When is pirating ok? (discussion)

[ShadowSoldier]

So apparently playing and enjoying gaming is only for the rich and not everyone, way to enforce class equality.

Is it that wrong to not let everyone be involved regardless of how they obtained their game, when someone else pirates does someone magically appear and punch you in the face? no that doesn't happen, it doesn't affect you personally so why bother standing on that high horse yourself and dictate what others should and shouldn't do because it doesn't fit in your perfect little world. If somebody pirates then who really cares cause i'm sure they have their own reasons why they do it.

You said it, not me.

 

[Just Another Gamer]

Everything is always for the rich Oh and I do not consider my self poor. But if i am gonna spend say 1.000 dollars this year for my gaming hobby i prefer to spend them on a new I5 processor, a new motherboard, new ram and a gtx670 for my pc and enjoy any game out there, than to waste them on buying the games and struggle to play them on my previous core2duo and gtx295

This is my point. I'm not saying i'm poor but i'm not rich either and why should I somehow be restricted from playing games when I can still get them and its not like I don't spend any money I still have to buy the console to play it on and newer consoles aren't hacked so you can't pirate so I do buy games until I don't have to anymore and that is going to be several years down the road.

I know how you feel.

Boo hoo, the executives sitting on the boards at the video games companies will have a smaller bonus this quarter and not be able to buy there mistress a new fur coat because some nerds pirated their games.

Lol, this is how I feel whenever I see a company say "piracy is killing us" when a few months later it got reported that they sold millions of their new game.

You said it, not me.

You didn't have to say to mean what I said. By telling others that they need to stop pirating and buy all their games is just another way of saying your poor so you don't deserve to have gaming as a hobby.

 

[ShadowSoldier]

This is my point. I'm not saying i'm poor but i'm not rich either and why should I somehow be restricted from playing games when I can still get them and its not like I don't spend any money I still have to buy the console to play it on and newer consoles aren't hacked so you can't pirate so I do buy games until I don't have to anymore and that is going to be several years down the road.

I know how you feel.


Lol, this is how I feel whenever I see a company say "piracy is killing us" when a few months later it got reported that they sold millions of their new game.


You didn't have to say to mean what I said. By telling others that they need to stop pirating and buy all their games is just another way of saying your poor so you don't deserve to have gaming as a hobby.

Again, I said no such thing so stop saying I did. I said that most pirates who pirate, they simply can't afford it to buy games, or some on here go out and buy the games after. But this guy alone is acting as if he's entitled to the games. He seems to think that because of some stupid government bullshit reasons he brought up and how it's not fair and how he's always getting ripped off and blah blah blah, that that somehow entitles him to games, which it does not. He also goes off how about how we're wasting money buying games when we can pirate them, and then in like 20 years or so he'll be laughing at all who bought games. Then he goes off about how he'll never ever get caught and all that stupid cocky shit that has been said multiple times by people who got caught. Like I said, I don't give a shit if people pirate games, but he, or you, or me are in any way entitled to games at all.

 

[jimskeet2002]

Ok guys to finish with this topic....
If any of you meet all of the following requirements:
Doesn't have a single downloaded MP3
Uses only purchased software, (Not a single downloaded pirated game, not a single version of windows downloaded, not a single software pirated (ex photoshop etc....)
Pays the artist for any image that he downloads on his pc, since they are copyrighted too...
Doesn't watch movies to friend's house, or Doesn't play any game on a friend's console or pc, or doesn't listen to music on friend's house
Didn't ever hack any of his consoles
(I am sure there are more requirements I can find that all of you have violated but I don't waste my time now to find them)
Then you are able to talk to us about piracy and how wrong it is...
If not just STFU and enjoy piracy and its glorious rewards like all of us do and don't feel ashamed to do it.
Nough said on this topic.
I have some hundreds of GB of pirated games to waste my time on.
Cya

 

[Just Another Gamer]

Again, I said no such thing so stop saying I did. I said that most pirates who pirate, they simply can't afford it to buy games, or some on here go out and buy the games after. But this guy alone is acting as if he's entitled to the games. He seems to think that because of some stupid government bullshit reasons he brought up and how it's not fair and how he's always getting ripped off and blah blah blah, that that somehow entitles him to games, which it does not. He also goes off how about how we're wasting money buying games when we can pirate them, and then in like 20 years or so he'll be laughing at all who bought games. Then he goes off about how he'll never ever get caught and all that stupid cocky shit that has been said multiple times by people who got caught. Like I said, I don't give a shit if people pirate games, but he, or you, or me are in any way entitled to games at all.

