[POLL] 2020 U.S. Presidential Election

[Lacius]

First, as a common person outside what they have already done. (Reached out to another that was one of the recipients on a multi recipient message) you cannot truly verify the validity of these email messages out side of the fact that they totally match up time line wise and contain a lot of personal emails that match up to people and personalities and other outside events that reflect reality.

To suggest they are fake is just a feeling/guess. None of us have access to the messages in their original form on that hard drive. I don't believe it is normal to provide details at that low of a level in situations like this.

They have already confirmed that on at least one very damning email it is legitimate because of confirmation from another party on that email. That is good enough to indicate there is something here, and there likely will be further confirmation from others in the days to come.

2nd.

Every single one of those email messages should have all of its metadata associated with it.

Which will contain all the message headers (x-headers)

Rudy Giuliani is a seasoned attorney. The moment he had that hard drive he would have had experts confirm the validity of the data before moving forward. They would have checked the meta data on each of these messages to confirm everything looked legitimate.

x-headers for each and every email will show it's path from who sent it, in many cases systems that processed the message along its way and the path it took to get to Hunter Biden.

You can pretty much guarantee all of that has been verified, the experts would look at the different providers mail servers that relayed the messages on their way to Hunter, confirmed times/dates in these x-headers all looked legitimate.

If you believe that Rudy got this hard drive and has done no follow up with experts with all of the data on it before moving forward then you don't know how attorneys work.

This is the real deal, and the the democrats are only going to make it worse on themselves pushing some fake Russian narrative on this.

For example, take the 1 single most incriminating email where a lunch is arranged after a meeting with Joe and Hunters Ukrainian associates. If from the x-headers it can be shown that email servers abc.gmail.com with IP xxx.xxx.xxx.xxx processed that email from the sender on xxx date and time, and it was sent to abd.gmail.com with IP xxx.xxx.xxx on xxx date and time and then was sent to hosta.hotmail.com with IP xxx.xxx.xxx.xxx on xxx date and time which was sent to hostb.hotmail.com with IP xxx.xxx.xxx.xxx date and time before being delivered to Hunter Biden. (Everything I listed is an example, I don't recall the mail providers involved with this particular message)

If this were to turn into an investigation. They can file a discovery subpoena to both Microsoft and Google to confirm if they have logs on their end correlating these messages going through their MTA's on those dates and times from the servers I listed above in my example, and even if they don't have the logs any more they can confirm that all the servers were accurate based on name/IP etc.. If anything matches up, boom. That's all it takes.

Summary.

Anyone saying these emails are not real is only guessing and has no real way to dispute the validity without the original in their hands. And if you think Rudy Giuliani as a long time attorney has not had all of this verified as much as can be, then you just don't get how this stuff works.

And we already have 1 party confirming the validity of one of the damning emails.

1. The FBI warned in 2019 that Rudy Giuliani "was being used to feed Russian misinformation."
2. We know the Russians' method of operations in 2017 in France was to hack emails, leak emails, but scatter fake emails in the real hacked emails to make them seem legitimate.
3. We know Burisma emails were hacked by Russia in January.
4. We know that the emails being discussed in this misinformation campaign likely in part came from the Burisma hack.
5. We know US intelligence analysts feared Russia would dump hacked and forged Burisma emails targeting Biden as an October surprise.
6. We know the FBI is investigating if recently published emails are tied to Russian disinformation effort targeting Biden.

This is a fake story. Stop pretending there is any evidence to the contrary, and stop pretending there isn't evidence that it's a fake story. You're peddling conspiracy theories and Russian misinformation.

 

[omgcat]

1. The FBI warned in 2019 that Rudy Giuliani "was being used to feed Russian misinformation."
2. We know the Russians' method of operations in 2017 in France was to hack emails, leak emails, but scatter fake emails in the real hacked emails to make them seem legitimate.
3. We know Burisma emails were hacked by Russia in January.
4. We know that the emails being discussed in this misinformation campaign likely in part came from the Burisma hack.
5. We know US intelligence analysts feared Russia would dump hacked and forged Burisma emails targeting Biden as an October surprise.
6. We know the FBI is investigating if recently published emails are tied to Russian disinformation effort targeting Biden.

