# Piracy and game sales...



## OrR (Sep 30, 2006)

As a kind of follow up on http://gbatemp.net/index.php?showtopic=33230 I'd be interested to know if piracy made you buy more or less games.

I'm pretty sure that piracy has made me buy more games than I would have bought otherwise. I own 17 DS games now, with another one on the way and several more purchases already planned. I bought most of these games because I pirated them and liked them. I would never have ordered Ouendan, Phoenix Wright or Miss Spider's Sunny Patch Friends ( 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 ) without playing the Rom first. I don't like buying games without knowing if I like them or not beforehand. Ideally all games would be free and I'd pay for them if I want to. Obviously many people aren't that open about giving money voluntarily so this model probably wouldn't work that well since some people would take advantage of not having to pay for anything. So how is the ratio of good people to bad people in this community?


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## Orc (Sep 30, 2006)

Same here. I like buying obscure games so I love testing them out first to see if they're worth it.


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## legendofphil (Sep 30, 2006)

I'd say less, but mostly in a good way.
If I can test first a game to see if its any good and its not then I would buy less games.
I would rather buy less good games than more bad ones.
But for a few systems (PC, Xbox and gamecube) I have bought much less than I would have had there not been an option to play a "backup" of the game.


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## lagman (Sep 30, 2006)

I´m not sure if I buy more or less, but I buy better games and that´s important  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




Like Killer 7 I think I´m the only person who really likes it.
And the awesome, gorgeous, incredible and completely unknown Beyond Good & Evil  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 , I never knew someone else who owns it..or even played it.


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## mthrnite (Sep 30, 2006)

Buy games? What do you mean by this... "Buy.. games.."... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	



Could you restate that in the Pirate language, I think something's being lost in translation.





 j/k

If I find something used for under 25 bucks that I know I like, I buy it (Zoo Keeper, Brain Age, Super Mario.)
If it's an import (and not somehow related to Sailor Moon) I usually don't. Oendan may change that though, I've put so many hours into that thing that I feel guilty not buying it.

If I haven't played it, and it's not a 9 on GameSpot, and it's not under 15 bucks, I won't chance it.

So, I probably buy more, and I definitely buy smarter.


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## Kyoji (Sep 30, 2006)

QUOTE(laguerzinho @ Sep 30 2006 said:


> And the awesome, gorgeous, incredible and completely unknown Beyond Good & EvilÂ
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Lurk moar. 

There are a TON of people on the net who have played, and enjoyed BG&E, myself included. It's no where near completely unknown-maybe to the general public, but the general public doesn't matter in this context. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




Piracy, for me, is a way to obtain something I wouldn't spend money on anyways. Like GTA: SA for the PC...I'm glad I downloaded it instead of wasting my money. Got my kicks for an hour or two, then uninstalled it. Rarely it will make me buy a game I downloaded, but it has happened; I bought Metroid Zero Mission after I downloaded it, because I absolutely loved the game. To bits. I suppose it just comes down to what kind of person you are.


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## lagman (Sep 30, 2006)

QUOTE(Kyoji @ Sep 30 2006 said:


> QUOTE(laguerzinho @ Sep 30 2006 said:
> 
> 
> > And the awesome, gorgeous, incredible and completely unknown Beyond Good & EvilÂ
> ...



I agree, I love GTA:SA


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## OrR (Sep 30, 2006)

Beyond Good & Evil! 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I still feel guilty because I missed the chance to buy it for the full price. Got it for 10 bucks from one of them cheap game pyramid things... I wanted to pay more!


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## Sick Wario (Sep 30, 2006)

Kyoji said what I was thinking reading this topic

"Piracy, for me, is a way to obtain something I wouldn't spend money on anyways. "

I understand that developers, publishers etc etc all need their cut f media sales to survive, but if I honestly NEVER would have purchased product-x in the first place, it's not a loss of a sale in my eyes
A lot of my choices depend on DRM on the products, I won't get into that
I do try to support the brands I 'care' about, as much as you can care about a brand, so most 1st party DS games, gamecube games, soon Wii games, the very rare new release dvd I might buy. honestly I haven't paid for a new CD in mabye 5 years though now that I think about it


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## Railgun (Sep 30, 2006)

Thats the problem with the piracy...

If u can get this Game/Movie/something for free, why to buy it?
1 year ago, i downloaded everything. Now im distanced me from the scene
cause it was realy hard to spend time every day on my pc.