I never said you said it but its easily the impression you get from reading what you said. Nonetheless it won't change if he thinks he won't get caught then thats his thinking and if his way to rationalize what he does is by somehow blaming the government then by all means it doesn't make a difference to any else expect him. Well to be fair from a financial point of view if you could get the get the game for free then I hardly see why you wouldn't, apart from collector's editions if I could pirate al my games then I would because I did save up and spent a lot on the console.

Although I never said I was entitled to get any games for free and I don't think anyone here says that but to be fair after spending a few hundred on the console I would like a few games for free instead of letting companies and retailers overcharge me.

Ok guys to finish with this topic....
If any of you meet all of the following requirements:
Doesn't have a single downloaded MP3
Uses only purchased software, (Not a single downloaded pirated game, not a single version of windows downloaded, not a single software pirated (ex photoshop etc....)
Pays the artist for any image that he downloads on his pc, since they are copyrighted too...
Doesn't watch movies to friend's house, or Doesn't play any game on a friend's console or pc, or doesn't listen to music on friend's house
Didn't ever hack any of his consoles
(I am sure there are more requirements I can find that all of you have violated but I don't waste my time now to find them)
Then you are able to talk to us about piracy and how wrong it is...
If not just STFU and enjoy piracy and its glorious rewards like all of us do and don't feel ashamed to do it.
Nough said on this topic.
I have some hundreds of GB of pirated games to waste my time on.
Cya

As true as this is putting it this way is a little arrogant. I mean I only pirate because of financial issues and some benifits from having the ISO instead of the actual disk like bypassing DRM or extra mods etc but apart from that I would happily buy games.

 

[jimskeet2002]

As true as this is putting it this way is a little arrogant. I mean I only pirate because of financial issues and some benifits from having the ISO instead of the actual disk like bypassing DRM or extra mods etc but apart from that I would happily buy games.

Truth is hard Everyone pirated for his own reasons. Also anyone is free to buy what ever he wants. But when little kids that are brainwashed from companies and governments talk to me about how bad piracy is and how wrong I am and they are the good ones that support developers so they don't go bankrupt I just want to pull my arm off so I have something to throw at them.... I am really enraged when I see how easily are people manipulated by media...

 

[Filipe C Bello dos Santos]

What country do you live? If it is Brazil it is not true at all. Avarage income here was $1049 in 2011, probabily it is even high now in 2013. A game here, for example, Mario Kart 7 is U$63.95 / GBP 39.60 (or R$ 129.99). So I dont get your point. For me this value is not so high.

Your argument was valid back on 1994, when the minumum wage was R$ 70.00 per month and a game was R$ 60.00, but now things are VERY different. But on MS Dos times, piracy was a rule, at least here.

So the average it's not $400, it's $500. and a game cost more than 10% of that and you don't see it as expensive.

I see it because i have other things to pay (house, taxes, food, school), but i buy my games when i can or can't pirate, like 3ds games and discount games on steam and gog.com.

True, in 1994, it's was hard to buy games, as you said, the minimun was 70 and a game was 60, but back then we had a lot of games to rent. Now that the minimun is R$690 (US$ 345) and games cost R$130 (US$70) and you have almost no place to rent a game, it became easy ? a console that is U$199 cost US400 or more.

 

[BloodShed]

So apparently playing and enjoying gaming is only for the rich and not everyone, way to enforce class equality.

What?? Is this a serious comment? You aren't entitled to be entertained for free on the backs of hard working people. Videogames are not a necessity. We're not talking about feeding the poor here.

Do you also complain to Lamborghini because they aren't sold at a price that everyone can afford? What kind of ridiculous thinking is that?

