Does Trump provoke Iran as an election stunt?

[brickmii82]

First of all, Trump is the one that reneged on the nuclear nonproliferation agreement we had with Iran, which they were fully compliant with. Second, he assassinated Iran's second in command in an act of unprovoked aggression (imagine if another country had done that to Mike Pence). Third, Trump ceded the moral high ground to Iran, as he threatened to target Iranian cultural sites (a war crime), and in response Iran said they have no quarrel with the American people, only with Trump himself. They also posted a list of properties owned by him.

So yes, no matter how much you want to play the victim on his behalf, Donald Trump has proven himself unequivocally to be America's biggest piece of shit. I say we air mail him straight to Tehran, with or without a parachute, and this whole conflict would end just like that. The American people have far more in common with Iranian citizens than they do with the billionaires attempting to send them to their deaths. No war but class war.

Tbf this one ain't really "on" Trump. Its been in the making for awhile now. He's just the fat guy that walked on the wrong side of the teetering.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1953_Iranian_coup_d'état

 

[spotanjo3]

I really hope that he will remove from the office permanent. Even all presidents and etc are the corrupt. They all sucks! War will never end. Never. Hatred existed period! No love! Most humans are DUMB human beings!

 

[WorldOfNerds]

Third.

Russia.

nope. they are close behind tho

 

[brickmii82]

nope. they are close behind tho

Kind of. As far as nuclear arsenal, we're neck in neck however Russia still uses small payload tactical nukes of 100 kilotons or less. We decommissioned those about 5 years ago and only use strategic nukes, or SSBM/ICBM's. They have around 6500 total units and US has about 6200. As far as other military assets, USA still pulls ahead in total units and total value. Troop count, America again pulls ahead.

 

[IncredulousP]

Kind of. As far as nuclear arsenal, we're neck in neck however Russia still uses small payload tactical nukes of 100 kilotons or less. We decommissioned those about 5 years ago and only use strategic nukes, or SSBM/ICBM's. They have around 6500 total units and US has about 6200. As far as other military assets, USA still pulls ahead in total units and total value. Troop count, America again pulls ahead.

I concede. It's subjective, and irrelevant to the topic at hand.

 

[WorldOfNerds]

Third.

Russia.

if you need some evidence, heres a quote from:https://www.lowyinstitute.org/the-interpreter/russias-military-better-americas

"The short-lived US intervention in the Libyan civil war was also another mistake, whereas Russia’s long-term intervention in the Syrian civil war is expected to eventually pay for itself. Russia’s military is certainly weaker than that of the US, but ill-fated decisions across multiple administrations have steadily undermined American power." So yeah, US is stronger.

 

[Glyptofane]

This was a disgraceful and reckless pledge of fealty to Israel who appreciates the gesture enough to "stay out of it".

https://www.foxnews.com/world/netanyahu-israel-soleimani

The entire pretext for the assassination is also horseshit. How about the attack in Kenya which killed three Americans including an actual serviceman, not just contractors, and garnered nary a tweet from President Cheeto?

https://apnews.com/65926ee82091f779d28d6a9644fb739f

 

[Xzi]

Tbf this one ain't really "on" Trump. Its been in the making for awhile now. He's just the fat guy that walked on the wrong side of the teetering.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1953_Iranian_coup_d'état

It's true that the US and CIA have been messing with Iran's internal affairs for what amounts to several lifetimes, but the 2015 nuclear nonproliferation agreement had the relationship between our two countries on fairly stable ground. It was air tight and both were getting what they wanted from it, all we had to do was stay the course and let Iran work out its own internal struggles. Instead Trump tore up the agreement, not because there was anything wrong with the terms of it, but solely because it had Obama's signature on it. Then we started placing new sanctions on Iran, and tensions slowly started to mount again. The man is petty, small, and driven entirely by ego. Soleimani's assassination was simply the moment his stupidity transitioned from laughable to dangerous for us all, Americans and Iranians alike.

This was a disgraceful and reckless pledge of fealty to Israel who appreciates the gesture enough to "stay out of it".

Yep, Israel and Saudi Arabia are the two countries who stand to gain the most from the US conducting a proxy war on their behalf. Unfortunately, religious fundamentalists like Trump's evangelical supporters are able to relate with Zionists and ISIS far more than with the peaceful citizens of any Western democracy, so they will support this war no matter how much blood is spilled.

