Gaming DQ9 Bad Grammar / English Discussion

[acturus]

some people don't understand that the spelling is intentional. dragon quest has always been that way, it gives the series it's own identity. why would we want every game to have perfect grammar when, for the most part, real people don't?

 

[GameDragon]

some people don't understand that the spelling is intentional. dragon quest has always been that way, it gives the series it's own identity. why would we want every game to have perfect grammar when, for the most part, real people don't?

Yes, thank you. Most people don't use proper grammar when they speak, and DQ captures that just fine.

 

[Acetic Orcein]

I love the dialogue! I think it's really unique and has character. Everything seems purposely done to me... It doesn't seem sloppy at all. Some of the puns are cheesy, but I love that! The game has a rather quirky sort of feel, despite alot of the dark themes that are in the story. So yes, I quite enjoy it.

Again, the argument of american english spelling is meh. Most games utilise it anyway so... it's nice to be different, and seems to fit more with the game i.e scottish accents etc, so I guess it would make sense to not use american english. I think this is a pretty good translation actually.

 

[darkranboria]

Plus there's nothing grammatically wrong about saying that the enemy are defeated.

There is something very grammatically wrong about saying the enemy are defeated. As for the stats, it was two people joking around. As for the game's translation, no clue, don't care, haven't played it, but am in complete agreement the OP is a fucktard.

BlueStar is right, there is nothing wrong with saying the enemy are defeated. "Enemy" is referring to the monsters. Enemy can be singular and plural. It's the same as saying the monsters are defeated.

 

[BlueStar]

Plus there's nothing grammatically wrong about saying that the enemy are defeated.

There is something very grammatically wrong about saying the enemy are defeated.

No there isn't, it's perfectly fine. Enemy can be a collective noun and is often used as such. I have a funny feeling it's just a phrase not used very often in the US - like when you guys say "I was in the hospital" whereas we'd say "I was in hospital."

 

[haflore]

Plus there's nothing grammatically wrong about saying that the enemy are defeated.

There is something very grammatically wrong about saying the enemy are defeated.

No there isn't it's perfectly fine. I have a funny feeling it's just a phrase not used very often in the US - like when you guys say "I was in the hospital" whereas we'd say "I was in hospital."

I like that.

 

[BobTheJoeBob]

The enemy are defeated is perfectly fine when fighting multiple enemy's. What would you say instead? The enemy is defeated, that only works if there's one enemy, if there's 2 it's the enemy are defeated.

 

[BlueStar]

I imagine it's simply that enemy is rarely used as a collective noun by Americans, even though that's perfectly correct to do so, so it seems unusual to the American ear. In fact, try this - Type "The enemy are defeated" in MS Word and run the grammar checker in both US and UK English.

 

[cruddybuddy]

Plus there's nothing grammatically wrong about saying that the enemy are defeated.

There is something very grammatically wrong about saying the enemy are defeated.

No there isn't, it's perfectly fine. Enemy can be a collective noun and is often used as such. I have a funny feeling it's just a phrase not used very often in the US - like when you guys say "I was in the hospital" whereas we'd say "I was in hospital."

No, it's not perfectly fine. If "enemy" is being used as a collective noun, as you say, then by the very definition it is singular and therefore require the singular form of "be."

With that said, I like the dialogue in Dragon Quest because it's humorous and adds personality. And yes, the grammar is intentional, but let's not pretend that it is correct.

 

[BlueStar]

Plus there's nothing grammatically wrong about saying that the enemy are defeated.

There is something very grammatically wrong about saying the enemy are defeated.

No there isn't, it's perfectly fine. Enemy can be a collective noun and is often used as such. I have a funny feeling it's just a phrase not used very often in the US - like when you guys say "I was in the hospital" whereas we'd say "I was in hospital."

No, it's not perfectly fine. If "enemy" is being used as a collective noun, as you say, then by the very definition it is singular and therefore require the singular form of "be."

Sorry, no. Look, think of another word that can be either singular or a collective noun, like sheep. If you have one sheep and defeat it, the sheep is defeated. If there are several and you defeat them all, the sheep are defeated.

 

[Leamonde.Halcyon]

Plus there's nothing grammatically wrong about saying that the enemy are defeated.

There is something very grammatically wrong about saying the enemy are defeated.

No there isn't, it's perfectly fine. Enemy can be a collective noun and is often used as such. I have a funny feeling it's just a phrase not used very often in the US - like when you guys say "I was in the hospital" whereas we'd say "I was in hospital."

