The End of Capitalism in Germany is here

[Engert]

Whoa whoa whoa.
I think you and others here are missing the point which is "how did you get here"?
Cos no one is advocating Nazis again. I think it's pretty clear where that lead.
So the question is "why are you in this situation again?"
Because of fucking Merkel that's why. So you got no one to blame but yourselves.

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------

Vote Merkel out, get a handle on immigration who is raping your female population and then we can go back to somewhat normal situation.
Not to mention here that at this point Merkel is such as pacifist that she can't even tell Erdogan to "fuck off" with his authoritarian rule.

 

[Youkai]

I think you have no idea what you are talking about and what is actually going on in Germany or Europe.
Germany is becoming a horrible cesspit of racism once again and Nazi-parties are once again getting elected.
How could you have missed that?
The execution of the refugee-crisis was handled poorly and a lot of germans are doing what they always do when they are scared... they vote for Nazis again.
No one took the time to check what kind of people we actually let in and now we don't just have people fleeing war and death... we also have dangerous criminals in our midst.
Germans are among the most peaceful people in the world until they no longer feel safe in their own homes and then they begin to lash out.

You think we are bout to become socialists again?
That we will live in harmony with others and share what we have?
Don't fucking kid yourself.
It's about to get much worse if this situation isn't resolved quickly.

Finally someone living in reality ! (not a joke)

Most people really have no clue at all and just don't care, that's actually why the Brexit happened

@Engert
So everyone is socialist in Europe ? that's news to me oO
Most Partys declare themself as Social that's true but in the end none of them is ...

And Socialism can never work anyways so who cares, everything a human does is actualy for Capitalism.
Else there would be much more Social workers doing it for free but there are rarely people doing social works especially when they don't get paid

Whoa whoa whoa.
I think you and others here are missing the point which is "how did you get here"?
Cos no one is advocating Nazis again. I think it's pretty clear where that lead.
So the question is "why are you in this situation again?"
Because of fucking Merkel that's why. So you got no one to blame but yourselves.

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------

Vote Merkel out, get a handle on immigration who is raping your female population and then we can go back to somewhat normal situation.
Not to mention here that at this point Merkel is such as pacifist that she can't even tell Erdogan to "fuck off" which his authoritarian rule.

You know that not Merkel made the War down there right ? it was mainly America and even the Turks and whatever fueling this since years

I don't like her and I never voted for her and I am not happy with all the foreigners coming in here especially not as they are not even ALLOWED ! to work even if they wanted so we have to pay everything for them -.-V

Still people blaming everything on here are just plainly wrong

I guess news in most part of the world only show a small part of the big thing and the first thing they usually show is Merkel telling everyone to come to Europe ...

 

[Phantom64]

cool with a far left wing Germany EUSSR would be a thing

Spoiler: no thanks

 

[Engert]

Sigh. @Youkai yes they're not socialist like Lenin or Stalin but they are socialist in policies and in the way government runs.
Compared to USA , Europe is socialist.

 

[KingpinSlim]

Finally someone living in reality ! (not a joke)

Most people really have no clue at all and just don't care, that's actually why the Brexit happened

@Engert
So everyone is socialist in Europe ? that's news to me oO
Most Partys declare themself as Social that's true but in the end none of them is ...



You know that not Merkel made the War down there right ? it was mainly America and even the Turks and whatever fueling this since years

And Socialism can never work anyways so who cares, everything a human does is actualy for Capitalism.
Else there would be much more Social workers doing it for free but there are rarely people doing social works especially when they don't get paid

You know what the worst part about all this is?
I am not happy here and i want to get out, but... where should i go?
Sure, it's horrible here and about to get much worse, but there really isn't a place that is any better.
I have no options.
So i stay, avoid the whole situation and hide.

 

[Ray Koopa]

If you think that coalition will change or end capitalism, then epic slowclap, you're probably living in your capitalism-is-cancer dreams.

