# Valve officially announces Steam Deck, its handheld gaming PC releasing this December



## Seriel (Jul 15, 2021)

Runs SteamOS 3.0, supposedly its now based on Arch Linux for some reason.
Game support thus relies on Linux and Proton support.

It is also not locked down and you can install Windows if you feel like it.


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## Prans (Jul 15, 2021)

As I mentioned in my review for the AYA NEO, the more competition, the better for us consumers! Looking forward to how this turns out!


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## Valwinz (Jul 15, 2021)

The Switch Killer no reason to get a OLED switch


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## Tom Bombadildo (Jul 15, 2021)

$400 for the base model is a super decent price, I'm certainly going to attempt to reserve one of those myself. Will make a good comparison to the GPD Win 3  

Hopefully the RDNA 2 CUs in the APU are actually decent and not like the Vega CUs in current APUs which are total ass.


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## bodefuceta (Jul 15, 2021)

The cheapest model looks great for it's price, I would be tempted to buy it as a computer. They're definitely overcharging for storage though, I hope one can add SSDs to it.


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## Veho (Jul 15, 2021)

I love the competitive pricing. Not having to pay a Windows license is probably part of it. 
Is it just me or does the design remind you of the Sega Game Gear?


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## 1B51004 (Jul 15, 2021)

really, the handheld is only going to be as good as the games it runs, so this can either be a huge success or a massive flop depending on how it can handle the steam library
minecraft java and tf2 handheld is... tempting to be honest. lets hope that its at least good.


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## Viri (Jul 15, 2021)

Looks neat, I might pick one up. I can install Windows, put Gamepass on it, and play some handheld Morrowind!


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## Jiehfeng (Jul 15, 2021)

This is amazing, I so hope to get one somehow!

Also this is probably great news in terms of competition. Maybe it'll help Nintendo try to make more powerful hardware in the future.


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## Justinde75 (Jul 15, 2021)

I personally love these handheld pc consoles, and this one having an official dock only makes it better. I was always a bit unsure of investing alot of money into a no name device, but if its by valve it should be backed alot better and shouldnt be abandoned that easily. Can't wait to see how it performs!


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## Prans (Jul 15, 2021)

Justinde75 said:


> I personally love these handheld pc consoles, and this one having an official dock only makes it better. I was always a bit unsure of investing alot of money into a no name device, but if its by valve it should be backed alot better and shouldnt be abandoned that easily. Can't wait to see how it performs!


I wouldn't rule out Valve not losing interest in its own hardware but at least for a beginning it shouldn't fare too bad.


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## Jiehfeng (Jul 15, 2021)

Prans said:


> I wouldn't rule out Valve not losing interest in its own hardware but at least for a beginning it shouldn't fare too bad.



I have a feeling it will sell well with this pricing.

But just in case whoever is interested should probably get one soon. I remember the Nvidia Shield Portable...


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## Justinde75 (Jul 15, 2021)

Prans said:


> I wouldn't rule out Valve not losing interest in its own hardware but at least for a beginning it shouldn't fare too bad.


Even if valve loses interest in it over time there is a higher chance that community made updates or stuff gets released for a valve product rather than stuff from gpd for example


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## Deleted member 560282 (Jul 15, 2021)

Veho said:


> I love the competitive pricing. Not having to pay a Windows license is probably part of it.
> Is it just me or does the design remind you of the Sega Game Gear?








I knew this reminded me of something-


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## diggeloid (Jul 15, 2021)

This thing looks GREAT, the price is GREAT, and I'm HYPED!!!!

But, I will never trust Valve when they claim something is "ergonomic" after they released that monstrosity that was the Steam controller.


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## Justinde75 (Jul 15, 2021)

Arekkusuda said:


> I knew this reminded me of something-


Thats the mini version of it, the buttons are alot smaller on the real one


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## Reploid (Jul 15, 2021)

Consoles are officially destroyed.


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## lokomelo (Jul 15, 2021)

If they live up to this promise, it will be a truly console experience...

(I know that we already can make it work like that ourselves, but "make the setup yourself" is most anti-console phrase ever)


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## matpower (Jul 15, 2021)

Now that's a real Switch killer, holy fuck. Great pricing, big company backing it up and I can vouch Steam on Linux has never been better than now, pretty much everything works painlessly.

Weird choice to go with Arch-based but given you'll need a recent Mesa stack for day-1 compatibility, it makes sense overall.


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## GCS (Jul 15, 2021)

Just knowing it runs arch based distro is enough for me to buy it.


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## Jiehfeng (Jul 15, 2021)

Yarr harr harr


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## Deleted member 560282 (Jul 15, 2021)

Jiehfeng said:


> Yarr harr harr
> 
> View attachment 270016


So basically is a portable PC?


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## Muskusrat (Jul 15, 2021)

Seriel said:


> Runs SteamOS 3.0, supposedly its now based on Arch Linux for some reason.
> Game support thus relies on Linux and Proton support


According to the IGN hands-on you can play windows and linux game out of the box on it. And if you want to, you can install whatever you want (like Windows). It is a computer according to Valve.


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## Jiehfeng (Jul 15, 2021)

Arekkusuda said:


> So basically is a portable PC?



Yeah nothing new, I just find it funny since it's Steam themselves who's doing it who sells the games.


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## GCS (Jul 15, 2021)

Now that steam is releasing a linux based console i am sure that more game devs will develop native linux games


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## grey72 (Jul 15, 2021)

Other than the base eMMC storage, I don't see anything about this. And even that is acceptable given the price.


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## Blaze163 (Jul 15, 2021)

I'm not up on PC gaming as I don't have the patience for settings and drivers and compatibility lists and an that shit. But isn't the whole point the ability to upgrade your rig and install custom stuff for a better experience? How exactly does this console do that? It's neat for capturing what Steam can do at the moment, sure. But this'll be outdated by the time it gets out of the box, surely?


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## AkitoUF (Jul 15, 2021)

Imagine the hacking and emulation posibilities. But still, 64gb seems TOO low for $400. Will definitively wait for a price drop for the 512gb one. Consider the following: you CAN'T install Doom Eternal in the cheapest one.


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## Jiehfeng (Jul 15, 2021)

Blaze163 said:


> I'm not up on PC gaming as I don't have the patience for settings and drivers and compatibility lists and an that shit. But isn't the whole point the ability to upgrade your rig and install custom stuff for a better experience? How exactly does this console do that? It's neat for capturing what Steam can do at the moment, sure. But this'll be outdated by the time it gets out of the box, surely?



Not a big issue as older systems can still play current games at lower settings. When the need really arises they can just release a revision.


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## Ampersound (Jul 15, 2021)

It looks bulky, actually reminds me of the Wii U gamepad.
And I'm pretty concerned about the button placement here. The main buttons all seem to scrunched up at the top, because of those pads.


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## grey72 (Jul 15, 2021)

Blaze163 said:


> I'm not up on PC gaming as I don't have the patience for settings and drivers and compatibility lists and an that shit. But isn't the whole point the ability to upgrade your rig and install custom stuff for a better experience? How exactly does this console do that? It's neat for capturing what Steam can do at the moment, sure. But this'll be outdated by the time it gets out of the box, surely?


Running your own software to do whatever is a bigger draw than upgrades for PC IMO, and you get control down to the choice of OS with this device. And while extremely underpowered compared to anything with a discrete GPU, AFAIK it should be juuust powerful enough to run 95% of all games at lowest settings at 25-30fps, which is terrible but its the price you pay for portability.


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## Kioku_Dreams (Jul 15, 2021)

Windows can be installed on it. RDNA 2 and Zen 2 chips. Granted, this could still be in the ball park of PS4/XOne power. This is actually the first device of its kind that actually grabbed my interest.


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## Jiehfeng (Jul 15, 2021)

Switch OLED preorders start today as well, coincidence?


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## Deleted member 514389 (Jul 15, 2021)

But how available will it be ?

Can I go into a store and buy it at some point ?
What about replacement parts ?
If this is a fad product that'll die soon...


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## linkchidori (Jul 15, 2021)

Jiehfeng said:


> This is amazing, I so hope to get one somehow!
> 
> Also this is probably great news in terms of competition. Maybe it'll help Nintendo try to make more powerful hardware in the future.


TBH i dont see Nintendo wanting to compete in any way, if this happens to be a threat they will probably just ignore it and focus on its own thing. I could even see them sticking to its failure rather than selling a console at a loss and with hardware they wont even use at its fullest.


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## Jiehfeng (Jul 15, 2021)

linkchidori said:


> TBH i dont see Nintendo wanting to compete in any way, if this happens to be a threat they will probably just ignore it and focus on its own thing. I could even see them sticking to its failure rather than selling a console at a loss and with hardware they wont even use at its fullest.



I wouldn't be so certain at least, now the Switch's advantage to having horrible AAA ports is thrown out of the picture with this being decently priced.


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## GoldenBullet (Jul 15, 2021)

If it can run the latest games at 720p with 60fps, my switch is gonna be left sitting with the 3ds


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## linkchidori (Jul 15, 2021)

Jiehfeng said:


> I wouldn't be so certain at least, now the Switch's advantage to having horrible AAA ports is thrown out of the picture with this being decently priced.





Jiehfeng said:


> I wouldn't be so certain at least, now the Switch's advantage to having horrible AAA ports is thrown out of the picture with this being decently priced.


Well, Nintendo doesnt really care much about third parties, thats why the Switch has its specs.


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## Jayro (Jul 15, 2021)

Seriel said:


> Runs SteamOS 3.0, supposedly its now based on Arch Linux for some reason.
> Game support thus relies on Linux and Proton support.
> 
> Apparently they said in a livestream that its not locked down and you can install Windows if you feel like it. Have no source except a friend watching a stream for that one.


Arch is a more "bare bones" OS that they can build up from, so it makes perfect sense to use it as the base for a gaming OS.


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## Jiehfeng (Jul 15, 2021)

linkchidori said:


> Well, Nintendo doesnt really care much about third parties, thats why the Switch has its specs.



They do, especially after the Wii U failed because of it being one of the reasons. There's a big player base who prefer the Switch because of the portable third party titles. To think Nintendo would not respond to this at all would be pretty rare, then again it's Nintendo... But I still wouldn't be so certain they're not going to.


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## Danker301090 (Jul 15, 2021)

dependant on the apu will make me consider this fully.


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## WiiMiiSwitch (Jul 15, 2021)

It looks like my joycons if my joycons gained weight, got hit by a car and did plastic surgery


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## linkchidori (Jul 15, 2021)

Jiehfeng said:


> They do, especially after the Wii U failed because of it being one of the reasons. There's a big player base who prefer the Switch because of the portable third party titles. To think Nintendo would not respond to this at all would be pretty rare, then again it's Nintendo... But I still wouldn't be so certain they're not going to.


The thing here is that i dont see Nintendo nowadays doing something so risky as launching a more powerful console. If they cant produce at a cheap price, i dont see them selling it.


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## cvskid (Jul 15, 2021)

Install windows on this thing, download the nintendo switch emulator yuzu and you are good to go.


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## Jiehfeng (Jul 15, 2021)

linkchidori said:


> The thing here is that i dont see Nintendo nowadays doing something so risky as launching a more powerful console. If they cant produce at a cheap price, i dont see them selling it.



At the same time they're known for _Switching _things up. If Steam can do it for $400, by the time Nintendo does, it would be very likely they could pull it off. But this is all speculation anyway, I'm just happy there's something that could possibly influence Nintendo to go in a more powerful direction at least.


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## Alato (Jul 15, 2021)

Arekkusuda said:


> I knew this reminded me of something-


Beat me to it.


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## Seriel (Jul 15, 2021)

Jayro said:


> Arch is a more "bare bones" OS that they can build up from, so it makes perfect sense to use it as the base for a gaming OS.


I understood that after thinking about it, I just found it interesting since the old SteamOS was based on Debian and they were very proud of it. I suppose even Valve can change with the flowing trends of the Linux community.


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## Hanafuda (Jul 15, 2021)

Screen res is a bit disappointing, but wow it's a damned bargain, innit?


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## Jiehfeng (Jul 15, 2021)

Hanafuda said:


> Screen res is a bit disappointing, but wow it's a damned bargain, innit?



If only it had OLED it would be perfect.


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## BitMasterPlus (Jul 15, 2021)

Yeesh man, more storage always costs more, huh? Either way, I'd like to see a review for this when it comes out since I'm kinda interested in it.


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## Jayro (Jul 15, 2021)

I love how Valve waited until mere hours before the Switch OLED model's preorders go up before dropping their announcement. Absolute savages, lol.


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## Pickle_Rick (Jul 15, 2021)

Switch-like design.
Can drop out of the Steam UI into bog standard Arch Linux KDE.
Dock-able as a desktop PC.
Better than base PS4/XB1 performance GPU wise with a waaaaay better CPU. (RDNA 2 does more per flop then GCN due to architecture improvements.)
Starts at $400.
I cum. Actually take my money. I'm getting the second tier model. Also I see a lot of people saying this might not run 9th gen AAA games. I'd say if it can run 8th gen AAA games at medium to high settings (like we've seen it can). It'll at least be able to run most 9th gen AAA games at low settings.


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## GCS (Jul 15, 2021)

cvskid said:


> Install windows on this thing, download the nintendo switch emulator yuzu and you are good to go.


installing windows on thi would do nothing more than decreasing the performance most probably


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## ZeroFX (Jul 15, 2021)

nice, ill consider it


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## FFTfanatic (Jul 15, 2021)

Hanafuda said:


> Screen res is a bit disappointing, but wow it's a damned bargain, innit?


1080p would have been nice but when it comes to more demanding modern games, 800p better suits the relatively weak spec (weak as in compared to a gaming rig with discrete GPU). With 800p you won't have to lower settings and / or upscale from sub-native resolutions quite so much, plus you can always downsample from a higher resolution if there's resource headroom. 
In that context, I'd sooner 800p than a 1080p screen where I would more often need to compromise on settings and/or upscale from sub-native resolutions.


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## ganons (Jul 15, 2021)

Is there any point on having user submitted news anymore? https://gbatemp.net/threads/steam-deck.591359/


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## MiiJack (Jul 15, 2021)

Wonder if the KFConsole will still be a thing after this.


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## chrisrlink (Jul 15, 2021)

a reservation system might nip the scalper problem in the bud


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## djpannda (Jul 15, 2021)

NO1 Preorder it until I say so... That Way I have a chance to preorder one before they are soldout


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## ganons (Jul 15, 2021)

Jayro said:


> I love how Valve waited until mere hours before the Switch OLED model's preorders go up before dropping their announcement. Absolute savages, lol.



Should have announced it a few days ago really.


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## chrisrlink (Jul 15, 2021)

GCS said:


> Now that steam is releasing a linux based console i am sure that more game devs will develop native linux games


they tried before with steam OS the major issue with that they never updated the OS Debian 8 (a 6 year old version)


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## ov3rkill (Jul 15, 2021)

That's a great news especially for PC gamers. I just hope it won't run out of supply during it's release. Great pricing by the way. Hope to see a review soon. Also, emmc is just way too slow especially when compared to nvme. Those ports are nice to have since it's not only for games, you can do so much with this... basically a portable PC.


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## raxadian (Jul 15, 2021)

Not enough ram, lack of mouse/touchpad and keyboard and you can play more games wasting a bit more and getting a 500 bucks laptop.


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## DocKlokMan (Jul 15, 2021)

Make it a 5" screen, move the touch panels to the rear like the Vita, rearrange the front controls like a Switch/Xbox but keep the dock and I'll replace my Switch Lite.


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## Bladexdsl (Jul 15, 2021)

imagine using the b button on that thing could they possibly put it in a more worse spot?!


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## smf (Jul 15, 2021)

Jayro said:


> Arch is a more "bare bones" OS that they can build up from, so it makes perfect sense to use it as the base for a gaming OS.



I would have thought it was more likely one of the reasons here

https://wiki.archlinux.org/title/arch_compared_to_other_distributions#Debian

They could just install a minimal debian.


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## DbGt (Jul 15, 2021)

But wouldnt AAA games run super slow off a microsd card? wouldnt loading times be eternal?


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## zoogie (Jul 15, 2021)

Veho said:


> I love the competitive pricing. Not having to pay a Windows license is probably part of it.
> Is it just me or does the design remind you of the Sega Game Gear?


The 2 hour battery life certainly does.


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## ov3rkill (Jul 15, 2021)

Bladexdsl said:


> imagine using the b button on that thing could they possibly put it in a more worse spot?!


Oh yeah, now that you mentioned it. The controller layout sucks really bad. It totally makes the Switch joycons ergonomic when compared to that Steam Deck controller.


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## CompSciOrBust (Jul 15, 2021)

Not going to get one of these but portable Halo sounds very enticing.


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## AncientBoi (Jul 15, 2021)

I am really really considering this.


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## The Catboy (Jul 15, 2021)

I can’t wait for 1 year on the market before Valve gets bored of it and stops production


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## GCS (Jul 15, 2021)

chrisrlink said:


> they tried before with steam OS the major issue with that they never updated the OS Debian 8 (a 6 year old version)


SteamOS Debian is a dead project but proton kept recieving updates and now in Linux it is pretty safe to say that you can run 90% of well-known titles without an issue.
One of the reasons old SteamOS failed was because of the Linux support but now that Proton is in this level I don't see an issue with it and the good pricing is another extra point.


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## Chrisssj2 (Jul 15, 2021)

For us pirates. this thing is useless.
Also no dlss get ouf here. And no dlss means no raytracing.
And all this for 720p gaming.


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## Prans (Jul 15, 2021)

ganons said:


> Is there any point on having user submitted news anymore? https://gbatemp.net/threads/steam-deck.591359/


There is a point. If they are front page worthy,are brought to our attention and properly fleshed out, we promote them as is. If they include 4 words and a video with no proper sentences, they'll need more work, so it's worth making a new post altogether.


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## K3N1 (Jul 15, 2021)

Ah so the switch finally has competition har har.


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## zoogie (Jul 15, 2021)

Rejected product title: Pocket Ripper.

Seriously, it will rip your pocket it's so big 
Kinda deserves the title for being powerful as well (and also for the AMD chips).

The size comparison is actually pretty O.O
Steam Deck:
11.73 x 4.61 x 1.93 inches   1.47lbs

Switch redbox:
9.4 x 4.00 x .55 inches   0.88lbs

The Deck has almost 5x the cubic inches, egad. You might as well just pack up your gaming laptop instead.


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## Xzi (Jul 15, 2021)

Zen 2 + RDNA 2 for $399?  Holy shit.  This is more powerful than a PS4.  I could've done with one less touchpad, but it's quite tempting regardless, even for somebody who already owns a Switch.  My Steam library is *UUGE* after all.


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## Owenge (Jul 15, 2021)

Chrisssj2 said:


> For us pirates. this thing is useless.
> Also no dlss get ouf here. And no dlss means no raytracing.
> And all this for 720p gaming.


"Pirating" - You can install windows 10 onto the device.
"no DLSS" - DLSS is a Nvidia exclusive but Amd has something similar which will most likely be included (fidelityfx).
"no ray tracing" - Just like the PS5 and Xbox series x Zen 2 + RDNA 2 does support ray tracing.


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## Chary (Jul 15, 2021)

The thing is darn ugly, and it looks way too wide or heavy to be comfortable to hold.

"2-8 hours" of gameplay is also concerning lol. I'd almost just rather clip my phone into a controller case and game stream with it instead, if only I had wifi in my house. 

...that being said, time to pre-order it, I guess.


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## pedro702 (Jul 15, 2021)

those 4 buttons on top right corner seems to be very bad to hit since they are right next to the analogue stick and on the corner of the console itself, no idea why they putted the buttons so far away, either way this will end up like steambox stuff, because people who do pc gaming want 4k 120hz this days and make fun of console gamers for not having that much power so this wont satisfy most pc gamers imo.


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## digipimp75 (Jul 15, 2021)

i wanna slap my balls on it


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## Xzi (Jul 15, 2021)

Chary said:


> The thing is darn ugly, and it looks way too wide or heavy to be comfortable to hold.


The joy-cons have the opposite problem, do they not?  Uncomfortable because they're so thin and have bad button placement.  Steam Deck looks closer to the thickness of the Hori Splitpad Pro, which is obviously far more comfortable.



Chary said:


> "2-8 hours" of gameplay is also concerning lol.


Attempting to squeeze every frame out of the latest AAA games versus playing 2D indie titles is what gives that big range.


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## Shenrai (Jul 15, 2021)

Does it matter if the purchase on steam was free or not? My sister has an account with only one free game purchased so I was wondering if that satisfies the requirement.


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## Chary (Jul 15, 2021)

Xzi said:


> The joy-cons have the opposite problem, do they not?  Uncomfortable because they're so thin and have bad button placement.  Steam Deck looks closer to the thickness of the Hori Splitpad Pro, which is obviously far more comfortable.
> 
> 
> Attempting to squeeze every frame out of the latest AAA games versus playing 2D indie titles is what gives that big range.


I genuinely find the Joy-Cons to be comfortable honestly. Especially against the chonky Split Pad Pro. I'm the kind of person who thinks the Elite 2 controller is "heavy" though, so maybe I need to stop skipping arm day 

Yeah the battery is probably fine, though I'm curious how skewed it is. 3-4 hours for 60fps mid tier AAA games should be fine, really. I just don't want launch Switch with its 2 hours for BOTW lol.


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## BLsquared (Jul 15, 2021)

That's a nifty device.


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## LightyKD (Jul 15, 2021)

I'm definitely picking up one of these babies! I'm kinda disappointed  at the lack of a second USB-C port and it would have been nice to have e-GPU support via the dock but as long as I can play and charge from that USB-C port, I'll definitely be making more of those Steam Cards I'm using on my current Windows tablet. BTW, anyone reckon this device would be good for some basic VR gaming? I see that the dock only has one USB 3.0 port. I'm curious as to whether I can replace my gaming PC with this thing or if I still need to keep it around.


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## ILuvGames (Jul 15, 2021)

I see very few UK gamers buying it because our beloved HMRC (Her Majesty's Revenue and Customs) are greedy bastards when it comes to import duty and taxes. That $649 for the most expensive model will inflate to about $830 (~£600) for us. And the extra money for the various SSD storage options above the base unit is extortionate. Think i'll stick with my Win 3 as it was certainly better value than this and from a company with shirt buttons for a net worth compared to Valve.


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## Chrisssj2 (Jul 15, 2021)

Owenge said:


> "Pirating" - You can install windows 10 onto the device.
> "no DLSS" - DLSS is a Nvidia exclusive but Amd has something similar which will most likely be included (fidelityfx).
> "no ray tracing" - Just like the PS5 and Xbox series x Zen 2 + RDNA 2 does support ray tracing.


How can you install windows 10? 
Also.. it may support it, but without dlss i doubt it will have the needed performance.


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## NoNAND (Jul 15, 2021)

Seriel said:


> Runs SteamOS 3.0, supposedly its now based on Arch Linux for some reason.
> Game support thus relies on Linux and Proton support.
> 
> Apparently they said in a livestream that its not locked down and you can install Windows if you feel like it. Have no source except a friend watching a stream for that one.


Tl:dr.
Aya neo handheld is better


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## Chrisssj2 (Jul 15, 2021)

CompSciOrBust said:


> Not going to get one of these but portable Halo sounds very enticing.


Already have that with the switch. Moonlight baby!


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## DarkCoffe64 (Jul 15, 2021)

If you can mod this thing up and put yuzu or whatever in it, then it'll literally be a switch killer, lmao.


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## Veho (Jul 15, 2021)

NoNAND said:


> Tl:dr.
> Aya neo handheld is better


It also costs twice as much.


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## FlameSpeedster (Jul 15, 2021)

More options in the PC gaming handheld market is good.


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## mspy (Jul 15, 2021)

Chrisssj2 said:


> How can you install windows 10?
> Also.. it may support it, but without dlss i doubt it will have the needed performance.


Dude the thing is a portable PC and as such you can install any OS you like, it just comes with SteamOS by default. They mention this on their FAQ.
As for DLSS that's an Nvidia only technology, the good news is that AMD (which is powering this device) has a DLSS-like technology which may be even better because it's open source and does not require any special hardware to run (discounting very old GPUs) only thing that it needs is for the devs to update their games to support it which according to reviews of the thing its not that hard to do because unlike DLSS it doesn't even require your game to be trained with AI, the technology it's called FSR.


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## Xzi (Jul 15, 2021)

Chrisssj2 said:


> How can you install windows 10?


By just...installing it.  Put it on an mSD or USB drive.  It's a portable PC, anything you can do with a laptop you can do with Steam Deck.


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## gudenau (Jul 15, 2021)

I am happy that it's not an OLED, but I am disappointed that it's not ZEN 3.


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## Owenge (Jul 15, 2021)

Chrisssj2 said:


> How can you install windows 10?
> Also.. it may support it, but without dlss i doubt it will have the needed performance.


Valve: "
Do I need a Steam account to use Steam Deck?
The default Steam Deck experience requires a Steam account (it's free!). Games are purchased and downloaded using the Steam Store. That said, Steam Deck is a PC so you can install third party software and operating systems."

Source - https://store.steampowered.com/steamdeck


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## Hanafuda (Jul 15, 2021)

FFTfanatic said:


> 1080p would have been nice but when it comes to more demanding modern games, 800p better suits the relatively weak spec (weak as in compared to a gaming rig with discrete GPU). With 800p you won't have to lower settings and / or upscale from sub-native resolutions quite so much, plus you can always downsample from a higher resolution if there's resource headroom.
> In that context, I'd sooner 800p than a 1080p screen where I would more often need to compromise on settings and/or upscale from sub-native resolutions.



Yeah I know. It's a nit-pick, in the big picture.


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## Chrisssj2 (Jul 15, 2021)

mspy said:


> Dude the thing is a portable PC and as such you can install any OS you like, it just comes with SteamOS by default. They mention this on their FAQ.
> As for DLSS that's an Nvidia only technology, the good news is that AMD (which is powering this device) has a DLSS-like technology which may be even better because it's open source and does not require any special hardware to run (discounting very old GPUs) only thing that it needs is for the devs to update their games to support it which according to reviews of the thing its not that hard to do because unlike DLSS it doesn't even require your game to be trained with AI, the technology it's called FSR.


DLSS no longer also rquires training by A.I just so you know. And at this point DLSS is still superiour.


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## AirbusX (Jul 15, 2021)

Day 1 Purchase for me


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## Chrisssj2 (Jul 15, 2021)

"It will have 1.69tflops or thereabouts. The new Arya Neo lands at around 1.1" for GPD win 3. this will have like 1.6 to 2 teraflops? yet to be determined. So performance on similiar level as GPD win 3? 
How? When they are using a dedicated graphics unit as per the GPD win and such use intel internal proc GPU?


----------



## GBADWB (Jul 15, 2021)

Chrisssj2 said:


> DLSS no longer also rquires training by A.I just so you know. And at this point DLSS is still superiour.



its not superior in all fronts, one of the big things DLSS introduces is ghosting in some situations, due to the fact that its a temporal and motion vector based upscaling tech.



> "It will have 1.69tflops or thereabouts. The new Arya Neo lands at around 1.1" for GPD win 3. this will have like 1.6 to 2 teraflops? yet to be determined. So performance on similiar level as GPD win 3?
> How? When they are using a dedicated graphics unit as per the GPD win and such use intel internal proc GPU?



tflops between vendors are not exactly comparable. its only when youre comparing flops from one AMD device to another, or one nvidia device to another where its more accurate.


----------



## Tom Bombadildo (Jul 15, 2021)

Chrisssj2 said:


> "It will have 1.69tflops or thereabouts. The new Arya Neo lands at around 1.1" for GPD win 3. this will have like 1.6 to 2 teraflops? yet to be determined. So performance on similiar level as GPD win 3?
> How? When they are using a dedicated graphics unit as per the GPD win and such use intel internal proc GPU?


They're not using dedicated graphics, they're using an APU. The integrated graphics are simply RDNA 2 based compute units, whereas past AMD APUs were Vega based.


----------



## Xzi (Jul 15, 2021)

Chrisssj2 said:


> DLSS no longer also rquires training by A.I just so you know. And at this point DLSS is still superiour.


DLSS would be great...if it wasn't limited to only two series of GPUs that nobody can buy at reasonable prices.  As a GTX 1000 series owner, I have to wait for AMD to provide some facsimile of DLSS for my card, and that's really quite pathetic on Nvidia's part.


----------



## mspy (Jul 15, 2021)

Chrisssj2 said:


> DLSS no longer also rquires training by A.I just so you know. And at this point DLSS is still superiour.


Any proof or I am to take your word for it? Is there any games that even support DLSS and FSR at the same time so you can compare which one is better?