But when little kids that are brainwashed from companies and governments talk to me about how bad piracy is and how wrong I am and they are the good ones that support developers so they don't go bankrupt I just want to pull my arm off so I have something to throw at them.... I am really enraged when I see how easily are people manipulated by media...

Jimskeet, do you have some kind of disorder? You think there's a conspiracy to incorrectly convince the world that piracy is wrong? In fact, you honestly think that it's perfectly acceptable to never purchase a single game for this reason? Wow.

Look, I happen to be a software developer. I can tell you there's a significant amount of work that goes into making these products. If you enjoy a game, there's a lot of talented people that deserve to be paid. In what alternate reality do you live in that you can sit there and tell us that these people deserve nothing and it's a conspiracy to suggest they do. You seem to think that they should be working tirelessly for your entertainment as some sort of unpaid slaves. Am I right?

I mean, fuck those guys and their families! Who cares if they have kids to support! What a bunch of crazy lies to suggest that anyone should actually pay them! Yeah! Down with government!

I mean, even as a developer, it doesn't really bother me if you said you pirate some games (as long as you buy the ones you like when you can). The thing that bothers me is to see your irrational opinion that software should never be supported because you'd rather spend your available money on something else (like hardware). I doubt you'd have the same opinion if someone told you your job and skills are worthless and should be provided to everyone for free.

You define the word "selfishness".


EDIT: Also, I just want to clarify again for everyone... I can also agree that brand new games are overpriced. Fine; don't buy it for $60 when it comes out. Buy it when the price drops to something you prefer! That's what I started doing. I buy the games when they drop to somewhere around $20-40 (depending on the game)

 

[jimskeet2002]

Jimskeet, do you have some kind of disorder? You think there's a conspiracy to incorrectly convince the world that piracy is wrong? In fact, you honestly think that it's perfectly acceptable to never purchase a single game for this reason? Wow.

Look, I happen to be a software developer. I can tell you there's a significant amount of work that goes into making these products. If you enjoy a game, there's a lot of talented people that deserve to be paid. In what alternate reality do you live in that you can sit there and tell us that these people deserve nothing and it's a conspiracy to suggest they do. You seem to think that they should be working tirelessly for your entertainment as some sort of unpaid slaves. Am I right?

I mean, fuck those guys and their families! Who cares if they have kids to support! What a bunch of crazy lies to suggest that anyone should actually pay them! Yeah! Down with government!

I mean, even as a developer, it doesn't really bother me if you said you pirate some games (as long as you buy the ones you like when you can). The thing that bothers me is to see your irrational opinion that software should never be supported because you'd rather spend your available money on something else (like hardware). I doubt you'd have the same opinion if someone told you your job and skills are worthless and should be provided to everyone for free.

You define the word "selfishness".

If you read my previous posts you will realize that I am not saying that they don't deserve to get paid. I am saying that they deserve to get paid IF they price their products correctly for ME. For you that you might make 5000$ per month 50$ per game is a good price, for me that i make ~600 IT IS NOT. So they do not deserve to get 1/12 of my salary for a game. Do you get my point?

And I am not up for waiting for a price to go to normal standards so I can play the game... Since they feel like overpricing their products then I feel like pirating. Simple as that

 

[Just Another Gamer]

What?? Is this a serious comment? You aren't entitled to be entertained for free on the backs of hard working people. Videogames are not a necessity. We're not talking about feeding the poor here.

Do you also complain to Lamborghini because they aren't sold at a price that everyone can afford? What kind of ridiculous thinking is that?

You do know there is a big difference between a luxury car and gaming right?

I'm also not entitled to be ripped off by people who assume they know better just because they work in the industry and be fed lies saying that piracy is the most evil thing on earth and who ever does it need to be sued for a ridiculous amount as some sort of "compensation". Heres my stand because this happened to me last year; I needed Photoshop for homework from school and it costs over $200 or was that $300, I forgot, so now I should've wasted my money on a program that can only do 1 thing and thats photo editng or pirate it because its a huge rip off and I need it for school I chose to pirate it and it does the exact same bloody thing.

