# Nintendo wins $2.1 million in lawsuit against ROM site RomUniverse



## Hells Malice (Jun 1, 2021)

Get rekt pirate scum

Looks like he'll be Storman off to prison

(for real tho what a moron...not even getting a lawyer lmfao)


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## DKB (Jun 1, 2021)

"and attempted to dismiss the charges by claiming that he himself did not upload any ROMs to RomUniverse." idk if people of his..intelligence should be on the streets.


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## Chary (Jun 1, 2021)

DKB said:


> he himself did not upload any ROMs to RomUniverse


It's even better, because in his original testimony, he did admit to uploading ROMs...whoops.


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## Xzi (Jun 1, 2021)

Good luck collecting on that Nintendo, dude's probably broke as a joke and gonna declare bankruptcy now.


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## Stealphie (Jun 1, 2021)

This is the one Nintendo ROMS related lawsuit that i'd say is justified. This site was charging for unlimited downloads, aka basically selling the roms.


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## Viri (Jun 1, 2021)

Nintendo is gonna find out what the RIAA found out when suing people into oblivion. They'll just declare bankruptcy.


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## gudenau (Jun 1, 2021)

What a fun game of whack-a-mole.

I know of multiple sites that have Nintendo stuff up, wonder when they will get clobbered too.


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## Kioku_Dreams (Jun 1, 2021)

35k per rom... He only hosted 49 roms?


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## Jayro (Jun 1, 2021)

Sweet, 3 more romsites are gonna pop up.  I've had best of luck using that "mania" site. Hope they're not next.


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## MaxToTheMax (Jun 1, 2021)

Woohoo.


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## CompSciOrBust (Jun 1, 2021)

Legally I guess N is in the right but from a preservationist perspective Nintendo can get fucked. Games are an important part of our culture, they're works of art, and it should be ensured that future generations have some means to play them. It is unrealistic to expect the kids of today, future game developers who should be drawing from the past for inspiration to have the hardware and technical skills to dump a copy of a game that went out of production decades before they were born. Websites like this need to exist for the future of the gaming industry.

Nintendo used a scene dump of Mario Bros for the Wii's virtual console for god sake, even their own developers rely on these resources. But nah fuck em, they're distributing data that's prohibitively expensive to obtain today so sue them in to the ground.


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## Crazynoob458 (Jun 1, 2021)

i lost brain cells reading both comments and the news article
the storman really has no common sence


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## Jayro (Jun 1, 2021)

CompSciOrBust said:


> Legally I guess N is in the right but from a preservationist perspective Nintendo can get fucked. Games are an important part of our culture, they're works of art, and it should be ensured that future generations have some means to play them. It is unrealistic to expect the kids of today, future game developers who should be drawing from the past to inspiration to have the hardware and technical skills to dump a copy of a game that went out of production decades before they were born. Websites like this need to exist for the future of the gaming industry.
> 
> Nintendo used a scene dump of Mario Bros for the Wii's virtual console for god sake, even their own developers rely on these resources. But nah fuck em, they're distributing data that's prohibitively expensive to obtain today so sue them in to the ground.


Well I mean... They haven't gone after archive dot org, which hosts rompacks as preservation. But they're also not primarily a "rom site" either.


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## CompSciOrBust (Jun 1, 2021)

Jayro said:


> Well I mean... They haven't gone after archive dot org, which hosts rompacks as preservation. But they're also not a primarily a "rom site" either.


That's a good point, I'm not sure why. Maybe they think they'd lose if they tried to sue Archive.org. They wouldn't even need to sue though, if they tell them that something they're hosting is illegal they'll happily take it down.


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## The Catboy (Jun 1, 2021)

I wonder how they are expecting to collect on this because I highly doubt that he has this money and that he will even be able to get this money.


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## CompSciOrBust (Jun 1, 2021)

Lilith Valentine said:


> I wonder how they are expecting to collect on this because I highly doubt that he has this money and that he will even be able to get this money.


Knowing someone else who N has sued for a stupid amount of money they'll likely arrange regular payments that have to be made until the total is met (given the amount he'll probably be paying it back for the rest of his life)


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## XDel (Jun 1, 2021)

I wonder if the clock were rolled back, if any of that would be spent on Epstein Island? Or would it go for more safety nets to catch the suicidal workers at their plants in China. Granted, I would be way off base and it's all just going to records, bubble gum, and so called sex change operations for Me-A-Moto.


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## TheXpertXD (Jun 1, 2021)

Not tryna to justify the site or anything, but what damage did Nintendo really suffer tho? It's not like they're trying to sell the games themselves, from my perspective they lost $35,000 each on games they aren't actually making money on anymore.


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## ihaveawindows (Jun 1, 2021)

Oh, the sacrifices I make for the good of this realm...
-Frederick (FE13)

I don't know about you, but here in Indonesia, there is no governing authority to stop the flow of pirated games and movies but piracy itself is illegal, and by such, on online shopping sites in Indonesia, you can find PS2 discs for Rp. 7000,- (around 0.5¢). That's why Nintendo, Sony, and Microsoft are reluctant to give development permits to Indonesian game companies such as Agate Studios Inc.

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------



TheXpertXD said:


> Not tryna to justify the site or anything, but what damage did Nintendo really suffer tho? It's not like they're trying to sell the games themselves, from my perspective they lost $35,000 each on games they aren't actually making money on anymore.


I also agree on this, I mean, you're just posting them, not modifying them or anything...
I don't get Nintendo...


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## CeeDee (Jun 1, 2021)

Oh god, oh god, what about the _*GaMeS pReSeRvAtIoN???*_ 

(cough cough, there are tons of rom sites out there, cough cough, full romsets are dirt easy to find)


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## Hells Malice (Jun 1, 2021)

CompSciOrBust said:


> Legally I guess N is in the right



"Yeah I guess Nintendo is kind of in the right to literally defend the theft and distribution of their personal property"

Lmao stay derpy GBAtemp

Btw anyone thinking this was about the money...you clearly have no idea why this is done.


