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[POLL] 2020 U.S. Presidential Election

For whom will/would you vote?


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UltraDolphinRevolution

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Let me know when he starts advocating for anything other than white interests and white separation.
So you acknowledge that wikipedia and you were wrong to call him a white supremacist? If he is about white interests or white separation, call him a white advocate, a white nationalist or white separatist.
After all, you probably don´t call the black panthers, BLM or politicians "black supremacists", I assume.
 

Lacius

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So you acknowledge that wikipedia and you were wrong to call him a white supremacist? If he is about white interests or white separation, call him a white advocate, a white nationalist or white separatist.
After all, you probably don´t call the black panthers, BLM or politicians "black supremacists", I assume.
He's a white supremacist. The fact that he thinks Asian people score higher on IQ tests than white people doesn't change that.

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------

The statistics I'm talking about support what that alleged racist is saying.
What are you talking about?
 

UltraSUPRA

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What are you talking about?
FT_19.03.28_ScienceKnowledgeRace_Amongthecollegeeducated.png

This was last year.
 

Lacius

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If you could actually articulate what it is you're arguing, that'd be great. I'd be happy to tell you why that image isn't evidence for the silly claim that, for example, some races are on average more intelligent than others, but for all I know, you're not arguing that, and I'd be wasting my time.

When you post an image without context, you're not actually making a point that can be disagreed with or agreed with. I'd have to guess what you're trying to say in order to offer any sort of response. You're 15 and American, which means you should be learning about paragraph and essay construction. If you turned in an essay that was made up only of quotes from other people, it wouldn't be much of an essay, and any point you'd be trying to make with those quotes would be anybody's guess.
 

UltraSUPRA

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If you could actually articulate what it is you're arguing, that'd be great. I'd be happy to tell you why that image isn't evidence for the silly claim that, for example, some races are on average more intelligent than others, but for all I know, you're not arguing that, and I'd be wasting my time.

When you post an image without context, you're not actually making a point that can be disagreed with or agreed with. I'd have to guess what you're trying to say in order to offer any sort of response. You're 15 and American, which means you should be learning about paragraph and essay construction. If you turned in an essay that was made up only of quotes from other people, it wouldn't be much of an essay, and any point you'd be trying to make with those quotes would be anybody's guess.
The context is already in the image itself. Did you read anything in it?
 

UltraDolphinRevolution

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He's a white supremacist. The fact that he thinks Asian people score higher on IQ tests than white people doesn't change that.
I confronted you with logic and you stubbornly keep to your world view. Just be a man and admit it.
It is also funny that you say "he thinks [East] Asian people score higher on IQ tests".

Joe Biden already pointed to his stance on dictators, i.e. that he is going to confront them. This sounds like war to me. I would much rather support a person who you (erroneously) call white suprecmacist than a warmonger like Trump or Biden.
 

Lacius

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The context is already in the image itself. Did you read anything in it?
Again, I can only assume what your specific point is. I'm not going to have a conversation with myself, so if you want me to respond, you're going to have to actually say your point. I'm not going to spend my time typing a response only for you to say, "That's not what I was saying when I posted that picture." I don't think you want me or anybody else to assume what you mean.

That all being said, you might find what you're looking for in my response post below this one.

I confronted you with logic and you stubbornly keep to your world view. Just be a man and admit it.
It is also funny that you say "he thinks [East] Asian people score higher on IQ tests".
A white supremacist is someone who thinks white people are better than people of other races, which applies to this man. I'm not especially moved by semantic arguments about the literal usage of the word "supremacist." It's about as convincing as when homophobes try to argue they aren't homophobic because they aren't literally afraid of gay people. You can get pedantic and say a white supremacist has to be someone who thinks white people are superior to all other races in all ways, but that's not necessarily how people are using the word.

It's also not a very good argument, since the guy still believes Asians and other non-white races should be minorites in the USA, if not gone entirely, since he believes white people are superior to all other races, his views on IQ results notwithstanding. He is a white supremacist, regardless of how you're using the word.

