Leaked emails reveal secret, widespread TrapWire surveillance system

[omgpwn666]

Never knew the US like stalking people.

I assume this kind of stuff is happening before confirmation so that when it's confirmed that they do what I thought they already did it's not shocking. If that makes sense.

 

[Foxi4]

TrapWire is “designed to provide a simple yet powerful means of collecting and recording suspicious activity reports.”

So... it's CCTV. Why is this causing wide-spread panic, you already live in Big Brother Societies, you should've gotten used to it by now. In other news, the sun rises in the east. I think it's a brilliant idea to collect videos of suspicious activity for comparison - pattern-matching can really help in investigations. If a given number of recordings show that culprits after, say, robbing an ATM reacted in a specific way, it makes capturing future ATM robbers easier or even preventing some of the robberies.

 

[Psionic Roshambo]

I wouldn't worry about being spied on unless you have something to hide, for 99.99999% of the population you have absolutely nothing to worry about. Stuff like this isn't meant to catch you smoking pot or speeding or cheating on your wife, it is designed to catch domestic terrorists and generally the really really bad guys. Not that it will catch most of them either I believe that most terrorists are probably so paranoid that they would not talk on a cell phone or email or post on face book about *insert evil plot here*.

In other words: the end purpose will be that it will be used to catch 0.00000% of the people. Doesn't that strike you as a major waste of tax payers money?

I don't see a problem with this, it is meant to protect people so what's wrong with it? Losing a bit of freedom in order to have better protection is nothing that bad, besides, you can still whatever you want, as long as you're not doing bad stuff you won't have any problems.. I don't get why people are so worked up about a few cameras watching them. z.z

If you sacrifice freedom for security, you deserve neither*. The problem you don't seem to grasp is that the morals of what's good and bad are set by the same people who do all that tracking. Reality doesn't work "in the way it is meant to be". At best, they'll realise there simply aren't enough terrorists available to give the project any meaning and shut down the place quietly. The more realistic outcome will be that the definition of "a terrorist" will shift toward "anyone who doesn't think the American way". Or even "anyone who's a threat to the president" (the way these presidential election campaigns go, I can foresee guys 'in the name of the people' misuse that trapdoor stuff to dig up dirt on the opposing side).

Also: I don't often throw people books in their face, but here's an opportunity: go read 1984 and then come tell me the future will be bright...


*Benjamin Franklin. But hey...if he was so smart, why is he dead, then?

I'd rather they did this, at least they can preempt terrorist activities.

Nobody wants another 9-11. However, it goes without saying that such power must be used right, and there must be some sort of oversight to keep them in check. Otherwise, they're just another band of cloaks and daggers.

Nobody wants another Iraq either. Still...despite the CIA, NSA, Echelon, interpol and who knows what else kind of intelligence agencies...the US still attacked an innocent country. That had nothing to do with 9-11 to begin with. It's your right to believe that with MORE intelligence, they would have found that Iraq really didn't have those mass destruction thingies. Or you can face up to the fact that the truth gets bended by those in control to make for an outcome they WANT. That isn't going to change by more security. On the contrary: I bet it will be used more often to look for "clues of terrorism" in countries that have a lot of oil, rather than actually checking objective* acts of terrorism.


*say what you want, but attacking an innocence country...how would YOU call it?

Innocent? I guess you missed the part about Iraq invading Kuwait....

 

[Pleng]

Innocent? I guess you missed the part about Iraq invading Kuwait....

 

[Skelletonike]

I don't see a problem with this, it is meant to protect people so what's wrong with it? Losing a bit of freedom in order to have better protection is nothing that bad, besides, you can still whatever you want, as long as you're not doing bad stuff you won't have any problems.. I don't get why people are so worked up about a few cameras watching them. z.z

If you sacrifice freedom for security, you deserve neither*. The problem you don't seem to grasp is that the morals of what's good and bad are set by the same people who do all that tracking. Reality doesn't work "in the way it is meant to be". At best, they'll realise there simply aren't enough terrorists available to give the project any meaning and shut down the place quietly. The more realistic outcome will be that the definition of "a terrorist" will shift toward "anyone who doesn't think the American way". Or even "anyone who's a threat to the president" (the way these presidential election campaigns go, I can foresee guys 'in the name of the people' misuse that trapdoor stuff to dig up dirt on the opposing side).

Also: I don't often throw people books in their face, but here's an opportunity: go read 1984 and then come tell me the future will be bright...


*Benjamin Franklin. But hey...if he was so smart, why is he dead, then?

So, you think that right now you live in a free world? No matter what you think most people have already lost their freedom, be it in the US or anywhere else, freedom is something pretty relative that's more fragile than one might think, also, the US can only watch their own country, just like your own country will just watch yours. When you go to a shopping center there's already cameras everywhere and no matter what you do, it's all being recorded, the same applies for nearly every building you go to, not to mention that in the streets there's already plenty of cameras recording what you do, this won't be that much of a difference and I don't care about it anyway, it won't change me nor will it bother me.. Why make such a fuss about it?

