San Francisco brands NRA a domestic terrorist organization

Discussion in 'World News, Current Events & Politics' started by morvoran, Sep 6, 2019.

  1. morvoran
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    morvoran Trump supporter

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    Well, Folks, it seems that the San Francisco Board of Supervisors is up to it's usual antics again. The last time, they were trying to impose PC terms for criminals and drug users to protect them from discrimination and label them a "protected group".
    Now it's calling an organization that protects the constitutional rights of American citizens a "domestic terrorist organization". Maybe they haven't heard of the groups that call themselves "Antifa" or people who think of themselves as "Liberal Progressives", but there several other groups causing more harm to the safety of the US then the NRA.

    It won't be long before the people from Florida start calling San Francisco "the crazy capital of America". If the SF Board of Supervisors keep this behavior up, we will have to label them a "domestic terrorist group".

    This is what our world is starting to become. A world where we protect people who attack positive values and commit violence while condemning those who work to protect our rights and make the world a better place.

    Feel free to share your opinions but try to stay on topic.

    San Francisco just passed a resolution calling the NRA a ‘domestic terrorist organization’

    Source: The Washington Post

    The San Francisco Board of Supervisors passed a resolution Tuesday declaring the National Rifle Association a “domestic terrorist organization” and urging the city to examine its financial relationships with companies that do business with the group.

    The sharply worded declaration noted recent acts of gun violence, including the July shooting that killed three people, all younger than 26, at a food festival in Gilroy, Calif., south of San Francisco.
    “The National Rifle Association musters its considerable wealth and organizational strength to promote gun ownership and incite gun owners to acts of violence,” it read. “The National Rifle Association spreads propaganda that misinforms and aims to deceive the public about the dangers of gun violence, and … the leadership of National Rifle Association promotes extremist positions, in defiance of the views of a majority of its membership and the public, and undermine the general welfare.”
    The resolution, adopted unanimously by the board’s 11 supervisors, notes many of the statistics that make the United States stand out in terms of gun violence, stating that the country’s gun homicide rate is “25 times higher than any other high-income country in the world” and that 36,000 people in the United States die in gun-related incidents every year, an average of 100 per day.

    It also said the city would assess its financial and contractual relationships with vendors that do business with the NRA.

    “The City and County of San Francisco should take every reasonable step to limit those entities who do business with the City and County of San Francisco from doing business with this domestic terrorist organization,” it noted.

    The news of its passage quickly drew attention from conservatives and right-leaning media outlets.

    Supervisor Catherine Stefani told reporters that she had decided to write the declaration after the shooting at the Gilroy Garlic Festival. A gunman there killed a 6-year-old, a 13-year-old and a 25-year-old before taking his own life. The mass shooting was followed within days by massacres in El Paso, where a gunman killed 22 people, and Dayton, Ohio, where a man killed nine people.

    “The NRA conspires to limit gun violence research, restrict gun violence data sharing and most importantly aggressively tries to block every piece of sensible gun violence prevention legislation proposed on any level, local state or federal,” Stefani said, according to KQED. “When they use phrases like, ‘I’ll give you my gun when you pry it from my cold, dead hands’ on bumper stickers, they are saying reasoned debate about public safety should be met with violence.”

    Stefani told The Washington Post that she believed the group had earned the designation as a “terrorist organization.”

    “They should reasonably know by now that they are fueling the hate fire in this country,” she said. “People are dying, and they continue to stand in the way of reform.”

    Amy Hunter, a spokeswoman for the NRA, called the resolution a “reckless assault on a law-abiding organization, its members and the freedoms they all stand for.”
    “This is just another worthless and disgusting ‘sound bite remedy’ to the violence epidemic gripping our nation,” she said. “We remain undeterred — guided by our values and belief in those who want to find real solutions to gun violence.”

    The NRA has been at the center of political tensions in recent years as horrific acts of gun violence continue to regularly punctuate the political conversation. New York Attorney General Letitia James, a Democrat, is investigating the group’s finances over its tax-exempt status as a nonprofit group.

    Lawrence B. Glickman, professor of history at Cornell University, said it was unusual for governments to orchestrate boycotts of private entities.

