Feedback Hacking The Internet Channel. "Internet Channel Deluxe" ? [WIP]

[GameGenieLabs]

Crazy thing to say I really haven't seen ANYONE have interest in truely modifying the Internet Channel WAD for Homebrew, but I'm here to show progress on a little test I've simply done to make a useful mod for this channel.

To start off, the project I'll call it, is Internet Channel Deluxe (still a work in progress name)

The idea behind it is to somewhat overhaul both the look and function of the channel, maybe to make it a little more useful. Now, obviously, this could only be patched if you install the WAD itself, however I've decided to try my best to study how it really works, and work on making a custom Internet Channel WAD.

The point of this, really in my opinion would be a novelty of a mod. Unsure if you'd say if it were cheating to add more code or images to the files, however, I want to try to make something that would be more of just a proof of concept that it would be possible to do something like this.

The Internet Channel's code (based off of my understanding) is from HTML, JavaScript, and CSS coding, which is also what most of the Wii itself runs on (especially HTML for the Wii Menus)

One of my theories is trying to think of a workaround that could load files directly from the link into the search bar. I don't know if this is possible, but if I could load custom HTML files that aren't apart of the original mapping, I could figure out a way to run an ACE like script (if possible) or even make a custom button that would just be a quick way to say if I wanted to run a Wiimmfi loader (I would put this on homepage, even though yes you can literally put this on Favorites)

Knowing that this channel would stay on the Nand, I do want to make this as optimized as I can, and even if I can also rewrite some of the Internet Channel code to make it more simplified. That's honestly the main issue I see here with this, as the Nand space is crucial really if you're using this on the Home Menu on a real Wii.

Overall a fun project that may be useless in the end, but I think the novelty behind it could have use, as the features I would like to add could be beneficial.

As a start, I've went ahead and replaced simple images in the background and such, but also wrote custom CSS code to fix a few oddities on how the text is viewed on if I were to use a different background.

Feel free to share your thoughts on this project. Again, I know there may be no point of it really, but I would personally love to know if this would be of interest.

 

[KleinesSinchen]

would personally love to know if this would be of interest.

Interest in a working Wii internet browser? Oh, yes!

But since Internet Channel for Wii is a *very* outdated Opera I don't see how this should work. Gee. We can run Opera 12 on Windows 98 with KernelEx.
What could possibly done on that basis? Some changes in GUI aren't gonna make the browser work again with current, normal websites.

For a really working "Internet Channel" we would need a port of a newer browser engine. Sadly I don't see any chances of this happening -- just like on 3DS, where some projects have been announced just to disappear into the void shortly after. A difficult and laberous task.

Common consensus (which I do not agree on): Too weak device, too little RAM.

I'm lacking any notable development skills myself and just look from user perspective on this: Full-fledged outdated Firefox works acceptable on a Celeron 433MHz with 192MB running Windows XP SP3 in the background.
I believe a somewhat working browser is possible on Wii and 3DS -- in theory. But since there are "a billion better devices" virtually nobody shows interest (developers and users).
I personally love pushing the limits of weak devices. Much cooler than buying the lastest and greatest >$1000 swank smartphone.
=========

If you go with patching the Wii Opera browser you probably may not redistribute the result. It was a free download, but I don't think you have any right to upload derivates yourself. Better only upload patches.

 

[Disorarara]

Interest in a working Wii internet browser? Oh, yes!

But since Internet Channel for Wii is a *very* outdated Opera I don't see how this should work. Gee. We can run Opera 12 on Windows 98 with KernelEx.
What could possibly done on that basis? Some changes in GUI aren't gonna make the browser work again with current, normal websites.

For a really working "Internet Channel" we would need a port of a newer browser engine. Sadly I don't see any chances of this happening -- just like on 3DS, where some projects have been announced just to disappear into the void shortly after. A difficult and laberous task.

Common consensus (which I do not agree on): Too weak device, too little RAM.

