Yes. That's not the child separation policy we are talking about.Under Obama children have been separated from their guardians in very specific circumstances - if the adults accompanying them posed a danger to them
Yes. That's not the child separation policy we are talking about.Under Obama children have been separated from their guardians in very specific circumstances - if the adults accompanying them posed a danger to them
Oh, so families were separated before Trump came along, and his policy is just harsher, as advertised during his 2016 run? It's beginning to look a whole lot like the "Well yes, but actually no" meme. Just to be clear, nobody wants to separate families, but what's the more humane alternative? Would you prefer if they were just turned around at the border and asked to venture back into the wilderness with guns pointed at them? Or would you prefer if we at least tried to provide them with humane living conditions until the adults at fault can be processed accordingly and either prosecuted or granted asylum? I ask that because an Open Borders policy is a non-starter, and that's, non-negotiable, so in your parlance, you have to pick the lesser of two evils.Yes. That's not the child separation policy we are talking about.
That official is wrong. U.S. law and international treaties guarantee refugees a way to seek asylum, regardless of how they entered the country.In the video I linked the ice official says it’s not. To do it legally the must go to point of entry to verify.
Child separation may be traumatic. But if a native citizen commits a crime and goes to jail who fault is it? The person committing the crime or the people throwing them in jail?
- The conditions are deplorable.
- Child separation alone is objectively torture.
- Children are dying under the "care" of the Trump administration.
- Many asylum seekers are crossing the border "illegally" because ports of entry have become nearly impossible to use under Trump.
- Asylum seekers have a legal right to asylum, even if they didn't cross at a port of entry.
In the video I linked the ice official says it’s not. To do it legally the must go to point of entry to verify.
The child separation policy is a Trump policy that didn't exist before Trump. Saying "yeah, but children were sometimes separated from their parents if they were in danger" isn't the family separation policy. Please don't confuse the two.Oh, so families were separated before Trump came along, and his policy is just harsher, as advertised during his 2016 run? It's beginning to look a whole lot like the "Well yes, but actually no" meme. Just to be clear, nobody wants to separate families, but what's the more humane alternative? Would you prefer if they were just turned around at the border and asked to venture back into the wilderness with guns pointed at them? Or would you prefer if we at least tried to provide them with humane living conditions until the adults at fault can be processed accordingly and either prosecuted or granted asylum? I ask that because an Open Borders policy is a non-starter, and that's, non-negotiable, so in your parlance, you have to pick the lesser of two evils.
The child separation policy has nothing to do with protecting people from sexual assault. In fact, it allegedly led to sexual assault in some cases.Child separation may be traumatic. But if a native citizen commits a crime and goes to jail who fault is it? The person committing the crime or the people throwing them in jail?
Separation was recommend to protect them from sexual assault.
Condition are overcrowded and conditions are not properly funded. The officials that commit crimes to children are of their own choice and no way the fault of Trumps administration. The administration can do what they can to levitate the issue, but you can’t stop all crime, just like you can’t stop all murderers. So how much can you blame him for conditions or due to lack of funding.
It wants it so bad that it stopped it by Executive Order on June 20th. Once again, if the adults are to be prosecuted for illegal entry, the children must be separated from them de facto in order to comply with the Flores settlement. Something's got to give, and you don't seem to have an alternative solution, so that's a dead end in this discussion.The child separation policy is a Trump policy that didn't exist before Trump. Saying "yeah, but children were sometimes separated from their parents if they were in danger" isn't the family separation policy. Please don't confuse the two.
The Trump adminstration wants to separate children purely as a disincentive, and even if they didn't want to, they don't have to.
Yes and no. Immigrants can apply for asylum regardless of whether they entered via a port of entry or not, but there are some additional conditions in terms of eligibility. It's also worth noting that asylum is not equivalent to citizenship and it can be terminated without judicial review.That official is wrong. U.S. law and international treaties guarantee refugees a way to seek asylum, regardless of how they entered the country.
It wants it so bad that it stopped it by Executive Order on June 20th.