    “Municipalities in the era of the American Revolution called for ostracism or boycotting of individuals who violated the non-importation movement by using, for example, British tea,” he wrote in an email. “Those might be the clearest antecedents for the SF Board of Supervisors decision.”
     
    Last edited by morvoran, Sep 6, 2019
  2. Xzi

    Xzi All your base are belong to the proletariat

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    I wouldn't go so far as to classify them as a domestic terrorist group myself, though they are a lobbyist group representing gun manufacturers, and therefore they do need to have their tax exempt status revoked.

    This is a good point. Support for certain gun control legislation (such as universal background checks) is nearly unanimous across party lines, and the NRA stands opposed to democracy in that way. A sale is a sale to them, no matter if it's a bolt-action hunting rifle going to a collector, or an AR-15 going to a person on the FBI's most wanted list. The profit motive has no morality built in to it by default.
     
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  3. morvoran
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    morvoran Trump supporter

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    The problem with universal background checks is that they only work if ALL people are ONLY able to buy guns through legal means such as at a gun shop where a background check will be performed. If I go to a back alley and buy a black market gun, the seller won't give a damn if I'm a felon, clinically insane, or what I'm going to use it for. If a criminal wants to get a gun, they're going to get a gun.

    The NRA is an "all or nothing" group when it comes to the second amendment as they believe EVERYONE has a right to protect themselves from other people intending to do them harm or a tyrannical government.

    It is not the NRA going around shooting people or influencing mass shooters. That is the fault of society. Maybe instead of pointing fingers at the NRA, San Francisco should point at themselves.
     
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  4. Xzi

    Xzi All your base are belong to the proletariat

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    If a criminal wants to commit murder, they're going to commit murder. That doesn't mean murder should be legalized. Universal background checks would allow us to start taking "back-alley" sellers off the streets and jailing them. As it stands now, you can legally sell a gun to a person who you know is a terrorist/murderer and get of scot-free as long as it can't be proven that you had that knowledge in advance.

    The "all or nothing" mentality is precisely what's keeping us from addressing the problem in its various forms. We can't be selling AR-15s to every violent ex-convict or homeless guy rambling to himself on the bus.

    You're right, they're just the people promoting availability of weapons to mass shooters and preventing the government from moving on legislation to stop them from doing so.
     
    Last edited by Xzi, Sep 6, 2019
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  5. morvoran
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    morvoran Trump supporter

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    No, but the laws against murder don't stop people from murdering, do they? Even with the punishment of death, people still kill others. It's a problem of society, not guns.

    Oh, yeah, they're going to tell criminals that selling guns in back alleys is not legal, and they're just going to stop all together and sing a happy tune. No more mass shootings or gun deaths. The world will, finally, be at peace forever. Right.

    Wrong. People will still be able to buy illegal firearms. It's a problem of society, not guns.


    Why are ex-convict's or homeless guys rambling to himself on the bus wanting to buy guns for? To hurt someone or to protect themselves? If it's the first one, then it's a problem of society, not guns.

    As long as we have a second amendment, everybody has a right to bear arms. I can't confirm what causes a mass shooter to do what they do, but I am sure it's a problem of society, not guns.
     
    Last edited by morvoran, Sep 6, 2019
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  6. Xzi

    Xzi All your base are belong to the proletariat

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    "It's a problem of gun culture, not the guns themselves." To some extent I'd agree, but that doesn't mean we need to be providing easy access to guns for people who would otherwise fail background checks. Both societal problems and problems with our gun laws need to be addressed, one does not invalidate the other.
     
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  7. PityOnU

    PityOnU GBAtemp Maniac

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    Honestly, the tech capitals of the USA (SF, Seattle, Austin) are just batshit insane and have no idea what they are doing.

    I'm saying this as a tech bro currently living/working in the Bay Area: the ultra-liberal mentality fostered by the culture of most of the large employers (tech companies) out here does not work and results in coddled individuals who are incredibly out of touch with reality and have more money than sense. They then elect officials.

    That being said, I like money more than sense, so out here I will stay.
     
