# The Xbox One and Why I Hate the Gaming Community



## danweb (May 24, 2013)

Hello,

My good friend Skrundarlow has written an article discussing the gaming community's reactions to the Xbox One announcement and I felt the need to share it here despite this not being his forum of choice. Here it is:

tl:dr? If you read the article you'll realize that I don't care anymore.

Wednesday March 23rd, 7:00 AM
Melbourne, Australia

It’s three hours after the announcement of the Xbox One. I’ve just woken, up, and I’m excited. I jump online to read up on Microsoft’s latest home console.

“Where are the games!?”
“Xbox One reveal a disaster!”
“Microsoft sure stuffed this one up”
“Why would anyone buy this shit, Microsoft deserves to die”
“The Playstation 4 announcement blew this out of the water”
“Consoles are still shit, omg this crap is already outdated, PC master race”

I'm confused by the articles, particularly the comments, and their overwhelming negativity. There are gifs, photoshopped pictures and videos blanketing the internet with furious hate for the Xbox One. What did Microsoft do that was so terrible? I wonder. I do some further reading. It seems that most people are complaining about online requirements and used games. Some are complaining about Kinect. It’s being called universally ugly. Surely the online requirement isn't that bad, I think to myself. I've always thought Kinect was pretty cool stuff. I think it looks ok, but I’ll reserve my judgement until I sit down and watch the conference.

Later that day, I finally had the opportunity to sit down, and watch the conference from start to end. The further I got into the video, the stranger I began to feel. My confusion from earlier in the morning had returned. I watched it all, through the unveiling, the sports, the TV, the Call of Duty, and by the end of it I was angry. Angry enough to write this piece. Angry at the gaming community.

Right now, I hate the gaming community.

I was excited as I sat through that conference. I saw that Kinect would come included with every console. ‘That’s awesome’ I thought to myself, ‘Every Xbox One owner will have a Kinect. It will really be able to live up to its full potential’ I thought. Blu-ray drive, games being installed to the hard-drive, and being linked to my account ala Steam. ‘This will be very great for a lot of people.’ It seems a small thing, but being able to launch a game without requiring the correct disk is a massive convenience. Then we get to EA sports. I could not care less about sporting video games, but the demos shown were cool. I started to think about how this technology will benefit the games that I love to play. I was excited because this was new, awesome technology that will enhance our experiences as both consumers and gamers. And yet just this morning I had had to sift through an ocean of hate to get to the Xbox One news.

I stopped thinking about the Xbox One and I took a step back to look at the gaming community as a whole. I did not like what I saw.

Because although it’s probably the worst response I've seen, it’s not just the Xbox One. The Playstation 4 announcement was attacked for several reasons, including not showing a console. The Wii U was attacked because people thought the gamepad was a waste of space, time and money. The Vita was attacked because the community felt it had no reason to exist. The 3DS was attacked because the gaming community called 3D a gimmick.

Very rarely do I remember seeing someone take a step back and say ‘hold on guys, think about how cool this is. Think about what new things we can do with it, and how it will enhance our gaming experiences.’ And I see this as a problem. I feel that regardless of what Microsoft had announced at that conference, it would have been torn apart, because that is what our community has become. Criticism can lead to innovation, and it is a very valuable tool that must not be discounted, but we have reached the point at which the gaming community has become so critical, and so hostile, that we have lost sight of why it is that we became gamers in the first place. We have become a community that is stifling innovation, a community that I’m not sure I want to continue to be a part of.

The Xbox One has its share of problems. I could write an entire article about how many of them are of little consequence, and have been over-dramatised by technology websites across the globe. I could explain why Microsoft’s decision during the unveiling event to focus on the console, and entertainment, as opposed to games, was a good one. But why should I? It will just be responded to with hate and disgust, as I’m sure will this one. I could try to change the community, to inspire everyone to just appreciate awesome technology for what it is,

But I’ve just about given up on you, ‘gamers’

This article was also posted at the following links if you'd like to see other comments:

http://www.ign.com/boards/threads/the-xbox-one-and-why-i-hate-the-gaming-community.453049501/
http://forums.toucharcade.com/showthread.php?t=190294

Now I would like to offer my personal opinions on the issue at hand.

I feel that Microsoft did the correct thing at this event. Microsoft had a strong focus on entertainment that does not include games and I see that as a very good decision. This is because E3 is within a month and that is the big video game event of the year. Microsoft have gotten all of the boring software and hardware capabilities out of the way at this relatively small event allowing for many of their "15 exclusives" to be shown at E3. Games belong at E3, and if they hadn't have announced the console and all the 'boring' TV features we wouldn't be able to enjoy seeing all of those games at E3. I also think that bundling Kinect (Still prefer the name Natal) is a great thing for the console as it encourages developers to make use of it in new and creative ways (See Ryse with Kinect). I look forward to what the 8th console generation will bring to video games when in full force (I love ya Nintendo, but you're hardware just doesn't match up in power).

Thanks for reading 

Edit: I'd also like to add that in contrast to the enormous amount of hate that the video game community provides, the board game community is almost always full of positivity.


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## Flame (May 24, 2013)

but tell you truth why did M$ call it Xbox One, the name is confusing.


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## danweb (May 24, 2013)

Actually, I agree with you on that one. I have had many a discussion with so much confusion, especially when we were contrasting the launches of the first Xbox, the Xbox 360 and the Xbox One. I think I would have been fine with the name Xbox 720, but I also understand why they didn't do that.


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## Guild McCommunist (May 24, 2013)

The name One is to imply that it's an all-in-one entertainment platform, it handles your TV, gaming, movies, all that jazz.

Not that I think it's a good name at all but that's what they were aiming for.


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## KingdomBlade (May 24, 2013)

Dude, it's the internet. The gaming community isn't really the most, um, rational of groups. Personally, my opinion is similar to the overwhelming majority in that I think that the X1 looks to be ass, but I don't like being hostile about it. I wouldn't ever say something like "MICROSOFT CAN EAT MY SHIT!!!!!" I acknowledge that there are some positive things about the X1, but we, as consumers, are more focused on the negatives as we have to make our selection between devices. I mean, they virtually have the same positives to them, what we need is to understand what's wrong with them to make an informed opinion. I mean, sure, we don't have to be ferocious about it, but it's still necessary to realize that there is something wrong with what Microsoft is doing.

