# Xbox One backwards compatibility list only contains 21 games so far



## endoverend (Jun 22, 2015)

I'm almost beginning to see MS's announcement at E3 as a quick and dirty trick to push units. This is ridiculous.


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## codezer0 (Jun 22, 2015)

I just don't understand why it isn't just simply 100%.

We know that they legally couldn't get BC to work on the 360 for original xbox games because they didn't own the IP to the underlying hardware anymore. But Microsoft does not have that excuse. If anything, because of the hardware now, I would think original xbox games should work even better on the Xbox One.


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## Nathan Drake (Jun 22, 2015)

To be fair, isn't BC not officially launching until September? Even then, this is a risky proposition no matter what, since it is reliant on devs agreeing to this. If devs just don't want their games available for whatever reason, that's that, nothing else Microsoft can do.


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## Reploid (Jun 22, 2015)

codezer0 said:


> I just don't understand why it isn't just simply 100%.
> 
> We know that they legally couldn't get BC to work on the 360 for original xbox games because they didn't own the IP to the underlying hardware anymore. But Microsoft does not have that excuse. If anything, because of the hardware now, I would think original xbox games should work even better on the Xbox One.


Because they need to sell HD remasters.


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## codezer0 (Jun 22, 2015)

Reploid said:


> Because they need to sell HD remasters.


After what that did to the ps3, I would rather stab the first fool that dares try to block their games from being BC in favor of this.


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## Costello (Jun 22, 2015)

Nathan Drake said:


> To be fair, isn't BC not officially launching until September? Even then, this is a risky proposition no matter what, since it is reliant on devs agreeing to this. If devs just don't want their games available for whatever reason, that's that, nothing else Microsoft can do.


It always has to start somewhere. But they should have maybe come up with a more impressive list of games from the start. It just makes them look bad right now. I guess we'll see how the list grows in the coming months...


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## Clydefrosch (Jun 22, 2015)

codezer0 said:


> I just don't understand why it isn't just simply 100%.
> 
> We know that they legally couldn't get BC to work on the 360 for original xbox games because they didn't own the IP to the underlying hardware anymore. But Microsoft does not have that excuse. If anything, because of the hardware now, I would think original xbox games should work even better on the Xbox One.



from what i gathered, it isnt 100% because they cant just emulate the 360 and the hardware does not natively support 360 code. the xbox just doesnt play the 360 disks, it has to load a somewhat changed version of that game online. to make a game run, they have to adapt the games coding somehow. they cant really just go ahead and mess with games coding and 'release' that to the users without consent from the producer/publishers of these games, because muh copyrights and stuff like that.
so this list is basically only going to grow by first party and explicit third party consent. companies who dont even exist anymore probably can't give any oks, and you have to wonder if third party honestly wants to make their games available for 'free' like that, when they could, potentially, rerelease their games somehow, maybe by adapting the coding themselves. red dead rerelease would probably still sell sufficiently for 20-40 bucks

so yeah, of course this whole bc business was meant to push units and in a years time, everyone will be unhappy with how little bc we'll get


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## WiiUBricker (Jun 22, 2015)

How does the BC implementation actually work? Via an emulator I assume? But wouldn't that be in contradiction to the statement given that 360 games will run natively on the Xbox One? What does native mean here exactly?


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## Adeka (Jun 22, 2015)

That game list is REALLY random


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## RustInPeace (Jun 22, 2015)

I'd still buy a 360, BC for the original Xbox and I don't think the new BC feature for One will be cause to not buy 360.


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## loco365 (Jun 22, 2015)

That list really, really, really sucks. There's not a lot of the hit titles on there.


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## chavosaur (Jun 22, 2015)

For the record, this is kind of inaccurate. This backwards compatibility isn't even available to the public yet. This list is for the xbox preview members in order to beta test the service in general before release.

The service is not set to fully release until the holiday season, and when it launches, is going to support over a few hundred titles.

The list probably wont even grow for the next couple months, except to continue the beta test. The service itself (im actually a part of the preview program) works well, but definitely has its kinks. The way it works, is it sort of emulates 360 hardware, all the way down to the original dashboard experience.

The download format works fine, its actually the disc method that has been strange. In testing Mass Effect, the game would run incredibly smooth for a good session of play, but if you happened to try any xbox one confirmed methods like streaming or screenshotting, the whole game would crash or freeze and crash the entire xbox.

Things still need to be ironed out, so I assume function will be prioritized over the games list for beta testing. That being said, they have promised a full scale of titles available in the future.

EDIT: The Banjo Kazooie game in my sig was played on Xbone, flawlessly I might add


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## Taleweaver (Jun 22, 2015)

LOL! 

So basically, of the...what...1139 games on the system, this is what they call backwards compatibility? That's 1.8% of the total games.

Why the hell are they even making a poll at this point? That's just pissing off the very people who got excited for the feature in the first place.


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## Costello (Jun 22, 2015)

chavosaur said:


> For the record, this is kind of inaccurate. This backwards compatibility isn't even available to the public yet. This list is for the xbox preview members in order to beta test the service in general before release.
> 
> The service is not set to fully release until the holiday season, and when it launches, is going to support over a few hundred titles.
> 
> ...


you said that this is "inaccurate" but you didn't contradict anything I said in my post.
all I stated is that Microsoft released a list of games that are supported by the backward compatibility system, that's hard facts right here (unless you question the origin of the xbox.com pdf list)
everyone knows the BC program isn't open to the public yet. It's in "Preview" right now.


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## chavosaur (Jun 22, 2015)

Costello said:


> you said that this is "inaccurate" but you didn't contradict anything I said in my post.
> all I stated is that Microsoft released a list of games that are supported by the backward compatibility system, that's hard facts right here (unless you question the origin of the xbox.com pdf list)
> everyone knows the BC program isn't open to the public yet. It's in "Preview" right now.


Well that's what I meant by inaccurate. The title doesn't state that its a preview release, it makes it seem as though the service is available to everyone and this is all they pushed out for EVERYONE.

Not everyone actually knows this is a beta system, your post didn't even mention it. There are plenty of people that think they can turn the system on and try it out right now, but to their dismay, cant (unless you use the preview trick, allowing you to play the games by following people in the program, then downloading the game by viewing their previously played game, if you own the game.)

Probably should have worded that differently but, yknow. 2am and stuff.


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## InsaneNutter (Jun 22, 2015)

If you own a PAL disc copy of various games listed they simply do not work (PDZ and Kameo for example) only the NTSC versions are compatible at this time.

You need to remember this is not officially released and only available to people in the preview program to test, games I can get to load work great however at 100% speed with no glitches i've seen so far.


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## TecXero (Jun 22, 2015)

Understandable. I'd imagine with a system as weak as the Xbox One, it would be hard emulating the 360 on there. I don't really care, as the 360 and Xbox One don't interest me. It's just interesting to see them push something like this this late. Though it's a consumer friendly feature, so I don't see a problem with it.


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## grossaffe (Jun 22, 2015)

WiiUBricker said:


> How does the BC implementation actually work? Via an emulator I assume? But wouldn't that be in contradiction to the statement given that 360 games will run natively on the Xbox One? What does native mean here exactly?


I have trouble believing  the Xbone can run a 360 emulator  My best guess would be the games have to be statically recompiled for the Xbone with a wrapper that translates 360 system calls into Xbone system calls.  It won't play games from disc, so I assume it will download the recompiled binary to your HDD and just use the disc as verification.


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## dontay0100 (Jun 22, 2015)

AYE someone try a backup of an 360 game!! Even though I already know it doesn't work lol


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## Chary (Jun 22, 2015)

For those complaining that there are not enough games available;
1. This isn't a full feature for most owners yet
2. Microsoft have promised over 100 titles working by "Holiday 2015"
3. It's not like they can just magically get all 1000+ games magically working, they have to code the thing to work correctly
4. Licensing issues. Have you noticed that the games available now are indies or first party? Microsoft needs permission to have BC with a lot of the games.


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## Costello (Jun 22, 2015)

chavosaur said:


> Well that's what I meant by inaccurate. The title doesn't state that its a preview release, it makes it seem as though the service is available to everyone and this is all they pushed out for EVERYONE.
> 
> Not everyone actually knows this is a beta system, your post didn't even mention it. There are plenty of people that think they can turn the system on and try it out right now, but to their dismay, cant (unless you use the preview trick, allowing you to play the games by following people in the program, then downloading the game by viewing their previously played game, if you own the game.)
> 
> Probably should have worded that differently but, yknow. 2am and stuff.


I will take your word for it and amend my post to make sure people realize we're in the Preview period


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## Nathan Drake (Jun 22, 2015)

Looking at the current list of 21, I have to wonder if the next 80+ are going to offer drastically different choices. You can vote on a survey all you like, but if anybody along the line says "nah, I don't want to do this", that's it. For any reason, if any developer/publisher/whatever authority decides that a title should not be on the One's backwards compatibility, it will never happen. Not to mention you know some things aren't coming. No way are they bringing Halo when the MCC is available. No way are they bringing Gears of War when they clearly seem to be looking to follow a different route with the content. Borderlands 2 + The Pre-Sequel aren't coming. Dishonored isn't coming. GTA V isn't coming.

In the long run, I just don't know how worthwhile the backwards compatibility will be. It will never really be a system seller due to the way it works for gaining content, but at least One owners should be relatively happy if they still have a decent sized 360 collection that isn't available up ported or remastered in some way already.


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## CathyRina (Jun 22, 2015)

You know they kinda ruined my excitement with BC after announcing rare replay.
Most 360 exclusives are already available in Xbone collections.


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## mightymuffy (Jun 22, 2015)

Chary said:


> For those complaining that there are not enough games available;
> 1. This isn't a full feature for most owners yet
> 2. Microsoft have promised over 100 titles working by "Holiday 2015"
> 3. It's not like they can just magically get all 1000+ games magically working, they have to code the thing to work correctly
> 4. Licensing issues. Have you noticed that the games available now are indies or first party? Microsoft needs permission to have BC with a lot of the games.