Now im testing every Game before i buy it^^

If i like it, i'l buy it!
If i dont like it i dont play it^^

hope ur guys understand it, cause my english sucks


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## Youkai (Sep 30, 2006)

I think i buy as much as i did before i had the chance to look into the games ... but like some others say now i buy only the good games !

there are games i know that are good i buy as fast as possible but than on the other hand why should i pay for some junk. When you say the programmers need to be payed ... ok but than they should do a good job and not just some rubbish.

The next game i buy will be Gothic 3 even if it doesn't look as good as the former versions in my opinion ... but that series was really worth its money till now, so i will give them my money in hope for more such games




QUOTE(Railgun @ Sep 30 2006 said:


> Thats the problem with the piracy...
> 
> If u can get this Game/Movie/something for free, why to buy it?
> 1 year ago, i downloaded everything. Now im distanced me from the scene
> ...



Hmm i sometimes play games i don't like only to see if they may become better ... as example ... i loved to Play the Settlers 2 (have original) now i tried that remake and i have to say i like the original more ! but somehow i want to play that as well but its not really good enough to buy ...


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## Bowser128 (Sep 30, 2006)

QUOTE(OrR @ Sep 30 2006 said:


> So how is the ratio of good people to bad people in this community?



LMAO. So we know where you stand then. What can I say, I'm a horrible person (a.k.a. I would like to support Nintendo, but the fact is if I have the opportunity to get stuff for free, my lack of moneyz means I'm going to take the free option).


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## TPi (Sep 30, 2006)

Piracy has almost no effect on game sales.


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## tshu (Sep 30, 2006)

QUOTE(TPi @ Sep 30 2006 said:


> Piracy has almost no effect on game sales.


Privacy has almost no reflect on lame snails.


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## lagman (Sep 30, 2006)

QUOTE(OrR @ Sep 30 2006 said:


> Beyond Good & Evil!
> 
> 
> 
> ...



WTH is that?

Yes, that game deserves to be buyed at full price. 
Indeed if I see it again I´ll buy it one more time


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## OrR (Sep 30, 2006)

Maybe they only exist in Germany... Lots of cheap games in CD cases for 5-10 € a pice in a pyramid shape store display thing.


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## martin88 (Sep 30, 2006)

Less for me. No game purchases were made after I bought a flashcart.

Same for other platforms, with privacy, I stopped buying PC games, GBA games, and DS games. Before I buy games regularly.

One exception is Doom 3 for PC because I want to own it.


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## lagman (Sep 30, 2006)

QUOTE(OrR @ Sep 30 2006 said:


> Maybe they only exist in Germany... Lots of cheap games in CD cases for 5-10 € a pice in a pyramid shape store display thing.



That sounds awesome, the closest thing I`ve seen on Mexico is a pack of 3 XB games -ETM,Onimusha,and other- for like US$15.


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## Jax (Sep 30, 2006)

In my country, videogames are super expensive, so I'd say I buy less games...


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## Psyfira (Sep 30, 2006)

I honestly don't know. I didn't use my GBA for a year after I got it; I didn't know which games were any good, and at 25-30 quid a cart you don't want to buy a rubbish one. I only got 2 cheap games (£10 and £15 respectively). I haven't brought a single GBA game since getting the cart either, because games are dead expensive over here. (I download, test out and then buy music CD's though, cause they're only about £8 each)

So in short, my current purchases are either the same or maybe a little bit less (cause there's a chance I wouldnt've played any at all) . 
But on the other hand, I think piracy has made my future purchases increase.

Let me explain: from having free access to the entire back catalouge I now know what kind of games I like, which ones are likely to be good and which to avoid altogether. Which means that in the future, when I upgrade to a system I don't have a cart for, I'm more likely to actually buy games for that system than let it gather dust on a shelf.


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## Hitto (Oct 1, 2006)

Years ago, when the warez scene consisted of a few bulletin boards and usenet (oh, how simple it was... Oh wait, it still is), someone threw out the question "If you were rich, would you still pirate stuff?" And a lot of people said "hell yea, why do you think we call this 0-day?"

Today, I'm gonna say the same thing I said back then, YES I WOULD, I WANNA PLAY SHIT A MONTH BEFORE IT'S RELEASED IN BRICK AND MORTAR STORES!

