FFTA2 + Real-Time Save Observations

Discussion in 'NDS - Console and Game Discussions' started by IBNobody, Jul 6, 2008.

Jul 6, 2008
  1. IBNobody
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    Member IBNobody I try to keep myself amused.

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    After playing FFTA2 a little bit, I wanted to post some observations on how the random number system works.

    The random number system is something that happens behind the scenes and affects just about everything. Hit rate, damage, and units hired during map events are just a few.

    Background: With computers, there is no such thing as a true random number. The program inputs a seed or starter value and then generates a seemingly random number based off it. The same seed will always generate the same number, and the current number is often used as the seed for the next number. If you want to change the outcome of something using a random number generator, you need to find ways to change the seed.

    So... If you had the ability to do a real-time save (like with the Cyclo Evo), you'd start to notice some patterns.

    (RTS = Real-Time Save, RTL = Real-Time Load, RTSL = Real-Time Save and Load)

    1. When hiring a unit from a map encounter, the name, class, and stats of that unit are fixed. You can RTSL, but you'll still get the same unit. The only way to change what you get is to reset your DS (L+R+Select+Start) and reload your savegame.

    2. It appears that each unit has a "dodge rate" random number tied to them. It's a fixed chance, from 1% to 100%. The only time it changes is when that unit is attacked. The current "dodge rate" number is used up, and the next one is generated. That sounds confusing, so let me explain...

    Let's say you RTS and then attack an enemy unit. You hit rate is shown to be 95%. The enemy unit dodges. If you reload your game, that enemy will dodge your attack EVERY TIME. What's worse, that enemy will dodge the next attack from anybody. The next attack you make on that unit will always miss, but subsequent attacks may hit.

    This was particularly annoying because I fought a clan trial where the law was "No Misses". There was an enemy that dodged a 95% hit-rate attack. I could RTS and RTL, and that enemy would always dodge (and cause a violation). I'd let turns pass, but that enemy would always dodge. I'd attack other units, but that particular enemy would STILL dodge when I attacked it. It was extremely annoying. Fortunately, my melee Bangaa had an opportunity turn. I was able to use the opportunity attack "Flurry" from behind. Flurry allows you to swing twice. The first swing missed, but the second swing KO'ed the enemy. Because the enemy died, I was not charged a penalty.

    Since the dodge chance ranges from 1% to 100%, you may run into situations where low hit-rate attacks miss, but high hit-rate attacks will strike. If your green mage's 60% sleep misses and you RTL, your green mage's 95% physical attack may hit.

    ---

    Anyone else have any RTS observations?
     
  2. IBNobody
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    Member IBNobody I try to keep myself amused.

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    Here's something else I've noticed.

    3. The auction house bidders follow a set pattern, but I believe it is due to the AI rather than any random number stuff. Using RTS, you can repeat the patterns and find the optimal winning solution. This was how I was able to win both initial auctions.

    If you can minimize your losses in the first round of an auction and then hit every 5-token bonus on subsequent rounds, you can win on the first "try".

    More observations coming as I see them... I'm trying to see how critical hits are handled.

    - N
     
  3. Umdlye

    Newcomer Umdlye Member

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    This button --> [​IMG]

    Its there for a reason.

    ON-TOPIC:
    Too bad my cart doesnt support RTS...
     
  4. Tenkaichi

    Member Tenkaichi GBAtemp Regular

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    I don't have RTS on my cart either but it kind of confirmed my suspicions. I too was playing the clan quest w/ law "no misses" (Adaptation?). It's kind of a pinch to do it in three rounds when I'm relying on a lot of damage, lots of luck (without using it as a privilage), and speed since I just jumped to veteran. I suppose that was the first bad idea, but I figured my guys leveled up a little bit and were able to barely do it.

    I ended up picking agility based on the game's description and ran into less problems overall... at least, during the trial. But what was driving me crazy before was that you could really miss at the most inopportune times... swinging AND spellcasting, grr.
     
  5. deathfisaro

    Member deathfisaro Narcistic Deathfisaro Fan

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    Don't think FFTA2 needs RTSL, because it's still easy on Hard difficulty. And some clan trials are quite luck based. (Especially most clan trials can be easily beaten using Tinker's Haste thing, forgot its name)

    On auctions, other clans have "tells." Once you learn the tells, you don't need RTSL to win by just 1.
     
  6. IBNobody
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    Member IBNobody I try to keep myself amused.

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    No game needs RTSL, but it's a pleasure to have.

    I am finding the hard mode quite challenging, but I turned off EXP gain using a cheat code. It results in me fighting lv 15 enemies with an avg lv9 team.

    As far as the auction house goes... It's not just the tells that give you an advantage. It's getting the +1/+2/+3/+5 coin count bonus as well as the +1 starting coin bonus. When you first start out, it's a challenge. Still, I use RTSL just in case I flub it.
     
  7. Shyvnal

    Member Shyvnal GBAtemp Regular

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    It was the same with the GBA. I sorta cheated, i saved (binded) and loaded between hits/misses
     
  8. IBNobody
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    Member IBNobody I try to keep myself amused.

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    You can't do that as much anymore. You can reload and farm around your "hits" to other enemies if you miss, but you can't keep reloading to score a hit.
     
  9. deathfisaro

    Member deathfisaro Narcistic Deathfisaro Fan

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    Some auctions like Goug can be tough to score all +5 chips, but if you're even disabling exp gain I don't think you'd farm gears using auctions?

    I scored a Zeus Mace as a regional specialty near that Moogle town, I was like O.o
     
  10. IBNobody
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    Member IBNobody I try to keep myself amused.

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    I hit the auctions while I'm recruiting for my clan.

    Which brings me to...

    4. You can't use RTSL to choose what party members you get via random encounters, nor can you use it to tweak the stats on the "Clan Mates" quest. What you can do, however, is RTS at the Load selection screen, off the main menu. The act of loading a save resets the random engine. If the new recruit isn't the right class or has substandard stats, you can RTL right back to the load screen and save yourself the hassle of resetting and going through the Basicscape and Ivalice Alliance screens.
     
  11. Joey90

    Member Joey90 Not around any more

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    So, in short, RTSL is pretty much useless in FFTA2... Except as a quick way to soft-reset (which it could be used as on pretty much any game.

    Ah well... at least that means if you do miss, there was nothing you could have done about it.
     
  12. Doomsday Forte

    Member Doomsday Forte GBAtemp Maniac

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    This sorta reminds me of Fire Emblem, in that if you did a quicksave or something and attacked a unit and missed, you would always miss if you restarted and tried to attack again.

    Or if you soft reset at the death of one of your units and have to watch it all over again. Heartrending.
     
  13. IBNobody
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    Member IBNobody I try to keep myself amused.

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    That's somewhat true.

    You cannot brute-force your way by using RTSL to get critical hits. What you can do, however, is use RTSL to try low hit-rate high damage attacks like Jump or Beat Down. If they miss, RTL and use a more accurate attack.
     

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