# 50 dead in Orlando nightclub mass shooting, worst in US history



## daxtsu (Jun 12, 2016)

> ORLANDO — A heavily armed assailant opened fire in a packed nightclub early Sunday, killing 50 people in the deadliest shooting spree in U.S. history before being fatally shot by police, local authorities said.



Source

When will it end? First Paris, then Belgium, now Orlando. In any case, give the fallen a moment of silence as you go about your morning/day/night.


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## mgrev (Jun 12, 2016)

It truly is sad that people can do such things. Can they even be considered people? Even though i live far away from america, this cuts a deep wound in my heart.


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## Mikemk (Jun 12, 2016)

daxtsu said:


> Source
> 
> When will it end? First Paris, then Belgium, now Orlando. In any case, give the fallen a moment of silence as you go about your morning/day/night.


Paris and Belgium were terrorist attacks, not mass shootings.  I hear about a mass shooting on the news somewhere in the US every 3-5 weeks, with dozens or hundreds happening before Paris.

I'm not saying mass shootings can't be categorized as terrorist attacks, I'm saying if you say Paris is first, then you can't group it with this.


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## mgrev (Jun 12, 2016)

Mikemk said:


> Paris and Belgium were terrorist attacks, not mass shootings.  I hear about a mass shooting on the news somewhere in the US every 3-5 weeks, with dozens or hundreds happening before Paris.
> 
> I'm not saying mass shootings can't be categorized as terrorist attacks, I'm saying if you say Paris is first, then you can't group it with this.


There were murders on all of the places


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## daxtsu (Jun 12, 2016)

Mikemk said:


> Paris and Belgium were terrorist attacks, not mass shootings.  I hear about a mass shooting on the news somewhere in the US every 3-5 weeks, with dozens or hundreds happening before Paris.
> 
> I'm not saying mass shootings can't be categorized as terrorist attacks, I'm saying if you say Paris is first, then you can't group it with this.



Murder is murder no matter how you look at it.


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## Mikemk (Jun 12, 2016)

mgrev said:


> There were murders on all of the places


There were murders in Aurora Colorado.  My point was that the OP is ignoring everything that happened before Paris.


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## Thelonewolf88 (Jun 12, 2016)

Is this appropriate to get salty at one on another on a public forum.  

Like any death (s) thoughts and condolences should go to those affected especially the families.


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## Argo (Jun 12, 2016)

@Mikemk I get what you're trying to say, but is that really the point of this thread? I took this thread as a way to pay our respects to the dead, as well as discussing this problem. However, you're right, we've had a lot before Paris too and we shouldn't forget them either.


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## daxtsu (Jun 12, 2016)

I didn't intend for it to come off as if I "forgot" or "ignored" other shootings before these major ones, the point was to inform the community who might not know that the shootings happened, and to give the victims a small place to be remembered.


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## mgrev (Jun 12, 2016)

Let's all stop the semi-flaming and calm down instead.


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## Mikemk (Jun 12, 2016)

mgrev said:


> Let's all stop the semi-flaming and calm down instead.


Ok


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## Deleted member 370283 (Jun 12, 2016)

Truly a disgusting act.
According to reports (which may be inaccurate at this point) the shooter called 911 and pledged allegiance to ISIS. ISIS is also claiming responsibility for the attack.


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## SonicCloud (Jun 12, 2016)

I feel really sorry about the families of the death families...

Luckily the shooter got what he deserved. That man wasn't a human...


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## Kinqdra (Jun 12, 2016)

Come on world, you can do better than that... My deepest sympathies go out to those affected..


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## deishido (Jun 12, 2016)

TheStoneBanana said:


> Truly a disgusting act.
> According to reports (which may be inaccurate at this point) the shooter called 911 and pledged allegiance to ISIS. ISIS is also claiming responsibility for the attack.



They were debunked, he made no such call. Officers responded to the scene after a security patrol for the bar discovered a few bodies appearently. The shooters father reports that the shooter wasn't strongly religious but very homophobic. This was a hate crime, pushed only by the shooters hatred of gay men.

Please, if you live in Orlando, they need blood and plasma donations. O and AB especially. Please donate if you are able. There is a rumor being spread that they have lifted the anti-gay ban on donors, but they have not. So please help us


Before anyone jumps in to say homophobia is rooted in the shooters religion, it isnt. Homophobia can exist alongside ANY religion, but NO religion is expressly homophobic.


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## Jao Chu (Jun 12, 2016)

Lol this thread is still on the first page and Islam apologetics are already chiming in. There is many passages in the Quran that state homesexual acts are a punishable act and sin. Hence why ISIS throws LBTQ of roofs etc. Judging by the assailants name, this man is Muslim and he was just following the instructions of the violent scripture called the Quran.

Wonder how long until the mods hode this post. *Cough* Liberal Censorship *cough*


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## Argo (Jun 12, 2016)

Mmm yea this kind of comment pisses me off. A guy with a muslim name can kill people for reasons other than extremism. Not to mention, there were no comments defending the shooter. Assumptions are what screw over the world you know.

Edit: This applies here if the guy didn't actually call 911 and praised ISIS, like @deishido said. If he did, I think it's a safe bet that he was an extremist.


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## LoganK93 (Jun 12, 2016)

God this is sad. Honestly the whole world has gone to shit but that's just my pessimistic view. There are reports now that the man called 911 to pledge his allegiance to ISIS just before commencing his attack. Now I'm not one of thos people who is going after every person who is Muslim. That wouldn't make us any different than people who lump "the blacks" or "the gays" into one big group. The fact of the matter is, it is ISIS who is at wrong here. Not the entire community. And as a country and as a race this shit needs to stop. IT IS 2016 AND WE ARE STILL KILLING OVER TRIVIAL SHIT LIKE HOMOSEXUALITY, RELIGION, AND SKIN TONE.

If there is anyone on here who was affected personally by this, my heart is with you. I am also gay, and cannot even imagine the horror of being attacked in what could be considered one of the "safe places" in our country and community.


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## VinsCool (Jun 12, 2016)

This is disgusting. Another hate based firing.

Condoleance to all the victim families. May they rest in peace.


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## DinohScene (Jun 12, 2016)

'Islam is a religion of peace!' said the extremist killing dozens of people.
Islam might be a religion of peace but enforcing it with violence and hatred isn't the way to do it.
Same goes for every religion.
Open your eyes, you're living in the 21st century.
Having laws and bans on homosexuality and what not is completely ridiculous.
It has been normal for literally thousands of years yet your make belief "god" suddenly opposes to it...

Either way, be it ISIS related or whatever, it's horrible and shouldn't have happened at all.


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## TotalInsanity4 (Jun 12, 2016)

deishido said:


> They were debunked, he made no such call. Officers responded to the scene after a security patrol for the bar discovered a few bodies appearently. The shooters father reports that the shooter wasn't strongly religious but very homophobic. This was a hate crime, pushed only by the shooters hatred of gay men.
> 
> Please, if you live in Orlando, they need blood and plasma donations. O and AB especially. Please donate if you are able. There is a rumor being spread that they have lifted the anti-gay ban on donors, but they have not. So please help us
> 
> ...


Is there a source on that? I listened to FOX news on the radio on the way home (shh it's the only station my car radio gets) and the anchors were all saying he shouted ALLAH AKBAR prior to pulling the trigger. I didn't believe it (mostly because of FOX's reputation), and if that's true it will kind of put my uncertainty to rest


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## TrapperKeeperX (Jun 12, 2016)

This is just sad and irrational that someone who is a citizen of the United States of America who shot over 100 People and killed 50. It make me feel more comfortable to stay inside my own house. This is a real wake up call to ban Semi Auto Assault Rifles since they're a Military Weapon and the NRA & other groups profit off of tragedy they're enablers for encouraging the discrimination against Gun Owners who defend the Second Amendment & Muslims who just want to live in peace without discrimination. Bernie Sanders wants real change this is why I'll vote for Bernie. I hate corrupted politicians profiting off of tragedy & suffering. This is a Hate Crime against humanity it needs to fucking stop! My thoughts go out to those families who were affected by such a hateful act towards the LGBT community.


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## DinohScene (Jun 12, 2016)

TrapperKeeperX said:


> This is just sad and irrational that someone who is a citizen of the United States of America who shot over 100 People and killed 50. It make me feel more comfortable to stay inside my own house. This is a real wake up call to ban Semi Auto Assault Rifles since they're a Military Weapon and the NRA & other groups profit off of tragedy they're enablers for encouraging the discrimination against Gun Owners who defend the Second Amendment & Muslims who just want to live in peace without discrimination. Bernie Sanders wants real change this is why I'll vote for Bernie. I hate corrupted politicians profiting off of tragedy & suffering. This is a Hate Crime against humanity it needs to fucking stop! My thoughts go out to those families who were affected by such a hateful act towards the LGBT community.



Just ban ownership of firearms throughout the US.
Citizens of Europe don't own firearms (except for hunting rifles) and we're doing fine.


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## Touko White (Jun 12, 2016)

From a friend's Facebook:

"Just saw about the shooting at an LGBT nightclub in Orlando, it's horrible that someone would just shoot innocent people because of their sexuality, and also not everyone there could've been LGBT, they could've been straight but like the club, ignorant and homophobic, such a horrible combination."

I absolutely agree.