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## Nerdtendo (Jun 1, 2021)

Jayro said:


> Sweet, 3 more romsites are gonna pop up.  I've had best of luck using that "mania" site. Hope they're not next.


Mania is pretty great. Fastest and just consistent for me so far


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## CompSciOrBust (Jun 1, 2021)

Hells Malice said:


> "Yeah I guess Nintendo is kind of in the right to literally defend the theft and distribution of their personal property"
> 
> Lmao stay derpy GBAtemp
> 
> Btw anyone thinking this was about the money...you clearly have no idea why this is done.


How else would you phrase it? Yes they have the legal right to sue people distributing their roms but that doesn't make it morally right. Slightly advantageous now but long term they're only shooting themselves in the foot by stopping people form playing their games. Game dev students (the same people who Nintendo will eventually hire and will be publishing games on their platforms) are encouraged to play old games to try to understand what makes them work so well, it's important to understand the history of your field. Overall this is more harmful to society than it is beneficial to Nintendo.


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## Deleted User (Jun 1, 2021)

Realistically, I have no Moral High-Ground to preach to Nintendo from; I have ROMs but I also continue to buy Official.

The way I look at this type of News is to check which Websites are still available even though I've already downloaded ROMs I don't want lost. The eventuality is that most of the ones I recognise will be gone but others will pop up.

I could argue that, for some people, playing those ROMs before being able to buy Consoles did cement a love for the Nintendo Franchise, as was my case, but I fully understand the legality of the position. 

The same could be said for a whole host of Windows Software in Asia, especially in Higher Education, that Students use through creative means and then pay for Licenses as Professionals. 

This is probably why I've had this mindset of paying it back in future purchases ever since.


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## ertaboy356b (Jun 1, 2021)

I guess they'll sue archive.org next.


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## CanIHazWarez (Jun 1, 2021)

CompSciOrBust said:


> Legally I guess N is in the right but from a preservationist perspective Nintendo can get fucked. Games are an important part of our culture, they're works of art, and it should be ensured that future generations have some means to play them. It is unrealistic to expect the kids of today, future game developers who should be drawing from the past for inspiration to have the hardware and technical skills to dump a copy of a game that went out of production decades before they were born. Websites like this need to exist for the future of the gaming industry.
> 
> Nintendo used a scene dump of Mario Bros for the Wii's virtual console for god sake, even their own developers rely on these resources. But nah fuck em, they're distributing data that's prohibitively expensive to obtain today so sue them in to the ground.


This exactly. When I started reading your post, I even thought "yeah, and Nintendo has even used/sold pushed ROMs themselves." But you meat me to it.


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## scoobydude51 (Jun 1, 2021)

if you are charging for ROMs, you deserve to be sued.


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## mr allen (Jun 1, 2021)

Video game preservation is one thing, but he was directly profiting off of piracy. That's a massive no no.


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## the_randomizer (Jun 1, 2021)

I bet he would've been less likely to face litigation if it didn't sell the ROMs like a dumbass. Oh well lol.


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## Deleted member 532471 (Jun 1, 2021)

Let's all pretend to hate piracy now, while we browse this illegal console modding forum

Grr curse you pirate scum, Nintendo has the right to ruin your life for ever
How dare you make people happy on sales they wouldn't make! Grr grr


It's braindead, but it's the kind of comment the masses approve apparently, being a Brand's pet is cool now
Let's validate each other's performative "virtuous" tantrums with likes


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## x65943 (Jun 1, 2021)

Memoir said:


> 35k per rom... He only hosted 49 roms?


My guess is that these 49 ROMs were the only first party Nintendo games - and that Nintendo did not seek damages for 3rd party games (I am not sure they would be legally allowed to do so either)


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## Kwyjor (Jun 1, 2021)

Chary said:


> Storman defended himself on his own, without a lawyer, and attempted to dismiss the charges by claiming that he himself did not upload any ROMs to RomUniverse, therefore he was innocent.


Remember way back when all the ROM sites had a message saying "You have to delete these ROMs within 24 hours of downloading them or it will be illegal!!!" Those were the days.



TheXpertXD said:


> Not tryna to justify the site or anything, but what damage did Nintendo really suffer tho? It's not like they're trying to sell the games themselves, from my perspective they lost $35,000 each on games they aren't actually making money on anymore.


I'm sure the arguments have been made many millions of times over by now. Perhaps you could say that people occupying themselves with older games will be less likely to spend money on new games?


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## x65943 (Jun 1, 2021)

Kwyjor said:


> Remember way back when all the ROM sites had a message saying "You have to delete these ROMs within 24 hours of downloading them or it will be illegal!!!" Those were the days.
> 
> I'm sure the arguments have been made many millions of times over by now. Perhaps you could say that people occupying themselves with older games will be less likely to spend money on new games?


I remember a certain site saying something like
"You agree to only download these ROMs if you already own a physical copy of the game"

And another one said something like

"You agree that if you are a federal officer you will not browse this website or download any files"
Maybe coolroms (?) back in the day


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## Urbanshadow (Jun 1, 2021)

ihaveawindows said:


> I also agree on this, I mean, you're just posting them, not modifying them or anything...
> I don't get Nintendo...



Nintendo is, and has for years, trying to settle a legal precedent where a ROM site whatever the size or wether it sells the roms or charges its users, stores the roms or simply redistribute third party hosted content is instantly fulminated to the ground after simply pointing them with the finger (cease and desist).

They will keep doing absurd to more absurd legal claims until they transform sharing your private collection of original games, purchasing a flashcard or dumping your games and let some friends play with them into felonies with a couple of prison months and some steep fee. Until all freedom regarding videogame content is gone and left for good.

