# Doctor Who



## alidsl (Sep 8, 2012)

I know protokun does and I do, just wanted to see if anyone else watched the best show in the universe


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## Brian117 (Sep 8, 2012)

Yeah I started watching it on Netflix a while back. I'm on episode 5 of Season 2. It's a really cool show. Don't know why I haven't watched it sooner.


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## littlecubba (Sep 8, 2012)

i watched the 2nd in the new season... nothing else on!
budget is getting bigger, scripts are weak, so weak... think they must have been written on toilet paper
wish they would sort out the music too...


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## alidsl (Sep 8, 2012)

littlecubba said:


> i watched the 2nd in the new season... nothing else on!
> budget is getting bigger, scripts are weak, so weak... think they must have been written on toilet paper
> wish they would sort out the music too...


But it's dinosaurs on a space ship, but I agree, it was a bit weak and out of the blue




Brian117 said:


> Yeah I started watching it on Netflix a while back. I'm on episode 5 of Season 2. It's a really cool show. Don't know why I haven't watched it sooner.


I haven't watched any of it before the 9th doctor, is it worth watching?


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## Hadrian (Sep 8, 2012)

littlecubba said:


> i watched the 2nd in the new season... nothing else on!
> budget is getting bigger, scripts are weak, so weak... think they must have been written on toilet paper
> wish they would sort out the music too...


Shits all over series 3 & 4.


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## alidsl (Sep 8, 2012)

Hadrian said:


> alidsl said:
> 
> 
> > littlecubba said:
> ...



9th was great, Tennant was great.
but matt smith seems to be going a bit dark recently, dino episode spoiler


Spoiler



He sent Solomon to his death and had the opportunity to save him



Hopefully Smith regenerates into this guy


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## Skelletonike (Sep 9, 2012)

I've been watching Dr. Who for a few years now, since like 3 doctors ago (when it had the tall short haired and older guy as doctor) and I also enjoy it's spinoff, Torchwood, which is really good as well. =3


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## The Catboy (Sep 10, 2012)

I watch Dr.Who.
But I haven't seen any of older series yet


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## FAST6191 (Sep 10, 2012)

I saw a handful of the older ones when they were replayed at various points in time and that special that came after the original run stopped and before the new one but I have actually not seen any of the new ones other than glimpses when I was wandering by or the starts of episodes as I was waiting for people to get ready; most of those glimpses made it seem as though it was just schedule filler and as such I have not bothered with it.


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## Vulpes Abnocto (Sep 10, 2012)

Spoiler: This made me consider watching it


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## Depravo (Sep 10, 2012)

I saw my first ever episode on Saturday and do you know what? I rather enjoyed it.



Vulpes Abnocto said:


> Spoiler: This made me consider watching it


That was certainly one of the highlights.



alidsl said:


> Hopefully Smith regenerates into this guy
> 
> 
> Spoiler


But would that make Doctor Who funnier or Richard Ayoade less funny?


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## littlecubba (Sep 10, 2012)

remember the doctor has only 12 or 13 life regenerations....

they better have a 24 strong team of writters and a 2million pound "movie" budget for each episode soon, other wise it's going the way of dino's on a spaceship!
(also they should hire someone like Thomas Newman or Danny Elfman to sort out the comical soundtrack)

this is going to show my age, watched every single doctor at least twice since i hid behind the sofa at the grand old age of 5, with Tom Baker and the Daleks, the story would run over 5+ episodes


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## Nathan Drake (Sep 10, 2012)

littlecubba said:


> remember the doctor has only 12 or 13 life regenerations....
> 
> they better have a 24 strong team of writters and a 2million pound "movie" budget for each episode soon, other wise it's going the way of dino's on a spaceship!
> (also they should hire someone like Thomas Newman or Danny Elfman to sort out the comical soundtrack)
> ...


Thirteen regenerations, though, at one point, it was mentioned (outside of the show) that since the Doctor is the last Timelord, perhaps the rules don't necessarily apply to him. I essentially anticipate that after an amazing final confrontation as the Thirteenth Doctor, the Doctor will be on the verge of death, thinking that he has hit the end of the line. Instead though, he'll find himself regenerated, will say some final line, and through a final montage, he'll forever disappear in the T.A.R.D.I.S. Or, of course:

(Early spoilers)


Spoiler



When River gave him all of her remaining regenerations in order to save him after she was brainwashed, trying to kill him, perhaps those didn't just purge him of the poison, but granted him more life than he once had. It'd be an interesting twist, and would actually make some sense.



Anyways, the dinosaurs on a spaceship thing really wasn't bad. People have gotta stop being critical. I thought both of the episodes so far, although not top tier, were absolutely fantastic. Instead of appreciating what's good though, people poke holes through everything and then say they didn't enjoy it. Just shut up and love the show. Unless they royally screw up, there's no reason to hate.


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## 431unknown (Sep 10, 2012)

I've been watching Who since 1980 and I started with the Tom Baker era. DOAS was an ok episode but in no way does it come any where close to AOTD. The only good thing about the episode was the way the Doctor dispatched the pirate. It's something that he never ever does outright. Favorite Doctor so far has been the 10th although  11 is starting to grow on me.


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## ProtoKun7 (Sep 16, 2012)

Nathan Drake said:


> Thirteen regenerations, though, at one point, it was mentioned (outside of the show) that since the Doctor is the last Timelord, perhaps the rules don't necessarily apply to him. I essentially anticipate that after an amazing final confrontation as the Thirteenth Doctor, the Doctor will be on the verge of death, thinking that he has hit the end of the line. Instead though, he'll find himself regenerated, will say some final line, and through a final montage, he'll forever disappear in the T.A.R.D.I.S. Or, of course:


Technically twelve regenerations. You don't regenerate into your first life.



alidsl said:


> I haven't watched any of it before the 9th doctor, is it worth watching?


Yes.


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## Foxi4 (Sep 16, 2012)

I started watching around the time when _"Let's Kill Hitler"_ was on, and I must say, I fell in love with the series to the point that I looked back and checked out the other seasons. Of course, the life-long truth of _"the first Doctor you see will be the one you'll feel attached to the most"_ applies here and Matt Smith is, and always will be, my favourite Doctor. I like his liveliness, crazyness and positive attitude which somehow covers the fact that he is indeed a thinking man that can be quite strict and straight to the point when needs-be.

Yesterday I watched _"The Assylum of the Daleks"_ and thoroughly enjoyed it, tonight I'm going to watch _"A Town Called Mercy"_, and judging from the preview at the end of the previous episode, it's going to be quite a watch!


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## alidsl (Sep 16, 2012)

A town called mercy was quite a fun episode again, but a few things I noticed
Possible spoilers


Spoiler



The Doctor referred to Christmas again "Someone's been peeking at my Christmas list"

The lightbulbs were flashing again (think Amy's dressing room in ep. 1 and Brian replacing the light in ep. 2) I think this was something that the silence did when they were nearby

The Doctor was willing to send someone to their death and says his mercy has cause people to die



Fun episode with the terminator


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## Just Another Gamer (Sep 16, 2012)

Just finished watching A Town Called Mercy and honestly it is a pretty good episode, can't wait until next week's episode.


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## ProtoKun7 (Sep 16, 2012)

_The Power of Three_ is the one of the first five that had the least information released about it.

Looking very much forward to episode 5 though; big fan of the Weeping Angels.


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## alidsl (Sep 16, 2012)

ProtoKun7 said:


> _The Power of Three_ is the one of the first five that had the least information released about it.
> 
> Looking very much forward to episode 5 though; big fan of the Weeping Angels.


Didn't the  Weeping Angels have light flickering when they were near?


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## ProtoKun7 (Sep 17, 2012)

alidsl said:


> ProtoKun7 said:
> 
> 
> > _The Power of Three_ is the one of the first five that had the least information released about it.
> ...


Sometimes, if they actively drain the power.


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## Hadrian (Sep 21, 2012)




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## MelodieOctavia (Sep 21, 2012)

Hadrian said:


>



I'm surprised you didn't screencap the Allons-y quote from claptrap.


Anyway, I think the show is incredible, and for a show that's been on for as long as it has (Longest running sci-fi series in the history of everything), and can still pull fresh material, it's an incredible feat.

With series that have run as long as this, you need to see the shows from week to week for what they are, not what they _were_. Yeah, you can piss and moan that Tennant was the best new Doctor, and that he should come back, but those saying that know better than anyone else that, _it's just not how it works_. Tennant, in a sense, is dead, and unless the Doctor meets the 10th doctor in one of his journeys, we will never see him in the series again.


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## ProtoKun7 (Sep 21, 2012)

To be fair, the Allons-y quote, while a reference to the series, is still just French, albeit popularised now.


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## Hadrian (Sep 21, 2012)

TwinRetro said:


> -snip-


I've not got that far (I don't think anyway) I just saw it posted elsewhere.


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## Species8472 (Sep 21, 2012)

One of my goals for the summer was to check out Doctor Who starting from the first Doctor. Never got around to it.


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## Jamstruth (Sep 21, 2012)

Good luck with that goal Species. There's about 40 years of TV to get through and a lot of the earlier stuff got burnt because archiving costs money, there was no home video market and there was some weird dispute with the Actor's Union where they didn't want reruns shown.

I enjoyed Mercy. As for the dark turns the Doctor has been showing Amy addressed that this episode. SHe wasn't there to protest in Dinosaurs but she was in Mercy. The Doctor has a habit of going very dark and vengeful when he's alone (see the David Tennant specials for precedent).


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## ProtoKun7 (Sep 21, 2012)

I wouldn't say a lot of stuff; some of the First and Second, but audio of everything exists, at least.


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## MelodieOctavia (Sep 21, 2012)

Jamstruth said:


> Good luck with that goal Species. There's about 40 years of TV to get through and a lot of the earlier stuff got burnt because archiving costs money, there was no home video market and there was some weird dispute with the Actor's Union where they didn't want reruns shown.
> 
> I enjoyed Mercy. As for the dark turns the Doctor has been showing Amy addressed that this episode. SHe wasn't there to protest in Dinosaurs but she was in Mercy. The Doctor has a habit of going very dark and vengeful when he's alone (see the David Tennant specials for precedent).



I was very surprised this week. For a "stupid monkey" to put The Doctor back in his place, Amy Pond has to be one of his better companions to date, though I wouldn't say the best.


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## Arm73 (Sep 21, 2012)

Funny, I just watched yesterday the first episode of the 2005 series ' Rose ' on netflix and it wasn't half bad,quite interesting actually.
A little too British for me if I may say so ( I lived many years in America and I'm not so used to the accent ).
But I have no previous experience of any doctor who, I don't know were to start, or even if I'll be alright by just watching this recent series.
I think I'll watch a couple of more episodes first before making up my mind, because as stated elsewhere, there is so much material out there if I were to become a fan, I'll sure keep busy for a long time....


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## CompC (Sep 21, 2012)

^^Keep watching. Series 1, beginning with Rose, is a great place to start!