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## deishido (Jun 12, 2016)

Jao Chu said:


> Lol this thread is still on the first page and Islam apologetics are already chiming in. There is many passages in the Quran that state homesexual acts are a punishable act and sin. Hence why ISIS throws LBTQ of roofs etc. Judging by the assailants name, this man is Muslim and he was just following the instructions of the violent scripture called the Quran.
> 
> Wonder how long until the mods hode this post. *Cough* Liberal Censorship *cough*



Alright, I didn't think I'd have to, but here we go.

It's also arguable that homosexuality is condemmed by christianity. You can't blame a religion for the acts of its followers. And you can't blame all of its followers for the acts of few. Especially when (the book of swords) isn't something usually studied in depth by anyone other than extremists. 

So lets look at some politically unbiased facts. It's Ramadan. If he was actually extremely devoted to his religion (when we have sources stating otherwise) he wouldn't have done this during ramadan. Commiting a violent act during this holy period goes entirely against their religion and essentially is the same as a Christain saying "you know, Jesus wasn't real probably" its not something that someone EXTREMELY devoted to their religion would do.

Next, you seem to think that ALL muslims are exactly the same and follow the exact same teachings. Its also quite ironic then that there are so many lgbt muslims. Something that should theoretically be impossible acording to your racist bigoted statement.

And finally, there was no ISIS 911 call. This man was not "following his religion" do not use the death of 51 people in a hate crime to fuel your racist islamophobic agenda. This was a crime against gay men, very specifically at a gay bar on a night that said bar would be full of [email protected] people. If this was really a "hate-for-america" fueled attack, he would have targeted a more white venue wouldn't you think? Not to mention that ISIS's primary targets so far have been muslim people and there hasn't been any direct ISIS attacks in our country so far, so your hateful retoric goes right out the door, where it belongs.

 If he was really an extremist, this wouldn't have happened today. Period. If you're just going to outright say that ALL muslims are like this, then this would have happened a long time ago. There are millions of muslims in the world, more than almost every other religion. If they were all just "following their religion" you would be living in a fucking war zone. Your hateful assumtions of a culture that you know absolutely nothing about are worthless and only spread more hate.

Also, shut the fuck up about ~Libral Censorship~ For one, libral doesn't even mean what it was originally coined to mean anymore. Its just a throwaway word that people use to make their weak arguments sound stronger. And for two, telling people not to be hateful and racist of completely innocent people isn't a bad thing. Censorship isn't always a bad thing. Censorship can be defensive, censorship can be constructive. Censorship is how we started the fight against terrible, hateful people like the Nazis, ISIS and the KKK. Censorship is how we end hate. If you have a problem with that, you are a part of the problem.

I'm not going to be apologetic, and I'm not going to stand around while you sling your baseless opinions around like some kind of grade school bully. Take a minute to actually think about what you're assuming and you'll quickly see how fucking ignorant it is.


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## spotanjo3 (Jun 12, 2016)

daxtsu said:


> Source
> 
> When will it end? First Paris, then Belgium, now Orlando. In any case, give the fallen a moment of silence as you go about your morning/day/night.



When will it end ? NEVER. As long as false religions and corruptions. NEVER.


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## Joe88 (Jun 12, 2016)

People please behave yourselves and keep it civil, would rather not have this thread be yet another statistic on "this is why we can't have nice things" thread on gbatemp.


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## deishido (Jun 12, 2016)

TotalInsanity4 said:


> Is there a source on that? I listened to FOX news on the radio on the way home (shh it's the only station my car radio gets) and the anchors were all saying he shouted ALLAH AKBAR prior to pulling the trigger. I didn't believe it (mostly because of FOX's reputation), and if that's true it will kind of put my uncertainty to rest



Fox's reputation is certainly questionable. There are no sources other than fox, and the few sites that sourced them, that he actually said that. What I'm seeing is updated articles adding that bit of information, when it wasn't there before. Re-reading older articles dont mention it at all until the news that he was under investigation 3 years ago appeared. Eyewitness statements no various news sites dont ention it n the timeline of events at all. However, there are sources that this attack was unrelated to his faith, and were solely his own homophobia. Im on mobile, so I'm having trouble linking multiple sources. Heres one: http://www.towleroad.com/2016/06/omar-mateen/

Even if he was acting with religious cause, that doesn't give people any reason to suspect ALL muslims of being radical ISIS members, just as we don't suspect ALL Christians of being in the KKK. (Because neither statement is true)

---------------
Update: Connections to ISIS have been partially confirmed, a trustworthy sourcable link should be coming soon. Please remember that just because this one attack was perpetrated by a hateful extremist muslim, not all muslims are hateful or extremists (hint, most of them aren't) there were over 170 other shooting attacks this year alone, only two were caused by people of the Muslim faith. we can't push all the blame on an innocent group of people because of the acts of a few.


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## Lucifer666 (Jun 12, 2016)

Jao Chu said:


> Lol this thread is still on the first page and Islam apologetics are already chiming in. There is many passages in the Quran that state homesexual acts are a punishable act and sin. Hence why ISIS throws LBTQ of roofs etc. Judging by the assailants name, this man is Muslim and he was just following the instructions of the violent scripture called the Quran.
> 
> Wonder how long until the mods hode this post. *Cough* Liberal Censorship *cough*


Yes, Islamic extremism and fundamentalism is a problem, but Muslims as a whole are not

Both the Quran and the Bible explicitly define homosexual activity as being worthy of the death sentence. You see a lot of bigots from both religions as well as many others. Fact of the matter is the way to go about life isn't by condemning religion itself but by ensuring that religion is practised in a way that is commensurate with modern beliefs and expectations

Don't use a tragedy to spew further hatred


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## Argo (Jun 12, 2016)

@deishido 
That was actually a really solid point, I completely forgot about the Ramadan aspect.


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## spotanjo3 (Jun 12, 2016)

Another news:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry...da27fe4b0ced23ca85716?utm_hp_ref=queer-voices

No one murdered. Whew. Crazy and crazy.


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## tofast4u (Jun 12, 2016)

It will end when people have the courage to blame radical Islam and stop importing these scumbags over here.  Trump #2016


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## VinsCool (Jun 12, 2016)

tofast4u said:


> It will end when people have the courage to blame radical Islam and stop importing these scumbags over here.  Trump #2016


Wow. So much bias.


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## dimmidice (Jun 12, 2016)

deishido said:


> They were debunked, he made no such call.


got a source? BBC news is still saying he made the call. i tend to trust BBC news.


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## Argo (Jun 12, 2016)

tofast4u said:


> It will end when people have the courage to blame radical Islam and stop importing these scumbags over here.  Trump #2016


I hope you're joking.


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## TotalInsanity4 (Jun 12, 2016)

azoreseuropa said:


> Another news:
> 
> http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry...da27fe4b0ced23ca85716?utm_hp_ref=queer-voices
> 
> No one murdered. Whew. Crazy and crazy.


Yeah, I heard about that. The two events are unrelated, but unfortunately the entire nation needs to be on high alert this week

(For those that don't know, it's Pride Week, and angry Americans tend to think with their fists... or their firearms)


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## dimmidice (Jun 12, 2016)

Argo said:


> I hope you're joking.


he's not. you should see the donald trump subreddit. its bloody ridiculous. like i'm not a fan of islam at all, but they're basically just anti islam extremists.


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## rasputin (Jun 12, 2016)

it was a ritual sacrifice by the devil worshipping elite


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## Argo (Jun 12, 2016)

This is why I lose faith in humanity. Maybe I'll join up with Yil to do some sorcery shit and end the world.


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## deishido (Jun 12, 2016)

dimmidice said:


> got a source? BBC news is still saying he made the call. i tend to trust BBC news.


(Im leaving this here for reference, please see my update at the bottom)
Actually, I can' find a real source. That why I'm not believing it. All the sites claiming he did don't have any sources for the call itself. And unfortunately, even the better sites like BBC have been prone to misinformation recently. Journalists have been especially lax the last year and have been snagging info from other unsouced news articles in a vicious cycle to be the most "up-to-date"

911 calls are kept on record and can be sourced immediately after events unfold. The allegations that he made any isis claims don't have this source. I'm also seeing different sites making different claims of what exactly he said. Some claiming he said "allah akbar" "praise allah" and "this is for isis" to name a few. If he did, I would really like to see a source link. But until then, the only source we have is his family saying he wasn't particularly religious, but was extremely angry when he saw a gay couple kissing prior to the attack. It sounds like plain old homophobia to me.
*
Even if this was religious, (update, it was at least partially) lets not forget that islamic extremists are a vast minority of muslim people. They exist, they are dangerous, but they do not define all muslims. Just as the KKK does not define all Christians. And even if this attack was spurred by religion, it was a very specific attack on the LGBT community. Its also fair to mention that of the over 170 mass shooting events this year, only 2 were caused by muslim affiliated people.*

On a related note. The FDA has NOT lifted the anti-gay ban on gay men donating blood if they have had same-sex relationships in the last year (and this actually includes trans women too) Many donation centers in Orlando are also reporting that they are at stock. They can't hold any more at this time and they recommend returning later this evening or early tomorrow if you can.

Please offer any assistance you can during this tragedy, even if its donating in your own city. Its pride month, so there are many lgbt events going on around the country. This could happen again, please be cautious at any lgbt events. There has already been a reported would-be shooter at a parade in California (link posted by someone else a few post back) I doubt this will be the last of the attacks.