 

[KingpinSlim]

Sigh. @Youkai yes they're not socialist like Lenin or Stalin but they are socialist in policies and in the way government runs.
Compared to USA , Europe is socialist.

That is not how this works and you simply do not grasp the words you are using.
Nothing is suddenly socialist just because you compared it to something else.
Something is either socialist, or it isn't.

Socialism is a political system that works by revoking ownership, controlling the economy and dictating peoples lifes.
I am clueless why you think europe would suddenly exhibit all of these aspects if you only compare it to the USA.
You can compare Europe to the moon and it still would not be acurate.
Your statement is ridiculously void of any merrit.
You do not understand what socialism is and i do not think you understand how comparisons work.

 

[Foxi4]

Capitalism and democracy do not exclude eachother - they exist alongside eachother and belong to separate categories. You don't have to pick, you can have both. Democracy is a system of government, capitalism is an economic model, so the whole premise of the thread is pointless. As for capitalism being the "cancer that's killing us", it's absolutely false - capitalism is the driving force of progress. Before the dynamic duo of capitalism and democracy came along, the history of mankind consisted of a 100 000 years of divisions into feifdoms and constant war over territory and resources. Today we live in some of the most peaceful times in history, crime rates are lowest since the beginning of time, education levels are highest they've ever been and we're not constantly on the verge of poverty anymore because some feudal d*ckhead took all our harvest as payment for an arbitrary tax. Thinking that capitalism causes problems exposes a fundamental lack of understanding how the market works. Capitalism is a system in which the customer is always right and companies are in a constant battle over who can provide goods and services more efficiently and at a better value, capitalism behooves you. Problems occur when corrupt idiots in governments enact regulations that restrict the mechanisms of the free market, create monopolies or make fair competition impossible. In a truly capitalist system citizens can band together against a shitty corporation and run it out of business by providing a better service, which is exactly what Uber is doing to taxi corporations as we speak. The invention and introduction of the capitalist model is one of humanity's greatest achievements and thinking otherwise is immature and naive. You'll grow out of it eventually, to be precise, you'll grow out of it when you'll achieve something in life and socialists will immediately neg you to share it with everybody else, even though they've had zero input into your success. Capitalism is the only system that incentivises initiative and self-improvement and rewards hard work and creative, inventive thinking - it's what we need more of, not less.

 

[Engert]

@KingpinSlim I think you are not being logical about this whole thing when you talk about schematics like this is a court room.
When the government pays for schools and healthcare is called to be LIKE a socialist government.
In USA government doesn't pay for schools for all its citizens and doesn't pay for their healthcare.
I think you need to get your perseptions straight.

 

[KingpinSlim]

@KingpinSlim I think you are not being logical about this whole thing when you talk about schematics like this is a court room.
When the government pays for schools and healthcare is called to be LIKE a socialist government.
In USA government doesn't pay for schools for all its citizens and doesn't pay for their healthcare.
I think you need to get your perseptions straight.

These are not hallmarks of socialism and you thinking that they are makes me sad, but doesn't suprise me.
If a goverment doesn't invest in the health and education of its citizens that makes it a shit goverment, but if a goverment provides these things that doesn't make it socialist in any way, shape or form.
It just makes it a marginably less shit goverment.
You are american, so i am not going to blame you for throwing around sensationalist "buzzwords", because thats what your politicians do. They don't know what they are talking about either and only do it to invoke some sort of emotion in the people when they hear "socialism" and they link any kind of social reform to that word, to keep them away from it.
Social Democracy, Social reform, socialism... it all has "social" in it. Must be the same thing, right?
right?

 

[Foxi4]

@KingpinSlim I think you are not being logical about this whole thing when you talk about schematics like this is a court room.
When the government pays for schools and healthcare is called to be LIKE a socialist government.
In USA government doesn't pay for schools for all its citizens and doesn't pay for their healthcare.
I think you need to get your perseptions straight.