 

[Taleweaver]

Innocent? I guess you missed the part about Iraq invading Kuwait....

 

[InuYasha]

Unless you live in a bunker underground with no electric devices you don't have any privacy...

 

[MarcusRaven]

I thought of this when reading this topic:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_wkqo_Rd3_Q

Actually saw this movie on my honeymoon. It was awesome. But this seems like a major step towards what this movie was really about. (Trying not to provide spoilers for anybody interested in seeing it.)

 

[MakiManPR]

I thought of this when reading this topic:

http://www.youtube.c...h?v=_wkqo_Rd3_Q

Actually saw this movie on my honeymoon. It was awesome. But this seems like a major step towards what this movie was really about. (Trying not to provide spoilers for anybody interested in seeing it.)

This movie is so awesome

 

[Deleted_171835]

Bullshit.

Not at the fact that the government or some group or organization likes to keep an eye on the civilians. But that someone this powerful and secure would be "leaked" or found out. First of all, shit like that you don't talk about in emails, no matter how many firewalls, codecs, encryptions or goddamn anti-spywares. Second, WHY would you expressively mention what it does in the email? Also, who would name something that watches everyone Trapwire, a name that certainly does envoke negative feelings towards it. And even if the email was legitimately leaked, you wouldn't have had a chance to post it, knowing our government they would bring down the hammer on shit like this. Its too perfect, like a network that gathers data on every source of surveillance in the country would have a name like that and be so simply leaked by something like EMAIL. There's no way this is true, and even if it is its not half as important as the article makes it seem.

Late late late response but no this isn't bullshit. It's confirmed to be real.

The fact that a system like this exists is not the surprising part. Multiple surveillance systems have popped off after 9/11. It's their clients (US government) and how widespread the system is that makes it notable.

 

[431unknown]

I've hear'd about this earlier in the year and I'm kinda surprised its only getting mainstream coverage now.

Edit: oh and this isn't just happening in the US there are other nations that are clients of this company too.

Big Brother is everywhere anymore.

 

[The Milkman]

Bullshit.

Not at the fact that the government or some group or organization likes to keep an eye on the civilians. But that someone this powerful and secure would be "leaked" or found out. First of all, shit like that you don't talk about in emails, no matter how many firewalls, codecs, encryptions or goddamn anti-spywares. Second, WHY would you expressively mention what it does in the email? Also, who would name something that watches everyone Trapwire, a name that certainly does envoke negative feelings towards it. And even if the email was legitimately leaked, you wouldn't have had a chance to post it, knowing our government they would bring down the hammer on shit like this. Its too perfect, like a network that gathers data on every source of surveillance in the country would have a name like that and be so simply leaked by something like EMAIL. There's no way this is true, and even if it is its not half as important as the article makes it seem.

Late late late response but no this isn't bullshit. It's confirmed to be real.

The fact that a system like this exists is not the surprising part. Multiple surveillance systems have popped off after 9/11. It's their clients (US government) and how widespread the system is that makes it notable.

So the fact that you can easily post about this super secret network of cameras and shit doesnt set any lights off to you?

Well shit, that more blind paranoia then you showed when we discussed google and privacy.

 

[Deleted_171835]

So the fact that you can easily post about this super secret network of cameras and shit doesnt set any lights off to you?

Well shit, that more blind paranoia then you showed when we discussed google and privacy.

....So what do you expect to happen, the FBI to come and silence everyone who speaks of this. No shit, that isn't happening.

The proof is right here. It's up to you whether you want to turn a blind eye or accept the fact that not everything is all moonlight and roses.
http://dazzlepod.com...rch/?q=TrapWire

Worth noting that Wikileaks suffered a massive DDoS after leaking these docs.

 

[Foxi4]

I look at the positives of this system. It's aimed to study terrorist and criminal activities by observing similar behavioral patterns of individuals with similar backgrounds - it's ingenious and I don't have any issues with it whatsoever. Cross-examination has been used before, simply on a smaller scale. It's called profiling, and it's a powerful tool in the hands of the right authorities.

 

[Deleted_171835]

I look at the positives of this system. It's aimed to study terrorist and criminal activities by observing similar behavioral patterns of individuals with similar backgrounds - it's ingenious and I don't have any issues with it whatsoever.

Whilst violating your privacy.

 

[Foxi4]

I look at the positives of this system. It's aimed to study terrorist and criminal activities by observing similar behavioral patterns of individuals with similar backgrounds - it's ingenious and I don't have any issues with it whatsoever.

Whilst violating your privacy.

The system is not aimed at the individual but at the pattern - it can be used to hunt down an individual, but only when there's a well-grounded suspicion of a crime. CCTV in general, search warrants, temporary arrests and other tools in the hands of the police also infringe upon your widely-understood privacy, but for the greater good. This system is likely to make finding culprits easier or even preventing certain crimes by creating a massive database of possible behavioral patterns - it's a *good* thing and it's been created for your protection, not harm.

 

[Valwin]

good for them we need security