th of average monthly pay check is too high. Looks like I'll be jumping ship this generation for a long time. At least my father inlaw get's pc parts from his company for free. Looks like I have legitimate reasons to go PC gaming. Unreasonable pricing and console DRMs are not for me.


 
That's why it's a luxury. The Xbox 360 launched at the same price and it was fine.

Compare it to the Wii U (which is reasonably priced). It's a little more advanced than our current consoles and thus sells for a little more (new base model PS3s for reference are $250 although they mostly sell in bundles at $300). The PS4 we can reasonably assume is significantly more advanced than current consoles and thus costs more. $100-$150 more than current gen isn't bad.

Also it's a luxury, of course it'll cost a lot of money regardless.



Bladexdsl said:


> stoned collage students?!


 
Well they spend so much time making fucking collages they obviously don't know how to do statistics!


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## Psionic Roshambo (Feb 7, 2013)

LockeCole_101629 said:


> I think I forgot how long I saved to get Sega MegaDrive & SNES.
> Now I understand why NeoGeo, 3DO, Jaguar, and CD-i is failing.


 
I remember playing the NeoGeo at a friends house at the time, I owned the SNES and I remember saying to him "This doesn't look like it's worth all the extra money..." He had Magician Lord, NAM 1975, and some other game. 

Very cool system but even the games where insanely priced, I believe they ran from 179.99 for the "budget" games and 249.99 for some of the more expensive games.


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## Issac (Feb 7, 2013)

Guild McCommunist said:


> Well_ they spend so much time making fucking collages_ they obviously don't know how to do statistics!


 
Wish I could give you multiple likes for this comment alone! Cracked me up!


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## RodrigoDavy (Feb 7, 2013)

Qtis said:


> Actually it doesn't have anything to do with IBM PC compatibility per se, it's all about Macs running on Intel processors instead of PowerPC. After the change from PowerPC to Intel was done, Windows was compatible. If Macs were still in the PowerPC wagon, I doubt Windows would run on it.


 
Yes, it is. A PC is not just a machine with a x86 processor, it is a machine who follow a series of standards as to type of hardware, type of connectors and type of peripherals. Macs were almost IBM PC compatible before switching to x86, they used IDE interfaces, USB, VGA, PS/2 connectors all of them standards imposed by the PC platform. The only thing that was missing for Mac to be fully PC compatible was using x86 proccessors.


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## LockeCole_101629 (Feb 7, 2013)

gaming is luxury, yes I agree.
but it no longer being exclusive things because everyone want it.
just like cars, the company knows it, they monitoring our behavior.

instead making something durable or powerful with high price, they made something more affordable but not so durable or powerful.
just like anybody else, everyone just trying to make a fortune, but in the end you know you can't satisfy everyone.

cheaper things? there's always someone telling it's too expensive.
cheaper games? it doesn't stop piracy.
Expensive quality games? shit I can't afford it, I'll just download it.
make it free? it's a crap.
make it free? don't take it, it's a trap.
make it free and give you money?! SCAMMM.
Free TV channel? it's full of ads, so it's crap.
Paid TV Channel? I HAVE TO PAY TO WATCH?
Selling water in a bottle? Are you out of mind?
etc.

Thank you guys.
Good Night.


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## mightymuffy (Feb 7, 2013)

Heh, good old inflation... I remember going to a games store with my dad and him buying Superman on the 2600 for about £40 and thinking WTF you Madman!, back in summat like 1982... that works out at about £175 now, ouch!

$400... flock the yanks and their moaning, who's reckoning us Euro's get royally screwed once again..... hell, our friends over the pond pay about a 3rd for their petrol, sorry, 'gas' (don't get me started about the 'gas' thing lol....) so shouldn't be moaning anyway: whilst there were PS3's burned at the stake over there for its $600 launch pricepoint, us lot had to wait nearly a soddin year, THEN get charged £425 (currently $668, but back then that was ~$800...)!!

Anyway, lost myself a bit there! $400 is a good pricepoint - probably equates to £350 here really, which is roughly the price of the deluxe Wii U at the moment..... It could be a lot worse! MS are coming to the table with a (apparently) comparatively underpowered console.... really they must undercut this price! (Who's guessing you HAVE to have Kinect 2 which comes packaged with it though..) £350 should also force a price drop for the Wii U - good news all round if this pricepoint is true!


