Hacking Gateway Brick Poll

[Celice]

I feel that Gateway had the right mindset and intention, but they would have a hard time figuring out responsibility for user's who were not necessarily manufacturing clone cards but who were still modifying the launcher, or whatever it is that is causing bricks.

Legitimate customers ought not be punished. Gateway simply did not approach the situation in as clean and efficient a way possible, and instead looks to have accepted casualties in customer systems in order to attempt and stop clones from profiting off their card.

 

[gamesquest1]

Yeah I was thinking it would of been better to detect the actual card being used rather than just any mod to the launcher itself

 

[osirisjem]

I think for all intents and purposes it should just mean anything just below an unrecoverable brick

It's a good idea, but I don't think there is such a thing.

50% of people are still picking an option that isn't possible.

 

[inuyasha555]

It's a good idea, but I don't think there is such a thing.

50% of people are still picking an option that isn't possible.

Who said that? I haven't seen anyone saying that.

 

[escherbach]

No, that's not entirely true. The 3DS has a ARM9 used as security core in 3DS mode and for the DS mode sandbox in DS mode.

Thanks I didn't know that - but even so the Gateway firmware code which does the checksum test would excute on the dual core ARM11 cpu - so your pseudo code is still a bit iffy.

 

[osirisjem]

Who said that? I haven't seen anyone saying that.

A few people have said that Gateway could not have bricked the clone cards because they aren't writeable when loading.
Can anyone verify ?

 

[juins]

i picked 4 but in actually its 3 and 4 because i own both.

Situation aside, in the long run, it sucks that all those 3ds got bricked, but on the other hand, its good for the 3ds scene, because ppl look into the 3ds to find problem/discover new things.

 

[gamesquest1]

That's what I have read too, I just voted 2 to show that if the unrecoverable aspect is true...I don't support that...it's just too much, a normal brick I could accept,as long as the user followed all the guides they would have a nand dump and could restore...I summed this up after voting though

 

[Wisenheimer]

Gateway's actions, if true, are not going, "a little too far". They represent malicious code designed to vandalize consumers' property. In the United States, they could be held civilly liable in a court of law for the damages and possibly could also face criminal charges for their "booby trap".

Since there is no option for, If true, Gateway's actions were illegal and possibly criminal, I am going to refrain from voting. Given that they are a company that has made every attempted to remain anonymous and operate out of a third world environment where consumers holding them legally responsible for their actions is difficult, and given that they make their money primarily from promoting piracy, not homebrew, I cannot say that I am surprised if this accusation is confirmed.

 

[osirisjem]

This Poll is too biased.
What responsibility does r4i (the clone card manufactures) have in this ?
Shouldn't they know about their own products ?


Does McDonald's make sure Burger King customers are happy ? No.

I say good for Gateway and shame on r4i for being so incompetent.

It's a total joke r4i says they were "testing" things. They tested nothing. Just a bunch of lies.

People shouldn't buy products from people who know NOTHING about what they are selling.

r4i willingly distributed the bad firmware to their own customers. Gateway didn't give anything to any r4i customers.

 

[profi200]

@escherbach:
No, the checks are on ARM9, or better to say the check + brick code which was found.

 

[Xzi]

I voted the second option, although I doubt it's possible to brick carts like that. I simply intend to show that I think any alternative probably would have been preferable to actually bricking peoples' consoles, even if they are ripping off your code with their rip-off devices.

Assuming 2.0 is released in a timely manner and works just fine on a Gateway cart, I will still be using their hardware/firmware, however. Not going to throw it away as a symbolic gesture just because somebody else has a bricked console, sorry.

 

[escherbach]

@escherbach:
No, the checks are on ARM9, or better to say the check + brick code which was found.

I can't confirm this myself as it seems hard to find reliable/official info on what the 2 VFP co-processors on the 3DS are for ( http://3dbrew.org/wiki/Hardware https://sites.google.com/site/t3gameszero/downloads/tech-info http://gbatemp.net/threads/3ds-proper-hardware-specs.335160/ )

Maybe you have a better link?