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## MelodieOctavia (Sep 21, 2012)

Arm73 said:


> Funny, I just watched yesterday the first episode of the 2005 series ' Rose ' on netflix and it wasn't half bad,quite interesting actually.
> A little too British for me if I may say so ( I lived many years in America and I'm not so used to the accent ).
> But I have no previous experience of any doctor who, I don't know were to start, or even if I'll be alright by just watching this recent series.
> I think I'll watch a couple of more episodes first before making up my mind, because as stated elsewhere, there is so much material out there if I were to become a fan, I'll sure keep busy for a long time....



You might want to sample a few episodes from each Doctor. (9th, 10th, 11th) Your tastes may vary throughout the seasons. I, for one, wasn't really digging the 9th until his last season, fell in love with the 10th right off, and the 11th, I had a struggle getting used to, but now I love him as The Doctor, but I still want to punch that stupid chin right off his stupid face for some reason.


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## Jamstruth (Sep 21, 2012)

TwinRetro said:


> Jamstruth said:
> 
> 
> > Good luck with that goal Species. There's about 40 years of TV to get through and a lot of the earlier stuff got burnt because archiving costs money, there was no home video market and there was some weird dispute with the Actor's Union where they didn't want reruns shown.
> ...


Donna did it as well. In her first episode she saved the Doctor's life when he was being vengeful. Her entire excuse for going with the Doctor in Series 4 was that he needed somebody with him to stop him being like that.


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## ProtoKun7 (Sep 22, 2012)

Adelaide Brooke also kinda set me straight after what I did at Bowie Base One. 




Arm73 said:


> A little too British for me if I may say so ( I lived many years in America and I'm not so used to the accent ).


I think you mean you aren't British enough.


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## MelodieOctavia (Sep 22, 2012)

ProtoKun7 said:


> Adelaide Brooke also kinda set me straight after what I did at Bowie Base One.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I have to admit. After watching Dr. Who, it makes me feel a bit British for a while.


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## SifJar (Sep 22, 2012)

TwinRetro said:


> You might want to sample a few episodes from each Doctor. (9th, 10th, 11th) Your tastes may vary throughout the seasons. I, for one,* wasn't really digging the 9th until his last season*, fell in love with the 10th right off, and the 11th, I had a struggle getting used to, but now I love him as The Doctor, but I still want to punch that stupid chin right off his stupid face for some reason.


The 9th only had one season, or rather "series", seeing as it is a UK show. So if you liked him in his last one, I guess that means you liked him all along?  Personally I started with the 9th doctor, liked him, then preferred the 10th and now much prefer the 11th, definitely my favourite of the three.


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## MelodieOctavia (Sep 22, 2012)

SifJar said:


> TwinRetro said:
> 
> 
> > You might want to sample a few episodes from each Doctor. (9th, 10th, 11th) Your tastes may vary throughout the seasons. I, for one,* wasn't really digging the 9th until his last season*, fell in love with the 10th right off, and the 11th, I had a struggle getting used to, but now I love him as The Doctor, but I still want to punch that stupid chin right off his stupid face for some reason.
> ...



Huh...so it is. I swear I remember watching more than one season of the 9th. Though during that time, I was usually drunk while I was perusing Netflix.


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## alidsl (Sep 22, 2012)

TwinRetro said:


> SifJar said:
> 
> 
> > TwinRetro said:
> ...


You were drunk


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## Gundam Eclipse (Sep 23, 2012)

This thread got me interested, so I acquired what I thought was series 1 was before realizing that there were others before and that this was a reboot(I am confused in this aspect, would love it if you could clear it up).
Still, watched the first episode. Holy fuck I LOVE THIS SHOW, I FUCKING LOVE IT.
So my question is, do I just keep watching the 2005 version or should I start from the very beginning? Will I miss any plot if I don't? Even if I don't, is the old series worth watching?

Also, thanks, seriously, I have only watched the first episode so far and even so I fucking love this.


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## SifJar (Sep 23, 2012)

Gundam Eclipse said:


> This thread got me interested, so I acquired what I thought was series 1 was before realizing that there were others before and that this was a reboot(I am confused in this aspect, would love it if you could clear it up).
> Still, watched the first episode. Holy fuck I LOVE THIS SHOW, I FUCKING LOVE IT.
> So my question is, do I just keep watching the 2005 version or should I start from the very beginning? Will I miss any plot if I don't? Even if I don't, is the old series worth watching?
> 
> Also, thanks, seriously, I have only watched the first episode so far and even so I fucking love this.


So basically, the original Doctor Who ran from 1963-1989. There were 8 different Doctors in that time. In 2005, the show was revived with the ninth Doctor in "Series 1". Note that this was a revival, not a reboot; the story "continues": in the interim between the old series and new ones, there was the "Time War" between the Time Lords and the Daleks, which eventually led to both being "wiped out" [although the daleks are still recurring villains in the new series], by the Doctor (the last living Time Lord).

The new series work perfectly well as a standalone show without any knowledge of the old series. I have never watched a full episode of the old series. I couldn't say if it's worth watching or not, but I've been told it is very good (although the acting is apparently quite poor). Every now and again there will be a reference to the old series, or a recurring enemy, but it doesn't matter if you don't get those references, it won't negatively impact on your enjoyment of the new series.


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## Just Another Gamer (Sep 24, 2012)

Just saw the Power of Three and its pretty good showing things from the view of the companion instead of the doctor. Can't wait until the next episode since Amy and Rory leave this time and honestly I couldn't like them that much to me even Donna was a better companion.


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## Gundam Eclipse (Sep 24, 2012)

SifJar said:


> Gundam Eclipse said:
> 
> 
> > This thread got me interested, so I acquired what I thought was series 1 was before realizing that there were others before and that this was a reboot(I am confused in this aspect, would love it if you could clear it up).
> ...


Thanks for the explanation! That clears up quite a bit :V Might end up watching the old series as well once I catch up with this.

Also just watched the second and third episode, fuck, I am downright addicted to this series. So good


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## signz (Sep 24, 2012)

Gundam Eclipse said:


> SifJar said:
> 
> 
> > Gundam Eclipse said:
> ...


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## ProtoKun7 (Sep 24, 2012)

SifJar said:


> Gundam Eclipse said:
> 
> 
> > This thread got me interested, so I acquired what I thought was series 1 was before realizing that there were others before and that this was a reboot(I am confused in this aspect, would love it if you could clear it up).
> ...



Strictly speaking, there were only seven incarnations from '63-'89. The Eighth Doctor debuted in 1996.


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## Arm73 (Sep 24, 2012)

I'm really new to the series, I'm watching now the 2005 reboot, and yesterday I've seen the episode with Charles Dickens and I like it more than the first and second episode.
Yep, it keeps getting better, I think I'll keep watching  !


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## ProtoKun7 (Sep 24, 2012)

Spoiler: Open this image at your own risk


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## Just Another Gamer (Sep 24, 2012)

Arm73 said:


> I'm really new to the series, I'm watching now the 2005 reboot, and yesterday I've seen the episode with Charles Dickens and I like it more than the first and second episode.
> Yep, it keeps getting better, I think I'll keep watching  !


I'm glad your enjoying the series and well to be fair the 1st and 2nd were kinda breaking in the new Doctor and his companion.


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## Prime_Zero (Sep 24, 2012)

I watch it off and on, its a thousand and one times better than the original which used to put me to sleep when I was lil, really wish they would stop changing the main character though. I mean some are good others arn't like the current one.. hoping he will die soon. Though I feel the show is getting a bit full of its self lately in my opinion....

As for the greatest show in the Universe err id have to say that would be Stargate / Stargate Atlantis, Atlantis was so freaking epic.


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## MelodieOctavia (Sep 24, 2012)

ProtoKun7 said:


> Spoiler: Open this image at your own risk



GAH! nononononononono....why would you do that? I looked in it's eyes!!!!


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## SifJar (Sep 24, 2012)

ProtoKun7 said:


> SifJar said:
> 
> 
> > Gundam Eclipse said:
> ...


Apologies, I must admit I'm not an expert on the old series, I have only seen a few snippets of episodes.


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## ProtoKun7 (Sep 24, 2012)

SifJar said:


> ProtoKun7 said:
> 
> 
> > SifJar said:
> ...


It's fine, that's what I'm here for.


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## ProtoKun7 (Sep 24, 2012)

TwinRetro said:


> ProtoKun7 said:
> 
> 
> > Spoiler: Open this image at your own risk
> ...


You think _that's_ bad?

http://youtu.be/zjeNUhcso-o?t=1m20s

Hm, can't get it to start at the right time on the embed.


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## Foxi4 (Sep 26, 2012)

Relevant and quite funny:

[yt]Do-wDPoC6GM[/yt]




ProtoKun7 said:


> Spoiler: Open this image at your own risk


FOOL! That which holds the image of an Angel *becomes* itself an Angel! You just killed a good few unsuspecting people!


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## The Catboy (Sep 26, 2012)

Quite relevant to the conversation, I am actually watching Dr.Who right now at this very moment. I have been watching it all day.


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## 431unknown (Sep 26, 2012)

I'm pretty sure that the Ponds departure is while going to be sad since they are leaving and at the same time going to be a "happy ending" of sorts.


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## Foxi4 (Sep 26, 2012)

431unknown said:


> I'm pretty sure that the Ponds departure is while going to be sad since they are leaving and at the same time going to be a "happy ending" of sorts.


What's sad is that Matt Smith pretty much confirmed he'll be leaving the series after the 2012/2013 season.

http://www.tgdaily.com/entertainment/59234-matt-smith-is-leaving-doctor-who

This pretty much means that the current Doctor is going to die by the end of this season and it will mark his 11th regeneration (12th incarnation).


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## MelodieOctavia (Sep 26, 2012)

Foxi4 said:


> 431unknown said:
> 
> 
> > I'm pretty sure that the Ponds departure is while going to be sad since they are leaving and at the same time going to be a "happy ending" of sorts.
> ...



I welcome it. I'm sick of looking at that stupid chin.


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## 431unknown (Sep 26, 2012)

Foxi4 said:


> 431unknown said:
> 
> 
> > I'm pretty sure that the Ponds departure is while going to be sad since they are leaving and at the same time going to be a "happy ending" of sorts.
> ...



He has in numerous interviews since then said that he was misquoted. I'm on my phone right now and don't feel like searching for it but he has said that he is in the role for the 50th and the series after that.

The chin grows on you kinda... Sorta.. No not really but if it helps.


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## Foxi4 (Sep 26, 2012)

431unknown said:


> He has in numerous interviews since then said that he was misquoted. I'm on my phone right now and don't feel like searching for it but he has said that he is in the role for the 50th and the series after that.
> 
> The chin grows on you kinda... Sorta.. No not really but if it helps.


Not the same quote. In this article, he says it himself - "I've got one more year of Doctor Who". Well, if he stays, I'm going to be pretty darn happy - he's my Doctor. 



TwinRetro said:


> I welcome it. I'm sick of looking at that stupid chin.


That's just... just... Rude!  ()

I like his "energy" more than anything. He's a "proper" Doctor - all around the place and crazy, but at the same time he can be wise and serious when the situation calls for it.


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## 431unknown (Sep 26, 2012)

Yeah that's because the BBC only really does contracts one year out and at that time his contract was only for the current series. I know that I have read somewhere that he has a contract now to the end of one more series and that's not counting the 50th anniversery special happening next year.