All of this. If it were 21 games on proper launch then fair enough, but over 100 is the number currently talked about. May I also add to the licensing issues that as it's a new system licensing has to be sorted out with various in game items, the most obvious being licensed music - take a look at the PS1 classics Wipeout series as an example, music tracks had to be removed as the license had expired. Can we also give them a bit of lee-way here anyway - any programmer has to be impressed with what they've achieved here: translating the 360s tri-core, 3.2Ghz ppc based CPU onto a low powered, 6 core 1.75Ghz x86?? Come on guys, it's a 5 loaves & 2 fish kinda thing here! 
And it's free! I mean, slag em off all you like if they're trying a PS Now with them.... Let's hope Sony follow suit and at the very least allow all our owned digital content to be played on PS Now for free...


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## Nathan Drake (Jun 22, 2015)

mightymuffy said:


> All of this. If it were 21 games on proper launch then fair enough, but over 100 is the number currently talked about. May I also add to the licensing issues that as it's a new system licensing has to be sorted out with various in game items, the most obvious being licensed music - take a look at the PS1 classics Wipeout series as an example, music tracks had to be removed as the license had expired. Can we also give them a bit of lee-way here anyway - any programmer has to be impressed with what they've achieved here: translating the 360s tri-core, 3.2Ghz ppc based CPU onto a low powered, 6 core 1.75Ghz x86?? Come on guys, it's a 5 loaves & 2 fish kinda thing here!
> And it's free! I mean, slag em off all you like if they're trying a PS Now with them.... Let's hope Sony follow suit and at the very least allow all our owned digital content to be played on PS Now for free...


That would be a ridiculous financial hit for Sony in so many ways, the most if it being in server space. Do you know how many servers they must have running for PS Now and how insanely expensive it must have been not only to set up, but to keep working and up to date? Do you know how much money they would lose if the service became bogged down by a bunch of people using it for free and how many people actually paying for releases would end up deciding against using the service due to performance drops?

Appealing to the handful of people who have decided they need PS3 games working on PS4 over a multi-system service that is apparently working great as it is now would be a PS Now ending move. After all the money Sony has poured into making PS Now a thing, you can guarantee it will never be a part of PS+, official backwards compatibility efforts, or anything of the sort.

As well, on the hardware level, the PS4 legitimately can't do PS3 backwards compatibility. The PS3 was such a unique beast, a PS3 would basically need to be inside of the PS4 in order for that to happen. The PS4 is also far from strong enough to emulate PS3 games, so don't expect that either. Backwards compatibility is just not coming to the PS4 ever.


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## TecXero (Jun 22, 2015)

grossaffe said:


> I have trouble believing  the Xbone can run a 360 emulator  My best guess would be the games have to be statically recompiled for the Xbone with a wrapper that translates 360 system calls into Xbone system calls.  It won't play games from disc, so I assume it will download the recompiled binary to your HDD and just use the disc as verification.


I could believe it to some degree. They have access to resources that independent homebrew coders don't, for the most part. I'm not saying Xbone is powerful (it's just a crappy midrange PC to me), just that we've seen companies put out some impressive emulators (though generally not feature rich) on hardware that seemed like they couldn't run on. Like the N64 LoZ games on the gamecube (though they were still buggy). They might not do it via emulation, I'm just saying I don't think it would be much of a stretch, given how long they've probably worked on it and how much money they could throw into it. Fairly impressive either way, considering how weak the system is.


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## shaunj66 (Jun 22, 2015)

I think this was a great move by Microsoft but calling it "backwards compatibility" is a bit of a stretch really, when you can't even run the game from the disc and are forced to download (a seemingly modified) version of the game.


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## cowboy619 (Jun 22, 2015)

I created a video of me playing Xbox 360 games on Xbox One


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## mightymuffy (Jun 22, 2015)

Nathan Drake said:


> That would be a ridiculous financial hit for Sony in so many ways, the most if it being in server space. Do you know how many servers they must have running for PS Now and how insanely expensive it must have been not only to set up, but to keep working and up to date? Do you know how much money they would lose if the service became bogged down by a bunch of people using it for free and how many people actually paying for releases would end up deciding against using the service due to performance drops?
> 
> Appealing to the handful of people who have decided they need PS3 games working on PS4 over a multi-system service that is apparently working great as it is now would be a PS Now ending move. After all the money Sony has poured into making PS Now a thing, you can guarantee it will never be a part of PS+, official backwards compatibility efforts, or anything of the sort.
> 
> As well, on the hardware level, the PS4 legitimately can't do PS3 backwards compatibility. The PS3 was such a unique beast, a PS3 would basically need to be inside of the PS4 in order for that to happen. The PS4 is also far from strong enough to emulate PS3 games, so don't expect that either. Backwards compatibility is just not coming to the PS4 ever.


Hmmm... I don't see any part of my post asking for BC to the PS4....? 
But elsewhere in your post you're saying my request for free games in PS Now is a daft move.... coz I'm sure PS Now is literally RAKING in the money for Sony isn't it (hint: no it isn't!). I'm told PS Now will evolve over time, and go as far as to include PS4 games themselves, but at the moment it's a laughing stock, and a move like this, however expensive it might be, might go a long way in repairing the franchise.... bigger picture man and all that! Plus I'm not sure the number of people wanting this is merely 'a handful', perhaps you're not arsed, fair do's but this is one thing I get sick of reading on my forum - not everyone has the same opinion as yourself.

Back to the topic in hand anyway.... a mate of mine does have Mass Effect 1 and has tried it through the XO - basically whilst Banjo-Kazooie may run great, that one doesn't: texture pop-in has improved playing on XO, as have loading times, but frame rate dips are both common and pretty huge.... basically the program isn't complete yet if it can't handle older disc based titles, so again little point chucking out 100 games to preview only members. Also 2 disc games haven't been figured out yet either, maybe they'll get that working, maybe not... still, as it's free...


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## Deleted member 473940 (Jun 22, 2015)

That list though... lol


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## DinohScene (Jun 22, 2015)

Except for Mass effect, all shit games.
Good job MS, good fucking job!


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## hippojay (Jun 22, 2015)

Eurogamer had a report of some testing done by digital foundry:

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-2015-vs-backwards-compatibility-on-xbox-one

Seems FPS is the big complaint.


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## mightymuffy (Jun 22, 2015)

hippojay said:


> Eurogamer had a report of some testing done by digital foundry:
> 
> http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-2015-vs-backwards-compatibility-on-xbox-one
> 
> Seems FPS is the big complaint.


Interesting read from a programmers point of view: the 360's 3 core CPU having 2 threads per core makes things a little more believable as the 6 core setup in the XO, running at 1.75Ghz, would handle a thread each. Still an impressive feat though, but clearly there's room for improvement before launch.


DinohScene said:


> Except for Mass effect, all shit games.
> Good job MS, good fucking job!


Geometry Wars? How DARE you son! Granted it isn't exactly a cutting edge 360 game... and Super Meat Boy! Again, how dare you, but since it's coming out on PS4/Vita later in the year, and free for Plus users in that first month, I'll be replaying it on those instead, but there you g--actually, point taken!


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## Vipera (Jun 22, 2015)

All I have to say is... duh?

The two consoles are built very differently. When Microsoft announced this, I was sure that there had to be something. And do you blame them? I honestly think this is the best they can do, other than releasing a bulky add-on much like the super game boy.


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## Nathan Drake (Jun 22, 2015)

Vipera said:


> All I have to say is... duh?
> 
> The two consoles are built very differently. When Microsoft announced this, I was sure that there had to be something. And do you blame them? I honestly think this is the best they can do, other than releasing a bulky add-on much like the super game boy.


They should just sell Xbox One's with 360's glued to the top. Same with PS4's, just with PS3's glued to the top. Then everybody will have 100% game compatibility for two generations only taking up the space of one ridiculously tall as well as wide console.


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## p1ngpong (Jun 22, 2015)

I am probably one of the few people who thinks that investing time and money into BC is a waste. The last gen lingered around way longer than it was welcome and the last thing I want to do on my next gen console is to play last gen games. Used 360's and 360 games go for super cheap prices now anyway, why wait for things to eventually be supported when you can just play all those games now for minimal cost?


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## CathyRina (Jun 22, 2015)

Vipera said:


> All I have to say is... duh?
> 
> The two consoles are built very differently. When Microsoft announced this, I was sure that there had to be something. And do you blame them? I honestly think this is the best they can do, other than releasing a bulky add-on much like the super game boy.


It's cetrainly better solution than PS Now.
We should give it some time, the list will be bigger.


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## Nathan Drake (Jun 22, 2015)

XrosBlader821 said:


> It's cetrainly better solution than PS Now.
> We should give it some time, the list will be bigger.


PS Now isn't a BC solution though. It's not comparable. PS Now is meant for long term use across Sony devices (including TV's and Bluray players) and Sony game consoles especially. It's just convenient that it does PS3 and is available on the PS4, not the purpose of it.


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## CathyRina (Jun 22, 2015)

Nathan Drake said:


> PS Now isn't a BC solution though. It's not comparable. PS Now is meant for long term use across Sony devices (including TV's and Bluray players) and Sony game consoles especially. It's just convenient that it does PS3 and is available on the PS4, not the purpose of it.


However currently on PS4 it is the only purpose of it.


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## Cortador (Jun 22, 2015)

Lost Odyssey, where art thou?


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## WiiCube_2013 (Jun 22, 2015)

Only 21? I like girls slightly younger than me but I'd hope for a larger quantity.  Yeah, I get it, emulation takes time to work properly.

I really hope they can get Conker Live & Reloaded to work on Xbox One because it's a must, but there's the Rare Replay Collection.. Still, it's a great remaster they did, imo.


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## The Catboy (Jun 22, 2015)

Couldn't they have at least tried for some better games?


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## Deleted User (Jun 22, 2015)

It's still better than the list of N64 games I can play on Wii U.

And like N64 games on Wii and Wii U, they can't just let you run any game and expect it to work. Different games use different aspects of the hardware, note how N64 emulation on PC often requires you tweaking graphics plugin settings per game Each game on Nintendo's VC and Microsoft's BC is being put into an emulator package that has the right configuration per game. Only difference between this and Nintendo VC is Microsoft is offering the BC games for free if you already have the original disc.


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## BORTZ (Jun 22, 2015)

Crystal the Glaceon said:


> Couldn't they have at least tried for some better games?


You get Mass Effect and both Viva Pinata games, what more could you want


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## Deleted User (Jun 22, 2015)

WiiCube_2013 said:


> Only 21? I like girls slightly younger than me but I'd hope for a larger quantity.  Yeah, I get it, emulation takes time to work properly.
> 
> I really hope they can get Conker Live & Reloaded to work on Xbox One because it's a must, but there's the Rare Replay Collection.. Still, it's a great remaster they did, imo.


