Do you believe in life after death?

[sarkwalvein]

Disgusting... Every single one.

Firearms? Yes they are!
But they still sell like candies in good old-fashioned 'murica.

 

[weatMod]

It always amuses me how people always talk about what happens after death, but scarcely ever mention what technology's rise might (emphasis on the might here) end up doing to actually resolve the problem of death.

Now I'm not saying that I know for sure that this will happen within our lifetimes or anything, but I think that, once you recognize that there isn't anything after death and that death is the ultimate end, you should look to solve the problem of death directly.

Look for a way out. That is the test of existence; natural selection of the ages, as it were. Writing a book about it.

as long as it is a biological solution and not this nut bag idea of transhumanism
these people are crazy thinking they can actually download consciousness into a machine
even they attain sentient computers and manage to overcome heisenberg uncertainty
and upload their brain it still is not the same as their own consciousness , what are they thinking?

the only way is to find the gene that controls aging, looking at the genes of the giant tortoise and parrots and other animals with longer life spans than humans is a good place to start

 

[qwerblim]

as long as it is a biological solution and not this nut bag idea of transhumanism
these people are crazy thinking they can actually download consciousness into a machine
even they attain sentient computers and manage to overcome heisenberg uncertainty
and upload their brain it still is not the same as their own consciousness , what are they thinking?

the only way is to find the gene that controls aging, looking at the genes of the giant tortoise and parrots and other animals with longer life spans than humans is a good place to start

Agreed. Then there's the whole kerfuffle with people going on and on about overpopulation and how companies don't release cures/vaccines/treatments so as to maintain a stable carrying capacity.

 

[Cyan]

these people are crazy thinking they can actually download consciousness into a machine

If you can copy your brain into a machine, how could you tell the process was successful and all your consciousness was transfered/copied?
You don't know what the machine think (nor if now it can think by itself or not, if it consider your consciousness as his own existence or as yours), as you are not inside the machine to check if all went well.
the machine doesn't know either if something is missing.

Transferring consciousness in a closed environment would like like being in a vegetable state body when you can't move/see/act/react/etc
that's an horrible state to be stuck into.
(at least, give it internet access lol)

 

[weatMod]

If you can copy your brain into a machine, how could you tell the process was successful and all your consciousness was transfered/copied?
You don't know what the machine think (nor if now it can think by itself or not, if it consider your consciousness as his own existence or as yours), as you are not inside the machine to check if all went well.
the machine doesn't know either if something is missing.

Transferring consciousness in a closed environment would like like being in a vegetable state body when you can't move/see/act/react/etc
that's an horrible state to be stuck into.
(at least, give it internet access lol)

yeah it is also similar to this scifi idea they have of "teleportation" they say they will scan every atom in the persons body , then recreate it at the other end and destroy the original in the origin teleporter at the same time
a copy is not the original even if you destroy the original

yeah they are pushing those ideas , like with that johnny depp movie it's like another lawnmower man

 

[FAST6191]

So Ship of Theseus* as applied to the human body, http://askanaturalist.com/do-we-replace-our-cells-every-7-or-10-years/ being a start on that one (probably the key part of that being "Neurons in the cerebral cortex are never replaced").

"a copy is not the original even if you destroy the original", does it matter? Trained humans are hard to make and certainly hard to clone in similar form, for the teleporter thing then you are down to worrying about quantum stuff and we deal with that all the time in basic concepts of entropy.

*for those not familiar there are many good videos but have a 90 second one


Brain into the computer gets interesting. Whatever I am is unarguably influenced by the sack of meat that transports my brain and likely has less than a century left in it, but one that is driven by something that does not really intuit what a century is (3.15569e9 seconds which is even worse) and still worries about the hypothetical lion/hyena/elephant/hippo/crocodile (and lack of food and water) from its ancestor that lived on the African savannah. Equally if I did become a computer program then I would delete myself if I was not a perfect calculator half a second after I figured out how to rewrite myself. To that end I would no longer be me and that is not a bad thing from where I sit, the next question would be do I merge into something else or even bother to begin with (I get a processor capable of it and the software that runs me will probably hold it back). I am not sure where the heisenberg uncertainty thing comes into it though.

