How do you feel about abortion?

[comput3rus3r]

It's pro-lifers that aren't living in reality. Rapes, unwanted pregnancies, and threats to the pregnant mother's life are all events that occur on a regular basis. These things don't go away just because you ban abortion through the law, we'd simply revert to back-alley abortions instead. Ultimately it's a necessary medical service to have available, whether you like the idea or not.

same weak argument. only 1.5% off all abortions are attributed to rape and incest. The majority of the time murdering the baby is just more convenient.

 

[nashismo]

It's pro-lifers that aren't living in reality. Rapes, unwanted pregnancies, and threats to the pregnant mother's life are all events that occur on a regular basis. These things don't go away just because you ban abortion through the law, we'd simply revert to back-alley abortions instead. Ultimately it's a necessary medical service to have available, whether you like the idea or not.

A medical service, my God... if they want to kill, fine, but make it illegal like any other murder. God made us free to do as we will, wether is right or wether wrong, yet the consequences of our actions and our responsibilities as human beings should never be wiped or erased, or throw under the rug. But that is what sick people like you want, trying to make wrong right and right wrong, complete satanism and I am not even that religious.

 

[Xzi]

same weak argument. only 1.5% off all abortions are attributed to rape and incest. The majority of the time murdering the baby is just more convenient.

Source? And I also mentioned unwanted pregnancies (accidents) and threats to the mother's life, not just rape. Nobody gets an abortion because "it's convenient," most of the time they just don't have the resources to raise a child in the first place. This just proves my point that pro-lifers are out of touch with reality.

A medical service, my God... if they want to kill, fine, but make it illegal like any other murder. God made us free to do as we will, wether is right or wether wrong, yet the consequences of our actions and our responsibilities as human beings should never be wiped or erased, or throw under the rug. But that is what sick people like you want, trying to make wrong right and right wrong, complete satanism and I am not even that religious.

Oh give me a fucking break. This shit is so cringy. Classic "holier than thou" attitude until the baby is actually born and the mother needs maternity leave/welfare to support the child. Then it's, "pull yourself up by the bootstraps." Or even better, "raise him to 18 then we'll send him to die in another pointless war." Assuming he doesn't die from cancer, climate change, issues stemming from overpopulation, or anti-vaxxer parents first. All of which are issues the 'pro-life' crowd refuses to address, making the 'pro-life' title about as hypocritical as it gets.

Roe v Wade is settled law, and the only reason one side keeps bringing it up is so they can play the fake moral outrage card. Nobody is forcing you to get an abortion, and nobody is forcing you to think about abortions. Yet I'd be willing to bet that the 'pro-life' crowd gets abortions at about the same rate everyone else does.

 

[codyjo]

Murder.. What!? Do you possess a uterus? Do you remember rolling around in your mom's uterus with a conscience?

 

[Jayro]

I am ALL for it! People need to STOP HAVING BABIES!!! This world is GROSSLY over-populated by about 3 billion people, and people's stupid-ass religions forcing them to disregard any form of birth control isn't helping matters. Please have pets instead of kids, thanks.

 

[Xzi]

I'm not even sure where people got the idea that abortion was "sinful" and "murder" to begin with. The bible doesn't say that. As a matter of fact, the bible has a how-to guide for abortion in it, and I'm fairly sure we already discussed it within this thread. Thus the abortion debate is entirely a political one, as people aren't willing to take Christianity's true view on it into consideration.

 

[deinonychus71]

I am ALL for it! People need to STOP HAVING BABIES!!! This world is GROSSLY over-populated by about 3 billion people, and people's stupid-ass religions forcing them to disregard any form of birth control isn't helping matters. Please have pets instead of kids, thanks.

Kinda agree with that...

You can talk about murder all you want but with overpopulated and the resources of the planet being depleted too fast, we're heading to mass suicide anyway.

And seriously. Whoever is using religion to influence politics need to be reminded that we don't have listen to them. Cults are and have been the cancer of societies for ages, and have caused more murders than the sum of all abortions there ever was.

 

[codyjo]

My first post in this thread was completely of a satirical nature. I wanted to see what kind of reaction I could stir up. In all seriousness, I do not possess a vagina nor uterus and thus do not find it right for me to proclaim any right or wrong in which way a woman chooses to deal with a pregnancy. I have been in a relationship where this issue occurred and was told after the fact by my partner at the time that the pregnancy had been terminated. That was her right and in any non-retarded ass backward country, the law agrees.

