Harada talks Super Smash bros.

[Hero-Link]

I still don't understand HOW this game can be considered a serious tournament game... This a party game, sure you can make tournaments with friends and whatnot.

But the main focus of this game is the same as Mario Kart, as Mario Strikers, etc.... Playing the game without any items, negating certain characters... how can you call that a fun game?

Street Fighter, Tekken, DOA, etc... now those can be played more seriously.

In my opinion, Melee was clearly the worse entry in the series as the game felt slower than the rest and didn't add as much as Brawl did to the original formula.

Brawl > SSB64 > Melee

 

[yusuo]

tekken is teh best fighter.

I used to think that too, now I realise DOA trumpts it thanks to the fine timing on the reversals

 

[KingVamp]

In my opinion, Melee was clearly the worse entry in the series as the game felt slower than the rest and didn't add as much as Brawl did to the original formula.

Imo, that's crazy.

SSB can be considered a "serious" tournament game just like any other fighting game.

I still think this Brawl hate is misplace. If you need exploits or to be heavier to play seriously then you are
doing it wrong.

I wonder if melee was Brawl and the old melee didn't exist, would it be getting so much hate?

 

[Sterling]

In my opinion, Melee was clearly the worse entry in the series as the game felt slower than the rest and didn't add as much as Brawl did to the original formula.

Imo, that's crazy.

SSB can be considered a "serious" tournament game just like any other fighting game.

I still think this Brawl hate is misplace. If you need exploits or to be heavier to play seriously then you are
doing it wrong.

I wonder if melee was Brawl and the old melee didn't exist, would it be getting so much hate?

The only problem is that anytime someone discovers an exploit, it's just hard to stop using it. I can't stop L-cancelling, or wave dashing myself. In vanilla Brawl I know how to use grab loops on every capable character. Many people feel really good about themselves when they can do it, and just can't stop themselves. Brawl is just riddled with exploits that make the game unfair and unfun to people who can play.

 

[Guild McCommunist]

fine timing on the reversals

The synonyms for "breasts" are getting harder and harder to follow these days.

 

[triassic911]

I still don't understand HOW this game can be considered a serious tournament game... This a party game, sure you can make tournaments with friends and whatnot.

But the main focus of this game is the same as Mario Kart, as Mario Strikers, etc.... Playing the game without any items, negating certain characters... how can you call that a fun game?

Street Fighter, Tekken, DOA, etc... now those can be played more seriously.

In my opinion, Melee was clearly the worse entry in the series as the game felt slower than the rest and didn't add as much as Brawl did to the original formula.

Brawl > SSB64 > Melee

You view it as a party game, and that is all. This game is a fighting game. Just because it has Nintendo characters, it doesn't make it any less of a competitive game. I can also call Street Fighter, or Tekken a party game. It's all about your personal view on it.

 

[Guild McCommunist]

You view it as a party game, and that is all. This game is a fighting game. Just because it has Nintendo characters, it doesn't make it any less of a competitive game. I can also call Street Fighter, or Tekken a party game. It's all about your personal view on it.

The distinct lack of combos and horrible balancing is what makes it less competitive. Also the fact that in order to be considered "competitive" you have to take out everything that makes the game in any way unique or enjoyable. Also the entire part of "skill" in the game is based on exploits.

 

[Lanlan]

You view it as a party game, and that is all. This game is a fighting game. Just because it has Nintendo characters, it doesn't make it any less of a competitive game. I can also call Street Fighter, or Tekken a party game. It's all about your personal view on it.

The distinct lack of combos and horrible balancing is what makes it less competitive. Also the fact that in order to be considered "competitive" you have to take out everything that makes the game in any way unique or enjoyable. Also the entire part of "skill" in the game is based on exploits.

I don't agree with this, a game doesn't have to emulate Street Fighter to be competitive. Sure, there are imbalances and tiers and stuff, but I think this Smash Bros. is more about reaction time, Street Fighter is about memorizing combos and stuffs. I don't use any exploits in Smash Bros., I just roll around people until I have a good chance to hit. Sure it's not super technical, it isn't trying to be. It's about reflexes, for me at least.

 

[Sterling]

You view it as a party game, and that is all. This game is a fighting game. Just because it has Nintendo characters, it doesn't make it any less of a competitive game. I can also call Street Fighter, or Tekken a party game. It's all about your personal view on it.

The distinct lack of combos and horrible balancing is what makes it less competitive. Also the fact that in order to be considered "competitive" you have to take out everything that makes the game in any way unique or enjoyable. Also the entire part of "skill" in the game is based on exploits.

