School shooting @ Great Mills Md high school today

the_randomizer · Mar 20, 2018

Laws don't matter to criminals, no, and that's true. But people calling for complete firearm bans is just as stupid, because if you disarm citizens, only criminals will be ones with access to them. Sounds a lot like Nazi Germany when they banned all guns.

Hate to break it to all the people calling for a complete ban, but that's just plain stupid.

osaka35 · Mar 20, 2018

Personally, I'm in the camp that thinks we need to be better about giving tools to people so they can work through their problems and feelings in a healthy way.

I don't particularly like what the news does, but restricting how they give the news is going to be harder and more shady than putting supports in place for kids who feel they've fallen through the cracks. Gun restrictions will help a lot, but it's just adding some semblance of a firewall, trying to mitigating the problem. Which is a lack of humanitarian resources, especially for teenagers and kids.

The rest, holding news reporters accountable and guns only in well-trained militia folk (yeah, yeah), will help increase the difficulty in causing such pain.

Xzi · Mar 20, 2018

Pacheko17 said:
I'm glad the shooter was stopped. I just hope nobody dies.

And I really hope liberals will not start calling for guns to be banned again...

Literally the only person that has called for guns to be seized without due process is Donald Trump. Seemed pretty extremist to me too.

SG854 · Mar 20, 2018

sarkwalvein said:
You're welcome /s

Mental issues are the scapegoat for everything in the modern society, like e.g. that pilot that decided to park the German Wings plane into the Alps. "Mental issues are to be blamed!". The problem of using mental issues as scapegoating, as you see, is not only American.

Of course there are "mental issues", but the mental issues themselves are not the base problem, it is not a problem of the part (the defective human with mental issues), it is a systemic problem (the society as it is is turning people nuts). And IMHO, guns are a relevant part of this systemic problem in America.

Well done, as I said before, IMHO you should have armed security personal around schools, considering the state of things in the late months. <link to previous comment here, if I happen no to be lazy later and carry on a forum search>

Its a bit of a mixture. Bad parenting, single parent families (Los Vegas shooter grew up in single mother home), maybe mental.
And then theres a group of people thinking banning will solve killings.

Another group thinking trying to ban will start a civil war. People will defend their 2nd amendment thinking government is reducing their rights and freedoms so they can take advantage of a gunless country. So they kill to defend it.

Theres also a problem with the black community not wanting to give up guns. They want guns around because they said guns is what helped freed slaves. And if they had access to guns then slavery wouldn't have happened. So they want to defend the 2nd amendment to defend against racism.

Gingerbread Crumb · Mar 20, 2018

vinstage said:
Laws don't matter to a criminal. Of course they don't, otherwise they're not a criminal LMAO.
They do matter in regards to their access to the offending weaponry however.

Usually they're either mentally ill or psychologically due to circumstances/culture/natural environments their minds can even mistake it for a trend. However note the usually, I'm not denying the possibility of attention seeking.

To your first point. No it doesnt. Its easy to get stuff illegally trust me on that. I have no idea where you live but where I live, I know gang bangers who aren't even registered to carry that carry guns. Also to the second point. Thats what I mean. These people are usually lonely or have some sort of problems so they do this to get revenge or cope. Tell me how thats not attention seeking?

osaka35 · Mar 20, 2018

the_randomizer said:
Laws don't matter to criminals, no, and that's true. But people calling for complete firearm bans is just as stupid, because if you disarm citizens, only criminals will be ones with access to them. Sounds a lot like Nazi Germany when they banned all guns.

Hate to break it to all the people calling for a complete ban, but that's just plain stupid.

...the nazi never banned all guns...

and laws are there so you can prosecute and better track criminal activity when it does happen. Murderers are going to murder no matter how much the cost, but we still want those laws because there needs to be something in place to hold them accountable. We have laws against making bombs, even if they're never used, for similar reasons. There are many many options between "no restrictions at all" and "ban all guns".

vinstage · Mar 20, 2018

the_randomizer said:
Sounds a lot like Nazi Germany when they banned all guns.

They banned books but, guns?

Gingerbread Crumb said:
To your first point. No it doesnt. Its easy to get stuff illegally trust me on that. I have no idea where you live but where I live, I know gang bangers who aren't even registered to carry that carry guns. Also to the second point. Thats what I mean. These people are usually lonely or have some sort of problems so they do this to get revenge or cope. Tell me how thats not attention seeking?

Restricting it limits chances, at least here (UK) we don't have issues like this. This is just my personal opinion, but you're sort of feeding to my point, restrictions on gun access would probably prevent examples like that being used.
They may not do it hoping for attention necessarily, attention seeking implies their aim goal is simply gaining attention from it. We don't know what these kids are thinking. We're all simply playing guesswork (assumption) here.

Gingerbread Crumb · Mar 20, 2018

vinstage said:
They banned books but, guns?

