Thousands of migrant children are reporting they were sexually assaulted in U.S. custody

[DeadlyFoez]

Ok, the question is who was sexually assaulting the children? Oh, illegal immigrants! MUST BLAME TRUMP!!!

Did you not realize that most of the children were abused before they even reached the border?

People need to stop letting the media play them.

 

[The Catboy]

Does quantity really matter? This isn't the first time democrats dog pile massive amount of allegations to destroy someones reputation.

So basically you are just going to attempt to dismiss them as if this is a grand conspiracy against Trump and ICE? Is that really what everything boils down to nowadays? It's somehow part of the Democrat's conspiracy to bring down Trump?

 

[notimp]

Ok, the question is who was sexually assaulting the children? Oh, illegal immigrants! MUST BLAME TRUMP!!!

Function of society - to keep safety infrastructures up.

Not to separate parents from their children and then engage in collective neglect, so that stuff like that can happen.

Even if the Trump administration would have not used it as political a gambit to appeal to "race-sesitive" voters, who wanted to hear the "parents will be separated from their children at the border" message, it would have been severe neglect. But because they have - its far worse.

Another example, why blaming it on one person doesnt help. Now people who are pro Trump think, they can defend sexual violence against children in the US with a "it was mostly foreigners who did it" rebuttal. Only 3% service personal.

 

[DeadlyFoez]

Function of society - to keep safety infrastructures up.

Not to separate parents from their children and then engage in collective neglect, so that stuff like that can happen.

Even if the Trump administration would have not used it as political gambit to appeal to "race-sesitive" voters, it would have been severe neglect. But because they have - its far worse.

Another example, why blaming it on one person doesnt help. Now people who are pro Trump think, they can defend sexual violence against children in the US with a "it was mostly foreigners who did it". Only 3% service personal.

Who is defending sexual violence against children? I am saying to stop blaming people whom did not actually do the act of sexual assault, instead blame the rapists and criminals. How does that not make sense?

 

[notimp]

Also blame the people who created the circumstance, under which this could happen to children, systematically - on US ground. Children who were in the official care of the state.

It can not even be argued to have been a "blindsight" issue, because "them foreigners are so sexually aggressive" - because it was literally neglect, that allowed this to happen. So if any infrastructure would have been in place to adher to the specific needs of minors (obligatory supervision) this could not have happend to that extent.

This is mass sexual violence under US custody...

What did they do? Wait for the polling people to get around, to catch, that this was an issue? Are those conservative values?

 

[DeadlyFoez]

Only way to do that is to crack down hard on employers who hire undocumented workers. In other words, it'll never happen under Republicans, they'll only provide more cheap talk and proposals for completely ineffective solutions to obfuscate their true intentions.

Out of all the absolutely ridiculous political nonsense that you diarrhea through your keyboard, This really takes the cake.
Blaming all this mess on the republicans is insanity, when it is the democrats fighting tooth and nail to continue to allow illegals into the country and to not have them booted out of here. It is the democrats that continue to encourage illegals to continue to come into this country.

 

[Anunnymous]

[Insert comment here.]

[Get persecuted for having a different belief and viewpoint.]

[Repeat a few dozen times.]


/thread

 

[DeadlyFoez]

Also blame the people who created the circumstance, under which this could happen to children, systematically - on US ground. Children who were in the official care of the state.

It can not even be argued to have been a "blindsight" issue, because "them foreigners are so sexually aggressive" - because it was literally neglect, that allowed this to happen. So if any infrastructure would have been in place to adher to the specific needs of minors (obligatory supervision) this could not have happend to that extent.

This is mass sexual violence under US custody...

What did they do? Wait for the polling people to get around, to catch, that this was an issue? Are those conservative values?

Buddy, you do realize that it is impossible to monitor tens of thousands of people all at once. The moment someone looks away these criminals take their chance.

The only way to prevent this from happening on US soil is to make sure these criminals never make it over the border, but they will still rape children everywhere else. So then who's fault is it? Mexico's because it happened in their country? No, it is still the criminals fault because they are the one's actually doing the act.

 

[notimp]

Buddy, you do realize that it is impossible to monitor tens of thousands of people all at once.

Then I'd suggest to at least leave them their parents for protection? Hot tip, for next time.

Its not even that. As I said before, the state is supposed to uphold a safety infrastructure. You dont have to monitor people individually to make sure, that this cant happen on mass scale - the only thing you have to do, really - is not to neglect them.

Talk to them, give them emotional support, catch when every tenth child suddenly shows signs of emotional withdrawal, because they got raped at night. You know... Schools are supposed to also be able to tell, when a child is neglected or abused at home. At least give them that level of protection.

Dont wait until the polls come in.