That's an Xbox game. But Xbox One uses the same architecture so Xbox games should theoretically work without emulation. Perhaps Microsoft would add that compatibility someday. I prefer the original anyway so I'm glad it's in the replay collection so I don't have to spend a large sum of money for the cartridge like I had been planning. Then again, for multiplayer it would be cheaper for the cartridge + both Banjo games on cartridge than 3 Xbox One controllers

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------



Bortz said:


> You get Mass Effect and both Viva Pinata games, what more could you want


Halo Reach


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## The Catboy (Jun 22, 2015)

Bortz said:


> You get Mass Effect and both Viva Pinata games, what more could you want


18 other good games.


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## WiiCube_2013 (Jun 22, 2015)

p1ngpong said:


> I am probably one of the few people who thinks that investing time and money into BC is a waste. The last gen lingered around way longer than it was welcome and the last thing I want to do on my next gen console is to play last gen games. Used 360's and 360 games go for super cheap prices now anyway, why wait for things to eventually be supported when you can just play all those games now for minimal cost?


Have to agree with 'em.

Xbox 360 consoles are pretty cheap nowadays and so are the games so it's unnecessary for Microsoft to be doing this. I still very much use my 360 because it's handy so even if I had an XO the 360 games would be all on the 360, clearly.

Btw, the Slim Xbox 360 model is very quiet, stylish and just looks great in vertical. Plus, with the ability to use large HDD storage all the more reason to stick to 360 instead when playing its games.


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## Ashtonx (Jun 22, 2015)

It can support whole damn library for all i care, there's like 4 exclusives worth playing ?
Fable games and ace combat ?

Oh wait fable 3 and anniversary was on pc... in that case 2 exclusives ?


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## ComeTurismO (Jun 22, 2015)

Funny to see this posted, actually. On Facebook, on some page, there was this guy who was saying that since Xbox One is starting to have BC games, it makes them better from Sony. 98% of the supported games are: *shit *so far. No offense. 

A guy replied: Sony looks to the future, not to the past.


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## Sanoblue (Jun 22, 2015)

if anyone has beta and can send a invite plz message me here or on xbone Sanoblue   TY in advance


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## WiiCube_2013 (Jun 22, 2015)

Ashtonx said:


> It can support whole damn library for all i care, there's like 4 exclusives worth playing ?
> Fable games and ace combat ?
> 
> Oh wait fable 3 and anniversary was on pc... in that case 2 exclusives ?


DoA4, NBB, RR6. 

My favourite will always be DoA2, though.


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## Joe88 (Jun 22, 2015)

ComeTurismO said:


> A guy replied: Sony looks to the future, not to the past.


could have fooled me


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## ComeTurismO (Jun 22, 2015)

Joe88 said:


> could have fooled me


You just reminded me...I read ahead and turns out another replied that they remastered many games like this.. Well, LOU, and GTA V weren't made by Sony, but this was. Oh well. Awkward.


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## Ashtonx (Jun 22, 2015)

ComeTurismO said:


> Funny to see this posted, actually. On Facebook, on some page, there was this guy who was saying that since Xbox One is starting to have BC games, it makes them better from Sony. 98% of the supported games are: *shit *so far. No offense.
> 
> A guy replied: Sony looks to the future, not to the past.


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## WiiCube_2013 (Jun 22, 2015)

ComeTurismO said:


> You just reminded me...I read ahead and turns out another replied that they remastered many games like this.. Well, LOU, and GTA V weren't made by Sony, but this was. Oh well. Awkward.


The Last of Us is a PlayStation exclusive so it's a Sony game by default.

So much for next-gen gaming.


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## ComeTurismO (Jun 22, 2015)

WiiCube_2013 said:


> The Last of Us is a PlayStation exclusive so it's a Sony game by default.
> 
> So much for next-gen gaming.


Even more awkward. Whooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooops. Cause Sony published it..


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## WiiCube_2013 (Jun 22, 2015)

The Last Guardian will at last be released on PS4 unless they decide to delay it again. lol

Still waiting for The Getaway 3.


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## T-hug (Jun 22, 2015)

Cortador said:


> Lost Odyssey, where art thou?


I'd hope this one is high priority, best jrpg on the system. When it came out it was the best game I'd played in years. Philly S said multi disc games are an issue though. I think they own the IP so hopefully it's added soon.


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## Nathan Drake (Jun 22, 2015)

Off topic, I know, but:
I enjoy when people complain about remasters except, when you get down to it, there really aren't all that many. Oftentimes they're not bad ideas either. Last generation did drag on a bit, and I'm sure plenty of developers feel like 2010< releases especially didn't necessarily hit their full potential on last gen hardware. Now whether or not some remasters offer a truly improved experience is an entirely separate matter. Hell, sometimes remasters include so much content that it makes them better deals than the last gen equivalent. For example, the Handsome Collection came out at $60 while the Pre-Sequel alone was barely selling below that. And that was $60 for Borderlands 2 GOTY as well as the (still woefully overpriced in individual sale) Pre-Sequel.

In the end, the value of remasters is left up to the discretion of the fans. If you don't like them, you simply don't have to buy them. It isn't like you won't be able to build a respectable library without those games.


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## CathyRina (Jun 22, 2015)

Remakes/Remasters are great for new people to experience old games and for developers its good to get used to new hardware while doing a simple task.
not to mention they're cheap to make and usually sell at a really good price. FFX HD remaster sold at 40€ while having 2 remastered games. That's good value.
I really don't get why People are so upset about them


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## kumikochan (Jun 22, 2015)

Atleast they're trying to port it for free and not like Sony is doing making you pay again to play the game you already own.


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## Nathan Drake (Jun 22, 2015)

kumikochan said:


> Atleast they're trying to port it for free and not like Sony is doing making you pay again to play the game you already own.


As has already been mentioned, PS Now is not considered a backwards compatibility solution. Sony has much bigger plans for the service than appealing to some salty former PS3 owners.


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## kumikochan (Jun 22, 2015)

Nathan Drake said:


> As has already been mentioned, PS Now is not considered a backwards compatibility solution. Sony has much bigger plans for the service than appealing to some salty former PS3 owners.


You also forgot to mention all those PSN games you bought on the ps3 or those PSX and PS2 classics you also bought on the ps3 wich you have to pay for again when  you want to run those on your ps4. Sony is forcing you to buy everything again. Microsoft is also bringing those XBLA titles back for free.


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## Nathan Drake (Jun 22, 2015)

kumikochan said:


> You also forgot to mention all those PSN games you bought on the ps3 or those PSX and PS2 classics you also bought on the ps3 wich you have to pay for again when wanting to run on the ps4.


You know the easy solution to that? Just keeping a PS3 like everybody else who wanted full access to their old PS3 content did. I own a PS4, but I still own my PS3 too. So do a lot of people. Those that got rid of their PS3 to get a PS4 already knew what they were getting and don't complain. In the end, the solution is pretty simple.

I mean, really, the PS3 and PS4 even use the exact same cables. Switching them around even in a one console set up is maybe a 30 second performance.


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## kumikochan (Jun 22, 2015)

Nathan Drake said:


> You know the easy solution to that? Just keeping a PS3 like everybody else who wanted full access to their old PS3 content did. I own a PS4, but I still own my PS3 too. So do a lot of people. Those that got rid of their PS3 to get a PS4 already knew what they were getting and don't complain. In the end, the solution is pretty simple.
> 
> I mean, really, the PS3 and PS4 even use the exact same cables. Switching them around even in a one console set up is maybe a 30 second performance.


I'm just saying that Microsoft is bringing all those titles back free of charge for people who already own them that's all.


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## Nathan Drake (Jun 22, 2015)

kumikochan said:


> I'm just saying that Microsoft is bringing all those titles back free of charge for people who already own them that's all.


At the same time, there's no point digging at the PS4. I mean, it is legitimately incapable of PS3 BC on every level, so even complaining about it loud enough with millions of people will never change the PS4's hardware limitations.


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## kumikochan (Jun 22, 2015)

Nathan Drake said:


> At the same time, there's no point digging at the PS4. I mean, it is legitimately incapable of PS3 BC on every level, so even complaining about it loud enough with millions of people will never change the PS4's hardware limitations.


How are psn titles that you downloaded for the ps3 incapable of being run on the ps4 ?


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## tbb043 (Jun 22, 2015)

kumikochan said:


> I'm just saying that Microsoft is bringing all those titles back free of charge for people who already own them that's all.



Maybe it's more important for MS to to that than Sony because of how much shittier the 360 hardware was and how much less likely a 360 is to stay working in the future compared to a PS3 (not that the early PS3's are built great either).


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## kumikochan (Jun 22, 2015)

tbb043 said:


> Maybe it's more important for MS to to that than Sony because of how much shittier the 360 hardware was and how much less likely a 360 is to stay working in the future compared to a PS3 (not that the early PS3's are built great either).


Sure that's why my 360 is still working from day one and i already had 2 YLOD ps3 systems. Anyway it doesn't matter, it's just bad luck. It could have been the other way around for me so i don't really care about that.


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## Nathan Drake (Jun 22, 2015)

kumikochan said:


> How are psn titles that you downloaded for the ps3 incapable of being run on the ps4 ?


Because the PS3 is a very unique machine, and games had to be coded for that very unique hardware. It's why most PS3 multiplats were lower quality than the 360 titles despite the PS3 being a stronger system. Basically, to run PS3 content on the PS4, they would have to shove a whole PS3 in the system which would be expensive and hideous. It was basically how original fat PS3's did PS2 BC. The alternative would be offering it via game streaming, but they need all their PS Now servers for paying PS Now customers. They can't afford to have it bogged down by PS4 owners playing PS3 games for free.


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## kumikochan (Jun 22, 2015)

Nathan Drake said:


> Because the PS3 is a very unique machine, and games had to be coded for that very unique hardware. It's why most PS3 multiplats were lower quality than the 360 titles despite the PS3 being a stronger system. Basically, to run PS3 content on the PS4, they would have to shove a whole PS3 in the system which would be expensive and hideous. It was basically how original fat PS3's did PS2 BC. The alternative would be offering it via game streaming, but they need all their PS Now servers for paying PS Now customers. They can't afford to have it bogged down by PS4 owners playing PS3 games for free.