I'm lacking any notable development skills myself and just look from user perspective on this: Full-fledged outdated Firefox works acceptable on a Celeron 433MHz with 192MB running Windows XP SP3 in the background.
I believe a somewhat working browser is possible on Wii and 3DS -- in theory. But since there are "a billion better devices" virtually nobody shows interest (developers and users).
I personally love pushing the limits of weak devices. Much cooler than buying the lastest and greatest >$1000 swank smartphone.
=========

If you go with patching the Wii Opera browser you probably may not redistribute the result. It was a free download, but I don't think you have any right to upload derivates yourself. Better only upload patches.

There really isn't any hope for this or any vintage piece of hardware to have a usable internet browser anymore due to the bloated technologies that are mandatory for a modern web browsing experience. So instead focus should be aimed towards making a piece of software that can interface with something like browservice. Either that or making a collection of Wii friendly websites which I believe is a thing now too.

 

[KleinesSinchen]

There really isn't any hope for this or any vintage piece of hardware to have a usable internet browser anymore due to the bloated technologies that are mandatory for a modern web browsing experience.

Weak for it's time year 1999 laptop doesn't count?
Well, it was kinda usable a year ago for basic browsing while having Win XP loaded (opposed to a gaming console running one single application at a time). And this was a standard desktop browser, not an optimized one for low spec devices asking for the mobile version and blocking (third party at least) scripts.

But probably nobody is going to put 100s or even 1000s of work hours into a piece of software with zero practical value.

You won't get anything fancy like YouBloatTube to work on weak devices (which lack h.264 hardware decoding anyway), but generally browsing is possible. Another device should protect the "vintage" hardware from getting overwhelmed with garbage: For example Pi Hole (DNS blocking).

Trying to make old devices things they were never intended to is a nice thing as such without any factual benefit (look at impressive 64KB demos for old home computers).

 

[a_username_that_is_cool]

If you go with patching the Wii Opera browser you probably may not redistribute the result. It was a free download, but I don't think you have any right to upload derivates yourself. Better only upload patches.

I'm not a lawyer, but doesn't the RiiConnect / WiiLink installer have the Internet Channel available? And would it be considered abandonware? I mean, the Wii isn't going back online officially any time soon, and any newer web browser would use a newer version of Opera/a completely different web browser

 

[KleinesSinchen]

I'm not a lawyer, but doesn't the RiiConnect / WiiLink installer have the Internet Channel available? And would it be considered abandonware? I mean, the Wii isn't going back online officially any time soon, and any newer web browser would use a newer version of Opera/a completely different web browser

I don't have the slightest idea since I never even looked at RiiConnect (never played any game online in my life). Abandonware is a problematic term as well. Some consider it as a legal grey area (and I'm all in for preserving stuff), but distributing old software with unknown rights holders -- sadly -- isn't exactly legal.

ModMii for example does offer to include the Opera, but it should be downloaded right from the Nintendo servers (as the originial system IOS which get patched to cIOS). If Nintendo completely pulls the plug at some point we will have to resort to other, potentially problematic, methods.

Copyright laws are a one-sided mess.

 

[a_username_that_is_cool]

I don't have the slightest idea since I never even looked at RiiConnect (never played any game online in my life). Abandonware is a problematic term as well. Some consider it as a legal grey area (and I'm all in for preserving stuff), but distributing old software with unknown rights holders -- sadly -- isn't exactly legal.

ModMii for example does offer to include the Opera, but it should be downloaded right from the Nintendo servers (as the originial system IOS which get patched to cIOS). If Nintendo completely pulls the plug at some point we will have to resort to other, potentially problematic, methods.

Copyright laws are a one-sided mess.

Agreed. Copyright Infringement and Parody Laws are a very confusing topic (see SMG4's lawsuit arc, where the best way they decided was with a WOTFI, which isn't even a real thing)

 

[GameGenieLabs]

Interest in a working Wii internet browser? Oh, yes!

But since Internet Channel for Wii is a *very* outdated Opera I don't see how this should work. Gee. We can run Opera 12 on Windows 98 with KernelEx.
What could possibly done on that basis? Some changes in GUI aren't gonna make the browser work again with current, normal websites.

For a really working "Internet Channel" we would need a port of a newer browser engine. Sadly I don't see any chances of this happening -- just like on 3DS, where some projects have been announced just to disappear into the void shortly after. A difficult and laberous task.

