Hacking Any 3.50 system testers?

Zetta_x

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I came across this post today and was wondering if anyone can test this. Requires Move:

Edit: I'm not liable for any damages that occur to your system if you try it.

QUOTE said:
It is possible to downgrade your 3.50 to 3.41. It’s really simple it’s a flaw with a ps3 game. I accidently downgraded using a move game by accident. It popped up saying I had to update (obviously a bug), so I did because I wanted to play it so badly. Then next thing I know I’m back at 3.41. Don’t believe me? try it. Use the champions that comes with moves bundle. Go into the dueling arena. Press start power off the system using the switch turn it back on, and you’ll be prompt to update. I’ve tested it with a friends ps3 and the same thing. If you’d like I may create a video demonstrating this. Oh, and I have a NTSC console in the US. If anyone else can get this to work please let me know! I guarantee I’m not kidding.
 

AceLighting

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Zetta_x said:
I came across this post today and was wondering if anyone can test this. Requires Move:

Edit: I'm not liable for any damages that occur to your system if you try it.

QUOTE said:
It is possible to downgrade your 3.50 to 3.41. It’s really simple it’s a flaw with a ps3 game. I accidently downgraded using a move game by accident. It popped up saying I had to update (obviously a bug), so I did because I wanted to play it so badly. Then next thing I know I’m back at 3.41. Don’t believe me? try it. Use the champions that comes with moves bundle. Go into the dueling arena. Press start power off the system using the switch turn it back on, and you’ll be prompt to update. I’ve tested it with a friends ps3 and the same thing. If you’d like I may create a video demonstrating this. Oh, and I have a NTSC console in the US. If anyone else can get this to work please let me know! I guarantee I’m not kidding.
where did you find the post ?
 

doyama

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This is entirely implausible. The game itself is unable to update the PS3, it must rely on the system OS to do this because all games run under the hypervisor and do not have low level access. If this was even remotely possible you could do it right now without a Move game, just throw a 3.41 firmware on a USB stick and do the system update.

Basically the only way this would be possible was if the game was somehow coded with a Hypervisor vulnerability that bypassed the firmware checks on a security ring lower than it has access to. Something like that would be the equivalent of somehow making a nuclear bomb by mixing together uranium and explosives together in a random way.

Whoever posted this is obviously trolling (not Zetta I mean the person he is quoting)
 

Zetta_x

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Well, A few weeks ago it was speculated true that it is possible to downgrade the firmware on a Jailbroken console by running a destructive file, possible so destructive that it broke the firmware in which any firmware could be placed on the system. No one was willing to try it.

As for the post, it was on some comment to a newspost to one of the many PS3 sites I was lurking on and can't find it at the moment.
 

dilav

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Zetta_x said:
Well, A few weeks ago it was speculated true that it is possible to downgrade the firmware on a Jailbroken console by running a destructive file, possible so destructive that it broke the firmware in which any firmware could be placed on the system. No one was willing to try it.

As for the post, it was on some comment to a newspost to one of the many PS3 sites I was lurking on and can't find it at the moment.

I've seen something about that here on the fourms. Running the fake PSP emulator on 3.41 bricks it in a way that you could downgrade via a game disc that has the update file.


Edit:vvv Kinda forgot the details but that sounds about right.

Edit: Heres the gbatemp topic:
http://gbatemp.net/index.php?showtopic=257271
 

Zetta_x

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Yeah, someone reported it was possible and the PSP brick program uses a .self file that was titled something like Manufacturer_reset_...

So it probably destroyed the firmware on the PS3 (which is why it bricked) in which any firmware could be updated (since your technically not downgrading when no capable firmware is present)
 

Kayot

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this is fake, the post is here -> http://www.ps3-hacks.com/2010/10/15/kakaro...test/#more-3607

quote said:
eliter22 says:
october 16, 2010 at 4:45 am

it is possible to downgrade your 3.50 to 3.41. it’s really simple it’s a flaw with a ps3 game. i accidently downgraded using a move game by accident. it popped up saying i had to update (obviously a bug), so i did because i wanted to play it so badly. then next thing i know i’m back at 3.41. don’t believe me? try it. use the champions that comes with moves bundle. go into the dueling arena. press start power off the system using the switch turn it back on, and you’ll be prompt to update. i’ve tested it with a friends ps3 and the same thing. if you’d like i may create a video demonstrating this. oh, and i have a ntsc console in the us. if anyone else can get this to work please let me know! i guarantee i’m not kidding.

report this comment

he followed up with:
quotereply
#
eliter22 says:
october 16, 2010 at 5:24 am

before anyone flames me with spam or w/e i should post that the previous post is not legit. i felt like being a jerk and getting peoples hopes up high. =) although i wonder if it is possible to do such a thing…idk lol
 

doyama

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kayot said:
this is fake, the post is here -> http://www.ps3-hacks.com/2010/10/15/kakaro...test/#more-3607

quote said:
eliter22 says:
october 16, 2010 at 4:45 am

it is possible to downgrade your 3.50 to 3.41. it’s really simple it’s a flaw with a ps3 game. i accidently downgraded using a move game by accident. it popped up saying i had to update (obviously a bug), so i did because i wanted to play it so badly. then next thing i know i’m back at 3.41. don’t believe me? try it. use the champions that comes with moves bundle. go into the dueling arena. press start power off the system using the switch turn it back on, and you’ll be prompt to update. i’ve tested it with a friends ps3 and the same thing. if you’d like i may create a video demonstrating this. oh, and i have a ntsc console in the us. if anyone else can get this to work please let me know! i guarantee i’m not kidding.