Also DLSS is an AI based technology which requires training, what they did was eliminate the per-game training that DLSS 1.0 fiasco required. If anything, for the simple fact that FSR is open source and not proprietary like DLSS (FSR even supports nvidia GPUs) devs will most likely support FSR 100%, making it open source was truly a genius move by AMD.


----------



## Foxi4 (Jul 15, 2021)

Xzi said:


> DLSS would be great...if it wasn't limited to only two series of GPUs that nobody can buy at reasonable prices.  As a GTX 1000 series owner, I have to wait for AMD to provide some facsimile of DLSS for my card, and that's really quite pathetic on Nvidia's part.


As far as I know, FSR already works on 10-series GPU's, if that's what you're waiting for.


----------



## 64bitmodels (Jul 15, 2021)

399 for a portable handheld gaming pc.
youre joking
i think i read that wrong
this is actually affordable.
bout the price of a digital ps5 as well
thank you valve


----------



## Xzi (Jul 15, 2021)

Foxi4 said:


> As far as I know, FSR already works on 10-series GPU's, if that's what you're waiting for.


I suppose that was bad phrasing.  I am excited to see the technology improve further, but at the moment I'm more than happy enough with what my GPU can do natively at 1440p.


----------



## 64bitmodels (Jul 15, 2021)

linkchidori said:


> The thing here is that i dont see Nintendo nowadays doing something so risky as launching a more powerful console. If they cant produce at a cheap price, i dont see them selling it.


the oled is the first nintendo console to go above 300- im pretty sure nintendo doesnt care about making their stuff cheap anymore. especially considering the price of all of their triple A exclusives


----------



## Lodad (Jul 15, 2021)

EDIT: It's going to have a 2230 (a very small form factor, smaller than current 2280 standard) M.2 slot for the SSD, and the top-end model is apparently going to offer high-end anti-glare glass for the screen. Who knows if the LCD itself will offer anything special. But, the important part is that the $250 larger price tag might just make sense due to the fact that a 512GB 2230 M.2 drive actually costs that much from a quality brand. Hopefully by the time it comes out, there will be aftermarket solutions available for the less premium models that can at least close the gap in storage for a better price.

The SD card slot bit tells me you can't use your own M.2 drives. I ain't spending $250 more for 512 GB when you can get a 1 TB Samsung SSD for $159.

So what are you gonna do, play two hours of Candy Crush before your battery dies? If you've got bangin' internet and a really good data connection, I'd understand using this for Steam Link on the go (or in your house like an excited time traveler from 2012 who wanted the Wii U to play PC games) and therefore not really needing the storage, but 512 GB is like four AAA games nowadays. And I'm way out of the loop on SteamOS, but is there even full compatibility across the Steam Library for PC games? What could the graphics capabilities of this mobile AMD chipset be?

I was more enthusiastic about the other handheld PCs that have been announced over the past year (was it AYA NEO and another GPDWin product?), but I really like the touch pads on Valve's controllers, so I'm a bit conflicted.


----------



## Xzi (Jul 15, 2021)

64bitmodels said:


> 399 for a portable handheld gaming pc.
> youre joking
> i think i read that wrong
> this is actually affordable.
> ...


Make no mistake, in the current climate it will sell out quickly, but yeah it's a great device at a stellar price point.  If I didn't already have a solid gaming desktop, I'd use it with the dock as my main PC.


----------



## 64bitmodels (Jul 15, 2021)

Xzi said:


> Make no mistake, in the current climate it will sell out quickly, but yeah it's a great device at a stellar price point.  If I didn't already have a solid gaming desktop, I'd use it with the dock as my main PC.


i wont use it as a main pc or anything but damn that price point is competitive

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------



raxadian said:


> Not enough ram, lack of mouse/touchpad and keyboard and you can play more games wasting a bit more and getting a 500 bucks laptop.


how is 16 gb not enough ram???


----------



## ZeroT21 (Jul 15, 2021)

Guess pc's and consoles are the same


----------



## shadow1w2 (Jul 15, 2021)

Oh this looks nice.
I loved the Steam controller and this seems a logical step in the right direction.
Controller design wise that is.
Does look a little cramped though.

I've been waiting for something like this for a long time and looking forward to see how emulation handles on it.

Switch is still good for casual local multiplayer though so I dont see myself abandoning it completely.

Though without restrictions I could just grab a small 8bitdo pad to carry around and toss to friend. Hmm.

Really hope this does well and promotes more open non restricted platforms.
Even if it doesnt do well its already doing a lot of things I like.


----------



## the_randomizer (Jul 15, 2021)

With chip shortages included? Sign me up!


----------



## 64bitmodels (Jul 15, 2021)

the_randomizer said:


> With chip shortages included? Sign me up!


that's the biggest problem here- then again if they do a reservation system for the preorders it could work itself out


----------



## gamesquest1 (Jul 15, 2021)

nice, I know valve have a habit of bringing something to market then quietly dropping it, but at least with a big company behind it you know the quality is going to be consistent and not pushed to the limit where it dies within a few months and the warranty process being such a pain it becomes impossible to even bother with, here hoping there is just user accessible M.2 slot to upgrade the storage on the base model as M.2 SSD's are pretty affordable at this point and you could pick up a 1TB M.2 drive for cheaper than difference between the base model and the 512gb model


----------



## CompSciOrBust (Jul 15, 2021)

Chrisssj2 said:


> Already have that with the switch. Moonlight baby!


My laptop has an AMD apu and my Switch is Mariko so it can't use xCloud via android.


----------



## the_randomizer (Jul 16, 2021)

64bitmodels said:


> that's the biggest problem here- then again if they do a reservation system for the preorders it could work itself out



I wouldn't bank on it. Don't forget those conceited prick scalpers too.


----------



## gamesquest1 (Jul 16, 2021)

the_randomizer said:


> I wouldn't bank on it. Don't forget those conceited prick scalpers too.


I think valve have the perfect store front where they could weight pre-orders going to long time steam users or regular steam users to limit the amount scalped, sure you would need to deal with people buying just to flip, but hey ho better than 20 million dummy accounts being made spamming buy orders

all that said I doubt this will suffer the same fate as GPU/CPU scalpers, its still a fairly niche target audience, and nobody should be buying up thermally throttled devices to mine crypto on or other such nonsense


----------



## 64bitmodels (Jul 16, 2021)

gamesquest1 said:


> I think valve have the perfect store front where they could weight pre-orders going to long time steam users or regular steam users to limit the amount scalped, sure you would need to deal with people buying just to flip, but hey ho better than 20 million dummy accounts being made spamming buy orders
> 
> all that said I doubt this will suffer the same fate as GPU/CPU scalpers, its still a fairly niche target audience, and nobody should be buying up thermally throttled devices to mine crypto on or other such nonsense


plus hardware prices are going down as we're slowly getting ourselves out of the pandemic and the semiconductor shortage


----------



## the_randomizer (Jul 16, 2021)

gamesquest1 said:


> I think valve have the perfect store front where they could weight pre-orders going to long time steam users or regular steam users to limit the amount scalped, sure you would need to deal with people buying just to flip, but hey ho better than 20 million dummy accounts being made spamming buy orders
> 
> all that said I doubt this will suffer the same fate as GPU/CPU scalpers, its still a fairly niche target audience, and nobody should be buying up thermally throttled devices to mine crypto on or other such nonsense



I've heard GPU prices are finally starting to stabilize a bit, so maybe it'll be fine. I already have a Series X, PS5 and PC, and it looks cool, but the price....


----------



## WiiHomebrew+Snes (Jul 16, 2021)

Very interested to see what this thing is capable of. Especially in terms of emulation. But considering the base model is only 64 GB and not even NVME you really have to go for that 256GB model. At the very least there's SD upgradability.


----------



## gamesquest1 (Jul 16, 2021)

yeah I would personally just wait for the reviews to come in, I can't imagine there will be insurmountable demand, I'm sure maybe there will be a few weeks of scalpers hoping its the next snes mini or whatever trying to flip them for double, but that should die off pretty quickly


----------



## nero99 (Jul 16, 2021)

I'd rather get a NEO. this thing looks like a pain to play on.


----------



## Xzi (Jul 16, 2021)

nero99 said:


> I'd rather get a NEO. this thing looks like a pain to play on.


Don't judge based on one picture.  Here you go (I know, yuck IGN):



The way the back of it is contoured is almost exactly like the back of the Hori Splitpad Pro, and I know for a fact that's comfortable in my hands.


----------



## diggeloid (Jul 16, 2021)

WiiHomebrew+Snes said:


> Very interested to see what this thing is capable of. Especially in terms of emulation. But considering the base model is only 64 GB and not even NVME you really have to go for that 256GB model. At the very least there's SD upgradability.



I have like all my Switch games on the SD card and the load times are fine (except for Pillars of Eternity, fuck that literal scam). 

Obviously it depends on the game, but if Nintendo can get away with selling a 64gb Switch I'm sure this thing will do fine. If you're planning to use it as an actual PC though, then that upgraded storage is definitely a must have.


----------



## 64bitmodels (Jul 16, 2021)

how about we start a handheld pc war between the steam deck and the aya neo


----------



## Xzi (Jul 16, 2021)

WiiHomebrew+Snes said:


> Very interested to see what this thing is capable of. Especially in terms of emulation. But considering the base model is only 64 GB and not even NVME you really have to go for that 256GB model. At the very least there's SD upgradability.


I'm probably just going to reserve the $400 model myself, being that the majority of storage space will come from mSDs anyway, and I've got a bunch of them already.  Load times aren't too bad, worse than nvme by a bit, but still far better than mechanical HDDs.

Then again, I will probably have more than enough money by December to splurge a little, and not having to buy a case separately would be nice.  Including the dock would've really sold me on the first upgrade tier.


----------



## smf (Jul 16, 2021)

the_randomizer said:


> I've heard GPU prices are finally starting to stabilize a bit, so maybe it'll be fine.



The main thing pushing graphics card prices up was miners, but they have started dumping them on the market now that btc has crashed.

Embedded GPU did not really suffer the same issue, it was just a problem getting hold of them.


----------



## krasaty (Jul 16, 2021)

If GBAtemp is able to do an early review or q&a with valve over this, the NVMe slot is definitely something to be looked at/asked about. Even if it's difficult to open to get to it, being able to upgrade internal storage yourself would be a must here. I can't imagine there being a difference in PCBs for 3 versions of the product. The 64gb model likely just has the emmc connected via an m.2 slot.


----------



## Xzi (Jul 16, 2021)

krasaty said:


> I can't imagine there being a difference in PCBs for 3 versions of the product. The 64gb model likely just has the emmc connected via an m.2 slot.


"64 GB eMMC (PCIe Gen 2 x1)
256 GB NVMe SSD (PCIe Gen 3 x4)
512 GB high-speed NVMe SSD (PCIe Gen 3 x4)"

So yeah I guess that would be a fair amount slower.  Probably be worth getting the 256 GB model just to have the option of putting a bigger SSD in later, if nothing else.


----------



## FFTfanatic (Jul 16, 2021)

Official FAQ session


----------



## Xzi (Jul 16, 2021)

FFTfanatic said:


> Official FAQ session



"The internal storage is not upgradable."

Well that's a bummer, but with a portable I shouldn't have issues making due with about 750 GB of total space anyway.


----------



## gamesquest1 (Jul 16, 2021)

FFTfanatic said:


> Official FAQ session



ooof, come on valve, you're a PC gamer market, people want at least the most basic upgradability, sure ram when you're squishing a PC to be as small as possible is probably better fixed, but they should've found a way to make the internal storage end user replaceable (beyond a SD card), I guess the dock should allow you to have cheap huge storage, but a end user replaceable SSD would've been nice

I'm hoping it is just a standard M.2 drive inside and they just mean its not user replaceable*.......*unless you rip the console apart, although it wouldn't surprise me if they soldered it all down on the motherboard,


----------



## krasaty (Jul 16, 2021)

Xzi said:


> "The internal storage is not upgradable."
> 
> Well that's a bummer, but with a portable I shouldn't have issues making due with about 750 GB of total space anyway.


Definitely disappointing if internal storage is truly not upgradable in any way. Hoping them saying it's not just means it's prohibitively difficult to do so though.


----------



## Tom Bombadildo (Jul 16, 2021)

Xzi said:


> "The internal storage is not upgradable."
> 
> Well that's a bummer, but with a portable I shouldn't have issues making due with about 750 GB of total space anyway.


I honestly doubt it's "not upgradeable" so much as "not recommended for the average person", it's a bog standard PC after all. Unless they do something really dumb like not include an M.2 slot and solder the storage to the board or something, there's no reason someone couldn't just tear it down and slap something in there. Whether it'll be easy to do is something else, but honestly unless they do something really stupid with the construction of the thing I expect the day it ships to anyone mildly good at DIY there will be tutorials on how to do it.


----------



## FFTfanatic (Jul 16, 2021)

krasaty said:


> Definitely disappointing if internal storage is truly not upgradable in any way. Hoping them saying it's not just means it's prohibitively difficult to do so though.


You can be sure that even if it is possible, it will invalidate your warranty, so better to attempt once expired.


----------



## Xzi (Jul 16, 2021)

Tom Bombadildo said:


> I honestly doubt it's "not upgradeable" so much as "not recommended for the average person", it's a bog standard PC after all. Unless they do something really dumb like not include an M.2 slot and solder the storage to the board or something, there's no reason someone couldn't just tear it down and slap something in there. Whether it'll be easy to do is something else, but honestly unless they do something really stupid with the construction of the thing I expect the day it ships to anyone mildly good at DIY there will be tutorials on how to do it.


It's a PCIe Gen3 x4 slot, and it will be very interesting to see a teardown of this thing.  They said everything is crammed in there very tight, so it might all be fixed to the main board.


----------



## Tom Bombadildo (Jul 16, 2021)

Xzi said:


> It's a PCIe Gen3 x4 slot, and it will be very interesting to see a teardown of this thing.  They said everything is crammed in there very tight, so it might all be fixed to the main board.


The thing is they don't explicitly specify whether it's a _slot,_ just that it's a PCIe x4 _interface_. Doesn't necessarily mean they're shoving an M.2 slot in there. It's possible they'll just solder the NAND and controller to the board if it's as "tight" as they claim, which would totally suck. Hopefully it's just an M.2 slot though.


----------



## smf (Jul 16, 2021)

Tom Bombadildo said:


> Hopefully it's just an M.2 slot though.



But if it's not and you pre-order the emmc one, then you're screwed.

If it is an m2, it'll probably be something tiny like 30mm.


----------



## Snintendog (Jul 16, 2021)

Tom Bombadildo said:


> I honestly doubt it's "not upgradeable" so much as "not recommended for the average person", it's a bog standard PC after all. Unless they do something really dumb like not include an M.2 slot and solder the storage to the board or something, there's no reason someone couldn't just tear it down and slap something in there. Whether it'll be easy to do is something else, but honestly unless they do something really stupid with the construction of the thing I expect the day it ships to anyone mildly good at DIY there will be tutorials on how to do it.


I mean if its on board it would be cheaper to just use a standard m2 than to solder it on for 3 different skus and repariblility would suck ass if they did solder it on.


----------



## Sterophonick (Jul 16, 2021)

>working with anticheat vendors for proton support
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA

Seriously this'll be a big dub for Linux gaming


----------



## Tom Bombadildo (Jul 16, 2021)

Snintendog said:


> I mean if its on board it would be cheaper to just use a standard m2 than to solder it on for 3 different skus and repariblility would suck ass if they did solder it on.


That's what I would expect as well, yeah, but given the insane price bump they're charging for storage it's not something that can be totally ruled out. An extra $130 for a 256GB NVMe is nonsensical, but if you account the additional manufacturing costs for different skus...it makes more sense. Not that I expect it to be true of course, I'm sure the price bump is purely there so they can lessen the amount of money they're undoubtedly losing on these things based on what Gabe said in an interview lol.


----------



## Xzi (Jul 16, 2021)

Sterophonick said:


> >working with anticheat vendors for proton support
> AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
> 
> Seriously this'll be a big dub for Linux gaming


Yeah I've heard some good things about compatibility with Proton lately, and this device will be great for familiarizing myself more with Linux.  Doubt I'll even bother dual booting, or if I do it'll be a different Linux distro.


----------



## Bauti (Jul 16, 2021)

PC gaming laptops get pretty damn warm, I have a feeling this thing will burn your hands when trying to deal with any current PC game.

Also I don't think many people realize that switch games are like 16 GBs max, versus the massive sizes of nowadays PC games like Tekken 7, MH World, Resident Evil, etc.


----------



## smf (Jul 16, 2021)

Snintendog said:


> I mean if its on board it would be cheaper to just use a standard m2 than to solder it on for 3 different skus and repariblility would suck ass if they did solder it on.



It's probably cheaper to do three pcb runs than stuff them individually by hand during assembly. It'll be more reliable too.


----------



## GBADWB (Jul 16, 2021)

on a tinkerers note, i wonder how well the RNDA2 igpu can undervolt


----------



## Sterophonick (Jul 16, 2021)

Xzi said:


> Yeah I've heard some good things about compatibility with Proton lately, and this device will be great for familiarizing myself more with Linux.  Doubt I'll even bother dual booting, or if I do it'll be a different Linux distro.



I gave Linux a fair shot for 3 months and found basically every base was taken, but gaming (especially with frontends) is just not quite there yet. Hopefully this machine can significantly boost adoption!


----------



## FFTfanatic (Jul 16, 2021)

I'll be getting it regardless, but for anybody wondering about relative weight for prolonged portable play sessions, particularly if for medical reasons, the Steam Deck, like the Neo and GPD Wins before it, is a heavy little fella.

At approx 669g it's over 50% heavier than the Switch with joycons, and not that much lighter than a 12.9 inch iPad Pro from 2017.


----------



## Xzi (Jul 16, 2021)

Bauti said:


> PC gaming laptops get pretty damn warm, I have a feeling this thing will burn your hands when trying to deal with any current PC game.


No chance they're using an all-metal enclosure/grips, and it's pretty damn thick.  They either fit one big ass fan in there or two smaller ones.  And since clock speeds and power draw are both entirely up to the end user's preference, I don't see overheating becoming a big issue.


----------



## MarkDarkness (Jul 16, 2021)

120% getting this.


----------



## samuzomoxo (Jul 16, 2021)

duplicate


----------



## the_randomizer (Jul 16, 2021)

smf said:


> The main thing pushing graphics card prices up was miners, but they have started dumping them on the market now that btc has crashed.
> 
> Embedded GPU did not really suffer the same issue, it was just a problem getting hold of them.



Good, screw those cryptomining douchebags. Now I can get an RTX 3060 TI...eventually.


----------



## FFTfanatic (Jul 16, 2021)

Bauti said:


> PC gaming laptops get pretty damn warm, I have a feeling this thing will burn your hands when trying to deal with any current PC game.
> 
> Also I don't think many people realize that switch games are like 16 GBs max, versus the massive sizes of nowadays PC games like Tekken 7, MH World, Resident Evil, etc.


Nah, PC gaming laptops tend to be pushing for a much higher target in terms of performance and image quality. Not only are they typically aimed at pushing several times more pixels than just 800p, with much higher refresh rates, but they also have to provide power to a much bigger screen. Moreover, they have the majority of their chassis insulated by whatever surface they are rested on.

This thing has a much smaller screen with a relatively low resolution and native refresh rate, and hand grips meaning the majority of its chassis will be exposed to the air for better heat dissipation.

(Btw, Switch game installs can go higher than 16gb. The biggest install is something like 33gb, one of the NBA2K games).


----------



## mattyxarope (Jul 16, 2021)

the_randomizer said:


> I've heard GPU prices are finally starting to stabilize a bit, so maybe it'll be fine. and it looks cool, but the price....



You really out here complaining about the price Mr. "I already have a Series X, PS5 and PC"?


----------



## wolffangalchemist (Jul 16, 2021)

The buttons could be placed better seems like they got pushed to the edge, and the track pad thing from the steam controller makes a bit more sense here but that really could be mapped to the analog.... my only qualms and this would be personal ones with the idea of this, is that i already have a gaming pc and there really isn't anything i can think of off the top of my head i need to play or really have time to play on a portable that i couldn't play on pc or a console. for those who travel a lot i can see it being a great thing but i don't really need another gaming pc and i have my gaming laptop for travel, i can't see this being more cost effective or having as much storage. now a newer GPU in that price range..... but i digress, just one of those not really for me things. hence my switch stays docked.


----------



## RedBlueGreen (Jul 16, 2021)

Seriel said:


> Runs SteamOS 3.0, supposedly its now based on Arch Linux for some reason.
> Game support thus relies on Linux and Proton support.
> 
> Apparently they said in a livestream that its not locked down and you can install Windows if you feel like it. Have no source except a friend watching a stream for that one.


I'd say either use Kubuntu or Windows 11 with the bloat and telemetry disabled on something like this, unless it's using desktop components which I doubt. Regardless of how good this custom APU is if it's a mobile CPU we can expect to be playing games at low-medium settings. As cool as these things are, I really think a good laptop and controller are better. Especially with how bad that button placement is.

Oh and SteamOS 3 being Arch-based seems weird. I get that Arch is basically bleeding edge, but stuff can break between updates. The one thing I hate about Linux (besides WINE not working for a bunch of general lack of software support) is how fragmented everything is because of the different distros. There's commercial software that only supports on CentOS, and some commercial stuff that only supports Debian/Ubuntu, etc. Sure a lot of people make scripts that let you install on the other distros, but that's beside the point. Supporting Ubuntu and other Debian based distros makes the most sense for stability and amount of users. Yes, Proton will still support Ubuntu, but being Arch based makes me think SteamOS will run into issues down the line.


----------



## Jayro (Jul 16, 2021)

Imagine installing Windows to this thing, and then firing up Yuzu (or that other forgettable Switch emulator) and playing Switch games at full speed. That's a dream come true, and definitely worth the price for the 256GB model.


----------



## Prior22 (Jul 16, 2021)

How can anyone call this a switch killer? The switch has tons of games you can’t play on any other platform.

This device simply allows you to play PC games on the go. So there’s no exclusivity.


----------



## Jayro (Jul 16, 2021)

Prior22 said:


> The face buttons are in a terrible location.  Same thing for the dpad. Why put them in those spots?
> 
> Also how can anyone call this a switch killer? The switch has tons of games you can’t play on any other platform.
> 
> This device simply allows you to play PC games on the go. So there’s no exclusivity.


Install Windows on it, and you can literally play Switch games on it.


----------



## wolffangalchemist (Jul 16, 2021)

Jayro said:


> Imagine installing Windows to this thing, and then firing up Yuzu (or that other forgettable Switch emulator) and playing Switch games at full speed. That's a dream come true, and definitely worth the price for the 256GB model.


i have doubts about full speed on 4 cores 8 threads on a APU. maybe though... i haven't really dabbled with  Yuzu at all so i don't know how far along it is as a emulator.


----------



## Tom Bombadildo (Jul 16, 2021)

Jayro said:


> Imagine installing Windows to this thing, and then firing up Yuzu (or that other forgettable Switch emulator) and playing Switch games at full speed. That's a dream come true, and definitely worth the price for the 256GB model.


I do love playing Switch games on my GPD Win 3. Finally, a way to enjoy Switch games but on the go!!


----------



## The Real Jdbye (Jul 16, 2021)

It looks nice. I like the inclusion of trackpads as the Steam Controller works so well for mouse/kb games, although they look a bit small, and aren't concave like the Steam Controller's which might make them harder to use.
That screen bezel is gigantic for 2021, feels like a lot of wasted space but maybe it's so packed on the inside a larger screen just wouldn't fit.
I wonder if the cheapest model has an empty NVMe slot that can be populated, or if the boards are different, or if the SSD is soldered on (probably the latter sadly, seeing as how that's the popular thing to do these days)
That price looks pretty good. 64 GB is uselessly small though. Sure you can expand the storage with a microSD but microSDs are laughably slow when it comes to random read/write performance. The experience on the base model with only slow eMMC and MicroSD storage is probably going to be about equivalent to a mechanical HDD. And nobody wants that. Spend the extra, don't go for the base model.
Of course it isn't available here in Norway, we get shafted by Valve once again. The Valve Index _still_ isn't available here.


Seriel said:


> Runs SteamOS 3.0, supposedly its now based on Arch Linux for some reason.
> Game support thus relies on Linux and Proton support.
> 
> Apparently they said in a livestream that its not locked down and you can install Windows if you feel like it. Have no source except a friend watching a stream for that one.


It says on the reservation page that you can install other OSes.


----------



## WhiteMaze (Jul 16, 2021)

I'm going to defend Nintendo here. The Switch OLED is the best system by far and ..

**laughs histerically*

*wipes tear of laughter**

Nah just joking, how do I pre-order this thing?


----------



## Tom Bombadildo (Jul 16, 2021)

wolffangalchemist said:


> i have doubts about full speed on 4 cores 8 threads on a APU. maybe though... i haven't really dabbled with  Yuzu at all so i don't know how far along it is as a emulator.


It'll do it no problem. Switch emulation is quite "easy" to run for the most part, and with Zen 2 cores there's no doubt something like Yuzu would be mostly playable. My GPD Win 3 manages quite well for most games, I've been playing Skyward Sword HD on it 60fps no problems. Yuzu can only utilize 6 threads anyways, so 4c/8t is going to be just fine.


----------



## Prior22 (Jul 16, 2021)

Jayro said:


> Install Windows on it, and you can literally play Switch games on it.



With anywhere near the compatibility and reliability of an actual Switch?  

Plus once a new game is released for switch how long does it take for the emulator to gain
Compatibility?


----------



## WG481 (Jul 16, 2021)

Just a thought, but wouldn't this mean ports of other games would be easier to play on a console similar to their original.

By that I mean I'm nerding out about how this could be used with Persona 4 Golden to at least somewhat feel like a PS Vita.


----------



## wolffangalchemist (Jul 16, 2021)

Tom Bombadildo said:


> It'll do it no problem. Switch emulation is quite "easy" to run for the most part, and with Zen 2 cores there's no doubt something like Yuzu wouldn't be mostly playable. My GPD Win 3 manages quite well for most games, I've been playing Skyward Sword HD on it 60fps no problems. Yuzu can only utilize 6 threads anyways, so 4c/8t is going to be just fine.


so i imagine overall game compatibility would be the deal breaker if anything then,well.. that and i can't see online play being very possible through emulation at this point in time with how Nintendo is with hacked switches.


----------



## Wickedchew (Jul 16, 2021)

just hate the directional buttons,,not a fan,,


----------



## wolffangalchemist (Jul 16, 2021)

WG481 said:


> Just a thought, but wouldn't this mean ports of other games would be easier to play on a console similar to their original.
> 
> By that I mean I'm nerding out about how this could be used with Persona 4 Golden to at least somewhat feel like a PS Vita.


there is no reason this should not play Golden, it's just a pc.. erm modern laptop with a game pad built in. however ports from console would have to come pc side per dev since this is really just a very portable computer, that and run on Linux through proton.


----------



## WG481 (Jul 16, 2021)

wolffangalchemist said:


> there is no reason this should not play Golden, it's just a pc.. erm modern laptop with a game pad built in. however ports from console would have to come pc side per dev since this is really just a very portable computer, that and run on Linux through proton.


Thank you for the clarification.
I meant it would be fun to play Golden as if I was on a PS Vita (which I sadly do not have).


----------



## anhminh (Jul 16, 2021)




----------



## RedBlueGreen (Jul 16, 2021)

Sterophonick said:


> >working with anticheat vendors for proton support
> AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
> 
> Seriously this'll be a big dub for Linux gaming


The problem is a lot of stuff like Battleye probably won't cooperate. They kick VM users because they claim something like "90% of cheaters were using VMs", when people are still bypassing their crap because client side anti-cheat just isn't effect. People bypassed Vanguard a while ago, and people have been cheating in EAC and Battleye games for ages. For PC gaming in big games they should always be using server-side anti-cheat unless the game uses p2p traffic and only uses a server for matchmaking and account/purchase validation.


Jayro said:


> Imagine installing Windows to this thing, and then firing up Yuzu (or that other forgettable Switch emulator) and playing Switch games at full speed. That's a dream come true, and definitely worth the price for the 256GB model.


You could also do that through proper desktop Linux distro too. Yuzu is open-source like most emulators. The real question is hoe accurate Yuzu is, because if accurate enough that most functions work properly but not so accurate that it emulates slowdown it might actually be better than playing on real hardware.


----------



## Wickedchew (Jul 16, 2021)

hope they revised the directional button,, like test if they can do hadouken or shoryuken on it..it will be a buy day one for me if it is


----------



## ertaboy356b (Jul 16, 2021)

Hope this forces GPD and other similar products to give competitive pricing.

