Ngmoco: NGP "dead on arrival"; 3DS "gimmicky"

[concealed identi]

Because exceptions do not prove the rule; naming a few games that are not RPGs doesn't change the fact that the majority of "long-players" on the DS are RPGs. The fact that you named a bunch of adventure games (which could EASILY be done on a smartphone) and some games that were designed to be played in short bursts hinted that you missed my point completely.

I stated some games, never said that was all the games. The statement isn't true whether I stated some games or not.
I didn't list any short bursts. There are puzzle,fighting,action and adventure.

Yes maybe some can easily be rehash for a cheap buck,but it wouldn't be as good as what it was
regularly made for, a true game device.

Other words even if high-profile game was taken exactly from game device and put on a phone it wouldn't hold
the same feel/value as on a true game device.

I still stand by it, and like I said, naming some games that aren't in the majority doesn't prove anything; if we're talking about long-playing games, there aren't more puzzle, fighting, action, or racing games than RPGs. But again, you missed my point.


So you don't think Mario Kart, Layton, Super Mario Bros, Grand Theft Auto, can be played in short bursts? Really?

You think Phoenix Wright, Layton, 999, would be radically different on a smartphone than on a DS? You really think this? How would they be different?

 

[DSGamer64]

The last sentence killed off any relevance of his rant.

What does the iPod touch have in terms of functionality for gaming that the NGP doesn't?

In terms of functionality for gaming... nothing?

The only reason I see the iPod Touch as useful is because it is a platform that can help make life easier in ways that a gaming platform cannot, such as with convenient applications for socialization and education, on top of the multimedia platform it is based upon.

Yet the 3DS will probably have applications like Facebook just like the DSi did. It is irrelevant to discount other portable devices that are hardly on the market. Odds are you will see Twitter and Facebook on the 3DS and NGP at some point, however with those applications you constantly need a wireless connection to stay updated.

 

[Omninox]

Because exceptions do not prove the rule; naming a few games that are not RPGs doesn't change the fact that the majority of "long-players" on the DS are RPGs. The fact that you named a bunch of adventure games (which could EASILY be done on a smartphone) and some games that were designed to be played in short bursts hinted that you missed my point completely.

I stated some games, never said that was all the games. The statement isn't true whether I stated some games or not.
I didn't list any short bursts. There are puzzle,fighting,action and adventure.

Yes maybe some can easily be rehash for a cheap buck,but it wouldn't be as good as what it was
regularly made for, a true game device.

Other words even if high-profile game was taken exactly from game device and put on a phone it wouldn't hold
the same feel/value as on a true game device.

I still stand by it, and like I said, naming some games that aren't in the majority doesn't prove anything; if we're talking about long-playing games, there aren't more puzzle, fighting, action, or racing games than RPGs. But again, you missed my point.


So you don't think Mario Kart, Layton, Super Mario Bros, Grand Theft Auto, can be played in short bursts? Really?

You think Phoenix Wright, Layton, 999, would be radically different on a smartphone than on a DS? You really think this? How would they be different?

HAVE you played Call of Duty (zombie mode), on the iTouch/iPhone? if you had, you wouldn't be saying its the same as playing games on the handhelds and on a smartphone...

 

[concealed identi]

Because exceptions do not prove the rule; naming a few games that are not RPGs doesn't change the fact that the majority of "long-players" on the DS are RPGs. The fact that you named a bunch of adventure games (which could EASILY be done on a smartphone) and some games that were designed to be played in short bursts hinted that you missed my point completely.

I stated some games, never said that was all the games. The statement isn't true whether I stated some games or not.
I didn't list any short bursts. There are puzzle,fighting,action and adventure.

Yes maybe some can easily be rehash for a cheap buck,but it wouldn't be as good as what it was
regularly made for, a true game device.

Other words even if high-profile game was taken exactly from game device and put on a phone it wouldn't hold
the same feel/value as on a true game device.

I still stand by it, and like I said, naming some games that aren't in the majority doesn't prove anything; if we're talking about long-playing games, there aren't more puzzle, fighting, action, or racing games than RPGs. But again, you missed my point.


So you don't think Mario Kart, Layton, Super Mario Bros, Grand Theft Auto, can be played in short bursts? Really?

You think Phoenix Wright, Layton, 999, would be radically different on a smartphone than on a DS? You really think this? How would they be different?

HAVE you played Call of Duty (zombie mode), on the iTouch/iPhone? if you had, you wouldn't be saying its the same as playing games on the handhelds and on a smartphone...

Can you point out to me where I said playing Call of Duty (zombie mode) on a smartphone is the same as playing it on handhelds?


Take your time and let me know when you find it.

 

[Maedhros]

)
Gimmicky!!
like what they called the DS..
-------------------------------------

The 3D aspect seems to be more gimmicky than the touch controls because they affect the gameplay directly, different from 3D which just enhance the visuals.