Correction - in both instances it's the citizens who pay for healthcare and education because the government doesn't have any money that belongs to it - the budget of a country consists of tax money. You're paying for both either way, it's just that the payment for public services is cleverly concealed. The problem with public healthcare and education is that you're not just paying for yourself - you're also paying for everybody else. In addition, the U.S. does have public schools and a degree of public healthcare via Medicaid and Medicare.

 

[Engert]

There was a candidate called Bernie sanders who I was going to vote for in this election.
He had socialist policies, so I know what they are but you're failing to undersand that these are not buzz words from an American but your failure as a people to allow yourselves to get in this situation by having an idealistic leader like Merkel who for the sake of an ideal is abandoning its countrymen.

 

[KingpinSlim]

There was a candidate called Bernie sanders who I was going to vote for in this election.
He had socialist policies, so I know what they are but you're failing to undersand that these are not buzz words from an American but your failure as a people to allow yourselves to get in this situation by having an idealistic leader like Merkel who for the sake of an ideal is abandoning its countrymen.

The things you are talking about have nothing to do with Socialism.
Bernie Sanders used that word, too. I know.
He might BE a socialist, but he didn't want socialism for america.
All these things you mentioned are great social things to do.
But still social does not equate socialism.
Do me a favor and at the very least read the wikipedia article on socialism and social democracy, if you don't have the time to read actual books on the subject.
You will see that no part of europe is in the least socialist and that people use this word wrong, all the time and americans are by far the worst offenders here.

 

[MisterPantsEyes]

Capitalism and democracy do not exclude eachother - they exist alongside eachother and belong to separate categories. You don't have to pick, you can have both. Democracy is a system of government, capitalism is an economic model, so the whole premise of the thread is pointless. As for capitalism being the "cancer that's killing us", it's absolutely false - capitalism is the driving force of progress. Before the dynamic duo of capitalism and democracy came along, the history of mankind consisted of a 100 000 years of divisions into feifdoms and constant war over territory and resources. Today we live in some of the most peaceful times in history, crime rates are lowest since the beginning of time, education levels are highest they've ever been and we're not constantly on the verge of poverty anymore because some feudal d*ckhead took all our harvest as payment for an arbitrary tax. Thinking that capitalism causes problems exposes a fundamental lack of understanding how the market works. Capitalism is a system in which the customer is always right and companies are in a constant battle over who can provide goods and services more efficiently and at a better value, capitalism behooves you. Problems occur when corrupt idiots in governments enact regulations that restrict the mechanisms of the free market, create monopolies or make fair competition impossible. In a truly capitalist system citizens can band together against a shitty corporation and run it out of business by providing a better service, which is exactly what Uber is doing to taxi corporations as we speak. The invention and introduction of the capitalist model is one of humanity's greatest achievements and thinking otherwise is immature and naive. You'll grow out of it eventually, to be precise, you'll grow out of it when you'll achieve something in life and socialists will immediately neg you to share it with everybody else, even though they've had zero input into your success. Capitalism is the only system that incentivises initiative and self-improvement and rewards hard work and creative, inventive thinking - it's what we need more of, not less.

This is rediculous. You think that in a socialist society, there would be no new inventions or progress, but this is just wrong.

Here you can see what happens in a capitalistic country when your market is """free""": http://www.news.com.au/lifestyle/he...g/news-story/bd82470b4e2984d2e36ffd42e3218ee1

And if I were rich, of course I'd share the money with others. There shouldn't be people who have millions while others are poor, I think it's the best when we just take most of the money from the rich and give it to the ones who really need it.

PS: People here joke about how your country is ruled by piss.

 

[KingpinSlim]

This is rediculous. You think that in a socialist society, there would be no new inventions or progress, but this is just wrong.