Restricting it limits chances, at least here (UK) we don't have issues like this. This is just my personal opinion, but you're sort of feeding to my point, restrictions on gun access would probably prevent examples like that being used.
They may not do it hoping for attention necessarily, attention seeking implies their aim goal is simply gaining attention from it. We don't know what these kids are thinking. We're all simply playing guesswork (assumption) here.

Exactly because you guys are not flooded with them like we are. The guns are already in the state. Plus criminals will always find a way to put more guns into the ecosystem, If you know the right people.

vinstage · Mar 20, 2018

Gingerbread Crumb said:
Exactly because you guys are not flooded with them like we are. The guns are already in the state. Plus criminals will always find a way to put more guns into the ecosystem, If you know the right people.

Depends on whether America's ready to reenact Nazi Germany and the book burning. /s

Hanafuda · Mar 20, 2018

Olmectron said:
Mexico has a very BIG black market of guns, since they are hard to get legally here, even for an adult.

People dies everyday in narco-attacks on the streets, but at least, school shootings are not really a problem here, since they happen a lot less than in USA. And I mean A LOT LESS.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/School_shooting#Mexico

School shootings as a phenomenon is a cultural ill, and as you point out has little to do with whether people have guns. I hope it does not spread to your country.

Olmectron · Mar 20, 2018

Hanafuda said:
School shootings as a phenomenon is a cultural ill, and as you point out has little to do with whether people have guns. I hope it does not spread to your country.

What I meant was for some people saying "gun control in USA won't matter since there will be a BIG black market". Well, I was just saying Mexico is an example of a country with strict gun laws and a really big black market, and yet, there's nearly NO school shootings here.

Yeah, lots of people die and "disappear" everyday here in the streets, but that's another issue. At least, I think we having hard ways to get guns is what has stopped <25 year old students to kill everyone else everyday in their schools.

Hanafuda · Mar 20, 2018

Olmectron said:
What I meant was for some people saying "gun control in USA won't matter since there will be a BIG black market". Well, I was just saying Mexico is an example of a country with strict gun laws and a really big black market, and yet, there's nearly NO school shootings here.

Yeah, lots of people die and "disappear" everyday here in the streets, but that's another issue. At least, I think we having hard ways to get guns is what has stopped <25 year old students to kill everyone else everyday in their schools.

So basically you're saying that if the US had stricter gun control, there'd be fewer school shootings but a huge black market for guns and people getting gunned down in the streets and disappearing everyday anyway, but that's another issue.

I'm not trying to be an ass, just I don't think I'd prefer your alternative.

dpad_5678 · Mar 20, 2018

MAGAtards: BuT AmErIca Is pErfEct and if yOu SaY Any dIffEreNt, yoU'rE unPatRiotIc!

vinstage · Mar 20, 2018

dpad_5678 said:
MAGAtards: BuT AmErIca Is pErfEct and if yOu SaY Any dIffEreNt, yoU'rE unPatRiotIc!

you forgot the /s

Olmectron · Mar 20, 2018

Hanafuda said:
So basically you're saying that if the US had stricter gun control, there'd be fewer school shootings but a huge black market for guns and people getting gunned down in the streets and disappearing everyday anyway, but that's another issue.

I'm not trying to be an ass, just I don't think I'd prefer your alternative.

Alright. I'm just stating my opinion.

Fact is (at least in my opinion), stricter gun laws would reduce school shootings.

Other issues will appear, but that's the thing with humans, they can't be but violent beings, one way or another.

sarkwalvein · Mar 20, 2018

Hanafuda said:
So basically you're saying that if the US had stricter gun control, there'd be fewer school shootings but a huge black market for guns and people getting gunned down in the streets and disappearing everyday anyway, but that's another issue.

As long as you also develop a drug cartel that overpowers your military and police forces, yes.
I don't see that happening though.

Hanafuda · Mar 20, 2018

dpad_5678 said:
MAGAtards: BuT AmErIca Is pErfEct and if yOu SaY Any dIffEreNt, yoU'rE unPatRiotIc!

Who said that? Specifically, who here said that??

vinstage · Mar 20, 2018

Hanafuda said:
Who said that? Specifically, who here said that??

They were being sarcastic kek.

SG854 · Mar 20, 2018

Here's my question to people that think gun shootings is a mental health problem.

If this is the reason for shootings then why don't girls go on mass shootings?
Girls live in the same homes, have the same family values, have access to the same guns, and have same mental health problems as boys.
Yet they don't go on mass shooting. If access to guns and mental health are to blame then why aren't girls doing it. Theres obviously something going wrong in society triggering boys to go on mass shootings.

Hanafuda · Mar 20, 2018

sarkwalvein said:
As long as you also develop a drug cartel that overpowers your military and police forces, yes.
I don't see that happening though.

You're not too familiar with the US then. The cartels are already here, with force. If you could exclude the gang controlled part of every major US city, the statistics would make for a much more peaceful place. Not perfect, but at least normal by international standards. The murder numbers out of St. Louis, Chicago, Detroit, etc. are anomalous to what most people living in the US experience.

School shooting @ Great Mills Md high school today

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