Still i don't see how PSN titles are hard to port to the ps4. If you're talking about Disc based PS3 titles i do agree but i don't see why it's so hard to give you those PSN titles you already paid for instead of making you pay again on the ps4 meaning they're already ported.


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## Nathan Drake (Jun 22, 2015)

kumikochan said:


> Still i don't see how PSN titles are hard to port to the ps4. If you're talking about Disc based PS3 titles i do agree but i don't see why it's so hard to give you those PSN titles you already paid for instead of making you pay again on the ps4 meaning they're already ported.


Because the only difference between the digital game and the physical game is where the game is being read from. It still all requires the same hardware regardless. Being a digital title doesn't mean it will magically run on anything that supports the same web store.


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## kumikochan (Jun 22, 2015)

Nathan Drake said:


> Because the only difference between the digital game and the physical game is where the game is being read from. It still all requires the same hardware regardless. Being a digital title doesn't mean it will magically run on anything that supports the same web store.


Like i said before i'm just talking about simple PSN games not triple A titles wich also had physical releases.


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## Nathan Drake (Jun 22, 2015)

kumikochan said:


> Like i said before i'm just talking about simple PSN games not triple A titles wich also had physical releases.


Still coded to run on the PS3. Exact same story. AAA, AA, A, B, C, it doesn't matter what combination of letters of the alphabet the game falls under. If it's a PS3 game, it is still coded specifically to run on the PS3 hardware, and thus it will not run on the PS4 without emulation which the PS4 is not powerful enough for as it would require emulating the PS3.


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## kumikochan (Jun 22, 2015)

Nathan Drake said:


> Still coded to run on the PS3. Exact same story. AAA, AA, A, B, C, it doesn't matter what combination of letters of the alphabet the game falls under. If it's a PS3 game, it is still coded specifically to run on the PS3 hardware, and thus it will not run on the PS4 without emulation which the PS4 is not powerful enough for as it would require emulating the PS3.


believe what you want to believe. Porting PSN titles is relatively easy if Sony wants to make you believe differenty well then you do so. Enjoy


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## CathyRina (Jun 22, 2015)

kumikochan said:


> believe what you want to believe. Porting PSN titles is relatively easy if Sony wants to make you believe differenty well then you do so. Enjoy


Actually Nathan is right.
Porting a PSN game is as big of a challenge as porting Triple A games.
The PS4 and XBO hardware was built to be more similar to PC so that Porting games between those platforms would be easier.
The only fault Sony did is not giving a PS1 and PS2 emulator from the get go but that had to be patched in to every console before so eh.


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## kumikochan (Jun 22, 2015)

XrosBlader821 said:


> Actually Nathan is right.
> Porting a PSN game is as big of a challenge as porting Triple A games.
> The PS4 and XBO hardware was built to be more similar to PC so that Porting games between those platforms would be easier.


Sure, it's not because a couple of people are saying differently that is gonna change my opinion. If you want to believe that then go right ahead, i could care less. Atleast Microsoft is proving it can be done since most of the titles in that list are titles that also got PSN releases. Doing that work is called '' a customer service ". But it looks like Sony thinks shit of customer service


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## WiiCube_2013 (Jun 22, 2015)

XrosBlader821 said:


> Actually Nathan is right.
> Porting a PSN game is as big of a challenge as porting Triple A games.
> The PS4 and XBO hardware was built to be more similar to PC so that Porting games between those platforms would be easier.
> The only fault Sony did is not giving a PS1 and PS2 emulator from the get go but that had to be patched in to every console before so eh.



What about porting the PC version of those arcade games?

People who've bought arcade should be able to play them on their PS4 regardless of having purchased via PS3.


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## CathyRina (Jun 22, 2015)

WiiCube_2013 said:


> What about porting the PC version of those arcade games?
> 
> People who've bought arcade should be able to play them on their PS4 regardless of having purchased via PS3.


I dunno about you but the PC versions aren't sony's property. If they aren't ported to PS4 (and XBO for that matter) blame the devs of the game not Sony or Microsoft.
The thing is these devs are probably busy developing other games and have little to no time to port their PC versions over to XBO and PS4. And to be fair most people don't care about them anyway.



kumikochan said:


> Sure, it's not because a couple of people are saying differently that is gonna change my opinion. If you want to believe that then go right ahead, i could care less. Atleast Microsoft is proving it can be done since most of the titles in that list are titles that also got PSN releases. Doing that work is called '' a customer service ". But it looks like Sony thinks shit of customer service


http://www.escapistmagazine.com/art...points/10215-Why-the-PS4-Doesn-t-Do-PS3-Games
How about you read that instead of shitting on people for no reason.


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## Qtis (Jun 22, 2015)

Sony may be able to bring PS3 games to the PS4, but the CELL is a bitch for a processor. Microsoft has a lot less hassle to do with them both developing DirectX as well as owning the hardware IO for the 360. This is a completely different case than a traditional emu on the PC such as Dolphin. Microsoft doesn't need to emulate the hardware as much as they can convert the translation magic on a game by game basis (convert 360 hardware connections to XB1 connection in a simply put way).

Also at all the hate for the remasters for the newest gen: You people must hate Game of the Year editions with the DLC included, as in many cases this is exactly the same situation. Never played Borderlands 2 or the Pre-Sequel? Well, buy the Handsome Collection. It's just available on the PS4/XB1 instead of the PS3/360. If you played the original games, sure the new games may not be for you. But the value is there with a modest price point and complete sets.


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## kumikochan (Jun 22, 2015)

XrosBlader821 said:


> I dunno about you but the PC versions aren't sony's property. If they aren't ported to PS4 (and XBO for that matter) blame the devs of the game not Sony or Microsoft.
> The thing is these devs are probably busy developing other games and have little to no time to port their PC versions over to XBO and PS4. And to be fair most people don't care about them anyway.
> 
> 
> ...


I'm not shitting anyone. Like i already said a thousand times, my opinion is not gonna change because what some people say or some articles. You're free to believe what you want and so am i. I don't care anyway, so i don't see that as shitting towards anyone. I'm sorry that i don't share your opinion


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## CathyRina (Jun 22, 2015)

kumikochan said:


> I'm not shitting anyone. Like i already said a thousand times, my opinion is not gonna change because what some people say or some articles. You're free to believe what you want and so am i. I don't care anyway, so i don't see that as shitting towards anyone. I'm sorry that i don't share your opinion


You do realize that you are neglecting facts right now not some dudes on the webz opinion right?


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## kumikochan (Jun 22, 2015)

Qtis said:


> Sony may be able to bring PS3 games to the PS4, but the CELL is a bitch for a processor. Microsoft has a lot less hassle to do with them both developing DirectX as well as owning the hardware IO for the 360. This is a completely different case than a traditional emu on the PC such as Dolphin. Microsoft doesn't need to emulate the hardware as much as they can convert the translation magic on a game by game basis (convert 360 hardware connections to XB1 connection in a simply put way).
> 
> Also at all the hate for the remasters for the newest gen: You people must hate Game of the Year editions with the DLC included, as in many cases this is exactly the same situation. Never played Borderlands 2 or the Pre-Sequel? Well, buy the Handsome Collection. It's just available on the PS4/XB1 instead of the PS3/360. If you played the original games, sure the new games may not be for you. But the value is there with a modest price point and complete sets.


So in this case if Microsoft does it eveything is hokey pokey easy but if it would be differently if Sony anounced this at E3 then everybody would claim Sony was god and convert to Sonyism. Funny everytime Microsoft does something everything gets scaled down a lot and when Sony does something everything gets blown up in proportion.

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------



XrosBlader821 said:


> You do realize that you are neglecting facts right now not some dudes on the webz opinion right?[/QU
> 
> 
> XrosBlader821 said:
> ...


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## Harsky (Jun 22, 2015)

I wouldn't be surprised if GTA V or any other "available on 360 AND Xbox One" games won't make it on the list. Need to milk that re-release cow.


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## Arras (Jun 22, 2015)

kumikochan said:


> So in this case if Microsoft does it eveything is hokey pokey easy but if it would be differently if Sony anounced this at E3 then everybody would claim Sony was god and convert to Sonyism. Funny everytime Microsoft does something everything gets scaled down a lot and when Sony does something everything gets blown up in proportion.
> 
> --------------------- MERGED ---------------------------


No, the PS3 hardware is much more different to the PS4 than the X360 is to the Xbone. It's much easier to translate calls between the latter two than it is for the former two. It's still not trivial, just much easier.


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## kumikochan (Jun 22, 2015)

Arras said:


> No, the PS3 hardware is much more different to the PS4 than the X360 is to the Xbone. It's much easier to translate calls between the latter two than it is for the former two. It's still not trivial, just much easier.


i'm done, nothing is gonna change what i said. If you want to believe PSN titles such as indies are so hard to port for free if you already own them then you do that. You're free to do so as am i.


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## Qtis (Jun 22, 2015)

kumikochan said:


> So in this case if Microsoft does it eveything is hokey pokey easy but if it would be differently if Sony anounced this at E3 then everybody would claim Sony was god and convert to Sonyism. Funny everytime Microsoft does something everything gets scaled down a lot and when Sony does something everything gets blown up in proportion.



Far from it. I love what Microsoft did at E3. They would have won my E3 ranking had it not been for Bethesda and their conference.

It's your ignorance regarding technical limitations that I find odd. The CELL is vastly different than a modern x86 or x64 processor. You have one master core and 6 "slave" cores. Each core acts differently and you can't unload stuff from one to another as easily as you can with say, an i5 CPU with 4 identical cores in function. Theoretically, it could be emulated/hardware routed. In practice, the PS3 is a bitch to make work.



kumikochan said:


> i'm done, nothing is gonna change what i said. If you want to believe PSN titles such as indies are so hard to port for free if you already own them then you do that. You're free to do so as am i.


That's what Sony is already doing for many titles. I've got quite a PS4 library already from cross-buy games. Just like the PSVita too. But as with the XB1 BC, you will not get everything overnight.


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## kumikochan (Jun 22, 2015)

Qtis said:


> Far from it. I love what Microsoft did at E3. They would have won my E3 ranking had it not been for Bethesda and their conference.
> 
> It's your ignorance regarding technical limitations that I find odd. The CELL is vastly different than a modern x86 or x64 processor. You have one master core and 6 "slave" cores. Each core acts differently and you can't unload stuff from one to another as easily as you can with say, an i5 CPU with 4 identical cores in function. Theoretically, it could be emulated/hardware routed. In practice, the PS3 is a bitch to make work.