I've rarely see the sharp commentators attack anything that the majority see as a positive. Is always on a positive? No. Because it's a form shit DRM and stifles the ability of gamers to play freely. Is having to pay for used games a positive? No. Because it allows Microsoft to gain a profit out of something they shouldn't have the right to. Is the fact that it's ugly a positive? No. Is the fact that Kinect can virtually monitor your living room without you allowing it to do so a positive? No. None of these criticisms are meant to stifle innovation. They're meant to show something that's just plain bad from the point of view of a user. To be honest, anyone who doesn't think that Microsoft isn't doing anything wrong by enforcing strict regulations on the way that gamers can use their games is incorrect in my opinion.

That's why I appreciate the PS4 so much more. The focus on sharing experiences with other players, the focus on making sure that game development is easier for independent developers, while still maintaining a healthy and beneficial set miscellaneous features is such a good thing. There wasn't that much backlash to the PS4. Most were fairly positive. Nothing exaggeratedly positive, since you can't expect that kind of reaction anymore these days, but there wasn't much negativity going around anywhere. When you compare the two launches, it should be obvious that X1 clearly did something wrong to generate that kind of response. They wouldn't have received that much backlash if they were simply innovating, right? I mean, the PS4 did about the same thing and received minimal criticism at best.

Look, I'm not saying this kind of hostility and overreaction is justifiable. It's not. It's the same deal with EA and them being rated the worst company in America, which is horrendous and stupid, because Exonn Mobil, McDonalds, Bank of America, AT&T and probably 20 others are probably worse than EA. However, what we can say is that Microsoft clearly did something wrong for people to be that mad at them. Even if gamers were more rational and reasonable, the amount of apathy would remain intact.

I agree, gamers have somewhat devolved into a community that is harsh, hostile, and tends to overreact to the slightest of things. But there's not much you can do to change the way the community works. Many of them are heavily self-entitled. However, gamers are also capable of doing incredible things to support the industry. Just look at the resurgence of indie games. The support that the community and the industry has given to the developers of these games is there reason why they keep on making games that we would never have been able to see otherwise; without the gaming community's overwhelming support of games that do something different like Flower or Braid, developers wouldn't have that kind of incentive to make games unique. The presence of Kickstarter to fund projects that would've never come into fruition. The fact that gamers have taken a stand to defending gaming as more than a form of entertainment, and instead attempt to cement its place as an art form. The fact that gamers are now, more than ever, willing to share their experiences and passion about gaming to each other and to the world.

The gaming community may have some problems, but you can't deny that there are a lot of things commendable about it. It's young, it's less developed, and it can be a little spoiled, but it's also willing to try things that are new and unexpected.


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## danweb (May 24, 2013)

KingdomBlade said:


> I've rarely see the sharp commentators attack anything that the majority see as a positive. Is always on a positive? No. Because it's a form shit DRM and stifles the ability of gamers to play freely. Is having to pay for used games a positive? No. Because it allows Microsoft to gain a profit out of something they shouldn't have the right to. Is the fact that it's ugly a positive? No. Is the fact that Kinect can virtually monitor your living room without you allowing it to do so a positive? No. None of these criticisms are meant to stifle innovation. They're meant to show something that's just plain bad from the point of view of a user. To be honest, anyone who doesn't think that Microsoft isn't doing anything wrong by enforcing strict regulations on the way that gamers can use their games is incorrect in my opinion.
> 
> The gaming community may have some problems, but you can't deny that there are a lot of things commendable about it. It's young, it's less developed, and it can be a little spoiled, but it's also willing to try things that are new and unexpected.


 
I'd just like to share my opinions on the negatives your brought up.

The DRM applied to games on Xbox One at this stage actually sounds fantastic given what they were trying to achieve. Microsoft wanted users to be able to play their games without the use of a disc and in order to do that they needed to restrict the games usage to an account. You will still be able to go over to a friend's place and log into your account in order to play the game. Microsoft has also confirmed that there will be a system in place to allow for preowned game trading. It is likely that this will be done by deactivating the digital ownership of the game so that it can be registered to a different account. That may not be the way it will work, but I think it is likely given Microsoft's comments on the matter. (Source)

I believe that the Xbox One and the new Kinect are ugly pieces of hardware. I think that Microsoft made both pieces of hardware very boxey and they must have done that to go along with their new style with Windows 8, Windows Phone 8 and the Surface Tablet. Many other software and hardware companies are following suit and making those rounded edges pointy as Microsoft is the one to follow for a lot of companies. It is possible that by the time the Xbox One comes to retail most similar hardware will also be boxey, however, I doubt it.

The privacy issue that the Kinect hardware creates is an interesting one. I do trust Microsoft's security enough that I would be comfortable in front of that camera as with any webcam. It is certainly an area of concern though.

Anyway, I feel that the hate that M$ has been receiving has been far too strong given the announcement.


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## KingdomBlade (May 24, 2013)

danweb said:


> I'd just like to share my opinions on the negatives your brought up.
> 
> The DRM applied to games on Xbox One at this stage actually sounds fantastic given what they were trying to achieve. Microsoft wanted users to be able to play their games without the use of a disc and in order to do that they needed to restrict the games usage to an account. You will still be able to go over to a friend's place and log into your account in order to play the game. Microsoft has also confirmed that there will be a system in place to allow for preowned game trading. It is likely that this will be done by deactivating the digital ownership of the game so that it can be registered to a different account. That may not be the way it will work, but I think it is likely given Microsoft's comments on the matter. (Source)
> 
> ...


I forgot the worst part. The fact that independent developers are unable to self publish their games on the platform. That is horrible, and it completely goes against the recent trends and developments among the gaming industry regarding the resurgence and recent popularity of indie titles, which, in many ways, surpass mainstream games in being unique, different, and establishing games as an art form. That disgusts me.

And also, sure, they wanted to focus less on games and stuff. Fine. Whatever. But at least, please, for the love of christ, show us at least ONE actual game on gameplay. You can show everything at E3 if you want, but just show us, like, one random racing or FPS game during gameplay. The fact that they didn't do EVEN that shows the shift in focus.


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## Pleng (May 24, 2013)

Flame said:


> but tell you truth why did M$ call it Xbox One, the name is confusing.


 
What do you expect form a company that brought it's flagship product in the following major revisions:
1,2,3,95,98,ME,XP,Vista,7,8?*


*This is using the 'home operating system' timeline so is ignoring any NT-based releases up until the point the NT kernal was merged into the home operating system family(XP), before anybody feels like getting smart!