With this, I can play Lewd Games on the go without exposing myself on a big ass monitor lol


----------



## FFTfanatic (Jul 16, 2021)

Prior22 said:


> How can anyone call this a switch killer? The switch has tons of games you can’t play on any other platform.
> 
> This device simply allows you to play PC games on the go. So there’s no exclusivity.


From a mass market consumer perspective, "Switch killer" is probably overdoing it, but in terms of spec and capability / versatility, this stomps on Switch for only 50 bucks more. It will definitely take a slice of the demand from those consumers whose main interest was playing multiplats natively on the go without being tethered to streaming.

Additionally, as mentioned by another user above, it can emulate Switch (admittedly to varying degrees of compatibility / success). Plus it can emulate other systems, in greater number and to a greater degree than a modded Switch.

Finally, believe it or not, PC exclusives *do* exist, particularly in the RPG and strategy genres. The library of this thing dwarfs that of Switch.


----------



## Wickedchew (Jul 16, 2021)

ertaboy356b said:


> Hope this forces GPD and other similar products to give competitive pricing.
> 
> With this, I can play Lewd Games on the go without exposing myself on a big ass monitor lol




wait..there is lwed games on steam?


----------



## the_randomizer (Jul 16, 2021)

mattyxarope said:


> You really out here complaining about the price Mr. "I already have a Series X, PS5 and PC"?



Wow, you sure showed me by calling me out. Thanks anyway, but I have enough to deal with without having to listen to condescending whiny bullshit attitudes like yours.

Piss off.


----------



## ertaboy356b (Jul 16, 2021)

Wickedchew said:


> wait..there is lwed games on steam?


https://store.steampowered.com/tags/en/NSFW/


----------



## wolffangalchemist (Jul 16, 2021)

the_randomizer said:


> Wow, calling me out. Thanks but I have enough shit to deal with without having to listen to your condescending bullshit. Have a nice day and piss off.


carry on my wayward son, edited miss read some things.... your not wrong price wise though it could have a bit better storage. not saying drop the price but increase the  capacity a bit. games are quite large nowday, especially pc games and 256gb on the high end is  rather low for this.


----------



## the_randomizer (Jul 16, 2021)

wolffangalchemist said:


> some people have more expendable income than others for various reasons and like to brag and belittle.... your not wrong price wise though it could have a bit better storage. not saying drop the price but increase the  capacity a bit. games are quite large nowday, especially pc games and 256gb on the high end is  rather low for this.



Did I ever come across as belittling or bragging? No, I didn't, so don't accuse me of that because I don't play those games. The price for the storage upgrades is too much per GB and SD cards aren't that great compared to NVMe storage. If people don't like what I say then that's not my problem and they should just get over it. Sheesh. So sorry for breathing the same air as you guys.

If people have proof of my bragging and all that, I would love to see proof.


----------



## wolffangalchemist (Jul 16, 2021)

the_randomizer said:


> Did I ever come across as belittling or bragging? No, I didn't, so don't accuse me of that because I don't play those games. The price for the storage upgrades is too much per GB and SD cards aren't that great compared to NVMe storage. If people don't like what I say then that's not my problem and they should just get over it. Sheesh. So sorry for breathing the same air as you guys.
> 
> If people have proof of my bragging and all that, I would love to see proof.


actually i was speaking in favor of you and against the latter persons statement albeit i may have miss read some things , also i have had afew.... forgive my miss reading  of some things. you are good bro do your thing.


----------



## ZeroT21 (Jul 16, 2021)

Hmmm, limited storage for a portable is always a drag, maybe having a part of the steam library onboard, while the rest is on a supported external storage, but then again I got 0 experience with steam OS or what it's capable of


----------



## the_randomizer (Jul 16, 2021)

wolffangalchemist said:


> actually i was speaking in favor of you and against the latter persons statement albeit i may have miss read some things , also i have had afew.... forgive my miss reading  of some things. you are good bro do your thing.



Sorry, I didn't exactly have a fantastic day at work. I can't stand it when people like him accuse me of stuff I haven't done.  And if I came across that way, it wasn't my intent, I've never had a job like this, esp. one that pays as well as it does. So yeah, I have a PC and consoles, but if people think I brag about it or whatever, they are dead wrong.

Thank you for sticking up for me, more than I can say about a CERTAIN  person on this thread.


----------



## RedBlueGreen (Jul 16, 2021)

Wickedchew said:


> wait..there is lwed games on steam?


>he doesn't know about koikatsu party


----------



## wolffangalchemist (Jul 16, 2021)

the_randomizer said:


> Sorry, I didn't exactly have a fantastic day at work. I can't stand it when people like him accuse me of stuff I haven't done.  And if I came across that way, it wasn't my intent, I've never had a job like this, esp. one that pays as well as it does. So yeah, I have a PC and consoles, but if people think I brag about it or whatever, they are dead wrong.
> 
> Thank you for sticking up for me, more than I can say about a CERTAIN  person on this thread.


it happens, and i feel you there just got promoted to management at my work... not a walk in the park and i am basically training myself. shits a bit stressful, just don't let the Internet get to you and do your best, never mind others judgment and focus on the end goal. end of year i will be done with a car payment and while that will be a weight off me i myself plan to buy a house lol. eh cheaper than rent.
also sorry for the off topic, gonna end that here lol


----------



## Kioku_Dreams (Jul 16, 2021)

Wickedchew said:


> wait..there is lwed games on steam?


Yes...?


----------



## Impossible_Igntiz (Jul 16, 2021)

Justinde75 said:


> Even if valve loses interest in it over time there is a higher chance that community made updates or stuff gets released for a valve product rather than stuff from gpd for example


and there's also Windows 10 OS you can install in case if it does get abandoned which is excellent imo


----------



## CrossOut (Jul 16, 2021)

I wonder if you will be able to run emulators on this and how well will it work? As will all these consoles and such if this does well they will do an upgraded version of his model and ill probably get that one if it can do emulation and do it well.


----------



## Impossible_Igntiz (Jul 16, 2021)

WG481 said:


> Just a thought, but wouldn't this mean ports of other games would be easier to play on a console similar to their original.
> 
> By that I mean I'm nerding out about how this could be used with Persona 4 Golden to at least somewhat feel like a PS Vita.


Installing so many awesome mods for it is a start

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------



Wickedchew said:


> wait..there is lwed games on steam?


a hella bunch than the Switch and you can play the uncensored versions of those games without having to jailbreak the device or be stuck with the censored versions


----------



## ertaboy356b (Jul 16, 2021)

DbGt said:


> But wouldnt AAA games run super slow off a microsd card? wouldnt loading times be eternal?


Not necessarily.
PC Gaming On an SD Card - How Does It Affect Performance? - YouTube
MicroSD Card vs PCIe SSD . Gaming Performance Compared. - YouTube


----------



## Jayro (Jul 16, 2021)

RedBlueGreen said:


> The problem is a lot of stuff like Battleye probably won't cooperate. They kick VM users because they claim something like "90% of cheaters were using VMs", when people are still bypassing their crap because client side anti-cheat just isn't effect. People bypassed Vanguard a while ago, and people have been cheating in EAC and Battleye games for ages. For PC gaming in big games they should always be using server-side anti-cheat unless the game uses p2p traffic and only uses a server for matchmaking and account/purchase validation.
> 
> You could also do that through proper desktop Linux distro too. Yuzu is open-source like most emulators. The real question is hoe accurate Yuzu is, because if accurate enough that most functions work properly but not so accurate that it emulates slowdown it might actually be better than playing on real hardware.


Given the specs and the high-clocked LPDDR5, I have faith it will perform well, even at 1x resolution.


----------



## WG481 (Jul 16, 2021)

DSwizzy said:


> Installing so many awesome mods for it is a start
> 
> --------------------- MERGED ---------------------------
> 
> ...


The amount of h**tai's on Steam outnumbers the Switch? That is a battle I do not need to see.


----------



## Taleweaver (Jul 16, 2021)

What's with the 64 GB of storage? And how much of that is 'wasted' on the OS and steam itself caching their fancy storefront images?

But honestly : it's smooth sailing across the board on every other field. Gotta check a few hands on videos first, but I'll probably reserve me one. And that's exceptional, as I usually wait a few years until all the kinks are removed and /or the price drops on hardware. But in addition to looking good on paper, they announce it at /for a good time : I was considering a new pc somewhere next year (my main gaming rig is about 7 years now). And with the train commuting I'm doing, I was already pondering over gpd max, 3 or that neo. This one just sells to have more access up its sleeve. 

(note : I'm using Proton for a couple years now. Most games work without a problem now)


----------



## Darth Meteos (Jul 16, 2021)

I'm buying it.


----------



## videogamefanatic (Jul 16, 2021)

CrossOut said:


> I wonder if you will be able to run emulators on this and how well will it work? As will all these consoles and such if this does well they will do an upgraded version of his model and ill probably get that one if it can do emulation and do it well.


Yes. It is literally a linux desktop with Steam Big Picture Mode running on top. They don't restrict player access at all. It's much more of a PC with a comprehensive console UI than a normal console.

Emulators will work and run fine. Even Cemu works through Wine, so it'll work here, but performance will very likely be hit or miss on Wii U, Switch, and PS3. Anything older than that? It'll work fine.


----------



## onibaku (Jul 16, 2021)

I just want Mass Effect and Fallout New Vegas on the go, I'm excited for this!


----------



## slimerancher (Jul 16, 2021)

Would be amazing if the controls were better


----------



## DonCaballero (Jul 16, 2021)

It reminds me of the SEGA Nomad!


----------



## koimayeul (Jul 16, 2021)

Now I was eying the OLED switch as my first portable since the vita's but this totally beat it! I got massive libraries among epic, Ubi, GOG, itch and Steam against the two xenoblade chronicles that I would actually want for Switch... Killer GabeN, a deal with Gamepass and GeForce now and it's sealed, also great to give competition for big N milking fans for years with the monopoly... Hyped AF!!


----------



## jomaper (Jul 16, 2021)

1280x800 oh.


----------



## Rahkeesh (Jul 16, 2021)

koimayeul said:


> Now I was eying the OLED switch as my first portable since the vita's but this totally beat it! I got massive libraries among epic, Ubi, GOG, itch and Steam against the two xenoblade chronicles that I would actually want for Switch... *Killer GabeN, a deal with Gamepass* and GeForce now and it's sealed, also great to give competition for big N milking fans for years with the monopoly... Hyped AF!!



While valve isn't locking this thing down, they have zero reason to promote competitor's ecosystem and Microsoft has zero interest in getting their ecosystem running on linux. The whole windows store stuff is incredibly locked down and where people have found workarounds for origin and EGS on linux, I doubt that will ever happen for windows store. Really the long-term play here for Valve is still to try and push more gaming to linux so they can escape any attempt to make the Windows store ubiquitous.


----------



## eriol33 (Jul 16, 2021)

If this doesn't prompt Nintendo to release switch pro, nothing will


----------



## anhminh (Jul 16, 2021)

On marketing aspect, this won't caught on. The exclusive game is the only way to market a handheld. Every time an exclusive game announced, people will heard about that handheld and talk about it, like "this is a good time to own a Switch". 

This though, this will only see some spotlight on annouce and maybe on release day. After that, there is almost no occasions its name would be say again and then people will quickly forget about it just like every other Steam handheld.


----------



## Xzi (Jul 16, 2021)

jomaper said:


> 1280x800 oh.


Eh who cares, it can output to any display and 1080p would give you 2 hours battery life max.


----------



## tech3475 (Jul 16, 2021)

Any news on if the internal storage can be easily upgraded or whether it’s just the mSD slot?


----------



## Xzi (Jul 16, 2021)

tech3475 said:


> Any news on if the internal storage can be easily upgraded or whether it’s just the mSD slot?


As far as we know right now, internal storage can't be upgraded regardless of which SKU you get.  There will definitely be modders who attempt it anyway, so we'll have to wait until launch to know for sure.


----------



## samuzomoxo (Jul 16, 2021)

Prans said:


> As I mentioned in my review for the AYA NEO, the more competition, the better for us consumers! Looking forward to how this turns out!


so wrong argument that ultra liberal use to make you think this
there are so many example that prove that just a trick


----------



## Pipistrele (Jul 16, 2021)

Pretty happy about this announcement - considering the history of Valve hardware releases, I’ll pass on it for a year or two to see whether they manage this one well, but cautious optimism is still optimism.

Though there’s already weirdos who already claim it as “Nintendo killer”, and yeaaah, that’s obviously not going to happen. Unless Steam Deck gets released with HL3+TF3+Portal 3 as exclusive titles or something, it’ll barely leave a dent on Switch sales, and target audience is definitely more niche at least for this one. Maybe in the future, if first instalment establishes itself well enough (and that’s assuming dedicated handhelds won’t get absorbed by cloud gaming, which is arguably a much more pressing danger for Nintendo's handheld dominance).


----------



## tech3475 (Jul 16, 2021)

Pipistrele said:


> Pretty happy about this announcement - considering the history of Valve hardware releases, I’ll pass on it for a year or two to see whether they manage this one well, but cautious optimism is still optimism.
> 
> Though there’s already weirdos who already claim it as “Nintendo killer”, and yeaaah, that’s obviously not going to happen. Unless Steam Deck gets released with HL3+TF3+Portal 3 as exclusive titles or something, it’ll barely leave a dent on Switch sales, and target audience is definitely more niche at least for this one. Maybe in the future, if first instalment establishes itself well enough (and that’s assuming dedicated handhelds won’t get absorbed by cloud gaming by then).



I think Valve needs to get better at marketing and get these into more stores, not just exclusive to Gamestop, etc.

It's interesting and I might get it, not a true Switch killer considering the Switch's exclusives and mass market appeal, but if I do go through and it's good, it will most likely replace my Switch when travelling considering it can also be made to run other software such Netflix and VLC, even if it means dual booting.


----------



## Xzi (Jul 16, 2021)

Pipistrele said:


> Though there’s already weirdos who already claim it as “Nintendo killer”, and yeaaah, that’s obviously not going to happen. Unless Steam Deck gets released with HL3+TF3+Portal 3 as exclusive titles or something, it’ll barely leave a dent on Switch sales, and target audience is definitely more niche at least for this one.


I'm not sure anything could "kill Nintendo" at this point, but I do think there is a decent chance this affects Switch's future sales numbers.  It's priced very competitively, there's nothing to build or upgrade other than the micro SD, and the UI looks plenty user-friendly.  Meaning this has appeal outside of the hardcore PC gaming crowd.  This also isn't 2003, everybody knows what Steam is and a ton of people have decent-sized game libraries there, so Valve doesn't need a big promotional bundle to market it.  They're already taking a loss on the hardware anyway.


----------



## Deleted User (Jul 16, 2021)

RedBlueGreen said:


> The problem is a lot of stuff like Battleye probably won't cooperate. They kick VM users because they claim something like "90% of cheaters were using VMs", when people are still bypassing their crap because client side anti-cheat just isn't effect. People bypassed Vanguard a while ago, and people have been cheating in EAC and Battleye games for ages. For PC gaming in big games they should always be using server-side anti-cheat unless the game uses p2p traffic and only uses a server for matchmaking and account/purchase validation.


Anti-Cheats like EAC and BattleEye are effective, most cheaters won't be hacking their way into games using these two anti-cheats unless you pay a hefty price for the hack.
And for server-side Anti-Cheat systems... have you ever played CS or TF2?
Valve's Server-Side Anticheat doesn't work at all.


----------



## Rafciu (Jul 16, 2021)

Thats good that something happens on handheld market. I still prefer switch over that device, im mainly console gamer. On PC im playing only strategies and i can't image playing them with on thic console on touchpad and tiny screen, yeah i know that i can plug this device to TV and using mouse but its not worth the money. 

Maybe i get this at some point at price drop, it can be cool for emulation of Xenia, Cemu, RPCS3.


----------



## such (Jul 16, 2021)

Valve hardware + button layout + pricing (those jumps are ridiculous) = wait at least a couple of years to see if Valve craps the bed + try one out before buying (probably tough to do in my neck of the woods) + continue waiting until a decent promo or a price cut. Or, going back to the whole Valve hardware thing, until they deem it a total failure and start dumping it for 90% off, I suppose.

And that's not getting into how the shortages and whatnot factor in here.

So yeah, I'll be postponing my excitement for... 3-4 years minimum, it looks like? It is interesting, I clearly am the target audience, I'd love me some portable New Vegas etc., but Valve hardware is not something I'd be comfortable pre-ordering even if I had this kind of money to straight up burn.


----------



## Raendor (Jul 16, 2021)

anhminh said:


> On marketing aspect, this won't caught on. The exclusive game is the only way to market a handheld. Every time an exclusive game announced, people will heard about that handheld and talk about it, like "this is a good time to own a Switch".
> 
> This though, this will only see some spotlight on annouce and maybe on release day. After that, there is almost no occasions its name would be say again and then people will quickly forget about it just like every other Steam handheld.



Wat exclusives? Another lame mario or zelda with terrible graphics? Only die hard nintendoids will care about those while the valve library offers so much more and backed up by a far more powerful device. My switch’s been gathering dust around 2 years already and now will definitely will go to a second hand market while is still worth anything, because steam deck made switch now completely useless to anyone other than die-hard Nintendo fanboys.


----------



## Pipistrele (Jul 16, 2021)

Raendor said:


> Wat exclusives? Another lame mario or zelda with terrible graphics? Only die hard nintendoids will care about those while the valve library offers so much more and backed up by a far more powerful device. My switch’s been gathering dust around 2 years already and now will definitely will go to a second hand market while is still worth anything, because steam deck made switch now completely useless to anyone other than die-hard Nintendo fanboys.


"I'm not interested in these games" =/= "Nobody's interested in these games". The hype for things like Splatoon 3, BOTW2 and SMT5 is pretty large so far, whether it's your cup of tea or not.


----------



## krasaty (Jul 16, 2021)

Pipistrele said:


> "I'm not interested in these games" =/= "Nobody's interested in these games". The hype for things like Splatoon 3, BOTW2 and SMT5 is pretty large so far, whether it's your cup of tea or not.


Even then, yuzu will probably be able to play those on release or shortly after release at this point. Likely even on this system.


----------



## Pipistrele (Jul 16, 2021)

krasaty said:


> Even then, yuzu will probably be able to play those on release or shortly after release at this point. Likely even on this system.


I like our boi Yuzu, but it's not polished enough just yet to be a sustainable alternative for the real deal - especially for newer games, which can throw in a ton of compatibility issues (stuff like Monster Hunter Rise and Bravely Default II are still borderline unplayable and crash-prone, to name a few). Especially since Splatoon 3 is a heavily multiplayer-based title, so yeah, so much for emulation with that one.


----------



## Moon164 (Jul 16, 2021)

To be honest I'm really excited about it, I doubt it's going to be the same success as the Nintendo Switch but I do think it has potential.

I know a lot of people who bought a Nintendo Switch just to play games like The Witcher 3, Doom Eternal, DarkSouls and etc... in the palm of their hand, anywhere and anytime, now imagine a portable capable of running the version of PC of these games ?, has a video of this ''console'' running Control while Switch had to resort to a Cloud version.

And the price isn't too bad either, $399 is a great price for what it offers and for comparison purposes the OLED Switch costs $350 and has the same hardware as the original 2017 Switch, for those who wanted something like a ''Switch Pro ''this move by Valve ends up drawing a lot of attention.

I hope this console is successful, competition is always good and that might make Nintendo step out of the comfort zone a bit.


----------



## Bauti (Jul 16, 2021)

FFTfanatic said:


> Nah, PC gaming laptops tend to be pushing for a much higher target in terms of performance and image quality. Not only are they typically aimed at pushing several times more pixels than just 800p, with much higher refresh rates, but they also have to provide power to a much bigger screen. Moreover, they have the majority of their chassis insulated by whatever surface they are rested on.
> 
> This thing has a much smaller screen with a relatively low resolution and native refresh rate, and hand grips meaning the majority of its chassis will be exposed to the air for better heat dissipation.
> 
> (Btw, Switch game installs can go higher than 16gb. The biggest install is something like 33gb, one of the NBA2K games).



Yep, that's a good point. Thanks for the insight.


----------



## Raendor (Jul 16, 2021)

Pipistrele said:


> "I'm not interested in these games" =/= "Nobody's interested in these games". The hype for things like Splatoon 3, BOTW2 and SMT5 is pretty large so far, whether it's your cup of tea or not.


No matter how big the hype is, these games are a drop in the ocean of variety the steam library offers.


----------



## jimbo13 (Jul 16, 2021)

Steam/devs can optimize for this hardware or even push "Deck optimized" editions same as any other console, devs have a baseline to target. No reason steam wouldn't offer support in this regard so the games should look better than they would on a comparable PC.  It may take a bit but that OS will have next to no overhead while gaming.  It's not for me, I don't generally do portable enough to warrant this but I am impressed and will be surprised if it doesn't make a impact.


----------



## Pipistrele (Jul 16, 2021)

Raendor said:


> No matter how big the hype is, these games are a drop in the ocean of variety the steam library offers.


Not sure if something like BOTW2, a sequel to literally one of the most critically acclaimed games of all time, is merely "a drop in the bucket" - quality counts more than quantity here. Having varied library is cool (I like my Steam account!), but if people want to play specific exclusives, Steam will do nothing for them - hence Steam Deck won't be able to make Switch obsolete in any foreseeable future.

I don't have much to add to this, so I'll avoid further bickering to not break the site rules =)


----------



## eyeliner (Jul 16, 2021)

Slap Retroarch on it!


----------



## ertre (Jul 16, 2021)

Oh FUCK THEM.
The Euro price is even higher than the Dollar price.


----------



## tech3475 (Jul 16, 2021)

ertre said:


> Oh FUCK THEM.
> The Euro price is even higher than the Dollar price.



It looks like it's down to VAT.


----------



## TotalSmart (Jul 16, 2021)

What are peoples thoughts of trying to run PC games from an SD card? assuming the fastest card easily available, anyone have experience tried this?


----------



## ertaboy356b (Jul 16, 2021)

TotalSmart said:


> What are peoples thoughts of trying to run PC games from an SD card? assuming the fastest card easily available, anyone have experience tried this?


PC Gaming On an SD Card - How Does It Affect Performance? - YouTube
MicroSD Card vs PCIe SSD . Gaming Performance Compared. - YouTube


----------



## FFTfanatic (Jul 16, 2021)

TotalSmart said:


> What are peoples thoughts of trying to run PC games from an SD card? assuming the fastest card easily available, anyone have experience tried this?


I have done this with one of the higher speed cards. It works fine in general. Until super fast SSDs become as integral to the experience as they are for the next gen consoles, I don't think you will have any serious complaints about microSD speed. That being said, I haven't tried anything in the way of modern open world AAAs that stream environmental assets in on the fly though.

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------



Pipistrele said:


> Not sure if something like BOTW2, a sequel to literally one of the most critically acclaimed games of all time, is merely "a drop in the bucket" - quality counts more than quantity here. Having varied library is cool (I like my Steam account!), but if people want to play specific exclusives, Steam will do nothing for them - hence Steam Deck won't be able to make Switch obsolete in any foreseeable future.
> 
> I don't have much to add to this, so I'll avoid further bickering to not break the site rules =)


There are games that are exclusive to PC, even if they tend to primarily be from more niche genres such as strategy and RPG.

Additionally, there are and will continue to be multiplat games that are not on Switch.


----------



## Pipistrele (Jul 16, 2021)

FFTfanatic said:


> There are games that are exclusive to PC, even if they tend to primarily be from more niche genres such as strategy and RPG.
> 
> Additionally, there are and will continue to be multiplat games that are not on Switch.


Which is kinda my point - that both platforms target different audiences, and one doesn't necessarily replace the other. My response was towards the notion that Steam Deck will somehow "kill Switch" and other weird stuff, while in reality, most fans of Ninty exclusives won't care about Deck in the same way as most PC gaming fans won't care about Switch (or alternatively, just getting base versions of both on a budget). Apples, oranges


----------



## Veho (Jul 16, 2021)

ertre said:


> Oh FUCK THEM.
> The Euro price is even higher than the Dollar price.


It's always like that with electronics. Look at the Switch, it's $300 in the US, but €330 ($390) in Europe (MSRP for both).


----------



## TotalSmart (Jul 16, 2021)

Veho said:


> It's always like that with electronics. Look at the Switch, it's $300 in the US, but €330 ($390) in Europe (MSRP for both).


Still more expensive in EU but the quoted US prices never include sales tax which varies per state


----------



## MagnesG (Jul 16, 2021)

16:10 aspect ratio though.


----------



## tech3475 (Jul 16, 2021)

Ok, here's some rough math.
US MSRP: 399
UK MSRP: 349
FR MSRP (used a proxy):  419

VAT for UK and France: 20%

US with 20%: 399*120%= 478.8
Converted to GBP (via Google):  346.67
Converted to EUR (via Google): 405.62


----------



## pedro702 (Jul 16, 2021)

Raendor said:


> Wat exclusives? Another lame mario or zelda with terrible graphics? Only die hard nintendoids will care about those while the valve library offers so much more and backed up by a far more powerful device. My switch’s been gathering dust around 2 years already and now will definitely will go to a second hand market while is still worth anything, because steam deck made switch now completely useless to anyone other than die-hard Nintendo fanboys.


lol lame exclusives? are you for real only die hard fans? you do realize the switch is becoming one oif the top 5 most sold consoles ever made right? how would that be made of only die hard fans?

does nintendo have 90 million die hard fans? lol nice for them i guess why would anyone need anything else when they have that many die hard fans?

switch has several things this thing wont ever have first its much cheaper since you dont get a dock with this price, second the joycons allow for multiplayer while taking the switch with you, third this thing is much heavier and even bigger than the switch itself, people already complained about the switch being too big and now this is even bigger heavier(almost twice the weight),third physical media that many console players like and 4th well exclusives which this device has none since any pc can play without needing this.


hit me up when this even makes 30 million units sold , heck  i dont think they will even sell 10 million at best.

I remember people saying the steamboxes would crush playstation and xbox and look where that went, same for this, this will be a gimmicky that will sell around 4 or 5 million and be done with that.


----------



## BlastedGuy9905 (Jul 16, 2021)

1B51004 said:


> really, the handheld is only going to be as good as the games it runs, so this can either be a huge success or a massive flop depending on how it can handle the steam library
> minecraft java and tf2 handheld is... tempting to be honest. lets hope that its at least good.


It runs all Steam games according to Valve. Minecraft Java though? You'll need a controller support mod for that. (unless you wanna hook up a KB & M)


----------



## Master X (Jul 16, 2021)

Assuming that Retroarch ever launches on Steam (Seriously, wasn't that supposed to be out in 2019?), it'll also have emulation out of the box.


----------



## Pipistrele (Jul 16, 2021)

Master X said:


> Assuming that Retroarch ever launches on Steam (Seriously, wasn't that supposed to be out in 2019?), it'll also have emulation out of the box.


Playtest version is already out btw, using it for months at this point.


----------



## LightyKD (Jul 16, 2021)

TotalSmart said:


> What are peoples thoughts of trying to run PC games from an SD card? assuming the fastest card easily available, anyone have experience tried this?



I do it all the time on my current Windows tablet. It's no biggie. Granted some of my SD cards are slower so yes the initial load time to get into the game can be lengthy but I find that going from level to level is about the same as something you'd expect from any game made within the Wii / 360 / PS3 era.


----------



## krasaty (Jul 16, 2021)

BlastedGuy9905 said:


> It runs all Steam games according to Valve. Minecraft Java though? You'll need a controller support mod for that. (unless you wanna hook up a KB & M)


Minecraft java would work well enough with steam's controller config options without using any mods. Set it to work as a keyboard with the buttons you need, use the trackpad for mouse control and you're golden.


----------



## FFTfanatic (Jul 16, 2021)

Pipistrele said:


> Which is kinda my point - that both platforms target different audiences, and one doesn't necessarily replace the other. My response was towards the notion that Steam Deck will somehow "kill Switch" and other weird stuff, while in reality, most fans of Ninty exclusives won't care about Deck in the same way as most PC gaming fans won't care about Switch (or alternatively, just getting base versions of both on a budget). Apples, oranges


On that we agree, to an extent. I don't think it's quite entirely "apples and oranges" though and would contend that the middle-of-the-road argument previously advanced by other users still has merit.

 Steam Deck could very well potentially eat into not only sales of the OLED model to some of those existing Switch owners who had otherwise been planning on upgrading, but going further forward, into sales of the Switch Pro too (or Switch 2 or whatever the Switch's successor turns out to be), if those users were primarily in it for portable multiplats. Previously, the Switch was not just the only relatively affordable handheld device capable of that, it was the only mainstream, mass-marketed device capable of that. That is about to change.