White supremacists have been using IQ as supposed evidence for their racist beliefs for a very long time, even though an IQ test doesn't tell you how smart a person is. Instead, an IQ test tells you a lot about how good a person is at taking an IQ test, and that usually has a lot to do with socioeconomic status, schooling, sociolinguistic factors, etc., which makes the test biased towards white people. Because of changes to immigration in 1965 that prioritized Asian immigrants of high socioeconomic status, however, IQ tests started to skew towards Asians over whites. At first, the racists didn't know what to say or do, but they eventually decided that they were willing to accept that Asians did better than whites on IQ tests if it meant they still had data to support their supposed intellectual superiority over other minority races. This doesn't mean that racists who want to use IQ data to try and "scientifically prove" their racism aren't white supremacists.

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------

Joe Biden already pointed to his stance on dictators, i.e. that he is going to confront them. This sounds like war to me. I would much rather support a person who you (erroneously) call white suprecmacist than a warmonger like Trump or Biden.
Joe Biden has said he's going to "stand up" to dictators, as opposed to Trump's coddling and idolizing of them.

Are you saying you support Jared Taylor?
 
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UltraDolphinRevolution

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A white supremacist is someone who thinks white people are better than people of other races, which applies to this man. I'm not especially moved by semantic arguments about the literal usage of the word "supremacist." It's about as convincing as when homophobes try to argue they aren't homophobic because they aren't literally afraid of gay people. You can get pedantic and say a white supremacist has to be someone who thinks white people are superior to all other races in all ways, but that's not necessarily how people are using the word.
Kamala Harris said how great it was to be around black people. Is she a black supremacist? By your logic, yes. I think "blacks" are better at singing, dancing and many different sports. Am I a black supremacist?

It's also not a very good argument, since the guy still believes Asians and other non-white races should be minorites in the USA, if not gone entirely, since he believes white people are superior to all other races, his views on IQ results notwithstanding. He is a white supremacist, regardless of how you're using the word.
He thinks America should remain a white majority country. I disagree with him (so no, I don´t support him on this, but he would be a better US president for the Middle East for sure). However, if that makes him a white supremacist, then most countries in the world are filled with xyz supremacists. Turks would want Turkey to remain Turkish etc. Is the Japanese president an East Asian supremacist? I doubt you would call him that. Is Netanyahu (and are most Jews) Jewish supremacist/s? [that´s even more interesting as Palestinians might be more racially Jewish]
 
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omgcat

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dude, when the GOP platform is "whatever trump wants" and has spelling errors on their official site.

https://prod-cdn-static.gop.com/doc...00.2055661719.1598124638-455285808.1584478680

RESOVLVED

Like get a proof reader for something this important.

also get a moral cause to stand behind already.

"If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power." -President Dwight D. Eisenhower

seriously you think out of the 1000's of people working for the GOP, that someone could think of a reasonable goal for the future. that on top of almost all of trump's campaign managers being arrested for corruption.

Also more than half of the scheduled speakers for the RNC are the presidents family members. it's gonna be "my dad", "my dad", "My husband", "daddy" the whole time.
 
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Lacius

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Kamala Harris said how great it was to be around black people. Is she a black supremacist?
Do you have a direct quote?

Hypothetically, if she said, "It's great to be around black people," that would not be racism nor racial supremacism. There is no claim that anyone is superior to anyone else.

I think "blacks" are better at singing, dancing and many different sports. Am I a black supremacist?
Stereotypes and overgeneralizations can be racist. What you're describing isn't necessarily supremacism. See below.

He thinks America should remain a white majority country. I disagree with him (so no, I don´t support him on this
If you do not agree with Jared Taylor, and he's irrelevant to the topic of the 2020 presidential election, then I don't know why we are still talking about him. This guy is gross, and I'm tired of talking about him.

If I remember correctly, your original point was that Wikipedia is not infallible. I agree with you that Wikipedia is not infallible, but Jared Taylor was a bad example, since Jared Taylor is in fact a white supremacist.

but he would be a better US president for the Middle East for sure).
You're going to have to be more specific about what you mean here, but I highly doubt a racist who only really cares about the interests of white people is going to be very good for the Middle East.