I don't give a *shit* about lost sales, money, and blah blah blah. Piracy is the fastest way to get stuff. Music, games, movies, you name it. Fast and simple and FREE. It will NEVER be beat. Stop trying to make a business model that will replace it. Only moronic users who can't click their way out of iTunes are stupid enough to pay for friggin' MP3's, but seriously.

The games that deserve my money, get my money except for mario games. I won't buy a Mario *anything* game because my relatives are completely videogame-clueless and they know that if they want to get me a gift, if it's got "mario" slapped on it, I'll most surely be happy. Otherwise, I don't even waste time downloading dreck I wouldn't be playing more than 10 minutes.

disclaimer : I've already seen some of MY paintings sold as posters with my signature wiped off by a very bad photoshop artist. It sucks, but the dude sold 10-15$ posters made in china. I sell luxury items worth hundreds to thousands of euros. His clientele surely wouldn't be the kind that buys my work anyway, so I don't believe the "lost sales" schtick the major companies keep spouting off.

And, since I'm pirated, it helps me rationalize the fact that I also pirate things. I do it, I suffer from it, and everyone's happy. Why worry? It's all about SHARING.


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## feriol (Oct 1, 2006)

QUOTE(Hitto @ Oct 1 2006 said:


> (stuff)


I second that. Waiting sucks, especially since lots of good titles don't -ever- see an european release.
Sometimes though, if something is really good, I still buy the original later - as long as there's a way to keep using my old savegames (I didn't buy the EU version of AC:WW b/c unfortunately it won't work with US saves for some reason).


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## adgloride (Oct 1, 2006)

I like trying games before I buy them.  No use buying a game then finding its rubbish and you go and trade it in.  So many rubbish games out lately that have a cheek to charge you full price for them.


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## Crygor64 (Oct 1, 2006)

Whether you like it or not, piracy kills small developers.  A company like EA might not feel the pain, but an indie developer certainly will.

And although were not supposed to mention industry affiliation, I know quite a few grunts who were working on PSP titles, only to have them canned because of this very problem.

If you follow sales charts, there hasn't been a single PSP game in the top 25 NPD* sales for the past 8 months.  No one buys PSP games.  Now why is that?  Its not like the software is lacking.


(The NPD group tracks console sales in the US, the world's largest video game market.)


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## OrR (Oct 1, 2006)

That's one point I never understood. How does piracy hurt small developers worse than big ones? Please explain!
And the reason that noone buys PSP games is definitely related to the software lacking. Everyone I know with a PSP simply doesn't use it. Not even to pirate games.


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## Crygor64 (Oct 1, 2006)

QUOTE(OrR @ Oct 1 2006 said:


> That's one point I never understood. How does piracy hurt small developers worse than big ones? Please explain!



If you can't figure it out... 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





Gee, maybe its because big developers make more money?  You think?


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## adgloride (Oct 1, 2006)

QUOTE(Crygor64 @ Oct 1 2006 said:


> Whether you like it or not, piracy kills small developers.Â A company like EA might not feel the pain, but an indie developer certainly will.
> 
> And although were not supposed to mention industry affiliation, I know quite a few grunts who were working on PSP titles, only to have them canned because of this very problem.
> 
> ...



Piracy may have something to do with people not buying psp games.  But being overpriced, UMD being slow and also the games are rereleased watered down versions of the ps2 version.  This is why the PSP is failing.


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## Crygor64 (Oct 1, 2006)

QUOTE(adgloride @ Oct 1 2006 said:


> QUOTE(Crygor64 @ Oct 1 2006 said:
> 
> 
> > Whether you like it or not, piracy kills small developers.  A company like EA might not feel the pain, but an indie developer certainly will.
> ...




Obviously all the factors you mentioned have an impact on the situation.  But in reality, with all the PSP systems that have been sold, the games should be doing a lot better than they are.

Here's something from this months Electronic Gaming Monthly:

I can't link to this one because its in the latest EGM, number 208. The issue with Guitar Hero 2 on the cover. 

_EGM:"Portable Problems: With all the hubbub over Nintendo's DS Lite, its sometimes hard to remember Sony also has a slick portable system. Thankfully games like KillZone: Liberation and GTA:VCS should keep portable pundits chipper." 

