Google's CEO Berates Apple's Focus

[Rydian]

This isn't about copying, so both sides need to take their fanboy SHIT to another thread.

This issue is about how too much of a competitive nature is harmful. Take the iOS6 maps move. Apple was so fixated on one-upping Google that not only did they remove Google Maps from iOS's default apps, they removed it from the App store so that users couldn't install it anyways. That's some heavy competition. And you know what? It hurt them. Apple is STILL getting ridiculed for how bad the iOS6 maps app is, and it's caused them headaches.

They had something that worked fine beforehand, but their anti-competition nature ended up hurting themselves and the customers.

This is something Google wants to avoid, which is why the CEO's trying to push a non-competition mindset.

 

[nando]

This isn't about copying, so both sides need to take their fanboy SHIT to another thread.

This issue is about how too much of a competitive nature is harmful. Take the iOS6 maps move. Apple was so fixated on one-upping Google that not only did they remove Google Maps from iOS's default apps, they removed it from the App store so that users couldn't install it anyways. That's some heavy competition. And you know what? It hurt them. Apple is STILL getting ridiculed for how bad the iOS6 maps app is, and it's caused them headaches.

They had something that worked fine beforehand, but their anti-competition nature ended up hurting themselves and the customers.

This is something Google wants to avoid, which is why the CEO's trying to push a non-competition mindset.

the maps was not about one upping google. google wouldn't deliver ios the same services they have on android, on top of that they wanted to mine personal data off of iphone users. it may of been premature and sloppy, but in my view it was a necessary move.

apple wanted siri integrated with maps and turn by turn navigation years ago and google did not deliver.

 

[Rydian]

on top of that they wanted to mine personal data off of iphone users.

Source? This is the first I've heard of that.

 

[nando]

Source? This is the first I've heard of that.

where's your source of apple's "true" intentions?

and do you really think google couldn't manage turn by turn on the iPhone? no they chose to give it to us.

 

[Rydian]

where's your source of apple's "true" intentions?

What? I, and the article, both have posted quotes (I posted one, the article has it and links to other interviews) from Apple about their intentions to wipe out android and their anti-competitive nature. If it was simply an "upgrade", they would not have removed Google Maps from the app store as well. They did that so that it would be a full replacement, not just a different default. If you're asking for sources on Google Maps not being in the App store, I can link that.

And again, where's your source on Google wanting to data mine and that being Apple's reason for the removal?

 

[nando]

well here is one

http://www.technobuffalo.com/2012/0...ment-over-voice-guided-directions-apparently/

i had read several before apple maps came out. but you could "google" them yourself.

 

[Arras]

well here is one

http://www.technobuffalo.com/2012/0...ment-over-voice-guided-directions-apparently/

i had read several before apple maps came out. but you could "google" them yourself.

That still doesn't explain the "data mining" you said Google was doing.

 

[Rydian]

but you could "google" them yourself.

You made a claim, I've called you on it. It's up to you to either back up the claim, or retract it.

If Apple, a huge company, removed Google Maps (a popular service) from iOS (the OS running on like a million+ devices) due to attempted data-mining by Google (another huge company), it'd be news somewhere. The article you linked states that voice navigation is the biggest issue, and I think if attempted data mining was there that'd be a bigger problem than Google not adding voice support when asked (and the article states it wasn't even in the contract).

 

[McHaggis]

I've had 3 iPhones since the very first one launched years ago, and I've recently switched to an Android. I was literally blown away by how much Android is more for me... the flexibility, the openness, not having to wait for a jailbreak after every OS update is probably the best part. I think I can see why Apple would be a little annoyed, especially with the ever-increasing popularity of Android.

I don't mean this in an anti-apple or offensive way, but I see Apple as the company that Microsoft used to be: complacent. They shun interoperability (lightning connector, anyone), attack other companies aggressively with their patents, they prevent other service providers from truly competing on iOS. Sure, MS are still a little that way, but I think they've at least improved a little, especially as far as interoperability goes. Apple seem to get away with a lot of stuff that the European Commission have heftily fined Microsoft for in the past. I admire Apple for revolutionising phones in the same way that Microsoft revolutionised PCs a long time ago but, just like I never looked back when I switched to Linux, I'm doing the same after switching to Android.

 

[nando]

That still doesn't explain the "data mining" you said Google was doing.

how do you think google makes their money?

part of the disagreement was in map advertisement and when it comes to google that comes to gathering data from your contacts, website visited etc. it is in your agreement with google services.

http://forums.appleinsider.com/t/15...irections-prompted-apple-to-ditch-google-maps

regardless. point being from a business stand point anyone with the resources would of done the same.

and google data mining on the iphone has hit the news many times, but anti google news seems to fade quickly

http://finance.yahoo.com/blogs/brea...ole-did-internet-giant-too-far-162219032.html

 

[Rydian]

part of the disagreement was in map advertisement and when it comes to google that comes to gathering data from your contacts, website visited etc. it is in your agreement with google services.

http://forums.appleinsider.com/t/15...irections-prompted-apple-to-ditch-google-maps

Both the sources for this you've linked make it clear that the turn-by-turn and voice navigation was the problem.

