When is pirating ok? (discussion)

[jimskeet2002]

Says the guy linking to greek propaganda pages as fact

I linked a page where German channels were talking about profits from crisis in Greece.

 

[Rydian]

in the Medieval ages, crazy people [or even people with slight issues] were usually relegated to the local witch roast.

And they died because the humans killed each other, not because of a natural need. If sanity is a "need", then insane people would be dead due to natural functions... but they're not. "Insane" people are still very much alive.

BTW, "insanity" is not a medical term, it's a legal one. You will not find it in the DSM-IV or anything else. It's a legal term used to denote that somebody was not in control of their actions.

Also, on the idea that 'humans have survived without entertainment for years'. Really? Didn't the earliest cave men draw shit on the cave walls? Weren't earlier people dreaming up the stories that we all read until now? [i.e. one of the oldest pieces of literature is the illiad, and that was before Christ was born, IIRC]

Humans that drew on cave walls did not do so instead of hunting/eating, they did so when they were safe and alive. They only went to entertainment after their needs were taken care of.

Believe me, I've seen people hooked to life assistance. That is not life. Life is being able to use your body, as evolution [or God, depends on your beliefs] gave it to you. If simply eating, breathing and shitting while we all wither away is life, something is terribly wrong with all of us.

If all that's needed for reproduction is the sperm to fertalize the egg, then there's something wrong with us?

Fuck that, I'll hump when I want to, but I'm smart enough to recognize that sexual pleasure is a want, and not a need.

 

[Rydian]

Yeah cause what ever PEOPLE write on internet websites like about.com is always true....

Actually "About" is not a user-driven site, like Wikipedia and Yahoo answers. It's written by professionals who do it as their job.

Not to mention the site and video I posted from two separate education foundations.

 

[Rydian]

So a house or clothes or sex etc are not needs right? Since you can survive without them... Humans did it for thousands of years... If they didn't we wouldn't be here today seeing how idiot you can really be. this is my last post here... I feel like I am talking to kid....

Yes, a house is not a need, homeless people are everywhere and still alive. Yes, clothes are not a need, even today there's still tribes living in the jungle that forgo clothing. Yes, sex is not a need, people die virgins all the time.

EDIT: And stop googling what ever you don't know and post here the first url you find....

"Googling what I don't know"? Those results confirm what I was saying, therefore I knew it before I grabbed those links for you.

EDIT 2: And even that fcking teacher asks the kids what do you need to live a good life... and one of them says a pet and the teacher tells them to circle it... At least watch what you post here first... IDIOT

Pay more attention to the video. The teacher tells kids to circle their answers and not say them out loud, which is why the teacher corrects a student who says their answer out loud to write it down instead, so the answers can be compared later.

It's like if you were to do the same thing, the teacher would tell you "write it down on the test, don't say it out loud".

 

[jimskeet2002]

Yes, a house is not a need, homeless people are everywhere and still alive. Yes, clothes are not a need, even today there's still tribes living in the jungle that forgo clothing. Yes, sex is not a need, people die virgins all the time.

"Googling what I don't know"? Those results confirm what I was saying, therefore I knew it before I grabbed those links for you.

Pay more attention to the video. The teacher tells kids to circle their answers and not say them out loud, which is why the teacher corrects a student who says their answer out loud to write it down instead, so the answers can be compared later.

It's like if you were to do the same thing, the teacher would tell you "write it down on the test, don't say it out loud".

Ok since a house, and everything else is not a need I can't have a conversation with you any more... Too low IQ for my levels.... Bye bye

 

[porkiewpyne]

Bye bye

Well that's kinda what you said quite a bit ago so.... XD LOL

 

[Filipe C Bello dos Santos]

You do realize this is more publicity than anything else?

If you openly come out saying "Piracy is bad and I don't like when people pirate my game" people boo you. If you say "OH I HAVE NO PROBLEM WITH PIRACY HERE LET ME HELP YOU PIRATE MY GAME" then a few pirates may go "Eh, might as well buy this one."