Here you can see what happens in a capitalistic country when your market is """free""": http://www.news.com.au/lifestyle/he...g/news-story/bd82470b4e2984d2e36ffd42e3218ee1

And if I were rich, of course I'd share the money with others. There shouldn't be people who have millions while others are poor, I think it's the best when we just take most of the money from the rich and give it to the ones who really need it.

PS: People here joke about how your country is ruled by piss.

If socialism is so amazing comrade, then explain to me why every communist nation in the world ended up like a spitting image of hell?
You are german, you know exactly what happened when east germany became socialist.
You should know better. You should know how these poor people suffered.
You are either uneducated or blinded by some kind of idealism. Neither option is good.

 

[Foxi4]

This is rediculous. You think that in a socialist society, there would be no new inventions or progress, but this is just wrong.

Here you can see what happens in a capitalistic country when your market is """free""": http://www.news.com.au/lifestyle/he...g/news-story/bd82470b4e2984d2e36ffd42e3218ee1

And if I were rich, of course I'd share the money with others. There shouldn't be people who have millions while others are poor, I think it's the best when we just take most of the money from the rich and give it to the ones who really need it.

PS: People here joke about how your country is ruled by piss.

There were dozens of alternatives to the drug, not to mention that this man is a con artist and he's been arrested for fraud. He's not a "model capitalist", he's a criminal. Not only that, there's nothing capitalist about the drug industry which is heavily subsidised by socialists like yourself who think it's appropriate to give multinational corporations "free money" for some inane reason. Capitalism, in and out of itself, takes care of the customer as dead customers don't tend to spend a lot of money. The system you claim to be faulty put this man in court. I also never said that there would be no progress, however it would be considerably slower. The birth of capitalism fueled the industrial revolution, the most prolific period of scientific discovery and technological development in the history of mankind. You have capitalism to thank for mechanised farming which solved our major problems with the sustainability of our food supply, among other things. Capitalism provides an incentive for development - profit. Socialism does not. I know a couple of fields where you could find better strawmen to beat up. You can make fun of my country all you want, at least I can spell properly. As for sharing, there's a difference between charity and pillaging or theft which you don't seem to understand. Nobody is entitled to the fruits of your labour - there is no public claim on income. "Boo-hoo, give me some of your moooney! I haven't done anything to deserve it, but I waaant it" - go earn your own. Rich people are rich because they and their entire family worked hard across multiple generations to get rich - it's not your money, nor should it be.

 

[KingpinSlim]

There were dozens of alternatives to the drug, not to mention that this man is a con artist and he's been arrested for fraud. He's not a "model capitalist", he's a criminal. Capitalism, in and out of itself, takes care of the customer as dead customers don't tend to spend a lot of money. The system you claim to be faulty put this man in court. I also never said that there would be no progress, however it would be considerably slower. The birth of capitalism fueled the industrial revolution, the most prolific period of scientific discovery and technological development in the history of mankind. You have capitalism to thank for when it comes to mechanised farming which solved our major problems with the sustainability of our food supply. I know a couple of fields where you could find better strawman to beat up.

I hate to admit that you are right. Not because i disagree with anything you are saying, but because i wish you were wrong.
Capitalism, for all intents and purposes is horrible and it makes me miserable, but it still is the best option we have.
Socialism SOUNDS better and i know that many people wish it could be real, but some things only work in books, not in real life.

There is no perfect system and there never will be, because every system by itself could in theory be absolute perfection and yet it will fail at actually being implemented as such.
The greatest enemy to prosperity is idealism.

 

[grossaffe]

So I think we all can agree that capitalism is the cancer that is killing us and that democratic socialism is what we need to have.

Well that's a bold statement to start out with. An untrue one at that.

 

[Foxi4]

Well that's a bold statement to start out with. An untrue one at that.

We should probably start out by saying that we're having this conversation because several corporations had a vested interest in providing us with computer hardware and software as well as providing us with the Internet service that allows us to communicate over long distances. This conversation exists because it was profitable for someone to give us the capability to have it.