But this guy is stupid. Nobody should give credit for someone like him.

 

[Omninox]

I still stand by it, and like I said, naming some games that aren't in the majority doesn't prove anything; if we're talking about long-playing games, there aren't more puzzle, fighting, action, or racing games than RPGs. But again, you missed my point.


So you don't think Mario Kart, Layton, Super Mario Bros, Grand Theft Auto, can be played in short bursts? Really?

You think Phoenix Wright, Layton, 999, would be radically different on a smartphone than on a DS? You really think this? How would they be different?

HAVE you played Call of Duty (zombie mode), on the iTouch/iPhone? if you had, you wouldn't be saying its the same as playing games on the handhelds and on a smartphone...

Can you point out to me where I said playing Call of Duty (zombie mode) on a smartphone is the same as playing it on handhelds?


Take your time and let me know when you find it.

my bad, i phrased it wrong. I meant that if you play that game you will see that playing games on the handheld and playing it on a smart phone just isn't the same. You asked if "Mario Kart", "Super Mario Bros" and "GTA" can be played in short bursts, sure they can... BUT the main question to be asked is, will the games be as smooth and easier to handle on a smartphone as it is on the actual gaming console. The answer is "no". Sure, certain games like "Professor Layton" and "Phoenix Wright" can be made to work out, however the other type of games just won't be the same.

 

[concealed identi]

I still stand by it, and like I said, naming some games that aren't in the majority doesn't prove anything; if we're talking about long-playing games, there aren't more puzzle, fighting, action, or racing games than RPGs. But again, you missed my point.


So you don't think Mario Kart, Layton, Super Mario Bros, Grand Theft Auto, can be played in short bursts? Really?

You think Phoenix Wright, Layton, 999, would be radically different on a smartphone than on a DS? You really think this? How would they be different?

HAVE you played Call of Duty (zombie mode), on the iTouch/iPhone? if you had, you wouldn't be saying its the same as playing games on the handhelds and on a smartphone...

Can you point out to me where I said playing Call of Duty (zombie mode) on a smartphone is the same as playing it on handhelds?


Take your time and let me know when you find it.

my bad, i phrased it wrong. I meant that if you play that game you will see that playing games on the handheld and playing it on a smart phone just isn't the same. You asked if "Mario Kart", "Super Mario Bros" and "GTA" can be played in short bursts, sure they can... BUT the main question to be asked is, will the games be as smooth and easier to handle on a smartphone as it is on the actual gaming console. The answer is "no". Sure, certain games like "Professor Layton" and "Phoenix Wright" can be made to work out, however the other type of games just won't be the same.

Right, but the points you're making aren't any different from the things I said before. I never said those other games would be the same.

 

[KingVamp]

So you don't think Mario Kart, Layton, Super Mario Bros, Grand Theft Auto, can be played in short bursts? Really?

You think Phoenix Wright, Layton, 999, would be radically different on a smartphone than on a DS? You really think this? How would they be different?

It can, but it not what it made for. Games mostly on iphone are made in for short bursts.

And maybe those games won't be different ( Phoenix Wright, Layton, 999 ) in terms of looks.

But if I had to pick between a quick or/and rehash made version on a iphone vs a well made version (which btw I can hold physically in my hand)
made for/ to fit the gaming devices I want. I whether pick the well made one.

 

[concealed identi]

So you don't think Mario Kart, Layton, Super Mario Bros, Grand Theft Auto, can be played in short bursts? Really?

You think Phoenix Wright, Layton, 999, would be radically different on a smartphone than on a DS? You really think this? How would they be different?

It can, but it not what it made for. Games mostly on iphone are made in for short bursts.

And maybe those games won't be different ( Phoenix Wright, Layton, 999 ) in terms of looks.

But if I had to pick between a quick or/and rehash made version on a iphone vs a well made version (which btw I can hold physically in my hand)
made for/ to fit the gaming devices I want. I whether pick the well made one.

That's fine, my point was that you are in the minority; if people can get the exact same game that plays identically to the original for under $10 instead of buying a $250-300 system and then spending another $40-60 on the game, a huge number of them will choose the former.

 

[machomuu]

So you don't think Mario Kart, Layton, Super Mario Bros, Grand Theft Auto, can be played in short bursts? Really?

You think Phoenix Wright, Layton, 999, would be radically different on a smartphone than on a DS? You really think this? How would they be different?

It can, but it not what it made for. Games mostly on iphone are made in for short bursts.

And maybe those games won't be different ( Phoenix Wright, Layton, 999 ) in terms of looks.

But if I had to pick between a quick or/and rehash made version on a iphone vs a well made version (which btw I can hold physically in my hand)
made for/ to fit the gaming devices I want. I whether pick the well made one.

