Hacking Converting NDS to DSIware to CIA?

[d0k3]

I wondered if it is somehow possible to convert Nintendo DS (.NDS) files to .CIA. If so, how do we do it? And if not, I'm interested in the technical details (how is DSIware different from the NDS retail game format?).

I suspect it's not possible, cause, from what I see, DSIware games are rather simple when compared to retail NDS games. Also, (to my knowledge) there are no retail games also available as DSIware. Apart from DSIware I see no way (yet) to get .NDS files installed.

 

[valyr]

dragons lair is available as a cart and as dsiware at least in europe

 

[d0k3]

dragons lair is available as a cart and as dsiware at least in europe

If these are really the same games, it might be possible to convert any NDS title. Now, if there only was some reference about both file types (DSIWare and .NDS)...

 

[tony_2018]

Are there any cia games that were in ds form before, but are now on eshop?

 

[d0k3]

Are there any cia games that were in ds form before, but are now on eshop?

There's a big list of DSIWare titles on Wikipedia. The only title apart from the two Dragon's Lair titles that I recognize to have also come out as retail cartridge is Puzzle Quest: Challenge of the Warlords. Somehow (correct me if I'm wrong), it seems that DSIware titles use 2D graphics rather than 3D graphics (such as NSMB or the DS Zelda titles), so maybe DSIWare can't access specific cards of the hardware. However, the Asphalt 4 title might prove me wrong. The reviews for that one even say it has better graphics than then the retail cart Asphalt title that came out for NDS.

 

[The Real Jdbye]

I wondered if it is somehow possible to convert Nintendo DS (.NDS) files to .CIA. If so, how do we do it? And if not, I'm interested in the technical details (how is DSIware different from the NDS retail game format?).

I suspect it's not possible, cause, from what I see, DSIware games are rather simple when compared to retail NDS games. Also, (to my knowledge) there are no retail games also available as DSIware. Apart from DSIware I see no way (yet) to get .NDS files installed.

Potentially, since sudokuhax works on 3DS and it can load .nds files. But it only loads homebrew right now.

 

[tony_2018]

aah, so they are called dsiware.

 

[blindseer]

And the fact the dsiware is installed to the system memory instead of the sdcard which would mean you can only install a couple of games.

 

[2DSGamerdude]

it would be so cool if we could convert .dsiware file into .cia for emunand install,
through dsiware isn't as easy to convert and use as vc games like gbc, nes etc
and the system part sucks as it installs to sys nand and viewing these files in data management deletes all data in emunand cia's and saves

 

[d0k3]

Potentially, since sudokuhax works on 3DS and it can load .nds files. But it only loads homebrew right now.

Yup, that would be an option, if it worked. But it seems DSIWare titles can be converted to .CIA directly, and you only need PastaCFW to install and play these. For example, this works with the Shantae game and Zelda Four Swords Anniversary Edition as well. So, if we knew more about the DSIWare file format, we might be able to convert retail NDS games to CIA, instead of relying on Sudokuhax.

And the fact the dsiware is installed to the system memory instead of the sdcard which would mean you can only install a couple of games.

You mean DSIWare titles have to be installed to NAND, really? Have you tested this?

 

[The Real Jdbye]

Yup, that would be an option, if it worked. But it seems DSIWare titles can be converted to .CIA directly, and you only need PastaCFW to install and play these. For example, this works with the Shantae game and Zelda Four Swords Anniversary Edition as well. So, if we knew more about the DSIWare file format, we might be able to convert retail NDS games to CIA, instead of relying on Sudokuhax.



You mean DSIWare titles have to be installed to NAND, really? Have you tested this?

Yeah, potentially. Saving could be a problem though, since regular DS games are designed to save on a flash chip.


DSiWare titles do install to NAND. I don't know if they will still work if the CIA is modified to install to SD though (if that's even possible)

 

[Keylogger]

Yeah, potentially. Saving could be a problem though, since regular DS games are designed to save on a flash chip.


DSiWare titles do install to NAND. I don't know if they will still work if the CIA is modified to install to SD though (if that's even possible)

I think you can choose to install CIA in NAND or SDCard with FBI

 

[MRJPGames]

I wondered if it is somehow possible to convert Nintendo DS (.NDS) files to .CIA. If so, how do we do it? And if not, I'm interested in the technical details (how is DSIware different from the NDS retail game format?).