--------------------
Update: ISIS connections have been confirmed by a special agent on the scene at the time, 911 recording should be floating around soon.  Please remember that one ISIS affiliated muslim doesn't mean all muslims are ISIS. Blaming non-radical muslims and pushing them away only helps ISIS spread their agenda.


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## Luglige (Jun 13, 2016)

Hurts, They found some AK's in the gay pride parade also. ;~; Annoying that it was a Gay club. So close to home too.


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## The Catboy (Jun 13, 2016)

The fact that mass shootings in the US have become so frequent shows just how disturbed our "culture" has become.


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## vayanui8 (Jun 13, 2016)

It seems he likely was related to ISIS. Its being reported from most sources. At the very least ISIS has claimed they were behind it, although it is possible that they are doing it in order to make people more fearful. I wouldn't be surprised if the shooter in CA decided to attack after seeing this and thought he could pull it off too. Thank God nobody was killed there.


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## omgpwn666 (Jun 13, 2016)

I live only 2 hours away from Orlando. This hits close to home in more than one way. I feel so bad for the victims, and families. I hope the best for all of them.


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## TrapperKeeperX (Jun 13, 2016)

omgpwn666 said:


> I live only 2 hours away from Orlando. This hits close to home in more than one way. I feel so bad for the victims, and families. I hope the best for all of them.


I live in Florida too it's a scary thought I am still shaking up about it I live 2 - 2 1/2 hours away hell the shooter lived in the same county St. Lucie County as me now that's a scary thought I don't think I'm going to sleep tonight. I just hope it doesn't get the better of me, but I know we should be strong!


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## suctions (Jun 13, 2016)

I live about half hour from Orlando, so this is pretty scary. I've passed by that place before, too.


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## Feeling it! (Jun 13, 2016)

Jao Chu said:


> Lol this thread is still on the first page and Islam apologetics are already chiming in. There is many passages in the Quran that state homesexual acts are a punishable act and sin. Hence why ISIS throws LBTQ of roofs etc. Judging by the assailants name, this man is Muslim and he was just following the instructions of the violent scripture called the Quran.
> 
> Wonder how long until the mods hode this post. *Cough* Liberal Censorship *cough*


 Holy shit I just found someone with a brain on here.
 How is this possible?


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## TotalInsanity4 (Jun 13, 2016)

vayanui8 said:


> It seems he likely was related to ISIS. Its being reported from most sources. At the very least ISIS has claimed they were behind it, although it is possible that they are doing it in order to make people more fearful. I wouldn't be surprised if the shooter in CA decided to attack after seeing this and thought he could pull it off too. Thank God nobody was killed there.


ISIS would tell you they hit the tree in your backyard with lightning if it would make you more fearful of them


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## Tigran (Jun 13, 2016)

Feeling it! said:


> Holy shit I just found someone with a brain on here.
> How is this possible?



Are you a christian? Cause if so, your own book says I can stone you to death... so.. I wouldn't go about using their religion against them. Or you know.. all the other atrocities christians have done... Not to mention how the Christian god is a dick that has to compensate for something.

Hell.. the only good version of the Judo Christian god *and I guess Allah since they're the same damn guy* was created from 4 dinosaurs, 2 Mammals and a Dragon.


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## TotalInsanity4 (Jun 13, 2016)

Tigran said:


> Are you a christian? Cause if so, your own book says I can stone you to death... so.. I wouldn't go about using their religion against them. Or you know.. all the other atrocities christians have done... Not to mention how the Christian god is a dick that has to compensate for something.
> 
> Hell.. the only good version of the Judo Christian god *and I guess Allah since they're the same damn guy* was created from 4 dinosaurs, 2 Mammals and a Dragon.


I'M Christian and I largely agree with this lol


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## EarlAB (Jun 13, 2016)

I have such a sick mind. I thought the "shooting" was of sperm.
I feel bad now. And sad. 
Why do these kinds of people exist...especially me...?


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## Tigran (Jun 13, 2016)

EarlAB said:


> Why do these kinds of people exist?



Fear... They simply fear what they don't comprehend. And if they can't comprehend it they try to make things simpler... by killing what confuses them.


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## Haloman800 (Jun 13, 2016)

Daily reminder it was a Muslim born to Afghan "refugees"

Daily reminder he was a registered Democrat

Daily reminder future attacks can be prevented if you #VoteTrump in November.

My heart goes out to the victims and their families.


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## richardparker (Jun 13, 2016)

daxtsu said:


> Source
> 
> When will it end? First Paris, then Belgium, now Orlando. In any case, give the fallen a moment of silence as you go about your morning/day/night.


i do...i live in india...but what did they do to deserve that?


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## TotalInsanity4 (Jun 13, 2016)

Haloman800 said:


> Daily reminder it was a Muslim born to Afghan "refugees"
> 
> Daily reminder he was a registered Democrat
> 
> ...


Daily reminder that he was an American born citizen

Daily reminder that it is still currently unknown whether he had any connection to ISIS and that it does not seem as though the attack was religiously motivated

Daily reminder that the casualties could have been drastically reduced if the (terrifyingly large amount of) ammunition and weapons he was carrying had been checked and regulated

Daily reminder that using a literal terrorist attack to back up a political agenda makes you an asshole, regardless of how much you say you care for the victims after doing so


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## omgpwn666 (Jun 13, 2016)

I believe it's easier to blame the individual, and not their beliefs. I only say this since I know Christians, and Muslims who are not killing anyone. If the individual is an ass, then they do their own thing. Obviously we can blame their religion, but only a lunatic is gonna carry out what they believe their religion wants when it comes to hurting someone.


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## Haloman800 (Jun 13, 2016)

TotalInsanity4 said:


> *snip*



Nothing you said contradicted _anything_ I posted. Was he not a Muslim? Was he not born to Afghan refugees? Political correctness is _killing_ people.


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## Tigran (Jun 13, 2016)

And trump was born to a Scottish immigrant, and from German background who hates colored people. He's obviously a Nazi Scottish nationalist!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nationalist_terrorism


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## TotalInsanity4 (Jun 13, 2016)

Haloman800 said:


> Nothing you said contradicted _anything_ I posted. Was he not a Muslim? Was he not born to Afghan refugees? Political correctness is _killing_ people.



*Was he a Muslim? *Yes. But according to reports from his family and those close to him, not a very devout one. Certainly not one cut out for a Jihad
*Was he a Democrat? *Yes. Cool. You've established that people from both sides of the political can commit acts of terror. No one perfectly fits a demographic. Plus, this is the following he's attracted
*Was he born to Afghan refugees? *Yes. WHY DOES THAT MATTER. It was not even the refugees that committed the crime, it was their American born son. The parents have gone on record saying they were shocked and lament with the rest of America

Stop using an atrocity as a poor excuse to push xenophobia on us.


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## XavyrrVaati (Jun 13, 2016)

>wants to control guns
>>Islamic terrorists don't obey gun laws
>>>mobsters don't obey gun laws
>>>>people who kill people tend no obey the law inherently.

Did I mention that people who intend to kill people are inherently already breaking one of the most important laws? Why would they care about lesser laws?
Sometimes I wonder if they should be handed out more freely, after all, if half of that gay bar carried guns, this wouldn't have happened like it did. Try to shoot up a bar in Texas, I fucking dare you. You might get two, maybe three people before you look like a pin cushion. This happened in Florida, a state full of old people and hurricanes. Kinda reminds me of the Incredibles movie, where the antagonist wanted to give everyone powers so everyone would be equal. I feel like people would have a weaker tendency to shoot other people if they knew that at least half the people around them also had firearms.
On the flip side, I can see why people aren't exactly on-board with this. Lol.

Either way, this is terrible.


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## Haloman800 (Jun 13, 2016)

TotalInsanity4 said:


> *Was he a Muslim? *Yes.
> *Was he a Democrat? *Yes.
> *Was he born to Afghan refugees? *Yes.


Thanks for acknowledging reality. We have a pattern here, Muslims and "refugees"/their kids commit a disproportionate amount of crimes and terrorist attacks as opposed to the native population. Maybe we should stop these potential threats from entering our country until we figure out what's going on, hmm?

Also one point on "politicizing a tragedy", every time there's a shooting (including this one) regressive liberals will start shouting "Gun control!!!" even as the bodies are still warm (_even now) _and no one calls them out on it.


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## Tigran (Jun 13, 2016)

Haloman800 said:


> Nothing you said contradicted _anything_ I posted. Was he not a Muslim? Was he not born to Afghan refugees? Political correctness is _killing_ people.
> 
> Not to mention, if your christian, according to -your own damn book!- I could legaly kill you for numerious reasons, rape your daughter and then she is forced to marry me. Oh lets not forget that the glorious Judo Christian God committed genocide -twice-.
> 
> ...


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## XavyrrVaati (Jun 13, 2016)

Haloman800 said:


> Thanks for acknowledging reality. We have a pattern here, Muslims and "refugees"/their kids commit a disproportionate amount of crimes and terrorist attacks as opposed to the native population. Maybe we should stop these potential threats from entering our country until we figure out what's going on, hmm?
> 
> Also one point on "politicizing a tragedy", every time there's a shooting (including this one) regressive liberals will start shouting "Gun control!!!" even as the bodies are still warm (_even now) _and no one calls them out on it.


Yes let's judge everyone by their uncontrolled characteristics. All blond people must be superior, non? You spew poison. You are innocent until proven guilty.


