thaddius' Console Roast 2014 Edition - Round 3

Discussion in 'General Gaming Discussion' started by thaddius, Feb 27, 2014.

?
  1. The Atari 7800

    51 vote(s)
    15.0%
  2. The Casio PV-1000

    241 vote(s)
    70.9%
  3. The FAMICOM/Nintendo Entertainment System

    13 vote(s)
    3.8%
  4. The Sega SG-1000

    21 vote(s)
    6.2%
  5. The Sega Master System

    14 vote(s)
    4.1%
  1. thaddius
    OP

    thaddius Charmander is not pleased.

    Member
    4
    May 5, 2008
    Canada
    Welcome back to thaddius’ Console Roast 2014 Edition. For those of you who are not aware this is a poll where you, the GBATemp user, get to vote on what GBATemp thinks is the worst console ever is. For more information check out the Rules section below.

    Recap:

    Last week we got our poll on the home page which seriously boosted the number of votes. I haven't checked (and won't), but I do believe that this week’s selection received more votes than we did each week last time. Thank you GBATemp for giving us the visibility to really make this GBATemp's - as a whole - choice.

    Without further ado this week’s ‘winner’ is:
    [​IMG]

    The Fairchild Channel F


    Congratulations Fairchild for winning this week with one of the worst console names ever! You will join the ranks of the Nintendo Color TV Game in the running for worst console. I don’t know how I feel about this victory as this is a console I actually struggled to come up with bad things to say about it, but GBATemp has spoken and I must honour the rules of the Roast!

    For more information on last week's vote, check out the thread here.

    Intro:

    And so we make our way out of the crash of '83 and into the generations that more people know a bit about. This generation marks Japan's rise as a video game powerhouse and the decline of North American manufacturers (the ones who survived the crash, anyway).

    I'm sure you'll all at least have played a game or two from one of these consoles so we may see some more 'informed' decisions being made. But before we find out more about these things, let's have a recap of the rules!

    Rules:
    Warning: Spoilers inside!
    Enough of that crap, time to get started!

    This Week's Challengers:
    The Atari 7800
    [​IMG]
    Atari under new management was a cautious bunch. A little too cautious. The 7800 was only given a small release in ’84 to ‘see how things would go’. When the higher ups were finally convinced to release the system in earnest it was launched a year after the North American release of the roaring success that was the NES and was decidedly behind in the times. As if acknowledging it’s poor tech Atari later opted for a NES/Master System-style controller (pictured above), but only released it in Europe.

    At least they got the 2600 backwards compatible thing right this time. And forgot about the 5200 for some reason…

    The 7800’s lack of success from ’86 to ’91 (and the lack of success of a certain handheld) caused Atari to cancel a bunch of 7800 peripherals and and we wouldn’t get another console from them for some another generation.


    The Casio PV-1000
    [​IMG]
    Nintendo’s success spurred a lot of people to enter the market, but here we have another competitor that did not benefit from sharing shelf space with their powerhouses. The ill-timed PV-1000 was released to the Japanese market after the FAMICOM in ’83 and, as you’d expect, did not fare well.

    For some reason Casio apparently pulled it from the shelves a few weeks after its release. So not only was it a failure next to the FAMICOM but it’s also vanishingly rare.


    The Family Computer/Nintendo Entertainment System
    [​IMG]
    While the FAMICOM was released successfully in the crash-of-’83-insulated Japan, Nintendo had a tough time eking out a place in North America post-crash.

    Initially Nintendo couldn’t find a North American distributor to help them; even Atari said no. Atari couldn’t have known how well the NES would do with all the crash doom-and-gloom in the company. When Nintendo finally got a toy company, Mattel, to distribute their VCR-like console in ’85 it did much better than some thought it would.