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## urbanman2004 (Feb 7, 2013)

I think $399 is a reasonable price point at this day and age compared to its current gen hardware that's out now. But I wouldn't be surprised if the final price at launch is $599, ijs.


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## narutofan777 (Feb 7, 2013)

will they lo$e money on this one too?


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## KingVamp (Feb 7, 2013)

Guild McCommunist said:


> Heh, and I made a Nintendo joke a few threads back and everyone reported it. Gotta love GBAtemp.
> 
> But yeah, $599, old joke, let's move on.


Oh and to be fair, while I didn't know what post/joke you are talking about, I will
say it is sometimes hard to tell when you are serious or just joking.


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## Guild McCommunist (Feb 7, 2013)

KingVamp said:


> Oh and to be fair, while I didn't know what post/joke you are talking about, I will
> say it is sometimes hard to tell when you are serious or just joking.


 
This was all lower case and basically looked like a Valwin post.

When I'm joking I usually make it dead obvious.


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## Foxi4 (Feb 7, 2013)

LockeCole_101629 said:


> *chart*
> 
> I think I forgot how long I saved to get Sega MegaDrive & SNES.
> Now I understand why NeoGeo, 3DO, Jaguar, and CD-i is failing.


The chart is entertaining but not really relevant in the discussion due to issues of inflation. 

Unless you have a chart that takes that into account? Now THAT would be educational!


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## duffmmann (Feb 8, 2013)

KingVamp said:


> Video games are use for stress relief and entertainment. I didn't know about you, but I can't live without some form of entertainment (at least not happily and/or comfortably) and video games is one of my choices for entertainment even if I can go for everything and the biggest thing.
> 
> Internet (isn't a phone deem so too?) is becoming/is essential thing, why can't my form entertainment be to me?


 

What a load of bull, do you realize how spoiled you are or how spoiled you sound?  How spoiled we all are.  You do realize that you only think you need these things because you grew up in an environment that allowed you to have such things.  You take them for granted, people are starving in third world countries, struggling to live one day to the next, and you have the balls to tell me that these completely unnecessary forms of entertainment aren't a luxury, and something you need?!  Jesus Christ you make me sick man.  The internet is not a necessity.  Man lived for years without it, and man could live for years without it.  They're great amazing things don't get me wrong, but they're completely man-made and unnecessary for life.  You only think they are necessary because you can't imagine a life without it.  Don't let that confuse you though, its absolutely a luxury.


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## Luckkill4u (Feb 8, 2013)

duffmmann said:


> What a load of bull, do you realize how spoiled you are or how spoiled you sound? How spoiled we all are. You do realize that you only think you need these things because you grew up in an environment that allowed you to have such things. You take them for granted, people are starving in third world countries, struggling to live one day to the next, and you have the balls to tell me that these completely unnecessary forms of entertainment aren't a luxury, and something you need?! Jesus Christ you make me sick man. The internet is not a necessity. Man lived for years without it, and man could live for years without it. They're great amazing things don't get me wrong, but they're completely man-made and unnecessary for life. You only think they are necessary because you can't imagine a life without it. Don't let that confuse you though, its absolutely a luxury.


A lighbulb was once a luxury too my friend. So many things that used to be a luxury has became a necessity to live an adequate and comfortable life. Yes we take things for granted but its not like you can remember the day all you had was a cave and a rock. My first christmas present ever was a SNES (Yes I was only 1 and yes I was an excuse for getting the new Nintendo) and I had videogames in my entire life. I believe its an essential to life.


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## duffmmann (Feb 8, 2013)

Luckkill4u said:


> A lighbulb was once a luxury too my friend. So many things that used to be a luxury has became a necessity to live an adequate and comfortable life. Yes we take things for granted but its not like you can remember the day all you had was a cave and a rock. My first christmas present ever was a SNES (Yes I was only 1 and yes I was an excuse for getting the new Nintendo) and I had videogames in my entire life. I believe its an essential to life.