----------



## TotalInsanity4 (Jun 13, 2016)

Haloman800 said:


> Thanks for acknowledging reality.


Thanks for pulling a FOX and removing all of the information that doesn't prove your point


> Also one point on "politicizing a tragedy", every time there's a shooting (including this one) regressive liberals will start shouting "Gun control!!!" even as the bodies are still warm (_even now) _and no one calls them out on it.


Kinda difficult to do considering that in 2016 alone there have already been 134 mass shootings. If we waited to talk about it until there wasn't one then it would literally never get talked about


----------



## Feeling it! (Jun 13, 2016)

Does anyone else remember that church shooting that was really just a FBI training drill? this is so fake it hurts.


----------



## Tigran (Jun 13, 2016)

Haloman800 said:


> Thanks for acknowledging reality. We have a pattern here, Muslims and "refugees"/their kids commit a disproportionate amount of crimes and terrorist attacks as opposed to the native population. Maybe we should stop these potential threats from entering our country until we figure out what's going on, hmm?
> 
> Also one point on "politicizing a tragedy", every time there's a shooting (including this one) regressive liberals will start shouting "Gun control!!!" even as the bodies are still warm (_even now) _and no one calls them out on it.



Actually no.. White Christians make up the majority, but they arn't called "Terrorists" or they get no coverage at all. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2011_Dearborn_mosque_bombing_plot.

As for the gun issue. Sorry no. There is no -more guns means that this will happen less-. That simply is not true as stated and shown by numbers time and time and time again.

2+2 = does not even 7... Now matter how many time gun nuts say it does. 

Also the US is the -only- country that has this particular issue. And I will also point out.


----------



## Feeling it! (Jun 13, 2016)

Tigran said:


> Actually no.. White Christians make up the majority, but they arn't called "Terrorists" or they get no coverage at all. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2011_Dearborn_mosque_bombing_plot.
> 
> As for the gun issue. Sorry no. There is no -more guns means that this will happen less-. That simply is not true as stated and shown by numbers time and time and time again.
> 
> ...


You are so obvious that it hurts dude.


----------



## Fugelmir (Jun 13, 2016)

Typical muslim behaviour.  I'm a teacher in Riyadh, Saudi Arabia.  Members of the Saud royalty here are openly gay and 20 feet away from the palace, they execute commoners for daring to behave the same way.


----------



## Tigran (Jun 13, 2016)

Feeling it! said:


> You are so obvious that it hurts dude.



Why? Cause I use actual facts? I link my sources and I'm not "Oooh! The boogy man is going to come kill me in my sleep?" Seriously.. most adults are just like kids, always believing there is a monster under their bed.


----------



## Tigran (Jun 13, 2016)

I am good... otherwise you wouldn't have to resort to such a pathetic cliche of a response. Simple fact is, you are scared.... and like all scared whiners, you look for a way to simplify things. And you do that by finding people who are slightly different than you and attack them. 

Again.. You want to claim this is islamic, there are plenty of christian or other religious terrorist activities, despite what fox news tells you.


----------



## Feeling it! (Jun 13, 2016)

Tigran said:


> I am good... otherwise you wouldn't have to resort to such a pathetic cliche of a response. Simple fact is, you are scared.... and like all scared whiners, you look for a way to simplify things. And you do that by finding people who are slightly different than you and attack them.
> 
> Again.. You want to claim this is islamic, there are plenty of christian or other religious terrorist activities, despite what fox news tells you.


I edited my post because I posted something meant for the mods to read.
Thanks though for piling onto it with your throw away account.....but either way I want this to get deleted since this kinda shit is what voids the post count.


----------



## TotalInsanity4 (Jun 13, 2016)

Fugelmir said:


> Typical muslim behaviour.  I'm a teacher in Riyadh, Saudi Arabia.  Members of the Saud royalty here are openly gay and 20 feet away from the palace, they execute commoners for daring to behave the same way.


But... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




...


----------



## dpad_5678 (Jun 13, 2016)

1. Most Muslims are NOT terrorists, you gross racists!

2. Anyone Anti LGBT will burn in hell hopefully.


----------



## XavyrrVaati (Jun 13, 2016)

Tigran said:


> As for the gun issue. Sorry no. There is no -more guns means that this will happen less-. That simply is not true as stated and shown by numbers time and time and time again.


Source please? Guns are extra effective because of their design. People can't really defend against a gun unless they also have a gun. If you walk into a room with half of the people carrying guns, and fire into it, you are very likely to get killed before you kill the half with guns. If you walk into a room and nobody has a gun and you open fire, the odds are in your favor. _Mathematically._


Tigran said:


> _2+2 = does not even 7_... Now matter how many time gun nuts say it does.


I'm not a gun nut, and I'm pretty good at math. So this statement is invalid lol.

And as stated as before, gun laws don't stop people who obtain guns illegally from getting guns illegally. :'v


----------



## ned (Jun 13, 2016)

It amazes me how nobody stop to think that own goverments setup stuff
like this to push their own agendas and further cause hatred among
the people, they did it in the 20's and still goes on today all goverements hire stooges and anyone can claim a belief and everybody believes this current isis bs.


----------



## Feeling it! (Jun 13, 2016)

TotalInsanity4 said:


> But...
> 
> 
> 
> ...


(insert sad air horns)

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------



ned said:


> It amazes me how nobody stop to think that own goverments setup stuff
> like to push their own agendas and further cause hatred among
> the people, they did it in the 20's and still goes on today all goverements hire stooges and anyone can claim a belief and everybody believes this current isis bs.


This is what my post was normally about before I got trolled.
The church shooting was openly claimed to be a police drill.......and other "shootings"


----------



## Fugelmir (Jun 13, 2016)

TotalInsanity4 said:


> But...
> 
> 
> 
> ...




Yes, it is the summer now.  The schools aren't in session.  With the intense heat, the wealthy who attend school generally flee to their other homes in Belize or Dubai.  I get a few months off to return home until mid September.


----------



## TotalInsanity4 (Jun 13, 2016)

Fugelmir said:


> Yes, it is the summer now.  The schools aren't in session.  With the intense heat, the wealthy who attend school generally flee to their other homes in Belize or Dubai.  I get a few months off to return home until mid September.


Ah, ok


----------



## Tigran (Jun 13, 2016)

XavyrrVaati said:


> Source please? Guns are extra effective because of their design. People can't really defend against a gun unless they also have a gun. If you walk into a room with half of the people carrying guns, and fire into it, you are very likely to get killed before you kill the half with guns. If you walk into a room and nobody has a gun and you open fire, the odds are in your favor. _Mathematically._


https://www.theguardian.com/science/blog/2013/mar/25/guns-protection-national-rifle-association

http://www.factcheck.org/2012/12/gun-rhetoric-vs-gun-facts/

http://www.livescience.com/51446-guns-do-not-deter-crime.html




> And as stated as before, gun laws don't stop people who obtain guns illegally from getting guns illegally. :'v



The law against Murder and Theft and Rape doesn't stop them... so they should be legal?


Hell, trained soldiers still have a problem with Friendly Fire, and you expect un-trained yokels to be able to do better?

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2010/oct/22/american-troops-friendly-fire-iraq


----------



## Viri (Jun 13, 2016)

The Reddit news section was censoring the fuck out of post and banning users left and right, it was funny. https://www.reddit.com/r/news/comments/4nql8f/orlando_nightclub_shooting_megathread/

In the end, the ask Reddit section had to be used as a mega thread.
https://www.reddit.com/r/AskReddit/comments/4nqnrm/breaking_news_orlando_nightclub_massshooting/


----------



## Feeling it! (Jun 13, 2016)

Tigran said:


> https://www.theguardian.com/science/blog/2013/mar/25/guns-protection-national-rifle-association
> 
> http://www.factcheck.org/2012/12/gun-rhetoric-vs-gun-facts/
> 
> ...


I see what you mean there at the end and this is something worth going over kindly. 
There are 2 sides to that with 2 good points.
1 side says.... If guns are legal then law abiding people can get them to protect their homes.
1 other side says.... If anyone can get a gun then someone can at any point turn into a criminal. 
1 says that George Washington said that the end of the country would be when we lost our right to bear arms.
1 says that if the country has the power to destroy itself then it will.           
which one do we choose?


----------



## Tigran (Jun 13, 2016)

Also, this guy used a AK *which he bought legally* so even if anyone else there did have a good, it would have been too late. Again I have to post this picture.


----------



## brickmii82 (Jun 13, 2016)

TotalInsanity4 said:


> I'M Christian and I largely agree with this lol


I'm a Christian, and I highly disagree with this. Among the hardcore bible-thumpers who tend to rely on the law of the Old Testament, there ARE a few of us who'd rather focus on the life of Jesus and his teachings as a reference. 2 laws come into mind here. "Love thy God with all thy heart" and "love thy neighbor as ye love thyself". Not to mention "he without sin may cast first stone". Let's not forget, according to the gospel, he associated himself with people who would likely be considered the "outcasts and criminals" for lack of better wording. Extremism and institutionalizations have done terrible things, and that can't be denied though.

My heart goes out to the family, and communities affected by this. My brother is gay and I'm a proud groomsman in his wedding. I hope I never have to suffer news like this involving him and his fiancé.


----------



## Feeling it! (Jun 13, 2016)

Tigran said:


> Also, this guy used a AK *which he bought legally* so even if anyone else there did have a good, it would have been too late. Again I have to post this picture.