Common consensus (which I do not agree on): Too weak device, too little RAM.

I'm lacking any notable development skills myself and just look from user perspective on this: Full-fledged outdated Firefox works acceptable on a Celeron 433MHz with 192MB running Windows XP SP3 in the background.
I believe a somewhat working browser is possible on Wii and 3DS -- in theory. But since there are "a billion better devices" virtually nobody shows interest (developers and users).
I personally love pushing the limits of weak devices. Much cooler than buying the lastest and greatest >$1000 swank smartphone.
=========

If you go with patching the Wii Opera browser you probably may not redistribute the result. It was a free download, but I don't think you have any right to upload derivates yourself. Better only upload patches.

I can easily see your valid point really. I would never link full on downloads to this ofc.Patches seem very much a better choice imo. Afterall, WAD's may still be considered as ROMS, and also the Internet Channel at one point did have a price on the Wii Shop Channel, and later was made free.

The other reason really that I've understood why most sites just don't load is the fact they use the secure https:// authentication, and instead of the non-secure http:// one used on very old sites. Still, some sites do for some reason work, like Pastebin, which is odly enough an https:// one, so my theory may or may not be correct.

I wish GitHub still supported hosting html sites on an http:// without this authentication part really, so that I could easily prove this theory, but they made a mandatory change iirc a few years ago, and it's currently impossible really nowadays to find a good free html hosting site that would do this.

 

[Disorarara]

Weak for it's time year 1999 laptop doesn't count?
Well, it was kinda usable a year ago for basic browsing while having Win XP loaded (opposed to a gaming console running one single application at a time). And this was a standard desktop browser, not an optimized one for low spec devices asking for the mobile version and blocking (third party at least) scripts.

But probably nobody is going to put 100s or even 1000s of work hours into a piece of software with zero practical value.

You won't get anything fancy like YouBloatTube to work on weak devices (which lack h.264 hardware decoding anyway), but generally browsing is possible. Another device should protect the "vintage" hardware from getting overwhelmed with garbage: For example Pi Hole (DNS blocking).

Trying to make old devices things they were never intended to is a nice thing as such without any factual benefit (look at impressive 64KB demos for old home computers).

Using a raspberry pi as a headless chromium instance for clients connecting to browservice is definitely the best way to go, and I think the Wii would benefit greatly from a native homebrew client specifically designed to connect to such a device. That way you could have a modern browsing experience on TV without much loss.

 

[KleinesSinchen]

The other reason really that I've understood why most sites just don't load is the fact they use the secure https:// authentication, and instead of the non-secure http:// one used on very old sites. Still, some sites do for some reason work, like Pastebin, which is odly enough an https:// one, so my theory may or may not be correct.

My guess would be missing and outdated root certificates. Most importantly Let's Encrypt. Since the browsers on Nintendo consoles don’t allow us to “accept the risk and continue” on unknown certificates many sites get blocked now for security reasons.
Yeah. Security. On this outdated browser.

Spoiler: Semi off-topic, different example for similar failure

I’ve lately encountered similar problems on much newer hardware (2017)+software (May 2019):

Android 7.0 and older don’t have Let’s Encrypt in trusted CAs and that breaks tons of sites and apps relying on online services using Let’s Encrypt. Compatibility/cross-signing expires and some apps started to show unhelpful “No Internet” messages instead of a proper CA-related error.
On Android users may not manually trust certificates either: user CAs are ignored in apps by default. Well. Being an educated adult of mature judgment as well as understanding and accepting a risk isn’t a thing nowadays.

Spoiler: Screenshots, Phone software, CA problem

Phone is Huawei Y7 (2017) TRT-LX1. Let's Encrypt is missing in System, added to User storage (has no effect)

Solutions?

• App developers must find a workaround or provide own CA storage like Firefox (many devs will more likely push an update with the app manifest demanding Android 7.1 or 8.0 as minimal version)
• Just root your old Android devices and make them trust defined user CAs → That repaired the broken apps for me.

