Covid-19 vaccine

[Foxi4]

Morrisons supermarket in the UK has decided to cut sick pay for employees that aren't vaccinated if they have to self isolate.

What concerns me is that it's entirely possible to be vaccinated and still have a positive test result and need to isolate. But in this case it seems you will get full sick pay.

I'm not comfortable with that at all even though I'm double jabbed and don't work at Morrisons.

Morrisons is legally required to pay sick pay to their employees, so the story is a little overblown. What they’re actually doing (from what I can gather) is lowering the amount from full contract hours to statutory sick pay (SSP) which equals £96.35 per week for up to 28 weeks. If they’re planning to pay them anything less, the Crown will have a little something-something to say about that.

https://www.gov.uk/statutory-sick-pay

Minimum pay at Morrisons at present stands at £9.20 per hour (if simple Google-fu is to be believed), so SSP works out as if the employee “worked” a little over 10 hours. It’s actually not that big of a difference for the average Morrisons employee since most of them are employed on garbage 12-hour contracts. The lion’s share of their income comes from overtime which they wouldn’t get as sick pay regardless, this is standard in retail. The bigger problem here is that this is clearly discriminatory.

They’re not doing this because they care about COVID-19 - they’re doing this because Morrisons is broke. The company has just agreed to a takeover offer by Clayton, Dubilier & Rice, accepting the £7bn offer earlier this month. This isn’t about protecting anyone, it’s about legging it from the scene with as much money as humanly possible before new management takes over.

https://www.theguardian.com/busines...-drops-as-firm-warns-over-supply-chain-crisis

Britons all across the country are (rightfully) boycotting the chain and I intend to do the same, the Equality Act might not include medical history in its anti-discrimination protected categories, but I certainly do. If Morrisons wants to coerce their employees to undergo medical procedures in order for them to receive the exact same sick pay as any other employee then they’re not getting any of my money, plain and simple. I’ll happily shop elsewhere, as should everybody else who thinks employers should treat all of their employees equally regardless of their beliefs. I firmly believe that everyone is free to make their own decisions regarding their health, and this includes silly or self-destructive ones. If Morrisons can’t afford to pay sick leave then their business model is at fault, not the virus.

 

[Deleted member 568468]

i don't see why the anti-vaxxers here want to screech so bad about "muh oppression" and even going as far as calling it segregation like in the old days of USA

not getting a jab because "i don't want to get a jab" is only your own choice and you choose to be an unjabbed entity. don't be surprised if some people won't want to be in same room as you because of your carelessness.

 

[subcon959]

I'm curious how many people think the vaccine's purpose is to stop you getting infected from being near someone with Covid, versus its actual purpose which is to increase your chances of having a positive outcome after you get infected.

 

[Deleted member 568468]

I'm curious how many people think the vaccine's purpose is to stop you getting infected from being near someone with Covid, versus its actual purpose which is to increase your chances of having a positive outcome after you get infected.

from my own experience, quite a lot of people think the jab is some miracle cure

 

[The Catboy]

What would you do if you found out for a fact that the conspiracy theorists were right and you were being lied to?

A. Re-evaluate your entire life
B. Start doing more research in an open minded way from both sides, even if it's just to satisfy your mind that the conspiracy theorists are still wrong
C. Stay in denial and blame the other party?
D. Shit your pants

I would ask for sources, something none of the conspiracies have been able to provide.

A link is not evidence. Please post actual statistics from the abstract. I can't do the research for opposition arguments. You're asking me to dig for proof. Take the time to form an argument.

Do you have any sources for whatever point you are trying to make?

 

[thehawksfuckingdead7]

I just got my first dose last week.

 

[Deleted member 568468]

I just got my first dose last week.

ooh, what jab?

 

[thehawksfuckingdead7]

ooh, what jab?

Pfizer!

 

[The Catboy]

I am once again asking if have any of the anti-vaxxors provided any sources to their claims?

 

[Deleted member 568468]

Pfizer!

Ah. I'm actually trying to find a free day to get the jab. Luckily none of these shady Chinese/Russian jabs are available here so anything will work for me

 

[thehawksfuckingdead7]

Ah. I'm actually trying to find a free day to get the jab. Luckily none of these shady Chinese/Russian jabs are available here so anything will work for me

That's good to know!

 

[KingVamp]

2. Your jab not working m8?
As long as big pharma keep getting free money from governments all over the world this will never be over.

Not everyone can get the jab, so they are protecting themselves and others.

Totally the people that don't want to do anything to curtail this virus, aren't the ones at fault for prolonging this virus and risking even more variants showing up.

I'm curious how many people think the vaccine's purpose is to stop you getting infected from being near someone with Covid, versus its actual purpose which is to increase your chances of having a positive outcome after you get infected.

I'm pretty sure it lowers the chance of getting it at all too. I never seen anyone claim it gives 100% protection. Either way, I guess they are somehow convince that no protection is better than some protection.

 

[elk1007]

I am once again asking if have any of the anti-vaxxors provided any sources to their claims?

No one here is anti-vax.

What claim do you need evidence for?

 

[djpannda]

No one here is anti-vax.

140 pages say otherwise but Granted 98% of people parroting anti-vax info is just because political reason as if their candidate won and mandated it would not be a issue...

 

[The Catboy]

No one here is anti-vax.

What claim do you need evidence for?