Will Deck topple the Switch? Highly unlikely. Will it cost the Switch some market share? Almost certainly, not just in hardware but, if you consider the devs who cater to the aforementioned demographic, then in software too, particularly for demanding games from those genres that are not traditionally big sellers on Nintendo platforms. If the Deck is commercially well-received, then as time passes, those devs will be less and less inclined to invest the time and resources into shoehorning complex and demanding multiplats into a Switch version, particularly if the results would be sub-par and the sales for such games on the platform are declining.


----------



## AkiraKurusu (Jul 16, 2021)

I wonder what the Aussie price of this thing'll be...hopefully the numbers will stay the same, even if the comparative values aren't.


----------



## donaldgx (Jul 16, 2021)

interesting prospect, and if it can run yuzu relatively well then it's a sure buy.


----------



## 64bitmodels (Jul 16, 2021)

the_randomizer said:


> Wow, you sure showed me by calling me out. Thanks anyway, but I have enough to deal with without having to listen to condescending whiny bullshit attitudes like yours.
> 
> Piss off.


calm tf down bro it was just a joke


pedro702 said:


> lol lame exclusives? are you for real only die hard fans? you do realize the switch is becoming one oif the top 5 most sold consoles ever made right? how would that be made of only die hard fans?
> 
> does nintendo have 90 million die hard fans? lol nice for them i guess why would anyone need anything else when they have that many die hard fans?
> 
> ...


yes. nintendo exclusives are lame right now. no one wants to play a giant open world walking simulator when they could play majora's mask or twilight princess. the people that do are incredibly retarded. even if you wanted to you could just put yuzu on this thing and enjoy.
60 dollar games, 20 dollar a year online, and controllers that cost upwards of 80 dollars is not "cheap". you can always just play online multiplayer on the go with this thing (and it's for free too), and you don't really need physical media on a system like steam where your games will always be in your posession and will be easy to install unless steam goes under (which isn't happening for another century at this point) 
there are people who are disappointed that the switch can only play 360 and ps3 ports. there are people who don't approve of nintendo's shit business decisons and would like to see the company topple (like, for example, LITERALLY EVERYONE ON THIS GOD DAMN FOURMSITE.). there are people who vastly perfer PC gaming for reasons that don't have to do with 4k 120fps with raytracing and 16k textures. these people are a big audience and i'm pretty confident valve will do well with this if they advertise it aggressively enough and get more people interested. this thing has the potential to dethrone the PSP as the best handheld gaming system of all time, and the potential to completely redefine the handheld gaming space in general. portable PC gaming is not a gimmick. its an innovation. the future is now old man


----------



## agpixel (Jul 16, 2021)

and it is ugly


----------



## the_randomizer (Jul 16, 2021)

64bitmodels said:


> calm tf down bro it was just a joke
> 
> yes. nintendo exclusives are lame right now. no one wants to play a giant open world walking simulator when they could play majora's mask or twilight princess. the people that do are incredibly retarded. even if you wanted to you could just put yuzu on this thing and enjoy.
> 60 dollar games, 20 dollar a year online, and controllers that cost upwards of 80 dollars is not "cheap". you can always just play online multiplayer on the go with this thing (and it's for free too), and you don't really need physical media on a system like steam where your games will always be in your posession and will be easy to install unless steam goes under (which isn't happening for another century at this point)
> there are people who are disappointed that the switch can only play 360 and ps3 ports. there are people who don't approve of nintendo's shit business decisons and would like to see the company topple (like, for example, LITERALLY EVERYONE ON THIS GOD DAMN FOURMSITE.). there are people who vastly perfer PC gaming for reasons that don't have to do with 4k 120fps with raytracing and 16k textures. these people are a big audience and i'm pretty confident valve will do well with this if they advertise it aggressively enough and get more people interested. this thing has the potential to dethrone the PSP as the best handheld gaming system of all time, and the potential to completely redefine the handheld gaming space in general. portable PC gaming is not a gimmick. its an innovation. the future is now old man



Jokes, what are those?


----------



## BlastedGuy9905 (Jul 16, 2021)

krasaty said:


> Minecraft java would work well enough with steam's controller config options without using any mods. Set it to work as a keyboard with the buttons you need, use the trackpad for mouse control and you're golden.


Ooh. I hadn't thought of that! Good point! The trackpads are nice.. I wonder how they will do as mouse control replacement.


----------



## MohammedQ8 (Jul 16, 2021)

Why don’t desktop pc cases have sd slot as well?


----------



## GenNaz (Jul 16, 2021)

It's official - I can no longer reasonably talk myself into paying 4 times as much for a multi-platform game on the Switch just because of portability and I'm glad for it. The second model seems almost like a no-brainer to me but I'm curious about the anti-glare screen on the most expensive kit.


----------



## Pipistrele (Jul 16, 2021)

FFTfanatic said:


> On that we agree, to an extent. I don't think it's quite entirely "apples and oranges" though and would contend that the middle-of-the-road argument previously advanced by other users still has merit.
> 
> Steam Deck could very well potentially eat into not only sales of the OLED model to some of those existing Switch owners who had otherwise been planning on upgrading, but going further forward, into sales of the Switch Pro too (or Switch 2 or whatever the Switch's successor turns out to be), if those users were primarily in it for portable multiplats. Previously, the Switch was not just the only relatively affordable handheld device capable of that, it was the only mainstream, mass-marketed device capable of that. That is about to change.
> 
> Will Deck topple the Switch? Highly unlikely. Will it cost the Switch some market share? Almost certainly, not just in hardware but, if you consider the devs who cater to the aforementioned demographic, then in software too, particularly for demanding games from those genres that are not traditionally big sellers on Nintendo platforms. If the Deck is commercially well-received, then as time passes, those devs will be less and less inclined to invest the time and resources into shoehorning complex and demanding multiplats into a Switch version, particularly if the results would be sub-par and the sales for such games on the platform are declining.


I can kinda see your point, and if Deck manages to explode into the mainstream, then it has potential to put a crack on Nintendo's existing monopoly. Still, there are a lot of obstacles that put me off from believing it would really happen, at least not for the first instalment - with Deck only launching in 4 countries and having portability as its sole selling point (with all of its games being playable on anything else, _including_ other other portable devices like laptops and UMPCs), it already kinda puts itself in a niche for its initial outing.


----------



## mattyxarope (Jul 16, 2021)

the_randomizer said:


> Wow, you sure showed me by calling me out. Thanks anyway, but I have enough to deal with without having to listen to condescending whiny bullshit attitudes like yours.
> 
> Piss off.



Wow I was just joking - chill


----------



## Daggot (Jul 16, 2021)

My friends and I went from laughing at this thing to getting ready to reserve it within a day. It has potential, it's also significantly cheaper than a GPD Win 3 or an Aya Neo while being more powerful so it's got that going for it. Gabe Gear FTW.


----------



## LightyKD (Jul 16, 2021)

I have butterflies! The wait is driving me nuts!!! I can't wait to pre order!


----------



## Veho (Jul 16, 2021)

MohammedQ8 said:


> Why don’t desktop pc cases have sd slot as well?


Because PCs have other ways to expand their storage other than memory cards, and USB memory card readers cost a few dollars, so there is little point in having it on the motherboard. It would increase the price and complexity of manufacture, even if by little, for a feature that most users won't need. Some desktop builds have readers built in, but they are not really sought after.


----------



## FFTfanatic (Jul 16, 2021)

agpixel said:


> and it is ugly


It's not that bad.


Pipistrele said:


> I can kinda see your point, and if Deck manages to explode into the mainstream, then it has potential to put a crack on Nintendo's existing monopoly. Still, there are a lot of obstacles that put me off from believing it would really happen, at least not for the first instalment - with Deck only launching in 4 countries and having portability as its sole selling point (with all of its games being playable on anything else, _including_ other other portable devices like laptops and UMPCs), it already kinda puts itself in a niche for its initial outing.


The limited territory release is a good point but is probably just to test the waters. If it sells well, they'll likely roll out further the following year (which is what they have stated they intend).

As for unique selling point, it's not just the portability, it's the portability in all-in-one, handheld form factor.

Laptops don't offer that and the Deck's only existing direct competitors in the PC space are not mass marketed or mainstream. The Aya Neo, OneXPlayer and Win 3 are supply constrained, considerably more expensive, and/or weaker specc'd, less optimised, lack some of the features such as trackpads, lack the same degree of Steam integration, and can't just compete with Valve in terms of marketing, reach and economies of scale. 

All of which leaves, as I said, the Deck as currently the only game in town when it comes to dedicated handheld PC gaming in the mainstream mass market sphere.


----------



## Kioku_Dreams (Jul 16, 2021)

Going to throw my proverbial hat into the ring. I wonder just how good of a supplemental device it'll be.


----------



## pedro702 (Jul 16, 2021)

64bitmodels said:


> calm tf down bro it was just a joke
> 
> yes. nintendo exclusives are lame right now. no one wants to play a giant open world walking simulator when they could play majora's mask or twilight princess. the people that do are incredibly retarded. even if you wanted to you could just put yuzu on this thing and enjoy.
> 60 dollar games, 20 dollar a year online, and controllers that cost upwards of 80 dollars is not "cheap". you can always just play online multiplayer on the go with this thing (and it's for free too), and you don't really need physical media on a system like steam where your games will always be in your posession and will be easy to install unless steam goes under (which isn't happening for another century at this point)
> there are people who are disappointed that the switch can only play 360 and ps3 ports. there are people who don't approve of nintendo's shit business decisons and would like to see the company topple (like, for example, LITERALLY EVERYONE ON THIS GOD DAMN FOURMSITE.). there are people who vastly perfer PC gaming for reasons that don't have to do with 4k 120fps with raytracing and 16k textures. these people are a big audience and i'm pretty confident valve will do well with this if they advertise it aggressively enough and get more people interested. this thing has the potential to dethrone the PSP as the best handheld gaming system of all time, and the potential to completely redefine the handheld gaming space in general. portable PC gaming is not a gimmick. its an innovation. the future is now old man


preety sure the future would turn to clould stream gaming on the average smartphone in the next decade or so this type of handheld pc type of deal will  have less appeal the more we move in the future and phones become better and better so the average pc player would stream their game while away and play it on their pc while in he house.  

How could this ever redefine handheld gaming? since like you said its just a portable pc sure its smaller than the average laptop but it has nothing unique about it not games, not the from factor(since they exist already), not anything so what would it redefine? i dont get it.


Also why is the psp the best handheld ever? im guessing its your opinion only, because by software sales/hardware sales/number of games available  and such it looses every category to the ds and gb by a huge damn margin, just because you liked the catalog more, it  there is no fact or value that will ever support that claim.

second this thing is buff and i mean buff you wont just be able to carry this on your pocket so you need a carrying case and by that logic you can just take a small laptop and there are alot of gaming laptops out there to choose from.

The main diference pc gaming is different from console gaming is that pc gamers like to upgrade their hardware over time and this will not allow that, you cant just pick up a faster gpu or cpu and put it in there, this defeats the propose of most pc gamers that keep upgrading their rig and they are many and actually like to do that.


----------



## GhostLatte (Jul 16, 2021)

Couldn’t even preorder smh


----------



## djpannda (Jul 16, 2021)

the site is frozen ....ahh I need it

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------

DAMNIT  GABE!! I WANNA GIVE YOU MONIES!!


----------



## Mikemk (Jul 16, 2021)

Wonder how well Yuzu will run


----------



## GhostLatte (Jul 16, 2021)

Looks like I have to wait until Sunday to preorder


----------



## LightyKD (Jul 16, 2021)

Hell yeah! I got it in for the win!!!! Woooooooo!!! 

(64GB Model)


----------



## onibaku (Jul 16, 2021)

Managed to reserve the 64gb model. Woohoo


----------



## Kioku_Dreams (Jul 16, 2021)

Got one for the 512GB model. Why am I so excited for this?


----------



## Xzi (Jul 16, 2021)

Servers 'sploded.  I knew this would be popular.  Gratz to anyone who got a reservation, I keep getting errors at the payment method screen.


----------



## Kioku_Dreams (Jul 16, 2021)

Xzi said:


> Servers 'sploded.  I knew this would be popular.  Gratz to anyone who got a reservation, I keep getting errors at the payment method screen.


I got an error at checkout, but it still went through.


----------



## Chary (Jul 16, 2021)

What is this, a Steam Summer Sale circa 2013? 

Got my smol 64GB model. Yay!


----------



## Xzi (Jul 16, 2021)

Memoir said:


> I got an error at checkout, but it still went through.


I'm stuck with, "it looks like you've been attempting a lot of purchases in the last few hours. Please wait a while before trying again."

It's like no...I've been attempting one single purchase repeatedly and it never went through.


----------



## subcon959 (Jul 16, 2021)

After about 12 errors I got email confirmation anyway. I went for the 256GB. I may well change my mind between now and December so glad to read they refund the £4 to your Steam wallet.


----------



## Chary (Jul 16, 2021)

Looks like throwing yourself at a wall works. I had about maybe 30 errors before it went through, eventually.


----------



## Shenrai (Jul 16, 2021)

Got my 256 at 10:00 PDT so I am hoping I end up with one at launch.


----------



## emigre (Jul 16, 2021)

Can't get one. Am locked out now. Proper bullshit from Valve.


----------



## the_randomizer (Jul 16, 2021)

GhostLatte said:


> Couldn’t even preorder smh


I've seen more stable servers on Battle.net lol


----------



## Daggot (Jul 16, 2021)

Managed to snag one! Those servers are run by a hamster on a wheel I swear.


----------



## emigre (Jul 16, 2021)

Managed to order a 256GB. It took over 40 minutes. Jesus Christ.


----------



## Devin (Jul 16, 2021)

Was locked out from purchasing but was just now able to get in line for a 512GB model.


----------



## Xzi (Jul 16, 2021)

Ugh, I bet orders are already out to December 2022.


----------



## EvilJagaGenius (Jul 16, 2021)

I'm not one to pre-order, but I am optimistic about this.  Hopefully I can snag one when there's a proper release... I'm debating between one of these or an XBox Series S for the dev mode.


----------



## chaoskagami (Jul 16, 2021)

I won my fight to the death for a 512GB model at the 21m mark. Is that the front of the queue or the back? I don't fucking know. They're still unstable judging by the twitter stream.

Not exactly a smooth launch, huh?


----------



## DJPlace (Jul 16, 2021)

OMG this price is the same when the PS3 first came out.... still....


----------



## emigre (Jul 16, 2021)

DJPlace said:


> OMG this price is the same when the PS3 first came out.... still....



There's been around 15 years of inflation...


----------



## Xzi (Jul 16, 2021)

DJPlace said:


> OMG this price is the same when the PS3 first came out.... still....


Huh?  PS3 was $600 at launch.  Both the 64 GB and 256 GB models are cheaper than that.


----------



## Devin (Jul 16, 2021)

Xzi said:


> Ugh, I bet orders are already out to December 2022.


----------



## Xzi (Jul 16, 2021)

Devin said:


>


Interestingly it shows Q2 2022 for the 512GB model now.  I expected that to sell the least.


----------



## Kioku_Dreams (Jul 16, 2021)

Xzi said:


> Interestingly it shows Q2 2022 for the 512GB model now.  I expected that to sell the least.


Nah. The higher storage models usually sell out quick. Same thing happened with the 512GB model of the S21 Ultra.


----------



## tech3475 (Jul 16, 2021)

Well it took about an hour with a surprisingly quick response from Steam support because my account got blocked, but I finally placed a deposit for a 512GB.


----------



## AirbusX (Jul 16, 2021)

chaoskagami said:


> I won my fight to the death for a 512GB model at the 21m mark. Is that the front of the queue or the back? I don't fucking know. They're still unstable judging by the twitter stream.
> 
> Not exactly a smooth launch, huh?



I got mine a minute later.


----------



## Clydefrosch (Jul 16, 2021)

my thumbs hurt just thinking about these sticks.
wouldve been better to put the pads, which youll probably rarely use, where the sticks are.

also xbox button lettering. ugh


----------



## djpannda (Jul 16, 2021)

my order when thru but it too forever!! now IM scared I won't get it till xmas 22


----------



## tech3475 (Jul 16, 2021)

Xzi said:


> Interestingly it shows Q2 2022 for the 512GB model now.  I expected that to sell the least.



I can think of some possible reasons:
1) They may be making less of them
2) It's the only model with anti-glare
3) AFAIK you can't officially upgrade the SSD, so if you don't want to rely on mSD it may be the best option.
4) It's the lower priority SKU to make
5) It's more complicated to make


----------



## Hells Malice (Jul 16, 2021)

Clydefrosch said:


> my thumbs hurt just thinking about these sticks.
> wouldve been better to put the pads, which youll probably rarely use, where the sticks are.
> 
> also xbox button lettering. ugh



Fukkin' xbox buttons amirite mates


----------



## krasaty (Jul 16, 2021)

Hells Malice said:


> Fukkin' xbox buttons amirite mates


xbox lettering is swapped.


----------



## Xzi (Jul 16, 2021)

Woo, got my reservation for the 256GB model!  Hopefully I managed to get in for Q1.


----------



## Hells Malice (Jul 16, 2021)

krasaty said:


> xbox lettering is swapped.



It's still the same letters though lol

It also makes way more sense ergonomically

But every controller on earth uses one or the other, except Sony's derpy symbols they jerk off to for some reason


----------



## blaisedinsd (Jul 16, 2021)

Can’t log in using my phone in order to pre order lame

well finally could log in but still can’t pre order reservation


----------



## chaoskagami (Jul 16, 2021)

Xzi said:


> Woo, got my reservation for the 256GB model!  Hopefully I managed to get in for Q1.



Just check the steam deck info page. If you're logged in, the availability date is based off when you ordered. My 512GB reservation continues to show Q1, for example. Of course, this doesn't go for everyone. People that order now are getting Q2 as their estimate.


----------



## Xzi (Jul 16, 2021)

chaoskagami said:


> Just check the steam deck info page. If you're logged in, the availability date is based off when you ordered. My 512GB reservation continues to show Q1, for example. Of course, this doesn't go for everyone. People that order now are getting Q2 as their estimate.


It shows expected availability for the two models I didn't order, but for the one I did it just shows "reserved on Fri, July 16th, 2021." 

I assume I got in on time for Q1 though since the 64GB model is still showing that estimate.


----------



## Shenrai (Jul 16, 2021)

So is there a way to tell where you are in the reservations?


----------



## chrisrlink (Jul 16, 2021)

i might shell out after reviews


----------



## Xzi (Jul 16, 2021)

Shenrai said:


> So is there a way to tell where you are in the reservations?


Not really.  If you got in the first hour and a half-ish, you should be set for Q1 2022.  Unless you got the 512GB model which moved to Q2 a lot quicker.


----------



## LightyKD (Jul 16, 2021)

Hells Malice said:


> Fukkin' xbox buttons amirite mates



Honestly wish the thing had GameCube buttons but I don't plan to use it in portable mode often. At the least, they could have colored the damn buttons :/


----------



## White_Raven_X (Jul 16, 2021)

Prans said:


> View attachment 270006​
> The Nintendo Switch (OLED model) wasn't the "Pro" upgrade many expected it to be with 4K support and new internals but before its announcement, other handhelds aimed to take the role of the "Switch Pro". The AYA NEO and GPD Win 3 are among those devices shooting for that nickname since they are able to run recent AAA PC games on the go, given that they are handheld gaming PCs. Their efforts and popularity, although niche, enticed companies like Lenovo and Tencent to make similar concepts or patents; indicating that these indie companies might have more serious competition in the future.
> 
> It seems like this will indeed be the case and these handheld gaming PC manufacturers will need to brace themselves as Valve is itself entering this market with a Valve-branded handheld gaming PC. This news was actually reported back in May and today we have the official confirmation. In a Steam post today, Valve revealed the Steam Deck, an AMD-based handheld gaming PC that is expected to begin shipping in December 2021 in select regions.
> ...





Reserved mine! Great pricepoint, smaller then a laptop and almost as powerful. It will also be cool to play my switch games with an emulator and be able to check emails, movies and everything else you can do with a Windows based "tablet" style portable gaming device.
Can't wait!

"Valve recommends not wiping SteamOS for Windows — naturally — but designer Lawrence Yang told IGN that it was possible."

Source: https://www.windowscentral.com/can-you-install-windows-steam-deck?amp


----------



## subcon959 (Jul 16, 2021)

512GB model is the one that the scalpers will go for so it's gonna sell the quickest. Already seen ebay listings for 5000.


----------



## Shenrai (Jul 16, 2021)

Xzi said:


> Not really.  If you got in the first hour and a half-ish, you should be set for Q1 2022.  Unless you got the 512GB model which moved to Q2 a lot quicker.



Wait did I miss something? Thought they were launching in December. Got my preorder in at 10:00 PDT.


----------



## krasaty (Jul 16, 2021)

Shenrai said:


> Wait did I miss something? Thought they were launching in December. Got my preorder in at 10:00 PDT.


Shipping in December (probably late december). Could take a while to ship.


----------



## mattyxarope (Jul 16, 2021)

I tried to upscale the shots of the desktop-mode on SteamOS. 

I managed to snag a 64gb version after an hour in the queue. I'm perfectly fine with just buying a terabyte SD card and using that - I actually prefer that. I think the highest price model doesn't make sense.


----------



## Xzi (Jul 16, 2021)

Shenrai said:


> Wait did I miss something? Thought they were launching in December. Got my preorder in at 10:00 PDT.


They are, but realistically very few people were ever going to actually get theirs in December.  If you got your reservation in just as they opened you might be one of those lucky few.


----------



## subcon959 (Jul 16, 2021)

December is when they will begin sending out invitations to order.. there is no clear date for when shipping is supposed to start.


----------



## Xzi (Jul 16, 2021)

subcon959 said:


> December is when they will begin sending out invitations to order.. there is no clear date for when shipping is supposed to start.


I imagine they won't send out invitations to order until they've actually got the product on-hand and ready to ship, so there should be people who get theirs in December.


----------



## LightyKD (Jul 16, 2021)

Y'all over there crying about lack of storage. I been ready for years! This device is the culmination of a 6 year dream!


----------



## FFTfanatic (Jul 16, 2021)

GhostLatte said:


> Couldn’t even preorder smh


Is it all out for you? If so, there's a second pre-order registration window on July 18.


----------



## Kioku_Dreams (Jul 16, 2021)

Can't wait to put a retro library on this thing!


----------



## Xzi (Jul 16, 2021)

Memoir said:


> Can't wait to put a retro library on this thing!


Even more options now that RetroArch is on Steam.


----------



## Rahkeesh (Jul 16, 2021)

Xzi said:


> Even more options now that RetroArch is on Steam.



Now we just need to run steam inside of win98 inside of dosbox inside of retroarch downloaded from steam...


----------



## MikaDubbz (Jul 16, 2021)

I think we're in store for a lot of these kinds of devices in the near future. Think I'll wait a year or so and see what this landscape looks like, if the consensus is that they're great devices and if there are even nicer models out by then, I may just get one at that point.


----------



## LinkmstrYT (Jul 16, 2021)

For me, honestly, it seems like the best portable emulation machine, and that's about it. I don't really mind that it can play PC games, but I feel there might be other issues that haven't been addressed thoroughly. I think pre-ordering is not a great idea, but that's just me.

It's promising, but to an extent.


----------



## NoNAND (Jul 16, 2021)

DarkCoffe64 said:


> If you can mod this thing up and put yuzu or whatever in it, then it'll literally be a switch killer, lmao.


Nintendo is watching


----------



## MikaDubbz (Jul 16, 2021)

I imagine that you'll be able to use Game Pass on this device, which really makes me think Nintendo should work something out with Microsoft already, put streaming Game Pass on the Switch and/or allow us to remote play our own Xbox with our own Switch.


----------



## Xzi (Jul 16, 2021)

MikaDubbz said:


> I think we're in store for a lot of these kinds of devices in the near future.


You're probably right, but I doubt many companies are going to be willing to take a loss on the hardware like Valve is doing.



LinkmstrYT said:


> I don't really mind that it can play PC games, but I feel there might be other issues that haven't been addressed thoroughly.


Such as?  If the hardware is quality that's all that really matters, users can address any software problems on their own.


----------



## krasaty (Jul 16, 2021)

MikaDubbz said:


> I imagine that you'll be able to use Game Pass on this device, which really makes me think Nintendo should work something out with Microsoft already, put streaming Game Pass on the Switch and/or allow us to remote play our own Xbox with our own Switch.


You should be able to if you install windows 10 since it's just a PC. Otherwise, microsoft doesn't support gamepass on linux,


----------



## LightyKD (Jul 16, 2021)

I really wanted one more USB port on the Steam Deck, A or C, I don't care just one more port would have been nice. Now I need to find a decent hub with card reader to sticky pad to my deck.


----------



## Xzi (Jul 16, 2021)

LightyKD said:


> I really wanted one more USB port on the Steam Deck, A or C, I don't care just one more port would have been nice. Now I need to find a decent hub with card reader to sticky pad to my deck.


I'm gonna wait to see how they price the official dock, and which third-party docks will actually fit it.  Steam Deck is considerably thicker than Switch, after all.


----------



## LinkmstrYT (Jul 16, 2021)

Xzi said:


> Such as?  If the hardware is quality that's all that really matters, users can address any software problems on their own.


It's just me being skeptical, that's all. I'll wait for more hands-on, in-depth reviews and whatnot.


----------



## Kioku_Dreams (Jul 16, 2021)

Xzi said:


> Even more options now that RetroArch is on Steam.


Don't even need to run it on Steam.


----------



## Xzi (Jul 16, 2021)

Memoir said:


> Don't even need to run it on Steam.


You sure don't, but it'll be a very convenient option for people who want to stay within their ecosystem.


----------



## GhostLatte (Jul 16, 2021)

Finally was able to put the $5 down


----------



## Owenge (Jul 16, 2021)

krasaty said:


> You should be able to if you install windows 10 since it's just a PC. Otherwise, microsoft doesn't support gamepass on linux,


You can.


----------



## DbGt (Jul 16, 2021)

Just preordered mine, 679 euros (801 USD!!) for the 512gb version.

I still have my doubts, don't know if I will buy it in the end. Hopefully we get much more information before having to pay for the device,


----------



## mattyxarope (Jul 16, 2021)

Xzi said:


> I'm gonna wait to see how they price the official dock, and which third-party docks will actually fit it.  Steam Deck is considerably thicker than Switch, after all.



The IGN interview said that you can use any standard usbc hub, and I bet that there will be 3rd party peripherals.

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------



DbGt said:


> Just preordered mine, 679 euros (801 USD!!) for the 512gb version.
> 
> I still have my doubts, don't know if I will buy it in the end. Hopefully we get much more information before having to pay for the device,



Honestly I think that's too much for a glass screen (when there will be glass screen covers) and storage. I think the 64gb or 256gb make more sense, considering you can use an SD card.

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------



chrisrlink said:


> i might shell out after reviews


Considering the first units will be released this December and the rest are back ordered (some until Q2 2022), you're not really going to have a chance to buy one until Q3/4 2022


----------



## Xzi (Jul 16, 2021)

mattyxarope said:


> The IGN interview said that you can use any standard usbc hub, and I bet that there will be 3rd party peripherals.


Yeah but with docking stands in specific, the gap between the front and back is only so wide.  They're usually made for phones or Switch.  Those that are made for tablets would probably have a better chance of fitting Steam Deck.


----------



## mattyxarope (Jul 16, 2021)

Xzi said:


> Yeah but with docking stands in specific, the gap between the front and back is only so wide.  They're usually made for phones or Switch.  Those that are made for tablets would probably have a better chance of fitting Steam Deck.



True, but what I meant was that you can use even a USB-c dock "adapter" that's just a dongle.


----------



## Something whatever (Jul 16, 2021)

LightyKD said:


> Y'all over there crying about lack of storage. I been ready for years! This device is the culmination of a 6 year dream!


WHAT IS THIS?!!!!


----------



## Xzi (Jul 16, 2021)

Something whatever said:


> WHAT IS THIS?!!!!


SD cards that he installed games on individually and printed labels out for.  Been a good while since I've seen a full-sized SD.


----------



## Something whatever (Jul 16, 2021)

Xzi said:


> SD cards that he installed games on individually and printed labels out for.  Been a good while since I've seen a full-sized SD.


I low-key want to know how to do this


----------



## Tom Bombadildo (Jul 16, 2021)

Something whatever said:


> I low-key want to know how to do this


I mean...you just setup a Steam Library on an SD card's drive letter, install games to different cards, and then you can just swap them and refresh Steam. I keep a Steam SSD that functions basically the same without having to have some folio of slow, flimsy SD cards that I'd have to swap. Can easily keep games on my gaming PC, gaming laptop, and GPD Win 3 without having to re-download or take up space on each device.


