Aphantasia

[Veho]

Aphantasia!
tl;dr it's when you can't "see" a vivid image of an object, person or scene you are thinking of. Since like most other brain-related things it's a spectrum, there are levels to which people can visualize stuff, ranging from completely clear, vivid images full of detail, over general sketches of said stuff, to absolutely nothing.

​

People with such complete aphantasia know what a thing looks like, are perfectly capable of describing or drawing the thing in minute detail, are perfectly capable of imagining the existence of "thing", but they just don't "see" it. There are aphantasic painters, and fiction writers. Being able or unable to "see" images in your brainmeats is not a function of imagination, or creativity.

And as with most of these innate things, most people don't even realize others can or can't do them and the realization takes some time to digest.
Since nobody goes around telling people this stuff, everyone just assumes everyone else works the same way, most people find it really really weird that it doesn't work the same for everyone.

And while "relatable" memes are somewhat overplayed, they do call attention to stuff like this.

​

And some people are like "ha ha ha, cow go brrrrr" while the others are like "what? no you can't, what's this guy talking about?"

Can you rotate a cow in your mind?

 

[Psionic Roshambo]

At times if I allow it.... My mind will flood with the image and every movie song or paper I read about it, related subjects and it can become hmmm trying to describe it. Like being in a massive junkyard looking for the piece of something I actually need.

 

[JuanMena]

Can you rotate a cow in your mind?

Otherwise I wouldn't have learned how to draw.
"Thinking in 3D" is vital for drawing.

But yeah, I learned about Aphantasia some years ago and I can't comprehend how's like to not see anything in your head.

 

[fvig2001]

I can like visualize but I can't control it well. Like if I try rotating the cow, it will just go spinning randomly fast and the camera zooms all over the place.

 

[Veho]

Otherwise I wouldn't have learned how to draw.
"Thinking in 3D" is vital for drawing.

Explain this guy then:

https://theconversation.com/the-art...create-without-being-able-to-visualise-162566

 

[JuanMena]

Explain this guy then:

https://theconversation.com/the-art...create-without-being-able-to-visualise-162566

Really?

The first point to consider is that there is a difference between knowing or remembering what something looks like and generating a mental image of that thing. To draw it, you only need to know how it looks, or would look.

Not necessarily. It involves different practices. "only know how it looks" does not equal "how would look". For instance, everyone can draw an eye. But not everybody knows that an eye has a concave shape, and that light scatters thanks to the concave shape that affects light refraction and thus, affects the overall color of the iris. So, with that in mind, knowing how it looks, one should render color and light/shadow based in shape. Not by just doing

Aphantasia prevents the generation of mental images based on knowledge of what things look like, but it does not prevent that knowledge serving as the basis for an image made with pencil and paper.

Basically scribbles... like the picture above.

Keane can draw a picture of Ariel because he knows what humans (and fish) look like, and that information – plus the skills acquired through study and practice – steers his hand accordingly.

Can everybody draw a triangle?

Another seemingly obvious but important point is that whereas mental visualisation takes place entirely within the brain, drawing is a partly external act, taking place in front of the artist’s eyes. When you draw, you perceive the marks you make. Each change, perceived, suggests the next, in a feedback loop. You don’t have to imagine.

Yes, draw something ebough times and you'll develop muscle memory. Many people has seen the "this artists makes a landscape in 30 seconds" or "this artist makes a portrait upside-down". Literally it's muscle memory, which diminishes actual knowledge and real practice.

Many of the aphantasic artists we spoke to emphasised this aspect of their creative process: they would need to “get something down” on the paper or canvas, or even start with a pre-existing image, which they can then alter, erase or add to. When Keane draws Ariel, he begins with what he calls an “explosion of scribbles”, then highlights and subtracts lines until he finds the form that he wants.

Basically what I just said before. The guy makes a bunch of scribbles and then adds or deletes strokes baded on how he thinks things should look, not based in how they look (involves shape, perspective, proportions, gesture, possible anatomy and complex light shadow placement and color theory among other things color related)

Designing the Beast was a similar process of trial and error. Keane started by copying the buffalo’s head that hung in his studio, then tried out features from various other animals – a gorilla’s brow, a lion’s main.

