Hacking Why add anti-piracy measures to Devolution ?

[JoostinOnline]

And some new Wii's have old drives that work with GC games.

 

[retKHAAAN]

There's nothing stopping tueidj from building a PC side app to transmit the dvv file to the Wii via wifi...

 

[tueidj]

As I see it, he was telling me I was wrong and that that claim is supposed by accepted on nothing but his authority, without evidential support. Arguments from authority are fallacious. What is required to prove that a claim is wrong is evidence to the contrary. Just saying so without providing evidence disproves nothing.

As I see it, you were telling me I was wrong and that that claim is supposed to be accepted on nothing but your authority, without evidential support. Arguments from authority are fallacious. What is required to prove a claim is evidence. Just saying so without providing evidence proves nothing.

 

[Ericss]

If Devolution was made with Family Edition Wii's in mind[1]
and Family Edition Wii's cannot read Gamecube disks
then doesn't this inference result in a false conclusion
where the conclusion is disk-based AP?

References:

1. WHY: To do what the "official" method doesn't. I hate GC controllers and the crappy little discs. And if you bought a new model wii you can't play NGC games at all.

The author has said that maybe he implement the verification through a PC DVD drive, so the games will be able to verify for people who have damaged his wii dvd drives or have the new model wii.

There's nothing stopping tueidj from building a PC side app to transmit the dvv file to the Wii via wifi...

I thought most PC DVD drives were unable to read GC minidiscs?

 

[Lumstar]

If Devolution was made with Family Edition Wii's in mind[1]
and Family Edition Wii's cannot read Gamecube disks
then doesn't this inference result in a false conclusion
where the conclusion is disk-based AP?

References:

1. WHY: To do what the "official" method doesn't. I hate GC controllers and the crappy little discs. And if you bought a new model wii you can't play NGC games at all.

The author has said that maybe he implement the verification through a PC DVD drive, so the games will be able to verify for people who have damaged his wii dvd drives or have the new model wii.

There's nothing stopping tueidj from building a PC side app to transmit the dvv file to the Wii via wifi...

I thought most PC DVD drives were unable to read GC minidiscs?

Generally they don't. I'm not certain quite why. As if PC drives aren't usually coded to understand the data structure or something.

Nintendo deviated from standards just enough to curb license fees and pirates. At the cost they may not market GC (and Wii) games with official DVD branding. Copyrighted logo and all that.
Nowhere in a manual, advertising, box art, disc label, press release, or any other policitically-correct Nintendo media, will you find any GC/Wii disc or drive referred to by the name "DVD".

 

[McHaggis]

Generally they don't. I'm not certain quite why. As if PC drives aren't usually coded to understand the data structure or something.

Nintendo media is designed to be read at constant angular velocity, for which only a few drives have the capability.

 

[tmv_josue]

If Devolution was made with Family Edition Wii's in mind[1]
and Family Edition Wii's cannot read Gamecube disks
then doesn't this inference result in a false conclusion
where the conclusion is disk-based AP?

References:

1. WHY: To do what the "official" method doesn't. I hate GC controllers and the crappy little discs. And if you bought a new model wii you can't play NGC games at all.

The author has said that maybe he implement the verification through a PC DVD drive, so the games will be able to verify for people who have damaged his wii dvd drives or have the new model wii.

I thought most PC DVD drives were unable to read GC minidiscs?

Generally they don't. I'm not certain quite why. As if PC drives aren't usually coded to understand the data structure or something.

Nintendo deviated from standards just enough to curb license fees and pirates. At the cost they may not market GC (and Wii) games with official DVD branding. Copyrighted logo and all that.
Nowhere in a manual, advertising, box art, disc label, press release, or any other policitically-correct Nintendo media, will you find any GC/Wii disc or drive referred to by the name "DVD".

I do not think it's easy to do but you should have hope in that:

Most PC drives are capable of doing the necessary steps to check the authenticity of a GC game, but because the OS normally tries to read the disc's actual data as soon as it is inserted the drive ends up stuck in a read-error-retry loop before any program has a chance to do anything.

 

[obcd]

I already tried to explain that the AP isn't there to prevent piracy.
It's simply an argument for the program to be delivered as closed source.

And this info comes from where?

Even if it were true, why would anyone need an argument to release their project as closed source? It's their's, they can do what they want with it. If that means closed source, so be it. (unless they happen to use GPL code or something, of course)

...Which can't be verified if the code is encrypted to protect the AP.

This information comes from logical thinking, deduction and years of experience. It's on topic with the title of this threat..
Maybe I should have written: "The Ap isn't only there to prevent piracy.."

 

[retKHAAAN]

lol @ people who use "logic" to deduce what a dev might be thinking when implementing something they know the majority of users will hate...especially considering we're talking about tueidj here...

 

[tueidj]

Do you really think I would be stupid enough to include GPL code when it is virtually guaranteed that people are going to be looking at the machine code and attempting to reverse engineer it?

 

[retKHAAAN]

Do you really think I would be stupid enough to include GPL code when it is virtually guaranteed that people are going to be looking at the machine code and attempting to reverse engineer it?

Considering there are users here who claim to know your program better than you do, would you expect anything less?

 

[PsyBlade]

Could we please drop that "argueing against the author" buisness.
Even his claims about what the program does are not sacrosanct.
Behavior observable by experiment for yourself tops claims regardless of whoever made them.

Not that I tried it this for myself.
Its just that advocating to generally dismiss things like that is just wrong.
It's not the middle ages anymore.

 

[bowser]

Hey I have a question:

How the hell do you pronounce tueidj?

 

[crono141]

This thread makes me LOL. So many facepalms in such a short amount of time.

 

[lex luthor]

Hey I have a question:

How the hell do you pronounce tueidj?

Two-eed-g

 

[obcd]

Do you really think I would be stupid enough to include GPL code when it is virtually guaranteed that people are going to be looking at the machine code and attempting to reverse engineer it?

HBC is closed source and as far as I know is based upon libogc.
The purpose of it being closed source is to prevent people from duplicating it and claiming it's their work....
Another argument is that people will start modifying it and will produce versions with bugs.
Before I was told it was to protect the exploit. I agree HBC isn't using an exploit. It's installer is likely using one.
Aren't most of these arguments usable for every piece of software? (Including devolution..)

Honestly, I don't know what to think and it's not really important.

Nobody seems to care for HBC, so why would we for devolution.
I just wanted to break the repeating circle of the same arguments coming back.
We will lose readers in this threat if we keep hammering on the same.. The sponsors won't like it

 

[Maxternal]

Hey I have a question:

How the hell do you pronounce tueidj?

Two-eed-g

How did you know that?

---

 

[Rydian]

Could we please drop that "argueing against the author" buisness.
Even his claims about what the program does are not sacrosanct.
Behavior observable by experiment for yourself tops claims regardless of whoever made them.

Not that I tried it this for myself.
Its just that advocating to generally dismiss things like that is just wrong.
It's not the middle ages anymore.

The fact that it goes against what the author said was not the main point, it was secondary backup. His claim failed simple flowchart logic too (I even posted a damn flowchart).

 

[Torran]

There's nothing stopping tueidj from building a PC side app to transmit the dvv file to the Wii via wifi...

Actually, I wouldn't do that if I were you.
The only reason there isn't a cracking effort for Devolution
is because it runs on a platform that lacks crackers.
Switch to the PC scene and you have a different story.
Here, DRM's are cracked within the hour or day.

 

[Rydian]

The PC wouldn't need to be tricked, it'd still be the Wii doing the checks.