Nintendo is the TOP 1 undisputed handler of "You are only purchasing your right to play, you don't own the content" bullshit. Also at least in TOP 3 of "If you can redistribute (i.e. physically move an original cartridge over a table surface) the games, you only will do so by our terms and only in the channels we will let you to, at intervals we decide and if you could at all".

It is sickening to the core and it hurts every kind of customer.


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## phonemonkey (Jun 1, 2021)

Hoo boy


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## MiiJack (Jun 1, 2021)

Oh no, Never heard of that site. Anyway.


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## Alkéryn (Jun 1, 2021)

ok, i'm not anti piracy but what a dumb move to not hire a lawyer.


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## x65943 (Jun 1, 2021)

Alkéryn said:


> ok, i'm not anti piracy but what a dumb move to not hire a lawyer.


Brought to you by the same man who believed he could sell ROMs and get away with it


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## Alkéryn (Jun 1, 2021)

x65943 said:


> Brought to you by the same man who believed he could sell ROMs and get away with it


oh man, i should get the popcorn.
well i didn't know that thing so i just assumed it was just another website to download roms lol.
if you have to pay half of the point is lost.


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## Nomi20 (Jun 1, 2021)

Viri said:


> Nintendo is gonna find out what the RIAA found out when suing people into oblivion. They'll just declare bankruptcy.


Exactly correct.


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## Sathya (Jun 1, 2021)

I love WiiU usb helper. The very very legal roms site


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## White_Raven_X (Jun 1, 2021)

I'd be running to all the Banks trying to get as many loans as possible... Hide that money and declare bankrupt 6 months later! Fack'em all! Lol


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## SG854 (Jun 1, 2021)

Soulja Boy they are coming after you next


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## Deleted member 514389 (Jun 1, 2021)

Urbanshadow said:


> Nintendo is the TOP 1 undisputed handler of "You are only purchasing your right to play, you don't own the content" bullshit. Also at least in TOP 3 of "If you can redistribute (i.e. physically move an original cartridge over a table surface) the games, you only will do so by our terms and only in the channels we will let you to, at intervals we decide and if you could at all".
> 
> It is sickening to the core and it hurts every kind of customer.



I'll let my
name be the answer for this one...


(Also, what you are describing is standart practice with iOS devices since -ever, and you can bet [email protected]#y and Micro$oft aren't above this thing either.)

"Games as a service" take this to extreme heights...

As far as preservation goes: Nintendo enthusiast cover that..

Also: youtube.com/watch?v=IqTEBX5cAQQ


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## Clydefrosch (Jun 1, 2021)

why would anyone try and defend themselves... that poor moron...

for his sake, I hope he made some money with the site

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------



Lilith Valentine said:


> I wonder how they are expecting to collect on this because I highly doubt that he has this money and that he will even be able to get this money.


i guess he'll go for whatever insolvency is in his country?


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## eriol33 (Jun 1, 2021)

Who would buy those roms? How did they lose sales at all?


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## Shadow_The_Hedgehog82 (Jun 1, 2021)

Clydefrosch said:


> why would anyone try and defend themselves... that poor moron...
> 
> for his sake, I hope he made some money with the site
> 
> ...



I doubt a lawyer would have helped much they never do in piracy cases


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## Viri (Jun 1, 2021)

Lilith Valentine said:


> I wonder how they are expecting to collect on this because I highly doubt that he has this money and that he will even be able to get this money.


Doubt it. He'll most likely declare bankruptcy. Here is a video on what happened to the people sued by the RIAA for music piracy.



Spoiler


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## Spider_Man (Jun 1, 2021)

Got to love the way nintendo focus more on hacks/mods/rom sites than they do making decent consoles and games.

Damages is laughable, nintendo no longer make any profit off any console game that is no longer in production or sale.

As for the shit switch, us gamers should be able to sue nintendo for its yet again lie claiming better support..... guess that turned out to be shit old ports of games we already own.


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## MetalTail (Jun 1, 2021)

I understand gaming companies need to protect their own products, and I have no clue what kinda of roms they are talking about, but this just seems excessive, specially if they relate to older hardware, I know Nintendo has the virtual console but it's kinda of a joke, stuff I had on the Wii U doesn't appear on the Switch because reasons???, also a lot of older games don't even appear on the virtual console so unless you are lucky enough to own the cartridge and a working console you can never play them again.


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## Sheimi (Jun 1, 2021)

MetalTail said:


> I understand gaming companies need to protect their own products, and I have no clue what kinda of roms they are talking about, but this just seems excessive, specially if they relate to older hardware, I know Nintendo has the virtual console but it's kinda of a joke, stuff I had on the Wii U doesn't appear on the Switch because reasons???, also a lot of older games don't even appear on the virtual console so unless you are lucky enough to own the cartridge and a working console you can never play them again.


To add a bit more, if it doesn't cost over 100 bucks for said game. For example: Pokemon HeartGold/SoulSilver


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## Brigand (Jun 1, 2021)

ertaboy356b said:


> I guess they'll sue archive.org next.


I really hope not. There's stuff on archive.org that is way more important in terms of preservation and availability in the public domain than roms. I'm all for video game preservation, but I think we've got that covered well and truly by now, and I'm really against people hosting roms there. It will only be a matter of time before Nintendo does catch on to the amount of their IP being hosted there, and while I believe it's silly to think archive.org would get taken down just because of that, it would no doubt lead to some tightening on archive's end in terms of what gets hosted, which if nothing else means more resources (money) spent on that and not on preserving/digitising things. It might sound like a trivial concern, but next time you need to find an obscure journal article or book that you can't get in print and it has no official scan, there's a good chance archive has it, as well as a plethora of other things.


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## munnimann (Jun 1, 2021)

Someone uses some lines of Open Source code without crediting: Get out the pitchforks, boys, and burn this soulless thief of intellectual property! We need to protect the author's right to their own creation!

Nintendo stops someone from effectively selling their intellectual property: Muh gAmE PrEseRVaTiON. Fuck Nintendo!


