And what if you want to go a bit beyond the bare minimum? Emunand is a cluster fuck right now even with Hekate making the process a little easier. Signature patches you have to come to this site for and find the thread. Can't blank out your prodinfo without downloading some other patches. To install NSPs you need Tinfoil, Goldleaf, or new Tinfoil. The latter won't work without even more patches.
SX OS is just drag and drop, and play your games without worry about ban right then / there. Don't need a hundred steps, downloads from 10 different sources, partitioning tools that only run in linux, etc.
That is where some of the Pros/Cons come in.
AMS - NSP Installs (working on XCIs)
SX - XCIs Only (working on NSPs)
You can instal NSPs on SXOS.
Technically out of the box atmosphere doesn't support anything except homebrew. NSPs require sig patches and installers made by others.
EmuNAND is easy to setup with Hekate.
Signature patches are all over the internet and aren't any more difficult to setup than SX OS, its licensing, etc. ReiNX also comes with them.
Incognito is not an SX OS feature, and it's easy to do on Atmosphere. ReiNX also doesn't require any extra patches. In addition, not being able to blank out one's proinfo is a method of brick-protection missing from SX OS.
SX OS has an NSP-installer that is quite comparable to the DZ Tinfoil.
That's inaccurate.
SX OS has a setup process too, and it's just as many steps to copy/paste XCI files and run them as it is to install an NSP file over USB using DZ Tinfoil and nut server.
Plenty of SX OS users have been banned. SX OS still results in a dirty NAND.
It's about as many steps as SX OS. A gross exaggeration only serves to counter your own point by drawing attention to its inaccuracy.
Linux isn't required.
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XCI files work with SX OS, but that's the only substantive difference. NSP files work just as well, if not better.
SX OS can also use NSP files.
and how many people on here have posted about it being accidentally triggered, let me guess out of over 100,000+ SX users... the answer is 0 ?
If you want to cut and paste XCI files without needing to install NSP files or you want USB support and you can afford $20 then there is nothing wrong with SX
those 'many ' people who say Sx is not worth the money are mostly from people who have never owned or used it.
Hekate can't make the partition, you've still got to do that yourself, and Windows doesn't work very well for that.
Still makes it a more annoying setup process than having everything installed for you. I can do it. I'm not bothering explaining all that shit to someone who isn't as experienced.
I never said it's an SX OS feature or that it's impossible to do on Atmosphere. I said it requires even more external patches, which is fact. I also didn't say anything about ReiNX, which itself is a non-starter due to the lack of emunand.
And? The point is that it comes with it. Don't have to download shit from all over the place.
No it's not.
If you say so. I disagree
But SX OS comes with easy to setup emunand, and it has protection out of the box. With atmosphere you've either got to remember to setup 90DNS before starting, or use some work arounds to install incognito.
It's fewer steps for sure, especially if you want to have as close to an equivalent experience as possible.
Addressed above.
The brick code wasn't present for very long. When it was discovered, it was an embarrassment for SX OS, and they promptly removed it. While I'm unaware of any cases of it being accidentally triggered, we do know it could have been under rare circumstances.
If XCI support is worth $20 to a person, then I agree (not counting the moral issues of supporting SX OS with its brick code and stolen code). I should also point out that, like Gateway, SX OS will likely stop offering support once it's no longer profitable to do so.
However, for the vast majority of users, installing an NSP is about as cumbersome as using an XCI file.
There are SX OS owners who no longer consider SX OS to be worth the money.
It works just fine on Windows. I also like how you've gone from "it doesn't work on Windows" to "it doesn't work well on Windows." For the record, goalpost-moving doesn't impress me very much.
Again, it's no more difficult than, for example, setting up the SX OS licensing. Downloading Atmosphere, signature patches, and Tinfoil aren't difficult. ReiNX also comes with everything you need, so you're argument is also pointless even if accept that not having to download signature patches and Tinfoil is worth $20 (it's not, in my opinion).
It's not an inconvenience to setup Incognito with Atmosphere, and I don't think leaving my prodinfo vulnerable is worth $20. You couldn't pay me $20 to leave it vulnerable.
We also weren't talking about emuNAND, so it's completely relevant to mention that Incognito works just fine with ReiNX. It's also going to get emuNAND in the not-so-distant future, not that it matters to the conversation.
My argument is it's not worth $20 to not have to download Tinfoil.
The extra patches that come with DZ Tinfoil are not required to use Tinfoil, assuming that's what you're referring to (your post was ambiguous). Also, since your concern is how many things you have to download and from where, it's irrelevant when those unneeded patches come with Tinfoil.