    Nintendo hoped to stymie the poor quality of games problem the Atari 2600 had with their ‘Seal of Quality’ and a strict policy of limiting the number of games a publisher could release each year. While these policies did ensure that there would be games of quality released for the system it didn’t prevent terrible games from being released for the system (which a dearth of AVGN videos can attest to). And while the NES didn’t start the trend of horrible movie tie-in and abstractly unplayable games, it certainly became known for some of the most iconic ‘horrible’ games of the generation.

    The Sega SG-1000
    [​IMG]
    Sega released the SG-1000 to Japanese, New Zealand, and Australian markets. There were also small releases of the console in some European countries and in South Africa.

    It did not fare well at all. The SG-1000 was an antiquated console next to the FAMICOM. Poor sales led to Sega being bought out by another company and attempts to vitalize sales of the console with re-releases, hardware tweaks, and re-brandings were unsuccessful.

    The Sega Master System
    [​IMG]
    Not to be deterred by the ‘abject failure’ of the SG-1000, Sega got to work on it’s next console. Having learned a lot from their previous console’s performance they released the Master System to the market.

    Hoping that mere technical superiority over the NES/FAMICOM would do the trick (a mistake you’ll see time and again) the Master System initially refused to allow third-party support for the console. This proved a poor decision and when they tried to find some of their own they were totally cock-blocked by Nintendo’s exclusivity contracts with third-party developers.

    It was considered a failure in the Japanese and North American markets. In an effort to boost sales Sega took a page out of Nintendo’s book and approached a toy manufacturer, Tonka in this case, to distribute their Master System Mark II. It didn't fair too well either.

    There were a myriad of other models around the world - like the Japan-only Mark III (which looks awesome, btw) - and while some were able to find limited success in the Brazilian market they were resounding flops in the larger markets.

    Outro:

    So there you have it, GBATemp. Who will you vote? Who will be the crap-de-la-crap?

    Current Standings:
    Warning: Spoilers inside!
     
    Taleweaver likes this.
  2. DinohScene

    DinohScene Feed Dino to the Sharks

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    Antarctica
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    Casio system.
    Controller just looks like a dildo.
    That and I never heard of it.
    So it's bound to be bad

    Although I'd nearly vote for the NES, then again I love that boxy design..
    The Mastersystem is pretty sweet imho.
    Looks futuristic.
    Even today it still does.
     
  3. trumpet-205

    trumpet-205 Embrace the darkness within

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    Jan 14, 2009
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    We need to get this thread on the front page, just like last time.

    Seriously though, PV-1000 is a no brainer. Most people didn't even know the existence of this system.
     
  4. Tom Bombadildo

    Tom Bombadildo Tom BombaDadlo

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    Tom Bombadildo is a Patron of GBAtemp and is helping us stay independent!

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    I forgot
    I can't say I've ever heard of the Casio system, and googling around it seems the thing only ever had 15 games programmed for it so I would have to assume the console was junk.
     
  5. Foxi4

    Foxi4 On the hunt...

    Global Moderator
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    Sep 13, 2009
    Poland
    Gaming Grotto
    Maybe that was the problem, actually. Maybe the Fairchild was like this unpopular dish in the local restaurant - nobody buys it, it's not technically bad, but you struggle to say something good or bad about it because it's so bland. I personally disagree with that description of the Fairchild - the controller is anything but bland, but hey! Sometimes a recognizable and attractive name makes all the difference. ;)

    As for my vote, this generation is a bit of a toss-up because a lot of those systems didn't make a splash at all. The SG-1000 and its derrivatives weren't all that successful, which could be attributed to the fact that they were exclusive to Japan, but its design had a huge impact on the Master System which was quite popular. The Atari 7800 wasn't hugely successful either, but it was a step up from the 5200 in every way imaginable. The Casio PV-1000... discontinued after a couple of weeks? Practically no gaems? Well, I think we have a winner, gentlemen, although the title is not something to be proud of. :rofl2:
     
  6. Gahars

    Gahars Bakayaro Banzai

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    Aug 5, 2011
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    I say the NES because I am a rebel.

    Atari 7800 for life!
     
