The dreaded "SJW"

Do you use the word SJW?

  • Yes

    Votes: 13 35.1%
  • No

    Votes: 24 64.9%

  • Total voters
    37

Pipistrele

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That almost reads as an "If you're not with us, you're against us" :/

The problem I'm having with most SJW's or "progressives" is most of the time they don't think past the current problem and what a certain "fix" will do in the future, or how it can be exploited.
A female friend of mine use to be all "we need to accept everyone in our country, we're rich enough to make it work", until she started working and having a house of her own near some less affluent people, now she still wants to help, but no longer "here" :/

I also think we should try to help, but first we need to get our own shit together and people coming here should adapt to our way of life and not just collect benefits and try to get us to adapt to them.
It's not about "us vs them" as much as about dealing with inaction. There's a lot of problems to solve, political climate is increasingly tense, and going the centrism route is pretty much an equivalent of being that meme dog who says "This is fine" while sitting in a burning building.

As for the rest, I partially get where you're coming from, but again, that's assuming the whole "collect benefits and forcing to get us to adapt to them" was true to begin with. I'm talking from perspective of migrants (not being an US citizen myself, yet knowing a lot of Eastern European people who moved there), and so far, it's anything but - being a migrant is an uphill battle where you work your ass off for lesser wages and benefits than native population, all while dealing with social prejudices at best and rather damaging discrimination at worst (stuff like "you won't get the job because you're not from here"). Same for the aforementioned "ways", as in it's less about "trying to get you to adapt to them" and more about just trying to keep their identity; in many situations, the demand to "adapt to our way of life" comes down to something as radical as asking migrated people to abandon their religion or forget their cultural traditions, and that's just not very humane in my book on a lot of levels.
 
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FGFlann

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Let's be real, it's always Us VS Them.

You dismiss the reasoning of the ideological opposition of "SJWs" as petty or hostile, but why? Which concerns? Which ideas? Held by how many people? Social polarization isn't going to get any better if that's the attitude we have for one another. Finding the ground on which everyone can agree is basic diplomacy, not inaction, and that's just failing to happen at all levels.
 

notimp

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Let me burst your bubble. :)

The issue with SJWs is twofold:

- they advocate for a world, where everything edgy, critical, nasty, is basically shunned into non existance - so everyone can have a nice time, not understanding what makes people tick, ostrasizing everyone that doesnt submit to a certain norm (installing social taboos).

They are under the very problematic believe, that 'what they dont see - doesnt exist', and they will throw a hissy fit - if they are exposed to something they don't like - trying to make society dragging it away for them.

Also they will resort to social media shaming to reach their misguided goals.

As a result people become more ostracized, more divided, more separated in different bubbles, and more unable to deal with adversity. Less likely to be able to bridge ideological gaps. Less likely to deal with criticism.

Second issue -

- because society had become pretty much sufficiently liberal, for any people with large enough support groups to meet their biggest demands, SJWs, seeking out issues to champion so they could feel better about themselves, or look better on social - took up the remaining ones. The issue here is, that the groups of people that fall into those have been so 'nieche' in society overall - that promoting their rights has a larger majority scratching their heads, because they themselves - might not have had direct personal contact with an individual of such a subgroup in their lives (previous efforts of those groups to get wider social recognition failed - arguably - because their reach was so small) - yet see others drawing their self identity from creating rulesets that would apply in such a situation.

The second issue, isnt much of an issue - its just something of a disconnect, if you first come across it. The 'what the heck are you doing here' question might have been in the forefront of many peoples minds, before they recognized, it is a youth trend, so act friendly. What their internal monologue after such an interaction is, you sadly dont control. Furthermore, if it helps smaller subgroups to integrate into society better - so be it. No harm done.

The first issue is a real issue. We dont establish social taboos, just for the fun of it - and then have people play act as if the issues dont exist, if they pressure others into not talking about them.

There is a backlash against this in place that is very deserved.

On the higher education (colleges) level, people spoke out against this practice far too late, because it was a trend, that was used to empower people by adhering to a mainstream social model, while at the same time calling people that wouldnt comply to 'speech regulation' the equivalent of racists who would be committing 'though crime'. ("You cant say that.").

The thing is, that none of what they'd claim being a social standard, was a social standard yet - they had just made it up, and the majority of people didn't just agree with it. They just acted as if they did. Professors often fell in line, because they saw it better for their careers not to be called racists, and all of a sudden - you had social echo chambers at colleges you didn't want.

