On the ability to play backups without drive chip

Discussion in 'Wii - Hacking' started by nitrotux, Jul 25, 2008.

  1. Rock Raiyu

    Rock Raiyu Clock Up

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    True. Plus chips add features that people with softmods probably can't/will never have.
     
  2. WiiCrazy

    WiiCrazy Be water my friend!

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    Above what marcan's written explains why bushing released those key dumping IOS hack with haste [​IMG]
    They seem to be pissed off badly by Nintendo.
     
  3. linkinworm

    linkinworm GBAtemp Maniac

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    you wont be able to do much with a softmod compared to an actual drivechip, cant you loads apps into the drivechip like GCOS or a dvd playing app i know you could on the gamecube
     
  4. elfsander

    elfsander GBAtemp Fan

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    Yep a Wii softmod can be made, but Nintendo will release a patch in a few months after it's released. They will always find a way to patch it. And saying that you won't update, might make it impossible to use new hardware with Wii (motion plus, Wii speak, etc)
     
  5. Rock Raiyu

    Rock Raiyu Clock Up

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    Thats where (I think, don't flame me) your wrong. You forget, we have the Wii Update Extractor so even if they do have an update where you have to update, we can take it out.
     
  6. Livin in a box

    Livin in a box Livin' in a cardboard box

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    Aha, Nintendo's reason to update. That update might just be a disc update though. If so, it won't do anything.
     
  7. Krono89

    Krono89 Member

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    So build a custom IOS with support for those things, but take out the DVD-R patch.
     
  8. Hellfenix

    Hellfenix GBAtemp Regular

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    Well not really elfsander, I think that it's possible that the scene will just get every update from the web, remove the security stuff and release it as a WAD so you can always keep up with the big N's updates... But that will be a hassle lol

    People buying new wiis will be screwed though
     
  9. Krono89

    Krono89 Member

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    I'm pretty sure someone will come up with a way to "downgrade" new Wiis.
     
  10. elfsander

    elfsander GBAtemp Fan

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    Also they might even make new ways of checking the firmware's version. Like the scene makes a "custom" 3.4, since 3.4 fixes the problem. The scene version of 3.4 includes all features from the Nintendo version, except the updated security. If they check the md5 / crc of the installed firmware (with the game discs) then the scene version is toast.
     
  11. blinktoday

    blinktoday Advanced Member

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    What does this mean?

    Re: Niños jugando a ser dioses

    Mensajepor marcansoft Hoy 23:11

    Hermes escribió:Ahora los papeles se cambian al parecer, y es Waninkoko quien se medio mosquea con otro, que parece que viene a contar aquí una información importantisima, pero que es mas vieja que el mear y hasta yo la conozco sin saber nada de IOS.


    Si hasta me dijo Waninkoko que se la había dicho otro [+risas]

    Hermes escribió:Por cierto marcan: ahora que todos sabemos el "gran" secreto que está detrás de un posible uso del DVD-R sin chip ¿porque carajo no teneis inconveniente ahora de publicar una librería que habilita este uso y que proporciona el ladrillo que otros todavía no han encontrado? ¿Es mas importante ser los primeros en llegar o ser los ultimos de proporcionar los ingredientes que conducen a un uso pirata de ésto? Y si, ya se que todavia quedarán varios muros por derribar, pero hasta hace muy poco esa no era la filosofía de tu team ¿o si?.


    Ese ladrillo que falta lo que hace es facilitar mucho el uso de este bug para el homebrew, y no ayuda a la piratería. De hecho, si se hubiera sacado de esa forma solo, no haría falta esta información y por lo tanto no haría falta divulgarla para usarlo con homebrew (con las consiguientes ayudas a la piratería). El hecho de que no se haya encontrado todavía ese ladrillo demuestra que, tal y como pensábamos al planear sacarlo si Nintendo pasa de nosotros, es bastante complicado seguir la conexión entre ese ladrillo y la información expuesta en este hilo (la ruta de ejecución que los une es bastante enrevesada). De hecho, en el sentido opuesto es muchísimo mas dificil (nosotros la hemos encontrado con relativa facilidad partiendo de lo expuesto en el hilo, pero al revés sería mucho mas complicado).

    Al principio, cuando encontramos este bug, nuestra intención clara era intentar ayudar a Nintendo por su potencial para la piratería. Pero estos tres factores han hecho que cambiemos de idea:

    * El hecho de que Nintendo no parece estar dándonos mucha importancia, ya que la comunicación hasta ahora, aunque existente, es decepcionante
    * El descubrimiento del "ladrillo" que es lo suficientemente distante del meollo interno como para ser util para homebrew y no para la piratería (a no ser que alguien siga el cable correctamente)
    * La dificultad de convertir esto en un cargador de backups (lo hemos intentado, por puro experimento, y lo hemos dejado cuando vimos que no era trivial. Estamos seguros de que podemos sacarlo dada una semana o por ahí de trabajar, pero pasamos)


    Al final, recuerda que nuestra meta siempre ha sido la mejora del homebrew. Cuando se involucra la piratería, hay que sopesar las posibilidades. En este caso, hemos llegado al punto en el que creo que gana la opción de liberarlo.