We can objectively count the steps. The steps of copy/pasting the XCI files and launching the XCI menu are comparable to the number of steps needed to install NSP files using Tinfoil. It's not a matter of whether or not you agree. You're wrong.
The Atmosphere emuNAND is easy to setup, and the SX OS emuNAND is not worth $20. They're functionally identical, given you can switch between Atmosphere and SX OS using the same emuNAND.
Atmosphere has more protection than SX OS. Refer to our conversation about Incognito.
With SX OS, you're paying to use what's functionally 90DNS.
It's a comparable number of steps, objectively. I also like the continued goalpost-moving, going from "100 steps" to "more steps."
Not very well.
Respectfully, I think I've said my peace. You're free to say your peace, of course, but I'm not interested in getting into a long(er) back and forth on this. My point was just about everything SX OS can do can be done on Atmosphere for free in a comparable number of steps, and that makes it not worth the price in my opinion. In addition, there's a decent chance SX OS won't be supported for as long as Atmosphere, and there are also some significant moral issues in paying to use SX OS.
Also, when did people on GBATemp find the setup of CFW to no longer be fun?
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If you knew what?
If I knew SX OS also allowed for NSP Install. All the Readings I read are all saying they are working on it. But SX OS can take the Base, Update, and DLCs and run them in 1 XCI.
Fun tid-bit about that; It wasn't removed, only stubbed.
On a more serious note, AFAICT the SX OS brick code has indeed been stubbed. The "WANNA PLAY :)" password is still generated and the code is still there, but now instead of trying to lock the eMMC it will just get stuck on a loop.
— Mike Heskin (@hexkyz) July 4, 2018
I'm not going to reply line by line again, as you noted, it's a waste of time.
I run atmosphere because I'm a cheap bastard when it comes to these things. But SXOS is by far the more user friendly solution, and that likely won't change until the Switch is near EOL.
You realize not all speech is literal, right? The point is it's a more cumbersome process.
The thing is, it is more steps whether or not you want to count it that way, and perhaps more importantly - things are really poorly documented. Most of the documentation has been made by other end users, the atmosphere devs themselves can't be bothered, and will in fact ban you from their server for wanting to do what all of us actually use CFW for.
I run atmosphere because I'm a cheap bastard when it comes to these things. But SXOS is by far the more user friendly solution, and that likely won't change until the Switch is near EOL.
except as we have discussed many, many times before and looking at the amount of support threads, it is not that simple (especially when upgrading) and lots of people cannot do it.. I wish I could find your (Lacius) post about how users so technically incompetent should not be using CFW.
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I think I originally posted this back in about February 2019.. the only thing that appears to have changed is emuNAND / emuMMC support has been added to atmos.
if you want to be able to play XCI files direct from a USB device, or you want to install NSP files direct from a USB device (I took a 4TB USB HDD with me on a cruise back in March and would pick and choose from the XCI games on the USB HDD and INSTALL the games I wanted to play while sitting beside the pool - you do not need to have the USB HDD attached as some idiots always try to make out). The SX OS is the only option that has USB and XCI support.
If you want to overclock or emulate amiibo figurines in games, then choose atmosphere. There aren't any other differences.
SX OS:
Pros:
XCI files - can mount and play XCI files direct from USB (no need to copy to SD card)
- No need to install each game, just mount and they run - just like inserting a cartridge.
- XCI files do not install tickets so *POTENTIALLY* are not as detectable as NSP files.
USB storage - NSP files can be installed to SD card direct from USB storage, no need for PC. Useful on long journeys.
EmuEMMC / emuNAND - makes it potentially possible to dodge a banned console due to no records kept in system NAND (online play under emuNAND not recommended however).
- different official firmware versions can be installed in system and emuNAND (no fuses are burned)
Cons:
Official software support is usually a couple of weeks after the update comes out.
Costs money - about the same price as a 200GB SD card for the jig, the dongle and the SX OS licence.
- about the same price as a 128GB SD card for just the SX OS licence.
Cannot use KIPs advanced features - like custom kernel modules (Overclocking module, etc)
MUST use the jig and payload injector on every cold boot (personally, if you're powering off completely regularly then why?).
Free CFW:
Pros:
Official firmware 8.0 support usually added just a few days after it is released.
No cost - just the included cost of your SD card for it to be installed on.
Can use KIPs advanced features - like custom kernel modules (Overclocking module, etc).
Can boot into CFW from Auto RCM - please note that auto-RCM has been extensively discussed as being potentially detectable by Nintendo and thus a bannable 'offence'.
