New Abortion Law Wave

[supersonicwaffle]

a simple google search does a lot . Belgium as an example it is legal to do so till 3 months in to the pregnancy and everybody can freely choose that but after 3 months it can only be done if it endangers the health of the person carrying the child. I think it should be the same everywhere in the world.
http://abortion-clinics.eu/abortion-europe/

Yes it tells you where it is illegal and severely restricted. I have to commend you on providing the sources that disprove what you say.

 

[kumikochan]

Yes it tells you where it is illegal and severely restricted. I have to commend you on providing the sources that disprove what you say.

The union has 28 countries wich only one has abortion banned completely and couple others partially. So almost every country has it legalized.

 

[kumikochan]

Yes it tells you where it is illegal and severely restricted. I have to commend you on providing the sources that disprove what you say.

The union has 28 countries wich only one has abortion banned completely and couple others partially. So almost every country has it legalized.

 

[FAST6191]

Nothing anyone can say to me will change my mind about abortion being wrong.

So try to change mine. I am less fixed in my opinions here; while I would like to believe my opinions were the result of a long and involved consideration of the concepts and ethics thereof, one undertaken having achieved an understanding of the underlying concepts, the whole "no amount can prove me right, any one experiment can prove me wrong" thing is very much in play.

 

[zomborg]

Why Cots why? I really wasn't ready for the abortion issue to be discussed.

First of all, if, each time a woman chose to abort, she died as a result, the number of abortions would significantly decrease. Also it would eliminate debate.

Also, to address those who refer to the unwanted life as a virus, parasite, blob of cells or crotch goblin.
Would your opinion be the same if the topic was an endangered species such as the the northern white rhinoceros? As with all endangered species on our world, scientists, activists and average citizens alike are concerned for them and rightly so. We want to fight as hard as we can to keep them from becoming extinct.
Even though humans are nowhere near extinction and many on the left would bring the overpopulation argument, although the white rhino is important, each and every human life is vastly more important.
Even we do not dare to categorize a white rhino pregnancy as a parasite or weed so then we should not do the same with a human. Humans have infinitely more potential. Humans have higher cognitive functions and more advanced reasoning. Humans drive trucks, operate advanced technologies and create cures for deadly disease.
Do you see any of the animals on the endangered list driving trucks?

Also if your pro abortion stances had merit and your views became law of the land many years ago, then many of you potentially may have been aborted and you would never have existed to engage in this debate or for that matter, ever have signed up at the temp. Many of the positive things that you each contribute to society may have been lost if your mothers were as steadfastly in favor of abortion. Just consider all of the programmers, coders, designers, engineers, mathematicians and other intelligent people who may never have been born because they weren't given that chance.
Many have argued that we have no right to tell a woman what she can do with her body but by that same token, the unborn life should be given the same respect and consideration.
How do we know that baby is not going to grow up to solve world hunger or cure all disease? Who are we to interfere?

One last point I wish to make. It boils down to responsibility. Those in favor of abortion, do not wish to be held accountable for their irresponsible actions. Yes, yes I know the whole rape, incest and unplanned pregnancy in wedlock arguments but those account for only a tiny portion of world wide pregnancies. As others have mentioned in this thread keep your legs closed and keep your pants zipped but if and when that fails, be prepared to accept your responsibility. A baby is one of the consequences of not being responsible and the only person you have to blame is yourself and your partner. But people want to step out and play and be promiscuous and then take the easy way out. Instead of being a responsible adult they become pro choice.

 

[DeadlyFoez]

One last point I wish to make. It boils down to responsibility. Those in favor of abortion, do not wish to be held accountable for their irresponsible actions. Yes, yes I know the whole rape, incest and unplanned pregnancy in wedlock arguments but those account for only a tiny portion of world wide pregnancies. As others have mentioned in this thread keep your legs closed and keep your pants zipped but if and when that fails, be prepared to accept your responsibility. A baby is one of the consequences of not being responsible and the only person you have to blame is yourself and your partner. But people want to step out and play and be promiscuous and then take the easy way out. Instead of being a responsible adult they become pro choice.

