Being transgender is no longer a mental illness according to WHO

[59672]

Your gender is written in your chromosomes and you cannot change that.

I hate to break it to you but gender and the sex of your body are two completely separate things. Gender is like self expression, it's a social construct or roles that we use to better define and align ourselves. Gender also breaks down into gender presentation (how you present yourself), gender identity (how you feel) and so on. Looking beyond the catholic western societies, there are other ones out there that have more than just the typical male and female genders, the idea of there being more than two is absolutely nothing new.
Sex refers to your body's physical anatomy, this is something that can only be changed by surgery. Indeed your sex, at least until altered by means of surgery is determined by your chromosomes. Also, like gender there are more than two sexes, there are also intersex folk out there, however rare they may be.

 

[Ty_]

I hate to break it to you but gender and the sex of your body are two completely separate things. Gender is like self expression, it's a social construct or roles that we use to better define and align ourselves. Gender also breaks down into gender presentation (how you present yourself), gender identity (how you feel) and so on. Looking beyond the catholic western societies, there are other ones out there that have more than just the typical male and female genders, the idea of there being more than two is absolutely nothing new.
Sex refers to your body's physical anatomy, this is something that can only be changed by surgery. Indeed your sex, at least until altered by means of surgery is determined by your chromosomes. Also, like gender there are more than two sexes, there are also intersex folk out there, however rare they may be.

If gender is a social construct/an expression and not an innate and therefore protected characteristic, why should I care about something like the gender pay gap?

 

[59672]

https://fairplayforwomen.com/canadian-lauren-southern-becomes-man/
Lauren Southern is a pretty qt man, you gotta admit.

Your link is not only a source of TERF information which is disgusting but also highly misleading. Misgendering being a crime is something that transphobes like TERFs and the alt right love to parrot but it's not such a simple matter. Don't take my word for it, a decent albeit posted by Vice explanation can be found at https://www.vice.com/en_ca/article/qbnamx/no-the-trans-rights-bill-doesnt-criminalize-free-speech

That individual may have found the perfect doctor to sign off without any real question but it is not such a simple journey

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------

If gender is a social construct/an expression and not an innate and therefore protected characteristic, why should I care about something like the gender pay gap?

I fail to see any point you are making, no one says you have to care about the gender pay gap. You should as a decent person but hey, no one's forcing you to be, just like no one is forced to align to their assigned at birth gender. By virtue of living in a society, we might be automatically placed into such groupings but just because society places a null hypothesis on people typically being straight and cis by default, it doesn't make it the only valid standing.

 

[deinonychus71]

Whoever the fuck called it a mental illness is an idiot. Being who you want to be is not a bad thing, so why label it as such?

I know it's gonna be unpopular but oh well...
I don't think it's got anything to do with being an idiot. It's heavily influenced by the social norms at the time. The "social construct" that every kid is being taught early on.
In our current society, these norms tend towards inclusiveness (which in most cases is a good thing imho) but rather than calling all the people who are having issues getting on the train of progress "alt right" and "evil" etc... - maybe - understanding where they come from would be more beneficial than outright calling them idiots. Attack the biased construct, not the person.

Also, Being who you want to be is a good thing, but the question is how far do we go before it becomes fantasy, where do we draw the line?

Maybe I'd love to be living in the body of another species? Like therians/otherkins etc. Should I force this view on people and expect them to call me differently? If that sounds crazy and stupid, will that sound just as crazy and stupid in 10, 20 years?
For the record, just for saying that I've been called troll before, but I think these people don't realize that this could just be the new "fight" of tomorrow (I hope not) and before they know it, they would be the one in the position of the "alt right" for not understanding people who need to be recognized as something else.
And since I know people will start invoking science here, we do share part of our dna with animals. And we ignore a lot of about it still, so why not?

You're always gonna be "at the right" of something in your life.