Well what if this country was like Switzerland where everyone has a gun? do you think he would of been stopped or not? (genuine curious about your answer)


----------



## XavyrrVaati (Jun 13, 2016)

Tigran said:


> st Murder and Theft and Rape doesn't stop them... so they should be legal?
> 
> 
> Hell, trained soldiers still have a problem with Friendly Fire, and you expect un-trained yokels to be able to do better?
> ...



I'm not saying it would happen less, I'm saying it would not happen as long.

Also why would you give a gun to an untrained person? I'm trained to cut with butcher knives by a butcher, and I still occasionally cut myself. Should knives be illegal too? They're really really sharp!
I don't think most people should have guns, but making them harder to get won't help anything.

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------

Lmao, don't generalize gun control and one of the best guns for killing ever invented. No citizen has a need for a fucking AK-47. Purchasing a gun specially designed to mow people down is a terrible thing to do, let alone it be legal.


----------



## Tigran (Jun 13, 2016)

XavyrrVaati said:


> I'm not saying it would happen less, I'm saying it would not happen as long.
> 
> Also why would you give a gun to an untrained person?



But that's the thing.. a large portion of gun owners are not trained at all. If training was part of what it took to get a gun, I'd be all for it. But it's not. It's actually easier for me in Georgia to go to a gunshow and buy a random gun, than it is for me to get my ID renewed.

And again... This picture kinda says it all.

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------



Feeling it! said:


> Well what if this country was like Switzerland where everyone has a gun? do you think he would of been stopped or not? (genuine curious about your answer)



However again.. This requires training and takes more than walking into a gun store/show to buy it. 

I'm not saying we should get guns, cause it never work.. But it should be a hell of a lot harder than buying a car.


----------



## Viri (Jun 13, 2016)

Twitter is such a hateful place!

http://i.imgur.com/cE85GQQ.jpg


----------



## TotalInsanity4 (Jun 13, 2016)

Feeling it! said:


> I see what you mean there at the end and this is something worth going over kindly.
> There are 2 sides to that with 2 good points.
> 1 side says.... If guns are legal then law abiding people can get them to protect their homes.
> 1 other side says.... If anyone can get a gun then someone can at any point turn into a criminal.
> ...


I've done a bit of research on this, and I think I've found the best compromise that I'll ever find by myself:

A control method composed of 5 separate parts based entirely on accountability that are 100% enforceable

1) All weapons need to be registered
.     Huge shocker there (not), if the gun can be tied back to you it is significantly less likely that you will use it in a crime.
2) All ammunition needs to require a gun license and ownership of a registered firearm.
.     "Buh, buh, the Second Amendment!" See point 1. Can your friends use it? Sure. But the purchase can be tied back to you.
3) All weapons need to be micro-chipped
.     "Sorry officer, I lost my gun ages ago" "Did you report it missing?" "......." Micro-chipping would help with locating firearms and determining if the right gun is in the hands it's supposed to be in, which ties into...
4) You DO NOT allow anyone to handle your firearm without your permission
.     Self explanatory. If the weapon is in the wrong hands and is not reported, the original owner is to be convicted as an accessory to whatever crime was committed with the weapon.
5) If you are in or near a gun free zone and see a weapon, REPORT IT IMMEDIATELY
.     I have read incident after incident where a student who carried a firearm on a college campus is only given a light slap on the wrist. This is DANGEROUS. Not only does this show that officials will be lenient about enforcing gun laws, but it also means that if there is a hostage and/or shooting situation, you will most likely end up hindering first responder action if they cannot tell who the shooter is, potentially causing more unnecessary bloodshed



brickmii82 said:


> I'm a Christian, and I highly disagree with this. Among the hardcore bible-thumpers who tend to rely on the law of the Old Testament, there ARE a few of us who'd rather focus on the life of Jesus and his teachings as a reference. 2 laws come into mind here. "Love thy God with all thy heart" and "love thy neighbor as ye love thyself". Not to mention "he without sin may cast first stone". Let's not forget, according to the gospel, he associated himself with people who would likely be considered the "outcasts and criminals" for lack of better wording. Extremism and institutionalizations have done terrible things, and that can't be denied though.
> 
> My heart goes out to the family, and communities affected by this. My brother is gay and I'm a proud groomsman in his wedding. I hope I never have to suffer news like this involving him and his fiancé.


And I also agree with this :3 This is the ideology that I base my life around, actually


----------



## Tigran (Jun 13, 2016)

Yeah... Jesus only had one lesson, "Don't be a dick" shame most Vocal Christians can't follow that rule, instead turn to murdering doctors and hating others.

BTW... The hating on abortion started just because Christians couldn't hate on blacks anymore *no.. I'm serious*

http://www.slate.com/blogs/xx_facto...ort_for_segregation_not_against_abortion.html

http://www.patheos.com/blogs/dispatches/2014/05/30/the-christian-right-started-over-segregation/

http://billmoyers.com/2014/07/17/when-southern-baptists-were-pro-choice/


----------



## vayanui8 (Jun 13, 2016)

It completely disgusts me how many people have turned this into a way of pushing their political agenda. Completely disrespectful to the people who died


----------



## Tigran (Jun 13, 2016)

vayanui8 said:


> It completely disgusts me how many people have turned this into a way of pushing their political agenda. Completely disrespectful to the people who died



Weather you like it or not, it's inevitable, if only because we have problems with the same things happening again and again in this country. From the religious nuts in all religions, to those that fear any different people coming out of the woodwork to profess how right they where that we should fear someone.

Also.. these issues have to be looked at? If not now.. when?


----------



## Jao Chu (Jun 13, 2016)

Feeling it! said:


> Holy shit I just found someone with a brain on here.
> How is this possible?



People like us who actually have common sense are in grave danger of extinction, unfortunately. 

TRUMP 2016!


----------



## TotalInsanity4 (Jun 13, 2016)

Jao Chu said:


> People like us who actually have common sense are in grave danger of extinction, unfortunately.
> 
> TRUMP 2016!


Yikes


----------



## Glyptofane (Jun 13, 2016)

Tigran said:


> Again I have to post this picture.


Megatron actually transforms into a gun though.


----------



## Deleted User (Jun 13, 2016)

Mikemk said:


> There were murders in Aurora Colorado.  My point was that the OP is ignoring everything that happened before Paris.


The media likes to forget the stuff that they don't care about. Or doesn't point their agenda.


----------



## Tigran (Jun 13, 2016)

clownb said:


> Megatron actually transforms into a gun though.



That goes to show you miss the whole point of the image.


----------



## Glyptofane (Jun 13, 2016)

Tigran said:


> That goes to show you miss the whole point of the image.


That you can only buy assault rifles in US? Still seems like a pretty lame piece of amateur liberal propaganda. In the cartoon he is a laser cannon, the toy is a pistol, but why use him at all?

Edit: Galvatron was the cannon. Sorry, it's been a while.


----------



## Tigran (Jun 13, 2016)

Okay.. The fact you can go into a store and legally buy an assault rifle... but you can't buy a toy -because- it turns into a realistic looking gun doesn't strike you as stupid?


----------



## Glyptofane (Jun 13, 2016)

I never realized the toy was banned. The wording of the image doesn't make the point immediately obvious. Like, to me, it looked like you could only buy ARs in US, but you could buy Megatron anywhere... in the 80s.


----------



## Jiro2 (Jun 13, 2016)

LoganK93 said:


> IT IS 2016 AND WE ARE STILL KILLING OVER TRIVIAL SHIT LIKE HOMOSEXUALITY, RELIGION, AND SKIN TONE.



No, it is 2016 and _they_ are killing over such things.

It's absurd to say that when an ISIS-inspired terrorist kills gays that "we" are killing gays.

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------



Tigran said:


> Okay.. The fact you can go into a store and legally buy an assault rifle... but you can't buy a toy -because- it turns into a realistic looking gun doesn't strike you as stupid?



You cannot go into a store and legally buy an assault rifle, despite media misreporting.


----------



## Glyptofane (Jun 13, 2016)

I really think that gays should be arming themselves and carrying after this. That is their right.

Also, it's *current year* lol


----------



## Jiro2 (Jun 13, 2016)

clownb said:


> I really think that gays should be arming themselves and carrying after this. That is their right.



Florida law doesn't permit carrying a weapon in an establishment that serves alcohol.  The club was basically a gun-free zone; no chance for any of the customers to arm themselves.

If you're suggesting that Florda gun laws be changed so that the gays in clubs there could arm themselves, that's fair enough.


----------



## Glyptofane (Jun 13, 2016)

Gun free zones don't work. Most frequently, these are the places most targeted by "mass shooters". So in this case, it may have not have been their right really. This sick terrorist goon could have been stopped quickly and a literal haji pincushion if not though.


----------



## Tigran (Jun 13, 2016)

Jiro2 said:


> No, it is 2016 and _they_ are killing over such things.
> 
> It's absurd to say that when an ISIS-inspired terrorist kills gays that "we" are killing gays.
> 
> ...



Oh yeah? http://www.impactguns.com/ak47-rifles.aspx


----------



## Nirmonculus (Jun 13, 2016)

As long as people like blaming others it won't stop. As long as people divide themselves by color, race, religion, sexuality, and whatever reason. It won't stop.
Damn 170 mass shootings in a year?! Is that only in the US? That's shocking! If this isn't related to any terrorist attack from outside the US then would it be safe to assume that this is a symptom of a sick society?