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  8. morvoran
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    morvoran Trump supporter

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    Of course not because gun laws will not fix societal problems, but fixing societal problems can alleviate the need for gun laws. Unfortunately, labeling the NRA as a terrorist org will do nothing for societal problems.
    If San Francisco can start work on fixing the drug problem and fecal matter on the streets issue while spending less time blaming others, maybe the social problems there will improve.
     
  9. Xzi

    Xzi All your base are belong to the proletariat

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    There are a million different societal problems to fix, and none of the solutions are fast or inexpensive to implement. Not to mention one of those problems is the glorification of and obsession our society has with both guns and crime. Meanwhile, small changes like the ones Wal-Mart recently implemented can have a big impact on gun violence, but they've also called for Congress to pass more common sense legislation.
     
    Last edited by Xzi, Sep 6, 2019
  10. morvoran
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    morvoran Trump supporter

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    how about poverty, homelessness, and lack of fathers in the homes causing our youth to lack moral character and continue into adulthood without proper guidance? Those are bigger issues that need to be fixed and lead to the problems you mentioned.

    Of course, trying solutions that have never worked and then throw money at the other problems to make them go away, but instead, just escalates them.

    Just FYI, Walmart is just doing that to gain liberal support to help them destroy our economy even more. Did you happen to catch the part where they said they were going to sell their remaining stock? If they really cared, wouldn't they remove the guns and ammo instead of selling them? Seems like your liberal ass got fooled, too. Congrats on finally showing support for the richest retail corporation in America. Enjoy your cheap China-made goods.
     
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  11. Xzi

    Xzi All your base are belong to the proletariat

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    Big problems certainly, but these are all features of crony capitalism, not bugs. There are very few politicians willing to confront that reality, which is why it's unlikely anything will be done about it in the next 50 years.

    If these things have never been tried before, how could you possibly know that they don't work? "We've tried nothing and we're all out of ideas" might be the NRA's slogan, but that doesn't mean it has to be America's.

    That's dumb. I'm still not going to be shopping at Wal-Mart, but that doesn't mean they can't have an impact as one of the nation's largest gun and ammo resellers. Again, leftists buy guns too. Taking an anti-mass shooting stance shouldn't be controversial to any political party.
     
    Last edited by Xzi, Sep 6, 2019
  12. morvoran
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    morvoran Trump supporter

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    Too bad the Democrats cover up most mass shootings by calling them, "gang related violence". Thats not what I call, "taking a stance".

    Maybe because I wasn't born yesterday and because I know stuff.

    Well, actually, there are a lot of politicians that know reality but just look the other way, they're called Democrats. Maybe you've heard of them? They can't fix these problems and stay in power. As long as there are poor people looking for free stuff, Democrats have a platform to run on.
     
  13. Xzi

    Xzi All your base are belong to the proletariat

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    This is so contradictory. Why are they the only ones pushing for more gun control legislation if they're also the ones supposedly downplaying mass shootings? AFAIK "gang violence" is counted among mass shootings in the yearly statistics.

    Also, I was talking about Wal-Mart taking a stance, not a political party.

    Oh okay, so you're psychic? Can I get the numbers for the upcoming lotto? :lol:

    They're called neoliberals (Biden) and neoconservatives (Trump). Different flavors of the same bullshit. As long as corporations are making record profits, they couldn't care less about homelessness and poverty driving people to violence.
     
    Last edited by Xzi, Sep 6, 2019
  14. GBADWB

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    Regardless on stance, the point is most of the gun violence that's in the U.S iirc is homicide usually due to actual gang violence (e.g chicago's high homocide rate). Both extremes when it comes to regulating guns fail to work, as in the situation I mentioned, Chicago has very strict gun laws and the guns being used are likely being smuggled into the city though underground methods. The flip side is the killing in Texas disprove any argument that arming other civilians would prevent the shootings.

    So really the only options is to fix societal problems(easier said than done of course), or regulate the aftermarket sales of guns in a similar way that vehicles are registered to a person. If responsible owners became liable for their arms, it shouldn't affect them, but for those who sell guns in the back drop, if a gun ownership registration and tracking were kept in place, could affect the illegal sales of guns if certain levels of punishment were given to bad ownership of guns who did not provide correct transfer of gun title ownership to another person.
     