I never said i'm entitled to get games for free, I said I can get the for free so why should I bother with some rich company's sob story about them not making that 2 billion dollars they wanted but only making 1 billion. Just so you know I do buy games but when the times comes that a console is hacked and can play downloaded ROMs/ISOs, its there that I stop buying unless it is a collector's edition or some additional stuff fr the game.

 

[lestatbytes]

Boo hoo, the executives sitting on the boards at the video games companies will have a smaller bonus this quarter and not be able to buy there mistress a new fur coat because some nerds pirated their games.

and grit their teeth while the orcs rejoice for free roms, its gonna happen whether you like it or not. Its just how it is, despite the endless debates about whose/whats right or wrong. Orcs will always pirate games, regardless of high priest constant warnings or BS.


Weird my skin is somewhat green.D:

 

[Filipe C Bello dos Santos]

So, if game is not for the poor people, why bother if poor people pirate games ? they will not buy it anyway, therefore they don't count on the market.

And i totally agree with Jimskeet, who doesn't have pirate software installed on PC ?

Finally, i'm in the middle, because i do buy games, when it is cool enough to belong in my collection.

 

[BloodShed]

I am saying that they deserve to get paid IF they price their products correctly for ME. For you that you might make 5000$ per month 50$ per game is a good price, for me that i make ~600 IT IS NOT. So they do not deserve to get 1/12 of my salary for a game. Do you get my point?

I get that! Like I'm saying, buy the game when the price is what you want it to be! If publishers see a huge spike in sales when it drops to a certain level, it can only help to encourage them to drop the price. Hell, games go on sale on Steam all the time for $5. How can you say you can afford a GTX670 but not a $5 game??

Instead, what I kept seeing in your previous posts is that you never buy any games, that buying games is a waste of money, and that you would rather selfishishly buy the things you can't get for free. Then, you sum it all up that anyone saying otherwise is a manipulated kid.

And I am not up for waiting for a price to go to normal standards so I can play the game...

It's just my own opinion, but that's why I say it's not a big deal to pirate if you eventually buy the games you enjoy. You're not willing to pay $60. I can agree. So, who cares if you play the game a bit earlier? But it seems pretty clear that you have no interest in ever buying any games... no matter what price it sells for.

 

[jimskeet2002]

I get that! Like I'm saying, buy the game when the price is what you want it to be! If publishers see a huge spike in sales when it drops to a certain level, it can only help to encourage them to drop the price. Hell, games go on sale on Steam all the time for $5. How can you say you can afford a GTX670 but not a $5 game??

Instead, what I kept seeing in your previous posts is that you never buy any games, that buying games is a waste of money, and that you would rather selfishishly buy the things you can't get for free. Then, you sum it all up that anyone saying otherwise is a manipulated kid.


It's just my own opinion, but that's why I say it's not a big deal to pirate if you eventually buy the games you enjoy. You're not willing to pay $60. I can agree. So, who cares if you play the game a bit earlier? But it seems pretty clear that you have no interest in ever buying any games... no matter what price it sells for.

That is not true. Have bought a 3ds, kid icarus (liked it a lot but after finishing it i wish i didn't buy it cause 50euro is kinda too much.....), several nitendo shop games and couple of PC games. Diablo 3, Guildwars 2 and Heroes of Newerth. The only purchases i feel was worth my money was diablo 3 since i made 400$ allready out of it and heroes of newerth since i ve been playing it since 2009 and I still play it very often. Bought guildwars 2 with money I got from Diablo 3. I though I got money from gaming so why not spend some of them on gaming too. But that's it... I wont pay 50$ for battlefield 3 that i finish it in 5 days... If they were selling it for 10 dollars ( which is actually what is really worth ) then I would maybe buy that too. And only because it has multiplayer... Else it wouldn't worth even the 10$
Also the companies won't do what you say. Do you know why? Cause there are too many people with lots of money that will buy them for 50 and 60 and even 100 and more for collectors editions and stuff... So they want to milk them first... After milking them, they decide to drop the prices so they milk the rest of the guys that are willing to pay less

 

[BloodShed]

So, if game is not for the poor people, why bother if poor people pirate games ? they will not buy it anyway, therefore they don't count on the market.