I'll be said to see him go when he does. He's grown on me and I've come to like how he plays the part.


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## shoyrumaster11 (Sep 26, 2012)

I watch doctor who! Sometimes. It lives on my Hard Disk and I watch it on there! Really nice series I must say!


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## 431unknown (Sep 26, 2012)

shoyrumaster11 said:


> I watch doctor who! Sometimes. It lives on my Hard Disk and I watch it on there! Really nice series I must say!



It's "all" on my hard drive. Every once in awhile I like to watch a classic episode.


I'll download the newest episode before its on BBC America and watch it a few hours before it premiers and then watch it again on BBCA.


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## Just Another Gamer (Sep 26, 2012)

431unknown said:


> I'm pretty sure that the Ponds departure is while going to be sad since they are leaving and at the same time going to be a "happy ending" of sorts.


Am I the only one who is a little happy about this?

I mean I didn't really like them companion wise compared to Donna and while the new doctor can grow on you although I still prefer the 10th more but I do like the 11th more than the 9th, I find the companions were more hit and miss this time


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## 431unknown (Sep 26, 2012)

No, i wouldnt say your the only one. I think it's high time for them to move on, but its still going to be sad to see them finally leave


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## Just Another Gamer (Sep 26, 2012)

431unknown said:


> No, i wouldnt say your the only one. I think it's high time for them to move on, but its still going to be sad to see them finally leave


True. Still unfortunately I wasn't able to like the Ponds more otherwise I would be a little more sad when they leave I mean when Donna left to me was horrible cause I felt she really fit well traveling with the Doctor but with the Ponds I mean it feels more of them just being there to keep him company instead of really being his friend.

Not saying Donna was better as a companion but it just that the Ponds wasn't that interesting to me.


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## Gundam Eclipse (Sep 26, 2012)

asdjasnkdjasnd FUCK. Just watched Bad Wolf from (2005) series 1. SHIT JUST HIT THE FAN.
God DAMN I love this series. The finale should be epic


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## FireGrey (Sep 26, 2012)

Gundam Eclipse said:


> asdjasnkdjasnd FUCK. Just watched Bad Wolf from (2005) series 1. SHIT JUST HIT THE FAN.
> God DAMN I love this series. The finale should be epic


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## Gundam Eclipse (Sep 26, 2012)

FireGrey said:


> Gundam Eclipse said:
> 
> 
> > asdjasnkdjasnd FUCK. Just watched Bad Wolf from (2005) series 1. SHIT JUST HIT THE FAN.
> > God DAMN I love this series. The finale should be epic


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## Foxi4 (Sep 26, 2012)

I find myself completely unable to watch Season 1 of the revived series. Christopher Eccleston feels a little bit "wooden" to me, I didn't watch much of that season... perhaps one day I'll have one more look at it.


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## Just Another Gamer (Sep 26, 2012)

Foxi4 said:


> I find myself completely unable to watch Season 1 of the revived series. Christopher Eccleston feels a little bit "wooden" to me, I didn't watch much of that season... perhaps one day I'll have one more look at it.


Well it did have a short number of episodes so maybe he didn't have a chance to ease into the character yet.


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## 431unknown (Sep 26, 2012)

Foxi4 said:


> I find myself completely unable to watch Season 1 of the revived series. Christopher Eccleston feels a little bit "wooden" to me, I didn't watch much of that season... perhaps one day I'll have one more look at it.



I actually liked Eccleston and wish he would have stuck with the part for at least a second series. One was just not enough for him to make the character his own.


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## SifJar (Sep 26, 2012)

Gundam Eclipse said:


> Spoiler
> 
> 
> 
> What exactly happened to Rose, when she saw the Tardis' core? What were those powers, and how exactly did she survive? My listening skills aren't the best unfortunately, so yeah, what exactly did the conversation at the end reveal?





Spoiler



She absorbed the Time Vortex which basically meant she could do whatever she wanted, she survived because the Doctor then absorbed it from her (saving her life), and instead of dying (as he "should" have done after absorbing the Vortex), he regenerated, "tricking" death.


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## ProtoKun7 (Sep 26, 2012)

Foxi4 said:


> 431unknown said:
> 
> 
> > I'm pretty sure that the Ponds departure is while going to be sad since they are leaving and at the same time going to be a "happy ending" of sorts.
> ...


No he didn't.

There was one tabloid last month that reported so, but it's entirely false, misquoted, and he has no plans to quit yet.

(Also, not only is that story invalid, it's from last October)

You need better sources.


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## Just Another Gamer (Sep 26, 2012)

Been rewatching from series 1 and honestly looking back I kinda miss the darker personality doctor. Matt is good but his doctor seems a little too goofy and it was really downplaying the last of the time lords thing when compared to 9th and 10th.


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## ProtoKun7 (Sep 26, 2012)

Can't always be gloomy, plus it's been 300 years since all of that.

Also, darker personality aspects are present in episodes 2 and 3 of series 7. Have you got to that point yet?


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## Just Another Gamer (Sep 26, 2012)

ProtoKun7 said:


> Can't always be gloomy, plus it's been 300 years since all of that.
> 
> Also, darker personality aspects are present in episodes 2 and 3 of series 7. Have you got to that point yet?


I seen all of them, just rewatching for the fun of it 

I'm not expecting him to be gloomy but he is more goofy than before which I found a little out of place seeing as he just said goodbye to Rose and was sad just before regenerating and then the next time you see him he is happy and joyful then settling on goofy a few episodes later. While series 7 got darker he was a little more series but overall he seemed to be largely unaffected by this seeing how he is in episode 4 but this might just be me though. I consider 9 and 10 to be more fun and adventure seeking but not goofy as they are usually quite serious but with a smile while 11 tends to try and be goofy all the time.


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## ProtoKun7 (Sep 26, 2012)

Mercurial attitudes. You can experience all sorts of emotional pain and manage to outwardly appear fine.

Once a regeneration sets in and it changes your personality, you can change your emotions very quickly. Every incarnation behaves differently.


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## Just Another Gamer (Sep 26, 2012)

ProtoKun7 said:


> Mercurial attitudes. You can experience all sorts of emotional pain and manage to outwardly appear fine.
> 
> Once a regeneration sets in and it changes your personality, you can change your emotions very quickly. Every incarnation behaves differently.


I know but I do miss the more serious doctor. Hopefully things change when the Ponds leave and I'm kinda hoping the new companion will be awesome and not Amy-like otherwise it'll be a letdown.


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## Foxi4 (Sep 26, 2012)

ProtoKun7 said:


> (Also, not only is that story invalid, it's from last October)


Wow, I must've been pretty tired not to notice the date. Nevermind then, I'm glad that Matt's staying - he really fits the role in my opinion.


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## SifJar (Sep 26, 2012)

Just Another Gamer said:


> I know but I do miss the more serious doctor. Hopefully things change when the Ponds leave and I'm kinda hoping the new companion will be awesome and not Amy-like otherwise it'll be a letdown.


He always seems much darker and more serious when Amy and Rory aren't about, so I'd say it's likely he'll be that way when they are gone for good. Although I personally quite like Smith's more lively portrayal of the Doctor. But it does need to be balanced with a bit of seriousness every now and again.


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## Foxi4 (Sep 26, 2012)

SifJar said:


> Just Another Gamer said:
> 
> 
> > I know but I do miss the more serious doctor. Hopefully things change when the Ponds leave and I'm kinda hoping the new companion will be awesome and not Amy-like otherwise it'll be a letdown.
> ...


I think that the "apparent insanity, carefree attitude and overly excited reactions" are his way of both coping what he's seen on his travels as well as avoiding having others worrying about him and being a downer. In numerous episodes you can see the Doctor's true face, where his internal conflicts surface.

David Tennant's Doctor was very much like that, with his own personal twist.


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## Just Another Gamer (Sep 27, 2012)

SifJar said:


> Just Another Gamer said:
> 
> 
> > I know but I do miss the more serious doctor. Hopefully things change when the Ponds leave and I'm kinda hoping the new companion will be awesome and not Amy-like otherwise it'll be a letdown.
> ...


I don't mind lively but the goofyness kinda annoys me a little, I mean all incarnations of the doctor are lively but the ones I liked more weren't as goofy as Matt's was in series 5 and 6 and some of 7 but my hopes for the rest of series 7 is he becomes a little less goofy but still has that energetic approach.


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## 431unknown (Sep 27, 2012)

Just Another Gamer said:


> SifJar said:
> 
> 
> > Just Another Gamer said:
> ...



I wouldn't get your hopes too high then. He plays the character like that because that's how he has made the character his and it is also how Moffat wants the character played.

Has anyone else noticed that at least once in every episode so far this series the Doctor has  said the line "This is new." I know that he has said it in the past 2 series but he is saying it more often in the current one.  For a being thats boardering on 1200 years of age I find it hard to believe that anything is new for them.


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## Foxi4 (Sep 27, 2012)

431unknown said:


> (...)For a being thats boardering on 1200 years of age I find it hard to believe that anything is new for them.


What's 1200 years compared to the enormity of time?

In the episode _Utopia_ we learn that by the year 100,000,000,000,000 A.D, most galaxies will colapse into themselves, leaving only areas stretched to the far away edges of the universe relatively intact._ "Even the Time Lords didn't venture that far into space"_, at least according to the Doctor himself. 1200 years pales in comparison to such a huge number, even if the Doctor travels everyday, not to mention that time can correct history on-the-fly.

Doctor's intrusions in history do have an influence on future events, we see that in the Doctor Who Special _"The Waters of Mars". _Albeit reluctantly, the Doctor is often forced to attempt changing fixed points in time or causing paradoxes, even though he tries his best not to do so. This in turn causes time and space to re-structure itself to accomodate the changes. Places in the future he had visited previously may look different after he made changes to the past - it's a never-ending cycle of time re-structuring itself. Everything can be made "new".


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## Just Another Gamer (Sep 27, 2012)

431unknown said:


> Just Another Gamer said:
> 
> 
> > SifJar said:
> ...


I know but it doesn't make me like the show any less, its still fantastic and to me is better than all the other crap on TV but its just something I notice when rewatching,


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## ProtoKun7 (Sep 27, 2012)

Just Another Gamer said:


> SifJar said:
> 
> 
> > Just Another Gamer said:
> ...


You should've seen Fourth and Sixth.



431unknown said:


> Has anyone else noticed that at least once in every episode so far this series the Doctor has  said the line "This is new." I know that he has said it in the past 2 series but he is saying it more often in the current one.  For a being thats boardering on 1200 years of age I find it hard to believe that anything is new for them.


I spotted it, but not in *A Town Called Mercy*; the only reference I remember there was not needing a new suit.


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## Just Another Gamer (Sep 28, 2012)

ProtoKun7 said:


> Just Another Gamer said:
> 
> 
> > SifJar said:
> ...


I've seen Fourth but not Sixth yet. The ones I haven't seen yet is 1st-3rd and 6th-8th I plan to watch but never really got around to it.


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## MelodieOctavia (Sep 28, 2012)

Foxi4 said:


> 431unknown said:
> 
> 
> > (...)For a being thats boardering on 1200 years of age I find it hard to believe that anything is new for them.
> ...



And we all saw what happened when a fixed point in time became "unfixed".


