The Illegal Immigration Non-Crisis in the USA

[Xzi]

You are right, Obama had the children locked up in the same area as viscous criminals. Stop being brainwashed by the liberal media and learn to think by yourself.

"Vicious criminals," otherwise known as the parents with no criminal record other than attempting to cross the border.

 

[zomborg]

Several possible reasons.

1. There's a chance they won't be caught.
2. Staying in their home countries puts their families at more risk than potentially being caught.
3. Coyotes can exploit the fear that people like Trump will 'shut down' the border entirely.
4. As I've stated several times, there are tons of employment opportunities in the US for illegals.

The US has been built on cheap/slave labor. Mexicans and Asians are just the latest in a long line of groups we've exploited to get our fix. There have always been people willing to perform mental gymnastics in order to justify it, but it's not any more justifiable now than it was with the Irish. Morally and ethically, this country is regressing under Trump.

Still, at least 3 of the reasons you stated were traditional, historic reasons to illegally cross our border.
The threat of mistreatment would not make the huddled masses bellow like a Norse god and say: "CHARGE!" "Let's go loved ones! I hear they are torturing illegal aliens in concentration camps in the USA, I want to go join the fun!"

 

[SG854]

There was no child separation policy under Obama. This false narrative needs to die.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trump_administration_family_separation_policy

Ok, I am convinced.

 

[Xzi]

Still, at least 3 of the reasons you stated were traditional, historic reasons to illegally cross our border.
The threat of mistreatment would not make the huddled masses bellow like a Norse god and say: "CHARGE!" "Let's go loved ones! I hear they are torturing illegal aliens in concentration camps in the USA, I want to go join the fun!"

The numbers don't lie man. Word has had plenty of time to travel that immigrants are being mistreated in these detention centers, but immigration numbers continue to rise none the less. It's by design. Trump gets to talk a big game while simultaneously providing his crony capitalist buddies with all the cheap labor they could possibly need or want. For that matter, there's no guarantee that even Trump's businesses have stopped hiring illegals. It's not like they can speak out with the threat of deportation looming over their heads.

 

[SG854]

Even IF your words are true. It may still provide a valuable lesson for future illegals. They may decide it's not worth the risk

From what I’ve been reading Trump ended child separation last year but because of loopholes it continues to exists.

And from what i’ve been getting from opinions which I have not verified yet, was that separation would still happen even without Reno v. Flores Case.

It seems it was created to cause damage to deter immigrants from coming. Which even not all Republicans agree on, as well as Democrats who call using it in this way to deter people in-humane.

 

[Xzi]

Is it any wonder that we're seeing a boom in illegal crossings and an overburdened system for seeking asylum? These are literally the only two options for South American and Mexican immigrants. If they try to enter through the legal ports, they're guaranteed to be turned away.

The bottom line is that we need a path to citizenship. Otherwise we're only ensuring that the system of exploitation for cheap labor continues on unchecked. Elizabeth Warren unveiled a comprehensive immigration plan just yesterday that I'm in support of, which includes a path to citizenship.

 

[Deleted User]

Popcorn tastes real good right now. Especially with cots giving up because too many people are just "fake news" to him.
In regards the problem with the states it's been exploiting people for a long time. And this really is just the next step. Health care system gouges people, people are more often incarnated than to get mental help, let alone also end up likely developing mental problems after being incarcerated. Meanwhile all these companies get to further extend profit. And also because of the price of health care, getting meds for people who actually need them to function well in a society can't in certain conditions, along with wages being way too low for what time people put in. And I can't be possibly surprised that we are failing at a society level. You cut people's access to function in a society and it slowly develops a culture of morons, combine this with the internet echo chamber, and it's ripe for extreme polarization which is then able to be banked off of further. I'm not saying people should work a ludicrously small amount of time, you get what you earn. But I don't exactly think waking up 6:00 in the morning and then getting home at 4pm and then repeat that for six days straight and get one day off for what is pretty much near minimum wage is kind of idk, unbalanced.

 

[UltraDolphinRevolution]

I was able to temporarily access youtube and listened to an interesting discussion between two Jewish intellectuals

(1:16:33, goes on for 5min)

The topic is Japan and how they don't accept migrants (1 to 2 asylum seekers per year). Sam asks why we couldn't call Japanese racists for not accepts migrants (1:20:20) and his interview partner basically says because the Japanese don't care.
In conclusion, every country receives the amount of migrants and the type of migrant it wants. It basically comes down to perception by others. Merkel didn't want ugly scenes at the borders and speaks of migrants as a gift, while at the same time desperately trying to limit the influx by paying Erdogan money and trying to force others within the EU to do the same. So in the end, there is nothing to be done. It is the will of the people in different countries. If you feel the need to give a dollar to a homeless person because others look at you, you shouldn't blame the homeless person.