Like i stated 100000000 times before i'm just talking about simple PSN games and not big triple A titles wich also had physical releases. I don't see how it would be so hard to port PSN titles to the ps4 that also had releases on PC or XBOX 360 wich they already ported a couple of them to the PS4. Nothing is gonna change my opinion about that.


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## Qtis (Jun 22, 2015)

kumikochan said:


> Like i stated 100000000 times before i'm just talking about simple PSN games and not big triple A titles wich also had physical releases. I don't see how it would be so hard to port PSN titles to the ps4 that also had releases on PC or XBOX 360 wich they already ported a couple of them to the PS4. Nothing is gonna change my opinion about that.


You missed the edit I made. It takes time. Just like MS and XB1 compatibility. It's not simply a push of a button to port a game unless the engine itself is used for it. And both Sony and Microsoft are doing just that.


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## kumikochan (Jun 22, 2015)

Qtis said:


> You missed the edit I made. It takes time. Just like MS and XB1 compatibility. It's not simply a push of a button to port a game unless the engine itself is used for it. And both Sony and Microsoft are doing just that.


I never said anywhere it was easy. I just said i see it as a customer service giving those things you already own again for free instead of buying it all over again.


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## 59672 (Jun 23, 2015)

Qtis said:


> Sony may be able to bring PS3 games to the PS4, but the CELL is a bitch for a processor. Microsoft has a lot less hassle to do with them both developing DirectX as well as owning the hardware IO for the 360. This is a completely different case than a traditional emu on the PC such as Dolphin. Microsoft doesn't need to emulate the hardware as much as they can convert the translation magic on a game by game basis (convert 360 hardware connections to XB1 connection in a simply put way).
> 
> Also at all the hate for the remasters for the newest gen: You people must hate Game of the Year editions with the DLC included, as in many cases this is exactly the same situation. Never played Borderlands 2 or the Pre-Sequel? Well, buy the Handsome Collection. It's just available on the PS4/XB1 instead of the PS3/360. If you played the original games, sure the new games may not be for you. But the value is there with a modest price point and complete sets.



The hate for remasters is sometimes justified. The thing is, a goty edition is just a modified reprint of the game more or less, it's not a lot of work to throw together. A remaster or even just straight port still requires a fair bit of work depending on how ambitious they are. The problem is when this a studio that would normally be making new releases. If it's some small side team at a studio or a outsourced studio doing the remaster, those are fine. Those still allow the studios whose games you enjoy to keep making new titles, titles that are designed for much more powerful consoles and allow for a whole lot that can't be achieved last gen, studios being competent enough provided.


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## VMM (Jun 23, 2015)

This list is a fucking joke.
I'm starting to think that the dream of 100% backward compatibility on X1,
will continue as a dream.

I thought they would pull something miraculous as Vita backward compatibility,
but I guess I was wrong.


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## Deleted User (Jun 23, 2015)

Qtis said:


> Sony may be able to bring PS3 games to the PS4, but the CELL is a bitch for a processor. Microsoft has a lot less hassle to do with them both developing DirectX as well as owning the hardware IO for the 360. This is a completely different case than a traditional emu on the PC such as Dolphin. Microsoft doesn't need to emulate the hardware as much as they can convert the translation magic on a game by game basis (convert 360 hardware connections to XB1 connection in a simply put way).
> 
> Also at all the hate for the remasters for the newest gen: You people must hate Game of the Year editions with the DLC included, as in many cases this is exactly the same situation. Never played Borderlands 2 or the Pre-Sequel? Well, buy the Handsome Collection. It's just available on the PS4/XB1 instead of the PS3/360. If you played the original games, sure the new games may not be for you. But the value is there with a modest price point and complete sets.


They've said in an official video they are emulating the Xbox 360. Each game on the service is packaged with a 360 emulator into an executable for the Xbox One much like how Nintendo's Virtual Console service works. The only difference is that if you have the original disc you can use it as a license and download it for free and they're adding games more rapidly than Nintendo


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## Adeka (Jun 23, 2015)

*looks at the huge selection of gamecube games in the Nintendo eshop*

But is the xbox one even powerful enough to emulate some of the more demanding 360 games?  There has to be more to this...


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## mightymuffy (Jun 23, 2015)

VMM said:


> This list is a fucking joke.
> I'm starting to think that the dream of 100% backward compatibility on X1,
> will continue as a dream.
> 
> ...


Dear oh deary me.... it's simply a preview, for Preview Members only, and the actual release will (apparently) be over 100 titles... they need permission to release games from the developers on a per game basis, not to mention permission for any licensed music etc... 
Let's compare this to PlayStation Now's initial launch, for preview members , earlier this year in the UK = *8* games... (and don't start @Nathan Drake , I'm just talking title numbers here). I don't recall seeing an outcry of 'OMFG! Only 8 games! Sony Bastards!!' because it was [also] a preview release not for the general public, so rightfully nobody batted an eyelid. Just like they shouldn't be doing here....

Come the proper launch sometime this Autumn if we only end up with a release list like this, then by all means grab the pitchforks - I'll be doing the same myself!  - but at the moment this topic is rather meaningless..


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## Deleted User (Jun 23, 2015)

mightymuffy said:


> Dear oh deary me.... it's simply a preview, for Preview Members only, and the actual release will (apparently) be over 100 titles... they need permission to release games from the developers on a per game basis, not to mention permission for any licensed music etc...
> Let's compare this to PlayStation Now's initial launch, for preview members , earlier this year in the UK = *8* games... (and don't start @Nathan Drake , I'm just talking title numbers here). I don't recall seeing an outcry of 'OMFG! Only 8 games! Sony Bastards!!' because it was [also] a preview release not for the general public, so rightfully nobody batted an eyelid. Just like they shouldn't be doing here....
> 
> Come the proper launch sometime this Autumn if we only end up with a release list like this, then by all means grab the pitchforks - I'll be doing the same myself!  - but at the moment this topic is rather meaningless..


People tend not to complain about Sony, people seem to like Sony no matter what they do but pick at Microsoft and Nintendo all the time, even criticize them for doing something right by saying they do it all for money, but isn't that what Sony is doing too? Note how many people preordered a PS4 despite a weaker launch lineup than the Wii U.


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## CathyRina (Jun 23, 2015)

Snugglevixen said:


> People tend not to complain about Sony, people seem to like Sony no matter what they do but pick at Microsoft and Nintendo all the time, even criticize them for doing something right by saying they do it all for money, but isn't that what Sony is doing too? Note how many people preordered a PS4 despite a weaker launch lineup than the Wii U.


I dunno the aftertaste with the server hacking and the fact how huge of a mistake the PS3 was still sits in most people's mind.
Or how incompetent they seem to be with their handhelds. There are people boycotting Sony for how they're treating the Vita.


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## BORTZ (Jun 23, 2015)

Snugglevixen said:


> People tend not to complain about Sony, people seem to like Sony no matter what they do but pick at Microsoft and Nintendo all the time, even criticize them for doing something right by saying they do it all for money, but isn't that what Sony is doing too? *Note how many people preordered a PS4 despite a weaker launch lineup than the Wii U*.


Remember, that is completely subjective.


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## Ashtonx (Jun 23, 2015)

Dunno what you're talking about, i've been bitching about sony for years, especially for their low quality hardware, and i always criticize them whenever i get the chance, not my fault they actually release good games from time to time and out of whole console crowd they're only ones that actually have anything worth playing ;/


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## Deleted User (Jun 24, 2015)

Bortz said:


> Remember, that is completely subjective.


I remember hearing a lot about that Knack game and how it was the only system seller and not as good as Mario. Personally I find Mario to be meh but there was also Nintendo Land, ZombiU and Lego City Undercover followed shortly after.
Xbox One's was even worse I think, I don't remember any of it's launch games other than Zoo Tycoon.


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## Captain_N (Jun 24, 2015)

What i don't get is , why dont people just keep their xbox360. 100% support there. Its super easy to keep what you already own. Why is that so hard to understand. Lack of hdmi ports is about as a lame of an excuse as no space is. Ever seen a HDMI Multi box? Trading in older consoles for the new console is no excuse either. Trading in is such a huge loss. BC is only really needed on portable systems. Backwards compatibility was never a problem for me.. Its called i keep the older console.


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## AndroD (Jun 24, 2015)

Any word on whether there will be upscaling or anything cool like that? Sounds like just straight up emulation.


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## tots (Jun 24, 2015)

Captain_N said:


> What i don't get is , why dont people just keep their xbox360. 100% support there. Its super easy to keep what you already own. Why is that so hard to understand. Lack of hdmi ports is about as a lame of an excuse as no space is. Ever seen a HDMI Multi box? Trading in older consoles for the new console is no excuse either. Trading in is such a huge loss. BC is only really needed on portable systems. Backwards compatibility was never a problem for me.. Its called i keep the older console.



Totally agree! Trade in value for old consoles is a pittance, might as well just keep them and not have to worry about this stuff.


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## Yugimumoto1 (Jun 24, 2015)

hey... awful idea for a compatable game... sonic 06


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## Deleted User (Jun 24, 2015)

Yugimumoto1 said:


> hey... awful idea for a compatable game... sonic 06


I've been wanting that game actually but I sold my 360 when I got a Wii U


Captain_N said:


> What i don't get is , why dont people just keep their xbox360. 100% support there. Its super easy to keep what you already own. Why is that so hard to understand. Lack of hdmi ports is about as a lame of an excuse as no space is. Ever seen a HDMI Multi box? Trading in older consoles for the new console is no excuse either. Trading in is such a huge loss. BC is only really needed on portable systems. Backwards compatibility was never a problem for me.. Its called i keep the older console.


