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Covid-19 vaccine

Will you get the vaccine?

  • Yes

    Votes: 500 67.1%
  • No

    Votes: 245 32.9%

  • Total voters
    745
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Foxi4

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The point of your first link, as it relates to the topic of racial bias in policing, was unclear to me. It may have been the source for data in the WSJ article that I either didn't see (because of the aforementioned paywall) or take no issue with. I didn't see anything about it that demonstrates racial biases in policing and justice don't exist, but I didn't read the whole thing.

As for the second link, the findings of the study were debunked by Princeton University scholars, who argued that the study's methodology and dataset made it impossible for the authors to reach the conclusion they reached. The authors of the original study issued a correction.
If you're going to (unfairly) criticize a comedian for sponnuting a conspiracy theory that's unsupported by evidence, my humble advice is that you also take care not to do the same thing.
It's always funny arguing with headline readers and skim readers - they see a correction or a retraction, but they don't actually read what's being corrected or retracted. I quote:
While our data and statistical approach were appropriate for investigating whether officer characteristics are related to the race of civilians fatally shot by police, they are inadequate to address racial disparities in the probability of being shot.
The study was widely misunderstood as a moratorium on the probability of getting shot. That is not what the researchers were analysing - they were analysing whether the race of the police officer influences their decision-making in regards to shootings. Since this was an issue, they've decided to retract the article, which does not invalidate the findings. The "deboonking" is a strawman, it attacks the researchers for something they've never claimed. Good try though.
 
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LOL They really are a joke!
Before 1/20 - COVID is fake, nothing but a small Cold. Your making a big deal out of nothing!!
After 1/20- COVID is CHINESE BIO-Weapon created to KILL Americans!! OMG the CARNAGE OF THE CPP Covid!!!!

Lab leak is a valid idea. Your dismissals were wrong.
 
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You should probably do more reading on the topic, since the overwhelming preponderance of research indicates there is extensive racial and ethnic discrimination by police and the judicial system.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Race_in_the_United_States_criminal_justice_system

Feel free to tag me in a relevant thread if you wish to continue the conversation.

5) Eastwald, your white christian privilege shines through yet again. You have the right to not take the jab, but regardless on if you think Jesus came to you in a dream and creamed your blood with immunity juice or not, you don't have the right to demand folk tolerate your unvaccinated presence anywhere you care to go. Sorry, dear, take it up with your maker for not making it clear enough for you.[/QUOTE]

Who says I'm a Christian? You are why White Supremacists are idiots - people like you are not the answer. Self-hating white person, I gotta run.


People's dismissal of the deadliness of the Virus in 2020(based on Lies) and the Refusal of Vaccine in 2021 (based on Lies) is 'Wrong"

Even if this were true, two wrong's make it ok for you to lie about another wrong? Modern 'logic' lol


Back down the numbers~

5) Eastwald, your white christian privilege shines through yet again. You have the right to not take the jab, but regardless on if you think Jesus came to you in a dream and creamed your blood with immunity juice or not, you don't have the right to demand folk tolerate your unvaccinated presence anywhere you care to go. Sorry, dear, take it up with your maker for not making it clear enough for you.

I'm Jewish, self hating white person.
 
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Lacius

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It's always funny arguing with headline readers and skim readers - they see a correction or a retraction, but they don't actually read what's being corrected or retracted. I quote:
The study was widely misunderstood as a moratorium on the probability of getting shot. That is not what the researchers were analysing - they were analysing whether the race of the police officer influences their decision-making in regards to shootings. Since this was an issue, they've decided to retract the article, which does not invalidate the findings. The "deboonking" is a strawman, it attacks the researchers for something they've never claimed. Good try though.
I read the entire Princeton response. It isn't long. You should read it too. If you're going to argue the original authors weren't making the kinds of arguments that were debunked, you should probably ask them why they made those arguments their principle claims.

@eastwald I am having trouble understanding what you're trying to argue, and I believe you are quoting me by mistake. If you want me to respond to you, please try again.
 
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I am having trouble understanding what you're trying to argue, and I believe you are quoting me by mistake. If you want me to respond to you, please try again.

Of course you are. You can't follow logic or intellectual consistency scientists used to swear by.

