Certainly how that culture and thinking has been allowed to continue to propagate, for sure. Though it didn't coin the term, it just kind of locked down the culture of the time period.
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How do you feel about abortion?
- Thread starter DRAGONBALLVINTAGE
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I think the most significant thing here is that the bible was translated quite literally - and these terms, like seed, come from the greek and hebrew. We have since moved past translating these words so literally in most other texts, but the bible in English continues to borrow heavily from 16th century translations - if you are not literally still reading those old translations (many still read KJB).
If we are doing old terms then I will have to bring it back to Aristotle and his theory of "haematogenous reproduction"
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/14735853
Equally I have been reading Malleus Maleficarum of late as my book for when waiting around in the world (the book the Roman Cathlolic church made to go after witches and detail their ways). It quite extensively covers abortion by "witch midwives" throughout it.
http://www.sacred-texts.com/pag/mm/mm01_11a.htm
http://www.sacred-texts.com/pag/mm/mm02a06a.htm
If we are sticking with antiquity then we have to also cover silphium. A contraceptive and abortion inducing plant that was driven extinct it was so well used.
http://allthatsinteresting.com/silphium
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/14735853
Equally I have been reading Malleus Maleficarum of late as my book for when waiting around in the world (the book the Roman Cathlolic church made to go after witches and detail their ways). It quite extensively covers abortion by "witch midwives" throughout it.
http://www.sacred-texts.com/pag/mm/mm01_11a.htm
http://www.sacred-texts.com/pag/mm/mm02a06a.htm
If we are sticking with antiquity then we have to also cover silphium. A contraceptive and abortion inducing plant that was driven extinct it was so well used.
http://allthatsinteresting.com/silphium
A fetus is far dumber than a chicken which we have no problem slaughtering because they taste good. We kill them because we enjoy what we gain from killing them. Similarly we enjoy not having to deal with being pregnant for months and giving birth to a child, both which greatly reduce quality of life, by far more than killing any chicken would benefit us. Being pregnant and giving birth are not easy. The babies being "murdered" by abortions are dumber than most animals because they aren't babies but fetuses. If you are fine with killing any animals for the sake of livelihood then there is no reason for you to be against aborting fetuses, which are by far the most beneficial "animals" to kill.
So, you would rather have the child and make it live on the street because you can't afford a house?
(note: I haven't read all replies, and I think it's better not to reply to most that I have read)
I consider abortion a necessary evil. You can spin the situation how you want, but the bottom line is some people/couples simply aren't cut out to be parents. They don't have the money, time, space, maturity or any other means to properly raise a child. Birth control methods aren't perfect (unless you happen to hate sex), but I honestly don't see why those who find that out firsthand should be punished for that.
I know: "raising children" isn't often spoken about in terms of punishment, but a pregnancy (especially an unwanted one) can ruin careers and suck the quality right out of life. Ever since my brother became dad of two kids, for example, him and his girlfriend are in survival modus. They had to buy a larger house in a better environment (because "think of the kids"), which meant working longer hours to pay off the alimony and at the same time spend more time at home because children can just do something lethal if you look the other way for five seconds...and those were wanted children.
What I, curiously enough, haven't seen mentioned: unwanted children grow up to be unwanted adults. This is of course a bit of an exaggeration, but the general line is true. And that's not my opinion but a measured fact. In the early nineties, crime in the USA suddenly took a nosedive. Of course lots of theories for this good news were presented, but none were really plausible. That is, until two guys pointed out that the decline in crime in the different states correlated nicely with the time period years before that abortion was legalized in these states. In other words: a lot of crimes never happened because the criminals were never born in the first place.
IMHO: that's the sort of perspective you should have on the topic: one that sees the society as a whole. In the ideal world, abortion can be made illegal because all the world's inhabitants have all the requirements needed to raise children. But as it stands, there's still plenty of things that prevent that utopia: many are either too poor in money in time to properly raise children with the caring, respect and maturity these children deserve.
It may be my own subjective bias, but I feel that most hardline anti-abortionists (or pro-life, so you will) are taking a rather dogmatic approach. I don't presume to convince them (threads like these are debates; not discussions), but I wonder...is my impression correct that the whole of your opinion is a strong gut feeling against abortion?
I consider abortion a necessary evil. You can spin the situation how you want, but the bottom line is some people/couples simply aren't cut out to be parents. They don't have the money, time, space, maturity or any other means to properly raise a child. Birth control methods aren't perfect (unless you happen to hate sex), but I honestly don't see why those who find that out firsthand should be punished for that.
I know: "raising children" isn't often spoken about in terms of punishment, but a pregnancy (especially an unwanted one) can ruin careers and suck the quality right out of life. Ever since my brother became dad of two kids, for example, him and his girlfriend are in survival modus. They had to buy a larger house in a better environment (because "think of the kids"), which meant working longer hours to pay off the alimony and at the same time spend more time at home because children can just do something lethal if you look the other way for five seconds...and those were wanted children.
What I, curiously enough, haven't seen mentioned: unwanted children grow up to be unwanted adults. This is of course a bit of an exaggeration, but the general line is true. And that's not my opinion but a measured fact. In the early nineties, crime in the USA suddenly took a nosedive. Of course lots of theories for this good news were presented, but none were really plausible. That is, until two guys pointed out that the decline in crime in the different states correlated nicely with the time period years before that abortion was legalized in these states. In other words: a lot of crimes never happened because the criminals were never born in the first place.
IMHO: that's the sort of perspective you should have on the topic: one that sees the society as a whole. In the ideal world, abortion can be made illegal because all the world's inhabitants have all the requirements needed to raise children. But as it stands, there's still plenty of things that prevent that utopia: many are either too poor in money in time to properly raise children with the caring, respect and maturity these children deserve.
