Final Fantasy VII remake thread

[tony_2018]

I actually think Bravely Default was a good game, totally different from final fantasy series (really didn't know square-enix created it). I haven't played Bravely Second.

As for how they will remake FF7, I think it just needs a graphical redesign, battle system was fine, story was fine, just update the graphics to todays gaming hardware. Man if they could remake FF6........

I started playing FF back in the SNES days and played all of Chrono Trigger, Secret of Mana, Secret of Evermore...etc..etc..
Those were some good games, well not evermore though.

 

[chartube12]

link?

There are a few articles ign posted to facebook with statements by Square Enix, stating the story will be altered to fit the timeline created by the prequel and sequels.

 

[G0R3Z]

Which is a shame. I suppose Ni No Kuni doesn't qualify as AAA?

Turn based systems are built around strategy of moves, whereas whatever they have today is just designed to move fast and keep up the flow of the game. "don't do anything that'll take the players out of the game" seems to be the mantra, as well as "let's make sure to keep the player engaged and not get bored". Which is fine and all, but they're doing a crap job with balancing that and the whole "carefully thinking about your next move" thing. It's not just nostalgia that makes me want the turn-based system, it's the winning with a strategy of my choosing. Or something like that.

On the plus side, the graphics are going to be amazing. and with a PC release, there could always be mods that'll do...something. Okay, my optimism is running a bit dry now.

Technically no, Ni No Kuni is an AAA quality game in my opinion, it didn't have millions upon millions of dollars funding it. I personally think more RPGs should be more like Ni No Kuni, that game is a masterpiece. Level-5 is a fantastic company who churns out consistantly good titles, like professor layton, inazuma eleven games, white knight chronicles and rogue galaxy among others. I don't think i've ever played a bad RPG from them. Their ethics are top-notch too, always sticking to their promises - SE could learn a lot from them.

 

[Nathan Drake]

Yeah, so far it's been pretty well established in interviews that you can find across various sites that the story is going to be altered in places, that the combat engine won't be the exact same thing (it wasn't said exactly how much it would change though), but that staple moments from the original like cross dressing cloud will still be part of it.

Personally I'm hoping for quite a few alterations. I know I'm in a minority apparently that didn't play FF7 at just the right time for it to be a fond memory loaded with nostalgia of a better time, but I think the original game kind of sucks. The story is pathetic (though nothing will fix that), the combat is the slowest of the three PS1 games, materia eliminated the idea of characters having roles, instead making it so every character could be essentially a carbon copy of another, and it otherwise didn't feel very fun. The game felt like an experimental grindfest, and although I played it when the game wasn't terribly old yet, not even young me could really get into it. Much like today, I found games like FF9 and Legend of Dragoon to be far better experiences.

Edit: By the way, Ni No Kuni is a hybrid action turn based system. You still have to constantly keep yourself moving, especially in boss fights, and although you press a button and an action happens, it isn't as if you have to stand there and take an attack unless you choose to duke it out with a familiar or otherwise. It's something closer to the Tales battle system than the old school turn based system.

 

[G0R3Z]

Yeah, so far it's been pretty well established in interviews that you can find across various sites that the story is going to be altered in places, that the combat engine won't be the exact same thing (it wasn't said exactly how much it would change though), but that staple moments from the original like cross dressing cloud will still be part of it.

Personally I'm hoping for quite a few alterations. I know I'm in a minority apparently that didn't play FF7 at just the right time for it to be a fond memory loaded with nostalgia of a better time, but I think the original game kind of sucks. The story is pathetic (though nothing will fix that), the combat is the slowest of the three PS1 games, materia eliminated the idea of characters having roles, instead making it so every character could be essentially a carbon copy of another, and it otherwise didn't feel very fun. The game felt like an experimental grindfest, and although I played it when the game wasn't terribly old yet, not even young me could really get into it. Much like today, I found games like FF9 and Legend of Dragoon to be far better experiences.