  7. Taleweaver

    Taleweaver Storywriter

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    Dec 23, 2009
    Belgium
    Belgium
    I had my doubts about voting for the sega SG-1000, but seeing how that led to the master system, it's hardly worth competing with the casio PV-1000 (though history is surely proving that retarded console names are nothing new :P ).
     
  8. tbgtbg

    tbgtbg Shaking the ring ropes up in the sky

    Member
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    Nov 27, 2006
    United States
    Casio? That has to win just for "what the hell is that" factor.

    And here I thought 7800 would have this era locked up.
     
  9. Foxi4

    Foxi4 On the hunt...

    Global Moderator
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    Sep 13, 2009
    Poland
    Gaming Grotto
    To be fair guys, there isn't much of a contest here. Here's a visual representation of this particular generation:

    [​IMG]

    ...there's only two notable systems - the rest fell. Some landed on their knees, some on their face, but they fell nonetheless. :rofl2:
     
  10. XDel

    XDel Author of the Alien Breed Odamex Projekt.

    Member
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    Jul 25, 2012
    United States
    Solaris
    Master System and 7800 HIGHLY under rated!

    I began with a Nintendo, and like most spoiled suburban children, I pressured my parents into getting me a Master System the next Christmas. And again, like most spoiled Suburban Children, a huge chunk of my friends pressured their parents into buying them a game system also.
    Most had the NES, a couple had the SMS, and one had a 7800.

    The SMS was held back ONLY by Nintendo's illegal monopoly in the video game market, bogus contracts with video game developers and what not.
    The 7800 was held back not only by this, but also by the fact that Atari changed hands right around the time the 7800 finished development, and was not released till two years after the fact. Also there was the lack luster offering of video games for the system, and the fact that the Paula audio chip was not installed directly on the board, but was to be included on the game carts (by choice of developer) instead. Well that and the fact that the 7800's 1st gen joy sticks sucked balls, though that was later corrected.
    The thing is though with the 7800, and they have gone more in depth about this time and time again over on Atariage.com, is the fact that the 7800 could pull off many stunts that the NES couldn't even dream of. In fact some of the 7800 games, though certainly blockier (Xenophobe) turned out a LOT better in the translation than they did on the NES. Had it had the third party support, and more than that, a broader set of passionate developers, it could have really made some waves while it was alive and kicking, but alas it was too little too late. Though games and hardware expansions are still being developed for it...

    Anyhow, the SMS on the other hand, despite being challenged by Nintendo's monopoly, still managed to churn out a shit load of games that far surpassed any offering available on the Nintendo for the longest time. In fact it was not till near the end of the Nintendo's cycle, that they began to pull an Atari and start adding in advanced chips to the game carts that allowed NES games to finally begin to pull of some of the things the SMS did naturally...

    ...well all but produce audio that didn't sound like complete and utter shit. Though that said, the Famicom did not suffer from this fate and had much better audio capabilities, ala Castlevania III.

    As for the SG-1000, well again, too little too late, though that's what the SMS was for, to correct that, though again Nintendo and their damned monopoly...

    At least the Europeans seemed to be smart in this case as they seemed to have clung to the SMS, for which reason games continued to be developed for it, and push it to the limits, long after the NES/SMS/7800 cycle was intended to have been slaughtered and thus pressuring mindless consumers into buying the next big and great thing. Though don't get me wrong, the next big thing was pretty great. I mean who doesn't love the SNES, Genesis, and Turbo GFX?!?!

    After that though... game consoles became really hit or miss.
     
  11. Taleweaver

    Taleweaver Storywriter

    Member
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    Dec 23, 2009
    Belgium
    Belgium
    You do know that this is a poll about the WORST game console, right? It took me a while to understand that you're actually praising the machines.

    I'm not sure why you're praising them, though. Saying that the atari was pretty good if there were more games for it and carried a reputation of having bad joysticks doesn't sound much of a praise at all.