I wonder if the people responsible for this to take place sleep well at night with the excuse of "sexually aggressive foreigners".

edit: Here is another hot tip. Get them out of those prelim camps and into society propper.

 

[DeadlyFoez]

Then I'd suggest to at least leave them their parents for protection? Hot tip, for next time.

Its not even that. As I said before, the state is supposed to uphold a safety infrastructure. You dont have to monitor people individually to make sure, that this cant happen on mass scale - the only thing you have to do, really - is to not neglect them.

Talk to them, give them emotional support, catch when every tenth child suddenly shows signs of emotional withdrawal, because they got raped at night. You know... Schools are supposed to also be able to tell, when a child is neglected or abused at home. At least give them that level of protection.

Dont wait until the polls come in.


I wonder if the people responsible for this to take place sleep well at night with the excuse of "sexually aggressive foreigners".

MANY of the parents and people that claim to be the parents are actually harming the children too. So that logic does not work.

So is it the schools fault if they did not notice the signs of abuse? NO! It is the perpetrators fault! We need to stop blaming others for the criminal actions of these people.

 

[notimp]

Listened to the congress mans statement. They actually tried to implement policy to mitigate this from a certain point forward. So they knew it was a problem, and tried to counteract.

*sigh*

 

[FAST6191]

Sucks if so. Hopefully they can clean house and/or get the necessary resources if it comes to pass. Mind you I am still not entirely sure why people are so up in arms about the notion of separation to begin with.

So is it the schools fault if they did not notice the signs of abuse? NO! It is the perpetrators fault! We need to stop blaming others for the criminal actions of these people.

It could be. While I am equally baffled by the "teach them not to *" mindset some espouse for such things the main counter to that is we have the legal system and such there for those individuals that don't care about such things and go anyway. Part of that is a detection and response framework. Similarly part of the law is depraved-indifference as well as reckless endangerment/culpable negligence, police are often empowered to stop and search under their expertise (driving under the influence and weapons being the big two, https://www.edwardtufte.com/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg?msg_id=0002w4 for a nice graphic there), and by similar token school teachers, care workers or key members of staff there are trained (in the UK it is called safeguarding, I don't know what terms are favoured in the US these days. https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/ofsted-safeguarding-policy/ofsted-safeguarding-policy has a bit more there) to detect things that may be troubling them, the failure to report or failure to act then potentially coming back to bite you in a big way.

 

[erikas]

So basically you are just going to attempt to dismiss them as if this is a grand conspiracy against Trump and ICE? Is that really what everything boils down to nowadays? It's somehow part of the Democrat's conspiracy to bring down Trump?

Probably. Though i am open to be proven wrong by investigation. My willingness to believe sexual assault allegations has been exhausted by what has been happening for the past year. I say that most, if not all of those allegations against ICE workers are lies. If I'm proven wrong, I'll admit i was wrong. Until then, it's another #metoo smear campaign.

 

[Taleweaver]

Does quantity really matter? This isn't the first time democrats dog pile massive amount of allegations to destroy someones reputation.

My inner devil likes how you change the narrative from "thousands of reports of sexual abuses" to "a massive amount of allegations to destroy someones reputation". If this was fiction, I'd put on a monocle, stroke a cat and practice my sinister laugh.
EDIT: nice going. In the time I wrote this post, you even upped your antagonist-act even more.


But alas: this isn't fiction. The truth is that there is a massive problem. The size matters to actual humans (if you really need me to point out to you that more reported sexual abuses are worse than fewer or no sexual abuses, then you need some serious help). And "but think of the reputation!!!" is neither appropriate to the victims nor helping the case.


Neither is blaming Trump, by the way. That guy has his own share of problems to solve right now.


No...the problem is that if this ICE is really so understaffed that they can't properly keep an eye on inmates despite immigrations being at an all-time low, then there is something wrong on that front. I agree that this isn't really news but a morbid consequence of the earlier discussed situation where immigrant parents and children are being divided from each other. So here's the thing: let's stop putting blame and FREAKING DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT! If the situation has worsened since this policy change, then revert the change. Simple, no?


I'm all of piling some more accusations on top of the already huge mountain against the president, but let that action cause no delay in unfucking this situation first and beforehand.

 

[erikas]

My inner devil likes how you change the narrative from "thousands of reports of sexual abuses" to "a massive amount of allegations to destroy someones reputation". If this was fiction, I'd put on a monocle, stroke a cat and practice my sinister laugh.


But alas: this isn't fiction. The truth is that there is a massive problem. The size matters to actual humans (if you really need me to point out to you that more reported sexual abuses are worse than fewer or no sexual abuses, then you need some serious help). And "but think of the reputation!!!" is neither appropriate to the victims nor helping the case.