You're wrong about the no combos thing. If every fighter had specific button presses to make combos, the genre would be very stale by now. Super Smash Bros has never been about press 'x' button precisely at 'x' time after 'x' button press for massive damage. It's always put emphasis on free combos. You can get creative in how or when you smack someone, and the game actually wants you to use a different one every time since. Otherwise it'll reduce your damage. SSB is 10x more fun than every fighter out there IMO.

 

[triassic911]

You view it as a party game, and that is all. This game is a fighting game. Just because it has Nintendo characters, it doesn't make it any less of a competitive game. I can also call Street Fighter, or Tekken a party game. It's all about your personal view on it.

The distinct lack of combos and horrible balancing is what makes it less competitive. Also the fact that in order to be considered "competitive" you have to take out everything that makes the game in any way unique or enjoyable. Also the entire part of "skill" in the game is based on exploits.

That's your opinion on it.

 

[Guild McCommunist]

You're wrong about the no combos thing. If every fighter had specific button presses to make combos, the genre would be very stale by now. Super Smash Bros has never been about press 'x' button precisely at 'x' time after 'x' button press for massive damage. It's always put emphasis on free combos. You can get creative in how or when you smack someone, and the game actually wants you to use a different one every time since. Otherwise it'll reduce your damage. SSB is 10x more fun than every fighter out there IMO.

You do realize the point of fighting games is combos and that the strategy behind it is being able to chain specific combos together and know when to use them at the right time.

EDIT: And every fighter does have "specific button presses to make combos". Complaining about that aspect of fighters is like complaining about FPS games being in the first person.

SSB is indeed fun, I'm a big fan of the franchise and can play it for hours on end with friends. But do I find it to be a fighter? No.

I don't agree with this, a game doesn't have to emulate Street Fighter to be competitive. Sure, there are imbalances and tiers and stuff, but I think this Smash Bros. is more about reaction time, Street Fighter is about memorizing combos and stuffs. I don't use any exploits in Smash Bros., I just roll around people until I have a good chance to hit. Sure it's not super technical, it isn't trying to be. It's about reflexes, for me at least.

Nor do all fighters emulate Street Fighter. Every person remotely familiar with fighters knows that there's different strategy between Street Fighter, BlazBlue, Marvel vs. Capcom, and Mortal Kombat. Or fighters are entirely different and are in a third person perspective like Tekken and Soul Calibur.

My point about the exploits is that people will say you're not a "hardcore player" if you don't memorize exploits in the game and you won't be considered "competitive worthy". You have to learn how to break the game in order to be considered "good" at it. In fighting games, skill is based on reflex, strategy, and precision.

 

[Lanlan]

You're wrong about the no combos thing. If every fighter had specific button presses to make combos, the genre would be very stale by now. Super Smash Bros has never been about press 'x' button precisely at 'x' time after 'x' button press for massive damage. It's always put emphasis on free combos. You can get creative in how or when you smack someone, and the game actually wants you to use a different one every time since. Otherwise it'll reduce your damage. SSB is 10x more fun than every fighter out there IMO.

You do realize the point of fighting games is combos and that the strategy behind it is being able to chain specific combos together and know when to use them at the right time.

EDIT: And every fighter does have "specific button presses to make combos". Complaining about that aspect of fighters is like complaining about FPS games being in the first person.

SSB is indeed fun, I'm a big fan of the franchise and can play it for hours on end with friends. But do I find it to be a fighter? No.

I don't agree with this, a game doesn't have to emulate Street Fighter to be competitive. Sure, there are imbalances and tiers and stuff, but I think this Smash Bros. is more about reaction time, Street Fighter is about memorizing combos and stuffs. I don't use any exploits in Smash Bros., I just roll around people until I have a good chance to hit. Sure it's not super technical, it isn't trying to be. It's about reflexes, for me at least.

Nor do all fighters emulate Street Fighter. Every person remotely familiar with fighters knows that there's different strategy between Street Fighter, BlazBlue, Marvel vs. Capcom, and Mortal Kombat. Or fighters are entirely different and are in a third person perspective like Tekken and Soul Calibur.

My point about the exploits is that people will say you're not a "hardcore player" if you don't memorize exploits in the game and you won't be considered "competitive worthy". You have to learn how to break the game in order to be considered "good" at it. In fighting games, skill is based on reflex, strategy, and precision.

It's okay everyone, Guild doesn't actually mean any of this, he's just being sarcastic.

 

[Guild McCommunist]

It's okay everyone, Guild doesn't actually mean any of this, he's just being sarcastic.

Amendment: I'm being sarcastic when I'm being a dick. Here I'm having a polite conversation and you've run out of points.