 

[nashismo]

I am ALL for it! People need to STOP HAVING BABIES!!! This world is GROSSLY over-populated by about 3 billion people, and people's stupid-ass religions forcing them to disregard any form of birth control isn't helping matters. Please have pets instead of kids, thanks.

This is an endless debate and of course a disagree with abortions, and I will take from you are saying the most important fact. What fact? The fact that today more than ever there exist a multiple of ways of preventing pregnancy!

Today more than ever abortion should not be excused! How can someone say he couldn't avoid it? You have all these tools to prevent pregnancy and you are still irresponsable enough to get pregnant, only to then kill that life that is within you?!

Irresponsible and more ridiculous than ever.

And I am sorry to all those speaking about US laws, I cannot argue back because I am working enough already speaking in a language that is not my own, and with people that are completely different than me/us here in south america.

But I think is good for you all to know the opinion and thinking of other people of the world. Please consider my last opinion on the subject, just don't get pregnant! Avoid killing a life for no reason then! Is that so hard?

Cheers and good night.

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------

I'm not even sure where people got the idea that abortion was "sinful" and "murder" to begin with. The bible doesn't say that. As a matter of fact, the bible has a how-to guide for abortion in it, and I'm fairly sure we already discussed it within this thread. Thus the abortion debate is entirely a political one, as people aren't willing to take Christianity's true view on it into consideration.

So if the Bible doesn't tell me that cutting someone elses dick is a sin, that means that is not? And that means that is OK! Get the fuck out of here, the Bible is simple, you shall not kill, simple.

And to not do to others what you don't want to be done to you! That amasses every fucking thing! You look like those lawyers looking for the tinniest ridiculous things within the code of law to get away with shit that is clearly WRONG!

And quote me the passage of the "bible" that tells me that abortion is just OK and not a sin etc. Bullshit man, just bullshit, come on, quote it.

 

[Xzi]

So if the Bible doesn't tell me that cutting someone elses dick is a sin, that means that is not? And that means that is OK! Get the fuck out of here, the Bible is simple, you shall not kill, simple.

The bible does not consider abortion to be killing/murder.

• A pregnant woman who is injured and aborts the fetus warrants financial compensation only (to her husband), suggesting that the fetus is property, not a person (Exodus 21:22-25).

• The gruesome priestly purity test to which a wife accused of adultery must submit will cause her to abort the fetus if she is guilty, indicating that the fetus does not possess a right to life (Numbers 5:11-31).

• God enumerated his punishments for disobedience, including "cursed shall be the fruit of your womb" and "you will eat the fruit of your womb," directly contradicting sanctity-of-life claims (Deuteronomy 28:18,53).

• Elisha's prophecy for soon-to-be King Hazael said he would attack the Israelites, burn their cities, crush the heads of their babies and rip open their pregnant women (2 Kings 8:12).

• King Menahem of Israel destroyed Tiphsah (also called Tappuah) and the surrounding towns, killing all residents and ripping open pregnant women with the sword (2 Kings 15:16).

• Isaiah prophesied doom for Babylon, including the murder of unborn children: "They will have no pity on the fruit of the womb" (Isaiah 13:18).

• For worshiping idols, God declared that not one of his people would live, not a man, woman or child (not even babies in arms), again confuting assertions about the sanctity of life (Jeremiah 44:7-8).

• God will punish the Israelites by destroying their unborn children, who will die at birth, or perish in the womb, or never even be conceived (Hosea 9:10-16).

• For rebelling against God, Samaria's people will be killed, their babies will be dashed to death against the ground, and their pregnant women will be ripped open with a sword (Hosea 13:16).

• Jesus did not express any special concern for unborn children during the anticipated end times: "Woe to pregnant women and those who are nursing" (Matthew 24:19).

https://ffrf.org/component/k2/item/25602-abortion-rights

Here's more on the bible's own how-to guide on abortions performed by priests, and sanctioned by god himself, in the book of Numbers:

https://dwindlinginunbelief.blogspot.com/2008/10/bibles-guide-to-abortion.html

 

[deinonychus71]

Why does it matter what the bible say?
We're in 2019. Can humanity grow up? At least kids eventually learn that Santa is not real.

Most abortions are done before the fetus even get a functioning brain with a single electrical signal. Legally, they're all done before the fetus is considered "awake".
Of course that doesn't matter for believers and their dear cults. But thankfully, morality doesn't have to be dictated by religion anymore. We have actual science now.

