Gaming DSi software will be region locked

[VmprHntrD]

Grr... Not amused. I was thinking of importing but now that's out the door. I know now I'd think screw downloadable content, and I still feel that way about full sized games. But, I do like getting the little things like MM9, Orbient, Star Soldier R, FFCC My Life as a King, etc on the Wii and I bet I'd like that too on the DSi and I don't want to re-learn all that Japanese again. :\ And of course if it's all written up right this also includes DSi carts how many ever do come out. This is Nintendo, the GBC towards the end nearly shifted to a large majority of specific COLOR only titles, DSi could too and then I'd be hosed.

Not cool at all. At least DS normal imports work as I have Electroplankton or I'd be furious.

 

[Vague Rant]

I wasn't planning to buy a DSi until it's been hacked anyway, so this will just be another prerequisite of my purchase.

 

[sconethief]

hope someone makes a wiifree-like homebrew for this

 

[Rock Raiyu]

Who cares? It has a SD slot. Can anyone say 'Custom Firmware' ? It's gonna happen sooner or later..

We don't even know if the DSi will have firmware.

what are you talking about? the software that runs on the DSi IS firmware.

..I didn't know DSiWare counted as firmware. Nintendo never said the DSi had firmware. =/

 

[Vater Unser]

Imagine they release let's say 'The Legend Of Zelda: The Twelve Trials' which states 'Only Compatible with the DSi Portable System' on the box.
That's totally not gonna happen unless Iwata really wants some pitchforks up his ass.

QUOTEDidn't they do that with the Gameboy Color or something?

Uhm, no?
While the GameBoy Color does have two exclusive Zelda games (as well as an enhanced version of Link's Awakening), you can't compare the GameBoy Color to the DSi at all.
There are major technical differences between the GameBoy and the GameBoy Color, like, you know, the color. The DSi on the other hand has NO relevant hardware changes at all which would justify the release of exclusive cartridge-based games.

 

[tatzelcow]

Who cares? It has a SD slot. Can anyone say 'Custom Firmware' ? It's gonna happen sooner or later..

We don't even know if the DSi will have firmware.

what are you talking about? the software that runs on the DSi IS firmware.

..I didn't know DSiWare counted as firmware. Nintendo never said the DSi had firmware. =/

...I had to finally register (after months and months of using this site) to comment on what you just said.
Oh course the DSi has firmware! :facepalm:
My printer has firmware, your mother board in your computer has firmware (BIOS), your cell phone, mp3 player, etc. You are in many cases able to flash these devices (phones, mp3 players...) with custom firmware that others have created for them (Linux for an Ipod for example)
Firmware is the built-in software on a device, and it can usually be updated by "flashing" the device. For ex. Flashme, that is a firmware replacement for the normal NDS firmware that allows the DS to boot homebrew without the need of a PassMe device and takes away the health screen.
Firmware in general is not like how we simply copy over a new folder onto our MicroSD cards, but it is almost like an operating system that is saved/built into the memory of the device.

What people are speaking of when they mention editing the firmware is pretty much making a Flashme-like replacement firmware for the DSi that bypasses the region restrictions, by maybe changing the firmware to that of a different region, or by making it register as firmware from all regions.


Hope This helps clear some things up

 

[kjean]

Now I can finally call it "the-ass-aye".

 

[Rock Raiyu]

...I had to finally register (after months and months of using this site) to comment on what you just said.
Oh course the DSi has firmware! :facepalm:
My printer has firmware, your mother board in your computer has firmware (BIOS), your cell phone, mp3 player, etc. You are in many cases able to flash these devices (phones, mp3 players...) with custom firmware that others have created for them (Linux for an Ipod for example)
Firmware is the built-in software on a device, and it can usually be updated by "flashing" the device. For ex. Flashme, that is a firmware replacement for the normal NDS firmware that allows the DS to boot homebrew without the need of a PassMe device and takes away the health screen.
Firmware in general is not like how we simply copy over a new folder onto our MicroSD cards, but it is almost like an operating system that is saved/built into the memory of the device.