It may be my own subjective bias, but I feel that most hardline anti-abortionists (or pro-life, so you will) are taking a rather dogmatic approach. I don't presume to convince them (threads like these are debates; not discussions), but I wonder...is my impression correct that the whole of your opinion is a strong gut feeling against abortion?
D
Deleted User
Guest
I'm fine with abortion
If somebody is raped they should be allowed to not have the child
If a student gets too kinky they should be allowed to get an abortion
If the person can't afford the child they should be allowed to get aborted
Its really not bad until the child develops a conscious
Iirc its developed ~6 months after birth but its been awhile since I read the thing on it
But if someone has been pregnant long enough for the child to develop past the turtle fetus looking thing phase they should look at adoption
Its pretty stupid how people thing abortion is murder
The child is also attached to you like an organ so your really just removing an organ you don't need
Its a shame there's so many gullible people in the world who listen to the bullshit churches spread
Aborting a child who isn't technically alive yet is "murder"
Some random drunk who was killed "came back to life" even though around the time it "happened" we had no medical knowledge an even up to recent (within 200 years) we were burrying people alive when they were just unconscious and thought to be dead
Sex is apparently bad even though its a natural thing
Some insane guy was out in the middle of a desert and was talking to a burning bush and is considered a hero
Some old guy heard voices in his head and attended to murder his son "in gods name"
Some other guy was eaten by a whale and not digested
I don't understand why people believe this shit
If abortion is murder then why are they not saying oral sex is cannibalism?
If somebody is raped they should be allowed to not have the child
If a student gets too kinky they should be allowed to get an abortion
If the person can't afford the child they should be allowed to get aborted
Its really not bad until the child develops a conscious
Iirc its developed ~6 months after birth but its been awhile since I read the thing on it
But if someone has been pregnant long enough for the child to develop past the turtle fetus looking thing phase they should look at adoption
Its pretty stupid how people thing abortion is murder
The child is also attached to you like an organ so your really just removing an organ you don't need
Its a shame there's so many gullible people in the world who listen to the bullshit churches spread
Aborting a child who isn't technically alive yet is "murder"
Some random drunk who was killed "came back to life" even though around the time it "happened" we had no medical knowledge an even up to recent (within 200 years) we were burrying people alive when they were just unconscious and thought to be dead
Sex is apparently bad even though its a natural thing
Some insane guy was out in the middle of a desert and was talking to a burning bush and is considered a hero
Some old guy heard voices in his head and attended to murder his son "in gods name"
Some other guy was eaten by a whale and not digested
I don't understand why people believe this shit
If abortion is murder then why are they not saying oral sex is cannibalism?
That's why no "child" is "killed".
D
Deleted User
Guest
But women can die during birth and its actually more common than you would think
Would you want to die giving birth to a child you never wanted to have and were forced to because someone raped you and abortion was illegal?
Which is why people terminate pregnancies long before what is inside them could biologically be considered a child
Fun fact, the Catholic church was ok with early aboritions for most of history, they changed their opinion in the 1800s based off of a lie where some scientists claimed that they saw that a fetus looked like a mini baby from the moment it is formed.
Abortion has always been tough for me. I can understand in cases of rape and incest, but it's despicable in any other case. If a woman couldn't afford to have a child, she should have kept her legs closed or used birth control. Using abortion as a form of birth control is digusting and cruel.
"Life is only precious until after the child is born." - liberals
And what if the condom breaks or birth control fails? There's many reasons for abortions and failed birth control is one of them. It's not a woman's fault that something went wrong and she shouldn't be made to carry that mistake.
Side note, your quote is honestly just flat wrong, considering pro-life is a very Conservative stance. You seem to want to have this very "anti-Liberal" stance to the point where you will literally just clump anything you don't like as "liberal."
As well I would like to note that the pro-life stance is an extremely shortsighted stance. Abortions are always going to happen regardless or "religious" or "legal" stances on the matter. They will simply be moved out of safe locations and be brought back underground. It's extremely stupid to believe that "pro-life" movement actually cares about the safety and well being of women when it's so extremely forgetful of the past and unwilling to see the dangerous future they pose for women.
Last edited by The Catboy,
If I was a girl, I'd get an abortion just as a fuck you to all the naysayers.
Also, fuck having children.
Filthy leeches.
Also, fuck having children.
Filthy leeches.
you're assuming a fertilized egg is a child. This is biologically incorrect. It is more accurate to think of a fertilized egg as a set of fuzzy blueprints for a human. The woman's body starts giving resources to the building of a future child based on the blueprints and you don't start getting an actual human child until around the 3rd trimester. The human child that results can vary wildly from the blueprints, given the environment the mother is in and other factors.
Ha, liberals don't like abortion. Nobody does. Whatever happens in a woman's body is her business and her business ONLY. It's not up to 50-60 white men behind closed doors to decide whether or not a woman has the rights to do what she wants with her own body. Also find it funny how pro-lifers and the righties believe that the unborn (and unconscious) child's "life" is more important than the mother's, because more often then not, woman have abortions to save their own life.
I've asked it earlier in this thread and I'm going to ask it again, since it seems like you just got here; what is the moral and/or physical difference between aborting in the case of rape and incest, and aborting for virtually any other reason?
I DON'T like abortion, and to me free and accessible birth control is the OBVIOUS solution, but until then... I see the above stance as an excuse. Either it's murder or it isn't. The only difference in my eyes (having been there) is that in the case of rape or incest, you allow yourself to place yourself in the girl/woman's shoes, whereas you refuse to otherwise
I wonder what's worse, never being born; or being born into a world where you aren't wanted. Hmm I really don't think the choice is that difficult. Death kind of loses its effect if you were never conscious to begin with.
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