This is a fake story. Stop pretending there is any evidence to the contrary, and stop pretending there isn't evidence that it's a fake story. You're peddling conspiracy theories and Russian misinformation.

not only that, he's trying to technobabble people who actually work with computers for a living.

 

[Lacius]

not only that, he's trying to technobabble people who actually work with computers for a living.

And not only that, but Trump was told all of this before we knew it, and he's knowingly peddling Russian disinformation anyway. It's arguably treasonous.

 

[GhostLatte]

Let us take a look at the democratic party & their history. KKK founded by DEMOCRATS. Democratic party are member & supporters of the KKK. Robert C Byrd was a democrat, he was a member of the KKK, once he was no longer a member he still supported them. Biden use to openly support the KKK, segregation etc. Biden use to take full credit for the crime bill that led to mass incarceration of African Americans. He really has not done anything positive for America during his whole entire political career, the same can be said about Sanders. Biden not answering the question about packing the court is admittance that he plans to pack the court. Joe Biden is a corrupt politician, no doubt about that, but the majority of career politicians are corrupt. Some of you say Trump lies more than any other President, false. Career politicians lie more. We are still being lied to by the Obama admin about numerous things, the investigation into Trump & dealings with Ukraine specifically. We are probably still being lied to about numerous things from past administrations from decades ago, but that is just one mans assumption. Securing the southern border got Trump a lot of hate. Every president before Trump spent millions securing the southern border but yet Trump is bad for doing it. There use to be this thing called operation wetback. Operation wetback was a joint operation between USA and Mexico. USA allowed Mexicans to come to America to work & in exchange Mexico helped secure our southern border. Thanks to Trump we have Mexico securing our southern border again. Trade war with China is great for America in the long run. Does anyone remember when America use to make electronics? There use to be this thing called the DUMPING ACT. The Dumping Act prevented Chinese made products from being sold in America for less than what American made products were being sold for. This encouraged American citizens to buy American made products. America is to dependent on other countries.

The parties switched in case you forgot.

 

[Lacius]

Let us take a look at the democratic party & their history. KKK founded by DEMOCRATS. Democratic party are member & supporters of the KKK. Robert C Byrd was a democrat, he was a member of the KKK, once he was no longer a member he still supported them. Biden use to openly support the KKK, segregation etc. Biden use to take full credit for the crime bill that led to mass incarceration of African Americans. He really has not done anything positive for America during his whole entire political career, the same can be said about Sanders. Biden not answering the question about packing the court is admittance that he plans to pack the court. Joe Biden is a corrupt politician, no doubt about that, but the majority of career politicians are corrupt. Some of you say Trump lies more than any other President, false. Career politicians lie more. We are still being lied to by the Obama admin about numerous things, the investigation into Trump & dealings with Ukraine specifically. We are probably still being lied to about numerous things from past administrations from decades ago, but that is just one mans assumption. Securing the southern border got Trump a lot of hate. Every president before Trump spent millions securing the southern border but yet Trump is bad for doing it. There use to be this thing called operation wetback. Operation wetback was a joint operation between USA and Mexico. USA allowed Mexicans to come to America to work & in exchange Mexico helped secure our southern border. Thanks to Trump we have Mexico securing our southern border again. Trade war with China is great for America in the long run. Does anyone remember when America use to make electronics? There use to be this thing called the DUMPING ACT. The Dumping Act prevented Chinese made products from being sold in America for less than what American made products were being sold for. This encouraged American citizens to buy American made products. America is to dependent on other countries.