----------



## Glyptofane (Jun 13, 2016)

I don't want to be one of those assholes who politicizes a tragedy, but this will help Trump.

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------



Nirmonculus said:


> If this isn't related to any terrorist attack from outside the US then would it be safe to assume that this is a symptom of a sick society?


It is though. The father of this creep was running for president of Afghanistan.


----------



## Tigran (Jun 13, 2016)

clownb said:


> I don't want to be one of those assholes who politicizes a tragedy, but this will help Trump.
> 
> --------------------- MERGED ---------------------------
> 
> ...



Source?


----------



## Glyptofane (Jun 13, 2016)

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...-even-tried-to-run-for-the-afghan-presidency/


----------



## EmanueleBGN (Jun 13, 2016)

Years ago, US have destabilized the Middle East giving money to "partisans" in Libya, Syria and other Countries. (In '70s US gave money also to Bin Laden for fight against USSR in Afghanistan).
Now these "partisans" founded a State (ISIS) and searching adept all around the world for a Jihad (holy war) because they want to make every country under the Muslim religion and many Muslims or go to fight in Middle East or fight alone in other Countries (France, Belgium, Italy, China...).
So: your fault, US Governament and EU allies.
Gheddafi and President Assad could controlled all of these rebels but now that they are funded from Saudi Arabia and other organizations they can buy weapons, pay mercenaries, legitimize attacks in our Countries and show that the war is just and victorious.
This must not be seen as an action against gays but as another piece of the Jihad puzzle: US and EU Countries have foreign fighters on their territory.
So, the fool Obanana must not say "an attack against gay" but an "islamic terroristic attack" and stop to starts wars all around the war.


----------



## Glyptofane (Jun 13, 2016)

It's not US... we are a proxy golem for the vampires in Israel.  everyone knows that now.


----------



## brickmii82 (Jun 13, 2016)

EmanueleBGN said:


> Years ago, US have destabilized the Middle East giving money to "partisans" in Libya, Syria and other Countries. (In '70s US gave money also to Bin Laden for fight against USSR in Afghanistan).
> Now these "partisans" founded a State (ISIS) and searching adept all around the world for a Jihad (holy war) because they want to make every country under the Muslim religion and many Muslims or go to fight in Middle East or fight alone in other Countries (France, Belgium, Italy, China...).
> So: your fault, US Governament and EU allies.
> Gheddafi and President Assad could controlled all of these rebels but now that they are funded from Saudi Arabia and other organizations they can buy weapons, pay mercenaries, legitimize attacks in our Countries and show that the war is just and victorious.
> ...


Genocide, civil war, seizure of territories, I'd hardly call the region stable to begin with. Let alone find western govts to blame. I'll acknowledge we played a part, but ultimately you have to hold the people who "pulled the trigger" accountable.


----------



## Glyptofane (Jun 13, 2016)

The opposite of the insane shit they tell us is true. Iran, Syria, Lebanon, Palestine are the good guys.  Turkey and the Saudis are insane creeps working with the Zionists.


----------



## Gingerbread Crumb (Jun 13, 2016)

To all the idiots trying to protect islam.


----------



## brickmii82 (Jun 13, 2016)

Gingerbread Crumb said:


> To all the idiots trying to protect islam.



Wanted to try and defend Islam, but this kinda spelled it out and broke my heart...
https://www.thereligionofpeace.com/pages/quran/homosexuality.aspx
Good video. This'll get what you're conveying across better though, as it has verifiable passages from the Quran.


----------



## Tigran (Jun 13, 2016)

Again... the Christian bible also says I can stone you all to death because of the clothes you are wearing.

People of all religions need to read their own damn books.


----------



## Judas18 (Jun 13, 2016)

It hurts to see my community brutally murdered for being who they were born to be. One day people will wake up and realise that gays aren't abominations deserving of death. We're normal people who just want to live our lives.


----------



## Tigran (Jun 13, 2016)

clownb said:


> https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...-even-tried-to-run-for-the-afghan-presidency/



I have not read it yet.. but thank you.

And why is no one talking about the White guy that was arrested *But apperantly not a terrorist* for having three assault rifles, bomb makings on his way to tear up a gay pride parade?

Oh yeah, because he's a white guy named James... So obviously no matter what he does he can't be a "Terrorist"


----------



## Deleted User (Jun 13, 2016)

I swear to fucking christ if YIL RUINS THIS THREAD


----------



## zezzo (Jun 13, 2016)

azoreseuropa said:


> When will it end ? NEVER. As long as false religions and corruptions. NEVER.


False religions? No one wants your disrespect.


----------



## Tigran (Jun 13, 2016)

I just want to point out that "Allah" and the "Judo Christian God" are the same dude.

The same dude who committed genocide twice, and got pissy when he felt humans got to close to him, and depending on your demonination may have committed insest.

Oh, and Jesus would have to be transgendered as he wouldn't have had the biological ingredients to have the correct chromosomes to be male.


----------



## Luglige (Jun 13, 2016)

Fugelmir said:


> Typical muslim behaviour.  I'm a teacher in Riyadh, Saudi Arabia.  Members of the Saud royalty here are openly gay and 20 feet away from the palace, they execute commoners for daring to behave the same way.


Muslim people aren't a race its a religon! GET YOUR FRICKING FACTS STRAIGHT!
Second, as for @Tigran Stop flamebaiting please. Just cause you're an oldie doesn't give you the rights to break rules.
Learn how to Temp kiddies, kthxbye

Also listen, please, Religon isn't what we're talking about. We're talking about the rights and the destruction of homesexual people. We don't need to hear your christain crap. Listen, I'm christain. Ok. But listen, if you want this fricking crap on wall to end. We need to focus on Terriosts. Also, In the islam side. As I am not bias to ANY party. I will say that no one should be judged by humans. They should be judged by the god they believe in. And,  finnally. Don't get the idea if you're muslim you're a terriost! Christains can be terriosts. Ever heard the term "Don't drink the koolaid" Yeah that came from a mass suicide in Africa from a CHRISTAIN EXTREMISTS! So please stop.


----------



## Abu_Senpai (Jun 13, 2016)

Luglige said:


> Muslim people aren't a race its a religon! GET YOUR FRICKING FACTS STRAIGHT!
> Second, as for @Tigran Stop flamebaiting please. Just cause you're an oldie doesn't give you the rights to break rules.
> Learn how to Temp kiddies, kthxbye
> 
> Also listen, please, Religion isn't what we're talking about. We're talking about the rights and the destruction of homesexual people. We don't need to hear your Christian crap. Listen, I'm Christian. Ok. But listen, if you want this fricking crap on wall to end. We need to focus on Terriosts. Also, In the islam side. As I am not bias to ANY party. I will say that no one should be judged by humans. They should be judged by the god they believe in. And,  finnally. Don't get the idea if you're muslim you're a terriost! Christains can be terriosts. Ever heard the term "Don't drink the koolaid" Yeah that came from a mass suicide in Africa from a CHRISTAIN EXTREMISTS! So please stop.




100% Agree, We(I.E Islam and Everyone else) should work towards dealing with our common enemy which is ISIS. This isnt a Muslim problem anymore(since ISIS is killing everyone even Muslims) and if we want it to stop we should unit as a species AKA The Human Race and work towards destroying ISIS or else this will NEVER stop.

Granted even when we chop of the snakes head, there still will be "Terrorists" but they wont be coming at us 247 like they currently are everywhere. Godamn it first Paris and now back to America. Whos next? how many more have to die before the governments and the people of the world realize that instead of bickering on forums we should let our voice be heard and force the governments to go into Syria and other areas held by ISIS and wipe them out. Al Qaeda and the Taliban too. Kill them all the time kill them all. Scum of the earth who deface a persons religion dont deserve to live. They have twisted the teachings of the Quraan to the extent where they have enough justifications to declare themselves as a freaking Caliphate. So i say unite and kill them all.(The terrorists that is)


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## ComeTurismO (Jun 13, 2016)

I was truly saddened to hear what happened yesterday in Orlando. A day before this tragedy, a talented girl was shot to death on stage; and a day after, people going out to have fun had no idea they were being murdered. 

I, as a Muslim, condemn this act. Yes, I admit it--my religion condemns homosexuality. But this Islamic law does not make sense to me, or to any of my other Muslim friends, and family. Why? Because our religion asks us to love, not to hate. What this disgusting fellow Mateen did, was truly unacceptable; and I hope he's in hell right now. Many of us regular, non-extreme Muslims view homosexuality as a natural thing people are born with; it's not a choice. I didn't choose to be straight, I just feel attracted to people of the opposite gender.  I and over a billion of Muslims do not represent the terrorists who think they're doing the right thing; in other words--think of it like a classroom; where everyone gets punished for what one or two people did.  Every single student didn't misbehave, it was only the minority who reside in Muslim countries. They're not Muslim--many people have wrong interpretations of Islam. In fact, real Muslims themselves have to still analyze the Quran. There's more to learn off of it; half of us reading it don't even know what is being said. The translations you all may find on the internet are very inaccurate; this religious book dates back to over a thousand years ago. We live in a new generation, new beliefs, new thoughts. Some live in the past, but we need to live in the future.


To really learn about Islam, don't look at CNN, FOX, Google, or some other source of the internet. The real source is at mosques and scholars. I am a Muslim who is not an extremist.