Never want your reply, btw. :)
 

Foxi4

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I read the entire Princeton response. It isn't long. You should read it too. If you're going to argue the original authors weren't making the kinds of arguments that were debunked, you should probably ask them why they made those arguments their principle claims.
I might do that in a more appropriate thread - I believe this would be the 4th and 5th study I post there that indicates no discernable racial bias with all relevant controls accounted for. As I said, we've spoken about this before and I doubt you have any new, groundbreaking evidence that would sway me to your side. Maybe one day, when the bias can be demonstrated and doesn't have a more obvious explanation besides the specter of racism.
 

Lacius

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I might do that in a more appropriate thread - I believe this would be the 4th and 5th study I post there that indicates no discernable racial bias with all relevant controls accounted for. As I said, we've spoken about this before and I doubt you have any new, groundbreaking evidence that would sway me to your side. Maybe one day, when the bias can be demonstrated and doesn't have a more obvious explanation besides the specter of racism.
The Wikipedia article I provided earlier does a thorough job summarizing the current research, and it acknowledges the shortcomings of what you've provided as well. If you're genuinely interested in seeing how the biases have been demonstrated, I recommend that page as a starting point.
 

Dakitten

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Of course you are. You can't follow logic or intellectual consistency scientists used to swear by.

Never want your reply, btw. :)

D'aww, I'm flattered. He's only here for me~ because I mistook what flavor of abrahamic racist zealot he is. By the by, the point Panda was trying to make was that right-leaning folk are not just moving the goalpost, they're switching to a whole other field whenever their propaganda falls flat by abandoning narratives to take up new vague conspiracies.
 
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smf

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If I posted a poll right now "Have Aliens probed Lacius's ass" I am confident It would break 30%, doesn't make it true or that anyone thought that it actually happened.

So if asking people is pointless, why have elections? All the trump supporters are obviously trolls.

The original quote from bill was not about microchips, but rather identification dyes, specifically for people crossing the border in the event they loose their vaccine documents, so when they reach hospitals, they know what vaccines they had.

Yes we know, because dye's that identify if you've had a vaccine isn't as sexy as bill gates injecting you with microchips and turning you into a magnetic 5g cell tower.

It's like the nigerian prince scams, they make it utterly unbelievable so only the truly thick people will believe it.

But also it's physically impossible, for anyone to have a small enough microchip that's not detectable, have enough features for wireless capablity, AND also have no battery (as a battery would require surgery).

Conspiracy theorists aren't able to rationalize to that level, otherwise they wouldn't be conspiracy theorists.

I don't know why people think the government needs to inject them with a microchip secretly to know their every move.

Only for people who don't care if they are being tracked. Your car, your phone & your payment cards can all be tracked.

If you don't carry a mobile, don't drive, don't pay with a card & wear a mask then it's quite difficult for them to track you. There are ways to identify people from cctv from the way they walk, but that is not currently a mass surveillance technique.

Define "miracle cure" and "not working". A recent observational study of ventilated COVID-19 patients indicates that hydroxychloroquine used in conjunction with azithromycin increases the survival rate by nearly 200%.

Do you have any other trials that support that, because it's been trialed in a lot of other places and there has been no similar results.

The paper wasn't written by quacks either - it's authored by researchers from Smith Center for Infectious Diseases & Urban Health and Saint Barnabas Medical Center.

By Quack do you mean someone who wouldn't go on fox news talking in April 2020 about hcq?

https://www.foxnews.com/media/dr-stephen-smith-on-effectiveness-of-hydroxychloroquine-with-coronavirus-symptoms-beginning-of-the-end-of-the-pandemic
http://video.foxnews.com/v/6146455701001
Ingraham's 'Medicine Cabinet' on effectiveness of hydroxychloroquine, whether diabetes increases COVID-19 risk

Drs. Ramin Oskoui, cardiologist and CEO of Foxhall cardiology, and Stephen Smith, founder of the Smith Center for Infectious Diseases and Urban Health, join Laura Ingraham on 'The Ingraham Angle.'

If the patients at St. Barnabas were better off when they were administered HCQ+AZM, I'm not going to question that - I'll wait until the results of the study are reviewed and the final version is published.

You would question it, if it wasn't already something you believed though.

Faucci is on record admitting that he personally manipulated herd immunity numbers knowing that they'll be disseminated by the media,

His initial estimate based on his scientific knowledge was wrong, as more information came out...