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## emigre (May 24, 2013)

Fuck Microsoft!


Am I doing this right?


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## danweb (May 24, 2013)

KingdomBlade said:


> I forgot the worst part. The fact that independent developers are unable to self publish their games on the platform. That is horrible, and it completely goes against the recent trends and developments among the gaming industry regarding the resurgence and recent popularity of indie titles, which, in many ways, surpass mainstream games in being unique, different, and establishing games as an art form. That disgusts me.


 
Wow, I actually haven't heard about that. No self publishing? I couldn't agree with you more there. That disgusts me!


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## Flame (May 24, 2013)

emigre said:


> Fuck Microsoft!
> 
> 
> Am I doing this right?


 
Wrong! is Fuck M$!


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## KingdomBlade (May 24, 2013)

danweb said:


> Wow, I actually haven't heard about that. No self publishing? I couldn't agree with you more there. That disgusts me!


Yep. It's true. They've decided to close themselves off and maintain their policy regarding self publishing, unlike Sony or Nintendo. (source)


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## Gahars (May 24, 2013)

Negativity? On my internet?

It's more likely than you think.


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## DinohScene (May 24, 2013)

Consoles died half way through the 7th gen.
Their not consoles anymore.
Nor are phones, phones.
Nor are telies, telies.

All-in-one.....
So I only need me phone to access the Web and go on Skype and watch telie and make me coffee?
Damn me house would be pretty fucking empty by then.


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## Foxi4 (May 24, 2013)

DinohScene said:


> Consoles died half way through the 7th gen.
> Their not consoles anymore.
> Nor are phones, phones.
> Nor are telies, telies.
> ...


It's the natural evolution of electronics - people are generally working towards having one device that does it all for them rather than owning tons upon tons of dedicated junk.

You connect a console to a TV, so if the specs are there, why _wouldn't_ it do more than just games? The next step was turning it into a media hub that also plays movies and does all sorts of other stuff.

You carry your phone in your pocket at all times, so why _wouldn't_ it do things other devices with the same nature do, for example play music? If they have big screens, why _wouldn't_ they play video? If they're connected to a Network that's Internet-capable, why _wouldn't_ they give you access to the internet?

This is a positive trend, not a negative one. It allows the End-User to do more things with less devices - the user pays less, has less clutter to worry about and uses less energy to achieve the same goals.


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## narutofan777 (May 24, 2013)

umm..ur trying to focus on the good like the rest of the media.  I went to the majority of their websites and they all tried to make it seem as if the microsoft presentation wasn't bad...it was BAD.

and u hate the gaming community, do u hate the haters or the unbiased folkzz? r u that 1 guy who thinks anon or anonymous is a group? 

innovation? u need internet once every 24 hours for the xbox one... and microsoft's pr staff are doing a horrible job at explaining what is what. people are confused and angry right now.

did u see this 1 youtube interview where this microsoft dude was avoiding questions and trying to say nice things about the xbox one? that was a good showing of ignorance. just read the yt comments, omg...





if i want a multi media do-it-all system i can get a computer. the only reason y i'd get a ps4 is because of the exclusives..i dont wanna miss out on the good games from developers such as naughty dog, quantic dream and such.


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## DinohScene (May 24, 2013)

Foxi4 said:


> It's the natural evolution of electronics - people are generally working towards having one device that does it all for them rather than owning tons upon tons of dedicated junk.
> 
> You connect a console to a TV, so if the specs are there, why _wouldn't_ it do more than just games? The next step was turning it into a media hub that also plays movies and does all sorts of other stuff.
> 
> ...


 
I'm just getting old then.
I have no use of a phone tho, no one calls/texts me anyways ;p
Internet I have on me lappie so I won't need it on me telie.
Music I have in me car and I hardly go outside so meh.


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## Foxi4 (May 24, 2013)

DinohScene said:


> I'm just getting old then.
> I have no use of a phone tho, no one calls/texts me anyways ;p
> Internet I have on me lappie so I won't need it on me telie.
> Music I have in me car and I hardly go outside so meh.


Having more features for the same amount of cash is usually called _"more bang for the buck"_. You may have Internet on your laptop, so what? Watching a movie online will still look better on a huge TV than it will on a small laptop screen. Sure, you can connect your laptop over HDMI... or you can _"do nothing"_ and just watch it on your console which is already connected to the TV - that's approx. 2 minutes less hassle.


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## DinohScene (May 24, 2013)

Foxi4 said:


> Having more features for the same amount of cash is usually called _"more bang for the buck"_. You may have Internet on your laptop, so what? Watching a movie online will still look better on a huge TV than it will on a small laptop screen. Sure, you can connect your laptop over HDMI... or you can _"do nothing"_ and just watch it on your console which is already connected to the TV, which is approx. 2 minutes less hassle and a lot less clutter.


 

I like me 90's CRT telie >:
DON'T YOU DARE MOCK IT!!
Cause you know yourself, 3rd,4th and 5th gen are the best on CRT ;p

Meh, I prefer watching films on me lappie anyways.
Have done it for ages c:


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## Chary (May 24, 2013)

I don't like the always-on Kinect. That thing has always unnerved me, taking pictures and monitoring my room.


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## Foxi4 (May 24, 2013)

DinohScene said:


> I like me 90's CRT telie >:
> DON'T YOU DARE MOCK IT!!
> Cause you know yourself, 3rd,4th and 5th gen are the best on CRT ;p


Dinoh plz, I haz holy shite batman hueg CRT in my room for old consoles. 



> Meh, I prefer watching films on me lappie anyways.
> Have done it for ages c:


A matter of taste, really. I only watch films on my laptop when it's more convenient, for example in bed.

By the way, look at it this way... _"Why would I have a portable computer? My desktop computer does all the things a laptop does, just better - I don't need another device that does all this. "_ - that's how you sound right now. 



Chary said:


> I don't like the always-on Kinect. That thing has always unnerved me, taking pictures and monitoring my room.


Yeah, nobody watches those pictures - they're analyzed by the console itself. I dread to think what you'd say about Location Data on Smartphones.


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## DinohScene (May 24, 2013)

Foxi4 said:


> Dinoh plz, I haz holy shite batman hueg CRT in my room for old consoles.
> 
> 
> A matter of taste, really. I only watch films on my laptop when it's more convenient, for example in bed.
> ...


 


85cm diagonal masterrace ;o;
Yes it's 4:3 with a convex tube <3


Meh, When I bought this lappie, it out performed most desktops
I currently have no room for a big ass desktop.