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## Foxi4 (Sep 28, 2012)

TwinRetro said:


> And we all saw what happened when a fixed point in time became "unfixed".


Nothing of great significance? Merely a few details, wheras the destiny of the human race remained unchanged.


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## ProtoKun7 (Sep 28, 2012)

Foxi4 said:


> TwinRetro said:
> 
> 
> > And we all saw what happened when a fixed point in time became "unfixed".
> ...


One particular fixed point (the base still exploded, which was the major point); another had far greater consequences.


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## Foxi4 (Sep 28, 2012)

ProtoKun7 said:


> One particular fixed point (the base still exploded, which was the major point); another had far greater consequences.


The Doctor's theory about fixed points in history is simply his way of justifying his intrusions in it - the truth is that everything he does changes history in some way - it'd be more accurate to say that he should merely intervene when someone else is trying to change history... but I digress. 

Future will always adjust itself, regardless of what he does. It may adapt in an undesirable way, but still.


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## funem (Sep 28, 2012)

I have watched the program from way back in the Jon Pertwee era. As far as the classic series goes Tom Baker was a (in my opinion) the best Doctor, "Jelly Baby?", as the series went on with him in it, the stories got better and better. If you are want to watch a classic few clasic stories then watch Genesis Of The Daleks, its quite dark but probably the best Doctor Who story ever made. Tom distanced himself from the series when he left as he thought he would be typcast, he has recently come back and done some audio stories and conventions. Other Tom Baker ones to watch are City of Death and Horror of Fang Rock. Peter Davison also had a few good stories, Earthshock and the five Doctors being the most notable. No-one was sure if the BBC considered Paul McGann to be an official Doctor from the 2005 series onwards until his face apeared in the diary in the The Family of Blood episode with David Tennent, he also then apeared in the montage at the end of the first Mat Smith episode which confirmed it. Colin Baker has done some really good full cast audio stories, as has Paul McGann and Peter Davison, well worth checking out as they have padded out their characters very well. Other Clasic stories to watch are:- "The Curse of Fenric" - Sylvester McCoy,   "The Caves of Androzani" - Peter Davison and  "The Talons of Weng-Chiang" - Tom Baker

These are the "Classic Doctors" and the dates
William Hartnell 1963-1966
Patrick Troughton 1966-1969
Jon Pertwee 1970-1974
Tom Baker: 1974 - 1981
Peter Davison 1982-1984
Colin Baker 1984-1986
Sylvester McCoy 1987-1989
Paul McGann - 1996


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## 431unknown (Sep 28, 2012)

Foxi4 said:


> ProtoKun7 said:
> 
> 
> > One particular fixed point (the base still exploded, which was the major point); another had far greater consequences.
> ...



Yes, but what if  his intrusions in time are how events are supposed to happen? We have learned that the TARDIS takes him mostly where he needs to be and not necessarily where he wants to go.


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## Foxi4 (Sep 28, 2012)

431unknown said:


> Yes, but what if  his intrusions in time are how events are supposed to happen? We have learned that the TARDIS takes him mostly where he needs to be and not necessarily where he wants to go.


Uuuuhh, that's debatable. As a Time Lord child, he gazed into the Time Vortex itself - he "senses" disturbances in time and travels them subconciously. He never travels anywhere without a reason, he merely doesn't realize the reason. The Tardis is a factor here, since it's a living machine, but they're like two pieces of one puzzle in my opinion.


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## 431unknown (Sep 28, 2012)

Foxi4 said:


> 431unknown said:
> 
> 
> > Yes, but what if  his intrusions in time are how events are supposed to happen? We have learned that the TARDIS takes him mostly where he needs to be and not necessarily where he wants to go.
> ...




I don't think its debatable. In The Doctors Wife as Idris the TARDIS clearly states that while he thinks she hasn't been very reliable she always takes him where he needs to be. While he might not know why he is where he is he now knows he is there for a reason. He didn't gaze into the Time Vortex he gazed into the "Untempered Schism".


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## Foxi4 (Sep 28, 2012)

431unknown said:


> I don't think its debatable. In The Doctors Wife as Idris the TARDIS clearly states that while he thinks she hasn't been very reliable she always takes him where he needs to be. While he might not know why he is where he is he now knows he is there for a reason. He didn't gaze into the Time Vortex he gazed into the "Untempered Schism".





> _*The Untempered Schism* was an opening in the space/time continuum, "a gap in the fabric of reality* from which can be seen the whole of the Vortex*"._
> _~TARDIS.wikia.com_


It would appear that we're both right, to a degree. 

Notice how the latest incarnations of the Doctor always seem to put an aura of mystery around the reasons for their travels, however more often than not, they unveil said reasons at the right time, a few moments later. I think it's a combination of the two.


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## 431unknown (Sep 28, 2012)

The TARDIS sees all of time clearer than what the doctor does. It was just that when she was in a humanoid body that she didn't know what the words ment. He can sense fixed points and that's about it. Hell he thought he stole the TARDIS when in actuallity the TARDIS stole him. Match made in heaven? I'd love to see that story for the 50th.


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## ProtoKun7 (Sep 28, 2012)

funem said:


> No-one was sure if the BBC considered Paul McGann to be an official Doctor from the 2005 series onwards until his face ap*p*eared in the diary in the The Family of Blood episode with David Tenn*a*nt


I was. Besides, when Christopher was cast, he was referred to as playing the Ninth.


431unknown said:


> Hell he thought he stole the TARDIS when in actuallity the TARDIS stole him.


To be fair, it was a bit of both. That TARDIS just happened to be unlocked.


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## 431unknown (Sep 28, 2012)

ProtoKun7 said:


> funem said:
> 
> 
> > No-one was sure if the BBC considered Paul McGann to be an official Doctor from the 2005 series onwards until his face ap*p*eared in the diary in the The Family of Blood episode with David Tenn*a*nt
> ...



He has stated that not even the collective armies on Ghengis Khan could get in. She left him in. That's why he can open the doors with a click of his fingers or walk right on in. In the classic series tho he usually used a key. If it makes you feel better I'll go along with that tho.


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## ProtoKun7 (Sep 28, 2012)

431unknown said:


> ProtoKun7 said:
> 
> 
> > funem said:
> ...


They couldn't get in _by force_. If it was unlocked, it unlocked itself to let someone in. The doors didn't need to be bulldozed.

Besides, the key still gets used sometimes.


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## MelodieOctavia (Sep 28, 2012)

ProtoKun7 said:


> 431unknown said:
> 
> 
> > ProtoKun7 said:
> ...



More recently, the key has been more symbolic of a token of trust. No necessarily a tool used to unlock the TARDIS.


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## ProtoKun7 (Sep 28, 2012)

Although the key does still unlock it.


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## 431unknown (Sep 28, 2012)

I can't remember but how exactly did the Master get inside in Utopia?


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## melkor42x (Sep 28, 2012)

431unknown said:


> I can't remember but how exactly did the Master get inside in Utopia?


He used that device to turn himself into a human.  It was all locked up in the pocket watch.

Wasn't the original excuse for not being able to pilot the Tardis, was because it requires four pilots to operate?  Though Ramona never seemed to have any problems.  Then again he did steal the Tardis and probably never bothered with the manual.  Wasn't he using the manual under a broken leg of something.


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## ProtoKun7 (Sep 28, 2012)

431unknown said:


> I can't remember but how exactly did the Master get inside in Utopia?


You mean to Malcassairo?

When he was recruited to fight in the Time War, basically, he escaped and ran as far away as he could, and hid from the Time Lords by using a Chameleon Arch to turn into a human, much like mine.



melkor42x said:


> 431unknown said:
> 
> 
> > I can't remember but how exactly did the Master get inside in Utopia?
> ...


Six pilots. And who's Ramona? Do you mean Romana[dvoratrelundar]?


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## 431unknown (Sep 28, 2012)

melkor42x said:


> 431unknown said:
> 
> 
> > I can't remember but how exactly did the Master get inside in Utopia?
> ...




Nope just went back and checked it out the door was already opened because of a cable coming out of it.  To properly fly a TARDIS  it requires 6 pilots. The Doctor states that in  Journeys End.


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## ProtoKun7 (Sep 28, 2012)

431unknown said:


> melkor42x said:
> 
> 
> > 431unknown said:
> ...


Oh, inside the _TARDIS_...you didn't specify.


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## ProtoKun7 (Sep 29, 2012)

Goodbye Ponds...


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## Jamstruth (Sep 30, 2012)

I don't normally cry over TV shows but I did not want the Ponds to end like this.


Spoiler: I feel my thoughts require spoilers




I wanted there to be one set of companions in the new series that the Doctor doesn't break. Ones that don't end up in another dimension, or whatever. The most normal ending was Martha's and she left because she couldn't take being in love with him and him going on about Rose.
Problem is that without an event like this why would the Doctor stop being with them? Why would they stop going and travelling? Them growing old and dying isn't a good way to end them either. They were at least the best companions in the new Series. I love them both (Amy more, YOWZAH!)



Goodbye Ponds.

However while I praise this ending, Moffat, I HATE YOU SO MUCH! I have to wait until Christmas to get more Who? DAMN YOUUUUU!!!!


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## Arm73 (Sep 30, 2012)

I must say, I started to watch the show just a few days ago, and I'm really hooked now, can't stop watching !
I really love anything that has to do with time travel, and I had no idea what Doctor Who was all about.
Now that I watched the first half a dozen episodes of the 2005 reboot, I'm really delighted and impressed as all the event and characters became all intertwined by the time I reached the  " Bad Wolf " episode.
Gotta love the show !


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## 431unknown (Oct 1, 2012)

Jamstruth said:


> I don't normally cry over TV shows but I did not want the Ponds to end like this.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: I feel my thoughts require spoilers
> ...



I know it's like a full 3 months till the Xmas special and then who knows when the actual second half of the series will start up.



Arm73 said:


> I must say, I started to watch the show just a few days ago, and I'm really hooked now, can't stop watching !
> I really love anything that has to do with time travel, and I had no idea what Doctor Who was all about.
> Now that I watched the first half a dozen episodes of the 2005 reboot, I'm really delighted and impressed as all the event and characters became all intertwined by the time I reached the  " Bad Wolf " episode.
> Gotta love the show !



It only gets better keep on watching and you'll see.


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## digipokemaster (Oct 1, 2012)

im currently watching it so far im on season 4 on the episode after the unicorn and the wasp


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## 431unknown (Oct 1, 2012)

Season 4 is truely my favorite of the new series.


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## Just Another Gamer (Oct 1, 2012)

Jamstruth said:


> I don't normally cry over TV shows but I did not want the Ponds to end like this.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: I feel my thoughts require spoilers
> ...


Honestly I think the ending was actually quite good. I mean they get to live out their whole life with no worries and with each other, continues in spoiler.


Spoiler: Spoiler thoughts




I mean if you look at all the others in the new series the Ponds had it easy plus I found the one who had it worse was Donna, I mean she was the perfect friend for the Doctor but she couldn't travel with him anymore and having her forget all the good things she did made her back to the way she was originally which was someone unhappy with their life and herself. 