report this comment

he followed up with:
quotereply
#
eliter22 says:
october 16, 2010 at 5:24 am

before anyone flames me with spam or w/e i should post that the previous post is not legit. i felt like being a jerk and getting peoples hopes up high. =) although i wonder if it is possible to do such a thing…idk lol

i would just like to point out my awesome powers of precognition. i accurately predicted the original poster was just trolling. i'm doing better than sylvia brown
tongue.gif
 

doyama

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rydian said:
all we need for what i posted originally is some method of corrupting the current firmware so that only recovery mode works. something badly programmed...

the ps3 needs more shovelware?

we'd need something like the pandora battery to do that though. it's possible, but without a leak of the actual hardware they use to do it, we probably won't see it.

it's not hard to brick the ps3, it's the recovery part no one has figured out yet.
 

Zetta_x

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nice catch doyama, it's too bad the average person is a welfare leeching magot, we need more people who can logically sense contradictions
happy.gif
.

thanks for clearing it up =)
 

tk_saturn

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you will never be able to downgrade firmware, the ps3 has e-fuses in that ibm core... and we know what e-fuses are used for.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/efuse

once an e-fuse is blown, it's permanent unless you switch the cpu.

i'm willing to bet when designing the 3ds, nintendo noticed how sucessfull those efuses were proving...
 

doyama

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tk_saturn said:
you will never be able to downgrade firmware, the ps3 has e-fuses in that ibm core... and we know what e-fuses are used for.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/efuse

once an e-fuse is blown, it's permanent unless you switch the cpu.

i'm willing to bet when designing the 3ds, nintendo noticed how sucessfull those efuses were proving...

The thing I've not yet seen is why the DSi Mode on the DSi hasn't been cracked yet. Certainly the DS and the Wii security models were piles of steaming poo. But has the DSi remained uncracked because it actually has as decent security model? Nintendo's track record there is very bad so I find it hard to believe they suddenly smartened up and implemented something useful.
 

Rydian

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I present to you: "DSi Encryption Put In Perspective", also known as "I Love Crushing People's Dreams".

The DSi uses 128-bit encryption (IIRC).
How do you break it? You find the correct encryption key.

How many encryption keys are there? 2 (binary, a bit) to the 128th power (number of bits), divided by 8 (8 bits in a byte).
That's so many that the calculator that comes with windows (at least XP) can't even display the number without reverting to scientific notation.

128-bits is...
340,282,366,920,938,463,463,374,607,431,768,211,456 possible values in binary.
However, Since there's 8 bits in a byte, you divide 128 by 8 and get 16. That's 16 bytes, 16 characters.
That's 18,446,744,073,709,552,000 possible values, ranging from 0x0000000000000000 to 0xFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF. Eighteen quintillion possible keys.
The actual number is a bit less less since a key will be a certain number of digits and be designed to not have repeating segments, but this puts it in perspective.

Let's say that you have a computer program which can try 50,000 unique keys a second.
That's 3,000,000 keys a minute.
180,000,000 keys in an hour.
4,320,000,000 keys a day.
1,576,800,000,000 keys in one year.

It would take 11,698,848 years to try all the keys at that speed.

So wait, how do they break other systems? If you can get a direct copy of the encrypted data and compare it to a copy of the unencrypted data (as well as view the data as it's transmitted around the DSi's internals), that goes a long way towards figuring out the key without having to try all possible combinations. You'll be able to find the key without all the guessing! The problem is you'd need to take a DSi apart and fuck with it's insides while it's on to try to get a copy of the data while it's unencrypted (since the DSi will unencrypt what it needs on the fly in order to use it), and usually when you're done with that the DSi's pretty broken and in no shape to game, or even to be experimented on a second time...
3869187499_da1665050d.jpg

http://www.flickr.com/photos/micahdowty/se...57621023570420/

This process can be hampered by the internal design of the system, so you may need to take apart many systems before you even figure out how to read some of the data, let alone get a full copy of it, and last I checked DSi's don't cost $5...
 

Zetta_x

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Hackers need to compromise every computer on the net and use their resources to run brute force test
happy.gif
 

doyama

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Well brute forcing the encryption is never the way to go obviously. Unless you have a quantum computer from the future
tongue.gif


Hacks have never been about brute forcing the key, but to find flaws in the security implementation. Buffer overflows on images on the PSP. Exploiting the weak DVD drive on the X360. Going into dev mode on the PS3.

I've never seen a decent write up of how the overall security model of the DSi actually works. I had hoped I'd see one after Team Twiizers posted their POC hack in 2009. Nothing seemed to come of that though.
 

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