Nintendo takes down Yuzu-based emulators including Suyu, Sudachi, Torzu, Uzuy and Nuzu

BlusterBong · Jul 21, 2024

Subtle Demise said:
How is it equivalent to toxic waste? Because Nintendo said so? Why did they say so again? Oh yeah because it utilized decryption. Well duh, because the games need to be decrypted in order to run! It's been that way for every console emulator since like the early to mid 90s. That's why a lot of those CD Based consoles required a BIOS dump. Why then haven't all those emulators been taken down, especially the Nintendo ones? They are "bypassing protections" aren't they? Ryujinx also needs to decrypt the games to play them, doesn't it? Hmm interesting.

It's actually because as a former Suyu dev has said, the Yuzu dev team used the Switch SDK to help code the emulator.

Mash0Star · Jul 22, 2024

How the hell did we regress so much where some company can have complete control over this by just using the DMCA.
The DMCA and copyright as a whole should be changed, we need these games to be able to be played by those who can't afford them and preserved for the future generations.

There is no reason why art should be for those who are wealthy and fortunate enough to buy them at that very specific moment in time.
Letting these companies have this much control just makes art get lost because they only care about money and power.

Kiiro_Yakumo · Jul 22, 2024

Mash0Star said:
How the hell did we regress so much where some company can have complete control over this by just using the DMCA.
The DMCA and copyright as a whole should be changed, we need these games to be able to be played by those who can't afford them and preserved for the future generations.

There is no reason why art should be for those who are wealthy and fortunate enough to buy them at that very specific moment in time.
Letting these companies have this much control just makes art get lost because they only care about money and power.

USA was an absolute master of this in negative sense. Not only they have increased duration of copyright laws and all that at least two or three times, not only they have wrote that it's currently now what, 70 years AFTER the LAST author passes away or so but because of the extension some things that went to public domain suddenly were under copyright law again, in other words law working backwards. Compared to this DMCA is just a brown cherry on the top of equally brown cake, if you catch my drift.
To answer your question it was slow and long process of softening humanity, "new normal" over the years, so that people will accept new compromises without realizing how much of the freedom was taken away from them. The Statue of Liberty is surely crying by now if it's still standing at least...

Captain-Z · Jul 22, 2024

Mash0Star said:
How the hell did we regress so much where some company can have complete control over this by just using the DMCA.
The DMCA and copyright as a whole should be changed, we need these games to be able to be played by those who can't afford them and preserved for the future generations.

There is no reason why art should be for those who are wealthy and fortunate enough to buy them at that very specific moment in time.
Letting these companies have this much control just makes art get lost because they only care about money and power.

To be fair, DMCAs aren't legally binding in any sense. If emulator devs feel they are doing nothing wrong then they can just ignore them and be confident they will win any potential lawsuit. The real issue is that GitHub has a policy of taking down repos that are DMCAed, if dev just used different repo hosting sites than companies like Nintendo wouldn't be nearly so liberal with DMCAs.

Regardless, no one has a right to view art, even if your poor. I'm all for charity, but charity isn't a right. There are also already archives that are preserving video games without piracy. I admit that copyright lasts too long , but when is does finally expire these games will be available even without pirates.

Post automatically merged: Jul 22, 2024

Subtle Demise said:
How is it equivalent to toxic waste? Because Nintendo said so? Why did they say so again? Oh yeah because it utilized decryption. Well duh, because the games need to be decrypted in order to run! It's been that way for every console emulator since like the early to mid 90s. That's why a lot of those CD Based consoles required a BIOS dump. Why then haven't all those emulators been taken down, especially the Nintendo ones? They are "bypassing protections" aren't they? Ryujinx also needs to decrypt the games to play them, doesn't it? Hmm interesting.

"It's actually because it's Nintendo's current console! Everyone should know emulating a current console is really bad and dumb!!" Again: Ryujinx. Again: Every emulator from the 90s onward. I remember playing Mario & Luigi on VBA when it was a brand new game. Hell, I remember playing a partially machine translated version of Pokemon Silver before it was even localized for the West on a Gameboy emulator. Not to mention Dolphin being concurrent with the GameCube AND the Wii! To make it even more egregious, it had high compatibility with commercial games to boot, unlike some of the earlier examples.

"No, no, it was actually because it was able to play TotK before the official release date!!!" Actually, no it wasn't. Ryujinx was the only one that worked for that game at first. There were custom builds pretty quickly, but those weren't official. In fact, the Yuzu team's official stance was not supporting games before release. There are rumors of private builds and ROM sharing, but IF those are true, then they are separate and unrelated DMCA cases and should have had no bearing on the takedown of the mainline emulator.