----------



## mattyxarope (Jul 17, 2021)

Tom Bombadildo said:


> I mean...you just setup a Steam Library on an SD card's drive letter, install games to different cards, and then you can just swap them and refresh Steam. I keep a Steam SSD that functions basically the same without having to have some folio of slow, flimsy SD cards that I'd have to swap. Can easily keep games on my gaming PC, gaming laptop, and GPD Win 3 without having to re-download or take up space on each device.


This is some big brain stuff, ngl


----------



## Kioku_Dreams (Jul 17, 2021)

LightyKD said:


> Y'all over there crying about lack of storage. I been ready for years! This device is the culmination of a 6 year dream!


That's actually kinda cool.


----------



## Tom Bombadildo (Jul 17, 2021)

mattyxarope said:


> This is some big brain stuff, ngl


Nah that's nothing, the real big brain move is doing it over network so you don't even need an external drive. One thing I toyed with for a while was setting up my home server as a universal Steam library for all my PCs. You can setup SMB, map it as a network drive to any PC, and then install games to it.

But I wasn't particularly happy with the amount of load it was putting on my whole network when playing a game, it'd need to have its own separate network that doesn't tie in to your own to be totally doable and I can't be bothered to set that up


----------



## the_randomizer (Jul 17, 2021)

Tom Bombadildo said:


> I mean...you just setup a Steam Library on an SD card's drive letter, install games to different cards, and then you can just swap them and refresh Steam. I keep a Steam SSD that functions basically the same without having to have some folio of slow, flimsy SD cards that I'd have to swap. Can easily keep games on my gaming PC, gaming laptop, and GPD Win 3 without having to re-download or take up space on each device.



Maybe I'm wrong, but isn't it inadvisable to install Steam games to SD cards due to low read/write speeds?


----------



## LightyKD (Jul 17, 2021)

Xzi said:


> I'm gonna wait to see how they price the official dock, and which third-party docks will actually fit it.  Steam Deck is considerably thicker than Switch, after all.



Since it's a PC any USB-C dock should work. The issue is drivers since Linux and all. I have 3 docks with card readers but until I get the deck in my hands I have no clue which one I want to use.


Something whatever said:


> I low-key want to know how to do this



Easy. I tell Steam to setup my card reader's drive letter as a install location for games. Then I install a game and copy all of the non game data from the first SD card to another that I set aside as a "Boot Card". For every card you use, make sure they are called the same thing ("STEAM CARD" in my case) and are seen by Windows under the same drive letter.

 Install more games to other cards but make sure you copy everything minus the game folder back to your "boot card". Eventually your "boot card" should have all the files needed to let Steam know that said games are installed to said location. From this point on, when you start your machine, just make sure your "boot card" can be seen before Steam starts and you will be able to swap cards as needed. Hopefully Valve will make a nice workaround for this but that's my "secret".


----------



## Kioku_Dreams (Jul 17, 2021)

the_randomizer said:


> Maybe I'm wrong, but isn't it inadvisable to install Steam games to SD cards due to low read/write speeds?


It's something I'm going to try and avoid. If anything, I'd use the MicroSD for small games, like indie titles and even emulation.


----------



## the_randomizer (Jul 17, 2021)

Memoir said:


> It's something I'm going to try and avoid. If anything, I'd use the MicroSD for small games, like indie titles and even emulation.



Yeah, I would avoid it


----------



## Xzi (Jul 17, 2021)

LightyKD said:


> Since it's a PC any USB-C dock should work.


Any _hub_ will work (connected via cable), but not all docks will fit this beast in the slot where the USB-C plug resides.

The specs say 49mm wide, nearly two inches.  I'm thinking that's measured at the grips though, its widest point.  Hard to say exactly how wide the middle of this will be, but I very much doubt it's gonna fit in docks made for Switch or phones.


----------



## zoogie (Jul 17, 2021)

Hopefully, this thing will gobble up enough of the public's money to make snagging a PS5/XSX actually possible.


----------



## Xzi (Jul 17, 2021)

zoogie said:


> Hopefully, this thing will gobble up enough of the public's money to make snagging a PS5/XSX actually possible.


Well you don't pay for it until it ships, so probably not.  On that note though, I wonder how many people are putting in reservations for Steam Deck just on the off chance they can't obtain a PS5/XSX this year.


----------



## Pepsiman94x (Jul 17, 2021)

think of how fantastic an emulation beast this thing could be. I think it'll be brilliant.


----------



## LightyKD (Jul 17, 2021)

1) Anyone know if there is a distro of Steam OS 3.0?

2) Any way to run Android apps on this OS?

3) Who is planning to try some lightweight VR on this thing?! Honestly I'll be happy if I can play Star Trek Bridge Crew on the deck! Got my Starfleet uniform ready!


----------



## Xzi (Jul 17, 2021)

LightyKD said:


> 1) Anyone know if there is a distro of Steam OS 3.0?


https://repo.steampowered.com/steamos/dists/

"Clockwerk" is 3.0.



LightyKD said:


> 2) Any way to run Android apps on this OS?


Someone else would have to chime in, but I assume there are some pretty easy options for that on Arch Linux.



LightyKD said:


> 3) Who is planning to try some lightweight VR on this thing?! Honestly I'll be happy if I can play Star Trek Bridge Crew on the deck! Got my Starfleet uniform ready!


Might as well since it's an option for me.  With re-projection enabled it can probably get by on low settings (and the lowest FoV setting for my Pimax 5K lol), but that's still very impressive for any portable device.


----------



## Something whatever (Jul 17, 2021)

LightyKD said:


> Since it's a PC any USB-C dock should work. The issue is drivers since Linux and all. I have 3 docks with card readers but until I get the deck in my hands I have no clue which one I want to use.
> 
> 
> Easy. I tell Steam to setup my card reader's drive letter as a install location for games. Then I install a game and copy all of the non game data from the first SD card to another that I set aside as a "Boot Card". For every card you use, make sure they are called the same thing ("STEAM CARD" in my case) and are seen by Windows under the same drive letter.
> ...




going to try that, I have a crap ton of 64gb SD cards


----------



## shanefromoz (Jul 17, 2021)

Will these be sold in Australia?
Or at least available to Australia?


----------



## nine0nine (Jul 17, 2021)

it's strange that a few weeks ago, according to the internets,  Nintendo simply had to release a Switch pro because 720p gaming on an LCD was outdated and would make your eyes implode, then this appears and an 800p LCD is the greatest thing since free blowjobs, but there you go.

At $400, and assuming it'll be actually buyable I see this as being more of a threat to xbox than the switch, especially as a second console for rich kids who already have the PS5. Although I haven't done the research, I would guess that the xbox library of 'exclusives' is somewhat overlapped by the PC games market, so for the few games which you can't get on PS5, you could probably opt for this over the series x

It's probably gonna be DOA in japan too, so sales wise they can forget those numbers, if anyone is counting and you can certainly rule out the kids market that Nintendo owns.



> The Steam Deck will be 11.7 inches long and 4.6 inches tall and it will come out to just under 2 inches thick. For comparison, the standard Nintendo Switch is 9.4 inches long, 4 inches tall and 0.55 inches thick. Meanwhile, the Steam Deck will weigh in at 1.47lbs, just less than twice the weight of a Switch with the Joy-Con controllers attached (0.88 pounds).


----------



## Xzi (Jul 17, 2021)

nine0nine said:


> it's strange that a few weeks ago, according to the internets, Nintendo simply had to release a Switch pro because 720p gaming on an LCD was outdated and would make your eyes implode, then this appears and an 800p LCD is the greatest thing since free blowjobs, but there you go.


The screen resolution isn't the issue, it's the overall power of the hardware.  Switch struggles to push 20 FPS in some third-party games, docked or not.  Steam Deck won't have any problem maintaining 60 FPS at 720p for most games, or even 60 FPS at 1080p with a few settings tweaks.


----------



## mattyxarope (Jul 17, 2021)

Xzi said:


> The screen resolution isn't the issue, it's the overall power of the hardware.  Switch struggles to push 20 FPS in some third-party games, docked or not.  Steam Deck won't have any problem maintaining 60 FPS at 720p for most games, or even 60 FPS at 1080p with a few settings tweaks.



I'd say temper your expectations - more than likely, judging on similar devices like the Aya Neo, the Deck will probably run medium settings, 30fps, 720p for most AAA games. Then again, it all depends on the game.


----------



## Kioku_Dreams (Jul 17, 2021)

mattyxarope said:


> I'd say temper your expectations - more than likely, judging on similar devices like the Aya Neo, the Deck will probably run medium settings, 30fps, 720p for most AAA games. Then again, it all depends on the game.


The Aya was running a Vega GPU.


----------



## Xzi (Jul 17, 2021)

mattyxarope said:


> I'd say temper your expectations - more than likely, judging on similar devices like the Aya Neo, the Deck will probably run medium settings, 30fps, 720p for most AAA games. Then again, it all depends on the game.


Yeah of course some games are more demanding than others, and sometimes it doesn't even have much to do with their graphical fidelity.  Thankfully the days of absolute ass PC ports seem to be drawing to a close, and anything that has had a bit of TLC put into it I'm sure will run great on these specs.  Control, for instance, can run on much weaker hardware than what Steam Deck has on offer, so with the right graphics settings 60 FPS should be achievable.


----------



## the_randomizer (Jul 17, 2021)

Xzi said:


> The screen resolution isn't the issue, it's the overall power of the hardware.  Switch struggles to push 20 FPS in some third-party games, docked or not.  Steam Deck won't have any problem maintaining 60 FPS at 720p for most games, or even 60 FPS at 1080p with a few settings tweaks.



It can't be worse than than a GPD Win or some other crap device from AliExpress. Most of them can't even run modern Snes emulators (cycle-accurate ones) at full speed.


----------



## ov3rkill (Jul 17, 2021)

Honestly, at this moment, I'm just hyped for the RDNA 2 GPU of this APU since there's hasn't been or at least AMD hasn't announced an APU for desktop with RDNA 2. Maybe it'll be announced or released later this year or next year but having this on a portable device is something to look forward to. Waiting for reviewers to get their feedback on this device. Also waiting for Valve's announcement on region availability for the device especially with the shortages of chips and the limited supply and supplier of semiconductor.


----------



## wiindsurf (Jul 17, 2021)

What a terrible forgettable name though...
And that's before you realise "steam deck" sound like some "As Seen On TV" sauna room equipment or something for the laundry...
If you're one of the first 100 callers, you'll get not only your amazing steam deck, but also this awesome steam foot massager, absolutely free! Call now!


----------



## limpbiz411 (Jul 17, 2021)

so when is that official retroarch release for steam? this would be amazing on that instead installing win10


----------



## Xzi (Jul 17, 2021)

limpbiz411 said:


> so when is that official retroarch release for steam? this would be amazing on that instead installing win10


I don't know when the official release is, but you can download it now just by opting in on the Steam store page.  I think there's also a standalone release of RetroArch for Linux.


----------



## chaoskagami (Jul 17, 2021)

the_randomizer said:


> Maybe I'm wrong, but isn't it inadvisable to install Steam games to SD cards due to low read/write speeds?



Sure, but most games work best on SSD nowadays. Running them off a microSD isn't that much slower than running off rotational media in the grand scheme of things. They're both slow media with five second loading screens. Game consoles like the Switch have been running games off microSDs for years. It's really not much different. Plus, microSDs are cheap.



wiindsurf said:


> What a terrible forgettable name though...
> And that's before you realise "steam deck" sound like some "As Seen On TV" sauna room equipment or something for the laundry...
> If you're one of the first 100 callers, you'll get not only your amazing steam deck, but also this awesome steam foot massager, absolutely free! Call now!



You should probably go read Neuromancer someday. "Deck" is a perfectly appropriate and memorable name if you get the reference.


----------



## r5xscn (Jul 17, 2021)

nine0nine said:


> It's probably gonna be DOA in japan too, so sales wise they can forget those numbers, if anyone is counting and you can certainly rule out the kids market that Nintendo owns.


It is not available to order in Japan.


----------



## limpbiz411 (Jul 17, 2021)

Xzi said:


> I don't know when the official release is, but you can download it now just by opting in on the Steam store page.  I think there's also a standalone release of RetroArch for Linux.


hey thanks. I didn't know that. This steam deck is gonna be an emulation beast.


----------



## Goku1992A (Jul 17, 2021)

I’m probably the black sheep but I’m not that impressed. It’s a cool device don’t get me wrong but we have so many duplicates doing the same thing. Nothing is wrong with the price but I feel the audience will not be into this.  Only a very few people will pick this up. 

I mean they have to realize you are going against remote play and game pass and etc..etc..


----------



## Xzi (Jul 17, 2021)

Goku1992A said:


> I mean they have to realize you are going against remote play and game pass and etc..etc..


They're not competing with any of this lol, it all works on Steam Deck.


----------



## Kioku_Dreams (Jul 17, 2021)

Goku1992A said:


> I’m probably the black sheep but I’m not that impressed. It’s a cool device don’t get me wrong but we have so many duplicates doing the same thing. Nothing is wrong with the price but I feel the audience will not be into this.  Only a very few people will pick this up.
> 
> I mean they have to realize you are going against remote play and game pass and etc..etc..


The target audience doesn't want remote play. Game Pass can be solved by installing Windows, which isn't hard. This is the first competitively priced device of this type that actually has promise. Aya, GPD, etc are so expensive for what they offer. Granted, those are touted almost purely as PCs with added benefits and have the I/O that you can only get on the Steamdeck through a dock.


----------



## TheCasualties (Jul 17, 2021)

Just saw this on my steam.. I hope this thing kicks ass. Track pads and sticks!  It's what I've been hoping for with a Steam Controller 2 for the last 5 years.

I haven't read enough to actually preorder one, but I'm going to be hopeful. Might drunk order one sometime soon though.

TBH, I'm just so excited for the controller scheme.. Please release a new steam controller like this!

Remote play is obviously not wanted but if it can play most current games at 30fps, with and option to cloud play or steam share, I'd be happy. Basically a switch for PC

AND THE QUAD BACK PADDLES LOOK AMAZING ... Dang I'm probably gonna order one. It says they all come with a micro SD slot, so the mid level is prob what I'll go for.

Edit: well, I just "ordered" the mid tier. Drunk money spending! We'll see what the 5 dollars turns into.


----------



## DarknessPlay3r (Jul 17, 2021)

TheCasualties said:


> Just saw this on my steam.. I hope this thing kicks ass. Track pads and sticks!  It's what I've been hoping for with a Steam Controller 2 for the last 5 years.
> 
> I haven't read enough to actually preorder one, but I'm going to be hopeful. Might drunk order one sometime soon though.
> 
> ...


Given that 5 dollars is refundable (to your steam wallet if after 90 days) at any time before you actually commit to purchasing even I jumped on getting one.

Given it's telling me Q2 2022 that turns into like this time next year, so I got a whole year to ponder and see if in fact I can make use of something like this.


----------



## TheCasualties (Jul 17, 2021)

DarknessPlay3r said:


> Given that 5 dollars is refundable (to your steam wallet if after 90 days) at any time before you actually commit to purchasing even I jumped on getting one.
> 
> Given it's telling me Q2 2022 that turns into like this time next year, so I got a whole year to ponder and see if in fact I can make use of something like this.




I'm slightly interested in the 512gb version, but the only real bonus is the "anti-glare etched glass". That can probably be solved with a screen protector. At least, I hope so. Doesn't seem worth an extra $100.

Otherwise, We can stick a 1TB microSD. So who cares what size SSD this thing has?


----------



## mattyxarope (Jul 17, 2021)

Memoir said:


> The Aya was running a Vega GPU.


That's not the only differentiating factor, for better or worse. I'd still say taper expectations and be realistic considering the hardware and TDP.

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------



Xzi said:


> Control, for instance, can run on much weaker hardware than what Steam Deck has on offer, so with the right graphics settings 60 FPS should be achievable.



Of course, that's the beauty of pc.

But maybe I'm in the minority and I'd rather play at 30fps with medium/high settings than at 60fps with all low settings. You can "LowSpecGamer" any game and make it run 60fps, but some may look like shit.

Also the footage of control that they show in the IGN interview didn't look 60fps to me.

Additionally: @Prans you might want to update the specs on the post because the website updated to reflect the fact that all three have m.2 slots (though they recommend not changing the sd). Makes me even happier with the 64gb model I preordered.


----------



## Xzi (Jul 17, 2021)

mattyxarope said:


> But maybe I'm in the minority and I'd rather play at 30fps with medium/high settings than at 60fps with all low settings.


Depends on the game for me, but yeah generally when using it as a portable I'll settle for a locked 30 FPS so as to improve battery life.



mattyxarope said:


> Also the footage of control that they show in the IGN interview didn't look 60fps to me.


Who knows what settings/clock speeds they were using for that.  All we know for sure is GabeN said it plays Portal 2 at 60 FPS with medium-ish settings no problem.  So not exactly the newest AAA game out there, but the fact that there's still wiggle room on the low end of settings is an encouraging sign.


----------



## TheCasualties (Jul 17, 2021)

Whoa it has a swappable m.2 slot? Gah i can't wait for more info.

Portal 2 at 60fps better be the bare minimum.. a switch could pull that off no problem.

To be honest though.. i mostly want it for that amazing control setup. 4 back paddles and track pads. I hope it can be used as a controller for PCs too.


----------



## mattyxarope (Jul 17, 2021)

Xzi said:


> GabeN said it plays Portal 2 at 60 FPS with medium-ish settings no problem.  So not exactly the newest AAA game out there, but the fact that there's still wiggle room on the low end of settings is an encouraging sign.



For reference, the nvidia shield tv has a portal port. I'd be flabbergasted if portal didn't run at 60fps at 800p max settings.

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------



TheCasualties said:


> Whoa it has a swappable m.2 slot? Gah i can't wait for more info.



Yes, even the base model according to the notes. It's probably not going to be simple to change though.

However this does open it up to the possibility of using a m.2 to pcie adapter that could use an egpu. But that's a crazy mod.


----------



## Xzi (Jul 17, 2021)

mattyxarope said:


> For reference, the nvidia shield tv has a portal port. I'd be flabbergasted if portal didn't run at 60fps at 800p max settings.


Well Shield TV is more powerful than Switch in itself, as it's not under-clocked.  But yeah I misheard, he didn't say what settings it was using at all, so it may well have been maxed.


----------



## tech3475 (Jul 17, 2021)

TheCasualties said:


> Whoa it has a swappable m.2 slot? Gah i can't wait for more info.
> 
> Portal 2 at 60fps better be the bare minimum.. a switch could pull that off no problem.
> 
> To be honest though.. i mostly want it for that amazing control setup. 4 back paddles and track pads. I hope it can be used as a controller for PCs too.



I’m annoyed I missed that about the SSD, makes the low end model more tempting, although officially it isn’t user serviceable so we’d have to see how easy it is to replace.

That said, looking around for 2230 M.2 cards they don’t seem to be that common, aimed more at OEMs right now or search engines hate form factor.

Dell sell them with 256GB on Amazon for £90 and 512gb for £133 on their site with places like ebay having what look like ones taken from machines, so they are relatively cheap.


----------



## ertaboy356b (Jul 17, 2021)

Not available in my country. Hope it becomes available in Asia next year.


----------



## Xzi (Jul 17, 2021)

Oh wow, so it is confirmed now that all three SKUs have a 2230 m.2 slot.  Kinda makes me regret going for the 256 GB, but as mentioned above, SSDs in that form factor are pretty pricey anyway, and Valve is still advising against users tinkering with it.  Good thing about not getting to order mine until Q1 2022 is that there will be plenty of tear-downs and full reviews available for reference by then.


----------



## tech3475 (Jul 17, 2021)

Xzi said:


> Oh wow, so it is confirmed now that all three SKUs have a 2230 m.2 slot.  Kinda makes me regret going for the 256 GB, but as mentioned above, SSDs in that form factor are pretty pricey anyway, and Valve is still advising against users tinkering with it.  Good thing about not getting to order mine until Q1 2022 is that there will be plenty of tear-downs and full reviews available for reference by then.



If they had made it user serviceable, I think they could have eliminated the 256GB option or just sell the base model.

If it makes you feel better, I have similar feeling over the 512GB model.


----------



## Purple_Shyguy (Jul 17, 2021)

1280x800p screen
1050 equivalent GPU
1.5 pounds weight
3 hour battery life
$550 for SSD version

Wtf. What a scam.


----------



## Raendor (Jul 17, 2021)

Purple_Shyguy said:


> 1280x800p screen
> 1050 equivalent GPU
> 1.5 pounds weight
> 3 hour battery life
> ...



And 6-year old tegra chip with primitive os, little memory, drifting joysticks but oled screen for $350 is not a scam? Deck even with basic model simply kills for its price.


----------



## D34DL1N3R (Jul 17, 2021)

Purple_Shyguy said:


> 1280x800p screen
> 1050 equivalent GPU
> 1.5 pounds weight
> 3 hour battery life
> ...





Raendor said:


> And 6-year old tegra chip with primitive os, little memory, drifting joysticks but oled screen for $350 is not a scam? Deck even with basic model simply kills for its price.



I wouldn't say "kills" is an accurate term. I have a 1060 in my PC and the thing can barely run any modern AAA games at a decent framerate without having to lower and/or disable several things a considerable amount. So a 1050???? Not a chance this thing "kills", even for the price.


----------



## ZoNtendo (Jul 17, 2021)

who the hell buy a Switch for specs anyway

99% of Switch owner most likely don't know it has a old ass TegraX1


----------



## HarveyHouston (Jul 17, 2021)

This will eat the OLED Switch for lunch. My prediction, or else I get one free!


----------



## SDA (Jul 17, 2021)

Aesthetically-wise, it awfully looks like a Game Gear, but with smaller buttons. Agh, now I think the OLED Nintendo Switch is not going to compete at all against this beast of a handheld.


----------



## AirbusX (Jul 17, 2021)

ZoNtendo said:


> who the hell buy a Switch for specs anyway
> 
> 99% of Switch owner most likely don't know it has a old ass TegraX1



I sure do! I am certainly not buying it for the boring ass Nintendo game library (aside Zelda which kicks ass).

With my line of work I want portability and the ability to play my games on the go. 

I hacked the crap out of my switch for that, but now I won’t have to with this new system, my switch is going to be a nice looking paperweight (until BOTW2) comes out which I’m certainly buying.


----------



## Ampersound (Jul 17, 2021)

Finally some good competition for Nintendo.
I feel like a lot of people who already own a regular Switch will be getting this instead of the OLED model.


----------



## ZoNtendo (Jul 17, 2021)

AirbusX said:


> I sure do! I am certainly not buying it for the boring ass Nintendo game library (aside Zelda which kicks ass).
> 
> With my line of work I want portability and the ability to play my games on the go.
> 
> I hacked the crap out of my switch for that, but now I won’t have to with this new system, my switch is going to be a nice looking paperweight (until BOTW2) comes out which I’m certainly buying.


Well I meant the performance specs not the portability gimmick, which is why the Steam console is more interesting 
if you don't care about 1st party titles. (because price/perf of the Switch is pretty awful, even back in 2017)


----------



## GhostWolf (Jul 17, 2021)

Blaze163 said:


> I'm not up on PC gaming as I don't have the patience for settings and drivers and compatibility lists and an that shit. But isn't the whole point the ability to upgrade your rig and install custom stuff for a better experience? How exactly does this console do that? It's neat for capturing what Steam can do at the moment, sure. But this'll be outdated by the time it gets out of the box, surely?



Well personally, the appeal of PC to me is the mouse + keyboard setup at a desk, with the ability to do all the things you want to do like running various programs, pulling up browsers, downloading this and that, gaming of course, I mean we all know what PC's are used for. That's the number one strength of PC's to me compared to consoles.

The fact that I can crack open my PC Case and look at the motherboard, the RAM, CPU and GPU inside, the PSU and all the cords and just remove something and replace it with something else is absolutely a bonus, that's definite bonus points, but I don't do this often at all, and it's certainly not the reason that I'm a PC guy. It's just a cherry on top if I'm honest, it's a juicy ass cherry but it's still just the cherry on top.


----------



## LightyKD (Jul 17, 2021)

I hope Valve posts the pre order numbers on Monday. Hope this device sells in the millions!


----------



## BLsquared (Jul 17, 2021)

Arekkusuda said:


> I knew this reminded me of something-


Oh, I thought it reminded me of this... But yeah, definitely 90s styling


----------



## mattyxarope (Jul 17, 2021)

I just realized something: 

We're going to be able to play Elden Ring on this


----------



## Purple_Shyguy (Jul 17, 2021)

Raendor said:


> And 6-year old tegra chip with primitive os, little memory, drifting joysticks but oled screen for $350 is not a scam? Deck even with basic model simply kills for its price.


The OLED is a scam. And? And it's still got a better screen than the Deck.

"Little memory" oled switch literally has the same 64gb emmc storage as the base $400 deck lol

What happens if your decks sticks drift? Can't simply replace that. Uh oh.


----------



## Vila_ (Jul 17, 2021)

Raendor said:


> And 6-year old tegra chip with primitive os, little memory, drifting joysticks but oled screen for $350 is not a scam? Deck even with basic model simply kills for its price.





Purple_Shyguy said:


> The OLED is a scam. And? And it's still got a better screen than the Deck.
> 
> "Little memory" oled switch literally has the same 64gb emmc storage as the base $400 deck lol
> 
> What happens if your decks sticks drift? Can't simply replace that. Uh oh.


they can both be expanded through a micro sd card slot so I beg you stop crying


----------



## Kioku_Dreams (Jul 17, 2021)

Purple_Shyguy said:


> The OLED is a scam. And? And it's still got a better screen than the Deck.
> 
> "Little memory" oled switch literally has the same 64gb emmc storage as the base $400 deck lol
> 
> What happens if your decks sticks drift? Can't simply replace that. Uh oh.


 Not the brightest bulb in the box, huh?


----------



## Purple_Shyguy (Jul 17, 2021)

Vilagamer999 said:


> they can both be expanded through a micro sd card slot so I beg you stop crying


Yeah? So can Switch. I didn't point out they had "little memory" the other guy did.


----------



## Pickle_Rick (Jul 17, 2021)

grey72 said:


> Running your own software to do whatever is a bigger draw than upgrades for PC IMO, and you get control down to the choice of OS with this device. And while extremely underpowered compared to anything with a discrete GPU, AFAIK it should be juuust powerful enough to run 95% of all games at lowest settings at 25-30fps, which is terrible but its the price you pay for portability.


IGN said it was running Jedi Fallen Order at high settings just fine.


----------



## ombus (Jul 17, 2021)

the prices are not really these at least on the 64 model.. nowdays games are 60+ easy.. so console + storage.. + dock if you want it.. 
just a remainder that not the most powerfull console gets the most love by people.. but the most fun.

pd: i will go play with my super duper...steam machine ? xD


----------



## mattyxarope (Jul 17, 2021)

ombus said:


> the prices are not really these at least on the 64 model.. nowdays games are 60+ easy.. so console + storage.. + dock if you want it..
> just a remainder that not the most powerfull console gets the most love by people.. but the most fun.
> 
> pd: i will go play with my super duper...steam machine ? xD



All models have SD cards which play just fine for most people, and even the 64gb version has a m.2 slot if you're ambitious and want to open it.


----------



## LightyKD (Jul 17, 2021)

I guess we're at the point in the conversation where the haters start coming in. Since I've started getting serious about PC gaming, I've always played at 720p High to Ultra. As long as I can get similar performance, I will be happy.


----------



## ombus (Jul 17, 2021)

mattyxarope said:


> All models have SD cards which play just fine for most people, and even the 64gb version has a m.2 slot if you're ambitious and want to open it.


be it sd or m.2 .. they cost money.. so same add that to the already 400 if you want the cheapest + price of the dock if on wants it..


----------



## Raendor (Jul 17, 2021)

D34DL1N3R said:


> I wouldn't say "kills" is an accurate term. I have a 1060 in my PC and the thing can barely run any modern AAA games at a decent framerate without having to lower and/or disable several things a considerable amount. So a 1050???? Not a chance this thing "kills", even for the price.


It’s a far lower resolution than what you’d run 1060 at and a newer architecture. It kills switch performance-wise, which is by far not even in state to compete with anything that level.

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------



Purple_Shyguy said:


> Yeah? So can Switch. I didn't point out they had "little memory" the other guy did.


Memory is just one of the many aspects and not the main one I mentioned. The main one is a freaking weak and ancient tegra chip from 2015 in a device sold for 350 in 2021. A chip defining the whole capability set. Everything else like “little memory” buffer you’ve clung to is just a side issue nevertheless.


----------



## sarkwalvein (Jul 17, 2021)

I've had my doubts regarding support and proton... but fuck it, preorder the 512GB model a minute ago.


----------



## Purple_Shyguy (Jul 17, 2021)

Raendor said:


> It’s a far lower resolution than what you’d run 1060 at and a newer architecture. It kills switch performance-wise, which is by far not even in state to compete with anything that level.
> 
> --------------------- MERGED ---------------------------
> 
> ...