Now we're entering sarcastic territory.

 

[Lanlan]

It's okay everyone, Guild doesn't actually mean any of this, he's just being sarcastic.

Amendment: I'm being sarcastic when I'm being a dick. Here I'm having a polite conversation and you've run out of points.

Now we're entering sarcastic territory.

Sometimes I think you argue for the sake of arguing.
Back on topic, okay SSB isn't a fighting game in the sense of SF, MvC, Tekken, SC, or whatever, but it's still a fighting game. It may be its own genre of fighting game, but it's still a fighting game.

 

[Anakir]

Namco working on this is the reason why I still have little hope for the game. Otherwise, I wouldn't even bother with it.

I'll stick with Melee and Project M. Project M is pretty much Smash 4 for me.

 

[triassic911]

It's okay everyone, Guild doesn't actually mean any of this, he's just being sarcastic.

Amendment: I'm being sarcastic when I'm being a dick. Here I'm having a polite conversation and you've run out of points.

Now we're entering sarcastic territory.

Sometimes I think you argue for the sake of arguing.
Back on topic, okay SSB isn't a fighting game in the sense of SF, MvC, Tekken, SC, or whatever, but it's still a fighting game. It may be its own genre of fighting game, but it's still a fighting game.

He is one of those guys who put out his opinion as if it were fact. Anyway, I also consider Smash Bros a fighting game, just as I would Tekken or Street fighter.

 

[Anakir]

I'd call it its own genre if anything - platform fighter.

 

[Sterling]

You're wrong about the no combos thing. If every fighter had specific button presses to make combos, the genre would be very stale by now. Super Smash Bros has never been about press 'x' button precisely at 'x' time after 'x' button press for massive damage. It's always put emphasis on free combos. You can get creative in how or when you smack someone, and the game actually wants you to use a different one every time since. Otherwise it'll reduce your damage. SSB is 10x more fun than every fighter out there IMO.

You do realize the point of fighting games is combos and that the strategy behind it is being able to chain specific combos together and know when to use them at the right time.

EDIT: And every fighter does have "specific button presses to make combos". Complaining about that aspect of fighters is like complaining about FPS games being in the first person.

You do realize that SSB uses the same concept without rigid combo maps right? A; A; B; B does not make a flashy double punch drop kick special. All this does in SSB is a character specific normal (punch, slash, etc.) and their special (bow, shieldbreaker, fireball). Let me name you a combo I use all the time with Shiek.

Dash; Grab + down; Neutral A with up; Neutral A with Diagonal up; Jump; Neutral A with up while in the Air. Visually this looks like a dash grab with a piledriver punctuated by two kicks and a flashy air finisher. At 100% damage and above you're close to being put into stage orbit. Now, tell me that this isn't a combo. Now, I can set up this easily, but it's also very avoidable. In a game like Tekken or Street Fighter, you can't freely dodge or block as you can in SSB. So not only is it harder to keep a special or a finisher from wrecking you, it's also harder to play against people who have memorized movesets and combo maps. It's the same in SSB, but someone who has the basics down can still face off against a better player and still have fun.

 

[Guild McCommunist]

Sometimes I think you argue for the sake of arguing.
Back on topic, okay SSB isn't a fighting game in the sense of SF, MvC, Tekken, SC, or whatever, but it's still a fighting game. It may be its own genre of fighting game, but it's still a fighting game.

I've argued this point on many occasions, plenty of people here can attest to it. If I'm "arguing for the sake of arguing" I usually make a point to note that I'm playing devil's advocate or make it very clear that I'm just playing out the other side.

He is one of those guys who put out his opinion as if it were fact.

And I assume you're one of those people who just can't make a solid point?

I mean I enter this conversation with points and in what I believe to be a respectful manner and people instantly go "WOW WHAT AN ASSHOLE". Remind me next time in an argument I should just start degrading people instantly.

 

[Gahars]

It's okay everyone, Guild doesn't actually mean any of this, he's just being sarcastic.

Amendment: I'm being sarcastic when I'm being a dick. Here I'm having a polite conversation and you've run out of points.

Now we're entering sarcastic territory.

Sometimes I think you argue for the sake of arguing.
Back on topic, okay SSB isn't a fighting game in the sense of SF, MvC, Tekken, SC, or whatever, but it's still a fighting game. It may be its own genre of fighting game, but it's still a fighting game.

So he offers his reasoning for why he doesn't consider the Smash Bros. franchise fighting games, and you respond by... just stating the opposite with nothing to support your opinion.

That's the argumentative equivalent of sticking your fingers in your ears.