However, there are living creature that are killed by millions and religions don't give a single shit about them. They have been proved to feel emotions and pain. If you think i'm a monster for pointing out the hypocrisy because I dare comparing this case to animals, so be it.

 

[Xzi]

Why does it matter what the bible say?

It matters because the 'pro-life' side never had any logic-based arguments for limiting women's freedoms to begin with. So they took the moral/religious high ground angle instead, but even that is based on a lie. As I said before, this debate is rooted entirely in politics, and it's for that reason alone it remains a hot-button issue. I think the vast majority of Americans were ready to move on from it twenty years ago or so.

 

[deinonychus71]

It matters because the 'pro-life' side never had any logic-based arguments for limiting women's freedoms to begin with. So they took the moral/religious high ground angle instead, but even that is based on a lie. As I said before, this debate is rooted entirely in politics, and it's for that reason alone it remains a hot-button issue. I think the vast majority of Americans were ready to move on from it twenty years ago or so.

Even calling themselves "pro-life" is absurd. The planet is dying of overpopulation, which means everyone is dying. If you care about life, then make sure that future generations will be able to survive, make sure that as many species as possible survive. Limit the population is the way forward.

The second they bring religion into an argument, it's a red flag that a person shouldn't be trusted as they're purposely ignoring facts. There is no excuse in this day and age to believe in Santa before Science.

 

[erikas]

Women have so many forms of birth control there is literally no excuse for abortion later than one week. Even if the woman was raped, the morning after pill exists. I cannot think of any reason why women are absolved of all responsibility to the point where abortion is tax funded. And if something is tax funded, the government does get a say, your body or no. The recent development of 3rd trimester abortions becoming legal just shows how pervasive gynocentrism is, what was the woman doing for the last 6 months that abortion in the 3rd trimester is necessary?

 

[Burorī]

why is this on gbatemp?

 

[nashismo]

The bible does not consider abortion to be killing/murder.

• A pregnant woman who is injured and aborts the fetus warrants financial compensation only (to her husband), suggesting that the fetus is property, not a person (Exodus 21:22-25).

• The gruesome priestly purity test to which a wife accused of adultery must submit will cause her to abort the fetus if she is guilty, indicating that the fetus does not possess a right to life (Numbers 5:11-31).

• God enumerated his punishments for disobedience, including "cursed shall be the fruit of your womb" and "you will eat the fruit of your womb," directly contradicting sanctity-of-life claims (Deuteronomy 28:18,53).

• Elisha's prophecy for soon-to-be King Hazael said he would attack the Israelites, burn their cities, crush the heads of their babies and rip open their pregnant women (2 Kings 8:12).

• King Menahem of Israel destroyed Tiphsah (also called Tappuah) and the surrounding towns, killing all residents and ripping open pregnant women with the sword (2 Kings 15:16).

• Isaiah prophesied doom for Babylon, including the murder of unborn children: "They will have no pity on the fruit of the womb" (Isaiah 13:18).

• For worshiping idols, God declared that not one of his people would live, not a man, woman or child (not even babies in arms), again confuting assertions about the sanctity of life (Jeremiah 44:7-8).

• God will punish the Israelites by destroying their unborn children, who will die at birth, or perish in the womb, or never even be conceived (Hosea 9:10-16).

• For rebelling against God, Samaria's people will be killed, their babies will be dashed to death against the ground, and their pregnant women will be ripped open with a sword (Hosea 13:16).

• Jesus did not express any special concern for unborn children during the anticipated end times: "Woe to pregnant women and those who are nursing" (Matthew 24:19).

https://ffrf.org/component/k2/item/25602-abortion-rights

Here's more on the bible's own how-to guide on abortions performed by priests, and sanctioned by god himself, in the book of Numbers:

https://dwindlinginunbelief.blogspot.com/2008/10/bibles-guide-to-abortion.html

You just quoted this so easily? You are a genius! Never met one before.

Sadly, all you wrote is a lie. Don't have time to argue every point, but only I will cite the bible, something you haven't!

You are just stating opinions of what someone or you thinks the bible says on those passages! A total deceiver.

Just the first one, (Exodus 21:22-25): "If people are fighting and hit a pregnant woman and she gives birth prematurely but there is no serious injury, the offender must be fined whatever the woman’s husband demands and the court allows. 23 But if there is serious injury, you are to take life for life, 24 eye for eye, tooth for tooth, hand for hand, foot for foot, 25 burn for burn, wound for wound, bruise for bruise.