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## NeoGranzon (Jun 1, 2021)

Here is another site that has gone the way of Emuparadise!


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## HideoKojima (Jun 1, 2021)

"Storman defended himself on his own, without a lawyer..."

That's what happens when you play a lot of Phoenix Wright pirated roms.
Also 2mn probably isn't enough to cover the legal expenses spent by Ninty so the goal is to deter people from creating these kind of websites...


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## Sheimi (Jun 1, 2021)

Shalashaska98 said:


> "Storman defended himself on his own, without a lawyer..."
> 
> That's what happens when you play a lot of Phoenix Wright pirated roms


Not a lot of lawyers are going to take on a piracy case like this.


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## Phenj (Jun 1, 2021)

Hells Malice said:


> Get rekt pirate scum
> 
> Looks like he'll be Storman off to prison
> 
> (for real tho what a moron...not even getting a lawyer lmfao)


POV: You've never felt the touch of a woman


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## HideoKojima (Jun 1, 2021)

Sheimi said:


> Not a lot of lawyers are going to take on a piracy case like this.


There's always a lawyer to do the job whatever it is but the guy wasn't consistant, he said he did upload then said he didn't which is a lame excuse to start with, so yeah you're right.


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## Sheimi (Jun 1, 2021)

Shalashaska98 said:


> There's always a lawyer to do the job whatever it is but the guy wasn't consistant, he said he did upload then said he didn't which is a lame excuse to start with, so yeah you're right.


What he should have done is not say he uploaded roms in the first place and kept his mouth shut. We'll never know when he potentially went to see a lawyer. Wherever it will be after he got the notice or after his first testimony. Could of not had the funds to hire a lawyer or they did not want to take on the case.


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## Foxi4 (Jun 1, 2021)

Guy's an idiot for not trying to settle out of court. As for the amount, Nintendo or their lawyers don't expect to ever see this money - it serves as a deterrent. He obviously isn't capable of paying up - they'll arrange a payment plan of some kind and it'll be hanging over his head for a while.


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## Frankbel (Jun 1, 2021)

I hope to be alive the day when the Nintendo copyright on its ancient games ends.


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## CTR640 (Jun 1, 2021)

What if he had a laywer? Would he still have lost or won? You're hosting a ROM site, charging for unlimited downloads and you claim you didn't upload any of them and therefore you're innocent?


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## Deleted member 534570 (Jun 1, 2021)

That's unfortunate.


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## RichardTheKing (Jun 1, 2021)

I do hate seeing ROM sites being taken down, considering they're the only way a hell of a lot of games will ever be preserved...like, I doubt Nintendo's ever going to upload an "Official DS Collection" (or GBA, or GBC, or 3DS, etc.) to their eShop, and licensed games inherently have a limited digital-shelf life.

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------

Same with Sony and PS2 classics; sure, the PS5 can run PS4 games, but can it run any of the original Ratchet & Clank games? Jak & Daxter? LEGO Star Wars I and II? Codename: KND? Spider-Man: Friend or Foe?
...For example...


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## Bladexdsl (Jun 1, 2021)

is this the guy that was trying to charge people to download roms? fuck him if it was serves him right this is one time i'm glad ninty won


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## smf (Jun 1, 2021)

Viri said:


> Nintendo is gonna find out what the RIAA found out when suing people into oblivion. They'll just declare bankruptcy.



You are assuming they would be upset with that, or that wasn't their original plan.



CompSciOrBust said:


> Yes they have the legal right to sue people distributing their roms but that doesn't make it morally right.



It doesn't make it morally wrong either. The people who get sued are the ones making money out of distributing copyright material, they are lucky that they aren't facing criminal charges.



CompSciOrBust said:


> Game dev students (the same people who Nintendo will eventually hire and will be publishing games on their platforms) are encouraged to play old games to try to understand what makes them work so well, it's important to understand the history of your field. Overall this is more harmful to society than it is beneficial to Nintendo.



Suing someone who is making money out of piracy isn't going to prevent anyone from playing anything.



Kwyjor said:


> Remember way back when all the ROM sites had a message saying "You have to delete these ROMs within 24 hours of downloading them or it will be illegal!!!" Those were the days.



Yeah you can make up any rubbish and people will believe it.



x65943 said:


> I remember a certain site saying something like
> "You agree to only download these ROMs if you already own a physical copy of the game"



In a lot of countries this doesn't even protect the person downloading, but it doesn't protect the person who is hosting the roms.



x65943 said:


> And another one said something like
> 
> "You agree that if you are a federal officer you will not browse this website or download any files"
> Maybe coolroms (?) back in the day



I would love to hear that as a defense in court. It's perfectly fine for officers to go undercover, besides they could hire someone who isn't a federal officer to browse it for them ;-)



White_Raven_X said:


> I'd be running to all the Banks trying to get as many loans as possible... Hide that money and declare bankrupt 6 months later! Fack'em all! Lol



If you have the ability to borrow enough money to make it worthwhile then the bankruptcy will hurt you more in the long run.
Hiding the money from bankruptcy is illegal. You might not want to publicly state your criminal plans on a forum.


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## Ericzander (Jun 1, 2021)

Never go pro se. $35,000 per ROM?

I don't care who you are, when you're involved in the legal system you should get a lawyer to prevent the justice system from totally fucking you. Even if you're a lawyer, you want a lawyer.

Even if he would have ultimately lost, an attorney probably could have mitigated these damages. Now I wonder if he's going to file for bankruptcy pro se.


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## Lazyboss (Jun 1, 2021)

Nintendo: why bother making new games when we can fire lawsuits on poor people.