"But while these two games look hot, the PSP's future is NOT - I hear several big-time 3rd party publishers are giving up on the PSP." _

They are giving up on PSP projects because its damn near impossible to make a profit on a PSP game.  Dev costs are extremely high, so unless your game is a blockbuster, you are left with meager rewards.


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## OrR (Oct 2, 2006)

QUOTE(Crygor64 @ Oct 1 2006 said:


> QUOTE(OrR @ Oct 1 2006 said:
> 
> 
> > That's one point I never understood. How does piracy hurt small developers worse than big ones? Please explain!
> ...


Yeah but where the hell is the logic in that? Piracy also takes more money away from big developers.


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## Bitbyte (Oct 2, 2006)

Because large companies can easily recover, piracy doesn't hurt them as much because, for example, 1 million people pirate, and they download the game, in the end it's only 1 million out of 20 million. For smaller companies though, their game won't be as successive and might only sell 2 million copies. Now, if 1 million people were to pirate that game.. You see where I'm getting at?


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## lagman (Oct 2, 2006)

QUOTE(Hitto @ Oct 1 2006 said:


> ----
> 
> disclaimer : I've already seen some of MY paintings sold as posters with my signature wiped off by a very bad photoshop artist. It sucks, but the dude sold 10-15$ posters made in china. I sell luxury items worth hundreds to thousands of euros. His clientele surely wouldn't be the kind that buys my work anyway, so I don't believe the "lost sales" schtick the major companies keep spouting off.
> 
> And, since I'm pirated, it helps me rationalize the fact that I also pirate things. I do it, I suffer from it, and everyone's happy. Why worry? It's all about SHARING.



Well, I think that piracy and sharing are two completely different things, that chinese guy is not sharing your work, he´s stealing it.
You could sale official and cheap copies of your work for the same price he does, so people wo can´t or don´t want to pay the full price can support the artist, and no some MF who doesn´t did a shizzle. 
I think it´s the same for games, music, movies and everything.


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## skywarp (Oct 2, 2006)

QUOTE(TPi @ Sep 30 2006 said:


> Piracy has almost no effect on game sales.



In the US/Japan that may be true, but in China and it's neighboring countries, and many parts of europe, game piracy is HUGE. And I think it is starting to have aleast a marginal impact on US game sales, PS2/Xbox modding was pretty big. I know and have met countless people who purchased virtually no games, while pirating everything. I think things like soft-mods, and very simple mechanical mods(flip-top ps2 mods, swap discs, and such), have really flared console piracy. 

It's probably not at all noticable with Nintendo systems yet, since the handhelds have a pretty young audience, and the Gamecube was just a pain in the ass to mod. PSP software software sales thou are really weak, compared to the number of PSPs sold. You can't tell me that has nothing to do with piracy.

Like some people have said in here, I'll buy games that I actually want to support, espicially obscure games like Killer7, Katamari, etc, but I'll admit I do pirate most things on GBA/DS/PS2.


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## adgloride (Oct 2, 2006)

QUOTE(skywarp @ Oct 2 2006 said:


> QUOTE(TPi @ Sep 30 2006 said:
> 
> 
> > Piracy has almost no effect on game sales.
> ...



I can remember years ago in the days of the spectrum.  All the games were on tape so were really easy to copy onto blank tape.  For every game bought 10 were meant to be copied, they still made loads of spectrum games.  If piracy didn't effect something like the spectrum I can't see how it can effect ps2 or xbox.  A lot of n00bs would have no idea how to softmod and xbox or fit a flip top on the ps2.  The xbox though is laugable how easy it is to softmod it and play backups.


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## lagman (Oct 2, 2006)

But I don´t think that most Spectrum games cost dozens of millions of dollars to make.


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## Hitto (Oct 2, 2006)

QUOTE(laguerzinho @ Oct 2 2006 said:


> QUOTE(Hitto @ Oct 1 2006 said:
> 
> 
> > ----
> ...



I could, but it's too much work for such shitty profit margins. Let him toil for his 15$ posters. I mean, he lives in communist china for all I know, that's punishment enough. Also... Me? Pirated? Free publicity, you mean. If only he left the signature, though...

On topic, sony shouldn't be crying about their precious PSP games being pirated. When the PS1 was released, most of us bought one because it was a nice complimentary console for when we'd be bored with mario kart 64, and the games were basically ALL FREE. I can honestly say I've never, ever bought a PS1 game. And most of the people I knew did the same. Yet the PS1 still was on top. I say easy piracy was a major selling point, and sony thought they could pull it off again with the PSP, this time only worse! HAY GUYS, BUY A SONY PRODUCT SO YOU CAN PIRATE NINTENDO GAMES!