Neither mention data mining, so I need to call bullshit.

regardless. point being from a business stand point anyone with the resources would of done the same.

Well I can't blame them for wanting an alternative with the extra features, at least.

and google data mining on the iphone has hit the news many times, but anti google news seems to fade quickly

Just like news about Google Chrome possibly sending Google a record of all the sites you visit, and your personal data faded quickly once some people actually bothered to run connection logs and prove it wasn't doing that.
http://www.mattcutts.com/blog/google-chrome-communication/
(The error page info in particular is useful, I had to stick a big random comment in my site's error pages at one time to make Chrome show them).

And hey, remember those rumors where people said Google would take any content you had in Google Docs and share and republish it?
http://www.legalandrew.com/2007/09/24/warning-google-docs-is-not-safe/
Oh yeah, turns out Google never republished a single document, and even changed their ToS so people would stop worrying.

Anti-google news fades quickly because it's generally bullshit.

http://finance.yahoo.com/blogs/brea...ole-did-internet-giant-too-far-162219032.html

That video doesn't go into any details on what actually happened though, do you have any sources that show what actually went on?

 

[ShadowSoldier]

If I was CEO at google, and I kept getting bullied by Apple, I'd just say

"Alright fine, we'll take YouTube off of your phones, we'll take all of our apps off of your store and if you put any on there we'll sue. Afterall we gotta get rid of that $40 billion bank account of yours :3 "

 

[Thanatos Telos]

Google's CEO claims that Apple is overly fixed in it's fight against Google. While some may think claim this is overblown, Apple's various CEOs have released statements showing their fixation, such as this famous one by Steve Jobs.

In addition to statements like this, Apple has taken public steps such as locking Google Maps out of iOS 6 (and removing it from the App store so it couldn't be re-installed afterwards).

However the article mentions how Google doesn't think it has any direct competitors because it doesn't have a single focus, and of the things it makes the most money off of (search and ads) it's the leader anyways so there's no company that's a polar reflection competing in the same spaces... but it's also hinted that this could just be a mental tactic by Google's CEO to shift the focus of it's employees and planners away from competition and back to their own projects.

Source

Google Maps was never on the App store, it was preinstalled.

 

[chris888222]

I've had 3 iPhones since the very first one launched years ago, and I've recently switched to an Android. I was literally blown away by how much Android is more for me... the flexibility, the openness, not having to wait for a jailbreak after every OS update is probably the best part. I think I can see why Apple would be a little annoyed, especially with the ever-increasing popularity of Android.

I don't mean this in an anti-apple or offensive way, but I see Apple as the company that Microsoft used to be: complacent. They shun interoperability (lightning connector, anyone), attack other companies aggressively with their patents, they prevent other service providers from truly competing on iOS. Sure, MS are still a little that way, but I think they've at least improved a little, especially as far as interoperability goes. Apple seem to get away with a lot of stuff that the European Commission have heftily fined Microsoft for in the past. I admire Apple for revolutionising phones in the same way that Microsoft revolutionised PCs a long time ago but, just like I never looked back when I switched to Linux, I'm doing the same after switching to Android.

The connector part is somehow flawed. Apple used the same 30pin for about 9 years and its only a matter of time which they changed the connectors.

I have to agree that Apple BS attacks other companies but at least Apple signed an agreement with HTC to end that nonsense.

 

[Rydian]

Google Maps was never on the App store, it was preinstalled.

It wasn't on the App store originally because it was preinstalled yeah, but after it was removed from iOS Google wanted to submit it to the App store (like they apparently did with youtube).
http://www.phonesreview.co.uk/2012/11/19/google-maps-app-for-ios-ready-to-submit/
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2012/11/17/google_ios_mapping_app_submission/

But it never made it through. Same type of reason Chrome isn't on there, Apple doesn't allow directly-competing apps. (Things like Opera Mini get on there because Opera Mini's technically a remote app, Opera's servers render the page and send the image and link data to you.)

 

[the_randomizer]

Apple's trying to eliminate the competition? Well, it worked for Microsoft when they tried to monopolize the competition, didn't it?

 

[chris888222]

Google Maps is now on the App Store.

 

[the_randomizer]

Google Maps is now on the App Store.

 

[Sicklyboy]

https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/google-maps/id585027354?mt=8

Looks like it is straight out of Android, too. Neat.

 

[NES SNES V.B. N64 G.C. Wii WiiU]

Same type of reason Chrome isn't on there, Apple doesn't allow directly-competing apps. (Things like Opera Mini get on there because Opera Mini's technically a remote app, Opera's servers render the page and send the image and link data to you.)

Chrome is on the iOS App Store. I am using it now.