Spoiler: Screenshot, CA problem solved

Magisk Module forcing above users CAs into System storage as well.

Back to Wii: Maybe the CA storage of Opera can be manually updated. That would be an important step for the browser to even try loading sites. In addition to CAs, the Wii (browser) might, and probably does, suffer from old TLS <v1.2 only. Hard to implement. I vaguely remember homebrew devs had to deal with it on 3DS for getting downloads from GitHub working again when old versions were removed server side.

 

[LNLenost]

Dude... this seems great! Nice job!

 

[GamerGatorDoesTech]

Should this ever end up working, I'm going to be one of the first to try it! I'm with you every step of the way. I just don't know how I can help.

 

[JuanMena]

Crazy thing to say I really haven't seen ANYONE have interest in truely modifying the Internet Channel WAD for Homebrew, but I'm here to show progress on a little test I've simply done to make a useful mod for this channel.

To start off, the project I'll call it, is Internet Channel Deluxe (still a work in progress name)

The idea behind it is to somewhat overhaul both the look and function of the channel, maybe to make it a little more useful. Now, obviously, this could only be patched if you install the WAD itself, however I've decided to try my best to study how it really works, and work on making a custom Internet Channel WAD.

The point of this, really in my opinion would be a novelty of a mod. Unsure if you'd say if it were cheating to add more code or images to the files, however, I want to try to make something that would be more of just a proof of concept that it would be possible to do something like this.

The Internet Channel's code (based off of my understanding) is from HTML, JavaScript, and CSS coding, which is also what most of the Wii itself runs on (especially HTML for the Wii Menus)

One of my theories is trying to think of a workaround that could load files directly from the link into the search bar. I don't know if this is possible, but if I could load custom HTML files that aren't apart of the original mapping, I could figure out a way to run an ACE like script (if possible) or even make a custom button that would just be a quick way to say if I wanted to run a Wiimmfi loader (I would put this on homepage, even though yes you can literally put this on Favorites)

Knowing that this channel would stay on the Nand, I do want to make this as optimized as I can, and even if I can also rewrite some of the Internet Channel code to make it more simplified. That's honestly the main issue I see here with this, as the Nand space is crucial really if you're using this on the Home Menu on a real Wii.

Overall a fun project that may be useless in the end, but I think the novelty behind it could have use, as the features I would like to add could be beneficial.

As a start, I've went ahead and replaced simple images in the background and such, but also wrote custom CSS code to fix a few oddities on how the text is viewed on if I were to use a different background.

Feel free to share your thoughts on this project. Again, I know there may be no point of it really, but I would personally love to know if this would be of interest.

I remember using the Internet Channel to make my homework at highschool as I didn't had a computer then. Yeah, used a USB keyboard for navigation.
Truly a great experience, even managed to load p0rn sites... just on weekends.

Anyway, I think it's a great project. But I have some concerns.
Old browsers have a lot of security problems, on top of not being able to load HTML5 or whatever it's the standard nowadays. So I guess those two problems (security and compatibility) might be present at some point. What kind of security problems might a Wii have for using an old browser?
Even then, what version of Opera is going to work for "modern browsing" in a 20 year old console?
Would it be possible to utilize a modified version of Opera Mini to work with the Wii? If I'm not mistaken, Mini is more lightweight than standard Opera browser.
Currently the oldest Opera I can run in an Android 10 smartphone is 17.X. and even that has troubles loading Google and Google Images. Opera 16.X and below works with old Android 5 devices but it won't be a nice experience, it's slow and sluggish. I'm guessing a Wii never reached Opera 10.X, so... it's going to be very interesting to see what kind of internet experience a Wii can provide nowadays. Also... DOWNLOAD WII ROMS STRAIGHT TO NAND! CAN'T WAIT TO ILLEGALLY DOWNLOAD SMASH BROS BRAWL FOR FREE STRAIGHT TO MY WII.

Post automatically merged: May 11, 2024

To start off, the project I'll call it, is Internet Channel Deluxe (still a work in progress name)

Call it Wiinternet Reduxe (Re for Rebirth and duxe for Deluxe)

 

[a_username_that_is_cool]

I remember using the Internet Channel to make my homework at highschool as I didn't had a computer then. Yeah, used a USB keyboard for navigation.
Truly a great experience, even managed to load p0rn sites... just on weekends.

