I want to learn about all this hacking stuff and making apps like everyone else but i don't know where to start. Is there some sort of class that teaches you how to hack gadgets or something? What classes have you guys taken if any?
Just Search Wiibrew. It tells you all about it.
(I Hate when people make threads like this!
)
(I Hate when people make threads like this!
im not talking about installing anything im talking about how do they know how to hack? Like where did it all start did they take a class? And stop being a jerk I hate it when people do that hate it!Zeek03 said:Just Search Wiibrew. It tells you all about it.
(I Hate when people make threads like this!)
JJBro1 said:im not talking about installing anything im talking about how do they know how to hack? Like where did it all start did they take a class? And stop being a jerk I hate it when people do that hate it!Zeek03 said:Just Search Wiibrew. It tells you all about it.
(I Hate when people make threads like this!)
judging by your response; I am going to say don't bother.
I am not trying to be a "jerk". If you have no idea about code, or how electronics work it would not be worth your time to attempt to learn. Some people just have the natural talent.
i only called you a jerk because of your last comment. I know they didn't learn this out of nowhere so im going off the assumption that they took classes. And google expects that you know some things to begin with.night_chrono said:JJBro1 said:im not talking about installing anything im talking about how do they know how to hack? Like where did it all start did they take a class? And stop being a jerk I hate it when people do that hate it!Zeek03 said:Just Search Wiibrew. It tells you all about it.
(I Hate when people make threads like this!)
judging by your response; I am going to say don't bother.
I am not trying to be a "jerk". If you have no idea about code, or how electronics work it would not be worth your time to attempt to learn. Some people just have the natural talent.
I'm by no means a programmer, but as a very basic starting point you're going to want to learn a programming language like C++. Be it through books, online tutorials, whatever. You'll want to wrap your head around the basic in's and out's of how things work in the software world. Once you have that step covered then the other possibilities open up. Thing is that many people don't get over that first hurdle because it's not exactly easy. Sure any Joe can whip up a "hello world" prog, but larger apps are a different story.
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1) understand asm,
2) look at the asm untill something big screams at you "i am a bug that is exploitable"
3) Exploit said bug
4) ????
5) PROFIT!!!
2) look at the asm untill something big screams at you "i am a bug that is exploitable"
3) Exploit said bug
4) ????
5) PROFIT!!!
JJBro1 said:i only called you a jerk because of your last comment. I know they didn't learn this out of nowhere so im going off the assumption that they took classes. And google expects that you know some things to begin with.night_chrono said:JJBro1 said:im not talking about installing anything im talking about how do they know how to hack? Like where did it all start did they take a class? And stop being a jerk I hate it when people do that hate it!Zeek03 said:Just Search Wiibrew. It tells you all about it.
(I Hate when people make threads like this!)
judging by your response; I am going to say don't bother.
I am not trying to be a "jerk". If you have no idea about code, or how electronics work it would not be worth your time to attempt to learn. Some people just have the natural talent.
LOL that wasn't me in the first thing you responded to. If you don't even know how to look at who is posting messages on a forum hacking is not for you.
woah that was weird, how did i quote you? Well i aimed that quote at the first response. Sorry...night_chrono said:JJBro1 said:i only called you a jerk because of your last comment. I know they didn't learn this out of nowhere so im going off the assumption that they took classes. And google expects that you know some things to begin with.night_chrono said:JJBro1 said:im not talking about installing anything im talking about how do they know how to hack? Like where did it all start did they take a class? And stop being a jerk I hate it when people do that hate it!Zeek03 said:Just Search Wiibrew. It tells you all about it.
(I Hate when people make threads like this!)
judging by your response; I am going to say don't bother.
I am not trying to be a "jerk". If you have no idea about code, or how electronics work it would not be worth your time to attempt to learn. Some people just have the natural talent.
LOL that wasn't me in the first thing you responded to. If you don't even know how to look at who is posting messages on a forum hacking is not for you.
How to hack.
1) Every feat of human scientific/technological endeavour has gone so far as to require something to be written down. This then becomes science and technology (how far would you have got without being taught things; I would count it lucky if any of us were are laws of motion stage should we have to go from scratch).
2) Ultimately these become standards (hence the learn programming, electronics, engineering).
3) Few people become programmers/engineers for any reason other than they think they can do things better than others (either aiming for monetary rewards, prestige, to help themselves out.....).
4) See 1), everything being so difficult/expensive to make means it is ultimately easier to pervert something to your own ends.
5) See 2) Being so difficult it has to be based on something that is known, secrets do not become known and thus are not so important. Even if it is kept secret from the general public it will ultimately be based on a standard somewhere along the line (see GC memory card being a rebadged SD slot).
6) See 3) people take 2)/5) and use it to achieve 3).
Methods by which to do this.
Electronics. Signals carry information, you have to work out what form this information is in and if/how it derives from that which already exists.
Popular methods include:
patents. Patents contrary to some level of popular belief do not keep things secret but disallow others to use the setup/methods for monetary gain.
Adverts/company portfolios. A company will usually shout from the rooftops that it has a given contract to make things and those that have it made will usually do the same.
Reverse engineering. If you see something in action you can tell how it works if you know where and how to look. Knowing where and how courtesy of the duality of knowledge is necessary to create new things so those that can create can also reverse engineer (although it is by no means a simple thing).
