Hacking What is with the CFW Wars?

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8BitWalugi

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If you can't reasonably activate it, then it essentially doesn't exist. This sounds like an irrational personal problem. But more to the point:

If you want a feature, implement it. No one is entitled to any developer serving their every want and whim, regardless of how prominent they might be.
You say that like literally anyone can code. I got no idea how this stuff works. All I know is I play a sound file and 5 minutes later I have CFW.

One thing I do know is that variables and booleans and whatnot aren't hard to implement. It can't be hard for a dev to slap together a 'Rosalina Menu Toggle' build.
 
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dark_samus3

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I've had a couple of crashes, but nothing major. I just want to know why something has to impede me in some way for me to want it to be optional.

Just like the detailed error screen, I don't want to deal with that. I just want CFW that looks and acts like normal 3DS FW, just with those small behind the scenes benefits. There's no issue in wanting choice.
Here's the thing about Rosalina, and it's been explained before. In the past there were some bugs with it. That's to be expected. However, with the bugs ironed out now, it actually provides a better user experience for a lot of users. Not only that, but the code is cleaner and easier to maintain for the devs. On the note of "impeding" you, here's the thing about it; other than those crashes in the past, which are now gone mind you, there is literally nothing about it that is impeding. There is a menu, but it is your option to bring it up. Otherwise, it will not affect you in any way that you could imagine. With regards to the exception screen, it actually does provide something convenient; first, and most simply, it provides a fast way to power off the console in the event one of these errors does happen; the 3ds OS actually requires you to hold down the power button for quite awhile, when you'd rather get on with your day. However, more than that, it allows the developers to provide you with a better experience in the case that you experience a crash. It maybe be that there is a bug, and being able to capture it when it happens and provide information on the screen, as well as in a file, is vital for finding and fixing bugs that can make a user's experience bad. In the end, you're free to use whatever version you like. However, if you aren't on latest, the bug may have already been taken care of, yet you're still experiencing it. That's why updating is recommended. It makes your life, as well as the developer's life easier. Imagine, you make something, and then later you discover there's an issue with it. Now, you, being the nice person you are, send out a fix for this issue, along with added things that can enhance the experience for the end user. Now, if the end user doesn't care to use the new features, they don't have to, and it won't affect performance. However, some users notice this new feature and don't like it. They decide to stick with the old version that has the problem. Weeks, months or however long in the future, these users start to experience the flaw that you attempted to fix with your update to the product, however, said users didn't actually use the update. Now those users are mad at you, and constantly filing reports with you. All on something that you had fixed very early. This is why it is recommended to update; because the developers knew that something might become a problem, and as such fixed it, while even adding something to make it better for users who wanted more from the it, while maintaining the status quo with the users who wanted to use it exactly how it was originally intended.Well, these CFW devs experience something similar. But they didn't get paid for their product. They provided hours and hours of work, to you, for free. The least you can do for them is read what they write, understand when they add new features and try to keep yourself up-to-date such that when you have a problem, it hasn't already been solved before, making undue work for the developers.

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------

You say that like literally anyone can code. I got no idea how this stuff works. All I know is I play a sound file and 5 minutes later I have CFW.

One thing I do know is that variables and booleans and whatnot aren't hard to implement. It can't be hard for a dev to slap together a 'Rosalina Menu Toggle' build.
since this was posted while I was writing my above post, I'd really like to add; there's already a boolean for disabling the menu; it's called isButtonComboHeld. If this boolean is false, then, guess what, no more menu!! Man, if only you'd realized that earlier, maybe that could have quelled some confusion! ;)
 

8BitWalugi

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I'm sorry dude, but one of the issues with Luma 8 was the lack of choice. Bugs are bugs, logs are logs, and I get that. But I want to be able to opt in and out of bug reporting. Thankfully that came along with Luma 8.1. I turned it off for the record. I don't feel the need to submit bug reports.