Well, it didn't work, next time sony will actually release a handheld focused on gaming and cartridges instead of ass and poo.


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## HugeCock (Oct 2, 2006)

I like money ....therefore my answer is less. However I usually bought USED games...which if I remember right means nothing to the gaming industry. Second note, never would have bought a ps2 if I couldn't pirate games for it, same goes for Xbox and the 360....I usually buy a system for A SINGLE game...gamecube for Resident Evil for instance. I never would have bought Mario Sunshine, games like TMNT, Simpsons Hit N run....but since my shits modded I'll give it a whirl....but in reality I never would have boughten those games. However now that everything in my house is modded....RE5 and Zelda will be downloaded not boughten....therefore sales will definatly be hurt cause that's 100 of my dollars they won't get anymore. Good thing they raped me on consoles. On my 3rd 360, 3 Phat DSes, 2 DS lites, 7 GBA Sps, 3 GameCubes, 5 Ps2's, 1 Xbox...Nintendo products I mainly doubled up on for different colours...everyone else was cause their shit breaks on me left and right.


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## Hypnotoad (Oct 2, 2006)

QUOTE(adgloride @ Oct 1 2006 said:


> ...and also the games are rereleased watered down versions of the ps2 version.Â This is why the PSP is failing.



Exactly.  I have a psp and the only thing I really play on it is old snes/sega games,  pretty sad. 
Most of sonys new releases just don't interet me.


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## outphase (Oct 2, 2006)

arrr matey. I bought few games before, I buy few games now. I got a PSP for free via freepsps.com (damn pyramid schemes). I didn't buy a game for it, nor do I really have games to pirate... it just sits there lonely.


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## OrR (Oct 2, 2006)

QUOTE(Bitbyte @ Oct 2 2006 said:


> Because large companies can easily recover, piracy doesn't hurt them as much because, for example, 1 million people pirate, and they download the game, in the end it's only 1 million out of 20 million. For smaller companies though, their game won't be as successive and might only sell 2 million copies. Now, if 1 million people were to pirate that game.. You see where I'm getting at?


No, I don't. Why would the pirate/buy ration be automatically worse for the smaller company? Why wouldn't it be worse for the bigger company? I wouldn't have as much of a moral problem with pirating a Mario game that sells a million anyway than with a game from Introversion who need all the money they can get.


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## Bitbyte (Oct 2, 2006)

"That's one point I never understood. How does piracy hurt small developers worse than big ones? Please explain!"

I already explained. Look, small devs, when they make a game, it's their first "big" project, so when it fails, the company might go bankrupt, but with a bigger, established company like Square-Enix, it doesn't hurt them at all, they already got an income large enough. So if 1 million people pirate the Squenix games, it's a 10% loss of income (kinda extreme, just taking these situations as an example), but if the same pirates, the same 1 million people, also pirate the game made by a smaller, independent developer, that's a loss of about 50% and they might just not make another game. It's has nothing to do with morals, they just don't have the money to come back. You should also know that each year, just 5-10 games actually make enough profit..


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## Hitto (Oct 2, 2006)

trust me, if an indie developper manages to get a millions downloads on their first game, they will NOT be bankrupt.


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## OrR (Oct 2, 2006)

QUOTE(Bitbyte @ Oct 2 2006 said:


> "That's one point I never understood. How does piracy hurt small developers worse than big ones? Please explain!"
> 
> I already explained. Look, small devs, when they make a game, it's their first "big" project, so when it fails, the company might go bankrupt, but with a bigger, established company like Square-Enix, it doesn't hurt them at all, they already got an income large enough. So if 1 million people pirate the Squenix games, it's a 10% loss of income (kinda extreme, just taking these situations as an example), but if the same pirates, the same 1 million people, also pirate the game made by a smaller, independent developer, that's a loss of about 50% and they might just not make another game. It's has nothing to do with morals, they just don't have the money to come back. You should also know that each year, just 5-10 games actually make enough profit..