Besides, as you said, it's a matter of taste.
Same goes for, it's just an opinion c:


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## Guild McCommunist (May 24, 2013)

Only in this day and age do people complain about _more _features on a device.

We just need the Wii U which can't play DVDs still!


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## the_randomizer (May 24, 2013)

Guild McCommunist said:


> Only in this day and age do people complain about _more _features on a device.
> 
> We just need the Wii U which can't play DVDs still!


 
People are still bitching about that, in an age where DVD players are <$80 at Walmart?  Most people have at least one device that plays 'em.



Spoiler



Bluray > DVD. Bluray master race!


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## Nah3DS (May 24, 2013)

I have a toaster that plays DVDs


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## Hyro-Sama (May 24, 2013)

http://gbatemp.net/blogs/


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## Deleted_171835 (May 24, 2013)

Your_ "friend"_ seems to be completely ignorant of all the reasons people hate the Xbox One.

The reason the system is such a disappointment is;

- You're forced to connect to the internet once every 24 hours. If your internet goes down for longer than a day or if you live in a place where consistent internet access is not common-plac, you're screwed.
- Indie devs can't self-publish. When even Nintendo is criticizing you on that, you know you dun goofed.
- You can't play used games without paying a fee (which is equivalent to the full price of the game). No more bringing a game over to a friend's house to check out.
- Always-on Kinect. Most gamers already hate the Kinect as a primary control-scheme so having it be mandatory for the system to function isn't exactly ideal. And then there's the privacy issues with having an always-on, always-listening and watching device.

It's not because of "selfish" or "entitled" gamers. The backlash is because of the aforementioned tactics that Microsoft is trying to pull (whilst trying to justify it as being beneficial for the end-user). Defending such anti-consumer behaviour makes you come across as nothing but a corporate shill for Microsoft.


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## yuyuyup (May 24, 2013)

Self-aggrandizing.  Name a time period with all gamers holding hands coalescing under a single platform.  Also, this is the internet.


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## Veho (May 24, 2013)

Every console announcement is met with mixed reactions, the skeptics poking fun at it are usually the loudest, and the, as your friend put it, " gifs, photoshopped pictures and videos blanketing the internet with furious hate" abound. The Wiimote is a dildo. The Move is a lollipop-slash-Chinese-love-balls-dildo. The more than one screen on the DS is ridiculous and pointless. And you have to admit Microsoft's announcement left more to criticize than most.


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## Foxi4 (May 24, 2013)

Guild McCommunist said:


> Only in this day and age do people complain about _more _features on a device.
> 
> We just need the Wii U which can't play DVDs still!


The Wii U doesn't play DVD's? Or BluRay discs because Nintendo would rather _die_ than pay royalties for any kind of formats - it's always call them _"proprietary Nintendo disc drives"_ even though we all know the drives in the Gamecube and the Wii are DVD-capable and the Wii U drive is BluRay-capable... simply because the End-User's convenience is not something they particularily care about.


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## Clydefrosch (May 24, 2013)

finally even the last one realized that the gaming community is filled with assholes, trolls and naysayers.
its pretty much worse than hitler


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## JoostinOnline (May 24, 2013)

Foxi4 said:


> ...the Wii U doesn't play DVD's? Or BluRay discs?
> 
> ...because Nintendo would rather _die_ than pay royalties for any kind of formats?
> 
> ...


No, it's to keep costs down.  That's what they said at E3.  Only early Wii models played DVD's, and not very well.  We don't know if the Wii U is capable of playing blueray discs.


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## RodrigoDavy (May 24, 2013)

soulx said:


> Your_ "friend"_ seems to be completely ignorant of all the reasons people hate the Xbox One.
> 
> The reason the system is such a disappointment is;
> 
> ...


As much as I agree that people always find defect everywhere, the Xbox One really deserves this because it want to takes the freedom off it users and control them. M$ is


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## Foxi4 (May 24, 2013)

JoostinOnline said:


> No, it's to keep costs down. That's what they said at E3. Only early Wii models played DVD's, and not very well. We don't know if the Wii U is capable of playing blueray discs.


_"That's what they said"_ is not a very good argument - it'd be a feature that's cheap to implement anyways. Nintendo doesn't want to share their profits with Sony, since Sony's one of the inventors involved.

All Wii models could potentially play DVD's - it's just that the late ones had the feature was blocked by hardware modification _(on the drive itself)_ - the drive was still a DVD one, Wii discs are still DVD derrivatives.

The Wii U's drive is based on a Blu-Ray drive, unless you know another disc standard with this much capacity.


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## RodrigoDavy (May 24, 2013)

Foxi4 said:


> _"That's what they said"_ is not a very good argument - it'd be a feature that's cheap to implement anyways. All Wii models could potentially play DVD's - it's just that the late ones had the issue blocked by hardware modification _(on the drive itself)_ - the drive was still a DVD one. The Wii U's drive is based on a BluRay drive, unless you know another disc standard with this much capacity.


HD-DVD?


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## Foxi4 (May 24, 2013)

RodrigoDavy said:


> HD-DVD?


Uhh, no. HD-DVD is a discontinued format and it only holds up to 15GB on a single layer - single layer Wii U discs are 25GB. Moreover, the technology is supplied by Panasonic - one of the companies involved in developing Blu-Ray further.


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## JoostinOnline (May 24, 2013)

Foxi4 said:


> _"That's what they said"_ is not a very good argument - it'd be a feature that's cheap to implement anyways. All Wii models could potentially play DVD's - it's just that the late ones had the issue blocked by hardware modification _(on the drive itself)_ - the drive was still a DVD one. The Wii U's drive is based on a BluRay drive, unless you know another disc standard with this much capacity.


Well it's perfectly logical. It puts extra strain on your drive and increases failure. It costs them a lot more money having to replace drives because they fail under warranty. They keep the price lower by not having to charge more to cover expenses for drives they'll need to replace.

Edit: It is a Blueray drive.


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## Foxi4 (May 24, 2013)

JoostinOnline said:


> Well it's perfectly logical. It puts extra strain on your drive and increases failure. It costs them a lot more money having to replace drives because they fail under warranty. They keep the price lower by not having to charge more to cover expenses for drives they'll need to replace.


...you're not being serious, right?

The base drive is _perfectly_ capable of reading normal, original, pressed DVD's - that's what it was made for. I'm not talking about DVD-R discs which _do_ increase strain on the drive, I'm talking about standard DVD-Video releases which do not. The barrier is artificial and unnecessary, it's only there to avoid paying for royalties.


