Explanation

Discussion in '3DS - Games & Content' started by curley12, Dec 27, 2012.

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Dec 27, 2012

Explanation by curley12 at 10:27 PM (1,060 Views / 0 Likes) 23 replies

  1. curley12
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    Member curley12 Mr.Awesome

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    Can some one explain why copied games from somebody elses 3ds wouldn''t work i asked the person which said it and he blanked me!!!! :gun:
     


  2. TyBlood13

    Member TyBlood13 Weeaboo Trash

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    downloaded games are tied to a single system, like the Wii
     
  3. Foxi4

    Reporter Foxi4 On the hunt...

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    When you download a game, its binary (equivalent of an .exe file on PC's) becomes signed in a specific way. To be executed, it needs to be paired with a key, and each 3DS has its own, unique signature key. When the key doesn't match, the game isn't executed or even detected for that matter.

    The original binary that is supposed to be executed is the result of a mathematical operation between the signed binary and a given very long value. With a "wrong" value, the result will not be correct.
     
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  4. curley12
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    Member curley12 Mr.Awesome

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    then why cant people get a file from eshopon one 3ds and then one from another 3ds (make sure it is the same app) compare the binary what ever and find the area were the code is different then change it so it would work on antoher 3ds it sounds logical to me
     
  5. curley12
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    Member curley12 Mr.Awesome

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    no they arent i have got copys of my friends vc and they worked
     
  6. TyBlood13

    Member TyBlood13 Weeaboo Trash

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    proof please
     
  7. Foxi4

    Reporter Foxi4 On the hunt...

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    Because the entire file is different and the equation is long and convoluted. Breaking signature codes can take years upon years, even if your script is running non-stop. That, and it's not just "a file" - the key is encrypted itself, hidden away in NAND which we cannot dump without hardware kits yet, sometimes even in a separate chip entirely (like the Private Key). It's not a "copy-paste and done" thing - the key itself is protected.
    No. Unless you mean .WAD installs.
     
  8. curley12
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    Member curley12 Mr.Awesome

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    how????
     
  9. curley12
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    Member curley12 Mr.Awesome

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    is this a bit like the wii with nand and keys what about the wiis key what ver signing method is the same? and it can be easily hacked using half the wii hacks?
     
  10. Foxi4

    Reporter Foxi4 On the hunt...

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    The physical method is relatively similar, but the software behind it is obviously different. The problem with the Wii was that the key was temporarily exposed in an unencrypted form on one of the chips which allowed Twiizers to extract it... literally with tweezers. It's unlikely that it will be "easily done" - otherwise we would've already seen homebrew signing. After all, Neimod rigged his 3DS's Main memory fully and can dump anything he wants from RAM. It's going to take a while before hackers piece things together, give them time.

    In any case, look at it this way:

    123 : X = 1

    123 is a binary, X is our signature. The 3DS knows that the result has to be 1, and there can be only one key which gives this result (in case of signatures, it's 2 options - the Common Key or the Private Key). That's how signing works - if the result is anything other than the expected one, the binary does not boot. Of course this is incredibly simplified - a signing equation is a million times more complex than this example, but it shows the mechanism.
     
  11. curley12
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    Member curley12 Mr.Awesome

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    yoyou should help get 3ds hacked your really smart
     
  12. curley12
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    Member curley12 Mr.Awesome

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    i sthere anyway to get the private key at all?
     
  13. Foxi4

    Reporter Foxi4 On the hunt...

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    Getting the private key is possible, but does not give "the edge" to the homebrew community unless it's done on the system itself and without extra hardware soldered to it, and that alone is unlikely. Signing systems are known to work outside of the Main memory setup on completely separate chips. Getting the common key would be far more beneficial, as as the name entails, it is common to all units. Also, I'm no hacker - that's just how software signing works in general. :P
     
  14. heartgold

    Member heartgold GBAtemp Psycho!

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    This reminds me of the time when the DSi common keys was leaked, nothing good came out of it and people were saying the private/signing key would be more useful as the common key didn't do much.
     
  15. Foxi4

    Reporter Foxi4 On the hunt...

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    Even with a signed binary, you still need a way to load it up. Besides, nobody gave two flips about the DSi. :P Besides, everything depends on the signing algorithms, really. One key may be required to use another etc.
     
  16. curley12
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    Member curley12 Mr.Awesome

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    has anybody opened up a 3ds and had a look inside yet and found anything intresting
     
  17. Foxi4

    Reporter Foxi4 On the hunt...

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    Neimod's Flickr
    3DSBrew

    Pretty much says it all. Patience is a virtue, the system will get a wide-spread hack, it just has to be developed and tested first.
     
  18. curley12
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    Member curley12 Mr.Awesome

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    so it is not possible to get eshop games without being an ambassador currently
     
  19. curley12
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    Member curley12 Mr.Awesome

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  20. curley12
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    Member curley12 Mr.Awesome

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