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## Wavy (Jun 1, 2021)

CeeDee said:


> Oh god, oh god, what about the _*GaMeS pReSeRvAtIoN???*_
> 
> (cough cough, there are tons of rom sites out there, cough cough, full romsets are dirt easy to find)


*NOooOoOOOo* we must point and stick our fingers at Ninfundo for being bad and hating their fans!! Everything Ninfundo does is bad and if you even *THINK* about calling me out and saying how I'm wrong I'm going to write a 30 page essay on how I'm right and you're just a blind fan who doesn't care about vidja game preservation!!!1! (we _totally_ aren't using "preservation" as a way to cover up that we want free games)


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## ChaosEternal (Jun 1, 2021)

Lazyboss said:


> Nintendo: why bother making new games when we can fire lawsuits on poor people.


I for one would love to see what sort of games their lawyers could cook up!


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## smf (Jun 1, 2021)

Ericzander said:


> Never go pro se. $35,000 per ROM?
> 
> I don't care who you are, when you're involved in the legal system you should get a lawyer to prevent the justice system from totally fucking you.



Nintendo asked for $15 million & got $2.1 million. A lawyer might not have helped much.

He wanted a lawyer, but he tried to crowd fund one and didn't raise enough. Where were all the people wanting to stick it to nintendo when he needed $$$?

His defense was pretty out there, but top marks for effort. I would have thought he'd have done better settling though.

Romuniverse twitter is kinda blatant....

https://twitter.com/romuniverse?lang=en
_Need Roms?  We've got them.  Over 17TB of Roms_
_
Hey you.  You know we have Nintendo Switch Scene Roms.  They're uploaded when they are dumped.  Check them out. _


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## Jacobh (Jun 1, 2021)

Bankruptcy won’t automatically affect this type of judgement. Selling access to roms is also significantly different than an individual downloading some roms (what the RIAA tried to go after).

Nintendo probably doesn’t care about the 2 million specifically and they may never collect the full amount. They will however keep pursuing it even if the guy has to have his wages garnished for the rest of his life.  This is about stopping other people from doing the same, and they’ll pursue it even if it costs them more than what they ever collect from this guy.


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## Kioku_Dreams (Jun 1, 2021)

x65943 said:


> My guess is that these 49 ROMs were the only first party Nintendo games - and that Nintendo did not seek damages for 3rd party games (I am not sure they would be legally allowed to do so either)


Still, that's a pretty low number. Even for first party.


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## inetkun (Jun 1, 2021)

I’m always more than willing to pay to play games from official sources, paying for a rom site does seem kinda suspicious. I don’t want that to come off as “this guy deserves it for charging money” but the judge did point to his financial gain (minuscule as it was) as part of the reason for his decision. At the end of the day if you try and profit off of another’s trademarked work, they are more likely to come for you.


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## AsPika2219 (Jun 1, 2021)

Sayonara RomUniverse...


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## the_randomizer (Jun 1, 2021)

Oh no, Nintendo is losing money on the games that they're not selling on digital storefronts, oh the horror 

Oh wait.


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## AkikoKumagara (Jun 1, 2021)

Trying to represent himself without a lawyer... both ballsy and completely stupid.


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## Kwyjor (Jun 1, 2021)

RichardTheKing said:


> I do hate seeing ROM sites being taken down, considering they're the only way a hell of a lot of games will ever be preserved...


The sheer volume of software that gets uploaded to the Apple Store poses something of an insurmountable obstacle to "preservationists", but generally, everything that can be dumped has been dumped and copied a hundred times over by now in the name of "preservation". I would be more concerned about the difficulty of retrieving those backups and making them accessible should the need ever arise. And the even bigger problem is that no one is going to care if Blurble's Adventure in Foobarland is available if no one has heard of the game and has no interest in playing it, no matter how many times it gets "preserved".


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## Kioku_Dreams (Jun 1, 2021)

RichardTheKing said:


> I do hate seeing ROM sites being taken down, considering they're the only way a hell of a lot of games will ever be preserved...like, I doubt Nintendo's ever going to upload an "Official DS Collection" (or GBA, or GBC, or 3DS, etc.) to their eShop, and licensed games inherently have a limited digital-shelf life.



Oh, please.. I'm sure you can find an archive somewhere with what you're looking for. A quick search would lead you to a plethora of links and sites. No intro needed.


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## chrisrlink (Jun 1, 2021)

companies don't give a shit bout preservation (Sony practicly said themselves this during their plan to shut down the ps3/vtia store) your right but practicly selling roms is pure suicide


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## Dungeonseeker (Jun 1, 2021)

Viri said:


> Nintendo is gonna find out what the RIAA found out when suing people into oblivion. They'll just declare bankruptcy.


The point was never about getting paid, Nintendo have billions in both cash & assets, they're significantly the richest out of the big 3 gaming companies and a few million in fines is inconsequential to them.

The point was to send a message to other morons who wanna charge people for access to pirated content.


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## chrisrlink (Jun 1, 2021)

before court i'm gonna make suicide pills thats for damn sure


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## Pacheko17 (Jun 1, 2021)

"Hurr durr good on Nintendo"

Goddamn bootlickers. Nintendo doesn't deserve a penny for 30-20 year old games that they re-re-re-re-re-re-release for $10 just to have an excuse to sue people who genuinely love their past (like me).

(But I do agree charging for downloads is wrong, that's really scummy)


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## Julie_Pilgrim (Jun 1, 2021)

this website fucking sucked anyways


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## the_randomizer (Jun 1, 2021)

That's cute, but I still have a shitload of Snes ROMs, they can't do a damn thing about that


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## Kioku_Dreams (Jun 1, 2021)

Pacheko17 said:


> "Hurr durr good on Nintendo"
> 
> Goddamn bootlickers. Nintendo doesn't deserve a penny for 30-20 year old games that they re-re-re-re-re-re-release for $10 just to have an excuse to sue people who genuinely love their past (like me).
> 
> (But I do agree charging for downloads is wrong, that's really scummy)


Why do people throw the term "bootlicker" around so loosely? Imagine getting mad at someone for doing something they're well within their rights to do.

What makes this even funnier is that this guy was CHARGING for access to these roms. So... What's your point here?


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## NinStar (Jun 1, 2021)

Now tell them to sue archive.org.