Dude, your logic is fucked up. If we suppose there are 1 million pirates. Those 1 million people would maybe all download the newest blockbuster. But why should they all download the unknown game by some unknown developer? And even if they do, why do you suddenly suppose that they would have bought it if they hadn't had the chance to download it? That doesn't make any sense.


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## adgloride (Oct 2, 2006)

QUOTE(laguerzinho @ Oct 2 2006 said:


> But I don´t think that most Spectrum games cost dozens of millions of dollars to make.



Don't forget when the spectrum was out gaming was only in its infancy.  I know the spectrum did quite well in the UK, I'm not sure about the rest of the world.  New games are 4 times more or even 5 times more (If you buy them retail) than the spectrum game.  Consoles are also released world wide which increases the games sales.  It is quite funny thinking how much a spectrum game actually cost to make, considering how much they may cost these days.  The cost of games is why theirs so little originality because it costs too much to make a game that won't sell.


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## Cyan (Oct 2, 2006)

In Europe and maybe many countries if there weren't the ability to modchip a console then we could never played some games.
Many games never reached Europe, and some not even USA (xenosaga, valkyrie, seiken 3, FF6, etc..)

I started with my Snes and since then, as it was at first to play imports that would never be sold in my country, it's now common for me to use any kind of pirating hardware and software.

Back on Snes, the games were very expansive and I had to wait almost 2 years for purchasing new games.
All was about money. Now I'm working (took my time away) and I have money to buy them, but I'm still not doing so.
Now I have the money, but I don't have the time to play all the good games I can have, what a shame 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




Piracy is for me a way to test games I would have never bought.


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## Psyfira (Oct 2, 2006)

QUOTE(Bitbyte @ Oct 2 2006 said:


> Dude, your logic is fucked up. If we suppose there are 1 million pirates. Those 1 million people would maybe all download the newest blockbuster. But why should they all download the unknown game by some unknown developer? And even if they do, why do you suddenly suppose that they would have bought it if they hadn't had the chance to download it? That doesn't make any sense.


Ah I finally understand your point. You're saying that games produced by smaller games companies wouldn't have the hype to get enough people interested in buying them in the first place to make downloading them have a significant impact on sales.

Lets try an example: Alien Hominid on GBA. Small developer, took forever for the game to actually come out, even then it only got released in the UK (and Europe?). Had lots of hype from the online communities, but at the end of the day how many of the already small group of people interested in the game actually brought it rather than downloading? The game's worth the money; it was cheap at £20 brand new and it's got enough replay value to make it not a wasted purchase. Not to mention that the graphics look f'king sweet. Thing is, the people interested wouldn't have complained about buying it without testing it first, they already knew what they were letting themselves in for. But because the ability to download the rom as a trial was there people did.  The game's so short that "try before you buy" downloads rapidly turned into "try and complete before you buy". 

So because of downloads the developers lost a huge percentage of their prospective sales to piracy. I'm not saying it's loads of money but to these companies a little bit can make a huge difference between paying off their development costs and, more importantly, the company's motivation to continue making games for that system.


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## omegatr0n (Oct 2, 2006)

i by games that i really want to be able to say...I own that game...Katamari, GTA, FFIX (yes nine), Burnout Revenge...but as for NDS...sorry im a pirate...I own asphalt urban GT for sleep mode... tetris...got it before my supercard...and i have access to an actuall card for mario kart


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## Mike83 (Oct 2, 2006)

I would say that Piracy has made me buy a wider variaty of games, maybe not increasting or decreasing the actual number, but I buy alot of differnt games now I have the chance to try them first.

I also have Piracy to thank for me playing the Pro Evo games, which I am happy to buy as I know I'll be playing them most days for the next year.


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## lagman (Oct 2, 2006)

QUOTE(adgloride @ Oct 2 2006 said:


> QUOTE(laguerzinho @ Oct 2 2006 said:
> 
> 
> > But I don´t think that most Spectrum games cost dozens of millions of dollars to make.
> ...



I could not agree more, without 3 megamans everymonth, Okami,VJ or K7 simply won´t exist.


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## Crygor64 (Oct 2, 2006)

People can defend piracy all they want but the results of this poll are pretty damning. The vast majority of users buys fewer games because of piracy.  There's no way to spin that fact.


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## OrR (Oct 2, 2006)

Vast majority? It's only half of them. That's not a vast majority.


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## Crygor64 (Oct 2, 2006)

QUOTE(OrR @ Oct 2 2006 said:


> Vast majority? It's only half of them. That's not a vast majority.