Not really proof that "piracy isn't bad", just more proof that people complain more about anti-piracy than being pro-piracy.

No, i don't, i only see one guy using pirated testers to find bugs on his game and another wanting to know why people pirate his games and what can he do to solve that.
If some a fair amount of people says "i pirate because it's expensive", the logic answer is sell his games at lower prices.

You guys trying to force people to accept that what they're doing is bad is almost dictatory. You're attacking everyone that feels fine pirating.

What is the point in forcing someone to feel bad about piracy, you want us to cry while we play?

Assuming that no one here never used any intellectual copirighted media without ad paid the asked price, it's hypocritical.


BTW, what you guys think about when someone borrows a game from another person ?

 

[Issac]

What is the point in forcing someone to feel bad about piracy, you want us to cry while we play?

Assuming that no one here never used any intellectual copirighted media without ad paid the asked price, it's hypocritical.

That's not the point of the discussion they're having though. They're not saying they should feel bad, they say "don't think you are entitled to have stuff".

And why do they say that? When people say "You're stupid if you pay for something that you get for free. I need to play video games to survive, and I would never pay for it lolz".

And what do I think of borrowing a game from a friend? I think it's fine. The friend loses his access to the game, he payed for it and is nice enough to let you have it.
(compare to used games, which I wrote previously)

 

[Filipe C Bello dos Santos]

I'm trying to stay away from that "wants vs. needs" conversation because for me they're right, you don't need vg to survive, but the again i agree that we need to have other things in life than only "needs". So i'm staying out of this.

But if you look a few pages back you will see plenty of comments like "i pirate myself, the case is that you're using something that you're not suppose to" forcelly over and over. for me this is hypocritical, i'm pretty sure that the pirate those medias because they don't want to pay, period.

Just wait and see someone saying that when you lend a game, you're taking food from the dev's table.

 

[notmeanymore]

Legitimate reasons for "piracy":
Own game on X, want to play on Y.
Own DVD copy of X, want Bluray quality version.
Not sure if a game will be any good and no demo is offered.

The reasons I pirate (these are not legal reasons):
Game isn't worth asking price, pirate until reasonable. (See: Skyrim and Dishonored still being $60 on Steam)
Never in a million years would I buy whatever game.

 

[Skyb]

@issac

Release game doesn't necessary mean big work or a lot of employee working on it... you take the battlefield 3 as bad example... (tou can work and win money without necessary ask a lot of money for a copy script work on every version of your game, i don't call battlefield 3 a game as is the most stupid game that i ever seen, a MAP that you can make yourself with prescripted IA and A<->B limitation world, same weapon, same engine, same gameplay... so yes paying 80euros for mod that was released for free in the past on PC yes it's so nice to exploit free work.

Look add Microsoft, they don't stop anybody to hack the XBOX, they tell you to choose between the LIVE and the Hack... so you have the choice... but did the hack made problem on the XBOX Game sales or XBOX360 console ?... not at all, look at HALO
http://www.vgchartz.com/article/250533/halo-4-sells-over-3-million-units-opening-day/ and you talk about Battlefield http://kotaku.com/5922548/battlefie...s-ea-to-give-more-games-the-premium-treatment

So you talk about stuff that you don't know, pirating aka sharing didn't make any problem, it make more sell...from the last few years of video games, they did enormous selling games...
COD Black Ops 2 http://mashable.com/2012/11/18/black-ops-2/

So please stop telling that pirating make problem to the video games industry, it's not true, like i said what is the problem, it's that the world and the people go poor as the game package go poor (Battlefield 3 is a Multiplayer game with a real solo mode, so you pay to play few min on a pre scripted map composing) you want to do the same on a better way, take UDK or Blender for free... and you would see that you can made the same with a little time of 3D/Physic learning.

So please again, i was a dev that stopped to work for this company because first they exploit the worker and the condition of life on this industry is the best one only for the manager, boss and co... the worker on dev department etc... win like a normal worker that work on a store...