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## Julie_Pilgrim (Jun 1, 2021)

the_randomizer said:


> That's cute, but I still have a shitload of Snes ROMs, they can't do a damn thing about that


the_randomizer was later hunted and killed by nintendo ninjas


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## Agusto101 (Jun 1, 2021)

It doesn't matter they close 1 site and then 3 more pop out, so yeah good luck with that nintendo, just give up already.


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## the_randomizer (Jun 1, 2021)

Scott_pilgrim said:


> the_randomizer was later hunted and killed by nintendo ninjas



I'd just tell them, "bring it on, bitch"


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## DonCaballero (Jun 1, 2021)

the_randomizer said:


> That's cute, but I still have a shitload of Snes ROMs, they can't do a damn thing about that



If you charge for them then you're screwed buddy.


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## SeventhSon7 (Jun 1, 2021)

Thought for the day: Nintendo's original video game success was proving that _Donkey Kong_ did not infringe Universal Studios IP because _King Kong_ was in the public domain.


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## ZeroFX (Jun 1, 2021)

this site was shit, but that doesnt make this "law"suit a good thing.


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## HarveyHouston (Jun 1, 2021)

Nintendo seems to be suing more than ever, especially during and after the "pandemic" (don't ask why it's in quotes). I don't remember reading about so many lawsuits before then. IIRC, Team Xecuters were caught during this time period, also.

I know of plenty of places where ROMs are hosted; not sure if they're still active now, though. Personally, I'd rather buy them legit if I can afford it, and play them on the original hardware. Not that I'm against ROM sites; I think that they help preserve games from being lost forever - I do wonder if Nintendo is trying to cause their own doom by restricting people from saving ROMs, but that's another story.


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## souhukyafod (Jun 1, 2021)

the problem is that these retards are making bank out of stolen games. The archive hosts for free and it is a not-for-profit


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## NinStar (Jun 1, 2021)

souhukyafod said:


> the problem is that these retards are making bank out of stolen games. The archive hosts for free and it is a not-for-profit



I'm pretty sure Nintendo sees no difference between these two things.


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## ClancyDaEnlightened (Jun 1, 2021)

CompSciOrBust said:


> How else would you phrase it? Yes they have the legal right to sue people distributing their roms but that doesn't make it morally right. Slightly advantageous now but long term they're only shooting themselves in the foot by stopping people form playing their games. Game dev students (the same people who Nintendo will eventually hire and will be publishing games on their platforms) are encouraged to play old games to try to understand what makes them work so well, it's important to understand the history of your field. Overall this is more harmful to society than it is beneficial to Nintendo.



Welcome to tech industry, you realize anyone working for any of these companies have to sign an NDA (even independent devs), trade secrets have a role in this, so these game dev students cannot legally do  unauthorized "hacking" or "reverse engineering" projects, you aren't even allowed to develop using open source homebrew sdk all in house





Urbanshadow said:


> Nintendo is, and has for years, trying to settle a legal precedent where a ROM site whatever the size or wether it sells the roms or charges its users, stores the roms or simply redistribute third party hosted content is instantly fulminated to the ground after simply pointing them with the finger (cease and desist).
> 
> They will keep doing absurd to more absurd legal claims until they transform sharing your private collection of original games, purchasing a flashcard or dumping your games and let some friends play with them into felonies with a couple of prison months and some steep fee. Until all freedom regarding videogame content is gone and left for good.
> 
> ...




That's why cfw and flashcards exists, I may not have rights for the software, but I 100% own the hardware, so it's subject to my terms and conditions



Ericzander said:


> Never go pro se. $35,000 per ROM?
> 
> I don't care who you are, when you're involved in the legal system you should get a lawyer to prevent the justice system from totally fucking you. Even if you're a lawyer, you want a lawyer.



Then his lawyer better call Perry Mason and Ben Matlock 

Guess he watched my cousin Vinny too many times


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## CompSciOrBust (Jun 1, 2021)

aadz93 said:


> Welcome to tech industry, you realize anyone working for any of these companies have to sign an NDA (even independent devs), trade secrets have a role in this, so these game dev students cannot legally do  unauthorized "hacking" or "reverse engineering" projects, you aren't even allowed to develop using open source homebrew sdk all in house


I don't see how that has any relevance to what I was saying. Yes when you start working at game studios you have to sign NDAs but student game devs aren't working at game studios, else they wouldn't be students would they? Student's are encourage to study older games like Mario to understand why the gameplay was designed that way. When I was studying game dev at college my tutors linked us to an online snes emulator that was clearly running pirated roms and told us to write an essay on the design choices and how it effects the gameplay. That isn't a unique situation either, I know students at other places that have had similar assignments. Actions like the ones taken by Nintendo make this more difficult and harms their own industry by impeding the education of future developers. Yes in this case the roms were being sold but it's not like they haven't sued people giving out the roms for free in the past.


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## the_randomizer (Jun 1, 2021)

DonCaballero said:


> If you charge for them then you're screwed buddy.



No kidding, I know that


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## Jacobh (Jun 1, 2021)

Nintendo has certainly made morally questionable decisions in the past and tried to bully people who weren't impacting their business.  However, the situation this thread is about - going after someone who was illegally *selling* their and other people's intellectual property -  seems justified both legally and morally. 

Whether you agree with how they've handled rom sites in general or think some of the actions they've taken are not moral, it's hard to  argue that Nintendo is making bad business decisions.  They made over $4 Billion in net profit last year, and they have rarely posted operating losses in the last 35 years.  It's also hard to argue they are seriously hurting the games industry overall which is bigger than the Movie industry and growing.


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## MetoMeto (Jun 1, 2021)

I see Nintendo is fighting windmills again... Good for them i guess.


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## Chrisssj2 (Jun 2, 2021)

DKB said:


> "and attempted to dismiss the charges by claiming that he himself did not upload any ROMs to RomUniverse." idk if people of his..intelligence should be on the streets.