The punishment is eye for an eye, right there God is telling you that if you kill a fetus, you are to be KILLED dont you get it dumbass, the bible says "give birth prematuraly" it does not say the baby was born dead, and then it says if there is injury (could be the woman or the child) there is eye for an eye.


Thank you for beating yourself. Still, the old testament is irrelevant now and is almost ALL that you wrote, because those were laws for the jews in the past. Everything changed with Jesus and the rules to follow are more simple and clear and for everyone.

 

[Subtle Demise]

well given that we disagree at a fundamental level, that being the fact that I believe In God and that I have a soul and you don't. I'm assuming you don't because the soul comes into the body at the moment of conception so you can talk about whether or not the brain is developed enough for your standards but it doesn't take away the fact that it is a person. The most obvious evidence is the fact that we both went through that stage of our lives and luckily no unconscionable person ripped us apart.

A medical service, my God... if they want to kill, fine, but make it illegal like any other murder. God made us free to do as we will, wether is right or wether wrong, yet the consequences of our actions and our responsibilities as human beings should never be wiped or erased, or throw under the rug. But that is what sick people like you want, trying to make wrong right and right wrong, complete satanism and I am not even that religious.

So here we have undeniable proof that the only argument against even early-term abortion is a religious one, meaning it is automatically unconstitutional for it to be illegal. The first amendment forbids the establishment of a state religion. The United States is not a theocracy and for as long as I'm still alive, it never will be! So tell me this, when a man masturbates, does that mean all those sperm are lost souls? What does it mean when a woman miscarries after just a few weeks? Did God perform his own abortion? Why are babies stillborn? Why did he create birth defects?

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------

You just quoted this so easily? You are a genius! Never met one before.

Sadly, all you wrote is a lie. Don't have time to argue every point, but only I will cite the bible, something you haven't!

You are just stating opinions of what someone or you thinks the bible says on those passages! A total deceiver.

Just the first one, (Exodus 21:22-25): "If people are fighting and hit a pregnant woman and she gives birth prematurely but there is no serious injury, the offender must be fined whatever the woman’s husband demands and the court allows. 23 But if there is serious injury, you are to take life for life, 24 eye for eye, tooth for tooth, hand for hand, foot for foot, 25 burn for burn, wound for wound, bruise for bruise.

The punishment is eye for an eye, right there God is telling you that if you kill a fetus, you are to be KILLED dont you get it dumbass, the bible says "give birth prematuraly" it does not say the baby was born dead, and then it says if there is injury (could be the woman or the child) there is eye for an eye.


Thank you for beating yourself. Still, the old testament is irrelevant now and is almost ALL that you wrote, because those were laws for the jews in the past. Everything changed with Jesus and the rules to follow are more simple and clear and for everyone.

But Jesus actually said to keep his father's laws.

 

[Pleng]

Even if the woman was raped, the morning after pill exists.

Yes I'm sure after enjoying a nice little rape, immediately sourcing a morning after pill is the first thing on a victim's mind...

 

[WeedZ]

well given that we disagree at a fundamental level, that being the fact that I believe In God and that I have a soul and you don't. I'm assuming you don't because the soul comes into the body at the moment of conception so you can talk about whether or not the brain is developed enough for your standards but it doesn't take away the fact that it is a person. The most obvious evidence is the fact that we both went through that stage of our lives and luckily no unconscionable person ripped us apart.

The bible specifically says you're not a living person with a soul until your first breath.

 

[Kigiru]

It's pro-lifers that aren't living in reality. Rapes, unwanted pregnancies, and threats to the pregnant mother's life are all events that occur on a regular basis. These things don't go away just because you ban abortion through the law, we'd simply revert to back-alley abortions instead. Ultimately it's a necessary medical service to have available, whether you like the idea or not.

The bolded one is truly one of the major reasons why women want right to abortion and i'll say it right fucking now - Abortion is not an anticonception, if women forget to take the pills, put condom on her partner's dick or use one of hundreds of other ways of anticonception then abortion should not be a thing, especialy if paid from others' taxes.
Also, speaking of dicks - I think that it should be obvious that for pregnancy there's needed a man and if we realy need to have so open law for abortion then only if we talk about making it possible only if BOTH parents declare that they want and allow for it. No "my utherus, my choice" bs.