360 takes up space


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## gamesquest1 (Jun 24, 2015)

i dont see why people are that surprised, most of the games are RARE games (who are owned by microsoft, so probably had a head start on the conversion process) or indie games that wouldn't of taken too long to get fully up and running.........think of it like any other emulator, it always starts off with the simpler games that are less graphically intensive as they are the easiest to get working as there isn't as much complex stuff going on, and then it slowly exapands as they refine and map out the system in their emulator so they can drop more and more titles into it that just work without having to patch and fix each game indevidually

plus really come on guys, we should all remember the "backwards compatibility" for the xbox 360 right? started off with like 10 games and by the times they stopped adding games it stood at around 50% of games being compatible....truth is the backwards compatibility is usually just added so they can say "WOW! backwards compatibility"....but i highly doubt it will ever be anywhere near 100%.......maybe 50% at a push, and will probably take a year or more to get to that point


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## mightymuffy (Jun 24, 2015)

Captain_N said:


> What i don't get is , why dont people just keep their xbox360. 100% support there. Its super easy to keep what you already own. Why is that so hard to understand. Lack of hdmi ports is about as a lame of an excuse as no space is. Ever seen a HDMI Multi box? Trading in older consoles for the new console is no excuse either. Trading in is such a huge loss. BC is only really needed on portable systems. Backwards compatibility was never a problem for me.. Its called i keep the older console.



You've just basically stated you're a single person there sunbeam... 
Nothing wrong with that of course, but perhaps you can 'get' why those that aren't single like this idea: I've got an XO, PS4, Wii U, 360 (and a TV box. And a PC snuggled away in a nearby unit) all under the living room TV - the shit I get off my missus because of it is unbelievable.... chucking the 360 out from under there, into our bedroom is therefore a great idea (and also less cluttered as Snugglevixen says). Which brings up point #2.... do you still live at home with your parents? Or a flat? Having the 360 spare, and thus able to put it next to my bedroom TV also has several advantages as I'm sure you can understand.... 

So basically, and I said something similar to this to Nathan Drake earlier in the thread, just because you can't understand the point doesn't mean it's automatically a waste of time! You perhaps saw the reaction of the crowd at the announcement at E3, hopefully you can understand the 2 reasons I've chucked up there, and now realise where we're coming from


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## sarkwalvein (Jun 24, 2015)

Captain_N said:


> What i don't get is , why dont people just keep their xbox360. 100% support there. Its super easy to keep what you already own. Why is that so hard to understand. Lack of hdmi ports is about as a *lame of an excuse as no space is*. Ever seen a HDMI Multi box? Trading in older consoles for the new console is no excuse either. Trading in is such a huge loss. BC is only really needed on portable systems. Backwards compatibility was never a problem for me.. Its called i keep the older console.


I think taking up additional space is a totally valid reason unless you suffer and are happy with some serious Diogenes syndrome.
For this reason I would keep the 360 and throw the One away.


----------



## Deleted User (Jun 24, 2015)

sarkwalvein said:


> I think taking up additional space is a totally valid reason unless you suffer and are happy with some serious Diogenes syndrome.
> For this reason I would keep the 360 and throw the One away.


Yea, I was actually considering getting a second hand 360 but I don't have room for it so I'll just wait and see if Halo Reach and the Sonic games will get added to BC.


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## CathyRina (Jun 24, 2015)

Snugglevixen said:


> Yea, I was actually considering getting a second hand 360 but I don't have room for it so I'll just wait and see if Halo Reach and the Sonic games will get added to BC.


Reach will probably get added to master chief collection before they add it to BC.


----------



## Deleted User (Jun 24, 2015)

XrosBlader821 said:


> Reach will probably get added to master chief collection before they add it to BC.


I hope so.

Though it bugs me that whenever I try to play the big Halo 1 maps I have to go into an all games BTB playlist and get outvoted for a Halo 2 map so I would rather play Reach on it's own.


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## VMM (Jun 24, 2015)

mightymuffy said:


> Dear oh deary me.... it's simply a preview, for Preview Members only, and the actual release will (apparently) be over 100 titles... they need permission to release games from the developers on a per game basis, not to mention permission for any licensed music etc...
> Let's compare this to PlayStation Now's initial launch, for preview members , earlier this year in the UK = *8* games... (and don't start @Nathan Drake , I'm just talking title numbers here). I don't recall seeing an outcry of 'OMFG! Only 8 games! Sony Bastards!!' because it was [also] a preview release not for the general public, so rightfully nobody batted an eyelid. Just like they shouldn't be doing here....
> 
> Come the proper launch sometime this Autumn if we only end up with a release list like this, then by all means grab the pitchforks - I'll be doing the same myself!  - but at the moment this topic is rather meaningless..



Playstation Now never promised backward compatibility, just a way to play some games from previous generations.
When we talk about backward compatibility, that means 100% of the previous titles will work, or at least close to.
That's not backward compatibility, they're probably just porting some Xbox and X360 games to X1,
just like Sony did with some Playstation 2 games on Playstation 3, do you understand now why I'm disappointed?
This was just a dirty trick to get attention at E3.



Ashtonx said:


> Dunno what you're talking about, i've been bitching about sony for years, especially for their low quality hardware, and i always criticize them whenever i get the chance, not my fault they actually release good games from time to time and out of whole console crowd they're only ones that actually have anything worth playing ;/



Low quality hardware? What the hell are you talking about?
They had the strongest hardware on the last two generations.
Also the built quality of their products is great.
I had a 360 who had 3RL and DSes that had problems with the analogs and shoulder buttons, but I never had a problem with my PS3, PS4 or PSP,
they always worked great.


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## grossaffe (Jun 25, 2015)

VMM said:


> Low quality hardware? What the hell are you talking about?
> They had the strongest hardware on the last two generations.
> Also the built quality of their products is great.
> I had a 360 who had 3RL and DSes that had problems with the analogs and shoulder buttons, but I never had a problem with my PS3, PS4 or PSP,
> they always worked great.


He didn't say "weak", he said "low quality".  The PS3 suffered from the YLOD, the PS2 had the Disc Read Errors, and I read the PSX had problems with FMV causing the system to overheat, warp the plastic and then cause read errors.

Also, anecdotal evidence doesn't mean much.


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## Captain_N (Jun 25, 2015)

mightymuffy said:


> You've just basically stated you're a single person there sunbeam...
> Nothing wrong with that of course, but perhaps you can 'get' why those that aren't single like this idea: I've got an XO, PS4, Wii U, 360 (and a TV box. And a PC snuggled away in a nearby unit) all under the living room TV - the shit I get off my missus because of it is unbelievable.... chucking the 360 out from under there, into our bedroom is therefore a great idea (and also less cluttered as Snugglevixen says). Which brings up point #2.... do you still live at home with your parents? Or a flat? Having the 360 spare, and thus able to put it next to my bedroom TV also has several advantages as I'm sure you can understand....
> 
> So basically, and I said something similar to this to Nathan Drake earlier in the thread, just because you can't understand the point doesn't mean it's automatically a waste of time! You perhaps saw the reaction of the crowd at the announcement at E3, hopefully you can understand the 2 reasons I've chucked up there, and now realise where we're coming from



I think is because most people want out with the old and in with the new. I Own my own home btw.
one computer type desk and i got more then enough space


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## sweis12 (Jun 25, 2015)

Black ops 2? Cmon microsoft.


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## gamesquest1 (Jun 25, 2015)

VMM said:


> Low quality hardware? What the hell are you talking about?
> They had the strongest hardware on the last two generations.
> Also the built quality of their products is great.
> I had a 360 who had 3RL and DSes that had problems with the analogs and shoulder buttons, but I never had a problem with my PS3, PS4 or PSP,
> they always worked great.


tbh all consoles have had their share of issues ever since the PS2 era, doing console repairs, ever since the switch to optical media there has always been the problem of burnt out lasers, which are quite common across all consoles, then there is the PSP analogue stick which is/was prone to failure and ended up being sporadic on many consoles (walking around on itself), and both thee the launch xbox 360 consoles and launch PS3 consoles where prone to overheating resulting in the RROD and YLOD, although it was more common with the 360, there is still a unreasonable number of PS3 YLOD faults, but dead lasers seem to be quite a bit more common on the PS3 too......in comparison the nintendo wii was the only console that was quite rare to have faults that rendered it useless (but ofc the lower specs where most likely the cause for that)

i think at this point, the 360 slim and ps3 slim are probably about on par for reliability, and so far the only major common hardware faults between the PS4 and XBONE where the DOA PS4 units that had apparently been "sabotaged" by people being forced to make them....personally i wouldnt buy any of the launch consoles put out by MS or sony, it always boils down to cost for the first batch and corners are always cut for the first batches


----------



## mightymuffy (Jun 25, 2015)

VMM said:


> Playstation Now never promised backward compatibility, just a way to play some games from previous generations.
> When we talk about backward compatibility, that means 100% of the previous titles will work, or at least close to.
> That's not backward compatibility, they're probably just porting some Xbox and X360 games to X1,
> just like Sony did with some Playstation 2 games on Playstation 3, do you understand now why I'm disappointed?
> This was just a dirty trick to get attention at E3.



Sorry pal but you're simply misinformed here - just because the initial release for preview members/this thread title says 21 games doesn't mean a jot: on full initial release come this fall they've promised over 100 titles - the only games that won't be compatible are those that require xbox 360 peripherals (ie Kinect 1, Rock band/GH instruments), and MS themselves have owned up to currently having problems with multi disc games (though this will be fixed apparently). Now [once the multi disc issue is fixed] that screams backward compatibility to me... Further proof in you not being read up on the subject is you mentioned original Xbox titles...?? No mention of those...
You can't realistically sit there and demand EVERY single game playable on day 1 of release either - in the real world (and mentioned before on here, not just from me either) there's licensing issues: 3rd party games - in game licensed music tracks and the like.


----------



## CathyRina (Jun 25, 2015)

VMM said:


> When we talk about backward compatibility, that means 100% of the previous titles will work, or at least close to.



The only reason Nintendo BC works 100% of the time is because they have the old hardware built into their consoles.
They don't emulate anything they just play them. However this is a very expensive way of doing BC. Your console either ends up costing 599$ like the PS3 did on launch or your tech is going to be outdated because you cut the price on the tech. Which evidently is what Nintendo does.
So no when talking about BC we don't talk about 100% of previous titles working.


----------



## WiiCube_2013 (Jun 25, 2015)

The Xbox One Elite controller will do wonders for gamers who'll try to get the best experience out of 360 and One games. I sure as heck would love it they had made it compatible with PS4 and Wii U too, but I get why such things aren't possible. The XO Elite controller looks all around amazing and its price? $150. Yeah, not for everyone's wallets.