Nothing special, it's basically the lazy way to draw/design. But it's romanticized because "Aphantasia".

The way that aphantasics like Keane work challenges the stereotype of the creative artist that has held sway over Western culture for centuries, at least since the Renaissance biographer Giorgio Vasari declared that “the greatest geniuses…are searching for inventions in their minds, forming those perfect ideas which their hands then express”.

Vasari was referring to Leonardo da Vinci and his comments show how we have come to think of artistic creativity as being an internal capacity, the fruits of which are simply reproduced in the outside world. The artist of genius is distinguished by the richness of their mental conceptions as much as their artworks.

But there are historical reasons for the stereotype: career-minded Renaissance artists wanting to define themselves against the craftsman and his rule-following, manual labour, for one.

And while there are individuals who, experiencing vivid imagery, do mentally preconceive their artworks, Keane and his fellow aphantasics show that the creative process can just as easily begin with, and depend on, the material world around them.

Blah blah blah, and I have a 7 inch dick, so what?

Did y'all know Disney movies are literally rotoscoping "animation"?

 

[Tom Bombadildo]

I am one of the estimated 2-4% that cannot see or make cow go brrrrrr at all. AMA

I never really knew how rare it was until a few years ago when asked, I just assumed that's how everyone's mind worked Quite fascinating to know there are people out there who's brain just "knows" how things should look without a person having consciously visualizing it.

 

[Veho]

*cope*

Yes yes yes, the golden age of Disney animation is "scribbles" and "tracing", sure. Whatever makes you feel better.
But you still don't have to have absolute visualization to learn how to draw, it simply isn't required.

 

[JuanMena]

Yes yes yes, the golden age of Disney animation is "scribbles" and "tracing", sure. Whatever makes you feel better.
But you still don't have to have absolute visualization to learn how to draw, it simply isn't required.

Do it then.

 

[Veho]

Do it then.

Do what? Aquire aphantasia somehow and then learn how to draw? Sure, lemme get right on that.

 

[JuanMena]

Do what?

deez!

 

[Maximumbeans]

I'm probably about a 2-3 on the scale. It's really hard for me to imagine certain things and the worst one is landscapes. I can't visualise a geographical place to save my life.

 

[Robert Newbie]

I'm probably about a 2-3 on the scale. It's really hard for me to imagine certain things and the worst one is landscapes. I can't visualise a geographical place to save my life.

Same. I've caught myself too many times thinking, "is that all the detail I can remember?" It's probably why I was never a good artist.

Shoutouts to @SylverReZ for posting this image in the funny pictures thread:

I can relate to this.

 

[Maximumbeans]

Same. I've caught myself too many times thinking, "is that all the detail I can remember?" It's probably why I was never a good artist.

Shoutouts to @SylverReZ for posting this image in the funny pictures thread:
[image]
I can relate to this.

That picture is fantastic never seen it before!
Yeah the imagination thing really doesn't work in my favour as a wannabe author...nor as a reader actually

 

[hippy dave]

Programmer art best art. Always.

I'm probably around a 3. Rotating a cow makes me think of the drivable cow from the Super Skidmarks game on the Amiga, classic.

Aphantasia is the inability to see that one Disney movie where the mouse is dressed as a wizard.

 

[Robert Newbie]

Programmer art best art. Always.

I'm probably around a 3. Rotating a cow makes me think of the drivable cow from the Super Skidmarks game on the Amiga, classic.

Aphantasia is the inability to see that one Disney movie where the mouse is dressed as a wizard.

I'm sorry for derailing, but Super Skidmarks is one of my favorite "from a more innocent time" type of game titles. What a treat to be 13 years old and come across this gem.

 

[x65943]

Best way I can describe my imagination is like wire frame

I can visualize wire frame and like a hint of an image well - but nothing beyond that

Basically like this (especially around 1:23)