What people are speaking of when they mention editing the firmware is pretty much making a Flashme-like replacement firmware for the DSi that bypasses the region restrictions, by maybe changing the firmware to that of a different region, or by making it register as firmware from all regions.


Hope This helps clear some things up

Firmware: Computer programming instructions that are stored in a read-only memory unit rather than being implemented through software.

You say that firmware is implemented through software...interesting.

 

[754boy]

The DSi on the other hand has NO relevant hardware changes at all which would justify the release of exclusive cartridge-based games.

You sure about that??

The 2 cameras would be the hardware changes that could justify the release of exclusive cart-based games. Some developer could cook up a game that utilizes one or both cams for gameplay. That would render the game unplayable on the Ds Lite/Phat due to their lack of cams, hence making that game exclusive to DSi. I definitely see that happening.

 

[rubaducky]

Raiyu245, The point made above about firmware being in every piece of electronic equipment is not a stab at your intelligence, it's a fact of life. If your computer did not have firmware on the motherboard, it would not know how to talk to the hardware attached to it and thus how to tell the hard drive to load Windows, for example.

Firmware can either be solid-state, as in, it's burned into the chip and cannot be changed (flashed) but this is very uncommon.
Most firmware these days is flashed onto an EEPROM (Electronically Eraseable Programmable Read Only Memory) chip, and should any bugs be found, or features be implemented to the device throughout its functional lifetime, they are sometimes flashed to that chip.

Don't be fooled that firmware is hardware-only. It is written to a hardware chip, but it can be modified given the appropriate software.

Take a look at upgrading the firmware on a digital camera or iPod, or even PSP for examples of how this works.

Hope this helps!

 

[tatzelcow]

Not "implemented through software", but in a way a "software" in itself independent of an operating system because it is one. pretty much.

 

[Rock Raiyu]

Raiyu245, The point made above about firmware being in every piece of electronic equipment is not a stab at your intelligence, it's a fact of life. If your computer did not have firmware on the motherboard, it would not know how to talk to the hardware attached to it and thus how to tell the hard drive to load Windows, for example.

Firmware can either be solid-state, as in, it's burned into the chip and cannot be changed (flashed) but this is very uncommon.
Most firmware these days is flashed onto an EEPROM (Electronically Eraseable Programmable Read Only Memory) chip, and should any bugs be found, or features be implemented to the device throughout its functional lifetime, they are sometimes flashed to that chip.

Don't be fooled that firmware is hardware-only. It is written to a hardware chip, but it can be modified given the appropriate software.

Take a look at upgrading the firmware on a digital camera or iPod, or even PSP for examples of how this works.

Hope this helps!

I know its not a stab at my intelligence. I'm just explaining my point that DSi Software isn't firmware. I may have been a bit harsh and I apologize for that, but just because DSi has software doesn't mean it will have firmware. The DS has flash firmware but the DSi is totally different from the past 2 handhelds, which don't have updatable firmware like the PSP and shouldn't think that they can get Custom Firmware like it.

 

[kjean]

...I had to finally register (after months and months of using this site) to comment on what you just said.
Oh course the DSi has firmware! :facepalm:
My printer has firmware, your mother board in your computer has firmware (BIOS), your cell phone, mp3 player, etc. You are in many cases able to flash these devices (phones, mp3 players...) with custom firmware that others have created for them (Linux for an Ipod for example)
Firmware is the built-in software on a device, and it can usually be updated by "flashing" the device. For ex. Flashme, that is a firmware replacement for the normal NDS firmware that allows the DS to boot homebrew without the need of a PassMe device and takes away the health screen.
Firmware in general is not like how we simply copy over a new folder onto our MicroSD cards, but it is almost like an operating system that is saved/built into the memory of the device.

What people are speaking of when they mention editing the firmware is pretty much making a Flashme-like replacement firmware for the DSi that bypasses the region restrictions, by maybe changing the firmware to that of a different region, or by making it register as firmware from all regions.


Hope This helps clear some things up

Firmware: Computer programming instructions that are stored in a read-only memory unit rather than being implemented through software.

You say that firmware is implemented through software...interesting.