The reason for them unable to continue travelling with the Doctor was probably they got sent to a point in time where the TARDIS isn't able to go there because of the paradox they created just before and the Doctor also said he was unable to go back there also there is nothing with growing old and dying I mean the Brigadier had his adventures with the Doctor over most of the Doctor's life and then grew old and died peacefully.


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## 431unknown (Oct 1, 2012)

They only possible way it would have been any better of an ending would to have been for the to be reunited with little Melody while she was in NYC at the end of Day of the Moon.


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## Domination (Oct 1, 2012)

Spoiler



The episode was great, had a few plotholes, but was a great episode nonetheless. Very touching though arguably it was a pretty cruel ending too, would have been better if there was more resolution (on the part of Rory and possibly Brian who was just left in the dark about it), which seems to be most people's greatest complaint.


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## Jamstruth (Oct 1, 2012)

Just Another Gamer said:


> Honestly I think the ending was actually quite good. I mean they get to live out their whole life with no worries and with each other, continues in spoiler.
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Spoiler thoughts
> ...



I never said the ending was bad I just said it wasn't the way I wanted them to go.


Spoiler



Yes it is possible for them to grow old and die but the Brigadier had a different relationship with the Doctor to Rory and Amy. The Doctor tended to come in to help UNIT with things already happening, Amy and Rory are just friends he travels with. Donna did get it the worst, I agree. It would've been nice after the End of Time for them to find a way to let Donna remember her time on the TARDIS.
Also the reason for the Doctor being unable to meet them is more complicated. They created a fixed time where they must die by seeing their own gravestone. Meeting the Doctor gives the possibility of returning to their own time and dying there creating a paradox. The Universe will go out of its way to make sure their paths never cross again. Also apparently New York, 1938 is now a complete temporal mess. Sure there's no problems with that.
They got to live out there lives together but in the wrong time, without any of their family and friends from the Modern day. Its the best outcome with the situation but still a pretty sad outcome for travelling with the Doctor. It seems each time he takes someone with him these days he destroys some part of their life. With Rose he ended up stranding her in a parallel universe, with Martha he wound up having her family tortured and humiliated and with Donna he removed all the amazing things he'd seen. None of it was because he wanted to, it just seems to be a side-effect of travelling with the Modern Day Doctor. Just once i would like to see one choosing to settle down somewhere and not travel with the Doctor because they want to not because they have to. I thought the Ponds would be the first.


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## Gundam Eclipse (Oct 1, 2012)

Unrelated to what you guys are discussing but I gotta ask.
Am I the only one who finds Dalek' fucking adorable D :


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## Foxi4 (Oct 1, 2012)

Gundam Eclipse said:


> Unrelated to what you guys are discussing but I gotta ask.
> Am I the only one who finds Dalek' fucking adorable D :


I find Daleks to be so adorably outdated that it'd be a shame if they weren't there. I mean, it's hard to even concieve an idea of a Dalek redesign. Sure, minor changes were introduced, but unlike Cybermen for examples, the core desing remained practically intact. They're such a throwback to early science fiction that they always bring a smile to my face, rather than fear or dread.

Also, I love their voices - absolutely hillarious! 



> _"E... Egg..." __"Egg...? You want the egg? This?" "Egg..." "Here you go, you can have it, come on..." "Egg...s... terminate... Exterminate! EXTERMINATE!" "Oh..."_




...that made me laugh so much...


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## Just Another Gamer (Oct 1, 2012)

Jamstruth said:


> Just Another Gamer said:
> 
> 
> > Honestly I think the ending was actually quite good. I mean they get to live out their whole life with no worries and with each other, continues in spoiler.
> ...


Well I guess i'm the only one who was actually more content with their ending.


Spoiler



I mean I get where your coming from that all companions of the modern Doctors that leaves has to instead of choosing to and usually it ends badly for them in one way or another but not every one of them had it as bad as Donna did, I mean Rose did get a doctor copy to live with even though she is stuck in a parallel world so atleast she would be a little happy to have her family and be able to be with the doctor again, Martha moved on and married Micky then went freelance, Jack had his team at Torchwood although things quickly went wrong but that wasn't the Doctors doing. What about Sarah Jane, she met with the Tenth and turned down his offer to travel with him.

Well to be fair modern day Doctor since the 9th became the survivor of the Time War and after seeing the Master die he became the last Time Lord so he is in a way a little broken because of it and maybe he does this by accident and seeing how Tenth turned down possible companions after what happened with Donna this does affect him greatly, it was only the 11th that he felt lonely he tried again with Amy and later Rory but i'm guessing he would be more hesitant to try again in future episodes, I know there will be a new companion but i'm sure he would be more hesitant this time.


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## ProtoKun7 (Oct 1, 2012)

It's an example of how the Angels kill you nicely.

Not that I don't hate that Angel for doing what it did right in front of me.


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## Nathan Drake (Oct 1, 2012)

This last episode brought on all of those feels. D: I had really grown to like those two, and it's a shame that their time on the show ended so abruptly and in such a way. I was truly hopeful that Amy and Rory wouldn't suffer a cruel end to their journey as so many others that traveled with the Doctor had, in one way or another. Buuut, remember, the show does have a funny way of working things back out, so perhaps this isn't the ultimate end of Amy and Rory. Remember, there's still half of a season to go after the Christmas special. Although, they've already revealed the new companion (which I'll throw into a spoiler below), that didn't stop the writers from bringing, say, Rose's story to a not as sad conclusion (she ends up with a complete family, as well as a man to love, and at that point, the parallel universe barely matters).

I still have hope that this isn't the last we'll be seeing of Amy and Rory.

Oh yeah, that new companion:



Spoiler



Her name is Oswin Oswald, and episode one of season seven was apparently the first bit of much time spent interacting with The Doctor.


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## ProtoKun7 (Oct 1, 2012)

Nathan Drake said:


> This last episode brought on all of those feels. D: I had really grown to like those two, and it's a shame that their time on the show ended so abruptly and in such a way. I was truly hopeful that Amy and Rory wouldn't suffer a cruel end to their journey as so many others that traveled with the Doctor had, in one way or another. Buuut, remember, the show does have a funny way of working things back out, so perhaps this isn't the ultimate end of Amy and Rory. Remember, there's still half of a season to go after the Christmas special. Although, they've already revealed the new companion (which I'll throw into a spoiler below), that didn't stop the writers from bringing, say, Rose's story to a not as sad conclusion (she ends up with a complete family, as well as a man to love, and at that point, the parallel universe barely matters).
> 
> I still have hope that this isn't the last we'll be seeing of Amy and Rory.
> 
> ...


Nope.

Karen said a comeback would ruin the finality of the exit. And no, Oswin Oswald is someone else. The new companion's name according to some sources is Clara (surname possibly Oswin). Relative, genetic multiple, memory reminiscence, double, maybe. Same actress doesn't mean same character. We have Freema and Karen as evidence of that already.


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## alidsl (Oct 1, 2012)

I wouldnt like to know how the character dies before she became a companion. We did that with river


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## tbgtbg (Oct 1, 2012)

It's impossible to save them? The Doctor does at least a dozen impossible things before breakfast each day. _I_ can think of several ways he could attempt to save them without making NYC explode or whatever. It makes the Doctor look mildly retarded that he can't think of _anything_.


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## ProtoKun7 (Oct 1, 2012)

tbgtbg said:


> It's impossible to save them? The Doctor does at least a dozen impossible things before breakfast each day. _I_ can think of several ways he could attempt to save them without making NYC explode or whatever. It makes the Doctor look mildly retarded that he can't think of _anything_.


When you graduate from the Time Lord Academy you can tell me what I'm doing wrong.


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## Jamstruth (Oct 2, 2012)

ProtoKun7 said:


> tbgtbg said:
> 
> 
> > It's impossible to save them? The Doctor does at least a dozen impossible things before breakfast each day. _I_ can think of several ways he could attempt to save them without making NYC explode or whatever. It makes the Doctor look mildly retarded that he can't think of _anything_.
> ...


The reason he can't is the same reason he can't just jump in the TARDIS and stop any event he's involved in from happening. It'll cause a time paradox. Once you know something happens it has to happen that way or the Universe doesn't like you. The Doctor has seen their grave showing that they lived their entire lives in NYC and any interaction with him could stop that so the Universe will stop him by any means necessary.
The Doctor believes some events can't change. Fixed Points. This is one of them. He's seen them dead so how can he have saved them? Its a paradox on his own personal timeline.


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## 431unknown (Oct 2, 2012)

Jamstruth said:


> ProtoKun7 said:
> 
> 
> > tbgtbg said:
> ...




He has not technically seen them dead. He just saw a tombstone with some familiar names on it. I like how it was fine for the 10th Doctor to figure out a way to save himself and Martha from the angels when they zapped them and  took the Tardis, but its fucken impossible to do so for Amy and Rory because he read their names on a piece of rock.

New Who has become so mainstream compared to the classic series that once you get a part on the show your almost destine for more roles in other shows. Simply put I wouldn't be surprised if Karen and Arthur wanted to leave to pursue other things. Them leaving and bringing in JLC makes the show fresh again it's how it's always been if the Doctors not going to regenerate lets ditch the companion(s) and bring in new one(s). Personally I'm kinda happy Amy and Rory are gone and I'm sure that if they really wanted too that they could be brought back for the 50th next November. They  put in a solid 2 and a half series and thats more than any of the past New Who companions to date and hopefully JLC as Oswin/Clara or what ever Dalek girls real name is going to be lives up to them. I mean for Christ sakes they gave the Doctor a wife.



Spoiler



Even tho River is actually dead, but because of them meeting at different points in time she is still around. The Doctor knows she is dead, but can't tell her about it.



I must say also that Moffat is a master of the twist in a story and I'm sure that some where in the past 5 episodes we all missed something that pertains to Oswin/Clara besides her showing up in the 1st episode. 



Spoiler



I meen I remember hearing that sound of the Tardis while Amelia was sleeping in the yard waiting for the Doctors return in a few minutes, but thought nothing of it and now here a few series later I know what it has meant.


----------



## ProtoKun7 (Oct 3, 2012)

431unknown said:


> I like how it was fine for the 10th Doctor to figure out a way to save himself and Martha from the angels when they zapped them and  took the Tardis


Because Martha was still alive; it was just time travel out of the capsule.



431unknown said:


> Even tho River is actually dead, but because of them meeting at different points in time she is still around. The Doctor knows she is dead, but can't tell her about it.


She's not dead. She is already dead, but she isn't yet again. It's only a matter of timelines.


----------



## Gundam Eclipse (Oct 4, 2012)

Finished the second series.
I CRIED LIKE A BABY, AND HAVE NO REGRETS ADMITTING IT
Though I went 'wat' as soon as the new character appeared at the end of Doomsday, guess it will make sense once I watch the Runaway Bride~


----------



## Hadrian (Oct 4, 2012)

I've been watching some of the first Doctor episodes again recently and man I miss the episodes where it wasn't just "monster/alien of the week threat".  There were some stories where they just went back in time, got in some trouble with humans or needed to help some humans and then went off to another time or place (the very first story An Unearthly Child was them being imprisoned by cavemen and having to survive through a power struggle), those stories were sometimes the strongest compared to the usual "alien threat" ones.