 

[Psi-hate]

I appreciate this, I've been told terrible and harsh things to me like "chopping off your body parts wont make you happy" or "you are mentally ill and if you don't get fixed you will likely end your life because of this disease". I don't even have genital dysphoria (not to an extent of it affecting my emotions), I just have other physical and appearance based dysphoria. Ideally taking estrogen would heal a lot of my problems. I've recognized me being a girl for 6 years and the pain gets worse, but it just means I'm closer to getting what I need. This will hopefully put a lot of ease into the process of getting the proper treatment we deserve.

 

[The Catboy]

Okay, which means transgender people have more issues with depression than the average person, tying in to the mental illness aspect. Also note that suicide rates for these people shoot up *after* transitioning

Actually that statement is completely false. Research (which has already been linked multiple times in this thread) has shown an increase in overall happiness, drop in depression, and drop in suicide rates. It's also been stated multiple times that links to depression and suicide have been connected to social issues and lack of a healthy supportive network. Basically the reason why suicides are higher than most is because people treating trans people like subhumans and they often end up in an unhealthy environment. Similar issues were shown during the periods before general acceptance of homosexuality, but in resent years suicides of homosexual youth have dropped drastically. Humans are social animals and need healthy social interactions with other humans.

If gender is a social construct/an expression and not an innate and therefore protected characteristic, why should I care about something like the gender pay gap?

It's called being a decent human. If someone is getting paid less for the same job based on arbitrary features, then that's something to be concerned about.

 

[SG854]

I hate to break it to you but gender and the sex of your body are two completely separate things. Gender is like self expression, it's a social construct or roles that we use to better define and align ourselves. Gender also breaks down into gender presentation (how you present yourself), gender identity (how you feel) and so on. Looking beyond the catholic western societies, there are other ones out there that have more than just the typical male and female genders, the idea of there being more than two is absolutely nothing new.
Sex refers to your body's physical anatomy, this is something that can only be changed by surgery. Indeed your sex, at least until altered by means of surgery is determined by your chromosomes. Also, like gender there are more than two sexes, there are also intersex folk out there, however rare they may be.

Sex being separate from Gender Identity and Expression has no scientific basis. No competent psychologists will agree with that. If it was different separate things then why do pray the gay away fail? Or telling trans that mentally they aren't the opposite sex fail? Social constructions have a biological basis behind it. Biology comes first then constructs.

 

[The Catboy]

I hate to break it to you but gender and the sex of your body are two completely separate things. Gender is like self expression, it's a social construct or roles that we use to better define and align ourselves. Gender also breaks down into gender presentation (how you present yourself), gender identity (how you feel) and so on. Looking beyond the catholic western societies, there are other ones out there that have more than just the typical male and female genders, the idea of there being more than two is absolutely nothing new.
Sex refers to your body's physical anatomy, this is something that can only be changed by surgery. Indeed your sex, at least until altered by means of surgery is determined by your chromosomes. Also, like gender there are more than two sexes, there are also intersex folk out there, however rare they may be.

Actually the social construct argument does have some flaws in it. Gender expression is a social construct, but gender expression is only a small part of gender. There actually are biological differences that have been researched and shows that people who are trans often have the brain structure wired for the gender that they identify as. This is the more important factor as it does show something that can be studied and understood, where as gender expression is just a social construct.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/20...-promised-study-shows-structural-differences/
https://bigthink.com/mike-colagross...ign-with-rather-than-what-they-were-born-with

Personally I am not a big fan of calling gender a social construct because it only focuses on some of the parts involved in gender and not the actual bigger picture.

 

[KingVamp]

Also, Being who you want to be is a good thing, but the question is how far do we go before it becomes fantasy, where do we draw the line?

Maybe I'd love to be living in the body of another species? Like therians/otherkins etc. Should I force this view on people and expect them to call me differently? If that sounds crazy and stupid, will that sound just as crazy and stupid in 10, 20 years?
For the record, just for saying that I've been called troll before, but I think these people don't realize that this could just be the new "fight" of tomorrow (I hope not) and before they know it, they would be the one in the position of the "alt right" for not understanding people who need to be recognized as something else.
And since I know people will start invoking science here, we do share part of our dna with animals. And we ignore a lot of about it still, so why not?