Dr. Fauci said that weeks ago, he had hesitated to publicly raise his estimate because many Americans seemed hesitant about vaccines, which they would need to accept almost universally in order for the country to achieve herd immunity.

That isn't manipulating people. Manipulating people is what Trump does when he tells people that covid will be gone soon, or basically anything else that Trump has ever said.

and he did so specifically to encourage or discourage certain behaviours. I quote the man himself:
Of course this is a "white lie" of sorts - ideally that number should be 100%, but that's extremely discouraging. If you keep the bar low and move the goal post incrementally, you're more likely to get people to come since you've put them in a perpetual state of "we're almost there".

Well of course 100% is ideal, what kind of imbecile thinks that by vaccinating 75% of people would be as effective as 100%?
They gave a lower figure for what they thought they could get away with in an emergency, that figure was too low and they had to raise it.

The funds weren't explicitly dedicated to gain of function research of coronaviruses, that part is correct, but money is fungible - if you fund a given institution for a specific purpose, the money that institution would've otherwise spent for the project out of their own pocket simply funds something else

By that argument, you fund sex traffickers and terrorists. Money that you spend will eventually end up there.

I know, I don't believe in the micro chip theory at all. I'm just saying they might be able to do something like that, though I doubt on such a large scale. Who knows

I don't think it's at all likely there is any kind of tech that is that small, it would not be something you could do in a small closed environment with few people & if you don't have that then it becomes a nightmare to keep quiet.

You said quite clearly that hydroxychloroquine "doesn't work" when used in COVID treatment - clearly it does, in specific cases - that's what the latest research says.

The research says quite emphatically it doesn't work, apart from magically when a right wing HCQ advocate uses it. A minute ago you were keeping an open mind, now you're saying it's clearly true. You can't have both.

if he said one thing based on polls and personal feeling rather than hard science, it makes perfect sense to treat what he says with a degree of skepticism.

There is no hard science, we'll have hard science in about ten years. Right now you'll get a best guess based on whatever peer reviewed studies they can cobble together & that is it.

It's funny how you want absolutes on things you don't believe in, but are happy with vague wishy washy statements when it's something you do.

HCQ is a drug - either it increases treatment effectiveness or it doesn't, and the answer to that question is found via scientific research, not bumbling idiots on TV.

There are numerous studies that concluded that it is not effective in any circumstance, just one magic one.

"if Trump said it at any point in time then it must be wrong". If that's the line of thinking both of you are applying on your decision-making, all the power to you, but don't simultaneously claim that what you say is based on "the science" - it's based on personal feeling, more specifically an inherent dislike of your opposition.

It makes perfect sense to treat what he says with a degree of skepticism.

We are not testing HCQ in isolation

You misunderstand, it was already tested with azithromycin back in 2020 and was found to be no better than placebo.

Whether it is an error or not remains to be seen based on peer review - the matter is being actively researched around the globe.

It has been researched since the first days of the pandemic.

Faucci is a government spokesperson - he's literally hired by the administration. He is a specialist, yes, but in his current position I expect him to be truthful and transparent. So far he only seems to be transparent when his feet are put to the fire, and if that's the case, he should be wearing shoes that are constantly engulfed in flames.

You expect the government to be truthful and transparent? Are you sure you're a republican?
He hasn't had his feet put to the fire.

200% is not probable coincidence - either it's a huge error (which should be easy to point out) or a relevant factor.

All they had to do was give HCQ to the people they thought would survive, it was an observational trial.

https://apnews.com/article/fact-checking-526005497789

That they even wrote a paper on their unscientific trial, is in itself suspect. It's like a giant red flag saying "I AM TRYING TO MANIPULATE YOU".

Not disclosing to the public that the figure is actually unknown and can only be estimated based on educated guesses is a lie by omission.

All science is based on educated guesses, you're either incredibly stupid or disingenous.

Trevor Noah is a shit comedian (which is why his show is on a "summer hiatus")

What? You think he is on holiday because he is a shit comedian? I really don't get the association...

I'm not forcing you to respond - you're the one insisting on continuing the conversation. I've read the article, and the studies linked within - they're consistent with what I've read over the years, no big surprises.