Actually encryption didn't become common in video games until the mid 2000s. The first Nintendo console to use it was the DS, whose rom dumps need to be decrypted via the DS itself since emulators can't do it. The Wii also uses encryption which Dolphin does decrypt, and is the reason why Dolphin had to cancel its steam release after Nintendo objected.

The reason why older consoles need a BIOS dump is because the BIOS often contains system functions that games require to run. Sometimes emulator recreate their own BIOS but they're often too complex to do that, so they require that you provide a legit one. BIOS' are copyrighted too so emulators can't ship with them. Some emulator DO try to include them anyway though which inevitably DOES result it legal action.

pogisanpolo · Jul 22, 2024

I believe's Github's policy isn't much different from most other firms that respect DMCA, and is mainly a way to keep liability off them while the copyright holder and the developer deal with the allegations of infringement on their own. If the dev files a counter notice and the copyright holder doesn't respond with a court case within two weeks, they even put the allegedly infringing repository back up no worse for wear.

I think the bigger problem is filing the counter notice requires filling in personal information, which is then publicly published in Github's DMCA repo, which then gives the copyright holder ammo on whom precisely they should target the court case to.

Captain-Z · Jul 22, 2024

pogisanpolo said:
I believe's Github's policy isn't much different from most other firms that respect DMCA, and is mainly a way to keep liability off them while the copyright holder and the developer deal with the allegations of infringement on their own. If the dev files a counter notice and the copyright holder doesn't respond with a court case within two weeks, they even put the allegedly infringing repository back up no worse for wear.

I think the bigger problem is filing the counter notice requires filling in personal information, which is then publicly published in Github's DMCA repo, which then gives the copyright holder ammo on whom precisely they should target the court case to.

Interesting, I didn't know that. But either way, its not DMCAs that are the issue so much as it is the way people respond to them.

pogisanpolo · Jul 22, 2024

Captain-Z said:
Interesting, I didn't know that. But either way, its not DMCAs that are the issue so much as it is the way people respond to them.

True. There's a bit of a "guilty until proven innocent" mechanic to DMCA takedowns, where it's the platform trying to save their own skin, leaving it to the content creator to stand firm or fold. Even with a counternotice, Github won't immediately put the content back up until after the grace period. If the point was just to harass the content creator, that's plenty enough, especially since DMCA trolls are definitely a thing. It's hardly unheard of for, say, a competitor filing a bogus DMCA claim to exploit the process, taking down the target content long enough for them to do their thing. By the time the filing has been shown to be bogus, the damage was already done.

There's been at least one case where a firm DMCA'd themselves such as what happened with Sony and The Last of Us 2 trailer on twitter, now X.

SeventhSon7 · Jul 22, 2024

someone help me make a new emulator, I will name it FUN

"F-U Nintendo"

Shape · Jul 24, 2024

Well this can only mean one thing: 'tendo is coming. Isuzu, Subaru, Suzuki, Daihatsu... Your days are numbered.

Cupra · Thursday at 6:46 AM

gaga941021 said:
Rightfully. Yuzu was bad for business.
Ryu is unaffected, since they do the job in the correct way.

Ryu is unaffected? LOOOOOOL

BaamAlex · Thursday at 12:42 PM

Cupra said:
Ryu is unaffected? LOOOOOOL

Ryujinx wasn't taken down in the "classical sense". Nintendo and the dev of ryujinx reached an agreement. If the repository suffered from a DMCA claim, then the DMCA notice would appear when entering the repository. Technically speaking, the dev of Ryujinx didn't have to stop working. And before you comment, first note when the comment was made. It was from July. And at that time, Ryujinx wasn't even remotely in Nintendo's sights.

Cupra · Thursday at 5:37 PM

BaamAlex said:
Ryujinx wasn't taken down in the "classical sense". Nintendo and the dev of ryujinx reached an agreement. If the repository suffered from a DMCA claim, then the DMCA notice would appear when entering the repository. Technically speaking, the dev of Ryujinx didn't have to stop working. And before you comment, first note when the comment was made. It was from July. And at that time, Ryujinx wasn't even remotely in Nintendo's sights.

Ryujinx was ALWAYS remotely in Nintendo's sights.

granville · 2024-10-05T16:56:57+0100

BaamAlex said:
Ryujinx wasn't taken down in the "classical sense". Nintendo and the dev of ryujinx reached an agreement. If the repository suffered from a DMCA claim, then the DMCA notice would appear when entering the repository. Technically speaking, the dev of Ryujinx didn't have to stop working. And before you comment, first note when the comment was made. It was from July. And at that time, Ryujinx wasn't even remotely in Nintendo's sights.

Two (now former) Ryujinx developers have stated that it was a C&D. They said Nintendo goons actually showed up to gdkchan's house and threatened him, he didn't get any money for it and it was an unpleasant experience for him.

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