 

[RaptorDMG]

Rockets have apparently been fired from Iran into a US base ... hopefully trump doesn't take this too far

https://www.rt.com/news/477674-alasad-airbase-rockets-iraq/

 

[Xzi]

Rockets have apparently been fired from Iran into a US base ... hopefully trump doesn't take this too far

https://www.rt.com/news/477674-alasad-airbase-rockets-iraq/

Here we fucking go. Lord Farquaad Trump is preparing to give a speech in response tonight.

 

[chrisrlink]

i aggree with xzi fuck the human race at this point kill em off for their own stupidity

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just think when he does get out pretty sure he'll be in prison after that and hopefully get the needle

 

[brickmii82]

It's true that the US and CIA have been messing with Iran's internal affairs for what amounts to several lifetimes, but the 2015 nuclear nonproliferation agreement had the relationship between our two countries on fairly stable ground. It was air tight and both were getting what they wanted from it, all we had to do was stay the course and let Iran work out its own internal struggles. Instead Trump tore up the agreement, not because there was anything wrong with the terms of it, but solely because it had Obama's signature on it. Then we started placing new sanctions on Iran, and tensions slowly started to mount again. The man is petty, small, and driven entirely by ego. Soleimani's assassination was simply the moment his stupidity transitioned from laughable to dangerous for us all, Americans and Iranians alike.


Yep, Israel and Saudi Arabia are the two countries who stand to gain the most from the US conducting a proxy war on their behalf. Unfortunately, religious fundamentalists like Trump's evangelical supporters are able to relate with Zionists and ISIS far more than with the peaceful citizens of any Western democracy, so they will support this war no matter how much blood is spilled.

About as airtight an international relationship as China and Japan. They (justly imo) loathe us. Perhaps not hate, but it’s certainly not a welcoming tone.

 

[Xzi]

Looks like we were fortunate for now and avoided any casualties in Iran's retaliatory missile strikes. It's also possible they were only trying to cause structural damage, IE fire warning shots. Hopefully Trump takes advantage of this opportunity to de-escalate the entire conflict, but my capacity for giving him the benefit of the doubt ran dry long ago.

About as airtight an international relationship as China and Japan. They (justly imo) loathe us. Perhaps not hate, but it’s certainly not a welcoming tone.

I meant that the nuclear nonproliferation agreement was air tight, "stable" was the most I said of our relationship with Iran. Certainly not "friendly," but for quite a while they were at least more preoccupied with internal struggles than with focusing on their hatred for America. That changed with the introduction of new sanctions and the assassination of Soleimani.

 

[chrisrlink]

hell you guys don't live near 5 freaking bases within a 15 mile radius prime target for iran

 

[wartutor]

Looks like we were fortunate for now and avoided any casualties in Iran's retaliatory missile strikes. It's also possible they were only trying to cause structural damage, IE fire warning shots. Hopefully Trump takes advantage of this opportunity to de-escalate the entire conflict, but my capacity for giving him the benefit of the doubt ran dry long ago.


I meant that the nuclear nonproliferation agreement was air tight, "stable" was the most I said of our relationship with Iran. Certainly not "friendly," but for quite a while they were at least more preoccupied with internal struggles than with focusing on their hatred for America. That changed with the introduction of new sanctions and the assassination of Soleimani.

Soleimani's direct actions led to his death. He has been on a list for years and should of been taken out way before this. At what point do you decide that a persons death is better than allowing him to continue plotting and killing others. Trump made a hard decision but at least he is standing behind it instead of just threatening and talking shit. While allowing him to continue. I myself cant stand politicians and anything that voting now and days brings mainly due to the fact that all parties are just spoon fed corrupt rich fucks that deserve nothing more than to have that stripped away and forced to work like there employees. But that is another discussion. Bottom line is trump had him killed...good...worlds better off without him. Any radical group thinks other wise take them out too. If trump wanted to do something to bring attention to his election then he would of ordered that kim wong (what ever his fuckin name is) in charge of north korea executed and proceeded to try and free those people.

 

[brickmii82]

Looks like we were fortunate for now and avoided any casualties in Iran's retaliatory missile strikes. It's also possible they were only trying to cause structural damage, IE fire warning shots. Hopefully Trump takes advantage of this opportunity to de-escalate the entire conflict, but my capacity for giving him the benefit of the doubt ran dry long ago.


I meant that the nuclear nonproliferation agreement was air tight, "stable" was the most I said of our relationship with Iran. Certainly not "friendly," but for quite a while they were at least more preoccupied with internal struggles than with focusing on their hatred for America. That changed with the introduction of new sanctions and the assassination of Soleimani.