Again stop saying pirating or co make game sell worst or anything similar

Watch when the video games was really video games few ago that dev release SDK and tools to make mod...that we can make free maps/free characters or new story to exploit more the game we have, how many times i offer my work because i like it to do it, ok to be pay but come on i will never release game that was never finished and ask people to pay for a partial numeric product (look at skylanders, look at every DLC and co, look ridge racer PS Vita, etc...) you think that the editor is right or what ? Skylanders the game that you can't play with portal or even without the portal you still need to have a figurine, the most expensive game that as never release and the crazy of all that, it's that Microsoft or Sony did the same by releasing game that need specific controler, stuff etc... so open your mind before saying that the problem doesn't come from the editor... even you stop piracy like i said, believe me, no one are going to buy more games anyway... like some country that the game was never release, some country like the game is released 2years after at the same price than the day one release etc...

The main problem is not paying for a game, it's paying for a real work... it's i'm going to shit in the toilet and i go tell you to pay for that and trust me it's a hard work to shit (just a joke, don't go mad)

 

[JuStYn.Leandro]

Me too. Also because I want to.

I REALLY can respect that! LOL

 

[Issac]

-snip-

I am not saying that piracy hurts companies, or that it doesn't hurt... I wouldn't know that for sure, so I can't express anything about that.

Another thing; $60 isn't much money for a game honestly.
-snip-
Now, is $60 too much to ask, to finance all that? I honestly don't think so. (Can I afford it? nope, not now.)

@issac

Release game doesn't necessary mean big work or a lot of employee working on it... you take the battlefield 3 as bad example... -snip- so yes paying 80euros for mod that was released for free in the past on PC yes it's so nice to exploit free work.

Look add at Microsoft, they don't stop anybody to hack the XBOX, they tell you to choose between the LIVE and the Hack... so you have the choice...
-snip-

So you talk about stuff that you don't know, pirating aka sharing didn't make any problem, it make more sell...from the last few years of video games, they did enormous selling games...
COD Black Ops 2 http://mashable.com/2012/11/18/black-ops-2/

So please stop telling that pirating make problem to the video games industry, it's not true, like i said what is the problem, it's that the world and the people go poor as the game package go poor (Battlefield 3 is a Multiplayer game with a real solo mode, so you pay to play few min on a pre scripted map composing) you want to do the same on a better way, take UDK or Blender for free... and you would see that you can made the same with a little time of 3D/Physic learning.

Again stop saying pirating or co make game sell worst or anything similar

The main problem is not paying for a game, it's paying for a real work... it's i'm going to shit in the toilet and i go tell you to pay for that and trust me it's a hard work to shit (just a joke, don't go mad)

Where did I say that piracy hurt sales? When did I talk about stuff I know nothing about?

and PLEASE... You can make Battlefield 3 a much bigger and better Battlefield 3 in little time with blender? right.

COD sells well because of piracy? that was news to me. However, many play COD on XBOX360, it is a multiplayer game, and as you said yourself: hack the console, or play live. I am truuuly amazed that COD sell well....

You talk all big about being an ex-dev, but all I hear is BS.

 

[JuStYn.Leandro]

Yes, a house is not a need, homeless people are everywhere and still alive. Yes, clothes are not a need, even today there's still tribes living in the jungle that forgo clothing. Yes, sex is not a need, people die virgins all the time.

"Googling what I don't know"? Those results confirm what I was saying, therefore I knew it before I grabbed those links for you.

Pay more attention to the video. The teacher tells kids to circle their answers and not say them out loud, which is why the teacher corrects a student who says their answer out loud to write it down instead, so the answers can be compared later.

It's like if you were to do the same thing, the teacher would tell you "write it down on the test, don't say it out loud".

Ok, I REALLY understand your point. But let's be boring and talk philosophy here: life as a concept can either be biological life (eating, shiting, breathing) OR some sort of metaphysical BS about pursuit of happiness and having some kind of purpose as a breathing, eating and walking being.