All I'm saying is that more choices are better. More options, more control for your CFW. For the most part, when complaints were coming out about being unable to turn off the Arm9 error screen, it felt like the devs were mostly flipping off the end users and telling them to deal with it. Felt like, not actually doing so. That's not right.

since this was posted while I was writing my above post, I'd really like to add; there's already a boolean for disabling the menu; it's called isButtonComboHeld. If this boolean is false, then, guess what, no more menu!! Man, if only you'd realized that earlier, maybe that could have quelled some confusion! ;)

Since this was posted while I was writing my above post, this kind of sass and patronisation is exactly what causes these sorts of flame wars to begin with! ;)
 
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dark_samus3

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I'm sorry dude, but the issue with Luma 8 was the lack of choice. Bugs are bugs, logs are logs, and I get that. But I want to be able to opt in and out of bug reporting. Thankfully that came along with Luma 8.1. I turned it off for the record. I don't feel the need to submit bug reports.

All I'm saying is that more choices are better. More options, more control for your CFW. For the most part, when complaints were coming out about being unable to turn off the Arm9 error screen, it felt like the devs were mostly flipping off the end users and telling them to deal with it. Felt like, not actually doing so. That's not right.
well, at the end of the day, it is the developer's code. They are free to do whatever they like with it. If they want exception screens, they'll have exception screens. Again, this is code provided free for you to use. If you have issue with it, there is a very very simple solution; don't use it. Anyway, that's my post quota on temp for the month. :)
 

vinstage

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This thread blew up pretty quick. To respond to the original question, people get jealous of the well accomplished Luma due to it being, well, so accomplished. It's noob-proof, caters to the wider majority and is (iirc) the only CFW to run on B9S.
When I say it caters to a wider majority, some CFW out there are far too complex for your casual CFW user. That's how I'd put it.
 
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8BitWalugi

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well, at the end of the day, it is the developer's code. They are free to do whatever they like with it. If they want exception screens, they'll have exception screens. Again, this is code provided free for you to use. If you have issue with it, there is a very very simple solution; don't use it. Anyway, that's my post quota on temp for the month. :)
But the issue is is that there wasn't any other choice at the time. ReiNand has picked up developent once again to (what seems to me like) fill in the gaps and faults that a Luma-exclusive scene has.

Does ReiNand have the auto SDROMFS thing Luma has? Caus if it does I'll switch over.
(This is a general question to users and developers of ReiNand)
 
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The Catboy

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just remember that more choices sounds good, but if they aren't affecting anything then it's just the illusion of choice. and some things are fixed in-place for a reason which has already been explained many times I'm not going to restate here.
I'm sorry, but this argument is just absurd. You are basically comparing apples to oranges and dismissing oranges based on the grounds that there's no reason to choose anything other than apples.
 

adrifcastr

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This thread blew up pretty quick. To respond to the original question, people get jealous of the well accomplished Luma due to it being, well, so accomplished. It's noob-proof, caters to the wider majority and is (iirc) the only CFW to run on B9S.
When I say it caters to a wider majority, some CFW out there are far too complex for your casual CFW user. That's how I'd put it.
You can launch what you want on b9s, a firm payload type file or a cakehax payload file, also there is no reason to be jeleous on an overrated piece of software, reinand is the noob proofest you can get. You boot it up and thats it. No hassle.
 

DinohScene

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The reason I use Luma is cause I have very little interest in the 3DS scene.

It isn't cause I known Aurora for years, it isn't cause everybody praises it to be amazing, it isn't cause the guide tells everybody to use it.
It's just that I got little interest in the 3DS.

Simple as that.

Now that I'm on it, time to compile me own CFW for 3DS.
 
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astronautlevel

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I'm sorry dude, but one of the issues with Luma 8 was the lack of choice. Bugs are bugs, logs are logs, and I get that. But I want to be able to opt in and out of bug reporting. Thankfully that came along with Luma 8.1. I turned it off for the record. I don't feel the need to submit bug reports.
I feel like I need to point out that it's not like it's uploading any data on its own, it simply shows you an error. It's 100% up to you whether or not you want to upload it, it's not like there's any telemetry.
 

Asia81

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Using Luma3DS, and have a Gaming PC.

And you
1502280946-larryttheluck.png
?
What's wrong with you, to not be in the master rass class
1502280946-larryttheluck.png
?
 