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## JoostinOnline (May 24, 2013)

Foxi4 said:


> ...you're not being serious, right?
> 
> The base drive is _perfectly_ capable of reading normal, original, pressed DVD's - that's what it was made for. I'm not talking about DVD-R discs which _do_ increase strain on the drive, I'm talking about standard DVD-Video releases which do not. The barrier is artificial and unnecessary, it's only there to avoid paying for royalties.


By extra I meant "additional due to increased usage", not "an increased rate".   Using a drive for more than just games means more overall strain in a shorter period of time.  By splitting up the mileage between your home DVD player and a Wii, there were far less drive failures under warranty.  I can't speak for the Wii U drive, but Wii drives weren't all that great to begin with.

I agree that it sucks, but there was more to it than not wanting to pay royalty fees.


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## Foxi4 (May 24, 2013)

JoostinOnline said:


> I agree that it sucks, but there was more to it than not wanting to pay royalty fees.


I just can't disagree more - there was no reason whatsoever not to include this as a feature. The PS2 supported DVD from the start and I've never heard anyone complain about having an extra feature like that. Hell, my PS2 still reads DVD's perfectly fine - it has no laser issues whatsoever.

_"Splitting milage"_ is a silly reason not to introduce it. You're _still_ going to use the disc drive - be it for games or for movies - there's no running away from that. If they wanted to cut the drive some slack and lower its use, they should've allowed the users to install their games to the SD just like the 360 and the PS3 allow to install a part of the game's Data to the HDD... or they could've included an HDD or an HDD Add-on themselves.


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## JoostinOnline (May 24, 2013)

Foxi4 said:


> I just can't disagree more - there was no reason whatsoever not to include this as a feature. The PS2 supported DVD from the start and I've never heard anyone complain about having an extra feature like that. Hell, my PS2 still reads DVD's perfectly fine - it has no laser issues whatsoever.


It was a problem for the PS2, it would have been a problem for the Wii.  Frequently used Wii's already had a problem with failing drives WITHOUT an extra way to add mileage.

Are you suggesting that mileage has no effect on your drive?


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## Foxi4 (May 24, 2013)

JoostinOnline said:


> It was a problem for the PS2, it would have been a problem for the Wii. Frequently used Wii's already had a problem with failing drives WITHOUT an extra way to add mileage.
> 
> Are you suggesting that mileage has no effect on your drive?


I'm suggesting that a crap drive is going to be crap regardless of whether or not you castrate it. The feature is natively available - it was cut out by introducing a chip which blocked recognition of discs other than Nintendo's optical format, it was not something the drive could not do. Moreover, it was not something Nintendo did to _"protect the End-User's drive"_, it's something they introduced to cut down on piracy as before Homebrew Channel became commonplace, people just used modchips and burned DVD's.

It was not a_ "problem"_ on the PS2 - it was a feature, and back then a selling point. The PS2 did DVD's, the XBox did DVD's, the PS3 did DVD's, the 360 did DVD's. The Wii and the Gamecube did not, and the feature was restricted by hardware means - either by the shape of the drive itself or by introducing chip-based lockout. See a pattern there? Somehow it's not a problem for _any other manufacturer but Nintendo._


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## JoostinOnline (May 24, 2013)

Foxi4 said:


> I'm suggesting that a crap drive is going to be crap regardless of whether or not you castrate it. The feature is natively available - it was cut out by introducing a chip which blocked recognition of discs other than Nintendo's optical format, it was not something the drive could not do. Moreover, it was not something Nintendo did to *"protect the End-User's drive"*, it's something they introduced to cut down on piracy as before Homebrew Channel became commonplace, people just used modchips and burned DVD's.


No, it was to protect them from having to pay for either:

A drive that didn't suck
A replacement drive when the sucky one gave out from too much use
Allowing DVD playback wouldn't have increased piracy or allowed burned games without a modchip.


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## Foxi4 (May 24, 2013)

JoostinOnline said:


> No, it was to protect them from having to pay for either:
> 
> A drive that didn't suck
> A replacement drive when the sucky one gave out from too much use
> Allowing DVD playback wouldn't have increased piracy or allowed burned games without a modchip.


 
...hovewer _not_ allowing DVD playback at all cut piracy to _zero_ on new Wii units until USB work-arounds were developed.

I particularily like _"if they gave us this feature, they would have to manufacture hardware that isn't sh*t"_ line of defense. Isn't that what they _should_ be doing anyways? 

We'll just have to agree to disagree here, I think.


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## JoostinOnline (May 25, 2013)

Foxi4 said:


> ...hovewer _not_ allowing DVD playback at all cut piracy to _zero_ on new Wii units until USB work-arounds were developed.
> 
> We'll just have to agree to disagree here, I think.


I don't think you have your timeline quite right.  Modchips were around in 2007.  USB loaders were around long before DVD playback was blocked in 2009.  By that time, modchips weren't very popular anymore, so it had almost no effect on piracy.


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## Foxi4 (May 25, 2013)

JoostinOnline said:


> I don't think you have your timeline quite right. Modchips were around in 2007. USB loaders were around long before DVD playback was blocked in 2009. By that time, modchips weren't very popular anymore, so it had almost no effect on piracy.


 
Introducing a hardware revision takes some time, so a _"slide"_ like that was somewhat expected. 

New consoles have to be manufactured, old consoles have to be shipped out to empty warehouses etc.


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## JoostinOnline (May 25, 2013)

Foxi4 said:


> Introducing a hardware revision takes some time, so a _"slide"_ like that was somewhat expected.
> 
> New consoles have to be manufactured, old consoles have to be shipped out to empty warehouses etc.


In your (innacurate) scenario, "slide" = over 2 years.  It was actually about 6 months.  USB "workarounds" (even though they weren't workarounds) were developed like a year before they started.

But even if that's what you meant, it still had almost no affect on piracy.  I'm not sure where you got the idea that it brought it to zero.


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## Foxi4 (May 25, 2013)

JoostinOnline said:


> But even if that's what you meant, it still had almost no affect on piracy. I'm not sure where you got the idea that it brought it to zero.


Let me rephrase that. It brought _disc-based_ loading methods on new Wii's to a screeching halt _(which is what I meant all along) _- how's that?


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## JoostinOnline (May 25, 2013)

Foxi4 said:


> Let me rephrase that. It brought _disc-based_ loading methods on new Wii's to a screeching halt _(which is what I meant all along) _- how's that?