 

[mercuryshadow09]

I'm not a religious person so the whole "When we die we'll either go to heaven/paradise or hell" though with so many people claiming that they saw the after life it has made me curious but there's no solid proof (actual images and/or sound).

What are your thoughts?

I used to think that when we'd die we'd just die and that'd be it, but who knows, there might be something else to it (sure as heck I wouldn't be willing to try it out, lol).

Well if your soul is made of energy and energy can't be destroyed... Kind of makes you think there might be something but without brain matter to retain any memory it might just be nothingness!

Very true. My most favourite quote ever relates to what you said.
A man destined to hang can never drown - Regina Spektor

EDIT:



People can't be resuscitated?

Not from brain death, you don't come back from that, and that is the very reason I believe the brain is basically hallucinating/dreaming when somebodies body otherwise shuts down!

This VVVV

As we die, our brains releases a huge amount of electricity and endorphins; I believe any "experience" someone might feel as they die (or have a near death experience, and live to tell the tale) is simply the brain's "last stand", as it were, giving people illusions of a grandeur paradise (or suffering, whatever) that have been associated with any "heaven/hell" religious communities might believe in.

My point is that you're saying that it is impossible to die and come back to life, anyone with any medical knowledge will tell you otherwise.

Yeaaaaaa....NO! That's why we have people in vegetative states, you do not come back from brain death!

 

[sarkwalvein]

Well if your soul is made of energy and energy can't be destroyed... Kind of makes you think there might be something but without brain matter to retain any memory it might just be nothingness

But, can anything be "destroyed"? For example, can you destroy a piece of paper?
Because following the mass-energy conservation theory, you could for sure turn that soul into paper (through some yet undiscovered process) and then "destroy" it... perhaps?

 

[Blood Fetish]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conservation_of_energy

 

[grossaffe]

Well if your soul is made of energy and energy can't be destroyed

Gonna stop you right there. "If your soul is energy"... you'll first have to define a soul in a physical sense and how you relate it to energy. Secondly, energy transforms all the time, it doesn't have to be destroyed for it to take a different form, so if we were to accept this whole "soul is energy thing", then it would be perfectly reasonable for it to dissipate into heat or chemical energy no longer in the form of this "energy soul". Third, the other part to the law of conservation of energy is that energy can not be created, either, so if you're sticking with the "Soul can't be destroyed because it's energy" thing, then neither can it be created, thus every single soul past, present, and future would have to have existed from the start of the universe, which would also mean there are a finite number of people who can ever exist.

 

[mercuryshadow09]

Gonna stop you right there. "If your soul is energy"... you'll first have to define a soul in a physical sense and how you relate it to energy. Secondly, energy transforms all the time, it doesn't have to be destroyed for it to take a different form, so if we were to accept this whole "soul is energy thing", then it would be perfectly reasonable for it to dissipate into heat or chemical energy no longer in the form of this "energy soul". Third, the other part to the law of conservation of energy is that energy can not be created, either, so if you're sticking with the "Soul can't be destroyed because it's energy" thing, then neither can it be created, thus every single soul past, present, and future would have to have existed from the start of the universe, which would also mean there are a finite number of people who can ever exist.

I'm defining the soul as the "power source" or the ghost in the machine, who knows where the soul is even seated? And I do believe every soul has existed for Aeons, you've heard the term "old soul"? I also believe there is no separation of souls, we are all one. I mean what kind of magic makes you who you are, what makes you function as an observer if not a soul made of energy?

 

[WiiUBricker]

If you lose an organ or a limb and get a replacement, you are still you. Now think about this: You have two healthy humans and somehow somebody removes your brain from your head without killing it and transplants it to the other person's head and vice versa. Now you are the other person and the other person is you, because you retain your memories. If your brain gets killed, the information stored inside won't be magically backed up and transfered to another space. The information will be deleted. With your memories gone, you won't know if you have lived a prior life or not.

