Following a Bloomberg report, Epic Games has confirmed that it will be laying off around 16% of its workforce; or some 830 employees.

"For a while now, we've been spending way more money than we earn, investing in the next evolution of Epic and growing Fortnite as a metaverse-inspired ecosystem for creators," Tim Sweeney said in an email to Epic employees. "I had long been optimistic that we could power through this transition without layoffs, but in retrospect I see that this was unrealistic."

Sweeney also mentioned that Epic is looking to sell the independent music storefront Bandcamp and spinning off SuperAwesome, a branch that specializes in creating safe online experiences for children.

SOURCE

 

[Sir Tortoise]

is there always hostility towards Epic every time they're even mentioned? What did they do? (I'm sure it's something I Just didn't hear about)

They're not Steam, and people put a similar amount of personal pride into launchers as they do consoles. Minor difference in that this isn't exclusive, costly hardware, you can have multiple for free on the same machine...but god forbid anyone try to challenge Steam's monopoly. Kneel before "Lord Gaben".

Post automatically merged: Sep 30, 2023

At least some of it likely stems from their use of third party exclusivity, in particular they did paid exclusivity for stuff already announced for Steam whilst they were lacking rather basic features by modern standards like a shopping cart, cloud saves, etc.

Had they just launched EGS with the free games, regular discounts and slowly built up the service there would IMO probably be allot less hostility towards them.

Paying for exclusivity is literally the only way they can compete on price. Steam forbids developers from charging a lower price elsewhere for games also on Steam.

 

[AkiraKurusu]

Do the 16% include people designing games or janitors?

Post automatically merged: Sep 30, 2023

Why is there always hostility towards Epic every time they're even mentioned? What did they do? (I'm sure it's something I Just didn't hear about)

...You don't know about Epic's propensity to purchase exclusives, even for kickstarted games that promised a Steam release? Or how lacking their storefront is, compared to Steam and GOG?

I'd support Epic if they even tried to be better than their main competitors, but they aren't - their storefront doesn't offer user reviews, for one thing, which means players can't warn other people about shoddily-made releases or asset flips. Oh, and despite initial promises to 'curate' the store, to prevent the flooding of asset flips that Steam gets...yeah, unfortunately asset flips are still making their way onto EGS. So much for that.

So no user reviews, no anti-asset flip protection...what does it offer over Steam or GOG? Free games? Sorry, but I don't care about that - most of them are games I'm not interested in, and for those I would like to play, I'd rather buy them and add them to my Steam library, or GOG library. Free games I don't care about aren't going to make up for the lack of reviews - or the store's history of purchasing exclusivity.

 

[Bladexdsl]

Why is there always hostility towards Epic every time they're even mentioned? What did they do? (I'm sure it's something I Just didn't hear about)

did you forget they were fined by the FTC for adding real gambling elements in fortnite? and that's only a tip of the iceberg to their shady business practice. they are just an untrustworthy company plain and simple as that. has nothing to do with steam!

 

[VartioArtel]

Do the 16% include people designing games or janitors?

Post automatically merged: Sep 30, 2023

Why is there always hostility towards Epic every time they're even mentioned? What did they do? (I'm sure it's something I Just didn't hear about)

They act like Saints of the Gaming World while constantly doing things to fuck over everyone except themselves.

They stole (near-literally) titles going to Steam by coercing the companies making those titles to make their titles exclusive to EGS - AFTER they already announced Steam versions. There's quite a few examples but look up the drama involving Shenmue III - the most blatant example.

___
Edit because of shills who will argue the above: There's no issues with exclusivity. The issue comes down to FORCING exclusivity on a product ALREADY LONG ANNOUNCED for another platform. Nobody, and I mean NOBODY, would be complaining if Epic had simply obtained the title for EGS. The issue comes down exclusively to the fact that these games were originally meant to launch on Steam then these launches cancelled because of the "Exclusivity" deal made long after the announcement. If these games had been announced as EGS Exclusives from the start, or simply launched on both, there would have been 0 conflict/complaint from Gamers.

Anyone who tries to tell you the ones complaining about the Exclusivity incident are doing so simply because they're 'Steam Shills' or 'hate exclusivity' are disingenuous, manipulative, or stupid. Probably all of the above.
_____

Then there was the whole Epic Vs Apple/Google thing, which was a shitshow of bad behavior of the highest degree, They formed an illegal, contract breaking backdoor to gain profits from the Apple Store that normally would go to Apple as part of their Terms and Services with Apple, put it to 'sleep' until a certain date, while they formed the 1984tnite video that they launched within an hour of Apple taking Fortnite down after said 'Apple Bypassing Service' launched (proving it was a pre-planned incident, right down to anticipating and HOPING Fortnite would be removed from the Apple Store. You don't make a 3D animation like that within an hour). They then used that video and a lot of lies and propaganda to try to turn everyone against Apple claiming Anti-competitive behavior despite doing just that. (And let's not forget the above Anti-Competitive behavior of hijacking games and making them exclusive to their own platform).