People seem to think that the supporting characters are more fleshed out in modern Who and that they play more of a important role then before, those people clearly haven't watch the first Doctor run. In fact they were far more important during the stories than the Doctor who always seem to be unconscious or captured...in fact he was mostly useless.

So yeah it would be nice if they looked at other aspects of science fiction rather than just aliens and monsters. One of the stories the TARDIS caused them and itself to shrink down on modern Earth and that would be something I'd like to see the new team try again. A little variety can go a long way.


----------



## ProtoKun7 (Oct 4, 2012)

Hadrian said:


> So yeah it would be nice if they looked at other aspects of science fiction rather than just aliens and monsters. One of the stories the TARDIS caused them and itself to shrink down on modern Earth and that would be something I'd like to see the new team try again. A little variety can go a long way.


At which point Ian decided to hide inside a matchbox.


----------



## Hadrian (Oct 4, 2012)

ProtoKun7 said:


> Hadrian said:
> 
> 
> > So yeah it would be nice if they looked at other aspects of science fiction rather than just aliens and monsters. One of the stories the TARDIS caused them and itself to shrink down on modern Earth and that would be something I'd like to see the new team try again. A little variety can go a long way.
> ...


Not quite as genius as hiding in a bag.


----------



## ProtoKun7 (Oct 4, 2012)

I never accused Ian of being a genius, mind you.


----------



## Hadrian (Oct 11, 2012)

Grabbed the Ambassadors of Death DVD on Monday, really great to finally watch this as it was intended rather than the grainy b&w version that the Beeb saved.  It's a really good restoration effort, it's not perfect but a lot better than what we had before.  Not the best of stories but it's fun to watch but like with most Who DVD releases the extras are really worth the asking price.


----------



## Foxi4 (Oct 11, 2012)

Forced by the fact that I already watched seasons 2 through 7 of the revived series, I started watching season 1 with Chrostopher Eccleston, whom I found to be incredibly "wooden" before. On second glance, he's not that bad at all... Fun was had.


----------



## ProtoKun7 (Oct 11, 2012)

Meanwhile I'm working through the Key to Time arc.
I was so much younger then.


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## Hadrian (Oct 13, 2012)

Foxi4 said:


> Forced by the fact that I already watched seasons 2 through 7 of the revived series, I started watching season 1 with Chrostopher Eccleston, whom I found to be incredibly "wooden" before. On second glance, he's not that bad at all... Fun was had.


I found him to be less grating than the Tennant (he did too much oohing, awwing and squeeing for most episodes) and I do wish he had a couple of extra series left. I never really liked him as an actor before Who but he clearly had a lot of fun in this despite the fact that he distances himself from the series nowadays.  Also I found series 1 to be a shitload better than all of the other RTD episodes. RTD could write some great episodes but then he ruins it by writing some truly dreadful ones or putting Catherine Tate in a whole series.


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## 431unknown (Oct 13, 2012)

For those that didn't know BBC has a story board of an unshot scene that ties up the ponds departure quite well.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XWU6XL9xI4k&feature=player_embedded


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## Gundam Eclipse (Oct 30, 2012)

About to rewatch Doctor Who from the beginning(2005), was on series 3 but I didn't watch for a while due to exams, thought it would be more fun to rewatch >3>
I have a question, but uh, I am not too sure if its against 'Temp rules or not. Are there any subtitles for this series I can get? I plan to rewatch it with some family members, and they would benefit greatly from having some English subtitles, me as well since my hearing isn't the best.
Again, I am not too sure if this counts against the rules, if it does, please ignore my question.


----------



## Nathan Drake (Dec 25, 2012)

Hey guys, Doctor Who Christmas special!

I don't get to watch it until I can find it online though, sadly. Family functions and all that.


----------



## trigger_ftu (Dec 25, 2012)

i'll be watching it soon. i'm using a good vpn fro watching it on bbc player. and family time is now. :-/


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## mrgone (Dec 25, 2012)

just finished it
christmas is saved


----------



## 431unknown (Dec 25, 2012)

Watched it a few hours ago. It was so far the Best Xmas special of the Matt Smith era.


----------



## Nathan Drake (Dec 26, 2012)

ProtoKun7 said:


> Nope.
> 
> Karen said a comeback would ruin the finality of the exit. And no, Oswin Oswald is someone else. The new companion's name according to some sources is Clara (surname possibly Oswin). Relative, genetic multiple, memory reminiscence, double, maybe. Same actress doesn't mean same character. We have Freema and Karen as evidence of that already.


HEY HEY, GUESS WHAT!

I WAS RIGHT! In a sense. I'll explain in a spoiler:


Spoiler



She is in fact, Oswin Oswald. The time stream seems to be a bit goofed up, and Oswin Oswald is being reborn time and time again with the same memories intact deep within her subconscious, as is seen right before her 1892 self dies. Even her attitude remains identical through it all, as well as her cooking habits. I assume an explanation will come later, but as of now, Oswin Oswald is definitely back!


 
Also, I liked Moffat's nod to the origins of Sherlock Holmes. It's neat to see two brilliant pieces of work mingle in such a way.


----------



## ProtoKun7 (Dec 26, 2012)

Nathan Drake said:


> HEY HEY, GUESS WHAT!
> 
> I WAS RIGHT! In a sense. I'll explain in a spoiler:
> 
> ...


Memory reminiscence/double/genetic multiple still seems to hold up. There's something more than just the two, and it seems so far to be not unlike a diffraction, in that the same person appears at different times in history.


----------



## TyBlood13 (Dec 26, 2012)

Hell yes I watch it!
Recorded the X-mas special on BBCA, will watch later


----------



## Gundam Eclipse (Feb 2, 2013)

Question, does the Master return after series 3?
Because I just finished it, and holy shit I want him back, BEST VILLAIN EVER D:


----------



## 431unknown (Feb 2, 2013)

He comes back at the end of David Tennants tenuoir as the Doctor in "The End of Time".


----------



## ProtoKun7 (Feb 2, 2013)

Not to mention his first appearances back in season 8 and onwards.


----------



## Psionic Roshambo (Feb 2, 2013)

Tom Baker was the best Dr ever....


----------



## Nah3DS (Feb 2, 2013)

doctor.... who?


----------



## Nathan Drake (May 19, 2013)

ProtoKun7 said:


> Memory reminiscence/double/genetic multiple still seems to hold up. There's something more than just the two, and it seems so far to be not unlike a diffraction, in that the same person appears at different times in history.


So, having just watched The Name of the Doctor, I'm glad they finally cleared up the mystery of Clara in that she is



Spoiler



the same person, time and time again, having thrust herself into the Doctor's time stream in order to thwart the Great Intelligence. Every Clara was just another piece of herself, born into whatever time she may have been needed in. That explains the mental linkup with Asylum Clara when 1892 Clara dies, and why she only seemed to appear in situations where the Doctor would have lost his life without her. Though, that raises another question: did the Dalek Asylum exist because of the Great Intelligence, or was the Clara of that time subconsciously dragged there, thwarting the Great Intelligence before the Doctor's arrival? Or was that just a side effect of being in absolutely every nook and cranny of the Doctor's timeline? Then, also, would Clara and the Great Intelligence be the reason that River and the Doctor's time streams were so goofed up and that they kept meeting in the wrong order?


 
On a related note, I'm now very excited for the 50th Anniversary Special. November is far too far away at this point.


----------



## Thanatos Telos (May 19, 2013)

The season finale was great. Can't wait to see the Valeyard pop up.


----------



## ProtoKun7 (May 22, 2013)

Nathan Drake said:


> So, having just watched The Name of the Doctor, I'm glad they finally cleared up the mystery of Clara[/spoiler]


I called it (on Reddit).


Thanatos Telos said:


> The season finale was great. Can't wait to see the Valeyard pop up.


That's assuming he does.


----------



## Nathan Drake (May 22, 2013)

ProtoKun7 said:


> That's assuming he does.


Yeah, I've been wondering about that. After the Doctor thwarted The Valeyard in the past, it doesn't make much sense for the Doctor to become the Valeyard once more. I believe the Valeyard, breaking as many time laws as he did, effectively ended his existence and his chance to exist once more. I can't remember where I read, but if I remember right, the original creator of the Valeyard thought he was a boring villain and pretty much decided he should be retconned anyways, or at least never brought back as a serious threat. Only a few lines of writing have kept him on, while the majority have abandoned the character at this point.

Then there's the problem of the Great Intelligence using the term "the Valeyard" once more when describing all the names the Doctor would come to be known by. It's hard to say if the Great Intelligence just pulled that from knowing about the Doctor's past with everything he had pieced together previously, though.

Regardless, we won't be seeing The Valeyard in the 50th unless they decide to make him the villain of it. John Hurt's role is already long confirmed.


----------



## ProtoKun7 (May 22, 2013)

Nathan Drake said:


> Yeah, I've been wondering about that. After the Doctor thwarted The Valeyard in the past, it doesn't make much sense for the Doctor to become the Valeyard once more.


Why not? The Valeyard hasn't been created yet. Plus he somehow turned up again disguised as the Keeper of the Matrix, and the Inquisitor didn't even notice.


----------



## Nathan Drake (May 22, 2013)

ProtoKun7 said:


> Why not? The Valeyard hasn't been created yet. Plus he somehow turned up again disguised as the Keeper of the Matrix, and the Inquisitor didn't even notice.


The Valeyard crossed his own time stream so many times in an effort to gain immortality, exposing the Doctor to his potential future. There is no saying that the Valeyard was actually a fixed point in the Doctor's timeline. Nobody has said that he _has_ to follow the path laid out for him by those events. He will eventually regenerate again, yes, but it's unlikely that the Doctor will follow that path ever again. Essentially, the Valeyard crossing his own time stream would seem to be what would come to eliminate his existence. Edit: I do have to accept the "then why didn't the Valeyard just blink out of existence" thing, but perhaps his personal timeline was just too mangled at that point from him jumping around. Honestly, I don't have a good answer for that.

Going back to The Valeyard as he appeared in older Doctor Who, that villain can never actually return seeing as the Doctor destroyed both him and his TARDIS. I'm sure they could twist that around somehow and say he survived, but it doesn't seem that anybody, writer of the show or any of the books, has decided he was worth bringing back from the dead.


----------



## Thanatos Telos (May 23, 2013)

Just going to say this: Was I the only thought the Doctor's name was 'please' for all of a second?


----------



## 431unknown (May 23, 2013)

That "Doctor" is the one that fought in the Time War and the one that used the " Moment" to end the war. Been reading that Omega will be back for the 50th as well as the Time Lords.


----------



## Nathan Drake (May 23, 2013)

431unknown said:


> That "Doctor" is the one that fought in the Time War and the one that used the " Moment" to end the war. Been reading that Omega will be back for the 50th as well as the Time Lords.