Amapola62

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The thing with the error screens is that it would be better if they were written in plain English and giving suggestions about how to solve the error...instead of being written in a way that only devs can understand ex: Instead of getting a Arm 11 exception Data abort SVC break when launching a game which need a seed, we would get a screen saying "Luma encountered an error when launching this game, try to import the seed using FBI's import seed option" or when getting an error when using an out of region game getting a message saying "Luma encountered an error when launching this game, it's a X region game while your console is a Y region 3ds, try using Luma's region emulation feature"...Of course I don't know how feasable it would be to make error screens excplicitely say why we got an error and how we can troubleshot it but it would be much more noob-friendly than getting Arm 11 exceptions...
 
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KunoichiZ

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The thing with the error screens is that it would be better if they were written in plain English and giving suggestions about how to solve the error...instead of being written in a way that only devs can understand ex: Instead of getting a Arm 11 exception Data abort SVC break when launching a game which need a seed, we would get a screen saying "Luma encountered an error when launching this game, try to import the seed using FBI's import seed option" or when getting an error when using an out of region game getting a message saying "Luma encountered an error when launching this game, it's a X region game while your console is a Y region 3ds, try using Luma's region emulation feature"...Of course I don't know how feasable it would be to make error screens excplicitely say why we got an error and how we can troubleshot it but it would be much more noob-friendly than getting Arm 11 exceptions...
What they possibly could do about this is provide a list of errors one could experience and list a possible suggestion on how to fix it instead of making the full error appear in the error screen. Like maybe add a page to the Wiki that people could like to that displays the error codes. The devs could do it, or the people who have these errors could ask to have said error code and possible solution added to the list.

It's just a thought, though. This doesn't have to be done.
 

8BitWalugi

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I feel like I need to point out that it's not like it's uploading any data on its own, it simply shows you an error. It's 100% up to you whether or not you want to upload it, it's not like there's any telemetry.
I never assumed that. It was mainly kinda daunting seeing a whole buncha zeroes appear on screen when something went wrong. First time it happened I almost thought I bricked something.
 

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I'm sorry, but this argument is just absurd. You are basically comparing apples to oranges and dismissing oranges based on the grounds that there's no reason to choose anything other than apples.
He's not talking about CFWs, he's talking about adding more toggles to Luma3DS.
 
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1x7

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I'm sorry, but this argument is just absurd. You are basically comparing apples to oranges and dismissing oranges based on the grounds that there's no reason to choose anything other than apples.

It's more like comparing an apple to a smaller apple, and dismissing the smaller apple because it's a shit apple
 
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Aurora Wright

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But I don't want it there. It doesn't provide me with anything and I see no reason for it to not have a toggle option.

Only time I've ever used Rosalina was to open the Homebrew Launcher when I've just finished hacking a 3DS to install FBI. And even then, I was perfectly happy with the old Health & Safety inject. I understand this isn't viable anymore, but why not have an option to turn it off once I'm done with it?
It's not that "there's no reason for it not to have", it's that "there's no reason for it to have".
What you say could apply to most Luma patches.
"I don't have a DS flashcard, so I want a toggle to disable the Home Menu/TWL FIRM patches that make DS flashcards boot"
"I don't use out-of-region games, so I want a toggle to disable the region free manuals and games patches"
"I don't have an O3DS/don't use extended memory games, and I don't use DS flashcards or custom GBA games, so I want a toggle to disable the firmlaunch patches"
The reason I don't do this is that the fact that Home Menu is patched not to verify the region, or the fact that TWL FIRM is patched not to check for flashcards have no adverse effect on those who don't use flashcards or foreign games. And the same is with Rosalina. It doesn't consume any extra battery or processing power, and as of the latest release, it causes no bugs to people who don't use it.
Conversely, adding toggles for everything adds a lot of confusion for people and makes things harder to troubleshoot for us: "This user says that they are unable to take a screenshot/launch an out of region game. Could it be they mistakenly turned those off?".

Also to be honest, ReiNAND also follows this principle as none of its patches can be turned off (and from what I read, soon it'll also have firmlaunch/twl/agb/DS flashcard patches), if anything you'd need to use Cakes or Corbenik if you wanted granular patches control.
 
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