Hacking Wii U Teaser HomeBrew Channel

[d.d.d.]

"DRM explained"

Yeah for that type of "DRM", I have no issues with that. It's pretty shady to resell freeware.

 

[WiiUBricker]

I never said I agreed with their DRM (although I personally I have no issue with it), I was explaining why it is there. It has absolutely nothing to do with piracy, no idea why you even mentioned that. TT believe that HBC should be free, and want to keep it that way. To do that, they stop people from selling it. It's the opposite of regular DRM; it is designed to make sure you DON'T pay for HBC.

But pretending to be the owners of the app and selling it is blatant piracy. This is why I brought piracy up in the discussion. While the HBC's DRM serves a moral purpose, you have to ask yourself 2 things:

1) Does the DRM of this Freeware limit the freedom of others to use it as they wish in any form? (Source doesn't necessarily have to be open)
2) Did the DRM actually serve its purpose or are scam sites selling it regardless?

 

[SifJar]

But pretending to be the owners of the app and selling it is blatant piracy. This is why I brought piracy up in the discussion. While the HBC's DRM serves a moral purpose, you have to ask yourself 2 things:

1) Does the DRM of this Freeware limit the freedom of others to use it as they wish in any form? (Source doesn't necessarily have to be open)
2) Did the DRM actually serve its purpose or are scam sites selling it regardless?

1 - who ever said TT wanted people to have freedom "to use it as they wish in any form"? Perhaps that's what you would like, but you didn't make HBC, so you don't get a say. Just because they release something for free doesn't mean they're giving you freedom to use it how you want. In an ideal world, of course you'd have that freedom. But we do not live in an ideal world; far from it.
2 - I dunno. I don't think the sites are as prominent as before, and I think they might bundle older versions without the scam warnings or something. But that's not the point. Most countries have a police force, and yet crimes are still commited regardless; I guess that means we shouldn't bother with having police? [note: this is sarcasm] Just because something isn't 100% effective doesn't mean it should just be removed, unless it is to be replaced with something more effective.

EDIT: And again, I want to remind you I was just offering an explanation to someone who asked, not "taking a side" so to speak.

 

[Rydian]

But pretending to be the owners of the app and selling it is blatant piracy. This is why I brought piracy up in the discussion. While the HBC's DRM serves a moral purpose, you have to ask yourself 2 things:

1) Does the DRM of this Freeware limit the freedom of others to use it as they wish in any form? (Source doesn't necessarily have to be open)
2) Did the DRM actually serve its purpose or are scam sites selling it regardless?

Buy a commercial DVD, it's illegal to copy it and sell the copy, even if you want to and are physically capable of doing it.

Attempting to limit what end-users can do with your products is an established practice that's been going on for hundreds of years (predating modern computers by far when you get to books and patents).

 

[McHaggis]

For the US units, yes. http://www.siliconera.com/2012/11/17/wii-u-backwards-compatibility-is-like-a-wii-in-your-wii-u/
How's your EU launch unit?
I'm hoping the update is in the JP unit but not hoping too hard.

Not allowed to play on it, it's a Christmas present for the kids. Damn kids ruin everything.

 

[WiiUBricker]

Attempting to limit what end-users can do with your products is an established practice that's been going on for hundreds of years (predating modern computers by far when you get to books and patents).

It's a contradiction if you are speaking of homebrew. That's why crediar brought the irony up.

 

[Rydian]

It's a contradiction if you are speaking of homebrew. That's why crediar brought the irony up.

What crack are you on? I've been using computers almost my entire (intelligent) life, and I've been seeing "this program is freeware, if you paid for it you got ripped off" for years before I even joined this forum. From Windows programs, not even console things.

And not to mention all the "don't reditribute, post a link to my site instead", and "if you reupload this you must include this readme file", etc...

 

[WiiUBricker]

What crack are you on? I've been using computers almost my entire (intelligent) life, and I've been seeing "this program is freeware, if you paid for it you got ripped off" for years before I even joined this forum. From Windows programs, not even console things.

And not to mention all the "don't reditribute, post a link to my site instead", and "if you reupload this you must include this readme file", etc...

Again, for homebrew, not programs for Win95. Homebrew is something that is founded on bypassing or breaching security measures of copyrighted products and comes with a bad taste of piracy. It resembles freedom, the right to make with your stuff whatever you want. When a homebrew takes this freedom away, it's clearly a contradiction (hence why the irony).

 

[Rydian]

Again, for homebrew, not programs for Win95. Homebrew is something that is founded on bypassing or breaching security measures of copyrighted products and comes with a bad taste of piracy.

Console homebrew, sure. Computer homebrew, no. There's a distinction between free and non-free software on desktops/laptops as well, and the line is getting blurred more and more with android ports of desktop softwares (like firefox), and Windows 8 even supporting both x86 and ARM (via a branch).

Homebrew software is the same thing as homemade software on the computer. It's software an individual wrote by themselves, not from a company under a license.

The difference on consoles being that they're often (not always!) locked down and require bypassing anti-piracy measures to run homebrew,.

OtherOS says hi.

It resembles freedom, the right to make with your stuff whatever you want. When a homebrew takes this freedom away, it's clearly a contradiction (hence why the irony).

Contradiction of what?

"The right to make with your stuff" - HBC is not "your stuff", it's the author's stuff. If somebody wanted to write an alternative or write their own program that is launched from HBC, HBC is not stopping them.