 
I would say a lightbulb is still a luxury.  What are you people not getting about this?  Anything that we use in order to make life easier, for entertainment, etc.  that we don't need to live or continue living.  Its a luxury.  If it ever once was a luxury, its still a luxury.  This is my point, our lives are filled with luxuries, because of how we've continued to evolve to such a point where now we just want to make life easier, and so many of us take all these luxuries in life for granted.  A light bulb is absolutely a luxury, I wish you could appreciate it.  Again, its people like you that make me sick, stop and appreciate what you have for just a moment, and stop being such an ignorant consumer.  There are so many people in the world that would love to have even a roof over their heads, and a guarantee where there next meal is going to come from.  Nothing any of you say is going to change my opinion on what I consider a luxury.


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## Luckkill4u (Feb 8, 2013)

duffmmann said:


> Nothing any of you say is going to change my opinion on what I consider a luxury.


 So why continue? If what you belive is a luxury is different from others opinions of a luxury why even state it? A meal/shelter/water/ect could never be a luxury because its a necessity. If I want to have an extravagant way of living as a "ignorant consumer" then so be it. If you live in a 3rd world country and is poor your probably the cause of overpopulation anyways. One can't blame the "ignorant consumer" on that, blame the damn parents who brought that lame excuse of life into that poor cruel world. If so then the only true luxury in this world is to be raised in a good, well off comfortable home the you should blame the poor and disadvantaged for being weak.


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## duffmmann (Feb 8, 2013)

Luckkill4u said:


> So why continue? If what you belive is a luxury is different from others opinions of a luxury why even state it? A meal/shelter/water/ect could never be a luxury because its a necessity. If I want to have an extravagant way of living as a "ignorant consumer" then so be it. If you live in a 3rd world country and is poor your probably the cause of overpopulation anyways. One can't blame the "ignorant consumer" on that, blame the damn parents who brought that lame excuse of life into that poor cruel world. If so then the only true luxury in this world is to be raised in a good, well off comfortable home the you should blame the poor and disadvantaged for being weak.


 
I'm stating it because people take for granted so much in life and think that so many luxuries in our lives are givens and therefore not luxuries.  Its really quite disgusting.

I can't believe you just said that if you live in a 3rd world country and are poor you probably cause the overpopulation.  What a terribly ignorant thing to say.  You could have been born anywhere, you're lucky that history lined up the way it did, so that you weren't born in a third world country, have you no appreciation for the suffering others are born into by no choice of their own?!?!  You continue to make me more and more sick.


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## KingVamp (Feb 8, 2013)

duffmmann said:


> What a load of bull, do you realize how spoiled you are or how spoiled you sound? How spoiled we all are. You do realize that you only think you need these things because you grew up in an environment that allowed you to have such things. You take them for granted, people are starving in third world countries, struggling to live one day to the next, and you have the balls to tell me that these completely unnecessary forms of entertainment aren't a luxury, and something you need?! Jesus Christ you make me sick man. The internet is not a necessity. Man lived for years without it, and man could live for years without it. They're great amazing things don't get me wrong, but they're completely man-made and unnecessary for life. You only think they are necessary because you can't imagine a life without it. Don't let that confuse you though, its absolutely a luxury.


So, because third world countries live worse/differently then us, then we should live the same?
We are taking them for granted because we didn't see something or most the stuff we use for our daily life
as luxury? Quite frankly, since you are so quick to diss some much as luxury, maybe you are the one
taking it for granted? There a lot of stuff men didn't have in the PAST that we have today that necessary to
that certain person.

Think about all the stuff you got, then think about if all that stuff was gone, but water, food and tent over your head (all of which you need to make/get yourself) , do you think you could or want to live that way?

Some people are doing even better off then me, if they need something make the most out of there life somehow that I didn't need then so be it. I'm not going to try to guilt trip them out of it.



duffmmann said:


> I would say a lightbulb is still a luxury. What are you people not getting about this? Anything that we use in order to make life easier, for entertainment, etc. that we don't need to live or continue living. Its a luxury. If it ever once was a luxury, its still a luxury. This is my point, our lives are filled with luxuries, because of how we've continued to evolve to such a point where now we just want to make life easier, and so many of us take all these luxuries in life for granted. A light bulb is absolutely a luxury, I wish you could appreciate it. Again, its people like you that make me sick, stop and appreciate what you have for just a moment, and stop being such an ignorant consumer. There are so many people in the world that would love to have even a roof over their heads, and a guarantee where there next meal is going to come from. Nothing any of you say is going to change my opinion on what I consider a luxury.