_____

EDIT 2: To clarify, the above went to trial. To my knowledge it was a 100% Apple win in the end. Because in the end they basically ruled that Apple had to allow companies to offer external means to make purchases for apps on their platform. But Apple already did that, you could for example purchase Vbucks via website, PS4, etc. And Apple won literally every point by time of their Appeal. To say it was a complete legal backfire despite all the Congress Lobbying, Lying, etc, is an complete understatement.

_____

Then there was the fact the EGS is a very barebones, low effort platform, to gain maximum profits with minimum effort. This is not to say it's a bad store, but rather emphasizes their natural low-effort for high-results greed. See this whole damn scenario playing out. Purchasing games was a slog at the time. A lot of simple functionality that let one learn about the game they were purchasing was non-existent. Etc Etc.

This mixed with concerns they were mining information for their Chinese Government 'overlords' as some put it, did not make a good opinion of them with some.

Basically put, they're a scumbag company who plays the Hero while constantly actually being the villain.

PS: That 16% was almost all Game Devs. Fall Guys devs got almost the whole team purged or so I hear.

 

[The Catboy]

Do the 16% include people designing games or janitors?

Post automatically merged: Sep 30, 2023

Why is there always hostility towards Epic every time they're even mentioned? What did they do? (I'm sure it's something I Just didn't hear about)

Anti-customer practices, shitty storefront, buying exclusives in an attempt to undermine their competitors and other anti-competitive practices, adding real gambling to Fortnite, and honestly a general dislike their company’s attitude. Personally, I am not a fan of their practices. They come off as extremely hostile, narcissistic, and toxic.

 

[Xzi]

They're not Steam

You can say that again. They're not even Xfire (blast from the past for my fellow oldheads).

Minor difference in that this isn't exclusive, costly hardware, you can have multiple for free on the same machine...but god forbid anyone try to challenge Steam's monopoly. Kneel before "Lord Gaben".

If you actually wanna compete with Steam, you gotta build good will with PC gamers the exact same way Valve did. The shortcuts Epic tried to take with EGS not only failed to make them competitive, they made the PC gaming landscape worse in general.

 

[ZeroT21]

Epic is probably just cutting their losses to make their earnings report look good

 

[The Real Jdbye]

I guess this is what happens when you give a ton of 3rd party devs money without any expectation of seeing a return on it all the while giving all your games away.
Could've seen that coming.

 

[Kwyjor]

So no user reviews, no anti-asset flip protection...what does it offer over Steam or GOG?

Do user reviews really matter all that much?! The main reason you hear about user reviews on Steam anymore is when some developer does something stupid and they get arbitrarily review-bombed for reasons that have nothing to do with the actual quality of the game.

Now, it is a little questionable they're allowing "blockchain" games after Steam decided to forbid them – but who cares, really; if you don't want to play blockchain games, then don't bother playing them. They're probably not going to last long anyway, especially in light of that recent report about NFTs being worthless.

And I really can't see why anyone thinks the lack of a freakin' shopping cart is somehow important.

 

[N10A]

Do user reviews really matter all that much?! The main reason you hear about user reviews on Steam anymore is when some developer does something stupid and they get arbitrarily review-bombed for reasons that have nothing to do with the actual quality of the game.

Now, it is a little questionable they're allowing "blockchain" games after Steam decided to forbid them – but who cares, really; if you don't want to play blockchain games, then don't bother playing them. They're probably not going to last long anyway, especially in light of that recent report about NFTs being worthless.

And I really can't see why anyone thinks the lack of a freakin' shopping cart is somehow important.

I use user reviews all the time to decide if a game is worth my time, the only reason that you don't "hear" about them unless someone's getting review bombed is because it's unusual and newsworthy, because it usually goes hand in hand with a gamedev making an anti-player decision. No one's gonna run a headline like "steam reviews functioning as normal". Just because something isn't in the news or on social media doesn't mean that it isn't helpful.

 

[Kwyjor]

I use user reviews all the time to decide if a game is worth my time

Y tho? Why not trust actual professional game reviewers with some experience in legitimate criticism?

Of course, not all "professional" "journalists" are necessarily trustworthy either, but I'd trust one of them far more readily than the average Steam user review!

 

[SS4]

Guys, no matter how you feel about EPIC you should realize that some ppl are losing their jobs and thats never a fun thing . . .
Put yourself in their shoes for a second, this isnt a good news or a funny one either . . .

 

[N10A]

Y tho? Why not trust actual professional game reviewers with some experience in legitimate criticism?

Of course, not all "professional" "journalists" are necessarily trustworthy either, but I'd trust one of them far more readily than the average Steam user review!

Because the point of encouraging random steam users to post reviews is that you get an aggregate of opinions. If you read through a few of them you start to get an idea what the consensus is. Steam reviews are great for getting the general public opinion of a game, and then I supplement that by watching videos of gameplay.
My question for you: Why do you trust large companies who are incentivised to give good reviews in order to keep the review codes coming in over people who don't have ties to the gaming industry?

 

[lordofcombo]

I support epic,why fatso gabe should be the only one getting profit?

 

[Xzi]

I support epic,why fatso gabe should be the only one getting profit?

