When is pirating ok? (discussion)

[jimskeet2002]

WHAYRhfadfhasfjhsadf

your stealing the profit the developer put into the software

No I am not... He wouldn't get my money for it either way... So i still don't steal something from them

 

[Rydian]

WHAYRhfadfhasfjhsadf

your stealing the profit the developer put into the software

Bullshit.

In order for theft to happen, the object has to be there in the first place.

There is no money in the software, and pirating software does not cause anybody to lose money. If so, then explain to me how? Do little MAGICAL PIXIES WITH TELEPORTING LEFT ASSCHEEKS waltz into the big bank accounts of companies and steal money every time they see somebody torrent a copy of Mass Effect or something?

 

[EyeZ]

No I am not... He wouldn't get my money for it either way... So i still don't steal something from them

That's a valid point

 

[Valwin]

No I am not... He wouldn't get my money for it either way... So i still don't steal something from them

your stealing the damn game you enjoying the experience without monetary exchange how do i need to spell it for you if you steal fine ok but a least say your stealing

 

[ShadowSoldier]

Whole America is stolen from Indians... I don't see someone giving it back to them Me paying taxes for corrupt governments to steal the money is stealing... None is giving them back to me... and the only thing you find to complain is about downloaded games? Are you serious???? Whole Europe is a victim of financial war ATM and so many families lose their homes and money to thieves (politicians) and you still brag about downloaded video games???? Really?

Are you actually pretending to be dumb or are you actually dumb? I can't tell anymore.

Poor Australians... My bro is a student there and can't stand the country...... They have super fast cars and don't even drive faster than 140kph.... LOL Then what the heck do you buy a mustang for??? to race with a skateboard????

Why in the hell would you want to go faster than 140 anyways? Jesus christ, there's no way in hell you're out of 6th grade.

 

[PolloDiablo]

"If a tree falls in a forest and no one is around to hear it, does it make a sound?"
"If someone downloads copyrighted material and no one is around to realize it, does it make it illegal?"

Spoiler: The Answer:

 

[jimskeet2002]

Are you actually pretending to be dumb or are you actually dumb? I can't tell anymore.



Why in the hell would you want to go faster than 140 anyways? Jesus christ, there's no way in hell you're out of 6th grade.

For the same reason anybody wants to go faster than 140. Listen. When I buy my Yamaha R1 (1000cc race bike with top speed of 300kmh) I am buying it so I can run with it. Cause I like running I but what would you know
Also why am i dumb? can you explain to me plz?

 

[Issac]

I've read some of the thread (5 pages out of 8)... and I just want to chime in with my oppinion.
When is pirating okay?
Almost never!
I do think it's alright to download an album in mp3 format, if you happen to own the Vinyl for example. Sure you can rip your own vinyl, but that's an effin' pain in the ass, so if there are mp3's online, why not?
Also, a movie that isn't sold any more, a tv series with no other option to view it (No possibility to import, etc.)... or an out of print album that you want, but can't find.
And the last case where I think it's okay: I own Actraiser. I have the cartridge. I was bored in school, downloaded it and played it on an emulator to pass the time. Or, I own Seiken Densetsu 3 (I actually do!) and I want to play it in english.
Apart from that. Nope. Never okay.

THIS doesn't say that I don't do it. I pirate a lot. I can, it's free. I do. I try to buy as many games I can, I want to support sometimes. But I'm poor as hell right now. Not any kind of "justification", but that is why I mostly buy games for un-hacked consoles and pirate the rest right now.

 

[Rydian]

your stealing the damn game

Bullshit. Piracy is not theft, EVEN US LAW SAYS SO.

Theft, larceny, criminal law. US Code, Title 10.
http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/10/921

Piracy, copyright infringement. US Code, Title 17.
http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/17

The only places that say it's theft are big companies when they're lying, and people like you that don't know any better.

you enjoying the experience without monetary exchange

So going to a friend's house and watching their copy of the movie is stealing?

Your logic sucks.

 

[osaka35]

WHAYRhfadfhasfjhsadf

your stealing the profit the developer put into the software

Rydian is talking about theft in regards to the legal definition. Since it is a matter of copyright infringement, Rydian is saying it's not a criminal act, just one you can be sued for. Meaning you can't serve any time in prison/jail for violating copyright (unless you're selling copyrighted stuff), unlike if you stole the same game from a store or something. You're talking about a more...conceptual idea of theft.

 

[Blaze163]

Ah, the old piracy issue. This never gets old.