That stuff, has to stop.

Not talking about the stuff like emotional support animal rooms and social ranking being based on belonging to more oppressed subgroups, that developed out of the more insane part of the SJW movement.


People on video explaining those concepts better than I just did:



(value conservative angle)

edit: Exchanged the second video link for a 'better' one (same interviewee)
 
Last edited by notimp,

Dahlumu

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tbh the term sjw means a lot of different things depending on which community you come from and who you talk to, so there's a lot of subjectivity around the term as well
like I know just bc im part of certain communities people are gonna call me an sjw, so at this point I've learned to just completely ignore it lmao
I've pretty much only seen it be used in a way that detracts all meaning from it
 

notimp

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"tI used a metaphor in class, and someone reported me."



I want to leave this here, because of the issue of 'believes' (ideology) over 'debates'.

According to that guy it comes from society taking away "free play" (to 'protect' children) and replacing it with social media.

No staying power, no argument is ever fully heard, who shouts loudest and most abrasively wins. (Callout culture.)
 
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vinstage

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i think people i know now just like to use sjw as an insulting way of putting people down for trying to participate in any kind of activism which sucks because it just skewers the actual meaning behind it for others who haven't come across the term.
 
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Waygeek

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Oxford defines social justice as "justice in terms of the distribution of wealth, opportunities, and privileges within a society."
How does the term SJW relate to this?
SJW, aka Social Justice Warrior.
I see this term thrown around all the time, but what does it really mean? What do you mean when you use it, and why do you use it?
It seems like such a nebulous term, and I've seen it used to describe anything from extremist feminist groups to any policy remotely liberal or progressive in nature.

Looking at the first example, we have a feminist extremist group. Let's say they fight for female power, not an inherently bad thing. But then they also claim that men are inferior, and should die, etc. Very sexist, and they are defined as SJWs. But when looking back at Oxford's definition of social justice, the term SJW doesn't seem to hold up. You could certainly call this group warriors for female empowerment, but is their form of feminism a type of justice? Not really, sexism isn't justice. Therefore, it doesn't make sense that the term social justice warrior is applied to this group.
Another example of the usage of this term is when two scenes were changed in Persona 5 Royal's western release (for context, click here). Many people referred to this decision as "SJW" or as something bad. But why is it bad? What makes this SJW? Yes, it has a social justice component because these scenes were changed to remove some dialogue that presented harmful stereotypes of homosexual men, but people are using the term SJW to describe this decision as if it's a bad thing. As if the progressive depiction of homosexual people is a bad thing. Odd.

So why is the term Social Justice Warrior even a bad thing? Why does it have such a negative connotation? Isn't it a good thing to be someone who fights for social justice? I see nothing wrong with that. Every time I see this word used, it never makes sense. It's either used to describe people or situations that actually oppose social justice (example one) or is used to put down progressive changes/policy/movements, etc (example 2). Again, very odd.

What are your opinions? I'm interested to hear what people have to say.
Please keep this thread civil, thanks!

Yup. You're right. 'Social justice' is indeed a positive concept we should be striving for.

No use asking for a nailed down definition of 'sjw' my friend, alt-right cuck soyboys use it against anyone that doesn't agree with them.
 

notimp

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SJWs are ruining open debate, have ostracized comedy in the name of good tone, are building a society where they out 'being oppressed' each other, and that works using a very strict notion of what is deemed accepted and what is not, and are solving their disagreements using deplatforming and shunning.

Thereby destroying the basis of open societies on their morning stroll to the coffee shop.

In short - they are the worst group of people the world has produced in my entire lifetime.

They are building cultures in which people are in constant fear or saying the wrong thing, or being deemed not appropriate enough for the fad value of the moment, at which point they are basically discarded from their communities - and they have deemed that the right environment to hold important discussions, because - finally - they can discuss topics without people making arguments they dont want to hear, or sabotaging discussion through rhetorical means. Like a joke. As a result they have become afraid of humor - and open debate not guarded by 'value princibles of f.e. "you have to respect me, because I work with poor people"'.

They are the real world expression of facebook ethics. Superficial, superfluous, easily enraged, and constantly out to win an argument by just saying at the right time, that the other side of the argument is just personally at fault. With them wanting to dictate universal ethics - that coincidentally are horrible.

All in the name of justice.

Also I'm left leaning. ;)
 
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