However, if that makes him a white supremacist, then most countries in the world are filled with xyz supremacists. Turks would want Turkey to remain Turkish etc. Is the Japanese president an East Asian supremacist? I doubt you would call him that. Is Netanyahu (and are most Jews) Jewish supremacist/s? [that´s even more interesting as Palestinians might be more racially Jewish]
Jared Taylor believes white people are superior to black people, Hispanic people, and others. This is white supremacism. He believes the United States should be a white-only (his preference) or white-majority country, since white people are superior to the aforementioned races. This is white supremacism. He believes in decreasing the numbers of what he perceives to be "lower races" through forcible sterilizations on the basis of welfare. This is white supremacism. He believes white people are so superior to black people that white people are the source of civilized society, and he thinks civilization itself disappears if it's left to only black people. This is white supremacism.

If you find an example of somebody else espousing these kinds of beliefs, it's also racial supremacism.
 
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UltraDolphinRevolution

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Hypothetically, if she said, "It's great to be around black people," that would not be racism nor racial supremacism. There is no claim that anyone is superior to anyone else.
Thank you, I wanted you to make this clear. If you enjoy the company of any given race, it is not a form of supremacy. So if Jared says he wants to be around white people, that does not make him a white supremacist either.
(Now we both know though what would happen if a white person said this. The media would call this person a white supremacist. And you are perpetuating this inconsistency)

Here is Kamala Harris´ quote:
“I stood in the back, looked around and thought, ‘This is heaven!’ Harris recounts in her biography, “The Truths We Hold: An American Journey.” “There were hundreds of people, and everyone looked like me.”
https://lite.cnn.com/en/article/h_3899feffb5cc27bc647543934dea6e6c

Stereotypes and overgeneralizations can be racist. What you're describing isn't necessarily supremacism. See below.
It is more complicated with regards to music but there is little subjectivity in sports.
If you do not agree with Jared Taylor, and he's irrelevant to the topic of the 2020 presidential election, then I don't know why we are still talking about him. This guy is gross, and I'm tired of talking about him.
I can give you many other examples but I doubt you know about them (in different countries).
since Jared Taylor is in fact a white supremacist.
We have been through this. Supremacy means number one. You are mistakenly thinking of superiority in a limited setting.

You're going to have to be more specific about what you mean here, but I highly doubt a racist who only really cares about the interests of white people is going to be very good for the Middle East.
That is exactly what Middle East needs. I am sick and tired of American supremacists (including you if you are for interventions) fucking up the Middle East.
Obama has called America the only indispensible nation. Do you agree with him? This is actual supremacy.

Since you are tired of talking about Taylor, I won´t go into detail about your representation of him. However, I want a clear answer from you:
If Taylor is a supremacist for wanting to live among white people and his country to remain majority white, then why do you not call Israelis accordingly?
After all, in Israel there has been actual forced sterilization of certain ethnic groups. [You have misrepresented Taylor. He said if poor mothers (he was not specifically talking about any race) have a right to produce an unlimited amount of babies, does society have an unlimited duty to care for them? Voluntary sterilization in exchange for welfare could be a solution - At least this is my memory of it, I don´t know if you want to open this can of worms]
 
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Lacius

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If you enjoy the company of any given race, it is not a form of supremacy. So if Jared says he wants to be around white people, that does not make him a white supremacist either.
The difference is that this man wants to be around white people because he thinks white people are superior to black people and others. His views also don't stop at merely enjoying the company of a particular race.

If someone from an oppressed minority group says they enjoy spending time with other members of that group, that's not to say they dislike spending time with people from the majority group. For example, if a gay person says he enjoys spending time around other gay people, that's not to say there's anything wrong with straight people; it's just a thing that's enjoyable and rare. However, when a member of a majority group with a history of oppression says he likes spending time with members of that group, the implication is usually that he doesn't like spending time with the minority groups.