Learn some history:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Party_switching_in_the_United_States

https://simple.wikipedia.org/wiki/Party_realignment_in_the_United_States

 

[omgcat]

the most interesting thing i have seen is that the republicans published messages of hunter coming to his dad for help, saddened by his drug addiction, and all Joe cared about was that he was safe. if they think that is bad, they are insane. the opioid epidemic has ravaged the united states, especially the Midwest for a while now. So many families are going to see that message, and understand the humanity that Joe Biden has. humanizing your competition is a bad move, especially if you have a history of throwing people under the bus.

 

[crimpshrine]

who is this person? also, you wouldn't be looking at x-headers for to/from information based on the SMTP protocol. standard message headers contain all that info already, x-headers track information about what happens to mail by the user or experimental features, not how it got there. if you need a refresher, or in my opinion a chance to look at it for the first time, you can see the headers and their protocols here. another thing to watch out for is that SMTP header manipulation is easy, like known for 20+ years easy. I'm not quite sure you are informed enough to talk about this stuff in a technical capacity.

LOL, what are you a level 1 tech or something? I know exactly how this stuff works. Have for a pretty long time.

You sound like someone trying to act like you know what you are talking about. LOL.

SMTP is the Simple Mail Transfer Protocol.

It is the conduit that is used to move messages around the Internet (and on local networks for organizations)

When 1 mail gateway sends a message to another it uses SMTP to do this.

Every email message contains meta data as I listed above. These are message headers/ x-headers. In these headers there are details related to the message exchange that took place along the way (via SMTP) and also x-headers added by systems that process these messages, spam fighting processes, security products, etc..

As I said above in my original message all of these messages would contain the details of how they got to Hunter. Which would all be verified before they made the determination they were likely legitimate. This same metadata can be used to correlate the transfer of the message on the other side in their logs on their mail servers during the legal discovery process.

It's very simple if you understand. For you to say "I work in the IT field" does not mean squat. Without the raw messages in your hand you cannot get visibility into this data.

And again I will restate, a seasoned attorney the FIRST thing they would do when getting something like this hard drive is get a 3rd party to look into the details that will be available for each and every one of these emails.

 

[omgcat]

LOL, what are you a level 1 tech or something? I know exactly how this stuff works. Have for a pretty long time.

You sound like someone trying to act like you know what you are talking about. LOL.

SMTP is the Simple Mail Transfer Protocol.

It is the conduit that is used to move messages around the Internet (and on local networks for organizations)

When 1 mail gateway sends a message to another it uses SMTP to do this.

Every email message contains meta data as I listed above. These are message headers/ x-headers. In these headers there are details related to the message exchange that took place along the way (via SMTP) and also x-headers added by systems that process these messages, spam fighting processes, security products, etc..

As I said above in my original message all of these messages would contain the details of how they got to Hunter. Which would all be verified before they made the determination they were likely legitimate. This same metadata can be used to correlate the transfer of the message on the other side in their logs on their mail servers during the legal discovery process.

It's very simple if you understand. For you to say "I work in the IT field" does not mean squat. Without the raw messages in your hand you cannot get visibility into this data.

And again I will restate, a seasoned attorney the FIRST thing they would do when getting something like this hard drive is get a 3rd party to look into the details that will be available for each and every one of these emails.

so who is the person verifying the information? still waiting on a name.

 

[crimpshrine]

Wow, I just saw this email from Hunters dump.

While it is not related to Joe, it is interesting nevertheless.

Why the heck is Steve Clemons (A Journalist) providing this guidance? WOW!

 

[omgcat]

Wow, I just saw this email from Hunters dump.

While it is not related to Joe, it is interesting nevertheless.

Why the heck is Steve Clemons (A Journalist) providing this guidance? WOW!

View attachment 229682

link to the dump?

 

[crimpshrine]

so who is the person verifying the information? still waiting on a name.

I already posted the link to it pages back I think yesterday. They announced it on Thursday I think.

Find it yourself. And seriously, you are in no way or shape suitable to make any judgements on if these emails are fake or not. And posting links to some other people who ALSO don't have the raw messages claiming it is fake is even worse.