I hate to admit that you are right. Not because i disagree with anything you are saying, but because i wish you were wrong.
Capitalism, for all intents and purposes is horrible and it makes me miserable, but it still is the best option we have.
Socialism SOUNDS better and i know that many people wish it could be real, but some things only work in books, not in real life.

There is no perfect system and there never will be, because every system by itself could in theory be absolute perfection and yet it will fail at actually being implemented as such.
The greatest enemy to prosperity is idealism.

Capitalism *is* the perfect system, it provides standardised means of exchanging your labour (upon conversion into legal tender) for goods and services and creates a competitive playing field so that companies consistently try to one-up eachother in order to give you better value for your money. Problems arise when someone tries to f*ck with this simple and beautiful system by introducing corruption, cronyism, nepotism and other forms of f*ckery.

 

[KingpinSlim]

We should probably start out by saying that we're having this conversation because several corporations had a vested interest in providing us with computer hardware and software as well as providing us with the Internet service that allows us to communicate over long distances. This conversation exists because it was profitable for someone to give us the capability to have it.
Capitalism *is* the perfect system, it provides standardised means of exchanging your labour (upon conversion into legal tender) for goods and services and creates a competitive playing field so that companies consistently try to one-up eachother in order to give you better value for your money. Problems arise when someone tries to f*ck with this simple and beautiful system by introducing corruption, cronyism, nepotism and other forms of f*ckery.

I respect your views, but i disagree.
Any system that offers rewards to humans also invites horrible misconduct.
Capitalism is a system that gives humans a lot of freedom.
Therefor in combination with democracy it is my favorite system as well, but to call it perfect is inacurate.
Any system that gives any human the freedom to abuse the system and do harm before he is punished has already failed once it has begun.
Humans, as a whole, are not able to ever reach perfection in anything they do.

 

[MisterPantsEyes]

Correction - in both instances it's the citizens who pay for healthcare and education because the government doesn't have any money that belongs to it - the budget of a country consists of tax money. You're paying for both either way, it's just that the payment for public services is cleverly concealed. The problem with public healthcare and education is that you're not just paying for yourself - you're also paying for everybody else. In addition, the U.S. does have public schools and a degree of public healthcare via Medicaid and Medicare.

This is so wrong that I got mad while reading it. No, you're not paying for everyone else. Poor people pay less money while rich people pay more. If you are poor, you can still have health care and go to university. In capitalistic shitholes, these things are only reserved for the elite and you couldn't afford it. Of course, if you are rich, you pay for others too, but then you still have much more than enough money.

As for sharing, there's a difference between charity and pillaging or theft which you don't seem to understand. Nobody is entitled to the fruits of your labour - there is no public claim on income. "Boo-hoo, give me some of your moooney! I haven't done anything to deserve it, but I waaant it" - go earn your own.

By reading this I came to the conclusion that you were born in very wealthy family and never experienced poverty and think that all people who aren't rich are just lazy and don't want to work.

Every human should have enough to at least survive. And nobody should have millions, while there are humans who can't even feed themselves because they don't make enough money. I don't care if you call it theft, it'd be the best if the money from the rich would be taken and distributed to the poor.

Ah well, what would Jesus do?

We should probably start out by saying that we're having this conversation because several corporations had a vested interest in providing us with computer hardware and software as well as providing us with the Internet service that allows us to communicate over long distances. This conversation exists because it was profitable for someone to give us the capability to have it.
Capitalism *is* the perfect system, it provides standardised means of exchanging your labour (upon conversion into legal tender) for goods and services and creates a competitive playing field so that companies consistently try to one-up eachother in order to give you better value for your money. Problems arise when someone tries to f*ck with this simple and beautiful system by introducing corruption, cronyism, nepotism and other forms of f*ckery.

Here's something you should know: Life isn't all about profits and making money. You think that the Internet and computers were only invented because their creators wanted to get rich off it.