You can bring up switch comparisons all day. You're comparing a 5 year old device.

800p, 1050, 2.2ghz CPU for $550-600+ is a scam.


----------



## Kioku_Dreams (Jul 17, 2021)

ombus said:


> be it sd or m.2 .. they cost money.. so same add that to the already 400 if you want the cheapest + price of the dock if on wants it..


"You get what you pay for" comes to mind.

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------



Purple_Shyguy said:


> You can bring up switch comparisons all day. You're comparing a 5 year old device.
> 
> 800p, 1050, 2.2ghz CPU for $550-600+ is a scam.


Based on what metric? Your personal feelings are completely irrelevant here. I assume you have comparable specs to share for a much less price? If not? You're wasting time. For what the hardware is and does, it's pretty low in price. Especially compared to its competition. No, the Switch isn't its competition.


----------



## Julie_Pilgrim (Jul 17, 2021)

jesus, 51 people viewing this thread right now


----------



## ShadowOne333 (Jul 17, 2021)

I have never used SteamOS (based on Linux, I know), but correct me if I am wrong, does this allow for installation of other software besides gaming stuff on SteamOS?
For once, I'd love to see RetroArch on it right from the get go. That would pretty much murder any other device out there, and imagine if it could run yuzu lol
I know RetroArch has a Steam port, but isn't that one limited to the selection of cores available?
Which cores can be played through RA Steam at the moment?


----------



## Kioku_Dreams (Jul 17, 2021)

ShadowOne333 said:


> I have never used SteamOS (based on Linux, I know), but correct me if I am wrong, does this allow for installation of other software besides gaming stuff on SteamOS?
> For once, I'd love to see RetroArch on it right from the get go. That would pretty much murder any other device out there, and imagine if it could run yuzu lol
> I know RetroArch has a Steam port, but isn't that one limited to the selection of cores available?
> Which cores can be played through RA Steam at the moment?


Yes, it has a full KDE based desktop that you can install apps on, and retroarch.


----------



## ShadowOne333 (Jul 17, 2021)

Memoir said:


> Yes, it has a full KDE based desktop that you can install apps on, and retroarch.


RIP any other console then.


----------



## DbGt (Jul 17, 2021)

Just preordered 1 of each version, in the end I will probably just buy 1.

Have to think about which version to get, hope more info comes out soon, especially about how easy or difficult its to upgrade the storage. Also I have to look up about this type of sdd availability and pricing in my region


----------



## mattyxarope (Jul 17, 2021)

ombus said:


> be it sd or m.2 .. they cost money.. so same add that to the already 400 if you want the cheapest + price of the dock if on wants it..



Well they cost money but the point is that you can get 512gb of storage for less than the top tier pricing, especially if you're not in the US. 

I don't care about a glass screen - I'll put a glass protector on it.

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------



DbGt said:


> Just preordered 1 of each version, in the end I will probably just buy 1.
> 
> Have to think about which version to get, hope more info comes out soon, especially about how easy or difficult its to upgrade the storage. Also I have to look up about this type of sdd availability and pricing in my region



Kind of a rude thing to do imo


----------



## Kioku_Dreams (Jul 17, 2021)

mattyxarope said:


> Kind of a rude thing to do imo



It's not like he stole a reservation from anyone. Valve is taking into account possible late orders. Plenty of people have reserved their systems even today.


----------



## DbGt (Jul 17, 2021)

mattyxarope said:


> Kind of a rude thing to do imo



Why? It's not like I'm buying all 3 of them and reselling them, the versions i do not buy will just be sold to someone else... So no damage done to anyone


----------



## mattyxarope (Jul 17, 2021)

DbGt said:


> Why? It's not like I'm buying all 3 of them and reselling them, the versions i do not buy will just be sold to someone else... So no damage done to anyone



It's pushing back others' orders - there was a reason they limited it to one per person.


----------



## Kioku_Dreams (Jul 17, 2021)

mattyxarope said:


> It's pushing back others' orders - there was a reason they limited it to one per person.


Should be hollering at the people who put their reservations up on eBay.


----------



## mattyxarope (Jul 17, 2021)

Memoir said:


> Should be hollering at the people who put their reservations up on eBay.



I'm not hollering. I'm saying it's not cool. I also disagree with scalpers putting up reservations up on Ebay. I don't like that either.


----------



## Noctosphere (Jul 17, 2021)

Preordered the 256GB SSD version for my sis (659CAD$)
She wanted a ps5 but we are running in a scalper problem
Plus, all the games she wanted on it are on PC
So, I'll give her acces to my steam account and she'll play on a portable PC 
We talked about it with her gamers friends about weither she should get a steam deck or a PS5 in the end
And she decided to get a Steam Deck in the end
Also, one of her friend also preordered the 820CAD$ one for himself 

Steam should share its profit with me, I'm selling console for them


----------



## DbGt (Jul 17, 2021)

mattyxarope said:


> It's pushing back others' orders - there was a reason they limited it to one per person.



Well, I'm just buying 1.... and others who? Anyone can order it if they want it right now, also as I said the versions i don't buy in the end will just be sold to "others". Furthermore, the pool in Europe and US are different, here in Europe the expected availability its still Q1 2022, so no, no damage done to anyone.


----------



## Noctosphere (Jul 17, 2021)

DbGt said:


> Well, I'm just buying 1.... and others who? Anyone can order it if they want it right now, also as I said the versions i don't buy in the end will just be sold to "others". Furthermore, the pool in Europe and US are different, here in Europe the expected availability its still Q1 2022, so no, no damage done to anyone.


really?
It's Q2 Here in Canada


----------



## DbGt (Jul 17, 2021)

Noctosphere said:


> really?
> It's Q2 Here in Canada



Yep, I know in NA its already Q2, but Europe its still Q1. The pools are different 

Just took this screenshot


----------



## Noctosphere (Jul 17, 2021)

DbGt said:


> Yep, I know in NA its already Q2, but Europe its still Q1. The pools are different
> 
> Just took this screenshot


okok, so it means the pool for Q1 at NA is already sold out?
Is that what you mean?


----------



## HideoKojima (Jul 17, 2021)

Is it strong enough to run Yuzu?


----------



## DbGt (Jul 17, 2021)

Noctosphere said:


> okok, so it means the pool for Q1 at NA is already sold out?
> Is that what you mean?



I mean that the pools are regional, and yes also the NA Q1 stock is sold out.

The steam deck reservation page says this in their FAQ:



> Is the reservation queue regional?
> Yes, the reservation queue and expected order availability times are specific to each region.


----------



## Noctosphere (Jul 17, 2021)

DbGt said:


> I mean that the pools are regional, and yes also the NA Q1 stock is sold out.
> 
> The steam deck reservation page stays this in their FAQ:


Alright thanks
I already knew it was regional, I just wondered if Canada actually started at Q2 instead of Q1


----------



## mattyxarope (Jul 17, 2021)

Shalashaska98 said:


> Is it strong enough to run Yuzu?



Aya Neo and Win GPD 3 are both capable of running some games, so yes.


----------



## Xzi (Jul 17, 2021)

sarkwalvein said:


> I've had my doubts regarding support and proton... but fuck it, preorder the 512GB model a minute ago.


It's at about 80% compatibility with Steam's whole catalog right now, not bad at all.  And they're pushing to have anti-cheats working on Linux by launch day, so that will bump the number up considerably.


----------



## windmill (Jul 17, 2021)

now i can experience bot hordes in tf2 while on the go


----------



## linkchidori (Jul 17, 2021)

If thing manages to eat up the Nintendo market, i could totally see the company easily moving to another kind of gaming device where it doesnt have a competitor.


----------



## Xzi (Jul 17, 2021)

linkchidori said:


> If thing manages to eat up the Nintendo market, i could totally see the company easily moving to another kind of gaming device where it doesnt have a competitor.


Valve is trying to encourage other manufacturers to make their own "portable gaming PCs," but realistically they are one of the only companies that can afford to/is willing to take a loss on each unit sold.  So they might just end up alone in this space anyway.


----------



## mattyxarope (Jul 17, 2021)

Xzi said:


> Valve is trying to encourage other manufacturers to make their own "portable gaming PCs," but realistically they are one of the only companies that can afford to/is willing to take a loss on each unit sold.  So they might just end up alone in this space anyway.



Microsoft will join this market, it's just a matter of time. They're the perfect company to do it. No better way to push Game pass than that...


----------



## linkchidori (Jul 17, 2021)

Xzi said:


> Valve is trying to encourage other manufacturers to make their own "portable gaming PCs," but realistically they are one of the only companies that can afford to/is willing to take a loss on each unit sold.  So they might just end up alone in this space anyway.


This is something that in kinda concerned about. I hope this can move enough units to justify the loss.


----------



## Paolosworld (Jul 17, 2021)

My bricked DS might finally be surrendered

is there emulator potential in steam os?


----------



## Noctosphere (Jul 17, 2021)

Paolosworld said:


> My bricked DS might finally be surrendered
> 
> is there emulator potential in steam os?


It's basicly a portable PC
it do is stated in the FAQ, any third party software CAN be installed on it


----------



## Paolosworld (Jul 17, 2021)

Noctosphere said:


> It's basicly a portable PC
> it do is stated in the FAQ, any third party software CAN be installed on it


so steam does nintendo better than nintendo confirmed?


----------



## Noctosphere (Jul 17, 2021)

Paolosworld said:


> so steam does nintendo better than nintendo confirmed?


it should even run perfectly Yuzu and Ryujinx


----------



## DerpDingus (Jul 17, 2021)

Besides the massive brick size and weight of this device, I have a feeling this will be the ultimate emulation device. I preordered this over the garbage OLED switch ( already have one) for any games under PS1 - Ill stick with my vita


----------



## pedro702 (Jul 17, 2021)

Am i the only one seeing a huge issue here? switch already has storage issues and switch games are bare bones and compressed so that they are minimum in size, this thing runs pc games, pc games are not compressed and have loads of modes and settings to tweak so are people expecting to uninstall 100+gb games on this? will they keep installing and deleting games all the time? because sd cards are extremely expensive even the ones at 512gb and they cant hold that many pc games at all.

So for me this will be a huge damn issue, and if you decide you want to play another game and need to install 150gb from a random network when away from home you will be disappointed on the time you will take or before battery runs out, i mean i see most people will only keep like 1 or 2 games installed or just waste a crap ton of money on sd cards to carry around.


----------



## xatzimi (Jul 17, 2021)

You know what I'd really like to use this for is to play visual novels away from my desk. Unfortunately I don't own them on Steam (it's a terrible service for VNs, please buy direct from the publisher), so I wonder if they'll even run from an executable


----------



## Crazystato (Jul 17, 2021)

Im keen for one of these. That 1280 x 800 panel though...


----------



## Kioku_Dreams (Jul 17, 2021)

pedro702 said:


> Am i the only one seeing a huge issue here? switch already has storage issues and switch games are bare bones and compressed so that they are minimum in size, this thing runs pc games, pc games are not compressed and have loads of modes and settings to tweak so are people expecting to uninstall 100+gb games on this? will they keep installing and deleting games all the time? because sd cards are extremely expensive even the ones at 512gb and they cant hold that many pc games at all.
> 
> So for me this will be a huge damn issue, and if you decide you want to play another game and need to install 150gb from a random network when away from home you will be disappointed on the time you will take or before battery runs out, i mean i see most people will only keep like 1 or 2 games installed or just waste a crap ton of money on sd cards to carry around.


While, yes, some games are releasing with file sizes close to if not in the triple digit GBs? Most still aren't. 512GB is more than enough storage for quite a few games on the go.

I would hope that those planning on buying one are informed on the limitations that will inevitably come from this device. 

For me, I'll be putting boomer shooters, some RPGs and Retroarch on it. I have zero plans to do serious gaming on this thing.


----------



## pedro702 (Jul 17, 2021)

Memoir said:


> While, yes, some games are releasing with file sizes close to if not in the triple digit GBs? Most still aren't. 512GB is more than enough storage for quite a few games on the go.


well they are advertising this to run AAA games and games are not getting smaller, they are getting bigger so we might see way more games like cod file sizes like 200gb in the next couple of years.

so imagine buying the 64gb version you cant already installs most AA games since you need os space and well your out of luck you need to buy an 512gb card which is already pretty damn expensive and you can fit like 2-3 AAA games in there and your stuck.

Sure there are smaller games but in the future every game will come out bigger and bigger and not going smaller, they are all going for 4k textures and in the next 4 or 5 years they will go for 8k for sure.

so i can see many people just getting sick of running out of memory and having to delete games and reinstall all the time or carry a pocket full of micro sd cards around.


----------



## Kioku_Dreams (Jul 17, 2021)

pedro702 said:


> well they are advertising this to run AAA games and games are not getting smaller, they are getting bigger so we might see way more games like cod file sizes like 200gb in the next couple of years.
> 
> so imagine buying the 64gb version you cant already installs most AA games since you need os space and well your out of luck you need to buy an 512gb card which is already pretty damn expensive and you can fit like 2-3 AAA games in there and your stuck.
> 
> ...


Yeah, it's the same problem we're seeing with the current Gen consoles. The unfortunate truth is that this is the best we're going to get because of limited storage expansion options without emptying your wallet. Short of building your own mini PC, or buying a laptop.. Even then, those will run you a pretty penny.

At the very least, I would have liked to have seen a full size USB type A port on the Deck..


----------



## Xzi (Jul 17, 2021)

mattyxarope said:


> Microsoft will join this market, it's just a matter of time. They're the perfect company to do it. No better way to push Game pass than that...


I'm not so sure.  Game Pass is going to be available on any given portable PC anyway, and Microsoft is kinda doing their own thing in that space with Surface/other mobile products.  But it is possible they were just waiting for someone else to "break the seal," so to speak, so that they didn't have to compete with Nintendo directly.


----------



## Axido (Jul 17, 2021)

pedro702 said:


> so imagine buying the 64gb version you cant already installs most AA games since you need os space and well your out of luck you need to buy an 512gb card which is already pretty damn expensive and you can fit like 2-3 AAA games in there and your stuck.



First of all, AAA games suck nowadays. Whoever deems them worthy of being installed onto anything should have to live with the consequences.

Second, AAA games with 4K or 8K textures couldn't even make use of those properly on the Deck, since it doesn't have the hardware to do anything worthwhile with them. For games that can be modded, you could be lucky enough to see any textures the Deck wouldn't need anyways being removed, which would shrink the filesize considerably. I don't see developers going the extra mile to implement that themselves, though.

Besides that I wouldn't call a 512GB micro SD card expensive. Compared to the premium you'd pay for the 512GB Deck those 70 bucks you'd have to shell out for a micro SD card of said size are peanuts. I for one got enough external HDDs (ever thought of those?) lying around to not worry about the lack of space on the 64GB model.

If you need to play games on the system that exceed 100GB in size, I'd advise you to stay away from it. Games with that file size will either look awful on the thing or run at very low framerates.


----------



## barnhilltrckn (Jul 17, 2021)

I have a 256gb version on hold for myself. I believe I got lucky seeing as how the Steam servers were so swamped lol


----------



## Noctosphere (Jul 17, 2021)

hum... care to explain guys?
Of ALL the AAA games I own, I think only one exceed 100GB (WOW in this case)
Pretty much all AAA games I own (I'd say released past 2015-2016) are around 40-70 GB each
Also, WOW has A LOT of big expansions and updates, hence why it exceed 100GB

Also, with this kind of portable PCs being more and more popular, I hope video games companies will start thinking about making 4/8k textures optional at download, so that people like me who still stick with 1080p don't have to be forced to get them (if it isn't the case already)


----------



## Kioku_Dreams (Jul 18, 2021)

Noctosphere said:


> hum... care to explain guys?
> Of ALL the AAA games I own, I think only one exceed 100GB (WOW in this case)
> Pretty much all AAA games I own (I'd say released past 2015-2016) are around 40-70 GB each
> Also, WOW has A LOT of big expansions and updates, hence why it exceed 100GB
> ...


Not even just the textures, but the parts of the games you may not even play anyway. So, I could install Campaign only because I don't want to play the multiplayer or vice versa... or even extra modes like map makers or theaters. Things like that.


----------



## EvilJagaGenius (Jul 18, 2021)

Xzi said:


> I'm not so sure.  Game Pass is going to be available on any given portable PC anyway, and Microsoft is kinda doing their own thing in that space with Surface/other mobile products.  But it is possible they were just waiting for someone else to "break the seal," so to speak, so that they didn't have to compete with Nintendo directly.



Does anyone know if Game Pass games run on Linux via Proton or Wine?  It would make a great addition to this machine.

About file sizes... The biggest games on my hard drive are Titanfall 2 (~70GB) and PSO2 (~90GB).  I know some other games like Path of Exile and Warframe are no slouches either.  Again, I'm not sure if those games run on Proton/Wine.

I'm not sure if this is going to press developers into rediscovering compression and bringing their games back down to manageable sizes - my guess is no, this looks more like a companion to a gaming PC or console where that's less of an issue - but it's frustrating that some good games are unplayable out of the box on the 64GB model.  Love Titanfall 2.  I can't really blame Valve though, they're not responsible for other devs' file sizes.  64GB can still fit a lot of games.

I think this'll make a great portable home for moddable games, like Quake, GZDoom, and Source Engine mods.  Open-source games too, with the native Linux ports.


----------



## Noctosphere (Jul 18, 2021)

Memoir said:


> Not even just the textures, but the parts of the games you may not even play anyway. So, I could install Campaign only because I don't want to play the multiplayer or vice versa... or even extra modes like map makers or theaters. Things like that.


well, I guess in most games, the same engine is used in both campaign and multiplayer
So installing one means installing the other minus few featues
For example, if you want only the campaign, you'll only need cinematics
While if you want only multiplayer, you'll need the client-server connections files


----------



## mattyxarope (Jul 18, 2021)

Noctosphere said:


> well, I guess in most games, the same engine is used in both campaign and multiplayer
> So installing one means installing the other minus few featues
> For example, if you want only the campaign, you'll only need cinematics
> While if you want only multiplayer, you'll need the client-server connections files



Something like COD is massive because it downloads single player and multiplayer and languages and their battle royale. I think they changed that now but it was huge - like 150gigs. 

Honestly even if I buy a game (I rarely play online), I typically download the cracked version of my purchased ones so I can choose to not have languages I don't speak and other unnecessary files on my hard drive. It saves a lot of space.


----------



## Xzi (Jul 18, 2021)

EvilJagaGenius said:


> Does anyone know if Game Pass games run on Linux via Proton or Wine? It would make a great addition to this machine.


I very much doubt there's any Linux equivalent of the Xbox app, but dual booting is always an option.

There is the possibility Microsoft brings Game Pass to Steam in the future, and there are already a couple distros for accessing EGS on Linux.


----------



## SaberLilly (Jul 18, 2021)

This isn't a bad little device for the price, the market for handheld computers is still relatively fresh and this thing would be prime to get a piece of the pie especially at 399 dollars. The addition of NVMe SSD slots really makes it appealing for me. HOWEVER, gaming on an APU does not really seem that appealing to me when i have a laptop with a 1050 ti in it. I can see this being a really nice Retroarch box/GeForce Now game streaming box though.


----------



## Goku1992A (Jul 18, 2021)

Xzi said:


> They're not competing with any of this lol, it all works on Steam Deck.



Okay so to clarify you need to have a game on steam to play this. Like you cant play a pirated steam game that is what I'm saying. Like to clarify I can't put emulators like Dolphin and etc.. on it

@Memoir 
For me personally the price of $400 isn't a big deal but what does it bring to the table? It just seems to me the only people who benefit from this who want to play their steam games on the go.  My issue is "maybe I'm wrong" many people seen how successful the switch is and they want a piece of the cake.  Nowadays you can steam a game so it really doesn't make sense to buy expensive equipment to stream but I'm guessing with this you can download your steam game and play it on the go.


----------



## Kioku_Dreams (Jul 18, 2021)

Goku1992A said:


> Okay so to clarify you need to have a game on steam to play this. Like you cant play a pirated steam game that is what I'm saying. Like to clarify I can't put emulators like Dolphin and etc.. on it
> 
> @Memoir
> For me personally the price of $400 isn't a big deal but what does it bring to the table? It just seems to me the only people who benefit from this who want to play their steam games on the go.  My issue is "maybe I'm wrong" many people seen how successful the switch is and they want a piece of the cake.  Nowadays you can steam a game so it really doesn't make sense to buy expensive equipment to stream but I'm guessing with this you can download your steam game and play it on the go.


1. Yes, you can put Dolphin on this device. It's a full fledged PC.

2. You pretty much pointed out the purpose to this device and any device like it. Obviously it's not for everyone. It doesn't have to be. Game streaming still leaves too much to be desired for it to be practical for your average consumer. To be able to play it natively on a device without the need for cloud gaming instantly beats out things like GeForce Now and the like.


----------



## xdarkmario (Jul 18, 2021)

defiantly not preordering but it has some of my interest. But i also have a beast ass desktop anyway so im not on need of it.
also my fingers are cramping just LOOKING at that button placement  
but if possible id rather install windows embedded edition (if that even exist anymore)  on it


----------



## Rahkeesh (Jul 18, 2021)

EvilJagaGenius said:


> Does anyone know if Game Pass games run on Linux via Proton or Wine?  It would make a great addition to this machine.



This is never going to happen. Microsoft Store security is too tightly embedded in the Windows OS and all gamepass PC releases go through that.

If Microsoft wants anything to do with Deck I'm pretty sure their play is to force windows onto it. Or else stream cloud stuff from a browser.


----------



## Xzi (Jul 18, 2021)

Goku1992A said:


> Okay so to clarify you need to have a game on steam to play this. Like you cant play a pirated steam game that is what I'm saying. Like to clarify I can't put emulators like Dolphin and etc.. on it


As Memoir said, you can play pirated games, emulated games, DOS games, whatever.  It's a desktop-based OS, and you're free to install a different OS (WIndows 10 or 11), or even dual boot.  Install Origin, Battle.net, Uplay, EGS, GOG, every launcher known to man if you want.

This isn't a console, it's straight-up a PC.  No limits on the software side.


----------



## Goku1992A (Jul 18, 2021)

@Xzi  and @Memoir 

It's impressive I will give it  that. But from my research you need to buy the $500 model as the 64gb model doesn't seem worth it.  

For those who are interested this video is really good.


----------



## Pickle_Rick (Jul 18, 2021)

Goku1992A said:


> @Xzi  and @Memoir
> 
> It's impressive I will give it  that. But from my research you need to buy the $500 model as the 64gb model doesn't seem worth it.
> 
> For those who are interested this video is really good.



I'll agree with that. The 64GB model is basically limited to an indie machine. I got the 256GB model because you really need it for AAA games.


----------



## Xzi (Jul 18, 2021)

Goku1992A said:


> It's impressive I will give it that. But from my research you need to buy the $500 model as the 64gb model doesn't seem worth it.


Every model has an m.2 SSD slot, though we don't know how manageable it'll be yet.  And every model has a microSD card slot, so that's another cheap storage solution.  But yeah I went with the 256 GB model just to avoid the hassle of installing an SSD myself, and with a 512 GB mSD that should be plenty enough space for me.  Mostly gonna put indies and older stuff/emulation on it, though early on I'll definitely put it through its paces with more demanding stuff.


----------



## Goku1992A (Jul 18, 2021)

Xzi said:


> Every model has an m.2 SSD slot, though we don't know how manageable it'll be yet.  And every model has a microSD card slot, so that's another cheap storage solution.  But yeah I went with the 256 GB model just to avoid the hassle of installing an SSD myself, and with a 512 GB mSD that should be plenty enough space for me.  Mostly gonna put indies and older stuff/emulation on it.



Maybe you can translate the specs because that part I'm highly confused about on this  device how strong is this? Like if you put it on a tier scale of like a NVIDIA® GeForce RTX™ 3060 6GB GDDR6.

Like is this like a PS4 in your hands ? I couldn't really understand the specs because it seems to me they are going to optimize the steam games to play on the device but for regular PC games that are cracked they go off a systems requirement list which is why I was confused on that part.


----------



## Xzi (Jul 18, 2021)

Goku1992A said:


> Maybe you can translate the specs because that part I'm highly confused about on this  device how strong is this? Like if you put it on a tier scale of like a NVIDIA® GeForce RTX™ 3060 6GB GDDR6.
> 
> Like is this like a PS4 in your hands ? I couldn't really understand the specs because it seems to me they are going to optimize the steam games to play on the device but for regular PC games that are cracked they go off a systems requirement list which is why I was confused on that part.


Sure, no problem.  In terms of TFlops, it is basically the power of a PS4, maybe slightly stronger.  The APU itself is a great value, but the real jaw-dropper here is 16GB of DDR5 5500 RAM.  My freaking desktop only has DDR4 3200.  Valve is taking a pretty decent loss on each unit sold here, save maybe the top tier option.


----------



## Noctosphere (Jul 18, 2021)

Xzi said:


> Sure, no problem.  In terms of TFlops, it is basically the power of a PS4, maybe slightly stronger.  The APU itself is a great value, but the real jaw-dropper here is 16GB of DDR5 5500 RAM.  My freaking desktop only has DDR4 3200.  Valve is taking a pretty decent loss on each unit sold here, save maybe the top tier option.


I don't have a ps4 but i know the quality of nvidia gpus
Can you tell me what would be the equivalent of steam deck's gpu among nvidia gpus please?
Thanks 

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------

Also, is it compatible with ray tracing?
Thanks again


----------



## Goku1992A (Jul 18, 2021)

Xzi said:


> Sure, no problem.  In terms of TFlops, it is basically the power of a PS4, maybe slightly stronger.  The APU itself is a great value, but the real jaw-dropper here is 16GB of DDR5 5500 RAM.  My freaking desktop only has DDR4 3200.  Valve is taking a pretty decent loss on each unit sold here, save maybe the top tier option.



Understood it's a VERY impressive device the only issue with me I just bought a G15 that has a NVIDIA® GeForce RTX™ 3060 6GB GDDR6. That's my 5 year investment since I opted out of buying the Series-X.  I also have my old G3 I decided not to sell it because I wouldn't get the money that I invested into it. 
But the handheld is very impressive it's kinda nice to see handhelds coming back in style who knows Maybe Sony may return with a handheld if the market is doing well.


----------



## Xzi (Jul 18, 2021)

Noctosphere said:


> I don't have a ps4 but i know the quality of nvidia gpus
> Can you tell me what would be the equivalent of steam deck's gpu among nvidia gpus please?
> Thanks


Somewhere between a GTX 1050 and GTX 1060, hard to nail down exactly.



Noctosphere said:


> Also, is it compatible with ray tracing?
> Thanks again


Would be a significant performance hit, probably end up putting you in the 10 - 20 FPS range depending on game.  Not compatible with Nvidia ray-tracing obviously as it's an AMD APU.


----------



## mattyxarope (Jul 18, 2021)

Xzi said:


> Somewhere between a GTX 1050 and GTX 1060, hard to nail down exactly.
> 
> 
> Would be a significant performance hit, probably end up putting you in the 10 - 20 FPS range depending on game.  Not compatible with Nvidia ray-tracing obviously as it's an AMD APU.



God I wish DLSS was open source and the Steam Deck had it


----------



## Goku1992A (Jul 18, 2021)

@Xzi 

For future games they have to optimize them on steam like how they would do a PS5/Series-X. My G3 had a GTX 1050 but it couldn't play Biomutant or RE8 but it could play 90% of the games on min settings but I paid $600 for my G3 2 years ago so it was a good price since it played most "last gen" PS4/XB1 games along with all my emulators fine. The only issue when it ran into certain titles I just bought the G15. 

IMO 32GB ram is overkill the most you will use is 8gb per game. Unless you want to be super fancy on Ultra Settings


----------



## Xzi (Jul 18, 2021)

Goku1992A said:


> Understood it's a VERY impressive device the only issue with me I just bought a G15 that has a NVIDIA® GeForce RTX™ 3060 6GB GDDR6. That's my 5 year investment since I opted out of buying the Series-X.


Yeah I just got a PS5 some months back.  If Steam Deck was releasing right _now_ there's no chance I'd buy it, but January/February of next year I'm pretty sure I can do.



Goku1992A said:


> For future games they have to optimize them on steam like how they would do a PS5/Series-X.


Not gonna be much optimization necessary considering that PS5/XSX also run on AMD APUs, lol.  That's how you know Steam Deck's performance should stay pretty consistent throughout next gen.



Goku1992A said:


> IMO 32GB ram is overkill the most you will use is 8gb per game. Unless you want to be super fancy on Ultra Settings


Oh for sure, 16GB is just the right amount for a gaming PC right now, and by comparison, Switch has freaking 4GB.  Speed of the RAM is more important than amount after a certain threshold.