Steam justifies its existence with a vast suite of features that no other online service provides, not even the paid console ones. EGS does nothing to justify its existence, there's no compelling reason to buy a game there instead of simply pirating it. For that matter, adding a pirated game as a non-Steam shortcut instantly makes it more robust than anything purchased on EGS.

 

[Kwyjor]

If you read through a few of them you start to get an idea what the consensus is.

Usually I read a few of them and start to get a very low opinion of the kind of person who bothers to write Steam reviews.

My question for you: Why do you trust large companies who are incentivised to give good reviews in order to keep the review codes coming in over people who don't have ties to the gaming industry?

For starters, a lot of them aren't exactly "large companies" anymore. And secondly, a lot of them tend to give an awful lot of bad reviews as well. And even the good reviews tend to be a whole lot more well-written and nuanced than the typical Steam review.

 

[AkiraKurusu]

Do user reviews really matter all that much?! The main reason you hear about user reviews on Steam anymore is when some developer does something stupid and they get arbitrarily review-bombed for reasons that have nothing to do with the actual quality of the game.

Now, it is a little questionable they're allowing "blockchain" games after Steam decided to forbid them – but who cares, really; if you don't want to play blockchain games, then don't bother playing them. They're probably not going to last long anyway, especially in light of that recent report about NFTs being worthless.

And I really can't see why anyone thinks the lack of a freakin' shopping cart is somehow important.

User reviews are important - as I said, they're a way of warning other potential buyers of malformed, dysfunctional games, or of predatory games. If a game has a horribly abusive marketshop in it, that's almost certainly going to be brought up in user reviews, just like game-breaking bugs or incredibly poor optimisation.

Sure, people can "review bomb" games for reasons unrelated to the specific game being bombed, but there's usually an understandable reason for it - one that comes to mind is when a Metro game (Exodus, I think?) was originally planned to release on Steam, only to suddenly jump ship to EGS, and so people bombed other Metro games to voice their displeasure.
People do this because there's no other real way for us to voice that displeasure; ranting about it on a thread somewhere won't do shit, it'll barely be seen. Boycotts infamously don't work. What else is there but to use user reviews?
This not only makes the game's publishers and devs aware of the backlash, but also other customers too - informs them of such anti-customer practices.

So yes, I do consider user reviews VITAL - just like how YouTube removed public dislike counts, removing reviews just allows companies and scammers to get away with horrendous shit. We need user reviews, whether you personally like it or not.


As for the shopping cart - are you serious? What kind of storefront doesn't have a cart these days? Woolworths has one. Amazon has one. Fangamer has one. Steam and GOG have 'em.
You telling me EGS still lacks a cart? Ugh. That makes buying multiple games in one go (like, say, during a sale - does EGS even do sales? The first one they did went disastrously) far more tedious than it needs to be.
A fucking shopping cart should be basic, fundamental pro-customer design - should be Storefront 101.

Y tho? Why not trust actual professional game reviewers with some experience in legitimate criticism?

Of course, not all "professional" "journalists" are necessarily trustworthy either, but I'd trust one of them far more readily than the average Steam user review!

...Because not all "actual professional game reviewers" can be trusted? Reviewers owned by 'traditional media' (the IGNs and GameSpots of the world) aren't known for being trustworthy, and inherently have a pro-positive bias in order to maintain good relations with game publishers, so they can get pre-release copies of new games to try to get customer attention first.

Even disregarding this bias, game reviewers tend to have a different view on what makes a game 'good' than a bunch of Joe Schmoes - actual reviewers don't have all that much time to play a single game before they have to wrap it up, create the review, and move onto the next game. This means they're not likely to "waste time" hunting down optional side quests or get too deep into postgame content, even if most of the fun comes from said optional content, and will base their opinion on the parts they did experience.
They might do a few side quests, or see a little of the postgame (if there is one), but rarely a lot of either.
Meanwhile, the Joe Schmoes writing user reviews are likely to do these optional tasks, and if there's issues with them that's likely to be brought up, making user reviews perhaps more informative than "professional" ones.

And even for trusted YouTube reviewers, those need to be deliberately sought out and watched, when user reviews listed on the game store page itself can be scrolled down to and quickly perused. Sure, videos can be more informative than text, but text can still be useful for gaining a general understanding of flaws or issues without much time investment.

Plus, as N10A said, it's great to have an average opinion too, where the thoughts and feelings of hundreds, if not thousands, of people can be roughly seen, instead of just a couple of reviewers. This can be more fair overall, especially considering all of the above.

 

[ZeroFX]

Get rekt!

 

[Jayro]

Well now I don't feel even slightly bad getting all their free games.

 

[yoyoyo69]

because of the woke u wont be able to do everything in games anymore. they couldnt make a real grand theft auto in todays media world. game looks cool but i bet it will be censored down to not being able to many things that are possible.

Holy shit! 830 employees is 16%???

830/16 x 100 = 5187.5

The bug question is, is that half a person still in employment?

All jokes aside, it's always a shame to see devs and studios being closed (almost always, there have been exceptions we've been glad to see them go). Always sad to see people out of work.