It is accurate though. If he didn't upload it himself. I mean they may have used his infrastructure but.yeah


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## Kioku_Dreams (Jun 2, 2021)

Chrisssj2 said:


> It is accurate though. If he didn't upload it himself. I mean they may have used his infrastructure but.yeah


Yeah... Well.. It's his hosting.. His fees... And so on and so forth.


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## rimoJO (Jun 2, 2021)

it's all fun and games 'til vimm's get taken down


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## the_randomizer (Jun 2, 2021)

DonCaballero said:


> If you charge for them then you're screwed buddy.



I'm not a dumbass, I don't charge people for ROMs, much less distribute them. What the deuce do you think I am, stupid?


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## Kwyjor (Jun 2, 2021)

aadz93 said:


> Guess he watched my cousin Vinny too many times


I hear that My Cousin Vinny's representation of the legal system comes so much closer to reality than any other movie that they actually show it in schools.



Jacobh said:


> Whether you agree with how they've handled rom sites in general or think some of the actions they've taken are not moral, it's hard to  argue that Nintendo is making bad business decisions.


A lot of people seem to like a challenge, eh?

Nintendo needs to find a way to make money off of all the people who thinks they know what Nintendo needs to do, I always say.


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## air2004 (Jun 2, 2021)

Hells Malice said:


> Get rekt pirate scum
> 
> Looks like he'll be Storman off to prison
> 
> (for real tho what a moron...not even getting a lawyer lmfao)


It's civil matter , not a criminal one .... so no jail time


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## ClancyDaEnlightened (Jun 2, 2021)

CompSciOrBust said:


> I don't see how that has any relevance to what I was saying. Yes when you start working at game studios you have to sign NDAs but student game devs aren't working at game studios, else they wouldn't be students would they? Student's are encourage to study older games like Mario to understand why the gameplay was designed that way. When I was studying game dev at college my tutors linked us to an online snes emulator that was clearly running pirated roms and told us to write an essay on the design choices and how it effects the gameplay. That isn't a unique situation either, I know students at other places that have had similar assignments. Actions like the ones taken by Nintendo make this more difficult and harms their own industry by impeding the education of future developers. Yes in this case the roms were being sold but it's not like they haven't sued people giving out the roms for free in the past.



True, I don't work for a studio, but I had to sign an NDA to access Nintendo dev tools, as an indie dev


Even then it's more about getting you to understand the theory, how the code interacts with the hardware, and how the hardware is utilized, gives a visual aspect of how a CPU and it's peripherals interact with each other, you can just use Atari 2600, Atari 8bit, C64, Sega roms and do exactly the same in the end, I never seen those get dmca'd 

Even then I don't think Nintendo is going to sue an educational institution over using roms and emulators, not a good public image


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## stanleyopar2000 (Jun 2, 2021)

Cant stand for profit privateers.  He had a subscription fee to access content.


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## placebo_yue (Jun 2, 2021)

Never heard of the site. I usually hate Nintendo for being such a douche about ROMS, but this guy sold them? fuck him. 
Also not hiring a lawyer when ur being sued for 15 million dollars? kek


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## Chrisssj2 (Jun 2, 2021)

Memoir said:


> Yeah... Well.. It's his hosting.. His fees... And so on and so forth.


Then by that logic the isp is responsible.


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## Urbanshadow (Jun 2, 2021)

notrea11y said:


> As far as preservation goes: Nintendo enthusiast cover that..
> 
> Also: youtube.com/watch?v=IqTEBX5cAQQ



That is not for you as a customer to enjoy or watch. And you already knew that before posting.

That, among the other things I already said are only perpetuating attempts at demeaning the customer. They are not doing a service for nobody but themselves.


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## Kioku_Dreams (Jun 2, 2021)

Chrisssj2 said:


> Then by that logic the isp is responsible.


I hope and pray you never become a lawyer.


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## Tomtani1 (Jun 2, 2021)

Deleted.


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## LightBeam (Jun 2, 2021)

Lmao it's really funny how Nintendo really wanted to get his ass and a maximum amount of money here
15 millions ? Come on lmao, they don't sell most of the games available there and they really tried to play the biggest victim on Earth.
I would have understood why they wanted SO much if they were selling the roms themselves, but they are not and they aren't willing to do so


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## pwsincd (Jun 2, 2021)

Memoir said:


> 35k per rom... He only hosted 49 roms?


ninty related roms.. surel they cannot pursue games they didn't make


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## Kioku_Dreams (Jun 2, 2021)

pwsincd said:


> ninty related roms.. surel they cannot pursue games they didn't make


Again... Only 49? Out of the past 4 decades of games, Ninty surely made more than 49 games?

That or the site only hosted such a small library of games..


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## stanleyopar2000 (Jun 3, 2021)

Hail Hydra. more will pop up...hopefully not privateers asking subscription fees


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## DonCaballero (Jun 3, 2021)

the_randomizer said:


> I'm not a dumbass, I don't charge people for ROMs, much less distribute them. What the deuce do you think I am, stupid?



The fine gents behind RomUniverse were stupid, considering they essentially charged for ROM downloads. That was my point.


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## baxzxd (Jun 3, 2021)

Hells Malice said:


> Get rekt pirate scum
> 
> Looks like he'll be Storman off to prison
> 
> (for real tho what a moron...not even getting a lawyer lmfao)


like the dude would be able to defend himself anyway


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## Ottoclav (Jun 4, 2021)

ihaveawindows said:


> Oh, the sacrifices I make for the good of this realm...
> -Frederick (FE13)
> 
> I don't know about you, but here in Indonesia, there is no governing authority to stop the flow of pirated games and movies but piracy itself is illegal, and by such, on online shopping sites in Indonesia, you can find PS2 discs for Rp. 7000,- (around 0.5¢). That's why Nintendo, Sony, and Microsoft are reluctant to give development permits to Indonesian game companies such as Agate Studios Inc.