Edit: By the way, Ni No Kuni is a hybrid action turn based system. You still have to constantly keep yourself moving, especially in boss fights, and although you press a button and an action happens, it isn't as if you have to stand there and take an attack unless you choose to duke it out with a familiar or otherwise. It's something closer to the Tales battle system than the old school turn based system.

I basically agree in the gameplay aspects. I grew up with it, but i'm not shallow enough to let it sway me. I see the game for what it really was - a beginner's RPG. It was simple, did away with any class system because westerners thought classes were too complicated at the time. FF8 had this same problem with the junction system, all characters were carbon copies.

And that's what i like about Ni no Kuni and the Tales games in fact. I like both series' gameplay and battle system but Ni no kuni had what FF can't seem to do - make you feel for a game. It was an emotional journey where you actually feel attached to the whimsical characters.

 

[Cyan]

I hope they are making it a big remake, both graphically and battle system.
Am I the only one?

I hope that, with the new console's power, they will not simply copy every town's map and make it in 3D. or the overworld identical size but just adding textures.
I would gladly see a bigger free roaming 3D world (not just a flat plain to go from Midgar to Chocobo farm, but actual relief, mountains, caves, etc.), bigger town's maps (not just 4 houses per town in the background), renewed battles (chrono trigger/Star ocean 5 style) either ATB or semi-ATB (other characters could act on their own while you control one). It's hard to make something not turn based when you need to control multiple characters at the same time.
Materia was a fine system, and I Largely prefer "cloned characters" than fucking FF10 locked path sphere system with bad and unuseful skills. Let the player choose how to buff his characters and how to play battles!

As long as the main story is the same, I don't see any issue with this remake.
They could even add more story to it (crisis? cerberus?)

I don't feel like "keeping the graphical style" is needed here.
I'm more nostalgic to pixel art in FF6, where developers tried their hardest to make small sprites looking good. But for an old, first try in 3D flat and almost untextured models, I really don't have nostalgia.

 

[The Real Jdbye]

People really misunderstand what a 'remake' and what a 'remaster' is. Remastered would be if they polished the graphics and left it as is. IT's a remake, they're remaking it all, battle system included. It's a given materia will be there as a staple of the core game but I actually welcome an FFXV style battle system. Turn based might make everyone orgasm with nostalgia, but it's not something you'd put into a modern AAA release.

Also, people are underestimating how much they'll change. I'll play it to see how they handle things like mini games (if they even include them). Can you see the modern SE designed cloud riding a chocobo or crossdressing? Can you see that emo doing any of that? I certainly can't. The old game he was sarcastic, snarky and full of one liners - the modern interpretation is nothing like that and he's become more depressing in recent years, in Kingdom hearts and other spin offs, like advent children, crisis core etc. I can see this game being gritty and more adult in nature - people need to stop fooling themselves that it will be 'the same game with shinier graphics'.

They are not going to change it too much, they'd get a mob of angry fans with torches and pitchforks outside their headquarters, and they know it. If they removed the turn-based battles I would be at the front of that mob, asking for the head of the project leader.

 

[Nathan Drake]

To be fair with FFX, it was shit. It was Hallway Simulator 1.0. They did offer an alternative level progression system though that offered more path customizing, at least in the remake (and I presume on some edition prior to the remake). It didn't save the game from being shit, but at least it gave options.

They are not going to change it too much, they'd get a mob of angry fans with torches and pitchforks outside their headquarters, and they know it. If they removed the turn-based battles I would be at the front of that mob, asking for the head of the project leader.

The project director is the same guy who directs all of the Kingdom Hearts games. I would presume it will be more action based. It may still be turn based in nature, but I'm guessing it will only vaguely resemble the original system.

 

[The Real Jdbye]

To be fair with FFX, it was shit. It was Hallway Simulator 1.0. They did offer an alternative level progression system though that offered more path customizing, at least in the remake (and I presume on some edition prior to the remake). It didn't save the game from being shit, but at least it gave options.