That being said, we can argue that, in the Biological concept of being alive, entertainment is not a need. In the Psychological, in the Sociological, in the Philosophical concepts, it is. It all depends on which ground we're treading, cuz in any of these concepts, the applicable definition of "want" and "need" change based on what is considered life.
I usually prefer the concepts of life that dictates that life is to be able to function and coexist inside a given society, and the biological one.
But, there are a lot of people who would disagree, and a battle of concepts wouldn't make anyone more right or wrong.

 

[JuStYn.Leandro]

Ok since a house, and everything else is not a need I can't have a conversation with you any more... Too low IQ for my levels.... Bye bye

Read my previous post. And argumentum ad hominem is not a valid discussion point, either.

 

[Skyb]

Yes it's too much money for a game that was based on a free work for example borderlands, portal, battlefield, etc...
now i'm not going to argue, i know exactly was is about, i'm just tired to see blind people like you that always like suck the ass of this company that exploit totaly the worker...
also don't worry about me, i already release free work many times, so thanks for the BS.

What's the point of not even converting the shaders to x86? naah, let's keep that PPC ! It's an amateur that made the game playable , a french dev called Knyz, then R* used it without asking on 1.0.3.0. or 1.0.4.0 , I don't remember. Rockstar Toronto is to blame here. We can afford these graphics with 50fps for sure even on low computers if even the game was PC optimized.

Just a small quote of my work on PC (GTA IV) Rockstar stole my works without thanks me, one dev from them contact me in private to say to me sorry about that...
so continue to talk man, i release this for free without asking any donation because i like it to work on it and help... stolen work is different than sharing work (put name on a work that is not your) yes i call that piracy

So now continue to defend that companies who stole work or take free work from other and just made the own stuff to sell it just after... i has a personal project that was stole by a big company, because i believe them i reveal everythings about it, 6month after the games was released with all my story/gameplay idea and co... it was supposed to be free to play... but no... let make it worst by releasing the game with a expensive price with work from other, nice mind

 

[JuStYn.Leandro]

No, i don't, i only see one guy using pirated testers to find bugs on his game and another wanting to know why people pirate his games and what can he do to solve that.
If some a fair amount of people says "i pirate because it's expensive", the logic answer is sell his games at lower prices.

You guys trying to force people to accept that what they're doing is bad is almost dictatory. You're attacking everyone that feels fine pirating.

What is the point in forcing someone to feel bad about piracy, you want us to cry while we play?

Assuming that no one here never used any intellectual copirighted media without ad paid the asked price, it's hypocritical.


BTW, what you guys think about when someone borrows a game from another person ?

Man, a while ago I've made a long post discussing this.. so let's try to make a long story short.
What's morally/ethically wrong doesn't necessarily need to make you feel bad, and vice-versa.
So, pirating is morally wrong, this is a fact.
I pirate all the same, and I couldn't care less. I wouldn't if certain circumstances were met, but ATM they are still non-existent.
Do I know I am acting in a morally wrong way? Fuck yeah.
Does this makes me feel bad? Nah.

End of history.

 

[retKHAAAN]

Man, a while ago I've made a long post discussing this.. so let's try to make a long story short.
What's morally/ethically wrong doesn't necessarily need to make you feel bad, and vice-versa.
So, pirating is morally wrong, this is a fact.
I pirate all the same, and I couldn't care less. I wouldn't if certain circumstances were met, but ATM they are still non-existent.
Do I know I am acting in a morally wrong way? Fuck yeah.
Does this makes me feel bad? Nah.

End of history.

And this is precisely how it should be. Thank you, sir.

 

[JuStYn.Leandro]

I got my 5 minutes of extra thinking in here, and what I'm seeing is that people are looking for incentive to pirate like "hey, you're poor, so if you can't buy, you are allowed to pirate" or "hey, your country sucks so you can copy my game".
Nope, that CAN'T happen.

 

[gameandmatch]

Te
Lol i didn't mean that only that games that lead to a hack are selling... I said that consumers will buy consoles that are easy to hack. They wont buy a console that cant be hacked... At least the majority of them. And this is a fact that developers and companies should count in their plans.

With that logic, the 3ds should be doing terrible right now.