Accurate, although it was nearing it's own halt anyway.  But regardless, piracy has nothing to do with why DVD playback wasn't included on the Wii, or why Blueray playback isn't included on the Wii U.  Nintendo just wanted to save money by not having to replace drives that ended up being used too much.


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## Foxi4 (May 25, 2013)

JoostinOnline said:


> Accurate, although it was nearing it's own halt anyway. But regardless, piracy has nothing to do with why DVD playback wasn't included on the Wii, or why Blueray playback isn't included on the Wii U. Nintendo just wanted to save money by not having to replace drives that ended up being used too much.


 
Here's where we disagree - those features were not introduced because Nintendo thought that the cons _(them having to pay royalties to the owners of those two formats) _outweighed the benefits _(the users being able to watch movies on their systems)_ - it's really that simple.

The moment DVD capabilities were unlocked on the Wii, they began working on methods to cut it out for good. Users who installed Homebrew Channel and DVDX, thus unlocking the capabilities wouldn't be able to replace their drive via official means anyways unless they wiped the system clean of any traces of Homebrew Channel, and that was a real _b*tch_ to do back then. I know, I've had a Wii for a _very_ long time and I remember the days before ModMii and the more advanced *.WAD Managers.

I respect your opinion as a Wii developer, but I have to respectfuly disagree - the move was made so that Nintendo gets more money in their pockets by not paying royalties per system sold and for no other reason, then it was blocked with an additional chip modification to cut down on piracy, as USB piracy was unstoppable at that point anyways.


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## The Milkman (May 25, 2013)

Wait, wait, wait. Your upset, about what the GAMING community has become? Sorry to alert you brother, but this aint 1993 where people think reasonably.


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## JoostinOnline (May 25, 2013)

Foxi4 said:


> Here's where we disagree - those features were not introduced because Nintendo thought that the cons _(them having to pay royalties to the owners of those two formats) _outweighed the benefits _(the users being able to watch movies on their systems)_ - it's really that simple.


I agree with that. But I think that there is more to it (although it's also related to them making more money). I guess we'll leave it at that.

And for the record, I've had a Wii since launch and I've been following modding status since Team Twiizers.


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## Nathan Drake (May 25, 2013)

To get back on topic, as this devolved into pretty much debating why Nintendo chooses to not let you play DVD's:

teh xbawkz wun is st00pid!

Continue.


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## chyyran (May 25, 2013)

There are valid concerns, Kinect always watching you, and I know for a fact that the TV features of the X1 will not work for me, due to a cable box that's needed to decrypt the encrypted TV signal. No used games is also a bummer, many people choose to buy used games because of the lower price point. The only way Steam, and Steam-like services, including the inability to re-distribute digital copies, is only justifiable because of the lower price that the game is available at. Unless Microsoft will offer discounts for brand new games in the weeks after release, a common practice in Steam's, and other PC distribution services' business models, and discount and reduce the price of old games, then only will the inability to resell games be justifiable. Of course, Microsoft has confirmed a system where you can trade used digital copies, but who knows how MS will curate that? In order to provide a profit margin, would there be a meaningful discount for buying used games? 



Spoiler: And now for obligatory related gif


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## Foxi4 (May 25, 2013)

Ron said:


> There are valid concerns, Kinect always watching you,


Your phone knows where you are _(location data, BTS triangulation, GPS location)_, your GPS knows your exact location as well, Google owns all the files you upload, no matter how private and you worry about a little camera that watches your movement and doesn't send a feed anywhere.


> and I know for a fact that the TV features of the X1 will not work for me, due to a cable box that's needed to decrypt the encrypted TV signal.


Nobody forces you to use them.


> No used games is also a bummer, many people choose to buy used games because of the lower price point.


Nobody said there won't be any used games. To the contrary, Microsoft was pretty clear about that - they said that used games will work and they're working on an activation system for those as well. They've already mentioned re-selling games over XBox Live.


> The only way Steam, and Steam-like services, including the inability to re-distribute digital copies, is only justifiable because of the lower price that the game is available at.


...what if you _could_ re-sell digital copies? Microsoft is introducing a system based on software activation, not owning the actual software. Whether you have the software installed or not or whether you have the disc is no longer important - what's important is that you have it registered so for all intents and purposes, they _can_ and _might_ introduce a system of trading the activation codes. The new owner of the license would simply re-download - it's _that_ simple.


> Unless Microsoft will offer discounts for brand new games in the weeks after release, a common practice in Steam's, and other PC distribution services' business models, and discount and reduce the price of old games, then only will the inability to resell games be justifiable.


The _"inability"_ that was debunked already.


> Of course, Microsoft has confirmed a system where you can trade used digital copies, but who knows how MS will curate that? In order to provide a profit margin, would there be a meaningful discount for buying used games?


Here you just contradict yourself. Earlier you said you can't re-sell used games, now you say you can _(because you can)_, except Microsoft oversees it. I'd laugh my pants off if they introduced an auction system that allows the seller to put up any price he/she wants for a given game... or better yet, a system of sending games as gifts like on Steam. Oh, that'd be a field day of all field days.

I'll be honest - Microsoft announced a few innovations and most of those can turn out either horribly bad or... incredibly good and game-changing. Of course the Internet is the Internet and users will assume the worst, but let's not jump to conclusions before we have more information.


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## Isaac (May 25, 2013)

I personally all for the next gen consoles, but my friends discredit the xbox one for one reason and one reason only.... the only reason thy have for not liking it, and are saying that the entire console sucks, it because it looks like a VCR... I don't see it.


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## Foxi4 (May 25, 2013)

Isaac said:


> I personally all for the next gen consoles, but my friends discredit the xbox one for one reason and one reason only.... the only reason thy have for not liking it, and are saying that the entire console sucks, it because it looks like a VCR... I don't see it.


 
I got that impression at first - the front view is terrible. The close-ups and the side view isn't all that bad though... so I think I'll judge it once I see it live.

It _does_ look a lot like a VCR and definitely not like a console, but I'm guessing that's because they want to attract the TiVo/Augmented TV crowd, stealing customers from Apple and Google. Why else would they put so much effort into including all the TV-related functionality?


