Homebrew Nintendont and GBARunner2 connectivity to emulate GC/GBA Link Cable?

Lotoonlink

Probably doesn't know what he's talking about
OP
Member
Joined
Aug 15, 2016
Messages
233
Trophies
0
XP
653
Country
United States
I've had this idea floating in my head where someone could use a modified version of Nintendont on a Wii/Wii U to play GC/GBA link cable games (such as four swords adventures) with a DS or a 3DS. The basic gist of it would be to use wii-ds-rom-sender to send a ROM of GBARunner2 patched with the GBA BIOS ROM to a DS' downloadplay (similar to how wii-ds-rom-sender can already send patched versions of GameYob and nesDS with GBC and NES ROMS injected into them), then Nintendont connects to GBARunner2 wirelessly to begin the GC/GBA link cable process.

I haven't seen any ideas like this elsewhere and I don't think it's completely unfeasible; here is a POC of GBARunner2 playing a GBA game multiplayer with the DS' wireless networking (and is available to try here) and the GBARunner2 + GBA BIOS Rom would be under the DS' 2MB of ram so I don't think there would be any issues loading it onto a DS. Nintendont and wii-ds-rom-sender are both developed by @FIX94 so perhaps they could be merged into a custom Nintendont release that allows ds-download-play functionality to start as soon as the GameCube game boots.

I think the biggest issue I see is getting Nintendont and GBARunner2 to communicate wirelessly, as GBARunner2 has made no development on this type of connectivity at the moment. So I guess this post is more of a "can this sort of thing be done" since I'm sure I don't understand all of these systems completely, and maybe the environments in which these systems work in are more sandboxed than I realize and so they just can't communicate between each other fundamentally.

Either way, I think that this concept by itself is really cool and if works out, it would make the games that use this kind of feature so much more accessible when utilizing wireless ds connectivity alongside a wii and I think so many people would be able to experience games like four swords adventures and crystal chronicles for the first time.
 
Joined
Nov 8, 2018
Messages
13,565
Trophies
3
Age
51
Location
Austria
XP
16,494
Country
Austria
Hello.:)

I've had this idea floating in my head where someone could use a modified version of Nintendont on a Wii/Wii U to play GC/GBA link cable games (such as four swords adventures) with a DS or a 3DS. The basic gist of it would be to use wii-ds-rom-sender to send a ROM of GBARunner2 patched with the GBA BIOS ROM to a DS' downloadplay (similar to how wii-ds-rom-sender can already send patched versions of GameYob and nesDS with GBC and NES ROMS injected into them), then Nintendont connects to GBARunner2 wirelessly to begin the GC/GBA link cable process.

I haven't seen any ideas like this elsewhere and I don't think it's completely unfeasible; here is a POC of GBARunner2 playing a GBA game multiplayer with the DS' wireless networking (and is available to try here) and the GBARunner2 + GBA BIOS Rom would be under the DS' 2MB of ram so I don't think there would be any issues loading it onto a DS. Nintendont and wii-ds-rom-sender are both developed by @FIX94 so perhaps they could be merged into a custom Nintendont release that allows ds-download-play functionality to start as soon as the GameCube game boots.

I think the biggest issue I see is getting Nintendont and GBARunner2 to communicate wirelessly, as GBARunner2 has made no development on this type of connectivity at the moment. So I guess this post is more of a "can this sort of thing be done" since I'm sure I don't understand all of these systems completely, and maybe the environments in which these systems work in are more sandboxed than I realize and so they just can't communicate between each other fundamentally.

Either way, I think that this concept by itself is really cool and if works out, it would make the games that use this kind of feature so much more accessible when utilizing wireless ds connectivity alongside a wii and I think so many people would be able to experience games like four swords adventures and crystal chronicles for the first time.


https://github.com/FIX94/Nintendont
What Nintendont will never support:
  • Game Boy Player

Unfortunately,this also maybe means,no Afford/Intention to do anything concerning GameBoy Advance Things.:(
 
  • Like
Reactions: LarryD

Lotoonlink

Probably doesn't know what he's talking about
OP
Member
Joined
Aug 15, 2016
Messages
233
Trophies
0
XP
653
Country
United States
Hello.:)

https://github.com/FIX94/Nintendont

Unfortunately,this also maybe means,no Afford/Intention to do anything concerning GameBoy Advance Things.:(

Yeah, as @meepdarby said, I was referring to the GBA link cable functionality which, in the same README you quoted from, they say that the cable is supported on a Wii; my idea would be to just have it function with the Wii to ds connection protocols.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Alexander1970

meepdarby

Member
Newcomer
Joined
Jul 17, 2020
Messages
19
Trophies
0
Age
22
XP
84
Country
United States
On the wii side its supported. The difficult part would be porting some kind of functionality to the 3ds. Preferably on console injects.