Neither is blaming Trump, by the way. That guy has his own share of problems to solve right now.


No...the problem is that if this ICE is really so understaffed that they can't properly keep an eye on inmates despite immigrations being at an all-time low, then there is something wrong on that front. I agree that this isn't really news but a morbid consequence of the earlier discussed situation where immigrant parents and children are being divided from each other. So here's the thing: let's stop putting blame and FREAKING DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT! If the situation has worsened since this policy change, then revert the change. Simple, no?


I'm all of piling some more accusations on top of the already huge mountain against the president, but let that action cause no delay in unfucking this situation first and beforehand.

The safety of people trying to breach the border is their own responsibility and nobody elses. Also the "few thousand" narrative is misleading. I do not care about them raping each other, Only if the ICE workers participated. And those allegations are around 200, so could very well be misidentification. I'd also like to know the circumstances of how these allegations were made.

 

[SG854]

ICE mistreating immigrants? Haven't they be doing this for FUCKING DECADES? Been saying it since Obama came into office. ICE needs to go. That whole entire outfit (including the aforementioned departments above) are a waste of the taxpayers dime.

Some Police officers mistreat people. The police force must go.

ICE has been doing a lot better under Trump then it has under Obama when it comes to types of people being deported. When you compare 2009 Obama’s first year in office 39% people deported had prior criminal history compared to 61% non criminal. In 2017 Trumps first year 74% deported had prior criminal history compared to 26% non criminal.

And all the shots against the Republican Party doesn’t make sense since the creation of ICE was largely responsible by the Democratic Party. And it also doesn’t make sense that Republicans would be against illegal immigrantion but want a to hire illegals for cheap labor. Being against illegal immigration would go against their cause. Which is the complaint I heard I this thread.

Not only that the Democratic politicians rail against ending ICE, but when the Republican Party called their bluff and said they’ll bring the legislation to the house floor, they changed their mind and said they’ll vote no on ending ICE. They don’t want to actually end ICE, and just again manipulating people for votes.

What needs to be done, rather than completely abolish ICE, since ICE has its place, is to improve it so that this stuff the main topic of this thread is about doesn’t happen. Improve so they aren’t sexually assaulted.

 

[Subtle Demise]

Some Police officers mistreat people. The police force must go.

ICE has been doing a lot better under Trump then it has under Obama when it comes to types of people being deported. When you compare 2009 Obama’s first year in office 39% people deported had prior criminal history compared to 61% non criminal. In 2017 Trumps first year 74% deported had prior criminal history compared to 26% non criminal.

And all the shots against the Republican Party doesn’t make sense since the creation of ICE was largely responsible by the Democratic Party. And it also doesn’t make sense that Republicans would be against illegal immigrantion but want a to hire illegals for cheap labor. Being against illegal immigration would go against their cause. Which is the complaint I heard I this thread.

The police force could be cut down to 10-25% of what it is now, and at the very least de-millitarized. Ending drug control would make them all but completely unnecessary. Funnily enough, ending the drug war and legalizing and regulating prostitution would deter a lot of illegal immigration.

 

[SG854]

The police force could be cut down to 10-25% of what it is now, and at the very least de-millitarized. Ending drug control would make them all but completely unnecessary. Funnily enough, ending the drug war and legalizing and regulating prostitution would deter a lot of illegal immigration.

The vast majority in prison isn’t in there because of drugs. They are in there because of violent crimes. Drug offenses make up a small percentage. Heather Mac Donald has books on this topic. I do think though we should legalize drugs.

Cutting down the police would be a bad idea, when you look at not just the U.S. but other countries less police enforcement led to higher crime rates. I’m also against militarization of police too.

 

[FAST6191]

The safety of people trying to breach the border is their own responsibility and nobody elses.

While I certainly imagine it is a perilous endeavour, and consider it accordingly, the same thing that sees you send out your ships to rescue those in distress regardless of country of origin, the ideas underpinning the treatment of prisoners of war ( https://www.ohchr.org/EN/ProfessionalInterest/Pages/TreatmentOfPrisonersOfWar.aspx ), the US being a signatory to the UN convention on the rights of the child ( https://www.ohchr.org/en/professionalinterest/pages/crc.aspx ), general human rights concepts and so on means you have some duty of care for those whom you detain, and if under your watch routine abuses happen then it reflects badly upon you.
If international treaties are not your thing then constitutional rights are given to those present within the borders https://www.pbs.org/newshour/politics/what-constitutional-rights-do-undocumented-immigrants-have and many variations on that have gone all the way to the supreme court with them saying yep. It is not like they choose to be the detention camps either.

 

[Fugelmir]

If true, it should probably serve as a deterrent to migrants. "Keep your butthole intact -- stay in Venezuela."