This reminds me of transhumanism.

 

[f0xrolder]

Johns Hopkins Psychiatrist: Transgender is ‘Mental Disorder;' Sex Change ‘Biologically Impossible’
By Michael W. Chapman | June 2, 2015 | 1:34 PM EDT


Dr. Paul R. McHugh, the former psychiatrist-in-chief for Johns Hopkins Hospital and its current Distinguished Service Professor of Psychiatry, said that transgenderism is a “mental disorder” that merits treatment, that sex change is “biologically impossible,” and that people who promote sexual reassignment surgery are collaborating with and promoting a mental disorder.

Dr. McHugh, the author of six books and at least 125 peer-reviewed medical articles, made his remarks in a recent commentary in the Wall Street Journal, where he explained that transgender surgery is not the solution for people who suffer a “disorder of ‘assumption’” – the notion that their maleness or femaleness is different than what nature assigned to them biologically.

He also reported on a new study showing that the suicide rate among transgendered people who had reassignment surgery is 20 times higher than the suicide rate among non-transgender people. Dr. McHugh further noted studies from Vanderbilt University and London’s Portman Clinic of children who had expressed transgender feelings but for whom, over time, 70%-80% “spontaneously lost those feelings.”

While the Obama administration, Hollywood, and major media such as Time magazine promote transgenderism as normal, said Dr. McHugh, these “policy makers and the media are doing no favors either to the public or the transgendered by treating their confusions as a right in need of defending rather than as a mental disorder that deserves understanding, treatment and prevention.”

 

[guisadop]

But playing videogames is? Doesn't sound right to me.

 

[f0xrolder]

I'd rather take the word of Doctor Paul R McHugh than an article written in the telegraph by a muppet whom is pushing this socio/political agenda!

 

[Song of storms]

Because they are medical treatments. Although they are actually optional medical treatments, they are often seen as a treatments to help someone live a comfortable life. Just because it's not a mental disorder, doesn't mean it no longer requires medical help when/if needed.

Not saying that I'm against transgender people, but I think that you can't have both. If it's no longer considered a mental illness then I refuse to pay for these optional treatments with my taxes. Where is the free dental care? Those can drive people to suicide too but the lobby of dentists laugh their ass off whenever people say that they want free surgeries.

 

[guisadop]

Gender is like self expression, it's a social construct

So you're saying that if we create a gender-dysphoric boy to live as a boy he won't be gender-dysphoric anymore? That is absurd.
No, gender is not a social construct. It is innate, you're born with it, like sexual orientation.

 

[KingVamp]

Everything else aside, saying real sex change is impossible is pretty shortsighted.

 

[f0xrolder]

See my "Warning Level" it's at 40%, because I disagree with the op's and most of the mentally ill here on this issue and it's considered "trolling" to voice an opinion opposite to this world wide agenda.

How many young impressionable minds do you think come to this site daily for gaming/modding news and then see and read vulgar topics of discussion like this?????


Why a mod doesn't shut this thread down and delete has me baffled! Maybe they really want young men to go and mutilate themselves and then have to wear plastic in their new slit to stop the wound from healing. Pretty sickening if you ask me!

 

[The Catboy]

Not saying that I'm against transgender people, but I think that you can't have both. If it's no longer considered a mental illness then I refuse to pay for these optional treatments with my taxes. Where is the free dental care? Those can drive people to suicide too but the lobby of dentists laugh their ass off whenever people say that they want free surgeries.

The treatment has actually been proven to better the lives of trans people and reduce depression and suicides. There's no reason not to support a treatment that has actually been proven to help people. As well your argument for dental care is something else, but it should be covered as well. It's absurd to have health care that doesn't care all health related issues, including dental.

But playing videogames is? Doesn't sound right to me.

