# The Problem with Borat 2 and South Park's Pandemic Special



## Deleted User (Oct 25, 2020)

I recently watched Borat 2 and I found myself rather very, very disappointed. SBC focused more on politics than being original and unique. Even the whole joke of "what's more dangerous: viroos or the democrats" didn't last long, either. The trailer made us think it would.

Plus, SBC's Borat voice seemed unrefined and somewhat high pitched. Kinda like, he forgot what Borat sounded like originally and how he was (mentally and emotionally).

Now, where does South Park fits in all of it? They hyped up their special episode using masks as if it was going to be focused on that issue, but really wasn't. Still, it was more entertaining than Borat 2 was.

I just hope that comedians can come up with funny jokes in 2021 because these were hardly any decent.


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## Pikm (Oct 25, 2020)

Borat is and was always about politics, you're just butthurt because your crazy views were criticized, and you would have hated the first film had you been politically active at the time.


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## gregory-samba (Oct 25, 2020)

I wish the media sites would stop with the stories about this Sasha guy. He's not funny what so ever.


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## Taleweaver (Oct 26, 2020)

gregory-samba said:


> I wish the media sites would stop with the stories about this Sasha guy. He's not funny what so ever.


I actually agree with you.

Oh, I'm sure he has an audience (humor's a personal taste), but I'm most certainly not one of 'em.

@Pikm I'm not saying you're wrong, but I wouldn't draw that conclusion just based on a "I don't like this nor this" comment.


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## notimp (Oct 27, 2020)

Borat 2 was sooo cringe. Even with left leaning sensibilities.  I'm uncertain if it was just something specific to my sensibilities, but the scenes with Tutar, where 'surface level societal politeness' gets played against, human rights and child space infractions, killed me. Like I couldnt watch - killed me.  Like, I'd watch the edge of the screen and waited until the scene would go away. 

Granted, there still was genius in it, and the high level acting (in the field, the filler scenes were used a little too much this time, but oh well, plot development) imho always gleaned through, but this was a new level of unwatchable I havent experienced before.

So I guess since - while actively looking away from the screen I was still able to recognizing the brilliance of the loose script (setup) and the acting, this is cringe that makes the movie kind of exceptional. Something was achieved here, that no other form of media had me experience before..  Sometimes I laughed while actively looking away from the screen.

Other parts were just outright brilliant and funny, and entirely enjoyable.  And yes, the Rudy Giuliani scene was one of them. 

So whtaever this movie experience was, great achievement, I'm not disappointed.. 

The Wuhan flu song scene was cut in too action cut centric, the actual leaked videos where even funnier. So if you havent seen them, watch them.

Also the Colbert Interview segment on the movie, also was exceptional (behind the scenes commentary..  ).


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## RyRyIV (Oct 27, 2020)

Ironically enough, both pieces of media heavily rely on a plot twist about "how the virus got spread."

South Park's Pandemic Special was definitely a miss for me, though I admittedly haven't liked South Park for a few years now. Borat Subsequent Moviefilm, on the other hand, I definitely enjoyed. Nothing about it was worse than the original Borat, and it brought plenty of laughs to my home. Humor's subjective, and my wife and I definitely enjoyed what SBC had to offer here.


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## notimp (Oct 27, 2020)

And she was brilliant in that movie. Total suspension of disbelieve.





Which is why the moral cringe hit so hard. 

https://www.imdb.com/name/nm7210025/?ref_=tt_cl_t2


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## MikaDubbz (Oct 27, 2020)

Eh, I thought they were both hilarious.  I don't care if something has a political slant or not, if it's funny, it's funny.  And that's all that really matters to me with comedic films and shows.


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## notimp (Oct 27, 2020)

Also - this:


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## Viri (Oct 27, 2020)

Borat was never funny to me. I remember in the mid 2000's when I couldn't get away from movie quotes of his, being confused, because I didn't find the movie to be that funny.


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## notimp (Oct 27, 2020)

Viri said:


> Borat was never funny to me. I remember in the mid 2000's when I couldn't get away from movies quotes of his, being confused, because I didn't find the movie to be that funny.


I have to mansplane the concept then.. 

Borat hits hard, because people get drawn in laughing at him, because thats the entire appeal at first glance - an exceptionally dumb foreigner you laugh about, while finding your amusement in 'cultural missunderstandings' - but then comes the part that hits so hard, while the people that he is interacting with on screen are doing just that, the entire script is flipped, and all of the scenes are crafted to actually lay bare just how much western culture fails at trying to act civilized, while never coming even close to fulfill its moral virtues (guidelines we all live by) or pretensions. Showing, that they are - in fact - often conflicting (and ritualistic at most).

Which is why the climax of the first movie didnt work.

(It was just outrageous - so the movie was sure to have broad appeal.  And by having that - I guess it worked as social commentary ("What we'd all like to do..." on some level is impermissible, so we made Borat a hero, being able to do it under the guise of a cultural misunderstanding.)

