Germany, a Paradise for slackers ?

Discussion in 'World News, Current Events & Politics' started by Youkai, Nov 21, 2017.

  1. Clydefrosch

    Clydefrosch GBAtemp Psycho!

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    I would guess by them actually doing more than what you think they do?
    this isn't how any job center operates, your friend has his quota of applications and he's certainly abiding by it.

    why is the guy who measures how arbeitslosengeld 2 works on his experience receiving arbeitslosengeld 1 trying to explain anything something to me?
    I've received H4 for about a year after i finished my masters degree.
    the first thing that happend was they put me in a 2 month program to teach me how to write my resume. together with a bunch of 50+ year olds who never operated a pc and teens who quit school early. all the while, i had a 5 application quota and was called in every three weeks so they could fill their quotas.
    and if you do those things, like sending out bad applications, they will punish you.
    i know this is not a thing that happens on tv (because guess what? that stuff isnt real), but its a thing that happens in the real world if you dont play by their rules.
    but again, I invite you to quit your job and see how much easier life is once you're on H4.


    my guess is you're a little piece of shit and your mother was ill in one way or another. you don't pretend to be ill and binge drugs and alcohol because you're fine.
    your anecdotal evidence does not undo reality. the system is inherently unfair and not just to the people in it. because H4 receivers cant say no to any job, no matter the conditions, its a pretty big part in why your wage has been almost stagnant for over a decade now. why ever raise wages like in the good old days when people can be legally forced to work for nothing?

    yeah we all know stories of such doctors, but neither are they the norm, they're also getting ever more rare. because guess what, insurers have been working to get rid of those rather successfully. also, the jobcenter can order a second opinion if they feel like you and your doctor are cheating the system. (which can also entail a hefty cut to h4)

    jesus man, i'm not saying its impossible to settle inside this system, but if you've never been inside, stop judging. its not half as nice as your delusional fantasies.

    why are you even whining, the H4 raise doesnt even offset inflation since the last raise. (and it hasnt for years).
     
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  2. dAVID_

    dAVID_ GBAtemp's Onion Cricket

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    Oh man, that's nothing! Try coming here to Mexico, where the minimum wage is just under $5 USD. And you said it was too little!
     
  3. Youkai
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    Youkai Demon

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    thanks -.-V

    first I wasn't talking about medica drugs but druggy drugs like LSD, Heroin and Kokain and whatever you can imagin ...

    second, no idea where you live but I guess there is a hugh difference in the job center around Germany, maybe you had bad luck with yours ...
    I know about these "got 2 hours a day into some kind of school to learn hot to write an application" stuff, another friend who finaly got work had to go there and he told me there was hardly ever any teacher there so they even had to tell the Job Center several Times about it untill they finaly could go to another place which wasn't much better. He came to my place to let me check his stuff some times (even though I don't really know any better) and now he finaly got a place where he can do a proper job training (earning 300€ a month)


    Don't know if they do something about the doctors but I know enough people that told me over and over again that they have similiar doctors ... after I moved town for my new job (moved 200km away to work!) I haven't seen any doctor nearby who would do that but thats actually a good thing ... I hardly ever go to a doc if not really needed and if I need it I want him/her to look at me...



    And about trying to live from Hartz4 money ... I did 2 ! Job training the first one 3 1/2 year with a salary of 800€ and the second one 3 years with 700-800€ and from this money I still had to pay everything except that I wasn't allowed to get the cheap food offers for the jobless and the cheap clothes as they want proof that you are poor (maybe I could have gotten something like this but no idea where from) living with my gf who is a student in her last Master year right know we got another 400€ from her parents so we hat ~1200 for 2 people that was less than my jobless friend and his wife got if you count in the money for the flat.
    Of course its hard to go to the government for the money (for some people) and beg for it but than again I wouldn't like to sit on the street and beg people for money as some do ... It is probably a different story for everyone.
    That one friend who finaly got a Job even told me he did some illegal stuff like seeling drugs he got in the netherlands back in Germany because he had no money and because of some circumstances he didn't got Hartz4 (he did quit his former mini job himself making him not getting any money for 3 month) still if you know what you are doing you can do it withouth much of a problem.

    If you "work" and learn how the system works you can benefit from it a lot, if you just use it withouth learning how to play the game you will probably loose and really have a Problem.




    P.S. just yesterday at Gallileo they said in Germany we use about 6,50€ a day for food and they checked if that is possible if you mainly eat at Fast Food places, as most of the not so intelligent people often claim it should be the cheapest possible option ...
    They checked and for these 6,50 a day you could hardly get anything at the most well known places ... only Ikea was really cheap but than again they are not really a fast food chain ^^V
    I know it doesn't really has much to do with hartz4 but mainly the not so intelligent people need this (and those who might just slack of or preffer to abuse the system) you can imagine why many of them might really have money problems.
     
  4. Joom

    Joom  ❤❤❤

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    Don't worry. Donald Trump is here to drain the swamp and make America great again. We'll all be wiping our asses with gold in no time.
     
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  5. kumikochan

    kumikochan GBAtemp Maniac

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    No they don't. Don't be so full of yourself. Never ever saw where belgium, france or the netherlands ever followed what merkel said. Belgium as an example is kicking out refugees constantly while your country opens them with open arms. Your country accepts Erdogan with open arms while Belgium tells him that he can't do speeches in public and kicking out turkish officials during Turkish election. How is that following Germany ?
     
    Last edited by kumikochan, Nov 22, 2017
  6. FAST6191

    FAST6191 Techromancer

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    Free speech type issues aside those are minor trifling things. When it comes to things that really matter to people other than tabloid headline writers Germany's already considerable clout is rather magnified.
     