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## Deleted_171835 (May 25, 2013)

Foxi4 said:


> I got that impression at first - the front view is terrible. The close-ups and the side view isn't all that bad though... so I think I'll judge it once I see it live.
> 
> It _does_ look a lot like a VCR and definitely not like a console, but I'm guessing that's because they want to attract the TiVo/Augmented TV crowd, stealing customers from Apple and Google. Why else would they put so much effort into including all the TV-related functionality?


From the very beginning, Microsoft's initial goal with the Xbox was to _"own"_ the living room. Their focus on TV, TV, TV with the Xbox One may come as a surprise to some but it was really their true intention all along, gaming was always a secondary focus. That's why they pumped so much money into the OG Xbox (to gain marketshare) and why they were so aggressive with the 360 (which worked out quite well for them making the 360 #1 console right now in NA).


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## Foxi4 (May 25, 2013)

soulx said:


> From the very beginning, Microsoft's initial goal with the Xbox was to _"own"_ the living room. Their focus on TV, TV, TV with the Xbox One may come as a surprise to some but it was really their true intention all along, gaming was always a secondary focus. That's why they pumped so much money into the OG Xbox (to gain marketshare) and why they were so aggressive with the 360 (which worked out quite well for them making the 360 #1 console right now in NA).


 
Oh, that approach shouldn't come as a suprise to anyone, really. The dedicated game console days are long gone - the shift towards media centers began way back when Audio-CD's were introduced, add DVD, Blu-ray and Online _(both browsing and streaming media of all sorts)_ that and the progress curve shows where we're heading pretty well. The only company that seems to live in a bubble and doesn't notice the trend is Nintendo...

...then again, they did allow Netflix and other such services to enter their infrastructure... so who knows, maybe they're embracing the idea, just not as strongly.


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## Forstride (May 25, 2013)

I'm glad you made this thread, OP, because it's exactly how I feel as well. We were only shown a small portion of the console, and already, people are calling it shit. Then there was supposedly "confirmed" information like the used game fee, which several large gaming news sites wrote articles on, that turned out to be false, and the community STILL thinks they're true.

And then we have the whole circlejerk over being able to "watch TV on your TV" and the other retarded shit people have been saying. People complaining about the lack of games shown, even though that wasn't the point of the reveal, AND they said there would be plenty of games shown at E3.

I'm not going to call the console good or bad yet, because we were only shown a very small portion of it.  People shouldn't make judgements on either side of it until there is more info.


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## totalnoob617 (May 25, 2013)

xbox1 , what an original name, who came up with that one?

it's almost as original as the aesthetic design of the thing 






sure to lead to some confusion this holiday season

hey son we got you that xbox 1 you have been asking us for





Spoiler: SPOILER!









or some great opportunities for parents to troll their kids this x-max


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## Foxi4 (May 25, 2013)

totalnoob617 said:


> xbox1 , what an original name, who came up with that one?
> 
> sure to lead to some confusion this holiday season
> 
> hey son we got you that xbox 1 you have been asking us for


 
Can't believe people still don't quite get where the _"One"_ in the name comes from*.



*All-in-One entertainment device.


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## totalnoob617 (May 25, 2013)

Foxi4 said:


> Can't believe people still don't quite get where the _"One"_ in the name comes from*.
> 
> 
> 
> *All-in-One entertainment device.


i get it  its an all in one type device ,i am just saying not very original,


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## JoostinOnline (May 25, 2013)

Foxi4 said:


> Can't believe people still don't quite get where the _"One"_ in the name comes from*.
> 
> 
> 
> *All-in-One entertainment device.


Also everyone got stoned at a party and one guy said, "You know what would be a great name for the third Xbox?  The Xbox _One_!"


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## Jan1tor (May 25, 2013)

I kind of agreed with this article a little. However being that the article was about everyone criticizing all the gaming consoles out now I really liked at the end of the article how he himself had to get his own personal jab at Nintendo with _*(I love ya Nintendo, but you're hardware just doesn't match up in power)*_. It isn't about the power it is the playability and fun of playing. Anyway to each their own.


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## the_randomizer (May 25, 2013)

Foxi4 said:


> Can't believe people still don't quite get where the _"One"_ in the name comes from*.
> 
> 
> 
> *All-in-One entertainment device.


 

That doesn't make it any more original.


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## Gahars (May 25, 2013)

the_randomizer said:


> That doesn't make it any more original.


 

The issue isn't originality, it's quality.

Calling the next Playstation console the PS4 isn't all that orginal, but it's concise and effective at communicating "Hey, this is the next one!" The Xbox One is just a bad, needlessly confusing name - there's better ways of communicating that the thing is an all-in-one box (hell, the rumored name "Xbox Infinity" would've been better).


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## JoostinOnline (May 25, 2013)

Gahars said:


> The issue isn't originality, it's quality.
> 
> Calling the next Playstation console the PS4 isn't all that orginal, but it's concise and effective at communicating "Hey, this is the next one!" The Xbox One is just a bad, needlessly confusing name - there's better ways of communicating that the thing is an all-in-one box (hell, the rumored name "Xbox Infinity" would've been better).


Of course when you do a 360, you're just back where you started, so if you think about it, "One" is part of a pattern, not a deviation.


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## Foxi4 (May 25, 2013)

JoostinOnline said:


> Of course when you do a 360, you're just back where you started, so if you think about it, "One" is part of a pattern, not a deviation.


 
Uhm...

Nintendo Entertainment System *->* Super Nintendo Entertainment System *->* Nintendo 64 *->* Gamecube *->* Wii *->* Wii U
XBox *->* XBox 360 *->* XBox One
PlayStation *->* PlayStation 2 *->* PlayStation 3 *->* PlayStation 4

_One_ of those naming schemes _makes sense_ - guess which one.


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## JoostinOnline (May 25, 2013)

Foxi4 said:


> Uhm...
> 
> Nintendo Entertainment System *->* Super Nintendo Entertainment System *->* Nintendo 64 *->* Gamecube *->* Wii *->* Wii U
> XBox *->* XBox 360 *->* XBox One
> ...


I was just joking.  What does  mean anyway?


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## Foxi4 (May 25, 2013)

JoostinOnline said:


> I was just joking. What does  mean anyway?


 
I always treat it as a _"derp smile"_, to be perfectly honest. 

I was joking myself y'know - Sony goofed big time with the whole PlayStation Portable *->* PlayStation Vita dealie-o. I kinda expected it to be named PSP2... Well, at least the logo's neat - I like the fact that they use the same font for the PSVita, PS3 and the PS4.


