Hacking Is al9h really that secure?

[wurstpistole]

If, with any system update, they manage to patch it, you just stay on the last version and spoof games again, like we did pre-a9lh with 9.2. No sweat.

 

[Pokem]

LOL
As I already said, A9LH is impossible to patch without hardware revision xD

however, you also did say that they can make it harder to re-install. Some noobies here will just give up on the hacking scene.
there they go, they just stopped some pirates.
Now, I'm not saying that people are not going to get a hardmod. Obviously, some will, but many temp members are still kids, incapable of earning money yet to ship to other countries for a hardmod, soooo yeah. making it harder to install like you said does kinda help them

But then "don't update to xx.xx version" would always be an option

 

[Gray_Jack]

however, you also did say that they can make it harder to re-install. Some noobies here will just give up on the hacking scene.
there they go, they just stopped some pirates.
Now, I'm not saying that people are not going to get a hardmod. Obviously, some will, but many temp members are still kids, incapable of earning money yet to ship to other countries for a hardmod, soooo yeah. making it harder to install like you said does kinda help them

But then "don't update to xx.xx version" would always be an option

You got a point, but I really don't care about the noobies as the majority of then are just toxic people ~"I want this, I demand that, you have to do the stuff for me"~ (sure, there is one or another that they are cool, I even made a friendship with a noob guy and I saw he became a advance user). These toxic people made a lot of developers give up of the 3DS scene or make their work private, the 3DS scene lost a lot of good stuff 'cause of them. So, if the majority of these toxic people get screwed, I'll be happy to see that.

And don't come to me with "most of them are just kids, they don't know what they're doing", well... since I can remember (4 or 5 years old) I always respected everyone with they own rate and waited till the thing is done, so yeah, kids can learn that.

 

[ScarletDreamz]

Some noobies here will just give up on the hacking scene.there they go, they just stopped some pirates.

Theres a difference in Newbies, Lazy and stupid people.

A newbie tries to read, understand and actually practice the sofmodding.
A lazy person, its the one that always want someone to do it for him.
An theres always the stupid people, who "Accidentally updated", "I got banned from playing online an unreleased game" etc, this last ones deserve to be stopped.

 

[Gray_Jack]

Theres a difference in Smart, Lazy and stupid people.

A smart tries to search, read, understand and actually practice the sofmodding.
A lazy person, its the one that always want someone to do it for him.
An theres always the stupid people, who "Accidentally updated", "I got banned from playing online an unreleased game" etc, this last ones deserve to be stopped.

Correction in bold

All of then can be noobies, since the definition off noob/newbe is someone that does know nothing or very little about the subject that is being talked about.

Sadly, most of the noobies are lazy, stupid or lazy and stupid people. =/

 

[HyperT]

I've been reading about how Al9h + Luma3DS should be able to survive updates, but what about if Nintendo was really trying to remove it? I mean, it seems to me like the "arm9loaderhax.bin" on the SD card or NAND will run every start up. What stops Nintendo from modifying these files? I heard about there being write protection to the FIRM, but I haven't heard of anything that stops them from modifying files on the SD card. What if they made something that every shutdown deleted arm9loaderhax.bin (Making you have to plugin the SD card to your computer every time you want to boot up) or even worse, replace it with their own file that could delete all "not acceptable" content on the SD including EmuNAND. Of course we could patch this out, but this would require a patch to be made. Everyone who updated (who may or may not have a recent backup) would lose all of their stuff. (Assuming Nintendo wants to take a Gateway approach to things)

Or am I completely wrong and would this not work?

Regarding the sdcard. I'd say every thing that isn't encrypted on it [i.e. Nintendo 3DS folder] is classed as user's data and if you check the EULA they can't touch that.

For completeness I'm not too sure on the legalities of the save files that are in N3DS folder as you have to decrypt them to use them. I know that cartridge saves [that could be gotten to with powersaves] are classed as userdata however.

 

[Goombi]

No. With Hourglass9, yes; A9LH is preserved during a restore. With Decrypt9, it has to be specifically told to retain A9LH after a restore.

Well the way you put it, it seems a restore without "keep A9LH" will remove it. "Restore NAND (keep A9LH)" is simply "restore the backup but skip secret sector and FIRM partitions". [Source]
There is no "uninstall" with D9 only "Restore pre A9LH backup".

The only tool that can truely uninstall A9LH is SafeA9LHInstaller. And only by taking advantage of the available OTP hash. It rebuilds a clean secret sector and restores clean FIRMs partitions, effectively un-A9LHing a console. But without OTP, Nintendo is sol.