I turned to piracy because given the circumstances of my life at the time, I needed some way to pick myself up and give me some much needed escapism from the nightmare that was my world. Video games have always been able to do that for me but I was so poor I could barely afford food, so I turned to hacking. It worked, and enabled me to get through a rough time in my life. Over time I have gradually weaned myself off it though, as my life recovers and I no longer need it as urgently. As I stand at present, I pirate under the following conditions;

- The game is prohibitively rare or expensive. Example, try tracking down a decent condition copy of PS2 gem 'Shadow of the Collosus'. Good luck with that. Even if I do find one it goes for extortionate prices, even preowned it's £25 around here. I refuse to pay more for a game than I paid for the system I play it on. Bollocks to that. Download.

- There's literally no other way to play it. Example, the English patched ISO of Monster Hunter Portable 3rd flat out doesn't exist without piracy, and without disabling my PS2's regional lockout with FreeMCBoot I have no way to play US-Only games like Ape Escape 3, Taled of Legendia, etc. If legal methods fail me I'll do what I must.

- I paid for the game once before but was forced to sell it. Example, more or less all of the PSP ISOs I have. I paid for them once before, the developers have had their money off me. I can't imagine they lose a whole hell of a lot by me not spending £8 to buy back my preowned copy of Outrun 2006, and they've had money off me already, so screw it. ISO time.

- Movies I can't wait to see but can't afford cinema tickets for. I usually invest in the DVD if the movie is truly worth it, though. In fact I saw a trailer years ago for The Count Of Monte Cristo and REALLY wanted to see it. Could never find the DVD, so I downloaded it. Love that film, one of my all time favourites. Years later I finally stumbled across the DVD and even though I had the download, I still bought the DVD.

- The Pokemon Anime I watch online. I'd be more than happy to pay for the DVD box sets if it were possible to get them for less than £75 per season. Anyone who honestly thinks they're worth that much can get down on one knee and kiss my hairy left arse cheek.

Other than that I've been good recently and pay for most of my games, and most of the movies. To be fair though when I'm finding games like Kid Icarus, Metal Gear and Resident Evil Revelations for a mere £10 in my local Asda, there's no need to spend hours downloading games. I'm good for a few hundred hours already with the backlog I have to clear up. Still got Tactics Ogre and Final Fantasy Tactics to keep my PSP charged for, not started either of them yet. And if all else fails I have about 30-odd PS2 games I grabbed for 20p each to work through. First on the list, Viewtiful Joe 1+2. Then a little Devil May Cry.

 

[Rydian]

Rydian is talking about theft in regards to the legal definition. Since it is a matter of copyright infringement, Rydian is saying it's not a criminal act, just one you can be sued for. Meaning you can't serve any time in prison/jail for violating copyright (unless you're selling copyrighted stuff), unlike if you stole the same game from a store or something. You're talking about a more...conceptual idea of theft.

People think of theft as bad in that theft is an act that directly harms somebody.

Which is why the idea that piracy not actually causing monetary loss is so hard for them to comprehend, because they've been eating lies their whole life.

 

[gamefan5]

Have you ever heard of anyone been arrested for downloading video games?

Yes. Yes I did. Had to pay a massive fine for damages. How massive is it? Probably more then you'll ever make in your life. XD

 

[the_randomizer]

Downloading a game illegally is only downloading a digital copy of said game, not the original source itself, hence why it's copyright infringement and not true theft. You might get fined, but going to jail isn't likely.

I agree with what was said, many games are extortionately priced and/or are hard to get a hold of. Personally, I don't care if people download games, especially if they're no longer generating revenue or belong to now-defunct companies. I feel the same about games I own but might get lost/stolen, I don't want to have to pay for another copy, hence why I backed up my Gamecube/Wii collection on an HDD, so I don't have to swap back and forth, nor do I have to repurchase said games. If someone is that paranoid, use a VPN.

 

[Sicklyboy]

WHAYRhfadfhasfjhsadf

your stealing the profit the developer put into the software

Me downloading a game does not put money back into my bank account.

Oh so it is fine if they legally rip us off but it is not fine if we illegally download their games hehe. Nice. Guess what. I will keep playing pirated games and none will sue me .
[...]

Good luck.

[...]
So going to a friend's house and watching their copy of the movie is stealing?

Your logic sucks.

Exactly. About as much as listening to public radio and switching the stations before commercial breaks is stealing.

There is little correlation between budget and amount of content, especially when comparing movies and video games.

For example:
Bioshock - budget $15mil - Development 3 years - Sales 4 mil units over all platforms - Avg. Playtime 20-25 hours

Transformers 3 - budget $270mil - Development 20 months (includes pre-production) - Total Box Office$1,123,746,996 - DVD sales $44,783,000 (figures for Oct/Nov/Dec 2011 only and no bluray figures available) - Runtime 154 minutes

Movies have two main sources of income; ticket sales and dvd sales. Games have one source of income, take longer to produce (unless we're talking about CoD or Sports games), are produced in far fewer numbers, bring in waayyyyyyy less profit (unless we're talking about CoD) and give the buyer far more content with their purchase. 3 playthroughs of Bioshock = 26 viewings of Transformers 3. Production costs tied to dvd/bluray come from printing/packaging. Blockbusters have already made their millions (and sometimes billions) long before a dvd release. Low budget films have lower expectations.