I can agree. A lot of people call piracy "theft" but that's only partially true. Unlike say... stealing the Lamborghini from my previous example, there's no loss of product. You are not taking the product away from another paying customer and, if you were never going to buy it anyway, there's no financial impact.

Now, if you CAN afford it and if you enjoy the game but still refuse to ever buy it... it's unethical and selfish.

 

[Foxi4]

People here are forgetting that video games are not essentials - they are not necessary for survival. Gaming is a luxurious hobby, not a necessity. It's understandable when someone seizes posession of a loaf of bread because he or she had to to survive - not so much when someone obtains and uses software which he or she is not entitled to use. If you don't have a license for the software, you're not supposed to use it, and that's that. Piracy is not theft, it is wrong though - any counter-arguments are just poor attempts at justifying illegal activities.

Now, I'm not going to lecture anyone - I pirate things too, but at the very least I'm aware that it's the wrong thing to do. Be true to yourself and accept that it is.

 

[jimskeet2002]

People here are forgetting that video games are not essentials - they are not necessary for survival. Gaming is a luxurious hobby, not a necessity. It's understandable when someone seizes posession of a loaf of bread because he or she had to to survive - not so much when someone obtains and uses software which he or she is not entitled to use. If you don't have a license for the software, you're not supposed to use it, and that's that. Piracy is not theft, it is wrong though - any counter-arguments are just poor attempts at justifying illegal activities.

Now, I'm not going to lecture anyone - I pirate things too, but at the very least I'm aware that it's the wrong thing to do. Be true to yourself and accept that it is.

Yes it is wrong for companies.
It is right for me and I guess for many others though. there are always 2 faces of the same coin.

 

[Foxi4]

Yes it is wrong for companies.
It is right for me and I guess for many others though. there are always 2 faces of the same coin.

Wrong for companies? It's wrong from the moral point of view first and foremost - you're taking advantage of the developer's hard work without paying a contribution for it. You're not paying credit.

So apparently playing and enjoying gaming is only for the rich and not everyone, way to enforce class equality.

It's not unfair, it's not tragic and it certainly isn't enforcing class unequality - it's tough love.

I'd love to "enjoy" a Lamborghini but I can't afford one - that's life. I have to deal with it. I can save up for one if I really want one - I have that option. Gamers have the option to save up for their games.

EDIT: I just realized someone used the same argument... along with the same brand of cars... what a coincidence, people must really like Lamborghinis...

 

[BloodShed]

That is not true. Have bought...

Cool. That's all I'm saying. Your previous posts come across differently. Maybe it's just my interpretation.

I'm not trying to change anyones opinion of what they think games are worth. I simply think that people should pay for it if they can honestly afford a price they feel it's worth.

Will people pirate games they can afford anyway? Of course. People will also shoplift and steal. There's no changing that. But they can't go around pretending it's okay either.

Also the companies won't do what you say. Do you know why? Cause there are too many people with lots of money that will buy them for 50 and 60 and even 100 and more for collectors editions and stuff... So they want to milk them first... After milking them, they decide to drop the prices so they milk the rest of the guys that are willing to pay less

Believe me, I'm with you. I posted earlier about these greedy publishers shoveling junk to rape the fan base. I was suckered into it for years. Even now, I know sometimes I can't resist. But, for the most part, I stopped buying games right away because I don't want to support this pricing trend either. I have no love for these board members that decide the pricing model. They also soak up all the profits. Maybe if they didn't pay themselves millions every year, they could easily sell games at a more reasonable price.

Obviously, that opinion doesn't apply to independent developers. But I also can't think of a single independent game that ever tried to sell for $60.

 

[jimskeet2002]

Wrong for companies? It's wrong from the moral point of view first and foremost - you're taking advantage of the developer's hard work without paying a contribution for it. You're not paying credit.


It's not unfair, it's not tragic and it certainly isn't enforcing class unequality - it's tough love.

I'd love to "enjoy" a Lamborghini but I can't afford one - that's life. I have to deal with it. I can save up for one if I really want one - I have that option. Gamers have the option to save up for their games.

While the developer isn't talking advantage of our human nature and our need to have fun with games when they price it for 60 dollars? And if you could download a lamborghini right out of your apartment for free I am pretty sure you would.