There’s a lot of people who are anti-vac in this thread and have been open about being anti-vac outside of this thread. I am not tagging them because I am not going to give them that attention but just scrolling back a little will reveal them.
The normal for me, are there any peer-reviewed papers showing that the Covid vaccine is unsafe? Is there any peer-reviewed papers showing that vaccines in general are harmful enough to warrant avoiding them?

 

[tabzer]

People are "anti-vax" like ivermectin is horse de-wormer.

Also, the definition of vaccine has been changed by the CDC to include inhaling farts, just so that they can keep calling this thing a "vaccine".

 

[Lacius]

The scientific data says this thing ain't perfect.
https://scivisionpub.com/pdfs/covid19-rna-based-vaccines-and-the-risk-of-prion-disease-1503.pdf
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7827936/
https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.05.23.21257679v1.full

Nobody said the vaccines were perfect, but they've been demonstrated to be safe, particularly when contrasted with the risks associated with contracting COVID-19. As your your link to the prion-based disease claim, it's purely speculative. There is no evidence that the COVID-19 vaccines are associated with prion-based diseases.

Eh... both are based on statistical inference. None is "clearer" than the other.
The "catch" is that reserach is much more prominent on the vaccines, for whatever reason.



Same for those figures.

And I can't see any scientific basis as to why the direct contagion (the actual disease, after recovery) would give me less protection than the vaccine.
If anyone can explain this one to me, please do. I'm really curious about this one.



This is false though. Most of them are indeed experimental.
We're definitely being used as test subjects, particularly for mRNA and some of the Adenovirus vaccines.
It is understandable, however, given the situation and how contagious the whole thing is.

A lot of people who were taking unrelated drugs, like HCQ and Ivermectin were being used as test subjects as well, though with a much smaller risk, considering the substances, their pharmacokinetics and their side effects are widely known, unlike those of the new vaccination methods.

Attenuated vaccines (mostly the Chinese ones) are the closest to the "classic" vaccination approach, and they were the only ones I would be willing to take, if I were to take any of them at some point.

I got a pretty severe case of CoViD-19 back in March, and I really don't want me (or anyone else) to get it (again), but, not even accounting for the wild conspiracy theories, I'm not willing to be a test subject for a new vaccination method with completely unforeseen long term consequences.

I respect those that do get vaccinated, and wish they'd respect my decision not to be vaccinated in turn :/

The vaccines underwent the "experimentation" stage before they were available to the general public under emergency use authorization. Since then, the Pfizer vaccine has received full FDA approval. It is incorrect to say the vaccines are "indeed experimental" or that people broadly are "definitely being used as test subjects."

The vaccines have been demonstrated to be safe and effective. If you want to minimize the odds you'll contract COVID-19 and/or spread it to other people, you should get vaccinated.

 

[RocaBOT]

People are "anti-vax" like ivermectin is horse de-wormer.

Also, the definition of vaccine has been changed by the CDC to include inhaling farts, just so that they can keep calling this thing a "vaccine".

source or get out

 

[Foxi4]

On the subject of the vaccine, I wonder what @Lacius has to say about a phenomenon I learned about recently. There’s an interesting disease that affects poultry called Marek’s disease, it attacks a chicken’s lymphatic system. The actual disease isn’t really of interest here, but rather the prevention mechanism and its indirect effects. Areas affected by MDV generally vaccinate their poultry against the disease, however the vaccine is “leaky”, meaning it protects the host from harm, but does not prevent contracting or shedding the virus. This ultimately led to a somewhat vicious cycle of chickens having to continuously receive boosters against new mutated strains of MDV, and with each cycle the virus becomes more and more resistant, necessitating a new vaccine. This is oddly reminiscent to our current predicament, and it would be somewhat ironic if the booster model become a driving factor in COVID mutation, considering we already know that vaccinated patients can have viral loads of Delta that are equivalent to those in an unvaccinated patient (we just don’t really know if they’re “live”, so to speak).

https://www.pbs.org/newshour/science/tthis-chicken-vaccine-makes-virus-dangerous

Thoughts? I found the parallel quite interesting, but I’m no virologist myself.

 

[AlexMCS]

Nobody said the vaccines were perfect, but they've been demonstrated to be safe, particularly when contrasted with the risks associated with contracting COVID-19. As your your link to the prion-based disease claim, it's purely speculative. There is no evidence that the COVID-19 vaccines are associated with prion-based diseases.


The vaccines underwent the "experimentation" stage before they were available to the general public under emergency use authorization. Since then, the Pfizer vaccine has received full FDA approval. It is incorrect to say the vaccines are "indeed experimental" or that people broadly are "definitely being used as test subjects."

The vaccines have been demonstrated to be safe and effective. If you want to minimize the odds you'll contract COVID-19 and/or spread it to other people, you should get vaccinated.

Their only demonstration of safety is short term, other than a "few" (quite a lot, but considering the scale, not much, really) severe reactions and side effects.
Effectiveness is great, as expected, which is why I don't condemn them at all.

They are fully approved by the FDA, not my local sanitary authority, ANVISA.
They are all experimental over here.

And Pfizer is the one I trust the least. I fear those mRNA/Adenovirus vaccines can be quite potential triggers to autoimmune diseases, among other issues.
I just think it is not worth the risk at the moment.

Yes, I think CoViD-19 isn't as bad as whatever the long term effects of those vaccines might be, so, for now, I'm just observing.