----------



## Deleted member 512337 (Jul 18, 2021)

got a 64 gig one. Im getting a ssd to put into it.


----------



## Xzi (Jul 18, 2021)

ChicoPancho said:


> got a 64 gig one. Im getting a ssd to put into it.


Just remember it's a 2230 m.2 SSD.  They're tiny little things.  For whatever reason, they're REALLY cheap at 128GB (about $20), but they quickly get expensive at higher capacities (512GB is like $200).


----------



## Deleted member 512337 (Jul 18, 2021)

Xzi said:


> Just remember it's a 2230 m.2 SSD.  They're tiny little things.  For whatever reason, they're REALLY cheap at 128GB (about $20), but they quickly get expensive at higher capacities (512GB is like $200).


I have a spare 512 gig sd card for my hacked switch, but the SD reader on the mobo went kaput so im gonna use that to hold me over/


----------



## mattyxarope (Jul 18, 2021)

Xzi said:


> Just remember it's a 2230 m.2 SSD.  They're tiny little things.  For whatever reason, they're REALLY cheap at 128GB (about $20), but they quickly get expensive at higher capacities (512GB is like $200).



https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0855SVCJ2/

This is shuckable, $229 for 1tb


----------



## Xzi (Jul 18, 2021)

mattyxarope said:


> https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0855SVCJ2/
> 
> This is shuckable, $229 for 1tb


Good call, didn't think there'd be many external SSDs available in that form factor.


----------



## Goku1992A (Jul 18, 2021)

@Xzi 
Is this something that you are going to be playing daily? My thing is I have a Vita, 3DS, and a Switch but I barely play them


----------



## Xzi (Jul 18, 2021)

Goku1992A said:


> @Xzi
> Is this something that you are going to be playing daily? My thing is I have a Vita, 3DS, and a Switch but I barely play them


I'm thinking I'll be using it for streaming TV shows and movies as much as anything else, also for tinkering with and familiarizing myself with different Linux distros.  I'm gonna get a dock and have it sit right next to my PC and switch, with it connected to one of my bigger displays most of the time.


----------



## Goku1992A (Jul 18, 2021)

Xzi said:


> I'm thinking I'll be using it for streaming TV shows and movies as much as anything else, also for tinkering with and familiarizing myself with different Linux distros.  I'm gonna get a dock and have it sit right next to my PC and switch, with it connected to one of my bigger displays most of the time.



How stable is Linux? Mainly the top OS are Mac OS and Windows


----------



## Xzi (Jul 18, 2021)

Goku1992A said:


> How stable is Linux? Mainly the top OS are Mac OS and Windows


It differs from distro to distro.  Android is Linux-based, so there's that.  I don't have a ton of knowledge on the subject, but I do know Valve switched from Debian to Arch Linux for SteamOS 3.0, and I've heard only positive things about that switch from the Linux community.


----------



## Kioku_Dreams (Jul 18, 2021)

Xzi said:


> It differs from distro to distro.  Android is Linux-based, so there's that.  I don't have a ton of knowledge on the subject, but I do know Valve switched from Debian to Arch Linux for SteamOS 3.0, and I've heard only positive things about that switch from the Linux community.


The only thing I've noticed is that the Arch community has a sense of elitism about them. I can understand the "bleeding edge" mantra. I just don't think it's explicitly better than Debian (or any other flavor for that matter). I say this as I hold tight to Manjaro. Still, I'm excited about this switch. I'd like to install Gnome instead of KDE though.


----------



## Rahkeesh (Jul 18, 2021)

Re: SD cards, the entire 8th gen of consoles was built around hard drives, and leans heavily into the CPU for decompression. Hardware Unboxed ran some benchmarks and could barely tell the difference between vastly different SSD speeds in terms of loading times because decompression was the bottleneck in most AAA PC games. A half-decent SD card should have much faster access than any hard drive here so I'm not sure it will be a major stumbling block among all the other graphics compromises you will already be making, at least for 8th gen. This device doesn't really have the GPU for 9th gen exclusives so I'm not sure how viable any of those are going to be anyway.

That said I'm guessing that the 64gb option is really only viable for steam OS, windows itself get bloated, and you probably want anything online-centric filled with player skins on your SSD since they can hardly preload those.


----------



## FFTfanatic (Jul 18, 2021)

Xzi said:


> Every model has an m.2 SSD slot, though we don't know how manageable it'll be yet.  And every model has a microSD card slot, so that's another cheap storage solution.  But yeah I went with the 256 GB model just to avoid the hassle of installing an SSD myself, and with a 512 GB mSD that should be plenty enough space for me.  Mostly gonna put indies and older stuff/emulation on it, though early on I'll definitely put it through its paces with more demanding stuff.


Valve reps told IGN that internal storage is non-upgradable which means if it can be done, it will invalidate your warranty.


----------



## pedro702 (Jul 18, 2021)

Axido said:


> First of all, AAA games suck nowadays. Whoever deems them worthy of being installed onto anything should have to live with the consequences.
> 
> Second, AAA games with 4K or 8K textures couldn't even make use of those properly on the Deck, since it doesn't have the hardware to do anything worthwhile with them. For games that can be modded, you could be lucky enough to see any textures the Deck wouldn't need anyways being removed, which would shrink the filesize considerably. I don't see developers going the extra mile to implement that themselves, though.
> 
> ...


the entire point of this is too play s on the go you gonna carry an external hdd with you and then wire it to the system while playing it away from the tv? lol makes no sense what you said.


----------



## Xzi (Jul 18, 2021)

FFTfanatic said:


> Valve reps told IGN that internal storage is non-upgradable which means if it can be done, it will invalidate your warranty.


Most likely, yeah.  That'd be kind of silly if it turns out to be a perfectly usable space, though.



pedro702 said:


> the entire point of this is too play s on the go you gonna carry an external hdd with you and then wire it to the system while playing it away from the tv? lol makes no sense what you said.


Well unlike Switch you could have a dock with an external HDD plugged in at home with a ton of game installs on it.  And a whole other set of games installed on your internal SSD/micro SD.


----------



## pedro702 (Jul 18, 2021)

Xzi said:


> Most likely, yeah.  That'd be kind of silly if it turns out to be a perfectly usable space, though.
> 
> 
> Well unlike Switch you could have a dock with an external HDD plugged in at home with a ton of game installs on it.  And a whole other set of games installed on your internal SSD/micro SD.


but if you are a pc gamer and you are in your house you could just you know use your pc?

this is for people who regularly play steam games and pc in general and im preety sure 99% of pc gamers already have a rigg at home more powerful than this so why would they choose to play this docked?


----------



## Goku1992A (Jul 18, 2021)

pedro702 said:


> the entire point of this is too play s on the go you gonna carry an external hdd with you and then wire it to the system while playing it away from the tv? lol makes no sense what you said.



I think they are just going to optimize the games on steam to make them play on the steam deck. But again the entire point of this is to continue your game from your PC to on the go this is the best way that I can think of it.  But people have to factor in are they going to be playing this frequently on the go because if they are at home they are just going to use their main PC to game on because the main PC will bring better performance.


----------



## Kioku_Dreams (Jul 18, 2021)

pedro702 said:


> but if you are a pc gamer and you are in your house you could just you know use your pc?
> 
> this is for people who regularly play steam games and pc in general and im preety sure 99% of pc gamers already have a rigg at home more powerful than this so why would they choose to play this docked?


It's a supplemental device. It can be used as a primary PC. It's portable. Easy to setup. Hell, I'm looking at using this as a device for schoolwork and gaming at a buddy's house.

Or better yet, it allows you to play your games without being tied down to one room in the home. Yeah, you can stream your games, but running them natively sounds so much nicer.


----------



## Xzi (Jul 18, 2021)

pedro702 said:


> but if you are a pc gamer and you are in your house you could just you know use your pc?
> 
> this is for people who regularly play steam games and pc in general and im preety sure 99% of pc gamers already have a rigg at home more powerful than this so why would they choose to play this docked?


Because you aren't limited to just games here.  Your desktop can be in use for productivity while your Steam Deck is in use for entertainment, or vice versa.  You can put one behind a VPN and torrent a bunch of stuff while using the other to stream shows/movies, etc and so forth.


----------



## pedro702 (Jul 18, 2021)

Xzi said:


> Because you aren't limited to just games here.  Your desktop can be in use for productivity while your Steam Deck is in use for entertainment, or vice versa.  You can put one behind a VPN and torrent a bunch of stuff while using the other to stream shows/movies, etc and so forth.


smart tvs are way too common nowadays so i dont see why anyone would need a pc to stream anything tbh,  every smartv has apps natively to stream movies and tv shows. well i will wait and see when people have this on hand to do review, if on most games this only runs 2 hour batery then i bet lots of people will be disappointed, since unlike you i dont think most people want to buy this to use it docked primarily.



Memoir said:


> It's a supplemental device. It can be used as a primary PC. It's portable. Easy to setup. Hell, I'm looking at using this as a device for schoolwork and gaming at a buddy's house.
> 
> Or better yet, it allows you to play your games without being tied down to one room in the home. Yeah, you can stream your games, but running them natively sounds so much nicer.


the thing is there is laptops , small ones even that are a way nicer than this to do work on since you know keyboard and such and need no set up just open them and be done with it, and they arent that much bigger than this.


----------



## Xzi (Jul 18, 2021)

pedro702 said:


> smart tvs are way too common nowadays so i dont see why anyone would need a pc to stream anything tbh, every smartv has apps natively to stream movies and tv shows.


Lol one of my displays is a 4K smart TV, but I'd never actually use that functionality or its UI, which is painfully slow and I'm guessing it hasn't had its firmware updated since I bought the thing five years ago.  Not gonna connect it to the internet to find out now.  And streaming is just an example.



pedro702 said:


> well i will wait and see when people have this on hand to do review, if on most games this only runs 2 hour batery then i bet lots of people will be disappointed, since unlike you i dont think most people want to buy this to use it docked primarily.


It's not that I'll use it docked primarily, I'm just excited to have a Linux desktop environment close at hand regardless of whether I'm using it docked or portable.  And on the flip side, people who want a more "console-like" experience never have to see the actual desktop of this thing, just Steam's new UX.

Battery life seems solid.  Portal 2 max settings at 60 FPS gives a little over two hours.  At 30 FPS it gives six hours.  Basically you're gonna want to run AAA games at 30 FPS portable, but that's ideal to avoid fluctuating frame rates anyway.


----------



## Julie_Pilgrim (Jul 18, 2021)

GOD FUCKIGN DAMMIT I JUST REALIZED THIS MEANS WE HAVE _ANOTHER _WAY TO PLAY SKYRIM


----------



## Xzi (Jul 18, 2021)

Scott_pilgrim said:


> GOD FUCKIGN DAMMIT I JUST REALIZED THIS MEANS WE HAVE _ANOTHER _WAY TO PLAY SKYRIM


The question is: who's gonna be the first to stream Skyrim to their Steam Deck from their PC, while simultaneously running an instance of Skyrim on their Deck, and simultaneously using it to install the Skyrim NSP via USB-C to USB-C connection with their Switch.


----------



## Julie_Pilgrim (Jul 18, 2021)

Xzi said:


> Edit: ninja edit


HE CANT KEEP GETTING AWAY WITH IT 

(this applies to both posts)


----------



## Xzi (Jul 18, 2021)

Scott_pilgrim said:


> HE CANT KEEP GETTING AWAY WITH IT
> 
> (this applies to both posts)


HA HA, the ninja has been ninja'd!  How the turn tables!


----------



## Julie_Pilgrim (Jul 18, 2021)

Xzi said:


> The question is: who's gonna be the first to stream Skyrim to their Steam Deck from their PC, while simultaneously running an instance of Skyrim on their Deck, and simultaneously using it to install the Skyrim NSP via USB-C to USB-C connection with their Switch.


me: todd please im begging you please just _one _ rerelease of fallout new vegas just make it playable without spending an hour modding it(id ask for any update to the existing steam version but with the state of the game tbh we're better off with a remaster)

todd: did i hear rerelease skyrim and fix abosuletly nothing for the 986th time?


----------



## Xzi (Jul 18, 2021)

Scott_pilgrim said:


> todd please im begging you please just _one _ rerelease of fallout new vegas just make it playable without spending an hour modding it(id ask for any update to the existing steam version but with the state of the game tbh we're better off with a remaster)


I would've said it'll never happen, but that was before Microsoft bought both Bethesda and Obsidian.  Put New Vegas on Outer Worlds' engine and update the graphics?  Hell yeah I'd pay $60 for that.


----------



## Julie_Pilgrim (Jul 18, 2021)

Xzi said:


> I would've said it'll never happen, but that was before Microsoft bought both Bethesda and Obsidian.  Put New Vegas on Outer Worlds' engine and update the graphics?  Hell yeah I'd pay $60 for that.


me: cant stand capitalism
*5 minutes later*
i would pay so much money for a new vegas port it's unreal


----------



## Xzi (Jul 18, 2021)

Scott_pilgrim said:


> me: cant stand capitalism
> *5 minutes later*
> i would pay so much money for a new vegas port it's unreal


Creative endeavors like video games are the only things that make capitalism bearable.


----------



## Julie_Pilgrim (Jul 18, 2021)

Xzi said:


> Creative endeavors like video games are the only things that make capitalism bearable.


(snipped cause i realized how stupid it was)


----------



## Drak0rex (Jul 18, 2021)

Why couldn't  they have made it so you can just insert an M.2 drive as you would an sd card? Any technical  reason? Also, wonder what would happen if you plugged an external gpu...


----------



## Ruryk (Jul 18, 2021)

Finally a portable PS2 emulator (I guess?)


----------



## lordelan (Jul 18, 2021)

Oh boy I hope this runs Ryujinx well. If it does, you can literally play a local multiplayer game with one of you using Steam Deck + Ryujinx and the other using a real Nintendo Switch:


----------



## machomuu (Jul 18, 2021)

Totally won't be a Switch killer but my Switch finally has a buddy <3

Excited to play FFXIV on this, and I hope more companies hop on the trend because it's a good one to shape up and refine. In fact, more likely than not I'll just wait until a better competitor is announced and jump on that train (which will probably happen before this is even released, in all honesty).


----------



## masagrator (Jul 18, 2021)

machomuu said:


> n fact, more likely than not I'll just wait until a better competitor is announced and jump on that train


This IS a better competitor in comparison to other PC handheld devices which can be twice or more expensive and don't provide this much performance to cost ratio.


----------



## tpax (Jul 18, 2021)

Drak0rex said:


> Why couldn't  they have made it so you can just insert an M.2 drive as you would an sd card? Any technical  reason? Also, wonder what would happen if you plugged an external gpu...


You can upgrade the M.2 according to Gaben. M.2's are not designed being switched frequently, it's not something that is hotpluggable by design.
As to the eGPU, I really doubt that there is a Thunderbolt 3 with 4 PCIe lanes (or even 2 lanes) attached to the USB-C port, so it would be a total waste and would probably perform even worse than the on board GPU. But technically, it should be possible.


----------



## Taleweaver (Jul 18, 2021)

Okay... I paid for a reservation (middle tier model).

While on paper it has everything I want (I like the WiiU model size, firm factor and have a huge as steam backlog waiting for something like this), I'm not 100% on it.

Most notably : steamos. Since it's release in 2015, it mostly vanished with the steam machines. It had a 2.0 version about a year later, but a version 3 as never appeared (Valve tradition, I guess ).
Proton is a different story. I've seen that improve from 'it plays some games' to 'it plays most games'... But it still often requires you to jump through hoops. 
I won't lie : the ambition to play all games in their store (as good as windows) isn't a pipe dream. It's more about streamlining the different Proton version and configurations. Okay, and there'll be exceptions, if course. They aren't partnering with anti cheat software for a reason. 

But to circle back to steamos... Proton users tweaking most likely didn't do that on this system(I certainly didn't) ... It's currently ranked 89 on distrowatch, and while not definitive... that's saying something. From what I remember it was functional (as in : you could use the desktop)... But that was about it.

Of course it's relatively easy to massively tweak the experience, but I still predict at least half the users will try to install windows on it within a month.


----------



## Vila_ (Jul 18, 2021)

Purple_Shyguy said:


> Yeah? So can Switch. I didn't point out they had "little memory" the other guy did.





Vilagamer999 said:


> they can *both* be expanded through a micro sd card slot so I beg you stop crying


----------



## GhostWolf (Jul 18, 2021)

gamesquest1 said:


> nice, I know valve have a habit of bringing something to market then quietly dropping it, but at least with a big company behind it you know the quality is going to be consistent and not pushed to the limit where it dies within a few months and the warranty process being such a pain it becomes impossible to even bother with, here hoping there is just user accessible M.2 slot to upgrade the storage on the base model as M.2 SSD's are pretty affordable at this point and you could pick up a 1TB M.2 drive for cheaper than difference between the base model and the 512gb model


The only problem is as you said, it's valve so you don't gotta worry about it dying and having to deal with a shitty warranty, but if you open it to manually change the SSD, you won't have a warranty here either XD But I agree overall, and if it is user upgradable SSD I'm definitely doing this route, the 399 model is where the value truly lies and that's what I reserved, I was optimistic basically about handling storage in a cheaper way and hopefully upgrading the SSD is one viable answer, but time will tell.


----------



## tech3475 (Jul 18, 2021)

GhostWolf said:


> The only problem is as you said, it's valve so you don't gotta worry about it dying and having to deal with a shitty warranty, but if you open it to manually change the SSD, you won't have a warranty here either XD But I agree overall, and if it is user upgradable SSD I'm definitely doing this route, the 399 model is where the value truly lies and that's what I reserved, I was optimistic basically about handling storage in a cheaper way and hopefully upgrading the SSD is one viable answer, but time will tell.



I think Valve missed a potential selling point by not making it officially user serviceable, unless it was an intentional decision to push people onto more profitable SKUs or more difficult to manufacture.

They could have even just sold 2 SKUs IMO, improving availability.

At £349 for the base SKU and officially user expandable internal storage, this would be a no brainer, where as the 256GB and to greater extent the 512GB model is a more questionable decision.

I went with the 512GB model mainly because at the time I was not aware of the M.2 slot.


----------



## Noctosphere (Jul 18, 2021)

tech3475 said:


> I think Valve missed a potential selling point by not making it officially user serviceable, unless it was an intentional decision to push people onto more profitable SKUs or more difficult to manufacture.
> 
> They could have even just sold 2 SKUs IMO, improving availability.
> 
> ...


There's still time to change of model you know


----------



## subcon959 (Jul 18, 2021)

The best I can figure out from the specs is that it's the equivalent of a Ryzen 3 3300X CPU with 20% of a Radeon 6700XT GPU.

That does make the GPU seem a little weak for something coming out a year from now, even if it's only 720p. I really wish they had pushed it to 16 CU's instead of 8.


----------



## chrisrlink (Jul 18, 2021)

wonder if the new steamOS on the steamdeck is exclusive or if they're trying to reboot steamOS for PC too?


----------



## Horvi (Jul 18, 2021)

Are scalpers already buying all of these?


----------



## tpax (Jul 18, 2021)

Horvi said:


> Are scalpers already buying all of these?


Take a look at eBay and you will have your answer 

Scalpers sell the 512GB model for around 1100 €, with the delivery date being December.



tech3475 said:


> I went with the 512GB model mainly because at the time I was not aware of the M.2 slot.


Don't forget, that the 512GB model is the only one with an anti-glare screen, which was my main selling point.


----------



## AirbusX (Jul 18, 2021)

pedro702 said:


> but if you are a pc gamer and you are in your house you could just you know use your pc?
> 
> this is for people who regularly play steam games and pc in general and im preety sure 99% of pc gamers already have a rigg at home more powerful than this so why would they choose to play this docked?



Yea I agree with you, for me for example, being a pilot a system like the Steam Deck is a godsend because of its size. 

I have a switch I hacked but being able to do anything I want with the system without the need to hack it (emulators) and also be able to play my ever growing steam library is perfection.

I’ll keep my switch for Zelda (new ones) since I can play the older ones via emulators.


----------



## Noctosphere (Jul 18, 2021)

tpax said:


> Take a look at eBay and you will have your answer
> 
> Scalpers sell the 512GB model for around 1100 €, with the delivery date being December.


Actually, those aren't the real scalpers
Scalpers usually buy ALL the stuff to resell at gold price
Those are just the people who sell their unique preorder

Scalpers haven't started yet to buy ALL the stuff
Right now, you have to had bought a game before june 2021 to be able to preorder one, so scalpers will be limited to one per account with a game bought before june 2021, so that limit considerably their possibility to buy more than one

Later today, they'll be able to buy one per any account, even if they dont have any game on it.
But yea, those scalper you see on ebay arent real scalper, just random people selling their unique preorder, they don't have many preorder like regular scalpers


----------



## barnhilltrckn (Jul 18, 2021)

Another great use for this is streaming our PC to it. For us with a gaming rig and a decent home network we can stream games or emulator this device struggles to run. I can't wait till these start shipping. I'm putting back 50 bucks or so each paycheck into saving so I know for sure I can pay for it when the bill comes due.


----------



## Kioku_Dreams (Jul 18, 2021)

Noctosphere said:


> Actually, those aren't the real scalpers
> Scalpers usually buy ALL the stuff to resell at gold price
> Those are just the people who sell their unique preorder
> 
> ...


They're still scalpers. That's what scalpers do.


----------



## Xzi (Jul 18, 2021)

Scalpers don't seem like a real concern here with the reservation system.  Everybody who wants one knows when they can expect to have an order available for them.  And nobody should be paying more than $20 to get a better spot in line.


----------



## Noctosphere (Jul 18, 2021)

Xzi said:


> Scalpers don't seem like a real concern here with the reservation system.  Everybody who wants one knows when they can expect to have an order available for them.  And nobody should be paying more than $20 to get a better spot in line.


actually, scalper do are a problem
Starting today, scalpers are welcomed by Steam to create many account with different credit card each and preorder one per account
Easy for them to do that and delay all the queue for those who really wants one
Like... if you want one in 2022 Q2, you'll have to pay double or wait until like 2023


----------



## tech3475 (Jul 18, 2021)

Noctosphere said:


> There's still time to change of model you know



I had thought about that possibility, but if I change my mind and still want the 512GB the orders are already up to Q3. Bearing in mind we probably wont see teardowns until this thing is released or Valve gives full details on what the procedure entails (which I doubt).

Getting the reservation in the first place was also a pain and as pointed out:



tpax said:


> Don't forget, that the 512GB model is the only one with an anti-glare screen, which was my main selling point.



That and the case does offset some of the cost.

Looking at the math again, the Dell 512GB 2230 card is ~£133. 

So to manually upgrade would end up being about £87 cheaper, so it's not too bad (case likely being £10-20).

That said, Dell does sell a 1TB drive for around $180/£227, so that would be £576. 



Taleweaver said:


> Most notably : steamos. Since it's release in 2015, it mostly vanished with the steam machines. It had a 2.0 version about a year later, but a version 3 as never appeared (Valve tradition, I guess ).



This will ship with Steam OS 3...oh correction, it's version 2.999999999


----------



## Xzi (Jul 18, 2021)

Noctosphere said:


> actually, scalper do are a problem
> Starting today, scalpers are welcomed by Steam to create many account with different credit card each and preorder one per account
> Easy for them to do that and delay all the queue for those who really wants one
> Like... if you want one in 2022 Q2, you'll have to pay double or wait until like 2023


The estimates seem the same as they were yesterday.  For the US, anyway.  Q2 2022 for the 64GB model, and Q3 2022 for the 512GB model.  I can't see the 256GB model because that's the one I reserved (Q1), but I'm guessing it's only out to Q2 right now as well.

Plus: almost everyone who wants one (and isn't a scalper) already had a Steam account with at least one purchase on it, so they didn't have to wait for that restriction to lift.


----------



## ganons (Jul 18, 2021)

tech3475 said:


> I think Valve missed a potential selling point by not making it officially user serviceable, unless it was an intentional decision to push people onto more profitable SKUs or more difficult to manufacture.
> 
> They could have even just sold 2 SKUs IMO, improving availability.
> 
> ...



I think its due to the size, the 2230 is smaller than the cheaper 2280. I'm guess space limitations.


----------



## Noctosphere (Jul 18, 2021)

Xzi said:


> The estimates seem the same as they were yesterday.  For the US, anyway.  Q2 2022 for the 64GB model, and Q3 2022 for the 512GB model.  I can't see the 256GB model because that's the one I reserved (Q1), but I'm guessing it's only out to Q2 right now as well.
> 
> Plus: almost everyone who wants one (and isn't a scalper) already had a Steam account with at least one purchase on it, so they didn't have to wait for that restriction to lift.


yea well, here in canada, yesterday, I preordered the 256GB one for Q2
660$ is a pretty high amount of money
Pretty sure a lot of people, even with a steam account with a lot of game on it, still hesitate on getting one (and that error will be fatal to them, because they'll be stuck with scalpers)


----------



## Xzi (Jul 18, 2021)

tech3475 said:


> This will ship with Steam OS 3...oh correction, it's version 2.999999999


Half-Life 2 confirmed.


----------



## Noctosphere (Jul 18, 2021)

Xzi said:


> Half-Life 2.9999999 confirmed.


ftfy


----------



## Xzi (Jul 18, 2021)

Noctosphere said:


> yea well, here in canada, yesterday, I preordered the 256GB one for Q2
> 660$ is a pretty high amount of money
> Pretty sure a lot of people, even with a steam account with a lot of game on it, still hesitate on getting one (and that error will be fatal to them, because they'll be stuck with scalpers)


Oof, gaming stuff does tend to cost more in Canada for whatever reason.  $529 for that same SKU here.

OTOH you get universal healthcare and probably better average/median pay, so ¯\_(ツ)_/¯


----------



## tech3475 (Jul 18, 2021)

ganons said:


> I think its due to the size, the 2230 is smaller than the cheaper 2280. I'm guess space limitations.



I’m not questioning the choice of form factor, 2230 makes sense for the size and it’s better than soldered onto the board, even if it’s a pain to replace.


----------



## Noctosphere (Jul 18, 2021)

Xzi said:


> Oof, gaming stuff does tend to cost more in Canada for whatever reason.  $529 for that same SKU here.
> 
> OTOH you get universal healthcare and probably better average/median pay, so ¯\_(ツ)_/¯


errr... not really
i mean, i think free healthcare is only available in Quebec afaik (luckily, thats where I live )
As for the pay, we have the same pay for the same job in usa and canada
For example, a job paid 13USD/h in usa will be paid 13CAD/h in Canada
However, electronics stuff cost about 30% more in canada compared to usa due to exchange rate, even if it should have dropped to about 20% by now


----------



## mattyxarope (Jul 18, 2021)

Noctosphere said:


> errr... not really
> i mean, i think free healthcare is only available in Quebec afaik (luckily, thats where I live )
> As for the pay, we have the same pay for the same job in usa and canada
> For example, a job paid 13USD/h in usa will be paid 13CAD/h in Canada
> However, electronics stuff cost about 30% more in canada compared to usa due to exchange rate, even if it should have dropped to about 20% by now



If you live by the border surely there is some way you could order it to an address in the US and pick it up, right? Do people do that?


----------



## Deleted member 514389 (Jul 18, 2021)

I'll take DF's word:
If the devs don't stand behind this thing, it'll crash and burn..

Sure, it might be near XSS, and over the Switch spec wise...

But then again the same could be said about the Dreamcast, GC and maybe even WiiU...
But they still failed despite being at least close to their competitors in terms of "power".

Furthermore I don't feel like this thing is plug and play-able enough...
Seems like a toy for nerds and geeks...

(And let's not forget who - as per usual - made this "design" en vogue.. yep, the red giant)

Power means nothing if it isn't utilized correctly.


----------



## Goku1992A (Jul 18, 2021)

Well people are forgetting rule #1 Scalpers would NOT EXIST if people wasn't buying them for the ridiculous prices. So the scalpers are not the problem the impatient people who are buying them for double or triple the asking price is the reason why it is like this. 

I take my time I don't rush. If I can't get a PS5 this year I will get one next year or the year after next.


----------



## Xzi (Jul 18, 2021)

notrea11y said:


> I'll take DF's word:
> If the devs don't stand behind this thing, it'll crash and burn..


GabeN talked about selling millions of units, I don't expect Valve to abandon this for a _long_ time, if ever.  But frankly, even if they did it wouldn't matter for a lot of us.  This is a full-fledged PC, you aren't in any sort of walled garden.



notrea11y said:


> Sure, it might be near XSS, and over the Switch spec wise...
> 
> But then again the same could be said about the Dreamcast, GC and maybe even WiiU...
> But they still failed despite being at least close to their competitors in terms of "power".


