Used Games Sales and the Future: Still Needed?

[Kirito-kun]

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Everyone seems to be arguing the same things so I'll explain my post to everyone at once.

What happens when you loose or can't find your disc?

You can't really argue against this one. People do loose games, and with digital distribution, this never happens. Even if it gets delisted, if you have the game already downloaded, you can still play it.

What happens when you scratch your disc?

Which is easier? Resurfacing the disk or... um... not having it happen at all?

What happens when a natural or artificial event destroys your disc?

What's better? Insurance claims or... um... not having it happen at all?

What happens when you're travelling?

It's easier to not have to bring physical disks in addition to your game system.

What happens when you want to dispose of old games or broken games?

What's better? Recycling or no waste at all.

What happens when you want to quickly find a game from your large collection?

It's still easier to just type the name of the game into the search bar.

 

[trumpet-205]

tl

* What if your hard drive crashed, you have no backup and games ended up delisted? Even if it is not delisted you'll be spending hours perhaps even days on downloading all those digital games (assuming your ISP does not impose bandwidth limit).
* Data are stored on the top layer, not the bottom layer where it is prone to scratching. Most of the time scratch is not deep enough to damage the data layer.
* Again take better care of your collection and stop blaming others because your inability to do so.
* It is easier to bring nothing with me while I travel, your point?
* Like I said, for a PC gaming fan (especially you), what are you going to do? Electronics, like GPU, are pretty harmful for the environment.
* No it is not easier to type in search bar, it is only easier if you want to be a potato coach.

 

[codezer0]

Everyone seems to be arguing the same things so I'll explain my post to everyone at once.

What happens when you loose or can't find your disc?

You can't really argue against this one. People do loose[sic] games, and with digital distribution, this never happens. Even if it gets delisted, if you have the game already downloaded, you can still play it.

you also apparently lose at grammar.

You can lose a digital game, too. Just ask anyone that's tried getting or keeping a vulnerable version of a game for use on the Vita, for instance. And in the case of the PS3 and Vita, if your game gets delisted, chances are you also lost the stored login credentials needed to play it, too. Unless you could use something like ReActPSN, you're boned there, too.

What happens when you scratch your disc?

Which is easier? Resurfacing the disk or... um... not having it happen at all?

Short of defective optical drives (which I personally ran into far more often with Sony than any other console maker), it usually takes abusing your games to cause a scratch on the discs to begin with.

What happens when a natural or artificial event destroys your disc?

What's better? Insurance claims or... um... not having it happen at all?

How about actually having the disc to keep playing, vs. some executive arbitrarily deciding to shut down your access to approve your ability to play the game?

Unlike digital, physical can actually continue to operate even when your internet is out. That's more than I can say for nearly every other kind of digital medium.

What happens when you're travelling?

It's easier to not have to bring physical disks in addition to your game system.

Thank you for completely ignoring my point. A Modded console with external storage is just as sturdy.

What happens when you want to dispose of old games or broken games?

What's better? Recycling or no waste at all.

I'd like to know what it is you do for a living, if you actually work and buy your games with your own money that is, that you could afford to dispose of old or broken games. With your attitude and words, I'm not convinced.

What happens when you want to quickly find a game from your large collection?

It's still easier to just type the name of the game into the search bar.

ASSuming that the platform even offers such a search capability, or that you have to go and delete your games to get something else... or that the platform you get it digitally actually even ALLOWS you to redownload... considering that it is still left in many a digital EULA that the distributor can revoke or limit your access to the game you just bought digitally...

 

[Kirito-kun]

* What if your hard drive crashed, you have no backup and games ended up delisted? Even if it is not delisted you'll be spending hours perhaps even days on downloading all those digital games (assuming your ISP does not impose bandwidth limit).
* Data are stored on the top layer, not the bottom layer where it is prone to scratching. Most of the time scratch is not deep enough to damage the data layer.
* Again take better care of your collection and stop blaming others because your inability to do so.
* It is easier to bring nothing with me while I travel, your point?
* Like I said, for a PC gaming fan (especially you), what are you going to do? Electronics, like GPU, are pretty harmful for the environment.
* No it is not easier to type in search bar, it is only easier if you want to be a potato coach.

The data layer of a disk doesn't have to be damaged. If the plastic gets damaged enough, the laser won't be able to pass through it properly and therefore it will be unable read the data layer underneath. Just because I game on PC doesn't mean I've never used optical medium. Severe scratches will make a disc unusable. If your hard drive dies? RAID 1. Google it.

We're just taking about convenience. I personally like to not worry about damaged discs.

Bring no discs in order to game or bring lots of discs so you can game. Which is easier? If you bring nothing, you can't game.

Not trying to eliminate waste, only reduce. If you can reduce waste even by a bit, that's better than nothing.

Is typing a word or two really that hard?

you also apparently lose at grammar.

I don't see how my grammar is wrong.

You can lose a digital game, too. Just ask anyone that's tried getting or keeping a vulnerable version of a game for use on the Vita, for instance. And in the case of the PS3 and Vita, if your game gets delisted, chances are you also lost the stored login credentials needed to play it, too. Unless you could use something like ReActPSN, you're boned there, too.

PC.

Short of defective optical drives (which I personally ran into far more often with Sony than any other console maker), it usually takes abusing your games to cause a scratch on the discs to begin with.

It still happens. Can't happen with digital.

How about actually having the disc to keep playing, vs. some executive arbitrarily deciding to shut down your access to approve your ability to play the game?

Unlike digital, physical can actually continue to operate even when your internet is out. That's more than I can say for nearly every other kind of digital medium.

PC.

Thank you for completely ignoring my point. A Modded console with external storage is just as sturdy.

You're literally creating digital medium from physical medium. And bring modding into the argument is like saying PC gaming is so cheap because you can pirate everything. It's not the intended usage.