I suspect it's not possible, cause, from what I see, DSIware games are rather simple when compared to retail NDS games. Also, (to my knowledge) there are no retail games also available as DSIware. Apart from DSIware I see no way (yet) to get .NDS files installed.

I know DSiWare can be injected (https://gbatemp.net/threads/tutorial-installing-sudokuhax-on-3ds.388621/) but the problem is most (if not all) NDS roms are too big to fit even 1 on the 3DS' NAND, you'd first have to find a way to install DSiWare to the SD card and make systemmenu load DSiWare from that same SD card.

 

[d0k3]

I think you can choose to install CIA in NAND or SDCard with FBI

Yeah, you can choose to install .CIAs to SD with FBI, but will it also work for DSIWare CIAs?

I know DSiWare can be injected (https://gbatemp.net/threads/tutorial-installing-sudokuhax-on-3ds.388621/) but the problem is most (if not all) NDS roms are too big to fit even 1 on the 3DS' NAND, you'd first have to find a way to install DSiWare to the SD card and make systemmenu load DSiWare from that same SD card.

DSiWare titles do install to NAND. I don't know if they will still work if the CIA is modified to install to SD though (if that's even possible)

Maybe someone has already tested this (installing DSIWare CIA to SD via FBI)? There are some DSIWare titles converted to .CIA on a very popular 3DS roms site (won't name it, not even via PM, so don't try).

Saving could be a problem though, since regular DS games are designed to save on a flash chip.

There are save file format patches available for various flashcards. I can't possibly know, but I think it should be possible to make a patch for the save fiel location as well.

 

[dkabot]

FBI errors out if you try to install a DSiWare CIA without switching destination to NAND. I've done it.

 

[d0k3]

FBI errors out if you try to install a DSiWare CIA without switching destination to NAND. I've done it.

Duh. It might have to do with that size restriction (sudokuhax doesn't work with anything above 2GB, too, but libnds might be the culprit there). Can a .CIA be modified (without completely rebuilding) to enable installations to the SD? Installing to NAND for testing purposes is just too dangerous when you don't have an EmuNAND. I wouldn't do this even with legit .CIAs.

 

[dkabot]

Duh. It might have to do with that size restriction (sudokuhax doesn't work with anything above 2GB, too, but libnds might be the culprit there). Can a .CIA be modified (without completely rebuilding) to enable installations to the SD? Installing to NAND for testing purposes is just too dangerous when you don't have an EmuNAND. I wouldn't do this even with legit .CIAs.

Recall the DSi was like the Wii; software went onto the NAND. Even when the Wii got "SD" software, it just copied on use.
The 3DS required DSiWare on the NAND because that's how the DSi worked. Getting it to cooperate with being on the SD card would be its own issue.

 

[d0k3]

Recall the DSi was like the Wii; software went onto the NAND. Even when the Wii got "SD" software, it just copied on use.
The 3DS required DSiWare on the NAND because that's how the DSi worked. Getting it to cooperate with being on the SD card would be its own issue.

That sounds rather plausible.... I'd have assumed that DSIWare (when bought for 3DS from the eShop) comes in some kind of wrapper that makes it think it's in the correct location.

That brings me to... Has anyone bought a DSIWare game from the eShop? If so, did it install into your NAND or your SD? (easy to find out, as you'd just have to remove the SD and see if it is still there.

 

[dkabot]

That sounds rather plausible.... I'd have assumed that DSIWare (when bought for 3DS from the eShop) comes in some kind of wrapper that makes it think it's in the correct location.

That brings me to... Has anyone bought a DSIWare game from the eShop? If so, did it install into your NAND or your SD? (easy to find out, as you'd just have to remove the SD and see if it is still there.

Reverse the question: Go into data management and check free blocks for 3DS content vs DSi content.

 

[d0k3]

Reverse the question: Go into data management and check free blocks for 3DS content vs DSi content.

Alright, I got it. With the limited size of the NAND and even more grave, the requirement to fiddle around with it, the sudokuhax route suddenly sounds a lot more attractive to me. Although that still works only on O3DS v4.x and plays only homebrew.