How do you suppose download play would help?

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------

So nintendont supports Bluetooth controllers.
What if the software on the 3ds emulated a Bluetooth controller that has link cable functionality? Is there any specific set of scripts or software that makes the link cable different from the regular gamecube controller? Has anyone reverse engineered the link cable?

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------

I just found this.
https://gbatemp.net/threads/talk-on-reverse-engineering-the-gba-link-protocol.532989/
 

Gericom

Well-Known Member
Member
Joined
Jun 30, 2011
Messages
1,359
Trophies
0
Age
23
XP
3,865
Country
Netherlands
Because the wifi linking still kinda unstable, I think it would first require DSi wifi support in GBARunner2 as that provides higher speeds and thus potentially lower latency. Only if linking is stable enough between (3)DS(i) devices is stable enough we could consider trying to link with nintendont.
 

V10lator

Well-Known Member
Member
Joined
Apr 21, 2019
Messages
435
Trophies
0
Age
33
XP
1,064
Country
Germany
Because the wifi linking still kinda unstable
LAN adapters exist and have a perfectly stable low-latency connection.

higher speeds and thus potentially lower latency.
Latency and bandwith are completely different things. You'll have a way better latency with a 10 Mbit/s LAN connection than with a 3466.8 Mbit/s 802.11 AC connection (yes I know the DS has no AC, was an example).
Also the 3DS uses 802.11b (Nintendo claiming it's G is marketing bullshit. Turn off B compatibility on your router and see what happens) while the Wii U uses 802.11g. 802.11g should in theory be able to reach lower latency than B but in practice that hardly depends on your neighbours.
 

Gericom

Well-Known Member
Member
Joined
Jun 30, 2011
Messages
1,359
Trophies
0
Age
23
XP
3,865
Country
Netherlands
LAN adapters exist and have a perfectly stable low-latency connection.


Latency and bandwith are completely different things. You'll have a way better latency with a 10 Mbit/s LAN connection than with a 3466.8 Mbit/s 802.11 AC connection (yes I know the DS has no AC, was an example).
Also the 3DS uses 802.11b (Nintendo claiming it's G is marketing bullshit. Turn off B compatibility on your router and see what happens) while the Wii U uses 802.11g. 802.11g should in theory be able to reach lower latency than B but in practice that hardly depends on your neighbours.
The linking doesn't use a router or whatever. It is just peer to peer. Besides is it not possible to connect a (3)DS(i) to a LAN adapter. DS wifi is up to 2Mbit/s, DSi wifi should allow up to 54Mbit/s so that should be a massive improvement. With latency I mean the time it takes to send over the bits to the other device. Higher speed with the same amount of data means lower latency. Wifi packets add a lot of overhead since I only have 16 bits to send every time.
 
Last edited by Gericom,

V10lator

Well-Known Member
Member
Joined
Apr 21, 2019
Messages
435
Trophies
0
Age
33
XP
1,064
Country
Germany
The linking doesn't use a router or whatever. It is just peer to peer.
Oh, just ad-hoc wifi? Well, could still be possible to make that configurable (could even allow internet linkage between two Wii Us with LAN adapter (WiFi + internet is probably too much latency).

DS wifi is up to 2Mbit/s, DSi wifi should allow up to 54Mbit/s so that should be a massive improvement.
DS uses 802.11b which should reach 11 Mbit/s. Are you sure about the 2 Mbit/s? DSi is 802.11b, too (again: Nintendo telling it's 802.11g is marketing bullshit. Even the (new) 3DS is 802.11b) so 11 Mbit/s max. If you don't believe that no DS has anything higher than 802.11b turn of 802.11b compatibility in your router: The DS can't connect anymore. Also watch speeds on your router: They'll never be higher than 11 Mbit/s.
 

Gericom

Well-Known Member
Member
Joined
Jun 30, 2011
Messages
1,359
Trophies
0
Age
23
XP
3,865
Country
Netherlands
Oh, just ad-hoc wifi? Well, could still be possible to make that configurable (could even allow internet linkage between two Wii Us with LAN adapter (WiFi + internet is probably too much latency).