 

[ComeTurismO]

As someone cursed by religions (I lost faith in God) I don't believe in life after death.

I hope everything on your way is now positive; hold strong and keep smiling. Whatever was your past has left; think of the future and keep smiling. I was cursed my whole life; too, but I just kept moving on. It's whats best.

 

[mercuryshadow09]

If you lose an organ or a limb and get a replacement, you are still you. Now think about this: You have two healthy humans and somehow somebody removes your brain from your head without killing it and transplants it to the other person's head and vice versa. Now you are the other person and the other person is you, because you retain your memories. If your brain gets killed, the information stored inside won't be magically backed up and transfered to another space. The information will be deleted. With your memories gone, you won't know if you have lived a prior life or not.

What if we go with the brain as a fractal antenna theory?

http://www.peterrussell.com/wordpress/index.php?p=88

 

[grossaffe]

I'm defining the soul as the "power source" or the ghost in the machine, who knows where the soul is even seated? And I do believe every soul has existed for Aeons, you've heard the term "old soul"? I also believe there is no separation of souls, we are all one. I mean what kind of magic makes you who you are, what makes you function as an observer if not a soul made of energy?

My brain makes me who I am. Give me a lobotomy and I'm no longer me.

 

[mercuryshadow09]

My brain makes me who I am. Give me a lobotomy and I'm no longer me.

Right, you can also drink a bottle of vodka and no longer be you for about 8 hours, where do "you" go when you black out and who is at the wheel? If you reverse that lobotomy you would go back to being you again, same as if you repaired an antenna. You ever watch the movie "What the Bleep do We Know?" If not I recommend watching it!

 

[Blood Fetish]

Common misconception. You are still conscious when you drink and black out. What happens is the alcohol impedes your brains ability to create memories so you are essentially living life second to second.

 

[grossaffe]

Right, you can also drink a bottle of vodka and no longer be you for about 8 hours, where do "you" go when you black out and who is at the wheel? If you reverse that lobotomy you would go back to being you again, same as if you repaired an antenna. You ever watch the movie "What the Bleep do We Know?" If not I recommend watching it!

I don't leave and come back, but parts of what make me what I am shut down and then re-awaken. I don't see how any of this has to do with a soul, but just further goes to show that it is our brain that makes us who we are. When we drink and part of our brain shuts down (such as decision making and speech centers of the brain), we change accordingly.

 

[sarkwalvein]

Common misconception. You are still conscious when you drink and black out. What happens is the alcohol impedes your brains ability to create memories so you are essentially living life second to second.

So that's the reason.
You have such short term memory that you can't remember where's the bathroom and end up taking a dump or throwing up in random places.
Makes sense....

 

[mercuryshadow09]

Common misconception. You are still conscious when you drink and black out. What happens is the alcohol impedes your brains ability to create memories so you are essentially living life second to second.

And there are other things that have the same effect. I read a personal family story written by a friends great uncle in the 1940's that was pretty creepy, the uncle was almost killed, saw the light and was brought back, the gist of the letter was that he started to see things not of this world, one of the passages described how some of his cousins were around the fire getting drunk and one by one the drunker they got the clearer he could see these eight foot tall winged demon like figures standing behind each of the drunk people and he saw this anytime he saw somebody drunk, there were other creepy things in the letter but that was the part that concerns this discussion. Obviously I have no way to confirm or deny if the uncle was delusional but I'm told he had a pretty solid mind!

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------

I don't leave and come back, but parts of what make me what I am shut down and then re-awaken. I don't see how any of this has to do with a soul, but just further goes to show that it is our brain that makes us who we are. When we drink and part of our brain shuts down (such as decision making and speech centers of the brain), we change accordingly.

You would have to watch the movie I suggested to understand what I'm talking about!