You believe in the articles that back up what you think, while reserving scepticm for anything that doesn't back up your beliefs. No surprises there.

Areas affected by more crime require a stronger police presence, a stronger police presence generates more police encounters, more police encounters generate more arrests. Nothing new under the sun, nothing to do with race.

And if you have a police encounter when you're black then you're more likely to get shot.

https://www.statista.com/statistics/1123070/police-shootings-rate-ethnicity-us/

The police choose where they work.
 

Foxi4

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I can always count on Mr.Bad Math to show up eventually. As a side note, Cullors bought the house with cash, or more accurately, Abolitionist Entertainment LLC. paid for the house, according to the documentation gathered by the realtor. There's no mortgage on the house - I figured I owe you an update. She also resigned from her position - curiously she did so right after the AG started an investigation against her non-profit. I wonder why she wants to distance herself from her own organisation, or why her other non-profit apparently footed the bill for what is ostensibly her own property. New LLC HQ, perhaps? Doubtful.

In terms of police shootings, swing and a miss - statistics show that black suspects are more likely to face physical force, but *less* likely to be shot in the same circumstances. Digging up some real old posts here:

https://gbatemp.net/threads/theory-related-to-george-floyd-murder.566984/#post-9087042

Since this is unrelated to the thread, I won't indulge you any further - I fully suspect Bad Math to follow, and I won't be responding to it. As for giving interviews, I'm not terribly surprised that a scientist wants to talk about their research, especially if it stands in contrast with other studies - you can boo-hoo the doctor for his FOX appearance all day, I don't turn my nose up when the opposition posts links to The Guardian or other tripe.
 

smf

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I wonder why she wants to distance herself from her own organisation, or why her other non-profit apparently footed the bill for what is ostensibly her own property. New LLC HQ, perhaps? Doubtful.

Are you saying there is something illegal about what she did?

Do you get as upset about all the shady deals Trump does?

Or do you only suspect black women?

Resigning isn't suspicious.

Or ignoring what other people say or link and assuming a pompous attitude that makes you look like a clown. :glare:

That is because he is a clown. Hadn't you noticed already?

He criticizes people based on their political leanings and will bang on about someone who he doesn't support, while excusing people he does. It makes for a pretty poor debate.

If you bring it up then he'll play the victim, but accuse other people of playing the victim.
 
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Foxi4

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Or ignoring what other people say or link and assuming a pompous attitude that makes you look like a clown. :glare:
Oh, I've made a conscious decision not to engage with Mr.Bad Math a long time ago since conversations with him are a lot like playing tennis with a brick wall - the ball is bouncing back and forth, but in reality you're just talking with yourself over and over. I'm more than happy to ingest any presented evidence and draw new conclusions from it, but I'm not keen on repeating myself for no reason - it's rather exhausting, and doesn't forward the conversation. I'm not entirely sure why you specifically have an issue with what I've been saying so far considering we seem to be in agreement on the requirement of peer review, which is where this conversation started. As for the various adjectives you have to offer, I'll add "pompous" to my long list of titles.
 

Lacius

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CDC will recommend everyone in K-12 schools wear a mask -- regardless of vaccination status -- in new guidance

"The CDC is also urging vaccinated people in certain areas of the country to resume wearing masks because of COVID-19."

https://www.cnn.com/2021/07/27/politics/cdc-mask-guidance/index.html

I think it's likely the CDC will at some point go back to recommending everyone in public wear masks, regardless of vaccination status. To everyone who didn't get vaccinated, you were told this would happen.
 

Foxi4

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CDC will recommend everyone in K-12 schools wear a mask -- regardless of vaccination status -- in new guidance

"The CDC is also urging vaccinated people in certain areas of the country to resume wearing masks because of COVID-19."

https://www.cnn.com/2021/07/27/politics/cdc-mask-guidance/index.html

I think it's likely the CDC will at some point go back to recommending everyone in public wear masks, regardless of vaccination status. To everyone who didn't get vaccinated, you were told this would happen.
In all fairness, it's hard to oppose a measure like this - young children are not cleared for vaccination as of yet and are liable to be carriers, even if their symptoms are very benign and mortality is fairly low. It's rather uncomfortable for kids who like to fidget, but we've all been uncomfortable for a year now, I think they can take it.
 
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