    Also: you're pulling that monopoly-thing from nintendo out of your ass. Nintendo learned from the crash of '83 that games needed to cater to a certain standard of quality before they would be allowed on their system (the nintendo seal of approval). I can imagine studios didn't like those restrictions, but it was certainly the right thing to do at that time. It's probably true that nintendo invented "exclusives" around that time, but that doesn't make it a monopoly (that would mean that if I was a game developer in those days, nintendo could have done something to prevent me from developing for whatever system I wanted).
     
  12. XDel

    XDel Author of the Alien Breed Odamex Projekt.

    Member
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    Jul 25, 2012
    United States
    Solaris
    Really? You are taking the time to lecture me over my rant which was on topic.

    And yes, Nintendo had a monopoly, they created a contract that said "you can develop games for the NES and no other". That's a monopoly .
     
  13. emigre

    emigre An electric type pokemons

    Member
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    Jan 28, 2009
    United States
    London
    The people who voted SMS deserve a kick in the balls.
     
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  14. thaddius
    OP

    thaddius Charmander is not pleased.

    Member
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    May 5, 2008
    Canada
    Personally I only knew one person who owned a Master System growing up, and it wasn't me. It never seemed as fun as my NES at home. I procured a Mark II a few years back and was not impressed with the games that came with it (Shinobi, and Alex Kidd in Miracle World).

    I understand your concerns about the perceived 'monopoly', but as this was a burgeoning industry there were no laws in place to prevent any misdeeds (similar to the film industry's lack of laws against vertical integration early in the 20th century). We wouldn't even have a rating system for another generation. But I don't believe that what Nintendo did was illegal or unsavoury, nor do I believe that they created a 'monopoly' in North America.

    Sega resisted third party developers initially to avoid the problem the Atari 2600 et al had last generation with shitty games flooding the market. That may have seemed like a good idea at the time, but it allowed Nintendo to make their exclusive third party move. By the time Sega opened their doors to third parties it was too late. There's no law against 'early bird catches the worm' business practises.

    Now a monopoly would be if Nintendo had complete control over the video game industry. The mere existence of competitors in the market denies the possibility of a monopoly. Nintendo did have the most third party developers, but they did not have control over all of them as Nintendo's competitors were able to round up people to make their games for them. I would assume you were using the words 'illegal monopoly' to emphasize by exaggeration, but I thought I'd clear this up anyhow.
     
  15. XDel

    XDel Author of the Alien Breed Odamex Projekt.

    Member
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    Jul 25, 2012
    United States
    Solaris
    Well any move to consolidate the market in a manner such as that, to me, is a step towards a monopoly, so I guess I'll verse it in that manner," a step towards a monopoly" which it ends up being in the end because if your contract says you can no longer develop games for other consoles, then you are bound. In the mean time, nobody else can have your business, and has to defend them selves by writing their own games, or trying to find those few companies left that did not jump on the Nintendo band wagon.
    So yes, I guess in a sense you are correct, there was no monopoly because there were other systems on the market, yet, because of Nintendo's policies, no one was free to develop for any of the other systems without putting their (now successful) business with Nintendo on the line.

    At most, Nintendo should have been able to have authorized games only, but in America at least, their contract was technically illegal from the get go. We have anti-monopoly laws here which are set in place not only to dismantle monopolies, but also to shoot down contractial moves that lead to a monopoly, meaning the U.S. courts should have shot this move down from the very beginning. All Nintendo had any rights to was putting a chip in their system that prevented un-licensed developers from making games on their system as a means of quality control (ha ha ha LJN got through the door, ha ha ha!).

    The sad truth though is that governments are just agents for those who draw in the most capital and have the most influence, so monopoly laws are not enforced in the very least here in America, and stuff like this goes down all the time without the courts uttering so much as a word. This has a lot to do with my Microsoft Windows is so wide spread at this point in the game, and why superior OS' such as BeOS were never given the chance to ship to stores with Dell, Compaq, Gateway, Toshiba, etc, though that's a rant for another day and another forum.
     
  16. Foxi4

    Foxi4 On the hunt...