^^^Exactly this.

 

[supersonicwaffle]

The union has 28 countries wich only one has abortion banned completely and couple others partially. So almost every country has it legalized.

Good that we agree. Now read further and you'll realize that the US has, on average, much more liberal laws regarding abortion. So I guess we're stuck in middle ages here?

 

[osaka35]

Also if your pro abortion stances had merit and your views became law of the land many years ago, then many of you potentially may have been aborted and you would never have existed to engage in this debate or for that matter, ever have signed up at the temp. Many of the positive things that you each contribute to society may have been lost if your mothers were as steadfastly in favor of abortion. Just consider all of the programmers, coders, designers, engineers, mathematicians and other intelligent people who may never have been born because they weren't given that chance.
Many have argued that we have no right to tell a woman what she can do with her body but by that same token, the unborn life should be given the same respect and consideration.
How do we know that baby is not going to grow up to solve world hunger or cure all disease? Who are we to interfere?

That's the old-school catholic approach. That's why masturbation is a crime against god. You're killing all those potential humans.

 

[D34DL1N3R]

So a doctor giving a rape victim an abortion would do FAR more time than the rapist themselves. Good one RepubliCONS. I bet you feel so proud of yourselves. Deplorable garbage.

 

[kumikochan]

Good that we agree. Now read further and you'll realize that the US has, on average, much more liberal laws regarding abortion. So I guess we're stuck in middle ages here?

If you would have read my complete comment i was talking in general when it comes to gay marriage, abortion, euthanasia and so forth wich is all perfectly fine here in Belgium. So yeah when it comes to the US in general a lot of laws are stuck in the middle ages and are a lot of times archaic. I find the US one of the least progressive countries in the world when it comes to the west in general and very very archaic in comparison to other western countries.

 

[DeadlyFoez]

So a doctor giving a rape victim an abortion would do FAR more time than the rapist themselves. Good one RepubliCONS. I bet you feel so proud of yourselves. Deplorable garbage.

Who the fuck ever said that? A rapist should be in prison for life, caged like the animal that it is.

Now, I could be wrong, but I know I hadn't even mentioned anything about the end of the doctor, and the comments from other people that I have read didn't mention anything about what may happen to a doctor. So wtf are you going on about?

 

[zomborg]

That's the old-school catholic approach. That's why masturbation is a crime against god. You're killing all those potential humans.

Yes indeed. Not all old school ideas are outdated relics. If people were more responsible our world would be a better place with significantly fewer problems.

 

[supersonicwaffle]

If you would have read my complete comment i was talking in general when it comes to gay marriage, abortion, euthanasia and so forth wich is all perfectly fine here in Belgium. So yeah when it comes to the US in general a lot of laws are stuck in the middle ages and are a lot of times archaic. I find the US one of the least progressive countries in the world when it comes to the west in general.

Well, I agree.
It's just that you specifically mentioned Europe, not the EU, not Belgium, yet the US is more progressive on gay marriage with the number of EU states where gay marriage is legal around 50%. As mentioned they are also more liberal in terms of abortion with only a few states who introduced more restrictive abortion laws very recently.

 

[osaka35]

Yes indeed. Not all old school ideas are outdated relics. If people were more responsible our world would be a better place with significantly fewer problems.

Funnily enough, that particular notions comes from the idea that the "whole" of the person comes from the man's sperm. We still use the same terminology, actually. the man's "seed", the woman is "fertile", etc. They thought semen was literally human seed, and the woman's womb was the human soil in which it was grown. This way of thinking has shaped this entire debate. Remove the religious dogma, and you'd have a far more logical and moral kind of discussion.

 

[kumikochan]

Well, I agree.
It's just that you specifically mentioned Europe, not the EU, not Belgium, yet the US is more progressive on gay marriage with the number of EU states where gay marriage is legal around 50%. As mentioned they are also more liberal in terms of abortion with only a few states who introduced more restrictive abortion laws very recently.