Leaked documents. Usually saves a lot of effort digging around the first three.
Other programmers. See 2) in the list above.
Programming: Everything starts at the electrical level but that is damn hard so it is abstracted to assembler/assembly language.
Assembler is different for every chip and/or setup so that is abstracted again. Usually this means C of some form.
C? is also difficult so it is abstracted again.
Rinse and repeat several times.
At every stage up you lose some level of control to an "intelligent" program and also some of the electronics will be hidden from the programming level. You then tweak the electronics (this would be the "chip" you add to a wii) to allow programming OR you emulate the electronics and conveniently forget to add in the restrictions of the real hardware.
Most hackers have a considerable level of mastery of at least the first 2 (electronics and assembler) and these days being able to pull apart a higher level language from the perspective of assembly is also a damn useful skill (and where I tend to fall down a bit).
Knowing these is how the hackers can do it.
Some links
Electronics:
http://ocw.mit.edu/OcwWeb/Electrical-Engin...ience/index.htm
Programming:
Assembly (this is for x86 but it is one of the best guides out there):
http://webster.cs.ucr.edu/
C
http://www.cplusplus.com/doc/tutorial/
http://www.physics.drexel.edu/students/cou...neral/C_basics/
Eventually the knowledge gets passed on/written down which allows conventional programmers a go at doing things.
1) Every feat of human scientific/technological endeavour has gone so far as to require something to be written down. This then becomes science and technology (how far would you have got without being taught things; I would count it lucky if any of us were are laws of motion stage should we have to go from scratch).
2) Ultimately these become standards (hence the learn programming, electronics, engineering).
3) Few people become programmers/engineers for any reason other than they think they can do things better than others (either aiming for monetary rewards, prestige, to help themselves out.....).
4) See 1), everything being so difficult/expensive to make means it is ultimately easier to pervert something to your own ends.
5) See 2) Being so difficult it has to be based on something that is known, secrets do not become known and thus are not so important. Even if it is kept secret from the general public it will ultimately be based on a standard somewhere along the line (see GC memory card being a rebadged SD slot).
6) See 3) people take 2)/5) and use it to achieve 3).
Methods by which to do this.
Electronics. Signals carry information, you have to work out what form this information is in and if/how it derives from that which already exists.
Popular methods include:
patents. Patents contrary to some level of popular belief do not keep things secret but disallow others to use the setup/methods for monetary gain.
Adverts/company portfolios. A company will usually shout from the rooftops that it has a given contract to make things and those that have it made will usually do the same.
Reverse engineering. If you see something in action you can tell how it works if you know where and how to look. Knowing where and how courtesy of the duality of knowledge is necessary to create new things so those that can create can also reverse engineer (although it is by no means a simple thing).
Leaked documents. Usually saves a lot of effort digging around the first three.
Other programmers. See 2) in the list above.
Programming: Everything starts at the electrical level but that is damn hard so it is abstracted to assembler/assembly language.
Assembler is different for every chip and/or setup so that is abstracted again. Usually this means C of some form.
C? is also difficult so it is abstracted again.
Rinse and repeat several times.
At every stage up you lose some level of control to an "intelligent" program and also some of the electronics will be hidden from the programming level. You then tweak the electronics (this would be the "chip" you add to a wii) to allow programming OR you emulate the electronics and conveniently forget to add in the restrictions of the real hardware.
Most hackers have a considerable level of mastery of at least the first 2 (electronics and assembler) and these days being able to pull apart a higher level language from the perspective of assembly is also a damn useful skill (and where I tend to fall down a bit).
Knowing these is how the hackers can do it.
Some links
Electronics:
http://ocw.mit.edu/OcwWeb/Electrical-Engin...ience/index.htm
Programming:
Assembly (this is for x86 but it is one of the best guides out there):
http://webster.cs.ucr.edu/
C
http://www.cplusplus.com/doc/tutorial/
http://www.physics.drexel.edu/students/cou...neral/C_basics/
Eventually the knowledge gets passed on/written down which allows conventional programmers a go at doing things.
night_chrono said:JJBro1 said:im not talking about installing anything im talking about how do they know how to hack? Like where did it all start did they take a class? And stop being a jerk I hate it when people do that hate it!Zeek03 said:Just Search Wiibrew. It tells you all about it.
(I Hate when people make threads like this!)
judging by your response; I am going to say don't bother.
I am not trying to be a "jerk". If you have no idea about code, or how electronics work it would not be worth your time to attempt to learn. Some people just have the natural talent.
What a horribly untrue thing to say.
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Wow. I totally misread this post. I thought he was asking how we know how to "hack" the Wii, as in homebrew, VC/Wiiware games, etc.
@FAST6191 that was amazingly well written my friend concise and to the point and funny to (or is that the nerd / reverser in me lol) do u mind if i quote that in the future on my website the next time someone ask me that same question. as my normal response is read a book do a course or summit along them lines
Do what you like skedone, it may well find its way into my upcoming hacking docs too if you are interested in those too (an extensive rewrite of the hacking docs in the DS hacking section).
The thing about Hacking is that you don't know what you're doing, a lot of times. You're just trying stuff, and seeing what happens (atleast in the start).
I, however, was going to suggest going to the MIT "Hacking for Dummies" course, it's really simple then, you spend 60k/year, and with that course, you will be fitted in a new shiny suit of armour, and given your diploma.
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