Anyway, I think it's a great project. But I have some concerns.
Old browsers have a lot of security problems, on top of not being able to load HTML5 or whatever it's the standard nowadays. So I guess those two problems (security and compatibility) might be present at some point. What kind of security problems might a Wii have for using an old browser?
Even then, what version of Opera is going to work for "modern browsing" in a 20 year old console?
Would it be possible to utilize a modified version of Opera Mini to work with the Wii? If I'm not mistaken, Mini is more lightweight than standard Opera browser.
Currently the oldest Opera I can run in an Android 10 smartphone is 17.X. and even that has troubles loading Google and Google Images. Opera 16.X and below works with old Android 5 devices but it won't be a nice experience, it's slow and sluggish. I'm guessing a Wii never reached Opera 10.X, so... it's going to be very interesting to see what kind of internet experience a Wii can provide nowadays. Also... DOWNLOAD WII ROMS STRAIGHT TO NAND! CAN'T WAIT TO ILLEGALLY DOWNLOAD SMASH BROS BRAWL FOR FREE STRAIGHT TO MY WII.

Post automatically merged: May 11, 2024

Call it Wiinternet Reduxe (Re for Rebirth and duxe for Deluxe)

Reduxe is a cool name, but Wiinternet (wii internet) is very close to Winternet (winter internet), so even if Winternet doesnt actually exist I'd just stick with Internet Channel

 

[Mondooooo]

This must be a great idea!

 

[GamerGatorDoesTech]

DOWNLOAD WII ROMS STRAIGHT TO NAND! CAN'T WAIT TO ILLEGALLY DOWNLOAD SMASH BROS BRAWL FOR FREE STRAIGHT TO MY WII.

Don't forget not to do this kids!

 

[GameGenieLabs]

My guess would be missing and outdated root certificates. Most importantly Let's Encrypt. Since the browsers on Nintendo consoles don’t allow us to “accept the risk and continue” on unknown certificates many sites get blocked now for security reasons.
Yeah. Security. On this outdated browser.

Spoiler: Semi off-topic, different example for similar failure

I’ve lately encountered similar problems on much newer hardware (2017)+software (May 2019):

Android 7.0 and older don’t have Let’s Encrypt in trusted CAs and that breaks tons of sites and apps relying on online services using Let’s Encrypt. Compatibility/cross-signing expires and some apps started to show unhelpful “No Internet” messages instead of a proper CA-related error.
On Android users may not manually trust certificates either: user CAs are ignored in apps by default. Well. Being an educated adult of mature judgment as well as understanding and accepting a risk isn’t a thing nowadays.

Spoiler: Screenshots, Phone software, CA problem

Phone is Huawei Y7 (2017) TRT-LX1. Let's Encrypt is missing in System, added to User storage (has no effect)
View attachment 432860 View attachment 432862 View attachment 432863

Solutions?

• App developers must find a workaround or provide own CA storage like Firefox (many devs will more likely push an update with the app manifest demanding Android 7.1 or 8.0 as minimal version)
• Just root your old Android devices and make them trust defined user CAs → That repaired the broken apps for me.

Spoiler: Screenshot, CA problem solved

Magisk Module forcing above users CAs into System storage as well.
View attachment 432861

Back to Wii: Maybe the CA storage of Opera can be manually updated. That would be an important step for the browser to even try loading sites. In addition to CAs, the Wii (browser) might, and probably does, suffer from old TLS <v1.2 only. Hard to implement. I vaguely remember homebrew devs had to deal with it on 3DS for getting downloads from GitHub working again when old versions were removed server side.

Sorry for late reply.

Yep, has stuff to do with SSL/TLS Certificates. Looking into the code, I'm noting that the Internet Channel is mostly made up of HTML files. They're just uniquely formatted and such, which I'm trying to figure out.

I didn't mention this, but the other plans is to really optimize the Internet Channel WAD/main file. There's a bunch of things that can be rewritten, and honestly needing cleanup. Like the bug where it seems to lag the majority of the time on the main menu page.