The project director is the same guy who directs all of the Kingdom Hearts games. I would presume it will be more action based. It may still be turn based in nature, but I'm guessing it will only vaguely resemble the original system.

Changing the game a lot wouldn't make much sense though, it wouldn't be FF7 anymore, it would be a spinoff of FF7 like Crisis Core etc.

 

[Nathan Drake]

Changing the game a lot wouldn't make much sense though, it wouldn't be FF7 anymore, it would be a spinoff of FF7 like Crisis Core etc.

As long as it contains the story, characters, and settings, it is FF7. It's a mistake to think that the battle system makes the game when the battle system was one of the most generic parts of the original experience. It isn't as if they'll abandon materia either, and it isn't like it requires an old turn based system to pull it off. Something more akin to the Tales system would probably be ideal, although what I've seen of Star Ocean 5, a system like that (similar to Chrono Trigger) would work well too.

 

[The Real Jdbye]

As long as it contains the story, characters, and settings, it is FF7. It's a mistake to think that the battle system makes the game when the battle system was one of the most generic parts of the original experience. It isn't as if they'll abandon materia either, and it isn't like it requires an old turn based system to pull it off. Something more akin to the Tales system would probably be ideal, although what I've seen of Star Ocean 5, a system like that (similar to Chrono Trigger) would work well too.

It's a mistake to think that the story is the only thing that matters too. It's a combination of everything coming together to create the perfect game (as perfect as something can be in this imperfect world, anyway), change the game too much and you'll disrupt that formula and the game will be inferior compared to the original.

I have nothing against the Tales games, but FF7 isn't a Tales game, and they shouldn't turn it into one.
A system like Chrono Trigger would work fine though, it wouldn't really change anything gameplay-wise but it would just make battles more streamlined.

 

[Nathan Drake]

It's a mistake to think that the story is the only thing that matters too. It's a combination of everything coming together to create the perfect game (as perfect as something can be in this imperfect world, anyway), change the game too much and you'll disrupt that formula and the game will be inferior compared to the original.

I don't think changing the battle system will disrupt things. If anything, keeping anything too similar to the old game would be jarring and hinder a lot of what can be brought with this remade experience. I don't want random encounters, and if possible, I don't even want separate battle screens. I want a seamless integration of combat to make the experience more fluid. It can still be turn based to some degree, but a lot of aspects of the archaic turn based system can go straight to old game hell where they belong. At the same time, I don't want something like FFXII either, where they managed to make the entrance into battles seamless by axing random encounters, but it was still totally turn based I hit you, you hit me, battle position doesn't matter.

Now, if they want to borrow from FFXII for FFVII's battle system, that could work. For example, you had a lot of options for setting up your teammates to act in very particular ways so that it wasn't necessary to be in full control of them all of the time. I don't want them to make it so you can just set up auto battle though and basically go make a sandwich and watch a show during an extended boss encounter, which was exactly what you could do with the XII system.

 

[The Real Jdbye]

I don't think changing the battle system will disrupt things. If anything, keeping anything too similar to the old game would be jarring and hinder a lot of what can be brought with this remade experience. I don't want random encounters, and if possible, I don't even want separate battle screens. I want a seamless integration of combat to make the experience more fluid. It can still be turn based to some degree, but a lot of aspects of the archaic turn based system can go straight to old game hell where they belong. At the same time, I don't want something like FFXII either, where they managed to make the entrance into battles seamless by axing random encounters, but it was still totally turn based I hit you, you hit me, battle position doesn't matter.

Now, if they want to borrow from FFXII for FFVII's battle system, that could work. For example, you had a lot of options for setting up your teammates to act in very particular ways so that it wasn't necessary to be in full control of them all of the time. I don't want them to make it so you can just set up auto battle though and basically go make a sandwich and watch a show during an extended boss encounter, which was exactly what you could do with the XII system.