That's fine, my point was that you are in the minority; if people can get the exact same game that plays identically to the original for under $10 instead of buying a $250-300 system and then spending another $40-60 on the game, a huge number of them will choose the former.

Actually he's not in the minority. Most people would rather play games on the original system(s) they were meant for as aesthetically this amost always look worse on iHardware and controls feel cramped as they are on the screen with the game itself, making it difficult to control many games and just uncomfortable. Also, you are omitting the cost of iHardware itself.

 

[ShadowSoldier]

Actually he's not in the minority. Most people would rather play games on the original system(s) they were meant for as aesthetically this amost always look worse on iHardware and controls feel cramped as they are on the screen with the game itself, making it difficult to control many games and just uncomfortable. Also, you are omitting the cost of iHardware itself.

Megaman is a prime example. It controls like shit on the iOS.

 

[blackdragonbaham]

comes to question what will come to life first, handhelds you can make calls with or smartphones which offer the features to make playing on em comfortable. at one point one of those two cases will become true. but we aren't at that point yet, to put smartphones on the same level as handhelds isn't right. also you can get a lot of software, apps and games to your smartphone they are nothing in comparison to real portable games which don't only entertain you for a short time but offer real gaming experience 'to go'. those prognoses are annoying and nothing more.

 

[concealed identi]

So you don't think Mario Kart, Layton, Super Mario Bros, Grand Theft Auto, can be played in short bursts? Really?

You think Phoenix Wright, Layton, 999, would be radically different on a smartphone than on a DS? You really think this? How would they be different?

It can, but it not what it made for. Games mostly on iphone are made in for short bursts.

And maybe those games won't be different ( Phoenix Wright, Layton, 999 ) in terms of looks.

But if I had to pick between a quick or/and rehash made version on a iphone vs a well made version (which btw I can hold physically in my hand)
made for/ to fit the gaming devices I want. I whether pick the well made one.

That's fine, my point was that you are in the minority; if people can get the exact same game that plays identically to the original for under $10 instead of buying a $250-300 system and then spending another $40-60 on the game, a huge number of them will choose the former.

Actually he's not in the minority. Most people would rather play games on the original system(s) they were meant for as aesthetically this amost always look worse on iHardware and controls feel cramped as they are on the screen with the game itself, making it difficult to control many games and just uncomfortable. Also, you are omitting the cost of iHardware itself.

I'm not omitting anything, because my point is that people aren't buying smartphones for gaming but already have them and USE them for gaming. That's what I've been saying.

And he's definitely in the minority; loads of people aren't going to pay hundreds of dollars to play a game they can get for less than 10 bucks on their phone. What they'd rather have wasn't my point, it's what they actually do. I'd rather have a TV than a TV tuner for my computer, but I bought the TV tuner because it was loads cheaper.


Honestly, this is getting tiring, every post I'm making now is just in response to people extrapolating stuff from my posts I've never said.

 

[KingVamp]

I'm not omitting anything, because my point is that people aren't buying smartphones for gaming but already have them and USE them for gaming. That's what I've been saying.

And he's definitely in the minority; loads of people aren't going to pay hundreds of dollars to play a game they can get for less than 10 bucks on their phone. What they'd rather have wasn't my point, it's what they actually do. I'd rather have a TV than a TV tuner for my computer, but I bought the TV tuner because it was loads cheaper.


Honestly, this is getting tiring, every post I'm making now is just in response to people extrapolating stuff from my posts I've never said.

Just 'cause you do not want to believe doesn't make you right.

All your points have been countered.

You seem to be the minority 'cause I weather have a TV vs a TV tuner because a
TV is in better quality.

 

[Maedhros]

Gaming on iPod Touch sucks. I know, because I have one. Besides the touch games (and genres like RPG), everything that uses the virtual gamepad SUCKS HARD. Period.

 

[concealed identi]

I'm not omitting anything, because my point is that people aren't buying smartphones for gaming but already have them and USE them for gaming. That's what I've been saying.

And he's definitely in the minority; loads of people aren't going to pay hundreds of dollars to play a game they can get for less than 10 bucks on their phone. What they'd rather have wasn't my point, it's what they actually do. I'd rather have a TV than a TV tuner for my computer, but I bought the TV tuner because it was loads cheaper.


Honestly, this is getting tiring, every post I'm making now is just in response to people extrapolating stuff from my posts I've never said.

Just 'cause you do not want to believe doesn't make you right.

All your points have been countered.

You seem to be the minority 'cause I weather have a TV vs a TV tuner because a
TV is in better quality.

Wow. All I can really say is that I recommend you read my posts carefully before you reply to them. I'm guessing English isn't your first language, so I don't mean to sound rude, but I can't argue with someone who makes the same points as I do and counts that as a counterargument. And I'm right because, in this case, I happen to be right. Of course I'm open to be proven wrong, but I haven't seen an effective argument that relates to what I actually said yet.