    Hermes escribió:Con una mano, me pongo en contacto con Nintendo para tapar un boquete y hago publico el bug, para que otros se den "cuenta" por el camino. Con la otra ,desarrollo una librería y ensamblo todas las piezas para poderlo usar. Tanto si Nintendo no responde, como si lo hace pero lo "descubren" otros, yo lo hago público ensamblando todas lass piezas y proporcionando "algo" que otros no conocen todavía y que es fundamental para que funcione


    Hermes, el ladrillo no es fundamental para que funcione. Simplemente es una forma mucho mas limpia de conseguir lo que queremos, y además mas distante de la piratería. No me cabe la menor duda de que si no hacemos nada va a salir un cIOS con esto activado, y como conocemos una forma mejor de hacerlo, lo lógico es liberarla para intentar que las cosas se hagan bien.

    Los que quieran piratear ya tienen toda la información que les podamos dar - el resto se lo van a tener que hacer solitos, saquemos la lib o no. Ahora solo queda ponerle las cosas mas fáciles al homebrew.
     
  12. linkinworm

    linkinworm GBAtemp Maniac

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    haha, yea [​IMG] toooo soon.
     
  13. blinktoday

    blinktoday Advanced Member

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    Haha, I was gonna say that, but decided not too.
     
  14. Hellfenix

    Hellfenix GBAtemp Regular

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    I only just read bits and parts of it but basically it says that they didn't want to release the way to read the DVDR's because it would allow piracy and nintendo would patch it. They decided to release it because the conversation with nintendo is deceiving and using that information to make an ISO loader although possible is not trivial, it's frikken hard. So yeah, basically they will release the lib to read from DVDR's from homebrew.
     
  15. linkinworm

    linkinworm GBAtemp Maniac

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    there efforts fail anyway, there are many people on the scene smarter than them, i think like 3 people knew the exploit, from looking on there own, its going to come out soon, well maybe like 2 months or so(no that isnt some inside info i have, its a guess) just need someone to harnis the exploit into a useable application/IOS
     
  16. Forcystos

    Forcystos Member

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    Re: Kids playing gods

    Message by marcansoft Today 23:11

    Hermes wrote: Now the tables turn it seems, and it's Waninkoko who whispers (?) with another, who seems to come here telling some very important information, but it's older than pissing and even I know it without knowing anything about IOS.


    Yes, even Waninkoko told me he had told someone else [+laugh]

    Hermes wrote: By the way marcan: now that we all know the "great" secret behind the possible use of DVD-R without chip, why the f*** don't you have a problem now with releasing a library that allows this use and provides the brick others have yet to find? Is it more important to be first to finish or being the last in providing the ingredients leading to pirate use of this? And yes, I know there's still some walls to knock down, but until a while ago that wasn't your team's philosophy, or was it?.


    What that missing brick does is make using this bug easier for homebrew, and it doesn't help piracy. In fact, if it was released that way alone, this information wouldn't be required so spreading it wouldn't be necessary to use with homebrew (with subsequent help to piracy). The fact that this brick hasn't been found yet proves that, just how we thought of releasing it if Nintendo went by us, it's pretty complicated to follow the connection between that brick and the information exposed in this thread (the execution line that ties them is pretty tangled). In fact, in the opposite sense it's much harder (we found it with relative ease starting from what's exposed in the thread, but the other way around would be far more complicated).

    First off, when we found this bug, our clear intention was to help Nintendo for it's potential for piracy. But these three factors have made us change our minds:

    * The fact that Nintendo isn't giving us much importance, since communication so far, though existent, is a letdown
    * The finding of the "brick" that is far enough from the internals to be used for homebrew and not for piracy (except if someone follows the line correctly)
    * The difficulty of converting this into a backup loader (we have tried, for pure experimenting, and we stopped when we saw it wasn't trivial. We are sure we ould release one after a week or so of work, but we'll pass)


    In the end, remember our goal has always been for the better of homebrew. When piracy is involved, we have to face the consequences. In this case, we have reached a point where I think wins the release option.

    Hermes wrote: With one hand, I contact Nintendo to cover a hole and I publish the bug, so others can "find" the way. With the other, I develop a library and put together all the pieces for it's use. Whether Nintendo doesn't answer, as if they do but others "find" it, I publish all the pieces together providing "something" others don't yet know which is fundamental for it to work


    Hermes, the brick isn't needed for it to work. It's simply a cleaner way to get what we want, and make it further from piracy. I have no doubt that if we don't do anything there's gonna be a cIOS with this, and since we know a better way to do it, it's common sense to release it so things go right.

    Those who want piracy already have all the information we can give - the rest you will have to do for yourselves, whether we release the library or not. Now it's only a matter of making it easier for homebrew.
     
  17. Rock Raiyu

    Rock Raiyu Clock Up

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    Yeah, thats what I read as well with my Spanish knowledge lol
     
  18. blinktoday

    blinktoday Advanced Member

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    Thanks man.
     
  19. teq

    teq GBAtemp Maniac

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    I don't believe it's as hard as everyone is saying...

    Maybe hard for an average person, but certainly not hard for them. They could have it done in afternoon, if they haven't already.

    If I'm following correctly, it should be easy to toggle the UID. From there, you'd have to pass calls from DVD_LowRead to DVD_EnableDVDVideo, and then tie the output back into what DVD_LowRead returns.


    In any case, nitro, if you could PM me, we could throw ideas around.
     
  20. Lumstar

    Lumstar Princess

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    I don't want an ISO loader. I'd rather run games from burned discs.
     
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