But you fail to realize that FF7 is loved for what it is. By changing that, they would lose all the original fans. They might gain some new ones, but this is first and foremost fan service.
You might not be a fan of the turn based system, but a lot of people are. It's one of the big reasons why I hate the later Final Fantasy games.

 

[Nathan Drake]

But you fail to realize that FF7 is loved for what it is. By changing that, they would lose all the original fans. They might gain some new ones, but this is first and foremost fan service.
You might not be a fan of the turn based system, but a lot of people are. It's one of the big reasons why I hate the later Final Fantasy games.

It may be first and foremost fan service, but you have to remember that a lot of people were born after FF7 released who didn't really start gaming until this last generation, but will be in their teens anticipating this game. They didn't grow up with that turn based system, and odds are they won't like it much. You can't discount these people either. There are just as many potential new customers, if not more, than there are old fans who are guaranteed to agree with everything about the remake and purchase it. I mean, you have to recognize that FF7 released in 1997. The game is only four years younger than myself. Since 1997, a lot of new gamers have come to be who either missed the PS1 generation entirely, or have little interest in older games like FF7.

As I've mentioned before, pandering to nostalgia endlessly will ultimately create a mediocre product that fans may appreciate, but that will most likely fail to captivate and create new fans. You have to recognize that quite a few fans look forward to a changed battle system too. They recognize that, at least as it was, the FF7 system has no place in modern gaming. Now consider if 50% of potential customers are FF7 fans who played the game before, 50% of potential customers are new to the FF7 experience, and 25% of the original 50% of FF7 fans want at least a heavily augmented battle system, it makes much more sense to appeal to 75% than it does to work tirelessly to appeal to the 25%. Granted, I pulled these numbers out of my ass and I could be way off base, but I feel altering the battle system in a significant way will result in a net positive rather than a net negative.

 

[The Real Jdbye]

You have to recognize that quite a few fans look forward to a changed battle system too. They recognize that, at least as it was, the FF7 system has no place in modern gaming.

I dunno about that.
Bravely Default and Golden Sun Dark Dawn seemed to do pretty well. I would even say that the Djinn system has a lot of similarities to the materia system.
There is definitely a place for classic turn-based JRPGs in modern gaming. I hate that there are hardly any of them anymore though It's the only type of RPG I play.
They seem to only be released on handhelds nowadays.

 

[Nathan Drake]

I dunno about that.
Bravely Default and Golden Sun Dark Dawn seemed to do pretty well.
There is definitely a place for classic turn-based JRPGs in modern gaming. I hate that there are hardly any of them anymore though It's the only type of RPG I play.

And their place is on handhelds that can't quite handle a more action based system yet. The DS tried and did okay in some games, but ultimately turn based was a better choice for the dated hardware. For the 3DS, I dunno, it's capable, but SE doesn't want to seem to try very hard on the 3DS so they stick with the turn based system probably just to cut down on development time. Hell, even now, some recent Vita titles from Japan are more traditional turn based, and the Vita is a system more than capable of pulling off action based combat systems. Traditional turn based is just easier to get away with on handhelds because people don't expect handheld systems to be beyond it yet. On the other hand, they expect especially current gen home consoles to be far, far beyond it.

 

[The Real Jdbye]

And their place is on handhelds that can't quite handle a more action based system yet. The DS tried and did okay in some games, but ultimately turn based was a better choice for the dated hardware. For the 3DS, I dunno, it's capable, but SE doesn't want to seem to try very hard on the 3DS so they stick with the turn based system probably just to cut down on development time. Hell, even now, some recent Vita titles from Japan are more traditional turn based, and the Vita is a system more than capable of pulling off action based combat systems. Traditional turn based is just easier to get away with on handhelds because people don't expect handheld systems to be beyond it yet. On the other hand, they expect especially current gen home consoles to be far, far beyond it.

Does it matter what platform it's on? It still shows that people like turn-based RPGs and still find them fun. They wouldn't be any less fun if they were on a home console rather than a handheld.