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## Bobbybangin (May 25, 2013)

I don't really care if Mi¢rosoft named it the 'DiamondstuddedImmacultateConceptionSuperSupremeDexluxeSpecialInfinityxInfinityBox'. The name is irrelevant to me. You'll have to excuse me if I don't like it even though M$ and their fanboys think I should. I'm sure the games will look amazing. I still don't want to pay a full priced licensing fee to play used games(We still don't know if the game developers are going to benefit from this). I don't want my Kinect to monitor how many bodies are in a room. I've never cared for online gaming except to play a little Zombies every now and then. In fact, I've been against online gaming since it's inception. DLC and trophies are some of the stupidest things to happen to gaming. DLC is genius from the standpoint of game developers, M$, and $ony. They sell you half a game at full price and then sell you the other half of the game content online and label it as 'DLC'. Doesn't say much for the people who buy it either. We've pretty much played into this. The only thing that the 'One's' new features improves is the linings of Mi¢rosoft's pockets. As consumers we get to pick and choose what we like and want, not be told what we like and want and be forced to buy things we don't need because it benefits the manufacturers to nickle and dime us at every corner.


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## danweb (May 25, 2013)

Jan1tor said:


> I kind of agreed with this article a little. However being that the article was about everyone criticizing all the gaming consoles out now I really liked at the end of the article how he himself had to get his own personal jab at Nintendo with _*(I love ya Nintendo, but you're hardware just doesn't match up in power)*_. It isn't about the power it is the playability and fun of playing. Anyway to each their own.


 
I am actually primarily a Nintendo gamer. I don't own and have never owned a 360 or PS3 but I do own a DS, 3DS, Wii and Wii U. Nintendo is targeting a different audience (me) to the other consoles and as a result it is undeniable that their systems for the past 7 years have had less power. I personally do not have an issue with this 'lack' of power, but many others do. When the Xbox One is being compared to other game systems of the 8th generation it is only really compared to the PS4 in the power department and for good reason.

To all those thinking that there will not be used games, Microsoft has confirmed that used games will be able to be sold "at retail". They haven't revealed any details as to how that will work yet, but it's likely that it will be done by adding the ability to deactivate the game from your account thus making the disc 'as new'.


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## RodrigoDavy (May 25, 2013)

Jan1tor said:


> I kind of agreed with this article a little. However being that the article was about everyone criticizing all the gaming consoles out now I really liked at the end of the article how he himself had to get his own personal jab at Nintendo with _*(I love ya Nintendo, but you're hardware just doesn't match up in power)*_. It isn't about the power it is the playability and fun of playing. Anyway to each their own.


The NES was very underpowered compared to the Master System... Nobody cared!
The Mega Drive was fairly underpowered compared to the Snes... Nobody cared!
The Game Boy was very underpowered compared to the Atari Lynx and Game Gear... Nobody cared!
The Dreamcast was hugely underpowered compared to the PS2... Nobody cared!
The PS2 was the weakest of its generation compared to the Gamecube and Xbox... Nobody cared!
The Wii and DS are underpowered compared to PS3/360 and PSP... OMG! How dare they?

Why did people suddenly started to care after all those years?


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## Guild McCommunist (May 25, 2013)

RodrigoDavy said:


> The NES was very underpowered compared to the Master System... Nobody cared!
> The Mega Drive was fairly underpowered compared to the Snes... Nobody cared!
> The Game Boy was very underpowered compared to the Atari Lynx and Game Gear... Nobody cared!
> The Dreamcast was hugely underpowered compared to the PS2... Nobody cared!
> ...


 

You're implying people weren't metaphorically measuring cock sizes over the power of their consoles years ago.

I still see people try to be all high and mighty about the Gamecube when it was a console that did absolute shit and honestly I think the games were pretty mediocre compared to the competition.


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## slingblade1170 (May 25, 2013)

Love the Xbox One but I hate the name, just like the Wii U I think it will cause some confusion and make marketing more difficult than it has to be. It doesn't matter though eventually even non gamers will learn what the systems are and start buying.


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## Jamstruth (May 25, 2013)

Really people are that fixated on the name? -_-

I don't like the Xbox One and won't be buying as the PS4 seems to have upped its game enough that it can offer the XBL experience for free on PSN. I don't like Microsoft's Pay Walls (which I can almost guarantee will get worse, not better). Most of the new features of the Xbox One won't be available to me. All the sweet, sweet, TV I can get on my actual TV is locked to the USA for now. NFL? Yeah.. we don't have that over here. Don't care about sports in the slightest.

I buy a lot of used games and this console seems to be an attempt to kill that market. I can't borrow games from or lend games to my friends as I have done in the past. One game. One account. The mandatory installation just sounds like an annoyance too unless they have the install times way down from the 360/PS3.

I'll admit that the only way MS was going to get me to even consider buying this one was to drop the Gold requirement for online gaming. They haven't because if they dropped that they'd lose almost all their subscribers. I know MS is in the business of making money but this is just getting ridiculous now with the services that Sony is going to offer for free on the PS4.


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## Pleng (May 26, 2013)

RodrigoDavy said:


> The NES was very underpowered compared to the Master System... Nobody cared!
> The Mega Drive was fairly underpowered compared to the Snes... Nobody cared!
> The Game Boy was very underpowered compared to the Atari Lynx and Game Gear... Nobody cared!
> The Dreamcast was hugely underpowered compared to the PS2... Nobody cared!
> The PS2 was the weakest of its generation compared to the Gamecube and Xbox... Nobody cared!


 
Yes they did


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## Taleweaver (May 27, 2013)

Foxi4 said:


> Can't believe people still don't quite get where the _"One"_ in the name comes from*.
> 
> 
> 
> *All-in-One entertainment device.


It's almost as intuitive as the 'u' in wiiu*. 

And while we're at it: both are as intuitive as a toenail clipper on your car keys. Just because you can come up with a story that makes sense somehow doesn't mean it's a good idea.



*if wii means 'we' or 'us', then 'u' obviously stands for you.


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## Foxi4 (May 27, 2013)

Taleweaver said:


> wii means 'we' or 'us', then 'u' obviously stands for you.


 
_"Can *you* please buy it so that *we* don't go bankrupt?" ;O;_


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## JoostinOnline (May 27, 2013)

Foxi4 said:


> _"Can *you* please buy it so that *we* don't go bankrupt?" ;O;_


Then Micro$oft's bad presentation answered, and sales skyrocketed.  According to this article, Nintendo has now sold 8.75 Wii U's (guess one was broken).


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