 

[Deleted-401606]

Popcorn tastes real good right now. Especially with cots giving up because too many people are just "fake news" to him.
In regards the problem with the states it's been exploiting people for a long time. And this really is just the next step. Health care system gouges people, people are more often incarnated than to get mental help, let alone also end up likely developing mental problems after being incarcerated. Meanwhile all these companies get to further extend profit. And also because of the price of health care, getting meds for people who actually need them to function well in a society can't in certain conditions, along with wages being way too low for what time people put in. And I can't be possibly surprised that we are failing at a society level. You cut people's access to function in a society and it slowly develops a culture of morons, combine this with the internet echo chamber, and it's ripe for extreme polarization which is then able to be banked off of further. I'm not saying people should work a ludicrously small amount of time, you get what you earn. But I don't exactly think waking up 6:00 in the morning and then getting home at 4pm and then repeat that for six days straight and get one day off for what is pretty much near minimum wage is kind of idk, unbalanced.

Didn't you make a post that broke the rules because you couldn't control your temper so you decided to quickly delete it before you got banned from your favorite website?

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------

Is it any wonder that we're seeing a boom in illegal crossings and an overburdened system for seeking asylum? These are literally the only two options for South American and Mexican immigrants. If they try to enter through the legal ports, they're guaranteed to be turned away.

The bottom line is that we need a path to citizenship. Otherwise we're only ensuring that the system of exploitation for cheap labor continues on unchecked. Elizabeth Warren unveiled a comprehensive immigration plan just yesterday that I'm in support of, which includes a path to citizenship.

We don't owe it to other countries to support a path of citizenship. As we are now, Hispanics will be a majority by 2060. When Israel supports a path of citizenship for non Jews,then they can feel free to start influencing our countries policies. Until then, I think we should make the Jews practice what they preach in America.

 

[SG854]

Sorry Cots my friend. I do not want to see you go. You could do like I have been doing recently.

Instead of letting them drive you off, just step back a little and take a break. That's what I did after the abortion thread. I would even make a conscious effort to not visit the politics forum.

I personally don’t like blocking people or any of that stuff. Because you won’t learn or get to hear what other people say which I hate.


The fact you took a break shows that you really believe in what you say, and you were drained from all this. I won’t knock on people for that. A break is good sometimes, to refresh yourself.


TBH I have no idea what’s going on anymore. The more I learn the more i’m like I have no idea. I read a lot to try to find answers buts it’s all muffled in politics. With everything else I can find quick answers with facts very fast, like how does a dolphin breath underwater. But not with Politics, it’s a big mess because of interests involved. With many sides at it.

 

[zomborg]

The numbers don't lie man. Word has had plenty of time to travel that immigrants are being mistreated in these detention centers, but immigration numbers continue to rise none the less. It's by design. Trump gets to talk a big game while simultaneously providing his crony capitalist buddies with all the cheap labor they could possibly need or want. For that matter, there's no guarantee that even Trump's businesses have stopped hiring illegals. It's not like they can speak out with the threat of deportation looming over their heads.

Ok, for the benefit of doubt, I do not agree with you that they are exploiting illegals for financial gain, but for the sake of argument let's say you are right.

Plain and simply, this country is over crowded already. Yes, once long ago, we actually needed more migrants to strengthen our economy but we've reached the tipping point. No, we have far exceeded the tipping point. We started out needing migrants but we have reached the point where now it does our economy and nation as a whole more harm.

Picture this if you will. You have a small boat that has a capacity of 50 people but when you start out you only have a few people so you begin to invite more. Soon you have 50 and the boat still stays afloat. Then, unbidden, 15 more people sneak aboard. The boat still stays afloat but now it is lower in the water. Eventually extra people continue to sneak aboard until finally the boat sinks.
Sound familiar?

 

[Xzi]

We don't owe it to other countries to support a path of citizenship. As we are now, Hispanics will be a majority by 2060. When Israel supports a path of citizenship for non Jews,then they can feel free to start influencing our countries policies. Until then, I think we should make the Jews practice what they preach in America.

We owe it to ourselves to become the shining city on a hill we've always proclaimed to be, rather than regress into 1930s Germany. Israel has nothing to do with our own domestic policy decisions, and they're certainly not setting the type of example we should be following with Netanyahu.

Plain and simply, this country is over crowded already. Yes, once long ago, we actually needed more migrants to strengthen our economy but we've reached the tipping point. No, we have far exceeded the tipping point. We started out needing migrants but we have reached the point where now it does our economy and nation as a whole more harm.

Nonsense. If there are jobs available for them as illegals, and there are, then there are certainly jobs available for them as citizens. In return they pay taxes and help prop up the economy with buying power like any other group of workers. If as a country "we're full," somebody definitely forgot to tell Wyoming.

 

[Deleted-401606]

1. I don't think you mean viscous criminals.
2. Don't conflate immigrants with vicious criminals. Stop being brainwashed by the conservative media and learn to think for yourself.