I figured it was the initial Ninth Doctor a few days back, but something bothers me. As a side note, seeing as the Doctor despises that form of himself for revealing his name, I'm thinking that the Doctor's name is also essentially the key to the Time Lock. If ever uttered by the wrong person in the right place, I imagine it could unleash the Time War once more, and cause the use of the Ultimate Sanction to finally occur. What I wonder is this: the Moment was supposedly used by the Eighth Doctor. Assuming this is entirely canon, that would mean that the Doctor that fought all through the Time War would have been the Eighth Doctor. With that in mind, John Hurt could actually be the Eighth Doctor, heavily aged from a very long involvement in a war removed from time, regenerating after his use of the Moment to seal the Time Lock in order to seal away the man that did what the man known as the Doctor never could have done. The jacket of the Ninth being worn over the clothes of the Eighth is easily explained as the Doctor simply transitioning throughout the Time War, with the Ninth keeping the jacket potentially as a reminder of his great crime. A Time Lord can force a regeneration, which is seen in classic Who with Romana I and Romana II, as well as when the Doctor is punished on Gallifrey and forced to regenerate by the council as part of his punishment (which, if I remember, was the cause of him transitioning from the Second Doctor to the Third Doctor), meaning that the idea of a forced regeneration would be entirely canon. It would also finally give us an explanation as to how and why the Eighth Doctor turned into the Ninth. It seems to be a subject that we have missed greatly and that nothing that's considered canon has touched on.

Now, how about Clara not seeing that part of the Doctor's life? Easy. As the Time War is time-locked, so is that part of his life. No amount of gallivanting through the Doctor's time steam will ever allow a person to return to that war without it being reinstated back into the normal flow of time. That would mean that there's a part of his life that absolutely nobody in existence truly knows about besides himself, and it also happens to be the part of his life that he's most ashamed of as a man that took on the title of protector.

With that in mind, my idea for why the Doctor's name is the key is simple: why else would the Doctor have to try so desperately to never reveal it? Why is it so imperative that the wrong person never get their hands on his name? Why would it anger him so much that he ever used his name for any purpose? It must hold great power, of course, but it can't just be that. There must be something behind the name of the last Time Lord that requires special consideration to keep his name free of being common knowledge. Speaking his name under the correct circumstances must have the ability to bring about great disaster.

And thus, I feel the 50th Anniversary Special will give us closure on the Eighth Doctor once and for all. I think it's the best they could do with Christopher Eccleston not coming back to the show for the 50th. Regardless, if they go the route of the Eighth and with him regenerating at the conclusion of the Time War into the Ninth, well, it would simply work. He wouldn't have necessarily been born in battle, but he would have been born at the conclusion of the Doctor's darkest moment. It would give a nice explanation as to why the Ninth Doctor was seemingly much darker than the Tenth and Eleventh, and give some credence to the Doctor reverting to great darkness at certain moments (such as at the conclusion of his first meeting with Donna as the Tenth).


----------



## Gabelvampir (May 23, 2013)

431unknown said:


> That "Doctor" is the one that fought in the Time War and the one that used the " Moment" to end the war. Been reading that Omega will be back for the 50th as well as the Time Lords.


I thought it was canon that the 8th Doctor fought the Time War? At least it was Russel T. Davies canon. I don't believe that Omega will be back, that is too obvious as he was only in anniversary stories before (10th anniversary story The Three Doctors and Arc of Infinity from the 20th anniversary season). But I really hope they bring back the Time Lords, as they were in the old series, not the cruel people changed by the war as seen in The End of Time.
Oh and I also think we won't see the Valeyard again, at least in any form similar to his previous incarnation. At least he won't be in the Anniversary special, I don't think they would have mentioned him in the finale if they wanted to use him. He works best as a surprise villain.


----------



## ProtoKun7 (May 23, 2013)

Gabelvampir said:


> I thought it was canon that the 8th Doctor fought the Time War? At least it was Russel T. Davies canon.


Never actually confirmed. Even so, "fighting in" does not necessarily mean finishing.


----------



## Gabelvampir (May 23, 2013)

ProtoKun7 said:


> Never actually confirmed. Even so, "fighting in" does not necessarily mean finishing.


That is true, although it was suggested in "Rose" that the Regeneration into the 9th Doctor was pretty recent, so it is very likely that the 8th doctor finished the Time War, or regenerated shortly before the end and the 9th did it then. Or the Regeneration could have been an effect of the Doctor finishing the Time War.
By the way, I know it was stated some time that the 1st Doctor really was the first, but is it really sure that 9, 10 and 11 are really the 9th, 10th and 11th incarnation? Maybe there is room somewhere for the John Hurt incarnation. Which would give a bit of a new meaning to the prophecy regarding the "Fall of the Eleventh".


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## 431unknown (May 23, 2013)

Just because it was suggested he recently regenerated it was never stated he regenerated from the 8th, only implied.


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## ProtoKun7 (May 23, 2013)

Gabelvampir said:


> I know it was stated some time that the 1st Doctor really was the first, but is it really sure that 9, 10 and 11 are really the 9th, 10th and 11th incarnation? Maybe there is room somewhere for the John Hurt incarnation. Which would give a bit of a new meaning to the prophecy regarding the "Fall of the Eleventh".


 
Eleventh confirmed himself as Eleventh, and the "fall" was in a way, the TARDIS falling with him inside when the antigravs were switched off.


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## Gabelvampir (May 23, 2013)

ProtoKun7 said:


> Eleventh confirmed himself as Eleventh, and the "fall" was in a way, the TARDIS falling with him inside when the antigravs were switched off.


Ah ok, I had a feeling that his number was stated some time. I don't think it was the fall mentioned in the prophecy because of the "when no creature can speak falsely, or fail to answer" part. But perhaps we'll see in November.


----------



## Nathan Drake (May 23, 2013)

ProtoKun7 said:


> Never actually confirmed. Even so, "fighting in" does not necessarily mean finishing.


Check out "The Last Great Time War" and "Death" for the Eighth Doctor. He did return to Gallifrey, did participate in the Time War, and was present to some degree in the final process of ending it. What's never truly specified is how the Eighth Doctor's life ends, or whether or not he was the one that pulled the trigger that created the Time Lock. It's also never mentioned what happens directly after the Time War for the Doctor, and what lead to him becoming the Ninth. What we know about the birth of the Ninth is essentially that he was born in (from?) battle, which could relate to either him finally being the one to end the Time War, or being the one to come right after it, likely because of some level of disgust from the Doctor himself causing him to force a new regeneration if the response of the Eleventh upon seeing that form of him was any indication.

That place I gave you is fantastic, by the way. It has details from every canon piece of Doctor Who out there, filling in a lot of the blanks that the TV show has never had the chance to cover. Even watching all of the Doctor Who episodes to date, one would be hard pressed to be able to say they really know more than about 60% of all the relative Doctor Who information. What really surprises me is how much material is out there in text and comic form that is considered canon. Tons and tons of stuff.

Edit: Also, if you read about the Moment, it's acknowledged that the Eighth Doctor made it, and it's implied that he also was the one to use it. Even if that's taken as absolute fact though, that leaves quite a bit of a problem area about how the Doctor came to cope with that decision, and how he ended up regenerating.


----------



## 431unknown (May 23, 2013)

Everything you have stated above is just speculation. I feel if it wasn't in the show and put on screen it's not canon. The comics, books, and Big Finish stories to my knowledge have never been thought of as canon by any on the shows production teams.


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## Gabelvampir (May 23, 2013)

431unknown said:


> Everything you have stated above is just speculation. I feel if it wasn't in the show and put on screen it's not canon. The comics, books, and Big Finish stories to my knowledge have never been thought of as canon by any on the shows production teams.


Yeah that's what I think about most of the canon of TV shows and movies.
But Doctor Who has so many non-TV material (and the life of the 8th Doctor mostly is in non-TV material) that I find it a bit hard to ignore that. And many fans seem to pick and choose their own canon from the material available, so it is hard to define the official canon. But as with other shows, what is on the screen is definitely canon, except the retconned stuff and that "half-human on my mother's side" thing.


----------



## cobleman (May 23, 2013)

I'm glad I am not the only dinosaur here I have been watching since Jon Pertwee. And I agree Tom Baker was my favourite too. I just could not watch Colin Baker and Sylvester McCoy. But when  Paul McGann appeared in the movie 7 years later I found myself wanting more! Then 9 years had past and "BOOM" he was back Bigger and better than ever thank you Russell T Davies.


----------



## Gabelvampir (May 23, 2013)

I wish I would have been able to watch Doctor Who much earlier then I did, but it almost nothing of it was broadcasted in Germany (and still isn't, at least in free TV which is much more important here then in other countries). I only started watching everything from the new series in 2011, but I love it. I am working my way through the old series stories, but I am very far from having seen everything, or even any substantial chunk.
Oh and for Colin Baker and Sylvester McCoy, I really like McCoy's Doctor, at least with Ace as companion. Haven't watch much Colin Backer stories as all scripts of his run seem to be sub-par at best. Only story I watched completely is The Two Doctors, and that wasn't very good, at least compared to the other Multi-Doctor stories.


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## SifJar (May 23, 2013)

ProtoKun7 said:


> Eleventh confirmed himself as Eleventh, and the "fall" was in a way, the TARDIS falling with him inside when the antigravs were switched off.


But could he not have been confirming (either implicitly or explicitly, I don't remember exactly what he said) that he was the Eleventh _Doctor_? When Eleven talked to John Hurt , Hurt says that he acted "in the name of peace and sanity" to which Eleven responded "But not in the name of the Doctor!", implying that this incarnation was not "The Doctor". So I reckon it is definitely possible he fits between Eight and Nine.


----------



## Nathan Drake (May 23, 2013)

431unknown said:


> Everything you have stated above is just speculation. I feel if it wasn't in the show and put on screen it's not canon. The comics, books, and Big Finish stories to my knowledge have never been thought of as canon by any on the shows production teams.


To be entirely fair Doctor Who pretty much is impossible to define using the traditional idea of canon, so that place I like to use only uses what's considered official (see below for what constitutes as official for anybody) when citing information in articles. There is far from a fine line between what could easily be considered part of the Doctor Who universe, and what's positively ridiculous but has still been published. The writers can't confirm or deny canon, as that would have to be up to all individual owners to determine it. Ownership is absolutely all over the place, so it would seem that, while we would expect someone to tell us what is truly canon, no one person or group of individuals actually can. Pretty much everybody who owns a piece of the Doctor Who universe would have to collectively come together, go through all the material, and make a decision, which I don't foresee ever happening.

A lot of what was made was officially given use of material by character creators and the BBC as a whole with a lot of it even being made by those that had or have had a hand directly in the show. The only negative side is that some of it is a touch conflicting with each other, but none of the official material seems to intentionally conflict with the established Doctor Who TV timeline. Funnily enough, it mentions one of the biggest problem spots is with the Eighth Doctor, likely because we got nothing but a TV movie about him before suddenly 2005 was here and the Ninth was introduced, so writers just took some liberties in introducing elements regarding his character and general adventures. I don't think show writers are ever going to worry about pre-war Eighth Doctor again though. That seems to just be an open field of fun for writers and comic creators alike.

