Hacking How copy protection works!?

CockroachMan

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I was wondering how consoles handle copy protection? How can they distinguish a backup from a original disc?

I know it sounds dumb.. but it's just a thought.. Why people mod the console instead of patching the ISO so it looks like the original game? Would it be possible?
unsure.gif
 

mr deez

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The part of the DVD which the wii looks at to check authenticity cannot be written to, therefore a burnt game can never fully replicate an original disc.
 

test84

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in addition to that addition, they are pressed, they are (talking simply) a piece of plastic that something is pressed upon them so it represents DVD's burnt points.
 

InfernoZeus

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Actually, thats not 100% true. When we burn it, it's trying to make the dvd look as close as possible to a pressed disc. So the pressed disc is the best for the laser, whereas a burnt disc reduces the life of a laser.
 

paul1991

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The wii has no copy protection per se. Its all in structure. The wii discs go (just an example, ill look up the real structure later) data, empty space, data, data, space. Dvds go data, data, data, space. The wii merely checks the data structure of the disc. If it does not match, it does not boot. There is no security ring, as people assume.
 

CockroachMan

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The wii has no copy protection per se. Its all in structure. The wii discs go (just an example, ill look up the real structure later) data, empty space, data, data, space. Dvds go data, data, data, space. The wii merely checks the data structure of the disc. If it does not match, it does not boot. There is no security ring, as people assume.

Well.. if that is true.. then it wouldn't be too hard to burn a "original" game.. once you find out the pattern..
 

TrolleyDave

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The wii has no copy protection per se. Its all in structure. The wii discs go (just an example, ill look up the real structure later) data, empty space, data, data, space. Dvds go data, data, data, space. The wii merely checks the data structure of the disc. If it does not match, it does not boot. There is no security ring, as people assume.

That's not strictly true. It doesn't have a security ring like the Sega Saturn has, but it does contain a different bookmark structure (or whatever they're called) to a normal factory made pressed disc. Otherwise standard HK silvers would play without a problem and there'd be no mod-chips as the far eastern pirates would be able to make more off of you being forced to by HK silvers. Also DVD-/+R's (as well as CDR's) have a bit set in them that says that it's a DVD-/+R rather than an original DVD and as far as I know there's no home burners that allow you to set that bit.

A mod chips basic function is to intercept the interrupt that tells the console whether a disc is an original or not and returns a true value 100% of the time. Modern mod-chips have more features but when it boils down to it that's all it really does. I know the original PS1 modchips were complete BIOS replacements, but modchips were new then and the originals were basically just pirated BIOS's from development machines (if I remember right, it's going back a long time) and wiring it in bypassed the original protected BIOS and basically turned it into a development machine.
 

arctic_flame

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I was wondering how consoles handle copy protection? How can they distinguish a backup from a original disc?

I know it sounds dumb.. but it's just a thought.. Why people mod the console instead of patching the ISO so it looks like the original game? Would it be possible?
unsure.gif



The SMG protection?

Firstly, The Wii checked right at the end of the disc. Recordable DVDs have a few more sectors than pressed ones.
Secondly, the Wii passed some random drive command (A4?) to the drive. IIRC, this returns the media tyoe of the disc, and wasn't patched by original modchips.

Actually, thats not 100% true. When we burn it, it's trying to make the dvd look as close as possible to a pressed disc. So the pressed disc is the best for the laser, whereas a burnt disc reduces the life of a laser.


As long as you don't change the POT of the laser, burnt discs have no affect on the life of the laser.

The wii has no copy protection per se. Its all in structure. The wii discs go (just an example, ill look up the real structure later) data, empty space, data, data, space. Dvds go data, data, data, space. The wii merely checks the data structure of the disc. If it does not match, it does not boot. There is no security ring, as people assume.

Well.. if that is true.. then it wouldn't be too hard to burn a "original" game.. once you find out the pattern..

That's incorrect. Firstly, Wii discs aren't like that, and secondly, burners can't reproduce patterns accurately. Look up Starforce.
 

paul1991

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DVD-ROM:

4bytes 2bytes 6bytes 2048bytes 4bytes
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
| ID | IED | CPR_MAI | User Data Frame | EDC |
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
^ | 2048bytes cipher stream |
^ - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
scrambling
seed index

Gamecube/WII Optical Disc:

4bytes 2bytes 2048bytes 6bytes 4bytes
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
| ID | IED | User Data Frame | unknown | EDC |
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
| 2048bytes cipher stream |


Found it:
http://www.ingenieria-inversa.cl/?p=9
 

paul1991

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Yes it does.
Your dvd writer writes data in the 1st pattern. Wii games read disc in the second pattern. If you writer could write in the 2nd pattern, you would not need a modchip. You would need special DVDs with a modified file system, though as blank dvds have the 1st file structure.

Why dont you think it matters?

whats afaik?
 

CockroachMan

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Yes it does.
Your dvd writer writes data in the 1st pattern. Wii games read disc in the second pattern. If you writer could write in the 2nd pattern, you would not need a modchip. You would need special DVDs with a modified file system, though as blank dvds have the 1st file structure.

Why dont you think it matters?

whats afaik?

AFAIK = "as far as I know"

and.. AFAIK.. the file system is defined when you burn the dvd.. I can't see why a dvd burner can't burn a disc with this pattern.. you just need a special burning software that does this.. seems too easy to be true
unsure.gif
 

paul1991

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NO! The blank dvds have writeable sectors. They are in the pattern of the first. It has DVDFS. CDs have CDFS. File systems are patterns of storage. There is a DVD FilenSystem and a wii FS. DVD FS cannot be changed. IF you were to make special discs with WiiFS and modify a writer to bwrite in the special FS, you could copy games without a modchip.

Am i being clear?
 

arctic_flame

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NO! The blank dvds have writeable sectors. They are in the pattern of the first. It has DVDFS. CDs have CDFS. File systems are patterns of storage. There is a DVD FilenSystem and a wii FS. DVD FS cannot be changed. IF you were to make special discs with WiiFS and modify a writer to bwrite in the special FS, you could copy games without a modchip.

Am i being clear?

No, because DVD burners can and are modified to write in area's they shouldn't. That's how bitsetting works.
 

paul1991

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Can you explain bit setting? I ve heard of it, but I dont know what it is.

The dvds cant be modified though. That is still a valid point.
 

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