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  15. morvoran
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    morvoran Trump supporter

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    Oh, I don't know why does Chicago have the strictest gun control laws while also having the highest gun violence rate? Because guns are being brought in from other states? Hmmm, then why don't the other states with less gun restrictions and more guns have a gun violence problem like Chicago? If the NRA is so bad for not supporting gun control, then why is it that more control causes more gun violence?

    Not when the leftists want to push the "white man bad" or "all mass shooters are white" agenda.

    Wrong. Democrats couldn't care less about homelessness and poverty as long as those issues keep them in power.

    I know ignorance is bliss, which is most likely the reason you are a liberal, but maybe you could try looking at things like a conservative for a change. I understand. Being red pilled, and seeing the world for what it truly is, can be scary at first, but you will ease into it. It's like a bad trip when you realize just how blinded you have been of the democrats' lies.

    It would be easier to do without democrat policies causing most of the societal issues. As you said with Chicago and gun control, that sure didn't make things better. I would go further, but I don't want to go too far off topic like Xzi is trying to do.

    Maybe we could try what they did in Judge Dredd and have the guns take a dna sample and tag each bullet fired from the gun or make it so only you could fire the gun by use of your hand print. This would be more effective in stopping shootings.
    Your idea wouldn't work because the seller could claim the firearm was stolen. It would be hard to prove otherwise.
     
  16. Xzi

    Xzi All your base are belong to the proletariat

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    You answered your own question, the laws need to be universal/nationwide to have a meaningful impact, not localized. And the country as a whole still ranks way in front of every other first-world nation for both gun violence and mass shootings. This isn't a Chicago-only problem (obviously).

    Yes yes, you're always the victim. :rolleyes:

    Are you mentally challenged? Do you seriously think every billionaire votes Democrat? Or are you just trying to deflect from the fact that you yourself are a neocon and part of the problem?
     
    Last edited by Xzi, Sep 6, 2019
  17. GBADWB

    GBADWB GBAtemp Regular

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    Hence why its a game of responsibility. We need responsible gun owners, and if someone else got hold of your firearm, then you could be marked as an irresponsible owner(possibly barring you from getting guns). If people want to keep their guns, then it's time to be responsible for it. It shouldn't be placed in an easily accessible place where it can be easily stolen. Barring further gun sales is just a light penalty on the person. the court can decide how severe a punishment for negligent handling of arms can be.

    I for one think the banning of arms gets us no where, (as banning of a lot of things tend to rarely work). but not doing anything doesn't work either.
     
    Last edited by GBADWB, Sep 6, 2019
  18. Hanafuda

    Hanafuda GBAtemp Addict

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    In a city famous for its map of where human shit is on the sidewalks, how good a job is that Board of Supervisors doing? Their opinions are as worthless as their job performance.
     
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  19. morvoran
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    morvoran Trump supporter

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    Are you ok? You might want to stop drinking that "Jesus juice" the DNC keeps sending you. It's not doing you any favors. If you can't see the true agenda of the Democrats and how they are destroying America, then you need help. Maybe go get that Trump derangement syndrome looked at. If you can't find help at Charter, please, find help somewhere.

    then why is it the media and Democrats spend so much time discussing the shootings in Ohio and El Paso, but they ignore the violence in Chicago, Philadelphia, Baltimore, etc? What's so different about those things? Hmmm, enquiring minds want to know.

    of course not, look at Baltimore, New York City, St Louis, San Francisco, Los Angeles, etc. What do those places have in common? Hmmm, Democrats in charge, that's what.

    I agree with you, and it won't happen as it's a right that's protected by the Constitution. What I don't agree with is more restrictions on gun owners when guns and responsible owners aren't the problem. It is society that's the problem, and we need to work on that instead. No matter how many people you punish for guns, people will still be killed either by finding illegal guns, using knives, sticks, hands, etc.
     
  20. Xzi

    Xzi All your base are belong to the proletariat

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    Well, I guess in your own special way, you answered my question.

    It's driven by viewer interest. People only tend to care when innocent people get shot, not people affiliated with gangs and/or hard drug dealers. And even then they only care for a few days at most. The shootings in Ohio and El Paso were kind of outliers in that they've actually got people fed up with this shit and pushing for change.

    Yeah, damn that liberal Texas having so many shootings recently!
     
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