Yawn.  Your comments bore me.

Which option has the most votes?

That pretty much proves my point even if it not the "vast majority."

Again, you bore me.


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## Hitto (Oct 2, 2006)

Sure thing, but let me ask the 1000 dollar question : so fucking what?
You think it's a "problem" that should be "taken care of"? It's a fact, and there's nothing anyone can do about it. What's next, are we going to protest against rain because it "undeniably" makes you wet when you're standing in it?

There's no *need* to spin that fact. Piracy and plagiarism and whatnot have always been around. Always will be around.

EDIT : don't be so aggressive, crygor, we're not on a fucking playground.


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## Crygor64 (Oct 2, 2006)

QUOTE(Hitto @ Oct 2 2006 said:


> Blah, blah, blah.....
> 
> There's no *need* to spin that fact. Piracy and plagiarism and whatnot have always been around. Always will be around.
> 
> EDIT : don't be so aggressive, crygor, we're not on a fucking playground.



First, look whose talking.  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Why don't you watch your mouth junior?

Second, do you even know the difference between piracy and plagiarism?  Maybe you should choose your words more carefully next time?


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## Mike83 (Oct 2, 2006)

QUOTE(Crygor64 @ Oct 2 2006 said:


> QUOTE(OrR @ Oct 2 2006 said:
> 
> 
> > Vast majority? It's only half of them. That's not a vast majority.
> ...



"Vast Majority" would be around the 80% mark, as it stands, its less than half.


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## Crygor64 (Oct 2, 2006)

QUOTE(Mike83 @ Oct 2 2006 said:


> QUOTE(Crygor64 @ Oct 2 2006 said:
> 
> 
> > QUOTE(OrR @ Oct 2 2006 said:
> ...




Again, yawn.  You quoted my post but you missed this part.


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## Hitto (Oct 2, 2006)

The usual forum troll's response : "LALALA I CAN'T HEAR YOU, I'M IMPERVIOUS TO LOGIC"

Just go back to gamefaqs, man.


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## Crygor64 (Oct 2, 2006)

QUOTE(Hitto @ Oct 2 2006 said:


> The usual forum troll's response : "LALALA I CAN'T HEAR YOU, I'M IMPERVIOUS TO LOGIC"
> 
> Just go back to gamefaqs, man.




Insults?  That's very mature.  Now how exactly am I trolling?  Why don't you explain that to us all?

If you can find the right words.

My point is simple.  Piracy does hurt game sales and the results of this poll proves my point.

Now am I against piracy?  Hell no.  You are looking at a guy who built a PC just to play EMUS on his living room TV.  I just understand the truth.  Piracy does hurt game sales whether we want to admit it or not.  That's why I try to live with balance and buy the best games.  I don't buy them all, but I'll give those special games my money. That's the best we can hope for in a situation like this.

Now, you were saying?


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## assassinz (Oct 2, 2006)

I buy more games because I can play them first and then decide which ones are actually worth my hard-earned cash. Without piracy I'd buy less because I wouldn't know which games suck and wouldn't want to risk wasting my money. I wouldn't have bought Drill Dozer if I had never played it. 

Piracy hurts "some" game sales only because it actually informs the customer if a game is good or bad and then the game companies can't sell that many of their 'crappy' releases to 'blind' customers. Good games become known by word of mouth and become popular and will sell well regardless of piracy, in my opinion.


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## Hitto (Oct 2, 2006)

QUOTE(Crygor64 @ Oct 2 2006 said:


> QUOTE(Hitto @ Oct 2 2006 said:
> 
> 
> > The usual forum troll's response : "LALALA I CAN'T HEAR YOU, I'M IMPERVIOUS TO LOGIC"
> ...



Ah, sometimes, I just can't resist taking the bait. You're on, troll.

I was saying "great way to base your whole shtick on a less-than-150-results poll". Now, stop telling people "you bore me" when they present you with inconvenient facts and stop trying to justify some internet forum poll proves anything.

Piracy hurts game sales as much as noy buying something you're not interested in hurts its sales. Even though I'm not even going to pirate barbie horse adventures, for example.

Anyway, judging from your other posts in various threads, I think I can safely assume you're a troll. Hell, even in your profile you managed to slip some sony bashing, thinking you'd "fit in" this handheld-thus-90%-nintendo community. Oh yeah, love that "japanese will line up for anything" comment in the pokémon thread. Borderline derogatory and racist, like a fine club a troll would wield.