(Now we both know though what would happen if a white person said this. The media would call this person a white supremacist. And you are perpetuating this inconsistency)

Here is Kamala Harris´ quote:
“I stood in the back, looked around and thought, ‘This is heaven!’ Harris recounts in her biography, “The Truths We Hold: An American Journey.” “There were hundreds of people, and everyone looked like me.”
https://lite.cnn.com/en/article/h_3899feffb5cc27bc647543934dea6e6c
She didn't say one race was better than another. She didn't say she preferred being around one race over another. She's describing her feelings with regard to increased access to higher education, regardless of "racial and socioeconomic background."

It is more complicated with regards to music but there is little subjectivity in sports.
Stereotypes and overgeneralizations like "black people are better at basketball," for example, are racist. The factors that lead one to believe this kind of overgeneralization have more to do with systemic racism and socioeconomic disparities and little or nothing to do with race and genetics.

I can give you many other examples but I doubt you know about them (in different countries).
You can give me examples of what? Because you're responding to a part of my post where I said a.) Jared Taylor has nothing to do with the 2020 presidential election, and b.) You apparently don't agree with Jared Taylor. Given A and B, there's no reason for us to continue talking about him.

We have been through this. Supremacy means number one. You are mistakenly thinking of superiority in a limited setting.
When I and the rest of the world are talking about white supremacists and white supremacy, we are talking about people who believe white people are better than other races. A white supremacist who says Race A is better at X than white people is still a white supremacist, particularly when we're talking about tired IQ arguments that are the cornerstone for a lot of white supremacist apologetics.

I'm about as interested in semantic arguments about the term "white supremacist" as I am interested in having semantic arguments about the term "homophobe," and I've probably let this one go on for too long.

That is exactly what Middle East needs.
Racism, nationalism, and white supremacy are not what the Middle East needs. These beliefs lead to actions that prioritize white Americans over the Middle East, for example, and these beliefs are also indicative of poor logical reasoning skills that are likely to result in other bad decisions unrelated to one's racism.

That is exactly what Middle East needs. I am sick and tired of American supremacists (including you if you are for interventions) fucking up the Middle East.
I'm not an interventionist.

Obama has called America the only indispensible nation. Do you agree with him? This is actual supremacy.
Do you have a direct quote?

Since you are tired of talking about Taylor, I won´t go into detail about your representation of him. However, I want a clear answer from you:
If Taylor is a supremacist for wanting to live among white people and his country to remain majority white, then why do you not call Israelis accordingly?
  1. That's not the extent of Taylor's views.
  2. We're talking about Taylor, not Israel.

You have misrepresented Taylor. He said if poor mothers (he was not specifically talking about any race) have a right to produce an unlimited amount of babies, does society have an unlimited duty to care for them? Voluntary sterilization in exchange for welfare could be a solution - At least this is my memory of it, I don´t know if you want to open this can of worms
Taylor is a self-described eugenicist. He alleges a direct link between poverty and genetics, he alleges a direct link between these supposed "poverty genes" and certain minority races, and he advocates for selectively breeding out those poverty genes/races via eugenics, including but not limited to making welfare contingent upon sterilization.

In reality, the need for welfare has to do systemic racism, socioeconomic disparities, inadequate access to healthcare, inadequate access to education, etc. It has little or nothing to do with race and genetics.
 
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Lacius

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UltraSUPRA

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Lacius

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So the phrase "it's time for we to come together" is grammatically correct?
No, but that's not the phrase that was used.

The use of a stylistic parenthetical phrase for emphasis the way he did is grammatically correct. Not that it automatically makes me correct, but you should know I taught English for several years.

It's not hard to find an actual example of a gaffe, poor grammar, etc. from Biden, but this isn't it. Biden's grammar issues are also nothing when compared to the incoherent nonsense that Trump vomits on a regular basis. Finally, I don't see poor grammar and gaffes as disqualifiers for the office of President. I'd probably vote for a Democratic candidate with twice as many examples of grammar problems as Trump if the candidate's policies were good.
 
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