  7. sarkwalvein

    sarkwalvein My mother tongue is Spanish, for god's sake!

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    The reality is that there is a limited freedom, any given country can boast so much, but they end up being limited by the decisions and possible punishments coming from the bigger fishes that impact on their economy, on their policy, and on the boundaries of their freedom.
    Don't worry, as much "influence" Germany may or may not have regarding one or other vote, America and China have a lot more influence on the EU and on Germany themselves.
     
    Last edited by sarkwalvein, Nov 22, 2017
  8. kumikochan

    kumikochan GBAtemp Maniac

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    And that was my point. Headline writers mostly talk about Merkel making non europeans think that merkel holds the most power in the union while she clearly doesn't. Other european countries don't follow what merkel does.
     
  9. FAST6191

    FAST6191 Techromancer

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    So I feel sorry for people that don't read beyond the headlines, especially those which think the political top offices really matter (it seems they are figureheads in most of Europe). I still maintain that Germany in addition to its own large number of votes hold considerable sway over much of Europe (they say vote this way and look at this nice trade contract for your natural resources you are mining which will appear, you think Spain is going to buy them?) and in turn. The two things are not mutually exclusive.
     
  10. Quantumcat

    Quantumcat Dead and alive

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    Haven't read all the replies, but to those thinking on the negative: this sort of policy creates upward pressure on wages. No one can get away with paying their workers chicken feed, because no one would work for that little if they could have the same quality of life without working. The reason US companies can get away with paying some of their workers so little that even working full time they are in effective poverty is because there is practically no social safety net. Is it really something to be proud of that you could work 40 hours a week and only be able to afford a broken down 1 bedroom apartment for you and your 3 children, and sometimes not have enough money for food or bills? I don't think that is something worth celebrating personally. In Germany if you're willing to work you can live comfortably, and if you lose your job you aren't going to become homeless and starve while you look for a new one, because your country cares about its citizens and will look after them. In the US if you are from a poor family that couldn't afford college for you, you can look forward to being poor all your life even if you work your fingers to the bone. If you lose your job and can't get a new one right away, hello living on the street. Which country do you think is "freer".
     
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  11. FAST6191

    FAST6191 Techromancer

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    http://money.cnn.com/2017/01/09/pf/cost-of-raising-a-child-2015/index.html
    "$233,610 to raise a child born in 2015..... And that number only covers costs from birth through age 17"

    Multiply that by three (though maybe 2.5 if you can hand down clothes and were not lumped with triplets or something).

    Relevant as of the last one


    In discussions like this though I do find the US... appearance of detached callousness to be odd or at least bemusing.

    I shall stop there though as I will be linking comedy sketches for hours if I start now.
     
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  12. Nightwish

    Nightwish GBAtemp Fan

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    I keep hearing of this mystical jobland where wages are livable and you don't get sacked for being sick. Not that I can personally complain as a software developer.
    There's also plenty of work that makes the world a worst place, TBH.

    You're right, it's not. Merkel and Schäuble were/are just the front for the European Financial system, and I'm sure we'll know many not-really-surprising revelations about the implementation of ordoliberalism, but there's many a tale about the EC and the ECB to be told as well.

    That's the thing with modern economics: it's not connected to precious metals anymore, so common sense doesn't apply at all. It still isn't hard to get that half of his fiscal incentives will leave immediately to foreign investors, though.
     
  13. sarkwalvein

    sarkwalvein My mother tongue is Spanish, for god's sake!

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    Life's still good. At least you have good weather.
    Don't underestimate the importance of good weather.
    I don't know if the sun is real anymore or just something I saw in a dream...
     
  14. smile72

    smile72 NewsBot

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    As a person who has used America's welfare. I can promise you it's shit. If not worse.
     
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  15. Bimmel

    Bimmel ~ Game Soundtrack Collector ~

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    Not working is no solution either in my opinion. At least when we talk about Germany.
    And yes, you don't get sacked for being sick for a longer time. Some "working" people use this system to have a good time, which is also kind of frustrating.

    But my solution instead of giving up is this one: Educate myself further and search for a better job, where I might have the power to change such things.
     
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  16. guisadop

    guisadop GBAtemp Regular

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    I don't think foreigners should be eligible for social security at all.
     
  17. Quantumcat

    Quantumcat Dead and alive

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    I doubt they are. Where did you hear they were?
     
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  18. BullyWiiPlaza

    BullyWiiPlaza Nintendo Hacking <3

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    They are, they get get benefits like normal citizens but don't necessarily work here. It's ridiculous. Germany is the only country in the world running such a policy and they are loved and exploited for that. Oh, well. It can be considered smart for reputation's sake or very naive. I tend to go with the latter though. They are not responsible for fixing everyone else's problems. :P
     
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  19. TotalInsanity4

    TotalInsanity4 GBAtemp Supreme Overlord

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    They have to become citizens first, don't they? Or at least be under a certain age, show an interest in living in the country for an extended period of time, and pay taxes
     
    Last edited by TotalInsanity4, Nov 25, 2017
  20. Julizi

    Julizi GBAtemp Regular

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    You will get a huge problem if the first sentence in your constitution is "The diginity of man is inviolable." and you refuse to pay the amount of money you consider as the minimum to live a life in dignity (which is the amount of all social benefits) to foreigners. Of course there are some exception (especially for EU citizens) but in general someone who never worked in Germany will get the same amount of money that a German would get.
     
    Last edited by Julizi, Nov 25, 2017
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