But the one in the second movie did. 

So if you've never laughed at societal conventions, you dont get the humor.
And if you never were interested in social commentary, you dont get how well crafted the interactions are. (The more subtle second layer.  )

So for all thats worth, right wing trolls lamenting on youtube or imdb comments, that they dont get whats so funny about scenes that hint at society failing to react to Covid appropriately - have a scene, where the running of the bulls in Pamplona, is mimicked, by a 'primitive country' - 'running from THE JEW', hinting at how propaganda works, and then realize, that they replaced the jew with a different subset of propaganda archetypes in the ending of the second movie. 

When you come to those realizations, when you laugh at them, propaganda seizes to work. Thats also part of the brilliance.


edit:
Added more important stuff below.. 

Good comedy always doesnt just 'entertain', but holds a mirror to society. Which Sasha Baron Cohen does like no one else at this point.  This is also the reason you have comedians host the Oscars or the Golden Globes f.e. - because the people at those events, without conjecture, otherwise would entirely look like pretentious pricks.  So in those cases comedy holding a mirror to society is abused for corporate (/PR) interests.  (If you are german, the better example for this is Nockherberg - where the same principle is applied to political decision makers.) Which partly also are societies interests. So stuff like that is a right of passage for every 'seen as good' comedian.

The ones who dont comply (Bill Hicks, Sam Kinison, ...), get ostracized. 

So in the end - conservatism always wins..  (Comedy serves societal interests, by confronting them, making people think about them, taking the piss out of them... Which aids reflection. And thereby (slow) progress through iteration.)

But both are needed (psychologically speaking  ), the confrontation, and the 'its just silly' conjecture. Both serve a societal purpose.

Oh and btw. Chomskys critique of the leftwing liberal avant garde is exactly that - that it serves as a guideline of what is 'possible/permissible' even at the level of the outrageous, for society at large. But then Chomsky is, and always was a dissident at heart..


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## Xzi (Oct 27, 2020)

So much salt rofl.  Borat 2 is gold, and the first Borat movie was just as much of a political satire.  Only difference this time is he's mocking Trump and his supporters instead of GWB and his supporters, and that's also the only reason some people who liked the original hate the sequel.


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## AmandaRose (Oct 28, 2020)

Boesy said:


> SBC focused more on politics than being original and unique .


That statement is  funnier than the second Borat film. 

Ever single character SBC has ever created was done to take the piss out of famous people/politicians and politics in general.



*Brüno Gehard*

*A character that takes the piss out of famous fashion models and politicians*

*Ali G*

*A character that takes the piss out of politicians and politics and famous people *

*Borat*

*A character that takes the piss out of politicians and politics *

*Admiral General Aladeen*

*A character that takes the piss out of world leaders politics and terrorists*

*And so on. *

*To say the film is too political is frankly hilarious *


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## notimp (Oct 28, 2020)

The message of this thread is, that if you now feel the need to gang up and attack the comedian for being outrageous - you are MAX level dumb.

You are so outrageously dumb, that you will never ever in your life get into a position of actual societal importance, because ability to self reflect and to take criticism are tested by institutions at one point or another.. 

The perfect video to illustrate this is this one:


If you believe the outrage message in that video - you are a proto drone, without the posibility for redemption.  You will live your entire life not understanding very much.

So Don Jr. was the victim here, for trying to recruit / cosy up with the pretend 'favourable journalist'?  The outrage is, that they could get into the white house?

You havent understood anything - if thats your opinion.  So much so, that by having it, it makes you not viable for any position of responsibility (in the classic sense (Trump has broken down some of those barriers..  )). Because it shows that you are highly ideologically manipulable. Which up to a point is a 'good virtue' (dependable, reliable, loyal), but after that its not.  Or to put it even simpler - if you were willing to 'hang the comedian' on grounds of 'them not being funny' and 'too political' - you'd make a wonderful despot. 

And again, that there is a cultural closeness between 'arts' and 'power' is not just incidental.  (Best example to illustrate this is the german Nokherberg. (Where the 'comedian hosts the Oscars' principle is applied to politcs/politicians. (US has the White house correspondence dinner, hosted by a comedian, but its not quite as good..  ) ))

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If you need it spelled out even further, for the "Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?" principle in democratic society to work 'best' its needed that the intended answer to that ('we all do'), actually reaches as broad of an audience as possible. The more (as in broader sections of society) are engaged in politics (political thought), the better.

Which also is, why political comedy in society is so valuable. Everyone can talk about 'what Borat did' - and by doing so, they actually are becoming politically engaged. 

Which is why in democracies, political comedy is actually looked for, and looked after. You dont have it in absolutist/fashist regimes, where its seen as more important for populations to mimic the major narrative. (Chomsky sees it a little differently.  )


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