So anyway, I was saying you're behaving quite rudely in this community, and it will not do. I'm not a mod or anything, but you're pissing people off with your lousy attitude. Lose it or go back to gamefaqs.


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## Crygor64 (Oct 2, 2006)

QUOTE(Hitto @ Oct 2 2006 said:


> QUOTE(Crygor64 @ Oct 2 2006 said:
> 
> 
> > QUOTE(Hitto @ Oct 2 2006 said:
> ...




That first line is hillarious. It doesn't even make sense.  I can see Enlgish is not your first language.

The second line, well I'm an Asian American moron.






My comment about the Japanese was meant as a statement of fact.

Damn you lose again.


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## Ragone (Oct 2, 2006)

Piracy is a way to test shitty games I would otherwise not buy...like "open season" and games companies thought were a good idea but in reality nobody will buy.


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## TripleA (Oct 2, 2006)

dont even bother with Crygor64

he had in his sig here on gbatemp that dcforums.co.uk gave him a virus..Im a mod there i sent him a pm asking about it and telling him that the forums couldnt give him a virus....Instead of a civilized reply from him i was called a jackass and was told to go fuck myself...

Seems to me just another lonely person on the net looking for a little Attetion cause in the real world they cant get any

:'(  :'( 





Back on topic 


Privacy drives hardware sells

kind of hard to play backup 360 games with out a xbox 360.....

i buy games only if i like them  etc like renting from blockbuster privacy just another way to try before you buy..
Does it hurt software sells  yes
are you gonna do something about it i think not


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## Crygor64 (Oct 2, 2006)

QUOTE(TripleA @ Oct 2 2006 said:


> dont even bother with Crygor64
> 
> he had in his that dcforums.co.uk gave him a virus..Im a mod there i sent him a pm asking him that the forums couldnt give him a virus....Instead of a civilized reply from him i was called a jackass and was told to go fuck myself...




Actually I told you that the virus came from one of your torrents, not from the forums.  Obviously you can't get a virus from a forum.  Edit: Its nothing personal TripleA.  Check your inbox.

Oh and piracy drives hardwares sales?

Really, then explain why the PSP is such a failure?

What about the Dreamcast?  Piracy on the the DC was so simple it wasn't even funny.  Playing back ups on that machine was a breeze.  (Just don't get them from DCF, otherwise you'll get a virus.)


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## Hitto (Oct 2, 2006)

QUOTE(TripleA @ Oct 2 2006 said:


> dont even bother with Crygor64
> 
> he had in his sig here on gbatemp that dcforums.co.uk gave him a virus..Im a mod there i sent him a pm asking about it and telling him that the forums couldnt give him a virus....Instead of a civilized reply from him i was called a jackass and was told to go fuck myself...
> 
> ...




Heh. Point taken, but I knew he was flamebaiting just to get some attention. Just wanted to point out how far and low an internet tough guy will go.
Remember yesterday, when he asked a mod to lock a topic he started because people thought the link he provided was shit?

Thanks for proving our points, cry. I'll keep calling you like this. If I ever care to indulJe in discussion with you.

PS : I'm leaving that typo in plain sight. arguing grammar on the internet makes you look really smart !!!!! do it again!!!


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## Crygor64 (Oct 2, 2006)

Actually I had the post locked because of the inflamatory anti-piracy rant found in the posted article.  I hadn't realized it would cause so much trouble.  Honestly, I had just skimmed over that part. And Hitto, you can call me out any time you wish.  I'm always up for a debate.  

Anyway, I have heard Sega employees state that piracy was a major contributing factor in the death of the Dreamcast.  Some of them feel the system was doomed the second it got cracked.

Its a sad fact considering how much I loved Sega.  And yet at the same time, I owned a bunch of DC back ups. (Hundreds)  So in a way, I helped kill one of my favorite systems and the company that created it.

Lets face it, Sega has never been the same since the DC failed.

I suspect the same thing is happening with the PSP.  Now you can say the software library is lacking.  (That's a point of view thing really.) But with all the PSP systems that have been sold, PSP games should be doing a lot better than they are.  As I said before, there hasn't been a single PSP game in the top 25 NPD sales for the past 8 months.


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