Why does this keep being brought up? Gaming isn't a mental disorder, people who literally starve to death because they addicted to gaming is. There is an extreme difference between what is classified as a video game addiction and your average gamer. I feel like people are taking it personally without actually looking into the actual qualification to what is considered an addiction.

 

[Kingy]

Also, like gender there are more than two sexes, there are also intersex folk out there, however rare they may be.

As people have already talked about the “social construct” myth, I’ll talk about this segment.

You can not classify intersex as an actual sex because it’s a birth defect. There is also no recorded case of the genitalia working. So no, there are only two sexes (which also means only two genders— gender is biologically linked to sex!) wether you like it or not.

 

[SG854]

Johns Hopkins Psychiatrist: Transgender is ‘Mental Disorder;' Sex Change ‘Biologically Impossible’
By Michael W. Chapman | June 2, 2015 | 1:34 PM EDT


Dr. Paul R. McHugh, the former psychiatrist-in-chief for Johns Hopkins Hospital and its current Distinguished Service Professor of Psychiatry, said that transgenderism is a “mental disorder” that merits treatment, that sex change is “biologically impossible,” and that people who promote sexual reassignment surgery are collaborating with and promoting a mental disorder.

Dr. McHugh, the author of six books and at least 125 peer-reviewed medical articles, made his remarks in a recent commentary in the Wall Street Journal, where he explained that transgender surgery is not the solution for people who suffer a “disorder of ‘assumption’” – the notion that their maleness or femaleness is different than what nature assigned to them biologically.

He also reported on a new study showing that the suicide rate among transgendered people who had reassignment surgery is 20 times higher than the suicide rate among non-transgender people. Dr. McHugh further noted studies from Vanderbilt University and London’s Portman Clinic of children who had expressed transgender feelings but for whom, over time, 70%-80% “spontaneously lost those feelings.”

While the Obama administration, Hollywood, and major media such as Time magazine promote transgenderism as normal, said Dr. McHugh, these “policy makers and the media are doing no favors either to the public or the transgendered by treating their confusions as a right in need of defending rather than as a mental disorder that deserves understanding, treatment and prevention.”

Something wrong happens in the developmental process that the brain develops differently then the body in the womb. Whether or not to classify that as a disorder is the debate.

Arguments I heard are...

What is the difference between Transabled people with Body Integrity Identity Disorder (BIID) who don't want their arms or legs so they cut it off to be happier. Compared to a MTF trans who think they are in the wrong body so they cut off their genitals. Why is BIID a Disorder but not Trans. Both struggle with self identity and both feel they were born in the wrong body.

A mental disorder is something that is disabling. So should we remove BIID as a disorder if Transgender is removed? People don't want to say someone who is in a wheel chair is handicapped but handicap-able, and don't want to see it as a disability or disabling. They say a wheel chair person can accomplish everything an abled body person can. They beat this in our heads over and over with make feel good self help speeches. If someone believes they can still function without their limbs and will be happier without an arm then what right do you have to tell them not to cut it off.

If they are a computer programer and don't need legs to program and thus not as disabling to their life, should we then not classify it as a disorder if they cut off their legs they are not happy with. Who needs to walk to the grocery store when you can order online for delivery? Like a trans who goes through sex realignment surgery. Nothing is off with their brains compared to the masses and not a disorder.

 

[linuxares]

Why a mod doesn't shut this thread down and delete has me baffled! Maybe they really want young men to go and mutilate themselves and then have to wear plastic in their new slit to stop the wound from healing. Pretty sickening if you ask me!

Because this is a topic worth discussing and being a bigot like some of your posts, isn't really discussion material, just pure hatred.

Do I see a lot of wrong with the on going transcommunity? I actually do, lately being "trend transers" is something that's really big on Tumblr and social media. I also think a really deep psychologial evaluation is needed before doing a major body reconstruction with medicine and surgery. Since some might have bipolar disorder for example? But there are people out there with real gender dysphoria and why should we forbid them to be healthy and happy?

PS. There is also females that have gender dysphoria, not just men.