EDIT: I forgot to mention, victims of ISIS and other asshole terrorist groups are Muslims mostly. If you look in Muslim countries, many people are murdered every day, people are scared of them; they can't go outside and they have to live under so much extreme laws. Countries like Canada or the U.S, you'd see a lot of them living lives happily opposite to how they appear in those Muslim countries.


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## Lucifer666 (Jun 13, 2016)

XavyrrVaati said:


> >wants to control guns
> >>Islamic terrorists don't obey gun laws
> >>>mobsters don't obey gun laws
> >>>>people who kill people tend no obey the law inherently.
> ...



JFC this is an invalid comparison. When murder is criminalised, a perpetrator can still violate that law by free will (and face consequences.) Purchasing guns when it's illegal isn't just breaking the law; it's difficult to do. Guns have been illegal where I live since the country was formed and I have never seen one in my life. There has never been a shooting here. I don't even think coppers are armed. Every murder in the past decade (which  is a VERY small number in total) has been a 1:1 stabbing. A lot less people are dead. This stuff works. In the case of the US it would have to be phased out but that's doable, especially since legal arms can be traced back to their owners.


Haloman800 said:


> Thanks for acknowledging reality. We have a pattern here, Muslims and "refugees"/their kids commit a disproportionate amount of crimes and terrorist attacks as opposed to the native population. Maybe we should stop these potential threats from entering our country until we figure out what's going on, hmm?
> 
> Also one point on "politicizing a tragedy", every time there's a shooting (including this one) regressive liberals will start shouting "Gun control!!!" even as the bodies are still warm (_even now) _and no one calls them out on it.



Lots of studies investigate the phenomenon of perceiving more of something than there truly are if you hate them. Statistically speaking, white Christian men commit such crimes at MUCH higher rates than Islamic fundamentalists and extremists. It's just that, when that shit happens, no one's pointing at or associating it to their race or religion, and suddenly it's all about "but he was a lone wolf" or "he was mentally ill", rather than the chants of terrorism that come with crimes committed by a Muslim. Besides, this guy was an American citizen, born and raised in the US and detached from his religion. I'm not trying to turn the focus of this tragedy to Muslims because at the end of the day its LGBT youth who were murdered, but for crying out loud if you're gonna use this as an opportunity to bash Muslims on the whole rather than just agree that there's scum in every ethnic and racial group, it's not something I can let slide.

Anyway, back on-topic RIP to the 50+ lives lost. I've been following one of the survivors on Twitter and it sounds like so heavy load a to bear, more than anyone should have to deal with. A hate crime of the lowest sort.


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## Jack Daniels (Jun 13, 2016)

mass murder doesn't have to be terrorism since terrorism has to have a greater goal... mass shooting can be just a one mans show on meds, while a terrorist does so to spread either fear or campaign for a groep of people that feel pressurized.


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## Fugelmir (Jun 13, 2016)

These honor killings just reinforce the incompatibility of Islam and western culture with its rule of law.

Muslims almost unilaterally despise homosexuals.  Al Jazeera and the mainstream muslim media laud this as a resounding success -- even my own colleagues.  It's very interesting because homosexuality is steeply on the rise, even in places where it is absolutely a death sentence to be discovered.  

And also, this guy may have had mental health issues, but don't play down the qu'ran's repeated disdain and intolerance of homosexuality, jews and anyone else who doesn't fit into their prophet mohammed-esque ideal muslim persona.  There's no doubt in my mind that Islam is the primary cause of this man's blind hatred of homosexuals.


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## TotalInsanity4 (Jun 13, 2016)

clownb said:


> It is though. The father of this creep was running for president of Afghanistan.


That fact alone doesn't associate him with a terrorist organization, though. The father has said that he's horrified that the incident happened and has basically said nothing to even recognize his son since, let alone validate him. "Normal" extremist behavior would be ignoring the tragedy, blaming the cops for his death, saying he was proud of his son, etc.


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## Gingerbread Crumb (Jun 13, 2016)

Tigran said:


> Again... the Christian bible also says I can stone you all to death because of the clothes you are wearing.
> 
> People of all religions need to read their own damn books.


I am criticising islam here not Christianity. Your sentence has no value here.


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## codezer0 (Jun 13, 2016)

Even though I'm currently living in Arizona, Orlando is my childhood and spiritual home.

Thankfully, none of my friends were in the area where this was going on, and have checked out safe. Even so, this hurts me internally.

I do have a friend that lives about five minutes away from where that incident occurred. At least I was able to confirm he was okay, and find out more of what actually happened.


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## Argo (Jun 13, 2016)

Fugelmir said:


> Muslims almost unilaterally despise homosexuals.
> There's no doubt in my mind that Islam is the primary cause of this man's blind hatred of homosexuals.


*cringing intensifies*
I honestly don't even care if the second part is right, this is just pathetic to look at.


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## Blaze163 (Jun 13, 2016)

I hope whatever god these people worship is as ashamed of them as I am. Every time I see someone killing in the name of their god, all I see in my head is god sat on a cloud looking down on them yelling 'I said no such thing you fucking lunatic'. Makes me sick to my stomach to see such ridiculous intolerance based on something that some random guy claiming to be special may or may not have said a thousand years ago that everyone took way too seriously. 

Here's the thing; you claim your 'saviour' or 'prophet' or whatever says homosexuality is a sin. I say it's not. I say I'm special in some way too. Who do you believe? I have just as much evidence for my point of view and my claim to being special as anyone else, IE: none whatsofuckingever. So the only difference is that the other point of view is in an old book. The fuck difference does that make? Again, none whatsofuckingever. The only difference is that I don't go around oppressing and murdering people.


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## brickmii82 (Jun 13, 2016)

You know, I JUST watched a documentary about the Orlando Magic and their induction into the NBA, along with their most successful years. Shaquille Oneal, and Penny Hardaway both said that was their favorite city they've played for, and the community there was really special. 
Also, after thinking about it, how did this guy make it through the door? Here in Phoenix most clubs/bars have armed security at the entry point. They pat you down and wand you before entry, while checking your ID. Every once in awhile someone sneaks a small pistol past, but a gaudy rifle wouldn't be missed.


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## Luglige (Jun 13, 2016)

Don Abu said:


> 100% Agree, We(I.E Islam and Everyone else) should work towards dealing with our common enemy which is ISIS. This isnt a Muslim problem anymore(since ISIS is killing everyone even Muslims) and if we want it to stop we should unit as a species AKA The Human Race and work towards destroying ISIS or else this will NEVER stop.
> 
> Granted even when we chop of the snakes head, there still will be "Terrorists" but they wont be coming at us 247 like they currently are everywhere. Godamn it first Paris and now back to America. Whos next? how many more have to die before the governments and the people of the world realize that instead of bickering on forums we should let our voice be heard and force the governments to go into Syria and other areas held by ISIS and wipe them out. Al Qaeda and the Taliban too. Kill them all the time kill them all. Scum of the earth who deface a persons religion dont deserve to live. They have twisted the teachings of the Quraan to the extent where they have enough justifications to declare themselves as a freaking Caliphate. So i say unite and kill them all.(The terrorists that is)


Someone gets me!



ComeTurismO said:


> I was truly saddened to hear what happened yesterday in Orlando. A day before this tragedy, a talented girl was shot to death on stage; and a day after, people going out to have fun had no idea they were being murdered.
> 
> I, as a Muslim, condemn this act. Yes, I admit it--my religion condemns homosexuality. But this Islamic law does not make sense to me, or to any of my other Muslim friends, and family. Why? Because our religion asks us to love, not to hate. What this disgusting fellow Mateen did, was truly unacceptable; and I hope he's in hell right now. Many of us regular, non-extreme Muslims view homosexuality as a natural thing people are born with; it's not a choice. I didn't choose to be straight, I just feel attracted to people of the opposite gender.  I and over a billion of Muslims do not represent the terrorists who think they're doing the right thing; in other words--think of it like a classroom; where everyone gets punished for what one or two people did.  Every single student didn't misbehave, it was only the minority who reside in Muslim countries. They're not Muslim--many people have wrong interpretations of Islam. In fact, real Muslims themselves have to still analyze the Quran. There's more to learn off of it; half of us reading it don't even know what is being said. The translations you all may find on the internet are very inaccurate; this religious book dates back to over a thousand years ago. We live in a new generation, new beliefs, new thoughts. Some live in the past, but we need to live in the future.
> 
> ...


Summed it up nicely.


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## ned (Jun 15, 2016)




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## Jack Daniels (Jun 15, 2016)

Gingerbread Crumb said:


> I am criticising islam here not Christianity. Your sentence has no value here.


it doesn't matter what religion you take, they all have been where islam is now, and none of any relegion takes the credits as being thier fault since all religious people are proud of what's been built in name of thier religion no one likes to look back on some black pages of thier history. from the moment you don't accept someone the way he is based on color/sex/sexual behavior/religion or whatever even if you just don't like the questions someone asks, you'll get war at the end... if you say gay people should be punnished, because thier ashamefull, what do you think such a person does? it's like saying to hetrosexuals that they should find a man for you feel ashamed of being next to him/her, it's not just strange to ask... it's impossible for such a person to stay sane cause he can't accept himself but he also can't trust anyone else. just stop pushing people in a life that's not fitting and you'll see there's peace for everyone but...
the blaming game won't help you nor will it help anyone else in fact it makes things worse... with your words you're giving muslims no chance of acceptence of life, they can't ignore thier religion like you say, just like you might not be able to stop liking good looking females or whatever taste you've got.
i'm not religious myself but i really wish you to learned to understand others cause if you can't you are one of those who might become one of these so called terrorists, cause you and they are talking the same language.