 

[wiimer]

I've been reading about how Al9h + Luma3DS

First, niceme.me It's ARM-9-Loader-Hax
A-9-L-H is actually pretty save and the non plus ultra in hacking your 3DS. You can update without being afraid and you can have your sysnand on the latest version.

 

[annoyingcalc]

Regarding the sdcard. I'd say every thing that isn't encrypted on it [i.e. Nintendo 3DS folder] is classed as user's data and if you check the EULA they can't touch that.

For completeness I'm not too sure on the legalities of the save files that are in N3DS folder as you have to decrypt them to use them. I know that cartridge saves [that could be gotten to with powersaves] are classed as userdata however.

Really? That's interesting. Would you mind linking me the EULA?

 

[The Catboy]

Here the thing, Nintendo can't just remove it because doing so will brick the system. Part of the A9LH install requires code that is console specific. Which means to remove it, without bricking the system, they would need that code first. Without that code they would not only brick A9LH users, but also people running non-hacked systems.
This is proven when you update your system without Firm0/1 protect, such as using a Gateway.

 

[annoyingcalc]

When I said remove it, I meant all data like games and homebrew not installed from the eshop. Or even EmuNAND. I got the part that code execution is secured. Just what code is run is not.

 

[xIce101x]

Worst case scenario we leave sysnand on the last FW that a9lh works on and use emunand again.

 

[HyperT]

Really? That's interesting. Would you mind linking me the EULA?

http://www.nintendo.com/consumer/info/en_na/docs.jsp

Maybe I was over/under-reading it yesterday but #4. User Content has 'You own your User Content.'

And as Nintendo only has the contents of Nintendo 3DS encrypted [not sure atm if the 3ds adds any other files/folders to a blank sdcard], they afaik can't definitively state anyother files as malicious [obviously they could compare the sha/md5 of known a9lh.bins but that would require reading data that they have no right to read]

As they haven't encrypted the sdcard as a whole [which they probably couldn't have when the 3ds's were released - might have been doable with the n3ds] - I think they have to acknowledge that the sdcard could have been used for multiple purposes.

Edit: yea I might have been wrong about what falls under "user content" reading #1 again but I think the rest of thebreasoning still stands

 

[Quantumcat]

http://www.nintendo.com/consumer/info/en_na/docs.jsp

Maybe I was over/under-reading it yesterday but #4. User Content has 'You own your User Content.'

And as Nintendo only has the contents of Nintendo 3DS encrypted [not sure atm if the 3ds adds any other files/folders to a blank sdcard], they afaik can't definitively state anyother files as malicious [obviously they could compare the sha/md5 of known a9lh.bins but that would require reading data that they have no right to read]

As they haven't encrypted the sdcard as a whole [which they probably couldn't have when the 3ds's were released - might have been doable with the n3ds] - I think they have to acknowledge that the sdcard could have been used for multiple purposes.

Edit: yea I might have been wrong about what falls under "user content" reading #1 again but I think the rest of thebreasoning still stands

This all makes sense, you might be sharing an SD card between your camera and console or PC and console. Nintendo have no right to be messing with stuff not created by the console. Imagine if they caused photos of your child as a baby to be corrupted. You wouldn't be happy.

 

[Exavold]

Out of topic but I gotta say ; it's refreshing to see a thread on 'temp where people are having actual discussions , for once.

 

[SirHaxALot]

What if they made something that every shutdown deleted arm9loaderhax.bin (Making you have to plugin the SD card to your computer every time you want to boot up) or even worse, replace it with their own file that could delete all "not acceptable" content on the SD including EmuNAND.

This part would be illegal in at least Germany (§303a StGB [In German]), as they do not own or even own the copyright of arm9loaderhax.bin or contents of the 3ds folder for example.

 

[annoyingcalc]

Awesome, that was my main concern. Thanks for helping clear that up.

 

[Cuphat]

This all makes sense, you might be sharing an SD card between your camera and console or PC and console. Nintendo have no right to be messing with stuff not created by the console. Imagine if they caused photos of your child as a baby to be corrupted. You wouldn't be happy.

If your only copy of important photos is on an SD card (or if "only copy" can be used to describe any photos of yours at all, for that matter) then you aren't going to be happy in the near future anyway. Backup your shit, people.

 

[Quantumcat]

If your only copy of important photos is on an SD card (or if "only copy" can be used to describe any photos of yours at all, for that matter) then you aren't going to be happy in the near future anyway. Backup your shit, people.

That doesn't matter. Nintendo has no right to read or tamper with their users' private files.

 

[Hyoretsu]

But then "don't update to xx.xx version" would always be an option

Worst case scenario we leave sysnand on the last FW that a9lh works on and use emunand again.

So if I have a9lh and only use my EmuNAND always at the latest version, I'll be safe forever?