    Global Moderator
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    Sep 13, 2009
    Poland
    Gaming Grotto
    I'm not entirely sure where the monopoly allegations come from - there are numerous NES games that were released multiplatform, even notable titles like Castlevania, Contra, Metal Gear or even Nintendo titles like Donkey Kong.

    As for the SMS, there's a variety of notable titles such as Shinobi or Castle of Illusions, the system was met with success in the European market and even though initially SEGA's software development policies impeded its progress, they quickly learned from their mistakes which led to the Mega Drive flourishing the next generation.

    Now, I won't talk much about its library as I only own a handful of games, but looking through Retro Sanctuary's Top 100 I can see a great number of interesting games I'd like to try out.
     
  17. XDel

    XDel Author of the Alien Breed Odamex Projekt.

    Member
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    Jul 25, 2012
    United States
    Solaris
    The history I am speaking of may be an American thing only as I noticed Konami games did grace the MSX and the like in Japan at the time. Of course there were the lack luster PC and Mac ports, as well as the hit or miss Amiga ports, but I imagine Nintendo did not see computers as contenders to their console market at the time, especially considering that at the time that most computer users were working in the field and were not home users, and secondly there was the fact that both PC's and Macs sucked at the time and the only decent machine on the market at the time (the Amiga) was way out of the price league for most.

    As for Sega and the SMS. Oh to be sure they put out some great titles, I stand by the SMS and the Turbo GFX 16 as the two of the best 8-bit consoles ever!
    The thing is though (and mind you things were different in Europe), is that hardly anyone in the US bought the SMS. The NES came out about a year before for one, and secondly the NES had the larger game library which I think consumers were also taking into account at the time. When the Genesis came out, the 3rd party devs had already broken Nintendo's attempt at a console market monopoly, plus they made sure they released their hardware before Nintendo this time which really helped them a lot in the long run for as we can see the Genesis was quite successful as was the SNES and it was nice, we had choice, and both of those consoles (Turbog GFX 16 included) were quite unique and of their own nature, which is more than what I can say about the Sony/Microsoft wars. Despite the little details, neither of them really feel like they are unique and of their own contrary to the spirit that Nintendo has always maintained...

    ...man I wish the old Sega heads were back and that they were working on a new, unique game console again. Sighhh. :/


     
  18. Foxi4

    Foxi4 On the hunt...

    Global Moderator
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    Sep 13, 2009
    Poland
    Gaming Grotto
    To be fair XDel, both the Mega Drive and the Master System continue to be sold and manufactured in countries like Brazil - some of them are even licensed by SEGA. That said, they're gradually moving away from the original hardware and cartridge support and opting for hardware emulation, SoC's and built-in games. If there's one thing that can be said about those two retro Sega systems then it's definitely that they've survived the test of time and continue to be played to this day.
     
  19. XDel

    XDel Author of the Alien Breed Odamex Projekt.

    Member
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    Jul 25, 2012
    United States
    Solaris
    Yes, you are correct! As stated in my rant, Europe continued to produce games for the SMS long after the rise of the 16-Bit era. And to be sure, I have played some of those shitty SMS/Genesis clones...

    ...they never seem to be able to work out the Genesis audio chip just right. :/

     
  20. calmwaters

    calmwaters Cat's best friend

    Member
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    May 27, 2013
    United States
    happy land
    I'd never heard of the one that's losing right now; it must be that bad. I must say that Sega dropped out of the race somehow and since it wasn't the SMS's fault, it must've been the other one.

    And, uh, why are you people complaining about the exclusivity contracts Nintendo wrote for the third party developers? Is it wrong for Nintendo to have a monopoly in business? You guys wouldn't have any problem with this if it was any other company, but Nintendo is somehow special. As well they should be. They came out of the crash of '83 and immediately dominated the market. But even though they hold an extremely dear place in your heart because of this, they still need to make money. And the money was guaranteed to them, unlike two generations later. (But that's a whole other story; I'll save it.)
    *POW*
     
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