And the fact you don't know how the process works at a legal level before it would get to this point is telling.

You think he just got that hard drive and has released the info in it? If it was someone like you or I, yeah maybe. But not a seasoned lawyer. I guarantee there have been MULTIPLE people that have already went over all the underlying details related to these emails before they told him they looked legitimate.

Edit:

Actually I misread what you said, I thought you were asking about one of the recipients on one of the 1 emails that they confirmed so far.

You can find the emails yourself. I am not posting any links to those.

 

[omgcat]

I already posted the link to it pages back I think yesterday. They announced it on Thursday I think.

Find it yourself. And seriously, you are in no way or shape suitable to make any judgements on if these emails are fake or not. And posting links to some other people who ALSO don't have the raw messages claiming it is fake is even worse.

And the fact you don't know how the process works at a legal level before it would get to this point is telling.

You think he just got that hard drive and has released the info in it? If it was someone like you or I, yeah maybe. But not a seasoned lawyer. I guarantee there have been MULTIPLE people that have already went over all the underlying details related to these emails before they told him they looked legitimate.

Edit:

Actually I misread what you said, I thought you were asking about one of the recipients on one of the 1 emails that they confirmed so far.

You can find the emails yourself. I am not posting any links to those.

still trying to hunt the email dump down, but seriously you claim someone has verified the emails, who are they?

 

[crimpshrine]

still trying to hunt the email dump down, but seriously you claim someone has verified the emails, who are they?

I have no idea, I have no way of knowing that.

But I know how attorneys work. It's pretty universal.

An attorney like Rudy has very little technical understanding.

Do you think he is the one that hooked up that drive to get the data off of it? No, my mom would probably be as good at doing that as Rudy.

But Rudy understands you can't just make claims without being able to back them up. (when it gets to the point of charging someone with something) Especially at levels like this.

Attorneys usually rely on 3rd parties, they normally have people that do this kind of stuff for them. So whoever this 3rd party is they would have dumped all the data for them and would have been asked to verify the likely validity of the data. This is where deeper analysis would come into play.

Like if someone provided me with the RAW dump of all those emails. I think in a couple days I would be able to determine the likely authenticity of the emails just based on all the headers I could extract from each message.

If you have ever watched attorneys do their work in court they are very methodical. But what gets them to that point of being so organized with documented proof and examples and everything else is from 90% of everyone else involved extracting details and doing work etc.

An attorney like Rudy is kind like the film director for a case. In a way I guess you could say. Not sure if that is the best analogy. But Rudy knows what he wants to determine but does not have the skills to do that with everything.

 

[omgcat]

I have no idea, I have no way of knowing that.

But I know how attorneys work. It's pretty universal.

An attorney like Rudy has very little technical understanding.

Do you think he is the one that hooked up that drive to get the data off of it? No, my mom would probably be as good at doing that as Rudy.

But Rudy understands you can't just make claims without being able to back them up. (when it gets to the point of charging someone with something) Especially at levels like this.

Attorneys usually rely on 3rd parties, they normally have people that do this kind of stuff for them. So whoever this 3rd party is they would have dumped all the data for them and would have been asked to verify the likely validity of the data. This is where deeper analysis would come into play.

Like if someone provided me with the RAW dump of all those emails. I think in a couple days I would be able to determine the likely authenticity of the emails just based on all the headers I could extract from each message.

If you have ever watched attorneys do their work in court they are very methodical. But what gets them to that point of being so organized with documented proof and examples and everything else is from 90% of everyone else involved extracting details and doing work etc.

An attorney like Rudy is kind like the film director for a case. In a way I guess you could say. Not sure if that is the best analogy. But Rudy knows what he wants to determine but does not have the skills to do that with everything.

until names come out verifying the info, it's bunk. no one has access to the actual files and no one is stepping forward to confirm this as real. all i could find is fox news stating an anonymous source verified the info. but we all know how you feel about anonymous sources.