Every one of these is a console, not a PC.  And there is no real "failure point" for Valve here, their profits will be stellar with Steam alone no matter what.  They're just trying to get more manufacturers and more users into the PC gaming ecosystem, and adding a portable option is a great way to do that.



notrea11y said:


> Furthermore I don't feel like this thing is plug and play-able enough...
> Seems like a toy for nerds and geeks...


SteamOS' UX doesn't look much more complicated than Switch's.  And people who never want to see the desktop environment don't have to.  This can definitely be used just like a "Switch Pro," but it also has so much more functionality for advanced users.



notrea11y said:


> (And let's not forget who - as per usual - made this "design" en vogue.. yep, the red giant)


Who cares?  I'm just glad Valve is willing to take a loss on the hardware, where Nintendo was not.  We definitely need more competition in that space.



notrea11y said:


> Power means nothing if it isn't utilized correctly.


The utilization is up to the user.  You can underclock or overclock, undervolt or overvolt, whatever the hell you like.  And an AMD APU is obviously a great choice, since next-gen consoles are also using AMD APUs.


----------



## machomuu (Jul 19, 2021)

masagrator said:


> This IS a better competitor in comparison to other PC handheld devices which can be twice or more expensive and don't provide this much performance to cost ratio.


Well duh but that's not what I'm referring to.

We've had handheld computers for years but this is the first time it hasn't been a niche release. This is making waves and a big part of what comes with that is companies scrambling to meet it, especially in the advent of the OLED's announcement. They're gonna come out of the woodwork and I'd be incredibly surprised if capable hands didn't end up making something better at more competitive prices.


----------



## Paolosworld (Jul 19, 2021)

pedro702 said:


> Am i the only one seeing a huge issue here? switch already has storage issues and switch games are bare bones and compressed so that they are minimum in size, this thing runs pc games, pc games are not compressed and have loads of modes and settings to tweak so are people expecting to uninstall 100+gb games on this? will they keep installing and deleting games all the time? because sd cards are extremely expensive even the ones at 512gb and they cant hold that many pc games at all.
> 
> So for me this will be a huge damn issue, and if you decide you want to play another game and need to install 150gb from a random network when away from home you will be disappointed on the time you will take or before battery runs out, i mean i see most people will only keep like 1 or 2 games installed or just waste a crap ton of money on sd cards to carry around.


A lot of AAA stuff doesn't seem viable on here at all, nowadays 30gb is considered small on steam.
Not to mention the low battery on high intensity stuff too.

Got forbid someone tries to play cod on this


----------



## Kioku_Dreams (Jul 19, 2021)

notrea11y said:


> I'll take DF's word:
> If the devs don't stand behind this thing, it'll crash and burn..
> 
> Sure, it might be near XSS, and over the Switch spec wise...
> ...


O
So, you're pretty ignorant on this then? I'm not going to pick apart your post, like @Xzi. I'll just keep it short. This design isn't Nintendo's. They weren't the first to create it. By any margin.

This also isn't a console. Devs are "supporting it" by optimizing their games and releasing them to the PC Game stores. They don't have to specifically come out with "Steam Deck Exclusive!". Seems weird.

Lastly, "nerds and geeks". If that isn't a shallow attempt at a subtle insult, I don't know what is.


----------



## Rahkeesh (Jul 19, 2021)

Yeah there's been a lot of misframing this thing as a console. Maybe that's even partly valve's fault. But this is the Index mark 2. It's meant to lead the way to encourage more mainstream PC manufacturers than rando chinese startupts to get into handheld gaming PCs. They are really leaning more into proton this time than expecting devs to show up on linux.

Gabe talking about "millions" is technically the same range as fail consoles like the dreamcast and wii u but again this isn't a console, it doesn't have exclusive games, and its specced to handle 8th gen at 800p well so it doesn't really need optimizing to work beyond some proton config. As the 9th gen marches on this is more a way to play last-gen AAA and contemporary indies, so like half the value of the Switch except you don't have to wait for whatever dev to port these games, they will just be there already by virtue of being on Steam.


----------



## Xzi (Jul 19, 2021)

Rahkeesh said:


> Yeah there's been a lot of misframing this thing as a console. Maybe that's even partly valve's fault.


Not at all.  This very post calls it a "handheld gaming *PC*."  But in some ways, this is a first of its kind, so people are having trouble wrapping their heads around the fact that it is a fully open device.  Especially given that a gaming laptop with similar specs would cost at least twice what Valve is asking for Steam Deck.


----------



## Kioku_Dreams (Jul 19, 2021)

Xzi said:


> Not at all.  This very post calls it a "handheld gaming *PC*."  But in some ways, this is a first of its kind, so people are having trouble wrapping their heads around the fact that it is a fully open device.  Especially given that a gaming laptop with similar specs would cost at least twice what Valve is asking for Steam Deck.


Even IGN correctly labeled it as a PC. FRIGGING IGN!!


----------



## tpax (Jul 19, 2021)

Noctosphere said:


> Actually, those aren't the real scalpers
> Scalpers usually buy ALL the stuff to resell at gold price
> Those are just the people who sell their unique preorder
> 
> ...


Selling pre-orders for astronomical prices is still scalping. Those were not regular users selling their reservations, since some of the eBay listings had like "10 items available" behind a single listing. Professional scalpers somehow were good prepared for Valve's terms on how you could pre-order a Deck. Fortunately, eBay banned all those listings as of yesterday.


----------



## ertaboy356b (Jul 19, 2021)

Memoir said:


> O
> So, you're pretty ignorant on this then? I'm not going to pick apart your post, like @Xzi. I'll just keep it short. This design isn't Nintendo's. They weren't the first to create it. By any margin.
> 
> This also isn't a console. Devs are "supporting it" by optimizing their games and releasing them to the PC Game stores. They don't have to specifically come out with "Steam Deck Exclusive!". Seems weird.
> ...


Unfortunately, the Steam Deck is running on a compatibility layer which is Proton and Proton does not run games perfectly as opposed to when running on a Windows machine. Unless you grandma and her dog knows how to install Windows, this handheld will massively require a Steam Deck optimized support from devs.


----------



## 9hundred (Jul 19, 2021)

I'm switching to steam.


----------



## sarkwalvein (Jul 19, 2021)

ertaboy356b said:


> Unfortunately, the Steam Deck is running on a compatibility layer which is Proton and Proton does not run games perfectly as opposed to when running on a Windows machine. Unless you grandma and her dog knows how to install Windows, this handheld will massively require a Steam Deck optimized support from devs.


You can install pure complete vanilla Windows if you want. It is a windows machine if you want it to be.

PS: I would prefer not to install Windows, but the option is there.


----------



## ertaboy356b (Jul 19, 2021)

sarkwalvein said:


> You can install pure complete vanilla Windows if you want. It is a windows machine if you want it to be.
> 
> PS: I would prefer not to install Windows, but the option is there.


Like I said, unless your average consumer knows how to install Windows, then good for them. If Valve wants this to sell as much as possible, they should streamline every game, make it plug and play as possible and to do that, they needed the support of the Devs. Unfortunately, Proton just won't cut it. Not everyone is as tech savvy as the people here.


----------



## Xzi (Jul 19, 2021)

ertaboy356b said:


> Unfortunately, Proton just won't cut it. Not everyone is as tech savvy as the people here.


In what sense won't Proton "cut it" with 80% to 90% compatibility on launch?


----------



## Goku1992A (Jul 19, 2021)

Best comparison of all the portable PC devices  

https://liliputing.com/2021/07/comp...-max-and-win-3-onexplayer-and-onegx1-pro.html


----------



## ertaboy356b (Jul 19, 2021)

Xzi said:


> In what sense won't Proton "cut it" with 80% to 90% compatibility on launch?


They need to streamline it more to make games work out of the box, no tweaking, etc. As far as I can tell, lots of games will need minor tweaks (setting proton version / installing the GE version, etc.)


----------



## Xzi (Jul 19, 2021)

ertaboy356b said:


> They need to streamline it more to make games work out of the box, no tweaking, etc. As far as I can tell, lots of games will need minor tweaks (setting proton version / installing the GE version, etc.)


I'm pretty sure SteamOS 3.0 handles all that in the background.  Or if it doesn't now, it will by the time Deck's launch rolls around.  Of course, you don't want to limit even casual users too much, so the option will be there to customize your settings.


----------



## sarkwalvein (Jul 19, 2021)

ertaboy356b said:


> They need to streamline it more to make games work out of the box, no tweaking, etc. As far as I can tell, lots of games will need minor tweaks (setting proton version / installing the GE version, etc.)


I believe they just need to add a "Steam Deck" compatible symbol for games into steam, as they do with the platform symbol. That would be good enough for your average Joe.

PS: I mean, the symbol is there for games fully supported/ tested/ no tweak needed.


----------



## AkikoKumagara (Jul 19, 2021)

Seriel said:


> supposedly its now based on Arch Linux for some reason.


Rolling kernel updates. As long as their front-end is decent, should be as user-friendly as the Debian versions were. This is a good move, in my opinion. Ever since the advent of simple package managers like flatpak, the appeal of Debian-based operating systems has decreased substantially, imo.


----------



## Kioku_Dreams (Jul 19, 2021)

ertaboy356b said:


> Unfortunately, the Steam Deck is running on a compatibility layer which is Proton and Proton does not run games perfectly as opposed to when running on a Windows machine. Unless you grandma and her dog knows how to install Windows, this handheld will massively require a Steam Deck optimized support from devs.


I'm well aware of what Proton is and what it does. You're downplaying its worth. It's in a significantly better state now than it was even a year ago. You're also acting like installing Windows isn't as easy as making a bootable drive. If anything, installing your preferred flavor of Linux and getting it up to snuff for gaming takes more work... But I digress.

Granted, I do see your point. I can't help but imagine that there will be a handful of customers who will be more than disappointed in what this will do out of the box. That, however, would more than likely be for games like Fortnite, Apex Legends, Destiny 2, etc. Which, if the anti-cheat companies work with Valve (Bungie won't, they don't seem interested in allowing Linux gamers into their garden), wouldn't be as much of an issue.


----------



## 2shizukasensei88 (Jul 19, 2021)

Epic, I wonder how hard would it be, to install a m.2 ssd, and yeah I also live in a third world country, I doubt that I'll see this in msrp for a while.


----------



## subcon959 (Jul 19, 2021)

If you did wipe it and install Windows, where would the various drivers come from? Even if it is just a PC it still needs dedicated support for gaming performance, I doubt the standard AMD driver suite will just work?


----------



## Goku1992A (Jul 19, 2021)

subcon959 said:


> If you did wipe it and install Windows, where would the various drivers come from? Even if it is just a PC it still needs dedicated support for gaming performance, I doubt the standard AMD driver suite will just work?



More than likely not because it's mainly designed to optimize steam games. It has the ability to play other games but it's going to have to co-exist with the hardware.


----------



## djpannda (Jul 19, 2021)

The Proton compatibility is going to make it or break it. Valve is claiming its at around 70% as of now and it still being worked on. It it does get released at 80-90% it would be a hit. In fact it can be under that as long as Valve is able to just make acouple of high profile anti-cheat and multiplayer games work 1day.  As the preorders are now at Q2-Q3, Valve has plenty of time to work on it before the general pop gets it and If youre a early adaptor and still bitch about it, your own fault.


----------



## sarkwalvein (Jul 19, 2021)

subcon959 said:


> If you did wipe it and install Windows, where would the various drivers come from? Even if it is just a PC it still needs dedicated support for gaming performance, I doubt the standard AMD driver suite will just work?


It's mostly AMD hardware custom made for Valve but based on standard AMD stuff. With Valve stating they won't make it intentionally hard to put any system you want on it because they are going for openness, the PC way; I believe the drivers will be provided by either AMD or Valve; quite possibly the standard AMD driver suite will indeed work.


----------



## Paolosworld (Jul 19, 2021)

tpax said:


> Selling pre-orders for astronomical prices is still scalping. Those were not regular users selling their reservations, since some of the eBay listings had like "10 items available" behind a single listing. Professional scalpers somehow were good prepared for Valve's terms on how you could pre-order a Deck. Fortunately, eBay banned all those listings as of yesterday.


Pre-orders are technically free. The $5 you pay to reserve it is part of the complete steam deck price.

In other words, if you reserve the $399 model for $5, you pay the $5 up front, and then when supply is ready, you pay only $394.
They say this in the FAQ on the steam page for it.

I guess the $5 reserve is just a way to make sure people don't spam reserves without being serious about buying it, so there's a $5 pacifier.

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------



sarkwalvein said:


> You can install pure complete vanilla Windows if you want. It is a windows machine if you want it to be.
> 
> PS: I would prefer not to install Windows, but the option is there.


Windows takes up like 37gb, so it's probably not the best idea unless you have the gangster model or sd cards


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## subcon959 (Jul 19, 2021)

sarkwalvein said:


> It's mostly AMD hardware custom made for Valve but based on standard AMD stuff. With Valve stating they won't make it intentionally hard to put any system you want on it because they are going for openness, the PC way; I believe the drivers will be provided by either AMD or Valve; quite possibly the standard AMD driver suite will indeed work.


I'm sure they will work it out, but it would be pretty cool if support was added to standard AMD drivers. The only reason I went for the 256GB model is because I want to install Windows and use it as a mini PC so it would be nice if the performance wasn't gimped in that mode (although it's possible it could actually be better until proton is fully optimised)


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## Daggot (Jul 19, 2021)

sarkwalvein said:


> I believe they just need to add a "Steam Deck" compatible symbol for games into steam, as they do with the platform symbol. That would be good enough for your average Joe.
> 
> PS: I mean, the symbol is there for games fully supported/ tested/ no tweak needed.


Considering that part of the early Steamdeck leaks called it Project Neptune(back then everybody thought it was a controller) and the info that came from steamdb showed out that steam started creating tags for "Neptune optimized games" a few months ago I'd say that's already the plan.


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## AkikoKumagara (Jul 19, 2021)

subcon959 said:


> If you did wipe it and install Windows, where would the various drivers come from? Even if it is just a PC it still needs dedicated support for gaming performance, I doubt the standard AMD driver suite will just work?


Why would the standard AMD drivers not work? It's using the same architecture from AMD's mainstream GPUs. It'll be supported just as much as any of AMD's other APUs are, I imagine, even if this one is a special case and designed specifically for this device. And what other various drivers would be an issue? Other than graphics, I don't see what part would be of any concern.


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## mattyxarope (Jul 19, 2021)

djpannda said:


> The Proton compatibility is going to make it or break it. Valve is claiming its at around 70% as of now and it still being worked on. It it does get released at 80-90% it would be a hit. In fact it can be under that as long as Valve is able to just make acouple of high profile anti-cheat and multiplayer games work 1day.  As the preorders are now at Q2-Q3, Valve has plenty of time to work on it before the general pop gets it and If youre a early adaptor and still bitch about it, your own fault.



To be clear, 70% of 50,000 is 35,000.

So 35,000 games (Steam games) work to some degree right now. 

I think most people will be fine. It's more important that they get anticheat working which is preventing big games like pubg from working properly.


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## pedro702 (Jul 19, 2021)

mattyxarope said:


> To be clear, 70% of 50,000 is 35,000.
> 
> So 35,000 games (Steam games) work to some degree right now.
> 
> I think most people will be fine. It's more important that they get anticheat working which is preventing big games like pubg from working properly.


depends on what those 15000 games are, people already complain about ps5 bc which only has like 10 none working and like 110 with issues out of 3250 which is 4% of games with issues/not working.

imagine a much bigger list with issues and if they start releasing new games and that the new games wont work on day one and you need to wait weeks or months to be patched, so yeah its a big not working list and if they are popular games the worse it gets, and in the future it all depends if ti will be compatible with new releases day 1.


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## mattyxarope (Jul 19, 2021)

pedro702 said:


> depends on what those 15000 games are, people already complain about ps5 bc which only has like 10 none working and like 110 with issues out of 3250 which is 4% of games with issues/not working.
> 
> imagine a much bigger list with issues and if they start releasing new games and that the new games wont work on day one and you need to wait weeks or months to be patched, so yeah its a big not working list and if they are popular games the worse it gets, and in the future it all depends if ti will be compatible with new releases day 1.




It's these games: 

https://www.protondb.com/explore?page=0&sort=playerCount

Notice many of the highest player count games are borked? Looking closer at those, though, it's because of the lack of anticheat like I said.


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## ChaoticCinnabon (Jul 19, 2021)

The Gaben Gear.

Anyways, i did actually reserve one on day one, and as someone who owns a GPD Win max and nearly made the mistake of buying the Win 3 (I'm convinced it was fate that made me not order it as my CC declined on that) i really hope the Deck can stand it's ground, i'm quite certain it will considering the price tag is much cheaper than a GPD/AYA offering but still packs near if not equal power. Playing persona 1-4 on the go is gonna be even better on that beast...


_and mayyyybbeee it can manage Xenosaga unlike the Win Max?
and mayyybbeee Persona 5 if atlus doesn't port it for the 25th anniversary? _


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## Noctosphere (Jul 20, 2021)

Paolosworld said:


> Pre-orders are technically free. The $5 you pay to reserve it is part of the complete steam deck price.
> 
> In other words, if you reserve the $399 model for $5, you pay the $5 up front, and then when supply is ready, you pay only $394.
> They say this in the FAQ on the steam page for it.
> ...



Are you seriously serious?
You think 5$ will stop scalpers?


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## Paolosworld (Jul 20, 2021)

Noctosphere said:


> Are you seriously serious?
> You think 5$ will stop scalpers?


I wasn't saying I'd be effective, I'm just saying what the intent of the $5 reserve was (according to the FAQ, anyway)

Clearly it wasn't effective because the damn reserves crashed the store on the first few hours.


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## Xzi (Jul 20, 2021)

Who's thinking that dual-booting WinXP 64-bit would be kinda cool, for running all those 2000s games that have a shit ton of incompatibilities with modern Windows?  You'd keep it off the internet, of course.


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## RichardTheKing (Jul 20, 2021)

> This item is not available for reservation in your country



Well, bugger. Oh well, I don't like pre-ordering anyway...grumble grumble...


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## mattyxarope (Jul 20, 2021)

RichardTheKing said:


> Well, bugger. Oh well, I don't like pre-ordering anyway...grumble grumble...


Could always do a shipping forwarder from US and pay the import tax


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## RichardTheKing (Jul 20, 2021)

mattyxarope said:


> Could always do a shipping forwarder from US and pay the import tax


A) How, when I don't have a US Steam account nor a US credit card? Regional stores don't tend to accept cards from "overseas". Purchasing US gift cards from a third-party would be possible, but for a $649 item...? Not really practical.
B) I don't exactly have the spending money for US$649+tax+import tax converted to AUD, whatever monstrous amount that ends up being.

I think I'll just wait for now.


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## Randy Steele (Jul 20, 2021)

I'm so glad I managed to get a pre-order and I'm even happier that this thing seems to have upgradeable storage with a little bit of extra work. I was seriously going to shell out the money for a Win 3 next year before this fortunately got announced. I really have no interest in giving GPD any more money after how much extra money and work I've had to put into my Win 2 to get it working properly. Replacing the dpad/membranes with better ones, installing the third party cooling mod, several thermal paste replacements and replacing the battery because the heat screwed up the original one. 
Ugh... i continue to hear people having issues with the Win 3 and they couldn't even put a proper keyboard on the device. Oh and good luck dealing with their (lack of) customer support. Yeah I'm looking forward to this.


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## dawnbringer (Jul 20, 2021)

base is 64gb???? nah


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## sarkwalvein (Jul 20, 2021)

dawnbringer said:


> base is 64gb???? nah


The 64 gb model really looks like a beast emulation and indie machine for a very reasonable price to be honest... still reserved the 512gb model myself.


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## tech3475 (Jul 20, 2021)

Paolosworld said:


> Windows takes up like 37gb, so it's probably not the best idea unless you have the gangster model or sd cards



Be careful with sd cards, I’ve had cheap tablets in the past where the mSD slot doesn’t work in safe mode and requires separate drivers, so backup software may not fully work with it e.g. restoring from a recovery OS, putting documents folder on the card, etc.

So you may have to plan a little if this matters.

Main reason I went for the 512 model.



dawnbringer said:


> base is 64gb???? nah



It uses an m.2 2230 card, so it may be good if you’re running stuff that’s ok on mSD e.g. emulators or are willing to open it up and replace it with something larger since 256GB cards I’ve seen relatively cheap or even a 1TB SSD.

Officially though it’s not intended to be replaced and I haven’t heard any confirmation over how easy or difficult it is to replace.


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## Nyaako (Jul 20, 2021)

I wonder how they'll handle replacements/repairs. Doesn't look simple for many end users to take it apart to replace certain parts like the buttons and sticks. Hopefully, they don't have any drift problems like with the Joycons and PS5 controllers.


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## Kioku_Dreams (Jul 20, 2021)

tech3475 said:


> Be careful with sd cards, I’ve had cheap tablets in the past where the mSD slot doesn’t work in safe mode and requires separate drivers, so backup software may not fully work with it e.g. restoring from a recovery OS, putting documents folder on the card, etc.
> 
> So you may have to plan a little if this matters.
> 
> ...


I think the 256 and 512GB models are the only ones using the M.2 drive. Granted, this could very well be a terrible misunderstanding based on phrasing.


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## tech3475 (Jul 20, 2021)

Memoir said:


> I think the 256 and 512GB models are the only ones using the M.2 drive. Granted, this could very well be a terrible misunderstanding based on phrasing.



According to the website:


> _All models use socketed 2230 m.2 modules (not intended for end-user replacement)_



https://www.steamdeck.com/en/tech


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## Kioku_Dreams (Jul 20, 2021)

tech3475 said:


> According to the website:
> 
> 
> https://www.steamdeck.com/en/tech





tech3475 said:


> According to the website:
> 
> 
> https://www.steamdeck.com/en/tech


Oh, modules. That's a key word, there.  My bad.


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## Chary (Jul 20, 2021)

Lame, I was hopeful I could shove an m.2 I've got sitting around into it. Oh well. Load times on a MicroSD won't kill me.


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## pedro702 (Jul 20, 2021)

so they dont want people replacing the ssd at all, they want to sell that 512gb model for profit xD


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## LightyKD (Jul 20, 2021)

Anyone plan to do some Wii U style gaming with the Steam Deck? Keep in mind that both screens can be active while playing. I can see someone having their Steam Chats or a game walkthrough on the deck screen while playing the game on a monitor or TV.


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## EvilJagaGenius (Jul 21, 2021)

Something came to mind a while ago: since Valve is marketing this as a PC, you can install/run whatever you want, access the Linux desktop, I wonder if we'll see versions of desktop software reworked to use the Steam Controller-esque layout of the Deck.  Like a Photoshop version or other art app that uses the touchpads, a DAW for music using the buttons and sticks.  Someone could probably build a whole IDE around VS Code or Atom and the GNU compilers.  There could be a whole suite of tools built for this - if someone builds the tools, we could see it become a portable game _development_ machine, not just a portable games machine.


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## such (Jul 22, 2021)

Here's another consideration after having watched that IGN ad: you're paying a minimum of 400$ (more, realistically speaking) for a squishy d-pad and squishy triggers. But hey, apparently it's "serviceable". What makes me worried is that even in that ad IGN isn't comfortable enough about the controller to avoid a warning. And the ending to that video... Imagine a film critic reviewing a movie and wrapping it up with a "in your local theater now, for only 9,95! Yeah, crap like this is why I have games "journalism" trust issues.

Would definitely need some time with it to consider buying - and that's not happening with the way Valve is (/have been) handling hardware.


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## FFTfanatic (Jul 22, 2021)

such said:


> Here's another consideration after having watched that IGN ad: you're paying a minimum of 400$ (more, realistically speaking) for a squishy d-pad and squishy triggers. But hey, apparently it's "serviceable". What makes me worried is that even in that ad IGN isn't comfortable enough about the controller to avoid a warning. And the ending to that video... Imagine a film critic reviewing a movie and wrapping it up with a "in your local theater now, for only 9,95! Yeah, crap like this is why I have games "journalism" trust issues.
> 
> Would definitely need some time with it to consider buying - and that's not happening with the way Valve is (/have been) handling hardware.


On the flip side they were rather complimentary about the touch pads saying that after the initial acclimatisation period, it was pretty close to the mouse experience.

There is also still time for them to tweak the design to be less squishy or to add actuation limiter locks (like on the Xbox Elite controllers). The promo material contains the disclaimer that it was a prototype and not the final retail unit.


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## such (Jul 22, 2021)

I'm thinking it's getting a bit tight if they want to make that December ship date. I have no clue how such a change would affect manufacturing deals. logistics etc, so it's pure speculation on my part.

This is also part of the issue: I have no point of reference for how a Valve controller feels like, so I hear a brown-nosing IGN say it's squishy and I assume it's on the cheapo half of the spectrum which may very well be wrong - but I've been taught by experience that more often that not it's a correct assumption.


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## WiiMiiSwitch (Jul 23, 2021)

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------

notice the difference


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## Xzi (Aug 3, 2021)

Got a seller offer for $120 on a Western Digital 1TB 2230 SSD, should I take it despite not knowing how accessible the slot will be?  I feel like I could sell it for more after Steam Deck is out regardless.


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## Skelletonike (Aug 3, 2021)

Xzi said:


> Got a seller offer for $120 on a Western Digital 1TB 2230 SSD, should I take it despite not knowing how accessible the slot will be?  I feel like I could sell it for more after Steam Deck is out regardless.



I mean, they did mention it would have a 2230 slot, so I don't think you'll be wasting that SSD anyway.
SSD prices have also been increasing lately (like everything else, sadly), so if you can afford it, I'd say go with it.


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## sarkwalvein (Aug 3, 2021)

Xzi said:


> Got a seller offer for $120 on a Western Digital 1TB 2230 SSD, should I take it despite not knowing how accessible the slot will be?  I feel like I could sell it for more after Steam Deck is out regardless.


I believe, unless you bought the 64GB version or you consider that price super convenient, it is better to wait. 

You can hold on with 256gb for quite some time, in the future there will be more info and video tutorials regarding what to use/ how to open it, and price of tech always goes down. You sure won't get the deck before December, so why hurry up with the ssd purchase?


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## Xzi (Aug 3, 2021)

Skelletonike said:


> I mean, they did mention it would have a 2230 slot, so I don't think you'll be wasting that SSD anyway.
> SSD prices have also been increasing lately (like everything else, sadly), so if you can afford it, I'd say go with it.


Yeah I can just grab an enclosure for like $15 and use it for extra PC storage space until Deck's release.  No open slots on my motherboard unfortunately.  New they seem to be $200, and most of the used ones are in the ballpark of $170.  This one was supposedly in a laptop that was "powered on less than 100 hours."



sarkwalvein said:


> You can hold on with 256gb for quite some time, in the future there will be more info and video tutorials regarding what to use/ how to open it, and price of tech always goes down. You sure won't get the deck before December, so why hurry up with the ssd purchase?


True, I doubt I'm gonna end up switching from the 256GB model now and add 6+ months of wait time for my Steam Deck.  The tear-downs and tutorials aren't really an issue since those will be out December and I won't be getting mine until sometime in Q1 2022.  TBH though, I don't see prices going down much in this form factor, as it's fairly uncommon.  $120 for 1TB is approaching SATA SSD prices, so I see some value there.


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## Xzi (Aug 7, 2021)

For those that might've missed them: we got a bunch of new hands-on videos today from the big tech Youtubers like LTT, Tested, GamesRadar, etc.  All the first impressions seem really positive, and the bulkiness of the grips seems a good thing for comfort reasons.


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## sarkwalvein (Aug 7, 2021)

Xzi said:


> For those that might've missed them: we got a bunch of new hands-on videos today from the big tech Youtubers like LTT, Tested, GamesRadar, etc.  All the first impressions seem really positive, and the bulkiness of the grips seems a good thing for comfort reasons.


After watching LTT's hands on videos I'm happy I was able to get an early ticket to preorder. My impression on the device has only improved.

It looks very well made and comfortable, and it runs the games they tried very well.


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## Xzi (Aug 8, 2021)

Figured I'd give a heads up: the seller I bought my 2230 M.2 (1TB) from changed the base price to $130, and afterward quickly sold through almost his entire stock.  There's just one left at that price, and the next cheapest on eBay is $150 (also with only one available).

https://www.ebay.com/itm/184975539024


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## Dancerdude64 (Aug 14, 2021)

Muskusrat said:


> According to the IGN hands-on you can play windows and linux game out of the box on it. And if you want to, you can install whatever you want (like Windows). It is a computer according to Valve.


So I can play Minecraft Java on this thing?


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## sarkwalvein (Aug 14, 2021)

Dancerdude64 said:


> So I can play Minecraft Java on this thing?


Sure.


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## WiiU_user (Aug 22, 2021)

The sticks look kinda uncomfortable


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