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## Gingerbread Crumb (Jun 17, 2016)

Jack Daniels said:


> it doesn't matter what religion you take, they all have been where islam is now, and none of any relegion takes the credits as being thier fault since all religious people are proud of what's been built in name of thier religion no one likes to look back on some black pages of thier history. from the moment you don't accept someone the way he is based on color/sex/sexual behavior/religion or whatever even if you just don't like the questions someone asks, you'll get war at the end... if you say gay people should be punnished, because thier ashamefull, what do you think such a person does? it's like saying to hetrosexuals that they should find a man for you feel ashamed of being next to him/her, it's not just strange to ask... it's impossible for such a person to stay sane cause he can't accept himself but he also can't trust anyone else. just stop pushing people in a life that's not fitting and you'll see there's peace for everyone but...
> the blaming game won't help you nor will it help anyone else in fact it makes things worse... with your words you're giving muslims no chance of acceptence of life, they can't ignore thier religion like you say, just like you might not be able to stop liking good looking females or whatever taste you've got.
> i'm not religious myself but i really wish you to learned to understand others cause if you can't you are one of those who might become one of these so called terrorists, cause you and they are talking the same language.


 I am not condemning their religion like I said I am criticising it. Of course I know people follow their religion differently. I'm just saying that when someone criticizes Islam why do people bring up something that is not relevant to the conversation like christianity. People like you seem to think that we aren't aware that all other religions have their flaws just like islam. The reason I like criticising Islam though is because Islam has not been called out on its bullshit as much as christianity has because people like you are quick to defend them.


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## TotalInsanity4 (Jun 17, 2016)

Gingerbread Crumb said:


> The reason I like criticising Islam though is because Islam has not been called out on its bullshit as much as christianity has because people like you are quick to defend them.


Where have you been that Christianity has successfully had any claims of bullshit stick to it?


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## brickmii82 (Jun 17, 2016)

Jack Daniels said:


> it doesn't matter what religion you take, they all have been where islam is now, and none of any relegion takes the credits as being thier fault since all religious people are proud of what's been built in name of thier religion no one likes to look back on some black pages of thier history. from the moment you don't accept someone the way he is based on color/sex/sexual behavior/religion or whatever even if you just don't like the questions someone asks, you'll get war at the end... if you say gay people should be punnished, because thier ashamefull, what do you think such a person does? it's like saying to hetrosexuals that they should find a man for you feel ashamed of being next to him/her, it's not just strange to ask... it's impossible for such a person to stay sane cause he can't accept himself but he also can't trust anyone else. just stop pushing people in a life that's not fitting and you'll see there's peace for everyone but...
> the blaming game won't help you nor will it help anyone else in fact it makes things worse... with your words you're giving muslims no chance of acceptence of life, they can't ignore thier religion like you say, just like you might not be able to stop liking good looking females or whatever taste you've got.
> i'm not religious myself but i really wish you to learned to understand others cause if you can't you are one of those who might become one of these so called terrorists, cause you and they are talking the same language.


I'm not "religious" either. I have a system of faith. It's my own take on Christianity. Many atrocities have been committed in the "religious" name of Christ. However they don't seem to follow his teachings. When, according to the Gospel, he was presented with the opportunity to enforce the law of the Old Testament he chose to show love to the woman who was being condemned instead of judgment. Christianity is "supposed" to be pretty much emulating the life and attitude of Jesus Christ. Yet organized and politicized parties have claimed horrible acts to be done in his name. It's sad. A faith, that to me, was intended to be non-judgmental and full of love and acceptance has been manipulated and tarnished so severely, that it turns people away from faith altogether.


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## Fugelmir (Jun 17, 2016)

I think the most shocking thing I've seen is the polygamy combined with child marriage.  You'll visit a colleague and have him with 3 or 4 wives you mistake as children as they're all prepubescent.  This isn't terrorism,  it's mainstream islam.  Somali girls or girls from other impoverished nations purchased with Saudi oil money.  I don't know the statistics and I wouldn't dare ask but it's certainly very common.

Not to say they're all treated badly: they are generally provided for at the cost of their freedom.  In some cases they're better off as brides than starving.  I never would have thought the western world and Nato would allow it.


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## Gingerbread Crumb (Jun 17, 2016)

TotalInsanity4 said:


> Where have you been that Christianity has successfully had any claims of bullshit stick to it?


Look I'm saying people have criticized or made fun of Christianity. Not a lot with Islam since you know people are scared of being killed for making fun of or criticizing islam.


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## Jack Daniels (Jun 17, 2016)

brickmii82 said:


> I'm not "religious" either. I have a system of faith. It's my own take on Christianity. Many atrocities have been committed in the "religious" name of Christ. However they don't seem to follow his teachings. When, according to the Gospel, he was presented with the opportunity to enforce the law of the Old Testament he chose to show love to the woman who was being condemned instead of judgment. Christianity is "supposed" to be pretty much emulating the life and attitude of Jesus Christ. Yet organized and politicized parties have claimed horrible acts to be done in his name. It's sad. A faith, that to me, was intended to be non-judgmental and full of love and acceptance has been manipulated and tarnished so severely, that it turns people away from faith altogether.


reed the old testamony again, it's not about love!!! it's about hate, hate towards gay people, hate to those who have another religion than the writer, hate towards politicians and about getting lost for 40 years  with god being next to the people and let them life for 40 years in a small desert that even without his help they should've found out to walk out within a year.



Gingerbread Crumb said:


> I am not condemning their religion like I said I am criticising it. Of course I know people follow their religion differently. I'm just saying that when someone criticizes Islam why do people bring up something that is not relevant to the conversation like christianity. People like you seem to think that we aren't aware that all other religions have their flaws just like islam. The reason I like criticising Islam though is because Islam has not been called out on its bullshit as much as christianity has because people like you are quick to defend them.


not defending them, christiannety is mostly the same religion... so it's pointless, if the jews were wrong then christians and islam can't be right either... just saying they're simular more than you thought they were... didn't read the scrolls, the books and all and see it's the same word by another author?


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## brickmii82 (Jun 17, 2016)

Jack Daniels said:


> reed the old testamony again, it's not about love!!! it's about hate, hate towards gay people, hate to those who have another religion than the writer, hate towards politicians and about getting lost for 40 years  with god being next to the people and let them life for 40 years in a small desert that even without his help they should've found out to walk out within a year.
> 
> 
> not defending them, christiannety is mostly the same religion... so it's pointless, if the jews were wrong then christians and islam can't be right either... just saying they're simular more than you thought they were... didn't read the scrolls, the books and all and see it's the same word by another author?


If this is what you got out of it, then so be it. Although I'd suggest you read what's known as the Gospel again. It's the first five books of the New Testament. Matthew, Mark, Luke, John, and Acts. As for both Islam and Judaiism, along with Christianity all stemming from the same source, you are correct. They all essentially stem from from Abram, who was renamed Abraham/Abrahim by God according to the Bible/Quran, and his sons Isaac and Ishmael. Islam believes Ishmael was gods chosen son, and Judaiism/Christianity believes Isaac to be. Like I said though, I personally don't bible thump on Old Testament law. Christs life(and death technically)is supposed to be the establishment of a new law, and it's love. Read the gospel I've mentioned and you'll see what I mean. I could go into detail about why I, personally, find those 5 books more important than anything else, but it's a deep subject that's lengthy to explain.


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## TotalInsanity4 (Jun 17, 2016)

brickmii82 said:


> If this is what you got out of it, then so be it. Although I'd suggest you read what's known as the Gospel again. It's the first five books of the New Testament. Matthew, Mark, Luke, John, and Acts. As for both Islam and Judaiism, along with Christianity all stemming from the same source, you are correct. They all essentially stem from from Abram, who was renamed Abraham/Abrahim by God according to the Bible/Quran, and his sons Isaac and Ishmael. Islam believes Ishmael was gods chosen son, and Judaiism/Christianity believes Isaac to be. Like I said though, I personally don't bible thump on Old Testament law. Christs life(and death technically)is supposed to be the establishment of a new law, and it's love. Read the gospel I've mentioned and you'll see what I mean. I could go into detail about why I, personally, find those 5 books more important than anything else, but it's a deep subject that's lengthy to explain.


Specifically the book of Luke. I love that book because it's basically all about Jesus saying "fuck you" to the religious society and taking a bunch of "unsaveable sinners" under his wing


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## The Catboy (Jun 17, 2016)

Religion is not to blame for these crimes, people are. People who take religion to an extreme, people who allow themselves to be overcome with hate, people, people are the ones to blame. 
Every religion claims to preach for love, yet people only for the hate. Religion isn't flawless, but it's not only reason that people kill. 
This shooter was homophobic, it doesn't matter what group he claimed allegiance with, this was a hate crime. He wanted to kill these people because they were LGBT+. He could have fallen under any faith or lack of faith, but it doesn't change the fact that he was doing this out of hate. 
There's no reason to attack an entire group of innocent people because a small group takes matters too far. If anything, hostile actions/attitudes will only create more problems.


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## Engert (Jun 29, 2016)

Some people say that the Orlando shooting is the worst in US history .... but give it time.


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