I don't really know where the wealth is held in Indonesia, but I'm assuming that most of it is in the 1% Elites' hands, not unlike here in the US. But my guess is that Ninty is going to sue where money is more easily earned. Even if this guy is paying a token payment each month, it's more money than someone in Indonesia is probably going to be able to pay each month. IMO.


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## I_AM_L_FORCE (Jun 4, 2021)

Shalashaska98 said:


> "Storman defended himself on his own, without a lawyer..."
> 
> That's what happens when you play a lot of Phoenix Wright pirated roms.
> Also 2mn probably isn't enough to cover the legal expenses spent by Ninty so the goal is to deter people from creating these kind of websites...


In what world would a claimant spend 2million on a single civil court case, that to my knowledge has no appeals

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------

>Indonesia

This guy will dissapear somewhere into Asia and will never be heard of again.


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## HideoKojima (Jun 4, 2021)

I_AM_L_FORCE said:


> In what world would a claimant spend 2million on a single civil court case, that to my knowledge has no appeals
> 
> --------------------- MERGED ---------------------------
> 
> ...


This is not a person suing another person we are talking about a corporation here, you need to get familiar of legal expenses of such cases.  

www.nintendo.co.jp/ir/pdf/2020/annual2003e.pdf


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## notimp (Jun 4, 2021)

Xzi said:


> Good luck collecting on that Nintendo, dude's probably broke as a joke and gonna declare bankruptcy now.


Media story is the important part. 2.1 milion I said.


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## BitMasterPlus (Jun 5, 2021)

As much as I support uploading games online, what this guy did, at literally every turn, was wrong and stupid. Like, it's no surprise he got his ass destroyed in court, he couldn't have made it easier to Nintendo to wreck him.


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## Ariff Tsukasa (Jun 5, 2021)

Nintendo, please sue cdromance next.


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## weatMod (Jun 5, 2021)

Shadow_The_Hedgehog82 said:


> I doubt a lawyer would have helped much they never do in piracy cases


they never do in most cases the FEDS have    something like 98 % conviction rate, the whole system  is a rigged scam
but i am assuming this was a  civil case
at any rate a lawyer  would have been a  waste of money cause  it's all rigged


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## realtimesave (Jun 5, 2021)

Can't this guy claim bankruptcy and have all this erased?  Isn't that how it works in the US?  Anyone know?  It's hard as hell to make 1.7mil in this country.


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## Jacobh (Jun 5, 2021)

realtimesave said:


> Can't this guy claim bankruptcy and have all this erased?  Isn't that how it works in the US?  Anyone know?  It's hard as hell to make 1.7mil in this country.



It depends, but probably not in this case. Not all debt is eliminated by bankruptcy.


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## realtimesave (Jun 5, 2021)

Jacobh said:


> It depends, but probably not in this case. Not all debt is eliminated by bankruptcy.



Sucks for this guy though.  And as far as hosting a large/popular website with pirated material and/or selling pirated stuff that's pretty much a no brainer you'd have to be an idiot to do that and think you'll get away with it forever.  I used to have a roms site on geocities though but it was pretty much only known to a small crowd on irc.  Glad I didn't continue with it.


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## Jack_Ishmael (Jun 6, 2021)

Hells Malice said:


> Get rekt pirate scum
> 
> Looks like he'll be Storman off to prison
> 
> (for real tho what a moron...not even getting a lawyer lmfao)




A lawyer would have made a difference


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## ruffo (Jun 6, 2021)

Mr. Storman this very moment:


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## Vila_ (Jun 7, 2021)

CompSciOrBust said:


> Legally I guess N is in the right but from a preservationist perspective Nintendo can get fucked. Games are an important part of our culture, they're works of art, and it should be ensured that future generations have some means to play them. It is unrealistic to expect the kids of today, future game developers who should be drawing from the past for inspiration to have the hardware and technical skills to dump a copy of a game that went out of production decades before they were born. Websites like this need to exist for the future of the gaming industry.
> 
> Nintendo used a scene dump of Mario Bros for the Wii's virtual console for god sake, even their own developers rely on these resources. But nah fuck em, they're distributing data that's prohibitively expensive to obtain today so sue them in to the ground.


archive.org
(edit, the site nintendo took down limited it's users on the ammount of roms you could get at a time and you had to pay to download more, they also had other scummy practices like that, so I'm glad they are taking awful sites like these instead of honest 100% free rom sites)


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## wolf-snake (Jun 8, 2021)

This bruh probably tried to defend himself using the "Its norally legat to pirate Nintendo games because they enable scalpers" as a legit defense.


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## Plazorn (Jun 9, 2021)

Nintendo doesn’t do lawsuits because of the games, they just want money. Kinda sad that a lot of video game companies are going in that direction now


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## Shadow_The_Hedgehog82 (Jun 17, 2021)

weatMod said:


> they never do in most cases the FEDS have    something like 98 % conviction rate, the whole system  is a rigged scam
> but i am assuming this was a  civil case
> at any rate a lawyer  would have been a  waste of money cause  it's all rigged


Doubt that means its rigged 
I doubt anything goes to court without good evidence or it'd be a waste of the governments money

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------



Plazorn said:


> Nintendo doesn’t do lawsuits because of the games, they just want money. Kinda sad that a lot of video game companies are going in that direction now


I don't think its for money because people normally declare bankruptcy for stuff like this and don't pay. its just because they don't like people sharing roms. I wish there were some legal protections for sharing games you cant buy anymore though its not like theyre losing money from people pirating old games


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## th3joker (Jul 12, 2021)

My friend has a sealed copy with the autograph of the voice actor for mario. Wonder if it is worth similar?


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## Plazorn (Jul 12, 2021)

Why does Nintendo go after small rom sites instead of big ones like cdromance and wowroms?


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## chrisrlink (Jul 12, 2021)

well good thing archive is protected under the dmca if worse comes to worse


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