----------



## grossaffe (Jun 25, 2015)

XrosBlader821 said:


> The only reason Nintendo BC works 100% of the time is because they have the old hardware built into their consoles.
> They don't emulate anything they just play them. However this is a very expensive way of doing BC. Your console either ends up costing 599$ like the PS3 did on launch or your tech is going to be outdated because you cut the price on the tech. Which evidently is what Nintendo does.
> So no when talking about BC we don't talk about 100% of previous titles working.


Nintendo doesn't have the old hardware in their (home) consoles, it's just built on an upgraded version of the previous system, much like my intel core i7 doesn't include a second processor for IA-32 legacy instructions, but rather the AMD-64 architecture has those instructions built into it making it backwards compatible.

On the handheld front, however, my understanding is that the GBA had extra hardware for backwards compatibility until the Micro when it did away with BC.  Same with the DS and GBA backwards compatibility.


----------



## VMM (Jun 25, 2015)

mightymuffy said:


> You can't realistically sit there and demand EVERY single game playable on day 1 of release either - in the real world (and mentioned before on here, not just from me either) there's licensing issues: 3rd party games - in game licensed music tracks and the like.





XrosBlader821 said:


> The only reason Nintendo BC works 100% of the time is because they have the old hardware built into their consoles.
> They don't emulate anything they just play them. However this is a very expensive way of doing BC. Your console either ends up costing 599$ like the PS3 did on launch or your tech is going to be outdated because you cut the price on the tech. Which evidently is what Nintendo does.
> So no when talking about BC we don't talk about 100% of previous titles working.



Tell this to PSVita, which has a different architecture than PSP and has full backward compatibility since day one.



grossaffe said:


> He didn't say "weak", he said "low quality".  The PS3 suffered from the YLOD, the PS2 had the Disc Read Errors, and I read the PSX had problems with FMV causing the system to overheat, warp the plastic and then cause read errors.
> 
> Also, anecdotal evidence doesn't mean much.





gamesquest1 said:


> tbh all consoles have had their share of issues ever since the PS2 era, doing console repairs, ever since the switch to optical media there has always been the problem of burnt out lasers, which are quite common across all consoles, then there is the PSP analogue stick which is/was prone to failure and ended up being sporadic on many consoles (walking around on itself), and both thee the launch xbox 360 consoles and launch PS3 consoles where prone to overheating resulting in the RROD and YLOD, although it was more common with the 360, there is still a unreasonable number of PS3 YLOD faults, but dead lasers seem to be quite a bit more common on the PS3 too......in comparison the nintendo wii was the only console that was quite rare to have faults that rendered it useless (but ofc the lower specs where most likely the cause for that)
> 
> i think at this point, the 360 slim and ps3 slim are probably about on par for reliability, and so far the only major common hardware faults between the PS4 and XBONE where the DOA PS4 units that had apparently been "sabotaged" by people being forced to make them....personally i wouldnt buy any of the launch consoles put out by MS or sony, it always boils down to cost for the first batch and corners are always cut for the first batches



The amount of PS3 with YLOD is minimal.
If we were talking about something massive like the 3RLoD that would make sense,
but blaming Sony on poor hardware for some minimal errors that occur with every kind of eletronic just doesn't feel right.
Also, the Wii uses a low quality Disk reader and I've seem plenty of cases that this reader just stop becomes defective.
All companies have their share of problems with hardware, but as long it's not sistematic like RLoD it's acceptable.


----------



## mightymuffy (Jun 25, 2015)

VMM said:


> Tell this to PSVita, which has a different architecture than PSP and has full backward compatibility since day one.


Coz the PSP and Vita have their own Kinect & Rock Band controllers don't they..... Not to piss on the Vita as I have one myself, think it's great, and of course know the BC is an achievement, but that is a COMPLETELY different kettle of fish....
Oh, and



> The amount of PS3 with YLOD is minimal.


HAHAHAAA! Good one sunshine! Try to retype your post in a realistic manner next time:

"The amount of PS3's with the YLOD is comparatively few"
See? The point was still made and actually truthful there too... 'minimal' - 

...

Got on the Preview Program anyway! Well, my youngest lad did, but I can use the features... Not tried Mass Effect yet, and I believe it won't work anyway as it's apparently only the North American version that does, but I've tried Banjo, BattleBlock and Meat Boy - lengthy initial load times (expected, and not that intrusive though) but otherwise nearly perfect! Missing textures on Banjo's eyelids on the intro video  (still brown though so nothing like Devil Bear on the Wii N64 emulator!), and that's it - impressive! Looking forward to that list of titles growing!


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## CathyRina (Jun 25, 2015)

VMM said:


> Tell this to PSVita, which has a different architecture than PSP and has full backward compatibility since day one.


Because every single PSP game is on the Vita 
Sure it can run each game but only if you hacked the system


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## VMM (Jun 25, 2015)

mightymuffy said:


> Coz the PSP and Vita have their own Kinect & Rock Band controllers don't they..... Not to piss on the Vita as I have one myself, think it's great, and of course know the BC is an achievement, but that is a COMPLETELY different kettle of fish....
> Oh, and



You talk like there are just few titles not working on X1 that were from X360 and the original Xbox, and that they're just special cases where there are accessories involved, but that's far from the truth. Even if we get to the 100 titles promised, it will be a disappointment and close to nothing to the huge library that is the X360 library and even less when included the original Xbox library 



mightymuffy said:


> HAHAHAAA! Good one sunshine! Try to retype your post in a realistic manner next time:
> 
> "The amount of PS3's with the YLOD is comparatively few"
> See? The point was still made and actually truthful there too... 'minimal' -



How many of the PS3 that have been manufactured have had YLOD? How many in percentage? 5%? Less.
When we compare to the total amount of PS3s ever made, the number of ones that had YLOD is minimal.




XrosBlader821 said:


> Because every single PSP game is on the Vita
> Sure it can run each game but only if you hacked the system



Vita can run all of the PSP games, Vita is truly backward compatible.
With X1, it seems the game are been ported or emulated in a different way, it seems far from a true backward compability


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## grossaffe (Jun 25, 2015)

VMM said:


> How many of the PS3 that have been manufactured have had YLOD? How many in percentage? 5%? Less.
> When we compare to the total amount of PS3s ever made, the number of ones that had YLOD is minimal.


The YLOD may have been less prevalent than the travesty that was the 360 and its RROD, but it was still very significant.


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## gamesquest1 (Jun 25, 2015)

VMM said:


> Tell this to PSVita, which has a different architecture than PSP and has full backward compatibility since day one.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


i think peoples perception of "minimal" or acceptable has been warped by companies, imho no console should have such design flaws as the original PS3 and xbox360, im sure they have plenty of hardware designers who could tell them exactly what kind of airflow they would need to keep the hardware they are packing in working order and an appropriate temperature, but both sony and microsoft put aesthetics above function and reliability, I'm pretty sure that the design meetings probably go "will it last as long as the warranty?" which is just making sure they are covered as that is the most important thing rather than "are the users who go out and buy these consoles at launch getting a console that is going to last the lifetime of the console generation" ....i mean if you look at what used to be acceptable,the likes of snes/atari/mega drive, most of those are still alive and kicking today, i would love to know how many launch xbox 360's and PS3 actually make it to end of life, never mind 20+ years after the end of the generation

and yeah if the YLOD was so minimal it wouldn't have its own acronym to go along with the condition, and as i said it was mainly the launch units that suffer the issues, so despite it being say only 5%, that's still millions of consoles prematurely dying, which imo isn't really "acceptable".....especially when they always ensure the consoles are build just well enough to ensure these faults won't arise until after your warranty has expired


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## VMM (Jun 25, 2015)

gamesquest1 said:


> i think peoples perception of "minimal" or acceptable has been warped by companies, imho no console should have such design flaws as the original PS3 and xbox360, im sure they have plenty of hardware designers who could tell them exactly what kind of airflow they would need to keep the hardware they are packing in working order and an appropriate temperature, but both sony and microsoft put aesthetics above function and reliability, I'm pretty sure that the design meetings probably go "will it last as long as the warranty?" which is just making sure they are covered as that is the most important thing rather than "are the users who go out and buy these consoles at launch getting a console that is going to last the lifetime of the console generation" ....i mean if you look at what used to be acceptable,the likes of snes/atari/mega drive, most of those are still alive and kicking today, i would love to know how many launch xbox 360's and PS3 actually make it to end of life, never mind 20+ years after the end of the generation



Try looking at a motherboard of a SNES/Atari/Mega-Drive and one of PS3/X360.
There are tons of pieces in the circuits of PS3 and X360, that there is almost no space left.
But with these old consoles, the pieces are really distant from each other,
making the console overheat is almost impossible.
The amount of consoles having problems is getting bigger just because the complexity of those systems is also getting bigger.



grossaffe said:


> The YLOD may have been less prevalent than the travesty that was the 360 and its RROD, but it was still very significant.



Significant is subjective


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## gamesquest1 (Jun 25, 2015)

VMM said:


> Try looking at a motherboard of a SNES/Atari/Mega-Drive and one of PS3/X360.
> There are tons of pieces in the circuits of PS3 and X360, that there is almost no space left.
> But with these old consoles, the pieces are really distant from each other,
> making the console overheat is almost impossible.
> The amount of consoles having problems is getting bigger just because the complexity of those systems is also getting bigger.


the point im trying to make is they rush into stuff despite being fully aware that what they are building will not last, which is why i never buy into the launch date hype, i know all people are doing is rushing to buy a console that you pay more for and will inevitably fail alot sooner than the later revisions.

and both sony and MS do that


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## grossaffe (Jun 25, 2015)

VMM said:


> Try looking at a motherboard of a SNES/Atari/Mega-Drive and one of PS3/X360.
> There are tons of pieces in the circuits of PS3 and X360, that there is almost no space left.
> But with these old consoles, the pieces are really distant from each other,
> making the console overheat is almost impossible.
> The amount of consoles having problems is getting bigger just because the complexity of those systems is also getting bigger.


The problems get bigger because they are poorly engineered with a focus on Moar Powar! instead of reliability.  If the console you designed is overheating it's not because "gee, things are so complex these days and there's nothing we can do about it!", its because it was designed with insufficient air-flow, cheap solder that melts at relatively low temperatures, and/or a processor that's running too hot.  A simple engineering solution to the PS3 and 360's overheating problems would have been to clock them lower so they produced less heat.  I've long held that those consoles were too powerful for their time, and it resulted not only in high cost of the console, but as history has shown, a high failure rate due to over-heating.