 

[Nathan Drake]

Does it matter what platform it's on? It still shows that people like turn-based RPGs and still find them fun. They wouldn't be any less fun if they were on a home console rather than a handheld.

It really does matter. Handhelds and home consoles demand different experiences. If anything, people are looking for even more console based experiences to be on handhelds, not the other way around. I mean, when was the last time you saw somebody say "but if they had just gone with a traditional turn based system over this action based system, the game would have been so much better"? I'd wager either never, or from somebody still very grounded in the nostalgia of late 90s and early 2000s video games. And if you reference a modern Final Fantasy game, trust me, the battle system was fine all things considered; everything else was the mess.

To put it in perspective, handheld games are designed largely with the idea of the on-the-go gamer in mind. The on-the-go gamer benefits from the ability to stop mid-battle and hop right back into it like all they did was hit the pause button no matter how much time passes. With an action game, it can feel off to stop mid-battle to do something and come back later trying to get the flow of battle back. With a turn based system, it's just a matter of selecting your next move. That isn't necessary on a home console. You're not playing a home console on the go, and thus the conveniences of a more on-the-go battle system disappear. What people desire when sitting in front of their big TV isn't a game that feels like it came out of the late 90s. They want a game that feels new. They want a game that feels modern. Modern is an action based battle system. New is giving it that unique touch that fits the particular game it's a part of. They intend to sit down for maybe upwards of five or six hours at a time and just play the game. With that in mind, the idea of creating a system the benefits more bite sized gaming becomes an unnecessary hindrance.

 

[The Real Jdbye]

It really does matter. Handhelds and home consoles demand different experiences. If anything, people are looking for even more console based experiences to be on handhelds, not the other way around. I mean, when was the last time you saw somebody say "but if they had just gone with a traditional turn based system over this action based system, the game would have been so much better"? I'd wager either never, or from somebody still very grounded in the nostalgia of late 90s and early 2000s video games. And if you reference a modern Final Fantasy game, trust me, the battle system was fine all things considered; everything else was the mess.

To put it in perspective, handheld games are designed largely with the idea of the on-the-go gamer in mind. The on-the-go gamer benefits from the ability to stop mid-battle and hop right back into it like all they did was hit the pause button no matter how much time passes. With an action game, it can feel off to stop mid-battle to do something and come back later trying to get the flow of battle back. With a turn based system, it's just a matter of selecting your next move. That isn't necessary on a home console. You're not playing a home console on the go, and thus the conveniences of a more on-the-go battle system disappear. What people desire when sitting in front of their big TV isn't a game that feels like it came out of the late 90s. They want a game that feels new. They want a game that feels modern. Modern is an action based battle system. New is giving it that unique touch that fits the particular game it's a part of. They intend to sit down for maybe upwards of five or six hours at a time and just play the game. With that in mind, the idea of creating a system the benefits more bite sized gaming becomes an unnecessary hindrance.

Ehh. I played FF13 for a while, and while it was pretty bad all around, the battle system itself was pretty bad too. It was oversimplified and dumbed down to the extreme, so much that I'm not sure it can even be called an RPG.

It's funny how you say people sit down and play action RPGs for 5-6 hours at a time. I could easily do that with a good turn-based RPG (that music, mmm) but with an action RPG I would be bored after the first hour

 

[Nathan Drake]

Ehh. I played FF13 for a while, and while it was pretty bad all around, the battle system itself was pretty bad too. It was oversimplified and dumbed down to the extreme, so much that I'm not sure it can even be called an RPG.

Like I said, the battle system was fairly okay compared to everything else in the 13 trilogy. I mean, the fact that the battle system is the one passable thing about the games speaks quite a bit for how they are as a whole, but either way, I don't foresee at least the initial 13 battle system coming back. At the same time, the 13-3 battle system is made for a single character, so they can't exactly adapt that either. The only one that might really work is if the XV system is good, and they choose to adapt that.