So, making life easier (which may include these things) isn't a necessary? Isn't that the point of evolution,to make things easier for us?

Look I'm not saying go buy all the biggest things, all I'm saying is that these small extra things you are so quick to diss as luxury, helps with living for that certain person.

Leave all the extra stuff behind and then come back and say you didn't need the things you have.


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## duffmmann (Feb 8, 2013)

KingVamp said:


> So, because third world countries live worse/differently then us, then we should live the same?
> We are taking them for granted because we didn't see something or most the stuff we use for our daily life
> as luxury? Quite frankly, since you are so quick to diss some much as luxury, maybe you are the one
> taking it for granted? There a lot of stuff men didn't have in the PAST that we have today that necessary to
> ...


 
Jesus Christ people what aren't you getting? We absolutely should keep living the way we do. Just stop every once and a while and appreciate how awesome life is because of all the luxuries we now have. Thats it. There is no greater message here. We have lots of luxuries. Thats just the fact of the matter. Its neither a good or a bad thing. In the context of what brought this up, my only point is, a GBA no matter how much you bought it for, if it still works and plays video games, its a luxury. The End. There's nothing more to it than that. Sorry if thats not what you want to hear, but thats the simple truth to it all. Get over it and accept it, because its true. We are living in a life full of luxuries, some more luxurious than others, but all of them luxuries.

Never once did I set out to diss luxuries, I only set out to define what luxuries are. And I'm alarmed by what some people don't realize what luxuries are. I love luxuries, they're fantastic, but the simplest things, including light bulbs are luxuries. Don't take that as me bad mouthing luxuries, cuz thats not what I'm doing at all.


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## Luckkill4u (Feb 8, 2013)

duffmmann said:


> I'm stating it because people take for granted so much in life and think that so many luxuries in our lives are givens and therefore not luxuries. Its really quite disgusting.
> 
> I can't believe you just said that if you live in a 3rd world country and are poor you probably cause the overpopulation. What a terribly ignorant thing to say. You could have been born anywhere, you're lucky that history lined up the way it did, so that you weren't born in a third world country, have you no appreciation for the suffering others are born into by no choice of their own?!?! You continue to make me more and more sick.


JUST PUKE ALREADY!!!!! 

Who the hell would appreciate suffering? If you mean sympathy then thats a no, beacuse 1 I have no way to relate 2 I am not to blame.

What should make you sick is people taking necessities for granted! Entertainment (a luxury) has no other gain other than excitement and comfort....  This is getting too OT so im done now if you want to continue feel free to PM me.


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## duffmmann (Feb 8, 2013)

Luckkill4u said:


> JUST PUKE ALREADY!!!!!
> 
> Who the hell would appreciate suffering? If you mean sympathy then thats a no, beacuse 1 I have no way to relate 2 I am not to blame.
> 
> What should make you sick is people taking necessities for granted! Entertainment (a luxury) has no other gain other than excitement and comfort.... This is getting too OT so im done now if you want to continue feel free to PM me.


 
I don't understand what the problem is here.  I'm not bad mouthing luxuries, I'm just pointing out what a luxury is, and how our lives are full of them.  Hell I love luxuries, but at least I can recognize them for what they are.  In the context that brought this all up, I asbsolutely stand by the fact that a GBA no matter the price if it still works and plays video games, its a luxury.  And you know why?  You could just as easily keep living without that GBA at the expense of not having gained entertainment in your life where you would fill it playing the GBA.  Do you get this or not?  Because this is all that my point is.  I love the GBA, I love light bulbs, but I know that these are all luxuries.  Understand this and move on.


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## KingVamp (Feb 8, 2013)

Last cents since I'm not taking this any farther.

I'm not saying you are dissing luxuries, I'm saying dissing everything as luxuries if it not
main things on the bases of the past and worse off counties.

There's a difference between just merely surviving, not even trying get more from life, vs living.
I'm not going sit here say "I didn't need that or they didn't need that" if it something I like to do that in my grasp when it helps me for feels comforted or anything else for apart of my life. All in balance of course.


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