What can be strongly inferred just from the TV series, ignoring every piece of non-show material: the Time War had to happen after the Seventh Doctor, and it had to conclude by the Ninth Doctor. This at least implies the involvement of the Eighth Doctor. Seeing the age they chose to represent the mystery Doctor (older), one could guess that it's either a war torn Eighth Doctor, or the original Ninth before the Doctor did something to himself post-Time War to modify his appearance. It would be a lot easier to explain it via the Eighth Doctor than it would be to try to explain it via the Ninth in terms of established information from the TV series (since, you know, the Ninth as we knew him had a slightly different clothing style, and a much younger appearance), but it can't be ignored that the Tenth Doctor mentioned the Ninth was born in battle. That is so open for interpretation though, it's hard to use that as conclusive information in determining what to think.

tl;dr: Canon is impossible with Doctor Who. Some stories could be considered canon as long as you pick and choose with care, and likely won't conflict if you choose to believe them as so. It would still make the most sense if John Hurt was the Eighth Doctor, though the possibility of him being the Ninth can't be entirely ignored.


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## Gabelvampir (May 24, 2013)

I don't believe that John Hurt is supposed to be the Eight Doctor, mostly because I don't think they would recast the role without a good reason. And Paul McGann stated he would return if asked.
I had the impression that he is supposed to be some other non-regular incarnation of the Doctor, maybe it has something to do with the ideas behind that old Cartmel Masterplan (http://tardis.wikia.com/wiki/Cartmel_Masterplan). Maybe he is supposed to be different incarnation before the First Doctor (that does not count to the regeneration limit for some reason). Or a split or alternate universe version that was created by some event in the Last Great Time War.
But at this point this is all mere speculation, we just have to wait till November 23rd to find out the truth. Which feels like a long time right now.


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## 431unknown (May 24, 2013)

Time War Doctor. Whether that makes him the 8th only older or an alternate 9 or just a regeneration that the Doctor has chosen to repress I don't know. 11/23/13 holds the answer.


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## 431unknown (Jun 1, 2013)

This just in,  Matt Smith to leave after the 50th anniversary special.

Source


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## EzekielRage (Jun 1, 2013)

I always figured 8 fought in the Time War and regenerated into 9 during it and 9 ended the war.

Also, yes, matt smith leaves. So either John Hurt is the next doctor or they recast again. Truth be told, I hope Tennant returns, he is my favourite. Him appearing in the 50th anniversary special gives me hope :

Edit:
I read a lot about a female doctor. And while I would love that, I doubt it because AFAIk he can only regenerate into another male. Also it would be weird for the female fans. Sure, they'd have a good female lead but they already confirmed the female companion and that would probably not work out well.
I could also see a black doctor but once again I am not sure if that is even possible. It would be cool though^^


----------



## dgwillia (Jun 2, 2013)

Wow, I couldnt imagine the show before without David Tennant, now I REALLY can't imagine it without Matt Smith...

I just don't see how anyone is going to top those two, they were perfect


----------



## 431unknown (Jun 2, 2013)

John Hurt is not the next Doctor.


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## ProtoKun7 (Jun 2, 2013)

431unknown said:


> This just in,  Matt Smith to leave after the 50th anniversary special.
> 
> Source


Christmas special.

There's something rather jarring about finding out about your own impending regeneration sometimes.



EzekielRage said:


> Truth be told, I hope Tennant returns, he is my favourite. Him appearing in the 50th anniversary special gives me hope :



That's not how it works.


----------



## Gabelvampir (Jun 2, 2013)

431unknown said:


> This just in, Matt Smith to leave after the 50th anniversary special.
> 
> Source


Ah crap, I feared something like this would happen. Hope they find a decent replacement, but all Doctors of the new series were at least ok, so not much to worry there.

Oh and David Tennant will not return (although I would very much like that). He is busy with other things, and as said above, that's not how it works.


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## tbgtbg (Jun 2, 2013)

It works how they want it to work. If they wanted Tennant back and he was available and wanted to come back they could come up with a way to do it.

They won't, but you can't just say that's not how it works. It's Doctor Who, anything you imagine can happen.


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## Smuff (Jun 2, 2013)

Gimme Tom Baker and K-9 or GTFO


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## Foxchild (Jun 2, 2013)

So... how did Clara know which times to save the Doctor and when to go ahead and let him regenerate?


Yeah, John Hurt is most likely Doctor 8.5, but I would rather he were a future regeneration, Valeyard reboot kinda thing.  Or at least something not so easy to guess.  Had a friend in college who thought that way down the road the Doctor should regenerate into the Master and go back in time to antagonize himself...


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## Gundam Eclipse (Aug 4, 2013)

LISTEN HERE CUNTS, I AM THE FUCKING DOCTOR NOW.


Spoiler








YESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS


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## EzekielRage (Aug 4, 2013)

Yep Love the choice. Also, he looks a bit like an older 10. maybe they use that and bring back some traits of 10^^


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## Foxchild (Aug 5, 2013)

Y'know, I really wish spoilers for this weren't all over everything.  I mean, this stuff has been all over my facebook, etc., and I'd rather have been surprised.  Ah well, at least I've kept the kiddos from finding out so far (they don't even know who's gonna be in the anniversary special) Mwahaha.  Guess the british just can't keep a secret.


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## 431unknown (Aug 5, 2013)

Only time will tell. He looks like a Doctor tho.


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## Gundam Eclipse (Aug 5, 2013)

Expect an endless stream of these when the new series starts <333333333333333333333333


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## The Catboy (Aug 5, 2013)

Peter Capaldi is the 12th Doctor! 



 
He actually looks a lot like what I thought the 12th Doctor would look like, so I am very interested to see how he plays The Doctor.


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## The Real Jdbye (Aug 5, 2013)

I've been meaning to, just haven't gotten to it yet. Seems like a show I'd love


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## The Catboy (Aug 5, 2013)

The Real Jdbye said:


> I've been meaning to, just haven't gotten to it yet. Seems like a show I'd love


 
I was about to tell you Doctors 9-11 are on Netflix, but then I noticed your flag, do you have Netflix in your country?


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## The Real Jdbye (Aug 5, 2013)

The Catboy said:


> I was about to tell you Doctors 9-11 are on Netflix, but then I noticed your flag, do you have Netflix in your country?


Yes and no. We have Netflix, but it hardly has any content. That's moot though since I use the US Netflix  Noticed there was some Doctor Who on there before.


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## relminator (Aug 5, 2013)

I only watched one episode (tv movie?).  It's the gamng vs the frosty snow monsters.  I liked it and would have wanted to see more if I'm not in the Philippines.

And the chick is hot!


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## EzekielRage (Aug 5, 2013)

I suppose this is all related to the 50th anniversary special and the 8.5 doctor. Moffat said there would be resolutions to plot threads lingering on for years now so I hope he keeps his word and ends 11 with a bang (see fall of the 11th) and i am really looking forward to it. but please no more doctor curse videos-.-


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## ProtoKun7 (Aug 5, 2013)

I've looked worse, I have to say.

I'm ok with this.


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## Thanatos Telos (Sep 13, 2013)

They have a poster for the Day of the Doctor!


Spoiler










 
What do you think, ProtoKun7?


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## ProtoKun7 (Sep 13, 2013)

Thanatos Telos said:


> They have a poster for the Day of the Doctor!
> 
> 
> Spoiler
> ...


 
I think they did a really good job of capturing my likenesses.


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## Blaze163 (Oct 30, 2013)

EDIT: Removed because I cannot for the life of me get the spoilers to work. What gives with that?


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## Thanatos Telos (Oct 30, 2013)

Blaze163 said:


> EDIT: Removed because I cannot for the life of me get the spoilers to work. What gives with that?


 
PM me them?


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## pyromaniac123 (Oct 30, 2013)

Blaze163 said:


> EDIT: Removed because I cannot for the life of me get the spoilers to work. What gives with that?


 
Spoilers?



Spoiler



Like this?


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## Blaze163 (Oct 30, 2013)

Been debating the upcoming 50th Anniversary Special with my sister (whose son was in Torchwood, just FYI) and we've come up with a pretty solid theory about what the special will be about. Pretty sure everyone else has reached the same conclusion already (and if they haven't, I'm curious why). Now that I've got the spoiler tags working again, here's our theory...



Spoiler



We have a solid basis for believing that the Special will finally show the final moments of the Time War, in which the Doctor who uses a weapon referred to in 'End of Time' as 'The Moment' to destroy the Daleks at the cost of also killing the Time Lords, something he did because of their degeneration into insanity and the creation of superweapons such as the Nightmare Child (whatever that is). This isn't just wild speculation though, we do have some evidence to back this theory up.

-  It's heavily implied, if not stated outright, that John Hurt's Doctor is a prior incarnation, not the next actual Doctor. The announcement of the actual 12th Doctor pretty much confirms this.

- Going back to Ecclestone's series, the Time War is mentioned constantly but never shown. A key episode would be Dalek, in which the Doctor actually tortures the dalek he finds in the vault, even orders it to kill itself and screams hysterically at it, tries to shoot it, etc. Add that to David Tennant's treatment of his double at the end of Journey's End, in which he references that when he first met Rose he was full of hate, born in battle, and we see that The Doctor was once vengeful and somewhat dark.

- When John Hurt says 'What I did was in the name of peace and sanity', we strongly believe he is referencing the use of The Moment (which the Time Lords state outright he has in his possession in the final days of the Time War, as seen in End of Time) to end the insanity again referenced in End of Time by David Tennant regarding the Time Lords creating terrible weapons and basically unleashing Hell.

- We know the Doctor feels shame over his actions at the end of the Time War, seen repeatedly through every season. In Dalek, he flat out says he is responsible for the ultimate destruction of the daleks and Time Lords, he says to the imprisoned dalek 'I made it happen'.

So from that all taken together, along with the setup being that the Doctor did something terrible that goes against everything the name of the Doctor stands for, on top of the fact that finally seeing the Time War in a cinematic release in 3D would be pretty beyond epic, it seems fairly obvious that's how the episode would, or at the very least SHOULD play out.


 
Opinions?


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## ProtoKun7 (Nov 23, 2013)

So...that was brilliant.


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## Osha (Nov 23, 2013)

Yeah, I was positively surprised, after how mediocre seasons 6 and 7 were, Moffat gave us a REALLY good special.


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## Vappy (Nov 24, 2013)

It was pretty good, wasn't quite as blown away as I'd hoped, kinda disappointed at the limited scope of the Time War shown after 8 years of build up, had a few other nitpicks and plotholes that annoyed me a bit, but I agree with Osha it was definitely a much more satisfying episode than those of the entire past few years. I thought An Adventure in Space and Time was better really, and a much better tribute.


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## RikuCrafter (Nov 24, 2013)

I missed all of Season 7's second half except the finale. Despite that, I understood everything, and I thought it was one of the best specials ever. Tennant and Smith were amazing together.

The glasses scene had me in tears laughing.


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## gokujr1000 (Nov 24, 2013)

Excellent special, answering nearly every question I had about the Time War and even perfectly representing the Classic Doctor Who via John Hurt. I'm definitely excited for the Christmas Special.


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## Jan1tor (Nov 24, 2013)

alidsl said:


> I know protokun does and I do, just wanted to see if anyone else watched the best show in the universe


Well............let's just say I have seen ALL of the Doctor Who shows.


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## TyBlood13 (Nov 24, 2013)

I loved every second of it. Though I do wish Billie Piper was actually Rose Tyler and that Eccleston came back instead of them using stock footage of him. But I understand why he didn't do it (At least from what Wikipedia says on the matter of him and his time on the show)


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