DS uses 802.11b which should reach 11 Mbit/s. Are you sure about the 2 Mbit/s? DSi is 802.11b, too (again: Nintendo telling it's 802.11g is marketing bullshit. Even the (new) 3DS is 802.11b) so 11 Mbit/s max. If you don't believe that no DS has anything higher than 802.11b turn of 802.11b compatibility in your router: The DS can't connect anymore. Also watch speeds on your router: They'll never be higher than 11 Mbit/s.
The DS is definitely not higher than 2Mbit/s. The hardware simply doesn't support it. I thought this thread was about nintendont <-> gbarunner2 though, so wii u <-> wii u makes no sense.
 

V10lator

Well-Known Member
Member
Joined
Apr 21, 2019
Messages
435
Trophies
0
Age
33
XP
1,064
Country
Germany
I thought this thread was about nintendont <-> gbarunner2 though, so wii u <-> wii u makes no sense.
Well, if we already see a PoC of DS to DS and if the exact same protocol should be used for DS to Wii U there's absolutely nothing stopping one from connecting two Wii Us. But yea, we got a slighly bit off-topic. Sry. :)
 

Gericom

Well-Known Member
Member
Joined
Jun 30, 2011
Messages
1,359
Trophies
0
Age
23
XP
3,865
Country
Netherlands
Well, if we already see a PoC of DS to DS and if the exact same protocol should be used for DS to Wii U there's absolutely nothing stopping one from connecting two Wii Us. But yea, we got a slighly bit off-topic. Sry. :)
Here's a video of the wifi linking branch of gbarunner2 in action:
 
  • Like
Reactions: Alexander1970

V10lator

Well-Known Member
Member
Joined
Apr 21, 2019
Messages
435
Trophies
0
Age
33
XP
1,064
Country
Germany
Back to topic: There's one big problem for that plan, from Nintendont:
What Nintendont will never support:
  • Game Boy Player
@GaryOderNichts Do you have an idea why this is?

Anyway, why even implement in into Nintendont and not some GBA emulator? We have Visual Boy Advance GX and there's VBA Link. Merging these two projects would allow the Wii U to connect to other Wii Us, Wiis and even computers. Then one could advance the protocol for ad-hoc and ask the GBARunner2 devs to use the same protocol.
 
  • Like
Reactions: SnakeEater

Gericom

Well-Known Member
Member
Joined
Jun 30, 2011
Messages
1,359
Trophies
0
Age
23
XP
3,865
Country
Netherlands
Back to topic: There's one big problem for that plan, from Nintendont:

@GaryOderNichts Do you have an idea why this is?

Anyway, why even implement in into Nintendont and not some GBA emulator? We have Visual Boy Advance GX and there's VBA Link. Merging these two projects would allow the Wii U to connect to other Wii Us, Wiis and even computers. Then one could advance the protocol for ad-hoc and ask the GBARunner2 devs to use the same protocol.
Like I said in a reaction on a github issue, the linking with Nintendont will not be GBA game <--> GBA game, but GBA game <--> Gamecube Game. They allow for extra features with a connected gba.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Alexander1970

Masana

Well-Known Member
Newcomer
Joined
Aug 12, 2016
Messages
67
Trophies
0
XP
1,179
Country
France
Hello everyone, Knowing that the gamepad Wiiu has a screen, so I don't use it as a gameboy avance if possible ?
I think that would be the best solution and that avoids buying a second material to enjoy the gc -> gba games.

PS: message written with google translate.
 

MikaDubbz

Well-Known Member
Member
Joined
Dec 12, 2017
Messages
2,185
Trophies
1
Age
34
XP
3,914
Country
United States
Hello everyone, Knowing that the gamepad Wiiu has a screen, so I don't use it as a gameboy avance if possible ?
I think that would be the best solution and that avoids buying a second material to enjoy the gc -> gba games.

PS: message written with google translate.

That is probably far less likely to be possible, but I wouldn't oppose such implementation if it could happen either. Still only one Gamepad can connect to the Wii U as things stand (though it was supposedly going to be capable of connecting to a second game pad), so for games like 4 Swords Adventures and Crystal Chronicles, getting DS/3DS connectivity would be ideal to get the multiplayer experience operational on a Wii U.

You also have to keep in mind, Nintendont is running from the vWii side of the Wii U, it is for all intents and purposes Wii homebrew that runs on Wii U as well. And while sure, we've been able to mirror the main screen and use the Gamepad as if it's recognized as a Wii Pro controller or Gamecube controller, no Wii homebrew has been able to send a separate display to the Gamepad, and I really doubt that it even possibly can be done.
 
Last edited by MikaDubbz,
General chit-chat
Help Users
  • No one is chatting at the moment.
    The Real Jdbye @ The Real Jdbye: i install gentoo for fun