If I build a PC and overclock the shit out of the CPU and GPU and it starts overheating, my response shouldn't be "oh well, these things happen on modern PCs."  The response should be "Gee, looks like my cooling was insufficient or perhaps I pushed the hardware too hard."  These things don't magically overheat; they overheat because they were poorly engineered.


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## VMM (Jun 25, 2015)

grossaffe said:


> The problems get bigger because they are poorly engineered with a focus on Moar Powar! instead of reliability.  If the console you designed is overheating it's not because "gee, things are so complex these days and there's nothing we can do about it!", its because it was designed with insufficient air-flow, cheap solder that melts at relatively low temperatures, and/or a processor that's running too hot.  A simple engineering solution to the PS3 and 360's overheating problems would have been to clock them lower so they produced less heat.  I've long held that those consoles were too powerful for their time, and it resulted not only in high cost of the console, but as history has shown, a high failure rate due to over-heating.
> 
> If I build a PC and overclock the shit out of the CPU and GPU and it starts overheating, my response shouldn't be "oh well, these things happen on modern PCs."  The response should be "Gee, looks like my cooling was insufficient or perhaps I pushed the hardware too hard."  These things don't magically overheat; they overheat because they were poorly engineered.



My point was that it wasn't that the old consoles were fantastically engineered, it's just that the circuits were simpler so they had almost no worry about overheating.

You're right about the PS3 and 360, they should be better engineered in order to not overheat, but remember I never said otherwise.


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## gamesquest1 (Jun 25, 2015)

VMM said:


> My point was that it wasn't that the old consoles were fantastically engineered, it's just that the circuits were simpler so they had almost no worry about overheating.
> 
> You're right about the PS3 and 360, they should be better engineered in order to not overheat, but remember I never said otherwise.


well the truth is even older consoles had to deal with heating, granted it was on a lesser scale, but the same principles apply, i.e do we pack everything in really close and be like "wow tiny console", or do we use hardware thats fit for use and make sure the case isn't like someone just shrink wrapped a PCB

truth is the saying is true, they really dont make them like they used to, its all just more more more and prettier smaller quieter.....so unfortunately reliability is left in the wayside if they find out that having the CPU run 20_°_ higher means they can shave 2mm off the dimensions


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## the_randomizer (Jun 25, 2015)

If Microsoft can add BC to the Xbox One, why can't Sony do the same? Isn't the reasoning behind both originally lacking BC due to CPU architecture differentials?


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## grossaffe (Jun 25, 2015)

VMM said:


> My point was that it wasn't that the old consoles were fantastically engineered, it's just that the circuits were simpler so they had almost no worry about overheating.
> 
> You're right about the PS3 and 360, they should be better engineered in order to not overheat, but remember I never said otherwise.


Simple engineering is underrated, sometimes.  It's not like the SNES couldn't have been overclocked which would have resulted in overheating.  I mean, if you look at it, Nintendo's been in the game since the 1980s and haven't had the same overheating issues.  The NES-N64 all ran cold enough to be passively cooled.  They started using active cooling since then, but even still, their consoles run cool.  They err on the side of stability and low power consumption over Moar Powar!


----------



## gamesquest1 (Jun 25, 2015)

the_randomizer said:


> If Microsoft can add BC to the Xbox One, why can't Sony do the same? Isn't the reasoning behind both originally lacking BC due to CPU architecture differentials?


i think its a matter of if they can be arsed to make an emulator for it or if they would prefer to not do that and focus on making HD remakes....so coding a emulator that creates minimal new sales VS waiting a few years then selling you the same game again with HD textures, seeing as both systems are in their infancy and dont have many decent games to offer i would say BC is a good idea, but then again sony are currently leading the race so i think they would prefer the resell you the same games a few years down the line instead.....if MS would of been in the lead i think the roles would of been reversed on the BC front

this move from MS imo is simply designed to encourge360 users to choose a xbox one over a PS4, as atm with no backwards compatibility there is zero reason for 360 owners to choose a xbox one over a PS4  either way they have to start their collection from scratch


----------



## kumikochan (Jun 25, 2015)

VMM said:


> Playstation Now never promised backward compatibility, just a way to play some games from previous generations.
> When we talk about backward compatibility, that means 100% of the previous titles will work, or at least close to.
> That's not backward compatibility, they're probably just porting some Xbox and X360 games to X1,
> just like Sony did with some Playstation 2 games on Playstation 3, do you understand now why I'm disappointed?
> ...


----------



## CathyRina (Jun 25, 2015)

VMM said:


> Vita can run all of the PSP games, Vita is truly backward compatible.
> With X1, it seems the game are been ported or emulated in a different way, it seems far from a true backward compability


Like I said only once you hack the console. The PSP library on PSN is missing tons of titles and the PSP UMD sadly won't fit into Vita's cartridge slot.


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## VMM (Jun 26, 2015)

XrosBlader821 said:


> Like I said only once you hack the console. The PSP library on PSN is missing tons of titles and the PSP UMD sadly won't fit into Vita's cartridge slot.



There are some titles that are not on PSN due to copyrights mostly but the fact that they can be run on a hacked Vita is enough to prove it's backward compatible, also the fact that the performance of the games have not changed is also enough prove.
I remember someone saying here on the post that backward compatible games on X1 have a longlasting loading before they can be played,
which is also enough prove that there's no true backward compatibility.


----------



## CathyRina (Jun 26, 2015)

VMM said:


> There are some titles that are not on PSN due to copyrights mostly but the fact that they can be run on a hacked Vita is enough to prove it's backward compatible, also the fact that the performance of the games have not changed is also enough prove.
> I remember someone saying here on the post that backward compatible games on X1 have a longlasting loading before they can be played,
> which is also enough prove that there's no true backward compatibility.


I wonder when You'll notice that I'm not disagreeing with you.


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## gamesquest1 (Jun 26, 2015)

VMM said:


> There are some titles that are not on PSN due to copyrights mostly but the fact that they can be run on a hacked Vita is enough to prove it's backward compatible, also the fact that the performance of the games have not changed is also enough prove.
> I remember someone saying here on the post that backward compatible games on X1 have a longlasting loading before they can be played,
> which is also enough prove that there's no true backward compatibility.


yeah, but it stands to reason, coding an emulator that makes you sales would be more important than coding an emulator that pretty much just allows people to play their old games on the new system with no additional purchase involved.....if xbox was trying to resell you 360 games and not letting you just use your original disks im sure they would be putting more effort into making the emulator as good as it can be

but anyways give them a chance its not even officially launched yet, see what they pull off, i doubt its going to be all that impressive, but as a free feature can people really be complaining


----------



## VMM (Jun 26, 2015)

gamesquest1 said:


> yeah, but it stands to reason, coding an emulator that makes you sales would be more important than *coding an emulator* that pretty much just allows people to play their old games on the new system with no additional purchase involved.....if xbox was trying to resell you 360 games and not letting you just use your original disks im sure they would be putting more effort into making the emulator as good as it can be
> 
> but anyways give them a chance its not even officially launched yet, see what they pull off, i doubt its going to be all that impressive, but as a free feature can people really be complaining



Now that's a point I'm curious, is it a X360 emulator?
I never thought X1 would be able to handle X360 emulation
When I saw the initial list I thought they were porting each one of the titles,
but considering there is a longlasting loading I wonder what they're actually doing.


----------



## gamesquest1 (Jun 26, 2015)

VMM said:


> Now that's a point I'm curious, is it a X360 emulator?
> I never thought X1 would be able to handle X360 emulation
> When I saw the initial list I thought they were porting each one of the titles,
> but considering there is a longlasting loading I wonder what they're actually doing.


yeah it seems you need to download the full game to play, but i doubt they are planning to manually port over 100+ games which people can then play them for free with a old disk it would just make no sense imo....possibly there is some conversion process involved but its a more automated approach semi-emulation,semi-port

would be interesting to know exactly what they are doing though, shame there isnt much in terms of xbox one hacking for people to know whats going on under the hood (afaik)

but on that note with it being downloaded to i guess depending on how thing go they will probably just start selling digital 360 games for download, they obviously have all the files server side to sell and it would be a good way to get dev's onboard with the porting/emulation/black magic process they have going on if they think it will lead to digital sales


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## Tom Bombadildo (Jun 26, 2015)

VMM said:


> Now that's a point I'm curious, is it a X360 emulator?
> I never thought X1 would be able to handle X360 emulation
> When I saw the initial list I thought they were porting each one of the titles,
> but considering there is a longlasting loading I wonder what they're actually doing.


They've stated it is a software emulator. I would imagine Microsoft themselves would have an infinitely easier time setting up an emulator on their XBOne than anyone else would, I mean they have complete documentation on both hardware platforms  There's actually even a "working" Xbox 360 emulator on PC now, though when I say working I mean they managed to launch and "play" a small commercial game, so it's not all too surprising Microsoft was able to pull it off.


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## lolboy (Jul 8, 2015)

They should port pokemon to xbox 360 and make it compatible with  Xbox one!


Spoiler


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## gamesquest1 (Jul 8, 2015)

lolboy said:


> They should port pokemon to xbox 360 and make it compatible with  Xbox one!
> 
> 
> Spoiler


awwww that great xbox 360 classic pokemon isnt supported, guess you will just have to keep your xbox 360 and play the xbox 360 pokemon release on that


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## CathyRina (Jul 8, 2015)

There is a Indie Pokemon game called collectems but it's not planned to release on Xbone.
You should ask them to port a version.


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## Deleted member 473940 (Dec 24, 2015)

Sorry to bump this.
But can you play 360 games online on the Xbone?

Like gears of war co-op.


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## Tom Bombadildo (Dec 24, 2015)

ShawnTRods said:


> Sorry to bump this.
> But can you play 360 games online on the Xbone?
> 
> Like gears of war co-op.


Yep. 

http://support.xbox.com/en-US/xbox-...xbox-360-faq#7db7be9b2a5b43479e36033732d1e451


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## Deleted member 473940 (Dec 24, 2015)

Tom Bombadildo said:


> Yep.
> 
> http://support.xbox.com/en-US/xbox-...xbox-360-faq#7db7be9b2a5b43479e36033732d1e451



nevermind. thanks


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