Yes and no. Immigrants can apply for assylum regardless of whether they entered via a port of entry or not, but there are some additional conditions in terms of eligibility. It's also worth noting that assylum is not equivalent to citizenship and it can be terminated without judicial review.
http://uscode.house.gov/view.xhtml?req=granuleid:USC-prelim-title8-section1158&num=0&edition=prelim#0-0-0-192
This new rule just entered last year says they can’t enter other then the ports of entry.That official is wrong. U.S. law and international treaties guarantee refugees a way to seek asylum, regardless of how they entered the country.
We are not talking about separating children to protect them from bad adults. We are talking about the separation of just about every child from every family in order to disincentivize illegal immigration.I support separating the children from the adults to protect the children. The same thing happens if you break the law if you're a citizen. Your kids don't come with you to prison. Yeah, let's start encouraging that next or better yet just do away with prisons and decriminalize crime. Criminals should be given less rights not more especially if they aren't citizens of our country. The United States of America comes first!
I don't find not linking to any sort of article to link that that goes along with my point of view making me right or wrong. It's not like simply linking to a 3rd party source makes my claim valid or invalid as with this issue as it's not about facts just about how you think it should be done. There's no right or wrong answer and it's the way I see things and that's good enough for me. I trust my own judgement and I definitionally don't trust Liberal snakes.
The Ice Official said it was for child protection im not lying.The child separation policy is a Trump policy that didn't exist before Trump. Saying "yeah, but children were sometimes separated from their parents if they were in danger" isn't the family separation policy. Please don't confuse the two.
The Trump adminstration wants to separate children purely as a disincentive, and even if they didn't want to, they don't have to.
There is no defense for this policy, evidence by the people here struggling and failing to defend it without lies.
--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------
The child separation policy has nothing to do with protecting people from sexual assault. In fact, it allegedly led to sexual assault in some cases.
Either do more research or stop lying.
More "think of the children", thanks for that. I'm well-aware of why the order was signed, it was signed for the same reason why this conversation persists. Your attempts at emotional manipulation are futile, children will continue to suffer until there's a feasible solution to the border issue, and unfortunately it's one of those problems that you have to throw money at until it's fixed. You can tell me that "children are dying" until you're blue in the face, that won't make detention centers any less underfunded and overcrowded, only stronger border security and a higher budget can help with that.Did you not know this?
- That was in response to backlash.
- The motives behind the child separation policy were explicitly stated.
- Child separation has illegally continued.
- That makes many of them legal asylum seekers.
- Whether or not they're illegal asylum seekers does not change legal limits on how long they're allowed to be detained.
- It's not excuse for the detainment conditions they're receiving under the Trump administration.
- Children are dying.
The Ice Official said it was for child protection im not lying.
Nice try cots.After seeing why you left the page in your post in the Discord for this site I thought I should sign up and give my two cents. While I can't speak about the moderators here due to no experience with them I can see how deleting your post because you generalized when this entire thread contains generalizations would be frustrating.
Maybe they shouldn't travel across the dangerous border with young children.We are not talking about separating children to protect them from bad adults. We are talking about the separation of just about every child from every family in order to disincentivize illegal immigration.
You're not thinking of the children enough, why would you assume that they're being used as legal meat-shields by adults who have chosen to enter the country illegally? Who would do such a thing? Makes no sense to me.how some people seem to see it is, if i take my kid with me to rob a bank i should be free to walk away if i get caught, if someone setup that system you would suddenly get a lot more people actively choosing to take their kids along with them to rob banks, stripping away that loophole to "dissisentivize" people dragging their kids along to dangerous criminal activities isn't a bad idea, if you don't want people committing certain crimes, you can't start adding loopholes that encourage people to take kids along with them on a dangerous activity
i'm sorry but if someone thinks its a great idea to take their small children with them on a dangerous activity, i'm pretty sure under any other circumstance removing the child from their "care" would be a typical response
With an article I linked earlier some people even fake families to claim asylum.how some people seem to see it is, if i take my kid with me to rob a bank i should be free to walk away if i get caught, if someone setup that system you would suddenly get a lot more people actively choosing to take their kids along with them to rob banks, stripping away that loophole to "dissisentivize" people dragging their kids along to dangerous criminal activities isn't a bad idea, if you don't want people committing certain crimes, you can't start adding loopholes that encourage people to take kids along with them on a dangerous activity
i'm sorry but if someone thinks its a great idea to take their small children with them on a dangerous activity, i'm pretty sure under any other circumstance removing the child from their "care" would be a typical response
Honk honk, cue the Benny Hill theme song!Nice try cots.