I understand that. A big problem though is availability due to price. There's a lot of people that would love to play every new game that comes out, and would have no problem paying for each one if they didn't cost so much. If games cost $15-$20 a piece, and even $30 for some of the big title games, I'd have very little problem buying each one I want to play. But at $60 a pop, that's a LOT of money. That's almost as much as I make in a day of work. So on a small scale, we're looking at me not being able to give the producers my money because I don't have enough and me not playing the game, or me not giving the producers my money because I don't have enough and still getting to appreciate their work and encourage me to purchase some of their products at a future date if I have some more disposable money. In either case, the developer gets no money up front, but at the pirate scenario, they're still not losing anything, but have the prospect of me buying some of their goods at a late date because I am now a bit more familiar with their work.
I'm not saying piracy is good, I'm not endorsing it, I'm not saying anyone ought to do it. I do think it is wrong no matter how you look at it. But that doesn't stop me from doing it on occasion.

 

[Parasite X]

I admit I buy new and used games if I do pirate it's for DS and GBA games but I also buy those games. Is it wrong to download illegal copies of games you don't own yes but it's ok if you own the games it's also ok if you plan to buy those games you downloaded.

 

[Zetta_x]

your stealing the damn game you enjoying the experience without monetary exchange how do i need to spell it for you if you steal fine ok but a least say your stealing

I've never seen someone troll by literally being dumber than rocks. Valwin, your lack of ability to logically put things together scares me. I'm serious, you just displayed logic behavior 3-4 standard deviations below normal, this is almost unheard of. I have taught special ed kids and I don't even know where to start with you. Rydian has made the best distinction between stealing and pirating even in legal terms and the only thing you did was regurgitate your posts. Please, re-read what has been posted to learn your errors. Seriously

 

[Chary]

I pirate, and I don't care whether it's legal or non-legal. I hardly doubt the police will come and arrest me.

In the end, it's just a matter on the availability of what I want. Official soundtracks to Sonic the Hedgehog games? They cost $90+. Pirate it. An English copy of Mother 3? Can't be purchased. Pirate it. Old TV shows that have not EVER been released on VHS/DvD? I'll never have it if I don't pirate it. So guess what? Pirate it.

I have an enormous collection of video games/movies/ect. I'm not saying that once you spend a certain amount of money, it's OK to pirate, but sheesh, I can't plunk ALL my money into things I want. So, of course, if given an opportunity, I'll pirate something, and have no qualms about it.

 

[retKHAAAN]

Me downloading a game does not put money back into my bank account.


Good luck.


Exactly. About as much as listening to public radio and switching the stations before commercial breaks is stealing.

I understand that. A big problem though is availability due to price. There's a lot of people that would love to play every new game that comes out, and would have no problem paying for each one if they didn't cost so much. If games cost $15-$20 a piece, and even $30 for some of the big title games, I'd have very little problem buying each one I want to play. But at $60 a pop, that's a LOT of money. That's almost as much as I make in a day of work. So on a small scale, we're looking at me not being able to give the producers my money because I don't have enough and me not playing the game, or me not giving the producers my money because I don't have enough and still getting to appreciate their work and encourage me to purchase some of their products at a future date if I have some more disposable money. In either case, the developer gets no money up front, but at the pirate scenario, they're still not losing anything, but have the prospect of me buying some of their goods at a late date because I am now a bit more familiar with their work.
I'm not saying piracy is good, I'm not endorsing it, I'm not saying anyone ought to do it. I do think it is wrong no matter how you look at it. But that doesn't stop me from doing it on occasion.

And yet, gaming is a hobby and a luxury. Something for collectors and enthusiasts. Let's say I'm a runner. Do I buy every new pair of shoes that come out? No. I buy the ones I like best, use them until they wear out, and then start looking for another pair. The trouble with games is that everyone seems to think they have the "right" to play everything. They don't. You don't. If you feel a true need to play everything that comes out...I'm sure google can bring up the medical name for whichever personality disorder causes that... There's an obscene sense of entitlement among communities like these. People develop this belief that if a game gets released then they should get to play it and will justify this ridiculous belief by telling themselves it's the dev's fault or the publisher's fault or the economy's fault... It's silly.

 

[Sephtenshi]

your stealing the damn game you enjoying the experience without monetary exchange how do i need to spell it for you if you steal fine ok but a least say your stealing

Good Lord!!! "You're" not "your"