 

[crimpshrine]

until names come out verifying the info, it's bunk. no one has access to the actual files and no one is stepping forward to confirm this as real. all i could find is fox news stating an anonymous source verified the info. but we all know how you feel about anonymous sources.

From your understanding I could see how you would think that.

But I guarantee those initial check boxes and analysis have been done. That brought it to the point it got to so far.

And AGAIN, we already have confirmation on one of the damning China based emails one of the recipients confirmed the message obtained from this they also got. So a 3rd party outside of Hunter has confirmed at least one of the damning emails.

What is funny to me, is those with TDS the double standards are amazing at what point you feel like the burden of proof has been met.

 

[omgcat]

we'll see how this develops. with 16 days left until election day, and massive early voting, I'm not sure how much this news would even change the outcome of the election. considering giulliani had this info for months, he really shit the bed on choosing when to release it.

 

[crimpshrine]

we'll see how this develops. with 16 days left until election day, and massive early voting, I'm not sure how much this news would even change the outcome of the election. considering giulliani had this info for months, he really shit the bed on choosing when to release it.

I think it is already having an impact.

I know it is only anecdotal, my MOM knew about this. She mentioned it to me on Friday evening I think it was when I was talking to her. I think the Streisand Effect occurred the moment Social media started trying to censor this.

But yeah we won't know for certain till later about where this will go, what more is coming, what impact it had ,etc..

 

[LumInvader]

I personally think Trump has a better chance this year then in 2016.

Trump's Covid-19 response is a huge selling point and should really help him.

Nearly 218,000 Covid-19 deaths in the US through 10-17-20
https://covid.cdc.gov/covid-data-tracker/#cases_casesinlast7days

The Trump campaign reportedly ordered venue workers to remove thousands of social distancing labels ahead of his Tulsa rally
https://www.businessinsider.com/tru...ocial-distancing-labels-at-tulsa-rally-2020-6



Former GOP presidential hopeful Herman Cain, who attended Tulsa rally, dies of COVID-19
https://apnews.com/article/herman-c...020-oklahoma-8173fe14f7cf7095ced3b55fdc65581e

Fauci: 'We had a superspreader event in the White House'
https://thehill.com/policy/healthcare/520409-fauci-we-had-a-superspreader-event-in-the-white-house

Trump, stricken by COVID-19, flown to military hospital
https://apnews.com/article/virus-ou...ichael-pence-f6ba3a16ab9b74b161a3a7211248e97e

Trump's aggregate polling reached a new low on Saturday, now trails Biden by 10.7 points
https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/polls/president-general/national/

 

[omgcat]

Trump's Covid-19 response is a huge selling point and should really help him.

Nearly 218,000 Covid-19 deaths in the US through 10-17-20
https://covid.cdc.gov/covid-data-tracker/#cases_casesinlast7days

The Trump campaign reportedly ordered venue workers to remove thousands of social distancing labels ahead of his Tulsa rally
https://www.businessinsider.com/tru...ocial-distancing-labels-at-tulsa-rally-2020-6



Former GOP presidential hopeful Herman Cain, who attended Tulsa rally, dies of COVID-19
https://apnews.com/article/herman-c...020-oklahoma-8173fe14f7cf7095ced3b55fdc65581e

Fauci: 'We had a superspreader event in the White House'
https://thehill.com/policy/healthcare/520409-fauci-we-had-a-superspreader-event-in-the-white-house

Trump, stricken by COVID-19, flown to military hospital
https://apnews.com/article/virus-ou...ichael-pence-f6ba3a16ab9b74b161a3a7211248e97e

Trump's aggregate polling reached a new low on Saturday, now trails Biden by 10.7 points
https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/polls/president-general/national/

it really fucks me up that herman cain's twitter account is tweeting after he died. like let dead people lie.

 

[LumInvader]

it really fucks me up that herman cain's twitter account is tweeting after he died. like let dead people lie.

Yikes, I didn't know that. I agree.