In any case, if you guys have really discovered the malicious code you need to be more clear about exactly how it works - is the random number generator seeded by launcher.dat modification date or the 3DS system date? - how come the brick() routine is not called on genuine gateway firmware if you modify random bytes in the file (confirmed by at least two posters here - so the checksum test would fail)? etc

 

[escherbach]

@profi200

ok, I found this link about the VFP co-processors http://www.gonintendo.com/boards/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=75951#p554939

so no arm9 chip - so you are appearing not very credible my friend

 

[diffikolt]

For the record, here is where I personally stand.

If you purchased a clone card with the knowledge that the code being used was Gateways code, I don't feel sorry for you. In fact, I am laughing at you, hard.

If you used the region free mod knowing it was untested and unapproved, I feel SLIGHTLY sorry for you. There's a smirk on my face, but I'll try to hide it.

If you purchased a clone card without the knowledge that they were using stolen code, I feel very sorry for you. I'm crying. Seriously.

If you do not believe Gateway did this on purpose, you are wrong. This wasn't some accident--take it from me, this was very intentional on Gateways part. They posted numerous warnings, and although the region free mod was an unintentional side effect, that doesn't change the fact that this was intentional. Anybody who understands ANYTHING about coding at all can and will tell you that. You don't write an eMMC to 0 accidentally.

There are lessons to be learned here:

1. Cheaper isn't always better. Especially if you're PIRATING something. (If your excuse is $80 is too much for a flash card, you are a moron--that's the cost of two games.)

2. Bitching about your bricked console doesn't fix anything. (zomg i am so mad!!!!!!!111111 u gateway fanbois r gay!!!!)

3. Bitching about something you have no stake in is pointless. (i don't have flash card and never will but gateway u r assholes fuck u!)

You have a choice of what to purchase in the future--if you buy Gateway, you're probably safe. If you buy a clone, you probably are now too because commenting out or removing the brick code is relatively easy once you know it's there, but I wouldn't trust it just in case they really are as incompetent as they seem.

In closing, there is a relatively simple way to fix your bricked console problem--it's completely unethical, but you're already pirates and I'll let you figure it out.

 

[escherbach]

For the record, here is where I personally stand.


If you do not believe Gateway did this on purpose, you are wrong. This wasn't some accident--take it from me, this was very intentional on Gateways part. They posted numerous warnings, and although the region free mod was an unintentional side effect, that doesn't change the fact that this was intentional. Anybody who understands ANYTHING about coding at all can and will tell you that. You don't write an eMMC to 0 accidentally by accident.

They might do it on purpose to temporarily prevent an accidental update of the real system nand when running updates in emunand - and then reset it back to its proper value after the emunand update.

How do you know the Gateway guys created the routine solely to destroy 4.x firmware consoles around the world?

 

[profi200]

@escherbach:
There is in fact a ARM9 core inside the SoC. That the core is not listed on 3dbrew or in docs, doesn't mean it is not there. It is hidden for a reason and the reason is, because it is the security core. If you don't believe, look in the python tools for 3DS thread. They thought they run their code on ARM11 too, but then they found out, that's not the case.

And btw i don't know, what you want to proof with just coprocessors.

 

[Zaide]

You want to blame someone, blame the people that stole Gateway's code. It's only non-Gateway devices running Gateway code that are causing bricks. The only ones at fault are the ones that made Gateway clones, and they won't be selling any more of those clone cards now anyway.

I agree that it sucks for the people who got bricked, but you should be bitching at the people who made your card, not the ones they stole the code from. If you had been using a card that the code was actually designed to run with then you wouldn't have this problem.

 

[osirisjem]

For the record, here is where I personally stand.

If you purchased a clone card with the knowledge that the code being used was Gateways code, I don't feel sorry for you. In fact, I am laughing at you, hard.

If you used the region free mod knowing it was untested and unapproved, I feel SLIGHTLY sorry for you. There's a smirk on my face, but I'll try to hide it.

If you purchased a clone card without the knowledge that they were using stolen code, I feel very sorry for you. I'm crying. Seriously.

Well said.

 

[osirisjem]

You want to blame someone

People who downloaded bad firmware should blame the place where they downloaded the firmware from.

The people with bricked consoles downloaded the firmware from r4i's site.

That's where people should voice their complaints.