Conflate isn't a synonym for confuse just so you know. Using big words to try to appear smart usually has the opposite effect.

 

[Deleted User]

Didn't you make a post that broke the rules because you couldn't control your temper so you decided to quickly delete it before you got banned from your favorite website?
Don't exactly have a favorite website... And I'm pretty sure you have me mixed for someone else. And then from a argument stand point of view, why would that matter? How does this relate to this thread?

 

[Deleted-401606]

We owe it to ourselves to become the shining city on a hill we've always proclaimed to be, rather than regress into 1930s Germany. Israel has nothing to do with our own domestic policy decisions, and they're certainly not setting the type of example we should be following with Netanyahu.

Most of the MSM is owned by Jews that push narratives that they themselves would never support in their country. We are nothing like Nazi Germany. Our president is a moderate that for some reason the liberal media hates. The guy was a registered Democrat in the 2000s and all of a sudden he is being hailed as an extreme right wing individual.

 

[Deleted User]

Conflate isn't a synonym for confuse just so you know. Using big words to try to appear smart usually has the opposite effect.

conflate

• transitive verb
  To bring together; meld or fuse.
• transitive verb
  To combine (two variant texts, for example) into one whole.
• To blow together; bring together as if by convergent winds.
  Someone forgot to check their vocab.
  Lacius used it properly. He's saying don't mix the two.
  Edit: proof of what I mean
  "Don't conflate immigrants with vicious criminals. Stop being brainwashed by the conservative media and learn to think for yourself."
  replace conflate with combine or mix
  don't mix immigrants with vicious criminals.

 

[Xzi]

Most of the MSM is owned by Jews that push narratives that they themselves would never support in their country.

Most of the MSM is center-right at best, and in support of the corporate status quo. As an example: they're obsessed with Joe Biden and mention Bernie Sanders as little as possible, if at all. Biden v Trump is the oligarchy's wet dream, because things would stay the same regardless of who wins that race.

We are nothing like Nazi Germany. Our president is a moderate that for some reason the liberal media hates. The guy was a registered Democrat in the 2000s and all of a sudden he is being hailed as an extreme right wing individual.

Trump is a populist with authoritarian tendencies who heaps praise on the world's dictators while simultaneously denouncing the US' traditional allies. He was a Democrat in name only so that he wouldn't be rejected by celebrities and movie stars, but his actions as president have revealed his true character and beliefs.

 

[SG854]

Most of the MSM is center-right at best, and in support of the corporate status quo. As an example: they're obsessed with Joe Biden and mention Bernie Sanders as little as possible, if at all. Biden v Trump is the oligarchy's wet dream, because things would stay the same regardless of who wins that race.


Trump is a populist with authoritarian tendencies who heaps praise on the world's dictators while simultaneously denouncing the US' traditional allies. He was a Democrat in name only so that he wouldn't be rejected by celebrities and movie stars, but his actions as president have revealed his true character and beliefs.

They are not center right. Not with all the Trump bashing articles.


They are a money making place. Whatever story can generate lots of views and money. They Attacked Hillary and Trump during the Election. They went on about her emails, and they bashed Trump calling him stupid.

 

[Xzi]

They are not center right. Not with all the Trump bashing articles.

They are a money making place. Whatever story can generate lots of views and money. They Attacked Hillary and Trump during the Election. They went on about her emails, and they bashed Trump calling him stupid.

They can bash Trump all they want, but they got him elected in the first place with all the free advertisement he was given during 2016. Even CNN and MSNBC aired several of his rallies without any commentary whatsoever. They ignored everything Bernie did back then too.

You're correct that many news outlets are in business purely for profit, but that only reinforces what I stated: they're in support of the corporate status quo. If they stray too far from that, they lose sponsors and advertising.

 

[kevin corms]

Popcorn tastes real good right now. Especially with cots giving up because too many people are just "fake news" to him.
In regards the problem with the states it's been exploiting people for a long time. And this really is just the next step. Health care system gouges people, people are more often incarnated than to get mental help, let alone also end up likely developing mental problems after being incarcerated. Meanwhile all these companies get to further extend profit. And also because of the price of health care, getting meds for people who actually need them to function well in a society can't in certain conditions, along with wages being way too low for what time people put in. And I can't be possibly surprised that we are failing at a society level. You cut people's access to function in a society and it slowly develops a culture of morons, combine this with the internet echo chamber, and it's ripe for extreme polarization which is then able to be banked off of further. I'm not saying people should work a ludicrously small amount of time, you get what you earn. But I don't exactly think waking up 6:00 in the morning and then getting home at 4pm and then repeat that for six days straight and get one day off for what is pretty much near minimum wage is kind of idk, unbalanced.

Lets be real, many people are ignoring the real problems at the border just because they dont like how Trump has handled it. The cartel has pretty much taken over mexico, and the secret service has helped them.