But they also have the death penalty, gay marriage is perfectly fine here in Belgium and gender change can be done without a surgery so in that regard i don't find the US to be that progressive. Think we're also the only country in the world were euthanasia is legal but yeah in regard to the union as a whole some countries aren't that progressive as Belgium is. But in general when it comes to like everything regarding prison, death penalty, gay rights, abortion and so forth they are one of the least progressive countries in the west. Some laws may be more progressive compared to other countries but when you look at everything in general it just doesn't count up.

 

[AkGBA]

Unwanted pregnancies destroy lives, plural.
People should be prepared if and when they want to raise children.

I'm trying to understand the pro-life stance, but I always come back to this argument.

 

[D34DL1N3R]

Who the fuck ever said that? A rapist should be in prison for life, caged like the animal that it is.

Now, I could be wrong, but I know I hadn't even mentioned anything about the end of the doctor, and the comments from other people that I have read didn't mention anything about what may happen to a doctor. So wtf are you going on about?

Oh, please. Don't play dumb. You know exactly what I'm talking about and exactly how it fits in to the entire conversation.

 

[Mollycule]

When I lived in England I knew 2 girls who had abortions, they loved to take cocaine and have weird parties with the bar owners after hours, I was unlucky enough to be that person who hears about all sorts of shit because I had loads of "friends" back then, and to be honest they were morons those two, and they are the sorts of people making abortions illegal, I agree that under certain circumstances a child can be aborted, but there are people that are disgusting excuses for human beings that abused it to the point of it basically becoming murder.

Religious bullshit aside, it's sad that people choose to stop another human from experiencing what life is, all for themselves, finances shouldn't be a reason, which I have heard used often as a reason for justification, because you're 'not ready'.. get fucking real.

 

[kumikochan]

When I lived in England I knew 2 girls who had abortions, they loved to take cocaine and have weird parties with the bar owners after hours, I was unlucky enough to be that person who hears about all sorts of shit because I had loads of "friends" back then, and to be honest they were morons those two, and they are the sorts of people making abortions illegal, I agree that under certain circumstances a child can be aborted, but there are people that are disgusting excuses for human beings that abused it to the point of it basically becoming murder.

Religious bullshit aside, it's sad that people choose to stop another human from experiencing what life is, all for themselves, finances shouldn't be a reason, which I have heard used often as a reason for justification, because you're 'not ready'.. get fucking real.

What for you is considered life is not considered life over there or here. It has been shown multiple times that brain activity starts after 3 months in and life here isn't considered to be life when there's no brain activity. It is the same with somebody who is in a vegative state. There's no brain activity so in that regard the person isn't seen as alive anymore. If you consider life without brain activity then you can also consider a beating heart without a body but attached to a machine life wich it isn't

 

[supersonicwaffle]

But they also have the death penalty, gay marriage is perfectly fine here in Belgium and gender change can be done without a surgery so in that regard i don't find the US to be that progressive. Think we're also the only country in the world were euthanasia is legal but yeah in regard to the union as a whole some countries aren't that progressive as Belgium is. But in general when it comes to like everything regarding prison, death penalty, gay rights, abortion and so forth they are one of the least progressive countries in the west. Some laws may be more progressive compared to other countries but when you look at everything in general it just doesn't count up.

Yet they're far more progressive on cannabis legalization. The death penalty is still signed into law in some regions of the EU it's just not in effect because it's superceded by that country's federal law, which I understand is the same with the Alabama abortion bill.
Some of the things you mention can also be argued to be rather regressive.

 

[kumikochan]

Yet they're far more progressive on cannabis legalization. The death penalty is still signed into law in some regions of the EU it's just not in effect because it's superceded by that country's federal law, which I understand is the same with the Alabama abortion bill.
Some of the things you mention can also be argued to be rather regressive.

What ? Name me one Union country that has the death penalty ? NONE !
https://ec.europa.eu/europeaid/sect...d-human-rights/fight-against-death-penalty_en