No, it's not perfectly fine. If "enemy" is being used as a collective noun, as you say, then by the very definition it is singular and therefore require the singular form of "be."

Sorry, no. Look, think of another word that can be either singular or a collective noun, like sheep. If you have one sheep and defeat it, the sheep is defeated. If there are several and you defeat them all, the sheep are defeated.

This is interesting and something I never knew. You're right, "enemy" as a plural isn't used here in the US. Neither is Hospital in that manner. I've never heard enemy used as a plural the same way sheep is. Only "enemies".

 

[BlueStar]

You can read some more about the different approach to collective nouns between US English and British English (which we've already established is the chosen variant of the DQ series) here, including mentions of the different uses of enemy.

http://www.britishcouncil.org/learnenglish...ctive-nouns.htm

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/collective+noun

In American English, a collective noun naming an organization regarded as a unit is usually treated as singular: The corporation is holding its annual meeting. The team is having a winning season. The government has taken action. In British English, such nouns are commonly treated as plurals: The corporation are holding their annual meeting. The team are playing well. The government are in agreement. When a collective noun naming a group of persons is treated as singular, it is referred to by the relative pronoun that or which: His crew is one that (or which ) works hard. When such a noun is treated as plural, the pronoun is who: His crew are specialists who volunteered for the project. In formal speech and writing, collective nouns are usually not treated as both singular and plural in the same sentence: The enemy is fortifying its (not their ) position. The enemy are bringing up their heavy artillery.

The characters speak British English because it's set in a pseudo-middle age setting from before the days of western colonisation of the US. Non-speech game text probably follows the same conventions because it would be too confusing switching between the two and deciding which bits become modern US english (The informal and chatty item descriptions for example).

Some bits might look odd to the American eye, understandably, but just take it as something which is there to add to the flavour of the game and console yourself with the fact that Brits have been playing 95% of their games in US English for the past 20 years.

 

[cruddybuddy]

You can read some more about the different approach to collective nouns between US English and British English (which we've already established is the chosen variant of the DQ series) here, including mentions of the different uses of enemy.

http://www.britishcouncil.org/learnenglish...ctive-nouns.htm

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/collective+noun

The characters speak British English because it's set in a pseudo-middle age setting from before the days of western colonisation of the US. Non-speech game text probably follows the same conventions because it would be too confusing switching between the two and deciding which bits become modern US english (The informal and chatty item descriptions for example).

Some bits might look odd to the American eye, understandably, but just take it as something which is there to add to the flavour of the game and console yourself with the fact that Brits have been playing 95% of their games in US English for the past 20 years.

I stand corrected. I was under the impression that the Dragon Quest (U) game had been localized to American English, not that archaic British rot. I'm just kidding.

 

[BlueStar]

I stand corrected. I was under the impression that the Dragon Quest (U) game had been localized to American English

You mean localised

 

[Ossot]

The enemy are defeated is perfectly fine when fighting multiple enemy's. What would you say instead? The enemy is defeated, that only works if there's one enemy, if there's 2 it's the enemy are defeated.

BlueStar already cleared up the confusion of the American's misunderstanding of it. But since you asked, if it was multiple enemies we would say the enemIES are defeated. Hence the argument.

edit: And this is the first time I've seen a "debate" go multiple pages without people going bat shit on each other and calling each other fucking asshole fuckfaces. Way to not be 13 everyone.

 

[Joe88]

I just assumed it was based on British english since a lot of characters were using the term "bloke"

 

[cruddybuddy]

I stand corrected. I was under the impression that the Dragon Quest (U) game had been localized to American English

You mean localised

Haha.

 

[BlueStar]

Some of the puns are American mind, like Zere Rocks. Would never have spotted that one if it wasn't pointed out as we don't use that term over here unless to specifically refer to that brand.

 

[Sterling]

Born and raised in Texas, I spell and say things so much more different than the rest of the country. The US really has about three different forms of English: West, South and North. Being the Texan that I am I say all sorts of things: ain't, y'all, etc. "Ain't" finally got added to the dictionary, so I am now so much more grammatically correct. ^.^ Having played games all the time, I have always found the "Proper" English names more correct. This game is blatant about it's spelling, and grammatical errors. It's so obvious it's funny. There are also so many puns and stuff that will make you laugh every time.

Spoiler

CruelCumber

 

[GhostToast]

Yea the enemy names are real clever. Just don't forget at some point to cast Zoom while inside a building! Do it!!