HBC is attempting to stop users from illegally profiting from it.

 

[WiiUBricker]

Rydian, by your logic you can call every piece of program that exists homebrew, since all programs are homemade, yes, even Win8. Why don't you understand that by homebrew I was referring to the most obvious meaning, game console homebrew (especially since we are talking about a game console homebrew in a game console topic from a 80% game console website)?

 

[ProtoKun7]

Rydian, by your logic you can call every piece of program that exists homebrew, since all programs are homemade, yes, even Win8. Why don't you understand that by homebrew I was referring to the most obvious meaning, game console homebrew (especially since we are talking about a game console homebrew in a game console topic from a 80% game console website)?

Win8 is homemade?

wat

 

[Rydian]

Rydian, by your logic you can call every piece of program that exists homebrew, since all programs are homemade, yes, even Win8.

... are you even serious?

Windows 8 was made by a gigantic corporation, in their headquarters, by a team of professionals explicitly paid to do so.

This is in clear contrast to something like Useless Homebrew, which was made by me, a single person, in my own home, with no monetary involvement.

Why don't you understand that by homebrew I was referring to the most obvious meaning, game console homebrew (especially since we are talking about a game console homebrew in a game console topic from a 80% game console website)?

'Cause the discussion was about the author's right to restrict use of a program in regards to paid versus free software.

This is a distinction that exists on consoles as well as normal computers, and as I mentioned has existed since well before the first home game console (copyright law on books, patents, etc.).

The author or creator of a product attempting to place limits on what end-users can do... that's been going on for hundreds of years.

 

[rizzod]

Rydian, by your logic you can call every piece of program that exists homebrew, since all programs are homemade, yes, even Win8. Why don't you understand that by homebrew I was referring to the most obvious meaning, game console homebrew (especially since we are talking about a game console homebrew in a game console topic from a 80% game console website)?

Ignoramus. (You're Welcome)

 

[WiiUBricker]

... are you even serious?

Windows 8 was made by a gigantic corporation, in their headquarters, by a team of professionals explicitly paid to do so.

This is in clear contrast to something like Useless Homebrew, which was made by me, a single person, in my own home, with no monetary involvement.

I didn't say Win8 was homebrew because I think so, I said it was homebrew by your logic (which I attempted to prove flawed). If I go by your logic I would claim that Win8 is homemade because it was developed by Microsoft, home in Microsoft's headquarters. But in my view programs are classified as homebrew if they are run on a platform they are not supposed to, like a hacked game console.

'Cause the discussion was about the author's right to restrict use of a program in regards to paid versus free software.

No, it was a discussion about a free homebrew that is a pain in the butt in regards to customize and making it work with other components due to the DRM it has. EVen if it were paid software, it would have the same DRM applied to it.

 

[Rydian]

I didn't say Win8 was homebrew because I think so, I said it was homebrew by your logic (which I attempted to prove flawed). If I go by your logic I would claim that Win8 is homemade because it was developed by Microsoft, home in Microsoft's headquarters.

That's not my logic, read my posts again.

It's software an individual wrote by themselves, not from a company under a license.

But in my view programs are classified as homebrew if they are run on a platform they are not supposed to, like a hacked game console.

I'm fairly sure that programs written for the Wii are supposed to be run on the Wii. I wrote Useless Homebrew to run on the DS, I did not write it to run on OSX, for example.

No, it was a discussion about a free homebrew that is a pain in the butt in regards to customize and making it work with other components due to the DRM it has. EVen if it were paid software, it would have the same DRM applied to it.

That's because of the author's belief.

Most homebrew is free, and most commercial programs are paid, which is why I mentioned that distinction. Like you said, however, the program is limited due to the author's intentions... and like I said, those sort of intentions have been standard for hundreds of years.

If you don't like it, write your own fucking HBC.

 

[pwsincd]

just dont call it HBC

 

[WiiUBricker]

I'm fairly sure that programs written for the Wii are supposed to be run on the Wii. I wrote Useless Homebrew to run on the DS, I did not write it to run on OSX, for example.

Yeah, because someone else hacked the Wii, wrote a free SDK and made a flash cart/emulator for you.

Most homebrew is free, and most commercial programs are paid, which is why I mentioned that distinction. Like you said, however, the program is limited due to the author's intentions... and like I said, those sort of intentions have been standard for hundreds of years.

I see that you apparently don't get the ideology of homebrew, which is kind of sad.

If you don't like it, write your own fucking HBC.

To criticize something isn't equivalent to wanting to create my own thing, especially when other, better things do exist.

 

[SifJar]

Yeah, because someone else hacked the Wii, wrote a free SDK and made a flash cart/emulator for you.

Just want to pop in here and say I don't think the Wii being hacked had an influence on Rydian writing a homebrew app for the DS.

 

[Deltaechoe]

Rydian, by your logic you can call every piece of program that exists homebrew, since all programs are homemade, yes, even Win8. Why don't you understand that by homebrew I was referring to the most obvious meaning, game console homebrew (especially since we are talking about a game console homebrew in a game console topic from a 80% game console website)?

Time to put an end to this.

Homebrew is software made by a consumer targeting a proprietary system (generally without licensing by the console manufacturer).

 

[Kikirini]

Awesome! Hope we do eventually see a release