ASSuming that the platform even offers such a search capability, or that you have to go and delete your games to get something else... or that the platform you get it digitally actually even ALLOWS you to redownload... considering that it is still left in many a digital EULA that the distributor can revoke or limit your access to the game you just bought digitally...

PC.

 

[trumpet-205]

f your hard drive dies? RAID 1. Google it.

At least do some research before telling people to Google it. RAID 1 is not backup, nor means for data loss prevention. In fact RAID 1 compounds data failure rate since there is no way to distinguish which drive has the correct file in case you run into URE and/or bit error. RAID, with the exception of RAID 0, is all about uptime, with secondary effect such as performance increase. It will never be a means to otherwise.

Also like I said, broadband Internet is still not widely enough for digital only distribution era. In fact with the way ISP is imposing bandwidth limit, it'll be years before we are reaching there. By then 4K will even increase game size significantly.

 

[Ryukouki]

Heh, keep it clean now guys.

 

[Kirito-kun]

Also like I said, broadband Internet is still not widely enough for digital only distribution era. In fact with the way ISP is imposing bandwidth limit, it'll be years before we are reaching there. By then 4K will even increase game size significantly.

So it'll take 30 seconds instead of 15 seconds once Google Fiber becomes popular. That's still tolerable.

Also, what do you mean by data loss prevention? Unless your drive dies or you accidentally corrupt or delete the file (which would be your fault if you do), I've never heard of a hard drive just loosing a file for no reason.

 

[codezer0]

tl;dr

So your common allegory is PC... Yea, let's look at that.

The fiascos of the limited installs for games like The Sims, Bioshock 1, Borderlands, or any recent game with SecuROM.

The DRM that makes many games practically un-installable both in the sense that you can't uninstall them to make room, nor can you actually install them at all because the glitches require the game to be successfully installed in the first place in order to apply the patch meant to fix them.

The always-on DRM that killed many a Ubisoft game, most famously Assassin's Creed 1&2.

Forget losing the game, losing the cd-key often can kill your ability to use the game, since you keep wanting to make losing the disc a "thing" to worry about, and are now talking about PC gaming specifically.

Or the games that are only available on EA Origin, and thus you could get banned access to just for someone moderating you on their forums.

Or trying to run an older game that won't work on anything made less than ten years ago, even though the hardware should be more than powerful to run it. That of course won't work in DOSbox.

PC started the whole activation/install limit way before it was even a thing on the console scene.

 

[trumpet-205]

So it'll take 30 seconds instead of 15 seconds once Google Fiber becomes popular. That's still tolerable.

Also, what do you mean by data loss prevention? Unless your drive dies or you accidentally corrupt or delete the file (which would be your fault if you do), I've never heard of a hard drive just loosing a fire for no reason.

Google Fiber will never become popular. It is merely a stunt to show how uncompetitive broadband Internet is. To make Google Fiber available nationwide would require Google to invest hundreds of billions, something that will never happen (not in upcoming 30 years).

And yes, HDD do and will corrupt data on its own. This is called bit error where a bit is mistakenly written down. I.e. 0 to 1. Unless you have a way to validate file, such as checksum, you are taking a 50/50 chance with RAID 1. RAID itself cannot validate which file is not corrupted. I repeat, RAID will never be a means to be a backup or data loss prevention.

 

[codezer0]

So it'll take 30 seconds instead of 15 seconds once Google Fiber becomes popular. That's still tolerable.

Also, what do you mean by data loss prevention? Unless your drive dies or you accidentally corrupt or delete the file (which would be your fault if you do), I've never heard of a hard drive just loosing a file for no reason.

I didn't think I'd see such a textbook case here of all places, but...

Damn.

 

[Foxi4]

Kirito-kun, do you remember when p1ng announced in the Shoutbox that you have two more strikes as far as your PC Master Race attitude is concerned before you get banned from the site? I do.

This is a thread about used games, not about PC, take your platform glorification elsewhere or keep it to yourself. I like PC gaming as much as the next guy, but you're really stretching it.

 

[Kirito-kun]

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Okay, let me rephrase my argument.

Steam.

You can also run any Windows program in compatibility mode all the way back to Windows 98 pretty sure.

 

[Foxi4]

Okay, let me rephrase my argument.

Steam.

You can also run any Windows program in compatibility mode all the way back to Windows 98 pretty sure.

False due to numerous incompatibilities, sometimes a virtual machine or OS modification are your only options, but that's besides the point because this is a thread about used games, not Steam or PC exclusively.

 

[Ryukouki]

How about this. The whole point of this discussion is about used games. If you want to go off and create a tangent about another issue, take it to a private message. Seriously.

EDIT: Do not get me wrong, I love having a solid discussion, but if it's going completely off the rails from the original target, then it's pointless.

 

[codezer0]

That's it, I'm out.

 

[ShadowSoldier]

edit post after banning of kirito:

I think used game sales are good. I mean I only got a PS3 last year, does that mean that I'm not entitled to playing the older games without paying full price? I just think that if new games are bought, about 10 bucks go to developers. But if you buy a used game, then maybe 5 bucks or a certain percentage should go to developers/publishers as well.

 

[p1ngpong]

Bye bye Kirito-kun, we all hated you.

 

[Vengenceonu]

And like the French revolutions, the (console) Peasants will always rise up to Behead the Benevolant (PC Master race) King!

 

[stinkoman]

If they're going to sell digital distribution games as high as they are physical games, then fuck 'em. If you can't afford to be as good to us as Steam is then gtfo of digital distribution.

 

[tbgtbg]

I am so sick of the whole they don't get a cut of used games argument. So what? If I buy a used book no one gets a cut of that either. It's called capitalism. Don't like it? Move to Cuba.