HTML, JavaScript, and CSS is really mostly what the code is made of. Not necessarily impossible to mod, but if this is going to be a thing that stays on the NAND, lot's of space has to be made up for really, since the Wii only has very little space.

Post automatically merged: May 22, 2024

I remember using the Internet Channel to make my homework at highschool as I didn't had a computer then. Yeah, used a USB keyboard for navigation.
Truly a great experience, even managed to load p0rn sites... just on weekends.

Anyway, I think it's a great project. But I have some concerns.
Old browsers have a lot of security problems, on top of not being able to load HTML5 or whatever it's the standard nowadays. So I guess those two problems (security and compatibility) might be present at some point. What kind of security problems might a Wii have for using an old browser?
Even then, what version of Opera is going to work for "modern browsing" in a 20 year old console?
Would it be possible to utilize a modified version of Opera Mini to work with the Wii? If I'm not mistaken, Mini is more lightweight than standard Opera browser.
Currently the oldest Opera I can run in an Android 10 smartphone is 17.X. and even that has troubles loading Google and Google Images. Opera 16.X and below works with old Android 5 devices but it won't be a nice experience, it's slow and sluggish. I'm guessing a Wii never reached Opera 10.X, so... it's going to be very interesting to see what kind of internet experience a Wii can provide nowadays. Also... DOWNLOAD WII ROMS STRAIGHT TO NAND! CAN'T WAIT TO ILLEGALLY DOWNLOAD SMASH BROS BRAWL FOR FREE STRAIGHT TO MY WII.

Post automatically merged: May 11, 2024

Call it Wiinternet Reduxe (Re for Rebirth and duxe for Deluxe)

Wiinternet Reduxe actually sounds like a good name lol. Really, I haven't been thinking of much to come up with it yet.

As for Downloading things to the Wii itself I'm sure that it may or may not be impossible. I do know that if it were to install it to the Wii, I would have to be really careful not to overflow the NAND. and such, although it would be cool though.

The secondary idea of putting a Wiimmfi patcher built in as an easy shortcut, may also be something I could get ACE to run.

The Opera version itself is really the main issue really. I've had ideas of making a site that basically extracts every file from a webpage, and rehosts it without SSL/TLS Auths. And yes this is a bit too complex, but the file is hosted temporarily then deleted.

Really the beauty of the Internet Channel is working around the limitations and actually getting something to work. The main app itself does have some flaws, but this project is also a code cleanup and making it a more useable app.

 

[TheOutGuy_2012]

Sorry for late reply.

Yep, has stuff to do with SSL/TLS Certificates. Looking into the code, I'm noting that the Internet Channel is mostly made up of HTML files. They're just uniquely formatted and such, which I'm trying to figure out.

I didn't mention this, but the other plans is to really optimize the Internet Channel WAD/main file. There's a bunch of things that can be rewritten, and honestly needing cleanup. Like the bug where it seems to lag the majority of the time on the main menu page.

HTML, JavaScript, and CSS is really mostly what the code is made of. Not necessarily impossible to mod, but if this is going to be a thing that stays on the NAND, lot's of space has to be made up for really, since the Wii only has very little space.

Post automatically merged: May 22, 2024

Wiinternet Reduxe actually sounds like a good name lol. Really, I haven't been thinking of much to come up with it yet.

As for Downloading things to the Wii itself I'm sure that it may or may not be impossible. I do know that if it were to install it to the Wii, I would have to be really careful not to overflow the NAND. and such, although it would be cool though.

The secondary idea of putting a Wiimmfi patcher built in as an easy shortcut, may also be something I could get ACE to run.

The Opera version itself is really the main issue really. I've had ideas of making a site that basically extracts every file from a webpage, and rehosts it without SSL/TLS Auths. And yes this is a bit too complex, but the file is hosted temporarily then deleted.

Really the beauty of the Internet Channel is working around the limitations and actually getting something to work. The main app itself does have some flaws, but this project is also a code cleanup and making it a more useable app.

I read it as weener-net Reduxe.