This new rule just entered last year says they can’t enter other then the ports of entry.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.usatoday.com/amp/1934635002
That's objectively false. This has nothing to do with child protection.The Ice Official said it was for child protection im not lying.
My post had a lot more to say than "think of the children," including very specific facts about the law.More "think of the children"
They admitted the policy and the harm it caused served the purpose of deterring illegal immigration.I'm well-aware of why the order was signed
Acknowledging the plights and children (and adults) at the border isn't "emotional manipulation." They are important issues. If you want to say, "I don't care about the children and adults at the border," be my guest. Until then, you can't justifiably criticize me bringing it up as emotional manipulation.Your attempts at emotional manipulation are futile
Children will continue to suffer until there's a different administration that, among other things, doesn't see suffering as a deterrent that should be used as such.children will continue to suffer until there's a feasible solution to the border issue
Objectively, money is not the cause of the deplorable detainment conditions. It's definitely not the cause of the child separation policy.and unfortunately it's one of those problems that you have to throw money at until it's fixed.
You can tell me that "children are dying" until you're blue in the face, that won't make detention centers any less underfunded and overcrowded
Whether or not we agree that border security is important, it's irrelevant to detaination conditions, child-separation, etc. And, as I said earlier in this post, the budget is not the issue.only stronger border security and higher budget can help with that.
I'd want protection from my own parents if they dragged me across hundreds of miles without adequate food, water, housing and toothpaste to illegally enter a country. I'd beg for it. If any USA citizen would do that to their own children they'd have them taken away. Every single illegal immigrant regardless if they are seeking asylum through legal means are still criminals for illegally crossing the border and should be treated as such.
There's also no way to tell if the adults they are with, that's if they are with any adults have any sort of criminal record other then the one they just created by illegally entering the country. The policy just makes sense, that's why the Liberals hate it. It's also a symptom of the problem. Why not focus on killing the cancer and not just treating the side effects? That's a pretty simple answer for Liberals too. Liberals need votes. They crave power and are using less fortune people as pawns. I say we send ICE after the Liberals after they're done deporting the illegals.
how some people seem to see it is, if i take my kid with me to rob a bank i should be free to walk away if i get caught, if someone setup that system you would suddenly get a lot more people actively choosing to take their kids along with them to rob banks, stripping away that loophole to "dissisentivize" people dragging their kids along to dangerous criminal activities isn't a bad idea, if you don't want people committing certain crimes, you can't start adding loopholes that encourage people to take kids along with them on a dangerous activity
i'm sorry but if someone thinks its a great idea to take their small children with them on a dangerous activity, i'm pretty sure under any other circumstance removing the child from their "care" would be a typical response
I suggest you research why asylum seekers are fleeing their homes. The "dangerous conditions" part is rare, and it usually exists out of a desperate need. If seeking asylum were actually doable at ports of entry and not being mostly blocked by the Trump administration, these dangerous treks wouldn't happen. In other words, illegal border crossing by asylum seekers, including the dangerous ones, are the fault of the Trump administration.Maybe they shouldn't travel across the dangerous border with young children, who are not eligible for asylum, by the way.
You're not thinking of the children enough, why would you assume that they're being used as legal meat-shields by adults who have chosen to enter the country illegally? Who would do such a thing? Makes no sense to me.
That's a minority.With an article I linked earlier some people even fake families to claim asylum.
Kids should not be punished for the crimes of the parents.
Native citizens are separated from their kids when they commit crimes and the same was going to happen with illegal immigrants.