Cons:
No XCI mounting.
No USB storage.
No emuEMMC / emuNAND.
Keep in mind that BOTH options allow installing of NSP titles to SD card and systemNAND (or emuNAND if using SX OS) via USB cable and NUT or SX server.
Both systems allow use of homebrew and backing up save games to alternate computers / storage for safe keeping.
The age old question - which CFW should I use?
Look at the pros and con feature lists and see which features are must have items for you.
So *IS* SX OS worth purchasing RIGHT NOW?
Both free CFW and SX OS have 8.0 support, so decide on which features you want and whether the cost is worth it TO YOU.
Please don't pretend like there aren't SX OS help threads, especially when upgrading.
ahh we're back to Lacius's "it might or it might not" arguments again are we? The king fence sitter has returned!! It was so quiet around here for months without the constant whine being generated on the forums.
I can think of one most public person - Nachuz - and they cracked it because when the switch goes into sleep mode it turns off the USB port and thus and XCI file loaded from a USB HDD is auto ejected.
Again, see how many help threads there are regarding emuMMC setup on atmosphere - with SX OS it has always been just press a button in the options menu in the CFW and it was all done for you. It has been THAT EASY since oh.. I think September 2018 when the emuNAND function was added to SX OS. For people that wanted emuNAND there was NO OPTION besides SX OS until June / July 2019 when atmos added it. My OFW on my switch is still 3.0.2 and my emuNAND under SX OS is 8.1
Incognito was developer by Blawar and required usage of SX OS or Reinx because atmos blocked writing to CAL0 - see the first post of the release here for actual information instead of conjecture - https://gbatemp.net/threads/incognito.531924/
If you were running SX OS (especially back in February, when Incognito was released) you would use it on your emuNAND as extra protection for not getting your OFW switch banned online.
Which is what lots of other CFW users were using and are still using to avoid online bans.. so I'm not grokking what your point (if any at all) is supposed to be.
I look forward to much more infantile backwards and forwards presentation of your ''facts'' and fence sitting comments.
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I'm not, but there are a magnitude less help threads for SX OS than atmos and most of the help threads have been solved with SX OS with the user being told to re-download the newer boot.dat from the SX website and that has fixed their issue (where they have usually mistakenly updated the firmware and then older SX OS boot.dat didn't work.. who would have thunk it hey?)
There was objectively brick code that could have been triggered accidentally. I don't know what else you want me to say. That there wasn't brick code?
You seem to be taking this personally. I hope you don't think this kind of catty comment is at all appropriate or impressive. Petty insults only serve as distractions, and it's often meant as a distraction from a bad argument.
There are more than one.
Yes, SX OS used to be the only CFW with emuNAND, but that's no longer the case. For someone who wanted to play online with a hacked Switch, emuNAND was arguably the only thing worth the money (in my opinion). But, since that's no longer the case, I don't see anything that's worth the price tag anymore.
And my 8.1.0 Switch is downgradable to 3.0.0, but I never used SX OS.
There was no "conjecture" in any of my posts about Incognito: only facts about how it works. I'm not sure why you're pasting a link to the Incognito thread and telling me things I already know.
The point is that with SX OS, you're paying to use things that are available for free and very easily accessible (e.g. 90DNS). Please keep up if you're going to reply to my posts. I'm less likely to respond if I have to repeat myself.
See above for my thoughts on petty quips that lack any real substance. You're unlikely to build a lot of positive relationships here or contribute to the community with this kind of attitude. I don't know why you're behaving as though I'm attacking you personally. The best word I can think of to describe it is "odd."
A good number of Atmosphere posts are solved by telling a person to download the latest version of something. The same goes for a good number of SX OS posts. And Luma3DS posts. That's how these things work, and if anything, it's a testament to how comparable the Switch custom firmwares are when it comes to ease of use.
Last edited by Lacius,
and the answer to upgrading is simple in nearly all cases, download the latest version of boot.dat and paste it to your sdcard.
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SylverReZ:
If you want a good system to port it to, at least have a good programmer and knowledge.+1 -
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Psionic Roshambo:
I didn't know they made an MSU cart for the Genesis.... I knew about the SNES one and the library for that is rather large but the Genesis one has very few games+1
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SylverReZ:
An FPGA could probably replicate the chip's functionality without buying donor parts.+1
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Psionic Roshambo:
Like not emulating the entire SNES but just a loader and the enhancement chips perhaps even slightly overclocked like FX-2
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SylverReZ:
@Psionic Roshambo, The Doom NES cartridges, a few batches were made. One was given to AVGN as seen in his Doom video.+1
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