 

[KingVamp]

Wow. All I can really say is that I recommend you read my posts carefully before you reply to them. I'm guessing English isn't your first language, so I don't mean to sound rude, but I can't argue with someone who makes the same points as I do and counts that as a counterargument. And I'm right because, in this case, I happen to be right. Of course I'm open to be proven wrong, but I haven't seen an effective argument that relates to what I actually said yet.

Agree on that fact that most games on games device are always going to be better than on the iphone, but for the most point; what you are saying
is that the majority of people will buy cheaper, less quality games (stuff) vs people who will play for well-made original games (stuff).

Which in fact isn't true.

You do not need to insult people for your misunderstanding of the conversation.

 

[concealed identi]

1. I didn't say that.

2. I didn't misunderstand anything, YOU misunderstood. YOU replied to my argument (incorrectly). You are STILL misunderstanding my argument, even after I have to keep repeating myself, so it's laughable that you even suggest I am the one misunderstanding anything. Point out to me what I misunderstood. Go ahead.

3. I didn't insult anybody, not sure what you're talking about there.


I can't help but feel like the people replying to my posts aren't even reading them properly. Surely that's a requirement if you want to discuss something?

 

[KingVamp]

1. I didn't say that.

That's fine, my point was that you are in the minority; if people can get the exact same game that plays identically to the original for under $10 instead of buying a $250-300 system and then spending another $40-60 on the game, a huge number of them will choose the former.
Actually he's not in the minority. Most people would rather play games on the original system(s) they were meant for as aesthetically this amost always look worse on iHardware and controls feel cramped as they are on the screen with the game itself, making it difficult to control many games and just uncomfortable. Also, you are omitting the cost of iHardware itself.

2. I didn't misunderstand anything, YOU misunderstood. YOU replied to my argument (incorrectly). You are STILL misunderstanding my argument, even after I have to keep repeating myself, so it's laughable that you even suggest I am the one misunderstanding anything. Point out to me what I misunderstood. Go ahead.
Unless the quote above isn't a point then I am misunderstanding.
3. I didn't insult anybody, not sure what you're talking about there.
QUOTE(concealed identity @ Mar 4 2011, 12:56 AM)

I'm guessing English isn't your first language

I can't help but feel like the people replying to my posts aren't even reading them properly. Surely that's a requirement if you want to discuss something?

Go ahead and make a summary of your point.

 

[concealed identi]

That wasn't an insult, I honestly wasn't sure if English was your first language. That's why I wrote that. You seem to have problems with the subtlety of the language (based on you extrapolating all of these arguments I never said), and you've used some really strange grammar from the beginning. Sorry if that offended you, I honestly thought maybe it wasn't your first language and didn't want you to feel bad about it.


As for the point I made that you highlighted, yes, you definitely misunderstood. Read it again, and read the reply you wrote about it. Notice how your summary of my point is completely different from the one you highlighted.



Here's a summary of my point:



Well, regarding the 3DS, as awesome as the 3D might be, it really is gimmicky on a fundamental level; it is known to cause eye strain, it drains the batteries, and it can be turned off, meaning every game will have to be playable without it. The system itself will be great, sell a lot, and have a lot of great games, and he acknowledges that - it's just that the 3D aspect of it isn't really going to amount to much apart from developers putting a lot of effort into the 3D aspects of the intro sequence and first level of their game.


With the PSP2, of course it'll have some great games, but if the price is as high as it seems it will be, it's going to have a really tough time in the market. He's completely right about smartphones and the $1-2 games available for them, and any industry analyst will say the same thing about them taking a HUGE share of the handheld market. This will only grow as smartphones become more and more of a standard.

Apart from that, the PSP2 won't even really have a niche like the original PSP did; smartphones can play media and browse the internet probably just as well as this can, the 3DS's graphics processing power are good enough that the PSP2 isn't going to stand out on this like it did with the original PSP/DS comparison, and anybody who's going to want a better graphical experience than the 3DS isn't going to want or need it in a handheld; they'll play it at home on their PS3 or Xbox.

This will also be noticeable regarding the games as well; the two main reasons why the PSP sold as well as it did in Japan is because the price went down to that of a DS eventually, and it had a number of "must-have" titles - these titles couldn't have been made on the DS due to its hardware capabilities, and they weren't put on consoles because of the slow market penetration of the PS3 (and no market penetration of the Xbox360). Now we have a scenario where the prices will probably be around $100 different in Japan (maybe more), a home console that's in a lot of houses now (PS3), cheap and fun handheld games available at a super low price (smartphones), and a handheld system that will have WAY more users in the market as well as the ability to play pretty much any game you throw at it (3DS).


I think the PSP2's only thing going for it is that it won't become outdated anytime soon...so it might see a surge in market share towards the end of its life (much like the PSP).