Read this carefully, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Firmware

"You say that firmware is implemented through software...interesting."
1. is not interesting, it's true.
2. in tatzelcow's post I can only found "Firmware is the built-in software on a device" not "You say that firmware is..."

and DSi certainly got firmware.

 

[tatzelcow]

If by DSiSoftware not being firmware you mean the downloadable games and applications then you are correct; I was not refering to that as firmware. What I was referring to was what you get when you boot up your DS without a game in it (Pictochat, download play, settings...all that stuff) everything there is a part of the firmware. And yes, replacements have been made for the normal DS firmware. Not revolutionary ones, but firmware replacements nonetheless. The DSi will have firmware...without it, it would be a brick. The problem will be figuring out a way to hack it. The implementation of the hack/firmware replacement will most likely be flashing the system like before.


And thank you rubaducky, wonderful response. Described it perfectly.

 

[rubaducky]

If by DSiSoftware not being firmware you mean the downloadable games and applications then you are correct; I was not refering to that as firmware. What I was referring to was what you get when you boot up your DS without a game in it (Pictochat, download play, settings...all that stuff) everything there is a part of the firmware. And yes, replacements have been made for the normal DS firmware. Not revolutionary ones, but firmware replacements nonetheless. The DSi will have firmware...without it, it would be a brick. The problem will be figuring out a way to hack it. The implementation of the hack/firmware replacement will most likely be flashing the system like before.


And thank you rubaducky, wonderful response. Described it perfectly.

Thank you, I do this for a living!

 

[Lumstar]

Possible its system menu could use a ROM chip, but that's very rare.

Even the officially non-user-upgradable DS and DS Lite had firmware instead.

 

[Rock Raiyu]

If by DSiSoftware not being firmware you mean the downloadable games and applications then you are correct; I was not refering to that as firmware. What I was referring to was what you get when you boot up your DS without a game in it (Pictochat, download play, settings...all that stuff) everything there is a part of the firmware. And yes, replacements have been made for the normal DS firmware. Not revolutionary ones, but firmware replacements nonetheless. The DSi will have firmware...without it, it would be a brick. The problem will be figuring out a way to hack it. The implementation of the hack/firmware replacement will most likely be flashing the system like before.


And thank you rubaducky, wonderful response. Described it perfectly.

Ah, so thats what you meant. What I was talking about was that the software such as the DSiWare games/apps were firmware since he was talking about there software. If you mean like firmware like that, then yeah it has it but Nintendo would probably up the security somehow or make it difficult to make a Custom Firmware. He made it seemed like it was in the games/apps itself.

QUOTE(kjean @ Oct 7 2008, 06:12 AM) Read this carefully, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Firmware

"You say that firmware is implemented through software...interesting."
1. is not interesting, it's true.
2. in tatzelcow's post I can only found "Firmware is the built-in software on a device" not "You say that firmware is..."

and DSi certainly got firmware.

For one, you have Wikipedia as your source which is bad. And even so, it says its between software and hardware but is tightly linked to hardware.

 

[tatzelcow]

If by DSiSoftware not being firmware you mean the downloadable games and applications then you are correct; I was not refering to that as firmware. What I was referring to was what you get when you boot up your DS without a game in it (Pictochat, download play, settings...all that stuff) everything there is a part of the firmware. And yes, replacements have been made for the normal DS firmware. Not revolutionary ones, but firmware replacements nonetheless. The DSi will have firmware...without it, it would be a brick. The problem will be figuring out a way to hack it. The implementation of the hack/firmware replacement will most likely be flashing the system like before.


And thank you rubaducky, wonderful response. Described it perfectly.

Thank you, I do this for a living!

@Rubaducky - Awesome, I am also planning on heading into the same field. I already have four MCAS certifications and I will soon be taking my certification exam for A+.

@Raiyu245 - Now I see where the confusion was lol.

 

[choupette]

Still i'm thinking of importing one

cause you're from europe. as I am. and the wait will be so long, that we're thinking of importing anyway.

 

[redviper]

I don't think that the region lock would be much of a problem. There will be ips patches or some sort of tools that will unlock locked ROMs. Also the flashcards' OS could fake region codes. Just wait and see