I wonder how morally bankrupt it'd be to form a betting pool based on the week they test the first nuke.

 

[Flame]

damn its all popping off now.

i really hope this isnt the start of a War. Full blown war.

 

[DeoNaught]

So I might of heard wrong, but wasn't the dude and his men planning to take down some officials? or some other important people? this is he said she said, pretty sure I heard it from my sister, but I thought it was just whoever shot first situation(e;i both sides were planning to kill someone, just one side got to it before the other side)

IDK if this was an election stunt, I'm probably too Naive right now, but wouldn't there be other things to do for re-election? that would fair better for him and the US. Even if he is blind, I think he does love America, he's just doing it really wrong.

 

[Condarkness_XY]

So I might of heard wrong, but wasn't the dude and his men planning to take down some officials? or some other important people? this is he said she said, pretty sure I heard it from my sister, but I thought it was just whoever shot first situation(e;i both sides were planning to kill someone, just one side got to it before the other side)

IDK if this was an election stunt, I'm probably too Naive right now, but wouldn't there be other things to do for re-election? that would fair better for him and the US. Even if he is blind, I think he does love America, he's just doing it really wrong.

You think Trump cares about America??

Here's the reality. He doesn't. He does care about money and only money. He will anything to get money. Did I mention money. He is a collosal idiot who doesn't give a dam. About anyone or anything other than himself.

 

[Taleweaver]

So I might of heard wrong, but wasn't the dude and his men planning to take down some officials? or some other important people? this is he said she said, pretty sure I heard it from my sister, but I thought it was just whoever shot first situation(e;i both sides were planning to kill someone, just one side got to it before the other side)

This would be an ambiguous thing even for a neutral government. With this one, you know in advance they're going to lie if it happens not to be true. And even if it's partially true, you can predict Trump waving some documents and repeating some stupid mantra every chance he gets (I can almost hear him "We've taken out Soleimani...who was a bad man...a very bad man...because he was planning to kill <person/group>. Here are documents showcasing exactly that. Therefore, I've managed to save <person/group>. I brought peace. I...<and so on>").

...but that's just a hypothesis based on earlier events. The absence of stupid Trump wannabe-hypnosis isn't proof that it's a lie. For that, it's better to use Occam's razor and ask what's more likely.
Soleimani has been an enemy of the US for many years (again: even W. Bush was given the "comedy last option" to take him out...so he's been on a watchlist for at least ten years now). If Trump really is about bringing peace, Soleimani should have less inclination than ever to plan something evil, let alone execute that something, right? So...that already tells us Trump isn't about bringing peace foremost (not much of a surprise, there).
Next up: does he has more reason to plot an action? Answer...yes. That one-sided cancellation of the nuclear agreement by Trump the USA and increased sanctions against Iran isn't going to make him happy.

But again: what would be his most effective move? Would that be A) sabotaging the oil production lines from the shadows, thus thwarting the global oil industry...or B) killing Americans, thus ensuring that both the USA is pissed off at them as well as losing any potential allies it might have or hope to get in the rest of the world ?

Occam's razor says he's far more likely to be the one either behind those earlier sabotage acts, or otherwise planning them than actually planning to provoke killing US citizens.

IDK if this was an election stunt, I'm probably too Naive right now, but wouldn't there be other things to do for re-election?

For a normal president: absolutely. But this is a guy that broke most if not all of his campaign promises (hint: Mexico hasn't payed for a wall), needlessly brought an economic war with China, distanced or downright insulted all sorts of allies both within and outside the country, has the longest government downtime in recent history, is part of so many scandals that actually solving them is still on the 'to do' list (note: it might be up for debate whether or not Trump ordered it, but it remains a FACT that Russia meddled in the 2016 elections. But that is hardly if at all addressed) and is actually impeached and on the verge of being removed from office.
Sorry, but you don't recover from this sort of negative publicity (heck...even Nixon was more popular when he resigned). At least not by normal standards.

At this point, many will point out the cult-movie 'Wag the dog', wherein a couple spin doctors fabricate a fictional war to deflect the attention from a sexual scandal the president's involved in. They do it so masterfully that at the end, the guy gets re-elected.
The thing is: while believable and would something many see Trump consider, I think he's just too dumb for this sort of Machiavellian play. Or rather: he's surrounded himself with yes-men rather than people smart enough to properly cook up something like this.

hell you guys don't live near 5 freaking bases within a 15 mile radius prime target for iran

Erm...as someone who only knows USA from movies and numbers on military spending...doesn't the USA have at least one military base about every 5 miles?